Rants and WTF are you talking about and Coronavirus!

[Pistons]

Then again, I'd still take my risk in order to meet with hot sweet Romanian and Bulgarian pussy across Europe. You only live once!

[Pistons]

Well, sure sounds like Phallus Maximus is another one of Mursenary's clone accounts. Aside from that, it is too much to read. But of course it is a dangerous virus. Not to mention that 10% of the infected get long term problems it seems. But what do you know when it's a biological weapon!

I personally told a few people: 'lock the fuck down' (as I understood immediately that this was a bio weapon), and we got away with it better than the swedes. Not surprisingly in retrospect though, as anything polar opposite to the swedish model in anything is usually the best way to do things.

[McAdonis]

Sweden set their single day record with 2820 new cases on October 28. If the virus had been circulating freely in Sweden all these months, then shouldn't their single day record have been established sometime between April and September? My belief is that the Swedish have been diligently following the recommendations of their health authorities since the beginning of the pandemic. In other words, even though there was not an "official" lockdown mandate, most Swedish voluntarily limited their social contacts. To put 2820 new cases into perspective: if adjusted to USA's population, it would be the same as the USA logging 90 K new cases in a single day. But USA's single day record to date is only 82K. My prediction is the Swedish will have it under control before the Spanish, French, and Czech, because Swedish authorities just put out new recommendations:

Authorities advised residents to refrain from indoor environments such as shops, malls, museums, libraries and gyms. But necessary visits to grocery stores and pharmacies can be made.

Refrain from participating in, for example, meetings, concerts, performances, sports training, matches and competitions. However, this does not apply to sports training for children and young people born in 2005 or later, officials said in a statement.

If possible, avoid having physical contact with people other than those you live with. This means, among other things, a dissuasion from arranging or participating in a party or similar social gathering.

https://www.aa.com.tr/en/europe/sweden-reports-its-highest-daily-covid-19-cases/2024003

[Mursenary]

5000 didn't die because of the virus, 5000 who died did test positive for the COVID-19. That's a huge difference, Sweden would have had a lot less deaths if they counted the same way as other countries.

Americans should go vote, vote against the irresponsible and failed Democrats.

Five bucks says Shoe actually lives in Sweden, Alabama.

[Gino02]

Since all the Trump haters keep bringing up his name, with special nicknames for the duly elected leader, for many of the issues that are not really in his control (as opposed to Trump lovers bringing up Biden's name that often), I wanted to throw couple of links (with views opposing to what the mainstream media like CNN, MSNBC, CBS etc want us to believe) for some more civic discussions and exchange of views about US politics and it's impact on us the mongers. Maybe we all will learn something from these, or maybe these will simply just generate more rants as this thread is aptly named, let's see. But I suggest anyone to comment on these only after reading thru the articles, please. Thank you all.

Newsweek opinion column: "Why I'm Voting for Donald Trump".

https://www.newsweek.com/why-im-voti...pinion-1542990

The Hill opinion column: "Trump or Biden? On the economy, the choice is clear".

https://thehill.com/opinion/finance/...hoice-is-clear

[Pahllus Maximus]

Mursenary is correct, many of the "beds" are specialized and secondly beds without highly trained people that go with them are useless furniture, and when that is factored in, then it is easy to see why governments around the world clamped down, fearing hospitals being overrun. Whatever may be the case 6 months later with better data / testing and hindsight, when they started this COVID was a big black box, and they rationally made the right call. With winter coming, and clinical realities referred to, yeah, there is a big problem in the USA.

Putting aside useless entertainment franchise labels (known as political parties), the two brands in the USA (and the UK, and some others) screwed it up. Other countries devoid of the major US brands fared much better, in the case of NZ and Taiwan, over a 100 fold LOWER in per capita rates compared to UK / USA. My guess is the reasons are structural. The stats I referred to shows the USA has fewer per capita doctors and a hell of a lot more bureaucrats in hospitals, probably dealing with Byzantine insurance duplication and inefficiencies.

As for the future of the USA, Glenn Greenwald (of Snowden and other highly controversial exposes) just quit a journal, complaining that his articles about Biden family cash-for-access by Russian gangster (putting aside legal niceties) was met by official Biden silence and the mainstream and / or social media did indeed censor it. This is not a political advertisment, but an observation that the media is selective and not some priesthood of impartiality. The schism between say NPR and Fox news merely represents different tribes in their respective echo chambers.

Who ever is in control after next week faces an economic meltdown, and polarized, angry society that needs to be less shrill, more rational and focus on practical issues like liveable wages, economic opportunity, housing, nutrition, health and happiness rather than moral nonsense, idiotic slogans, race and hatred. The administration/congress will be forced to have a huge fiscal expansion, and hopefully go direct to households and bypass the banksters and hustlers.

It is well to blame politicians of all varieties for greed and corruption, but their behavior exists because we tolerate it and vote them in. All of that coupled with a lot of emotion, noise, outright BS and misdirection they exploit. If we as a population taught children critical thinking from pre-school and and became more evidence based and rational, then indeed America could prosper in a generation from now. Unfortunately, I think many power elites would be aghast at the idea they could not sway the cognitively trained and critical thinking natives with BS. Mursenary is spot on. Reductionist labels are the resort of intellectual straw men.
Mursenary is correct, many of the "beds" are specialized and secondly beds without highly trained people that go with them are useless furniture, and when that is factored in, then it is easy to see why governments around the world clamped down, fearing hospitals being overrun. Whatever may be the case 6 months later with better data/testing and hindsight, when they started this COVID was a big black box, and they rationally made the right call. With winter coming, and clinical realities referred to, yeah, there is a big problem in the USA.

Putting aside useless entertainment franchise labels (known as political parties), the two brands in the USA (and the UK, and some others) screwed it up. Other countries devoid of the major US brands fared much better, in the case of NZ and Taiwan, over a 100 fold LOWER in per capita rates compared to UK/USA. My guess is the reasons are structural. The stats I referred to shows the USA has fewer per capita doctors and a hell of a lot more bureaucrats in hospitals, probably dealing with Byzantine insurance duplication and inefficiencies.

As for the future of the USA, Glenn Greenwald (of Snowden and other highly controversial exposes) just quit a journal, complaining that his articles about Biden family cash-for-access by Russian gangster (putting aside legal niceties) was met by official Biden silence and the mainstream and/or social media did indeed censor it. This is not a political advertisment, but an observation that the media is selective and not some priesthood of impartiality. The schism between say NPR and Fox news merely represents different tribes in their respective echo chambers.

Who ever is in control after next week faces an economic meltdown, and polarized, angry society that needs to be less shrill, more rational and focus on practical issues like liveable wages, economic opportunity, housing, nutrition, health and happiness rather than moral nonsense, idiotic slogans, race and hatred. They will be forced to have a huge fiscal expansion, and hopefully go direct and bypass the banksters and hustlers.

It is well to blame politicians of all varieties for greed and corruption, but their behaviour exists because we tolorate it and vote them in. All of that coupled with a lot of emotion, noise, outright BS and misdirection they exploit. If we as a population taught children critical thinking from pre-school and and became more evidence based and rational, then indeed America could prosper. Unfortunately, I think many power elites would be aghast at the idea they could not sway the cognitively trained and critical thinking natives with BS. Mursenary is spot on. Reductionist labels are the resort of intellectual straw men. More signal, less noise.

[McAdonis]

I wonder how or who will ever judge whether this experiment is a success or failure.

Every country is different in so many ways. Geography, demographics, pop density, economic conditions, health infrastructure, government spending on healthcare, on and on.

If outcomes are different, how does any one attribute the end result to one specific thing such as the action the government / country took with regards to lockdown, and not other things which make Sweden different from others?

ANd what is success / failure? Economic? Health outcomes? Would that be deaths, absolute # deaths, death / populations, deaths / infection, something else? What about # infected and their long term health conditions? Those will not be known for a long time.

I suspect if a broad cross section of countries adopted the Swedish model, we would see mixed results tbh. Since mid June, all the Schengen countries moved toward the Swedish model simply by reopening, did they not? Despite implementing a lockdown earlier in the year, I believe Czech Republic is closer to herd immunity than Sweden. If the world wants to know what happens when a large percentage of population has been infected, I say look at Czech Republic, not Sweden.

[Pessimist]

I'll take that as a compliment coming from someone like you.

You should, because you will not get too many more. BTW, why the fuck is a Swedish bloke yukking up about a country he knows nothing about? Did you pay a dime of tax in this country? I realize you may find some fraternity with the Proud Boys gang but until you pay you don't get to play. Come back to talk to us when you have a US citizenship and paid some taxes. Until then you are just a foreigner who has an opinion about American politics, which everyone in the world seems to have. Your view counts for something if you have a vote, which you don't. Thank god, because we have already enough idiots in our own country.

[Mursenary]

Interesting that so many people are talking about Sweden, especially those who know nothing about Sweden. I live in Sweden and the health authorities have said masks are useless for ordinary people (in line with scientific evidence until March of this year when suddenly every politician decided they know better than 100 years of medical expertise) so I am grateful for that. The only reason authorities mandate masks is to lower the oxygene flow to the brain so people will stop critical thinking. As for lock-downs the evidence is clear that it does not work, still countries try it a second time. The whole thing is mind-boggling.

Sure seems to be working in east asian countries and Oceana including Australia and New Zealand.

[Mursenary]

It's funny how you Democrats always have an excuse and never a solution.

The worst affected states are still the blue ones, come back when that has changed.

The point is that the Democrats failed to make it better than the red states.

LOL, it's called critical thinking and living in the present. NY, NJ, and Mass have have controlled the outbreak as well as any Nordic or Asian countries since the initial outbreak. Meanwhile, Texas, Arizona, Florida, Georgia, and all of the Trump midwest took the protected head start and continue to bath in covid infested respiratory droplets at every redneck Trump rally.

Never even voted for a Democrat in my life until just 2 hours ago. People who think the way you are presenting, demigod worship and lack of nuance in data analysis, have killed the Republican brand. Perhaps rational conservatives can fill the void and undo the damage that these anglo-centric nationalists have done.

[Oregon97]

It's only political, in the US that is, because a petulant, childish sociopath is running for a second term as president. He decided to ignore his own CDC and all contagious disease specialists at his disposal and hire a wholly unqualified herd immunity quack (radiologist) because he felt such an outlook better suited his re-election prospects. And, sadly, there is an abundance of bigoted, poorly educated folks in the US that believe anything he and his preferred media sources tell them. It hasn't been particularly political in Asia because people tended to just follow science and reasonable government protocols, and all often to good ends. As to Sweden, follow the evidence. Yes argument is inevitable. Unreasonable people always yell the loudest and fight to the bitter end. They are a sure bet for the last word in an internet discussion. But all arguments aren't created equally. Comparing Sweden to their Nordic neighbors is especially embarrassing, but there's much more.

https://time.com/5899432/sweden-coronovirus-disaster/

Interesting that so many people are talking about Sweden, especially those who know nothing about Sweden. I live in Sweden and the health authorities have said masks are useless for ordinary people (in line with scientific evidence until March of this year when suddenly every politician decided they know better than 100 years of medical expertise) so I am grateful for that. The only reason authorities mandate masks is to lower the oxygene flow to the brain so people will stop critical thinking. As for lock-downs the evidence is clear that it does not work, still countries try it a second time. The whole thing is mind-boggling.

[Paulie97]

100% Bullshit talk.

That's a very sophisticated comeback. How was the Trump rally?

[Mursenary]

USA: 924 k beds for a population of 328 million, so one bed for every 354 people, and 36.3 m annual admissions. Hospitals hit 100% theoretic capacity at 0. 002817073% of the population getting sick and needing to be hospitalized. Not all beds are the same. ICU beds are much shorter supply, about 80 k beds.

Some definitions seem wonky, - the ratios do not make sense. From the looks of it, an admission to a US hospitals costs $30.6 k on average. Median is unknown.

You probably meant 0.28%. Point remains, not a lot of space considering many of those beds are designated for speciality services such as obstetrics and pediatrics. Then you still have to staff those units with physicians, nurses, and ancillary staff needed to care for these patients (Hospitals never retain enough staff to operate at 100% capacity.) There was a reason why, back in June, my hospital needed to construct an auxiliary field hospital in the parking lot staffed by the National Guard and temporary, contract physicians and nurses. My ICU (a major metropolitan hospital) is already over normal census with mostly non-covid patients. As covid hospitalizations rise and flu season sets in, there's a strong possibility that we're screwed if people continue to refuse to take precautions. Let's see what happens when families congregate during American Thanksgiving and then Christmas.

[ShooBree]

Ah yes, you basically listed states that were / are the main ports of entry for Europeans back in February and March and before social mitigation and appropriate standards of care were developed. What has happened since the summer as these republican states reopened? Oh yes, states you mentioned controlled the spread with less cases, deaths, and hospitalizations per capita than just about every red southern state (where I happen to live and work). Believe me, the only thing that saved my region despite the stupidity here is the fact that the international community has little to no desire to come here. Meanwhile Texas, Florida, Georgia, Arizona, Dakotas, etc have been leading the covid charge for the past 5 months. You have been listening to one too many autocratic orange monkey.

It's funny how you Democrats always have an excuse and never a solution.

The worst affected states are still the blue ones, come back when that has changed.

The point is that the Democrats failed to make it better than the red states.

[Pahllus Maximus]

Mongerer88: it's emigrate (leave) rather than immigrate. As a matter of fact, I am thinking of that, joining Peter Theil (PayPal) and Steve Wozniak (co-founder of Apple), one of the founders of Google and several Wall St billionaires who have chosen New Zealand as home, getting a passport and buying housing. The list is long. I'm in good company. And have a look as USD currency pairs while you are at it. Furthermore, the UK and US are a covid disaster. That's just fact. And why we travel the world as pussy hounds is because US women are not up to snuff.

Some rough facts Mursenary queried:

USA: 924 k beds for a population of 328 million, so one bed for every 354 people, and 36.3 m annual admissions. Hospitals hit 100% theoretic capacity at 0. 002817073% of the population getting sick and needing to be hospitalized. Not all beds are the same. ICU beds are much shorter supply, about 80 k beds.

I plucked this from https://www.aha.org/statistics/fast-facts-us-hospitals.

Some definitions seem wonky, - the ratios do not make sense. From the looks of it, an admission to a US hospitals costs $30.6 k on average. Median is unknown.

A more detailed report is here:

https://www.healthsystemtracker.org/...her-countries/#item-hospital-beds-per-1000-population-total-and-by-curative-care-and-rehabilitative-beds-2016.

Putting the usual labels aside, we did phuck it up. Let's start fixing it. Starting with slowing new cases (duh !)