American Politics

[Golfinho]

I am certain that President Barack Obama would have performed much better in dealing with this viral outbreak (definitely at the beginning). Barack probably would have saved the world if he was still in power. and done nothing in the entire month of February other than repeatedly say that the virus was a hoax.

At the beginning? When was that? We've all been to China — and everywhere else in Asia — where they've been wearing masks for years, years before Obamatime. Viral outbreaks any of which could have escalated to global pandemic and all the Chinese did was strap on masks and keep on churning out their junk while focused on GDP. Look for a root cause to eliminate the next potential outbreak? It was not happening. Preparedness Chinese-style has been mask up and when it's too bad the Party goes heavy-handed.

For this specific covid-19 situation: in the Philippines by mid-January, there were no masks and no hand sanitizer available anywhere. Sold out. Everyone was on alert, taxis were not picking up Chinese, hotels were assuring us they had no Chinese guests (as everyone was asking). Back in the USA near end of January, there were no masks anywhere — pharmacy, medical supply, or construction supply stores. At Wal-Mart I started asking why and was told Chinese came in and bought them all. At Ace Hardware, they told me Chinese had been calling non-stop asking for masks. The Chinese response once the virus reached community transmission stage in the West and the death toll surpassed theirs was: 'your fault for not being prepared. ' Translated that means: you failed to lay in a sufficient supply of masks and your ruling Party didn't run militarized police out to drag the citizenry kicking and screaming into quarantine, while suppressing the scale and scope of the virus and silencing anyone who spoke up.

The only way to prevent the epidemic was to immediately stop flights from China, and quarantine anyone who'the been there. No US administration would have done that. The countries that are being praised for their responses are the countries closest geographically to China. The Koreans know what goes on there, how unhygienic and dirty Chinese are, and knew what to do. The USA was simply inexperienced and naive: 'it can't happen here because it's never happened here mentality.

By the way, the Obama response to Ebola was, you know, a blackman President, outbreak in Africa affecting black people. He was playing politics, in other words an easy stunt that cost little.

[EihTooms]

It's like I said in another thread. Leadership matters. And when you have poor and / or ineffective leadership (United States and Brazil as examples), then you're going to be worse off and more adversely impacted by a crisis like a pandemic.

In the face of Trump's years long dismantling of America's Pandemic Response teams and systems (because Obama supported and helped to build and establish them, of course), Joe Biden tweeted a warning and prediction about this current disaster back in October 2019!

Biden's tweet in 2019 is what leadership looks like. Trumpers scoffed at it, but he was right.
https://crooksandliars.com/2020/05/j...ber-2019-about

[ScatManDoo]

Obama certainly could have prevented our upcoming "Trump Economic Depression".

Look at this 88 second clip of President Barack Obama from December 2014:

From the snopes website:

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/ob...aredness-2014/.

Oops.

Here is the correct link to the 88 second video:

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/ob...aredness-2014/

[ScatManDoo]

It's like I said in another thread. Leadership matters. And when you have poor and / or ineffective leadership (United States and Brazil as examples), then you're going to be worse off and more adversely impacted by a crisis like a pandemic.

Exactly.

There is a reason why some countries, like Germany, South Korea & New Zealand have things well under control, with much smaller numbers of infected people & virus deaths.

While the virus is running wild in other countries, like Mexico, Brazil, England and the United States.

Good leadership matters and results with better outcomes than in countries with bad leadership, like our country.

[The Cane]

I don't think it is possible for you to be more wrong about that Golfinho.

It's like I said in another thread. Leadership matters. And when you have poor and / or ineffective leadership (United States and Brazil as examples), then you're going to be worse off and more adversely impacted by a crisis like a pandemic.

[ScatManDoo]

This Covid thing in the USA would be playing out just about the same regardless of who was the Figurehead-in-Chief.

I don't think it is possible for you to be more wrong about that Golfinho.

I am certain that President Barack Obama would have performed much better in dealing with this viral outbreak (definitely at the beginning). Barack probably would have saved the world if he was still in power.

Obama certainly could have prevented our upcoming "Trump Economic Depression".

Look at this 88 second clip of President Barack Obama from December 2014:

From the snopes website:

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/ob...aredness-2014/

Also from the snopes website:

President Barack Obama visited the NIH campus on Dec. 2 to see firsthand the progress that biomedical research is making against Ebola virus disease.

The President toured the NIH Vaccine Research Center and met with scientists who are working hard to develop ways to combat this deadly virus that continues to devastate West Africa. And, in a speech before a packed auditorium at the NIH Clinical Center, the President praised the contributions of NIH staff. He also emphasized the need for emergency Congressional authorization of resources to ensure that the nation's research and public health efforts against Ebola will lead as quickly as possible to an end to this devastating outbreak.

Obama stressed the importance of investing in research for the long term. "If and when a new strain of flu, like the Spanish flu, crops up five years from now or a decade from now, we've made the investment and we're further along to be able to catch it," he said. "It is a smart investment for us to make. It's not just insurance; it is knowing that down the road we're going to continue to have problems like this particularly in a globalized world where you move from one side of the world to the other in a day. ".

A full transcript of Obama's address at the NIH can be viewed here (no link), while the portion excerpted in the video clip seen above read as follows:

President Barack Obama on 12/2/2014: "We can't say we're lucky with Ebola because obviously it's having a devastating effect in West Africa, but it is not airborne in its transmission.

There may and likely will come a time in which we have both an airborne disease that is deadly. And in order for us to deal with that effectively, we have to put in place an infrastructure not just here at home, but globally that allows us to see it quickly, isolate it quickly, respond to it quickly. And it also requires us to continue the same path of basic research that is being done here at NIH that (Dr.) Nancy (Sullivan) is a great example of. So that if and when a new strain of flu, like the Spanish flu, crops up five years from now or a decade from now, we've made the investment and we're further along to be able to catch it. It is a smart investment for us to make. It's not just insurance; it is knowing that down the road we're going to continue to have problems like this particularly in a globalized world where you move from one side of the world to the other in a day."

Our Congress did not pass legislation, and did not provide the $2 billion President Obama was pushing for over 5 years ago.

So we didn't have our people on the ground when this break-out was hitting Wuhan in Hubei province during November or December. Instead we relied on what we were told by the WHO and Chinese Government.

But certainly if we had President Obama at the helm of our ship of state.

He would not have sat on his hands and done nothing in the entire month of February other than repeatedly say that the virus was a hoax.

[PVMonger]

USA is #1 economy in terms of GDP in the world and they #1 military in the world. But here is catch, they are also #1 in healthcare expenditure in the world and their economy is only 2nd behind (Hong Kong <-- Still belongs to China) in terms the service sector (80% of GDP) and #1 in service sector output or productivity. So, you've found the weakness. If you can't beat the army, then attack the service sector industry with something health related. A second wave or spike would pretty much destroy the USA and plummet us into a depression.

The following is a message from an infectious disease physician. I think it expresses the sentiments of all of us physicians at this time:

This has easily been the longest 2 months of my career, and, for that matter, my life. COVID-19 has changed everything. The way we live, the way our kids learn, the way we work. It has trashed the economy, exploded unemployment, and harmed businesses, many of them, sadly, beyond repair. But here's the deal: it's real and it's here and it's still spreading.

As a healthcare worker, I'm exhausted. Physically, mentally, and emotionally. As a manager in the the healthcare industry, it's been one of the longest, most stressful things I've tackled.

First off, the truthers and the conspiracy people and the protesters, you're not helping. The people bitching CONSTANTLY about the governor's or whatever level of government's handling of things, it's not constructive.

Do you want to know why medical people, real medical people, not some crackpot quacks and kooks with a YouTube account or Facebook page, are taking this seriously? Because it's serious. And we're serious people when it comes to people's health and their lives. Yes, it mostly kills at-risk populations (the elderly and those with underlying medical conditions) but it also kills perfectly healthy people with no prior diagnoses and we don't know why. I'm so tired of people acting like there's information that's being cooked up or withheld. You know why there's lots of gaps in the information? Because we're still learning about this virus every day. It's new. It's never been seen. How it acts, how it spreads, why it does the things it does is all new and we're learning on the fly. Stop mistaking genuine lack of information for misinformation or withheld information.

The numbers: this one sticks in my craw like no other. "I heard they didn't die from COVID-19, they died from a heart attack but they were positive so they called it COVID-19 to boost the numbers and scare people. " Stop. It. You know how many people died specifically from AIDS? Zero. AIDS patients die from pneumonia or some other illness normal, healthy people fight off because the AIDS virus destroyed their immune system and they couldn't fight off the infection. But at the heart of it, they died because of AIDS. The coronavirus attacks the respiratory system. The respiratory system is, in case you didn't know, pretty important to sustaining life. It also has a huge impact on how other organ systems, like the heart, work. Guess what, when your lungs don't work because they've basically filled with brick mortar because the virus is attacking them, that puts a bit of a strain on your ticker and very well can cause it to fail. So unless you have a basic understanding of or want to understand how interconnected organ systems are and how the body fundamentally functions: stop.

I think I can speak for a lot of medical professionals when I say, we don't mean to be arrogant, we don't mean to be jerks, but damn it, this bullshit is frustrating and yes, we're going to clap back to ignorance. Ignorance is not something to be flaunted and there is a difference between ignorance and stupidity. Ignorance is being uninformed. Stop being willfully ignorant and even reveling in it because it doesn't fit your preconceived narrative or opinion. Even worse, stop pretending you're not ignorant because you watched some damn YouTube video or read some op-ed piece. That's someone's opinion, normally based on nothing. NOTHING. No research. That's not information. That's not factual. That's not based in science. It's click-bait with the sole intention of riling you up and getting you to let your guard down. And instead of being pissed at the virus that's causing all this, it's to direct your anger at the government or doctors or anywhere else their agenda wants it directed.

Medical people are fired up for a couple reasons. 1 month ago, we were all heroes and putting our lives on the line because this was dangerous stuff. Well, I think I can speak for most of us when I say we aren't heroic, we're just doing our job. But guess what, we're still doing the same damn thing we were doing a month ago and this crap still hasn't gone away but now we're "just trying to scare people" because "it's really no big deal. " We aren't looking for a pat on the back or even a thank you, we just want you to do what we all need to do to stop this thing and avoid the spread. Listen, if you think that my big fat ass enjoys sweating like a working girl in church in an isolation gown, walking around like Mr Magoo because my glasses are fogged up because of my mask, and wearing goggles that dig into the backs of my ears because I'm "just a sheep," you are mistaken. It's because I don't want this virus and I don't want to take it home to my family and I don't want to infect my co-workers and other patients. We're fired up because we've seen and even performed intubations. We don't intubate for funsies. Outside of the surgical setting, an intubation is basically throwing a Hail Mary to save someone's life. And when the mortality rate once that plastic tube slides between your vocal cords with COVID-19 is 85-89%, yeah, that's terrifying. This virus is dangerous.

Lastly, stop being spoiled children about public health advisories. Stop bitching about wearing a mask when you're in public places. Stop pretending that that is somehow infringing on your rights. Get over yourself. I wish all businesses would grow a pair and refuse service to people who refuse to wear a mask "out of principle. " Police aren't inclined to enforce it and that's fine but, spoiler alert, private businesses have and reserve the right to refuse service to anyone. Don't tell me it's OK for a bakery to refuse service to a gay couple for a wedding cake on religious grounds but not OK for a convenience store to refuse service because they don't want the outbreak monkey strolling through their place coughing all over other patrons and their staff. Stay outside the 6 ft bubble, wear a damn mask, and wash your hands. It's that easy. Stop pretending they're asking for a kidney. It's as much to protect yourself as it is everyone else. People wonder why we have things like stay-at-home orders and closing of non-essential businesses. It's because of you, *******, you're the problem. It's your lack of ability to exercise common sense and your refusal to follow simple, insanely simple advice that forces the government to exercise it for you. And even then, you still thumb your nose at it in all your ignorant glory. Sorry that you feel like they're infringing on your right to be an irresponsible child.

Look, all I'm saying is I get that it's frustrating and I get that it's irritating, and inconvenient and all the other bad things that it is, but please, continue to take this seriously, continue to do the little things that make a big difference. Stop denying facts, science, and the advice from people who have spent a lifetime doing what they do in the medical and research fields to ultimately make everyone's lives healthier, safer, and better.

[Run Mann]

Would be best that he didn't since, given past business performance (failures and bankruptcies) it's likely to go belly up. Let me see that thong? No, let me see them taxes! LOL!

The primary purpose would be to give the press he wants but given the large far right following in the USA Coupled with so many people who enjoy drama TV, it could work as a money making venture.

[Golfinho]

This Covid thing in the USA would be playing out just about the same regardless of who was the Figurehead-in-Chief.

[The Cane]

Trump complains about the media all the time so to get the press he wants it may be time for him to start Trump TV.

Would be best that he didn't since, given past business performance (failures and bankruptcies) it's likely to go belly up. Let me see that thong? No, let me see them taxes! LOL!

[Beijing4987]

I think you mean feelings of personal aggrievment.

Liberal contrarians are threatening to off those of the opposing political spectrum. The civil authorities will match their "hunting rifles" with body armor, tanks and drones. Revolutionaries before were burned out (Nazi bank robber on Whidbey Island, Washington state) Simbionese Liberation Army / Patty Hearst's kidnappers. Messiah David Koresh. M. O. V. E. In Philadelphia.

Meanwhile a Fat Nixon and Steve Munchkin and the boy wonder son in law are looting the treasury. Those who choose to crowd together can have Liberty & Death. No need to choose. Poor me. I can't get a tattoo and my wife can't gets her roots done. I wish they could meet someone whose relative was pushed out of a helicopter in Chile by military personnel trained at Fort Benning Georgia. The dominoes surrounding them now are tiny germs that will destroy their lungs. Party on. Mission accomplished.

[Run Mann]

There has never been a louder war cry from conservatives than there currently is against Trump. The conservative Wall Street Journal seems to have had enough and several on Fox News and other conservatives are now openly taking Trump to task on a number of issues. Trump complains about the media all the time so to get the press he wants it may be time for him to start Trump TV.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/wsj-ed...t-transparency

https://www.alternet.org/2020/05/wsj...-even-for-him/

https://www.wsj.com/articles/trumps-...gs-11586389028

http://www.nydailynews.com/opinion/n...q7y-story.html

[John Clayton]

...conservatives when it comes to feelings of righteousness.

I think you mean feelings of personal aggrievment.

[EihTooms]

So, is this the thread where we can point out that (as of today) the Dow has only logged an average annual gain of about 7.9% since Trump became president 3 1/2 years ago and only about a 0.6% average annual gain since he passed his first economic "stimulus" legislation on December 23, 2017?

Cool.

I didn't even notice there was a thread like this here.

[MonkeyPaw]

Opening America now is a clever Trump economic decision. Everybody will get COVID-19, the young working people will do fine, the old retired people will die. Social security quickly becomes solvent because nobody collects retirement. Trump is rushing, he can't let a vaccine save us old farts first!

USA is #1 economy in terms of GDP in the world and they #1 military in the world. But here is catch, they are also #1 in healthcare expenditure in the world and their economy is only 2nd behind (Hong Kong <-- Still belongs to China) in terms the service sector (80% of GDP) and #1 in service sector output or productivity. So, you've found the weakness. If you can't beat the army, then attack the service sector industry with something health related. A second wave or spike would pretty much destroy the USA and plummet us into a depression.