Safe Sex

[Zircon]

Sangue Bon is correct. HepC is a Blood Borne Virus (BBV). The biggest risk for contracting HepC is sharing needles - prevalence in most countries is highest amongst injecting drug users. HepC is a tough little virus and can last quite a long time outside of the body, so "risk behaviours" also include sharing razor blades and toothbrushes, sharing other injecting equipment (spoons, filters), needle stick injuries, etc.

The risk of HepC transmission through sex is almost non-existent, although certain activities could increase the risk - like having sex during a woman's menstrual period, or BDSM activities that break the skin, or where both parties have genital sores/irritation, or if there's traces of blood in semen. Anal sex may also be risky if tearing or bleeding occurs. Put it this way...studies have shown that for long-term couples having regular unprotected sex, where one party has HepC and the other doesn't, there is only a 2%-5% risk of transmission over 10 years. It's so low that HepC is not generally considered to be an STI.

HIV is a slightly different kettle of fish. While it *IS* officially classified as a BBV, it's also talked about as an STI, because it can be present in other bodily fluids, like vaginal fluids and semen. Obviously, there is a high risk of transmission with direct blood to blood contact (blood transfusions, sharing needles). But HIV doesn't survive for long outside of the body, so transmission via razors, needle stick injuries, etc is unlikely. The amount of virus found in other bodily fluids can vary greatly and even if your partner's viral load is high, the virus still needs to find a way into your actual blood stream, via cuts or tears or genital sores.

Disclaimer: I am a trained sexual health educator, but I'm NOT a medical practitioner. Feel free to correct or question me, but don't flame me about my 'professional qualifications', because I'm freely admitting I don't have any.

No need to apologize, your info is quite helpful.

[Rubber Nursey]

So if someone gives you an STD, then it is more likely they gave you HIV as well?

The only way you could know that for certain, is if you only have sex with one person in the 3-6 month period before being tested. That said, if their HIV infection was the result of risky sexual behaviour, there's a good chance they also picked up something else along the way.

Or does this mean that you have to have the STD to begin with then acquiring HIV is more likely?

You have a much greater risk of acquiring - and transmitting - HIV if you already have another STI present, especially one that causes genital sores.
From the American CDC website: "Ulcerative STDs that cause sores, ulcers, or breaks in the skin or mucous membranes, such as syphilis, disrupt barriers that provide protection against infections. The genital ulcers caused by syphilis can bleed easily, and when they come into contact with oral and rectal mucosa during sex, increase the infectiousness of and susceptibility to HIV".

Of course, it's the sores and tears that increase risk, not the STI itself. Sores and tears can also happen to perfectly healthy people, during perfectly 'normal' sex - sharp fingernails or foreign objects in vaginas, rough or prolonged sex, anal sex, latex allergies, thrush, unhealed surgical scars, shaving cuts, etc.

[Jon32]

The amount of virus found in other bodily fluids can vary greatly and even if your partner's viral load is high, the virus still needs to find a way into your actual blood stream, via cuts or tears or genital sores.

So if someone gives you an STD, then it is more likely they gave you HIV as well? Or does this mean that you have to have the STD to begin with then acquiring HIV is more likely?

[Rubber Nursey]

Hep C is transmitted from blood to blood, so if she is bleeding in her mouth and you have an open wound on your penis then transmission is possible. Otherwise not to worry. Same goes for HIV, blood to blood.

What? This seems to be very false information.

Sangue Bon is correct. HepC is a Blood Borne Virus (BBV). The biggest risk for contracting HepC is sharing needles - prevalence in most countries is highest amongst injecting drug users. HepC is a tough little virus and can last quite a long time outside of the body, so "risk behaviours" also include sharing razor blades and toothbrushes, sharing other injecting equipment (spoons, filters), needle stick injuries, etc.

The risk of HepC transmission through sex is almost non-existent, although certain activities could increase the risk - like having sex during a woman's menstrual period, or BDSM activities that break the skin, or where both parties have genital sores/irritation, or if there's traces of blood in semen. Anal sex may also be risky if tearing or bleeding occurs. Put it this way...studies have shown that for long-term couples having regular unprotected sex, where one party has HepC and the other doesn't, there is only a 2%-5% risk of transmission over 10 years. It's so low that HepC is not generally considered to be an STI.

HIV is a slightly different kettle of fish. While it *IS* officially classified as a BBV, it's also talked about as an STI, because it can be present in other bodily fluids, like vaginal fluids and semen. Obviously, there is a high risk of transmission with direct blood to blood contact (blood transfusions, sharing needles). But HIV doesn't survive for long outside of the body, so transmission via razors, needle stick injuries, etc is unlikely. The amount of virus found in other bodily fluids can vary greatly and even if your partner's viral load is high, the virus still needs to find a way into your actual blood stream, via cuts or tears or genital sores.

Disclaimer: I am a trained sexual health educator, but I'm NOT a medical practitioner. Feel free to correct or question me, but don't flame me about my 'professional qualifications', because I'm freely admitting I don't have any.

[Jon32]

Hep C is transmitted from blood to blood, so if she is bleeding in her mouth and you have an open wound on your penis then transmission is possible. Otherwise not to worry. Same goes for HIV, blood to blood.

What? This seems to be very false information.

[Girlsex1988]

That’s why I get pissed off when you get these guys trying to throw all mongers in the same boat. One member goes on on about how some members like to “crow on top of the shit pile” oh no all mongers are not created equal.

Hello,

I'm new. excited to participate in this forum.

[Rubber Nursey]

The answer I got when I inquired is that the condom with attached skirt at the base isn't yet available in the USA. Does anybody know if and where they can be bought now, either in person or by mail?

Perhaps for now the female condom with the inner loop removed and used as if it were a male condom is the best available, since standard male condoms leave users at risk of STIs that are transmitted by skin-to-skin contact (syphilis, herpes, warts).

You don't remove the inner ring from a female condom, unless you're having anal sex. Female condoms can't be used as a 'regular' condom outside of a woman's vagina. They're way too large. Also, female condoms only provide about half an inch (if that) of additional protection outside of the vagina. Once you start thrusting, it moves enough to allow for at least occasional skin contact. Obviously half an inch is better than nothing and I'm not trying to discourage their use...just wanted to put their 'protective' properties into perspective.

If you're really worried about skin-to-skin transmission, here's an old 'hooker trick' to protect against herpes, etc: Get a dental dam (a square of latex designed for protected oral sex on a woman) and cut a small slit in the centre. Put your penis in the slit and slide the dental dam down, ALMOST to the base. Then put on a condom as normal, ensuring the base of the condom covers the top edge of the dental dam. Voila! Absolutely NO genital contact.

Those condoms with skirts are a fabulous idea, though.

[Param Ahmad]

Traditional condoms cover the penis only but not the pubic area, so can not effectively isolate the body fluids. This condom has an attached skirt at the base to also prevent HPV and other skin to skin transmitted STDs.
http://www.goldcannon.com/

The answer I got when I inquired is that the condom with attached skirt at the base isn't yet available in the USA. Does anybody know if and where they can be bought now, either in person or by mail?

Perhaps for now the female condom with the inner loop removed and used as if it were a male condom is the best available, since standard male condoms leave users at risk of STIs that are transmitted by skin-to-skin contact (syphilis, herpes, warts).

[John Dough]

Traditional condoms cover the penis only but not the pubic area, so can not effectively isolate the body fluids. This condom has an attached skirt at the base to also prevent HPV and other skin to skin transmitted STDs.
http://www.goldcannon.com/

[Brad Dupree]

The findings in that study are quite contradictory to the findings in this study. See post #478.

http://internationalsexguide.info/fo...7&page=4&pp=15

Guys, if you're out there barebacking prostitutes your risk of catching AIDS is comparable to that of the prostitutes you fuck. As a monger you fall in a higher risk group so statistics for the general population are not applicable to you. This recent report is eye-opening for mongers.

http://chhs.sdsu.edu/newspdf/7.12.09...ansmission.pdf

[Chocha Monger]

If you caught AIDS from mongering bareback would you giving up or mongering or will you continue to monger bareback?

[Chocha Monger]

Guys, if you're out there barebacking prostitutes your risk of catching AIDS is comparable to that of the prostitutes you fuck. As a monger you fall in a higher risk group so statistics for the general population are not applicable to you. This recent report is eye-opening for mongers.
http://chhs.sdsu.edu/newspdf/7.12.09...ansmission.pdf

[Param Ahmad]

Thanks for the reply, Tiny 12. I think you are right about a man being more likely to get genital herpes (HSV 1 or 2) or genital warts (Human Papilloma Virus or HPV) from intercourse with a typical male condom than oral sex without a condom. According to the Wikipedia article on the female condom, "Female condoms are better at preventing some STIs than the traditional condom. This is because they cover more skin, which is the main way skin-to-skin viruses are contracted, such as herpes." (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Female_condom, accessed Nov. 10, 2009) So I think female condoms should be used for vaginal intercourse. The inner loop can be removed, permitting it to be used the same way a male condom would be, providing much greater protection than can be had with the usual male condom from any sexually transmitted disease that is transmitted by skin to skin contact, such as herpes 1 or 2, genital warts (HPV), or syphilis.

Having HSV-1 may make you less likely to get genital herpes (HSV 1 or 2) through oral or vaginal sex, but having HSV-1 hardly makes you immune.

==================================================

http://www.healthcentral.com/genital.../hsv1-oral-sex
accessed Nov. 10, 2009, The Truth About HSV1, HSV2, and Oral Sex
Charlotte Grayson, M.D.: "However, did you know that either type can reside in either or both parts of the body and infect BOTH areas? In some parts of the world, genital infection with HSV-1 is as common as HSV 2 genital infection." ...

"[Q]You have genital HSV-1 and your partner has genital HSV-2 and you have unprotected sex.
[A]There is a small risk that you will get HSV-2. However, it’s not very likely that your partner will get genital HSV-1. It’s rare for a person with genital HSV-2 to get HSV-1."

"[Q]Your partner has genital HSV-2 and you perform oral sex on him or her. Will you get oral HSV-2?
[A]Not likely. Almost 100% of HSV-2 infection is genital. Part of the reason is that most people have oral HSV-1 – providing some immunity against infection against HSV-2."


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http://www.webmd.com/sexual-conditio...x-womens-risks, accessed Nov. 10, 2009, By Miranda Hitti, WebMD Health News, Reviewed by Ruth Oratz, MD, "Herpes and Oral Sex: Women’s Risks
Receiving Oral Sex, Vaginal Intercourse Boost Chance of Herpes Infection": ...
"HSV-1 has been traditionally thought to spread "above the waist," while HSV-2 has a reputation for Transmission through sexual behavior "below the belt," say University of Pittsburgh researchers. But now, they've shown that women can also catch HSV-1 through vaginal or oral sex. ... HSV-2 infection doesn't help protect against HSV-1 ..."

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http://www.herpes.com/hsv1-2.html, accessed Nov. 10, 2009, "The Truth about HSV-1 and HSV-2": "... 'People don't understand that you can have type 1 genitally or orally, that the two types are essentially the same virus,' says Marshall Clover, manager of the National Herpes Hotline."

[Tiny 12]

In the Madrid, Spain thread downtown Madrid and German FKK club girls who engage in deep kissing and unprotected oral sex are praised as preferable. Herpes simplex virus (HSV) and human papilloma virus (HPV), which causes genital warts, are easily transmitted by such skin to skin contact, probably as easily by oral as vaginal contact. Both are incurable. A look at these pictures might make be cautionary:

http://www.herpes-coldsores.com/std/...s_pictures.htm

Don't do it, guys.

Param, I've read a lot on this topic. The chances of getting HPV (warts) by kissing or by receiving oral sex are extremely low. I think that getting herpes on your genitals from oral sex would also be low, provided you've already been exposed to Type 1 HSV -- that is, if you've had cold sores on your mouth, I think your chances of getting herpes on your genitals from some woman giving you a blow job are low.

Finally, I've read it's uncommon for a man to contract HSV on his mouth through cunnilingus. With regard to HPV though, I do think there's a risk with cunnilingus. There's a study out that indicates eating strange pussy raises the probability you'll get throat cancer, a lot -- supposedy because you're exposed to HPV.


Provided you already have Type 1 HSV (cold sores), deep french kissing should be pretty safe. In fact, from what I've read, if a woman has a cold you're not that likely to get it from DFK provided you wash your hands before you pick your nose or scratch your eyes.

I suspect you're more likely to get HSV or HPV through protected (with a condom) sexual intercourse than through unprotected oral sex. If a woman has either, there's a good chance you're going to have skin-on-skin contact even with a condom.

That said, supposedly chlamydia and gonorrhea are commonly spread through oral sex.

On another topic, apparently one of our brethren contracted HIV in Ethiopia,

http://www.internationalsexguide.inf...&postcount=615

[Param Ahmad]

In the Madrid, Spain thread downtown Madrid and German FKK club girls who engage in deep kissing and unprotected oral sex are praised as preferable. Herpes simplex virus (HSV) and human papilloma virus (HPV), which causes genital warts, are easily transmitted by such skin to skin contact, probably as easily by oral as vaginal contact. Both are incurable. A look at these pictures might make be cautionary:

http://www.herpes-coldsores.com/std/...s_pictures.htm

Don't do it, guys.