Kyiv

[Horny Monger]

Dude,

I really don't understand what you're expecting. Taxi is a general term for having someone drive you. In Kiev (and most of FSU) it's perfect normal to stop a car en route and haggle for a ride.

Every Lady. Really, everyone, not just working girls. Got several numbers of people who earn some additional dough by doing privat taxi. I'd be rather suspicious when a normal person show up with a marked taxi.

And if she's a working girl, she usually has a driver who's even waiting to pick her up later on. That's pretty much standard.

Man, that's extreme rude. Taking the Metro is considered low. And way low beyond anything expected of a foreigner to think of. Real Ladies don't take the metro. That's for old babushkas.

It's good to look for your money, but not taking a (private) taxi in Kiew produces you as a super-cheapnik. You've promised to pay her some large sum money to stay with you, and even before it starts, you're unable to cover some minimum expense? Even in business terms that's suspicious, and for sure not a way to treat someone where you expect a good experience afterwards. Asking her about taking the metro has been quite an insult and with 'not hearing' your question, she just played cool. Treat her with _some_ respect.

Serious, 100-200 Griwna for a taxi is fine for most inner city routes, not any kind of scam. And thinking about it, I guess she felt for sure more safe to find any way to pay the driver later on, than to stay. Maybe he got to taste her for the ride.

Hahaahaaaaaa. . . . . .

You know what. . . . . . she sent me SMS in in Russian telling me that she still wanted to meet and wanted to meet today.

So I called her back to say that I couldn't meet today, but we can meet tomorrow. And she volunteered that she'd take the metro this time, even after I told her, it's ok you can take a taxi because now I know what's going on and I'll pay for it.

She came this afternoon and her attitude couldn't be better!

She also asked for money upfront because she said she got screwed before because some guy didn't give her money afterward.

Is that one of those guys you were talking about, understand no sh*t about FSU culture and thought they got free sex?

Or they just had no intention of giving money.

[Riina]

Sorry, guys, but "Decadence House", "The Lab" и "Bacardi Terrace" located in Arena Center are all closing as of October 1. They have new owners and the new owners will not continue the current set up as they have a different vision for the location. No word on what exactly will replace the soon-to-close clubs.

I wonder if this is yet another sign of the demise of high end clubs in Kiev. The war is a major factor, but maybe the girls just no longer need Kiev as their hub.

[NightOwl69]

Sorry, guys, but "Decadence House", "The Lab" и "Bacardi Terrace" located in Arena Center are all closing as of October 1. They have new owners and the new owners will not continue the current set up as they have a different vision for the location. No word on what exactly will replace the soon-to-close clubs.

I don; t know if this is related but it seems there is a new club at Arena Centre opened.

http://darlingclub.net/

Not much info in the website other than its 24/7 strip club.

Any one in Kiev now to take one for the team and check it out.

Cheers.

[DruidFire]

Yesterday, I met a 20 year old busty blond, clearly not a pro, but she asked for money upfront before she took off her clothes and had sex. She asked several times!

But she didn't come in a taxi or a car of any kind.

Quite a nosy, inquisitive and cautious girl who asked me about my job, where I work, my marital status and etc.

Came to my place and made a comment: "Oh, it's big!" Then, walked herself to check out the bedroom and rest of the place.

Seems uninhibited as opposed to most of girls. or the girls you described.

While in Kiev last month, I was trying to get an idea of how many "semi pros" are out there. I asked the one girl that I was with every night and she seriously estimates that "at least" half of all college age girls in Kiev would trade sex for money. I don't know if that's true, but it's what she said and she was certain of it. Some are more cautious about it and are too frightened to have a Mamba profile proclaiming to be looking for a sponsor. Some may picky about the guy they would sleep with. Not *too* old or *too* ugly. Unlike FKK girls who are real hardcore working girls. Some might fancy the idea of a decent looking foreign guy becoming a boyfriend of sorts (why else would she care if you are married or not?) And of course, why would she care what job you have as long as you're making enough to pay her? I guess it could just be small talk. But I suspect if your job sounded interesting or high paying, she would like you more. This is in no way a knock on local women. In their place I would do exactly the same, if faced with the choice of making 200 $ a month or making 200 $ a day. And I suspect many college girls who expect to work just to pay for expenses quickly realize their is no job that will pay them what they are making now. The girl I spoke with at length also worked as a hair dresser. When I asked her why, she said that she obviously can't be a working girl when she gets older (She is now 23).

Anyway, maybe off topic but definitely interesting.

[Horny Monger]

If a girl asks (beside the phase of setting the price) to get the money early, she's usually a hardened pro _and_ does not respect you as someone within her culture.

Yesterday, I met a 20 year old busty blond, clearly not a pro, but she asked for money upfront before she took off her clothes and had sex. She asked several times!

But she didn't come in a taxi or a car of any kind.

Quite a nosy, inquisitive and cautious girl who asked me about my job, where I work, my marital status and etc.

Came to my place and made a comment: "Oh, it's big!" Then, walked herself to check out the bedroom and rest of the place.

Seems uninhibited as opposed to most of girls. or the girls you described.

[AColonizer]

It is the first time I perceive a so strong pollution in the center of Kiev. I sometimes put a napkin in front of my nose.

[Raffzahn]

I lost my luggage on a glight from Frankfurt to Kiev which I'm told is a common occurrence. Spent an hour asking questions and filling in forms etc. And eventually informed my bag is on the next flight.
Waited next day for a call to be told my bag will be delivered to my apartment. This was good news as I had not had a change of clothes for 2 days and the weather in Kiev is on the warm side.

What airline if I may ask? I had the same issue with Lufthansa some years ago and got an overnight package plus money to buy basic clothing for the next day.

I'm now wondering whether the girls at the lost luggage desk are in league with this scam since they asked a lot of questions about the physical appearance of my bag before suddenly informing me my bag is on the next flight without as much as a look at a computer screen.

I don't think so. These questions are part of a standard catalog. They have a normalized checklist with features to encode the baggage type / appearance. Baggage left at the Airport of origin (or change) is also encoded using the same tables, thus they can be matched vine if labels got lost, which is usually the reason why baggage is left behind (The other common, but never told reason is an additional security check where it couldn't be put together again in time for departure. Happens often if you maxed out the space while being late at the same time).

[Raffzahn]

It is my undersganding that TSA locks work only in the USA. I could be wrong, but it was so when TSA locks first came out. TSA is an American agency anyway.

Yes, that stuff was defined by TSA, but don't you think that the needed keys / numbers made a fast way to any other Airport around the world? Ofc, including supplies for every crook working near.

[Raffzahn]

I explain to everybody how is the correct behavior of a girl:

- she leaves the money in a place that is easily visible to everyone until the time has expired and the customer is satisfied.

In fact, this is some of the finer details of Russian / FSU culture. If you want to give some money to a friend (as a gift for example, like jumping in for the expenses you caused), you usually don't give money direct to him. You just deposit it in their home. Clearly visible, but everyone will pretend not to see it.

The same works fine to identify non pros, when they get coyly when it comes to money. They want you to just put it somewhere in their coat or alike. They will also never ever ask or worse count the money while you're watching. I walked even pros back to the street without paying or showing money upfront, just to slip it in their hand / pocket at a good bye kiss. It's also a good hint that she'll respects you as a gentleman.

In unclear situations, you just place the money on a sideboard, visible for her. She won't take it until she gets dressed again. And even then she might wait until you turn. If a girl asks (beside the phase of setting the price) to get the money early, she's usually a hardened pro _and_ does not respect you as someone within her culture.

Often new mongers in FSU report about freebies with semi pros or other girls they thought they had to pay, but who went without asking for money, believing how cool they are, but in reality they just added to the long story of western idiots behaving bad. So don't be an idiot, unless you are really on a proposed marriage (or other clear terms) make sure she finds some 50+ bucks, next time she checks her coat.

Yes, Russians got some really strange habits. There are way more around money, your / their home and meeting people. But when you get introduced to it, it opens a new door and shows insight to ways of politeness, one wouldn't expect just ahead.

[Horny Monger]

Maybe. If she asked the meeting money when she was inside or near the car, then you understood it was a scam. It is acceptable to loose the taxi money but not the meeting money. Instead if the meeting money remains inside the customer's apartment, then it is possible to rescue the meeting money even if the prostitutes could start to break something.

I would never have let it happen.

[Horny Monger]

This afternoon this girl arrived in an unmarked black car (the car looked quite new), which she called a taxi. She looks quite plain, skinny and older than her reported age.

I asked her telling the taxi to leave then I'll meet her and give her the taxi money but she insisted that I give her the taxi money to pay the taxi then meet. She claimed she didn't have any money, but how did she left with the same taxi after 25 min without any money? I aslo asked her why did she take the taxi if she didn't have any money to pay for it and why didn't she just take the metro. She didn't say anything but just kept on asking if I have money and if I'll pay the taxi. At the end, I ask her: "Are you an agency?" and she said she didn't understand. I told her again: "I think you are an agency! You and this unmarked black car makes me nervous!" Tell the black car / taxi to leave. Shortly, she left with the black car.

Any input from the veterans of this thread is welcome as to what's going on here with this girl's acton.

In general I agree, but when you have meetings during the day; the girls often do come by metro, if your apartment is close by a metro station. Often they ask me to meet them outside the metro station. Perhaps because the traffic can be very bad during the day.

It was during the day about 4 pm, peak traffic hour, and I am in the center of the center 2 min. Walk from Metro Kreshschatyk and the Mcdonald's. ; so there's absolutely no reason to take an illegal taxi to save a few grivnas; besides, I've already agreed to pay for it; so it wouldn't come out of her pocket. If she's trying to save me a couple of grivnas and she had no money, why didn't she just take the metro? Unless she's got something to do with the driver?

[EasyEase]

I've have long relations with several WG's in several parts of the world. So we talk about this and that and I know that for a WG it is also crucial to get her money sometimes in advance because some customers don't pay the agreed price or don't pay at all. Since I am a GFE Monger and I want the WG to be in a relaxed mood, I usually put the agreed money on a table, talk a little bit and I tell soon (if I like the WG) that her money is on the table and this visible to her. If she attempts to take the money right away and I feel bad vibes this puts me on alert status. This is usually a bad sign. If she leaves the money on the table, this is a good sign.

This has worked for me in the past years.

Easyease

Maybe. If she asked the meeting money when she was inside or near the car, then you understood it was a scam. It is acceptable to loose the taxi money but not the meeting money. Instead if the meeting money remains inside the customer's apartment, then it is possible to rescue the meeting money even if the prostitutes could start to break something.

There are two cases in which money is lost:

- when the customer pays in advance and the prostitute gives the money to a third person, who gets away.

- when the customer pays in advance to two prostitutes and they get away with the money otherwise they denounce for violence the customer to police.

I explain to everybody how is the correct behavior of a girl:

- she leaves the money in a place that is easily visible to everyone until the time has expired and the customer is satisfied.

[Epicurus]

Oh, don't get me wrong, I really like the Kiev public transport. It's great, well working (OK, catching the right marshrutka is sometimes a bit confusing), and way better than most places in the world. Then again, I'm kind of a public transit nerd anyway. Heck, even had a friend one time arrange me a cab ride along the metro.

Then again, over all the years, I don't really remember many arranged girls to come other than by taxi. And usually these are normal cars. I got a habit to meet them downstairs, especially if it's someone I don't know. Feels more safe, and I get a good look at her before letting her in. On the way out they call 'their' drivers. When late, they may have to call a second or third number. Or even resort to some licenced taxi, but that's rather rare. I usually guide them on their way out again, so I get to see the way they leave. Can't remember anyone who went for Metro (especially considering that the Kiev system doesn't work 24 h).

In general I agree, but when you have meetings during the day; the girls often do come by metro, if your apartment is close by a metro station. Often they ask me to meet them outside the metro station. Perhaps because the traffic can be very bad during the day.

[AColonizer]

Maybe. If she asked the meeting money when she was inside or near the car, then you understood it was a scam. It is acceptable to loose the taxi money but not the meeting money. Instead if the meeting money remains inside the customer's apartment, then it is possible to rescue the meeting money even if the prostitutes could start to break something.

There are two cases in which money is lost:

- when the customer pays in advance and the prostitute gives the money to a third person, who gets away.

- when the customer pays in advance to two prostitutes and they get away with the money otherwise they denounce for violence the customer to police.

I explain to everybody how is the correct behavior of a girl:

- she leaves the money in a place that is easily visible to everyone until the time has expired and the customer is satisfied.

Thanks for your input.

I share many of the philosphies you posted here when dealing with p4p girls; so I have to be careful, in case, things went wrong and if I have to. . . . . .

Maybe that girl was planning to give the meeting money immediately to give it to the driver after I gave the taxi money to her?

[Jojosun]

I

One guy here said that he even rents two apartments, presumably side by side, one to keep his stuff and another one for fun.

LOL, Stuff? Must be 4 his Crown Jewels.