German FKK Clubs - Lounge and chat area

[Bfsie]

I think the crux of the discussion was your suggestion that working girls in AO clubs only work there because they got STDs before working there, and don't care about repeat infections. I am not sure where you got this information from but it contradicts my own experience 100%.

I don't want admin to label me as a argumentative member and delay my post in the future, so this is my last post on this topic. I do have the sources telling me about this. Let's leave this like that.

[BaltiX]

It seems like the FKK clubs located in Frankfurt itself (Mainhattan and Palace) follow the condom law strictly, more so than other clubs based on posts I read here. Why is that?

[Optimist]

KK. Thank you for your insistence on polite and civilised discussion. Unlike many ISG members you show it is possible to disagree (as you and I do on some matters) and remain on good terms.

As for AO girls not caring about STDs. Every one I have discussed this with have been very concerned and are horrified if any of their colleagues, or themselves, get an infection. They are as reluctant as anybody to get ill (I wish I could convince them to stop smoking).

Bfsie. KK did specifically encourage you to continue writing your opinion. I think the crux of the discussion was your suggestion that working girls in AO clubs only work there because they got STDs before working there, and don't care about repeat infections. I am not sure where you got this information from but it contradicts my own experience 100%. They get tested ad nauseam, take prophylactic antibiotics, and worry.

Rocky. Girls in AO Clubs get tested. Girls in non AO Clubs may well never get tested.

Cheers to you all.

[Kosher Kowboy]

Kosher Kowboy,

You wrote a short novel here. Am I entitled to my opinion here? What parts of my post offended you? Just tell me and I will write here again.

Apologies for the novel, our government shut our boards down ( indirectly) so my keyboard is lonely.

Absolutely you are entitled to your opinion, we all are. Read and reply as you see fit.

Sorry for the length, I think I incorporated some AO thoughts both related to your posts and some other ones that went up the past few days that I did not reply too.

Sorry, I am bored with nothing to do today yet but watch the market tick (watching paint dry).

Be happy to read your reply.

[Bfsie]

Kosher Kowboy,

You wrote a short novel here. Am I entitled to my opinion here? What parts of my post offended you? Just tell me and I will write here again.

[Kosher Kowboy]

With regards to AO activities, The governments' and other organizations' statistics of likelihood getting STDs which are based on civilian populations are always irrelevant here because we are talking about WGs who sell sex for living and have sex with hundreds (if not thousands) men, particularly the WGs in AO clubs vast majority (if not most) of whom I think have some sort of STDs. Many of those WGs had STD (s) before starting to work in AO clubs and the STD (s) they had is the only reason they chose to work there because they didn't care anymore. If they didn't have STD (s), they would probably not work in AO clubs.

If you don't want to get STDs, you should avoid AO clubs or at least have condom protection there. In non-AO clubs, you should better avoid those well-known BB sellers (WGs). Instead you should work on the WGs whose regular you are and convince them to do it with maybe a little more expense if you really like AO and don't want to get STDs.

I used to do many BBFSs. I was always very selective in terms of whom I would do due to STDs and mainly chose the girls who hadn't been in the business long and were young between 18 and 20 and used my intuition.

Bfsie,

With all due respect we are entitled to our opinions but this post needs a rebuttal as having read posts on the internet since it incorporated prostitution in to the world wide web this post could be nominated perhaps for one of the silliest and outright most worthless posts I have ever read or even moderated back in those years I wore that hat. I am not attacking you personally or your choices however I do wish to answer some of these outright in my opinion silly statements that stem from opinion and some factually wrong.

From the bottom up.

You claim you used to do many BBFS. Congrats, Join the club. Many more men are in the club than admit to it. Most guys in this club stay in the club once they join up. However some leave the club often when they get a significant other but more often when they encounter an STD themselves. Might you share with us why you stopped BBFS? Was it an STD? Was it to protect a significant other (which would be the right thing to do) Please enlighten us, inquiring minds want to know. How does intuition come in to play when choosing who to bareback or not? Do you see what they do on the side outside of work? Do you know what they did in the room prior? 18 to 20 year olds? Really? STD rates are often higher in the category, many of the girls are younger and do not even know the risks and get taken advantage of. Studies here have even suggested STD rates among WGs that are not ' users' are less with the older ladies. FWIW I will not fuck anyone in the USA under 25 for several reason, one being that generation having tossed the condom out the door. IMHO that age group is a higher risk. Just my intuition. A girl not being in the business very long is automatically STD free? I disagree as sometimes it takes a ' lesson' for a girl to wise up. I met a girl once at a club on one of her first few days and I started losing my hard on and she ripped off the condom and let me AO her. Can I safely assume she is safe as she is newer? How many other men did she rip the condom off for? Another girl I did AO once in the Frankfurt area told me she kept a list and by the time she turned 19 she had fucked her fiftieth man! Yeah, that 18-20 crowd is real safe. FYI, she told me she wore a condom with none, that is right none of those 50 men. Everyone one of them ejaculated in to that hot young 19 year old. Safe?

I agree with you on not attending AO clubs or using condoms if you want to ' reduce your risks' of an STD but by no means should you use the word ' avoid. ' The AO club girls get tested although between tests the risks and the odds of a client do increase as each load of cum gets fired in to them. You really think if you AO a ' Shark' for example you are avoiding an STD. Got news for you. The next time you rim a girl in Sharks or get rimmed odds are you are kissing the rear end of the man she rimmed before you or perhaps he rimmed her and you are rimming her and licking up his slobber. Next up you can DATY her but AO is so rife there exists a great chance you will be licking the cum out of her pussy that has yet to get expelled from her vaginal region. Enjoy. It comes with a risk too. There are a few very anti AO Sharks. It has been rumored it might be due to the fact an STD was contracted that changed their behaviors. Those same girls started when 18-20 in the biz. You do realize many men go to AO clubs to fuck and AO ' my darling filthy and disgusting dirty Gypsies' than go to Sharks or other mainstream clubs and do whatever. Are those WGs at the mainstream clubs than exposed? Or are they immune? What happens when they bareback a guy in the middle of their 15 man marathon fuck that day and that guy was the one who went to an AO club?

Avoid the known BB girls at mainstream clubs, probably a wise idea and I agree if one is worried about an STD to do such, to each their own. Now I ask how do you know the ' non well known' BB WG do not really bareback. (They do, all do some it is just more obvious and known) How do you know if a guy just left some random AO Day Care Center with an STD and will do as you say see a lower volume Shark (not picking on Sharks, Sharks being used generically for mainstream clubs) and infect her right before you see her and pick up a present from the Day Care Center delivered to Darmstadt unknowingly? I am sure my example may be off medically as there are incubation periods but I think the point got across.

In your first paragraph I agree with you that we can not use government statistics for the reason you state and apply them to the game we play, all of us take on a greater risk in general as we are a very promiscuous group. These girls do fuck many more times and many more men than most civilians. You think most girls in the AO clubs have STDs? They may have a higher risk of contraction but they also get tested although the period between tests carries a risk but do you really think every mainstream WG is tested frequently? They all have lovers and boyfriends too that cum in their pussies after the paying johns. Many get a hot load of warm cum shot in them before work. I have dated hookers before and I loved pumping my cum deep in their pussies before they went off to work and than would laugh when I would read a review how they showed up with a dripping wet vagina and the guy thinks it was because she was turned on by him and brags how excited she was (thanks to my DNA though.) Those same loverboys in Germany are also fucking other girls many bareback during the time their girls are fucking us. Some of them even go to Dietz to fuck (Facebook can be very educational and is a great way to see some realities of what is really going on).

There are many reasons girls choose to work in an AO club and for the most part they can not get in to a Sharks, most do not have the looks. Most could not command the same money a cute little Shark can. I could list several reasons they choose an AO club but not worth it but it is worth pointing out that they do not care anymore, that they have STD's etc is just plain stupidity. That also implies they would be knowingly passing on STD's possibly and when you start making statements like that it is almost borderline character assassination of those girls. They do not want an STD. You seem to describe them and portray them in a way that they are a disease infested sub human being. I can assure you these AO club girls would rather not have to be pumped full of 10-20 loads of cum a day and they are fully aware of the risks but sadly it is the only way for them to make money now to support their kids, pay their bills and it is not like they come from wealthy families in Beverly Hills. In fact I went to college with several girls from Beverly Hills and the only reason I mention the Beverly Hills suburb is because a girl from Beverly Hills who was 19 (yep, right in that 18-20 range) did a gangbang in the basement of our frat house and 4 guys had to go to the doctor within the following week. While they were contracting an STD from the wealthy Beverly Hills 19 year old I was with a skank I picked up on Boylston Street by Fenway Park fucking her in some back alley apartment contracting no STD.

I am not an idiot fully aware I am playing a higher risk game going to AO Clubs but I am aware of the risks and do not want an STD. The same can be said of the girls who work there. They have brains and are not stupid. They also have hearts that I think are much nicer than the kunts in the mainstream clubs that bareback much more than any of us realize and on top of it want a crisp 50 or 100 note and a tip. Remember, if you play in an AO Club, a mainstream club or even the RLD you take a risk. If you are going to be in the pay for play world I suggest that all of us access our own risk. As for me when I choose how and with who I play I always play under the assumption that I take a risk with each appointment and also that each girl I see barebacked the prior client. They all bareback someone. Bareback trends worldwide have changed, guys I know are now doing AO in Thailand, Colombia, Mexico and especially in the USA the bareback sex has increased dramatically. Semen can live in the female body for quite some time, most likely the next time you see a mainstream girl and eat her out or fuck her your mouth or cock is coming in contact with another mans DNA. DNA cocktails are served outside of AO clubs too.

Be careful with that 18-20 crowd, I know more guys here who have contracted an STD from the 18-25 (a little higher than your 20) crowd than any other age category and I know this is the USA not Germany however the dynamics of AO / BBFS are pretty much the same, just the platform / location changes. I have not commented on any of these AO posts simply because everything posted the last few days to me is beating a dead horse as not one comment I see is new to me. This very subject has been posted about over and over on all the USA boards for 20 plus years now. Same shit different year. Nothing here is new to me. Everything is regurgitated opinions that have been posted for 20 years only difference being we are discussing it in Germany but bareback is bareback whether it be me pumping a creampie in to a Gypsy, pumping a creampie in to a wild and fun Mexican girl like last night at FKK Holiday Inn or perhaps the President of a western country pumping a hot load of cum in to a porn star.

However what you posted to me did stand out, the content IMO pure garbage. Let me make it clear to I am not attacking you personally as you have every right to buy the hogwash you posted but I will call it one of the most uninformed posts I have read since joining my first hooker board in the 1990 era. I highly disagree with 90 percent of what you posted however I 100 percent agree with your right to post it and believe what you want. We can not all agree all the time. If we all agreed on all subjects and all liked the same girls only we would not need message boards.

Thank you for posting what you did, once again I highly dissent from what you posted not your right to post it or you as a person / fellow member. Back and forth ' polite and civil' disagreements make these places better IMHO.

Happy mongering, enjoy whatever it is you do, assess your own risk and have fun, that we all have in common. This game is not risk free, if someone wants to pass judgement on me for excessive visits to sit on red couches I would hope they would pass the judgement on my choices not on me as a person. That is what I have tried to do here, counter your points not you nor your right to think that way. Just try to keep in mind that many of these girls we all fuck be it in a mainstream club and especially the AO clubs are not born in to the same world of economic opportunity especially ones in AO clubs. They are good people too and to insinuate they are STD infected and passing them on (which you have by your wording) is plain wrong, once again simply my opinion which is no more or less important than yours.

Respectfully,

KC.

[MythoVirus]

I used to be a BBFS guy, in 2009-2012 probably I had BBFS around 100-200 Russian WG, at that time I was in total paranonia that I was sure I had HIV, I even developed hypochondriasis at that time, panicking with any new enlarged lymph node, sore throat, cough, etc.

However in 2013 I did pre-occupation mandatory HIV / Hepatitis be&see, and I was deemed clean from those shitty viruses.

Since then (2013) till now 2018 I probably had BBFS with 5 WG max.

All my BBFS were not in FKK Germany, and there were all vaginal non were anal, funny that I used to get a BBFS from WG that even refused BBBJ intitally, and all the BBFS I had was without an upsell, without even asking for it.

Speaking of FKK, I never asked for BBFS in any FKK club, except once I had it in 2016, it was in FKK Mondial, 30 Euro session, didn't ask for it, but it happened spontanously.

I'm pretty sure BBFS is not hard to find in most FKK, it needs either:

- Extra money as an upsell (300-500 Euro sounds reasonable).

- Prolonged session without an upsell (ie taking a WG for 5 hours etc.).

- Long term relationship.

- Deep understanding of human psychology, body langauge, and alpha demenour.

- WG overdosed herself with alcohol or whatever.

- Luck (like my mondial session).

That aside I'm just happy with BBBJ it can and had kept away from BBFS, with slips here and there (like once a year).

Since we are on the topic of BBFS, and HIV probabilty, no one mentioned the benefits of circumcision, last time I checked it does confer protection against HIV, as the foreskin is highly populated by an immue cell called dendric cells, which are the target cells for HIV itself, removal of the foreskin on the other hand significantly decrease those cells, ergo decreasing the chance of being infected with HIV. No pushing an agends or anything, just worth a read.

Lastly if any monger is truly into BBFS, I recommend an HIV specialist opinion, to consider Pre-exposure prophylaxis, or PrEP, which proved to be highly effective against HIV if used as indicated (more than 90% protection). And for Hepaitis be a vaccine is already avialable, just to check your serology. Only Heptitis see is without a vaccine or PrEP but luckly HepC is rare to occur from sexual transmission.

[Mr Ho]

I think we all miss Marketa. Aksena kind of took over in her role at Artemis for me after Marketa left. But now also Bulgarian Aksena may be gone. They were kind of the same type of girl. Except Aksena didn't smoke. Marketa smoked a bit heavily the last time I saw her. Wonder what she is up to these days.

I don't know what is up with Angelina. She does the exact same thing with me, hitting my balls if I try to ignore her. But she gets it more nowadays that she is not my type. But she is still shittalking me to her friends behind my back. I don't know what she says, but her friends don't go with me. Too bad for them I guess. The Angelina influence won't make them much money if that's their tactics to trust in her.

Marketa was saving to do her business in Prague, so she must be somewhere in that beautiful city, she was great and all natural and no tattoo. Golden era of Artemis. Another one I miss is Geraldine Hungarian, Coco Greek albanian, Joy German also know as July in Palace, Kimmi blonde German from Berlin also worked in Palace, Ivy German girl from Hamburg, and list continue. FKK Artemis had real gold era from 2009 till 2015. It was very good 6 years.

Well now we are not doing too bad at all, so let us crave for the best stunners we can find here and there in various FKK.

[Mr Ho]

Didn't I see you post recently about your desires for the open borders and work visas that would allow Ukrainian women to join the ranks at the clubs in Germany yet here you state you avoid Romanians for fear of diseases they may have caught from childhood injections. Seems interesting you desire more women from a country in the top three of highest percentage of European countries with HIV and avoid those from a country in the bottom three. If you look for an excuse to avoid Romanians, pick a better statistic like avoiding petite, nimble ladies who still maintain flexibility resulting from years training to be a Womans Olympic Gymnastics Gold Medalist.

There are risks, I think largely increased by fellow mongers who travel to far off lands and participate in BBS activities. I recently read on several news sites that a British male returned from Asia and has been diagnosed with antibiotic resistant Super Gonorrhea.

Thailand it is, Thailand, or possibly Philippines.

Ukrainians are beauty, I love fucking Ukrainian girls, they are among my favorite nationality to fuck, yeah I hope to find them in FKK in near future in large quantity like Romanians. This is possible Ukraine is ruined economically and I do not think they will ever do well with being sandwiched between mother Russia and west, so I be waiting for them in FKK, I hope they come by in large numbers.

[Mr Ho]

With regards to AO activities, The governments' and other organizations' statistics of likelihood getting STDs which are based on civilian populations are always irrelevant here because we are talking about WGs who sell sex for living and have sex with hundreds (if not thousands) men, particularly the WGs in AO clubs vast majority (if not most) of whom I think have some sort of STDs. Many of those WGs had STD (s) before starting to work in AO clubs and the STD (s) they had is the only reason they chose to work there because they didn't care anymore. If they didn't have STD (s), they would probably not work in AO clubs.

If you don't want to get STDs, you should avoid AO clubs or at least have condom protection there. In non-AO clubs, you should better avoid those well-known BB sellers (WGs). Instead you should work on the WGs whose regular you are and convince them to do it with maybe a little more expense if you really like AO and don't want to get STDs.

I used to do many BBFSs. I was always very selective in terms of whom I would do due to STDs and mainly chose the girls who hadn't been in the business long and were young between 18 and 20 and used my intuition.

That is what I plan to do. I do bareback here at home with working girls, but I also choose too.

Also being in FKK for 9 years without bareback sex, but with all other BBBJ etc and I never got any std in FKK so far, also I never read any std reports from FKK. It is odd though because many of these girls in FKK are quite reckless and fuck so many guys in FKK and outside, but yet, I never heard of incidents of std in FKK.

[Rocky V]

With regards to AO activities, The governments' and other organizations' statistics of likelihood getting STDs which are based on civilian populations are always irrelevant here because we are talking about WGs who sell sex for living and have sex with hundreds (if not thousands) men, particularly the WGs in AO clubs vast majority (if not most) of whom I think have some sort of STDs. Many of those WGs had STD (s) before starting to work in AO clubs and the STD (s) they had is the only reason they chose to work there because they didn't care anymore. If they didn't have STD (s), they would probably not work in AO clubs.

If you don't want to get STDs, you should avoid AO clubs or at least have condom protection there. In non-AO clubs, you should better avoid those well-known BB sellers (WGs). Instead you should work on the WGs whose regular you are and convince them to do it with maybe a little more expense if you really like AO and don't want to get STDs.

I used to do many BBFSs. I was always very selective in terms of whom I would do due to STDs and mainly chose the girls who hadn't been in the business long and were young between 18 and 20 and used my intuition.

Very good point as the incidence of STDs in WG is very high, compared to the general population, and very few get regularly tested. Condom use decreases the risk of getting some STDs but not all, such as herpes, gonorreah.

[Rocky V]

That's all very well but HIV is now a treatable disease and has become something of a side-issue. There are now much more worrying pathogens around. As for BBFS I don't ask for it in FKKs but I'm one of the skeptics regarding availability at acceptable prices with the better-looking girls. I mean without putting 500 E on the table. Even getting some girls to accept my own condom brand is sometimes difficult.

Let me point out that HIV is treatable but, most importantly, not curable and you will have to live with it for the rest of your life, together with the stigma that it brings. Treatment of HIV is supposed to be very heavy and brings a lot of side effects as well.

[Bfsie]

With regards to AO activities, The governments' and other organizations' statistics of likelihood getting STDs which are based on civilian populations are always irrelevant here because we are talking about WGs who sell sex for living and have sex with hundreds (if not thousands) men, particularly the WGs in AO clubs vast majority (if not most) of whom I think have some sort of STDs. Many of those WGs had STD (s) before starting to work in AO clubs and the STD (s) they had is the only reason they chose to work there because they didn't care anymore. If they didn't have STD (s), they would probably not work in AO clubs.

If you don't want to get STDs, you should avoid AO clubs or at least have condom protection there. In non-AO clubs, you should better avoid those well-known BB sellers (WGs). Instead you should work on the WGs whose regular you are and convince them to do it with maybe a little more expense if you really like AO and don't want to get STDs.

I used to do many BBFSs. I was always very selective in terms of whom I would do due to STDs and mainly chose the girls who hadn't been in the business long and were young between 18 and 20 and used my intuition.

[UncleOx]

I don't think Mr Ho can see my posts. Maybe someone can point out that according to my calculations below, a man's chance of getting HIV from a vaginal session with a random German prostitute is 0.00008%.

Also given intercourse with a man who *IS HIV infected*, the transmission rate to women is 0.08% for vaginal intercourse, and 1.38% for anal.

https://www.cdc.gov/hiv/risk/estimat...behaviors.html

I have read several articles related to those observational studies. Actually, the risk of acquiring HIV is about "per coital act" instead of "per sexual intercourse". So I believe the actual risk should be about 4%-8% per penile-vaginal intercourse if exposures to an infected source.

[Mr Ho]

That's all very well but HIV is now a treatable disease and has become something of a side-issue. There are now much more worrying pathogens around. As for BBFS I don't ask for it in FKKs but I'm one of the skeptics regarding availability at acceptable prices with the better-looking girls. I mean without putting 500 E on the table. Even getting some girls to accept my own condom brand is sometimes difficult.

So you guys are promoting me to go BBFS now then LOL!

I always use my own condom, I never had issue with that one. But I never try asking BBFS at German FKK. I did slide my dick on girls pussy before, stunner in German FKK, but I did not ask to put it in, I have however got refused few times on sliding my dick on pussy in German FKK.

If I find good one enough, I will try to ask for BBFS, I got to find one I want to penetrate BBFS first though. I am going to accidentally cum inside, nakadashi style LOL!