San Jose General Reports

[Noguera]

I heard that a bunch of Gringos pulled six of the best girls out of the Sportsmens Lodge and took them to the beach this past Sunday. I think they were all going to be down there for most of the week. If any of you guys read this let us know and give us some details. Which ever of you guys got to hook-up with Daisy ... you won the lottery. She not only has the best tits and nipples in Costa Rica, a killer face and body, but she is sweet and so very much fun and alive. I am jealous! Tell us about your adventure guys.

[FlacoDuro1]

Chase Star QUOTE:

"Finally, of course they're banging their "women", otherwise so many wouldn't be knocked up before they're 18. Hopefully, it is very few gringos that are responsible for that. But that brings up a non-financial aspect to this debate which is as much the ticos fault as our own. Many of them make lousy mates for their chicas. They get them embarazado and then they take off on them because they can't afford to support a family. OTOH, gringos may be old and fat but at least we shower them with money by comparison and perhaps as importantly in general we treat them much nicer thanks to our strict house-training by gringas. In other words, I think we make them look bad."

Truer words were never so spoken or in this case written.

I met a girl in Idem several years ago who spoke perfect english. She worked during the day at the INTEL plant, she had two kids. I asked her why she was working at IDEM, "because Costa Rica does not have child support laws" her tico husband ran off with a younger women, he had no job, nor is there any laws inplace to force him to support his children. She told me she was looking to hook up permanently with a gringo pensionato, which she evidenly did. I have probably fifty stories like this one. Tico men get plenty of pussy, unlike American men they aren't force to pay for it for the rest of their lives, and in some cases beyond. On one of my earlier visits I met another girl at the ARTE who aked me to marry her, basically the same story as above, but her family had money and had thrown her out when her Novio made her pregnant. She dropped out of college and was working at a casino and the Arte. I would have married her but my wife wouldn't let me.

Flacoduro1

I'm old but not fat

[Prolijo]

, the very fact that we are down there able to throw money around that they don't have, able to buy things that they can't afford, including their women ?

You lost me on this one Chase!!!

Are you implying they aren't banging their women...one might conclude from that idea that all those babies they are supporting must be half gringo,

I don't think so Chase

That's not what I was suggesting at all. What I'm saying is the fact that we have so much more money to throw around for pussy changes the whole dynamic in many ways.

First of all, it makes prostitution more appealing from the women's perspective since there is so much more money to potentially be made and so it turns sisters, wives and girlfriends into hookers that might not otherwise become ones. In other words, whether they're getting any themselves or not, how would you feel if a woman close to you was prostituting herself with some fat old gringo with a ton more money than you and as a result in addition to "sullying her honor" it puts her in the position of being the real breadwinner. Don't get me wrong I'm sure many of these guys would have no problem "sullying a girl's honor" themselves, but it is probably something else for some fat old gringo being able to do it to "their" women. Also, I'm sure they have no problem spending the money that their chicas bring home but I'm sure the fact she's the breadwinner instead of them must have some impact on the latin male ego.

Secondly, while I'm sure that tico men are probably not hurting at all for lack of willing pussy, that is more for lack of enough gringos to go around. As many of us as there are, there still aren't enough to corner the market. There are just too many chicas who would go for us, er I mean our wallets, if they had half a chance. Few working chicas score more than an hour or two "rental" at a time from us, let alone hit the big payoff of a jerk wiring them money from the US or worse yet marrying one of them. And those are just out of the comparatively few at the HDR/BM and assorted gringo-oriented MP's like ZB or NF. What does happen, at least in the P4P arena, is that the better looking chicas wind up at the gringo oriented places and the scummier looking chicas wind up at the scummier MP's which tico guys can afford. Sure there are exceptions and a few "diamonds in the rough" at the more obscure places but as a general rule it has some basis. Go to a strip joint with both ticos and gringos in the audience and see who gets the attention. The chicas know the ticos can only afford to look and have little money to play around. Same thing at better quality supposedly "tico" MP's like Oasis. Sure they get some business from a few wealthier ticos, but even Oasis is beyond the pocketbook of the average tico on the street. That leaves places like the Pensiones, and from what I've seen of the chicas there the ticos can have them.

Finally, of course they're banging their "women", otherwise so many wouldn't be knocked up before they're 18. Hopefully, it is very few gringos that are responsible for that. But that brings up a non-financial aspect to this debate which is as much the ticos fault as our own. Many of them make lousy mates for their chicas. They get them embarazado and then they take off on them because they can't afford to support a family. OTOH, gringos may be old and fat but at least we shower them with money by comparison and perhaps as importantly in general we treat them much nicer thanks to our strict house-training by gringas. In other words, I think we make them look bad.

[Johnny Sax]

you lost me on this one chase!!!

are you implying they aren't banging their women...one might conclude from that idea that all those babies they are supporting must be half gringo,

i don't think so chase

but they tell a good lie and i guess they actually make some of us feel like we are special (sic)

i think it was clear that chase was saying that the ticos cannot afford the prostitutes in the del rey, not that they can't afford to date other ticas.

one other form of resentment they have for us is increasing, and that is that we are buying up all their best property and many of them can no longer afford to buy it.

this however is a double-edged sword: we also bring jobs to an area, employing them to be gardeners, maids, farm workers, construction workers, maids, cooks, babysitters, etc. etc..

gringos bring a ton of money into costa rica and in fact, if they start enforcing draconian immigration and tax laws which they are talking about doing, then they will be cutting off the hand that feeds them, killing the goose that lays the golden eggs...

that said, i can certainly understand their resentment of rich gringos buying up their land. but the same thing happens here: rich japanese, saudis, etc. buy up our real estate, even our farms, our businesses, etc.. it's the way of the new world odor, one world economy, and will only get worse with cafta, like it did with nafta, but there will be some advantages as well. all in all, politics has not changed: it's all about the rich getting richer and the poor getting poorer. the corporations will [CodeWord123] the land and abuse the people and destroy the environment for the almighty dollar. always has been that way and always will be. it's just that now, it's gone global more so than ever before.

[Johnny Sax]

Chase, we sometimes don't see eye to eye on things, but I respect your opinions and certainly your right to have different ones than mine.

I think you have made a very cogent appraisal of the situation here, as far as Tico culture. I basically agree with everything you said.

With Ricky Ricardo it is a no-win situation, I think. Or rather, it is either you give in (he wins) or you don't give in, and he loses and he thinks you are just a cheap American asshole because you have plenty of money but don't want to give him a dollar. But it's the principle of it, not the buck, that bothers me.

If I had 2 heavy bags, I'd gladly give him $2 or so to carry them for me.

Actually the cheapness of the Morazan is not the main reason I stay there. I stay there because the Del Rey is full, and I like the close location; and I refuse to stay at the Prez since their Draconian dress code policy. With my discount I could stay at the Prez cheap enough, but I don't. Again, it's the principle of it. (Plus the fact I don't want to risk any hassles at the door or desk.)

I can address the issue of people in the 3rd World or "Developing Countries" having the opinion that Americans are all rich. I had a girlfriend from Mexico who told me that in fact, her and her friends and family thought that everyone in the U.S. was rich and there was no poverty at all! Sounds stupid, but yes, many people in these poorer countries believe this. I guess stories about homeless and poverty don't make it into the 7 o'clock news down there.
They know we make a LOT of money here, but what they do not know is that we also pay a LOT of bills on things they don't: car insurance, medical insurance, parking fines, moving violations, utilities, clothes, EVERYthing is high here in the good ole USA but all they hear are the incomes, not the out-goes. They have no idea that one might pay $1200 a month for a one bedroom apartment, $60 for cable, $100 for gas heat, $400 for medical insurance and then still pay $25 for a doctor visit... We all know this stuff, but they don't, so they think we're rich. Some of us are. Others of us are just getting by, but have a priority of spending our spare money on chicas Ticas.

I have gone out with Tico friends and at the end of the night, the girl - who I was NOT with at all, she was just invited along for the ride by another Tico - expected ME to pay her cab fare back to her pueblo out of town, about $8. I refused and she started to cry. I gave them a lecture about how all Americans aren't rich, in fact at that time (I was living in Costa Rica) I was nearly flat broke myself, and simply could not afford to pay for her cab. I don't know what they thought, but I know I felt that they were out to milk me. They'd also expected me to pay for drinks earlier on which I refused to do, though I may have put in a couple extra bucks. I think it was an education for them, to see an American who wasn't rich. So the point is, there IS this idea that all gringos have money to burn. And in COMPARISON to them, we usually do, if you look at it that way. I have more money now than I did then, but having been poor before, I have respect for how hard money is to get, and I don't like giving it away for nothing. On the other hand, if I see a poor woman in the street, obviously hungry and in need, I will go out of my way to double back and give her some money.

But the whole thing is, for me I am against the principle of letting someone like Ricky / Ricardo force me into giving him money to carry my bag when I do not wish him to carry it. It's not the money, it's the principle of it.

As to staying at the Morazan because it's cheap, yes, it's nice that it's cheap, but frankly I stay there more because of it's location. If I could get a nicer room for $50-65 in that location, I would pay it.

However, regarding the rooms at the Morazan, the rooms are not that bad, exept for the showers that don't work right. The girls usually go "This is nice!" which is good enough for me. Also, another thing: the rooms at the Morazan, at least the ones I get, are QUIET. You can hear the music at Key Largo, depending on your location, but not too loud and with my ear plugs in I sleep great there. Not so at some other places, even the Prez with their hard floor hallways and clicking heels. I've never had a problem sleeping at the Morazan.

That might be somewhat true but I don't know if I would frame it quite that way. You're stereotyping all ticos (except for the few with direct exposure to the US) and I'm not so sure that is safe to do any more than it is for them to stereotype us. The fact is that nearly all ticos, and certainly the vast majority with their hands out, are much poorer than even the most humble of us. They see us as having tons of money to just throw around. That is a stereotype too, but for too many gringo tourists it seems to apply quite well (albeit probably not the ones that stay at a cheap hotel like the Morazon). So, in their view, the most likely route for them to make the money they need to survive is by soaking us for as much as they can. Even more so than from their fellow ticos. After all, we're the ones that have the money and we're the ones that have the culture of tipping everyone at the drop of a hat even for just standard or substandard service.

... etc...[EDIT]

Finally, even when we are on our best behavior, the very fact that we are down there able to throw money around that they don't have, able to buy things that they can't afford, including their women and driving the prices up is bound to cause resentment among some ticos. How would you feel if the show were on the other foot?

[Johnny Sax]

Guys it is in their culture. Costa ricans will try to sodomize you out of every nickel you have. Deep down they Dispise Americans, but yet they have that "happy meal" smile about them. Living there for about 6 months in 2002, I learned the game. Costa Ricans remind me of the French in a way, they are two faced., except for some of them whom have relatives and may have been educated in the states, they tend to be more straight Forward. They feel that the United States has an obligation to give them whatever they want. they also remind me of the French, due to their anti-war appeasement mentality. Costa Ricans do not like to be confronted.

Don't feel bad though, they screw each other also....

Whatever you do with them, never ever lose your cool... Just be firm and say "no" in a regular toned voice, it works... But fat ass, you may have to yell at him. When he gets out of hand , give him a quarter

You make some valid points. I also have lived there, and known quite a few Ticos. I think, like any people, it is over-generalizing to say that it is in their culture to want us to give them money, or that they despise Americans. Some do, some don't. Some love Americans.

Overall, I have found the people to be genuinely helpful and nice there. Maybe part of it is a matter of "Getting back what you put out there".

[Member #2666]

, the very fact that we are down there able to throw money around that they don't have, able to buy things that they can't afford, including their women ?

You lost me on this one Chase!!!

Are you implying they aren't banging their women...one might conclude from that idea that all those babies they are supporting must be half gringo,

I don't think so Chase

But they tell a good lie and I guess they actually make some of us feel like we are special (sic)

[MJG Dogs]

This is Tony Lama Butch'es fault too!!!!

Could be beavis. Especially the ones wearing the Burnt Orange texas Longhorns Polo Shirts, that are crisply ironed, with the gold chains, fake rolex, and with Burnt Orange and White Fake ostrich Cowboy Boots...

These creatures were all over Los Angeles last new years for the BCS title game at the rose Bowl. They are loud and never shut up.. Too bad some of them did not think the game was at the LA Coliseum and get lost driving around MLK and Figeroua. They would have shit in their pants, just like they would if they ran into FARC down in Colombia.......

[NastyBoy]

... I hope Israel Nukes Iran. ...

You and me both, brother.

[Member #2041]

IMHO, Chase Star's post below is the best primer that a newbie could possibly read in order to understand where the typical Costa Rican is coming from in dealing with us when we are in their country. I have re-posted it under Reports of Distinction.

[Beavis]

This is Tony Lama Butch'es fault too!!!!

[MJG Dogs]

[QUOTE=Chase Star]ne in which you ultimately control the wallet, and just laugh it off. MJG is right that ticos don't like to be confronted, which is why they may seem to be two-faced, but that is just part of their culture. Remember, that you are in their world. Being too straightforward or showing your irritation is the worse thing you could do. MJG is right, never ever lose your cool. That will only feed their stereotypes about us.

That is a very good way of seeing things Chase Star, a game to see whom controls your wallet. You can expand it also to the chicas..

The resentment is jealousy more than anything. This attitude towards us has gone on for years and was the same , in the early 90's, when shithead was the president. LAFTA, foreign policy and war on terror, also do play a role in their hatred, but they more than any other culture in Latin America, " bites the hand that feeds them". Without American Investment, tourism etc... Costa Rica becomes another Honduras economically. In fact Panama's economy is much much better than Costa Rica's. Costa Rica also has way too much socialism in the workforce, and try even getting cable TV installed, you have to go through 3 or 4 people to get a simple task completed.

Costa rica needs to reform internally or else not just Panama will exceed them economically in the region... Just my take Chase.....

[FlacoDuro1]

Quote MJ DOGS,

"Guys it is in their culture. Costa Ricans will try to sodomize you out of every nickel you have. Deep down they Dispise Americans, but yet they have that "happy meal" smile about them. Living there for about 6 months in 2002, I learned the game. Costa Ricans remind me of the French in a way, they are two faced., except for some of them whom have relatives and may have been educated in the states, they tend to be more straight Forward. They feel that the United States has an obligation to give them whatever they want. they also remind me of the French, due to their anti-war appeasement mentality. Costa Ricans do not like to be confronted.

Don't feel bad though, they screw each other also.

Whatever you do with them, never ever lose your cool. Just be firm and say "no" in a regular toned voice, it works. But fat ass, you may have to yell at him. When he gets out of hand , give him a quarter"

While I don't claim to be an expert on their culture, I have gong to C.R. for the past 12 years and with that said, I believe a lot of what DOGS said is true. I've been there on family trips and personal trips, I've made a lot of friends with ex-us pats. Its is clear that they see Americans as wealthy millionaires and play the "lets screw the gringo". While I believe they are geniune in their friendship, when you do make a friend. It all comes down to money and how much can they get from you. It doensn't matter wether its a girl , cab driver or shop keeper. Do they despise Americans? probably some do, most don't. Right now our economy is faltering, travel is down to C.R. I know that some businesses are hurting in San Jose. On one of my very first trips tp C.R. a very wise older ex-pat gave me several pieces of advise for C.R.

1. If it flys , Floats or Fucks, rent it

2. If you want to leave C.R. with a million dollars make sure and bring at least two million.

3. Theres always a gringo or a tico waiting to screw you out of your money.

As far a world politics go, for too long American have been shouldering the burden of being the worlds police man. I say F***K the French, Germans and Russians, let them start assuming more of leadership role in the Middle East. They for a fact really do despise Americans. I don't like idea of sheding any more American Blood for the countries that smile in your face while sticking it in your back. I hope Israel Nukes Iran. The rest will fall in line.

Flaco

[Prolijo]

Guys it is in their culture. Costa ricans will try to sodomize you out of every nickel you have. Deep down they Dispise Americans, but yet they have that "happy meal" smile about them. Living there for about 6 months in 2002, I learned the game. Costa Ricans remind me of the French in a way, they are two faced., except for some of them whom have relatives and may have been educated in the states, they tend to be more straight Forward. They feel that the United States has an obligation to give them whatever they want. they also remind me of the French, due to their anti-war appeasement mentality. Costa Ricans do not like to be confronted.

That might be somewhat true but I don't know if I would frame it quite that way. You're stereotyping all ticos (except for the few with direct exposure to the US) and I'm not so sure that is safe to do any more than it is for them to stereotype us. The fact is that nearly all ticos, and certainly the vast majority with their hands out, are much poorer than even the most humble of us. They see us as having tons of money to just throw around. That is a stereotype too, but for too many gringo tourists it seems to apply quite well (albeit probably not the ones that stay at a cheap hotel like the Morazon). So, in their view, the most likely route for them to make the money they need to survive is by soaking us for as much as they can. Even more so than from their fellow ticos. After all, we're the ones that have the money and we're the ones that have the culture of tipping everyone at the drop of a hat even for just standard or substandard service. Ticos don't normally tip 15% at restaurants or give anything more than the 10% that is automatically added to their bills and probably wouldn't even leave that if they didn't have to. I'd be willing to bet you don't flinch at leaving a 15% or more tip when you go out back home. I'm not saying that to suggest that we should bring our US standards for tipping to CR, but some idiot gringos certainly do and it helps explain why more and more ticos are coming to expect it from the rest of us. Stereotypes!

I'm not saying we should surrender to this cultural trend but I don't think it helps to get angered by it either. I'm saying understand where it is coming from and shrug it off. If someone grabs your bags as a means for extracting a tip. Politely insist it is not needed or desired. Grab them back. If you can't, stop in him at the door of your room. You can figure out the light switches and TV remotes on your own. If he insists on giving you the grand tour, give him a friendly "gracias y adios". If he puts his hand out, shake it and say "hasta la vista". Sooner rather than later he'll get the idea, you have no intention of tipping him for a service you didn't want in the first place and maybe the next time you come to stay there he'll remember you and leave you alone. He'll certainly remember you if you fall for his ploy and tip him. But you should remember that is all just part of the game that is inevitable as any poor country starts to experience more visits from wealthier tourists.

Look at it as just a game that is played between the 2 cultures, one in which you ultimately control the wallet, and just laugh it off. MJG is right that ticos don't like to be confronted, which is why they may seem to be two-faced, but that is just part of their culture. Remember, that you are in their world. Being too straightforward or showing your irritation is the worse thing you could do. MJG is right, never ever lose your cool. That will only feed their stereotypes about us.

As for the two-faced tico stereotype, first I don't think that is universally true. They may see us as walking wallets and be friendly to us for that reason but that doesn't mean they all or even most secretly despise us. Second, for those ticos that DO secretly despise us, you should understand where that might be coming from.

To begin with, we as a nation haven't exactly been behaving on the world stage in a manner that exactly endears us. Forget about our heavyhanded tactics in the moslem world, our policies in LatAm have been quite controversial as well. LAFTA, which we've been ramming down their throat, is probably going to put a lot of ICE emplyees out of work and the impact on the agricultural sector is an open question as well. True its our government and not the people doing this but we elected them.

Also, as individuals, many gringos don't exactly act in a manner that endear us to them. Of course, it is stereotyping to generalize the bad behavior of a few to the rest of us, but that happens and it is often the most boorish and arrogant fellow tourists that become the most noticeable.

Finally, even when we are on our best behavior, the very fact that we are down there able to throw money around that they don't have, able to buy things that they can't afford, including their women and driving the prices up is bound to cause resentment among some ticos. How would you feel if the show were on the other foot?

[Playapavones]

Oh yeah forgot about this. Not sure if it's open yet, but Balmoral is building a big restaurant to compete with News Cafe (not that I like Balmoral). Harley (I think that's his name) from Canada, who made News Cafe a success, was going to be the main guy in the rennovations (and actually from what he told me it sounded pretty good menu wise); but as of late June, he had argued with Balmoral owners and was fired.