Kyiv

[Harry Hardman]

You're very funny with this "Blink" thing in your reports.

LJ, I am humming the immigrant song for you, and then you can maybe figure out approximately where I come from.

Yea, we always have to talk to the girls before we take them home, don't we. There can be bitches everywhere. But I am glad to read that you found many sweet girls in the pay for play venues. If one likes to "hunt" in a hard core prostitution environment, it is always nice if there is some atmosphere and some friendly people. I agree, it can be comfortable to shoot fish in a barrel. One parameter is already taken care of so to speak. You can be pretty sure they will f*ck you unless you smell or are a bastard. The parameter of what they will do is almost always a trade off with girls who took the step and publicly works as prostitutes. They will for sure almost always have some "rule" that their imaginary pride or health are hung up on. But we horny dogs can take that as long as they are friendly or pretend to be friendly at least. I will remember to talk to the girl next time I get a lap dance. Will be tough but the things we do not put ourselves through to have some variation in the barba-burgers we dive in to. A newfound friend told me you can either touch the girl up or wank off in the dance boot. The napkins in the one boot I had a dance in, during my visit to Kiev, indicates that not everyone go for touching the female. I tried to do a little bit of both and no alarm went off. I forgot the name of that club but the girl was pretty. An 8. 36 in my book. Blink.

In shooters I met a couple of very friendly girls. I do not think they where hard core pros because we where dancing and partying all night. I was drained and normally do not like to fuck after a bottle of vodka anyway, but got some numbers that I did not follow up on properly. I love the hunt. Woff. Since some speak of skin color here, it seems like they sometimes will refuse entry for people with darker skin and hair. But I would still try Shooters because it is great fun. Vodka bar is more edgy with more drunk, young Ukraine boys but still good fun. My ISG buddy almost got into a fight over a female but a knight saved him before it got serious. Later the same Ukrainian guys where fighting someone else, and then choose to take a punch at the guards so I imagine at least the little cocky prick where in sever pain after the six guards where done.

This was the view that kept me dancing, even after the bottles started to fly all around us. Nice girl with sexy moves but Barba and his agent buddy slipped and failed with her and her big tit friend. Anyone else know them?

B.

[Harry Hardman]

I hate to tell you all this: Racism is alive and well in Ukraine. Haven't you heard about? : a black guy from USA embassy jogging around town was harassed and beaten up by the Kiev police. And a Korean guy was killed in Kharkov?

I am African American and I actually been here in Kiev for 1 month and will be here for 2 more months. I have wesley snipes complexion (very dark) but like to think I have a really cool style when it comes to fashion. Pedro was right in the sense of not walking by yourself at night out of crowded areas downtown and nearby clubs or bars. Now granted I will be honest. I have only been out 1 time since I have been here and that was to TGI Fridays with a puerto rican friend of mines. I got stares from women but none in which I could actually decipher and I kept walking. I chose not to speak cause I figured they either did not speak english or would not speak to me in fear of ukranian men watching them or something. (that was my reasoning). Now I could have been wrong but if you step out. You will get stares from men also (some good, some bad). In reality no one on this site can tell you what people think about you because they are not black. Now they can go off what women may tell them or darker complexion friends they may have went out with. Climax kindly gave me pointers also as to what to expect here and you get mixed reviews. Some guys here will say ukranian women love darker complexion guys because you would be considered exotic, some guys will tell you ukranian women may or may not talk to you. I decided to use mamba and banged 2 chicks. Both about 6 or 7 in my book, but they were both freebies simply because they were fascinated with black men. I got a few messages from women who said they are not into black men so it's a toss up. While you are in town. Let me know and I may hang with you. Granted I have not stepped foot in a single club or bar except TGI Fridays. I am still earning this place

[Prosal]

Sad to see how so many here are discussing how to impress on the females with these shoes or that brand of clothes. Sure it is fine to dress well and feel like a winner, but get some self esteem guys. A monthly salary for a teacher is 200 USD. No need to wear Armani unless your ego needs this to be able to talk to a girl.

To say that someone who is well-dressed is someone who lacks of self esteem is simply silly. Of course, being well-groomed doesn't compensate a lack of self-confidence, charm, witt or poise. But you can have those qualities AND have taste in the way you dress.

About the 200us$ teacher, let me disagree also. Dyevs, whatever their social class, their age group or their expectations, inevitably dress to the tens when they go out, and for most of them anything less than a similarly well-appointed guy is not a guy worth fucking. It's a question of self-respect. Especially if you're a foreigner. Coming from the West, you CAN'T convince a Russian girl that you don't like or can't afford to dress well. It's beyond her comprehension. It has been said many many times here, dressing style is even more important than looks in this part of the world.

BTW Armani is now just a mid-level brand which abuse of the ridiculously emblazoned clothes that screams out that the wearer is a poseur.

ISG is the place where men create fantasy versions of a country, and the need to qualify for the females are always an ingredient in every fantasy incarnation I see.

You seem to forget that Russia, Ukraine, ect are definitely class societies and you want (you must) to show everybody which class you are in. The fashion issue is an unending issue in FSU. Russian (and Ukrainian for that matter) girls are second to none in their obsession with it. I agree that they are very superficial in that respect.

As a Moscow resident rightly said in the ISG Russia forums, being well-groomed is deadly effective in FSU. Dress with rafinement and style (the "style" IMO doesn't include to wear a suit) and you'll literally pushing girls off of you, no matter your language skills.

[Prosal]

BTW - pleats are currently back in fashion.

You must be attempting humour here.

[DoctorOral]

I can test her for you. Tonight, if you want! PM me with details, I will post or PM you my report.

Anyone with experience from this girl? Told me she is not into P4P when we had lunch. I need to qualify with time. Model that just turned 18. I checked her passport. PM if you know her but do not wish to take it here.

B.

[Member #4491]

Anyone with experience from this girl? Told me she is not into P4P when we had lunch. I need to qualify with time. Model that just turned 18. I checked her passport. PM if you know her but do not wish to take it here.

B.

[Member #4491]

Spoken like someone with his sights set on average. Enjoy.

CD, try to see beyond you own need to come across as a winner in every post you make, and read what I am actually writing. A looser in a suit is still a looser. Most women will choose a self secure man / winner rather than a well dressed looser. Powerful DNA and self distance prevails. Only the females with equally corrupt and weak egos will stare herself blind on the brand of the suit. Real quality females will rarely fall for the cheap expensive suit trick (especially not if you look outside the [CodeWord140] poor sheit holes of this globe). Where a man has collected the 1200 numbers is irrelevant if one can see the bigger picture / patterns. I guess it all depends on how you define "average". Most men are pathetic in their anxious and vain need to impress (mostly themselves).

I agree that a bad dressed looser is perhaps the absolute worst combination for scoring pretty girls. And to dress well will rarely hurt the cause, even though Prosal has a point about being the club clown. Females are attracted to recourses (financial, intellectual etc). If you project an image of controlling resources by any mean, they will be attracted to you. The most impressive resource controller is perhaps a humoristic, financially independent and intelligent man with a good portion of self distance, yet in touch with the monkey that will f*ck her like the female she is. Or is this just my own vanity speaking?

All the best from Barba (who did not wear jeans since the mid 90s)

[Cruiser D]

Spoken like someone with his sights set on average. Enjoy.

Sad to see how so many here are discussing how to impress on the females with these shoes or that brand of clothes. Sure it is fine to dress well and feel like a winner, but get some self esteem guys. A monthly salary for a teacher is 200 USD. No need to wear Armani unless your ego needs this to be able to talk to a girl. And of you are trying to impress prostitutes with your clothes, you are in serious need of some coaching.

Either I was warped to another Ukraine, or guys here believe all the shit these girls try to fill them with. Take command and be a positive and interesting guy, and you can wear almost whatever you wish and still meet great girls. ISG is the place where men create fantasy versions of a country, and the need to qualify for the females are always an ingredient in every fantasy incarnation I see.

[Cruiser D]

I generally have one of my girls call one of the various taxi dispatchers for me.

Otherwise I try to keep it to under 30uah in the center. If one taxi is too high just say no and go to the next.

Look. Plese do not do this! Learn Russian numbers for taxi, do NEVER pay more than 50 unless going to the airport!

We need to keep it real, so HELP, all of you!

[Cruiser D]

My success must be unique to me.

See you at the club with the Afflication shirt and bling on.

BTW - pleats are currently back in fashion, although it was never a look I liked.

Well, depends of the suit. An 1500€ Roberto Cavalli, Pal Zileri or Zegna suit (slim cut, straight pants, two buttons, ect) and a 500$ out of date three buttons suit with pleat-front pants (or worse, cuffs) are two very different things. Slavic girls are VERY fashion-conscious and are very good at jauging what you wear (and very fast to write you off if they judge that you are cheap and has-been).

Recently I bumped into the photo galleries of the famous "romance tours in Ukraine" organized for yanks by Anastasia dot com (or something alike) and I ROTFLOL just to see how most of the guys were dressed, that is with outmoded and cheap suits.

Anyway, I don't imagine myself wearing a suit in a club, but as usual, to each its own.

[Cruiser D]

It all depends on where you are and the time of day. Even oligarchs wear ties during the day.

I hit Kiev in 2004, spent probably 3-4 years in total in Ukraine and have about 1200 names and numbers in my Ukrainian mobile phone, please do tell me how it really is.

I happen to be the president of a corporation and I dress usually with suit or at least a blazer, nice pants and wear a tie. A girl explained to me that the real rich men in this part of the world DO NOT wear a tie. The people who work for them wear ties. The rich (called oligarchs here) can afford a more casual look. The bottom line, if you dress up to impress, as we do in the West, it is interpreted here (I am in Kiev now) as a want to be.

[LilJoey]

LJ, please. You can't stop mentioning at every post the club they say you are a shill for? At first I thought they misrepresented you, but by now it is obvious you are working the social media for them. C'mon, give us a break! Please prove me wrong, don't talk about that club again, and let me apologize to you.

Pedro, if you decide to enter into a conversation between two other people (in this case Barba and I) , at least read what the conversation is about before offering a rebuke. We were talking about the possibility or lack thereof of GFE dates from the strip club, so the topic of the conversation into which you entered makes your comment not logical.

Barba had previously commented about the jaded and bitchy attitude that usually is exhibited by hardened prostitutes, which is the reason he doesn't like the strip club environment as he assumes no GFE would be possible. I responded to him that the concern is true of all Working Girls no matter where one is trying to pick them up, whether it be in a nightclub, or a strip club, or even a mamba. Ru escort coming to you apartment. In all cases, one needs to carefully interview the girl and use all one's mongering skills to try to recognize the signs that the girl is a bad experience waiting to happen, or is the GFE great experience that one hopes for.

In his last post (did you even read it?) he seemed to misunderstand me and gave an exaggerated description of what I was saying, writing that I have found the one place in the world where sexworkers don't become hardened and jaded from their work. I wrote in response to that post, that one shouldn't overstate what I was saying, and I agree undoubtedly some girls are jaded.

Instead, I said, what is important to understand is that one must carefully interview the girl to find out what type of personality she is, and a second point, that you yourself are part of the equation, and if you treat the girl in a sweet and charming fashion, you are more likely to elicit friendly responses from her, a foundation upon which a GFE date might be built. I noted that while I cannot quantify how many girls are in the club who are GFE as a percentage, the fact is that following my method of interviewing the girl and my gut intuition and sense of her vibes, I have rejected and avoided many girls, and chosen only those with whom I felt a very good connection and chemistry with. And so in over a year of taking out dates from the strip club using care and common sense, I have yet to take out a girl who ended up being bitchy to me, and have had consistently GFE results, in the sense of friendliness and fun and good sex, even if in several cases BBBJ (usually included in definition of GFE) was not provided, although the sex was otherwise very good.

My post was about getting GFE, and the importance do so when seeking p4p with Working Girls,

[How14]

They will not kill you. Bargain a bit and just get into the cab. Ukraine is not such a bad country as some guys make it sound. All in all, these are good people. More honest than many other nationalities I came across. They will however often try to increase the price. Over charge you, just like cops. Stand your ground and know your rights / what is right, and you will be fine. It can be good to learn how to say 20, 30, 40, 50, 60 and 70 as well as "deal". When it comes to cops it is a matter of defending you rights. Ask anyone from Ukraine that you get a honest relation with, and they will confirm this. This is not a lawless society, in that ultra corrupt African or South American sense. People know what is the right thing to do, and they know that they can get into trouble if they harass tourists or citizen.

Why don't you try the bus from the airport? It is an interesting experience to ride with a bus full of locals. Took me 12 sec to Google info on what bus to use. Cost you 10% of a taxi (25 grivnas) , but the main benefit is that you get to see a bit of the everyday life of people when you commute with public transportation. Subway cost about 2 gremlins.

Barba

I totally agree, the bus from the airport is a great experience, seeing people on the bus and the locals is great to see. Why take a taxi at them prices?

[How14]

To be more precise in Pattaya, Thailand I met a brother at a McDonalds who was there with 2 ukrainian girls in his arm. I flirted a little with one of them and when he came back from the bathroom we talked and I sat to eat with them. When they were done, the one I was flirting with left her pocketbook (I think she did it on purpose). Anyway we chatted some more and she gave me her cell number. We hooked up later that day on the beach by Soi 7 and we had a great, great afternoon and evening. She lives over there in Thailand. I wish I had taken a picture, but no I did not. Meeting her in Thailand last year is one of the reason why I am going to the Ukraine.

Its Pattaya I'm referring to to be precise, ok, you would have noticed on walking street plenty of Russian / Ukrainians wandering about, and many with black guys. Ok, be safe there my friend.

[How14]

It is really funny with these taxis in Kiew. And somtimes tragic. Firstly, it is difficult to find english-speaking driver. Secondly, every car is a possible taxi. All over town, day and night, there are men sitting in cars, and if you approach them, they will ask you: Taxi? Thirdly, there is the price. I sometimes think the distance is totally irrelevant. Therefore, I always negotiate the price beforehand, even if I speak almost no Russian. Just name some hotel, restaurant, bar they know, and they will give you price. Minimum 40 for a foreigner. Now they are starting to demand 200 at night. Even the hookers were shocked and wanted another. If you find english speaking driver at night, he may want to take you to some clubs or saloons, he may also want to take care of all your trips. I once had and lost a tel number which I could call for taxi, english speaking, and he would tell me the exact and totally fair and cheap price (compared to street-prices) , and also tell me how long I would have to wait for the taxi to arrive. Does anyone know this? Fourthly, in the heat of the summer, like beginning of May, I would accept everything below 81 uah, but demand air conditioning. And don't be surpized, I find the drivers can have very creative navigation skills, especially around Maidan with its one-way-streets. Coming to Kiev for the first time, I don't regret that I had ordered a transfer from my landlord. Of course it is possible to negotiate with the drivers on site, but I am sure this was cheaper in the end. In this forum, someone mentioned a bus or some other transportation. Flying to Zhelany has made this a lot simpler.

Simply not true what you have said here, prices don't start at 40, I've had taxis for 20 from shooters, to maidan, it all depends on your negotiating skills and how desperate the driver is. Try your luck, plenty of drivers will queue up as your talking, so you can cherry pick the cars.