Seeking Arrangements

[Mongerer88]

Elvis 2008,

I don't know where you get this:

"Even with the FOSTA and SESTA bullshit to fight "human trafficking", which really just resulted in a bunch of johns being jailed and financially shook down to line LE pockets. ".

There have been few, if any, "jailings" of Johns in the USA, and none at all under Fosta / Sesta.

The standard state / local law enforcement technique in the USA Was to do fake ads on Backpage and arrest guys for solicitation based on explicit texts. Certainly there are arrests for picking up street decoys and a few citations for going to massage parlors that are unlicensed and where sex is found to occur during sting operations, but that is rare.

Law enforcement has never had success in attacking escorts who screen, or their customers. It is a purchase of time and companionship, which is legal. Sugar arrangements are even safer legally than that.

Fosta / Sesta is a federal law. The federal government has a very specific policy that it does not charge Johns or sex workers criminally if all parties are 18 or over. The federal government criminally pursues owners / operators when it comes to sex work. And the federal government does huge asset seizures of any entity involved in interstate sex work. But thst is far different than jailing Johns.

Many of your criticisms of the USA Are accurate, and there are plenty of reasons for a USA Guy to go overseas for sex, but your parts about law enforcement are misleading. The issues relate more to pricing than law enforcement concerns. Poorer women outside the USA Are simply more likely to exchange quality sex for a lower price, and they have more incentive to be attractive and sexual.

[Elvis 2008]

So I see no harm in digressing from time to time with information the thread readers as a whole find useful. Since this thread has been quiet recently on SA topics no harm in the diversion.

Let me just start something else up seeing as how we have diverged into mongers versus sugar daddies. Steve, you said that you did not want to do SA in Brazil because the club scene was so awesome.

You reminded me of the two reasons I wanted to be a SB. First off, the sex internationally was so much better than with escorts in the sex prison and cheaper abroad to boot. I thought it was because of cultural attitudes, but I was surprised that even in South America, where I thought being a ho was not frowned on as much, was not something women were okay with. It was just more tolerated because women needed the money.

What bugged me so much in the sex prison was the $1200 dinner date. I have no shortage of hot female sales people who were willing to hang out with me and pick up the tab so female company was not a thing of value with me. I would just be having a good time with a working girl. We would be done having sex, she was hungry and so was I, and yet there was this stupid four figure fee for eating dinner. I was like, "What idiots are paying for this?" With the SB SD relationship, we could just enjoy the meal without the woman feeling ripped off.

For the sex prison, the SA SB-SD relationship just made more sense to me. I started about ten years ago when the USA economy was way down, met some smoking hot women, and the sex with said women was as hot as I got abroad though I paid more. Sadly, SA in the sex prison now seems to be filled to the gills with scammers and the quality response rate is quite low. I did have a promising nibble here the other day though.

I talked to a lawyer about the SB-SD relationship, and he said that given how out in the open it was that he doubted there would be any prosecution of SDs. Even with the FOSTA and SESTA bullshit to fight "human trafficking", which really just resulted in a bunch of johns being jailed and financially shook down to line LE pockets, the SB-SD relationship and SA have been largely left alone by LE.

As great as the working girl sexual relationships were in the Latin countries I visited, the quality of women I have met through SA abroad has been amazing. They are truly women in the top 1%. I had a Latin beauty kind of convince me that getting engaged was a good thing. At the time, I thought I had scored. She was stunning, in great shape, and super smart. Thing is she was very selfish, and when she was caught lying, she broke up with me before I broke up with her. It took my ego down a notch. Still, I was able to follow her on social media and I saw the clusterfuck her life was with me not in it.

It was tough finding similar quality at first but since Covid hit, it has been raining 10's. The commonly held belief is that women want men their own age, want men who are attractive physically, and they only like us older men only for our money. However, the young women with me had orgasms that I could smell and see the white cum. They called and texted me without asking for money and got mad at me when I didn't text or call often enough. The engagement has given me an excuse to not commit to any of the women I have met. If they ask if I am seeing other people, I tell them I will not answer because I do not know what they are doing. I do not give away my monogamy. The only time I tell the women I am willing to pledge it is when I can watch a girl every day.

My ex swore she did not see anyone else, and I do not think she did, but wanted to show the world she was with a handsome model versus me on her social media page. She thought putting up my picture would incite negative comments and she said that she was upset enough people were calling her a gold digger.

Thing is people were calling her that because she had soured on me. I remember a cab driver saying to me after she kissed me goodbye, "You have a very pretty girlfriend. " I was like why would the guy think that versus her being a working girl, and I realized it was how she looked at me. This revelation was greatly empowering to me because I realized that my giving her money was not what caused people to think she was a gold digger. It was her shitty attitude towards me at the end of our relationship.

The working girl or gold digger shaming is huge for women, and I turned the lemons into lemonades and have used it to my advantage. After my breakup, I was seeing a Vennie 10 super model in Mexico and was getting fed up with her lack of response to my texts. I asked her if she just wanted to be pay for play or my GF / SB / Novia, and she recoiled at the thought of being a P4P hooker. I told her she was shitty with responding to my texts and calls, and she apologized and has done way better since then.

I lectured the Mexican lawyer who is a 10 about showing up on time. I told her, "You keep making plans and breaking them. I need a woman I can trust. Is that you? And she showed up on time from then on. The last time I asked her if she needed money, she refused taking it and asked, "Need money for what?

I now have two women in Mexico, six women in Colombia, and one in Brazil that are SBs or SB prospects. They send me texts all the time. My understanding in Spanish is that Te quiero which technically means I want you. It is the English equivalent of I really like you. Te amo is I love you. Of these nine, five have texted me te quiero and four have texted me Te amo. I have responded likewise if I felt that there were sincere, and I have not if I thought the proclamations were financial manipulation.

I have met six of the nine women in person. I have had sex with three without payment after the deed. For the guys saying they are just with me for money, I would ask what money?

But more importantly, if these women give off the impression that they are gold diggers to the world, I am calling them out on it. GFs pack my suitcase, give me massages, make things like clothing for me, buy me gifts, and show the world how much they care about me, and I now expect these things from these women.

The easiest thing in the world to spot is a woman in love with a man versus with him for his money. If anyone told me that these women were just after my money, I would ask them to tell that to the woman's face and see how she reacts. She better respond about how I walk on water, and that is as much if not more to protect her image as mine.

So now if any guy says to me that a woman is just after me for money, I will tell them: prove to me she is and she is gone. I have no need for working girls. I think American men have been wussified. Shit, women in the People's Republic of California can say regretting sex the next day is now rape.

But most importantly, I am now honest with myself. My ex wife shamed me so much that I was paying women just to get my ego up. I will never forget my ex getting offended at what I laughed at in a comedy. She even shamed me for how I breathed. When I told her to get a job so she had something to do besides bugging me, she threatened to kill herself. Trump gave great advice after his first wife shamed him. When asked what to do with a wife shaming her husband, he said "Dump them."

I see women even ugly women in America on SA wanting platonic relationships. Men are supposed to work for their money. Women are supposed to be given it as victims. That is the great female game. Shame us and make us feel badly and then we pay to have said women to have the shame removed. Fuck that!!

I never thought I could demand as much from SB / GF types as I have. Ironically, it was seeing my ex-wife and fiance's lives going down the tubes without me and that great female weapon of shame turned against women that has allowed me to do so.

Nothing is a bigger turn off for me then having great sex with a woman and her running for the door when we are done. Thankfully for me, those days are in the past.

[Steve 9696]

Isn't this thread WAY OT?

Yes technically this thread is about SA. But like all threads ISG is really about sharing information and learning. So I see no harm in digressing from time to time with information the thread readers as a whole find useful. Since this thread has been quiet recently on SA topics no harm in the diversion.

[BrizLad]

Isn't this thread WAY OT?

I have found that girls from Asian countries that we associate with lower priced pussy tend to ramp up their prices when they on seeking.com. Trying to get back on topic, has anyone had success with Asian SB pussy when travelling in Asia?

[Midwestern]

Your most willing tour guide at your service!.

Thanks so much for the awesome insights!

[Blue Swede]

Isn't this thread WAY OT?

[Lucky Nuts]

What makes Thailand the Wild West in your opinion? Granted the scene is a neon sexual Disneyland. There are ways to put yourself out there and meet willing Thai female partners away from the bright lights and meat market atmospheres. I do find Thai women do be some of the most sexual women in Asia. I'll have number 33 please.

As far as COVID, the Thai people did a diligent job of controlling it. They have had only 58 deaths. I have not kept up on whether they were currently shutting down the go-go bars and massage parlors in Bangkok and Pattaya. One thing is for sure some of these countries have taken advantage of the rapid development in testing. You might be able to play in Thailand if you take a test on arrival.

Thailand extinguished the virus with the draconian measures of nightly curfews and no alcohol sales for a couple months. But it worked! And now to enter their country you would need to do a 14 day quarantine upon arrival at a designated hotel at your own expense. I had a one month January reservation which the airbnb host agreed to cancel with 100% refund due to the difficult entry requirement.

Regarding the OP's question yeah Singapore sucks for our hobby. I went for a week and stayed for two nights. Beautiful airport though!

If the OP really wants Asia Cambodia is open. Phnom Penh is cheap enough but one of the hardest places to find a diamond in the rough. I'd advise to wait for Asia until Thailand is open again post covid.

Brazil is open I believe and Colombia is opening by the end of September probably the best choices available right now imo except for the more costly Austria & Switzerland already mentioned - if you are allowed to enter which us Amercans are not.

[Steve 9696]

Steve, thanks so much for doing this. Every time I come to ISG, I notice that the FKK threads and the India threads are at the top of the list. I checked out the India threads, and it's mostly just posters begging for contacts. I checked out the FKK threads, and I kept thinking to myself that this scene looked amazing, but I could really use a beginner's guide. And, lo and behold, you just provided one. Because of you, I have now started a monger bucket list for myself, and there is currently only one thing on it, which is to partake in the FKK experience.

Hope you won't mind a few questions:

Thanks in advance, man.

Your most willing tour guide at your service!

(1) Can I assume that everyone can speak English, including the management, staff, and the girls?

Yes very good English. Everyone.

(2) Are there girls from all nationalities, including Americans, Asians, and Africans, or are there only Germans and other Europeans? What's the general breakdown?

The FKKs are 90% staffed with Romanian girls. Don't be put off by this. Romania has all types. Blonde brunette tiny thick. It's all there. Occasional African or Brazilian or German but nothing to write home about. The Romanian girls are fine. They may tell you they are Italian or Spanish. But they are not. Many girls speak Spanish because they broadcast South American Telenovas in Romania.

(3) I've read in the FKK forums about some guys having the no-pop many-girls strategy. That is, they don't ejaculate so they can sex as many girls as possible. Some guys talk about sexing a dozen girls per visit. This sounds like something that I'd like to do. I don't care about the pop. I just like fucking. Is this a good strategy, or is there a downside to this approach that I am not seeing, besides the money of course?

Guess it depends on the guy. I personally never want to session without cumming. But if that's your thing so be it. All girls of course prefer a guy to cum quickly so they can go to the next guest. You might develop a bad rap as a guy that maxes his time with fucking nonstop. But probably not if you visit just a few times.

(4) What are their hours? Is there a best time of day to go? I don't like staying out late anymore, especially when I'm in a new environment.

Evening is better imo. From 8 on is fine. Don't have to be a night owl. Be forewarned that food is not 24/7. I skipped lunch one time and went at 3:30 and they had closed the buffet till six.

(5) Is it like a crazy bar scene, with loud live music, dancing, and tons of people, where it's almost impossible to have a convo with someone because it's so loud, and where it's almost impossible to get a drink because it's so crowded and the bartenders and waitresses are so busy, and where it's so dark that you cannot get a good accurate look at the girls? I am not into that scene anymore, which is why I no longer do takeout from monger bars.

Definitely not like that. Much more relaxed and laid back than a night club. Lighting at Sharks is good. I remember Oase and World being darker. And Sharks is huge. You will never feel crowded.

(6) Would it be weird if I go there alone, or is that what most guys do?

Most guys go alone.

(7) You mentioned bringing condoms. Man, I always forget to carry condoms, because I am so used to girls having them. Can I buy condoms at the club?

Girls provide condoms so no problem. I just hate regular condoms. Hey maybe that is why you fuck for forever. Once I tried the super thins like Trojan BareSkin no way I am using a regular condom. It's night and day.

[Midwestern]

Since the FKK is probably the least understood of the venues and every man should have it on his bucket list here is an intro to FKK.

Steve, thanks so much for doing this. Every time I come to ISG, I notice that the FKK threads and the India threads are at the top of the list. I checked out the India threads, and it's mostly just posters begging for contacts. I checked out the FKK threads, and I kept thinking to myself that this scene looked amazing, but I could really use a beginner's guide. And, lo and behold, you just provided one. Because of you, I have now started a monger bucket list for myself, and there is currently only one thing on it, which is to partake in the FKK experience.

Hope you won't mind a few questions:

(1) Can I assume that everyone can speak English, including the management, staff, and the girls?

(2) Are there girls from all nationalities, including Americans, Asians, and Africans, or are there only Germans and other Europeans? What's the general breakdown?

(3) I've read in the FKK forums about some guys having the no-pop many-girls strategy. That is, they don't ejaculate so they can sex as many girls as possible. Some guys talk about sexing a dozen girls per visit. This sounds like something that I'd like to do. I don't care about the pop. I just like fucking. Is this a good strategy, or is there a downside to this approach that I am not seeing, besides the money of course?

(4) What are their hours? Is there a best time of day to go? I don't like staying out late anymore, especially when I'm in a new environment.

(5) Is it like a crazy bar scene, with loud live music, dancing, and tons of people, where it's almost impossible to have a convo with someone because it's so loud, and where it's almost impossible to get a drink because it's so crowded and the bartenders and waitresses are so busy, and where it's so dark that you cannot get a good accurate look at the girls? I am not into that scene anymore, which is why I no longer do takeout from monger bars.

(6) Would it be weird if I go there alone, or is that what most guys do?

(7) You mentioned bringing condoms. Man, I always forget to carry condoms, because I am so used to girls having them. Can I buy condoms at the club?

Thanks in advance, man.

[LshRoomer]

I could not agree more. So much fun, it can kind of be a little overwhelming.

Dammit Steve9696 and DramaFree11, What you guys describe makes me want to get on a plane ASAP for FKK, schnitzel, and beer!!

I've tasted the german scene but only really dipped my toe in (escorts / SA). I haven't really tried the other stuff, as I'm usually outcall focused. You are recommending the same that I have heard from others, that an FKK should be experienced at least once. I'm never been to Frankfurt, but I'm comfortable in Germany and I think that may be on my short next trip list, especially because it's closer and more familiar than Asia.

I've been to showpark in Prague a number to times, but it doesn't sound like to compares to an FKK experience. The description is definitely welcome during these days of limited or no travel.

Last non SA / GFE related question I promise. Now that you have FKK experience, what would do differently if you could relive your first FKK experience?

[BrizLad]

It sounds like there is a consensus to avoid Singapore, consider Indonesia, and try Thailand. . I'll have to consider whether to try Thailand or do FKK and a few SA girls in Baltics (that already sounds fun) . Hell, Brazil sounds like it has some potential as well.

Do yourself a favour and forget planning those trips. Even if you can go it simply won't be the fun that we have all had in the past. Realistically for the next 2 years we need to find a way to enjoy the delights in our home countries. That's why sugarbabes are looking like such a good option.

I know here in my country the significant job losses have occurred and government benefits start getting reduced at the end of this month.

It won't be cheap in our home countries but it will be the best we can get for now.

My first international trip when I can will be pussy paradise. Philippines.

[DramaFree11]

Since the FKK is probably the least understood of the venues and every man should have it on his bucket list here is an intro to FKK.

So what is this crazy FKK I speak of?

Imagine if you will a very large building -- perhaps a warehouse -- that has been lavishly outfitted inside with a men's paradise. Buffet, sauna, jacuzzi, massage, pool, bar, relaxation areas and attractive ladies galore. And oh, yeah, the ladies are naked. Did I mention they all want to fuck you? Use the onsite rooms for your carnal pleasures; then rinse and repeat -- as many times as you have stamina and money for!

The drill is pretty much the same at each FKK and as you will see it is designed as the perfect place to start your journey to a better life. You know on TV where the guy gets caught with perfume or a hair or lipstick on his collar? That is never going to happen here because the Germans have engineered the perfect experience -- with virtually guaranteed no trace evidence left behind. Here's how it goes (I'll use Sharks, my favorite, to describe it):

When you enter the FKK, you pay your entry fee ($90-100 USD at nice ones) which entitles you to the full use of the facility and its amenities (sauna, buffet, lounges, non-alcohoic drinks) -- alcoholic drinks, massages, and girls' services are extra. You are issued a towel, robe, flip flops, and a wristband with key and they point you to the locker room. Here you get out of your street clothes, take a shower and suit up in a towel or robe and head into the club. Bring your wallet and condoms with you, as you will put these in a separate small locker when you enter. Prepare to be amazed!.

I could not agree more. So much fun, it can kind of be a little overwhelming.

[Steve 9696]

Since the FKK is probably the least understood of the venues and every man should have it on his bucket list here is an intro to FKK.

So what is this crazy FKK I speak of?

Imagine if you will a very large building -- perhaps a warehouse -- that has been lavishly outfitted inside with a men's paradise. Buffet, sauna, jacuzzi, massage, pool, bar, relaxation areas and attractive ladies galore. And oh, yeah, the ladies are naked. Did I mention they all want to fuck you? Use the onsite rooms for your carnal pleasures; then rinse and repeat -- as many times as you have stamina and money for!

The drill is pretty much the same at each FKK and as you will see it is designed as the perfect place to start your journey to a better life. You know on TV where the guy gets caught with perfume or a hair or lipstick on his collar? That is never going to happen here because the Germans have engineered the perfect experience -- with virtually guaranteed no trace evidence left behind. Here's how it goes (I'll use Sharks, my favorite, to describe it):

When you enter the FKK, you pay your entry fee ($90-100 USD at nice ones) which entitles you to the full use of the facility and its amenities (sauna, buffet, lounges, non-alcohoic drinks) -- alcoholic drinks, massages, and girls' services are extra. You are issued a towel, robe, flip flops, and a wristband with key and they point you to the locker room. Here you get out of your street clothes, take a shower and suit up in a towel or robe and head into the club. Bring your wallet and condoms with you, as you will put these in a separate small locker when you enter. Prepare to be amazed!

Sharks is huge and there are girls everywhere. There is a big central bar where you can get your favorite cocktail or beer and start figuring out who tickles your fancy. If it's your first time here, you will be overwhelmed with selection. Blondes, brunettes, big fake tits, A cups, short, tall, skinny, thick. It's all here -- and they are all pretty in their own way. Just settle in and enjoy the spectacle. Generally you will have a few thoughts in this order:

1 This is fucking amazing!

2 Surely this can't be legal.

3 This must be what heaven is like if god knew what the fuck he is doing.

You will probably be approached by one or more girls who want you to go to the room with you. Almost 100% of the time you should NOT go with these girls. They tend to be the ones needing business or planning to shark you for big money. You are better off seeking out the girl you want if you are a newbie.

The general drill is to make the most of your entry fee and spend as much time as humanly possible. Find a girl, negotiate the fee / services (generally 50-100 E / half hour) and head to the room. Do your thing. Now, comes the hardest part -- relax and recharge. You can try to find a quiet corner, but invariably you will be assaulted by various girls wanting you to go. Hold out. Go to the buffet, sauna, get a massage. Recharge. Go again. Rinse and repeat until you can go no more! It is also possible to leave the club and come back the same day -- just make sure to tell them you are returning.

Now bear in mind that FKK can be widely varying in the awesomeness of the facility and / or girls. So what I describe primarily relates to the biggest and best in and around Frankfurt. Everywhere else may be a shade (or more!) less awesome in the food or the facilities or the girls; but the idea is generally the same.

Every man needs to experience FKK.

[WyattEarp]

I just caught up on the Pattaya thread. Apparently, Thailand currently has a 14 day quarantine. I suspect they have hotels monitoring guests.

[WyattEarp]

I know we all vary but if you had the choice I would do Brazil, FKK, London, and Thailand in that order. (I know London was not on your list but wow the Romanian incall there! I know this is the SA forum but if I get a moment I'll post my intros to Brazil, FKK, and Thailand as they may be useful to this travel starved group for future planning.

All I would say is the four destinations are so very different. I think it's best for a newbies to decide what they want out of a trip then decide. I personally would put Brazil at the top of my list so long as I spent a few days on the beach in Rio. This along with ample time in Sao Paulo.

I absolutely love London the city, but there are also other great cities for escorts. It only takes a few good escorts to have a good time. I don't have any experience with FKK, but this would probably be more a sexual destination for me as I prefer other vacation spots. I also hear a lot of disappointment in the typical FKK girl service level.

Thailand is just fucking crazy as a sexual theme park. While the girls are definitely not as sexual Brazileiras, they have a certain sweetness and openness. If you tire of submissive girls you just have to do a little more searching and screening in Thailand..

As far as one member saying he didn't care for Thai girls, I find Thai girls are a good mix of the dark-complected Southeast Asian look and the lighter Chinese/Vietnamese appearance. I think they are a bit taller than average for Asia. So with that you will find all sorts of builds. Some Thai girls have long legs. Some are curvier. Of course, we are talking about the Asian standard. I'm a bit biased because I have been with some great Thai working girls who were both sex partners and tour guides.