Crime, Safety, and the Police

[ClamSlammer]

The book, Poso Del Mundo by Ovid Demaris described how the Nuevo Laredo policia fought the local cartel and got control of the local drug business, then the policia tried to fight off the Federales who were shutting their drug business down. . . This was back in the 70's offhand. Nothing new under the sun. . .

Just 8 years ago, in Mexico City airport there was a police vs. Police shootout.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-18581077

[SpeedToys]

The book, Poso Del Mundo by Ovid Demaris described how the Nuevo Laredo policia fought the local cartel and got control of the local drug business, then the policia tried to fight off the Federales who were shutting their drug business down. . . This was back in the 70's offhand. Nothing new under the sun. . .

Ya, nothing new.

A reasonable, but politically impossible approach, would be to create a pathway for the cartels to. Supply the inevitable demand, but. Keep it 'clean', out the news, and much less visible, and there will be enough for everyone, and we won't be forced to be on your ass.

[Travv]

The book, Poso Del Mundo by Ovid Demaris described how the Nuevo Laredo policia fought the local cartel and got control of the local drug business, then the policia tried to fight off the Federales who were shutting their drug business down. . . This was back in the 70's offhand. Nothing new under the sun. . .

It was never a war, it was a cash grab by every level of LE.

Human nature will always prevail, and drug use / abuse / capitalization can't go away.

[Jackie888]

Potholes and impossibly STEEP hills. I was dropping my 19 year old amiga off in the Camino Verde neighborhood and using GPS to guide me back to the main road I come up to a hill that literally looked like I was about to drive off a cliff. I parked my car, walked over to the hill and looked down, and it literally was so steep it looked like almost like dropping off a cliff. I said fuck that, so I turned around to go back up the hill the way I came from but the hill was so steep my tires just spun out. You remember the saying "past the point of no return"? That was me I had no choice but to drive down the hill that looked like a straight drop off a cliff. My bunghole tightened up super tight. The hill was so steep my car bottomed out as I started the initial descent. I somehow made it out of there unscathed, but for a second I wasn't sure I was going to make it. Be careful driving around the hills of Tijuana. If you come up to a super steep hill turn around before it's too late. Back out of it and find another route, especially at night. Or risk your vehicle sliding or tumbling off the side of a mountain.

LOL. I had the same experience driving a girl home over in East Tijuana at 5 in the morning. I remembered putting my car in 2nd gear to go up a double diamond hill so steep that I keep reminding myself to not touch the brakes. I avoided that road when leaving, and considered asking Google to add a hill steepness feature to Google Maps. Fuck, some of those roads out there have no barriers to prevent people from driving off the cliffs.

[SpeedToys]

Looks like the cartels are winning the war on drugs

It was never a war, it was a cash grab by every level of LE.

Human nature will always prevail, and drug use / abuse / capitalization can't go away.

[Dogers69]

Anyone with a little experience in Mexico would know its government is corrupt from top to bottom, and the alleged cooperation by Mexico's military and policia is a sick joke, more like pick pocketing and back stabbing, not worth bargaining for. DEA can always use confidential informants and high-tech surveillance to investigate. They don't need Mexico's officials to involve and compromise their work. Considering the threats and damages done to the people in America by the cartels and their enablers, the US is a sovereign country and should have gone ahead and prosecute whomever violated her laws and not bowed to pressure from foreign countries. Releasing an indicted foreign official is a very bad precedent. Strong and firm legal prosecution of criminals, whoever and wherever thay are, will benefit the people of America and may assist in improving other countries' socio-political systems.

Looks like the cartels are winning the war on drugs, more people will be kidnapped, tortured, murdered to enforce trafficking and sales of drugs in the US, to enrich cartels bosses and the generals. Civilian government will bow and follow orders from the powerful military. Military patrols on the streets of Mexico and alleged cooperation with US DEA are just phony theatricals. They are just playing US' LE for more aids, to corrupt America and to enrich themselves on the back of the people in both countries.

I would guess, trump allowed this guy to be released as a favor to keep the Mexican president safe in his own country, due to his cooperation on what trump cared about most concerning Mexico, which was immigrants flooding the border. These kinds of favors and tradeoffs would happen on showtimes homeland, always deals being done between countries. Mexico's sever problems, lack of unity as a country, and civil war taking place between the army, politicians, cartels, corrupt "cops", and its citizens, its fascinating to follow. For such a rich country financially, and to have utter chaos, there's no country like it. I do see united states trending towards Mexico in many ways, with the emptying of jails, eliminating police enforcement in many cities, letting people settle their own beefs, tracking down where politicians live to scare them into doing what your group wants.

[Artisttyp]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/mexico-mo...204243058.html

[Captain Solo]

Anyone with a little experience in Mexico would know its government is corrupt from top to bottom, and the alleged cooperation by Mexico's military and policia is a sick joke, more like pick pocketing and back stabbing, not worth bargaining for. DEA can always use confidential informants and high-tech surveillance to investigate. They don't need Mexico's officials to involve and compromise their work. Considering the threats and damages done to the people in America by the cartels and their enablers, the US is a sovereign country and should have gone ahead and prosecute whomever violated her laws and not bowed to pressure from foreign countries. Releasing an indicted foreign official is a very bad precedent. Strong and firm legal prosecution of criminals, whoever and wherever thay are, will benefit the people of America and may assist in improving other countries' socio-political systems.

Looks like the cartels are winning the war on drugs, more people will be kidnapped, tortured, murdered to enforce trafficking and sales of drugs in the US, to enrich cartels bosses and the generals. Civilian government will bow and follow orders from the powerful military. Military patrols on the streets of Mexico and alleged cooperation with US DEA are just phony theatricals. They are just playing US' LE for more aids, to corrupt America and to enrich themselves on the back of the people in both countries.

In the end, generations of the peoples of America and Mexico will have to pay very high prices for the corruption and destructions of their societies by drug cartels and their government enablers.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/mexica...epedas-release

Mexican Army's 'Secret Brotherhood' Forced General's Release.

High-ranking military officers blackmailed the civilian government into pushing USA Prosecutors to drop drug trafficking charges against a former defense secretary.

Jeremy Kryt.

Published Nov. 26,2020 5:27 AM ET.

Daniel Becerril / Reuters.

Cali, Colombia—It's called El Sindicado, or the Syndicate. Allegedly, it's a "secret brotherhood" within Mexico's military that also wields some control over the civilian government.

How much control? Apparently enough that the cabal of elite four-star generals successfully forced the release of General Salvador Cienfuegos Zepeda, a former national defense secretary, from USA Custody earlier this month.

ADVERTISING.

Cienfuegos had been arrested on drug trafficking charges in LOS Angeles on Oct. 15, and DEA agents and prosecutors had built a strong case against him based on intercepted calls and text messages from his phone. The assembled evidence revealed that El Padrino (the Godfather), as Cienfuegos was known to his underworld contacts, had helped Mexico's H-2 cartel move thousands of kilograms of cocaine, heroin, and crystal meth into the USA In exchange for bribes.

DEA Investigators Fuming Over Mexican General's Dropped Case.

SAVED BY THE BARR.

David Shortell.

But sources say the powerful cabal of retired and active-duty generals—which includes other, previous defense secretaries like Cienfuegos himself—had begun working to undermine the DEA's case and secure El Padrino's return to Mexico since the day of his arrest.

Within hours of his capture in California, where he had been vacationing with his family, the Syndicate had sent a representative to knock on the door of current defense chief Luis Crecencia Sandoval, according to Mexico City-based news site Emeequis, which first broke the story.

This cabal's rep is identified in the Emeequis report as an officer with experience fighting the cartels in northern Mexico, as well as a close friend of Sandoval. And the message he delivered was that the highest-ranking commanders of the army "were not going to sit with their arms crossed while a foreign government tore their credibility to shreds. ".

Sandoval was instructed to carry this message to President Andrés Manuel López Obrador (often known by the initials AMLO), and in the coming weeks similar dictums followed. The generals' push increased after Cienfuegos was transferred to a maximum security prison in New York, and eventually turned to outright blackmail.

"The army had to be very concerned that Cienfuegos would disclose names. ".

"(The Syndicate) exerted a very strong pressure on AMLO so that he, in turn, would make Trump free Cienfuegos," said Dr. Raúl Benítez-Manaut, a security expert with the National Autonomous University of Mexico, in an interview with The Daily Beast.

Advertisement.

That pressure included threats to "return to their barracks and no longer cooperate with the United States," Benítez-Manaut said.

After initially siding with the DEA, AMLO was allegedly forced to concede by his generals. His administration communicated the threat of ending bilateral cooperation for law enforcement to USA Attorney General Bill Barr, ultimately resulting in Cienfuegos being returned to Mexican soil with all charges against him dropped.

A Corrupt "Military Junta".

The incident highlights how the growing militarization of Mexico's drug war has empowered the armed forces while diminishing the authority of democratically elected officials. The army has been used to fight organized crime in Mexico since 2006, but its role increased sharply after AMLO took office in 2018.

"(The Syndicate) operates like a military junta that allows for a civilian president, but they pull the strings from the shadows," Mike Vigil, the former chief of operations for the DEA, told The Daily Beast.

Soldiers are now routinely used to police shipping ports and urban centers, and even in construction projects like the new international airport in Mexico City.

Vigil, who spent more than a dozen years stationed in Mexico, accused the military of "playing a role in every facet of the government. ".

A senior law enforcement official in Mexico, who asked that his name be withheld so he could speak freely, likened the Syndicate to a "clan of power" which Mexico's president must "serve blindly and absolutely out of fear for a coup against him. ".

"The military has always behaved independently and in their interests," the official said. "And they have a decisive influence on the president who must bow to their requests. ".

The 'Comey of Mexico' Flees Justice in Student Massacre.

'Donde estan los 43?

Jeremy Kryt.

The army's growing power in Mexico has not, however, translated to victory in the cartel wars. Instead, the death toll has continued to climb over the last few years. There have already been 29,182 murders within the first 10 months of 2020—including an 8-percent spike in October—putting it on pace to be the deadliest year in the country's history.

At the same time, the military's once sterling image has become increasingly tarnished. In recent years the armed forces have been implicated in a number of human rights abuses and extrajudicial killings. That list includes a massacre of 16 civilians in 2015 and the infamous disappearance of 43 students in Guerrero province—both of which happened under Cienfuegos's tenure as defense minister.

Dr. Robert Bunker, a research director with the strategic studies institute Futures LLC, compared Mexico's Syndicate to Venezuela's Cartel de LOS Soles, which is also said to be run by the country's top generals.

"The Mexican army was desperate to gain the release of Cienfuegos in order to maintain the illusion that they and the government have no ties to organized crime. "

"The officer corps in authoritarian and still transitioning authoritarian militaries, of which (Mexico's) is the latter, are corrupt and heavily profit from the illicit economy at the most senior levels," Bunker said in an email.

The army's internal corruption is one reason USA Law enforcement agencies prefer to work with the smaller but more elite Mexican Marines.

"The marines are viewed as being less tainted and corrupted by cartel money or actively profiting from narcotics trafficking," he said. "This is why they have traditionally been used as a 'hunter-capture' force to take down cartel kingpins rather than the army. "

"A Poster Boy for Impunity".

So what's next for El Padrino?

The AMLO administration has promised that he'll be tried fairly in Mexico but critics remain skeptical.

"I don't believe that he will be prosecuted because Mexico has never investigated Cienfuegos, nor do they have any charges against him," said former DEA chief Vigil. "he will be protected by the military cabal and the judiciary there is very weak. "

Vigil also pointed out that even if the case does go to trial the outcome will be in doubt, as the success rate in federal prosecutions is less than 5 percent.

"he will be a free man and will be a poster boy for corruption and impunity," Vigil said. He also said that part of the Syndicate's motivation for demanding the repatriation and avoiding a trial is so that the general can't out co-conspirators to cop a plea.

"The thousands of intercepted Blackberry communications showed that Cienfuegos was recruiting other army commanders to protect H-2's operations as they moved tons of drugs through multiple Mexican states to the USA Border," said Vigil. "The army had to be very concerned that Cienfuegos would disclose names," which would be "disastrous for the institution. ".

"(The Syndicate) operates like a military junta that allows for a civilian president, but they pull the strings from the shadows. "

The DEA and USA Prosecutors have made the evidence gathered in the case available to their counterparts in Mexico. But because the intercepted messages were collected by a foreign government there is no guarantee that judges will find them admissible.

Futures director Bunker said there might be a kind of show trial, during which the presiding judge could just "make the case fall apart. "

"I have trouble seeing Cienfuegos being convicted—even with a light sentence—since the army as an institution would be dishonored," Bunker said.

Benítez-Manaut agreed with that assessment:

"In Mexico the general opinion is that the judges will help him and he will not be hit with criminal charges. ".

Because of their power and influence and long-standing regard in Mexican society, commanders at the highest level sometimes do see themselves as above the law. "For them it is not impunity, it is a right," Benítez-Manaut said.

Vigil agreed. "There is a different set of rules for high ranking corrupt officials. The military normally gets a stay-out-of-jail card for corruption and wholesale massacres," he said.

Another motive to quash the case could be the need for the military as a whole to preserve its image as an almost sanctified entity—one immune to the influence of narco-traffickers—lest Mexico come to be seen as a full-fledged narco state.

"The Mexican army was desperate to gain the release of Cienfuegos in order to maintain the illusion that they and the government have no ties to organized crime," Vigil said.

Despite such efforts at damage control, the rift between USA Law enforcement and the military in Mexico may be irreparable, at least for the near future.

Vigil called the new-found distrust between Mexico's security forces and the DEA a "malignant tumor" that will continue to fester.

"The issue of Cienfuegos release will certainly choke the critical exchange of information between both countries," Vigil said, "and that will only benefit the violent cartels. "

[Captain Solo]

https://www.latimes.com/california/s...gs-ammo-seized

Federal agents seized $3. 5 million in cash and massive quantities of cocaine, fentanyl and. 50-caliber ammunition from an Otay Mesa truck yard. (Homeland Security Investigations).

By Kristina Davis.

NOV. 24,20209:29 PM.

San Diego — Three Mexican nationals tied to cross-border trucking companies were charged Tuesday in San Diego federal court following the discovery of a massive cache of drugs, cash and ammunitions stockpiled at an Otay Mesa truck yard, the USA Attorney's office said.

The cumulative seizure — $3. 5 million in cash, 685 kilograms of cocaine, 24 kilograms of fentanyl, about 20,000 rounds of. 50-caliber ammunition and hundreds of body armor vests — is believed to be the largest of its kind in the Southern District of California, federal prosecutors said.

The stash illustrates the pillars of a drug-trafficking empire: narcotics that flow north and illicit proceeds that flow south, along with USA Weaponry to maintain control over it all.

This collection belonged to the Sinaloa Cartel, authorities said. The three men who were arrested — Chula Vista resident Jesus Burgos Arias and Tijuana, Mexico, residents Juan Alatorre Venegas and Jose Yee Perez — are accused of trafficking drugs on the organization's behalf.

The case is part of a much broader investigation into the cartel's activities, a probe that began nearly a decade ago in San Diego County and has resulted in charges against more than 125 people, many of them leaders in the inner circle of the organization.

One thread led investigators to a pair of brothers, Jorge Alberto Valenzuela Valenzuela and Gabriel Valenzuela Valenzuela, identified as high-ranking members who together own multiple Mexican trucking companies that they use to transport cocaine from Sinaloa, Mexico, into the USA, according to an arrest affidavit. The trucks are also used to ferry cash from the drug sales back to Mexico, authorities said.

Burgos, Alatorre and Yee are accused of working for the brothers, according to the affidavit.

On Oct. 15, agents watched Burgos and Jorge Valenzuela at an airport in Long Beach, preparing to board a private jet with eight suitcases. But the pilot inspected the contents of one piece of luggage, discovering what appeared to be bricks of drugs wrapped in plastic, according to the affidavit.

Valenzuela was arrested Oct. 29 outside of Boston after taking another flight from San Diego to the East Coast.

On Friday, agents put an Otay Mesa truck yard under surveillance, and sheriff's deputies conducted traffic stops on three departing vehicles: tractor-trailers driven by Alatorre and Yee and a Ford pickup driven by Burgos.

A subsequent search of the commercial facility revealed the millions of dollars, most of it wrapped in plastic and coated in axle grease. The drugs were found in the garage, and the ammo and body armor were found loaded into a tractor-trailer — likely bound for Mexico, investigators said. An AK-47-style rifle, which had been reported stolen in LOS Angeles in 2017, was also seized.

Authorities did not give the exact location of the facility.

"This seizure is significant not just because of its size, but because it demonstrates the direct correlation between narcotics, illicit money and guns that drives violence in our communities and destroys lives," said Cardell T. Morant, special agent in charge of Homeland Security Investigations. The agency worked jointly with the Drug Enforcement Administration, the San Diego Police Department and Sheriff's Department and the USA Attorney's office.

The initial investigation into the cartel began in 2011, when authorities thought they were dealing with a small-scale drug distribution cell in National City and Chula Vista. But the drugs were traced back to the cartel, and the case was expanded and continues today.

Among those who took guilty pleas were Dámaso López-Serrano, a godson of Sinaloa cartel kingpin Joaquín "El Chapo" Guzmán; Jose Rodrigo Arechiga Gamboa, who led the cartel's assassin squad as "El Chino Antrax"; and Serafin Zambada Ortiz, a USA Citizen born in San Diego who is a son of the cartel's at-large co-leader, Ismael "El Mayo" Zambada.

Last week, a former Mexican federal police officer alleged to be a high-ranking member, Ramón Santoyo Cristóbal, was extradited to San Diego following an arrest last year in Rome on a 2016 warrant.

There have also been tunnel builders, money launderers and numerous low-level associates prosecuted as a result of the investigation.

While Guzmán had been indicted in San Diego as part of a prior investigation, he was ultimately prosecuted in Brooklyn. He is serving a life sentence in a super-maximum security prison in Colorado.

Kristina Davis writes for the San Diego Union-Tribune.

[Captain Solo]

Why should I want to drive back to sleep in SD? If I am tired, sleepy or have a buzz, I could very quickly crash in a nice, clean hotel in Tijuana for cheap.

We used to book hotel rooms, party all night then crash in the room, wake up 4 AM and start driving back, stopping along Fwy 5 for a quick breakfast and real coffee. By 5 AM the SENTRI lanes would have a long waiting line on Padre kino way beyond the Chuhuatemoc rotary. Some morning policia blocks traffic on many streets for no apparent reasons and traffic severely congested. Traffic in Tijuana is a biitch. I hate to drive in commuting hours.

There are lots of hot chicas in HK and Chavelas in the last 2 weeks. Some of the hottest chicas have come back to work after 9 months without income. We are going down this Thursday for Mexican Thanksgiving, renting all night room in Cascada so we can bring girls up for long sessions, and stay half day Friday for some more drinking, partying and having sex with hot chicas.

I will drive at exactly 65 MPH all the way to keep CHP and the slow pokes in this forum happy hehehe.

[Hargow20]

Personally I would stay in a Airbnb in SD. You can find a cheap clean one for a very cheap price. Even though I live in SD I find visiting Tijuana to be fairly tiring sometimes. The whole ordeal of parking & walking to the Zona takes a lot out of me epsecially when the weather is hot. I really miss the days when it was fairly easy to find a hot SW on El Cajon blvd. The risk of LE was relatively low and the quality was better. Whenever I visit Tijuana I carry some drinks and a few snacks to help keep expenses down. I almost always stop at the 99 cents only store for some cheap food.

StRobert.

I am fine driving back about midnight. After 2 AM I get tired and sleepy. I am a deep sleeper. Once I drop off I would sleep like a log for straight 8 hours.

Moving south is a very tempting idea. A lot of guys I know are trying to find jobs in SD so they can go to Tijuana often. If I move I would find a nice second place in Tijuana and keep minimum clothing there just to crash a few nights a month. Then it would be cheaper and more convenient just crashing in a hotel in La Zona. Travv spends lots of time in Tijuana. I found him just about every time I am in HK, ran into him at breakfast at 8 in Las Perlas. He's a pro and probably has all the best solutions to Tijuana problems hehe. I like to go to Tijuana with wingmen and party with girls, but will have to rein in this wingman, who already divorced 3 wives, can only pop once a day, but wants to sit with girls all night, and I would sleep in Tijuana when I don't feel like driving. Then he would cry that he would get fired from his job and get shit on by wives and kids ect. This guy is weak and irrational with girls and needs reprogramming.

We just try to do too many things, have too much fun with hot girls with very little time and may get into troubles. There are warning signs that I take seriously and will have to modify my playing and driving habits.

[Captain Solo]

StRobert.

I am fine driving back about midnight. After 2 AM I get tired and sleepy. I am a deep sleeper. Once I drop off I would sleep like a log for straight 8 hours.

Moving south is a very tempting idea. A lot of guys I know are trying to find jobs in SD so they can go to Tijuana often. If I move I would find a nice second place in Tijuana and keep minimum clothing there just to crash a few nights a month. Then it would be cheaper and more convenient just crashing in a hotel in La Zona. Travv spends lots of time in Tijuana. I found him just about every time I am in HK, ran into him at breakfast at 8 in Las Perlas. He's a pro and probably has all the best solutions to Tijuana problems hehe. I like to go to Tijuana with wingmen and party with girls, but will have to rein in this wingman, who already divorced 3 wives, can only pop once a day, but wants to sit with girls all night, and I would sleep in Tijuana when I don't feel like driving. Then he would cry that he would get fired from his job and get shit on by wives and kids ect. This guy is weak and irrational with girls and needs reprogramming.

We just try to do too many things, have too much fun with hot girls with very little time and may get into troubles. There are warning signs that I take seriously and will have to modify my playing and driving habits.

[Hargow20]

Update:

When I crossed last evening there was no change crossing.

If anyone sees any new changes in Mexican immigration policy please post. ? It is quite possible they could start demanding prescriptions once again.

[Hargow20]

Fairly surprised you were pulled over by the CHP so often. I rarely see CHP officers when I am on the 5. But I supposed there far less cars at 2 am. Much wiser to not speed at that time of night.

Travv,

Last few years I have been pulled over by policia 7 or 8 times late at night after 6 or 7 hours of partying, one time tested with breath analyzer in Tijuana's medical truck on Benito Juarez. My BAC was way below Tijuana legal limit, which AFAIK is half of California, something like 0. 04%. If policia gets me for DUI with solid evidence, I could easily get out of it with $20. One night last month a policia even volunteered to escort me around an alcohol check point on be Juarez, but I know I would pass their BAC test and declined. It turned out to be just a quick fugitive check point, no alcohol test truck on site.

I was pulled over by CHP late at night near La Jolla a few years ago. The 2 cops claimed I flew past their parked patrol car at high speed, nearly blew their door off blah blah blah. They were hoping to make a big bust, gave me a long DUI test which I passed, so they gave me a speeding ticket instead. A SD attorney, Elizabeth Aronson, got the ticket dismissed for a small sum. Remember her name, a very good attorney and a beautiful, classy princess.

In the last couple years I got pulled over too many times on freeway by CHP, got a few tickets. I am more worried about CHP than the dumb and corrupt Tijuana policias. But you are right. Knowing the dire consequences of DUI in Mexico and California I should modify my driving habits, may be staying over on nights I feel tired or inebriated. Sometimes the problem is to accommodate the wingmen's work schedules or spousal commitments ect. But this latest wingman is irresponsible and repeatedly felt too drunk or too tired to drive. I am really mad at this loser, so I have to figure out alternatives.

You are a real gentleman with lots of experiences in Tijuana and kind concerns for the bros' safety. I wish you would share more of your experiences in this forum and just ignore jealous, ignorant guys who claim to know everything and crudely attack other bros without clear facts, solid evidences or good reasonings.

[Jinxx]

I don't know about anyone else. But potholes are a huge risk in Tijuana for drivers. I had 2 major flats in the last 4 weeks. These were nearly brand new. I found the first flat after I got my car from the garage so it may have not been a pothole. But on my 2nd flat, I hit a pothole at only about 20 mph and it blew out my new tire. The pothole was so deep that I thought I felt the bottom of my car hit pavement.

Potholes and impossibly STEEP hills. I was dropping my 19 year old amiga off in the Camino Verde neighborhood and using GPS to guide me back to the main road I come up to a hill that literally looked like I was about to drive off a cliff. I parked my car, walked over to the hill and looked down, and it literally was so steep it looked like almost like dropping off a cliff. I said fuck that, so I turned around to go back up the hill the way I came from but the hill was so steep my tires just spun out. You remember the saying "past the point of no return"? That was me I had no choice but to drive down the hill that looked like a straight drop off a cliff. My bunghole tightened up super tight. The hill was so steep my car bottomed out as I started the initial descent. I somehow made it out of there unscathed, but for a second I wasn't sure I was going to make it. Be careful driving around the hills of Tijuana. If you come up to a super steep hill turn around before it's too late. Back out of it and find another route, especially at night. Or risk your vehicle sliding or tumbling off the side of a mountain.