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You may find it interesting to know that its customary for businesses to take the Chinese character for luck and turn it upside down before CNY and right side up after CNY. As your "friend" has her own business it may impress her if you suggest or check if she follows this custom for her business.
Also, in the Southern part of China, HKG & TWN its not unusual to buy young bamboo clippings place them in water and allow them to sprout. Its understood to represent increasing & growing wealth due to good business skills.
Hope this is useful
/WYes, by turning the character upside down is meaning that "luck" had arrived. It is best to always have it upside down.
China Maverick
01-14-09, 18:48
Brothers:
I wanted to share a situation with the seniors and get their opinion on a freebie sitaution that I have.
I have known a Chinese lady for about 5 years now and she is not related directly to my business but is in some way; thru one of my clients. She is 43+; married has a grown up kid going to the university abroad. I helped her on number of ocassions purely as a good friend and I guess she feels indebted. She is pretty rich, husbad maye be the typical guy? She told me somethings in the past?
She knows I am married and have kids and has also met my family but it in the recent past. Its been all about comin in close, touche touche, feeli feeli, at first I thought that its just casual but recently there have been suggestions to go to a remote place (like Haikou/Sanya types) to relax together (I travel a lot) and this has been repetitive.
Last time she mentioned that; I told her that if my wife would know that I went to a destination alone for relaxation then? She replied no one would tell her! My little johnny triggered that I need to take up this offer! On the flip side I thought I should take help from the senior brothers in ISG.
I feel that I should take it up; but not sure how do I put it out across; as I would want to get her to be a fuck buddy discreetly. Any ideas are welcome and I would request Eagle Star; especially as he is a master in this category! But any and all advice is welcome.
Thanks,
CM
Loveasiangirls
01-15-09, 04:38
You could not get clearer messages than this my friend.
I have had a lot of freebies (50+) and they are usually more shy than this. I have no doubt what she is after. She is the ideal candidate as she is also married. She will not screw up your life as she could put hers in jeopardy as well.
Brothers:
I wanted to share a situation with the seniors and get their opinion on a freebie sitaution that I have.
I have known a Chinese lady for about 5 years now and she is not related directly to my business but is in some way; thru one of my clients. She is 43+; married has a grown up kid going to the university abroad. I helped her on number of ocassions purely as a good friend and I guess she feels indebted. She is pretty rich, husbad maye be the typical guy? She told me somethings in the past?
She knows I am married and have kids and has also met my family but it in the recent past. Its been all about comin in close, touche touche, feeli feeli, at first I thought that its just casual but recently there have been suggestions to go to a remote place (like Haikou/Sanya types) to relax together (I travel a lot) and this has been repetitive.
Last time she mentioned that; I told her that if my wife would know that I went to a destination alone for relaxation then? She replied no one would tell her! My little johnny triggered that I need to take up this offer! On the flip side I thought I should take help from the senior brothers in ISG.
I feel that I should take it up; but not sure how do I put it out across; as I would want to get her to be a fuck buddy discreetly. Any ideas are welcome and I would request Eagle Star; especially as he is a master in this category! But any and all advice is welcome.
Thanks,
CM
Brothers:
I wanted to share a situation with the seniors and get their opinion on a freebie sitaution that I have.
I have known a Chinese lady for about 5 years now and she is not related directly to my business but is in some way; thru one of my clients. She is 43+; married has a grown up kid going to the university abroad. I helped her on number of ocassions purely as a good friend and I guess she feels indebted. She is pretty rich, husbad maye be the typical guy? She told me somethings in the past?
She knows I am married and have kids and has also met my family but it in the recent past. Its been all about comin in close, touche touche, feeli feeli, at first I thought that its just casual but recently there have been suggestions to go to a remote place (like Haikou/Sanya types) to relax together (I travel a lot) and this has been repetitive.
Last time she mentioned that; I told her that if my wife would know that I went to a destination alone for relaxation then? She replied no one would tell her! My little johnny triggered that I need to take up this offer! On the flip side I thought I should take help from the senior brothers in ISG.
I feel that I should take it up; but not sure how do I put it out across; as I would want to get her to be a fuck buddy discreetly. Any ideas are welcome and I would request Eagle Star; especially as he is a master in this category! But any and all advice is welcome.
Thanks,
CMI run across quite a few candidates in this group. Base on what you told me, this women has been married to her husband for over twenty years. My guess is that for the last fifteen years she has been rarely used and more than a bit of pent up sexual desires within her.
If you have met her husband, my question first before taking aim on the prey is her husband. If he is a senior official or a bit of a big wig with the local party, back off. If he loses face, you lose life. If he is a blind deaf mute and is loaded, then I would say go for it, providing that she is decent and does not look like "jabba the hut".
If she past the first test, the "who's your hubby", then you need to find out her motive. If she wants to get out of her marriage and wants you, then back off, she is trouble. If she is just horny, then go out to a quiet dinner and give her a few glasses of wine. She may pretend to be a bit drunk, just take her back to your place or hotel and put the moves on her. Maybe like pushing her against the wall and plant a kiss on her and see if she respond.
I think you know the rest.
PM me if you want more specific. If you do nail her. Post some pics for all of us to enjoy.
PS. From my experience, the older, underused ones could get quite racy or even a bit kinky in bed.
EDITOR'S NOTE: I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
China Maverick
01-15-09, 16:54
Thanks "LAG". Any specific expereince that you can share?
I am sure this woman has been off sex for years now! and is looking at something discreet which she cant find with the locals so I am the best "laowai" bet she got?
In fact I was out with her to one of the pubs quite some time back and since I knew the band; I bought a round of drinks for them and the band came across for a hello and a hug; and I clearly remember this woman telling me that she can be a better friend and spend on me rather than me spending on the women in the band!!! Now I am get the jigsaw in place.
I plan to go on this so called relaxation visit but I am not sure how do I get this across? or do i just go bang bang; once we are there?
Thanks anyway,
CM
China Maverick
01-15-09, 17:15
Bnlee2. Xie Xie; Just to answer your questions; yes I have met her husband and he does not fall into any of the categories that you have mentioned; so I feel more safe. He seems to be one of those secluded types.
From what I know; ths woman aint wanting to get out of the marriage as it may be a social stigma for her at this stage and with a grown up kid it maybe inappropriate for her. She once mentioned to me that she wanted liberties earlier in life which she didn't get and now since she wears the pants so she politely is working on her mandate!
Last time she mentioned that we should go before a date in the next month because after that she will travel abraod and this came in very specifically; so now the ball is in my court.
Thanks anyway,
CM
Nighthawk55
01-15-09, 20:10
A question for the experts. On two separate occasions now, I have seen Chinese girls apply the hotel toothpaste to their pussies after they have showered, following a fairly vigorous fucking session, which unusually, happened to be bareback with withdrawal before ejaculation, I think, in each case. Am puzzled by the rationale for this. Do they like the soothing sensation of the toothpaste, or do they believe that it offers some sort of antiseptic or contraceptive protection. Glad views.Some African prostitutes wash out with kerosene thinking it prevents AIDS. It actually makes things a lot worse.
OldAsiaHand
01-16-09, 13:29
Bnlee2. Xie Xie; Just to answer your questions; yes I have met her husband and he does not fall into any of the categories that you have mentioned; so I feel more safe. He seems to be one of those secluded types.
From what I know; ths woman aint wanting to get out of the marriage as it may be a social stigma for her at this stage and with a grown up kid it maybe inappropriate for her. She once mentioned to me that she wanted liberties earlier in life which she didn't get and now since she wears the pants so she politely is working on her mandate!
Last time she mentioned that we should go before a date in the next month because after that she will travel abraod and this came in very specifically; so now the ball is in my court.
Thanks anyway,
CM
CM,
If I may offer a couple of alternatives if you are doing your business in S. China. These are not as obvious relaxation destinations. First, there are many Hot Springs outside of Guangzhou and Zhuhai. Many have hotels attached with hot spring tubs in the rooms. There is nothing better to set the mood. Second, Dameisha is a beach area just outside of Shenzhen. There is a very nice Sheraton hotel just built there. I use these destinations often with freebies since they are easily accessible by car within and hour or so of a city.
Just my POV.
OAH
China Maverick
01-16-09, 15:19
Hey OAH,
Thanks for the tip. I do know the Dameisha and Xiaomeisha and shall try that some time but I guess this time its gonna be somewhere else as there is an old Chinese saying "Rabbit doesn't eat grass in front of his house or something like that"
Lets see; and I will report back with an update.
Cheers,
CM
Bnlee2. Xie Xie; Just to answer your questions; yes I have met her husband and he does not fall into any of the categories that you have mentioned; so I feel more safe. He seems to be one of those secluded types.
From what I know; ths woman aint wanting to get out of the marriage as it may be a social stigma for her at this stage and with a grown up kid it maybe inappropriate for her. She once mentioned to me that she wanted liberties earlier in life which she didn't get and now since she wears the pants so she politely is working on her mandate!
Last time she mentioned that we should go before a date in the next month because after that she will travel abraod and this came in very specifically; so now the ball is in my court.
Thanks anyway,
CMCM,
As a rule, I never meet the gals husband. I usually have her show me a pic of him. But if you have met him, and if she is the dominant in the marriage, the guy may quietly knows and may be cuckold. Have not run across this, but it is a definite possibility.
Some African prostitutes wash out with kerosene thinking it prevents AIDS. It actually makes things a lot worse.Damn. I'll really think twice about lighting up a cig after orgasmic bliss. It may be quite a larger flambe' than a normal fart. I could see how it could make things worse.
Member #4247
01-17-09, 15:19
China women love Singaporeans best esp rich, generous, kind property consultants.
OAH is totally correct though I believe there is a cut off age to giving redenvelopes to those older than 21 or around that age. Unless you are the boss then you are not REQUIRED to give them and always hard to since the person will either be embarrassed or think you are stingy for not giving them enough. Usually the office will give a bonus at this time and that makes all the employees happy.
My understanding of hongbao is that Children receive red envelopes from family members, value depending on relationship and the financial situation. It is very important to give GF red envelopes for her children. Elderly family members are often given substantial sums as this may be thier only source of income. I normally make up a list of hongbaoees, then give GF a hongbao to cover her total amount. Works for me!
fz
Albert Punter
01-18-09, 04:53
It happened to me same, after a covered (as usual) session where girl claimed my d... was big.
Same shit I thought.
When she showered and I saw her applying some toothpaste to her pussy I asked what the hell she was doing, "that isn't linement" I commented.
Girl replied she knew but it had some refreshing effect from pain.
A question for the experts. On two separate occasions now, I have seen Chinese girls apply the hotel toothpaste to their pussies after they have showered, following a fairly vigorous fucking session, which unusually, happened to be bareback with withdrawal before ejaculation, I think, in each case. Am puzzled by the rationale for this. Do they like the soothing sensation of the toothpaste, or do they believe that it offers some sort of antiseptic or contraceptive protection. Glad views.
Albert Punter
01-18-09, 04:57
I must immediately advise a guy I know who travels to Africa very often and likes to smoke a cigar after the deed.
Imagine where he wet the cigar: right in the pussy !
Damn. I'll really think twice about lighting up a cig after orgasmic bliss. It may be quite a larger flambe' than a normal fart. I could see how it could make things worse.
Some African prostitutes wash out with kerosene thinking it prevents AIDS. It actually makes things a lot worse.
Clean Gene
01-18-09, 08:06
It happened to me same, after a covered (as usual) session where girl claimed my d... was big.
Same shit I thought.
When she showered and I saw her applying some toothpaste to her pussy I asked what the hell she was doing, "that isn't linement" I commented.
Girl replied she knew but it had some refreshing effect from pain.
When I was working in Africa, the girls used to give "Colgate Toothpaste Blow Jobs". It gave a tingling sensation which stimulates Xiao Didi, while giving a slightly numbing effect which prolongs hardness.
The Chinese also have effective concoctions.
During a recent trip to Southern China, Guangdong the sauna girl used toothpaste in the shower bed. She is only one month plus in the sauna scene from Hunan farmland. It was my first and did not like the cooling effect after she srubbed didi with her fingers + toothpaste. It may have been different if she used her tongue/mouth. Tingle and mint cool sensation.
So, I query her and said no one has done this before; why did she practice cleaning didi with toothpaste? She Went on to explain it kills the bacteria and reduce the odor!
Must say her Hygiene was good. She had her personal toothbrush and brushed her teeth before the session.
BBBJ was short compared to other veteran sauna girls, but the total GFE and hugs after the session were the selling points. I repeated several more times but decline the toothpaste-scrub-down for didi.
GGS / bc8000
Clean Gene
01-18-09, 21:53
During a recent trip to Southern China, Guangdong the sauna girl used toothpaste in the shower bed. She is only one month plus in the sauna scene from Hunan farmland. It was my first and did not like the cooling effect after she srubbed didi with her fingers + toothpaste. It may have been different if she used her tongue/mouth. Tingle and mint cool sensation.
So, I query her and said no one has done this before; why did she practice cleaning didi with toothpaste? She Went on to explain it kills the bacteria and reduce the odor!
Must say her Hygiene was good. She had her personal toothbrush and brushed her teeth before the session.
BBBJ was short compared to other veteran sauna girls, but the total GFE and hugs after the session were the selling points. I repeated several more times but decline the toothpaste-scrub-down for didi.
GGS / bc8000
Good explanation. The girls in Nairobi often gave "Salt water and alcohol blow jobs" given like the "fire and ice" in China. Anti-Bacteria! YES!!! I got my "Disease from Hell" there. Took years to get rid of. A very nasty cocktail of micro-organisms. (Lost a wife in the process. Not to speak of Alimony, Stock and Bond portfolio, House in Southern Cal, and a share of a ranch.)
Decades ago, but the memory still burns.
SE Asia Joe
01-19-09, 07:28
Washing up with tooth paste.....First time I experienced this was approximately 6 or 7 months ago in a shenzhen sauna - and since then, I've noticed more and more gals lathering themselves with the hotel toothpast and trying to do the same to me - which I of course forcefully refuse each time.
My little 'un don't need any more abrassion and/or irritation - only warm, moist USDA grade mouths or pussy (covered) around him!
Anyway, this "fad" like most fads in China (and I guess around the world) will I think soon run its course. After all, as far as I can figure out, it does nothing towards hygiene/fastidiousness and will instead cause some of these gals to injure themselves/making their nether regions raw and more subsceptible to bacteria.
SEAJ
From what I've read, it seems like China has got to be one of the easiest places in the world for a foreigner to get pussy. But the question for me is, is it just as easy for a non-white guy (south asian) ? I've got the American accent and western sensibilities, but would I better off just sticking to the pros?
From what I've read, china seems like the easiest place in the world for a foreigner to get free pussy. But does it work for a non-white (south asian) guy as well? I've got the American accent and the western sensibilities, but should I just forget about it and stick to the pros?
From what I've read, it seems like China has got to be one of the easiest places in the world for a foreigner to get pussy. But the question for me is, is it just as easy for a non-white guy (south asian)? I've got the American accent and western sensibilities, but would I better off just sticking to the pros? Yes. I'm an ABC and I get more than my fair share. At times I feel like a duck in a field of MILF constantly feeding me.
why did she practice cleaning didi with toothpaste? She Went on to explain it kills the bacteria and reduce the odor!
Must say her Hygiene was good. She had her personal toothbrush and brushed her teeth before the session.
GGS / bc8000
I've been receiving this treatment fot the past two years, (Peppermint flavour) GF stated it was to ensure longer lasting pleasure, and it certainly works for me.
From what I've read, china seems like the easiest place in the world for a foreigner to get free pussy. But does it work for a non-white (south asian) guy as well? I've got the American accent and the western sensibilities, but should I just forget about it and stick to the pros?
If you are an ABC (or Chinese living overseas) then you will have to fight the girls off with a big stick. Chinese girls prefers ABC, then Taiwan guys, followed by Hong Kong and then the foreigners.
On the other hand is you are not series about finding a girlfriend, I would just stay with P4P. Why break a girl's heart just so you can save a couple of rmb. Plus you don't know what kind of trouble you can get into by playing with their feeling. Just my 2 cents.
From what I've read, china seems like the easiest place in the world for a foreigner to get free pussy. But does it work for a non-white (south asian) guy as well? I've got the American accent and the western sensibilities, but should I just forget about it and stick to the pros?
If you are south asian, stick to the pros. But then, you may have difficulties even with the pros since, based on my experience, a lot of chinese pros in China do not like south asians.
Old Mean Dog
01-21-09, 07:06
If you are an ABC (or Chinese living overseas) then you will have to fight the girls off with a big stick. Chinese girls prefers ABC, then Taiwan guys, followed by Hong Kong and then the foreigners.
On the other hand is you are not series about finding a girlfriend, I would just stay with P4P. Why break a girl's heart just so you can save a couple of rmb. Plus you don't know what kind of trouble you can get into by playing with their feeling. Just my 2 cents.
I think it all depends on where you're at and what kind of place it is. If your in some backwater, knee-jerk village, then obviously the more Asian looking and speaking you are the better. But in a big city like SZ in a modern area, with the more younger, educated gals, foreigners have high success rates.
Then again, the more wealthier you look, the better it helps too.
-CPE
SE Asia Joe
01-21-09, 10:04
From what I've read, china seems like the easiest place in the world for a foreigner to get free pussy. But does it work for a non-white (south asian) guy as well? I've got the American accent and the western sensibilities, but should I just forget about it and stick to the pros?
May I suggest that you also go thru the "Discrimination against Foreigners in China" thread since you are south Asian. Believe it should be an eye opener.
May I also suggest that if you do decide to come to China, that you would first change your mind set that "China seems like the easiest place in the world for a foreigner to get free pussy?" We really don't need foreigners coming and re-inforcing the notion that foreigners are all just cheapskates or worse, disrespect Chinese womenfolk.
No, sorry, but we really don't need this at all.
Peace and good karma
SEAJ
I think it all depends on where you're at and what kind of place it is. If your in some backwater, knee-jerk village, then obviously the more Asian looking and speaking you are the better. But in a big city like SZ in a modern area, with the more younger, educated gals, foreigners have high success rates.
Then again, the more wealthier you look, the better it helps too.
-CPEOh, really? Didn't know I have to be in some backward villages to get my girls. The only city I know that a foreigner might have an advantage is in beijing, period.
I toke some non-asian friends on a recent trips around beijing, shanghai, guangzhou and shenzen and I could tell you without a doubt that most of the girls are flocking toward me rather than my non-asian friends. Now I am no brad or am I trump, I am just an normal abc with good Chinese speaking skill. All of my friends have more money and better looking than I, but who gets all the actions. Dude, it is all in the attitude and nothing to do with who and what you are made of!
......But in a big city like SZ in a modern area, with the more younger, educated gals, foreigners have high success rates.
-CPEI find that questionable. I still feel that an ABC still have a slight edge. just my $2rmb on this matter.
Albert Punter
01-22-09, 04:56
I agree with this statement.
It is all up to you.
.....
it is all in the attitude and nothing to do with who and what you are made of!
Then, I also agree with SE Asia Joe, be respectful and you will get more than you expect.
I agree with this statement.
It is all up to you.
Then, I also agree with SE Asia Joe, be respectful and you will get more than you expect.You bet, a great sense of humor goes a long way whether you in China or elsewhere. Make a woman laugh and you are half way home. Project a positive energy will bring you home or in this case, bring her home. LOL
I find that questionable. I still feel that an ABC still have a slight edge. just my $2rmb on this matter.Yup, ABC with average plus Chinese language is considered the ultimate catch.
If you are an ABC (or Chinese living overseas) then you will have to fight the girls off with a big stick. Chinese girls prefers ABC, then Taiwan guys, followed by Hong Kong and then the foreigners.
Since I've never been an ABC or other Overseas Chinese I can only speak for Westerners and say that if you can speak some Chinese it is very easy to get to know Chinese girls, but there are also problems involved, e.g. most Chinese men seem to resent Westerners with Chinese women, at least if the women are attractive.
So if you find a good one be prepared for mostly negative reactions (behind your back) from the local population.
I couldn't really care less what some idiots on the street think of me, or if they stare at me etc., but for the girls it may be a problem, since most Chinese seem to be extremely sensitive about what others may think of them.
I couldn't really care less what some idiots on the street think of me, or if they stare at me etc., but for the girls it may be a problem, since most Chinese seem to be extremely sensitive about what others may think of them.
This is why most Chinese girls prefer an oversea Chinese. The culture and the language are the same. You wouldn't get people talk behind your back.
The problems is that not many oversea Chinese guys are there looking for a wife so the chance of a Chinese girl meeting a single ABC is slim but there are a lot of foreigner there in China now.
I had 6 friends (2 Taiwan guys and 4 oversea Chinese from the Los Angeles area) looking for a wife a few years ago and you wouldn't believe how many girls were lined up to meet them. Most the girls were real beauty. A lot of the girls were brought by their parents to meet them. It was really funny when you see their parents making a pitch on why their girl will make the prefect wife.
It is true many regular girls do feel funny walking around with a foreigner. Some will never.
But nowadays Chinese people are more used to foreign people. It is not much of a taboo to chinese girl compared to a few years ago.
Ofcourse people will stare. This happens in any country with a local girl. More so if there is a big age difference. That is why some girls insist on bringing their girl friends for company on a outing. If the girl loves you she does not care.
I had a 19 year old student GF who went with me everywhere. Even took her on a yangtze river cruise. Yes, many chinese people would stare at us but we ignored them. She told me people were commenting in chinese. I told her to ignore it.
As my experience goes this happens in any country when you are with a local girl although subtle. In china it is more because the locals are not much used to this.
Most the girls were real beauty. A lot of the girls were brought by their parents to meet them. It was really funny when you see their parents making a pitch on why their girl will make the prefect wife.Hey, wait a minute.
How come I am never in the position to meet those?
The problems is that not many oversea Chinese guys are there looking for a wife so the chance of a Chinese girl meeting a single ABC is slim but there are a lot of foreigner there in China now.
I had 6 friends (2 Taiwan guys and 4 oversea Chinese from the Los Angeles area) looking for a wife a few years ago and you wouldn't believe how many girls were lined up to meet them. Most the girls were real beauty. A lot of the girls were brought by their parents to meet them. It was really funny when you see their parents making a pitch on why their girl will make the prefect wife.This is just one school of thought, so it is not to generalize on all Mainland Chinese girls because there are some genuine gems out there.
Here is what a 21 yo China girl vision her OWN life scenerio.
NOW
I love money the most
AFTER marriage
I love will my child the most, money second, and husband third.
Marry one and share your life savings will make you their 3rd love. Then again, emigrating their family members from China might be third. So, be prepared to be 4th LOVE.
Bc8000
This is why most Chinese girls prefer an oversea Chinese. The culture and the language are the same. You wouldn't get people talk behind your back......I had 6 friends (2 Taiwan guys and 4 oversea Chinese from the Los Angeles area) looking for a wife a few years ago and you wouldn't believe how many girls were lined up to meet them. Most the girls were real beauty. A lot of the girls were brought by their parents to meet them. It was really funny when you see their parents making a pitch on why their girl will make the prefect wife.I have seen this happen several times with single ABC being inundated with offers. If I was twenty years younger, I would be sampling the goods all day long.
I'm in my mid fifties, married and definitely no Brad Pitt (maybe an older George Clooney), but it feels great that you find a lot of great looking gals in their mid twenties to mid thirties hitting on me. They do not even mind being an "Er Tai". It does add when you are up the social economic ladder. I think that if I was just in line managment, I would still be "hit on" by these office gals.
Being an ABC, they would not have the rude stares from others but rather stares of envy. Ten years ago, I did not know about the advantage until a friend told me about it and sure enough he was absolutely correct. I'm having the time of my life when I'm over in China on business.
It is true many regular girls do feel funny walking around with a foreigner. Some will never.
It takes a real brave local girl to be seen in public with a dark skin foreigner like black or Indian.
On a different note, there is an increasingly serious population imbalance problem between the sexes since the government implemented the one child policy a generation or so ago. Chinese, like a lot of other asian cultures such as Indian, has a strong preference for male offspring. As a result, girls are in short supply. So, enjoy them while you can.
But nowadays Chinese people are more used to foreign people. It is not much of a taboo to Chinese girl compared to a few years ago.I don't know if getting used to foreigner is the proper way of putting it, they tolerate foreigner and used them to gain an advantage for themselves. Is a doggie dog world! I sometimes go into these Chinese chat rooms and I listen in, hearing just exactly how foreigners being ditched and trashed on and on. Oh yeah, they hate the japs. Rightfully so! But man, I am telling you and the words they used.
It is all about "face", face means everything to the Chinese in China. Now with that said, there are always the exception. But when it comes down to it. It is always about their face. But it is changing, very slowly.
As a result, girls are in short supply. So, enjoy them while you can.The last China census is 55-45% going toward men but I doubt China's census is accurate or come even close.
Hey, wait a minute.
How come I am never in the position to meet those?MMlouie,
Next time we meet up, i will take you one of these small towns/village and tell the villagers that you are seeking a wife to take back to America. That should cause a small riot and you will be inundated by so many people you will want to get the heck out of dodge.
In China it is mostly about "face". Being with a foreigner, many people stare and they may think that she maybe a WG . With an ABC ,they do not have that stigma. That is just my 2rmb on this. Im not dissing the "gewi lo". There are some gal that wants to find a person to take them away to a better life and a "gwei lo", they will have a better chance of leaving china. When they take them back to the family, some family member may whisper, "what did she do to meet the foreigner". There is just less stigma when it is an ABC.
Skin color to play a lot in it. I know that "Clandestine-another ISG memeber" had spoke about discrimination. Yes it does exist. I think that the darker the skin color the less desirable. Guys, don't flame me on this last statement but it does happen. I feel very bad about it. There are gals that i have ran into that are curious and i just hope that that get more curious and try it. Then i guess their fears will dissapate.. Most of the people in china are very social concious and having a bf with a darker skin does not help. Even with a WG, if friends see her with a 'brother' it is difficult on them. It is all about 'face'.
Early last year i met this gal in sha tsui. To make a long story short, this gal did an african american. I ask her why, she told me that she really needed money to send home. I ask her how did she feel afterward, she told me that it was not as bad as what she thought. She told me that afterward, it was like a gwei lo with a deeper tan. I just laugh. I ask her if she would do it again, she told me that she is worry about the "face" aspect of it. things are changing. but it will take time.
For now, i feel great to be ontop of the pecking order
MMlouie,
Next time we meet up, I will take you one of these small towns/village and tell the villagers that you are seeking a wife to take back to America. That should cause a small riot and you will be inundated by so many people you will want to get the heck out of dodge.You are right Bnlee2, they will come. This is an account of a client at a US travel agency. A 67 yo US male (Chinese) weds a 22 yo girl from Chengdu (near recent Sichuan earthquake). This is a good girl he chose from the city who worked in an office environment.- not in the P4P industry.
Parents also were active presenting the best qualities of their daughters.
Interviewed 17 candidates over 4 days. Final pick was given a wedding ceremony / red-packets / dinner, etc. All for about USD$4000.
Now back in the US and plans for a small family.
Bc8000
I have been with local girls in chinafor long time, and have travelled alot, I am of indian origin born in UK, with brownish skin, I have found when with a local girl people do look and atare, or comment to their friend's that there is a foreigner. It happens more when in smaller cities or town, where they do not see many foreigners. I'm in shenzhen alot with a local girl I'm her second B/F a very traditional girl, who is not a WG, she has no econd thoughts about us together, yet noone ele much stare's I gues they are used to foreigner, but where I travelled alot throughout China linke in small villages thing are different, I just got to the point to ignore them or if they anoy me stare back sometimes work.
If the girl is a wg from young then she will have a certain mentality and attitude.
It takes a real brave local girl to be seen in public with a dark skin foreigner like black or Indian.
On a different note, there is an increasingly serious population imbalance problem between the sexes since the government implemented the one child policy a generation or so ago. Chinese, like a lot of other asian cultures such as Indian, has a strong preference for male offspring. As a result, girls are in short supply. So, enjoy them while you can.
The situation with gender is more complicated than a population imbalance. Look at AFF/CFF, there are large numbers of single women (just using that site alone) around 30 years old and above, some divorced, some widowed, some never married, who are having a hell of a time finding a decent man. After some years using AFF, I'm getting fairly depressed about this, as it seems an indicator of a widespread phenomenon. After I started using Skype a couple years ago--just to call the US, mind you--many women fitting this description added me out of the blue and started chatting me up, and I've ended up in bed with more than one. Many of these women are extremely interested in marrying a foreigner, and if he can speak Chinese and has a job, there's almost nothing else for them to discuss. When I tell them I'm married, 9 out of 10 beg me to help them find a husband, meaning among my foreign friends. A few remind me of this frequently, and ask me how the progress is!
Mao Dun
MMlouie,
Next time we meet up, I will take you one of these small towns/village and tell the villagers that you are seeking a wife to take back to America. That should cause a small riot and you will be inundated by so many people you will want to get the heck out of dodge.LOL, I might just take you up on that. Being abc, single and in my prime years (for China anyway, I am considered an old fart in the states). I am in enough troubles already, but just once wanted to know what it feels like being hung up as a prime piece of meat.
In China it is mostly about "face". Being with a foreigner, many people stare and they may think that she maybe a WG.that is exactly what I am talking about! The older generation will be saying behind her back that she is not a good enough so she have to go outside her race. I doubt it if this thinking ever will change with the older generation.
Chinese student just arrived to U.S.A. at Jan 8th. Her head just been chopped off by male chinese student at the same school.
Marry one and share your life savings will make you their 3rd love. Then again, emigrating their family members from China might be third. So, be prepared to be 4th LOVE.
Bc8000A 21 year old Chinese girl still have choices, a 41 year old Chinese girl does not have much choices. Once a girl past their 30, the chance of getting married and finding a husband diminished by each day.
That is also why we abcs don't marry young China girls, we know exactly what they are looking for. Well, at least for me anyway.
Trackster42
01-24-09, 02:36
Chinese student just arrived to U.S.A. at Jan 8th. Her head just been chopped off by male chinese student at the same school.What has this tragic but extremely rare incident got to do with the topic at hand (China women: opinion and advice)?
I have been with local girls in chinafor long time, and have travelled alot, I am of indian origin born in UK, with brownish skin, I have found when with a local girl people do look and atare, or comment to their friend's that there is a foreigner. It happens more when in smaller cities or town, where they do not see many foreigners. I'm in shenzhen alot with a local girl I'm her second B/F a very traditional girl, who is not a WG, she has no econd thoughts about us together, yet noone ele much stare's I gues they are used to foreigner, but where I travelled alot throughout China linke in small villages thing are different, I just got to the point to ignore them or if they anoy me stare back sometimes work.
If the girl is a wg from young then she will have a certain mentality and attitude.You may not care, but I'm sure the inside her she does care. In China, it is all about face. I'm in Shenzhen a lot, sure it happens less in major urban area than rural area but it still happens. It is not your face, it is her's. The descrimination could go beyond it. Sure she will say she does not care so that you do not feel hurt but I'm sure she feels it within her. Sometimes staring back at others may make you feel better but I would not advise it because it could hurt your gf more. If the person staring my know her, the talk behind your backs may eventually go back to her. My advise, just smile and move on.
The situation with gender is more complicated than a population imbalance. Look at AFF/CFF, there are large numbers of single women (just using that site alone) around 30 years old and above, some divorced, some widowed, some never married, who are having a hell of a time finding a decent man. After some years using AFF, I'm getting fairly depressed about this, as it seems an indicator of a widespread phenomenon. After I started using Skype a couple years ago--just to call the US, mind you--many women fitting this description added me out of the blue and started chatting me up, and I've ended up in bed with more than one. Many of these women are extremely interested in marrying a foreigner, and if he can speak Chinese and has a job, there's almost nothing else for them to discuss. When I tell them I'm married, 9 out of 10 beg me to help them find a husband, meaning among my foreign friends. A few remind me of this frequently, and ask me how the progress is!
Mao DunIn China, Relationship and Culture is very complex. Remarrying either after a divorce or death is really not an openly used option. Age discrimination is also a problem. When a female is over 30, divorce, widow or whatever, she is at a major disadvantage in finding anything from a husband to a job. There is just not that much choices. Being educated and multilingual maybe of some assistance. Many single Chinese male will not marry a women that is divorce, widowed or over the age of 30 due to the stigma or "used or old" goods. Most of them in that category have no option but to look further out if they do not want to be alone. Marrying foreigner maybe an option that they only have.
Twenty years ago, if you were in that category you are literally "unmarketable" irregardless of what you maybe with the exception is you were rich. Now, remarrying after a divorce, or death is getting more acceptable but not by much. Divorce twenty years ago was unheard of. It did not matter how bad the marriage is, you were stuck with it. Now divorce can be accepted but not by much.
I could go on and on. But I will stop here. There are many stunning divorce, widow and older gals in China. I, for one prefer a little older than the 19/20 year old.
Chinese student just arrived to U.S.A. at Jan 8th. Her head just been chopped off by male chinese student at the same school.Sorry, can you explain the statement a little more?
i posted here a while back about the stewardess i met on flight from beijing to shenzhen and got some good advice in response to my query about how to guide the relationship in the direction of f**k buddies rather than a girlfriend. (see http://internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?p=826469#post826469 and http://internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?p=826164#post826164).
well it seems that despite my best efforts it's heading in the wrong direction. she's just too innocent and loving. last night i saw her in person for the second time. the first time i took her to the movies, on the advice of an isger, then back to my apt. all i got that day was some cuddling and hand-holding on my couch while we listened to music. she turned away when i tried to kiss her.
this time i took her to dinner, then again back to my place. it helped that it was so cold that the idea of doing anything else seemed no less attractive to her than it did to me. also, she doesn't drink, so we weren't going to go to a bar.
after nearly two hours of additional chatting and cuddling, i finally got her to kiss me. after the first round, she asked me, "what if i told you you were the first person i ever kissed besides my mother?" that was definitely not what i wanted to hear. after more cuddling and chatting she eventually let me feel her up. i actually got her bra off, which i considered an impressive accomplishment given the circumstances.
it was getting late and since she lives out by the airport, she had been planning to go sleep at a friend's house closer to my place. i raised the idea of her sleeping with me, but she asked repeatedly if i would "bother" (乱闹 luan4 nao4 was the term she used)her during the night. we went back and forth, and the truth is i'm pretty sure i could have convinced her to stay. she even asked me if i had clothes for her to sleep in, though she wasn't happy when i offered her a small pair of boxer shorts (imagine if she'd known that they were actually free pyjamas obtained from a fs sauna!). i had some more modest bottoms i might have offered, but what would the fun be in that?
the reason i didn't push harder for her to stay is that the idea of sharing a bed with a slim, 24-year old, 178cm tall girl who won't have sex with me didn't seem like a recipe for a relaxing night's sleep.
of course, it's not impossible that i could have convinced her to go all the way. once she's in the bed, obviously anything can happen.
the problem is i'm just not heartless enough. she is an incredibly sweet, innocent girl who wants me as a boyfriend. i have no doubt that i could have sex with her within the next few dates -- maybe even the next one -- but like i said before, virgins scare me. i don't want to de-flower anyone unless i'm in it for a long haul (or maybe unless i'm a rich guy who can pay exorbitant prices for someone who's selling their virginity voluntarily).
now i recognize there's a possibility that the innocence is all just an act. but if it's an act, it's damn convincing, and towards the end of the night i started saying things (again, at the suggestion of some isgers) along the lines of, "i think you're too pure for me" and "i dont' want to harm your reputation.") so she should have gotten the message that acting innocent, if she really isn't, wouldn't be the way to increase her chances with me.
just now she sent me a message saying she wants to get together tomorrow to roll dumplings for new year. i replied, "i have plans tomorrow, but also i'm afraid of dealing with virgins." she wrote back and said, "are you saying you're a bad boy? am i giving you pressure?" this is not going well.
am i just a pussy? are there battle-hardened mongers out there who would really just go full-speed ahead and then just drop her once the deal is done?
OldAsiaHand
01-24-09, 06:49
I agree with most of what has been posted but wanted to add a few cents of my own:
Dark skin foreigners are less desirable in the eyes of Chinese girls, but still get laid. I also recommend sticking with P4P. No racial discrimination intended on my part, it's just the way it is.
Although the mainstream leans towards Chinese, white foreigners have pretty good chances with freebies if they can speak some Chinese. The best lookers cannot speak English, they don't have to learn. My best luck is in the 28-35 age group. For the younger girls, I stick to P4P.
That said, China is not the best place for freebies for the casual visitor. There are certainly not stunners on every corner looking for one night stands. For me, it has not been as easy as I have seen posted on this forum. Most of the freebies I get take a little more time and effort. Some guys have very good luck with the internet, but also invest a lot of time on it too.
There is a stigma among middle aged Chinese men towards girls with foreigners. I often overhear comments while walking down the street with Chinese women.
Just my POV.
OAH
Vista Sushi
01-24-09, 14:06
am i just a pussy? are there battle-hardened mongers out there who would really just go full-speed ahead and then just drop her once the deal is done? i'm in a similar situation. i was at her place last night (recently moved to her own apartment). she cooked a rather elaborate dinner for me. after dinner we spent sometime on the couch watching tv and cuddling. it came to a point where i could have spent the night. but similar to you, conscious kicked in. she's far to innocent to mess with.
plus, she (and most every 22+ y/o chinese woman) is looking for marriage. if you ask a few more questions about why shes interested in you, it gets to the desire to have a mixed baby, potentially live the "western" dream, and the ability to have more than one child. it gets complex pretty quickly.
advice for conversion:
it's best to keep it up front that you aren't looking or marriage (but could be convinced). she will move to try to keep you around. you'll know if she starts to give you gifts or food. if that happens, you might be able to get her to try to use you. she's curious and sometime curiosity works in your favor.
on her end, she's getting a lot of pressure from her mother to get married. so, she's likely already called you her bf to her mother. if that happened, you are already in the mess. might as well get the benefits. if you want confirmation, just ask who she's told about you.
from a negotiation standpoint you've already got some "firsts" with her. that's very important. just reassure her that she's still a good girl even after sex and that it's natural for her to want to try new things. you don't want to destroy her emotionally. it may work, but she is a woman, so who knows. she'll still think of you as her bf. you can't avoid that.
also be up front that it is normal for you to have multiple gfs and that she too can date other guys. you'll lose her eventually, but then its on her terms. stressing the need to be "convinced" about marriage will get you the action. just keep in mind that she'll want to save face. so, you'll need to construct a good out.
although i'm a manipulative jerk, i'm backing away from the edge. after tinkering with some minds, i'm sticking to p4p. it's on-demand. it's better than an freebie could do (get her to ar you. good luck). and after its over, it's over.
I posted here a while back about the stewardess I met on flight from Beijing to Shenzhen
I always thought it was against airline regulations for stewardesses to hand out private contact infos, since I've tried chatting them up during flights in China several times without success, but now I guess they just didn't want to give ME their cell phone numbers.
China Maverick
01-24-09, 17:06
I tend to agree with OAH. A foreigner with Chinese reading, speaking skills would be the lead; followed by the ABC's etc and this particular category could be prioritized by the western foreigners as opposed to the south Asians etc. Even if both are fluent Chinese speakers. But this would all depend on individuals really; rather than generalizing it.
Gaoshu. I tend to agree with you and I would do the same. If you are invited for the new year celebrations then you are being introduced informally; to the family as a BF. Beaware if you don't want to carry baggage!
Just my two cents
CM
She wrote back and said, "Are you saying you're a bad boy? Am I giving you pressure? " no, on the contrary. I think you should txt her back and say that you are a bad boy and you intend to do her the next time you see her. Stop guessing and dickin around. Get to the point. Most Chinese girls will not make the first move, this way they could still keep their innocent and blame it on you rather then having that "bad girl" feeling herself.
Just do it and report in.
I tend to agree with OAH. A foreigner with Chinese reading, speaking skills would be the lead; followed by the ABC's etc and this particular category could be prioritized by the western foreigners as opposed to the south Asians etc.
CMNo pun intended but what have you guys been smokin? I want some too! Stop delusional about your theory on the packing order; putting up your foreigner with Chinese reading and speaking skills with an abc with Chinese reading and speaking skills up, I could almost guarantee 98% that the abc will come out ahead. Now that is pretty damn good odds! I am sure that I am going to get hit with this comments but bring it on and chime in.
Now I admit that they are a small percentage of China girls that are only into foreigners but as a general overall, no. Girls will tell you exactly what you want to hear but reality is what it is. Read my posting about choices and face to understand why.
As to myself, I stick with p4p it is less complication. I don't mind having 2-3 China gfs but I will never married one. There are too many options and they come too easy for me.
Eyebrow777
01-24-09, 23:57
am i just a pussy? are there battle-hardened mongers out there who would really just go full-speed ahead and then just drop her once the deal is done?who am i to judge, but since you asked. i don't think you're being a pussy. personally, i'd never misrepresent myself (or my intentions) to get laid. just not my style and if it's not your style, then don't let anyone pressure into thinking otherwise.
just my 2 rmb
eb
I agree with most of what has been posted but wanted to add a few cents of my own:
Dark skin foreigners are less desirable in the eyes of Chinese girls, but still get laid. I also recommend sticking with P4P. No racial discrimination intended on my part, it's just the way it is.
OAHOah,
You are very correct on dark skin foreigner. There is a definite decrimination. I personally feel bad about it but give China some time and things will change.
I found the once they tried the darker skin monger, they tend to be less afraid. But their major problem is from what other will further think of them when they see her with a less desirable monger. In China, It is all about FACE.
I will also give you my 2 cents.
In my opinion with everything being equal, I believe an ABC will win hands down over the foreigners. Even if the girl prefer a foreigner, the family pressure will be very high.
The other reason why girls prefer ABC over a foreigner is there is limited culture difference. The other thing is that having a husband or boyfriend who is from overseas (mainly US) is a big face for the family. Look at how many family try to send their kids to schools in the U.S.
Aside from everything, there is usually no language problem because of the ABC. Just think how it will be if you are foreigner visiting her family at new year, everyone is sitting around speaking Chinese and looking at the foreigner who doesn't understand what is going on. Then the girl has to stop and repeat everything in English to the guy so he is not left out.
Then when you bring the girl to your family, she is sitting around with your family, not fitting in with your friends and feeling left out.
Culture and language makes a big difference in both families.
On the other subject, I think it is fine to get a girl for sex if she knows the score. I on the other hand do not believe it is right to string a girl along when you have no intention of a future with her when you know that she is looking for a boyfriend or husband. It is cheap enough out there for P4P why would you want to break a girl's heart just to save a few rmb or just so you can bag a trophy. After all, you still have to look at yourself in the mirror in the morning. Climbing off my high horse now.
For all you single ABC guys, just let some people like the hotel staff, bellboy, etc know that you are single and looking for a wife, you will be surprised how many girls will be coming to meet you.
It seems like very one in China knows some girl that is looking for a husband.
The problem I saw with my friends was not meeting girls but which girl to choose since there are just sooo many.
I will also give you my 2 cents.
In my opinion with everything being equal, I believe an ABC will win hands down over the foreigners. Even if the girl prefer a foreigner, the family pressure will be very high.
The other reason why girls prefer ABC over a foreigner is there is limited culture difference. The other thing is that having a husband or boyfriend who is from overseas (mainly US) is a big face for the family. Look at how many family try to send their kids to schools in the U. S.
Aside from everything, there is usually no language problem because of the ABC. Just think how it will be if you are foreigner visiting her family at new year, everyone is sitting around speaking Chinese and looking at the foreigner who doesn't understand what is going on. Then the girl has to stop and repeat everything in English to the guy so he is not left out.
Then when you bring the girl to your family, she is sitting around with your family, not fitting in with your friends and feeling left out.
Culture and language makes a big difference in both families.
On the other subject, I think it is fine to get a girl for sex if she knows the score. I on the other hand do not believe it is right to string a girl along when you have no intention of a future with her when you know that she is looking for a boyfriend or husband. It is cheap enough out there for P4P why would you want to break a girl's heart just to save a few rmb or just so you can bag a trophy. After all, you still have to look at yourself in the mirror in the morning. Climbing off my high horse now.Not just single ABC. Some of the girls do not even mine being an "er tai, second wife" to an ABC. You are so correct about the family pressure and having a member of the family that is an ABC.
I do not mislead them, I tell them straight out the I'm married and have two college age daughter and I still get hit on. I'm in my mid fifties, a full head of hair (no bald guy here), not ugly but no brad pitt either. Knowing all this, if the hottie still want to hit on me then it is all fair game. Not all ABC fully understand the language but the barrier is much less than a foreigner.
Loveasiangirls
01-26-09, 05:26
I will also give you my 2 cents.
In my opinion with everything being equal, I believe an ABC will win hands down over the foreigners. Even if the girl prefer a foreigner, the family pressure will be very high.
The other reason why girls prefer ABC over a foreigner is there is limited culture difference. The other thing is that having a husband or boyfriend who is from overseas (mainly US) is a big face for the family. Look at how many family try to send their kids to schools in the U.S.
Aside from everything, there is usually no language problem because of the ABC. Just think how it will be if you are foreigner visiting her family at new year, everyone is sitting around speaking Chinese and looking at the foreigner who doesn't understand what is going on. Then the girl has to stop and repeat everything in English to the guy so he is not left out.
Then when you bring the girl to your family, she is sitting around with your family, not fitting in with your friends and feeling left out.
Culture and language makes a big difference in both families.
I guess you mean ABC with language skills. Most ABCs or CBCs that I know cannot speak mandarin. Some speak a bit of cantonese. I know more putong hua and culture that they do. But they sure look more chinese than me.
Loveasiangirls
01-26-09, 05:32
I am sure there is some kind of pecking order but I am not sure it matters. There are more girls there than we can handle. More than enough to choose from. A Chinese lady friend created a profile for me a Chinese web site. I got 400 e-mails in the first 24 hours.
I guess you mean ABC with language skills. Most ABCs or CBCs that I know cannot speak mandarin. Some speak a bit of cantonese. I know more putong hua and culture that they do. But they sure look more chinese than me.I am not trying to say that foreigners are not any good, just pointing out if the average Chinese girl make out her wish list, I think most of them would like an ABC living in the U.S., has a lot of money and speaks the language.
But as most of us (and the girls) know that those guys are in very short supply.
This does not mean if a Chinese girl get to know a foreigner she would reject him outright while waiting for the perfect guy because they also know that the perfect guy may never arrive.
A Chinese lady friend created a profile for me a Chinese web site. I got 400 e-mails in the first 24 hours. let me get something very clear to you guys; the standard for Chinese male toward their s/o is much higher in standard than foreigners and China girls know that for a fact. The girls also know after a certain age there chances of finding someone good to hold on to diminished by the day, there are just too much competition. They also know that foreigners have lesser standards, they are much gullible and easier to manipulate in getting their way. Why do I say this? Because I have heard it time and time again, I have been told that it is much easier to marry off to a foreigner than Chinese oversea. And since they will be marry off to a foreign country and they do not have to be consistently bitched at by her relatives, no big deal. It is only a few years of their life in exchange for an opportunity getting out of prc! If I could only have a dollar every time I heard about some foreigner marry a China girl that ran away with their money and property, I could be a rich man. The other regular story you hear is having a child with you immediately after marriage, you are her guarantee meal ticket.
If you think that China women are all angels and have no motives other than looking for love with a foreigner, than I have a bridge to sell you. Don't get me wrong, there are plenty of good girls that are just simply interested in just finding a husband, but it is not for me. It is much cheaper and less complicated than p4p.
I guess you mean ABC with language skills. Most ABCs or CBCs that I know cannot speak mandarin. Some speak a bit of cantonese. I know more putong hua and culture that they do. But they sure look more Chinese than me.As bnlee2 posted, it is all about FACE in China. FACE is the only thing and everything. Hey, how did you know about my putonghua? Girls think that my imperfect putonghua is cute, and they all want to taking extra time in teaching me their native tongue personally.
Old Mean Dog
01-26-09, 10:42
Oh, really? Didn't know I have to be in some backward villages to get my girls. The only city I know that a foreigner might have an advantage is in beijing, period.
I toke some non-asian friends on a recent trips around beijing, shanghai, guangzhou and shenzen and I could tell you without a doubt that most of the girls are flocking toward me rather than my non-asian friends. Now I am no brad or am I trump, I am just an normal abc with good Chinese speaking skill. All of my friends have more money and better looking than I, but who gets all the actions. Dude, it is all in the attitude and nothing to do with who and what you are made of!
Did I say that is the only place you can get a girl?? NO.
I merely said that that an ABC/CBC or an Overseas Chinese period can get girls in places a foreigner cannot, BUT a foreigner in a modern city like Beijing, Shanghai, Shenzhen, Guangzhou, etc. has a pretty high success rate if he is in the modern areas of town with the educated gals.
I assure you Beijing is NOT the only city we can score in...
-CPE
Old Mean Dog
01-26-09, 10:48
I find that questionable. I still feel that an ABC still have a slight edge. just my $2rmb on this matter.
Geez, seems I touched a sore spot here. Where did I say that foreigners do better than ABC/CBC's, etc??
All I merely stated, was that a foreigner in a modern city, in the modern part of town has a pretty high success rate amongst younger educated girls....that's it. I did not have some "Pecking order", nor did I mention that we score more than an ABC/CBC, I was just stating to Csuns post that maybe we do better than he thinks we do.
-CPE
China Maverick
01-26-09, 16:36
Its not about being an ABC or a pure laowei or a South Asian! I guess we all have a pick; available in a large pool la! Lets not argue and waste time! Lets look at getting more pussies!
Gong xi fa cai!
CM
Geez, seems I touched a sore spot here. Where did I say that foreigners do better than ABC/CBC's, etc??
All I merely stated, was that a foreigner in a modern city, in the modern part of town has a pretty high success rate amongst younger educated girls....that's it. I did not have some "Pecking order", nor did I mention that we score more than an ABC/CBC, I was just stating to Csuns post that maybe we do better than he thinks we do.
-CPE
If your in some backwater, knee-jerk village, then obviously the more Asian looking and speaking you are the better. But in a big city like SZ in a modern area, with the more younger, educated gals, foreigners have high success rates.I am sure that you meant no offense but that sure sounds like one to me. First of all, I would not even go into any villages without some friends that know the area. Although there are reports that you could bao a girl up north for merely 500rmb a month. Yes, that is correct! They are in the 7-9 category and without attitude, they don't dress like the girls in the city but with their clothes off. Who cares. With that said; it is absolutely dangerous to venture into those places without the guidance of local people and the knowledge of the land, it is not advised for any one period.
Loveasiangirls
01-26-09, 19:28
let me get something very clear to you guys; the standard for Chinese male toward their s/o is much higher in standard than foreigners and China girls know that for a fact. The girls also know after a certain age there chances of finding someone good to hold on to diminished by the day, there are just too much competition. They also know that foreigners have lesser standards, they are much gullible and easier to manipulate in getting their way. Why do I say this? Because I have heard it time and time again, I have been told that it is much easier to marry off to a foreigner than Chinese oversea. And since they will be marry off to a foreign country and they do not have to be consistently bitched at by her relatives, no big deal. It is only a few years of their life in exchange for an opportunity getting out of prc! If I could only have a dollar every time I heard about some foreigner marry a China girl that ran away with their money and property, I could be a rich man. The other regular story you hear is having a child with you immediately after marriage, you are her guarantee meal ticket.
If you think that China women are all angels and have no motives other than looking for love with a foreigner, than I have a bridge to sell you. Don't get me wrong, there are plenty of good girls that are just simply interested in just finding a husband, but it is not for me. It is much cheaper and less complicated than p4p.That's fine. My point is that there is plenty of pussy to go around.
I never mentioned marriage. I got to be friend with a girl I met from the website "chinalove" that presumably focuses on getting chinese girls foreign husbands. I had dinner with her last time I was in Shenzhen. I asked her is this thing works, do chinese ladies find foreign husbands. She says it is rare. Almost never happens unless the girl is really beautiful and speaks english. Those that can't speak english go nowhere. But the agency keeps the dream alive and collects fees from them. A lot of girls on the website would love to marry (especially if above 35) but are happy to get some sex while they keep looking.
I never mentioned marriage. But the agency keeps the dream alive and collects fees from them. A lot of girls on the website would love to marry (especially if above 35) but are happy to get some sex while they keep looking.That website is a scam, did she ever tell you how much they charged the girls to response? And if you check the website, you could find out how much they charge members to sent a letter. They get you coming and going both way, I certainly would love to get a piece of that action.
Old Mean Dog
01-27-09, 03:33
I am sure that you meant no offense but that sure sounds like one to me.
Then I will chalk this up as a misunderstanding on your part, because it was not meant to be offensive in any way.
I have been in Southern China (Far from Beijing) for a few years now and have never had any problems getting a girlfriend when I wanted one, nor have any of my foreign friends that are here long term. Sure, they are not all putty in our hands, nor are ALL the single gals highly receptive to us, but normally our batting average is pretty good.
Personally, In the P4P arena, the strikeout ratio is maybe 1-2 girls per shop that don't want to be with a laowai, but otherwise, it's business as usual and I always got what I wanted in Saunas and KTV's.
So, even though it is obvious that a Foreign Born Chinese can and always will be able to score more girls throughout China (Including the little villages) than a white foreigner, we still do pretty good here.
Happy New Year!
-CPE
Then I will chalk this up as a misunderstanding on your part, because it was not meant to be offensive in any way.
I have been in Southern China (Far from Beijing) for a few years now and have never had any problems getting a girlfriend when I wanted one, nor have any of my foreign friends that are here long term. Sure, they are not all putty in our hands, nor are ALL the single gals highly receptive to us, but normally our batting average is pretty good.
Personally, In the P4P arena, the strikeout ratio is maybe 1-2 girls per shop that don't want to be with a laowai, but otherwise, it's business as usual and I always got what I wanted in Saunas and KTV's.
So, even though it is obvious that a Foreign Born Chinese can and always will be able to score more girls throughout China (Including the little villages) than a white foreigner, we still do pretty good here.
Happy New Year!
-CPE
I agree that foreigners will have a good shot in finding a girlfriend in China since you are competing again the local Chinese. Most foreigner are better educated, have more money (future) and treat the girls better than most (noticed I said most) local guys. Remember hearing "why are you so nice to me' from the girls when all you are doing is treating them the same way you have always treated a lady? When was the last time you saw a guy in China pull open a door, hold a chair, help them with their coat? Just saying this is the way we were brought up in our culture and it is not the Chinese culture. Do the girls like being treated like a lady?
Do you know that if you treat your girlfriend (wife) with respect, you are consider pussy whipped and will lose face in front of your friends.
I personally know a case when a bunch of us went out after work and then decided to have dinner together. I asked the guys at the table whether they should call home and tell their wife that they won't be home for dinner, the response I got was a bunch of laughter and comments like, I don't need to tell my wife anything, if I don't come home, it is my business and she understands this. Then when I was going to the bathroom, I saw one guy making a phone call to his wife telling her he won't be home for dinner. When he saw me, his face dropped and asked me not to tell the other guys that he called home. He said he would lose face and his friends would think that he was afraid of his wife.
I am just saying that this is the difference in culture. Most of us would call home out of respect and not out of fear.
Old Mean Dog
01-28-09, 08:34
That's fine. My point is that there is plenty of pussy to go around.
I never mentioned marriage. I got to be friend with a girl I met from the website "chinalove" that presumably focuses on getting chinese girls foreign husbands. But the agency keeps the dream alive and collects fees from them. A lot of girls on the website would love to marry (especially if above 35) but are happy to get some sex while they keep looking.
Chinalove (www.chnlove.com) is actually a Hong Kong company that just provides the tools (i.e. the name and website) for the other mainland companies to utilize. They pay China Love sort of a membership fee to be on their network. A mainland company has to have enough gals as clients just to qualify to be on the website and a single gal in China cannot post her own profile there.
That being said and to add onto this, often a gal will have to pay the said mainland agency a fee to be in the network, so you know any gal that is coughing up her own cash, will be wanting results, not just causal sex.
But, to further comment on Mmlouie's post, many agencies don't require an upfront fee from the gals, rather the contract is backloaded, meaning they expect the money to come from the guy, that falls in love with the gal.
Majority of these women are "Coached" by the agents, who fill their heads with some real bullshit about what's the minimum requirement for a foreign man and fantasyland crap about what the West is like. On an initial date, usually the gal will bring a friend or two with her, these are not her friends, but rather the agent(s) and/or a company translator who are there to ensure, the client and the potential payday do not circumvent the system.
Many of the clients can't even speak more than two words of English, so many times it's a translator (boy or girl) that you are writing these mushy love letters too and who replies to them.
It's a ugly fucking business and one of the reasons I got out of it.
Can you score some freebies from these websites? You betcha can. Once the agency feels the guy is good, they will even coach the gal into giving up the ass, to seal the deal. Just a piece of advice: Never tell them you live/work in China, your success rate will drop drastically.
Personally, I would avoid utilizing these kinds of websites (i.e. Ones solely based on the premise of marriage), because the situation could turn out bad for a guy not really sincere or willing to follow through.
Just my 2 cents.
-CPE
I agree with CPexpat's statement on the Match maker sites. I have seen some of the site and a lot of them just want your membership money. Some of the pictures of the girls are not the girl you are going to meet. A friend of mine joined some becauase he was short on time and can't keep going to China to meet girls so he thought the matchmaker site would be the fastest way to find the girl of his dream.
After he used the search and picked out the girls he wanted to meet, the matchmakers said they would arrange the meeting if he would pay the membership fee. However after he paid, the girls were always either too busy or not in Shenzhen anymore. When another friend looked at the picture of the girls, he found that a few of them were actors on TV or singers and not real members in the matchmakers. The company just download pictures of pretty girls off the internet, makeup a profile and then charge guys who don't know better a fee to meet them. Of course after you paid the fee, they will not refund, they will then try to push some average girls on you. My friend just gave up after meeting a few girls and never returned to them. The matchmakers don't care since they already got his money and there is always the next sucker out there.
SE Asia Joe
01-30-09, 05:18
I agree that foreigners will have a good shot in finding a girlfriend in China since you are competing again the local Chinese. Most foreigner are better educated, have more money (future) and treat the girls better than most (noticed I said most) local guys.......... Do you know that if you treat your girlfriend (wife) with respect, you are consider pussy whipped and will lose face in front of your friends................. When he saw me, his face dropped and asked me not to tell the other guys that he called home. He said he would lose face and his friends would think that he was afraid of his wife.........I am just saying that this is the difference in culture. Most of us would call home out of respect and not out of fear.
I bet that the guy who had to surreptitiously call his wife was Shanghainese.... or that his wife is Shanghainese!!
And on your observation that "foreigners will have a good shot in finding a GF in China etc.... This MAY be true but again I betcha - that for every one foreigner who managed to find a decent, good GF/wife in China, there must be tens if not hundreds others who only found heart-ache, frustration and...... be out of pocket!
Chinese gals ain't the docile, trusting, naive little things that a lot of foreigners think they are. Not by far - and ESPECIALLY for those Chinese gals who would have anything to do with foreigners!
Just IMHO
SEAJ
And on your observation that "foreigners will have a good shot in finding a GF in China etc. This MAY be true but again I betcha. That for every one foreigner who managed to find a decent, good GF/wife in China, there must be tens if not hundreds others who only found heart-ache, frustration and. Be out of pocket!
Chinese gals ain't the docile, trusting, naive little things that a lot of foreigners think they are. Not by far. And ESPECIALLY for those Chinese gals who would have anything to do with foreigners! Just IMHO
SEAJAmen to that, SEAJ. And where have you been, I was waiting for you to chime in.
Old Mean Dog
01-30-09, 06:39
And on your observation that "foreigners will have a good shot in finding a GF in China etc.... This MAY be true but again I betcha - that for every one foreigner who managed to find a decent, good GF/wife in China, there must be tens if not hundreds others who only found heart-ache, frustration and...... be out of pocket!
Chinese gals ain't the docile, trusting, naive little things that a lot of foreigners think they are. Not by far - and ESPECIALLY for those Chinese gals who would have anything to do with foreigners!
Just IMHO
SEAJ
Always so negative. Good girls for girlfriends and *****s for fun, don't mix the two.
I hear this shit happens to a lot of Hong Kong fellas also, maybe you know some that got taken for a ride? ;)
-CPE
Always so negative. Good girls for girlfriends and *****s for fun, don't mix the two.
I hear this shit happens to a lot of Hong Kong fellas also, maybe you know some that got taken for a ride? ;)
-CPEit is not negativity, it is rather sound good advice. Good girls or wgs, they are the same. Thats what seaj trying to say, they all are not who you think they are. Inside that little pretty person is another hidden person, more than any normal person could handle.
Btw; Hong Kong people general are quite smart, can be devious and manipulative but they are quite honest. But it is nothing compare to mainland chinese . . . especially the shanghainese, we are just a little puppy. It is never what it seems to be, poof and it is magic!
Chinese gals ain't the docile, trusting, naive little things that a lot of foreigners think they are. Not by far - and ESPECIALLY for those Chinese gals who would have anything to do with foreigners!
Just IMHO
SEAJSEAJ.
You hit it right on the nose. You are so correct on this statement. You sound like a "grey hair" with a lot of wisdom. Drinks are on me next time we hook up.
PS. With your wisdom, you must be related to Confucius.
Girls are the same all over the world. There are good ones and bad ones. I am sure what you say in your statement can be applied to any country include our own.
Marriage is a long term commitment, if you don't take the time to really get to know the girl (or the guy) then it can blow up in your face. This is why I think people that have the basic same culture (oversea Chinese who speaks the language) have a better chance of success.
For anyone who thinks they can just come over to China and spend a few weeks getting to know the girl and her family, then marry her hoping for a long term marriage is crazy.
.
Old Mean Dog
01-31-09, 09:45
For anyone who thinks they can just come over to China and spend a few weeks getting to know the girl and her family, then marry her hoping for a long term marriage is crazy.
That is the best piece of advice any of the resident experts have given.
Chinese women are not as complex as some may say. "Face" is important to them as well, but through other materialistic means such as clothes, car, jewelry, apartment, etc.. It really depends on her background, as to what level of material "commitment" is required.
One such proof of this is a former client and now friend of mine who not only had to buy an apartment in China, to show long term commitment, but also had to finance a large portion to the gals parents for them to get a new home as well.
If you noticed in my other comment, I stated us guys that were here long-term. But as Csun213 pointed out, there are many fools that think that they are the "Knights in Shining Armour" and can just come over here, whisk the girl away and live Happily Ever After are in for a very rude awakening.
-CPE
Mmlouie: Your general attitude and writing style is very similar to our own beloved Ace Gallant, any relationship?
GoodEnough
01-31-09, 10:26
I'm certainly no expert on China or Chinese women, but it seems to me from this discussion that you could substitute "Filipinas" or "Thais" in the recent posts and be just as accurate. I've seen the "get off a plane, fall in love and get married" disaster repeated here in the Philippines, with much the same disastrous results.
GE
Clean Gene
01-31-09, 10:38
Btw; Hong Kong people general are quite smart, can be devious and manipulative but they are quite honest. But it is nothing compare to mainland chinese . . . especially the shanghainese, we are just a little puppy. It is never what it seems to be, poof and it is magic!
Shanghai is a very commercial society. Sex, loyalty and love are all commodities to be traded at a profit. A "loser" trades at a loss.
"Hidden" Shanghainese I have known:
(1) X.. , a tall, beautiful, long legged Beijing born and raised. Her father, a former ambassador, was born in Wuxi.
(2) H... A lovely, delightful journalism graduate from a Xi'an Univ. Her mother came from Shanghai as a girl.
(3) W... A lovely professor of medicine now in NYC, born and raised in Beijing. Her mother is Shanghainese.
I should also include my "country girl" wife. Her mother lived a few years in Shanghai before moving west with her soldier husband. It took me over a decade to realize "country girl" was a Shanghainese in disguise. She likes the line of Marilyn Monroe in "Diamonds are ...": "I didn't marry you for your money. I married you for your Daddy's money."
Mmlouie: Your general attitude and writing style is very similar to our own beloved Ace Gallant, any relationship?I am not even going to dignify that with an answer.
Wow Gene,
There has been rumors that Shanghai girls are the most cunning in all of China. But I feel bad for you man. If your country girl wife is really that like. But If you are still in China, it's ok. You can have your pick with a variety of young women there.
But honestly, every girls out there is out there to get ahead in life I suppose, it's a matter of the degree of personal ambition I suppose.
I got rocked by a shanghai girl once. Learned to stay the hell away from them.
AsnDragon
Shanghai is a very commercial society. Sex, loyalty and love are all commodities to be traded at a profit. A "loser" trades at a loss.
"Hidden" Shanghainese I have known:
(1) X.. , a tall, beautiful, long legged Beijing born and raised. Her father, a former ambassador, was born in Wuxi.
(2) H... A lovely, delightful journalism graduate from a Xi'an Univ. Her mother came from Shanghai as a girl.
(3) W... A lovely professor of medicine now in NYC, born and raised in Beijing. Her mother is Shanghainese.
I should also include my "country girl" wife. Her mother lived a few years in Shanghai before moving west with her soldier husband. It took me over a decade to realize "country girl" was a Shanghainese in disguise. She likes the line of Marilyn Monroe in "Diamonds are ...": "I didn't marry you for your money. I married you for your Daddy's money."
Alright, call me a cynic if you want. But honestly, it's not just China girls, thai girls, filipinas girls or asian girls in general who want to suck a man's wallet dry. I feel that all woman around the world are the same.
In some sense, isn't that what a marriage is as well? You get married and your wife becomes complacent with her career and demands the husband to work his ass off to support her every needs and desires.
I mean any girl who came from some farming village in China, who probably didn't even have shoes until they were 6 yrs old and were so poor they didn't even have a pot to [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) in, would do whatever it takes to get ahead, whether it be through hustling, tricking, fu*king etc.
So I think it's the same as any other country as it is in China. If you just come and try to romance a girl in a few weeks and marry her, then prepared to be burned. This could happen in any country. But I guess if I were to choose, I'd pick China, because if your girl ends up being the world's biggest *****, at least she will hopefully age better than white chicks- with less sag and less wrinkles.
Just my two cents
AsnDragon
That is the best piece of advice any of the resident experts have given.
Chinese women are not as complex as some may say. "Face" is important to them as well, but through other materialistic means such as clothes, car, jewelry, apartment, etc.. It really depends on her background, as to what level of material "commitment" is required.
One such proof of this is a former client and now friend of mine who not only had to buy an apartment in China, to show long term commitment, but also had to finance a large portion to the gals parents for them to get a new home as well.
If you noticed in my other comment, I stated us guys that were here long-term. But as Csun213 pointed out, there are many fools that think that they are the "Knights in Shining Armour" and can just come over here, whisk the girl away and live Happily Ever After are in for a very rude awakening.
-CPE
Mmlouie: Your general attitude and writing style is very similar to our own beloved Ace Gallant, any relationship?
Taiwan Laowai
02-01-09, 21:31
A good friend of mine did a wife search about 10 years ago. He was about 44 at the time, never married, and had no children. Although he was in good shape and OK looking, he was only 5'3" and looked several years older than his real age. Also, he made just an average living in LA as a freelance accountant (3-6K monthly salary).
I first met him in Colombia. He had been corresponding with a young girl from China (Shenyang), another from the Philippines, and had started dating an attractive 18 year old in Cali from one of the marriage agencies there. Although he had no interest in China (thought it was a backward dirty country) and found the Latin girls more attractive, I encouraged him to give the Chinese girl a chance. I just couldn't imagine a typical 18 year old Colombian sticking it out with him long term. Of course, I realized China was a long shot too. But I spoke with the girl on the phone a couple times, looked at some of her emails, and got a good feeling.
One thing that impresses me about Chinese people in general is many of them seem to have a high tolerance for the long stretches of boredom and monotony required to successfully run a small business or raise a family. In places like Brazil, I always felt pressure to dazzle the girls to keep things exciting and fresh. But in Taiwan and China, most of the girls I dated tended to get attached over time and did not require a lot of entertainment or excitement to be satisfied. And judging by some of the couples I see, many of the Chinese girls are more forgiving of a guy's unattractive appearance or poor physical shape than their western sisters would be. And believe it or not, some of the below average looking guys I see with these hotties (by Asian and western standards) do not have a lot of money. I also believe China and Taiwan still have a lower incidence of divorce and unwed mothers than Latin America or the US. I know the bad stats are all on the rise in China but even today, the all important 'face' principal helps keep these figures lower.
Anyway, fast forward 10 years. My friend has been married to the Shenyang girl for about 7 or 8 years now, they have a 3 year old daughter, and live in LA. She is 25 years his junior, looks even younger, and is very attractive, at least by SoCal standards. She speaks very fluent English now too, albeit with a northern Chinese accent. I stayed with them just a few months ago and got no sense that she would ever think about leaving him. Her parents like him (though she lied to them about his age) and told her from the get-go not to send any money back as they have a decent retirement (father was in the military bureaucracy and mother was a teacher). She does have an edge and can be bitchy sometimes. Also, she is high maintenance time wise and doesn't like him to go out without taking her. But I can tell she is very sincere and really does not have a social life outside of him and his friends. At the end of the day, marriage just comes down to yuan fen. Sometimes, if you think too much and over-analyze, everything becomes impossible. But if you just go with the flow, anything is possible though of course not without risk.
EDITOR'S NOTE: I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
For anyone who thinks they can just come over to China and spend a few weeks getting to know the girl and her family, then marry her hoping for a long term marriage is crazy.
.
The problem is that if you have no great job opportunities in China this is about the only method I know for a Westerner to live together with an attractive Chinese girl.
Actually most of the time I'm really pissed, because I would like to live in China, simply because of the girls there, but see no job opportunities there at the moment, so I'm forced to live in a country where most "women" have hairy legs and a bad attitude, while every time I'm in China I meet attractive non-prostitute women around 18 years old who show great interest in me.
That's why I would like to marry an attractive Chinese chick to ease an eventual relocation to China and then finally hump more of the girls there, not only on vacation once a year or so.
The problem is that if you have no great job opportunities in China this is about the only method I know for a Westerner to live together with an attractive Chinese girl.
Actually most of the time I'm really pissed, because I would like to live in China, simply because of the girls there, but see no job opportunities there at the moment, so I'm forced to live in a country where most "women" have hairy legs and a bad attitude, while every time I'm in China I meet attractive non-prostitute women around 18 years old who show great interest in me.
That's why I would like to marry an attractive Chinese chick to ease an eventual relocation to China and then finally hump more of the girls there, not only on vacation once a year or so.
If you are serious about marrying a Chinese girl, I would recommend you go ahead and get a job as an English teacher. I know the pay is not that great but it would at least give you enough to live on while you are in China. This would also give you enough time to find the right girl.
Most of my friends that find wives in China are either from Taiwan or Los Angeles. The ones from Taiwan have it easy because they will usually fly to Hong Kong and then go across to SZ every Friday evening after work and would then fly back to Taiwan for work on Monday morning. My other friends from Los Angeles would fly to China and stay there for 2 months at a time, then go back to work for 2-3 months then back to China for 2 months, etc. I had one friend who just stayed in China for over a year getting to know his girlfriend (wife now).
Finding a wife (someone to spend the rest of their life with you) is not easy and it would involve a lot of time regardless it is in China or other places. Nothing worth having in life comes easy and without sacrifices. The other thing to remember is not to find someone who is very young, in my opinion any girl under 24-25 is not marriage material since I don't think they are mature enough and don't really know what they want out of life.
Just think about all the young girls 18-20 and ask what they want in their boyfriend, most of they want someone who is handsome and nothing else matters. Then when you ask a more mature girl 21-24 and they want someone who is good looking (not necessary handsome) and have money. Now ask someone who is 25-28, they now don't think looks matter too much anymore, money is not that important either but they should have a good job and treat them right. Then when you ask a girl over 30 and they just want someone who is nice to them. So as girls mature, their demand change.
They other thing about Chinese girls is that family is the most important thing in their life. They will sacrifice everything for family. When I first got to know the Chinese Culture it really surprised me when the wife will cut the last apple in half to give one piece to the child and the other piece to the husband and nothing for herself. When I asked her why she did not cut the apple into 3 pieces so she can have one for herself, her answer was that it never crossed her mind. I have seen this type of small sacrifice over and over again when I worked in Taiwan for 10 years. The thing is that the wife never sees it as a sacrifice but just something normal. So if you treat your Chinese wife right, she will never leave you.
If you are serious about marrying a Chinese girl, I would recommend you go ahead and get a job as an English teacher. I know the pay is not that great but it would at least give you enough to live on while you are in China. This would also give you enough time to find the right girl.
I have thought about this already, some of the problems are:
- English is not my native language
- I will probably graduate in a totally different field Spring of this year and it seems dubious to [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) my career down the drain to work as an English teacher who is neither a qualified teacher nor a native speaker of English
I guess my best hopes are working in Europe for a couple of years, marrying a Chinese woman and then trying to find some foreign company that wants to send someone to China.
Just think about all the young girls 18-20 and ask what they want in their boyfriend, most of they want someone who is handsome and nothing else matters.
I'm not interested in MARRYING the 18-20 yo Chinese girls, rather in
- marrying a Chinese chick who is around 25
- eventually relocating to China, when I or my wife have found a decent job offer
- once I'm firmly located in China get to know the 18-20 yos as girlfriends or "second wives" + contact P2P girls, basically the same types of behaviour I have always conducted during my holidays in China as well, only this time on a more permanent basis
Basically if I have to spend the rest of my life here in the land of hairy, android, transvestite, bitchy "women" I could just as well jump down from a building.
At the same time every time I'm in China I basically have attractive teenage girls crawling all over me and it drives me ABSOLUTELY CRAZY not to be able to be there permanently.
I have heard there are some Westerners who work at some boring jobs in the West half of the year and spend the other half in Thailand actually living a life and that's about how I would describe my situation vis a vis China, only that my stays there only amount to a couple of weeks a year.
Phil1980, you sound like you are still young (under 30), I would go ahead and get a job, work hard for a few years, save up some $ and then come to China for a longer time. When you visit China for your 2 weeks, you might want to look around and see if there are any business opportunity that you can fill. There is nothing like being a success business owner in China. Ask all the regulars that are living in China but travel all over the world.
Just take your time, life would be better for you since you will have a goal (to live in China).
Old Mean Dog
02-02-09, 05:13
I'm not interested in MARRYING the 18-20 yo Chinese girls, rather in
- marrying a Chinese chick who is around 25
- eventually relocating to China, when I or my wife have found a decent job offer
- once I'm firmly located in China get to know the 18-20 yos as girlfriends or "second wives" + contact P2P girls, basically the same types of behaviour I have always conducted during my holidays in China as well, only this time on a more permanent basis.
I personally see some real problems with your game plan:
1. Most Chinese chicks around 25, if they are with a foreigner, want to leave China and travel, not all, but many. As I stated in an earlier post, most gals don't want their laowai husband to become corrupted in China. If they do, you need to give them a lifestyle that is far better than the one they have now.
2. The wife in China does not intend on supporting the husband, especially a 25 year old and if she would even consider this, it would be to a gal probably making under 3,000 RMB a month, so what kind of life is that for you?
3. If this is your primary goal in marrying a Chinese gal, I foresee a very ugly disaster in the future, considering you even get this far with one.
As Csun213 has pointed out, your much better off, staying where you are and seek a job in China from there, or start looking to teach. English is not the only language taught here. Once you have secured this and have settled in China, then start looking for a relationship.
Just my 2 cents.
-CPE
SE Asia Joe
02-02-09, 06:48
Always so negative. Good girls for girlfriends and *****s for fun, don't mix the two.
I hear this shit happens to a lot of Hong Kong fellas also, maybe you know some that got taken for a ride? ;)
-CPE
GOOD GIRLS??? CPat, Cpat, Cpat!! And what is you definition of a "good girl?"
- Is she the one who's already made her money "doing it' and is now back home and reverting to her 'good family girl' status?
- Or the gal slaving away at a restaurant or a shop or a foot massage (maybe, just maybe because she's really not all that good looking??) earning a pittance and maintaining her "pride" by not going out with "clients' - or at least not until a "client' shows up offering her enough money, or prospects or benefits or.. ?
- Or is it the office secretary/clerk all fluffy and nice, waiting, just waiting for a really big - and unsuspecting - fish for her to get her claws on? After all, what better way to establish whether a prospects got the wherewithalls than knowing him through business?
-Or is it the Golf caddy on the prowl for all 'em rich golf playing sportsmen?
- Or the "untouchable KTV DJ - "No, I don't go out with customers, I am a nice girl - and that is why I work as a DJ and not a xiaojie here; but you, you're really different, you're not like the usual KTV guys I see,....."
-Or the real dangerous ones - those who really are extremely beautiful, know it and is bound and determined to use such beauty to its best advantage. She's definitely NOT going to even seem to be "for sale" and will act all decent and proper and high fallutin' and will only occassionally land a big 'un -who'll finance her life for the meanwhilst - until she lands the next bigger 'un. I've met these gals oft times masquerading as Models, actresses, Cosmetics girls, Clerks at up-market men's boutique, Golf/Insurance/Real Estate sales gals etc.
NO, of course not ALL the gals in China are like what I describe above - but let me point out to you that ECONOMICS and how the society is at present, is what is in play in China and also in other poorer countries like LOS, PI, Cambodia, Vietnam etc. MOST Gals in such countries just do not have the necessary skills and/or opportunities to be able to advance in life without the 'assistance' of a guy or another. Their approaches may be different, their targets vary, their aspirations too - but one would really be a fool to NOT recognize the truth of how things are in China. What - they're gonna fall madly in love with you because you are soooo good looking or your schlong is sooo long or that you make love so skillfully?? And then eat ....WHAT??
Oh yeah, sure, there ARE gals who do fall in love with deadbeats - and then end up getting pimped out by them. But a true "good gal" without any secret agenda is a rare phenomena - and again, let me emphasize this - ESPECIALLY for a foreigner. The Western Concept of "falling in Love' as depicted in the movies is rather foreign to the Chinese as they've all grown up seeing how traditional marriages had been. Its not that long ago that work units would actually arrange marriages for the young - never mind that even nowadays, parents are still on the look-out for suitable mates for their Children - and base such NOT on love or other such silly notions, but on materialistic considerations. You even talk about $$ when it comes to Love and marriage in the West - and you are consigned to being branded as an Ogre. In China - it's openly discussed... FIRST!
And no, I certainly am not being negative - am just a realist. And the sooner that a foreign monger assess the situation as it really is, then the sooner he will be able to appreciate - and actually like - how life is in China. All the nuances, all the subtleties, all the beauty - without having to end up bewildered, heart broken....and broke!!
Just IMHO
SEAJ
1. Most Chinese chicks around 25, if they are with a foreigner, want to leave China
Many also want to be close to their parents and want the guy to move to China, because they don't speak foreign languages well etc.
2. The wife in China does not intend on supporting the husband, especially a 25 year old and if she would even consider this, it would be to a gal probably making under 3,000 RMB a month, so what kind of life is that for you?
I never said she should support me financially, she could perhaps be of support in finding a job and providing some local connections, greasing some palms, the types of guanxi a foreigner can't aquire on his own so easily. As far as I know if you're married to a Chinese girl as a European it's also very easy to get a long-term China visa.
Phil1980, depending on the girl you meet. The richer the girl's family are, the more likely she would want you to move to China.
I have a friend who married a well to do girl in Shenzhen, one of the condition for marriage was that she will move to Los Angeles with him until she gets a green card (3-5 years) and as soon as she does get her green card, then he would have to come to China where her family will set him up with his own business. They will invest in his business and pay all the expenses until the business starts to make money.
The wealthy Chinese can live a better life in China than they can in the U.S. They have 2 house keeper, a Gardner plus a driver and pays them less than US$1000 per month.
So if you are lucky enough to meet a well to do girl then her family will probably set you up in business in China rather than lose their daughter to a foreign country where they might see her once every couple of years.
SE Asia Joe
02-02-09, 10:17
Phil1980, you sound like you are still young (under 30), I would go ahead and get a job, work hard for a few years, save up some $ and then come to China for a longer time. When you visit China for your 2 weeks, you might want to look around and see if there are any business opportunity that you can fill. There is nothing like being a success business owner in China. Ask all the regulars that are living in China but travel all over the world.
Just take your time, life would be better for you since you will have a goal (to live in China).
Phil - I believe that what Csun wrote is most probably the best advise for you.
From what I've seen you write, it does seem that you really do not have a good grounding in anything but the fact that you like Chinese girls. Well, liking something is great but it cannot be the over riding factor in all your decisions - and which I see you seem to be doing. Trying to fit your job, your profession, even where you eventually live at - only on the basis of loving Chinese Pussy. What kid of decision making process is THAT??!!
You've gotta establish yourself as a PERSON before you should even consider what you'd enjoy doing. Unfortunately, that is how things are in this world. The way you're doing it - and this is only in my very humble opinion - you're turning the process backwards and will only lead to major disappointments in your life - if not actual disaster.
"10 strokes in a word and you've not even brushed down a dot" - a transliteration of a popular Chinese saying which means that you've really gone way way too far ahead - without even considering the practical steps needed to get where you wanna be at. And the practical steps is that - again - YOU MUST ESTABLISH YOURSELF AS A PERSON FIRST.
Hope I'm not causing you any offense - and it certainly is never meant to be so - but I can only see a life of meaningless drifting for you if you continue to pursue your goals the way you're going about it right now.
Peace
SEAJ
From what I've seen you write, it does seem that you really do not have a good grounding in anything but the fact that you like Chinese girls. Well, liking something is great but it cannot be the over riding factor in all your decisions - and which I see you seem to be doing. Trying to fit your job, your profession, even where you eventually live at - only on the basis of loving Chinese Pussy. What kid of decision making process is THAT??!!
Call it a severe case of Yellow Fever or Asian fetish or Asiaphilia (especially for Chinese) or a mental disease, but I've had it since I was 16. Now, over 10 years later I've been to China roughly a dozen times by myself (and I'm not even 30) for the sole purpose of Chinese women!
These trips aren't even really fun, since I'm not rich I stay in really rundown places, sit on 24 hour train rides surrounded by smelly peasants etc. They also cost me lots of money. And all that for my fetish.
PS: I even jerk off only to Asian porn.
And that is why everything (job, place of living) has to be subordinated to this one underriding current in me.
Old Mean Dog
02-02-09, 11:41
GOOD GIRLS??? CPat, Cpat, Cpat!! And what is you definition of a "good girl?"
Joe, I'm hearing ya and I know you been around longer than me. But the problem with your examples are:
Playboy Lifestyle and Mongering
This is not conducive to a good relationship period(Well, unless your Huge Heffner), so if that is the life someone wants, then forget about trying to have a serious relationship for the time being.
If one wants a to try and establish a serious relationship, then he must give up or at least cut WAY back on this.
Anyway, I guess we don't have to see eye-to-eye on everything.
Regards
-CPE
Taiwan Laowai
02-02-09, 12:23
For anyone who thinks they can just come over to China and spend a few weeks getting to know the girl and her family, then marry her hoping for a long term marriage is crazy.Its not impossible.
A good friend of mine did a wife search about 10 years ago. He was about 44 at the time, never married, and had no children. Although he was in good shape and OK looking, he was only 5'3" and looked several years older than his real age. Also, he made just an average living in LA as a freelance accountant (3-6K monthly salary).
I first met him in Colombia. He had been corresponding with a young girl from China (Shenyang), another from the Philippines, and had started dating an attractive 18 year old in Cali from one of the marriage agencies there. Although he had no interest in China (thought it was a backward dirty country) and found the Latin girls more attractive, I encouraged him to give the Chinese girl a chance. I just couldn't imagine a typical 18 year old Colombian sticking it out with him long term. Of course, I realized China was a long shot too. But I spoke with the girl on the phone a couple times, looked at some of her emails, and got a good feeling.
One thing that impresses me about Chinese people in general is many of them seem to have a high tolerance for the long stretches of boredom and monotony required to successfully run a small business or raise a family. In places like Brazil, I always felt pressure to dazzle the girls to keep things exciting and fresh. But in Taiwan and China, most of the girls I dated tended to get attached over time and did not require a lot of entertainment or excitement to be satisfied. And judging by some of the couples I see, many of the Chinese girls are more forgiving of a guy's unattractive appearance or poor physical shape than their western sisters would be. And believe it or not, some of the below average looking guys I see with these hotties (by Asian and western standards) do not have a lot of money. I also believe China and Taiwan still have a lower incidence of divorce and unwed mothers than Latin America or the US. I know the bad stats are all on the rise in China but even today, the all important 'face' principal helps keep these figures lower.
Anyway, fast forward 10 years. My friend has been married to the Shenyang girl for about 7 or 8 years now, they have a 3 year old daughter, and live in LA. She is 25 years his junior, looks even younger, and is very attractive, at least by SoCal standards. She speaks very fluent English now too, albeit with a northern Chinese accent. I stayed with them just a few months ago and got no sense that she would ever think about leaving him. Her parents like him (though she lied to them about his age) and told her from the get-go not to send any money back as they have a decent retirement (father was in the military bureaucracy and mother was a teacher). She does have an edge and can be bitchy sometimes. Also, she is high maintenance time wise and doesn't like him to go out without taking her. But I can tell she is very sincere and really does not have a social life outside of him and his friends. At the end of the day, marriage just comes down to yuan fen. Sometimes, if you think too much and over-analyze, everything becomes impossible. But if you just go with the flow, anything is possible though of course not without risk.
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A true experience; a few years back during one of my so cal business trip, I hooked up with one of the sale manager of a company I associate with. She was a recent immigrant China woman from shanghai with ok english ability. She was an attractive lady and we have a little chemistry from the get go. We end up having dinners, drinks, laughs and such, she told me that she had a bf back in China and she did not wanted anything serious. Perfect!
She would fly up occasionally and I would fly down to see her every so often. Anyway, I remember one occasion after the deed she started to get serious and begin to chat about what she is looking for in life. Well, the conversation stalled very quickly since I never mix business with pleasure. To make a long story short; she made a strong suggestion and tell me to introduce her to some rich laowei friends to her. She would then make one of them fall in love with her and marry her, she would in turn take all his money from him. While in the meantime, we could maintain our fuc* buddy status and we will split the money that she stole in half. Well, that relationship did not continue much longer after that conversation.
I accidentally ran into her sometime last year, we went out for tea and conversation to catch up. Well, guess what? Need I say? Got married, got divorced within 2 years. Now she own a beauty shop in so cal so guess where she got her money from?
Just wanted to share my experience with you all, thats all.
Intelligent viewpoint SEAJ, but I would like to present the opposite, just for the sake of friendly discussion.
What is wrong with just picking up and moving to China for a couple years to teach English or to do some other low paying job? Perhaps you can learn Chinese during that time and then go back to your country with a new skill set. Also, can't you discover more opportunities in China once you are living there?
If Phil is so obsessed and determined that China is his version of happiness, why not just try it for a while? At least at Phil's age he can be forgiven for any mistakes he makes. Once he gets 10-20 years older, it will become even more difficult to find a way to move there, but believe me, the intensity and desire will only have increased.
Boss
Phil - I believe that what Csun wrote is most probably the best advise for you.
From what I've seen you write, it does seem that you really do not have a good grounding in anything but the fact that you like Chinese girls. Well, liking something is great but it cannot be the over riding factor in all your decisions - and which I see you seem to be doing. Trying to fit your job, your profession, even where you eventually live at - only on the basis of loving Chinese Pussy. What kid of decision making process is THAT??!!
You've gotta establish yourself as a PERSON before you should even consider what you'd enjoy doing. Unfortunately, that is how things are in this world. The way you're doing it - and this is only in my very humble opinion - you're turning the process backwards and will only lead to major disappointments in your life - if not actual disaster.
"10 strokes in a word and you've not even brushed down a dot" - a transliteration of a popular Chinese saying which means that you've really gone way way too far ahead - without even considering the practical steps needed to get where you wanna be at. And the practical steps is that - again - YOU MUST ESTABLISH YOURSELF AS A PERSON FIRST.
Hope I'm not causing you any offense - and it certainly is never meant to be so - but I can only see a life of meaningless drifting for you if you continue to pursue your goals the way you're going about it right now.
Peace
SEAJ
SE Asia Joe
02-03-09, 04:15
Joe, I'm hearing ya and I know you been around longer than me. But the problem with your examples are:
Playboy Lifestyle and Mongering
This is not conducive to a good relationship period(Well, unless your Huge Heffner), so if that is the life someone wants, then forget about trying to have a serious relationship for the time being.
If one wants a to try and establish a serious relationship, then he must give up or at least cut WAY back on this.
Anyway, I guess we don't have to see eye-to-eye on everything.
Regards
-CPE
Cpat - the kind of guys you write about - the non-playboy/non-mongering types - are precisely the kind of guys who are going to get into deep doo-doo unless they really have a pretty good idea about the realities in China.
These guys come over - their heads full of the popular stereotypes of Chinese Women being docile, obedient, ready to loyally devote their whole life to building up a a family and their future with their hubby, refined ladies in the living room and total *****s in the bedroom with their oriental sex techniques - promptly falls in love with one of our porcelain skinned beauties - good or bad gal, whatever that means - and Ciao Ciao Bambino!! Game over!
The mongers do not require any warnings - they come over, know what they want and Wham Bam Thank you 'Mam! Actually for these guys, we instead need to educate our ladies about them. Too many of these either BSD's flashing around their $$'s or GBP or whatever in China (whilst back at home they're nothing more than a truck driver or a clerk or ..), promising "a Future" whilst all they want to do is just to get into their pants - and worse, the penniless mongers out to con, cajole, charm their way into their panties again. Yeah, event though I do believe that most gals in China are pretty street-wise, a lot of them are also quite naive and innocent - especially to the ways of an experiwenced monger.
And you're right - we certainly don't need to agree on everything!! Makes life more interesting I say. Besides which, if we agree on the same thing, I'll only go for the same gals you'd go for - and hell, you're way bigger than I and I'd always end up losing the gals of my dreams to you!!
Ciao
SEAJ
SE Asia Joe
02-03-09, 04:32
Intelligent viewpoint SEAJ, but I would like to present the opposite, just for the sake of friendly discussion.
What is wrong with just picking up and moving to China for a couple years to teach English or to do some other low paying job? Perhaps you can learn Chinese during that time and then go back to your country with a new skill set. Also, can't you discover more opportunities in China once you are living there?
If Phil is so obsessed and determined that China is his version of happiness, why not just try it for a while? At least at Phil's age he can be forgiven for any mistakes he makes. Once he gets 10-20 years older, it will become even more difficult to find a way to move there, but believe me, the intensity and desire will only have increased.
Boss
A very valid view point and one that could be adopted succesfully.
The only problem with this is that the barrier to success gets progressively higher placed as one advances in age and experience. Kids in grade school - they also have "barriers"/need to pass a test or another? Well, I always advise kids that if they had excelled in such a tests, to savour the euphoria felt at such success (pretty well close to some drug induced "high?"), analyze the key ingredients to such and use it again and again when faced with other barriers. I advise them to get "Hooked" on the euphoria associated with the greater and greater successes that they SHOULD achieve their whole life, following this prescription.
This is important for as we grow older, tests, responsibilities, challenges - Barriers - gets progressively higher. i.e. it's a no-brainer to pass a first grade exam - but what the hell do we do with the latest financial turmoil - especially when you've just lost your job etc etc. One needs to make choices and decisions all the time and unless you've got experience in succesfully tackling such, you ain't gonna be able to base your decision making on anything solid.
The life you suggest for Phil COULD work for him, but I would say that it would just box him in mediocrity - or worse inferiority. He would be accustomed to achieve such mediocrity at a stage of his life when he really needs to excell.
Just IMHO - and like I said to Cpat, I appreciate differing opinions as it forces me to learn. Thanks
SEAJ
SE Asia Joe
02-03-09, 04:51
call it a severe case of yellow fever or asian fetish or asiaphilia (especially for chinese) or a mental disease, but i've had it since i was 16. now, over 10 years later i've been to china roughly a dozen times by myself (and i'm not even 30) for the sole purpose of chinese women!
these trips aren't even really fun, since i'm not rich i stay in really rundown places, sit on 24 hour train rides surrounded by smelly peasants etc. they also cost me lots of money. and all that for my fetish.
ps: i even jerk off only to asian porn.
and that is why everything (job, place of living) has to be subordinated to this one underriding current in me.
oh jeez - now you're gonna make me not only look like an old geezer, but to also sound like an old geezer. oh what the hell....
phil - please see what i've written to boss and then ask yourself - are you really going to be satisfied with mediocrity all your life? do you really enjoy having to only partake of the lowest strata of chinese womenwhood - as per your posts in the "cheap sex in china" threads. don't you ever wish you could actually ravish some of the ladies you jerk off to? how would you handle the constant looks of disdain and jeering from your peers as well as the gals you're trying to do? all because you just ain't got what it takes to be considered somebody desireable?
come to think of it, have you discussed your "plans" with anybody older and more experienced than you? your dad, a loving uncle or even somebody you look up to? what would they think of such plans? have any of these guys actually given you their approval and blessings? (and if so, i would think you should be very sorely disappointed in them!). and have you imagined your being asked by your own future progeny to go along with such a plan - and if you would really do so?
you gotta be honest to yourself and go along with what is right. let me tell you, doing things the right way is very often not the easiest thing to do - but it is the right thing. there's no 2 ways about it.
just imho and hope i've not opened up any wounds or cause any offense - but you've come on the boards asking for advise - and that is what i'm offering.
seaj
SE Asia Joe
02-03-09, 04:56
A true experience; a few years back during one of my so cal business trip, I hooked up with one of the sale manager of a company I associate with. She was a recent immigrant China woman from shanghai with ok english ability. She was an attractive lady and we have a little chemistry from the get go. We end up having dinners, drinks, laughs and such, she told me that she had a bf back in China and she did not wanted anything serious. Perfect!
She would fly up occasionally and I would fly down to see her every so often. Anyway, I remember one occasion after the deed she started to get serious and begin to chat about what she is looking for in life. Well, the conversation stalled very quickly since I never mix business with pleasure. To make a long story short; she made a strong suggestion and tell me to introduce her to some rich laowei friends to her. She would then make one of them fall in love with her and marry her, she would in turn take all his money from him. While in the meantime, we could maintain our fuc* buddy status and we will split the money that she stole in half. Well, that relationship did not continue much longer after that conversation.
I accidentally ran into her sometime last year, we went out for tea and conversation to catch up. Well, guess what? Need I say? Got married, got divorced within 2 years. Now she own a beauty shop in so cal so guess where she got her money from?
Just wanted to share my experience with you all, thats all.
A much more typical Chinese woman's modus operandi and mind set.
SEAJ
SE Asia Joe
02-03-09, 05:13
Its not impossible.
A good friend of mine did a wife search about 10 years ago. He was about 44 at the time, never married, and had no children. Although he was in good shape and OK looking, he was only 5'3" and looked several years older than his real age. Also, he made just an average living in LA as a freelance accountant (3-6K monthly salary).
Anyway, fast forward 10 years. My friend has been married to the Shenyang girl for about 7 or 8 years now, they have a 3 year old daughter, and live in LA. She is 25 years his junior, looks even younger, and is very attractive, at least by SoCal standards. She speaks very fluent English now too, ........... She does have an edge and can be bitchy sometimes. Also, she is high maintenance time wise and doesn't like him to go out without taking her. But I can tell she is very sincere and really does not have a social life outside of him and his friends. At the end of the day, marriage just comes down to yuan fen. Sometimes, if you think too much and over-analyze, everything becomes impossible. But if you just go with the flow, anything is possible though of course not without risk.
OK - let me try to paint a picture in my mind on this:
A nerdy, older looking, short 54 year old Laowai accountant working his ass off bringing back $3-6K a month to a glamorous White skinned 29 YO Northern Chinese (she should be tall!) who likes to spend lots of money living in Southern California where the streets of Monterey Park, Beverly Hills, Palos Verde, Newport Beach etc are filled with Cadillacs, Bentleys and Mercedeses.
Million dollar homes, sun-tanned muscle-ripping bodies, conspicuous consumption, Sex and the City morality, LV Gucci Armani even in department stores..... Hmmm.... wonder how this all is affecting them? And you say she can be a bit bitchy sometimes?
NOT saying that what you relayed is improbable - not at all - as miracles DO happen - but just wondering how long all this is gonna last? When her green card can be traded for a US passport? When she figures she's gotten all that she can from him? When she finds a good job herself? When some dirty old guy - perhaps a Chinese from Monterey Park - offers a "better deal? When???
Sorry for being a bit flippant and/or perhaps disrespectful in what I am writing - but I must point out that the story of your budy is definitely NOT what usually happens - and that it would be a great big mistake for anybody here to get all dreamy-eyed, thinking that the same is gonna be his "future" - and hop on a plane to out here to try his luck.
SEAJ
Ps. A pretty good friend of mine (a bit old, a bit dirty too, I guess) in Monterey park DOES keep a gal - but he makes sure she does NOT have a US passport - although he's been keeping her for the past 15 years!!
A much more typical Chinese woman's modus operandi and mind set.
SEAJYeah! For every single successful story you hear.
There are tens if not hundreds of horrid stories that you did not get to hear.
A pretty good friend of mine (a bit old, a bit dirty too, I guess) in Monterey park DOES keep a gal - but he makes sure she does NOT have a US passport - although he's been keeping her for the past 15 years!!Pretty good point! As long as you are aware of what you buying and am totally prepare for the consequences. Remind me of an old Chinese saying that goes something like "treat your wife like a coat, if it does not fit. Find another one to wear". One of my buddy uses that to an extreme; he goes back and find the youngest and best looking girl from a small town knowing that she will leave him after the green card. When it happens, he goes back again after that and get another one. I cannot even keep up with all his ex-wives. He figures that he get a newer model every 3-4 years, to him that is a good deal.
Like I said, as long as you know what you are getting yourself into. More power to you!
Its A Secret
02-03-09, 10:58
You guys claim you can't make decent money as an English teacher, but what defines decent money exactly? I have found 1400 square foot apartments, completely furnished with everything included, for 1400 RMB a month. Thats 200$ US. Considering you make 100 RMB per hour as a teacher on average, some making up to 200 DOE, if you worked 30 hours a week thats 12, 000 RMB + anything you made doing teaching on the side.
Frankly I'm under the impression that the majority of girls over there are simply nice, honest, if a bit naive and innocent. The problem I am having, and maybe it's just my state, but the girls here are spoiled and perhaps over-empowered by feminist crap they are force fed as of late. Honestly, to any of you guys who are 40-60 years old, being a young guy in America *currently* is a whole new ball game. I routinely see guys who are a 7 to an 8 on the looks scale with girls who are obese or maybe a 4. Alot of my friends, who are decent-looking dudes, find it hard to find girlfriends but at the same time, fairly nasty female friends / aquaintences of mine routinely sleep around with guys and NEVER have a problem finding dates.
You guys claim you can't make decent money as an English teacher, but what defines decent money exactly? I have found 1400 square foot apartments, completely furnished with everything included, for 1400 RMB a month. Thats 200$ US. Considering you make 100 RMB per hour as a teacher on average, some making up to 200 DOE, if you worked 30 hours a week thats 12, 000 RMB + anything you made doing teaching on the side.Man, where is this 1400 rmb furnished apartment at? I like to get my hands on that one? Where in China exactly are they paying workers by the hour?
Taiwan Laowai
02-03-09, 19:53
Thanks for commenting on my post SE Asia Joe. The case is definitely true. But let me clarify a few points I made which may have caused some misunderstanding:
1. Guy is not nerdy, he's tanned, decent looking, and in great shape. But he is very short and looks at least his age. I would say the girl is around a 7 looks wise by SoCal standards and looks younger than her age.
2. Not all northern gals are tall. She's only 158 cm. When I visited northern cities such as Harbin and Changchun, the people, on average, were noticeably taller than the ones I saw in other cities I spent time in such as Chengdu or Guangdong. But there were still plenty of under 160 cm girls in the north. I pay attention to this cus I like the very tall ones.
3. By high maintenance, I meant time wise. She doesn't spend much money but rather conserves for the sake of their daughter's school, etc.
4. I know what you mean about the SoCal lifestyle and of course she sees all this but really has no direct connection to it. She is quite dependent on her husband socially and does not really seem motivated go out and make friends. Is she disappointed that my friend is not richer? I’m sure she is. But her attitude seems to be, that’s my luck, wo jiu neng ren ming.
5. She has been a US passport holder for over a year now.
6. My Taiwanese girlfriend has also spent time with her on our visits to the US and of course they talk a lot. She thinks the girl is OK too. By the way, her bitchy / edgy side was imported from China. This didn’t get any worse after he brought her to the States.
7. Will she change eventually and bolt? Perhaps. But maybe that's not so bad. My friend enjoyed the girl’s youngest years and got what he wanted most. A child. He also doesn’t have significant assets to worry about loosing (a good thing or bad thing depending on how you look at it).
OK - let me try to paint a picture in my mind on this:
A nerdy, older looking, short 54 year old Laowai accountant working his ass off bringing back $3-6K a month to a glamorous White skinned 29 YO Northern Chinese (she should be tall!) who likes to spend lots of money living in Southern California where the streets of Monterey Park, Beverly Hills, Palos Verde, Newport Beach etc are filled with Cadillacs, Bentleys and Mercedeses.
Million dollar homes, sun-tanned muscle-ripping bodies, conspicuous consumption, Sex and the City morality, LV Gucci Armani even in department stores..... Hmmm.... wonder how this all is affecting them? And you say she can be a bit bitchy sometimes?
NOT saying that what you relayed is improbable - not at all - as miracles DO happen - but just wondering how long all this is gonna last? When her green card can be traded for a US passport? When she figures she's gotten all that she can from him? When she finds a good job herself? When some dirty old guy - perhaps a Chinese from Monterey Park - offers a "better deal? When???
Sorry for being a bit flippant and/or perhaps disrespectful in what I am writing - but I must point out that the story of your budy is definitely NOT what usually happens - and that it would be a great big mistake for anybody here to get all dreamy-eyed, thinking that the same is gonna be his "future" - and hop on a plane to out here to try his luck.
SEAJ
Ps. A pretty good friend of mine (a bit old, a bit dirty too, I guess) in Monterey park DOES keep a gal - but he makes sure she does NOT have a US passport - although he's been keeping her for the past 15 years!!
Pretty good point! As long as you are aware of what you buying and am totally prepare for the consequences. Remind me of an old Chinese saying that goes something like "treat your wife like a coat, if it does not fit. Find another one to wear". One of my buddy uses that to an extreme; he goes back and find the youngest and best looking girl from a small town knowing that she will leave him after the green card. When it happens, he goes back again after that and get another one. I cannot even keep up with all his ex-wives. He figures that he get a newer model every 3-4 years, to him that is a good deal.
Like I said, as long as you know what you are getting yourself into. More power to you!
This is a great idea however the downside is that when she leaves, she take a part of your money with her (at least here in the US). So by the 3rd wife, he won't have enough money to attract a 4th wife.
You guys claim you can't make decent money as an English teacher, but what defines decent money exactly? I have found 1400 square foot apartments, completely furnished with everything included, for 1400 RMB a month. Thats 200$ US. Considering you make 100 RMB per hour as a teacher on average, some making up to 200 DOE, if you worked 30 hours a week thats 12, 000 RMB + anything you made doing teaching on the side.
The 12000rmb per month is a correct amount and it was not by the hour. I was offered that to teach English in Shenzhen however it was teaching to mostly business men and not children. A lot of Chinese business men are in need for English since they are dealing with US.
Taiwan Laowai
02-03-09, 21:03
In 2005, I became good friends with a girl in Changchun. 26 yrs. Old, 174 cm, sold GPS systems to taxi companies and spoke decent English. Although she had some acne, she was beautiful. We stuck some of her photos up on Hot or Not (back when it gave accurate ratings) and each one scored at least 9. 5.
She had dated an older married expat (wife back home) for the previous 3 years who visited occasionally from Shanghai but finally broke it off with him. She had a great sense of humor, seemed fascinated by American culture and wanted to find a serious boyfriend who she could have a future with. So I helper her craft a profile for Asia Friend Finder. Of course she got dozens of responses. I watched her go through them without any reaction until she saw one which just made her laugh out loud. The guy had several photos. In the main one, he was dressed like Santa and in another one, he was with Mickey Mouse at Disney, etc. The guy was just a regular looking, somewhat overweight 42 year old but she just thought he was so cute and adorable. Also, he lived in Minnesota which she liked for the climate. So she only responded to him.
He moved fast on her and within a few months, had her over there on a fiance visa. She wrote a couple emails telling me that he was quite possessive and controlling which scared her a bit. But she decided to go forward and the last I heard from her was through a Christmas email in 2007 with some photos of her and their 3 month old baby. She looked and sounded very happy. I hope doesn't get corrupted by life in the States.
Sorry for being a bit flippant and/or perhaps disrespectful in what I am writing - but I must point out that the story of your budy is definitely NOT what usually happens - and that it would be a great big mistake for anybody here to get all dreamy-eyed, thinking that the same is gonna be his "future" - and hop on a plane to out here to try his luck.
SEAJ
This is a great idea however the downside is that when she leaves, she take a part of your money with her (at least here in the US). So by the 3rd wife, he won't have enough money to attract a 4th wife.Dude, you are so wrong! Depends on how you handle your money, got to know how to work the system. I am sure that you know that most Chinese hide their money from their wives and vice verse. They get pay by cash and they don't pay much taxes, there is nothing to take when you don't even have much money in the bank account. You must be kidding, right?
There are no down side for him, he still have more money than you and I put together and he is on his 4th wifey already. i guess his thinking is even if he pays, it would not amount to much since ca divorce law apply only for the time that they are together and three years would not amount to that much if you are hiding everything. dude, you cant tell your wife everything!!!
This is a great idea however the downside is that when she leaves, she take a part of your money with her (at least here in the US). So by the 3rd wife, he won't have enough money to attract a 4th wife.Man, you must tell your wifey everything and hand over your paycheck too? if you carefully read my posting, he already know the score and he is prepared for it so he knows how to handle it. You think that he will tell his wife what he got hiding and where? LOL
SE Asia Joe
02-04-09, 05:49
You guys claim you can't make decent money as an English teacher, but what defines decent money exactly? I have found 1400 square foot apartments, completely furnished with everything included, for 1400 RMB a month. Thats 200$ US. Considering you make 100 RMB per hour as a teacher on average, some making up to 200 DOE, if you worked 30 hours a week thats 12, 000 RMB + anything you made doing teaching on the side.
Frankly I'm under the impression that the majority of girls over there are simply nice, honest, if a bit naive and innocent. The problem I am having, and maybe it's just my state, but the girls here are spoiled and perhaps over-empowered by feminist crap they are force fed as of late. Honestly, to any of you guys who are 40-60 years old, being a young guy in America *currently* is a whole new ball game. I routinely see guys who are a 7 to an 8 on the looks scale with girls who are obese or maybe a 4. Alot of my friends, who are decent-looking dudes, find it hard to find girlfriends but at the same time, fairly nasty female friends / aquaintences of mine routinely sleep around with guys and NEVER have a problem finding dates.
This is precisely what I'm talking about!!
I really wonder how many guys from the "West" reads the China Threads and come up with the conclusion "........I'm under the impression that the majority of girls over there are simply nice, honest, if a bit naive and innocent..........." Ohimigawd!!
And then comes over here all wide -eyed and expectant....only to find out the real truth of the matter. And let me tell you, it really is NOT easy to get to the real truth as the exotic and enchanting outward appearance of Chinese gals is just too beguiling to the Western eye.
And this figuring out that one can live like a king on RMB 12,000/month (hell, of course you can, when average salaries for the great majority of Chinese is only approximately 1K/month!) - only to find out that one can easily blow all that in a few days. A furrener on RMB 12,000/month is only gonna be able to bottom feed - and certainly not going to be able to live anywhere close to his dreams. And certainly will NOT be able to enjoy 90% of the things we routinely talk about here!
SEAJ
SE Asia Joe
02-04-09, 05:51
This is a great idea however the downside is that when she leaves, she take a part of your money with her (at least here in the US). So by the 3rd wife, he won't have enough money to attract a 4th wife.
Sooooo easy to get them to agree to anything when starting.
.......including Pre-nups!
SEAJ
Man, you must be telling your wife everything. Read my posting, he know the score and he is prepared for it. You think that he will tell his wife what he got hiding? LOLAny man that tells his signif. other 100% of everything is a fool. Im married for almost 30years and from day one, i have always have a private account put away just in case. Of course, it is all after tax money (just incase there is some taxman lurking).
SE Asia Joe
02-04-09, 07:08
In 2005, I became good friends with a girl in Changchun. 26 yrs. Old, 174 cm, sold GPS systems to taxi companies and spoke decent English. Although she had some acne, she was beautiful. We stuck some of her photos up on Hot or Not (back when it gave accurate ratings) and each one scored at least 9. 5.
She had dated an older married expat (wife back home) for the previous 3 years who visited occasionally from Shanghai but finally broke it off with him. She had a great sense of humor, seemed fascinated by American culture and wanted to find a serious boyfriend who she could have a future with. So I helper her craft a profile for Asia Friend Finder. Of course she got dozens of responses. I watched her go through them without any reaction until she saw one which just made her laugh out loud. The guy had several photos. In the main one, he was dressed like Santa and in another one, he was with Mickey Mouse at Disney, etc. The guy was just a regular looking, somewhat overweight 42 year old but she just thought he was so cute and adorable. Also, he lived in Minnesota which she liked for the climate. So she only responded to him.
He moved fast on her and within a few months, had her over there on a fiance visa. She wrote a couple emails telling me that he was quite possessive and controlling which scared her a bit. But she decided to go forward and the last I heard from her was through a Christmas email in 2007 with some photos of her and their 3 month old baby. She looked and sounded very happy. I hope doesn't get corrupted by life in the States.
HAH!!! You've been un-masked Santa!! If you've got a 9.5 at home - what are you doing still mongering in CP and LOS?! Get you ass back to Minnesota (or is it cincinatti) PRONTO!!
And Taiwan laowai - what's with all these "feel Good" stories that you seem to always be coming accross?? You ever do these gals or are you always just the good Ole helpful guy who gets our maidens hitched off to Dirty Old Men in the land of Milk and Honey?
And from what you described - this must be a marriage made in heaven!
I mean, the fat slob's gotta dress up in a Santa suit and establish his bona-fides by posing with Mickey Mouse to attract gals? And she was kept by another old geezer as an Er Lai for 3 years (Hey Eaglestar - was that YOU??!!) - and her Santa is a possessive and controlling farmer in the middle of....nowhere??!! And lots of American culture in dem dar lakes!! Yup - its a marriage made in heaven...TRULY!!
Oooopps..... Now I've gone and done it haven't I??!! And really do need to apologize to you Laowai. Sorry sorry sorry - administer the 100 lashes with a wet noodle to me please!
SEAJ
SE Asia Joe
02-04-09, 07:20
Thanks for commenting on my post SE Asia Joe. The case is definitely true. But let me clarify a few points I made which may have caused some misunderstanding:
Hey Taiwan Laowai - like I said, I apologize for being flippant.... and even condescending ... in my posting.
By the way, are your posts delayed being put up on the thread as you're only a regular member? I've been writing without seeing some of your delayed posts.
I have no doubt that there ARE many good stories of US/China liaisons - but am also quite sure that for every good story, there must be tons of disasters. And that is all I wanted to point out - to make sure that people reading our pages do understand this, to give balance, to forewarn, to.......
Regards
SEAJ
1. Guy is not nerdy, he's tanned, decent looking, and in great shape. But he is very short and looks at least his age.Thats odd! China girls are not into guys that are tanned. Chinese think tanned guys are usually the lower working class folks, the laborer type. Don't think they are into short or bald either.
Sooooo easy to get them to agree to anything when starting.
.......including Pre-nups!
SEAJ
Here in California, we have a no fault state so she will get a good part of my money. Do a google check on Pre-nups and you will see how many are broken during a divorce. I don't plan on marrying but I do have a friend who is a lawyer and I did ask him about pre-nups. The truth is that a good lawyer can break it. If she does not have her own lawyer when she signs it then it is even easier to break it.
I don't have any skin in this but just want guys to know what they are getting into when they do get a divorce. How many of you or your friends that came out even or ahead after a divorce?
Man, you must tell your wifey everything and hand over your paycheck too? if you carefully read my posting, he already know the score and he is prepared for it so he knows how to handle it. You think that he will tell his wife what he got hiding and where? LOL
You don't think a good lawyer can hire someone to find what you are worth? Look into your tax return?
If it was that easy to hide money then we wouldn't be paying the taxes that we do now.
Dude, you are so wrong! Depends on how you handle your money, got to know how to work the system. I am sure that you know that most Chinese hide their money from their wives and vice verse. They get pay by cash and they don't pay much taxes, there is nothing to take when you don't even have much money in the bank account. You must be kidding, right?
There are no down side for him, he still have more money than you and I put together and he is on his 4th wifey already. i guess his thinking is even if he pays, it would not amount to much since ca divorce law apply only for the time that they are together and three years would not amount to that much if you are hiding everything. dude, you cant tell your wife everything!!!
I must assume that your friend does not live in the U.S. I can see him hiding money in China or in a foreign country however I think he will have a hard time hiding in the U.S. since we don't get paid in cash.
I must assume that your friend does not live in the U.S. I can see him hiding money in China or in a foreign country however I think he will have a hard time hiding in the U.S. since we don't get paid in cash.Did you read the posting at all? Where is ca? My friend, where have you been? You don't have much china friends here? I'm sorry, I don't think you have much interaction with people from china here if you think most of them get pay by normal payroll and paid their taxes.
SE Asia Joe
02-04-09, 08:46
Here in California, we have a no fault state so she will get a good part of my money. Do a google check on Pre-nups and you will see how many are broken during a divorce. I don't plan on marrying but I do have a friend who is a lawyer and I did ask him about pre-nups. The truth is that a good lawyer can break it. If she does not have her own lawyer when she signs it then it is even easier to break it.
I don't have any skin in this but just want guys to know what they are getting into when they do get a divorce. How many of you or your friends that came out even or ahead after a divorce?
Ahhh sooo.... you're most probably right about pre-nups. Guess the better way then would be just to keep 'em as "er lais!" Laws againts bigamy/polygamy should then protect us all!
On Taxes and "undocumented funds" etc - it quite common knowledge that just about all chinese restaurants in California always have two sets of books - one to record credit card receipt and some smaller cash transactions and another one to record all larger cash transactions.
Payrolls also has two sets of records - one to pay a few hours a week which is taxable and another record to pay in cash for more hours which is non-taxable to the employee - AND also absolves the employer from Unemployement insurance, S/S, workman's com etc etc. PLus there are also the undocumented workers (Chinese AND Mexicans!!) who insists on all cash payment! Such double record keeping is also pretty well de rigeur in lots of other types of Chinese business in California. Never mind the out and out illegal businesses like Drugs, underground casinos, arms/cigarette smuggling/trading, protection racket, prostitution etc. Nahhh.... U.S. may be relatively "clean" but it ain't Squeeky clean!!
SEAJ
You don't think a good lawyer can hire someone to find what you are worth? Look into your tax return?
If it was that easy to hide money then we wouldn't be paying the taxes that we do now.You live a very shelter life, you got to get out there to see what's going on within the Chinese community. Give me a call so I could show you the real world.
Its A Secret
02-04-09, 08:50
This is precisely what I'm talking about!!From what I understand, the average Chinese worker seems to make perhaps 2000-4000 RMB per month. I understand apartments in Beijing, Shangai, and other large cities are probably expensive. However consider a non-expensive city that's decently large but no Beijing or Shangai; I was pointed to a chinese website (by an English teacher in the city I will be teaching at) that had apartment listings in that city. Hundreds. I consistently found "nice" apartments that came pre-furnished with every luxury known to man, AC, broadband internet, you name it. 1000-1400 square feet, usually 1400-2000 RMB per month. I also came across "dumpy" apartments that were 1500-2000 square feet and going for as low as 500 RMB a month, however these were non-furnitured and you pretty much had to renovate the place. You're probably going to counter this with "they're just saying that on the website, you've never been there". What if I told you that I have met a girl online from the city that I will be teaching at, and gotten her to check out these apartments herself while taking a video of the whole thing on her cellphone and sending it to me?
They pay foreign teachers more money because lets face it, who wants to go to China to teach when you can go to Japan, Europe, etc. Lets say you make 10,000 RMB per month. You pay 1500 for a rather nice and large apartment. You're still pulling in twice the salary of your average chinese and thats after taking care of pretty much your most expensive monthly bill. Taking the bus somewhere can't cost more than 5 RMB. I was told by numerous sources that food/travel is ridiculously cheap there, and while a westerner wouldn't want to drink the water or eat the food from a restaurant, things like oranges can be bought for 10 RMB a pound.
Is all of the above completely wrong? I am just trying to make sense of this and dispel any incorrect notions.
Its A Secret
02-04-09, 09:24
Man, where is this 1400 rmb furnished apartment at? I like to get my hands on that one? Where in China exactly are they paying workers by the hour?This is in Shenyang, northeast China; from what I have been told (by both English teachers working there and the girl I met online who lives there) it's a dirty city with hardly any foreigners. I'm sure Beijing / Shanghai are much more expensive.
I personally am more interested in traveling / sightseeing in a foreign country as opposed to mongering, but to each their own. The girl I met online is just an added bonus. Pretty sure she's not a gold digger as she's the one of the only girls I talked to online that didn't stop talking to me once I gave them the initial impression that I was dirt poor. Inversely, she was also the hottest, at 5'7, 105 lbs.
All I can say to It's a Secret is that is absurd. Good luck with your delusions; I hate to say it but a cold hard rain is gonna fall once you arrive here.
Good lord is that silly. What did you do, look on craiglist or something ? Be careful, you are obviously easy prey for scam artists
ZhaoBenshan
02-04-09, 16:54
1400 RMB for 90-100m² in Shenyang is not impossible, but you won't be living in a new Western-style apartment. It will very likely be an old Chinese-style building w/o any elevators. And if it's a very old building, you'll probably have to make do with a squat toilet only.
For a new Western-style apartment, you've got to at least double the amount.
Its A Secret
02-04-09, 17:26
1400 RMB for 90-100m² in Shenyang is not impossible.It had a western-style toilet, one of the first things the girl captured in the video. No elevator, definitely had a chinese vibe to it. Very good condition. Found the apartment on a chinese website that I translated through google translate. Included everything down to AC and broadband, plus the girl even gave him a sob story and talked him down to 1200 for the first three months.
There were other good deals such as this one, but this one happened to be two blocks down the road from where I'll be teaching.
Did you read the posting at all? Where is ca? My friend, where have you been? You don't have much china friends here? I'm sorry, I don't think you have much interaction with people from china here if you think most of them get pay by normal payroll and paid their taxes.
We may have a miscommunication here. You keep talking about China while I am talking about the U.S. I came to this conclusion because you talked about getting a Green Card which is usually in the U.S.
Here in the U.S. it is not common to get paid in cash and if you work for a company, payrolls are reported to the government.
I agree that if you own a restaurant then you can hide some money away but not all your profit. If you are getting paid in cash then you are not making enough money to really matter. No one I know gets paid a $50.000 in cash because the person who paid you would want to claim it as a business expense so he can save on his income tax.
There is no sense to keep argue about this since you really believe that you can hide your money so no one (including the government) can find it. If you can do that then more power to you but I don't think the average guy here in the U.S. is smart enough or brave enough to avoid cheat on their taxes in a big way. Today, the last thing I would want to do is to cheat on my taxes and get caught. It would be the end of everything and is just not worth it to me or most other people.
In the end, the gain of having someone who doesn't love me, marry them to get free sex, then to try to hide all my money from her, her lawyers, the government is just not worth it. I would rather just go to China and get cheap sex and have fun.
You live a very shelter life, you got to get out there to see what's going on within the Chinese community. Give me a call so I could show you the real world.
Just to give you a little background, I am a Chinese-America who live in California, US which have a very big Chinese community for the US. I speak fluent Chinese. I have worked in Taiwan for 10 years and have traveled to China for the past 7 years. I have met and hookup with a lot of the senior here on this board and had a lot of fun with them. Now that I am back in the U.S., I still try to go to China twice a year. I have had 6 friends who have been looking for wives in China and 5 of them have found and married their wives.
You might want to also post up your Chinese experience.
Ahhh sooo.... you're most probably right about pre-nups. Guess the better way then would be just to keep 'em as "er lais!" Laws againts bigamy/polygamy should then protect us all!
On Taxes and "undocumented funds" etc - it quite common knowledge that just about all Chinese restaurants in California always have two sets of books - one to record credit card receipt and some smaller cash transactions and another one to record all larger cash transactions.
Payrolls also has two sets of records - one to pay a few hours a week which is taxable and another record to pay in cash for more hours which is non-taxable to the employee - AND also absolves the employer from Unemployment insurance, S/S, workman's com etc etc. Plus there are also the undocumented workers (Chinese AND Mexicans!!) who insists on all cash payment! Such double record keeping is also pretty well de rigeur in lots of other types of Chinese business in California. Never mind the out and out illegal businesses like Drugs, underground casinos, arms/cigarette smuggling/trading, protection racket, prostitution etc. Nahhh.... U.S. may be relatively "clean" but it ain't Squeeky clean!!
SEAJ
I do agree with you however we are talking about hiding a BIG amount of money here so I don't think the workers being paid under the table really applies here. My parents had owned a Chinese restaurant in the past so I do know about the 2 sets of books but the amount of hidden money is not usually a huge amount ($200,000 and up).
The point that I was trying to make is that even if you are hiding a large amount, unless you hide it under your bed, you can not do anything with it without leaving a trail. Putting it in a bank will leave a trail, purchasing a car, house, stocks will also leave a trail. You can't even take more than $10,000 out of the country without leaving a trail. This is why the drug dealers are having trouble moving a large amount of money.
We are not talking about hidding a little bit of money, we are talking about marrying someone, divorce them and try to hide almost all your asset from her and her lawyers.
As far as pre-nups, do you remember what happened to Donald Trump when he divorce his Frost wife? He probably had the best lawyer when he drew up his pre-nup but it got broken and his ex-wife walked away with tens of millions of dollars. Here in California, breaking a pre-nups are getting so easy now which is sad for the guys.
From what I understand, the average Chinese worker seems to make perhaps 2000-4000 RMB per month.
They wish! Typical wage in GuangDong (province in southern China) is 800-1200 rmb for factory workers, store clerks, waitresses. A bit more if they work overtime. Room and board included (= real crappy food, 6 to a room). Guangdong is a booming province, lots of migrant workers come here to work because the wages are significantly higher. In poor parts of China, it's maybe 400 per month.
I understand apartments in Beijing, Shangai, and other large cities are probably expensive. However consider a non-expensive city that's decently large but no Beijing or Shangai; I was pointed to a chinese website (by an English teacher in the city I will be teaching at) that had apartment listings in that city. Hundreds. I consistently found "nice" apartments that came pre-furnished with every luxury known to man, AC, broadband internet, you name it. 1000-1400 square feet, usually 1400-2000 RMB per month. I also came across "dumpy" apartments that were 1500-2000 square feet and going for as low as 500 RMB a month, however these were non-furnitured and you pretty much had to renovate the place.
For modern, highrise, new/newer, western-style apartments, UNfurnished:
In a large expensive city like Shenzhen:
- prime location: 3000 rmb for 450 square feet (1 bedroom)
- non-prime location: 1200-1600 for a 450 sq f
In a hicktown in Dongguan: Around 2000 rmb for 1200 sq f
Internet not included. For managed buildings (all highrises) there is a monthly management fee, usually 3-4.5 rmb per square meter, so tack on another 600-800 rmb for a 2000 sq f (= 200 sq m) apartment. Utilities (water, electricity, gas), depending on how much you use, maybe another 200 per month.
"Chinese-style" apartments are usually much cheaper, especially if they are located in less than desirable locations.
I don't know what your definition of a "large city" is. China has a lot of people, and cities/towns here have much larger populations than US/Europe. A "small town" here can easily have 1 million souls, and up. Medium city is maybe around 3-5 million. Large cities are 10 million and up.
So yeah, 1400 rmb for a nice 1400 sq f apartment, all-in, in a large city is a bit of a stretch.
They pay foreign teachers more money because lets face it, who wants to go to China to teach when you can go to Japan, Europe, etc. Lets say you make 10,000 RMB per month. You pay 1500 for a rather nice and large apartment. You're still pulling in twice the salary of your average chinese and thats after taking care of pretty much your most expensive monthly bill. Taking the bus somewhere can't cost more than 5 RMB.
If you have some teaching credentials, or if you are white with obviously good command of the English language, you can make 10,000 rmb and up... in a city like Shenzhen. Sometimes a free apartment is included (but not 1400 sq f with free AC and internet). But "3 hours a day" is usually 4 classes of 45 minutes each, with a break of 15 minutes in between. Since you are in the classroom for the breaks anyway, it's more like "teach 4 hours, get paid for 3".
Second-tier cities (just as big, but not booming economically) pay maybe 7000. Small-medium cities, maybe 5000. Of course, you can always earn more money by doing private tutoring on the side.
I was told by numerous sources that food/travel is ridiculously cheap there, and while a westerner wouldn't want to drink the water or eat the food from a restaurant, things like oranges can be bought for 10 RMB a pound.
Busses are cheap, often 1-2 rmb for a short ride, especially in small cities.
Food, like you said, depends on what you can put up with. Factory workers in Dongguan (GuangDong) typically get fed on 6-7 rmb per day (per day!). Breakfast for 1.5 rmb per person: small portion of greasy noodles with no meat or vegetables, served directly from a handcart (meaning the noodles are lying right on the cart, no dishes or containers). It's not food you or I would want to eat though. Cheapest you can stomach is probably 5-10 rmb per meal.
Oranges are cheap this year, weather has been mild, harvest has been good. 2-3 rmb per pound in the smaller cities.
Just to give you a little background, I am a Chinese-America who live in California, US which have a very big Chinese community for the US. I speak fluent Chinese. I have worked in Taiwan for 10 years and have traveled to China for the past 7 years. I have met and hookup with a lot of the senior here on this board and had a lot of fun with them. Now that I am back in the U.S., I still try to go to China twice a year. I have had 6 friends who have been looking for wives in China and 5 of them have found and married their wives.
You might want to also post up your Chinese experience.Dude, you told me where you live. I live 15 minutes away from you. My friend lived in millbrae, have six houses all paid by cash. 1st wife left after her green card = $0. 2nd wife, gave her 5k and she disappear. 3rd wife, divorced last year = $0. He is with his 4th wife right now. He is a license general contractor and he accept cash only, in turns he paid his worker cash only.
You want to know my back ground; born in hk, been in the state for 43 years. Educated in europe, speak both french and italian. 2 bachelor degree with one from cal, speak both cantonese and putonhua fluently, live and travel all over the world. I used to live off my suitcases traveling around all over the world. currently co-owner of two joined venture companies, travel back to China 4-5 times a year. Relatives and friends all over the world including hk and China. i am friends with some high chinese offical and a army colonials, you should see some of the parties i get invited to ... make penthouse forum looks like kiddie story.
I could tell you stories that make your toes curl along with some warm and fuzzy successful stories as well.
We may have a miscommunication here. You keep talking about China while I am talking about the U.S.Oh my goodness, I think you are delusional. I live in california and everyone I am talking about is in california. That is exactly why a lot of Chinese businesses take only cash and no credit cards. Wow, you are really shelter. Pm me and I will give you my telephone number, I will take you around sunset, richmond, fremont, san jose, milipitas, cupertino, oakland, daly city, millbrae, mv, sunnyvale, santa clara to all my friends businesses. That could shred some light into the real chinese community. Introduce to some of my chinese cpas, attorneys and financial advisers, they could show you how things are done. I will personally introduce you to my friend that are on his 4th wife.
My friend, I have done black, grey and white businesses so I do know a little something. If you don't know what those business are, then you will never know what I am talking about.
Any man that tells his signif. other 100% of everything is a fool. Im married for almost 30years and from day one, i have always have a private account put away just in case. Of course, it is all after tax money (just incase there is some taxman lurking).You go, bnlee2!
A man after my own heart.
Vista Sushi
02-04-09, 23:04
For modern, highrise, new/newer, western-style apartments, UNfurnished:
In a large expensive city like Shenzhen:
- prime location: 3000 rmb for 450 square feet (1 bedroom)
- non-prime location: 1200-1600 for a 450 sq fYou can get a respectable, furnished 1BR in Pudong area of Shanghai for 1500 RMB furnished. Furnishings are typically a queen sized bed, a closet, couch, table and chairs, a TV with stand, and AC/Heat Pump. You are a 30 minute 2RMB bus ride from the Bund. By taxi it would be 30 RMB and 15 minutes (non-peak). So, it's just a little out there. They are building subway lines like crazy so, eventually you'll be able to get anywhere in Shanghai pretty quickly.
There are a lot of empty newly-built apartment blocks in Pudong. The housing over-supply has hit Shanghai pretty hard. On the Puxi side in Jing'An or Xuhui, good luck. 3, 000 RMB will get you nothing.
SE Asia Joe
02-05-09, 03:41
This is in Shenyang, northeast China; from what I have been told (by both English teachers working there and the girl I met online who lives there) it's a dirty city with hardly any foreigners. I'm sure Beijing / Shanghai are much more expensive.
I personally am more interested in traveling / sightseeing in a foreign country as opposed to mongering, but to each their own. The girl I met online is just an added bonus. Pretty sure she's not a gold digger as she's the one of the only girls I talked to online that didn't stop talking to me once I gave them the initial impression that I was dirt poor. Inversely, she was also the hottest, at 5'7, 105 lbs.
Shenyang is the capital city of Liaoning province and its one of the top 10 largest city in China - some thing like 4-6 million people!! Nearly as big as Hong Kong! And there ARE foreigners (not as many as shanghai, Beijing, Shenzhen, GZ etc of course) there as it is THE Automobile Manufacturing, Machinery, IT and Pharmaceuticals centre of North China.
Wadman's analysis etc is pretty well accurate and you can see from it vs. what you wrote, that you really do need to do a bit more "research" before you go and make such a major move like uprooting yourself to there. If you're talking about a tiny village/hamlet (and in China, anything under half a million COULD be considered such - that is how big population centres in China are!!), then your RMB 1,400 apartment is conceivable - but I seriously doubt it in Shenyang!!
And as far as teaching English is concerned - being a teacher - or "lao sze" - of anything in China brings with it a set of unique problems - in that you are expected to live quite a modest/aesthetic existence befitting the role model that you are for their young!
And the pay - even if you DO manage to make RMB14,000/month - well, that really ain't gonna get you far in China AS A FOREIGNER! At least you can forget about living even a life of modicum luxury, never mind debauchery. Oh I know you said you ain't all that interested in "that" but hell, you're on here aintcha?? And you're talkin' about a young lady there aintcha? And how everything seems to have been formulated jointly with her!
Do more research young man; perhaps take a few weeks holiday there first and know exactly what you're getting into - before you actually commit to uprooting yourself. Believe that's the best advise anybody could give you.
IMHO only
SEAJ
SE Asia Joe
02-05-09, 03:57
I do agree with you however we are talking about hiding a BIG amount of money here so I don't think the workers being paid under the table really applies here. My parents had owned a Chinese restaurant in the past so I do know about the 2 sets of books but the amount of hidden money is not usually a huge amount ($200,000 and up).
The point that I was trying to make is that even if you are hiding a large amount, unless you hide it under your bed, you can not do anything with it without leaving a trail. Putting it in a bank will leave a trail, purchasing a car, house, stocks will also leave a trail. You can't even take more than $10,000 out of the country without leaving a trail. This is why the drug dealers are having trouble moving a large amount of money.
We are not talking about hidding a little bit of money, we are talking about marrying someone, divorce them and try to hide almost all your asset from her and her lawyers.
As far as pre-nups, do you remember what happened to Donald Trump when he divorce his Frost wife? He probably had the best lawyer when he drew up his pre-nup but it got broken and his ex-wife walked away with tens of millions of dollars. Here in California, breaking a pre-nups are getting so easy now which is sad for the guys.
Like I said, just "keep" 'em as er-lais (mistresses, concubines) - will save all the hassles!!
and as far as "small Money" is concerned - well.... you ever seen the big houses the drug dealers, Chicken heads etc live in? And even the restaurant owners - who ARE many times also money launderers? Nahhh... as per Mmlouie says - I am quite forced to agree with him (and with plenty of apologies!!) and say that you really are blinkered as to what really goes on in southern California. Sorry!.
I don't live in California full time, but even I know that it ain't all that "Squeeky" clean.
SEAJ
There is no sense to keep argue about this since you really believe that you can hide your money so no one (including the government) can find it. If you can do that then more power to you but I don't think the average guy here in the U.S. is smart enough or brave enough to avoid cheat on their taxes in a big way. Oh mine! Did I ever tell you or anyone else to cheat on their taxes or did I ever said that I cheated on my tax? I think you should go back and read the posting again. You started this by telling everyone that it simply cannot be done, that no one person or any business cheat on their taxes. It is like telling everyone that politician do not lie and they always tell the truth. I am certainly not an advocate to anyone to go cheat on their taxes, I was simply posting something about "my friend". So don't go twisting my words to justify yourself!
These facts will never go away; politicians will always lie, there will always be those that cheat on their taxes, those who uses steroids, there will always p4p (amen to that), on and on. .
I thought this forum is called opinions and advice? So don't be so close minded and open your eyes, there are people that are breaking the laws as we speak. Did I just say that?
I don't live in California full time, but even I know that it ain't all that "Squeeky" clean.
SEAJIs Northern california rather.
With the new insertion of newly arrived legal or illegal China immigrants, it is getting more and more filth. We used to be able to offer workers 50-50 cash to check, but now. All cash baby. They are used to China way of doing business, so you just got to go with the flow and make it happen somehow.
A much more typical Chinese woman's modus operandi and mind set.
SEAJJust heard something typical of China girls who are on the prowl. Relatives or not it is ALL ABOUT MONEY, faster the better.
Like a session of Mah-Jong, everyone wants to see who made the most money in the shortest time - sort of daily HIGHSMAN THROPY.
I've been writing without seeing some of your delayed posts.
I have no doubt that there ARE many good stories of US/China liaisons - but am also quite sure that for every good story, there must be tons of disasters. And that is all I wanted to point out - to make sure that people reading our pages do understand this, to give balance, to forewarn, to.
SEAJ
This is an account of a wealthy Overseas Chinese living in Australia. He has a career as a successful Exec in a MNC, Never married, Aged mid 50s. At one of the major China trade shows, Mr Exec met this beautiful girl from Dong-Bei (oops am I letting the cat out of the bag already? ). Like a catch of a life-time. Absolutely gorgeous. Tall, light skin, dress and talk with great charm etc. Brings her back to Australia to marry and lived in a huge mansion worth some 1. 5 million Aussie $. Time passed and she became a resident but boredom also set in. So, she convinced Mr Exec to bring her Mom over from DongBei China. Now mother and daughter are together in Australia. Wow, living a beautiful mansion worth lots of money.
One morning, Mother-In-Law grabs a pointed kitchen knife, walks into the study and slams it straight down into the desk, right in front of Mr Exec. "I want this house" she claims.
Shocked and fearful of deep embarrassment in his profession/community, he handed over a stash of cash that week and sent both of them packing. Divorced!
They, the China women especially, are competing for your "M"oney and your father's "M"oney. (Credit given to Clean Gene for this single line.)
It IS their throphy! BRAGGING RIGHTs TOO!
Bc8000
Over time there have been many comments about how many Asian (Chinese) wives "look the other way" when her philandering spouse works overnight, weekends etc.
I found a post on a dating site and have copied and pasted it for all to see.
serious relationship
I,38, am looking for a single nice man(30-40) with his own career. Or maybe we could work together as my knowhow sells to international market too. If u r from Australian, it will be best, but not the must. As a lady, I am honest, caring, helping, considerate, sympathetic, I expect u with the same natural qualities. From my experience and my professional understanding of human nature, I know that we can both overcome the culture-shock and meanwhile u will be happy to keep your nature as a man, as I respect your nature and would like to give u chance keeping the quality of honesty,-man never be satisfied with just one woman, unless he holds a high spirit, which of course, I do appreciate. Caucasian men only please. The one who can make video-chatting are in consideration. P.S. I am also looking for some good friends from different countries, male or female. If you feel there is a common understanding between us, you are more than welcome to contact me.
She understands "-man never be satisfied with just one woman".
ES
Taiwan Laowai
02-05-09, 18:24
I do have a lot more 'feel good' stories but most of them are from Taiwan, not China. However, I do have a lot of experience with Chinese girls making me 'feel good' but that's a different type of story.
I never got real serious because during my extended stays in China because I always end up comparing the local girls to Taiwanese who in general, seem better educated and more familiar with American and western culture (and the world in general) - kinda the best of both worlds.
The Changchun girl didn't really dig me so much. Our friendship generated enough familiarity that I got plenty of intimacy with her but she resisted going all the way and I didn't push it.
Was the AFF connection a marriage made in heaven? Who knows. Maybe the guy was rich and she's already got half. Last I heard from her was in late 07. Was kinda disappointed not to get the Christmas/New Year email in 08.
And Taiwan laowai - what's with all these "feel Good" stories that you seem to always be coming accross?? You ever do these gals or are you always just the good Ole helpful guy who gets our maidens hitched off to Dirty Old Men in the land of Milk and Honey?
And from what you described - this must be a marriage made in heaven!
I mean, the fat slob's gotta dress up in a Santa suit and establish his bona-fides by posing with Mickey Mouse to attract gals? And she was kept by another old geezer as an Er Lai for 3 years (Hey Eaglestar - was that YOU??!!) - and her Santa is a possessive and controlling farmer in the middle of....nowhere??!! And lots of American culture in dem dar lakes!! Yup - its a marriage made in heaven...TRULY!!
SEAJ
Taiwan Laowai
02-05-09, 18:35
It seems so. Anything I submit gets checked by the moderator(s) which delays posting for at least a few hours but the software puts them back to the time I made the submission.
So anything posted by senior members in the interim will appear in front of my post.
By the way, are your posts delayed being put up on the thread as you're only a regular member? I've been writing without seeing some of your delayed posts.
SEAJ
We are not talking about hidding a little bit of money, we are talking about marrying someone, divorce them and try to hide almost all your asset from her and her lawyers. I am for one never advocated anyone to go out and do this without knowing the fact or am I suggesting anyone this is the route to go. I am just simply telling you guys a true story of my friend and how he see all this in this eyes only.
First of all; if you read the post correctly, I said that my friend know the score and he is prepared for it. His plan is to change wife every 2-3 years as he get tired of her, he said is like p4p for 2-3 years. Unlike some of us, he does not tell his wife anything about his assets. He does not go around flaunting his wealth or his assets, his hiding of his assets and wealth is a normal standard practice for him. "he who flaunt does not have". So none of his ex-wife knowing or suspecting that he is a rich man from the beginning. He does not live the lifestyle of a movie star or drive around in a mercedes (which he does own and does not park in his house). The man is a smart cookie. Those who hands over their paycheck, goes around and flaunt all his have and provide all the knowledge and illusion to their future spouse and try to hide it during their divorce deserve to be cleaned out. Let me point out again that I have never said to hide your assets during a divorce proceeding, it must be something that you do before thinking about before getting into a relationship with a China woman.
As far as pre-nups, do you remember what happened to Donald Trump when he divorce his Frost wife? He probably had the best lawyer when he drew up his pre-nup but it got broken and his ex-wife walked away with tens of millions of dollars. Here in California, breaking a pre-nups are getting so easy now which is sad for the guys.as to the pre-nups; you are correct, they are pretty much useless. But let me clear it up for you, calif community property law only apply to the years that you are actually married to each other. In his case and in the worst scenario is that she will be awarded for those two to three years of their marriage which is really amount to nothing much. Anything you accumulated before the marriage does not apply and even a first year lawyer student are aware of this. As to donald and ivana case; ivana is a very smart cookie, donald was not her first husband. She have her agenda, she had done it before with her first canadian husband and she cleaned him up too. She gave donald three children, stood by his outrageous flaunting adulterous behavior, strong spoke person, put herself out there for everyone to notice, advocate to donald's business, she was even on his board at one point, those adds up a lot to a judge so at the end she was awarded with millions. She know exactly how to break a pre-nup and she worked it to her advantage and eventually got what she wanted at the appropriate time. A regular China girl that does not speak the language or even understand the law will not be able to figure that out within the first or second years, it takes time and effort to keep records and events. Without records, a good lawyer can only do so much.
one thing for sure; love in the eyes of a China women is different from the love as we know. It is your choice to make, so gather all your info and if this is still what you want to do. Go for it, life only go around once but make sure that you have all the facts and be prepare for it. If I have offended anyone during the course of this, I apologize.
Like one smart person once told me; it is never the end until the end.
She understands "-man never be satisfied with just one woman".
ESAmen to that, only in china! if only that were true in anywhere else.
This is some years ago; a cousin of mine living in guangdao desperately want to leave prc, it was still under mao’s control back then. He wetback (just an expression and no pun intended) himself to hk, established hk residency after 7 years so we could help him immigrant to the us. All this time, he found a way to maintain contact and relationship with his childhood sweetheart back home promising her that he will get her to the promise land. And so he did, the day he got his citizenship. Story book ending, right?
Wrong! When she finally arrived here in the us, at first she was motivated to learn English, the culture and our way of lives. My cousin enrolls her into ESL, drop her off and pick her up. Brought her a computer so she could qq her friends and family back home. Then all of the sudden, my cousin started to realized a dramatic turn with moody temper swings, she started to skip school, staying up late at night into the morning, spending all her free time on the computer, etc. Then within the first year, she told my cousin that she wasn’t happy and wanted some space so she could find herself. Decided to go to Minnesota and meet up with a friend of her, poor sap even pay for her ticket. You guys could guess what happens after that. To make a long story short, she divorced him after her green card came through.
Bear with me, there is a happy ending to all this. He was so bum out so he decided to move to vegas for a change of scenery. Well, he meets this recent immigrant Chinese girl from guangdao province. Got married within the first year (he rebounded quick) and brought their first house together. Four houses and 8 years later, no child but they are still happily married. See, I am not all that cynical after all.
Is there a moral to this story? A good female friend once told me; if you have the qualifications and ability, find a girl here in the states. If you do not have the qualifications and ability, then go find a girl in China.
"hoping for the best and be preparing for the worst!" Pretty damn good advice I must say!
EDITOR'S NOTE: I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
i meet a shanghainese woman recently; she is around early 50’s, very youthful, attractive, elegant and with a professional demeanor. we started a conversation and i found out that she did not have much command of the english language. i enjoyed her company so we decided to continue our conversation over coffee the next day. well, we became good friends over time.
over time, she started to open up with her story; born and raised in shanghai but she been in the us over 20 + years now by the way of marriage. she married a laowei because he was the first one to ask her plus it was her ticket out of china. she did the wifey thing, cook for him, gave him 2 children, did the house work, laundry and provided support for the children and family so she did not have much time to learn english.
speed it up after 18 years, children are grown. out and gone to college. you see, they never really communicate much because of the language barrier. now she realized it is time to tell her husband that with the children gone; she wanted out of the marriage. they did, he gave her the house, a bunch of money for the 20 + years that they were together.
what shocked me is that she told me that she had to endure 18 years of misery with some guy that she has absolutely no feelings for and to which they have nothing in common except for the children. with the children gone, now it is her time to find her new freedom which she waited 18 years for that to happened. she is enjoying life now more than ever but when ask would she would have done it after knowing. her answer was yes, for a chance of a better life she would do anything.
kind of woke me up after that and got me really thinking, just how much someone could endure for a chance to have a better life out of china.
Over time there have been many comments about how many Asian (Chinese) wives "look the other way" when her philandering spouse works overnight, weekends etc.
I found a post on a dating site and have copied and pasted it for all to see.
serious relationship
I,38, am looking for a single nice man(30-40) with his own career. Or maybe we could work together as my knowhow sells to international market too. If u r from Australian, it will be best, but not the must. As a lady, I am honest, caring, helping, considerate, sympathetic, I expect u with the same natural qualities. From my experience and my professional understanding of human nature, I know that we can both overcome the culture-shock and meanwhile u will be happy to keep your nature as a man, as I respect your nature and would like to give u chance keeping the quality of honesty,-man never be satisfied with just one woman, unless he holds a high spirit, which of course, I do appreciate. Caucasian men only please. The one who can make video-chatting are in consideration. P.S. I am also looking for some good friends from different countries, male or female. If you feel there is a common understanding between us, you are more than welcome to contact me.
She understands "-man never be satisfied with just one woman".
ESI have found that many prc asian females are quite contented as being an er tai knowingly that the man has wife and kids outside of asia. When you enter into those relationships just watch out that they know that as time passes (them getting older), they feel less attractive and more security concious. They will quietly work on getting some of your assets.
I rather just be like a butterfly and keep moving. Just keeping them as girlfriends (hopefully freebies) and move on after several years of fun at most. If you can move on after a year or so that is even better. Have fun and just move on before their they realize that their biological clock is ticking. That is why I prefer married MILF, but there are danger in that area too, I very dangerous habit to keep sometimes.
Clean Gene
02-06-09, 07:46
There was a manager at the Szechuan Restaurant on Garvey in Monterey Park, So. Cal. He had married, serially, several Chinese girls and given them green cards. They were usually waitresses at his place. One of the girls told me that she had divorced him so her sister could take her place, and she could go to school. She seemed happy with the situation. The money and property were all in the hands of the manager's parents. My Slovenian friend Zav... was banging regularly another of the waitressess at the time.
There was a manager at the Szechuan Restaurant on Garvey in Monterey Park, So. Cal. He had married, serially, several Chinese girls and given them green cards. They were usually waitresses at his place. One of the girls told me that she had divorced him so her sister could take her place, and she could go to school. She seemed happy with the situation. The money and property was all in the hands of the manager's parents. My Slovenian friend Zav... was banging regularly another of the waitressess at the time.Of course, there are money to be made from green card as well. anyone interested in extra cash?
Old Mean Dog
02-06-09, 16:07
The 12000rmb per month is a correct amount and it was not by the hour. I was offered that to teach English in Shenzhen however it was teaching to mostly business men and not children. A lot of Chinese business men are in need for English since they are dealing with US.
In SZ, it is quite easy to make 200 RMB an hour teaching Business English. I have several friends doing this P/T to cover their "Pussy Money".
-CPE
Old Mean Dog
02-06-09, 16:31
From what I understand, the average Chinese worker seems to make perhaps 2000-4000 RMB per month. I understand apartments in Beijing, Shangai, and other large cities are probably expensive. However consider a non-expensive city that's decently large but no Beijing or Shangai; I was pointed to a chinese website (by an English teacher in the city I will be teaching at) that had apartment listings in that city. Hundreds. I consistently found "nice" apartments that came pre-furnished with every luxury known to man, AC, broadband internet, you name it. 1000-1400 square feet, usually 1400-2000 RMB per month. I also came across "dumpy" apartments that were 1500-2000 square feet and going for as low as 500 RMB a month, however these were non-furnitured and you pretty much had to renovate the place. You're probably going to counter this with "they're just saying that on the website, you've never been there". What if I told you that I have met a girl online from the city that I will be teaching at, and gotten her to check out these apartments herself while taking a video of the whole thing on her cellphone and sending it to me?
They pay foreign teachers more money because lets face it, who wants to go to China to teach when you can go to Japan, Europe, etc. Lets say you make 10,000 RMB per month. You pay 1500 for a rather nice and large apartment. You're still pulling in twice the salary of your average chinese and thats after taking care of pretty much your most expensive monthly bill. Taking the bus somewhere can't cost more than 5 RMB. I was told by numerous sources that food/travel is ridiculously cheap there, and while a westerner wouldn't want to drink the water or eat the food from a restaurant, things like oranges can be bought for 10 RMB a pound.
Is all of the above completely wrong? I am just trying to make sense of this and dispel any incorrect notions.
It's possible. Many schools that recruit teachers from overseas, will often times give you a Western style one bedroom apartment as part of your package or give you some additional money to help pay for one. Also look to see if they offer Airfare (One way for 6 month contract, R/T for 1 year), Z Working Visa and paid vacation.
I am not sure how the housing costs are where you are going, but I stayed in Suzhou for 3 months and became friends with a guy teaching English there and he had a super nice 3 bedroom apartment (Furnished) for 2,000 RMB (Western toilet, Chinese Shower)....Didn't have an elevator, but it was duplex style and didn't need one.
When I was living in Dongguan, had a brand new, nicely furnished 3 BR/2BA apartment for 3,000 per month...at Dong Tian Gardens, also a 2 BR/1BA, short term for 2,000.
In SZ, 2,500-3,500 for a 2 BR/1BA for a nicer apartment, close to Metro. If you don't mind taking a bus (If you don't drive), then you can get one cheaper.
Anyway, if you are making 12-15k a month, you will be fine. If your a high roller and only want top-shelf beauty queens, then this may not work, but if your an "Average Joe" and can settle for 7's and 8's, then you will be fine.
Don't let some of these guys discourage you.
-CPE
In SZ, it is quite easy to make 200 RMB an hour teaching Business English.
-CPEWouldn't that be great if someone would pay you monthly salary for a pt gag? Where do I sign up?
OldAsiaHand
02-07-09, 08:08
From what I understand, the average Chinese worker seems to make perhaps 2000-4000 RMB per month. I understand apartments in Beijing, Shangai, and other large cities are probably expensive. However consider a non-expensive city that's decently large but no Beijing or Shangai; I was pointed to a chinese website (by an English teacher in the city I will be teaching at) that had apartment listings in that city. Hundreds. I consistently found "nice" apartments that came pre-furnished with every luxury known to man, AC, broadband internet, you name it. 1000-1400 square feet, usually 1400-2000 RMB per month. I also came across "dumpy" apartments that were 1500-2000 square feet and going for as low as 500 RMB a month, however these were non-furnitured and you pretty much had to renovate the place. You're probably going to counter this with "they're just saying that on the website, you've never been there". What if I told you that I have met a girl online from the city that I will be teaching at, and gotten her to check out these apartments herself while taking a video of the whole thing on her cellphone and sending it to me?
They pay foreign teachers more money because lets face it, who wants to go to China to teach when you can go to Japan, Europe, etc. Lets say you make 10,000 RMB per month. You pay 1500 for a rather nice and large apartment. You're still pulling in twice the salary of your average chinese and thats after taking care of pretty much your most expensive monthly bill. Taking the bus somewhere can't cost more than 5 RMB. I was told by numerous sources that food/travel is ridiculously cheap there, and while a westerner wouldn't want to drink the water or eat the food from a restaurant, things like oranges can be bought for 10 RMB a pound.
Is all of the above completely wrong? I am just trying to make sense of this and dispel any incorrect notions.
It's A Secret,
Yes, you can live in China, especially in secondary cities, for 10k RMB per month. But, do you want to? Do you take the bus in your home country, or do you drive a car? Do you take a date to a fancy restaurant sometimes or always eat at McDonalds? Do you want to eat noodles and rice boxes every day? Will you miss some of the food that you eat at home and want to buy them at extravagant prices at the local imported products shop? I spend around 2k per month just on this stuff. Do you like to go out to better clubs where beer is 40-50 per bottle? Do you want to do BBS or catacomb girls all the time or want to spoil yourself at KTV or a sauna occassionally? It depends on the lifestyle you want. You can do it on the cheap, but cannot compare it with a western lifestyle.
Just my POV.
OAH
OldAsiaHand
02-07-09, 08:10
This is in Shenyang, northeast China; from what I have been told (by both English teachers working there and the girl I met online who lives there) it's a dirty city with hardly any foreigners. I'm sure Beijing / Shanghai are much more expensive.
I personally am more interested in traveling / sightseeing in a foreign country as opposed to mongering, but to each their own. The girl I met online is just an added bonus. Pretty sure she's not a gold digger as she's the one of the only girls I talked to online that didn't stop talking to me once I gave them the initial impression that I was dirt poor. Inversely, she was also the hottest, at 5'7, 105 lbs.
Its A Secret,
Interesting take on the dirt poor perception. Are you sure she believed you or just thought you were using this ploy to test her "sincerity"?
OAH
It's A Secret,
Yes, you can live in China, especially in secondary cities, for 10k RMB per month. But, do you want to? Do you take the bus in your home country, or do you drive a car? Do you take a date to a fancy restaurant sometimes or always eat at McDonalds? Do you want to eat noodles and rice boxes every day? Will you miss some of the food that you eat at home and want to buy them at extravagant prices at the local imported products shop? I spend around 2k per month just on this stuff. Do you like to go out to better clubs where beer is 40-50 per bottle? Do you want to do BBS or catacomb girls all the time or want to spoil yourself at KTV or a sauna occassionally? It depends on the lifestyle you want. You can do it on the cheap, but cannot compare it with a western lifestyle.
Just my POV.
OAHErmmmm....What exactly is a catacomb girl? :D
Thanks in advance,
Wushu
Old Mean Dog
02-07-09, 10:54
Wouldn't that be great if someone would pay you monthly salary for a pt gag? Where do I sign up?
It's quite easy to string along enough p/t work to make it a f/t job. I think most companies want the training 2x a week @ 2 hours per class. So it would end up being decent money. I did this for awhile at a couple of American companies here and they also provided a private car to pick me up and drop me off.
The other benefit is, you make a lot of business contacts this way, because it's the office staff, engineers and bosses who are learning. Which certainly helps if you are aspiring to do business here and/or need a little guanxi.
The benefits of working f/t is the company usually provides a 1BR apartment or additional money to help, Z Working Visa and other benefits. Problem is, you are required to do 40 hours a week. Even if the ad says only 28 Teaching Hours, the other 12 will be in the office. Doesn't give you much free time and your two days off are normally not back-to-back.
10k a month might be a bit low, it would certainly be in SZ, but I don't know the area he is in and what benefits are included. If an apartment is provided, then he might be OK there, since all he would need to pay is the bills.
So, if a guy really wants to get out of the rat race and try living in China, this isn't so bad.
-CPE
It's quite easy to string along enough p/t work to make it a f/t job. I think most companies want the training 2x a week at 2 hours per class. So it would end up being decent money. I did this for awhile at a couple of American companies here and they also provided a private car to pick me up and drop me off.
-CPEThe point is to get pay ft salary for pt hours. If that is possible, I am sure that I am not the only one that will be standing in line for that job. LOL
Sound Stream #2
02-08-09, 12:30
Is there a moral to this story? A good female friend once told me; if you have the qualifications and ability, find a girl here in the states. If you do not have the qualifications and ability, then go find a girl in China.
"hoping for the best and be preparing for the worst!" Pretty damn good advice I must say!Did the girl that tell you that also happen to be from the states?
What I learn is that girls tend to tell you things from the perspective of what benefits them, and not what really works to your advantage.
I know a girl from the states who is cheating on her husband behind his back, and his husband is ignorant about it and blind eventhough all the clues were plain obvious. Poor guy!
OldAsiaHand
02-08-09, 16:55
Ermmmm....What exactly is a catacomb girl? :D
Thanks in advance,
Wushu
The term "catacombs" was coined by Johnnykon666 to describe a maze of small alleys in DG where there are girls standing in front of small rooms with dirt floors, no plumbing, and a hole in the floor for a toilet. There is a wooden bed, no mattress but one of those straw mats over it. The rooms stink to high heaven, and there are all sorts of insects and rodents running around. The price is usually 30RMB for 20 minutes for local clientele mostly construction workers, taxi drivers and the like. The girls take on 10-12 punters per day.
Actually, most towns in Guangdong have an area like this primarily to serve the migrant population, however, most of the girls are older with the exception of the area in DG above.
These places are not for the feint hearted.
OAH
Nighthawk55
02-08-09, 21:49
I have to say the whole plan sounds dubious. It is not like you will end up with a hottie. At best you will end up with a mildly attractive, undereducated girl from the provinces. Who speaks no English. You can get THAT without all the work moving to a small town in Nebraska.
I just don't get the point of moving to China, working shifty low paying jobs, living in a shifty apartment so you MIGHT be able to screw a few girls who you can't talk to.
Did the girl that tell you that also happen to be from the states?
What I learn is that girls tend to tell you things from the perspective of what benefits them, and not what really works to your advantage.
I know a girl from the states who is cheating on her husband behind his back, and his husband is ignorant about it and blind eventhough all the clues were plain obvious. Poor guy!It would be hard to imagine that a man could be that stupid and blind to the spouse's activities. In many relationship's especially for older asian couples, the women in most cases knows of the husband philandering but turns a blind eye to it. They just don't want the stigma of being a divorced women. The smarter ones don't care just as long as they have a lot of money stashed away, just in case the get goes all the way of filing for divorce paper. In my mind, the guy (if he was married in the west) would be stupid to go through that since most states divvies the property up and usually the women walks away with a much bigger half. I just have a good friend just lost over $10M USD to a 300# exwife (she was only 110# when they married twenty years ago).
Another situtation is that the husband could truly be cuckold, maybe he maybe a bit voyeur and rather watch than participate. It maybe a mental situation for him.
No one is really so dumb and blind, there is always a situation behind it. Just my two rmb on this.
Did the girl that tell you that also happen to be from the states?
What I learn is that girls tend to tell you things from the perspective of what benefits them, and not what really works to your advantage.
I know a girl from the states who is cheating on her husband behind his back, and his husband is ignorant about it and blind eventhough all the clues were plain obvious. Poor guy!
the point i was trying to get across is not about the reason she left. who cares? please read the whole posting in a context and forget about why. the moral of the story is that you do not have to travel to china to find a good girl, if you have the qualification and ability . . . look for it here first.
if you are talking about my female friend quote; Yes and we were been good friends for over 20 years. And yes, you could have female friends without ever crossing that line, I personally have much more female friends than male friends. We were engaged in a conversation regarding the reason a lot of men are going to China to get their wives and why certain men cannot get gfs here in the states.
I do agreed with her totally. China women expectations are much less and lower than girls in the states, they are even readily settle with someone that are 15 or 20 years their senior, the problem is when given a few years here; their mentality changes very quickly. Girls in the states usually are not that open-minded and much more demanding and have higher expectations in their men.
It would be hard to imagine that a man could be that stupid and blind to the spouse's activities. In many relationship's especially for older asian couples, the women in most cases knows of the husband philandering but turns a blind eye to it. They just don't want the stigma of being a divorced women. The smarter ones don't care just as long as they have a lot of money stashed away, just in case the get goes all the way of filing for divorce paper. In my mind, the guy (if he was married in the west) would be stupid to go through that since most states divvies the property up and usually the women walks away with a much bigger half. I just have a good friend just lost over $10M USD to a 300# exwife (she was only 110# when they married twenty years ago).I agreed, bnlee2. It is all about face and money. Men don't want to divide up his assets and women do not want to lose face about the divorce, so they both turn the other way. I know many older and successful couples like that, they both have their own fun, separate lives and they both know about it. As long as they both agreed to be discreet, is cool. They just see who could outlive the other first, LOL.
Ouch, 300#. I don't mind losing 10m for that!
SE Asia Joe
02-09-09, 07:46
SHE WON'T BLOW ME!! and now she's refused to even do me!!!
Yup, exact words I heard on my phone, being uttered by a good buddy who is no stranger to mongering. And here he was, practically screaming at me!!
WTF??!! WHAT THE FXXK do YOU want me to do about it??!! ForCrissakes!!
My buddy had read my #4971 Donngguan post
Kuo Lie who I had ditched in favor of another gal in the past, and who I had promised I will take. And had foned me several times in the past couple weeks. All 172 cm of white skinned loveliness. A vegetarian. And what a nice name. How could I have neglected to call her earlier? YEAH!! Thank you Goddess, thank you!! Only there was no time for a pop before lunch - so I just told her to meet me at PP.
Nice, great looking and all fresh. Had a great lunch with lots of pawing and touching under the table whilst eating. Yup - I is gonna have me a good time in a while. Beautiful, sweet smelling, great moves - all that I expected and I was merrily pumping away until.....OH SHIT, The Goddess just shat on me again!! Blood on the sheets, blood on my pecker - Old Auntie was visiting the very embarrassed Kuo Lie. JEEZ!! All's not lost though, as we reverted to Plan B and she merrilly blowed me to completion!
And had insisited on looking (no, actually he seriously studied) at her pictures on my camera, questioned me thoroughly about the BJ (No, I did NOT CIM, but YES, she did blow me till I came and just pulled away), and all other minute details about her.
Even up to now, I still have NO IDEA what all happened - but there he was screaming on the phone. Inconceivable as far as I was concerned - but apparently Kuo Lie (according to my buddy) only blew him for a couple or three minutes and then refused to do anything else. Refused to even allow him to mount her - and just insisted on her money.
Another reason why I do not like to give recommendations on any particular gal OR to take recommendations from anybody else! YMMV, plus of course I actually enjoy discovering "things" myself.
SEAJ
Ps. Come to think of it, if it was OAH with Kuo Lie instead of my above buddy, OAH would have been DELIGHTED that a gal would give him more than the 10 or 20 seconds BJ he routinely gets!!
SE Asia Joe
02-09-09, 07:55
Its A Secret,
Interesting take on the dirt poor perception. Are you sure she believed you or just thought you were using this ploy to test her "sincerity"?
OAH
And even a "Dirt Poor" Yank - and, here one who can afford to actually travel to China - is bound to be "wealthier" than herself - especially since he's also got that all important U.S.A. passport!!
Oh hell, now we're gonna get all the "Dirt Poor" Yanks wanting to come over and sow their wild oats using their U.S.A. passport!! Cain't win writing about this subject!!
SEAJ
SE Asia Joe
02-09-09, 10:08
It's A Secret,
Yes, you can live in China, especially in secondary cities, for 10k RMB per month. But, do you want to? Do you take the bus in your home country, or do you drive a car? Do you take a date to a fancy restaurant sometimes or always eat at McDonalds? Do you want to eat noodles and rice boxes every day? Will you miss some of the food that you eat at home and want to buy them at extravagant prices at the local imported products shop? I spend around 2k per month just on this stuff. Do you like to go out to better clubs where beer is 40-50 per bottle? Do you want to do BBS or catacomb girls all the time or want to spoil yourself at KTV or a sauna occassionally? It depends on the lifestyle you want. You can do it on the cheap, but cannot compare it with a western lifestyle.
Just my POV.
OAH
OK OAH...... just how long have you been in the Middle Kingdom?? Honestly!! And when did all....... "this" start happening to you??
How many months? Years? Before the "call of the Yank, the I miss so many of the things back in the good Ole U.S. of A so much" start to overpower the sweet scent of Chinese nookie?
Ya been in China too damn long my friend!!
BHetcha if you go back and live in the U.S., that you'd be really itching to get back within 2 weeks - 3 max!! One month and you'd be a total wreck!!
Just my POV - as you would say!!
SEAJ
And had insisited on looking (no, actually he seriously studied) at her pictures on my camera, questioned me thoroughly about the BJ (No, I did NOT CIM, but YES, she did blow me till I came and just pulled away), and all other minute details about her.
Yes, and Joe and me straightened out the termininology with XueEr (Joe's favourite mommy).
Chui1 Bao4 = Blow explode = blow till you cum, but not necessarily in her mouth. More likely, she will pull away at the last moment
Kou3 Bao4 = mouth explode = this is supposed to be CIM
Get your termininology straight, Joe, and you may get more CIMs.
Ps. Come to think of it, if it was OAH with Kuo Lie instead of my above buddy, OAH would have been DELIGHTED that a gal would give him more than the 10 or 20 seconds BJ he routinely gets!!
LOL, stop picking on the guy.
OldAsiaHand
02-10-09, 04:30
Ps. Come to think of it, if it was OAH with Kuo Lie instead of my above buddy, OAH would have been DELIGHTED that a gal would give him more than the 10 or 20 seconds BJ he routinely gets!!
SEAJ,
I have started to confirm in advance how long the BBBJ will last. Back in the room, I start the timer on my phone with the agreed amount of time. Although, they nearly never go the distance, at least, most will try.
As I have posted before, the perception of most working girls in China is that the purpose of a BJ is just to get you hard in preparation for the deed. I usually get more than 10-20 seconds, but rarely more than 5 minutes from the vast majority of BBS or KTV girls.
If I want a good BBBJCIM, I go to a sauna.
Just my POV.
OAH
SE Asia Joe
02-10-09, 06:36
SEAJ,
I have started to confirm in advance how long the BBBJ will last. Back in the room, I start the timer on my phone with the agreed amount of time. Although, they nearly never go the distance, at least, most will try.
As I have posted before, the perception of most working girls in China is that the purpose of a BJ is just to get you hard in preparation for the deed. I usually get more than 10-20 seconds, but rarely more than 5 minutes from the vast majority of BBS or KTV girls.
If I want a good BBBJCIM, I go to a sauna.
Just my POV.
OAH
You're kidding about actually using the timer aintcha?
I mean, I can imagine it all.... "
OAH: "No No No, you gotta keep on going, it's only been 1-1/2 minute"
WG: "yeah but my neck hurts already"
OAH: "I don't care, thats what was agreed to"
WG, spitting on the floor: "Not ME! It's mommie. You get HER to blow you!"
OAH: "Aw come-on"
WG: "Come on my ass!! On top of everything else you smell of hamburgers"
OAH: "Just lick my balls a bit - OK?"
WG: "wushe guai more?"
OAH: "sanshe..............
SEAJ
I have to say the whole plan sounds dubious. It is not like you will end up with a hottie. At best you will end up with a mildly attractive, undereducated girl from the provinces. Who speaks no English. You can get THAT without all the work moving to a small town in Nebraska.
I just don't get the point of moving to China, working shifty low paying jobs, living in a shifty apartment so you MIGHT be able to screw a few girls who you can't talk to.Good point! Not to burst the guy's bubble, he just might be lucky or handsome enough to get a hottie to live with him in a shifty apartment, shared paying the bills and live on bread and water. Is that possible in China?
Its A Secret
02-15-09, 16:58
Its A Secret,
Interesting take on the dirt poor perception. Are you sure she believed you or just thought you were using this ploy to test her "sincerity"?
OAHYes my good man I am 100% sure. I have talked to her on the phone, seen many cellphone videos with her and friends, seen her on webcam. Refused my offer of sending her money multiple times, thus passing the scammer / gold digger test. She is physically perfect at 5'7, 105 lbs, B cups, and to top this off, worships me. In contrast to the moody, often overweight, borderline fem-nazi 20-somethings that seem to plague Alaska's dating scene, I will probably never date another Alaskan girl again. If anyone is interested PM me and I can send you the site I found her at, there were a ton of girls on the site.
With that being said, I need someone to provide me with the solid math on why 10,000 RMB a month in Shenyang will only allow you to live on bread and water while the average chinese person only makes 1/5th of that.
OldAsiaHand
02-16-09, 07:00
With that being said, I need someone to provide me with the solid math on why 10,000 RMB a month in Shenyang will only allow you to live on bread and water while the average chinese person only makes 1/5th of that.
I am not saying that you cannot live reasonably for 10k/month in Shenyang. I was exagerating somewhat. I am just saying it will be more of a local lifestyle rather than a western lifestyle. Many people do it. And, Shenyang should be cheaper than other cities like Beijing or Shanghai.
The average Chinese person cannot live alone on 1/5th. Factory workers are provided food and housing. Single people live at home with extended families. Costs are shared among multiple earners. Nearly every household has 2 or more breadwinners.
It would not hurt you to come over and see if you like it. You can always go home if you cannot handle it.
Just my POV.
OAH
LittleGoomba
02-16-09, 08:33
As OAH just said, get on the plane and come check it out for yourself. Both for the living conditions as well as the girl. Especially for the girl. If you don't like living here you can just get on a plane and go home but if the girl gets her hooks into you (marriage, money, etc.) and things take a turn for the worse, then you're screwed.
Look, she might be as great as she seems and if she is, wonderful. You've hit the online dating lottery. Grab the girl and go carve out a future together wherever before someone else scoops her up. I've posted a few reports of genuinely awesome girls who have the whole package that I've met online. Just do your homework before you do anything rash and don't make any firm judgments from afar!
One cautionary tale: A former co-worker of mine got into a long-term relationship with a local girl - pretty good looking, college educated, decent job, almost demure - who for two years never once asked for money or gifts, just seemed totally into the relationship. They got married and returned to Canada to start 'life' but as soon as she had the chance, left him and filed for divorce. The guy didn't see it coming and I don't blame him, she played it perfectly. That was two years ago and he is still a wreck.
So while you never know, at the very minimum cover your bases and do your homework!
Yes my good man I am 100% sure. I have talked to her on the phone, seen many cellphone videos with her and friends, seen her on webcam. Refused my offer of sending her money multiple times, thus passing the scammer / gold digger test. She is physically perfect at 5'7, 105 lbs, B cups, and to top this off, worships me. In contrast to the moody, often overweight, borderline fem-nazi 20-somethings that seem to plague Alaska's dating scene, I will probably never date another Alaskan girl again. If anyone is interested PM me and I can send you the site I found her at, there were a ton of girls on the site.
Clean Gene
02-16-09, 08:42
Good point! Not to burst the guy's bubble, he just might be lucky or handsome enough to get a hottie to live with him in a shifty apartment, shared paying the bills and live on bread and water. Is that possible in China?
It's no secret. One can live well on 10,000 RMB/month. An acquaintance lives in Shanghai and doesn't even spend all of his social security every month (which must be around $1,500/month). He lives well, although not as luxuriously as many of our ISG guys. He does own his own apartment (His son by his 1st wife helped him buy it. He is single with 3 ex-wives.)
Another lives in Jinan, also on social security. He is having the time of his life with younger women who throw themselves at him. He lives in a very small place which he rents from an old high school friend.
The above two settled in their boyhood hometowns.
I have an old friend who lives in a very deluxe retirement home. My bank gives him an automatic transfer of 300 USD/month. His daughter visits him every month and he is happy and content.
Gulp. I might be heading this road (marriage to a PRC national).
Gulp.
Does anyone have any experience (first or second hand) with pre-nuptial agreements?
P13
I live in Shenzhen part time and have a apartment there.
Here is the breakdown. I keep shuttling between New York and shenzhen.
1. Rent- I pay 2600 RMB for a nice 2 bedroom apt 5 min walking distance
from Louhu station. fully furnished including TV.
Apartments can be had from 1500-6000 RMb/month depending
on your budget.
2. Common charges- Mostly for security- 800 RMB for six months.
3. Electric, gas,cable TV, internet- Approx 200-300 depending on how often
I turn the air conditioner on.
In china all of these are heavily subsidized by government.
4. Maid- 300 RMB /month-6 days a week if I am staying there.
200 RMB/month- 2 days a week if I am not staying there.
She cleans, washes and Irons clothes, Does some shopping but does
not cook.
She will cook if I ask her but I do not like chinese food all the time.
5. Food-Food is very cheap. I know cheap and good places. only with some girls I need to take them to nice places. But most of the girls are happy to show where we can eat cheap.
6. Girls- When you live here no need to spend give too much money to girls.
Unlike other countries most of the chinese girls do work and not
looking for handouts. Easy to make friends here. lots of young girls.
So with 8000 RMB, little more than $1000 you can have a decent time. Stay away from Karaoke bars. Have a few drinks at home before going to DIsco. Chinese girls are very homely and like to stay home. Generally there are no marriage committment issues as long as she knows she is your girlfriend. Happy with small gifts. No sick buffallo, need milk money for the baby, mother's third husband sick etc.
7. Language- Communication is a problem. But they are quick learners.
Besides no need to discuss world issues.
4. Maid- 300 RMB /month-6 days a week if I am staying there.
200 RMB/month- 2 days a week if I am not staying there.
She cleans, washes and Irons clothes, Does some shopping but does not cook.
She will cook if I ask her but I do not like Chinese food all the time.Serious question; She really only charges 300 per month? If she does a good job, would appreciated it if you could PM me with her contact number. Bet the cat is out of the bag now and she won't be charging 300 anymore!
Mmlouie
Clean Gene
02-17-09, 08:33
It's no secret.
I have an old friend who lives in a very deluxe retirement home. My bank gives him an automatic transfer of 300 USD/month. His daughter visits him every month and he is happy and content.
I might add that they took care of me when I was down with malaria twenty some years ago. The daughter, was adopted and an absolutely stunning teenager then, used to slip under my mosquito net at night and give me a quiet and delicious fuck. She got pregnant that year and married a young unemployed boy. (She said the boy was the father.)
Yes my good man I am 100% sure. I have talked to her on the phone, seen many cellphone videos with her and friends, seen her on webcam. Refused my offer of sending her money multiple times, thus passing the scammer / gold digger test. She is physically perfect at 5'7, 105 lbs, B cups, and to top this off, worships me. In contrast to the moody, often overweight, borderline fem-nazi 20-somethings that seem to plague Alaska's dating scene, I will probably never date another Alaskan girl again. If anyone is interested PM me and I can send you the site I found her at, there were a ton of girls on the site.
With that being said, I need someone to provide me with the solid math on why 10, 000 RMB a month in Shenyang will only allow you to live on bread and water while the average Chinese person only makes 1/5th of that.Hi Its a Secret!
I am Tightway and live in China already for 7 Years. I am ok looking and can easily get girls in China until now, because I am open and friendly and decently dressed when meeting them.
Many guys on ISG think that they don't need to care about their looks and just walk around as they please. But thats why they just go to hookers most of the time. If a girl is nicely dressed and takes care of herself than she seems more attractive too, and guys flock around her.
If you are looking for advice on Chinese normal women in this forum, than you might be at the wrong place. Because this is a forum where guys usually exchange info on hookers mainly. Many guys here can't or don't want to get a normal girl. Whatever is true I don't know. I prefer a normal horny girl over a lame unmotivated hooker too.
I once wrote about getting a lot of freebies on this forum and was attacked by mostly the older guys who can not get any freebies. So thats why I stopped coming here and stopped posting as well. But since I got a lot of PMs of guys telling me that they really enjoyed reading my few posts, here I go once again.
I have read through your posts, and not through the comments, and it seems to me that this beautiful girls feelings! FOR NOW! Are genuine. To really judge her you have to send me her picture or video, which I would love to see of course, hehe. But it is possible that she is so pretty that she is hit on all the time by men and that she is sleeping around with lots of guys all the time. But as most girls, she is also looking for love and someone special. So, hoping you are that guy, she is doing all kinds of things for you, without even having met you. This is typical of quite a few Chinese girls, to live in a dream world, when getting to know a man on the internet but never having met him. Of course you don't have more to offer than all these other guys this girl might be meeting. But she wants to believe it. When you acutally really meet her it is possible that your relationship only last for a very short time and that she quickly looses interest in you, because she has so many choices when it comes to men. If she is from an uneducated and poor Chinese family background than she might also not know how to appreciate your education and upbringing. But as I said, I have to see her in order to get a hint of who she is. It might also be that you hit it off.
But you must understand that most Chinese people have a different relationship with honesty than westerners do. For many mainland Chinese good means what is good and useful to them.
I got burned many times in China regarding girls in the beginning. Because as a westerner I first could not tell the difference between a good and a bad Chinese girl, or lets just say good and bad in my eyes. Now I can much much better discern! I find in China there is often a mentality of eat or to be eaten. Also in relationships. Since I have never seen your girl, what expression she has in her face what cloth she wears and how she moves and acts, I can not really judge if she is a good one to me or not.
But she probably is very convincing and smart, and might also be using her feminine qualities as a weapon, since she can persuade landlords to lower the price and talk school directors (and I am sure they are male) into giving you a job without a BA Degree.
Did she convince the landlord to lower the price by telling him an untrue story? Which would be not uncommon in China. But she could do the same with you too. In the end you can only ask someone with a good eye and a lot of eyperience in China if she is a good one or not.
Or you have to take the hard road of experience.
I tried to PM you, but it did not work. Maybe you got to pay and register?
If you want you can PM me (if you can) your email and I reply to you and than you can send me her pic or video and than I can tell you what I think.
Cheers!
P.S. : And I am happily awaiting all the Forum comments that are bound to come! If not, I will be disapointed. Haha!
EDITOR'S NOTE: I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
SE Asia Joe
02-18-09, 05:37
I might add that they took care of me when I was down with malaria twenty some years ago. The daughter, was adopted and an absolutely stunning teenager then, used to slip under my mosquito net at night and give me a quiet and delicious fuck. She got pregnant that year and married a young unemployed boy. (She said the boy was the father.)
Soooo... you're actually sending this guy US$300/month to live in a deluxe retirement home - a sort of private pension. And this is making me very curious - as to why! And please note that I am NOT flaming you or taking the [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) out of you. Just plain old curious.
Is it because he'd actually saved your life?
Is it because of guilt for dicking his daughter whilst he was being so kind to you?
Is it that US$300 is peanuts to you?
Fact, is who is this guy? Is he Chinese? From China? From the U.S.? What/who is he to you exactly?
Where did you get malaria - since I didn't think that Malaria was that serious a problem in MOST parts of China (perhaps the more tropical areas) and that its pretty well under control by the Health Ministry for many many years.
Like I said, apologize if I'm asking things that ain't nuthin' of my business, but I AM curious as to why you are doing what you are doing/how the human mind works.
Thanks
SEAJ
I got burned many times in China regarding girls in the beginning. Because as a westerner I first could not tell the difference between a good and a bad Chinese girl, or lets just say good and bad in my eyes. Now I can much much better discern! I find in China there is often a mentality of eat or to be eaten.Ain't that the truth! I don't think it is just the foreigners, most oversea Chinese will have the same problem in recognizing who are the good or bad girls as well. There are signs, you just have to keep your eyes open.
SE Asia Joe
02-18-09, 08:48
Hi Its a Secret!
I am Tightway and live in China already for 7 Years. I am ok looking and can easily get girls in China until now, because I am open and friendly and decently dressed when meeting them.
.............
P.S. : And I am happily awaiting all the Forum comments that are bound to come! If not, I will be disapointed. Haha!
]
Great post Tightway!! Really!!
You know what I appreciate most about you??
You truly are so full of shit - but its shit that you truly believe 100% in. No, that's true!! You are a genuine one of a kind!
AND your advise to the young man really resonates with me - for I know that what you wrote is mostly correct and that the guy'd be best served if he reads and reads it again and answer some of the Question Marks you've posed.
Now about being well dressed..... Man..... you sure?? Long black leather coats are best worn by the Russian Mafia. And all things leather - including AG's leather pants - are best suited north of Shanghai!! Muahahaha!!
Actually I love reading your posts and have been missing reading 'em so - here's a great big welcome back!!
SEAJ
I once wrote about getting a lot of freebies on this forum and was attacked by mostly the older guys who can not get any freebies. So thats why I stopped coming here and stopped posting as well. But since I got a lot of PMs of guys telling me that they really enjoyed reading my few posts, here I go once again.
Yeah, I agree, I also wrote on this issue already and received a lot of derisive comments from certain members. Still the normal girl issue is actually more interesting to me in many ways than the hooker girls, because I just find it more satisfying to be with a girl whom you don't have to pay just to be with you. Not that I have a problem with P2P, but some emotional content is missing there.
Probably there is some kind of divide between the older and younger guys on this board regarding this issue, since it may be difficult for 60 yo's to find regular girls, so they get kind of snappy when you address the issue.
Vista Sushi
02-19-09, 05:56
Ain't that the truth! I don't think it is just the foreigners, most oversea Chinese will have the same problem in recognizing who are the good or bad girls as well. There are signs, you just have to keep your eyes open.Please do tell. What are the signs of a bad girl that we seek?
SE Asia Joe
02-19-09, 07:08
Sunday Post Magazine 15 February 2009
Sunday Post 15 February 2009
Hello my concubine
Chinese men have historically taken 'second wives' to enhance their prestige and years of strong economic growth have revived the tradition in the mainland. Zhang Lijia meets some ernai and gets their take on life, love and the financial downturn
SOCIETY
Feb 15, 2009
Wang Chunlei knows she's beautiful. On stage in a Shenzhen karaoke bar called Lucky, she is putting everything into her singing, one jewelled hand holding the microphone, the other waving goodbye to an imaginary lover. Her tight black top sparkles with sequins, her face glows and the audience showers her with applause.
Wang usually visits two or three bars a night, driving between each in her Audi. She is paid 100 yuan (HK$113) for a 30-minute performance and 20 per cent of that ends up in her DJ/agent's pocket; leaving little to pay for the car and her diamond rings. But like many singers in Shenzhen's karaoke bars, Wang harbours a thinly veiled secret: she has a wealthy patron. She is an ernai, one of millions in the mainland.
Ernai means "second wife" and is the term used to describe a mistress of a married man. Those who have managed to snag a particularly wealthy businessman or official, as Wang has, enjoy their own apartment, a designer wardrobe and the luxury of leisure.
Before the Communists outlawed the practice when they came to power in 1949, rich and powerful men kept concubines to enhance their prestige. In recent decades, a relaxation of the party's control over society and growing wealth have sparked a spectacular resurgence of concubine culture; manufacturers and retailers of luxury goods joke that the market for designer handbags and expensive watches would collapse if the army of ernai started to shrink in numbers, which may already be happening as the global financial crisis bites.
Shenzhen is well populated with ernai. Places such as Huanggang, just across the border from Lok Ma Chau, have been nicknamed "ernai villages". Before Deng Xiaoping turned the surrounding pocket of land into a special economic zone, Huanggang was a small village; now it is packed with nondescript residential blocks. Lucky is on a street dominated by restaurants, mahjong parlours, beauty salons and bars.
Inside one of Lucky's private rooms, 28-year-old Wang reflects on her life. Born in Wuhan, the capital of Hubei province, she ventured south 10 years ago, hoping to become a star. With no formal training, she struggled to land a job as a singer and instead found work as a waitress in a karaoke bar.
"That was the hardest time in my life," she says. "I was jade in the palms of my parents but suddenly I had to fend for myself and I was treated like a cheap piece of straw."
But she was too beautiful to be ignored. She soon met her first "master", Jin Min, a successful businessman from her hometown who was married and nearly 20 years her senior. Wang played the virgin card.
"I told him that I was sexually inexperienced," Wang says. "I said, 'If you really want me, you must take good care of me.' And he did. I never felt like he was a married man because his wife and daughter were in Wuhan. I sometimes felt he was like a caring father."
Jin set her up in a rented apartment in Silver Lake, on the outskirts of town, and did his best to spoil her, even paying for her to study singing in Beijing.
"I was lucky because he was in love with me and I was very fond of him," Wang says. Despite that, she embarked on an affair with a fellow student. "It was just different with Peng. We are the same age and we had so much in common. And the fact we had to keep our love secret made it all the more exciting."
Jin may have suspected something was going on. After two years' of study, he lured Wang back to Shenzhen by buying her a new car.
"I had to come back even though I was in love with Peng. I had to be practical. He could hardly feed himself," Wang says. But she wasn't happy to be back in Jin's arms. For the first time she was bothered by his wrinkled neck and his bulging "Buddha belly".
When Jin discovered Wang had kept in touch with her Beijing lover, he vanished.
"I was devastated," Wang says, carefully wiping away tears with a handkerchief. "How could I continue the lifestyle I was accustomed to?"
It took her a few months to find a replacement: a Hong Kong property developer in his 50s.
"He doesn't treat me as well as Jin did. We've been together for over two years now. I'll make do with him before finding someone better."
Feng Ling, a Shenzhen-based journalist with the Yangcheng Evening News, has written extensively about the second-wife phenomenon.
"The ernai used to be, with few exceptions, poor girls from the countryside with very little schooling," he says. "Some of the new ernai are from comfortable backgrounds and are fairly well educated. They tend to treat being an ernai as a lucrative career option and go after whoever offers the highest bid."
Feng believes money is becoming more important than morality to such women. And vainglorious men are treating ernai as trophies, parading them in public while their legal wives live in blissful ignorance.
"It's not just sex; men keep ernai for face as well," explains Feng. "They love to show off good catches to their friends and business associates. It's almost like you are not successful if you don't have an ernai."
Wang's current benefactor is one of those who likes to appear successful.
"He likes me to dress up glamorously and go to his business banquets," she says, playing with the sequins on her top. "I have lots of beautiful outfits. He also loves to introduce me as a singer."
Despite Wang exchanging her affections for material goods, she is outraged when men mistake her for a hostess who sells sex.
"However, an ernai is, by definition, a prostitute because the union between her and her patron is not based on emotions but on money or material benefits," says Professor Pan Suiming from Renmin University, author of China's Sex Industry. "The ernai are simply at the pinnacle of the prostitution hierarchy,"
Wang is not prepared to disclose how much her benefactor spends on her upkeep but Andy Liu, her agent and the man who looks after her karaoke discs, says that a girl of her "class" can expect to receive between 10,000 yuan and 20,000 yuan a month, excluding presents. According to Liu, about 80 per cent of those who support ernai in Shenzhen are businessmen from Hong Kong. Typically, they pay a DJ or a mama-san (a female pimp) to find a "girlfriend". "These guys all want young, pretty things; sweet-natured if possible."
"And why not?" asks a 55-year-old Hong Kong man who gives his name as Cheung. "I realised I was getting old and I can't take my money to the grave. My wife had long ago lost interest in bedroom activities. I needed some colour and excitement. If I can do that with my hard-earned money, why not?" Cheung spends weekends in Hong Kong with his wife and children and weekdays in Shenzhen, with a 26-year-old girl from Hubei province.
Zhao Tieling is an author and photographer who has written several books about prostitution. "Unlike the west, China is a despot society where there is still a strict hierarchy," he says. "Men with power always want concubines. The tradition was never wiped out, even during Mao Zedong's reign. He had quite a few women himself."
The fact that corruption and ernai go hand in hand seems to support Zhao's view. According to a recent article in Beijing News, 14 of the 16 most senior government officials convicted of corruption last year kept ernai. Zhao blames declining morals and a widening income gap.
Li Lingling's story is typical. "No girl wants to demean herself but the financial temptation is too big," she says, sitting in an open-air bar bustling with late-night merrymakers. Five years ago, when Li was 18, she left her village in Sichuan province and got a job selling beer at a western restaurant in Shenzhen. She has dimples and large, expressive eyes. "The owner was very pleased to hire a pretty girl," says Li, laughing. "In Shenzhen, most good-looking women become bar girls."
Li made 600 yuan in her first month. Then a friend got her a job in a karaoke bar, where she would provide men with company as they drank. Her salary leapt to 2,000 yuan. When the drinks and money had dulled her inhibitions, she started to sleep with clients. Then her salary soared to 4,000 yuan or 5,000 yuan a month.
"In the early days, I cried every night. But then, I told myself, I came here to make money to build a house for my grandma," she says, flicking back her hair, as if tossing away unpleasant thoughts.
Li's first "boyfriend" was a young Hong Kong engineer who worked in Shenzhen. He was transferred abroad a few months after the relationship had begun. For two years, she was kept by a man in his 40s who owned a trading company in Hong Kong. She refers to him as "Piggy".
"Piggy's fat but he paid me generously," Li says, adding that she recently bought that house for her grandmother.
Piggy wanted Li to stay at home but she had other ideas. "Why be idle when I can make money?" she says.
Li pretended to oblige Piggy but continued to work at the bar, although, she says, only as a drinking companion for men. She developed a text message code so her mama-san would know when Piggy was in town and she was unable to work.
Like many ernai, she has had genuine love affairs. One of them was with Wang's DJ, Liu. It was an intense on-and-off relationship that lasted for two years.
"I loved him. I think he loved me, too. But we argued so much. He was terribly jealous of Piggy. But what could I do?"
She recalls how they'd have violent fights, followed by passionate lovemaking. They'd make up and he would sing her sweet songs and talk about having a family together. "Then I realised that he would never marry me because he knew my background," she says.
Then Piggy took a new ernai. "Maybe he found something out. Or maybe he had just had enough of me," Li shrugs her thin shoulders.
Li now works as a mama-san at a karaoke bar a few blocks away from Lucky. She is looking for a new master. "It's much better to be an ernai than a 'chicken' [prostitute]. There's more security."
Her plan is to find a man to marry when she returns home in two years, when she's 25, with the money she has saved. No one from her hometown knows what she's been doing in Shenzhen.
Li may have to bide her time; business has slowed along with the economy. "People are going out less and spending less and giving us less tips. They're less likely to take an ernai now."
A few nightclubs and karaoke bars have shut down but "I don't think the ernai scene has been hit as badly as the sex industry", says Liu. "It has had an impact since some of the businessmen from Hong Kong work in the finance sector."
Fewer men are coming to him in search of a mistress and more girls are asking him to introduce them to a patron.
With or without the financial crisis, being an ernai can be a precarious existence. Like anyone making a living in the grey economy, ernai are vulnerable. Beijing lawyer Zheng Baichun has set up the website www.2n88.com for ernai and has dedicated himself to the protection of their rights.
"Don't get me wrong. I don't approve of taking ernai," he says in a Beijing cafe, taking off dark glasses - he is afraid of being recognised and insulted by women whose husbands have strayed. "But they have rights just as we do."
Since he set up the site, in June 2006, he has received hundreds of queries and helped dozens of women. One was a former maid who had become the ernai of a deputy minister in Beijing. After her second abortion, the minister promised to pay her 200,000 yuan but later retracted the offer. Zheng wrote to him, threatening to take the case public. His approach paid off.
Supported by some women's groups, Zheng has lobbied the government, urging it to class taking an ernai as bigamy, arguing that the practice is leading to the breakdown of family values and even poses a threat to social stability. He has so far had little success, although four provinces have passed legal guidelines to make divorce easier for women whose husbands who have kept an ernai.
Wang isn't particularly worried about the economic downturn. "There are always ups and downs. And people always need entertainment. Men always need women," she says. And there's little incentive for women like her to give up their way of life.
"Everyone makes use of their special talents. Why can't I make use of my beauty and charm?"
Sunday Post Magazine 15 February 2009I was told by a friend in sz that there are actually three ernai village areas. Been to one and find it quite interesting and very lively pretty much 24/7. As I commented before, there are always secret lives hidden behind those little cute China dolls that we see.
Mmlouie
OldAsiaHand
02-19-09, 12:35
Great post Tightway!! Really!!
You know what I appreciate most about you??
You truly are so full of shit - but its shit that you truly believe 100% in. No, that's true!! You are a genuine one of a kind!
Tightway,
I second the motion. You are always welcome to post your POV on this forum provided you do so according to the set guidelines.
I have a question for you. How any regular girls do you think you would score if you were completely straight up with them? I mean to tell them from the start that you only want to do them and move on rather than feeding them bull and giving them false hopes of looking for a g/f, getting married, foreign passport, taking them out of their misery, etc. I guess some guys will do whatever it takes to get laid for free, but I cannot con them the way you do.
I remember the day we met and went to KTV. Did you pay that KTV girl you left with or feed her the same bull to get her to do you for free? How would you like it if someone came to China and asked you to do some work for them here only to find out later that they left the country, did not pay you and never contacted you again after the work was done? Is this not the same scenario as doing a P4P girl and not paying her?
I get my share of regular girls, albeit not the numbers that you do, but I am always upfront with them from the start about my situation and intentions. I sleep better that way.
Just my POV.
OAH
OldAsiaHand
02-19-09, 12:39
Probably there is some kind of divide between the older and younger guys on this board regarding this issue, since it may be difficult for 60 yo's to find regular girls, so they get kind of snappy when you address the issue.
Phil1980,
Eaglestar is living proof that it is not difficult at all for 60 yo's to get regular girls. Just take a look at the Photo Gallery.
Just my POV.
OAH
Tightway,
I have a question for you. How any regular girls do you think you would score if you were completely straight up with them? I mean to tell them from the start that you only want to do them and move on rather than feeding them bull and giving them false hopes of looking for a g/f, getting married, foreign passport, taking them out of their misery, etc. I guess some guys will do whatever it takes to get laid for free, but I cannot con them the way you do.
I remember the day we met and went to KTV. Did you pay that KTV girl you left with or feed her the same bull to get her to do you for free? How would you like it if someone came to China and asked you to do some work for them here only to find out later that they left the country, did not pay you and never contacted you again after the work was done? Is this not the same scenario as doing a P4P girl and not paying her?
OAH
I totally agree. It is hard to image that anyone would be so cheap to lead a girl on thinking that there might be a future and then break her heart just so you can save a couple of bucks.
I think it is fair game if you are serious about a girl, date for a while but then find out you are not right for each other but to lie and cheap without any intention of a future with them is just wrong. I just hope what goes around comes around for these guys.
Please do tell. What are the signs of a bad girl that we seek?Like most of us, we look but we don't see or that we just refused to see.
Here's one; A Taiwanese friend of mine married a China girl years ago, she was very attractive and with a great figure. He once mentioned to us that he noticed that many men are smiling and saying Hi to her on the streets in her hometown. You think this is "big red sign"? To make a long story short, he married her anyway and you could guess the ending.
Trust your instincts, they are usually right. Sometimes you just need to ask yourself why a hot looking 20's China girl with a brick house body would be interested in a middle-age balding man with a beer potbelly? Btw, I was just making a point and was not in anyway directing this comment to you or anyone else. So, please do not take offense.
Mmlouie
SE Asia Joe
02-20-09, 08:43
Tightway,
I second the motion. You are always welcome to post your POV on this forum provided you do so according to the set guidelines.
I have a question for you. How any regular girls do you think you would score if you were completely straight up with them? I mean to tell them from the start that you only want to do them and move on rather than feeding them bull and giving them false hopes of looking for a g/f, getting married, foreign passport, taking them out of their misery, etc. I guess some guys will do whatever it takes to get laid for free, but I cannot con them the way you do.
I remember the day we met and went to KTV. Did you pay that KTV girl you left with or feed her the same bull to get her to do you for free? How would you like it if someone came to China and asked you to do some work for them here only to find out later that they left the country, did not pay you and never contacted you again after the work was done? Is this not the same scenario as doing a P4P girl and not paying her?
I get my share of regular girls, albeit not the numbers that you do, but I am always upfront with them from the start about my situation and intentions. I sleep better that way.
Just my POV.
OAH
WHOA Dere Pardner!!
As far as I know, Tightway had always been upfront with the gals he meets. Practically his first opening gambit had always been - I am LOOKING FOR a true love relationship and not just P4P or one night stands. Repeat - he does not lie to them about his intentions at all. He absolutely does NOT promise that he will definitely get serious with the gal.
NOw, what the gal's reaction to such an up-front proposition is of course her own choice. Amongst them:
- She finds him truly attractive and will try to snare him by hook or by crook
- She thinks - yeah right! OK, I'll go along with this nonsense and see how far it gets AND how much I can get in the end
- She don't know what to think - but just go with the flow - to see where it leads to - and will decide what to do when and wherever she gets to.
- whatever else....
But as far as I know/believe, Tightway does NOT promise them anything up-front.
At first of course I was VERY sceptical as to his "methods" - but what I found out as I got to know him better was .... TIGHTWAY REALY BELIEVES that he is on a search for his one true love.
I told him time and again that CP, Zhuhai KTV, BBS and Saunas are definitely NOT where he is gonna find his true love - and that to a very large extent, for him to search for such true love in such places is TOTALLY UNFAIR to the gals. The gals are not doing what they are doing searching for love but to make $$. BUT, he tells me that he doesn't mind where a gal is from and what she's doing - if it was meant to be, then it was meant to be.
Now, you guys will most probably say that this guy is so full of shit he should spend his whole life in the toilet - but from what I do know about him - he really believes that what he's doing is 100% correct.
Different Strokes for Different Folks - you go figure
SEAJ
Ps. I am NOT defending Tightway at all - but just relaying to you what I do know about him..
OldAsiaHand
02-20-09, 12:44
WHOA Dere Pardner!!
As far as I know, Tightway had always been upfront with the gals he meets. Practically his first opening gambit had always been - I am LOOKING FOR a true love relationship and not just P4P or one night stands. Repeat - he does not lie to them about his intentions at all. He absolutely does NOT promise that he will definitely get serious with the gal.
SEAJ,
First of all, I do not know Tightway as well as you do, However, have you ever been with Tightway when he chatted up a girl? Were you with him in his hotel room when he was trying to get in her pants? Have you talked with any of his rejects? I remember he pulled his shit with one in CP and she called the cops on him when he refused to pay her.
IMHO, "I am LOOKING FOR a true love relationship" is one in the same. What comes with a "true love relationship"?
Now, maybe he really believes that he wants to fall in love with every girl he meets on the street. Whether he directly promises anything is not important. The "LOOKING FOR" line is enough to give them false hopes.
Just my POV.
OAH
Vista Sushi
02-20-09, 22:19
Trust your instincts, they are usually right. Sometimes you just need to ask yourself why a hot looking 20's China girl with a brick house body would be interested in a middle-age balding man with a beer potbelly? Btw, I was just making a point and was not in anyway directing this comment to you or anyone else. So, please do not take offense.
MmlouieNo offense taken. Mainly because I don't fit your description. Yet. Time and copious beer consumption will take care of that.
Along with this thread I found the following web page pretty helpful to figure out a mess that I got myself into.
http://middlekingdomlife.com/wp/relationships/dating-etiquette-relationships-and-sex-in-China/
The sections I refer to are these:
"Much to your surprise, and, paradoxically perhaps (in light of the relative importance of virginity at marriage), you will find many that many girls are actually eager to sleep with you on the second or third date (in fact, they are often the ones to initiate it), but you should exercise extreme caution in how that apparent sexual aggressiveness is interpreted: For most "good" Chinese girls, an offer of sex is almost always a gesture of good faith in contemplation of marriage. It’s intended to be a binding dealmaker and that is how it should be responded to, one way or the other. "
AND
"Finally, Chinese girls who have lived with or even dated Western men are extremely limited in their future marriage options if the relationship doesn’t last (which then often leads to a forced pattern of serial monogamous cohabitating relationships with foreign men exclusively). Outside the three major international cities, it is highly unlikely you will encounter an unmarried Chinese girl, under the age of 35, who is only looking for a "friend with benefits. " If this is all you are interested in, then you must be clear about that from the outset. "
In any case, I got caught up with a girl that dated an English teacher about a year ago. Apparently, they were getting near to marriage and he took off to live back in the States. As a side note, that could have meant 3 dates for all I know. But in any case he met the family. So, that devastated her because now she's got the public stigma of losing a guy (and face). Now, she's pretty much on the hunt for his replacement. She tagged me as that guy, but I ain't having it. Now it's time to milk it or run.
In any case, the site if full of some guy's opinion, but for guys that don't have much experience with the Chinese woman, it seems like a good start.
EDITOR'S NOTE: I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.
Vista Sushi
02-20-09, 22:30
I spend a reasonable amount of time RTFF and have tried to contribute some along the way. And, I must say the research supporting my publications has for the most time been pretty fun. And when it isn't fun, it has been insightful. I've played at a few sauna's and picked up some WGs. I've even struck up some pen pal relationships that turned into meetings. But, most of these girls are in their early 20s. I'm not complaining.
But, a lot can be said about an older (35+) Chinese woman. First, they look better than the Caucasian version (in most cases). Second, they seem reasonably open to having action on the side since there is an assumption their husband is doing the same.
But, how do you find them? Where do they congregate? How much time goes into grooming them for action?
Old Mean Dog
02-21-09, 05:19
Like most of us, we look but we don't see or that we just refused to see.
Here's one; A Taiwanese friend of mine married a China girl years ago, she was very attractive and with a great figure. He once mentioned to us that he noticed that many men are smiling and saying Hi to her on the streets in her hometown. You think this is "big red sign"? To make a long story short, he married her anyway and you could guess the ending.
Trust your instincts, they are usually right. Sometimes you just need to ask yourself why a hot looking 20's China girl with a brick house body would be interested in a middle-age balding man with a beer potbelly? Btw, I was just making a point and was not in anyway directing this comment to you or anyone else. So, please do not take offense.
Mmlouie
Would it matter if she was Chinese, Russian, American, Thai, etc. If I am with a gal and many men are coming up to her and saying Hi, then I would safely figure she probably gets around and is a *****.
This is not some "Secret" Chinese good girl/bad girl detection method, this is just common sense.
Enrich us with something more than this.
-CPE
Would it matter if she was Chinese, Russian, American, Thai, etc. If I am with a gal and many men are coming up to her and saying Hi, then I would safely figure she probably gets around and is a *****.
This is not some "Secret" Chinese good girl/bad girl detection method, this is just common sense.
Enrich us with something more than this.
-CPEWell, this girl happens to be a very popular sauna girl. We look but we don't see.
Mmlouie
Would it matter if she was Chinese, Russian, American, Thai, etc. If I am with a gal and many men are coming up to her and saying Hi, then I would safely figure she probably gets around and is a *****.
This is not some "Secret" Chinese good girl/bad girl detection method, this is just common sense.
Enrich us with something more than this.
-CPEChinese have a old saying addressing someone in particular as "马夫".
Mmlouie
Old Mean Dog
02-21-09, 05:37
WHOA Dere Pardner!!
As far as I know, Tightway had always been upfront with the gals he meets. Practically his first opening gambit had always been - I am LOOKING FOR a true love relationship and not just P4P or one night stands. Repeat - he does not lie to them about his intentions at all. He absolutely does NOT promise that he will definitely get serious with the gal.
SEAJ
Ps. I am NOT defending Tightway at all - but just relaying to you what I do know about him..
Yes and No.
Maybe he can justify his actions, by saying he is seeking out his one true love/perfect match, but in the process of finding her, he will sample any and all gals to seek her out.
If he wants to play this with P4P gals, then it becomes a game of one bullshits the other, but when he uses this game on the common, hardworking, sometimes a bit nieve girls, then it's bad news.
As you are fully aware, many girls in China have a strong desire to marry and have children, it's the holy grail for them. As many have already said, it's difficult enough for a common Chinese girl to be with a foreigner, let alone end up being used by one.
If he is so sincere, in finding love, why is he in such a hurry to get into her pants?
Love 'Em and Leave 'Em or I Love You Till I Cum?
I have met Tightway, he seems to be a nice guy, I just hope he ain't like the guy mentioned above.
-CPE
Old Mean Dog
02-23-09, 08:00
Chinese have a old saying addressing someone in particular as "马夫".
Mmlouie
Ahhh...this means Groom or an another sense Stableman. I am not seeing the connection here.
Do you mean "she" keeps a stable of fellas?
-CPE
Hey guys,
I'm not sure about stereotyping here, but has anyone noticed that Chinese women seem to have larger labia minora (inner lips) and smaller clit protrusion than other races? I'm not trying to get technical here, just don't know how else to ask the question?
Thanks,
MD40
Ahhh...this means Groom or an another sense Stableman. I am not seeing the connection here.
Do you mean "she" keeps a stable of fellas?
-CPEIf you go by the book, that will be the translation. Local lingo and meanings are not translatable, just like jarring. for example; 鲍鱼 does not mean abalone in local lingo.
Mmlouie
If you go by the book, that will be the translation. Local lingo and meanings are not translatable, just like jarring. for example; 鲍鱼 does not mean abalone in local lingo.
MmlouieIn mongering context 马夫 (mafu) "in local lingo" just means pimp, moreso one who is connected to organized crime.
马夫 itself refers to a (junior) member of a gang / triad. So a 马夫 might be tasked to pimp-out girls, manage brothels, as "drivers" or "bodyguards" for streetwalkers or outcall girls, as intermediaries, money collectors, etc.
I concede Mmlouie's knowledge "in local lingo" might be as superior as his English.
Old Mean Dog
02-24-09, 14:04
If you go by the book, that will be the translation. Local lingo and meanings are not translatable, just like jarring. for example; 鲍鱼 does not mean abalone in local lingo.
Mmlouie
You've lost me once again and I'm still waiting on your special method of determining a good girl from a bad girl in China.
As far as jarring is concerned, besides the examples already mentioned, I have heard this to mean the same as kind of like arguing or talking shit with someone.
-CPE
SE Asia Joe
02-25-09, 11:21
Hey guys,
I'm not sure about stereotyping here, but has anyone noticed that Chinese women seem to have larger labia minora (inner lips) and smaller clit protrusion than other races? I'm not trying to get technical here, just don't know how else to ask the question?
Thanks,
MD40
Have you ever considered that its perhaps that the Chinese gals are generally thinner than some of the beached whales in Western countries?
And thus relatively, their labia minora appear to stick out more instead of being all enfolded amongst all that blubber?
And no I ain't bein' technical either - for sticking out, sticking in, even flat 'uns - they're all good!!
SEAJ
SE Asia Joe
02-25-09, 12:05
SEAJ,
First of all, I do not know Tightway as well as you do, However, have you ever been with Tightway when he chatted up a girl? Were you with him in his hotel room when he was trying to get in her pants? Have you talked with any of his rejects? I remember he pulled his shit with one in CP and she called the cops on him when he refused to pay her.
IMHO, "I am LOOKING FOR a true love relationship" is one in the same. What comes with a "true love relationship"?
Now, maybe he really believes that he wants to fall in love with every girl he meets on the street. Whether he directly promises anything is not important. The "LOOKING FOR" line is enough to give them false hopes.
Just my POV.
OAH
No to all that - but yes I've talked to a few of the gals he managed to bag - and they invariably were all starry eyed and ever so pliant in his hands. Nothing surprising in all this you say? Well, howzabout this - one of the gals who fits the above description, he had met her at the Peninsula KTV - and that evening, she was the ultimate hardened Pro - to the point that I told Tightway that he's really got his hands full that evening. His answer? No, but I really really like her and I will do anything to get to know her better.
I mean - the guy was - and I guess still is - totally striaghtforward with me and with them. I guess that's part of his "Charm" AND NO - I do NOT condone his actions at all! I keep on reminding him that for him to try to fall in love - or get the gal to fall for him, WHEN SHE IS A WG (whether KTV, BBS, or Sauna) is just NOT fair and is like shooting fish in a barrel. But the thing about it all is that Tightway truly believes that he is going to be able to find his true love - whether she is presently a WG or not. Amazing! and I KNOW you guys think that I must be an idiot for believing Tightway. But hell, as you would say OAH, this is only my POV!
And by the way, that calling the police - actually it was Tightway who called the police. He had "courted" the gal whilst emphasising several times that he is only after true love and NOT going to pay (according to him, yes true, but methinks this is not a lie), and when it was time to part, she then asked him for $$. Typical Tightway, he refusesdto pay - telling her over and over again - hey, I already told you that we are going to make love becasue we both want to make love - and there's no question about $$. She then threatened him, begged him... and then started to tear up his clothing and threatening to tear it all up unless he paid her. Which was when tightway called the Police. YES - can you believe this guy - he actually called the police and complained..... and the police actually removed the gal. Amazing!!
SEAJ
On the other hand, I did also hear about some of the "shit" he got into in the Zhuhai Saunas - nasty there I heard.
Hey guys,
I'm not sure about stereotyping here, but has anyone noticed that Chinese women seem to have larger labia minora (inner lips) and smaller clit protrusion than other races? I'm not trying to get technical here, just don't know how else to ask the question?
Thanks,
MD40No I would say smaller maybe my tongues getting bigger with the workouts.But its not a true comparison as most are under 25 compared with the 50 year old seals back in the states .
Huckleberryfinn
02-25-09, 22:46
I spend a reasonable amount of time RTFF and have tried to contribute some along the way. And, I must say the research supporting my publications has for the most time been pretty fun. And when it isn't fun, it has been insightful. I've played at a few sauna's and picked up some WGs. I've even struck up some pen pal relationships that turned into meetings. But, most of these girls are in their early 20s. I'm not complaining.
But, a lot can be said about an older (35+) Chinese woman. First, they look better than the Caucasian version (in most cases). Second, they seem reasonably open to having action on the side since there is an assumption their husband is doing the same.
But, how do you find them? Where do they congregate? How much time goes into grooming them for action?Simple. Let them come to you. Try dateinasiaDOTcom. I've met two women, one 38, the other 44. Both very much into Western guys. Fun to go out with in addition to doing the horizontal tango. And you are correct. They look MUCH better than Western gals their age, for the most part. There are exceptions on both sides, but as a rule, you get a good 15 extra years of fine looks from an asian woman. That's why I married one.
Huckleberryfinn
02-25-09, 22:51
"Finally, Chinese girls who have lived with or even dated Western men are extremely limited in their future marriage options if the relationship doesn’t last (which then often leads to a forced pattern of serial monogamous cohabitating relationships with foreign men exclusively).
EDITOR'S NOTE: I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.First, I agree that your post is outstanding. Regarding the above quote, it is partially true. In China today, so many women travel to other areas to find work (read: away from their families) that they have more opportunity to be out on their own, sexually and/or romantically speaking. If things don't work out, who's to know?
Huck
Mr Big Johnson
03-07-09, 18:51
No I would say smaller maybe my tongues getting bigger with the workouts.But its not a true comparison as most are under 25 compared with the 50 year old seals back in the states .That is a funny post. I do find some of the woman small like others though there are all sizes of snatches. I find it curious how there are so many with a mole right on or near the snatch.
I do find on a whole that Chineese woman are not as sexy as other Asians, but there are so many that I do not mind banging one after another every other day.
Johnson,
I suppose your comment that Chinese girls are not as sexy as other asians is just a matter of personal opinion. But perhaps you haven't met many types of Chinese women yet. I can tell you that with such a huge population, China's got every shape, type and sexiness imaginable.
I've gone to other countries, Thailand, phillipines, japan, korea etc. Chinese in my opinion still ranks as the best looking out of the whole bunch. Yeah some of the south east asian girls are a bit more wild, like threesomes etc. But in terms of looks, they don't come anywhere close to the beauty of Chinese girls.
AsnDragon
That is a funny post. I do find some of the woman small like others though there are all sizes of snatches. I find it curious how there are so many with a mole right on or near the snatch.
I do find on a whole that Chineese woman are not as sexy as other Asians, but there are so many that I do not mind banging one after another every other day.
I suppose your comment that Chinese girls are not as sexy as other asians is just a matter of personal opinion.
AsnDragonThat's ok, AsnDragon.
Mr. Big Johnson is allow to have his own opinion.
Which mean, more for me and you to enjoy.
Mmlouie
Mmlouie,
Agreed! More for you and I to choose from.
I must say one thing though. It's great to be a guy in China though. I mean all these working girls are busting their ass to earn money either working in a factory or working as a Xiaojie to earn a few bucks here and there to bring back money home for their brother to go to school, brother to have money to get married and buy a house. It's as if all guys in China are all spoon fed or something. On top of that these guys there feel that it's their right to have their sister go out there and sacrifice their time, effort and youth in exchange for him having a plusher lifestyle. It's amazing, but Chinese girls are pretty damn hardworking. And many, NOT ALL, of the Chinese guys are just completely useless.
Many of the girls that get into becoming a working girl, is either tricked into the trade by a boyfriend, or doing it for a useless brother back home in their village somewhere etc. In any case Chinese girl really do sacrifice themselves for others, a very amiable trait I must say.
I may be stereotyping and all, but this is what I've encountered in my years in China.
AsnDragon
That's ok, AsnDragon.
Mr. Big Johnson is allow to have his own opinion.
Which mean, more for me and you to enjoy.
Mmlouie
OldAsiaHand
03-14-09, 09:04
I have been in Asia a long time and done girls from every country. It depends on what you are looking for. IMHO, the top Chinese stunners are the best looking, however, there are stunners in every Asian country. On the other hand, if it is service you are after, Chinese girls rank very low on my scale in comparison. This may be a preference issue. Chinese girls are far less laowai friendly than their Asian counterparts.
Just my POV.
OAH
On the other hand, if it is service you are after, Chinese girls rank very low on my scale in comparison. This may be a preference issue. Chinese girls are far less laowai friendly than their Asian counterparts.
Just my POV.
OAHAs a general statement, I do agree with you.
Oah,
Well what I've noticed is. While other countries are more westernized, having the mentality "the bigger the penis the better the sex is"--Japan, taiwan, Korea etc.
China is the opposite it appears, they don't like it big.
Strange but true. .
However, I do agree with you, that the stunners in China are the best. And it think in terms of service, Chinese working girls are not that great, but when you find a non-working Chinese girl who passionately is in love with you, they actually get fairly wild in bed though. I'm sure you've gotten many of those scenarios from all of your freebies you've accumulated over the years.
AsnDragon
I have been in Asia a long time and done girls from every country. It depends on what you are looking for. IMHO, the top Chinese stunners are the best looking, however, there are stunners in every Asian country. On the other hand, if it is service you are after, Chinese girls rank very low on my scale in comparison. This may be a preference issue. Chinese girls are far less laowai friendly than their Asian counterparts.
Just my POV.
OAH
I have been in Asia a long time and done girls from every country. It depends on what you are looking for. IMHO, the top Chinese stunners are the best looking, however, there are stunners in every Asian country. On the other hand, if it is service you are after, Chinese girls rank very low on my scale in comparison. This may be a preference issue. Chinese girls are far less laowai friendly than their Asian counterparts.
Just my POV.
OAHI totally agreed about their fears of laowais. I believes that their greatest fears is to be stretched out. I found that once they tried a "gentle" laowai/gweilo their fears diminish dramtically providing that the laowai did not have a "supersize" thingy. I think most of them fear the size. When they ask me about it, I usually respond that I have never tried it either. Being an abc I tell them that they are safe with me. I just love being a nice to them. I try to be cordial and tell them that they are probably right about their fears. Just my 2rmb on this.
OldAsiaHand
03-15-09, 13:21
However, I do agree with you, that the stunners in China are the best. And it think in terms of service, Chinese working girls are not that great, but when you find a non-working Chinese girl who passionately is in love with you, they actually get fairly wild in bed though. I'm sure you've gotten many of those scenarios from all of your freebies you've accumulated over the years. AsnDragon
AsnDragon,
I was referring mostly to working girls, however, even the Chinese freebies I have had pale in comparison with freebies in Thailand for example. Yes, the passion adds to the experience in any case, but I think other countries' girls are more "in to it". This may be because they have less inhibitions about sex in the first place. Most of the freebies in China have less experience and fewer partners.
Just my POV.
OAH
Bored In Beijing
03-16-09, 08:35
However, I do agree with you, that the stunners in China are the best. And it think in terms of service, Chinese working girls are not that great, but when you find a non-working Chinese girl who passionately is in love with you, they actually get fairly wild in bed though. I'm sure you've gotten many of those scenarios from all of your freebies you've accumulated over the years.
AsnDragon
I happen to agree here. I think part of it is that a lot of Chinese WG's tend to focus on the cash and not the service they have to perform to get the cash.
I think this is illustrated by the hierarchy in the Den. You have the Mongolians going up to men, having a laugh making an effort and hoping you will take them home. The Russians tend to sit at a table and expect you to go up to them. They believe their blonde hair and looks are good enough, but at least they are in the bar making some effort. Then there are the Chinese who hang around outside, not even trying to make an effort but hoping to score with someone as they leave.
Of course, freebies/regulars are different and far more wild and less concerned with cold hard cash.
Just my opinion.
SE Asia Joe
03-18-09, 04:20
Apologies that I am double posting the following:
Sick sick SICKOS
Ths takes the cake. These damn sickos!
Just happened on to a conversation amongst some mongers and one of them was relating a new "Trick" he had just learned and espousing others there to do the same.
Baby Oil - he tells us that if you use baby oil - convince the gals to give a preliminary hand job, and better still, convince them to use such on themselves for more pleasure/less pain or whatever - that the condom will break at least 50% of the time. And thus allowing him to bare back her. Not a care about her getting pregnant - or worse - getting VD from this sicko. He was even relating how wonderful that release/pop of the rubber feels.
I was of two minds about writing this - as I know that there ARE sickos out there who will now use this trick to carry out their sick desires - but at the same time, I am hoping and asking the rest of you to get the word out to your friends, favorite gals,, even mommies that there are sickos out there who are using this trick.
I do believe that the large majority of us here on this board are fair minded gentlemen who just happens to enjoy mongering; and thus this post.
Thank you Gents.
SEAJ
Loveasiangirls
03-18-09, 09:04
Good post SE Asia Joe. You are right, posting this is a double edge sword but maybe that should be part of what they learn in training!
Apologies that I am double posting the following:
Sick sick SICKOS
Ths takes the cake. These damn sickos!
Baby Oil - he tells us that if you use baby oil - convince the gals to give a preliminary hand job, and better still, convince them to use such on themselves for more pleasure/less pain or whatever - that the condom will break at least 50% of the time.
It's true and it's sick. If you need lubrication, use a water based, latex safe product. Best is Pjur Bodyglide from Germany.
I just discovered this website and this is my first post. I've been to China 3 times over the past 3 years. My first time there I went with a group from my university to study the language and culture for a summer semester. It was a lot of fun, and while riding around Kunming on some piece of shit bike I bought for 50 yuan I found, what I think you guys call BBS shops. Little shops in the wall with pink lights or whatever. Before I went to China I didn't know these existed here, but wow! I had a great time with a few girls there, first time with hookers.
After all my fun I met a girl, a student not a working girl, but we kept in touch for over a year. I don't know what the hell I did, but we decided to get married. I am still young (25) and in school and after almost 2 years of marriage I told her I want a divorce. I've realized I'm highly unlikely to change from who I am in relationships. Every serious girlfriend I've had I have become bored after a year or two. Especially in the bedroom but also my love, for example my wife is beautiful and I still think she is sexy and I still have some love for her, but very very rarely do I actually want to have sex with her, I'd rathr jerk off honestly.
I've come to the decision that I never want to get married again or get into some very serious relationship, and I don't care about having kids either. I'm hoping to become a China monger like some of you guys here! It's the life I want! Of course I need to save up money and I'm sure it will be a least 10 years before I could come there on a more permanent basis. I'm taking the big first step towards this dream by divorcing my wife which is actually hard because I want her to be happy and end up with a good guy, a guy that wants a family and settle down with one girl. I told her I wanted a divorce 5 days ago and she has been trying like hell to change my mind and crying like crazy and I had to stop her from swalling a bottle of sleeping pills. She doesn't really have any good friends here for her to talk to. She doesn't want to go back to China, I told her she can live in the apartment until she finds someone else and I'll help her get the 10 year green card, its just so fucking hard hearing her crying and begging me to stay every day. Thank god I don't have a nickel to my name as a student, can't wait for this to be over.
Mr Big Johnson
03-21-09, 16:18
That's ok, AsnDragon.
Mr. Big Johnson is allow to have his own opinion.
Which mean, more for me and you to enjoy.
MmlouieDon't take it so serious fellers.
I don't mind a few moles as stated, and there are plenty to be had. I may be a bit different than your average poster as when I visit these boards I tend to post what I see and without regard to "how hard girls work", and the other liberal stuff. To me all that does not matter it is just the sex and experience.
I have had some great ones as well, just do not find them as attractive as say Koreans or Vietnamese girls. It is not to say you can't find some pretty ones. I have had many believe me that would make you cream your jeans just to look.
I have as well had many three ways and more, had two cousins once even do each other while I watched. So kind of don't understand that post saying they won't perform those sex acts, as for me it is quite easy to find.
Geeez
Chengdude=1st class, card carrying, dues paying ass hole.
Be careful what you wish for, cuz you might get it.
ES
Pointpanic
03-21-09, 23:16
Chengdude,
I'll interpret ES' comments for you. You violated mankind's basic code of human ethics. "Do unto others as you would have others do unto you." The Golden Rule. Your immature actions have caused great harm to an innocent. You did not understand the cultural differences. Woe to any girl in China or elsewhere that falls for you. Who is to blame? Think about it. You made your bed so now lie in it or work on it.
You are respnsible for her well-being.
A Disgusted Senior Member,
PP
I just discovered this website and this is my first post. I've been to China 3 times over the past 3 years. My first time there I went with a group from my university to study the language and culture for a summer semester. It was a lot of fun, and while riding around Kunming on some piece of shit bike I bought for 50 yuan I found, what I think you guys call BBS shops. Little shops in the wall with pink lights or whatever. Before I went to China I didn't know these existed here, but wow! I had a great time with a few girls there, first time with hookers.
After all my fun I met a girl, a student not a working girl, but we kept in touch for over a year. I don't know what the hell I did, but we decided to get married. I am still young (25) and in school and after almost 2 years of marriage I told her I want a divorce. I've realized I'm highly unlikely to change from who I am in relationships. Every serious girlfriend I've had I have become bored after a year or two. Especially in the bedroom but also my love, for example my wife is beautiful and I still think she is sexy and I still have some love for her, but very very rarely do I actually want to have sex with her, I'd rathr jerk off honestly.
I've come to the decision that I never want to get married again or get into some very serious relationship, and I don't care about having kids either. I'm hoping to become a China monger like some of you guys here! It's the life I want! Of course I need to save up money and I'm sure it will be a least 10 years before I could come there on a more permanent basis. I'm taking the big first step towards this dream by divorcing my wife which is actually hard because I want her to be happy and end up with a good guy, a guy that wants a family and settle down with one girl. I told her I wanted a divorce 5 days ago and she has been trying like hell to change my mind and crying like crazy and I had to stop her from swalling a bottle of sleeping pills. She doesn't really have any good friends here for her to talk to. She doesn't want to go back to China, I told her she can live in the apartment until she finds someone else and I'll help her get the 10 year green card, its just so fucking hard hearing her crying and begging me to stay every day. Thank god I don't have a nickel to my name as a student, can't wait for this to be over.
I just discovered this website and this is my first post. I've been to China 3 times over the past 3 years. My first time there I went with a group from my university to study the language and culture for a summer semester. It was a lot of fun, and while riding around Kunming on some piece of shit bike I bought for 50 yuan I found, what I think you guys call BBS shops. Little shops in the wall with pink lights or whatever. Before I went to China I didn't know these existed here, but wow! I had a great time with a few girls there, first time with hookers.
After all my fun I met a girl, a student not a working girl, but we kept in touch for over a year. I don't know what the hell I did, but we decided to get married. I am still young (25) and in school and after almost 2 years of marriage I told her I want a divorce. I've realized I'm highly unlikely to change from who I am in relationships. Every serious girlfriend I've had I have become bored after a year or two. Especially in the bedroom but also my love, for example my wife is beautiful and I still think she is sexy and I still have some love for her, but very very rarely do I actually want to have sex with her, I'd rathr jerk off honestly.
I've come to the decision that I never want to get married again or get into some very serious relationship, and I don't care about having kids either. I'm hoping to become a China monger like some of you guys here! It's the life I want! Of course I need to save up money and I'm sure it will be a least 10 years before I could come there on a more permanent basis. I'm taking the big first step towards this dream by divorcing my wife which is actually hard because I want her to be happy and end up with a good guy, a guy that wants a family and settle down with one girl. I told her I wanted a divorce 5 days ago and she has been trying like hell to change my mind and crying like crazy and I had to stop her from swalling a bottle of sleeping pills. She doesn't really have any good friends here for her to talk to. She doesn't want to go back to China, I told her she can live in the apartment until she finds someone else and I'll help her get the 10 year green card, its just so fucking hard hearing her crying and begging me to stay every day. Thank god I don't have a nickel to my name as a student, can't wait for this to be over.
You are too young and immature to marry. I guess you married her in order to get her here . If you do not have romantic feeling to have sex with her then it is over.
The fact is some girls are happy to be here in america and some are not. You should let her socialize with local chinese population . It is not likely in here that somebody will marry her immediately. Here as you know dating takes precedence over marriage. Most of these girls do not know dating having lived in a rigid society.
Divorce or simply abandoning wife is very common in China. In most of the divorce initiated by the man the women will cry and try to hold on to the marriage. But it is no reason to stay together.
Another thing is you married her with poor financial situation. All south asian women think Americans are rich.
You may say now that you will pay for her apartment etc. But she gets the divorce you are unlikely to keep your promise.
She doesn't want to go back to China, I told her she can live in the apartment until she finds someone else and I'll help her get the 10 year green cardDo you mean that in two years you still haven't got her a green card yet? You must be kidding? It doesn't sound like you guys are actually married so the million dollar question is: Where did you guys married and what visa did she use to get here?
Being that if she been here for almost two years, I could get her a permanent green card without any problem what so ever. Legally!
Chocha Monger
03-22-09, 00:35
Chengdude,
If you divorce your wife before she gets her permanent green card she'll be deported back to China. You'll have to stay in the marriage, if you really want to help her, until she gets a permanent green card. Anyway, I am not going to pass judgment on you because I don't know why the both of you got married. If you promised her a green card or anything else to get her to marry you and leave China then you should at least keep your end of the bargain. From what you said it sounds like you knew that the relationship wasn't going to last for more than two years but you decided to get married anyway.
Have you told your wife the real reason that you want to get divorced?
I just discovered this website and this is my first post. I've been to China 3 times over the past 3 years. My first time there I went with a group from my university to study the language and culture for a summer semester. It was a lot of fun, and while riding around Kunming on some piece of shit bike I bought for 50 yuan I found, what I think you guys call BBS shops. Little shops in the wall with pink lights or whatever. Before I went to China I didn't know these existed here, but wow! I had a great time with a few girls there, first time with hookers.
After all my fun I met a girl, a student not a working girl, but we kept in touch for over a year. I don't know what the hell I did, but we decided to get married. I am still young (25) and in school and after almost 2 years of marriage I told her I want a divorce. I've realized I'm highly unlikely to change from who I am in relationships. Every serious girlfriend I've had I have become bored after a year or two. Especially in the bedroom but also my love, for example my wife is beautiful and I still think she is sexy and I still have some love for her, but very very rarely do I actually want to have sex with her, I'd rathr jerk off honestly.
I've come to the decision that I never want to get married again or get into some very serious relationship, and I don't care about having kids either. I'm hoping to become a China monger like some of you guys here! It's the life I want! Of course I need to save up money and I'm sure it will be a least 10 years before I could come there on a more permanent basis. I'm taking the big first step towards this dream by divorcing my wife which is actually hard because I want her to be happy and end up with a good guy, a guy that wants a family and settle down with one girl. I told her I wanted a divorce 5 days ago and she has been trying like hell to change my mind and crying like crazy and I had to stop her from swalling a bottle of sleeping pills. She doesn't really have any good friends here for her to talk to. She doesn't want to go back to China, I told her she can live in the apartment until she finds someone else and I'll help her get the 10 year green card, its just so fucking hard hearing her crying and begging me to stay every day. Thank god I don't have a nickel to my name as a student, can't wait for this to be over.
I normally don’t post on the on this board but your post struck a real cord with me as I am in a similar situation. I am not married but do have a LTR. At any rate what is your reason for the divorce…to monger with prostitutes or you think you can do better in the relationship department? Mine is a little of both.
If you’re only doing this to chase prostitutes I think that is really disheartening in all aspects but it’s your decision to make. I mean to give up a decent woman only to chase after the filth we brag about on these boards is ridiculous but at least your being a man and attempting to not do it behind her back.
Is she overweight, bitchy, financially draining?
Unless you are abnormal you will get tired. Mongering becomes like the old “hamster on the wheel” sort of thing at first it’s fun and exciting but after a while it becomes boring same routine different place. A vicious cycle starts you will want to quit but can't. You will then start to chase normal women again but the monger in you will expose himself.
You say you are not that old. In your 20s. At most mongering venues as I have discovered I am the youngest guy as I am in my 20s. I hit the gym, wear fine clothes then I see the older guy with gut the tank top shirt with stain and he can have the same girls I can have in this place for a few bucks. I ask myself questions like what am I doing here?
Destruction Of Feelings:
Some guys can live without the emotional connect from a woman can you? Once you start mongering full time your chance at a normal life will be destroyed forever. You will only view women as good for sex. No longer will their companionship be good enough no matter how unique she really is.
Pitfalls:
Potentially dangerous situations. Just read these pages of guys getting drugged and robbed, rogue prostitution establishments making patrons pay excessive tabs under threat of an ass whipping etc…this mongering world is not all glamour and glitz….
man take some time away from her and get your thoughts together and think about what you really want out of life before you walk down that lonely mongering road and trust me regardless of what some these guys say on these boards mongering is a lonely road…
When you are caught in a some jam it will be only be you who has to deal with the consequences.
I just discovered this website and this is my first post. I've been to China 3 times over the past 3 years. My first time there I went with a group from my university to study the language and culture for a summer semester. It was a lot of fun, and while riding around Kunming on some piece of shit bike I bought for 50 yuan I found, what I think you guys call BBS shops. Little shops in the wall with pink lights or whatever. Before I went to China I didn't know these existed here, but wow! I had a great time with a few girls there, first time with hookers.
After all my fun I met a girl, a student not a working girl, but we kept in touch for over a year. I don't know what the hell I did, but we decided to get married. I am still young (25) and in school and after almost 2 years of marriage I told her I want a divorce. I've realized I'm highly unlikely to change from who I am in relationships. Every serious girlfriend I've had I have become bored after a year or two. Especially in the bedroom but also my love, for example my wife is beautiful and I still think she is sexy and I still have some love for her, but very very rarely do I actually want to have sex with her, I'd rathr jerk off honestly.
I've come to the decision that I never want to get married again or get into some very serious relationship, and I don't care about having kids either. I'm hoping to become a China monger like some of you guys here! It's the life I want! Of course I need to save up money and I'm sure it will be a least 10 years before I could come there on a more permanent basis. I'm taking the big first step towards this dream by divorcing my wife which is actually hard because I want her to be happy and end up with a good guy, a guy that wants a family and settle down with one girl. I told her I wanted a divorce 5 days ago and she has been trying like hell to change my mind and crying like crazy and I had to stop her from swalling a bottle of sleeping pills. She doesn't really have any good friends here for her to talk to. She doesn't want to go back to China, I told her she can live in the apartment until she finds someone else and I'll help her get the 10 year green card, its just so fucking hard hearing her crying and begging me to stay every day. Thank god I don't have a nickel to my name as a student, can't wait for this to be over.
I'm hearin' ya bro. Actually my situation is the opposite. I'm in my late 20s, been to China a dozen times, just for the women, and hope to get married to a girl living in Central China later this year, only so I can have a sex partner whenever I want without paying for it.
And actually mongering does suck. I've been disrespected by Chinese prostitutes more times than I care to remember, I've been stabbed by a pimp, I've had my face beaten in, just to tell some of the happy Chinese mongering stories.
Chengdude,
If you divorce your wife before she gets her permanent green card she'll be deported back to China. You'll have to stay in the marriage, if you really want to help her, until she gets a permanent green card. Anyway, I am not going to pass judgment on you because I don't know why the both of you got married. If you promised her a green card or anything else to get her to marry you and leave China then you should at least keep your end of the bargain. From what you said it sounds like you knew that the relationship wasn't going to last for more than two years but you decided to get married anyway.
Have you told your wife the real reason that you want to get divorced?That is not entirely true, she will not be deported providing if she already have a temporary green card. If the marriage was performed in China, temporary green card will be issued within the 6 weeks of her arrival. Then it would take from 12 months to 18 months for the permanent green card to come through, providing if all the papers were filled out correctly. If the marriage was performed within the US, temporary green card in around three months and permanent will be issued within the year. This time line varies from city to city, I am just quoting the California filling center as a reference.
I do not know all the circumstances on his case and we did not do his paperwork, so I cannot comment on why it would take two years to get her permanent green card. But something is not adding up! Just IMHO!
SE Asia Joe
03-22-09, 09:58
Chengdude,
I'll interpret ES' comments for you. You violated mankind's basic code of human ethics. "Do unto others as you would have others do unto you." The Golden Rule. Your immature actions have caused great harm to an innocent. You did not understand the cultural differences. Woe to any girl in China or elsewhere that falls for you. Who is to blame? Think about it. You made your bed so now lie in it or work on it.
You are respnsible for her well-being.
A Disgusted Senior Member,
PP
Chengdude - did you really think that just because we here ARE mongers - that we're all gonna rally around you and tell you - Right On Man! That's the way to go!
Well, let me tell you that even though we here ARE mongers - it does not mean that the majority of us are not normal human beings too - with conscience, compassion and sense of what is wrong and what is truly right.
Please re-examine your own conscience and ask yourself if what you're doing meets the means test of what it takes to be a responsible and mature male. Ask yourself if in all good conscience if you truly should just abandon her. Even if just cannot stay in the marriage, I hope that you will still make ALL provisions for her future well being. You owe her that little bit.
Just IMHO - but I do hope that you will reconsider your actions - perhaps even discuss it with some of your friends/relatives before you do something which I do believe you will regret in the future.
SEAJ
SE Asia Joe
03-22-09, 10:25
And talkin' about foolishness..... one of my regular gals asked for my advise/further directions about this poor sap from "the other board" who she been stringing along.
My gal is not a "regular" WG in the classic sense in that she plays the "innocent" card so well - so much so that even I many times fall under her charms. My mongering philosophy is always to just go along with the flow to get the maximum out of liaisons with gals - gives life to the term GFE and makes for a more pleasant experience. So what the hell - to me she is truly innocent!!!
Anyway, back to my gal's quary (let's call him Quasimodo - as that's what another guy named him as looking like). Like I said, she's playing the innocent card - and Quasimodo really thinks that he's so smart and that he's gonna get into her pants free - by QQ'ing, telephoning, even sending work her way (she's got a regular job) and tellin' her that he's truly fallen in love with her. And I mean Quasimodo is actually talking about marrying her..... and get this.... the only time he's seen her had been the ONE time I was with her whilst we were KTV'ing with a bunch of other guys!! All other times had NOT been in person!!
I mean - does Quasimodo really think that Chinese gals are that stupid and naive?? To think that she had actually fallen hook line and sinker for his gambit? That she's gonna wait for him with bated breath and drop her pants as soon as he sees her - as she is now his fiance!!
And why am I writing this?? To warn Quaismodo .... and all other mongers who thinks that Chinese gals are ALL pure, innocent, lowly educated virginal waifs without any guile or tricks up their sleeves!
And oh - of course I know that the main reason she asked me for my advise is to hint that I'd better step up MY play for her - as she's got somebody else waiting in the wings!! Like I said, this gal IS GOOD!!
And she just laughed when I "advised" her that it's no problem who she wants to be or not to be with PLUS I've introduced her to some of my other regular gals! Hell I even went ahead and told her that I would be very happy for her if she did get married and settled down with a good guy - and that I'd even buy the young couple their matrimonial bed!!
But, she of course KNOWS where her bread is buttered on ...... and she knows it ain't gonna be with Quasimodo!
SEAJ
Loveasiangirls
03-22-09, 10:56
...and Quasimodo really thinks that he's so smart and that he's gonna get into her pants free - by QQ'ing, telephoning, even sending work her way (she's got a regular job) and tellin' her that he's truly fallen in love with her. ...
I mean - does Quasimodo really think that Chinese gals are that stupid and naive?? To think that she had actually fallen hook line and sinker for his gambit? That she's gonna wait for him with bated breath and drop her pants as soon as he sees her - as she is now his fiance!!
SEAJ
Interesting. I am just back from an afternoon delight session with a freebie met on AdultFriendFinder. She told me that she is also on AsianFriendFinder (aka ChineseFriendFinder) and she tells me that all the guys there are stupid as they immediately talk marriage. I guess many girls there are looking for marriage so guys assume that be raising it they may get in their pants!
Well put and agree. I would be interested to know what you think the average of mongers are in China, in particular Dongguan, so close to Hong Kong. I guess the KTV and Sauna scene are so much in abundance and cheap, they are the only places one can go with friends to have fun. In Europe, I think the mongering age is a little older.
I normally don’t post on the on this board but your post struck a real cord with me as I am in a similar situation. I am not married but do have a LTR. At any rate what is your reason for the divorce…to monger with prostitutes or you think you can do better in the relationship department? Mine is a little of both.
If you’re only doing this to chase prostitutes I think that is really disheartening in all aspects but it’s your decision to make. I mean to give up a decent woman only to chase after the filth we brag about on these boards is ridiculous but at least your being a man and attempting to not do it behind her back.
Is she overweight, bitchy, financially draining?
Unless you are abnormal you will get tired. Mongering becomes like the old “hamster on the wheel” sort of thing at first it’s fun and exciting but after a while it becomes boring same routine different place. A vicious cycle starts you will want to quit but can't. You will then start to chase normal women again but the monger in you will expose himself.
You say you are not that old. In your 20s. At most mongering venues as I have discovered I am the youngest guy as I am in my 20s. I hit the gym, wear fine clothes then I see the older guy with gut the tank top shirt with stain and he can have the same girls I can have in this place for a few bucks. I ask myself questions like what am I doing here?
Destruction Of Feelings:
Some guys can live without the emotional connect from a woman can you? Once you start mongering full time your chance at a normal life will be destroyed forever. You will only view women as good for sex. No longer will their companionship be good enough no matter how unique she really is.
Pitfalls:
Potentially dangerous situations. Just read these pages of guys getting drugged and robbed, rogue prostitution establishments making patrons pay excessive tabs under threat of an ass whipping etc…this mongering world is not all glamour and glitz….
man take some time away from her and get your thoughts together and think about what you really want out of life before you walk down that lonely mongering road and trust me regardless of what some these guys say on these boards mongering is a lonely road…
When you are caught in a some jam it will be only be you who has to deal with the consequences.
The weird thing: why Chengdude posted here in the first place!?! Is he looking for a husband to a chinese girl to get her green-card?
So many questions? here are few:
Why did you really marry her in first place?
Why did she really marry you?
What kind of visa she is on?
How did you support the relation? so far and now with the current economy?
I just discovered this website and this is my first post. I've been to China 3 times over the past 3 years. My first time there I went with a group from my university to study the language and culture for a summer semester. It was a lot of fun, and while riding around Kunming on some piece of shit bike I bought for 50 yuan I found, what I think you guys call BBS shops. Little shops in the wall with pink lights or whatever. Before I went to China I didn't know these existed here, but wow! I had a great time with a few girls there, first time with hookers.
After all my fun I met a girl, a student not a working girl, but we kept in touch for over a year. I don't know what the hell I did, but we decided to get married. I am still young (25) and in school and after almost 2 years of marriage I told her I want a divorce. I've realized I'm highly unlikely to change from who I am in relationships. Every serious girlfriend I've had I have become bored after a year or two. Especially in the bedroom but also my love, for example my wife is beautiful and I still think she is sexy and I still have some love for her, but very very rarely do I actually want to have sex with her, I'd rathr jerk off honestly.
I've come to the decision that I never want to get married again or get into some very serious relationship, and I don't care about having kids either. I'm hoping to become a China monger like some of you guys here! It's the life I want! Of course I need to save up money and I'm sure it will be a least 10 years before I could come there on a more permanent basis. I'm taking the big first step towards this dream by divorcing my wife which is actually hard because I want her to be happy and end up with a good guy, a guy that wants a family and settle down with one girl. I told her I wanted a divorce 5 days ago and she has been trying like hell to change my mind and crying like crazy and I had to stop her from swalling a bottle of sleeping pills. She doesn't really have any good friends here for her to talk to. She doesn't want to go back to China, I told her she can live in the apartment until she finds someone else and I'll help her get the 10 year green card, its just so fucking hard hearing her crying and begging me to stay every day. Thank god I don't have a nickel to my name as a student, can't wait for this to be over.
That is not entirely true, she will not be deported providing if she already have a temporary green card. If the marriage was performed in China, temporary green card will be issued within the 6 weeks of her arrival. Then it would take from 12 months to 18 months for the permanent green card to come through, providing if all the papers were filled out correctly. If the marriage was performed within the US, temporary green card in around three months and permanent will be issued within the year. This time line varies from city to city, I am just quoting the California filling center as a reference.
I do not know all the circumstances on his case and we did not do his paperwork, so I cannot comment on why it would take two years to get her permanent green card. But something is not adding up! Just IMHO!
It is the law which states 2 year co-habitation is required to get a permanent green card. This is to prevent sham marriages in order to obtain green card. If you have seen the movie "green card" it explains everything.
In the seventies and early eighties many americans will get a sham marriage in exchange for money sometimes amounting to $5000-$10,000 for the purpose of green card. I know couple of girls who did that.
It is the law which states 2 year co-habitation is required to get a permanent green card. This is to prevent sham marriages in order to obtain green card. If you have seen the movie "green card" it explains everything.
In the seventies and early eighties many americans will get a sham marriage in exchange for money sometimes amounting to $5000-$10,000 for the purpose of green card. I know couple of girls who did that.The INS has a long reputation as a brutal agency, and is one of the more shameful parts of the US Government. I am aware of a case (a few years ago) when they accused a young foreign-born woman of having had a sham marriage to a US citizen. They argued for months, but what finally persuaded them was a large collection of photographs of the actual ceremony, taken by a professional photographer at the time.
What the INS wanted to do was deport the woman to her native country for at least a couple of years before allowing her to return, an impractical suggestion in this case because she had left there very young, with no native language skills, and knew only English!
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