Phnom Penh

[Orange Sunshine]

So very very glad to see the big guys getting written up for having sex w/ prostitutes, i.e. NY governor Spitzer. The US is run by a bunch of sexually repressed men and women who go to some facimile of church to feel good about their fucked up mentalities.

He was using taxpayer money to pay for services; for that he should be banned from public office. But as far as having sex with a prostitute, that should be a matter between him and his wife and not addressed by laws based on Judeo-Christian morals. Is that the point you wanted to make?

Sorry for diversion. Let's get back to the scene in Phnom Penh.

[Orange Sunshine]

Wow, I am in Phnom Penh again and what a difference 2 months makes!! The place (in my humble opinion) has fallen to peices. It is scarcely worth coming here to monger at the moment, it would almost seem as though there is some kind of movement to get rid of the Vietnamese girls...Cyrcee's was good on Friday night and then empty on Saturday night, but apart from that one good night in Cyrcee's the rest has been nothing to get excited about..maybe this is because of the Khmer Rouge trial thing that has been going on, maybe they decided to clean the place up...

Could you elaborate on this a bit? Are you saying the usual venues are dry for Vietnamese providers? or that girls are gone altogether because of a clean up? What other places did you visit recently? I was also there in early January and, like you, I thought things were humming along.

Can anyone else out there add to Bowerboy's observations?

[Hummer Bird]

Its funny you should mention this, because MSNBC just did a 1hr documentry last night about the sex tourism industry and you PP was just a popular place, and how the women are sold into sexual slavery. They went on as to how long it took the Cambodian government to do anything about it, until Bush signed into law banning US citizens from traveling abroad with the intent to have sex with a prostitute.

So very very glad to see the big guys getting written up for having sex w/ prostitutes, i.e. NY governor Spitzer. The US is run by a bunch of sexually repressed men and women who go to some facimile of church to feel good about their fucked up mentalities.
The reason this country is so fucked is because nobody is fucking, and everybody is handcuffed for doing it. Finally their was an Age of Consent report done by John Stossle(sp?) on lame O 20/20, and he noted how screwed and skewed the whole system is. So very disturbing to see men and women being punished for natural biological behaviors. Obviously I do not condone or respect any grown men or women for seeking out children for sex, but this Age of Consent really does shine light on the stupidity of labrinth laws to punish all.
I hope the B administration rots in hell for what they have done to the world and the US.
And I encourage all men with clacking balls to get out of the states and start living!!!!!!!!!!!!!.

[Blackangst]

its funny you should mention this, because msnbc just did a 1hr documentry last night about the sex tourism industry and you pp was just a popular place, and how the women are sold into sexual slavery. they went on as to how long it took the cambodian government to do anything about it, until bush signed into law banning us citizens from traveling abroad with the intent to have sex with a prostitute.

the law applies to **** sex tourism. there is no law regarding legal ages.

[RonnieMonger]

Its funny you should mention this, because MSNBC just did a 1hr documentry last night about the sex tourism industry and you PP was just a popular place, and how the women are sold into sexual slavery. They went on as to how long it took the Cambodian government to do anything about it, until Bush signed into law banning US citizens from traveling abroad with the intent to have sex with a prostitute.

Didn't know there was a new US law that now prevents you from having sex with 'above' age hookers whilst abroad! Man they'll be banning Internet porn before you know it. Wanking will be next. The "wanker" police.

I must agree PP is getting a bit stranger. And I think this is because the anti-prostitution NGO types (let's call a spade a spade. They're not "NGOs" like the conventional types. Who also like to monger on occasion I reckon. They're "moral zealots" opposed to ALL prostitution. That's their 'mission' or 'missionary') and they are using their mobile phones to take pictures of the customers inside the favorite sex venues. I've seen this already actually (at least I was pretty sure that's what was happening). The guy tried to be discreet but I noticed it on one occasion.

[Blackangst]

its funny you should mention this, because msnbc just did a 1hr documentry last night about the sex tourism industry and you pp was just a popular place, and how the women are sold into sexual slavery. they went on as to how long it took the cambodian government to do anything about it, until bush signed into law banning us citizens from traveling abroad with the intent to have sex with a prostitute.

the law was in regars to ****d prostitutes. it is not illegal to travel for mongering.

[DFWdude]

Wow, I am in Phnom Penh again and what a difference 2 months makes!! The place (in my humble opinion) has fallen to peices. It is scarcely worth coming here to monger at the moment, it would almost seem as though there is some kind of movement to get rid of the Vietnamese girls...Cyrcee's was good on Friday night and then empty on Saturday night, but apart from that one good night in Cyrcee's the rest has been nothing to get excited about..maybe this is because of the Khmer Rouge trial thing that has been going on, maybe they decided to clean the place up...

Went to street 63 and a few of the places were closed or just waving people away...went into one place in 63 and got a girl upstairs but it was clear from the beginning that she was going to be a complete waste of time...I had already paid the $15 in advance and I was very surprised that when I came back downstairs the Papasan agreed to refund my money in full...I think the stories about trapdoors under the bed are an urban myth personally.

Just my 2 cents worth but personally I feel that Phnom Penh is in its death Knell (I have been here 5 times over the last 15 years) and it has been amazing to see the transformation since I first came here in 1994... or even since January when I was here last!!!

Its funny you should mention this, because MSNBC just did a 1hr documentry last night about the sex tourism industry and you PP was just a popular place, and how the women are sold into sexual slavery. They went on as to how long it took the Cambodian government to do anything about it, until Bush signed into law banning US citizens from traveling abroad with the intent to have sex with a prostitute.

[Bowerboy]

Wow, I am in Phnom Penh again and what a difference 2 months makes!! The place (in my humble opinion) has fallen to peices. It is scarcely worth coming here to monger at the moment, it would almost seem as though there is some kind of movement to get rid of the Vietnamese girls...Cyrcee's was good on Friday night and then empty on Saturday night, but apart from that one good night in Cyrcee's the rest has been nothing to get excited about..maybe this is because of the Khmer Rouge trial thing that has been going on, maybe they decided to clean the place up...

Went to street 63 and a few of the places were closed or just waving people away...went into one place in 63 and got a girl upstairs but it was clear from the beginning that she was going to be a complete waste of time...I had already paid the $15 in advance and I was very surprised that when I came back downstairs the Papasan agreed to refund my money in full...I think the stories about trapdoors under the bed are an urban myth personally.

Just my 2 cents worth but personally I feel that Phnom Penh is in its death Knell (I have been here 5 times over the last 15 years) and it has been amazing to see the transformation since I first came here in 1994... or even since January when I was here last!!!

[Wendella]

If you have 3-4 days, you will spend one whole day just getting to Siem Reap and or Sihanoukville. Count on 6hrs of bus travel, which at the end does not drop you conviently at a hotel. Thus you will need to Tuk Tuk it from the bus stations, and find a hotel to unload and shower (1hr). Set up arrangements to see Ankor Wat, tour starts at 7-8 in the a.m.. Then get back again. It is either PP or SR as you window of time is too limited.

By the way unless you are a hardcore anthropologist, 1 day is enough of Ankor.

OK, it does take abt 6 hrs by bus to get to Siem Reap from PP, that's right. You could also instead fly into SR rather than stop in PP on the way. Flights to PP (Air Asia) are much lower than to SR. Whether taking the bus or flight, if you book a room ahead of time via the net (one suggestion: www.talesofasia.com, the Two Dragons in SR) they'll pick you up at the bus station or airport. I think that would be free. Same is true in PP with Flamingo. (btw, the bus trip to Sihanoukville from PP should be only 4 hrs). Your Angkor tour can start anytime you like -- I've always done it with a motorbike guy, and then I'm on my own inside the temple (not led by a guide). Last, I've done the Angkor temples twice, and I'd say one day is a bum's rush through it. Two days would be about right for the first time -- I found 3 days straight did burn me out. So I'd suggest get the 3 day pass and then go on day one, then take a day off and go again on the last day for the rest. Angkor Wat itself (the biggest by far of the bunch) is worth at least a few hours alone. If you can get something that explains the wall carvings on the ground floor, they tell stories of epic battles or scenes from the Mahabharatta (sp? -- Hindu holy epic text) with an overwhelming amount of interesting detail, if you can figure out what you're looking at. In one area, one after another of torture scenes are depicted. Battles with monkey armies atop elephants in other areas. These murals (they're carved) go on and on for hundreds of meters in length*, on each side of the ground level. And this is just the first level. It's true that you can get tired of looking at more and more temples one after another, but if you refresh yourself in between then you will notice the unique things on your later visits and be able to appreciate it. If you went all that way, should try to get as much of the experience as possible, in the best conditions, I think.

ps: To go to Angkor Wat and not enter the temples, as suggested below, well, to go into the temples is what the experience is all about. I mean, would you go to Bangkok and only look at the Grand Palace and Wat Po from outside the wall? Or maybe go to Nana Plaza and only stand at the front gate, not go inside? You can save money on beer then, and no risk of having to pay a bar fine. ;-)

* exaggeration... but it's REALLY LONG

[Sammon]

There is no Pass required to enter the temple complex.
If you do not enter the temples physically it is ok. You can see from outside and take pictures etc.
The guy at the entrance will ask you for the Ticket if you try to enter any of the temples.

[Dinghy]

Angkor "pass" - 1 day $20; 3 days $40; 7 days $60

Don't get caught without it - the fine is $100 and you have to go back and buy the pass, too

Now being HONEST - Bayon, Elephant Terrace, couple of the other "more famous ruins" and a look at some restoration activity is worth a DAY (8AM to 4PM or so) and frankly, AFTER YOU'VE SEEN ONE BIG FUCKING PILE OF ROCKS YOU'VE SEEN THEM ALL (ruins, that is, the "intact temples" and the ones under restoration are interesting and good photo ops)

Grab a bite to eat at 4 or so and wait somewhere close to Angkor until 5 PM or so then take the hike up the hill to the summit temple ruins directly across from the Angkor causeway. Watch the sundown, take a few more pix (you DID take pix at all those photo sites earlier in the day, right?) then right after sunset GET YOUR ASS DOWN OFF THE HILL! (it's not "dangerous" - might be better if you have a torch and it is NOT pitch black going down the elephant trail to/from the summit (which you can ride the elephant for $15 or so, if you so fancy) BUT THE BUGS ARE OUT FOR BLOOD - YOUR BLOOD (and with dengue in the area, tis better to avoid than be bitten (OK?) OFF! Deep Woods repelled them more or less (100% DEET)

Next day go back out and do Angkor itself. Takes at least 4 hours to scratch the surface (poor pun - don't scratch it, it's marvelous to look at the ancient Hindu temple works) Climb to the top (not for the faint of heart - only ONE handrail, the steps are about 16 inches high and while it's easy enough going UP, going down is where the faint of heart will feel it) Several nooks and crannies with various Buddha images there and a marvelous frieze in relief around the outer pavillion of the Ramamaya tale of Vishnu and triumph over the demonic forces (all 300 meters (900 feet more or less) of it).

Then, unless you are not worn out yet. GO BACK TO PP or Thailand. SR seems to flood easily - an early evening thunderstorm and the streets seem to have up to 10 cm of water (6 inches).

There is entertainment, just not a whole lot unless you speak Khmer (I don't, poot Thai, dai, though) or want to take "pot luck"

Obviously, this doesn't belong in PP posting, but since that's where the question started, I'll leave it here

[Hummer Bird]

If you have 3-4 days, you will spend one whole day just getting to Siem Reap and or Sihanoukville. Count on 6hrs of bus travel, which at the end does not drop you conviently at a hotel. Thus you will need to Tuk Tuk it from the bus stations, and find a hotel to unload and shower (1hr). Set up arrangements to see Ankor Wat, tour starts at 7-8 in the a.m.. Then get back again. It is either PP or SR as you window of time is too limited.

By the way unless you are a hardcore anthropologist, 1 day is enough of Ankor. As there are really only 4-5 temples that are the bomb, the rest are small and rely on "interesting" stories to desiginate their importance. And the endless Tuk Tuk hum on seemingly never ending roads around SR makes it very tiring to spend three days driving around. You will be spent in more ways that one.

Like Wendella said, the selection of babes in Cambo is not geared toward stunners, nor girls that really maintain themselves in a 1st world kind of way. But it is cheap. SV brothels are the right out of a David Lynch movie freak scene. I would avoid them and go to the bars, and "nicer" hostess places. Sometimes you will find somthing perceived as very pretty (see PP Photo Gallery- Jewel), but often the perception is due to ones long term exposure to uglies.

once again
Cheers.
Hummer.

[Run Mann]

On my last trip to PP, I used driver Chhoeun Sovann and he was very reliable, he operates out of the Big Luck hotel and obviously knows his way around town, check out his web site below.
http://phnompenhdriver.com/

[Wendella]

I'm in thailand and have been 5 times. I want to see something different before I go to the USA. I'll probably be going myself and feel leary of a new place. Can someone suggest some basics, ie. where to go from the airport, (hotel, etc)

I would like to see some sites as well as having some fun. Also just what not to do to stay out of trouble. Also I'm open to going to siem riep instead since I'll just have 3-4 days.

I'd say FLY to Phnom Penh, that road trip is hell. If you really want to see some sights and feel like you really saw something, head straight to Angkor Wat the next day and take 3 days or so to go around and see all the temples. Ask for the VIP bus to go from PP to Siem Reap, it was $12 last time I took it, gets you there by afternoon. Very comfortable, they even give you a coffee and croissant as you set off. Phnom Penh's sights and atmosphere are nothing great. Sihanoukville is a normal beach town, and beachwise isn't near as good as Thailand's best (they must have good drugs there tho, if anyone could think that -- its good, not great -- murky brownish water, for one). You said you wanted something different than Thailand. Angkor is different. Phnom Penh and S'ville are cheaper, smaller versions of what Thailand has to offer -- PP as mongering destination with bars & clubs (fewer girls than in BKK or PTY and finding hot ones is tougher in PP); SV has some very seedy venues, not for the faint of heart. Siem Reap is all about Angkor and its venues are expensive, lousy, not even worth the visit unless you're really desperate.

If you're mainly interested in mongering and are happy with sth just a bit diff than Thailand, then by all means go to PP and SV. You might be disappointed (very few super-hotties, sometimes none), or you might dig it. (cheap)

[Dinghy]

There are 4 ways to do the trip in the Cambodia part

SR to Poipet (120 miles of either dusty or muddy road and takes about 4 hours or so depending on road conditions)

SR to Battambang (you wind up going down thru Sway to Battambang, then Battambang to Paillin and entering Thailand from there - but watch it - there have been some entry into Thailand scams going on at the border where they want a bus tickey "onward" - go read trip reports from "talesofasia.com" - it's about the best overland travel site out there - and they don't do the sex part so it's NOT a competing site to this one)

SR to PP and then PP to either Poipet (you just went a long ways out of the way to get where you could have gone direct) or Paillin (see above - you REALLY need to know how to do it this way or have someone with you who speaks Khmer or English (there))

SR to PP to Koh Kong (you cut off the route ro S'ville about 100 miles and head west thru the Cardamoms. Scenic trip but it takes about 7 hours from PP with 2 new bridge crossings and 2 ferry crossings - it used to be 4 ferry crossings. Take lots of fluids because except for the ferry crossings they try not to stop. Read the reports on "tales" but you will need to drill down into the reports which are in chronological order. They WERE dropping people right at the border, then 110B minibus ride to Trat, then a bus north to Rayong, then change for a bus to Pattaya.)

Alternately screw it and fly back on AirAsia for $55 or so plus the $25 departure fee - 1 hour. IF you are in PP, the AirAsia office is very close to "International Hotel"

I do the overland in ONE direction because I like the trip...ah, the "adventure" of it all. Besides, I want to see how much progress they are making on the remaining 2 bridges (be there in 10 weeks)