Kyiv

[Lucky Nuts]

That is correct and absolutely no need offend somebody like a fool. However, if you get the "look", follow up.

Well if it's correct that 99.9 percent are not interested in P4 P then rather than look for that one in a thousand or even one in one hundred I'll just continue doing a couple pro apartments girls each day I'm in Kyiv. And I'll keep my eyes open in case by chance I stumble into that rare one with that "look" in her eyes LOL. Or one with more groceries than she can handle herself.

[Riina]

May be you have to come to the basics: how to seduce a woman, 99.9% of the girls are not prostitutes so money will not work.

That is correct and absolutely no need offend somebody like a fool. However, if you get the "look", follow up.

[Kozerog]

May be you have to come to the basics: how to seduce a woman, 99.9% of the girls are not prostitutes so money will not work.

Money can often turn maybe into yes. Try the following procedure. Ask the girl if she would like to meet you in person for drinks. Or, if you just met her in the street and it's harsh weather outside, ask if she wants to continue the conversation indoors. Then YOU choose the venue. Either nearest coffee shop, or typical mid-priced bar/restaurant with drinks for under 100uah, or fancy place like Avalon in center city of she's a recent arrival from some village and you want to show her how the oligarchs live. Wherever you go, tip decently, especially if you plan to return.

After talking a bit, if she seems like a good prospect, invite her to your apartment. Before she can accept/refuse the invitation, explain that you are an older foreigner and tourist, and as such, it would shameful for both of you (you = cheapskate, girl = naive fool) if she visited you and didn't get a nice gift afterwards, but of course you don't want to insult her by discussing the proposed gift unless she is interested. If she is interested, state clearly how much you will pay, what services you absolutely need, and then explain clearly that money will be counted out and placed on table when you emerge from bathroom (I assume you take your wallet into bathroom) and remain there until she leaves, and that she will not be forced to do anything she isn't comfortable with and can leave the apartment early if she wants, but in that case she doesn't get the gift.

Each guy has to figure out his own way of stating the above expectations and procedures, based on how much bluntness the girl can take. To avoid problems, avoid ambiguity. That is, explain everything very clearly upfront so the girl has no excuse for not understanding.

I'm leaving out a lot of steps. Maybe you need several dates before inviting to your apartment. Maybe you don't want to discuss cash amounts amd services and not define "gift" or conditions under which gift will be given. My thinking is that, assuming the girl is interested in you without money, adding 2000 UAH sweetens the deal and makes her very careful about shit-testing you, wasting your time, etc.

I went the opposite way, and converted an escort to a sugar baby. I took a two week break from her recently, without explaining why, after accidentally on purpose letting her glance at a Viber message with smiley from my pretty young Russian instructor. Now that we are back together, certain disagreeable attitude I noticed in her previously has completely disappeared. Maybe she missed my golden dick or my super seduction skills during that two week break. Or maybe it was the 5000 uah I give her each visit.

[Pajsph]

Anyone know if the clubs like darling Rio etc are open? Always enjoy killing a few hours during my visits. Thank you!

[ExpatLover]

May be you have to come to the basics: how to seduce a woman, 99.9% of the girls are not prostitutes so money will not work.

[Kater100]

Cool if you have the game and balls to persuade normal girls into P4 P. Although I can do this in Cuba I would not be confident enough to do so in Kyiv expecting to be shot down or insulting to a young lady. Maybe I just don't understand the scene well enough yet. Please share any tips or ideas how to work this angle. I remember Yummy helped a gal carry her groceries and sacked her that same night. I saw so many hotties in Kyiv that I wished I knew how to ask if they wanted to make some easy money.

You should definitely not do that! Here we talk about normal flirting. Nothing more. You can find tips for this at so-called "pick-up artists" on the Internet. It is important that you do this more often. There is no guarantee that it works for everyone.

At some point you will develop a feeling if she do P4 P or not. Also, she will address the topic by herself. Don't worry Besides there is still the chance that you won't have to pay for it. .

[YummyPL]

I remember Yummy helped a gal carry her groceries and sacked her that same night.

She certainly wasn't a particular prize, but it was fun practicing. My short game is rather weak, but if I can get them on the hook enough to spend a few hours with me, I am very good at getting what I want from a girl.

Mamba is filled with scammers and other bad shit, but it is working for me. Time and effort. But I am living in the city alone with nothing better to do than work on the hunt. I enjoy spending time finding the gem, but most people don't have time to spend a couple of hours a day on hunting. I mostly don't have the interest in what apartment girls have to offer.

[Lucky Nuts]

You can also Google adverts. There are tons of whatsapp numbers, going to same bunch of apt addresses. I prefer semi or non professional. Few gems to be found on mamba or SA but requires work.

Yeah I think we all prefer semi or non pros. Just hard to find them. SA is a LOT of work in Kyiv. I haven't tried Mamba how's that going compared to SA?

Hi Lucky Nuts,

I'm Kiev for a few more days, could you please share via any numbers of interest. I have purchased a subscription.

PM sent.

You are probably right. The top few girls get the vast majority of the attention. It is like a law of nature.

However, the point remains. The top girls, the ones you want, have likely already seen a few customers that day. If you pick the ugliest one, you might be her first customer all week. In any case, the bed has already been used several times that day. I just prefer secretaries, nurses, cashiers and retail girls, bank tellers who work independently, get all the money themselves, and agree to meet at my place.

Cool if you have the game and balls to persuade normal girls into P4 P. Although I can do this in Cuba I would not be confident enough to do so in Kyiv expecting to be shot down or insulting to a young lady. Maybe I just don't understand the scene well enough yet. Please share any tips or ideas how to work this angle. I remember Yummy helped a gal carry her groceries and sacked her that same night. I saw so many hotties in Kyiv that I wished I knew how to ask if they wanted to make some easy money.

[Stevie69]

I read in the Dnipro thread that Tinder and maybe Mamba cannot be accessed in Ukraine unless you have a non-Russian VPN. Can anyone confirm or deny? And explain? Thanks.

[Stevie69]

You are probably right. The top few girls get the vast majority of the attention. It is like a law of nature.

However, the point remains. The top girls, the ones you want, have likely already seen a few customers that day. If you pick the ugliest one, you might be her first customer all week. In any case, the bed has already been used several times that day. I just prefer secretaries, nurses, cashiers and retail girls, bank tellers who work independently, get all the money themselves, and agree to meet at my place.

You overestimate the income of prostitutes in Kiev. Many of the girls from "brothels" only have 1-2 customers a day. Sometimes no customers at all.

[VinDici]

Any chance you are still in Kiev? American guy here looking to find the location of "the apartments".

If you want to meet up, send me a message, I'll be here until Thursday.

I've only booked outcalls to the hotel, 2 indies and an agency (or Salon as they say in Ukraine) girl so far in my 3 days. I'm staying in a small boutique hotel, and they don't give a fuck if I have girls over, they are business focused pure and simple. I even asked the receptionists to speak to escorts to guide them to the hotel (it has an awkward location and so far no one has managed to find it with some further assistance, including my initial cabbie) I'll write a full report once the trip is finished.

One caveat, my tastes are not in line with what other mongers usually go for, I prefer older BBWs types, although I do vary my tastes somewhat. The 2 indies were 100% older BBWs and certainly the type of escort, many others on this forum would turn away.

The agency girl was a plain MILF next door, however I must say that particular agency is great. The pictures they sent were accurate, they quoted me a price for the services I wanted, and the escort performed everything exactly to my specifications, no cheating or quibbling. The price they quoted was what I paid and not a penny more. Honest and reliable, which is not something I've experienced from agencies before. I tend to exclusively book indies, however my lack of Ukrainian language skills is hampering my efforts, it is taking considerable effort to book indies and when all is said and done, I'm saving maybe $25 compared to just going with this agency I tried.

Those who have been mongering for some time know the game of asking for kissing or CIM, paying extra for this, and then the girl claiming no knowledge, or that she never does this and they shouldn't have agreed before etc etc. It's not the money that bothers me when this happens, I just don't like being played for a mug. Which is why I was overjoyed when the agency girl performed to expectations.

I will continue the indie hunt, but this agency will be a solid plan be if things don't go as planned.

I have an indie lined up tomorrow afternoon, so hoping that works out. I've been lucky so far and not been ripped off, let's see if my luck holds out a little longer.

[VinDici]

....

Hi Lucky Nuts,

I'm Kiev for a few more days, could you please share via any numbers of interest. I have purchased a subscription.

[Jojab007]

Hi Lucky Nuts,

Any chance you are still in Kiev? American guy here looking to find the location of "the apartments".

I will gladly buy you dinner or coffee if you can meet up in Kiev.

Thanks!

You can also Google adverts. There are tons of whatsapp numbers, going to same bunch of apt addresses. I prefer semi or non professional. Few gems to be found on mamba or SA but requires work.

[Lucky Nuts]

Hi Lucky Nuts,

Any chance you are still in Kiev? American guy here looking to find the location of "the apartments".

I will gladly buy you dinner or coffee if you can meet up in Kiev.

Thanks!

Hi Gamer welcome to the game LOL! Wow your first post, nice. No I'm back in USA for a few more days before my next trip.

So the first thing you should do is buy a membership to ISG. PMs can provide invaluable information.

Best way I can offer you to find "the apartments" is to find Darling Club and walk around the street in front of the club like a lost puppy late night on weekends. Guys called agents will approach you and ask if you want to visit apartments with girls. The ones I've met have been cool and trustworthy. I use three different agents and would give you a number or two if you could receive PMs.

Please report back your experience trying to find an agent and trying to find "the apartments". What goes around comes around.

Oh and btw check out Darling Club. My experience there's usually no customers just 3 or 4 girls there and typically one good enough to make me very hard. I would usually go in the afternoon and ask for a card to re-enter again late night without paying another 200. They alway agreed to give me a re-entry card. I think all the girls charge 2200 per hour at Darling. My last time there they had six girls working and they told me 5 of them cost 2200 and the super hot one cost 3200. I said I want the super hot one. When we got in the room I start speading out my money on the bed to pay her and she stopped collecting at 2200 and gave the rest back to me. I'm guessing she already had a customer that day and the others didn't so they tried anyhow to dissuade me. Darlings is a good venue and the owner has several apartments not far from the club. The bartender could probably call a guy to take you to the other apartments.

[GamerGuy]

Hi Lucky Nuts,

Any chance you are still in Kiev? American guy here looking to find the location of "the apartments".

I will gladly buy you dinner or coffee if you can meet up in Kiev.

Thanks!

RTFF.

And buy a membership so that you can receive private messages.

I visited many different apartments. Prices range from 1200 to 5700 per hour. I never paid the 5700 but did pay 4500 a couple times. Most often I paid 2200 and also paid 1200 several times.

And yeah I hit the Baseina Street for 1800 and other various places for 1700, 2800 and 3200. I can't say there was much correlation between the prices and the quality of the girls. But I like variety so I visited as many different places as I could find rather than just frequenting the same cheaper apartments.