Seeking Arrangements

[Midwestern]

So now the question for you fellows. What's the next step? Another date and try for a hotel close? Talk a bit about what she sees as next steps? Start hinting private time is next? Anyone broken in a nervous first timer? Thoughts?

If it were me, I would do another date like this. Then, on the third date, if you guys are still doing DFK, then ask if you can go to a hotel. If she says no, then bail on her after the date. I have a 3 date rule when it comes to real dating (that is, sex has to happen by the 3rd date, otherwise, she is stringing you along), so why wouldn't I apply the same rule for SA dating?

For normal dating, what is your "X" date rule?

[DramaFree11]

Yes, this is exactly what I mean. It is not easy to jump in the sack right away. In the beginning, we have to delicately let a non-pro SA gal know that we will help them out financially, but we do not think of them as pros. It takes time to give her both assurances. Both are important to many non-pro SA gals. For me, it has worked out eventually ONLY when the gal genuinely likes me and is attracted to me. If she doesn't, then it doesn't work out for me despite my best efforts at giving her both assurances. For example, I have given money to girls to show them that I respect their time or to help them out with a bill or payment, but if we don't have sex by the 3rd date at the latest, then I know she's not really attracted to me and is only in it for the money, so I bail.

To make it seem non-transactional, this means we have to give them money when there is no sex. If you only give them money when you have sex, this does not separate money from sex that well, at least not in her mind. I still say it is tricky. Not easy to do. For example, how many of us have had sex with an SB and did not give her money on that day? It probably almost never happens. It only happens after a long process. It took me weeks and active effort to establish it with one SB, and it took me months to establish it with another SB, where we can now meet for sex and I don't pay them a dime, because they know I will help them out when they need it later because they now think we are in some sort of real relationship.

Question, I have found the girls that want gifts instead of money seem much more High Maintenance, what do you guys think? This last couple of reports real have me thinking, but I am not sure I am interested if there is not sex in Mexico. The girls that just wanted gifts, real were not looking for sex, in my opinion.

As far as gift they are special to me and I want them to be more meaningful if that makes sense, so I would rather give money.

[Midwestern]

If you are impatient and want to jump in the sack in 2 days, well ain't going to happen, not the way I do it. But that is why it is important to build a rolodex over time. Once you have had sex w / a girl, you don't have to do that dance all over again. From then on, it becomes totally normal, no discussion required whatsoever.

Yes, this is exactly what I mean. It is not easy to jump in the sack right away. In the beginning, we have to delicately let a non-pro SA gal know that we will help them out financially, but we do not think of them as pros. It takes time to give her both assurances. Both are important to many non-pro SA gals. For me, it has worked out eventually ONLY when the gal genuinely likes me and is attracted to me. If she doesn't, then it doesn't work out for me despite my best efforts at giving her both assurances. For example, I have given money to girls to show them that I respect their time or to help them out with a bill or payment, but if we don't have sex by the 3rd date at the latest, then I know she's not really attracted to me and is only in it for the money, so I bail.

To make it seem non-transactional, this means we have to give them money when there is no sex. If you only give them money when you have sex, this does not separate money from sex that well, at least not in her mind. I still say it is tricky. Not easy to do. For example, how many of us have had sex with an SB and did not give her money on that day? It probably almost never happens. It only happens after a long process. It took me weeks and active effort to establish it with one SB, and it took me months to establish it with another SB, where we can now meet for sex and I don't pay them a dime, because they know I will help them out when they need it later because they now think we are in some sort of real relationship.

[Steve 9696]

So still coming off the high of Alexa. Definitely one of my best life experiences. And she's so girlfriendy we chat nearly daily. It's almost like a real relationship.

Meanwhile Layla is kinda ghosting me after I ghosted her while with Alexa. It occurred to me that I've advanced her about $900 more than the sex we've had. So I realized she's not wanting to deal with the $900. Pondering this. Going to be important soon.

Recently also had a date with a stripper (Noelle) and met another on SA and realized the local club might be a place to find a hookup. So I've stopped in a few times. Still holding out a little hope but so far the strippers are proving lame:

1. Isabella is hot and fun. I get her number. Convinces me to do a private dance with her friend. It is of course lame and expensive as almost all US strip clubs are. Nonetheless we text back and forth and agree on a date. Set the time and place and everything. Then day of date she ghosts me.

2. Next day I find Aimee and she is totally new. A good thing. Get her number and try to generate some interest but seems pretty cool. May see her at the club again and see. She seems sweet and impressionable.

3. Arianna. From SA refuses to meet outside the club. Clearly just out to get a champagne room rip-off. Boo.

4. Noelle. This is the girl I had a great date with. She's on stage when I arrive. She says she thought I'the be mad at her but I say let's talk it out. First she contends I came on too strong (uh actually real girls are much more DTF than u) but then admits she will only do "fun time" but no sex. Wants $$ to be arm candy. Uh no. Time waster!

So really the stripper angle has been a bust. But hey window shopping is fun so I may keep it up.

So as I am nursing my wounds at the club after the Noelle fiasco I text Layla and say just tell me ur ok and she says shes been stressing about money and car repairs and all. So now, knowing my options are limited, I know what I have to do if I wanna get back in the game and say you can keep the $900 and if u ever wanna hook up hit me up and what do U know? She says what are u doing right now? Hahaha that was easy.

I tell her Ive only got a half hour but ten minutes later we go do a BJ in the car and I give her a small amount. It’s naughty and quick after blue balls and b*tches in the club and we are both happy. Then we meet up the next day and do 2 hours of nonstop sex for the usual allowance. So we are back on — pretty much sex in call. ($900 is not a huge amount of money to me and really shes been charging me $100-150 under market since August. And now I have sex on call again. Totally worth it.)

In other developments I've found a girl on the other end of the spectrum. Recent breakup. Never done SA. Manage to get her out on a date by swearing we will not do anything more than kiss (which both put her at ease and put kissing on the menu!) and it went super well. It was a little awkward because she's nervous. But after a bunch of drinks we go for a walk. I stop her and go for a kiss and after two soft close lips kisses the tongues come out and it's full on mackin. We walk back to my car and make out again. Wow. Really good. She's a great and passionate kisser. Felt like if we didn't have the pact it was on.

So now the question for you fellows. What's the next step? Another date and try for a hotel close? Talk a bit about what she sees as next steps? Start hinting private time is next? Anyone broken in a nervous first timer? Thoughts?

[Pessimist]

It is not difficult to separate money and sex during the discussions. I tell them I do give allowance / gifts. In fact I said so in my profile description itself. More than half the guys on SA are freeloaders and girls are assured if you tell them you will give allowance. Then the next question is how much and what is involved. If they ask me, I say the allowance can be help towards some of their expenses such as rent or books or just a cash amount to help out. If they press further, I will give a sense of the range of amounts I have given in the past. SOme ask what they need to do in return. I will keep it very general and will say that "just to get to know each other, how we get along and go from there". Most sensible girls know and realize they are not going to receive hundreds of dollars just for meeting for coffee. Well, if they do that is their problem because I am not giving them any cash after a coffee meet anyway. The important thing to do is never bring up sex explicitly in any discussion. Sooner or later the girl realizes she will see the money only she give it up. And as I said again and again, it is important you enjoy the process. If you are impatient and want to jump in the sack in 2 days, well ain't going to happen, not the way I do it. But that is why it is important to build a rolodex over time. Once you have had sex w / a girl, you don't have to do that dance all over again. From then on, it becomes totally normal, no discussion required whatsoever.

[DramaFree11]

Thanks for sharing your story. Yeah, when we meet a non pro on SA, we have to tread carefully and not treat them like a pro and not treat them like something that we are buying. As Pessimist, WyattEarp, and Steve9696 have said recently and in the past, we have to separate the money and sex for non pro SA gals, otherwise they will feel bad about themselves. But this is easier said than done. In the beginning, when we meet an non pro SB for the first time, how do we separate the money from the sex? This is very hard to do. Many years ago, when I was pretty new to SA, I had a great first date, and she suddenly said, "lets go back to my place and snuggle. " I was stunned and thrilled. So I said, "okay, and I will give you $500. " She shot back, "I am not a prostitute!" I quickly apologized and told her that I was so crazy about her, that I lost my mind. That calmed her down. So, yeah, we have to separate money from sex, but how? I guess the best thing to do is to NOT bring up money unless she brings it up. This has worked for me on occassion. What I will do is listen carefully on the first date, and if we end up in the sack, then the next day, I will say, "last night, you told me your dog needed to see the vet today, I love dogs, so let me pay for that, here's $200. " Or, I will look for opportunities to pay for something else. Another example is that on the next day after a successful first date, I said, "I see your car door handle is broken. You should fix that. Let me give you $300. "..

Wow, amazing report. I learned a lot, thanks for the advice and wisdom.

[Midwestern]

When I decided to go to the casino, I didn't have any intentions of taking the date to her apartment, but somehow we ended up talking about that. I did not have too much time that day and had to get home back soon, so I asked if we can go to her apartment for a preview of our weekend's date and not the full monty. She was on board for that after a bit of coaxing but she thought I thought I mean the same arrangement (250) also to meet tonight. I told her that I cannot stay for a ling time and thus we will not be able to enjoy each other fully, so how about a reduced arrangement of maybe 100-150, for like a blowjob or something like that. To be honest, I made the rookie sugar daddy mistake of thinking in terms of how much I would pay a hooker for a specific time frame. If this was now, I would have treated it differently.

Anyways, she was kind of ok with that and agreed to leave after she goes to the bathroom. We return to our table, she goes to the bathroom with her friend, and suddenly her mood had changed, and she told me that she did not like how I offered her money, and I should have made my proposal in a different way. I was a bit pissed honestly, and tried to come to an arrangement but the mood was already spoiled. I think the ***** friend said something about it when they went to the bathroom together, but don't know for sure. I finished my drink and left for the night (with a disappointed johnny). We kind of said our goodbyes the next day on text, but I was careful not to burn bridges.

I did message her after a few days, but she was a little bit dry, although still willing to meet. I haven't had the chance to meet her yet, but maybe someday, who knows.

Thanks for sharing your story. Yeah, when we meet a non pro on SA, we have to tread carefully and not treat them like a pro and not treat them like something that we are buying. As Pessimist, WyattEarp, and Steve9696 have said recently and in the past, we have to separate the money and sex for non pro SA gals, otherwise they will feel bad about themselves. But this is easier said than done. In the beginning, when we meet an non pro SB for the first time, how do we separate the money from the sex? This is very hard to do. Many years ago, when I was pretty new to SA, I had a great first date, and she suddenly said, "lets go back to my place and snuggle. " I was stunned and thrilled. So I said, "okay, and I will give you $500. " She shot back, "I am not a prostitute!" I quickly apologized and told her that I was so crazy about her, that I lost my mind. That calmed her down. So, yeah, we have to separate money from sex, but how? I guess the best thing to do is to NOT bring up money unless she brings it up. This has worked for me on occassion. What I will do is listen carefully on the first date, and if we end up in the sack, then the next day, I will say, "last night, you told me your dog needed to see the vet today, I love dogs, so let me pay for that, here's $200. " Or, I will look for opportunities to pay for something else. Another example is that on the next day after a successful first date, I said, "I see your car door handle is broken. You should fix that. Let me give you $300. ".

Finally, I think sometimes we just have to roll the dice and take a plunge. One of my current SBs is someone I met for a PPM, and it was great, but then she said that she will never do that again. And so, I had to cajole her into seeing me a few times on real dates. We had lunch. We did window shopping. When she saw something she liked, I bought it for her. One time, I even bought her an expensive piece of jewelry. So one day, at lunch, she said, let's go to a hotel. She even paid for the room! A few days later, I said, "I know you have some stress about your mortgage back home, which is $1,200 per month. I like you a lot. And so, let me pay your mortgage for you every month." For me, I thought it was very important for me to wait a few days before I suggested paying her mortgage, so she didn't feel I was paying her for sex. That was a couple of months ago. Since then, I've been seeing her almost twice per week at my love shack. And each time meet, I give her nothing. At the end of the month, I give her money for her mortgage. Sometimes, I might still buy her stuff when she sees something she likes. But this relationship works because we keep money separate from sex. But it took a long time and a lot of money to get this established and running smoothly. She now even buys me small gifts (one time, she gave me a nice gift) and pays for lunch sometimes.

Anyways, I've been using Seeking in Mexico City and Colombia over the past couple of months while traveling. I've got to say, it takes a lot of time and patience for flakes, but the reward may be worth it depending on who you are. On multiple occasions I've had girls confirm with the day of and never show up. One girl even had the balls to say she was in the Uber on the way over and she ghosted me. And in general these girls will go days without answering their messages. But the upside is potentially so sweet. You might find a novia (feel like I've already struck gold) or at least find some very cute university girls / non-pros that you can chill with.

With these non-pros, there's no clock watching, complete GFE, and its a girl that I can just hang out with for hours and have a real conversation with.

Yeah, this is exactly the tradeoff. SA can be a lot of time and aggravation, but when you find good SBs, then it's totally worth it.

[Bdb013]

I just returned from a trip to Puebla Mexico. It was Day of the dead weekend there. I have to say that the city was pretty much subdued because of covid. Everyone wore masks inside and out. We were able to see some sights and eat at some nice restaurants.

There were three of us on the trip. I used SA exclusively for finding dates for all of us. I started out about 3 weeks prior to my trip. I found a pretty 21 yr old college student. She stayed with me for 4 days. My other two friends had multiple dates from SA. One of my friends was even able to talk two chicas to come see him. The two girls had never met before. He said it was the best night of his life. All the girls ranged from 19-23. All very beautiful. We could have struck up with several more from SA. But didn't. We stayed at a small boutique hotel on the center square in the historic part of town. It was very girl friendly and had a nice restaurant & bar.

I almost always use SA exclusively now. It is a little expensive, but with great big rewards.

[Pessimist]

Just because work is slow right now, thought I am going to share some of my SA experiences in my home country.

So I live in a northern European country where the girls are not considered the most beautiful, but still some lookers of course. I have had encounters with I think 7 or 8 girls over the last few months, have had sex with some, not with some, but overall has been a very interesting experience. SA girls are quite flaky and its a bit difficult to match schedules, arrange hotels and stuff when you are mongering in your own city. Thats why I have missed on meeting quite a few interesting ones, but the haul has not been bad by any measure. Here goes:

Girl 1: She is the first one I met and also the most fun one I met in my home country. We had a very nice drink on a terrace overlooking a lake as our first date and she looked quite lovely. With makeup, she looked like late 20's. She had a good figure, a little bit thicker than I usually prefer, but a solid 7.5-8 overall. We had a very nice chat for a couple of hours, the waiter who was serving us was an awesome guy, he realised that we were on a date and helped me a bit in making her laugh etc, asked both of us mischievously how the date is going, so that really helped break the ice, so the date overall went very well. I was very green at that time and honestly did not know how to bring up the money topic. But finally, while walking back towards our cars, I did bring up the money topic and agreed to meet that weekend for 250 ppm at her apartment. I think at that point she genuinely liked me and was looking forward to meet me. A nice wet kiss in the parking lot and went home happy that day.

The day after, I was just casually chatting with her at night and she told me that she was at the casino with some friends. I joked if I could come over since I am a roulette fan, and she said sure. After thinking about it for a while, decided to go over and meet up with her and hopefully have fun at the casino. She was there with another couple (the girl was def another sugar baby friend of hers, I got to know later). This is important later. She did not look as nice as she did on the previous date, and was a little bit drunk, so I wasn't that happy this time, but went along with the flow. Played a bit of roulette, lost again like always, had a couple of drinks, and overall had quite a fun time. When I decided to go to the casino, I didn't have any intentions of taking the date to her apartment, but somehow we ended up talking about that. I did not have too much time that day and had to get home back soon, so I asked if we can go to her apartment for a preview of our weekend's date and not the full monty. She was on board for that after a bit of coaxing but she thought I thought I mean the same arrangement (250) also to meet tonight. I told her that I cannot stay for a ling time and thus we will not be able to enjoy each other fully, so how about a reduced arrangement of maybe 100-150, for like a blowjob or something like that. To be honest, I made the rookie sugar daddy mistake of thinking in terms of how much I would pay a hooker for a specific time frame. If this was now, I would have treated it differently.

I feel that honestly you made a mistake. I would also give up on that girl and move on.

She is right in her mind thinking that you reneged on the terms. Negotiating for 250 and then saying you will give 150 because you have less time and can only do a blow job absolutely does treat her a prostitute and not only that cheapens it a bit. I am sorry to be harsh but that is the blunt truth.

To her, assuming she is a not pro, the very act of having any sexual contact is a big step. And whether it was a BJ or fucking, it is still sex. You are almost saying "I will give x euros for BJ, x1 euros for licking, x2 euros for fucking, etc". Frankly, that sort of a la carte pricing is how FKKs have changed of late and most mongers hate it. Why would a non-pro sugarbabe like it?

And you trying to repair it now will not work in my estimation. The girl has formed an impression in her mind. Is it worth changing it? She is not your GF. Just forget her and move on to greener pastures. Unless your city is a terrible hunting ground for sugar daddies, you are better off putting this behind you and finding someone else where the relationship is not spoiled due to prior impressions.

Anyway, that is what I would do if I were in your shoes today. Good luck.

[Mongerer88]

Thanks for posting. We can all learn from your experience.

First, you live in a Northern European country where the girls aren't considered the most beautiful. Hmmm. I was running through the Northern European countries. I started to think there must be a country north of Scandinavia that I do not know. LOL.

As you said, I think you made a big rookie sugar daddy mistake. As has been mentioned by Steve9696, keep the money as far apart from the sex as possible. I wouldn't blame the friend. Girls talk whether in the bathroom or as soon as you and your sugar baby are off the phone. Just by the way you described it, the sex sounded very transactional as soon as you began discussing specific amounts for specific sex acts. Perhaps it was more subtle. I'm guessing things were going well and alcohol colored your judgement a bit.

Good luck on getting back on track with this girl. I'm sure some time will help.

And yes, please post more experiences. I think the experiences help us inexperienced members understand how the sexual relationship can escalate or fail.

We may be a bit biased because Montreal's Nordic Goddess is considered by most to be a true stunner.

https://twitter.com/MissSashaJo

Jackofnone, do all Nordic women not look like her?

[WyattEarp]

Just because work is slow right now, thought I am going to share some of my SA experiences in my home country.

So I live in a northern European country where the girls are not considered the most beautiful, but still some lookers of course. I have had encounters with I think 7 or 8 girls over the last few months, have had sex with some, not with some, but overall has been a very interesting experience. SA girls are quite flaky and its a bit difficult to match schedules, arrange hotels and stuff when you are mongering in your own city. Thats why I have missed on meeting quite a few interesting ones, but the haul has not been bad by any measure. Here goes:

Girl 1: She is the first one I met and also the most fun one I met in my home country. We had a very nice drink on a terrace overlooking a lake as our first date and she looked quite lovely. With makeup, she looked like late 20's. She had a good figure, a little bit thicker than I usually prefer, but a solid 7.5-8 overall. We had a very nice chat for a couple of hours, the waiter who was serving us was an awesome guy, he realised that we were on a date and helped me a bit in making her laugh etc, asked both of us mischievously how the date is going, so that really helped break the ice, so the date overall went very well. I was very green at that time and honestly did not know how to bring up the money topic. But finally, while walking back towards our cars, I did bring up the money topic and agreed to meet that weekend for 250 ppm at her apartment. I think at that point she genuinely liked me and was looking forward to meet me. A nice wet kiss in the parking lot and went home happy that day..

Thanks for posting. We can all learn from your experience.

First, you live in a Northern European country where the girls aren't considered the most beautiful. Hmmm. I was running through the Northern European countries. I started to think there must be a country north of Scandinavia that I do not know. LOL.

As you said, I think you made a big rookie sugar daddy mistake. As has been mentioned by Steve9696, keep the money as far apart from the sex as possible. I wouldn't blame the friend. Girls talk whether in the bathroom or as soon as you and your sugar baby are off the phone. Just by the way you described it, the sex sounded very transactional as soon as you began discussing specific amounts for specific sex acts. Perhaps it was more subtle. I'm guessing things were going well and alcohol colored your judgement a bit.

Good luck on getting back on track with this girl. I'm sure some time will help.

And yes, please post more experiences. I think the experiences help us inexperienced members understand how the sexual relationship can escalate or fail.

[Rextor]

So if anyone wants to read my post history, you'll know that I went on an awesome SA date pre-pandemic. Long story short, over the course of the pandemic this girl and I grew close to the point that she is now basically my novia. I think we were both in a position that we were lonely and wanted company, she didn't really need money at the time, and I wanted it to feel real, so I basically brought up the idea of vanilla, unpaid dates, and she was absolutely fine with it. Fast forward many months and many Zoom-based movie nights, and I finally got to see her a few weeks ago. I'll confess I am weak against the pleasures of the flesh, and I had seen other girls that I found on SA in Medellin. But to show you guys how chill my novia is, we went to La Isla strip club. Not only was she ok with me looking or touching, she actively brought over girls for me to play with. And at the end of the night, she said that she didn't consider it cheating if I had sex with other girls. So definitely picked the right one haha.

Anyways, I've been using Seeking in Mexico City and Colombia over the past couple of months while traveling. I've got to say, it takes a lot of time and patience for flakes, but the reward may be worth it depending on who you are. On multiple occasions I've had girls confirm with the day of and never show up. One girl even had the balls to say she was in the Uber on the way over and she ghosted me. And in general these girls will go days without answering their messages. But the upside is potentially so sweet. You might find a novia (feel like I've already struck gold) or at least find some very cute university girls / non-pros that you can chill with.

With these non-pros, there's no clock watching, complete GFE, and its a girl that I can just hang out with for hours and have a real conversation with. In contrast, I've never met an actual puta that I didn't want out of my room 10 minutes after finishing (then again, not very experienced, so who knows). I guess the only strategy is to have a stable of professionals at hand in case someone does flake. I'll confess my Medellin FB game was not on point, so I spent many nights just alone. Which is ok since I was and will be there for an extended period of time but not great for a someone trying to maximize their time.

[Pessimist]

I recently converted a monthly allowance to PPM. She was someone that I had an affair with last year, and she never expected or asked for a penny. She is 45 years old, married, but has a pretty good body, and she loves to DFK and we are quite compatible in the sack. I didn't see her for about 8 months due to the lockdown, and her deciding to stay in her hometown. However, she and her husband and their adult daughter recently moved to a city neighboring Shanghai. This meant that we could rekindle our affair. However, when I met her again for the first time, a couple of months ago, she was desperate for money, because she and her husband did not work during the lockdown, and she needed to pay three months rent, so I gave her a lump sum to cover the entire three months rent, and I told her that I would give her another lump sum in three months. But I told her that I wanted to see her once per week and she agreed, mostly because I think she genuinely likes me too. Since then, we've only met three times. She kept coming up with excuses to not meet. I did not mind too much. I like her and I was happy to help her. And then, a few days ago, she asked me if I could give her another lump sum to pay off a debt, and she said that I didn't have to pay her rent next time. I thought about it for a couple of days, and then I told her that I don't have large sums of cash laying around, but that I could give her some money each time we meet. As soon as I said this, she said, "can we meet tomorrow?" So, PPM definitely works well sometimes, despite the fact that it feels transactional..

Thanks for sharing MW. How did the monthly allowance arrangement begin? Did you start it off with monthly or was it a ppm that converted to a monthly? I can see building trust with a bunch of ppms, like each other and have trust, then convert to monthly.

I prefer ppms because monthlys imply a long term obligation. If you have a sugarbabe on a monthly for a couple of months and then drop her, it has the feeling of a breakup with a GF. Also, if you agree to see other once or twice a week in the monthly arrangement but have to travel, have some other issues that make you busy then you are still on the hook for the money part but you end up paying with not much in return.

That said, if you find a gem and you like each other, monthly can be very nice. I had some super cutie young sugar babes who I did see several times and if I had an opportunity to have any of them on a monthly for a year or two, I would have jumped at it because they were absolutely awesome. But girls like that were never in a rush for monthly; they tended to be strictly NSA.

[Midwestern]

Issue with conversion between per meet and per month allowance is the frequency of payments. Say, you are used to giving allowance of $300/ meet. If you agree to $1200 a month with the implicit understanding that you will meet once a week, do you give the $1,200 at the start of the month, in the middle, or at the end? If you give it at the first meet, what will you do if she takes it and vanishes? On the other hand, if it is at the end or even in the middle she is giving a free one (s) and you might not come back.

I recently converted a monthly allowance to PPM. She was someone that I had an affair with last year, and she never expected or asked for a penny. She is 45 years old, married, but has a pretty good body, and she loves to DFK and we are quite compatible in the sack. I didn't see her for about 8 months due to the lockdown, and her deciding to stay in her hometown. However, she and her husband and their adult daughter recently moved to a city neighboring Shanghai. This meant that we could rekindle our affair. However, when I met her again for the first time, a couple of months ago, she was desperate for money, because she and her husband did not work during the lockdown, and she needed to pay three months rent, so I gave her a lump sum to cover the entire three months rent, and I told her that I would give her another lump sum in three months. But I told her that I wanted to see her once per week and she agreed, mostly because I think she genuinely likes me too. Since then, we've only met three times. She kept coming up with excuses to not meet. I did not mind too much. I like her and I was happy to help her. And then, a few days ago, she asked me if I could give her another lump sum to pay off a debt, and she said that I didn't have to pay her rent next time. I thought about it for a couple of days, and then I told her that I don't have large sums of cash laying around, but that I could give her some money each time we meet. As soon as I said this, she said, "can we meet tomorrow?" So, PPM definitely works well sometimes, despite the fact that it feels transactional.

That said, my other SB is still a monthly allowance. So far, it's going well. I see her once or twice per week. And around twice per month, she spends all day with me. She actually said something to me that really struck me. She said, "I need two things from you: love and money. The only way I can get those things is to make you happy. " At first, I wasn't sure how to take this. But then I decided that this makes her a good SB. She also texts me everyday. She's hilarious. But yeah, she too has canceled dates too. That happens with monthly allowances.

One of the best parts of both SBs is that we bareback. So, this is another reason why I cut them some slack in terms of our arrangements.

[Pessimist]

Issue with conversion between per meet and per month allowance is the frequency of payments. Say, you are used to giving allowance of $300/ meet. If you agree to $1200 a month with the implicit understanding that you will meet once a week, do you give the $1,200 at the start of the month, in the middle, or at the end? If you give it at the first meet, what will you do if she takes it and vanishes? On the other hand, if it is at the end or even in the middle she is giving a free one (s) and you might not come back.

If you have been seeing each other for a while, then it is easier to trust each other and convert per meet to per month because you have some trust built up.

The formula itself is generally per meet * expected number of meets = per month (with some discount likely because you are guaranteeing that many meets a month).

But the key hurdle is always the trust issue. I recommend not to blindly enter into a monthly arrangement and hand over the entire monthly sum at the first meet. That would be foolhardy.

If you are talking about a vacation together, then it is different. If you bought the plane fare for her, she would not run away because you could cancel her ticket. On the other hand, girls would be reluctant to travel with you unless they know you and trust you because they know they are in your power -- typically they don't have too much money and if you get upset with them and kick them out, they would be stranded homeless in a foreign country with no money to get back home. That may or may not happen but any girl would be foolish to not consider such a downside scenario. There are quite a few assholes out there and they will take advantage of a girl in such a situation. If I was advising a girl as a friend, I would tell her to be very careful to ever accompany any guy on a foreign trip unless she knew him very well and has a tremendous amount of trust. From a girl's pov, in my view it is simply not worth it to place herself in the power of an unknown guy.