Phnom Penh

[RCA Knight]

On the topic of the cheapest, young good looking girls in SE Asia, I have found Vientiane to be the best value. 20USD LT no probs. Give it a try if PP isn't for you.

20USD is no where near the norm in Vientiane. That was how much I paid 20-25 USD ST in the karaokes and disco pick ups back in the early 90's when I first discovered Vientiane. The average now in Vientiane from karaoke bars, expect to pay minimum 50USD up, for freelancers, expect to pay at 35 USD or 1000 baht for a medium doable girl, for a cutie freelancer, believe me, the Lao girls know if they are cute or not by now, always want around 50 USD up. Of course the price can fluctuate 5-10 USD depends on the demand and supply of that time. But 20 USD for a good looker all night in Vientiane, well, she must like you so much to give you 30 USD discount. It's a market economy, very unfortunately the demand has spoiled the supply. BTW, the cheapest sex in Vientiane besides the unattractive freelancers, is the hotel brothels, which also cost 1200 bahts or 40 USD ST room included. Vientiane is definitely more expensive than PP.

[Anzac]

[QUOTE=Leftfield1965; 1325701]What a load of horseshit! (except the last paragraph, never been to Laos so can't comment)

I've been to PP over 20 times in the last 3 years and have never paid more than $20 ST/$30 LT and I consider those prices fair.

Leftfield, you are entitled to your opinion, as everyone is. My advice and observations are based on 15 years of mongering in PP. But then again, if you consider yourelf the infinite wisdom on such things after 3 years, who am I to argue.

[GentleBoner]

Yeah I disagree too.

I always tell Khmer girls that I live in Thailand and it's no big problem. They never try to demand Thai prices.

The only girls who try to charge me $40-50 are girls who think I'm a dumb tourist.

And only the hardened sharks go after the newbies. I see plenty of newbie tourist looking guys getting no attention because they look clueless like they don't even know what a working girl does.

A lot of the best girls go for the guys who are already known to be nice.

[Leftfield1965]

"I think it's a spillover effect from Thailand. Most tourists in PP flew in from Bangkok."

Its more than a tourist effect. Its also cultural and national pride. Living in Thailand and having mongered in PP for 15 years, I am well aware.

Of the animosity and jealousy between Cambodian and Thai women. I have a Thai wife who refuses to go to Cambodia for a holiday. My advice to mongerers seeking the going rate for ST / LT in PP is to never, ever mention that you live in, or have just come from holidaying in Thailand. Cambodians are just as proud as the Thais, and the working girls of PP know exactly how much punters are paying in BKK, Pattaya etc. Guaranteed you tell a Cambodian girl you have just come from Thailand,

Its the Thai price or more you will pay. In their Asian way of thinking, to accept less money than the Thai girls is to admit that they are a lesser race than the Thais. Something they will never do. To this day, unless there are girls that know me in the bars / clubs, I still play the dumb newbie and get treated like one (lets face it, the girls pay alot more attention to newbies than regular punters) , with the knowledge and experience behind me to know when they are trying to rip me off.

On the topic of the cheapest, young good looking girls in SE Asia, I have found Vientiane to be the best value. 20USD LT no probs. Give it a try if PP isn't for you.

What a load of horseshit! (except the last paragraph, never been to Laos so can't comment)

I've been to PP over 20 times in the last 3 years and have never paid more than $20 ST/$30 LT and I consider those prices fair.

All the girls I've been with know where I live (Bangkok) , as it is usually the first or second question they ask me. It makes absolutely no difference where you come from, the majority of working girls in PP wouldn't have a clue what the going prices are in Bangkok.

Regarding your comments that the girls pay more attention to newbies, again I beg to differ. The regular punters who live in PP or visit on a regular basis are their bread and butter. The girls need these customers more to keep things ticking over when there's a shortage of tourists in town, so they look after them very well.

[Anzac]

"I think it's a spillover effect from Thailand. Most tourists in PP flew in from Bangkok."

Its more than a tourist effect. Its also cultural and national pride. Living in Thailand and having mongered in PP for 15 years, I am well aware
of the animosity and jealousy between Cambodian and Thai women. I have a Thai wife who refuses to go to Cambodia for a holiday. My advice to mongerers seeking the going rate for ST / LT in PP is to never, ever mention that you live in, or have just come from holidaying in Thailand. Cambodians are just as proud as the Thais, and the working girls of PP know exactly how much punters are paying in BKK, Pattaya etc. Guaranteed you tell a Cambodian girl you have just come from Thailand,
its the Thai price or more you will pay. In their Asian way of thinking, to accept less money than the Thai girls is to admit that they are a lesser race than the Thais. Something they will never do. To this day, unless there are girls that know me in the bars / clubs, I still play the dumb newbie and get treated like one (lets face it, the girls pay alot more attention to newbies than regular punters) , with the knowledge and experience behind me to know when they are trying to rip me off.

On the topic of the cheapest, young good looking girls in SE Asia, I have found Vientiane to be the best value. 20USD LT no probs. Give it a try if PP isn't for you.

[AussieGuy100]

Surprise for me, that the locals use condom. The few times I went to such places it was BB all the time.

Cheers!

The choice of whether to use condoms or not in places that don't require it is yours to make. Personally I think it's crazy not to use them here in Cambodia. HIV drugs are so good these days that HIV-positive girls often don't look any different to HIV negative girls. Sure you still see scary thin, worried looking girls, but there are many healthy looking girls who may be HIV positive. There was a discussion on another forum where it was claimed that a guy selling HIV test kits a few years ago offered to test all the girls at Cyrcee for free, and 20% of them were positive. I can't verify this, but it's a scary thought.

[Ekspat]

It was only $7, but there were no less than 20 condom wrappers on the floor and my guess would be they were all from that day.

Surprise for me, that the locals use condom. The few times I went to such places it was BB all the time.

Cheers!

[Wendella]

Someone mentioned spots for locals and I would advise that most members stay away from there. Many local men look for a different type of sexual gratification that the average foreigner. You may go to a local brothel and the girl may go for $5 for a quick fuck, but she may just spread her legs and close her eyes for the whole time. Or worse, you may realize that she is pretty much a daily mattress. I was in whatever town has the bamboo bridge and my motodriver would not shut up until I let him take me to the local brothels. When we found one that would take a black guy so I went in the room to do my thing. It was only $7, but there were no less than 20 condom wrappers on the floor and my guess would be they were all from that day.

These places really should be avoided, period. There's something much more important than our lack of comfort that is the issue in these places. These kinds of for-locals brothels are normally stocked with girls who are in debt bondage, or what the UN and most mainstream media call sex slavery. Typical story is that a daughter is handed over by a father who foolishly accrued a large gambling debt, this kind of thing. Another is that false job offers were made, and the reality instead turned out to be this place. There are other reasons to avoid, which can't really be discussed, but the gist is that you could easily put yourself at risk of ending up in a Cambodian prison, or else one in your own country. These places are bad, bad news.

[QUOTE=Tmat 4636; 1322944]L fly into PP from Bangkok this Sunday and would like a few hints from readers out there.

L haven't booked a hotel and was wondering which girlfriendly hotel is near the action as l want to hit the ground running. L am interested in a secure hotel2-3 stars $40 beint themaximum l would like to pay a night.

L have gone through the posts and would like a hint on the best route for barhopping l can make as l am in pp for only one night befor heading to Seam reap.

/QUOTE]Who is L? ;.)

[Scorchin1470]

Thanks guy for all the updates.

L fly into PP from Bangkok this Sunday and would like a few hints from readers out there.

L haven't booked a hotel and was wondering which girlfriendly hotel is near the action as l want to hit the ground running. L am interested in a secure hotel2-3 stars $40 beint themaximum l would like to pay a night.

L have gone through the posts and would like a hint on the best route for barhopping l can make as l am in pp for only one night befor heading to Seam reap.

You can PM me or reply in the thread.

Thanks in advance.

Any guys in town then can PM and we can meet up for a barhop. The last tile l was in PP was 2004

I would suggest you book an hotel before you travel if only for the first night. Old soldiers will always tell you to secure your pit first. Otherwise you will be hassled by taxis and tuk tuk drivers at the Airport. Most hotels other than the top 5 star hotels are gf. More

So if you book a double room. You can always ask outright when you book; the hotels are used to being asked.

Walk down the river font, Sisoweth Quay and the streets off it will yield more opportunities than you can manage.

[Mr Enternational]

Supply and demand only factors into prostitution that does not occur in areas heavily traversed by tourists. By that I mean that the average tourist will have no problem dropping $200 in BKK for sex, although the price should be closer to $60. For a real world example, think about the over-priced items that are in all tourists destinations.

I found that to get a reasonable p4p price in Cambodia you need to: get a freelancer, be prepared to buy a drink chat then go back the next night, get friendly with one of the other girls who will advocate for you or cross your fingers and hope.

Thanks Joe. You hit the nail right on the head. In the last few days I have been combing through your reports on Nha Trang and HCMC getting for my Vietnam trip. You are really teaching me some things brother. And big ups to Hatguy for adding this report to the ROD thread.

[Hatguy]

Joe's report has been put in the reports of distinction thread by myself. This is exactly how I felt about PP. And looking back on it I got the great GFE I got because I didn't take the girl the first day and played a bit hard to get.

I am planning to be in PP at the end of the year for a bit longer this time. Only 2 days in Pattaya and the rest drinking cheap beer and hanging out with some people I met last time. Might get over to Siam Reap. See how it goes.

[Tiger 888]

@Joe Looking: I couldn't have put that better. Very well said. And that is exactly why I like Cambodia over Thailand.

[Joe Looking]

Supply and demand only factors into prostitution that does not occur in areas heavily traversed by tourists. By that I mean that the average tourist will have no problem dropping $200 in BKK for sex, although the price should be closer to $60. For a real world example, think about the over-priced items that are in all tourists destinations.

I found that to get a reasonable p4p price in Cambodia you need to: get a freelancer, be prepared to buy a drink chat then go back the next night, get friendly with one of the other girls who will advocate for you or cross your fingers and hope.

So why the high prices?

At Horny and one of the other bars I went to the girls each received a salary. It was not a lot, but it was more than enough to sustain them given the local cost of living and their lifestyle. They were also not forced by management to fuck. I'm not sure if it is still widely the case, but I was told that in BKK and Pattaya it was once pro-forma for the girls to have to pull in a certain amount in lady drinks and bar fines per week or they would owe the bar. I was also told that many bars did not let women refuse a customer. Those sorts of conditions mean that workers have to fuck, which means the customer has a bit of leverage in the price. If most PP bars are like the two I mentioned, the girls can hold on until they get the price they want. At Horny, there was a girl who had only been barfined I think twice in 6 months and she did not want to drop her price below $40 and ST or LT she only wanted to have sex once.

You all may want to ask if the girls get a salary before asking about the ST / LT price. If they have no salary there will come a time when they have no choice but to deal. For example, there are deals to be had in Cyrcee because at least when I was there last I was told that they get no salary. Not counting the BF you can get the girls for 30-40LT and maybe less if you are a repeat customer for them. When I was there in March one of the girls who works in 2s first offered me 2 girls LT for 90 then 80 then 60 and I later found out that neither had been barfined in 3 weeks. Things could be different now, but from what I saw the only chick who seemed to be in high demand was the one who took it up the butt. The rest stand there hoping most nights. There's also nothing wrong with asking the bartender who never gets barfined or how often a particular girl is barfined.

Another thing affecting the cost is the USD. Many SEA business people are fairly ignorant of western ideas of capitalism. The idea of things like loss leaders, pricing for a local market and so on are largely foreign to them. That said, most of them probably throw out numbers like $50 because it is "big money" for them, but seems like "small money" for most foreigners. Kind of like how some freelancers in Vientiane charge 12000 kip ($15USD) for LT but others will ask for 2500 THB (70USD?) if they think you are on a border run because that is what men pay in Thailand.

If you want bar girls for a reasonable price then be prepared to put some work in or try a different approach than walking up to the prettiest one and saying how much. Your goals are to get the girl and at least one other girl to think you are nice and to soften your main girl up. This means that you will probably walk away with nothing at least the first night. One really good thing to do is to get one of the other girls to advocate for you. I once bought a girl a drink because she was nice and spoke okay English. I then told her point blank that I was not into her. Instead of getting pissy she told me to point out the girl I liked. She then called the girl over, introduced us and stayed through the negotiations. Initially the girl wanted something ridiculous but the first girl talked her pretty far down. One subtle thing that is lost on many mongers is that a ton of women working in SEA bars do not actually consider themselves to be prostitutes, more opportunists. Because of that distinction you cannot approach them all by immediately asking how much. Sometimes you have to say you like them and want to take them home then give them the opportunity to bring up money.

I found the Cambodians to be far less hardened than the chicks at agogos and some bars in BKK. You might have to work a bit harder for some of the Cambodians but I found that many of them are worth it. One guy put it to me like this. When he was in Thailand 20 years ago all the bar girls wanted to get married to a foreigner so if you could get them to like you or think you were a nice guy, you could get away with murder. Now many Thai chicks just want cash. In Cambodia some of them seem to want a nice guy and not all the money they can get, so if they like you then all bets are off.

Someone mentioned spots for locals and I would advise that most members stay away from there. Many local men look for a different type of sexual gratification that the average foreigner. You may go to a local brothel and the girl may go for $5 for a quick fuck, but she may just spread her legs and close her eyes for the whole time. Or worse, you may realize that she is pretty much a daily mattress. I was in whatever town has the bamboo bridge and my motodriver would not shut up until I let him take me to the local brothels. When we found one that would take a black guy so I went in the room to do my thing. It was only $7, but there were no less than 20 condom wrappers on the floor and my guess would be they were all from that day.

[Tmat 4636]

Thanks guy for all the updates.

L fly into PP from Bangkok this Sunday and would like a few hints from readers out there.

L haven't booked a hotel and was wondering which girlfriendly hotel is near the action as l want to hit the ground running. L am interested in a secure hotel2-3 stars $40 beint themaximum l would like to pay a night.

L have gone through the posts and would like a hint on the best route for barhopping l can make as l am in pp for only one night befor heading to Seam reap.

You can PM me or reply in the thread.

Thanks in advance.

Any guys in town then can PM and we can meet up for a barhop. The last tile l was in PP was 2004

[GentleBoner]

Actually, I never brought up the prospect of leaving with them as I was usually still enjoying my first drink. Each and every time (except when I stopped on the bar on 51) they brought it up to me. So it wasn't a question of me just rolling in and treating it like a brothel. The prices just don't match the country though, place and simple, even at the rates you're saying.

Cambodia 159th in GDP per capita. Average monthly income = $30. Average ST $33 USD.

Thailand 94th in GDP per capita. Average monthly income = $683. Average ST $30 USD.

Philippines 133rd in GDP per capita. Average monthly income = $142. Average ST $17 USD.

Hong Kong 28th in GDP per capita. Average monthly income = $1353. Average ST $33 USD.

Does that seem right to you?

This place seems to be totally skewed on prices, probably largely because of the dollarized economy. I pay more for coffee and ST here than I do in Philippines or Thailand. From what people have told me, rent here for a Western style apartment is double what it costs for a new condo unit in the Philippines. Heading to the airport now to check out Bangkok. Want to get some enjoyment on my holiday. Enjoy your overpriced ST's and lack of sidewalks my friend.

All in good fun of course. The value just isn't there for me. I'll chalk it up to experience. Thanks for the help from those who offered.

You're right that the prices haven't gotten too high in PP. Especially considering the city itself isn't an attraction.

I think it's a spillover effect from Thailand. Most tourists in PP flew in from Bangkok. Girls there cost about $75 / ST from gogos and MPs, so when you can get girls for half that in PP it seems like a bargain.

The prices asked at the bars on 102 and 136 are ridiculous $40 or 50 for ST. I never pay that and rarely visit those places.

The freelancers are much more reasonable. $20 or $25 LT for a nice girl you're attracted to seems like a good deal, and it's one I've partaken in frequently as a result.


I choose not to live there because the apartment prices are way too high. You can get furnished condos in the Philippines or thailand for cheaper than you'd pay for a shithole in PP.