Odessa

[Delgado]

Possibly he is talking about the market close to the train station?

[Doctor_Skank]

VV:

Really, with all due respect, why are you writing about a city you've never been to and recommending places you've never even seen? I just dont get it... and it certainly isnt a service to ISG, as all that you have written about ODS is hearsay and info from other reports...

As for the trade center, I assume that you are talking about the port (morsky voksal) and the lineup there. But why even write about it, since you have never been there?

Or should I start telling everybody to go to HELP disco in Rio just because I read about it somewhere?

Please, only write about things you've personally experienced, only recommend places you've actually been to and only post pictures that YOU have taken of girls YOU have had.

ISG is an information platform for mongers and not a showcase for egos. If you dont have any info or pictures, dont pretend you do by printing info posted by others in the ODS section months ago or by stealing photos from others or taking them from websites.

You want info about girls, thats fine. But with your erratic behavior, who do you think is going to give you any?

[Uke Boy]

Vinnie Baby

Here we are all waiting for your exact information about this trade center and the hundreds of $50 babes there!

What puzzles me most of all is that when CA Traveler who actually lives, works and mongers in Odessa doesn’t know about this fabulous resource, then we all must be made aware of it from you.

It really is interesting that someone who has never been to Odessa seems to know everything about the place but can't give us any specific details. This is the same person who in almost every message begs for a phone number or more lady contact details. In the other message, he of course reveals confidential details or posts stolen photos. What a stand-up guy Vinnie really is.

How about a map or a street address of this trade center. Do the mamachkas there have any phone numbers we can call? Come on now Vinnie, give us all the information.

Vinnie be a man and not the 15 year old boy we think you really are and answer all our questions.

[CA Traveler]

VV... the question is WHERE is the trade center you speak about????

[Uke Boy]

This Trade Center post of yours is another of your useless so-called contributions to the forum.

It appears that you have given us second or third-hand information since you have never been to Odessa. The purpose of the forum is to not only share information but also to provide first hand facts on what is going on in the locality.

Is your post factual of events today? I have no idea and no one else does, too. It may well be but the point is we need actual real-time and accurate information based on hard experience, not plagiarism and a repeat of what others may have said some time ago.

Maybe when you get to ODS, if you ever do, try and post what is and what you have really experienced and not steal pictures and words from others as you seem to do with regularity.

[Uke Boy]

Cruiser,

If you really want fake, fraud and generally useless nonsense and non-contributions on a regular basis, read Vinnie's posts, or at least try to.

Painful, really painful.

[Cruiser D]

Internet fraud and fabrication? No way!!

Next thing you are going to tell me is that sweet Ukrainian girl I've never met and professes her undying love for me online is just going to take the 5k I wired her for a plane ticket, passport, and to take care of her sick grandmother.

Geez, what's next people posting fake reports on ISG? Never gonna happen!

I took this report by a supposed NYC cop to a security guy I know at one of the embassies. He couldn't believe that it was written by a NYC cop. It does seem to be some con or fraud by someone with an agenda to scare foreigners away.

.

[Irish Lad]

Vinnie,

The photo you link here is the one I sent you on your personal email. The number for Diana is wrong.................

Why is it wrong? Because I made a typo when I sent it to you last week.

IL

[Delgado]

There is absolutely no reason to stay away from here since violent crime against foreigners is rare.

I´ve been to Odessa or Kiev about 10 times during the last year. First thing people at home ask me is if it´s not dangerous. I always say I feel safer than at home, so I was wondering if i had just been lucky.

Uke Boy, you might be right about the local mafia though. I met an absolutely incredible girl during my first visit to Odessa and it was sort of strange that she always wanted to stay in the apartment with me or only go to places very far from the center. It turned out she moved together with this mafia big-shot when she was 16, she´s 19 now, living with her mother again and studying at Odessa university, but this guy still has total control of her life and won´t let her go. From the stories she told me i can only imagine what would happen to me if he found out...

The only uncomfortable situation i experienced in Odessa also was with this girl. On our first date we were just leaving a cafe in the center, when two policemen stopped us and wanted to see my passport. I always carry a copy of the two main pages with me, but this did not satisfy them. They refused to take any cash, so i suggested we all go to my apartment and get my passport. When we arrived in front of the house things got really complicated. They said they could not let me go inside the house alone to get it, so i told them to come up to my apartment with me. For some reason this was not an option for them, they insisted that my new girlfriend go inside to get my documents. At that point my alarm bells started ringing. The girl looked to good to be true, like she just fell off a catwalk, and now these maybe fake cops were going to have an eye on me, while this creature from heaven would search my apartment and disappear with my valuables. So i said no way, i´ll call a friend and have him go up. I was relieved that they accepted, my friend was there 5 minutes later, and when we finally were able to present my passport, the two lunatics only grinned, didn´t even have a look at it, turned around and left.
I don´t know if police checking foreigners happens often in Odessa, i suspect not. My girl told me afterwards that the two cops had asked for her telephone number, they were pretty young guys, and she is hot even for Odessa standards, so probably they were more interested in her.

[Uke Boy]

I took this report by a supposed NYC cop to a security guy I know at one of the embassies. He couldn't believe that it was written by a NYC cop. It does seem to be some con or fraud by someone with an agenda to scare foreigners away.

We came to the conclusion that this is a phony report. Security staffs at embassies are attuned to what happens to foreigners while in the country. Either they report an incident to the embassy or reports of their nationals are forwarded to them by the police.

In any case, I was told that except for the usual idiot bumbling total drunks who almost always ask for a rolling, very little if any violence of the type in that article is evident in Ukraine against foreigners in any of the cities, Kiev and Odessa included, or even in the smaller towns and villages.

Yes, you are a target for pickpockets and con artists of all sorts but severe violence against you as a person is just not going to happen unless you do something real stupid like try and walk away with some Mafioso's girlfriend.

Unfortunately, in almost all those cases of actual violence, it is a racial attack against blacks and sometimes Asians and other nationalities lumped together as Caucasians. But even here, it is not as frequent or as bad as it is in St. Petersburg where skinheads really rule.

There is absolutely no reason to stay away from here since violent crime against foreigners is rare.

[Uke Boy]

Vinnie,

Instead of your usual childish whining asking us to "discuss girls," why don't you actually begin a discussion about the girls or add to a discussion substantially.

You are always about asking for help on one thing or another but you never contribute except for some stolen photos from time to time.

If you can't contribute then don't complain.

[CA Traveler]

AS... Again, I want to say that this guy seems to be living in a different place than where I am... I don't see gangs... I don't see skinheads... I don't see fights on the street.... I just don't get it. If it is true, then I suggest that he is either living waaaay out of the center or as mentioned before is just looking at everything through a cops eyes.

If this were printed about St.Petersburg, I would believe it but in my year of living here, I just have seen no indication of any problems at all which is pretty significant since the center of the city is so small and compact.

[DirkDingy]

Its official, My Man Ca Traveler Hooked Me Up with the Apartment. www.odessaexecutivesuites.com I will be in Odessa from July 1- July 25. If you want to hook up. We can. I am a 25 yr old African American. My plans are to party my a$$ off but not get into any trouble. Im going to go the CLUB everynight.

russians and ukes will not take kindly to you in their hunting ground. take some mates with you. you will likely be ok, but you are playing with fire going solo. also, don't mistake a friendly man at a bar for a friend; they will turn on you very quickly. if you are in trouble, don't count on local LE for assitance. good luck bro.

dd

[Delgado]

Sorry if the link i posted caused any problems. No virus warning on my system, but i´ll copy the text in here, in case anyone else is interested:

Attacks in Ukraine increased

Posted by jay on March 07, 2005 at 01:49:07:

Attacks in Ukraine increased. Actually Mark things might be different in Sevastopol. But in the laerger cities where there is known to be mny foreigners, attacks on te rise. When I waa living in Kiev back in 2002 I eremember a group of 30 young punks attacked some asian tourists on main street while everyone watched in broad daylight. 2 police officers just watched but being in law enforcement myself I am twelling you that I wouldnt do much different until alot of back up comes.
But in tourist area like Odessa many expats I know have been attacked. In fact I never heard of Marriage agency owners being attacked but it wouldnt be in there best interest to report it because last thing they want is scare off customers but I know for a fact that almost every english language teacher at local language schools has been robed atleast once. I also know personally that other expats have been attacked in brutally beaten. I n one case the expat almost died and police in this case made an arrest and the atackers did time but in most cases police blamed victim and tried to get bribe from expat for not having proper documents. M y friend who has lived there for 5 yrs was in 3 fight ,attack situations but being ex military martial artist was able to do some damage back before he got more hurt. M ost of the attacks happened in center on side streets late at night, one happened on beach in daylight.
Knowing this I have to say Odessa has potential to be very hostile because if most expats I know have been attacked , I can imagine the number of tourists who get attacked but ofcourse we do not know about because the tourists are gone in a matter of days and also includes non english expats who do not hang in same circles.
Now my opinion of what is happening(as well as my ukrainian friend fro Odessa) is that being that Odessa is like the Tijuana of Ukraine and tourists come for short holidays gangs know that they can make an easy score without having to worry about the victim staying around to cause trouble. Also Odessa had a reputation of having the worst pirate cut throats for 2 hundred years ,port ,smuggling city and all. My friend feels that they attack foreigners because they believe they have money and because unlike the RUSSIAN WEALTHY, WILL ROAM THE STREET SA ALONE AT NIGHT. Rich Russsians(Odessa is ethnically Russian or pro Russian city) will drive there BMW home and not be caught in the street.
My advice is to travel in groups but no alone. Avoid side streets and do not think you are safe in the center because in reality thats where the gangs lok for victims. Lets be honest they do not expect rich foreigners in outer areas so they will not be actively looking there (dont crap in your own backyard). Other advice keep away from drunk Ukrainians , it seems drinking leads from passiveness to agressiveness. Avoid palldium night club i know of some attacks that happened there because alot of thug like mafia guys hang out there who are young. Older types actually get along woith foreigners(after all they always trying to prove they western cool a well) but the young new ones who aren't so wealthy seem to resent the guys coming to get there women and have like a Brooklyn eat New york getto machoness.
In Kiev remember places cater to expats. Heck alot of clubs wouldnt let ukrainians in unless they are with a foreigner. Usually peple who go to these place are happy to be hanging out with foreign expats and girls either hookers or nice girls wanting foreign boyfriends. But in Odessa the town caters to the natives. Yes, alot of peple make money off tourists in summer but the rest of the year they are glad you are not there because it seems Odessa has changed. The people were the most friendliest yrs back but I guesss they got sick of the foreigners and now want to hang with there own. In fact Odessa has no real expat hangouts. Estrelita was for awhile and then they kicksd out expat management also if you notice girls do not hang out there> In kiev foreigners have there groupies in most expat places(moscow and other cities as well) but in odessa they are so used to foreigners the girls dont really want to have anything to do with them. Infact I know the expat dating scene is hard in Odessa while in Kiev its great. Natives have more favorable relations with expats in kiev because usually they have better experiences with expats including working for them in office,etc. But in Odessa except for loud tourists and people on sex vacations ,the natives do not really meet the cream of the crop and do not need the associate with expats for career develpoment. All this can make Odessa a hostile place, I myself ,even though I have flat in Odessa realized now that I would trade in a minute(too expensive) to go back to kiev wheree I feel expats fit in more.
Second word of advice, if you are attacked , be agressive and run if you can, its semms that Russians there tend to want to show thay are a man by kicking your ass together with 6 buddies while in America usually a guy has to show hes a man by kick your ass 1 on 1 and riends root, but here the guy shows that he and his six friends are real men by kicking your ass like cowards. This means you better not ever let yourself get surrounded and its ok to run because if you do not you are in trouble. But if you can not get away try to hurt a few if you can. I know this seems like bad advice and as a NYC cop I shoyuldn't be telling you this BUT it seems like in everycase the attackers attack first no matter how submissive or surrendering you are, then if they want to take something they do, but then they will probably conclude by roughing you up more. Now remember a cuple guys really got hurt this way, teeth knocked out hit back of head with pipe,etc. But my friend who has lived there longest and yes knows a bit martial arts, he fought back and he realized that in most cases the attackers gave up after he showed that he can hurt them. Basically its shows that Ukrainian strategy is wolf packs and if they see that they will get hurt will back off. So carry mace, small club whatever and start swinging. Remember except for knives guns are rarely ued in robbereies in Ukraine.
Afterwards if you survive contact police and screw what new president says, offere bribe or award to police and guess what you will find that not only will you be helped but chances are that the police will find some of the attackers and either hold them for you to beat or beat them themsevlves. It seems the police know already what gangs stalk the streets and probably get a cut but police do not appreciate it when it gets violent and will work for you to make an object lesson if you reward them .I once told another expat in kiev to do same thing and beliee me police took care of it, ofcourse i hope they did not just pull any poor igor of the street.
I know alot of you liberal softies will say revenge is wrong , but if expats,tourists start showing that they will not take it the gangs will be more cautios.
I am thinking to give a small course on surviving Ukraine ,lol

[Ringgold6581]

Its official, My Man Ca Traveler Hooked Me Up with the Apartment. www.odessaexecutivesuites.com I will be in Odessa from July 1- July 25. If you want to hook up. We can. I am a 25 yr old African American. My plans are to party my a$$ off but not get into any trouble. Im going to go the CLUB everynight.