Bangkok Reports

[Syzygies]

After several weeks of bizzare events the majority partner of Dollhouse meets a gory end. I wonder what was on his mind when he decided to retrieve the keys to his apartment in such a novel manner. Why not call a locksmith?

http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/general/856216/troubled-soi-cowboy-bar-owner-falls-to-death-from-39th-floor-condoI have heard from staff that him and his friends were not necessarily well liked. I wonder if such an accident was the true story, without having any knowledge? Don't believe everything in the media too easily. I should ask my ex dollhouse girl for her thoughts.

I hear rumours that many cases that police right off as accidents or suicides, can actually be murders. There is the Pattaya Flying Club of Farangs going off tall buildings to their deaths not being uncommon.

[Banana Boi]

What's going on with the light yellow-green folded card seemly floating on the first girl's right side? Yes she is nice and slim.It's a bikini label. She's in a change room trying on bikinis. Agree she has cuteness potential.

[Syzygies]

It's a bikini label. She's in a change room trying on bikinis. Agree she has cuteness potential.Thanks. So obvious now. Can see another price tag in the picture as well. Sort of never occurred to me for girls to try on outfits for the purpose of a photo more so than to buy them. LOL I guess some would have hidden the price tag.

[Aviator12]

In the old days (for me), a higher percentage of bargirls were slim, fewer had sillies and very few had nose jobs. It was easier hunting in those days, and any one of several bars was okay For me 20 years ago. Others with different requirements and smaller budget have quit bar scene completely. Finding nice natural experienced girls in Soapies became much harder as well, with me not having a great deal of luck with girl selection at Nataree, and most of my Soapy favourites long gone. I did not start Oilies till 9 years ago, so no significant decline in that area for me.Would it not be a reasonable assumption that you also were a different guy 20 years ago? I only have 5-6 years of mongering experience in Bangkok / Pattaya but I find sexy girls in most bars! I see a lot of boobs and nose jobs of course. With some exceptions I think it benefits the girl; make them more pretty. I understand others might disagree, but I really wonder if the general quality was better 20 years ago? With more influx of fast food etc. There is probably more fat bellies around, but as far as I can see it is not a big problem. 70% of the girls still have good bodies. We still have the privilege to choose our own little gem in a bar and that is what makes this hobby so interesting.

[Goatscrot]

Would it not be a reasonable assumption that you also were a different guy 20 years ago? I only have 5-6 years of mongering experience in Bangkok / Pattaya but I find sexy girls in most bars! I see a lot of boobs and nose jobs of course. With some exceptions I think it benefits the girl; make them more pretty. I understand others might disagree, but I really wonder if the general quality was better 20 years ago? With more influx of fast food etc. There is probably more fat bellies around, but as far as I can see it is not a big problem. 70% of the girls still have good bodies. We still have the privilege to choose our own little gem in a bar and that is what makes this hobby so interesting.If you only started coming 5 or 6 years ago then you did not see the quality that was here before. I would say that by '10 there was a marked decrease in the looks of P4 P gals in BKK. Yes, Syz is spot on. The quality was quite a bit better. Part of it had to do with volume. There are just far fewer gals available now. In the early '00's you could not make it 15 meters on Suk at night without hearing "Go with you. " And that is not an exaggeration. The bars and freelancer spots were just heaving with gals. Nana Disco at the turn of the century was unreal. Every night packed to the gills. Not to mention the Nana hotel lobby. Same with Thermae, and not a Japanese guy in sight. You'd walk around the bar and gals would just grab your package. They were all partying and having fun; which I might add is the main ingredient missing in today's FL scene. Oh, and at Thermae and Nana the none of the gals would turn down 1 k Baht.

Closing time at Nana and Cowboy was a gas as well. Hundreds of gals who did not get a customer heading out of their bars looking to make some money. You could pick 'them off like flies. It was just amazing. Now, they want to go party with their friends because they are making plenty.

BKK was really paradise. And don't get me started on how good Pattaya was. 90% of the tourists were mongers. Low season was amazing. You could have the town and all the hookers almost to yourself. A riot. Sorry today's scene does not even begin to compare.

Do we wax on about the "good ole days?" You bet we do. I miss the hell out of them. It will never be that way again. So glad I was able to experience them.

[Goatscrot]

Not all are fatties out there.True, but you are hard pressed to find thin ones these days.

[Banana Boi]

So where did all these girls go? Is it because they can make a living working normal jobs now? Too many Cheap Charlie's around to not make it worth their while any longer? I have to say I was very disappointed in soi 4. I was hoping it would be more of a scene that Goats described where I could pick hot girls off like flies.

As Thailand becomes more Westernized, prices are bound to increase over the years and girls will get fatter with unhealthy Westernized fast food, much to Syzy's dismay.

The good ole days are gone in many monger countries, including Germany. Are there any countries that are actually better monger destinations now than they were 5 or 10 years ago?

[Christian G]

BKK was really paradise. And don't get me started on how good Pattaya was. 90% of the tourists were mongers. Low season was amazing. You could have the town and all the hookers almost to yourself. A riot. Sorry today's scene does not even begin to compare.
Total agree. I started coming in Thai just 10 years ago, so I'm not a 20-30 years old vet on the ground, but I can see the different between today and 10 years ago very well.

[Syzygies]

Would it not be a reasonable assumption that you also were a different guy 20 years ago? I only have 5-6 years of mongering experience in Bangkok / Pattaya but I find sexy girls in most bars! I see a lot of boobs and nose jobs of course. With some exceptions I think it benefits the girl; make them more pretty. I understand others might disagree, but I really wonder if the general quality was better 20 years ago? With more influx of fast food etc. There is probably more fat bellies around, but as far as I can see it is not a big problem. 70% of the girls still have good bodies. We still have the privilege to choose our own little gem in a bar and that is what makes this hobby so interesting.I do think that the level of change is often exaggerated. I can still find some sexy girls in many bars on occasions. I accept that I am much more fussy than when first arriving in Bangkok for mongering 25 years ago. I can look at a photo of some girl from the past and be mystified that I actually selected her somehow. Must have been dark. LOL I guess tastes change a bit.

I still hot Thai girls out on the street or shopping every day. Wow, the girlfriend of the owner of a restaurant "The Blend" I saw the other day in her restaurant and again another time shopping at the Villa Markt.

So I accept that more bargirls were my spec many years ago because I was less fussy in addition to less fakes and less fatties. Combination of reasons. Also not enough experience with girls to have massive expectations of hookers initially.

So what bars have 70% of girls with good bodies? Not many bars do that for my specs. My requirements for slim and natural are a bit too tough? Also I like bars where can see "most" of the girls without too much problem. I object to highly covered up tits too (like what the Coyotes do), when have no idea what the girl's tits are really like.

Used to frequent Sheba (closed), Suzie Wong, Doll House and Long Gun but lost interest in them. Many years back used to frequent Lollipop, Pretty Lady, Voodoo and Hollywood.

Where did all the good girls go? I think it's more a case of the same types of girls but they now fatter, or have nose jobs, or have tit jobs, where in old times they were more natural. Maybe stunners have moved to high price soapies and escort work. Bangkok always had lots of crappy ordinary single mother looking girls in any era.

[Zeus9]

I was wondering which section would be best for me to post some info about Nonthaburi, Muang Thong Thani, Chaeng Wattana, Pakkred, Laksi, and more. There is the other areas thread, even though these spots are still in the Bangkok metro area. There's also general reports. Let me know where you guys think I should post where it would be most effective.

I have benefited from all the info posted on ISG. I come into Bangkok several times a week and make the best of my time with that info. So I appreciate the contributions. So I'll try and make some of my own that might cover other areas beside the usual. I know that there have to be other guys besides me that want to find some good alternatives closer to home. I haven't found much information online. I've pieced a few things together from random websites that aren't active anymore. But I've found most things through word of mouth and legwork.

To make a long story short, I've found soapies (both I have never seen referenced online), a whole street of MP's (maybe 15 in a row, but the services vary wildly from shop to shop and girl to girl), karaoke, cayote bars, kapoo clubs (very hot girls, and they do a lot more than the HJ with multiple shots as standard). I was actually very surprised as to what I was getting out of the kapoo clubs after what I had read to expect. Maybe it's a bit different up here. You guys just tell me where to post, and I'll get to work.

[JesseJames]

True, but you are hard pressed to find thin ones these days.One of the smaller bars on SC has 2/3 fatties.

[Finnish Fucker]

It's a bit hot for Sauna here, and you might have to be lenient in your tits size requirements down to just Ccups, even then a bit scarce, unless you are happy with some bars and other places that are silicone paradise. Even I take tits from zero to large, choice is still difficult for me.
The whole Thailand is a huge outdoor sauna. Hot and humid weather is good for my respiratory system and future old bones.

If I was to select the country to live my retirement days, just based on the looks of best girls and tits, I would go to Russia or Brazil. But these countries have their own issues. Russia is no country for old men unless you have a shitload of money, I don't. Brazil has some great looking girls and big natural tits but the country is not the safest and I am not the biggest fan of the latin mentality. Asia suits me fine. Nicely done silicones suit slim asian girls well, I have no problem with sillies there.

I still have 20+ years to play with big natural tits all around the world. Should be enough to get an overdose so I can concentrate on other things as an old man.

[Syzygies]

So where did all these girls go? Is it because they can make a living working normal jobs now? Too many Cheap Charlie's around to not make it worth their while any longer? I have to say I was very disappointed in soi 4. I was hoping it would be more of a scene that Goats described where I could pick hot girls off ....No it was never that good, however it was a massive contrast to the home country. In the old days o used ti think one in 3 Thai girls in the age group were doable. Probably was not that good. Stunners were still relatively few. Now there are far less than 1 in 3 doable unless you are in the right place for your special type of girls.

For guys that like silucone and nose jobs or more weighty girls, its still damn good I guess.

[Phoenix949]

The whole country is a huge outdoor sauna. Hot and humid weather is good for my respiratory system and future old bones.

If I was to select the country to live my retirement days, just based on the looks of best girls and tits, I would go to Russia or Brazil. But these countries have their own issues. Russia is no country for old men unless you have a shitload of money, I don't. Brazil has some great looking girls and big natural tits but the country is not the safest and I am not the biggest fan of the latin mentality. Asia suits me fine. Nicely done silicones suit slim asian girls well, I have no problem with sillies there.

I still have 20+ years to play with big natural tits all around the world. Should be enough to get an overdose so I can concentrate on other things as an old man.Wow, FF can only follow your words, I also loving the easy way to enjoy These Asian B, because no hassle to enjoy the fun.

[Blanquiceleste]

I was wondering which section would be best for me to post some info about Nonthaburi, Muang Thong Thani, Chaeng Wattana, Pakkred, Laksi, and more. There is the other areas thread, even though these spots are still in the Bangkok metro area. There's also general reports. Let me know where you guys think I should post where it would be most effective.

I have benefited from all the info posted on ISG. I come into Bangkok several times a week and make the best of my time with that info. So I appreciate the contributions. So I'll try and make some of my own that might cover other areas beside the usual. I know that there have to be other guys besides me that want to find some good alternatives closer to home. I haven't found much information online. I've pieced a few things together from random websites that aren't active anymore. But I've found most things through word of mouth and legwork.

To make a long story short, I've found soapies (both I have never seen referenced online), a whole street of MP's (maybe 15 in a row, but the services vary wildly from shop to shop and girl to girl), karaoke, cayote bars, kapoo clubs (very hot girls, and they do a lot more than the HJ with multiple shots as standard). I was actually very surprised as to what I was getting out of the kapoo clubs after what I had read to expect. Maybe it's a bit different up here. You guys just tell me where to post, and I'll get to work.I guess the Other Areas thread would be most appropriate. Put it down anywhere really, but do it! Waiting for the reports.

[Goatscrot]

So where did all these girls go? Is it because they can make a living working normal jobs now? Too many Cheap Charlie's around to not make it worth their while any longer? I have to say I was very disappointed in soi 4. I was hoping it would be more of a scene that Goats described where I could pick hot girls off like flies.

As Thailand becomes more Westernized, prices are bound to increase over the years and girls will get fatter with unhealthy Westernized fast food, much to Syzy's dismay.

The good ole days are gone in many monger countries, including Germany. Are there any countries that are actually better monger destinations now than they were 5 or 10 years ago?When you look at average salaries in Thailand over the past 15 years, you will see a huge increase, especially among uni grads. Also restaurant workers are making a lot more than they used to. It's really all a function of development. Sadly I don't think there is any place that is as good as it "was. " I would have loved to have been able to monger in Eastern Europe in the very early 90's or in Brazil in the 80's.

I agree with you about Soi 4. It is just depressing. What used to be "charmingly sleazy" is now just gross.

[Goatscrot]

I was wondering which section would be best for me to post some info about Nonthaburi, Muang Thong Thani, Chaeng Wattana, Pakkred, Laksi, and more. There is the other areas thread, even though these spots are still in the Bangkok metro area. There's also general reports. Let me know where you guys think I should post where it would be most effective.

I have benefited from all the info posted on ISG. I come into Bangkok several times a week and make the best of my time with that info. So I appreciate the contributions. So I'll try and make some of my own that might cover other areas beside the usual. I know that there have to be other guys besides me that want to find some good alternatives closer to home. I haven't found much information online. I've pieced a few things together from random websites that aren't active anymore. But I've found most things through word of mouth and legwork.

To make a long story short, I've found soapies (both I have never seen referenced online), a whole street of MP's (maybe 15 in a row, but the services vary wildly from shop to shop and girl to girl), karaoke, cayote bars, kapoo clubs (very hot girls, and they do a lot more than the HJ with multiple shots as standard). I was actually very surprised as to what I was getting out of the kapoo clubs after what I had read to expect. Maybe it's a bit different up here. You guys just tell me where to post, and I'll get to work.Wow. Can't wait to read your reports. I smell a road trip.

[Eszpresszo]

I do think that the level of change is often exaggerated. I can still find some sexy girls in many bars on occasions. I accept that I am much more fussy than when first arriving in Bangkok for mongering 25 years ago. I can look at a photo of some girl from the past and be mystified that I actually selected her somehow. Must have been dark. LOL I guess tastes change a bit.


So I accept that more bargirls were my spec many years ago because I was less fussy in addition to less fakes and less fatties. Combination of reasons. Also not enough experience with girls to have massive expectations of hookers initially.

. Bangkok always had lots of crappy ordinary single mother looking girls in any era.Mr. Syzgies. Thanks for your input. I am trying to plan my first trip the LOS here in the next month. But, the constant persistent theme I keep seeing here is complaints about how things are not what they used to be. Constant whining / moaning / bitching about how things have gone downhill. However, if we look at the rest of the forums covering different regions, we see the same thing. If you were to believe everything you read here, you'd think things were perfect / peachy 10/20/30 years ago and that mongering is a waste of time now. Right?

Of course, this is all subjective. Perspective and experience is everything. People complain about how much more expensive the cost of mongering is from 20 years ago. I have to ask, what else is the same price as it was 20 years? Do you make the same income as you did 20 years ago? My income has doubled in the past 20 years. I don't know of anyone, except for retirees or people who have derailed their lives, or were downsized out of a exceptional job, who are earning less now than they did a decade ago.

And as you mention, age is a factor. We were easier to please in some matters when were younger. We are more jaded and experienced now (OTOH, I am less picky about other things as I get older, especially women who are much younger than I am). And too often mature adults are busy chasing their youth. That is a problem there for some people. Also note that we feel better when we are younger, we had more energy, and we could take in more things. Not to mention we looked better. I think too many mongers ignore the impact of their appearance on the working girls. As your appearance goes downhill, the chances of a GFE with a younger woman decline, regardless of how much you pay them.

Common sense should tell us we can't expect to repeat the same experiences. We need to move on, and try new experiences. Just because we had a good experience in one brothel during one vacation, doesn't mean we can expect that experience to be repeated every time we show up. I recently visited Berlin and had two encounters with freelancers in their own apartments (feel free to check out my trip reports). Both were excellent service providers and I paid less than 100 Euros for the hour I spent with them. I've love to try that again with both of them. However, something inside tells me I need to try some other girls. I might have just caught those girls on a good day. But, they could be ineffectual on the next visit. Their enthusiasm for their job might have waned. Luck and chance are always going to play into the situation. If you don't go back you won't be disappointed by the next visit.

And of course, I do think what you get out of anything, including mongering, is what you put into it. It has come to my attention that working girls around the globe don't like drunk patrons, unless they are out to take advantage of them. When I read about guys getting plastered in the clubs and then trying to engage the women, I can't visualize an optimum sexual encounter. And I am completely with you guys who say they don't drink alcohol in the clubs.

Okay, I've said my piece. So, Mr. Syzgies, in your opinion, is there any reason why a first time visitor / monger to the LOS can't have an awesome time on a reasonable budget?

[Phordphan]

Okay, I've said my piece. So, Mr. Syzgies, in your opinion, is there any reason why a first time visitor / monger to the LOS can't have an awesome time on a reasonable budget?I'll jump in here and offer unsolicited opinion.

Of course a first-timer can have a great time. Obviously you have no basis for comparison, so it has every chance of being great. A reasonable budget is very subjective, so you may or may not receive value for money.

The issue that most of us old-timers have, when you boil it down, is that there is no longer an attitude of sanuk. That's the undefinable quality of "fun" that the Thais used to be famous for. You went to your favorite bar and the girls wanted to have fun. Yes, they were there to make money, but it tended to take a back seat to fun. The girl could have fun, and still get paid. Some of my best memories are of the times when there was a bit of chemistry between me and a lady, we went long-time and hit local clubs, local eateries, discos, whatever, and had a great time all night and into the next day. That's much harder to do these days.

The attitudes today (and I'm speaking generally, as individual exceptions exist) tend to be far more mercenary. Long-time is quickly becoming a thing of the past. Short-time has degenerated into 30 minutes in extreme cases. Basically, much of the sanuk is gone and I think that's what most guys miss the most. Yes, we all become more jaded. But, objectively, the attitudes of the girls are not the same.

Of course the clientele has changed, too. Hordes of package tourists, with lists of thing to do and places to see, busily checking each off the list and moving on to the next, have replaced the "traveler" who had a few weeks, or more, in-country and no fixed agenda. Short-time tourists tend to breed short-time girls, if you follow my meaning.

But, yes, as a first-timer you can have a blast. Especially if your reason for going isn't solely to screw as many girls as possible. It's a fascinating country and offers a lot more than simply girly bars.

One must consider the cost, too. By reading these boards you'll see that a short-time encounter with a go-go girl will probably set you back around $100 USD when you factor in a couple of drinks, a bar fine, etc. , etc. And that encounter may be about an hour, maybe less, maybe a bit more. YMMV. Factor in the cost of airfare and the time involved. If your reason for going is to screw, you may have better alternatives, depending on where you live. If you're going there to travel around, take in the culture, and have a bit of fun on the side, well, IMHO, SEA in general, and Thailand in particular, is hard to beat.

[Wolvenvacht]

I have heard from staff that him and his friends were not necessarily well liked. I wonder if such an accident was the true story, without having any knowledge? Don't believe everything in the media too easily. I should ask my ex dollhouse girl for her thoughts.

I hear rumours that many cases that police right off as accidents or suicides, can actually be murders. There is the Pattaya Flying Club of Farangs going off tall buildings to their deaths not being uncommon.On the other hand, don't cry "malice" what can easily be explained by stupidity.

[Syzygies]

On the other hand, don't cry "malice" what can easily be explained by stupidity.I don't claim anything.

Could be an accident. Its just that many guys going off buildings are not accidents or suicides. I just keep an open mind to possibilities. Open and shut case maybe.

[Syzygies]

Espresszo,

I don't mean to be overly negative. Indeed most of my reports are about having a good time. I do find girls to have fun with.

It obviously costs more than the old days.

The ISG can guide you in things to try where a good time is likely. When I first arrived I had no ISG to guide me. I did have a buddy that knew a few places.

The bar scene is more difficult in that there are a lot less bars that interest me. However a newbie might find some more interesting.

In the old days we always took a bar girl for the whole night and sometimes was hard to get rid of her. In the modern day its more likely to take a girl for a short time but long time may be possible.

I really can't remember was percentage of mistake girls I had in the old days. Probably lower.

I still have a good time because I know where to go that suits me. I don't have to have a girl every single day anymore and rarely have two on same day any more.

Its not really more difficult to afford because my earnings per year is better and the exchange rate is also better.

Having a Thai GF is more expensive if she is not self supporting.

If tou are not an experienced monger, can still be a wonderland.

Read ISG posts regularly and try to learn from. Bear in mind that posters attitudes vary a lot.

I moan about the increasing numbers if nose jobs but many guys just don"t care about trivial mattters like that.

[Goatscrot]

And as you mention, age is a factor. We were easier to please in some matters when were younger. We are more jaded and experienced now (OTOH, I am less picky about other things as I get older, especially women who are much younger than I am). And too often mature adults are busy chasing their youth. That is a problem there for some people. Also note that we feel better when we are younger, we had more energy, and we could take in more things. Not to mention we looked better. I think too many mongers ignore the impact of their appearance on the working girls. As your appearance goes downhill, the chances of a GFE with a younger woman decline, regardless of how much you pay them.As Syz will attest the opposite is true for many of us. I have become way more picky as I have aged. I have to find the "right duck" these days. Of course living here changes your perspective. Living here for 16 years really changes your perspective. One of the reasons I chose to move here in the late 90's was seeing all the 60 plus dudes with really hot 20 something gals. Now you really don't see that. You see the 60 plus crowd with 40 plus women. It has really changed.

[Goatscrot]

I'll jump in here and offer unsolicited opinion.

Of course a first-timer can have a great time. Obviously you have no basis for comparison, so it has every chance of being great. A reasonable budget is very subjective, so you may or may not receive value for money.

The issue that most of us old-timers have, when you boil it down, is that there is no longer an attitude of sanuk. That's the undefinable quality of "fun" that the Thais used to be famous for. You went to your favorite bar and the girls wanted to have fun. Yes, they were there to make money, but it tended to take a back seat to fun. The girl could have fun, and still get paid. Some of my best memories are of the times when there was a bit of chemistry between me and a lady, we went long-time and hit local clubs, local eateries, discos, whatever, and had a great time all night and into the next day. That's much harder to do these days.

The attitudes today (and I'm speaking generally, as individual exceptions exist) tend to be far more mercenary. Long-time is quickly becoming a thing of the past. Short-time has degenerated into 30 minutes in extreme cases. Basically, much of the sanuk is gone and I think that's what most guys miss the most. Yes, we all become more jaded. But, objectively, the attitudes of the girls are not the same.

Of course the clientele has changed, too. Hordes of package tourists, with lists of thing to do and places to see, busily checking each off the list and moving on to the next, have replaced the "traveler" who had a few weeks, or more, in-country and no fixed agenda. Short-time tourists tend to breed short-time girls, if you follow my meaning.

But, yes, as a first-timer you can have a blast. Especially if your reason for going isn't solely to screw as many girls as possible. It's a fascinating country and offers a lot more than simply girly bars.

One must consider the cost, too. By reading these boards you'll see that a short-time encounter with a go-go girl will probably set you back around $100 USD when you factor in a couple of drinks, a bar fine, etc. , etc. And that encounter may be about an hour, maybe less, maybe a bit more. YMMV. Factor in the cost of airfare and the time involved. If your reason for going is to screw, you may have better alternatives, depending on where you live. If you're going there to travel around, take in the culture, and have a bit of fun on the side, well, IMHO, SEA in general, and Thailand in particular, is hard to beat.Phordphan sums it up very nicely. One thing I did not think about was the duration of most folk's visits. When I first moved here most mongers would be in for a month or so. Very few short trips. Of course economies were different then. And yes, the "fun" factor is way less. Every venue was a party every night. From Cowboy, to Nana, to Thermae, to Nana Disco. All the gal were drinking and looking for money and a good time. We all talk about the disappearing fun factor.

As a first time visitor you will have a good time.

[Banana Boi]

Some of my best memories are of the times when there was a bit of chemistry between me and a lady, we went long-time and hit local clubs, local eateries, discos, whatever, and had a great time all night and into the next day. That's much harder to do these days.All my LT with gogo girls followed a similar pattern. I thought this was the norm. My girls would leave around 3 or 4 pm the next day to get ready for work. If not, what is the norm for LT with no chemistry?

[BionicMan]

I'll jump in here and offer unsolicited opinion.

Of course a first-timer can have a great time. Obviously you have no basis for comparison, so it has every chance of being great. .All very well said.

Girls in the past had nothing else to do than build the chemistry with the customer and all have a good time. Vand make money.

Now the customer is a break during the smartphone usage.

Once customers could be found mainly through the bars.

Now social media, websites, chatting apps, do the marketing. Sophisticated make up, cosmetic surgeries do the rest, together with intense use of Photoshop.

Once the customer enjoyed the hunt after months spent at home dreaming of the dream holiday: exotic country, sandy beaches, warm temperature, the feeling of a sex paradise.

Now they prepare the trip like a marketing campaign to search for new products. Winter is spent with strategies, checks on Internet, Q&A on the web.

[Syzygies]

I was wondering which section would be best for me to post some info about Nonthaburi, Muang Thong Thani, Chaeng Wattana, Pakkred, Laksi, and more. There is the other areas thread, even though these spots are still in the Bangkok metro area. There's also general reports.I would not use General Reports Thread. That is more for things pertaining to the whole of Thailand (or the world), and may well be on non-sexual topics.

It would indeed be good to have a Bangkok Outskirts Thread as Nonthaburi is officially a separate province. Laksi, Chaeng Wattana, and Don Meuang are part of Bangkok, but there is no need to be to technical about the province boundaries.

Could use the Bangkok Thread but would mean specialised reports would get mixed in the whole lot of other guff. Bangkok already fills up with reports that are not really Bangkok and not even related to mongering.

Would be good to hear about Soapy massage of the north like "Ocean" is it? somewhere near the road to Nonthaburi.

[Syzygies]

All my LT with gogo girls followed a similar pattern. I thought this was the norm. My girls would leave around 3 or 4 pm the next day to get ready for work. If not, what is the norm for LT with no chemistry?Many girls have commitments, like a child for example, so have to leave early like 6 AM to beat the traffic. Also some of them want to leave in order to get some decent sleep. Some girls claim they don't sleep at all well in a strange bed. Some are used to sleeping only in the daytime. They may have things to do in their own personal life. Always important to know what time a girl absolutely must leave.

Having to leave early is not always about an absence of chemistry, but could be. I think 6 to 8 hours is the most normal type of LT, but I prefer girls who will stay to breakfast at least. I see little point in a LT with a girl if there is no sex session in the morning.

[Syzygies]

The issue that most of us old-timers have, when you boil it down, is that there is no longer an attitude of sanuk. That's the undefinable quality of "fun" that the Thais used to be famous for. You went to your favorite bar and the girls wanted to have fun. Yes, they were there to make money, but it tended to take a back seat to fun. The girl could have fun, and still get paid. Some of my best memories are of the times when there was a bit of chemistry between me and a lady, we went long-time and hit local clubs, local eateries, discos, whatever, and had a great time all night and into the next day. That's much harder to do these days.

The attitudes today (and I'm speaking generally, as individual exceptions exist) tend to be far more mercenary. I don't think Thai girls have forgotten how to have fun if the customer makes it fun.

However girls maybe a bit less wild (if not on drugs and sober). Still girls get very drunk, but I prefer girls to be a most a little tipsy. Soi 23 next to Cowboy at 3 am is a horror zone with many girls so drunk they can hardly stand. Bad for their health to be like this repeatedly. All the Thai boy pimps waiting around with motorcycle to pick up their girl. I guess these girls don't do LT generally. I hate to see this stuff.

As times have gone by, I detect an increase is the selfishness streak of people. That is a major cause of degradation in the fun. Everyone wants to get so much but give so little. It works both ways for the girls and the customers. The "up to you" type of girls of the past are fading away. They want far more. It is not quite the same buyers' market of yester-year. I do recall part time freelancer girls in the Thermae 24 years ago giving many potential customers the knock back, presumably looking for the guy they would be happy to be with (or maybe the right money too - I forget). I did not get rejected at that time, but I doubt I was at all handsome, so something else must have been working. I did have a little bit of Thai and was nice to them so that may have helped.

The Thai concept of "Greng Jai" (opposite of selfishness or imposition) is fading away. They know the word well but do not feel or practice it. Farangs have no such word but only may have the feeling, depending on the guy.

It's hard to avoid living in the past just a little. Just one year ago I had a P4P girl that I was really heavily hooked on. She gave me extra special service and was like a 2nd GF. She has retired now. We are still in touch, but she is not available now. Impossible to replace, so everything else in P4P seems a bit mediocre.

[Wolvenvacht]

Many girls have commitments, like a child for example, so have to leave early like 6 AM to beat the traffic. Also some of them want to leave in order to get some decent sleep. Some girls claim they don't sleep at all well in a strange bed. Some are used to sleeping only in the daytime. They may have things to do in their own personal life. Always important to know what time a girl absolutely must leave.

Having to leave early is not always about an absence of chemistry, but could be. I think 6 to 8 hours is the most normal type of LT, but I prefer girls who will stay to breakfast at least. I see little point in a LT with a girl if there is no sex session in the morning.I always offer them a breakfast option, but few take it. I'm already happy if they have a "sausage and protein shake" breakfast in the morning. ;)

[Blanquiceleste]

All my LT with gogo girls followed a similar pattern. I thought this was the norm. My girls would leave around 3 or 4 pm the next day to get ready for work. If not, what is the norm for LT with no chemistry?


Many girls have commitments, like a child for example, so have to leave early like 6 AM to beat the traffic. Also some of them want to leave in order to get some decent sleep. Some girls claim they don't sleep at all well in a strange bed. Some are used to sleeping only in the daytime. They may have things to do in their own personal life. Always important to know what time a girl absolutely must leave.

Having to leave early is not always about an absence of chemistry, but could be. I think 6 to 8 hours is the most normal type of LT, but I prefer girls who will stay to breakfast at least. I see little point in a LT with a girl if there is no sex session in the morning.Early in my mongering career I used to think that a girl leaving early (8 am - 10 am, never before that and never without morning sex) was simply because there was little chemistry. But back in the day I had little patience to hear out the girl's stories. But as time passed by I think I have become more empathetic to the girls and their conditions. Some have even told me they could not sleep all night because of my snoring but they never left without morning sex and a big smile.

I make it a part of the interview process to determine what time a girl will leave. And I make it clear that time is money and money is time. You stay less I pay less. Simple.

Personally I like my girls to stay till lunch time and not beyond that unless I have decided to keep her for a few days in a row. Invariably, after lunch I like a nice foot massage, a sound nap and then a ST hop in the sack with a new girl.

[Eszpresszo]

Espresszo,

I don't mean to be overly negative. Oh, but you weren't Syzgies. And I am sorry for not being more clear. I latched onto your comment "I do think that the level of change is often exaggerated" because you hinted at the negative or jaded perspective of some posts. I was asking a purely rhetorical question when I said "is there any reason why a first time visitor / monger to the LOS can't have an awesome time on a reasonable budget?" Again I apologize to everyone else for not being more clear. I just wanted to sort out the reality from what some posters seem to perceive as a negative.

I am pretty confident I can have a great time in the LOS, with the right attitude, reasonable expectations, and common sense. I just wanted to chime in on how some mongers' perspectives don't paint an accurate picture of the situation for the rest of us. And by no means is it restricted to this forum. I found another site that focused on Pattaya, and the forum them was populated by people complaining about how it wasn't what it used to be. They complained about the popularity of the place, without realizing how they were contributing to the situation, as if their participation didn't matter. It was kind of silly, I thought.

I will go off-topic briefly (at least as far as Thailand goes) and refer to an area I do have experience in. If you check out the Germany forums, you can read people complaining about the FKK clubs, and how they aren't what some mongers think they can be. Heck, when I first really visited Germany, as a student doing a semester abroad, there was no such thing as an FKK or any kind of public sex club. It was at the beginning of 1980. In my quiet University town, there was an secluded alcove of maybe three or four houses, where the WG would sit in the window (though there was usually only one sitting in her window at any give time). That's what you had to choose from then. Go down to Stuttgart and there was a good Laufhaus that a Croatian friend of mine liked an awful lot (he was a monger at a young age). Up in Frankfurt, there was sort of a red light district across the river in Sachsenhausen. Mature women working on the street, while more upscale girls would cruise the streets in a sedan, pick up the customer and drive to a secluded spot for a quickie in the car. The girls were pretty much German then. Hamburg always had the Davidwachte and the Reeperbahn. But that was Hamburg. In Bavaria, prostitution was illegal. The working girls were pretty much German girls, and of course, the prettiest German girls are not going to be involved in open prostitution. Nowadays, the town I lived supposedly has a decent FKK and once hosted a notorious all-inclusive club. Sex clubs are all over Germany now, and there is a huge choice of women of different nationalities or races to choose from. Some hookers openly work the rest stops on the autobahn and advertise when and where they will be on their website. Yet for all this variety and free market competitiveness, mongers complain. They complain about the predominance of Romanian girls or the lack of German girls (truth is, the Romanians are better looking than the German working girls. You think the prettiest Germans will work in an FKK?)

Its all a lot of complaining from people who have unrealistic expectations. People who have no concept of what it REALLY used to be like in Germany. And this is my point. A lot of negative posting comes from unrealistic expectations, because they have the wrong attitude or they expect things to always be how they want them to be (which never really happens in real life.) And that doesn't help people who are new to the scene. What some monger thinks how things should work, won't always jibe with what the newcomer to the scene can experience.

[Goatscrot]

It's hard to avoid living in the past just a little. Just one year ago I had a P4P girl that I was really heavily hooked on. She gave me extra special service and was like a 2nd GF. She has retired now. We are still in touch, but she is not available now. Impossible to replace, so everything else in P4P seems a bit mediocre.Amen. My two regulars are gone and I have not been able to find replacements. One I had about once every month to six weeks for 5 years and the other once a month or so for 3 years. Both just "did it" for me for some reason. But, got to keep looking.

[Ixgzca]

The Thai concept of "Greng Jai" (opposite of selfishness or imposition) is fading away. They know the word well but do not feel or practice it. Farangs have no such word but only may have the feeling, depending on the guy.
The word in English would be "considerate" or "unimposing". These two translations work in 99.9% of cases. I don't know where this notion of เกรงใจ being untranslatable came from. Silly rabbits.

[MusicalToM]

I'm a non-alcohol drinker. I'll be hitting BKK / Pattaya this April for a week & it's my first time.

Correct me if I'm wrong, I assume soft drinks are available in all Beer / A Go Go Bars and considered as normal drink. It might be a real noob question, but I want to make sure that they consider even soft drinks as normal drinks & don't ask to buy alcoholic drinks. To be actual, I even don't take soft drinks like coke in any day due to it's high calorie content, which imbalances my gym diet plan. Now this is being said I'd also like to ask "Would it be okay if I don't buy any drink for me (except mineral water & Lady drinks) in any Club" ?

Any advice from senior & experience folks would be most welcome.

[Titanio]

I'm a non-alcohol drinker. I'll be hitting BKK / Pattaya this April for a week & it's my first time.

Correct me if I'm wrong, I assume soft drinks are available in all Beer / A Go Go Bars and considered as normal drink. It might be a real noob question, but I want to make sure that they consider even soft drinks as normal drinks & don't ask to buy alcoholic drinks. To be actual, I even don't take soft drinks like coke in any day due to it's high calorie content, which imbalances my gym diet plan. Now this is being said I'd also like to ask "Would it be okay if I don't buy any drink for me (except mineral water & Lady drinks) in any Club" ?

Any advice from senior & experience folks would be most welcome.To be a little but up market you may order manao soda. Anywhere in Asia you will get a can of Schweppes Soda with a slice of lemon and ice cubes. In Thailand you will get a bottle of lcal sparkling water. Still very drinkable if you get used to it, and accepted in any bar everywhere. No worries.

[EihTooms]

I'm a non-alcohol drinker. I'll be hitting BKK / Pattaya this April for a week & it's my first time.

Correct me if I'm wrong, I assume soft drinks are available in all Beer / A Go Go Bars and considered as normal drink. It might be a real noob question, but I want to make sure that they consider even soft drinks as normal drinks & don't ask to buy alcoholic drinks. To be actual, I even don't take soft drinks like coke in any day due to it's high calorie content, which imbalances my gym diet plan. Now this is being said I'd also like to ask "Would it be okay if I don't buy any drink for me (except mineral water & Lady drinks) in any Club" ?

Any advice from senior & experience folks would be most welcome.Any venue where buying at least one drink for yourself is expected in order to have a seat and enjoy the view or entertainment will consider a Coke, Coke Zero, Coke Light, bottled water, ice tea, ice coffee, fruit juice or anything of the kind to qualify as that drink. That includes go-go bars, beer bars, freelancer bars, whatever. I am not aware of any exceptions to that observation and experience, but maybe someone else knows of one.

[Syzygies]

I'm a non-alcohol drinker. I'll be hitting BKK / Pattaya this April for a week & it's my first time.

Correct me if I'm wrong, I assume soft drinks are available in all Beer / A Go Go Bars and considered as normal drink. It might be a real noob question, but I want to make sure that they consider even soft drinks as normal drinks & don't ask to buy alcoholic drinks. To be actual, I even don't take soft drinks like coke in any day due to it's high calorie content, which imbalances my gym diet plan. Now this is being said I'd also like to ask "Would it be okay if I don't buy any drink for me (except mineral water & Lady drinks) in any Club" ?

Any advice from senior & experience folks would be most welcome.I am also mostly a non-alcoholic drinker and trying to avoid sugar. In bars I order Soda, Coke Light, Tomato juice, Pineapple juice, or mineral water. Not a problem. You probably have to buy at least one drink to be entitled to watch the entertainment (if any) and justify your seat.

Once you are buying drinks for ladies, a drink order need not include one for yourself. I would suggest to you not to finish a drink or even be close to finished, as will cause waitresses to start bugging for your next drink. Keep watch of your drink to avoid stupid waitresses thinking it is nearly finished and taking it away.

[Syzygies]

The word in English would be "considerate" or "unimposing". These two translations work in 99.9% of cases. I don't know where this notion of เกรงใจ being untranslatable came from. Silly rabbits.Unimposing is an okay Translation or better still "not wishing to impose". Considerate is a bit too vague with multiple meanings, IMHO.

Anyway "Unimposing" does not really come up in Farang conversation, so much. Sounds clumsy. It is more that westerners do not speak the word, rather than being untranslatable. If a word is rarely used, then a person may not be able to think of it as well.

When "grengjai" is used as a verb in Thai, we can't really say unimpose in English. I don't think such a negated verb exists. So in English a several word expression is needed.

Many Thais speak about "grengjai" but do not feel it. Westerners feel "grengjai" but do not say so.

[Syzygies]

Amen. My two regulars are gone and I have not been able to find replacements. One I had about once every month to six weeks for 5 years and the other once a month or so for 3 years. Both just "did it" for me for some reason. But, got to keep looking.I was far more hooked than that. I was seeing her privately as often as possible, sometimes 3 times per week, and including a multi day holiday. I wished I had met her years earlier when she was young, so that by last year, I could have been a bit bored by her already, or failing that, have got married. LOL Anyway clearly she had multiple suitors and both of us already had "official" GF / BFs. Eventually some younger handsome very rich guy got her, but I am sure she took time and chose very carefully, and got better than me.

I wasn't keen on her silicones, the one defect, but she had them removed for a big improvement, with Bcups remaining. Expensive but very expert job.

I can find girls as good looking, but the playful sexy character and overall package cannot be replaced easily. Sometimes, but very rarely, we find something that is just too good, and blows all the competition away.

[Syzygies]

My usual Crazy House visit thoughts.

Recent visit saw all my regular or prospective girls missing Donut, Ging, Oom, Noi, Naen, and Jane (last two yet to be tried). I realised that girls are in 3 groups: Yellow badge are the little girls who have good bodies and dance downstairs. Red badge are tall models who dance downstairs. Green badge are the older or fatter girls who dance upstairs when place gets too busy downstairs.

Virtually all my girls are red badge. Last night I noticed quite a few yellow badge girls with excellent bodies, number 5, 13, 99 (or 66), 130, 140, 145. Yet not one was really my spec. The body was just fine (excellent). Each girl dipped out slightly from the face (I am very fussy), in some cases due to nose jobs. 140 had a good enough face almost, but chemistry wasn't there. She came on a bit too strong, and I felt her character was a little false. Wanted to play handies with me in a rather childish manner (weird). I got bored with her very quickly. Maybe she did not want her tits touched so did not find out how good her tits were, wearing a bra.

The stand out looker for me was red badge 36. Light skin, great body and importantly really great face. By the time I spotted her, she had been called by another customer. I guess I will meet her another day.

One customer near to me was groping a girl's pussy. This is possible with some of the very raunchy girls but many girls either do not allow or are not happy about it. The raunchy girl goes with it because her body is too straight from waist to thigh and her face is puffy swollen ugly for me. She has to be wild to get customers. Other guys don't seem to notice her lack of beauty as are very pussy focussed. LOL She is popular despite being a very ugly girl to my taste.

My favorite waitress was also missing. I was asked to sign each drink bill slip so as to avoid any misunderstandings with the bill. I did order a drink for Som number 140. As with many girls, they try to get 2 drinks at a time, like Tequila coke. I don't fall for it. When waitress arrives I point at the girl, and then raise one finger to indicate one drink for the girl. Girl can decide if it is coke or tequila or whatever. Makes little difference.

At one time a passing girl tried to just sit on my lap. I closed my knees together to stop her, and the waitress ticked her off. Telling her that I am known and I don't take any girls that just show up, but rather choose for myself carefully, sometimes after long delay. Number 140 got called, but as the chemistry was not there, I lost interest in her very quickly. Would have replaced her with red 36, if she was available, a very superior looking girl with interesting braided hairstyle. Don't know yet whether I would have BFed her, but a good chance being so good looking. Number 36 eventually left her customer but I am not sure where she went. Could not see her. Could have used my normal waitress to find out. Possibly she went to the toilet. This can take time as there maybe a queue of girls waiting and some are too shy to use the men's toilets. The customer of 36 seemed to moved to now groping the highly tattooed (full ass tattoos) and highly pierced girl, one of the most ugly girls for me, saggy tits and big "masculine" jaw. She reminds me of a Ladyboy. Not very feminine at all, but raunchy.

My total bill was 2 drinks for myself and one for girl. I did not get scammed. I managed to avoid it as is usually the case. Said Hello, to the mamasan that I like, chubby Paeng. Seems nice to me. Not to sure about any of the other ones, although I know the longer term one Par (Phaa) a little. I moved on to somewhere else.

Summary is, a huge number of girls with outstanding natural bodies. A good view of plenty of bare tits, ass, and pussy. Just a very small number with outstanding natural face to my picky taste. Another day, most of my regulars might be there.

One customer sitting near me at the start was weird. He sat on a bench sofa. One and a half free spaces to his right and one and a half free spaces to his left. He was right in the middle of a space big enough for 4. Two Asian men were looking for space to sit, so waitress asked the Farang to move slightly either to the left or to the right, so that 2 Asian guys could sit together. He refused to co-operate. That is what you call a Royal Asshole, in my opinion. Later he was in the toilet same time as me and skipped washing his hands. No wonder many girls don't want their pussy groped. Can't tell easily if a guy is clean, gentle and well behaved. I wonder if he reads the ISG.

[Wolvenvacht]

I'm a non-alcohol drinker. I'll be hitting BKK / Pattaya this April for a week & it's my first time.

Correct me if I'm wrong, I assume soft drinks are available in all Beer / A Go Go Bars and considered as normal drink. It might be a real noob question, but I want to make sure that they consider even soft drinks as normal drinks & don't ask to buy alcoholic drinks. To be actual, I even don't take soft drinks like coke in any day due to it's high calorie content, which imbalances my gym diet plan. Now this is being said I'd also like to ask "Would it be okay if I don't buy any drink for me (except mineral water & Lady drinks) in any Club" ?

Any advice from senior & experience folks would be most welcome.A drink is a drink and I have noticed that during "happy hour" only beers are discounted with soft drinks sold at their usual price. So the soft drinks are sometimes even more expensive than alcohol.

Many times I saw the girls express happiness when I ordered a soft drink as then they could have a soft drink for their LD as well. Only one looked at me suspiciously and asked if I was a Muslim.

[Syzygies]

30 Nov 2015 (Crazy House):


My buddy Noi spotted me and came over and asked would I like her friend to come over. Normally I am not into girls dragging a friend along, however today was different. Her friend was stunning, and just a 2 second glance told me she was the best looker in the shop. Why not meet her at least?

Name turned out to be Paeng meaning "powder" (not Phaeng meaning "expensive" - pronounced differently). Was appropriate, she was delicate and white skin. Tall, maybe 167 cm, slim, good waist to thigh ratio, slim thighs, high curvy taunt ass, only Acups but they were very beautiful to look at and touch. Braces on teeth and aged just 21. Long straight black hair which she tied up at some point later on. Small face and very cute slightly upturned nose. Everything natural except for the teeth straightening apparatus. Did not intend to BF any girl originally, but Paeng jiggled around on my lap for a bit and got me starting to feel rather horny, even though she is new and quite shy.

Took her for short time. ......Blah Blah ......

Don't really have a clue what her number is but I described her pretty well. She doesn't yet have confidence to dance naked but believe me there are absolutely no body faults being hidden. Seems to be a good friend of Noi (very white skin) number 78, who does dance nude these days. Paeng has studies so doesn't work everyday. Turned out this year that this girl uses working name Donut and is number 83. Wears quite high heels and so looks very tall indeed now. She does dance naked this year too. Immaculate curvy but slim hot model type. Can't wait to do her again (only two times to date). Failing that I could try number 36.

Someone mentioned number 60 the other day. I have being keeping a casual eye out for number 60, but have not yet seen her. Could be away for a few days or longer period. If she has a green number and upstairs, the chance of spotting her is less.

[Syzygies]

Many times I saw the girls express happiness when I ordered a soft drink as then they could have a soft drink for their LD as well. Only one looked at me suspiciously and asked if I was a Muslim.I don't quite understand. How does lady drink have any relevance to the drink you ordered for yourself? Normally I am drinking soda and lady takes tequila, or soft depending on her preference. Usually if I take Tequilla, the lady does also, but there exist teetotaller ladies who never ever drink alcohol, so even I take tequila, she can drink soft. For ladies becoming drunk, it is better if they stop the alcohol too.

If a muslim was secretly in Crazy House, the chances are he would drink alcohol too. Muslims have to behave when they are at home. LOL Elsewhere they can party like others. Just like Buddhists don't follow the 5 principles very well at all. Mai Pen Rai. I have been to parties with plenty muslims dancing and drinking and listening to sinful music/songs but at the house of a Buddhist lady, in Satun province (south of Thailand) where there are no troubles at all (except price of fuel and rubber and floods). Satun, Songkhla and Hat Yai muslims are scared to go to Pattani, Yala, Narathiwat just like any one else is scared to go there. One muslim lady at the party told me how she had two boyfriends. Shock horror. The Bangkok BF did not know about the Pattani Policeman BF. The Buddhist lady was one I met in Thermae Massage 24 years ago, so is now a bit too old for me. LOL

[Ixgzca]

When "grengjai" is used as a verb in Thai, we can't really say unimpose in English. I don't think such a negated verb exists. So in English a several word expression is needed. No, we would say something like " I didn't want to impose" in that case. But I can think of several uses of "greng jai" where considerate would be the direct translation and many more cases where inconsiderate or imposing would be the direct tranlslation "ไม่กรงใจ", especially when describing another person. It's easily translated as long as the person translating is aware of the context. English is another language where the meaning of words can change slightly or drastically depending on the context. This doesn't mean the words are untranslatable though.

[Syzygies]

No, we would say something like " I didn't want to impose" in that case. But I can think of several uses of "greng jai" where considerate would be the direct translation and many more cases where inconsiderate or imposing would be the direct tranlslation "ไม่กรงใจ", especially when describing another person. It's easily translated as long as the person translating is aware of the context. English is another language where the meaning of words can change slightly or drastically depending on the context. This doesn't mean the words are untranslatable though.Yes fine. We are on same wavelength.

Being very technical, as a language student, "Considerate" often means, depending on context:

"jai dee" (good hearted).

"ao jai sai" (considering the wishes or desires of another).

Variations of meaning rather different to "grengjai". That is the only reason I don't like "Considerate" as a translation, without showing a context.

In general dictionaries that translate a single Thai word to a single English word, or visa versa, are quite useless. A phrase or sentence is often / usually needed to explain the meaning clearly. This is simply due to words having multiple meanings in one of the languages. The only really good English to Thai dictionary / phrasebook, I could find in my early days, was Robertson's dictionary phrase book with a yellow paper sleave cover, because it explained meaning well and showed usage for a Western person. That was before I could read Thai script. It may be still possible to get it, but not easy. I believe the update of it was taken over by the Goldings couple Mike and Benjawan. For phone or computer App I recommend Thai-English English-Thai Talking Dictionary (Paiboon). I used to use that a lot on my old iphone, but have other free dictionaries now, suited to advanced use only (Intended for Thai people - meanings can be in Thai script).

The funny one is the Thai word "maa" (flat tone) meaning to "come" to the place where the speaker is located. When a guy wants to ask the girl, did she come (cum or orgasm), he cannot use the Thai word "maa", yet Thai word "maa" also can mean dog, horse, or chinese mother, depending on if rising, high, or falling tones. Met one bargirl called "Maa" at Suzi Wong 2 or 3 years ago I guess. Important to get the right tone. LOL Obviously was not Maa (dog).

Other Thai words have multiple meanings without any tone change as well. "Chaa" (flat tone) means either tea (to drink) or numb. Exact same spelling.

[EihTooms]

I am also mostly a non-alcoholic drinker and trying to avoid sugar. In bars I order Soda, Coke Light, Tomato juice, Pineapple juice, or mineral water. Not a problem. You probably have to buy at least one drink to be entitled to watch the entertainment (if any) and justify your seat.Despite the fact that it does contain sugar, which I also try to avoid as much as possible, I would pay 200 baht for a non-alcoholic beer like O'Doul's or even Sharp's if the go-go bars and beer bars would import and stock it. Sometimes I get a bit sick of sweet drinks like sodas (even artificially sweetened) and fruit juice and long for the taste of beer as an alternative with pizza, burgers, spicy Thai food, et al or to just sip from when viewing the passing parade. But I really don't like the short term or long term effects of drinking a regular beer, especially when the pattern is usually not just one beer at one go-go bar for the whole night but more than one beer at several go-go bars. So a non-alcoholic beer would do the trick. However, I assume the idea of selling a beer that does not get someone buzzed or drunk enough to make more foolish choices than usual is out of the question in Thailand.

[Syzygies]

Despite the fact that it does contain sugar, which I also try to avoid as much as possible, I would pay 200 baht for a non-alcoholic beer like O'Doul's or even Sharp's if the go-go bars and beer bars would import and stock it. Sometimes I get a bit sick of sweet drinks like sodas (even artificially sweetened) and fruit juice and long for the taste of beer as an alternative with pizza, burgers, spicy Thai food, et al or to just sip from when viewing the passing parade. But I really don't like the short term or long term effects of drinking a regular beer, especially when the pattern is usually not just one beer at one go-go bar for the whole night but more than one beer at several go-go bars. So a non-alcoholic beer would do the trick. However, I assume the idea of selling a beer that does not get someone buzzed or drunk enough to make more foolish choices than usual is out of the question in Thailand.Ha ha. Sugar, if overdone, is one of the worlds most insidious poisons, and a major cause of bad health (forget low fat diets) in addition to being rather fattening, I believe. Extreme moderation called for.

Yes non-alcoholic beer seems foolish to many, just like can be hard to get a good decaffeinated coffee. My local pub doesn't have it. Thai oriented coffee shops do not have it, despite the fact they will adulterate their coffees with all sorts of gimmicky things like whipped cream, caramel, sugar syrup, etc. Etc. (can't think of them all). I have to make my own night time coffee at home with a good quality 100% Arabica Decaf (I usually import to Thailand in my suitcase), which can retain a pretty excellent taste without keeping me awake all night. I happen to be semi-addicted to coffee without necessarily needing the Caffeine fix all the time. It's a bit like being semi-addicted to hot naked girls.

Since I cum with great difficulty, and alcohol only makes that worse, I drink alcohol in extreme moderation before sex fun. Drinking after sex fun is already done suits me better. I can imagine, that for guys that cum too quick, a few drinks before to numb the dick sensitivity just a little, could be a big help, rather than hindrance. Thick condoms could also help. LOL (but not for me). One Japanese buddy always drinks before mongering to help last longer.

[Blanquiceleste]

I'm a non-alcohol drinker. I'll be hitting BKK / Pattaya this April for a week & it's my first time.

Correct me if I'm wrong, I assume soft drinks are available in all Beer / A Go Go Bars and considered as normal drink. It might be a real noob question, but I want to make sure that they consider even soft drinks as normal drinks & don't ask to buy alcoholic drinks. To be actual, I even don't take soft drinks like coke in any day due to it's high calorie content, which imbalances my gym diet plan. Now this is being said I'd also like to ask "Would it be okay if I don't buy any drink for me (except mineral water & Lady drinks) in any Club" ?

Any advice from senior & experience folks would be most welcome.While you will get non alcoholic drinks at all bars, you might get the odd stare or snide remark from a cheeky waitress. I got one at Pattaya in Baccara last week. I got pissed and I simply paid for the water I ordered and left. I am not tolerant about bad attitude from waitresses. But if that does not derail you, you will be fine.

P.S. - In most places just normal water is fine too.

[Syzygies]

While you will get non alcoholic drinks at all bars, you might get the odd stare or snide remark from a cheeky waitress. I got one at Pattaya in Baccara last week. I got pissed and I simply paid for the water I ordered and left. I am not tolerant about bad attitude from waitresses. But if that does not derail you, you will be fine.

P.S. - In most places just normal water is fine too.I wonder what remark makes a guy pissed so easily. I don't let the odd smartass spoil my fun.

In Thailand we should learn to be cool.

[MusicalToM]

Nice to hear from you all. To be a bit technical I would like to mention that a normal Coke / Pepsi / Artificial fruit juice of 200 ML. Contains around 200-210 cals, which is same as running for 35 minutes at 6 km / HR. I consider these drinks are bad for health if you care about your good health.

I think I'll stick to mineral water or fruit juices at these places. And I believe these clubs / bars offer sugarless juices as well.

And for the Lady drink part, "What would be the best way to tell a lady that I prefer non-alcoholic drinker, meaning I don't want her to drink alcohol since it may create a bad smell / taste for me while having kisses later in the night" ? And I do understand that some soft drinks are even more expensive than beers, but that's okay with me.

At Wolvenvacht: I couldn't stop my laugh after reading this. No offense to anybody but I believe this Muslims not drinking alcohol tradition (or whatever you call it) exists only in golf countries. People living in States / UK / Europe / India & in other major countries drink alcohol irrespective of their religion.

I personally don't drink alcohol since I don't like neither it's taste nor it's smell & I believe it exposes someone fake (sometimes original) personality in front of others. It's like alcohol speaks for you but not you.

[EihTooms]

My usual Crazy House visit thoughts.

Recent visit saw all my regular or prospective girls missing Donut, Ging, Oom, Noi, Naen, and Jane (last two yet to be tried). I realised that girls are in 3 groups: Yellow badge are the little girls who have good bodies and dance downstairs. Red badge are tall models who dance downstairs. Green badge are the older or fatter girls who dance upstairs when place gets too busy downstairs.
I have never taken a girl who was dancing upstairs although I have sat up there a couple of times when there were no seats available downstairs. It seemed to me there are times when a girl has been sent up there because she is too new, too inexperienced, or isn't cutting it on the Lady Drink sales downstairs. One time when I sat up there I watched a couple of very young looking girls being "taught" how to move their asses and work the pole by the other, more experienced girls. Dancing, that is. LOL.

[EihTooms]

While you will get non alcoholic drinks at all bars, you might get the odd stare or snide remark from a cheeky waitress. I got one at Pattaya in Baccara last week. I got pissed and I simply paid for the water I ordered and left. I am not tolerant about bad attitude from waitresses. But if that does not derail you, you will be fine.

P.S. - In most places just normal water is fine too.I got the smartass remark, eye-rolling, very showy so all could see disgusted look of dismay (seriously) from a downstairs waitress and another time from an upstairs waitress at Crazy House when I ordered bottled water. And this was after I had been going there, buying plenty of Lady Drinks, and barfining several girls multiple times. I cancelled my order right there on the spot with a smile and took my good times and money with me to another bar. That was months and months ago.

Now, I never get a crossed eye or a negative reaction to my ordering water, Coke Zero or whatever I want from any waitress at Crazy House. And I suspect that might be the case with other customers now as well. I think my earlier reaction, the one they apparently wanted me to have by their idiotic behavior, did exactly what I wanted it to do. Couldn't care less how they "felt" about my reaction deep down inside as Thais and all that. All I care about is how they behave now, which is much better with me at least than they behaved before. Mission accomplished.

[EihTooms]

I wonder what remark makes a guy pissed so easily. I don't let the odd smartass spoil my fun.

In Thailand we should learn to be cool.There is no bar or venue in Thailand where ones "fun is spoiled" if they leave there and go somewhere else, usually right next door or around the corner at most.

[Wolvenvacht]

I don't quite understand. How does lady drink have any relevance to the drink you ordered for yourself? Normally I am drinking soda and lady takes tequila, or soft depending on her preference. Usually if I take Tequilla, the lady does also, but there exist teetotaller ladies who never ever drink alcohol, so even I take tequila, she can drink soft. For ladies becoming drunk, it is better if they stop the alcohol too.
I can only guess but perhaps some punters will think they are "swindled" if the LD does not contain alcohol and cause trouble. I remember a discussion on the forum here about someone finding out that the "whisky-cola" LD he (thought he) paid for was just watered-down cola.

The Thai girls with their desire to "take care", not give offence and "save face" may feel themselves somehow obliged to follow their guest in his drinking style.

But that is just my guess. Or maybe I have the looks of an old drunkard and they are surprised that I am only old.

[Hioctane]

While you will get non alcoholic drinks at all bars, you might get the odd stare or snide remark from a cheeky waitress. I got one at Pattaya in Baccara last week. I got pissed and I simply paid for the water I ordered and left. I am not tolerant about bad attitude from waitresses. But if that does not derail you, you will be fine.

P.S. - In most places just normal water is fine too.In some cases. Non alcohol drinks are the same or more expensive than alcoholic drinks! You can order whatever you want. Is is your money and holiday! And if a waitress made a snide remark, I just chuckle and tell her I have been out for hours already drinking all day and just taking a break. Most of the time, it's actually true.

[Hioctane]

Nice to hear from you all. To be a bit technical I would like to mention that a normal Coke / Pepsi / Artificial fruit juice of 200 ML. Contains around 200-210 cals, which is same as running for 35 minutes at 6 km / HR. I consider these drinks are bad for health if you care about your good health.

I think I'll stick to mineral water or fruit juices at these places. And I believe these clubs / bars offer sugarless juices as well.

And for the Lady drink part, "What would be the best way to tell a lady that I prefer non-alcoholic drinker, meaning I don't want her to drink alcohol since it may create a bad smell / taste for me while having kisses later in the night" ? And I do understand that some soft drinks are even more expensive than beers, but that's okay with me.

At Wolvenvacht: I couldn't stop my laugh after reading this. No offense to anybody but I believe this Muslims not drinking alcohol tradition (or whatever you call it) exists only in golf countries. People living in States / UK / Europe / India & in other major countries drink alcohol irrespective of their religion.

I personally don't drink alcohol since I don't like neither it's taste nor it's smell & I believe it exposes someone fake (sometimes original) personality in front of others. It's like alcohol speaks for you but not you.You can't control what a lady does or does not drink. You can refuse to buy her a certain drink. Think about it. Hasn't she probably drank throughout the night already? If you are really worried about her smell, stock mouth wash in your room and have her rinse her mouth.

[Syzygies]

Nice to hear from you all. To be a bit technical I would like to mention that a normal Coke / Pepsi / Artificial fruit juice of 200 ML. Contains around 200-210 cals, which is same as running for 35 minutes at 6 km / HR. I consider these drinks are bad for health if you care about your good health.

I think I'll stick to mineral water or fruit juices at these places. And I believe these clubs / bars offer sugarless juices as well.

And for the Lady drink part, "What would be the best way to tell a lady that I prefer non-alcoholic drinker, meaning I don't want her to drink alcohol since it may create a bad smell / taste for me while having kisses later in the night" ? And I do understand that some soft drinks are even more expensive than beers, but that's okay with me.

I personally don't drink alcohol since I don't like neither it's taste nor it's smell & I believe it exposes someone fake (sometimes original) personality in front of others. It's like alcohol speaks for you but not you.I avoid high calorie (high sugar drinks). Sex is not going to work it off. You may think alcohol is bad for the lady, and the high calories can be too.

If the lady is drinking Tequilas, the usual alcoholic lady drink, I don't find it results in bad breath that I can tell. Sometimes the lady can have something from food on her breath. I don't like drunk ladies though. The lady has limited choices for her lady drink. A lady coke is usually watered down to decrease her sugar intake. Nothing strange about that. Whiskey Coke is not a typical lady drink at Crazy House. It may be at some bars.

A tequila for lady costs 170 Baht (at Crazy House) and she gets 60 Baht from that. Not sure if a coke / fanta is exactly the same, but Tequila and coke may have costed less than 340 Baht. I seem to recall either 320 or 330 for that. I think a waitress coke drink is 160 Baht. Not sure if commission on that is 50 or 60 Baht.

When I shout my special waitress a drink (S1 - service lady number 1), she is drinking something that looks watered down. I don't really care what it is. Probably part coke, part soda. She looks after me very special so she gets something special from me. Other staff sometimes make mistakes with calculator or put a bill in wrong holder while customer is at the toilet. My waitress does not mistakes in my experience. We now have to sign each sheet to prove it is our bill page. If you have an unsigned bill page, and do not recognise the number of the girl who drinks were bought for, you would know that a page was mistakenly put in your holder. Can happen. Not all waitresses have same levels of concentration and ability. I can recommend for anyone little waitress S1 if happen to spot her working in your area.

In my opinion alcohol exposes the real personality of people moreso than a fake personality. I never like to get a girlfriend without having seen her behavior drunk. If her drunk behavior is really bad, then I am afraid that is a personality trait that would be exposed over time anyway. Happy silly drunks are okay For me. Nasty evil drunks are not on. Run amok drunks are also not to be accepted. For a casual acquaintance like a bargirl, its better she is not drunk, however a few drinks can loosen a girl up so she is able to have fun despite normal timidness.

[Banana Boi]

I never check to see if the LD's are watered down or not. My regular at Windmill can't weigh more than 45 kg. I buy her 10 tequilas for 1000 baht which is quite the deal for 30 songs of DFK and lap dances. If the tequilas weren't watered down my girl would be hammered. In reality, she doesn't even look like she had a single drink. Doesn't bother me imo the LD's are a symbol of me buying her time.

[Syzygies]

Ging 40 arrives at the bar late. She doesn't come to me immediately, has hassles to deal with. I go upstairs to the toilet. She is waiting in girl queue to pish most likely. I tell her I have guessed she has more than just me as a regular customer today. "a crash of trains" we call it in Thai. Little do I know just how many guys are wanting her to come to them. I tell her straight off, I will bar fine her if she chooses me. So she knows she can make money. She indicates one other customer did not come to her birthday but today would just like to buy her some drinks. I say no problem, I will hang around and she can still come to me after that.

I have been watching various girls dance and no other special option turns up. Eventually Ging comes to me, but indicates while she will accept my barfine of her to go for ST, she does not want to be BFed immediately. Ah Ha. I understand. I say okay I am not in a hurry. I tell her she can go entertain some other regular customers for a while and come back to me. She sits with me for one period before going off to dance. Coming off dancing another customer has grabbed her. I don't know everything that is going on, but I have given her permission to do her best to look after her best regulars and return to me later. Some customers are going to be annoyed that Ging will not go with them as she has already agreed to go with me. Despite this some guys are buying her several drinks and giving cash tips as well. I don't want to interfere with her potential to make money, and meanwhile I don't have to buy many drinks. She speaks to my waitress to pass on a message to me to wait and she will return. I am trusting her and eventually she does return. I hope she already told guys she was booked, but how can I know for sure. She was straight with me because she knows I am a good cool non jealous guy that she can trust.

Girls cannot trust all customers that are unknown to them. Ging claims that especially when she was quite new, some time back, several different guys took her for ST and then did not pay afterwards. Girls always consider its possible a new customer will dupe them, or even occasionally steal from the girl. Girls naturally prefer regular guys that they know can be trusted, and are very wary of new guys. Ging also comments that some customers are hassling the girl to go bareback since the guys will state that some other girls do it. She doesn't need that sort of shit. I am always stressing to girls the importance of ensuring they do not get pregnant under any circumstances and that just the pill is not 100% reliable. Some girls do not take the pill anyway.

Later she told me she had 7 potential customers, and some were regulars. One just flew in from overseas and wanted her badly, but he had not pre booked and she had promised me already. Also she commented he tries too hard to get her to bareback. She ended up making money from three customers (at least) for the night including from me. Because of myself being willing to wait patiently, she could make extra money. She indicated that the previous Friday, none of her regulars showed. But today several. Impossible for her to juggle them all and try to keep them all happy. I probably won out over the others, by being the most accommodating understanding guy of the lot and having a reliable track record. Other customers are not like me. If I had lost out today, too bad. Most guys did lose out, could have been me too, but I assume some were willing to buy drinks anyway even if BF was not possible.

Ging admonished me for not sending her a LINE message first to say I was attending this night. Later asked if I would come back for her tomorrow. Looks like I can get a booking if I want it. I never sent Ging a LINE message before CH starting time this occasion, because initially I was thinking about Donut (who did not show up). LOL Actually I like them both a lot.

Another hot girl Jane (Jaeng) number 4, I saw her dance for one set and then go straight to her regular customer, and shortly get her plain clothes on. She never lasts long. Just too sexy. I never got a chance to BF her yet. With some girls you have to be damn quick to have a chance and even then they may be expecting their regular customer.

Other ordinary girls are very very available. It's not an even playing field.

[Syzygies]

I never check to see if the LD's are watered down or not. My regular at Windmill can't weigh more than 45 kg. I buy her 10 tequilas for 1000 baht which is quite the deal for 30 songs of DFK and lap dances. If the tequilas weren't watered down my girl would be hammered. In reality, she doesn't even look like she had a single drink. Doesn't bother me imo the LD's are a symbol of me buying her time.At some bars lady tequilas and customer tequilas are not at all the same. You know why obviously.

At Crazy House they are exactly the same. May not be the absolute strongest tequila on the market, but when the tequilas come, the customer can select whichever one he chooses. They are identical, unless one is slightly fuller than another.

So I would certainly not buy a girl 10 tequilas. If not BFing a girl, I may give her a small cash tip in addition to a few drinks. Some girls have ordered exclusively Tequilas, and others have mixed it up between sometimes Tequila and sometimes soft. Occasionally meet a girl who doesn't drink alcohol at all. I hate to see really drunk girls, but it happens sometimes. We don't know how many she had earlier and if had any of the Yaa Dong (strong drink) out front of bar, unless she tells the detail.

[Goatscrot]

Ging 40 arrives at the bar late. She doesn't come to me immediately, has hassles to deal with. I go upstairs to the toilet. She is waiting in girl queue to pish most likely. I tell her I have guessed she has more than just me as a regular customer today. "a crash of trains" we call it in Thai. Little do I know just how many guys are wanting her to come to them. I tell her straight off, I will bar fine her if she chooses me. So she knows she can make money. She indicates one other customer did not come to her birthday but today would just like to buy her some drinks. I say no problem, I will hang around and she can still come to me after that.

I have been watching various girls dance and no other special option turns up. Eventually Ging comes to me, but indicates while she will accept my barfine of her to go for ST, she does not want to be BFed immediately. Ah Ha. I understand. I say okay I am not in a hurry. I tell her she can go entertain some other regular customers for a while and come back to me. She sits with me for one period before going off to dance. Coming off dancing another customer has grabbed her. I don't know everything that is going on, but I have given her permission to do her best to look after her best regulars and return to me later. Some customers are going to be annoyed that Ging will not go with them as she has already agreed to go with me. Despite this some guys are buying her several drinks and giving cash tips as well. I don't want to interfere with her potential to make money, and meanwhile I don't have to buy many drinks. She speaks to my waitress to pass on a message to me to wait and she will return. I am trusting her and eventually she does return. I hope she already told guys she was booked, but how can I know for sure. She was straight with me because she knows I am a good cool non jealous guy that she can trust.

Girls cannot trust all customers that are unknown to them. Ging claims that especially when she was quite new, some time back, several different guys took her for ST and then did not pay afterwards. Girls always consider its possible a new customer will dupe them, or even occasionally steal from the girl. Girls naturally prefer regular guys that they know can be trusted, and are very wary of new guys. Ging also comments that some customers are hassling the girl to go bareback since the guys will state that some other girls do it. She doesn't need that sort of shit. I am always stressing to girls the importance of ensuring they do not get pregnant under any circumstances and that just the pill is not 100% reliable. Some girls do not take the pill anyway.

Later she told me she had 7 potential customers, and some were regulars. One just flew in from overseas and wanted her badly, but he had not pre booked and she had promised me already. Also she commented he tries too hard to get her to bareback. She ended up making money from three customers (at least) for the night including from me. Because of myself being willing to wait patiently, she could make extra money. She indicated that the previous Friday, none of her regulars showed. But today several. Impossible for her to juggle them all and try to keep them all happy. I probably won out over the others, by being the most accommodating understanding guy of the lot and having a reliable track record. Other customers are not like me. If I had lost out today, too bad. Most guys did lose out, could have been me too, but I assume some were willing to buy drinks anyway even if BF was not possible.

Ging admonished me for not sending her a LINE message first to say I was attending this night. Later asked if I would come back for her tomorrow. Looks like I can get a booking if I want it. I never sent Ging a LINE message before CH starting time this occasion, because initially I was thinking about Donut (who did not show up). LOL Actually I like them both a lot.

Another hot girl Jane (Jaeng) number 4, I saw her dance for one set and then go straight to her regular customer, and shortly get her plain clothes on. She never lasts long. Just too sexy. I never got a chance to BF her yet. With some girls you have to be damn quick to have a chance and even then they may be expecting their regular customer.

Other ordinary girls are very very available. It's not an even playing field.I admire your patience. I really have no desire to get that involved in a working girls business or the politics of a GoGo bar. I would find it very tedious. The only think I really care about is how skilled they are in the sack.

[Syzygies]

I admire your patience. I really have no desire to get that involved in a working girls business or the politics of a GoGo bar. I would find it very tedious. The only think I really care about is how skilled they are in the sack.On the other hand, I am not that concerned about girl having wonderful skills. It's only an extra bonus for me, and of course rarely found with bar girls. As long as she is hot, pretty, can go with the flow, have fun, and have a reasonable GFE, that is enough for me. I take some girls with rather weak blowjobs. Not a big deal for me. Even some expert MP girls BJ technique is not right for me, being too fast or too strong.

I think some bargirls are doing extremely well on looks, sexiness, and attitude. That means they don't have to be that concerned with developing wonderful skills. May not even occur to them. For ordinary looking girls, they may need to build skills to really hook regulars, with attitude possibly not enough, I am not sure. Even in massage joints, I am still going for looks, GFE, and fun attitude, feel of the pussy, with maybe a slightly higher skills expectation.

Some special things I like, I can easily train the girl to do for me, such as ball tickling and tits brushing balls. However what are the skills that a skilled girl brings? The only ones that occur to me are: DFK (not difficult at all), soft slow body slide (unskilled girls go too fast and hard. Less sexy), soft slow BBBJ, deepthroat is added bonus, cowgirl grind movements (that should come naturally to a girl). That is about it for me. Perhaps there are plenty of skills I forget. There is the pussy squeeze of dick that I get from one favorite bargirl, but not many girls are doing that very well.

Do we say a girl is really skilled if her blowjob is superb, or is there more to it than that? Okay I recall many guys have ass rimming as a big requirement. However that is not difficult to do (I do for girls if they like it). Is it just about if girl likes to do it or not? I don't have girls sticking anything up my ass. Also I am not into massage at all. I guess I forgot handjob, but again I do not take HJ. Little interest in that. Maybe blowjob, deepthroat, and squeezing pussy are the only skills really that useful to me, but I don't assume I will get more than some sort of BJ. Very expert BJ I find quite rarely as well, and maybe my expert BJ is not the same as for other guys.

Something else that occurs to me. Some girls like to fuck in a fairly powerful manner, and I expect many guys like it. This is not really suited to me, perhaps relating to me taking a long time to cum. Obviously no one likes a starfish fuck. Orgasmic girls are more fun, but its not a skill.

[JesseJames]

At some bars lady tequilas and customer tequilas are not at all the same. You know why obviously.

At Crazy House they are exactly the same. May not be the absolute strongest tequila on the market, but when the tequilas come, the customer can select whichever one he chooses. They are identical, unless one is slightly fuller than another.

So I would certainly not buy a girl 10 tequilas. If not BFing a girl, I may give her a small cash tip in addition to a few drinks. Some girls have ordered exclusively Tequilas, and others have mixed it up between sometimes Tequila and sometimes soft. Occasionally meet a girl who doesn't drink alcohol at all. I hate to see really drunk girls, but it happens sometimes. We don't know how many she had earlier and if had any of the Yaa Dong (strong drink) out front of bar, unless she tells the detail.Make her clean up her puke in the morning.

[Goatscrot]

On the other hand, I am not that concerned about girl having wonderful skills. It's only an extra bonus for me, and of course rarely found with bar girls. As long as she is hot, pretty, can go with the flow, have fun, and have a reasonable GFE, that is enough for me. I take some girls with rather weak blowjobs. Not a big deal for me. Even some expert MP girls BJ technique is not right for me, being too fast or too strong.

I think some bargirls are doing extremely well on looks, sexiness, and attitude. That means they don't have to be that concerned with developing wonderful skills. May not even occur to them. For ordinary looking girls, they may need to build skills to really hook regulars, with attitude possibly not enough, I am not sure. Even in massage joints, I am still going for looks, GFE, and fun attitude, feel of the pussy, with maybe a slightly higher skills expectation.

Some special things I like, I can easily train the girl to do for me, such as ball tickling and tits brushing balls. However what are the skills that a skilled girl brings? The only ones that occur to me are: DFK (not difficult at all), soft slow body slide (unskilled girls go too fast and hard. Less sexy), soft slow BBBJ, deepthroat is added bonus, cowgirl grind movements (that should come naturally to a girl). That is about it for me. Perhaps there are plenty of skills I forget. There is the pussy squeeze of dick that I get from one favorite bargirl, but not many girls are doing that very well.

Do we say a girl is really skilled if her blowjob is superb, or is there more to it than that? Okay I recall many guys have ass rimming as a big requirement. However that is not difficult to do (I do for girls if they like it). Is it just about if girl likes to do it or not? I don't have girls sticking anything up my ass. Also I am not into massage at all. I guess I forgot handjob, but again I do not take HJ. Little interest in that. Maybe blowjob, deepthroat, and squeezing pussy are the only skills really that useful to me, but I don't assume I will get more than some sort of BJ. Very expert BJ I find quite rarely as well, and maybe my expert BJ is not the same as for other guys.

Something else that occurs to me. Some girls like to fuck in a fairly powerful manner, and I expect many guys like it. This is not really suited to me, perhaps relating to me taking a long time to cum. Obviously no one likes a starfish fuck. Orgasmic girls are more fun, but its not a skill.It is amazing how our likes vary so much; but I am sure that is true for all of us on this board.

[Blanquiceleste]

I wonder what remark makes a guy pissed so easily. I don't let the odd smartass spoil my fun.

In Thailand we should learn to be cool.Yeah! I guess I need to work on my inner peace. 5555.

I reported on this on the Pattaya thread but in short here is what happened: I had already consumed 5 drinks when I entered Baccara. So I ordered just plain water. The lady made a face and got me abottle of water and put it on the table and turned away. I called her and asked for a glass with ice. She turned away like she was being asked to move a mountain, came back with it and put it down a bit harder than usual and said "You no want to drink ah mister?

That is it!

[Syzygies]

I called her and asked for a glass with ice. She turned away like she was being asked to move a mountain, came back with it and put it down a bit harder than usual and said "You no want to drink ah mister?
Well, you know every bar probably has some crap waitresses. Some have brain floating away, too slow, forgot who ordered the drink, can't calculate a bill correctly, take too long to total bill when you need to leave in a hurry, hassle customer for drinks, make wrong assumptions, etc. Shit happens everywhere.

Some staff have seen a past pattern of cheap Charlie sitting on a bottle of water all night, a waste of space. The problem is just that she may assume the worst before that is actually justified.

If me, I would not be too pissed off with faulty assumptions. Some Crazy House dancing girls commented to me that they were scared of me when I first started to go to Crazy House due to dark rings around eye sockets, and maybe deadpan expression (not smiling constantly). Soon they learned from waitresses that in fact I was a nice guy. I proved the assumptions to be wrong.

[MusicalToM]

I had already consumed 5 drinks when I entered Baccara. So I ordered just plain water. The lady made a face and got me abottle of water and put it on the table and turned away. I called her and asked for a glass with ice. She turned away like she was being asked to move a mountain, came back with it and put it down a bit harder than usual and said "You no want to drink ah mister?
LOL. It's business everywhere & it's their (waitresses) job to get it done somehow. They simply don't care whether you want it or not. Perhaps it's an attitude they have built over time. I wonder how they handle it in their initial days as an amateur, may be they get some training of some sort. And this is the same story everywhere in the world (more in developing countries though).

Anyway we go their for something else, drink is just a part of it. And till the time a mineral water is considered as drink we can ignore these annoying remarks. Anyway nice to hear your experience, will use it as an feedback in my trip.

[Titanio]

LOL. It's business everywhere & it's their (waitresses) job to get it done somehow. They simply don't care whether you want it or not. Perhaps it's an attitude they have built over time. I wonder how they handle it in their initial days as an amateur, may be they get some training of some sort. And this is the same story everywhere in the world (more in developing countries though).

Anyway we go their for something else, drink is just a part of it. And till the time a mineral water is considered as drink we can ignore these annoying remarks. Anyway nice to hear your experience, will use it as an feedback in my trip.I jusr order Manao Soda (soda water with a slice of lemon) everywhere, never get a complain, sometimes a question from a girl why I only drink water. But that is all. Unfortunately the soda in Thailand is just purified local water where in all surrounding countries a can of Schweppes is served. Occasionally I finish with a Jack Daniels & Coke, and then you see the surprises, but again never a complain.

[Goatscrot]

Well, you know every bar probably has some crap waitresses. Some have brain floating away, too slow, forgot who ordered the drink, can't calculate a bill correctly, take too long to total bill when you need to leave in a hurry, hassle customer for drinks, make wrong assumptions, etc. Shit happens everywhere.

Some staff have seen a past pattern of cheap Charlie sitting on a bottle of water all night, a waste of space. The problem is just that she may assume the worst before that is actually justified.

If me, I would not be too pissed off with faulty assumptions. Some Crazy House dancing girls commented to me that they were scared of me when I first started to go to Crazy House due to dark rings around eye sockets, and maybe deadpan expression (not smiling constantly). Soon they learned from waitresses that in fact I was a nice guy. I proved the assumptions to be wrong.Service in general in LOS is really not all that great IMHO. There are some very noted exceptions, but overall one cannot expect Western style service here. I think this is especially off-putting to Americans who are used to superb service in restaurants and bars where most employees work for tips.

[Pipe Layer99]

Service in general in LOS is really not all that great IMHO. There are some very noted exceptions, but overall one cannot expect Western style service here. I think this is especially off-putting to Americans who are used to superb service in restaurants and bars where most employees work for tips.Exactly! And that's why we don't care about their motivation for doing their jobs.
Same goes for gogo girls. We expect them to get off their ass and take care of the customer. When they don't do their job, they lose $.

[Pipe Layer99]

I admire your patience. I really have no desire to get that involved in a working girls business or the politics of a GoGo bar. I would find it very tedious. The only think I really care about is how skilled they are in the sack.That's a sucker. Waiting for a working girl to come. That's a joke.

If I am willing to pay the barfine, she is coming NOW. Otherwise, I'm out of there and going to get another one. I'm not waiting for a prostitute.

[Goatscrot]

That's a sucker. Waiting for a working girl to come. That's a joke.

If I am willing to pay the barfine, she is coming NOW. Otherwise, I'm out of there and going to get another one. I'm not waiting for a prostitute.Amen. At the end of the day I am the customer and expect to be catered to. I am not going to "*****mance," wait around or cater to her whims. Methinks that is one of the big problems and one of the reasons the scene has declined so much. Mongers 15-20 years ago were a different breed. More demanding and with higher expectations. A gal that pulled that crap would not make a thing. Dudes would just not stand for it. That has all changed. If I have to cater to them I might as well move back home. Of course I feel the same about the ridiculous prices. Have a buddy who is friends with the owner of Baccara. His top earners are making close to 300 K Baht per month. Really guys, let that sink in. Do you really know how much money that is in Thailand? I don't blame the gals at all. It is the sucker customers that are dishing out big bucks for 15 min of action. Amazing really, but yes, it screws it up for all of us. Now don't get me wrong, there were 15 min quickies back in the day, but you paid between 500 and 1k Baht for them and at the time that was 12.50 - 25 USD and that is still about what a 15 min quickie is worth.

[Pipe Layer99]

Amen. At the end of the day I am the customer and expect to be catered to. I am not going to "*****mance," wait around or cater to her whims. Methinks that is one of the big problems and one of the reasons the scene has declined so much. Mongers 15-20 years ago were a different breed. More demanding and with higher expectations. A gal that pulled that crap would not make a thing. Dudes would just not stand for it. That has all changed. If I have to cater to them I might as well move back home. Of course I feel the same about the ridiculous prices. Have a buddy who is friends with the owner of Baccara. His top earners are making close to 300 K Baht per month. Really guys, let that sink in. Do you really know how much money that is in Thailand? I don't blame the gals at all. It is the sucker customers that are dishing out big bucks for 15 min of action. Amazing really, but yes, it screws it up for all of us.Too many suckers out there putting up with that crap. I treat the ladies right. But at the same time I'm a paying customer. I expect her to take care of me (now). If you can't, you lose. Bye bye.

I told a girl to come tonight via message. She said, I just came to the club 5 minutes. I replied ok, Come to my room? (as if I care that she just went to the club). She said, I wait for my friend to come. I replied, I don't wait for you long time. I want you come soon. You come now you win money.
8 minutes later she replies asking if I can wait 1. 5 hours. I didn't answer that message. I already told her I am not waiting. (no I am not waiting for her to come. She needs to come now. If she wants to work).
5 minutes after that she asks where is my room now. And she wants to know if I want her to come now. (How many times do I need to tell her to come now?)

I didn't answer. Why? She is in the club looking for a man. I told her to come. She wants to wait for a friend. Yeah right. IMO she can tell her friend she has a customer and get on that motorbike. She lost money.
I don't play that crap.
In the meantime, during those 15 minutes, I already called 2-3 more and the first one to reply won.

[Syzygies]

LOL. It's business everywhere & it's their (waitresses) job to get it done somehow. They simply don't care whether you want it or not. Perhaps it's an attitude they have built over time. I wonder how they handle it in their initial days as an amateur, may be they get some training of some sort. And this is the same story everywhere in the world (more in developing countries though).
The management of many bars is not great. The waiting staff can be pretty shit. Some need to be fired, however maybe they are not paid well enough to hire better ones. If I find a good waitress that looks after me, I hang on to her.

In Mandarin Upstairs, the whole place was slack. Girls supposed to be dancing were just standing there half the time. If the music is no good fire the DJ. Otherwise fine the girls for not dancing. Some places have very poor lighting, some have very poor music. Some very poor or annoying waiting staff.

It may not be rocket science to improve the bar overall experience.

[Goatscrot]

Too many suckers out there putting up with that crap. I treat the ladies right. But at the same time I'm a paying customer. I expect her to take care of me (now). If you can't, you lose. Bye bye.

I told a girl to come tonight via message. She said, I just came to the club 5 minutes. I replied ok, Come to my room? (as if I care that she just went to the club). She said, I wait for my friend to come. I replied, I don't wait for you long time. I want you come soon. You come now you win money.
8 minutes later she replies asking if I can wait 1. 5 hours. I didn't answer that message. I already told her I am not waiting. (no I am not waiting for her to come. She needs to come now. If she wants to work).
5 minutes after that she asks where is my room now. And she wants to know if I want her to come now. (How many times do I need to tell her to come now?)

I didn't answer. Why? She is in the club looking for a man. I told her to come. She wants to wait for a friend. Yeah right. IMO she can tell her friend she has a customer and get on that motorbike. She lost money.
I don't play that crap.
In the meantime, during those 15 minutes, I already called 2-3 more and the first one to reply won.If the majority of mongers took this approach we would all receive better service and see better attitudes, like we did in the past. Sadly, I don't think that is going to happen. Dudes have brought their Western ways to LOS.

[Syzygies]

In the meantime, during those 15 minutes, I already called 2-3 more and the first one to reply won.Thais cannot be on time even if money depends on it. Maybe they are just not desperate enough.

Plenty of bar girls will not come to work purely because its raining and more difficult to get a taxi organised to pick her up at her front door, even if they know they will miss out on some good money.

My GF takes hours to get ready to go somewhere, e. G. Out to dinner, entertainment, etc. Pushing her to be quick just makes her angry and then she won't go at all, so it's useless. Don't expect to Thais to work by Farang values of punctuality. Just won't happen for working girls.

Just try going into a Thai oriented Coffee shop, and tell them you are in a hurry for your order. Even so they can be incredibly slow and mucking around, despite no other customers to serve. A western oriented coffee shop has to be better or the customers will not come back. How many Thais and how much time does it take to buy a simple item in a department store?

In my local sports pub, one girl was incredibly efficient. She was from Myanmar. The Thai staff varied from medium fast to one incredibly slow and only able to do one thing at a time. That one should have been fired for slowness in my opinion. She was considered to have good English, her only asset.

After a very long time in Thailand, you get used to Thai slowness but find places and staff who are better. Sure if a P4 P girl cannot come at the right time, she misses out if have a good option. Sometimes we have no time. Sometimes we have plenty of time. I remember well a girl that was very slow to show up (too busy partying with friends or whatever), so did not bother to contact her any more. It's much easier to go to place and take something available than make appointments with girls. Rather few are on time.

Lollitas shop makes it difficult to book a girl. Fortunately 90% of the time my girl is available, otherwise I could not be bothered to go there.

[Christian G]

Too many suckers out there putting up with that crap. I treat the ladies right. But at the same time I'm a paying customer. I expect her to take care of me (now). If you can't, you lose. Bye bye.
.......
I didn't answer. Why? She is in the club looking for a man. I told her to come. She wants to wait for a friend. Yeah right. IMO she can tell her friend she has a customer and get on that motorbike. She lost money.
I don't play that crap.
In the meantime, during those 15 minutes, I already called 2-3 more and the first one to reply won.I total agree with your approach and usually do the same. Yeah she lost money, up to her. In the last years it seems that many girls prefer to spend time in party drinking with friends first and looking for customer later, up to them. I'm paying customer and I don't waiting for their schedules.

[GoodShag]

I've been to Soi Cowboy before, as well as Nana plaza, but for this trip, I decided to try something different.

So instead of going to those places, I walked towards Phrom Phong skytrain station. About midway between Asoke and Phrom Phong, there are a few bars. I stopped at the "penalty spot", good place to watch a football game surrounded by girls.

Girls working there are waitresses, but are available for pick up, bar fine 600 baths.

I left with a girl called Miaouw (like a cat begging for food). Not the prettiest, but very GFE.

Paid 1500 baths for short time, but since it was late, she stayed overnight.

It was good fun with all my fav. Positions (BBBJ, DATY, doggy, etc.). To my surprise, she gave me a really good BBBJ when we woke up in the morning, so that was a plus.

I thought that it was a nice experience, a good change from the more famous (and aggressive) bars in cowboy and Nana.

[Goatscrot]

I total agree with your approach and usually do the same. Yeah she lost money, up to her. In the last years it seems that many girls prefer to spend time in party drinking with friends first and looking for customer later, up to them. I'm paying customer and I don't waiting for their schedules.That's been going on for quite a few years now. The gals make enough money to only work when they feel like it. And hey, good on on 'them. That's what happens when they can make 5-15 times the daily minimum wage in 15 minutes. Blame the punters for that. I remember fondly just a decade ago when being on Cowboy or right outside Nana at closing time was just amazing. You were confronted with literally hundreds of gals approaching you asking, "go with you?" Like being a bear during a salmon upstream spawning run. But once the ST fees and salaries started creeping up, this ended. Gals would rather party with their friends.

[EihTooms]

Some Crazy House dancing girls commented to me that they were scared of me when I first started to go to Crazy House due to dark rings around eye sockets, and maybe deadpan expression (not smiling constantly). Soon they learned from waitresses that in fact I was a nice guy. I proved the assumptions to be wrong.Man, from the physical condition and demeanor of some of the guys I've seen the girls at Crazy House walk out with (me too, who knows?), including the top lookers dancing there, I would say mere dark rings around the eyes and not smiling constantly should be a welcome relief! LOL.

[Goatscrot]

Geez, it must be contagious. Went into one of the Suk BJ bars (I will not name it as I think this is a one off issue), grabbed the best looking gal and headed upstairs. She was all smiles and I was anticipating a great little sesh. Started to attempt to disrobe her and she immediately started with, "I take off you tip 500 Baht. " What? Really? I was a bit taken aback as I have never had an issue getting a BJ gal to disrobe. When I said, no, but you will get a tip, she continued to press me for the amount I would tip her. When I told her it depended on her service her mood soured even more. At this point I was done and I headed for the exit and I made sure to relay my experience to the owner on the way out. In the real world treating a customer like this would get you fired.

[Syzygies]

Geez, it must be contagious. Went into one of the Suk BJ bars (I will not name it as I think this is a one off issue), grabbed the best looking gal and headed upstairs. She was all smiles and I was anticipating a great little sesh. Started to attempt to disrobe her and she immediately started with, "I take off you tip 500 Baht. " What? Really? I was a bit taken aback as I have never had an issue getting a BJ gal to disrobe. When I said, no, but you will get a tip, she continued to press me for the amount I would tip her. When I told her it depended on her service her mood soured even more. At this point I was done and I headed for the exit and I made sure to relay my experience to the owner on the way out. In the real world treating a customer like this would get you fired.Many now have the attitude that they make so little from a BJ, half the fee or less, that you won't won't get anything extra at all without paying something more. That is how they make make money.

Girl's first BJ of the day could be the boss gets 500 and girl 300. That is only 10 bucks. The ratio may improve if she does more BJs, I can't know precisely for every shop.

You could offer her at least something to take to the gear off. Maybe not 500, but not zero. Even 200 would be a significant increase for some girls that are stuggling.

In my case, I almost always want the girl to be nude and fuck her as well. So its always going to cost me extra, however the extra isn't split with the boss if only pay for BJ up front.

[Ixgzca]

Geez, it must be contagious. Went into one of the Suk BJ bars (I will not name it as I think this is a one off issue), grabbed the best looking gal and headed upstairs. She was all smiles and I was anticipating a great little sesh. Started to attempt to disrobe her and she immediately started with, "I take off you tip 500 Baht. " What? Really? I was a bit taken aback as I have never had an issue getting a BJ gal to disrobe. When I said, no, but you will get a tip, she continued to press me for the amount I would tip her. When I told her it depended on her service her mood soured even more. At this point I was done and I headed for the exit and I made sure to relay my experience to the owner on the way out. In the real world treating a customer like this would get you fired.I have seen similar actions at other BJ bars. I inform the management and more importantly I inform the other girls downstairs that their colleague is no good and will drive away customers if she continues. Usually doesn't happen again.

[Goatscrot]

Many now have the attitude that they make so little from a BJ, half the fee or less, that you won't won't get anything extra at all without paying something more. That is how they make make money.

Girl's first BJ of the day could be the boss gets 500 and girl 300. That is only 10 bucks. The ratio may improve if she does more BJs, I can't know precisely for every shop.

You could offer her at least something to take to the gear off. Maybe not 500, but not zero. Even 200 would be a significant increase for some girls that are stuggling.

In my case, I almost always want the girl to be nude and fuck her as well. So its always going to cost me extra, however the extra isn't split with the boss if only pay for BJ up front.I always tip a bit, even if the gal is not so skilled. But a bigger tip has to be earned.

[EihTooms]

Geez, it must be contagious. Went into one of the Suk BJ bars (I will not name it as I think this is a one off issue), grabbed the best looking gal and headed upstairs. She was all smiles and I was anticipating a great little sesh. Started to attempt to disrobe her and she immediately started with, "I take off you tip 500 Baht. " What? Really? I was a bit taken aback as I have never had an issue getting a BJ gal to disrobe. When I said, no, but you will get a tip, she continued to press me for the amount I would tip her. When I told her it depended on her service her mood soured even more. At this point I was done and I headed for the exit and I made sure to relay my experience to the owner on the way out. In the real world treating a customer like this would get you fired.Goatscrot, you didn't specify but I assume you and your girl were using one of the BJ bar's cubicles or curtained booths instead of one of their Short Time rooms? If so, I can't say full nudity has ever been a given in the BJ cubicles / booths for me over the years. I only tried to unbutton a blouse or unhook a bra a couple of times in the past when using those locations and both times it was met with resistence so I stopped. No tip in exchange was even mentioned at the time. And I am talking about starting from a few years back with the more seasoned, better performers I had in those bars, girls with whom I became a repeat customer, not some one week wonder who made up her own rules contrary to house rules and was gone by the following weekend.

When I have wanted full nudity and / or FS along with more time with a girl at a BJ bar, I pop for the typically 1700 baht or so Short Time room. Of course, I have never seen a menu at Dr BJ, L0 lita's, Kasalong, Lolipop1 or Som's Haven stipulating exactly what should be expected in the BJ cubicles / booths, I. E. BBBJ CIM, nudity, FS, whatever, but always assumed the only givens for the BJ cubicles / booths, especially in places where the girls wear theme uniforms, were BBBJ CIM while still in uniform. Isn't that why that experience is only 700-800 baht vs 1700 baht? I never assumed full nudity with or without FS was a realistic much less an expected option in a location where there is no shower and bath towels as there is in the Short Time rooms.

However, if what you described happened in one of their Short Time rooms that you chose and were paying more for, then that was truly inappropriate behavior on the girl's part.

[Pipe Layer99]

.... she immediately started with, "I take off you tip 500 Baht. " What? Really? I was a bit taken aback as I have never had an issue getting a BJ gal to disrobe. When I said, no, but you will get a tip, she continued to press me for the amount I would tip her. When I told her it depended on her service her mood soured even more. At this point I was done and I headed for the exit and I made sure to relay my experience to the owner on the way out. In the real world treating a customer like this would get you fired.Good on you. I'm glad you have the balls to walk out. She won't last long.
So where did you go next. One of the places right next door! ;)

[Goatscrot]

Good on you. I'm glad you have the balls to walk out. She won't last long.
So where did you go next. One of the places right next door! ;)Actually right up the street!

[Goatscrot]

Goatscrot, you didn't specify but I assume you and your girl were using one of the BJ bar's cubicles or curtained booths instead of one of their Short Time rooms? If so, I can't say full nudity has ever been a given in the BJ cubicles / booths for me over the years. I only tried to unbutton a blouse or unhook a bra a couple of times in the past when using those locations and both times it was met with resistence so I stopped. No tip in exchange was even mentioned at the time. And I am talking about starting from a few years back with the more seasoned, better performers I had in those bars, girls with whom I became a repeat customer, not some one week wonder who made up her own rules contrary to house rules and was gone by the following weekend.

When I have wanted full nudity and / or FS along with more time with a girl at a BJ bar, I pop for the typically 1700 baht or so Short Time room. Of course, I have never seen a menu at Dr BJ, L0 lita's, Kasalong, Lolipop1 or Som's Haven stipulating exactly what should be expected in the BJ cubicles / booths, I. E. BBBJ CIM, nudity, FS, whatever, but always assumed the only givens for the BJ cubicles / booths, especially in places where the girls wear theme uniforms, were BBBJ CIM while still in uniform. Isn't that why that experience is only 700-800 baht vs 1700 baht? I never assumed full nudity with or without FS was a realistic much less an expected option in a location where there is no shower and bath towels as there is in the Short Time rooms.

However, if what you described happened in one of their Short Time rooms that you chose and were paying more for, then that was truly inappropriate behavior on the girl's part.In a cubicle, and this was the first time I have ever had this issue in my many years of going to BJ bars. And I am not expecting full sex, although on more than one occasion that did occur and the required sum was given.

[EihTooms]

In a cubicle, and this was the first time I have ever had this issue in my many years of going to BJ bars. And I am not expecting full sex, although on more than one occasion that did occur and the required sum was given.Interesting. I have had BJ bar girls in cubicles / booths initiate DFK, encourage me to take them to the Short Time rooms for more and better action than what usually occurs in the cubicles / booths, and swallow on occasion. But I have never had a girl in one of those lower cost BJ rooms voluntarily remove any clothing, ask if I wanted her to remove any clothing with or without an additional fee or respond positively to my gentle attempts to remove any of their clothing with or without a discussion about an extra fee. But, as I said, I only tried that a couple of times a few years ago and it was met with something like, "Oh no, honey, cannot", end of story so I never bothered to try it again on subsequent visits.

And I have had dozens of girls in just about all of the BJ bars around town over the years. However, I would not discount the distinct possibility that those two early "refusals" were just very unlucky draws for me that set me up for not bothering to bring up the subject ever again.

The only exception for me was once at Som's Haven where it was agreed upfront that FS would take place in one of the BJ rooms on the couch at the 1200 baht price for that option because the Short Time rooms had just been occupied.

The other thing is I rarely use the cubicles / booths in the BJ bars anymore and much prefer the Short Time room experience.

I don't see you mention it, but did you also refuse to pay the 800 baht? Sounds like one of the most annoying things was a Jeykll and Hyde change in her demeanor once you were alone in the cubicle. I have aborted missions for that alone. It never bodes well for anything that follows.

[Wolvenvacht]

Brothers in Sin!

Is there a pharmacy at Suvarnabhumi airport that sells vitamin "V" and "C" (generic forms by preference, if available)?

I will be passing through BKK airport on my way to Hongkong and will stay in a hotel close to the airport before my early flight out again, so I have no time to go to my usual pharmacy on Sukhumvit Road (I'm arriving too late for that).

Wolvenvacht.

[Titanio]

Brothers in Sin!

Is there a pharmacy at Suvarnabhumi airport that sells vitamin "V" and "C" (generic forms by preference, if available)?

I will be passing through BKK airport on my way to Hongkong and will stay in a hotel close to the airport before my early flight out again, so I have no time to go to my usual pharmacy on Sukhumvit Road (I'm arriving too late for that).

Wolvenvacht.I don't think so. But why to worry, your vitamin C or V you can get at almost every street corner in Kowloon.

[Crypton]

Thank you Ken, Syz, and Crypt, and anyone else who chimes in. I wasn't planning on 2 weeks of mongering, but I was concerned with 25 hours of travel time and hoping two weeks was enough stay before the 25 hours back!! Will def mix it up. So for a couple hours with a little cute I'm looking at 1000 baht? What about bar fine? Or should I stick to freelancers and massage girls? Was hoping to take back to my hotel. It was hard to figure on here, overwhelming info.

Thank you thank you guys.I don't think you'll get 2 hours for 1000 baht. One hour probably. I prefer freelancers. No bar fine in any of the bars I mentioned. Of course, it's been a few years since I have been to Bangkok. So I don't know if the prices have risen. But the exchange rate is the same.

[Goatscrot]

Interesting. I have had BJ bar girls in cubicles / booths initiate DFK, encourage me to take them to the Short Time rooms for more and better action than what usually occurs in the cubicles / booths, and swallow on occasion. But I have never had a girl in one of those lower cost BJ rooms voluntarily remove any clothing, ask if I wanted her to remove any clothing with or without an additional fee or respond positively to my gentle attempts to remove any of their clothing with or without a discussion about an extra fee. But, as I said, I only tried that a couple of times a few years ago and it was met with something like, "Oh no, honey, cannot", end of story so I never bothered to try it again on subsequent visits.

And I have had dozens of girls in just about all of the BJ bars around town over the years. However, I would not discount the distinct possibility that those two early "refusals" were just very unlucky draws for me that set me up for not bothering to bring up the subject ever again.

The only exception for me was once at Som's Haven where it was agreed upfront that FS would take place in one of the BJ rooms on the couch at the 1200 baht price for that option because the Short Time rooms had just been occupied.

The other thing is I rarely use the cubicles / booths in the BJ bars anymore and much prefer the Short Time room experience.

I don't see you mention it, but did you also refuse to pay the 800 baht? Sounds like one of the most annoying things was a Jeykll and Hyde change in her demeanor once you were alone in the cubicle. I have aborted missions for that alone. It never bodes well for anything that follows.First of all heading up the stair I always grab the gals ass and check for a pad. If I find one I put on that disappointed face and ask in Thai if she has her "men. " If the answer is yes the session is a no-go and I am out of there. When I get to the room before she even goes out to get her stuff I go in for a DFK and start to unbutton the shirt. Most of the time I get "cha-cha. " But at that point she knows my intentions for her to disrobe. Sometimes they will say "tip for me?" And of course I say yes. "Oh no, honey, cannot" would be fine with me. Up to her. If they don't want to do something more power to them. The experience the other day was very different. The gal pulled away and in a very aggressive and belligerent tone demanded 500 Baht to take anything off. But you are correct. It was a Jekyll and Hyde experience. 800 Baht? I barely got my shoes off. Nothing occurred. And BTW, most of the time I have no issues not only with gals getting naked, climbing on for a 69, fingering, DFK, etc. Usually tip the leftover 200 out of the 1 K as well. Considering you only spend about 15-20 min there, I think that is a fair price. Especially when compared to 1900 at an oily for an hour where it is anything you want as many times as you want.

[EihTooms]

...It was a Jekyll and Hyde experience. 800 Baht? I barely got my shoes off. Nothing occurred. Ah, that is the beauty of venues and options where you pay all of it after! Good. She didn't still profit in any way from the Jeykll and Hyde routine and instead was left to explain why a girl whose behavior drives paying customers away should still be allowed to sit there and haunt the place.

[Syzygies]

When I have wanted full nudity and / or FS along with more time with a girl at a BJ bar, I pop for the typically 1700 baht or so Short Time room. Of course, I have never seen a menu at Dr BJ, L0 lita's, Kasalong, Lolipop1 or Som's Haven stipulating exactly what should be expected in the BJ cubicles / booths, I. E. BBBJ CIM, nudity, FS, whatever, but always assumed the only givens for the BJ cubicles / booths, especially in places where the girls wear theme uniforms, were BBBJ CIM while still in uniform. Isn't that why that experience is only 700-800 baht vs 1700 baht? I never assumed full nudity with or without FS was a realistic much less an expected option in a location where there is no shower and bath towels as there is in the Short Time rooms.
ET Smooth,

I also prefer the comfort of the special rooms, however sometimes these are not available when desperate and have limited time. Having girl naked and fucking her has been my experience as quite possible at Lollytas with couch and curtain, a little less practical to fuck at Dr. BJ due to cubicle set up, but still possible. Have not tried Kasalong or Som's.

There may be a problem of course: Girl is on "mehn" (menses, menstruation), "prajum duean" (monthly period); Girl pussy out of action (sore, swollen inflamed from previous usage or fungal infection); girl just does not fuck; the tip offered is not considered good enough to be worthwhile for her. Mostly I have been able to overcome the last problem (the suitable tip). It obviously costs less to tip the girl to fuck on the couch since don't have to share funds with the greedy boss, and not getting the benefit of a nice room. A period typically lasts for 4 days per month, and girls are not normally taking that time off, so hitting period time is not that unusual. 12% chance, at least.

I have sometimes been able to convince girls during last stages of a period, if not painful, to take out the sponge and fuck me anyway. I am not very afraid of small quantities of colour (wearing a condom of course). One girl did offer her ass as a backup when pussy was out of action but did want an extra tip for it (a while back now so I struggle to remember if I got to fuck her anyway). I don't normally want anal, if it costs extra above the fuck price.

[SimpleGuy85]

Hello,

I will be staying near junction of Ratchaprarop road and Phetchaburi road early next month. Was wondering if there are any full service MP around this area and what would be the approximate rates for such services. Any help will be much appreciated.

[EihTooms]

ET Smooth,

I also prefer the comfort of the special rooms, however sometimes these are not available when desperate and have limited time. Having girl naked and fucking her has been my experience as quite possible at Lollytas with couch and curtain, a little less practical to fuck at Dr. BJ due to cubicle set up, but still possible. Have not tried Kasalong or Som's.
Syzygies, I believe fucking in the cubicles at Som's or Kasalong would be much more practical than in either Dr BJ's Salon or the curtained booths in L0 lita's if for no other reason than that the formers' cubicles have enough carpeted floorspace for it. Sure, you can also use their couches. But, in my case, although I enjoy indulging in a variety of positions during fucking, I cum almost exclusively in missionary position. So for my finish I need a more literally level playing field so to speak than what you get on a couch or in a chair.

BTW, it seems as though you know but other readers might not know that if you don't tip the girl enough extra to upgrade from BJ to FS in the cubicles or curtain booths at the BJ bars on the assumption it will remain a secret between the two of you that you have saved some meaningful amount of baht by not going for the 1700 baht Short Time room from the get go, the girl will in all probability mention the upgrade from BJ to FS finish to the cashier when you settle your bill and they will increase the amount anyway. But they will not take it all the way to 1700 baht since you didn't use their shower, towels or muss up the sheets on the bed in the Short Time room. In Som's the amount for FS in a BJ cubicle used to be 1200 baht. Not sure if that is still the case or if it is a similar amount at Kasalong and L0 lita's.

[JjBee62]

Hello,

I will be staying near junction of Ratchaprarop road and Phetchaburi road early next month. Was wondering if there are any full service MP around this area and what would be the approximate rates for such services. Any help will be much appreciated.Looking at the map, where you will be staying is a short walk to the Chit Lom BTS station. From there it's only 2 stops to Nana or 4 stops to Phrom Phong. If I recall correctly from the Bangkok Massage forum, one of those 2 stops should put you within range of anything you might be looking for.

[Syzygies]

Syzygies, I believe fucking in the cubicles at Som's or Kasalong would be much more practical than in either Dr BJ's Salon or the curtained booths in L0 lita's if for no other reason than that the formers' cubicles have enough carpeted floorspace for it. Sure, you can also use their couches. But, in my case, although I enjoy indulging in a variety of positions during fucking, I cum almost exclusively in missionary position. So for my finish I need a more literally level playing field so to speak than what you get on a couch or in a chair.
Okay That makes sense. I come usually in doggy, so no problem for me. Mish is not so important for me. Even in mish I can be upright to see her pussy better. Then there is reverse mish with her prone and me vertical from behind. Then there is spooning. Lots of positions I like. Recall one Thai girl who wanted me to fuck her on a chair when a perfectly good bed was available. Just variety.

I should have a look in Som's som day. LOL. I presume it is the famous Som from SOL, that is the owner? I did try Lollipop was it on Soi 12 a long time ago, but girls were ugly at the time. Have to get lucky with best looking girls available, as always. I like beauties that provide adequate service these days, either BJ or sex.

Som would not pass of course, if she was still working, for looks. I got a lot more fussy in old age. Still remember a threesome with Som and Aey from SOL, many years back. Aey later quit and went to work in Central Chitlom. Maybe she had a BF, she did not say, but was still O.K. to play up. Its a long time ago now. I probably still have her old number and should try it one day.

A different Som in Kangaroo bar still remembers me by name, after I did not visit there for 6 to 8 years. LOL Maybe because of my extravagant orgies with two or three girls in the old days. Apparently this Som has been there 12 years, but Kangaroo and Annies Rose in Pat Pong were my first BJ shops, dating back 24 years ago, when I was relatively young. It was really an anything goes place in daytime back then. Can't remember the prices. Could have been 500 to each girl. Fucking did happen too. Have vague memories of one Thai girl with light skin and very large naturals. She wasn't really my spec totally, as not quite skinny, but her face tits and pussy were really good. An absolute doll like girl. As we entered the Kangaroo bar 24 years ago, it was dark inside coming from bright sunshine outside, so I wanted to slow the girls down slightly till I could see which looked good and which were ugly. They had other ideas. Would be attacked by multiple girls typically three, who would be trying to get my dick in their mouths as quickly as possible. Tag team. No discussion of the charges first. LOL You would soon be playing with their tits and pussies while getting sucked off. A girl could stand over you to allow DATY too. Lying horizontal was not usually a big requirement but they did have a small back room for that.
Kangaroo bar is now in a slightly different location to back then but only moved a short distance.

I would still like to find a place where wild orgies are still as possible, even not in a private room, with crazy girls. Lollytas is definitely not it. You have to be very well behaved downstairs. Does anyone know if Toy Bar still has wild behaviour in the public bar or have they cleaned up their act? Haven't had a wild session in there for a few years too. Need to find a good looking girl or two first, of course, not easy.

[Syzygies]

Hello,

I will be staying near junction of Ratchaprarop road and Phetchaburi road early next month. Was wondering if there are any full service MP around this area and what would be the approximate rates for such services. Any help will be much appreciated.Most places are not close.

However easy walk north under skytrain (to the airport), and turn left at next main road (Chaturathit / Sri Ayutthaya). A big place on the right is Chao praya 2 Soapy massage. Further a long a small massage joint Chawala / Chavala may still be there. I advise against J One massage on left side. They will try to rip you off most likely.

In the distant past Chao Praya 2 was my favorite place but is in decline. Don't know how many girls in the fishbowl. Try it at 6 PM. The older ladies typically do full Thai Massage as well as sex, and the young models don't do massage but bath you, and sex. Rates at Chao Praya 2 should be fair and include cost of sex. I would guess not more than 3000 and could be closer to 2000 Baht. I have not been there for several years so forget the last prices. At J One, the prices may be a lot higher so cheer person can pocket the extra charged to non Thais.

Venus mentioned by another poster is not far away, but I have never visited it, so cannot recommend.

Suggest you also check out some other Soapy places like Nataree (huge numbers of young girls) and Amsterdam (more up market) for comparison. Nataree is near to subway station Huay Kwang and Amsterdam near to Rama 9 station (Phra Ram 9). Try the Sukumvit Oily Massage too, but its hard to get too. Motorcycle is quickest, but added danger, so not always the best idea.

[Syzygies]

Most places are not close.

However easy walk north under skytrain (to the airport), and turn left at next main road (Chaturathit / Sri Ayutthaya). A big place on the right is Chao praya 2 Soapy massage. On google Maps search for "Chaophya 2 Bath & Massage" Sometimes the English has crazy spelling. Sounds like Jao-pra-yar.

[Amorbasha]

Hi everyone,

Not too sure if this is the right place to post this. I needed to see a Dr. Google search showed Bumrungrad hospital nearby. There are more than one building, you need to go to the clinic one. Info downstairs refer first timers to 10th floor for registration. Filed paperwork, asked to see a dermatologist, they asked more questions and issued a Hospital card which has a hospital number plus a wrist bracelet (you will need the number to access the hospital WiFi). Skin section is on the 12th floor. You give them your registration papers and wait. They call your name, take some basic measurements eg weight, hight, BP etc. Back to waiting. Call your name again to see Dr. I knew what I had already but expressed my concern about bleeding. Biopsy advised. Accepted advice and back to waiting, paying and giving more information to be emailed the results. And. Be. You will need your passport or a copy. Bill before test takes place (I guess they wanted to make sure you have the money) I have been told consult would be 1000-2000 Baht and I thought that is equivalent to gap payment back home so no dramas. Bill came after test 7500 Baht 312 AUD, far out. I didn't want to look like a dick so, I paid and biopsy was done. Some antibiotics cream after settlement (I got back 150 Baht!

All in all the hospital and Service are five stars. However I found it to be a tad expensive especially with no travel insurance. They seem to cater for lots of Arabs (Arabic language signs are everywhere beside Thai and English) maybe that is why!

I work close to the medical field and aware of the guidelines and biopsy is not recommended in my case as cryotherapy is more common; that is why I felt the Dr want to do it for hospital profit. I felt ripped off in a way.

I am not too sure how much a full STI screen would cost but I would be really interested to know.

What I found interesting that they don't give you a script for your medication but rather they send it electronically to the in-patient pharmacy. I guess to keep all money in house but once again it could be a good thing for you if you have insurance, this way you claim once.

Moral of the story: always wear a hat).

[EihTooms]

Okay That makes sense. I come usually in doggy, so no problem for me. Mish is not so important for me. Even in mish I can be upright to see her pussy better. Then there is reverse mish with her prone and me vertical from behind. Then there is spooning. Lots of positions I like. Recall one Thai girl who wanted me to fuck her on a chair when a perfectly good bed was available. Just variety.
For me, mish allows the girl much easier access to my balls for the ball tickling that I also like leading up to and all during my orgasm. One hand, not both. Laying on her back with her legs up and wrapped around the small of my back, she doesn't reach for my balls over her thigh with her arm between her thigh and my crotch. That is too awkward and requires too much space between my crotch and her pussy to allow room for her hand and/or arm while I am thrusting in and out of her pussy. No, she reaches under her buttock and thigh and makes contact with my balls from underneath and more or less from behind from that angle. I have no problem lasting virtually forever when I am in other positions. And could last a very long time in this kind of mish position as well. But when it is time for me to cum, I get into that kind of mish position with her tickling my balls from underneath and behind and I can make it last as long or as short as I want. Could cum within a very few minutes if desired. Or not, if desired. But in other positions, I will almost certainly never cum. Meanwhile, in this particular position she is laying comfortably on her back, her hand is on my balls and she never seems to mind even if I choose to enjoy that feeling for quite a long time rather than let go within a very few minutes.

I am surprised you like to cum doggie as often as you say since you have mentioned several times you like to get your balls tickled. As do I. However, isn't it more difficult for the girl to tickle a man's balls in doggie position? I mean, it isn't difficult for her to reach between her legs and get to them, of course. But that means she has to support her upper body with only one free arm if she is going to do that while in doggie position. And under those circumstances, I would be concerned about taking too long because that means she either drops the ball tickling rather soon in the experience so she can support her upper body with both arms/hands (or switch arms often) or she develops the muscles in one arm to the point of resembling a fiddler crab. LOL. Am I missing a key element here with regard to ball tickling combined with prolonged doggie style fucking?

[Syzygies]

For me, mish allows the girl much easier access to my balls for the ball tickling that I also like leading up to and all during my orgasm. One hand, not both. Laying on her back with her legs up and wrapped around the small of my back, she doesn't reach for my balls over her thigh with her arm between her thigh and my crotch. That is too awkward and requires too much space between my crotch and her pussy to allow room for her hand and/or arm while I am thrusting in and out of her pussy. No, she reaches under her buttock and thigh and makes contact with my balls from underneath and more or less from behind from that angle. I have no problem lasting virtually forever when I am in other positions. And could last a very long time in this kind of mish position as well. But when it is time for me to cum, I get into that kind of mish position with her tickling my balls from underneath and behind and I can make it last as long or as short as I want. Could cum within a very few minutes if desired. Or not, if desired. But in other positions, I will almost certainly never cum. Meanwhile, in this particular position she is laying comfortably on her back, her hand is on my balls and she never seems to mind even if I choose to enjoy that feeling for quite a long time rather than let go within a very few minutes.

I am surprised you like to cum doggie as often as you say since you have mentioned several times you like to get your balls tickled. As do I. However, isn't it more difficult for the girl to tickle a man's balls in doggie position? I mean, it isn't difficult for her to reach between her legs and get to them, of course. But that means she has to support her upper body with only one free arm if she is going to do that while in doggie position. And under those circumstances, I would be concerned about taking too long because that means she either drops the ball tickling rather soon in the experience so she can support her upper body with both arms/hands (or switch arms often) or she develops the muscles in one arm to the point of resembling a fiddler crab. LOL. Am I missing a key element here with regard to ball tickling combined with prolonged doggie style fucking?Well I am the same for the balls touching, however it's actually easier in doggy position, reaching underneath, except she has to support herself with just one remaining arm, so she better be a lightweight girl. LOL She can switch arms from time to time. Girls have not complained that it is too difficult, even the GF.

[Syzygies]

Hi everyone,

Not too sure if this is the right place to post this. I needed to see a Dr. Google search showed Bumrungrad hospital nearby.

All in all the hospital and Service are five stars. However I found it to be a tad expensive especially with no travel insurance. They seem to cater for lots of Arabs (Arabic language signs are everywhere beside Thai and English) maybe that is why!

I work close to the medical field and aware of the guidelines and biopsy is not recommended in my case as cryotherapy is more common; that is why I felt the Dr want to do it for hospital profit. I felt ripped off in a way.

I am not too sure how much a full STI screen would cost but I would be really interested to know.

What I found interesting that they don't give you a script for your medication but rather they send it electronically to the in-patient pharmacy. I guess to keep all money in house but once again it could be a good thing for you if you have insurance, this way you claim once.

Moral of the story: always wear a hat).Yes this hospital is known to be a rip off. An International private Hospital. They don't want you to buy your medicine at a fraction of the cost somewhere else. Any private hospital can charge a fortune (unwarranted) even for Thais. I use Sukhumvit Hospital at Ekkamai.

[Crocodilexp]

they don't give you a script for your medication but rather they send it electronically to the in-patient pharmacy.

This is common practice at private hospitals. Medicines at the in-house pharmacy tend to cost 2-5 times the equivalent generics at an outside one.

You can always ask for a prescription / list of medicines (either ask the doctor, or if they already sent it down, ask the pharmacist) and purchase outside. It's your right, and in my experience they always comply, politely and without any issue. Obviously, they won't be advertising that you can do this, since they stand to gain a fair bit of money if you're unaware.

The only exception is a handful of restricted medications (like Xanax), which you can only legally obtain at hospitals, not regular pharmacies. It's a fairly brief list, and the doctor should warn you about these.

As an aside, "General Reports" section is probably more suitable for this (as it's not Bangkok mongering specific).

[Syzygies]

This is common practice at private hospitals. Medicines at the in-house pharmacy tend to cost 2-5 times the equivalent generics at an outside one.

You can always ask for a prescription / list of medicines (either ask the doctor, or if they already sent it down, ask the pharmacist) and purchase outside. It's your right, and in my experience they always comply, politely and without any issue. Obviously, they won't be advertising that you can do this, since they stand to gain a fair bit of money if you're unaware.

The only exception is a handful of restricted medications (like Xanax), which you can only legally obtain at hospitals, not regular pharmacies. It's a fairly brief list, and the doctor should warn you about these.

As an aside, "General Reports" section is probably more suitable for this (as it's not Bangkok mongering specific).I recall paying a price for some medication for step daughter at the hospital. Later found out was Ibuprofen. Ha Ha. Have that at home already. Mostly Thais do not known what medication they are taking. Even normal doctors do not tell the patient what the medication is, so as to force the patient to keep returning to the doctor to get more pills / Medicine. Could be sugar pills for all they know.

This is the Thai way, which is of course totally unacceptable to us foreigners.

An doctors are horrified that we start to get into self medication. LOL

One doctor was treating my GF for asthma for some time (many years ago), when it was clear to everyone else she did not have Asthma. Turned out to be a chronic sinus infection.

[EihTooms]

Well I am the same for the balls touching, however it's actually easier in doggy position, reaching underneath, except she has to support herself with just one remaining arm, so she better be a lightweight girl. LOL She can switch arms from time to time. Girls have not complained that it is too difficult, even the GF.Yes, the girl switching arms from time to time was what I assumed would be a likely solution. But if the girl is concerned that you might take a long time to cum, wouldn't the strain of a one arm support during prolonged doggie position be a factor in her concern? I mean, it might not just be the potential for a sore pussy. Maybe she is as much if not more concerned about a sore arm, no?

[Goatscrot]

Yes this hospital is known to be a rip off. An International private Hospital. They don't want you to buy your medicine at a fraction of the cost somewhere else. Any private hospital can charge a fortune (unwarranted) even for Thais. I use Sukhumvit Hospital at Ekkamai.My hospital of choice is St Louis. Private, but non-profit. Drs really take their time with you. And the cost is at least 40% or more less than Bummy or the other boutique privates.

[Syzygies]

Yes, the girl switching arms from time to time was what I assumed would be a likely solution. But if the girl is concerned that you might take a long time to cum, wouldn't the strain of a one arm support during prolonged doggie position be a factor in her concern? I mean, it might not just be the potential for a sore pussy. Maybe she is as much if not more concerned about a sore arm, no?Ha ha.

No no not at all. The girl does not have to use the one arm constantly. Switching is allowed. She gets criticised if her nails touch my balls too. Cannot stand nails. It has to be delicate. No curling the fingers. Lube or oil can be used. Girls can put pillows under their chest to support their body.

I have heard sore pussy complaint far more often than sore arm. Sore arm usually is associated with handjobs I believe, but I don't really like handjobs for the most part, and avoid them. Very few girls are sufficiently skilled at HJ the way I might like it. Hate a fast moving hand or a hand that rubs against the skin. Even I struggle to enjoy my own hand plenty of times, but can be useful to get it back hard after a rest break (always left hand) while right hand plays with her body, preferably pussy. BJ is better but that assumes her BJ skills are really good.

Digits in pussy while getting a super BBBJ is one of my favourite things. Normally she lies down on her side and I am vertical on knees in front of her mouth. This is the position that suits me best for getting to CIM these days, given I don't cum easily. Sometimes 69 can work well too and be quiet blissful. I think of my 69 with JJ at Addict. I did not want to cum however as wanted to do other positions first. She must have the technique that suited me, or I was exceptionally horny.

Many things are possible for me at a BJ bar provided they have a couch of a reasonable width where at least girl can lie on it. A chair only, is bit limiting for me, then I would automatically go for the special room. While I have been to Dr. BJ for a BJ only, it is probably not going to happen like that any more. I am greedy and always get frustrated if I am restricted in what can be done, and I need options in case the BJ was weak or just ordinary for me.

[ParkVille]

Hi everyone,

Not too sure if this is the right place to post this. I needed to see a Dr. Google search showed Bumrungrad hospital nearby. There are more than one building, you need to go to the clinic one. Info downstairs refer first timers to 10th floor for registration. Filed paperwork, asked to see a dermatologist, they asked more questions and issued a Hospital card which has a hospital number plus a wrist bracelet (you will need the number to access the hospital WiFi). Skin section is on the 12th floor. You give them your registration papers and wait. They call your name, take some basic measurements eg weight, hight, BP etc. Back to waiting. Call your name again to see Dr. I knew what I had already but expressed my concern about bleeding. Biopsy advised. Accepted advice and back to waiting, paying and giving more information to be emailed the results. And. Be. You will need your passport or a copy. Bill before test takes place (I guess they wanted to make sure you have the money) I have been told consult would be 1000-2000 Baht and I thought that is equivalent to gap payment back home so no dramas. Bill came after test 7500 Baht 312 AUD, far out. I didn't want to look like a dick so, I paid and biopsy was done..Avoid Bumrungrad and mos international hospitals. In the past 2 years, they have all gone completely profit. I was charged 23,000 baht for routine bloodwork and a sinus infection. They also intentionally withheld information about how / why / what I was sick with (I had to learn about why I was sick later, and they withhold test results until you pay their crazy price). I went to a better hospital and was treated at a price of 2000 baht.

[Aviator12]

Having spent a lot of time in go-go's in Bangkok and Pattaya over the past 10 days, there are some things that surprise me. And some details that I find more and more annoying:

1) Girls not dancing or trying to make eye contact; they seems to be little interested in making money and do not create a good wibe in the club. Too shy? Or instructed by the managers? Lazy?

2) Lack of basic English. Can really not blame the girls. But still very annoying.

3) Some constantly pad my belly. Very annoying. I hate it!. I am a fairly athletic built man and I do not have a big belly at all. The girls seems to do it to "make funny" but it just gets me in a bad mood. I would never dream of poking a girl in their belly the same way they do to customers.

4) Pushy waiters. We all hate it I guess. Some are plain rude and should find another job.

5) [CodeWord109] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord109) smell and dirt. Amazing to witness how some bars can not even keep a basic sanitary standard.

6) Bad managed bars. Some bars can not even basic stuff like instructing their girls or staff members. Why are the floor managers there?

7) Fat, ugly girls. What is the point? Don't the bar owner see them?

Look at bars like Happy, Baccara and Beach Club (Pattaya. Same group); well run. No bullshit. Nice girls. Making money, but maybe too "effective" for some punters that care for a more laidback style. In the end the most important factor for a bar is to have pretty girls. As punters we always look for this quality and I guess most of us are willing to put up with a lot of the other shit just to settle in with sexy, cute dancers on stage. However, amazingly many bars fall short on very basic details. How difficult can it be to run a go-go properly?

[Syzygies]

Avoid Bumrungrad and mos international hospitals. In the past 2 years, they have all gone completely profit. I was charged 23,000 baht for routine bloodwork and a sinus infection. They also intentionally withheld information about how / why / what I was sick with (I had to learn about why I was sick later, and they withhold test results until you pay their crazy price). I went to a better hospital and was treated at a price of 2000 baht.I haven't used these 2 myself but a big thanks for the warning. I have heard similar stories for private hospitals even for a Thai bargirl being treated for ridiculous prices.

[Syzygies]

Having spent a lot of time in go-go's in Bangkok and Pattaya over the past 10 days, there are some things that surprise me. And some details that I find more and more annoying:

1) Girls not dancing or trying to make eye contact; they seems to be little interested in making money and do not create a good wibe in the club. Too shy? Or instructed by the managers? Lazy?

2) Lack of basic English. Can really not blame the girls. But still very annoying.

3) Some constantly pad my belly. Very annoying. I hate it!. I am a fairly athletic built man and I do not have a big belly at all. The girls seems to do it to "make funny" but it just gets me in a bad mood. I would never dream of poking a girl in their belly the same way they do to customers.

4) Pushy waiters.We all hate it I guess. Some are plain rude and should find another job.

5) smell and dirt. Amazing to witness how some bars can not even keep a basic sanitary standard.

6) Bad managed bars. Some bars can not even basic stuff like instructing their girls or staff members. Why are the floor managers there?

7) Fat, ugly girls. What is the point? Don't the bar owner see them?

Look at bars like Happy, Baccara and Beach Club (Pattaya. Same group); well run. No bullshit. Nice girls. Making money, but maybe too "effective" for some punters that care for a more laidback style. In the end the most important factor for a bar is to have pretty girls. As punters we always look for this quality and I guess most of us are willing to put up with a lot of the other shit just to settle in with sexy, cute dancers on stage. However, amazingly many bars fall short on very basic details. How difficult can it be to run a go-go properly?Wow all of these are common complaints. You could add that the manager seems to know best and doesn't want to know what the customer thinks.

Causes can be corruption, nepotism, arrogance. Etc.

1. Simply bad management possibly contributed to by having a DJ that does not choose really music good to dance to. Girls not making eye contact is only a problem in your mind. Some are too shy, some have a mind elsewhere, e. G. In Baccara can be looking into space bored out of their brains. I don't have a problem. I don't expect girls to eyeing me off like I was Brad Pitt or something. If I want a girl I will soon enough do whatever it takes to get her attention. I prefer to be the persuer.

2. Good English is not seen as a requirement. She will learn soon enough, is the attitude. Mamasans are go between so they have to have good English.

3. Maybe girls are checking if you have a six pack. LOL For me its usually asking how many months pregnant I am especially if any change in my weight. No big deal for me.

4. Annoying waitresses exist in any bar. I just try to find a good one and ignore the bad ones. Sometimes management causes every staff member to be too pushy. I could not stand a visit to Rainbow 3 a few years back. All the staff seemed to be relentlessly annoying. That is bad management. Maybe I just needed to chill a bit longer till I found a better staff member.

5. Bad smell not uncommon in Thailand. Drain ppes are notorious. If its only in the toilet, I can probably stand it, however regular cleaning needs to occur.

6. Bad management. What can I say. Arrogance, not willing to listen, nepotism, lazyiness etc.

7. fat girls. If did not take fat girls some bars would have no girls at all. The monthly salary can be too low. Sometimes a group of female friends arrives at a bar. If the bar does not take every girl in the group, the entire group will move to apply for work in a different bar. This can be overcome by offering a better salary. That is how Crazy House got started with a small but very good line up. Now rhe numbers have risen it is hard to maintain the standard, but still have few fatties.

You can always vote with your feet of you are really pissed off. Won't help anything.

For me the bar firstly has to have some real lookers. I have to be able to find fun natural girls and avoid being hassled constantly. I have found ways to do that. Having a favourite waitress helps me a lot.

[Wolvenvacht]

However, amazingly many bars fall short on very basic details. How difficult can it be to run a go-go properly? I have no idea how difficult it can be. Did you ever try to run an agogo club in Thailand?

[OneRose]

I will try to make a few (very) late reports from my last visit in BKK. I have been a few more times before so I wasn't a newbie.

First night, just got off the plane, went to my hotel in Sukhumvit and hit the streets. As it was already 2 am, the bars were closed, but it was OK, as I am not so much of a big fan of taking girls from bars.

As I was walking along Sukhumvit I was kind of surprised of seeing so many African WG and their Pimps. I mean, every year there were a few, but now it seemed they were a lot. You could even say they were kind of exclusive after a certain hour in the area. As I was going to find out later, their number increased a lot, and they filled the street bars along Sukhumvit.

I just wanted to start my trip with some Asian lady so I just went down Soi 4. There were a lot more Asian girl but, I was thinking because is was so late, there wasn't any stunner. I wanted one for a short time only so I would accept just as any OK looks girl but with good attitude.

As I passed the Rajak (I'm not sure about the spelling) , one lady approached me and showed me on her mobile phone a movie. That intrigued me as my biggest fetish are amateur movies. She showed me how good she is at deep throat. Well, as her looks were OK and I liked the attitude I decided to proceed. I just asked her if she will allow me to take a video while we are fucking (only for my personal use of course) . After a short moment of reluctance, she accepted.

We went back to the hotel, agreeing a 2200 baht price for 2 pops oral, normal, anal, COF and video. As she got the money, she suddenly lost her friendliness and GFE disappeared. She sucked me, than I fucked her, we did some anal as well, but not so much and then I finished in her face. The second pop was mainly the same except the finish that was COB. In between she showed me some movies of her having sex with customers and told me a lot of bullshit about her life. I found out that she has a website and that she is into dominations, [CodeWord100] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord100) and our things, and she (allegedly) works the street only when she doesn't have any customers. Kind of hard to believe as I've seen her almost every night out there.

Looks 6.5.

GFE 3 (at start it was around 7, still a little bit aggressive).

Sex 7 (good DT, nothing special about the rest of it, extra point for Video and for COF).

P.S. This is my first post so please don't start trowing with stones if I did anything wrong. I am happy to adapt my other reports from my holiday to the rules, maybe a little shorter?

[GoodEnough]

I haven't used these 2 myself but a big thanks for the warning. I have heard similar stories for private hospitals even for a Thai bargirl being treated for ridiculous prices.My single experience at Bumrungrad was excellent. I went to visit a cardiologist there for a routine exam, including a stress test. My total bill, including medication was about $200, and the service was completely professional, very efficient and friendly.

GE.

[JjBee62]

Having spent a lot of time in go-go's in Bangkok and Pattaya over the past 10 days, there are some things that surprise me. And some details that I find more and more annoying:

1) Girls not dancing or trying to make eye contact; they seems to be little interested in making money and do not create a good wibe in the club. Too shy? Or instructed by the managers? Lazy?There are a few possible reasons, the first, she isn't interested in you. The good part, you're not wasting money buying her a drink. Another reason, it may still all be new to her. She hasn't been there long enough to learn how to milk the last baht out of the customers.



2) Lack of basic English. Can really not blame the girls. But still very annoying.It's Thailand.



3) Some constantly pad my belly. Very annoying. I hate it!. I am a fairly athletic built man and I do not have a big belly at all. The girls seems to do it to "make funny" but it just gets me in a bad mood. I would never dream of poking a girl in their belly the same way they do to customers.They probably figure the belly is a safe spot.



4) Pushy waiters. We all hate it I guess. Some are plain rude and should find another job.Management wants to make a profit, selling drinks helps. Without pushy waiters half the seats would be filled with old punters who just want to see some young flesh, but don't want to spend any money.



5) ... smell and dirt. Amazing to witness how some bars can not even keep a basic sanitary standard.It's Thailand. Sanitary and sewage systems are probably not the greatest. But if the bar is too dirty, move on until you find a clean one.



6) Bad managed bars. Some bars can not even basic stuff like instructing their girls or staff members. Why are the floor managers there?Floor managers are there either to keep things running smoothly or because someone's worthless cousin needed a job.



7) Fat, ugly girls. What is the point? Don't the bar owner see them?For some of the customers, the fatter the better. It's not my preference, but there are plenty who like them chubby. As for ugly, everyone has different preferences. Should every club only bring in girls that meet your specifications?



Look at bars like Happy, Baccara and Beach Club (Pattaya. Same group); well run. No bullshit. Nice girls. Making money, but maybe too "effective" for some punters that care for a more laidback style. In the end the most important factor for a bar is to have pretty girls. As punters we always look for this quality and I guess most of us are willing to put up with a lot of the other shit just to settle in with sexy, cute dancers on stage. However, amazingly many bars fall short on very basic details. How difficult can it be to run a go-go properly?In the end, the most important thing is for the bar to turn a profit. If a bar doesn't meet your requirements, spend your money at one that does. Review the bars and let people know which ones you like or dislike and why. This will cut the profits of the bad and boost profits of the good. Eventually the bad places may improve.

How difficult can it be to run a gogo properly?

Let's see, there's vendors to deal with to make sure they aren't shorting on deliveries, employees to watch to make sure they aren't stealing, facilities to monitor for cleanliness and maintenance issues, scheduling, training, advising and supervising girls, managing personality conflicts between employees, customers to watch, assist, advise or remove, police and other officials to pay off, and a few dozen other things to deal with. Doesn't seem hard at all.

[Goatscrot]

Having spent a lot of time in go-go's in Bangkok and Pattaya over the past 10 days, there are some things that surprise me. And some details that I find more and more annoying:

1) Girls not dancing or trying to make eye contact; they seems to be little interested in making money and do not create a good wibe in the club. Too shy? Or instructed by the managers? Lazy?

2) Lack of basic English. Can really not blame the girls. But still very annoying.

3) Some constantly pad my belly. Very annoying. I hate it!. I am a fairly athletic built man and I do not have a big belly at all. The girls seems to do it to "make funny" but it just gets me in a bad mood. I would never dream of poking a girl in their belly the same way they do to customers.

4) Pushy waiters. We all hate it I guess. Some are plain rude and should find another job.

5) smell and dirt. Amazing to witness how some bars can not even keep a basic sanitary standard.

6) Bad managed bars. Some bars can not even basic stuff like instructing their girls or staff members. Why are the floor managers there?

7) Fat, ugly girls. What is the point? Don't the bar owner see them?

Look at bars like Happy, Baccara and Beach Club (Pattaya. Same group); well run. No bullshit. Nice girls. Making money, but maybe too "effective" for some punters that care for a more laidback style. In the end the most important factor for a bar is to have pretty girls. As punters we always look for this quality and I guess most of us are willing to put up with a lot of the other shit just to settle in with sexy, cute dancers on stage. However, amazingly many bars fall short on very basic details. How difficult can it be to run a go-go properly?Very good post. And spot on as to how most bars are lacking. Truth be told when drinks were 80 Baht (2 USD at the time), BF was 400- 500 Baht (10-12.50 USD at the time), and the gal was 1000 Baht (25 USD), then it really didn't matter. Getting a bit of a buzz and getting laid would cost you all of 50 USD. You were paying peanuts so these issues were kind of charming in a way. Now that you are paying way over 100 USD for the privilege, it's not cute at all.

[Kazeu]

Just FYI, a few years back I had a some STD tests done at the Thai Red Cross on Ratchadamri Rd. You can probably get your STI panel done here very cheaply. Its also completely anonymous if I remember correctly.


Hi everyone,

Not too sure if this is the right place to post this. I needed to see a Dr. Google search showed Bumrungrad hospital nearby. There are more than one building, you need to go to the clinic one. Info downstairs refer first timers to 10th floor for registration. Filed paperwork, asked to see a dermatologist, they asked more questions and issued a Hospital card which has a hospital number plus a wrist bracelet (you will need the number to access the hospital WiFi). Skin section is on the 12th floor. You give them your registration papers and wait. They call your name, take some basic measurements eg weight, hight, BP etc. Back to waiting. Call your name again to see Dr. I knew what I had already but expressed my concern about bleeding. Biopsy advised. Accepted advice and back to waiting, paying and giving more information to be emailed the results. And. Be. You will need your passport or a copy. Bill before test takes place (I guess they wanted to make sure you have the money) I have been told consult would be 1000-2000 Baht and I thought that is equivalent to gap payment back home so no dramas. Bill came after test 7500 Baht 312 AUD, far out. I didn't want to look like a dick so, I paid and biopsy was done. Some antibiotics cream after settlement (I got back 150 Baht!.

[Syzygies]

There are a few possible reasons, the first, she isn't interested in you. The good part, you're not wasting money buying her a drink. Another reason, it may still all be new to her. She hasn't been there long enough to learn how to milk the last baht out of the customers.

Management wants to make a profit, selling drinks helps. Without pushy waiters half the seats would be filled with old punters who just want to see some young flesh, but don't want to spend any money.

For some of the customers, the fatter the better. It's not my preference, but there are plenty who like them chubby. As for ugly, everyone has different preferences. Should every club only bring in girls that meet your specifications?Yes I agree with all of these. Why does anyone complain that a girl does not make eye contact. Thailand is a prudish country and newbie girls are too fucking shy. Some of the most ugly girls are also the most raunchy and get customers by doing things like eyeing the customer, and dancing with her pussy almost in the customers face. I dislike these girls that are coming on too strong (especially as they are usually ugly). The are a very small number of pretty girls that are not so shy and play up to her customer just a little in a sexy way without being too low class. Jane / Jaeng number 4 at CH is one such girl who is constantly booked out with new and repeat customers. Not much tits, brown skin, but cute face, cute ass, and shows off her cute crotch nicely.

The bar has to make a profit and if its got a good line up the monthly salaries will be high. This and the waiting staff have to be paid. Without guys buying drinks regularly, it cannot work. A guy sitting for 2 or 3 hours on a single bottle of water is a waste of space, and staff will know they have a duty to get such a customer pissed off, so he will leave in a bad mood. This type of customer is not wanted. Even so some waitresses are too eager to get next drink order too soon, and before last drink is close to finished. Just find a sensible moderate waitress.

In Mercury bar, I found that all of the gogo girls were far too chubby for me except two girls, and the coyote girls were generally slim enough, yet Indian or similar customers would come into the bar and choose the ones too chubby for me, possibly with big sillies. They probably thought my girls were suffering malnutrition. One of my best buddies always took voluptuous (chubby) girls and called my girls bag of bones or skeleton girls.

[Blanquiceleste]

I will try to make a few (very) late reports from my last visit in BKK. I have been a few more times before so I wasn't a newbie.

SNIP

As I passed the Rajak (I'm not sure about the spelling) , one lady approached me and showed me on her mobile phone a movie.

We went back to the hotel, agreeing a 2200 baht price for 2 pops oral, normal, anal, COF and video. As she got the money, she suddenly lost her friendliness and GFE disappeared.

SNIP

P.S. This is my first post so please don't start trowing with stones if I did anything wrong. I am happy to adapt my other reports from my holiday to the rules, maybe a little shorter?You say you are not a newbie and I assume you have read the forum properly. Paying upfront before the agreed upon services are delivered is one of the worst rookie mistakes to make.

No other comments, we all learn more by sharing so keep the reports coming pal.

[ZuperFly]

She caught my eye as perhaps the best looking girl in CH, certainly with the nicest rack.

But she was tricky and hustled me for a double ladies drink--and I am not easily hustled.

I asked her first whether she had a customer and could be barfined (in Thai). She said no, no customer yet, and yes, she could barfine no problem. So I sprung for the overpriced tequila + coke, with the understanding that we would pay bar and go back to my place after for ST.

She started checking out my package and acting scared of my size. I am not small, but this gal is a hardened pro, it was just an act. When it came time to pay bar, mamasan came over and said she'd need to collect the ST fee in addition to the barfine. I told her no way, I pay the girl later, not now in the bar. Mamasan at first tried to tell me this is standard operating procedure, but when I explained to her that I'd lived in Thailand for years and never paid for a girl's services in advance at the bar, she backed off and acknowledged that Ging was making that demand. I cut bait. Ging acted very fishy and could not be trusted. I made peace with mamasan and explained to her that Ging just cost her a tip by wasting my time and money. Her looks are no way worth the attitude and the attempt to grab my cash without providing any service is not appreciated.

[Aviator12]

The bar has to make a profit and if its got a good line up the monthly salaries will be high. This and the waiting staff have to be paid. Without guys buying drinks regularly, it cannot work. A guy sitting for 2 or 3 hours on a single bottle of water is a waste of space, and staff will know they have a duty to get such a customer pissed off, so he will leave in a bad mood. This type of customer is not wanted. Even so some waitresses are too eager to get next drink order too soon, and before last drink is close to finished. Just find a sensible moderate waitress.Agree on this. My comment on pushy waiters was related to pushing for choosing a girl on stage. In some bars I see this is common, Rainbow Bar in Nana is one of them. I do not care if they ask me to buy a new drink for myself, that is their job. I drink a lot but cannot drink with both hands. It seems more difficult to find a good waiter than to find a good girl. LOL. Bars need to make profit but there is different strategies to obtain this. In a bar like Rainbow 4 (Or Rainbow are&be now?) it seems like the girls are instructed to be very composed and not overly "play" with customers from the stage. Does anybody know if this is a clear instruction from the bar management or just a "tradition"? In some bars the girls are very active. And in some others they do not interact. My guess is that it is all instructed, but I don't know.

[Amorbasha]

I have been to a massage place where I see a regular. While waiting for her another provider made a long eye contact with a spark that gave me immediate hard-on. The question is weather to take the new, younger girl with the promising wink and risking upsetting my regular or stick to my guns and choose the the lady I came for who provide super duper service. Decisions decisions!

[BionicMan]

I will try to make a few (very) late reports from my last visit in BKK. I have been a few more times before so I wasn't a newbie.
P.S. This is my first post so please don't start trowing with stones if I did anything wrong. I am happy to adapt my other reports from my holiday to the rules, maybe a little shorter?Report was perfect, has all ingredients. If taken, a picture would be icing on the cake.

Only remark to be made is 2200 for 2 pops at that time of the night. She should have been happy with 1500 for an extended ST.

On the other hand you ended spending what you would have spent if taking her from a bar (fee, barfine, drinks, maybe a top).

[BionicMan]

She caught my eye as perhaps the best looking girl in CH, certainly with the nicest rack.

But she was tricky and hustled me for a double ladies drink--and I am not easily hustled. I told her no way, I pay the girl later, not now in the bar. Mamasan at first tried to tell me this is standard operating procedure, but when I explained to her that I'd lived in Thailand for years and never paid for a girl's services in advance at the bar, she backed off and acknowledged that Ging was making that demand. I cut bait. Ging acted very fishy and could not be trusted. I made peace with mamasan and explained to her that Ging just cost her a tip by wasting my time and money. Her looks are no way worth the attitude and the attempt to grab my cash without providing any service is not appreciated.Well managed! The way to go.

[OneRose]

Second lady had to be an African babe. Had to be because I was really into some chocolate for the night.

As I was saying, there is a lot of black beauty along Sukhumvit. I had a little bit of trouble trying to ignore the 'protectors' but I found a few that were not sitting at tables in the end. I had to ask a few until I found one that agreed to let me take a video of the deed and we went back to the room.

We agreed a 2500 baht price for long time, oral normal COF and video. She was a beautiful 23-24 yo lady, with very dark skin, small tits and very big bubble butt. She was clean, shaved, and quite friendly. Her English was average, way over the normal Thai WG level. She was Ugandan, as most of the girls on the streets of BKK.

As we proceeded to the deed, I found out that her breast were saggy in an unpleasant way but, at least, the ass was great. She was very submissive but cold in the same time. The lack of initiative was somehow bothering me but I guess for 50 euros a night you can't really expect more. She blew me covered, than I fucked her in a lot of positions and I finished on her face. In the morning we repeated.

I would rate it as a good experience, except from one thing that made me wonder my whole trip: after we went to sleep she spoke on her phone with someone (no idea if man or woman) and told her / him in a very easy to understand code (I guess she thought I was asleep) in which hotel she is and the room. Call me paranoid but I didn't close an eye that night as I was waiting for someone to come and steal from the room (even though the hotel has quite a reasonable security despite it's low price, and my belongings were anyway in the safe box).

I might be crazy but, it really woke me up to reality, realizing the kind of danger at which we are exposing ourselves during a LT. Even though I am doing this since many years now, I always underestimated the dangers of it. We trust our safety and our belongings in the hands of some (easy corruptible) hotel clerks.

Maybe I am just getting older, but that night, while listening to my girl snoring as I couldn't sleep, I decided to drastically reduce the number of LT that I'm going to do in the next years.

Back to the lady, in the morning, after the second round, she got her money, we kissed good bye and way she went.

Looks: 7.5 (ass was great, face was cute, tits were really bad).

Service: 8 (good suck but no DT, good fuck but lack of initiative, extra point for submissiveness, COF and video).

[Goatscrot]

She caught my eye as perhaps the best looking girl in CH, certainly with the nicest rack.

But she was tricky and hustled me for a double ladies drink--and I am not easily hustled.

I asked her first whether she had a customer and could be barfined (in Thai). She said no, no customer yet, and yes, she could barfine no problem. So I sprung for the overpriced tequila + coke, with the understanding that we would pay bar and go back to my place after for ST.

She started checking out my package and acting scared of my size. I am not small, but this gal is a hardened pro, it was just an act. When it came time to pay bar, mamasan came over and said she'd need to collect the ST fee in addition to the barfine. I told her no way, I pay the girl later, not now in the bar. Mamasan at first tried to tell me this is standard operating procedure, but when I explained to her that I'd lived in Thailand for years and never paid for a girl's services in advance at the bar, she backed off and acknowledged that Ging was making that demand. I cut bait. Ging acted very fishy and could not be trusted. I made peace with mamasan and explained to her that Ging just cost her a tip by wasting my time and money. Her looks are no way worth the attitude and the attempt to grab my cash without providing any service is not appreciated.I am smiling ear to ear. Most awesome sir. If more punters took your attitude we would all be getting better service.

[OneRose]

Report was perfect, has all ingredients. If taken, a picture would be icing on the cake.

Only remark to be made is 2200 for 2 pops at that time of the night. She should have been happy with 1500 for an extended ST.

On the other hand you ended spending what you would have spent if taking her from a bar (fee, barfine, drinks, maybe a top).You are right, but all the bars were closed and there wasn't too much of a choice. And it was the first night in TH after a long time, I still had to adapt to the local prices.

[Syzygies]

She caught my eye as perhaps the best looking girl in CH, certainly with the nicest rack.

But she was tricky and hustled me for a double ladies drink--and I am not easily hustled.

I asked her first whether she had a customer and could be barfined (in Thai). She said no, no customer yet, and yes, she could barfine no problem. So I sprung for the overpriced tequila + coke, with the understanding that we would pay bar and go back to my place after for ST.

She started checking out my package and acting scared of my size. I am not small, but this gal is a hardened pro, it was just an act. When it came time to pay bar, mamasan came over and said she'd need to collect the ST fee in addition to the barfine. I told her no way, I pay the girl later, not now in the bar. Mamasan at first tried to tell me this is standard operating procedure, but when I explained to her that I'd lived in Thailand for years and never paid for a girl's services in advance at the bar, she backed off and acknowledged that Ging was making that demand. I cut bait. Ging acted very fishy and could not be trusted. I made peace with mamasan and explained to her that Ging just cost her a tip by wasting my time and money. Her looks are no way worth the attitude and the attempt to grab my cash without providing any service is not appreciated.Its standard practice for girls to try it on to get two drinks. Doesn't mean the customer has to agree. I have agreed on occasions if I know where I am going with the girl. A new girl, no way.

Ging has been ripped off by several customers that did not pay for the ST at all. Hence girls get very scared of being ripped off and has become common to request payment in advance. They don't want to fuck for free. I have never paid in advance myself but as I am well known at the bar, it's not a problem. It's standard for mamasans to ask for payment in advance, never mind whether they are blaming the girl or not. I talk to girls first and just give her the barfine to take to mamasan. I don't need a mamasan involved. However I am not typical.

My first ever CH girl Mint was trying to insist on up front payment for a LT. No way. She could have been a disaster and need to be sent packing with only a ST fee.

So mutual distrust is serious problem in a bar. Ging has plenty of regulars though. Young girls can be a little on the selfish side of course, but she gets away with it through popularity and very happy personality.

I have been with Ging maybe 4 times and found her to be responsive on the bed, and very nice feeling pussy. Kissing okay And BJ okay Not magnificent skills but she can be hot for it. Sensitive. Yes a bit scared of large size, but no where near as much as many other girls. If you are above average and a hard bang bang fucker, many young girls will have a problem. It's normal. Some girls say O.K. but go gentle and not too long duration. Unfortuantely I am long duration. Oom is a girl liking strong fucking unlike most girls. Hard for her to make it.

"Hardened Pro"? Not really. Although she may have started a couple of years back, she has been missing for very long periods frequently. I never even met her till 2nd half of last year, despite being a long term regular.

Only Donut in the bar, would I possibly choose sometimes in preference to Ging. Do have other favourites though.

Maybe bad luck for you that you decided to miss out. YMMV. She wouldn't be too concerned . Too many alternative options show up in within first hour or two of work. One of the very busiest girls possibly behind No. 4 Jane/Jaeng.

[Member #4591]

Its standard practice for girls to try it on to get two drinks. Doesn't mean the customer has to agree. I have agreed on occasions if I know where I am going with the girl. A new girl, no way.

Ging has been ripped off by several customers that did not pay for the ST at all. Hence girls get very scared of being ripped off and has become common to request payment in advance. They don't want to fuck for free. I have never paid in advance myself but as I am well known at the bar, it's not a problem. It's standard for mamasans to ask for payment in advance, never mind whether they are blaming the girl or not. I talk to girls first and just give her the barfine to take to mamasan. I don't need a mamasan involved. However I am not typical.

My first ever CH girl Mint was trying to insist on up front payment for a LT. No way. She could have been a disaster and need to be sent packing with only a ST fee.

So mutual distrust is serious problem in a bar. Ging has plenty of regulars though. Young girls can be a little on the selfish side of course, but she gets away with it through popularity and very happy personality.

I have been with Ging maybe 4 times and found her to be responsive on the bed, and very nice feeling pussy. Kissing okay And BJ okay Not magnificent skills but she can be hot for it. Sensitive. Yes a bit scared of large size, but no where near as much as many other girls.

"Hardened Pro"? Not really. Although she may have started a couple of years back, she has been missing for very long periods frequently. I never even met her till 2nd half of last year, despite being a long term regular.

Only Donut in the bar, would I possibly choose sometimes in preference to Ging. Do have other favourites though.Never in my time in BKK has it been standard practice to pay upfront to the Momason in a Suk area go go, Nana or Soi Cowboy. I can think of only one reason she chose this and it's that CH is becoming the most popular bar on Soi Cowboy and they are testing the waters now to see what they can get away with. However paying upfront in the bar is common practice at the Thai go go bars frequented by the locals. I have been spending a great deal of time in the Sephan Kwai bars recently and always pay 2000ST or 2600 LT at the bar and not once did I have a problem with bad service. I can speak mediocor Thai and I always make friends with the staff and tip well. This scene is great. 2600 LT, 1,000 for Lady drinks and my beers, and 500 tip for the moma. 4,100 for a night out drinking and sex with a white skinned 22 year old hottie. On Nana or Soi cowboy I would have been in for about 6,000-8,000 for the same. Love it!

[Syzygies]

Never in my time in BKK has it been standard practice to pay upfront to the Momason in a Suk area go go, Nana or Soi Cowboy. I can think of only one reason she chose this and it's that CH is becoming the most popular bar on Soi Cowboy and they are testing the waters now to see what they can get away with. However paying upfront in the bar is common practice at the Thai go go bars frequented by the locals. I have been spending a great deal of time in the Sephan Kwai bars recently and always pay 2000ST or 2600 LT at the bar and not once did I have a problem with bad service. I can speak mediocor Thai and I always make friends with the staff and tip well. This scene is great. 2600 LT, 1,000 for Lady drinks and my beers, and 500 tip for the moma. 4,100 for a night out drinking and sex with a white skinned 22 year old hottie. On Nana or Soi cowboy I would have been in for about 6,000-8,000 for the same. Love it!Thais can't be trusted. Likewise certain foreigners seem not be trusted too. Most MPs have changed to up front payment.

Girls being ripped off became all too common. Even in places like Tulip, mango, SW etc. Ask any of the girls.

[BionicMan]

I have been to a massage place where I see a regular. While waiting for her another provider made a long eye contact with a spark that gave me immediate hard-on. The question is weather to take the new, younger girl with the promising wink and risking upsetting my regular or stick to my guns and choose the the lady I came for who provide super duper service. Decisions decisions!Easy. Next time you go there with no plan and hope to bump into the young one. If not you can ask the reception about her name and if she is bookable (of course she is. But pretend you are inquiring). Maybe receptionist will tell your regular one, but hey,. That's life, and they know the don't and can't have exclusivity on customers.

Another way is to ask yo regular if she does 4-hand massage with somebody else, hinting you saw one who is new and maybe not fully experience. A good investment t check the skills of the young one.

[EihTooms]

Ging has been ripped off by several customers that did not pay for the ST at all. Hence girls get very scared of being ripped off and has become common to request payment in advance. They don't want to fuck for free. I have never heard this story from the girls I have been with. But it seems other customers hear these stories from the girls they have been with, so I suppose there are such stories to tell. I know there are assholes out there. But how often would a man who wants to find a beautiful girl for the night who treats him well in the room decide upon striking gold with that damned hard to find combination that this is the perfect opportunity to save 2000-2500 baht, never be treated to her treasures and service again and most certainly be marked lousy in that bar forever by dodging payment entirely? Something just doesn't smell right about this story some bargirls tell other customers but have never told me.

This Ging girl is beautiful, supposedly the best looking girl in one of the hottest go-go bars in Asia if not the entire world and apparently gives decent service in the room worth the money she demands. Yet she has managed with only a few months off and on in the business over a couple of years to be plagued by enough (several?) guys willing to scoff at the presumably utterly disposable combination of fabulous looks and worthy service / performance in the room to rip her off that her standard policy now with any newcomers is to get the mamasan to collect it all upfront? Seriously?

Something doesn't compute. Either she has discovered she really isn't worth the money once the hotel room door closes and she is alone with the customer or that girl has the worst luck in all of Thailand's go-go bars in choosing new customers.

Personally, if a mamasan or a girl in one of the most popular, standing room only go-go bars on the planet told me that the reason she needs to collect the money upfront is because "several customers did not pay for (her) ST at all", I would take that as a flashing red warning sign to move on to another girl. I mean, there has got to be a reason for that beyond that there are a lot of assholes out there and/or that she is that unlucky to have been targeted by so many of them in the past and fully expects to be targeted by more of them from now on. One customer who just up and ran out without paying a beautiful girl for decent service, ok. Two customers who shorted her by trying to get away with only paying her 1000 baht or something like that, sure. But SEVERAL customers over the course of a few months during a couple of years who didn't pay her anything at all?! I don't know, man. I guess I'd like to hear those customers' side of the story before I only blame them and not her for that so often recurring outcome.

[Member #4591]

Thais can't be trusted. Likewise certain foreigners seem not be trusted too. Most MPs have changed to up front payment.

Girls being ripped off became all too common. Even in places like Tulip, mango, SW etc. Ask any of the girls.Not that it matters, but I've never paid upfront in any Suk MP, however it is standard practice to pay upfront in the Ratchada MPs.

[Member #4591]

I have never heard this story from the girls I have been with. But it seems other customers hear these stories from the girls they have been with, so I suppose there are such stories to tell. I know there are assholes out there. But how often would a man who wants to find a beautiful girl for the night who treats him well in the room decide upon striking gold with that damned hard to find combination that this is the perfect opportunity to save 2000-2500 baht, never be treated to her treasures and service again and most certainly be marked lousy in that bar forever by dodging payment entirely? Something just doesn't smell right about this story some bargirls tell other customers but have never told me.

This Ging girl is beautiful, supposedly the best looking girl in one of the hottest go-go bars in Asia if not the entire world and apparently gives decent service in the room worth the money she demands. Yet she has managed with only a few months off and on in the business over a couple of years to be plagued by enough (several?) guys willing to scoff at the presumably utterly disposable combination of fabulous looks and worthy service / performance in the room to rip her off that her standard policy now with any newcomers is to get the mamasan to collect it all upfront? Seriously?

Something doesn't compute. Either she has discovered she really isn't worth the money once the hotel room door closes and she is alone with the customer or that girl has the worst luck in all of Thailand's go-go bars in choosing new customers.

Personally, if a mamasan or a girl in one of the most popular, standing room only go-go bars on the planet told me that the reason she needs to collect the money upfront is because "several customers did not pay for (her) ST at all", I would take that as a flashing red warning sign to move on to another girl. I mean, there has got to be a reason for that beyond that there are a lot of assholes out there and/or that she is that unlucky to have been targeted by so many of them. One customer who just up and ran out without paying a beautiful girl for decent service, ok. Two customers who shorted her by trying to get away with only paying her 1000 baht or something like that, sure. But SEVERAL customers over the course of a few months during a couple of years who didn't pay her anything at all?! I don't know, man. I guess I'd like to hear those customers' side of the story before I only blame them and not her for that outcome.If it wasn't for Sygs I would completely agree with you, so in this case I will give this provider the benefit of the doubt, enough that I will plan on making a special trip just to snage her.

[EihTooms]

If it wasn't for Sygs I would completely agree with you, so in this case I will give this provider the benefit of the doubt, enough that I will plan on making a special trip just to snage her.Of course, I'm not saying the girls don't tell Syzygies that story. And I have certainly heard girls say "a customer" didn't pay or tried not to pay once upon a time. Girls who have been at it for several years, that is. But as I think back to the very few times either the girl or the mamasan tried more than a little bit to get me to pay upfront in a Thai go-go bar, which I never did but forged ahead and took the girl anyway with a pay after agreement, I also remember thinking at the end of the experience that I understood entirely why this girl wanted the money upfront. And I can't think of one time where I would blame it on evil customers who just didn't appreciate this girl's terrific effort or skills in the room and must have tried to rip her off. It always seemed to make sense that a lot of guys would balk at paying her nearly as much as the mamasan tried to collect upfront considering the minimal effort she put out. LOL.

[BionicMan]

Not that it matters, but I've never paid upfront in any Suk MP, however it is standard practice to pay upfront in the Ratchada MPs.You do pay in advance At Annies. You usually pay after in any legitimate MP where, then, girl still offers some HJ, nude or not nude. The girl sometimes tries to cash before the service but I always say after.

I pay on arrival at Dubai MP once I set the length and pay the girls later, even if they too to ask for their fee before the service.

[Sunlover2]

Not that it matters, but I've never paid upfront in any Suk MP, however it is standard practice to pay upfront in the Ratchada MPs.Some of the Suk PSE oilies have gone to upfront payment (room charge + lady fee) I can remember Mango Massage and Candy Massage from my last trip. It also gives the provider the opportunity to better differentiate a "tip" at the end of the session as that is traditionally where money changed hands.

Not really liking it personally and not the way it used to be.

SL.

[Syzygies]

I have never heard this story from the girls I have been with. But it seems other customers hear these stories from the girls they have been with, so I suppose there are such stories to tell. I know there are assholes out there. But how often would a man who wants to find a beautiful girl for the night who treats him well in the room decide upon striking gold with that damned hard to find combination that this is the perfect opportunity to save 2000-2500 baht, never be treated to her treasures and service again and most certainly be marked lousy in that bar forever by dodging payment entirely? Something just doesn't smell right about this story some bargirls tell other customers but have never told me.

This Ging girl is beautiful, supposedly the best looking girl in one of the hottest go-go bars in Asia if not the entire world and apparently gives decent service in the room worth the money she demands. Yet she has managed with only a few months off and on in the business over a couple of years to be plagued by enough (several?) guys willing to scoff at the presumably utterly disposable combination of fabulous looks and worthy service / performance in the room to rip her off that her standard policy now with any newcomers is to get the mamasan to collect it all upfront? Seriously?

Something doesn't compute. Either she has discovered she really isn't worth the money once the hotel room door closes and she is alone with the customer or that girl has the worst luck in all of Thailand's go-go bars in choosing new customers.

Personally, if a mamasan or a girl in one of the most popular, standing room only go-go bars on the planet told me that the reason she needs to collect the money upfront is because "several customers did not pay for (her) ST at all", I would take that as a flashing red warning sign to move on to another girl. I mean, there has got to be a reason for that beyond that there are a lot of assholes out there and/or that she is that unlucky to have been targeted by so many of them in the past and fully expects to be targeted by more of them from now on. One customer who just up and ran out without paying a beautiful girl for decent service, ok. Two customers who shorted her by trying to get away with only paying her 1000 baht or something like that, sure. But SEVERAL customers over the course of a few months during a couple of years who didn't pay her anything at all?! I don't know, man. I guess I'd like to hear those customers' side of the story before I only blame them and not her for that so often recurring outcome.Your sarcastic tone and exagerration do not not make a convincing story. Just reads like mocking mocking.

Girls getting ripped off by the customer is not related to their looks or popularity.

You would not hear of these things for two reasons. You don't come across as someone sympathetic to the girls problems, and two you probably never asked any girls how bad the customers can be.

I have asked a variety of girls over the years what tjey thought of the customers. E. the. Tulip Yok, mango Cat, etc. Etc. MP girls have had customers with no money to pay.

What I have heard from various girls has been fairly consistent, so I don't assume they make up lies. What would be the point in that? There is no benefit to them. It's not going to change anything.

Bargirls and in particular newbie inexperienced bargirls get ripped off quite requrlarly, at least this was a major complaint when asked about problems with customers. Not as frequent as guys wanting bareback but still significant. Do you really believe that all customers are honest? Ha ha. Some guys are known to break the condom slyly on purpose.

I have heard many things about bad customers, because I was interested to understand something about the problems of the job.

Possibly very experienced bargirls are better able to suss out which guys are likely not to pay, and hence just refuse them. MP girls don't have same luxury to knock back all the customers that do not appeal to them.

I am also keen not to pay in advance if possible. My worry would be the possibility that with an unknown girl, once she got her money, if she was a bad girl, then could take the slightest oportunity to do a runner. With girls I know and trust, that would not be an issue.

I do recall at a new year's eve party, a freelance type of girl agreed to go with me long time, but actually she had no intention of that. Just wanted a quickie, get the money and head of with her friend somewhere for the new year. A lesson to be learned.

In the end, if neither bargirl nor customer trust each other, then no deal. It's that simple. One of the two has to be persuaded to trust the other, for something to be able to proceed.

It may well be that all of the girls in the bar are not worth what they charge for yourself and many othersm However they demand what they can get away with based on their popularity and may adjust it a bit depending on the particular customer being difficult or easy. All bargirls are over priced right?
The ugly ones go for less I am sure, but I don't bother with those ones.

I have seen reports of very high bargirl prices in Pattaya too now, that shocked me as I thought Pattaya was supposed to be a lot cheaper.

[ZuperFly]

I agree with everything Syz says. He knows what he's talking about. And I understand the attempt to explain Ging's behavior, since he's had positive experiences with her.

But I've logged more hours in Bangkok gogos than I care to remember over the years. And clearly a girl who has been selling pussy for two years on Soi Cowboy is lying if she says she's never been fucked by a big dick. Also it was clear that she and the mamasan were lying about the need to pre-pay.

Yes, I would have liked to fuck her, but since I have already fucked my share of hotties at the bars when they were better looking and performed better, I was not interested in putting my money at risk. I don't feel I missed out. I had every reason to suspect that a crummy session or a runner was in store, and I had done nothing to give the girl or mamasan any reason to suspect I was not going to pay. Quite the contrary, two nights earlier I had barfined a girl from CH and everything was cool. Plus, several of their wait staff used to work at Tilac, where I was a notorious regular for years, so I am not exactly an 'unknown quantity'.

I am not going to speculate why Ging adopted this strategy. It is true that girls sometimes get ripped off, even the 'superstars'.

My report was meant as a 'buyer beware', and also as my only recourse to what I considered squirrelly behavior that cost me money and valuable time at a bar where you got to jump on your prey early and fast.

I realize this discussion won't have any effect on this girl's ability to snag customers, but maybe it will save some board members time and money.

[EihTooms]

Your sarcastic tone and exagerration do not not make a convincing story. Just reads like mocking mocking.

Girls getting ripped off by the customer is not related to their looks or popularity.

You would not hear of these things for two reasons. You don't come across as someone sympathetic to the girls problems, and two you probably never asked any girls how bad the customers can be.
I have no doubt that if I routinely asked the girls, "Please tell me how bad the customers can be," they would not be stumped for tales of terror to keep me entertained as requested. How embellished and self-serving to their position those stories would be as well as how juicy and entertaining they can be to comply with my request would probably only be limited by their imagination.

I have had two bargirls from two separate bars cry on my shoulder about the difficulty of doing their job over the past 6 months. I suppose you might expect it was because they had gotten ripped off by several customers who didn't pay them anything at all for ST or that they had been forced to do something icky with a bad customer they didn't like and all that. Nope. It was about how much they hated their mamasan / owner for upping the Lady Drink quota and how sick they get when they have to drink so damn much alcohol every night of their working lives. Not one word about how bad their other customers are. Then again, I didn't ask them to supply me with stories about how bad the other customers are and, therefore, how they don't know how to treat them as well as I do.

Btw, I don't think I exaggerated. The words I used and responded to are the ones posted about this already. If it sounds like sarcasm and mockery to you, I can't help that. There just doesn't seem to be any other way to challenge a remarkable pattern of either bad luck or at least SOME level of justifiable non payment the girls who tell you these stories are plagued by.

[LA Guy 5]

Some of the Suk PSE oilies have gone to upfront payment (room charge + lady fee) I can remember Mango Massage and Candy Massage from my last trip. It also gives the provider the opportunity to better differentiate a "tip" at the end of the session as that is traditionally where money changed hands.

Not really liking it personally and not the way it used to be.

SL.I began noticing this trend maybe a couple of years ago. It seems many of the places ask for the money upfront if they don't recognize you as a customer, and still let you pay later if they know who you are. There have been some instances where someone who didn't know me was at the payment counter, and when they have asked for the money upfront I just told them I would pay later as I always did. That usually has worked but I wouldn't try it at a place I had never frequented previously, like Mitu, which is new enough (I believe) that it likely never in the past had a pay-at-the-end-of-the-session policy (but in fairness probably also is in a different category than what we often refer to as PSE oilies).

[Kazeu]

I've never heard of these Sephan Kwai bars. Can you elaborate a little on this area? Are there a lot of bars there? How does it compare to Soi cowboy?


Never in my time in BKK has it been standard practice to pay upfront to the Momason in a Suk area go go, Nana or Soi Cowboy. I can think of only one reason she chose this and it's that CH is becoming the most popular bar on Soi Cowboy and they are testing the waters now to see what they can get away with. However paying upfront in the bar is common practice at the Thai go go bars frequented by the locals. I have been spending a great deal of time in the Sephan Kwai bars recently and always pay 2000ST or 2600 LT at the bar and not once did I have a problem with bad service. I can speak mediocor Thai and I always make friends with the staff and tip well. This scene is great. 2600 LT, 1,000 for Lady drinks and my beers, and 500 tip for the moma. 4,100 for a night out drinking and sex with a white skinned 22 year old hottie. On Nana or Soi cowboy I would have been in for about 6,000-8,000 for the same. Love it!

[Syzygies]

I have no doubt that if I routinely asked the girls, "Please tell me how bad the customers can be," they would not be stumped for tales of terror to keep me entertained as requested. How embellished and self-serving to their position those stories would be as well as how juicy and entertaining they can be to comply with my request would probably only be limited by their imagination.

I have had two bargirls from two separate bars cry on my shoulder about the difficulty of doing their job over the past 6 months. I suppose you might expect it was because they had gotten ripped off by several customers who didn't pay them anything at all for ST or that they had been forced to do something icky with a bad customer they didn't like and all that. Nope. It was about how much they hated their mamasan / owner for upping the Lady Drink quota and how sick they get when they have to drink so damn much alcohol every night of their working lives. Not one word about how bad their other customers are. Then again, I didn't ask them to supply me with stories about how bad the other customers are and, therefore, how they don't know how to treat them as well as I do.
Your first paragraph is just your knowledgeable fantasizing. You always know would happen if you did something. You cannot accept real information that is contrary to your fantasies. Must always be lies. I report what I see and hear from actual experiences, not imaginings.

Bargirls particular gripe on the day was the mamasan. So what. That is just one example of the problems they face.

Sure all bargirls are liars and tell us nothing but fantasies. Have it your way. So don't go to any bars. Do you like any working girls at all or are they just a piece of meat?

Some of us are trying much harder to understand what is going on, and be able to have our fun, without making girls hate us.

Anyway the reason for upfront payment is very clear, whether at bars or MPs. Episodes of the customer not paying the girl at all, and also episodes of the customer agreeing to pay 2. 5 K (even he did not think the girl could possibly be worth it), and after the deed giving her a vastly reduced sum, saying she wasn't worth the original price, or just taxi money, saying he did not enjoy it. Unfortunately there are no money back guarantees that you will enjoy the fuck. It's a gamble. A contract is a contract but plenty of customers are reneging. It's not like the very old days when nearly all the girls just said it's up to you how much you pay them. That used to be a system that worked out O.K. for them on average as some would underpay and some would overpay. These days, with so much information on the internet guys are more empowered to be always paying bottom prices when they do pay.

So paying up front is simply the way they see to avoid the customer altering the contract after the event. This is really pretty obvious. I am doubtful that each shop will be thinking this is the ideal method for the girl to renege on her duties, although they do realise it can happen too.

As others have said, valued and regular customers at various shops are still given the option to pay later, as those customers already have a reputation for not being a cheat. Many places are thinking we don't need the business of cheats, which are only potential cheats, since they cannot know for sure in advance.

Some guys proudly report on ISG how they sent the girl packing with just taxi money, because she wasn't up to scratch. They just announce themselves as cheats. I am sorry but if you fucked the girl, you have to pay. There is no other option. I am not referring to special cases like she promised two pops and couldn't get you to a second pop or was too tired. I would still pay her provided no clear intent to cheat me. That is tricky, but I am referring to a simple ST booking. If I had a 2 pop agreement with every girl, hell I would never have to pay, right? since I never get to two pops, almost never. Of course this would be the path of a cheat. I am O.K. if a guy negoitiates two prices with the girl, a one pop price and a two pop price, and reasonable time limits. If the girl did her best to get the 2nd pop, she still deserves to be paid for it. Payment for sex is not dependent on a pop. If I don't cum at all, I still pay. With a recent freelancer, her Bj was poor (no experience I guess), and her pussy had no feel at all. Definitely no pop. Bad luck for me. Still have to pay. Still fucked her.

So many cheats exist in society, like the mamasan who refuses to give change, or guy that steals the tip money from the centre pot at a group meal in a restaurant, thinking the tip amount was too high, or just doesn't pay when bill is already covered by tips of others. Sure girls can be cheats too, fortunately has rarely happened to me. I don't trust freelancers too much. They are the most untrustworthy.

[Crocodilexp]

The trend towards demanding payment upfront is worrying.

In most service businesses where quality is variable, you pay after the fact. Take restaurants, for instance: you only pay ahead at fast food chains (where you know exactly what you're getting), while in any place with variable quality (even street food if you sit down), they'll let you pay after eating. Most customers don't run away without paying, there is a punishment for that.

In the sex industry, those most at risk of customer not paying are freelancers, and yet, they are rarely in a position to demand money upfront. Bars hire security staff and have police on a retainer, MPs also have doors that can be locked until the customer pays. Sure, there are cheaters and psychopaths out there and non-payment happens, but I don't believe it's too frequent.

In my experience (and it's fairly broad), prostitutes usually insist on upfront payment when they intend to deliver a subpar service for a (relatively) high price, knowing that the customer will contemplate paying less. When they intend to provide standard or good GFE service, they are OK with the customer paying afterwards too. Some take a gamble with "up to you" pricing, and often win big (at least in the old day when sex was cheap and a typical session amazing value from a western perspective).

Most venues with sex on the premises demand payment upfront. It's still a somewhat bad sign (basically that service is borderline value for most customers), but it might be OK at PSE oilies since they have a good reputation for service. Do note that decent oilies give refunds too, I had a flake once at Snow White, and got a full refund (of course, we haven't fucked yet, but did take a shower with some touching and the session went downhill in the first 10 min), so props to them. For whatever reason, that girl no longer works there.

Paying upfront shifts all the risk to the customer, and they're doing it because they can get away with it. In the old times, (a) they couldn't get away with it due to competition and (b) service for the price was generally good enough that not many customers had any misgivings about paying even more than the going rate.

[Christian G]

In my experience (and it's fairly broad), prostitutes usually insist on upfront payment when they intend to deliver a subpar service for a (relatively) high price, knowing that the customer will contemplate paying less. When they intend to provide standard or good GFE service, they are OK with the customer paying afterwards too. Some take a gamble with "up to you" pricing, and often win big (at least in the old day when sex was cheap and a typical session amazing value from a western perspective).

Most venues with sex on the premises demand payment upfront. It's still a somewhat bad sign (basically that service is borderline value for most customers), but it might be OK at PSE oilies since they have a good reputation for service. Do note that decent oilies give refunds too, I had a flake once at Snow White, and got a full refund (of course, we haven't fucked yet, but did take a shower with some touching and the session went downhill in the first 10 min), so props to them. For whatever reason, that girl no longer works there.Totaly agree with you! Pay upfront is a big risk for the customer, in fact I never paid upfront any freelancers and avoid the gogo have this rule. If some girl ask for the payment upfront I kindly ask her to leave the room. The only places where sometimes I paid in advance was in PSE oils, but first I talk with the girl and mamasan about which services I want.

[Member #4591]

Some of the Suk PSE oilies have gone to upfront payment (room charge + lady fee) I can remember Mango Massage and Candy Massage from my last trip. It also gives the provider the opportunity to better differentiate a "tip" at the end of the session as that is traditionally where money changed hands.

Not really liking it personally and not the way it used to be.

SL.I was at Mango last week and I always tell them I'll pay after if asked to pay upfront. I've never been refused.

[BionicMan]

I was at Mango last week and I always tell them I'll pay after if asked to pay upfront. I've never been refused.Surely pays being a regular. I feel that other might not get the same experience, bro' Ahahahah.

[Member #4591]

Surely pays being a regular. I feel that other might not get the same experience, bro' Ahahahah.I frequent many of the shops in the area on a random and definatly not regular basis, and the only suk MP shop that insists on paymet upfront is Annies. I had actually forgotten about Annies until another poster mentioned it. I normally will hit the same spot for a few times in a row and then move on and repeat the same pattern. I won't end up back at the same shop again for maybe 3 months after I decide to change it up. You don't need to be a regular. You just need to insist on not paying upfront and not look like a broke dick with no money. Smell good, enough with the flip flops, and tank tops. Honestly I work in BKK, speak moderate Thai, and wear a suit everyday so maybe it helps.

[Member #4591]

Totaly agree with you! Pay upfront is a big risk for the customer, in fact I never paid upfront any freelancers and avoid the gogo have this rule. If some girl ask for the payment upfront I kindly ask her to leave the room. The only places where sometimes I paid in advance was in PSE oils, but first I talk with the girl and mamasan about which services I want.Actually, paying upfront at most Bangkok MPs is not risky at all, especially if it is a reputable shop that has been around for many years such as Mango, Annies, and Snow White. However go go girls and especially freelancers who demand payment upfront are a clear sign of scam or lousy service. A classic example is paying for LT and then some emergency arises and she promises she will be back or continue the following night. I don't mean paying the go go girl upfront at her bar, but actually after the bar fine and in your room I still refuse to pay her until after the deed. I have lost a few bar fines that way but so be it. Once I was even able to get the BF back from Baccara but I turned around an hour later and Bar fined another lady so it all evened out in the end. On the other hand as I mentioned in a previous post, paying upfront in the bar to the momason and then taking the girl to my room from the local Thai go go's has proven to be ok. I was told if there was a problem, I could come back and change the girl.

[Daddy San]

What is a good place to buy sex toys in Bangkok?

The street vendors on Suk between Nana and Asoke have only cheap junk.

[Member #4591]

What is a good place to buy sex toys in Bangkok?

The street vendors on Suk between Nana and Asoke have only cheap junk.There really isn't. Bring them with you.

[JjBee62]

The trend towards demanding payment upfront is worrying.

In most service businesses where quality is variable, you pay after the fact. Take restaurants, for instance: you only pay ahead at fast food chains (where you know exactly what you're getting), while in any place with variable quality (even street food if you sit down), they'll let you pay after eating. Most customers don't run away without paying, there is a punishment for that.

In the sex industry, those most at risk of customer not paying are freelancers, and yet, they are rarely in a position to demand money upfront. Bars hire security staff and have police on a retainer, MPs also have doors that can be locked until the customer pays. Sure, there are cheaters and psychopaths out there and non-payment happens, but I don't believe it's too frequent.

In my experience (and it's fairly broad), prostitutes usually insist on upfront payment when they intend to deliver a subpar service for a (relatively) high price, knowing that the customer will contemplate paying less. When they intend to provide standard or good GFE service, they are OK with the customer paying afterwards too. Some take a gamble with "up to you" pricing, and often win big (at least in the old day when sex was cheap and a typical session amazing value from a western perspective).

Most venues with sex on the premises demand payment upfront. It's still a somewhat bad sign (basically that service is borderline value for most customers), but it might be OK at PSE oilies since they have a good reputation for service. Do note that decent oilies give refunds too, I had a flake once at Snow White, and got a full refund (of course, we haven't fucked yet, but did take a shower with some touching and the session went downhill in the first 10 min), so props to them. For whatever reason, that girl no longer works there.

Paying upfront shifts all the risk to the customer, and they're doing it because they can get away with it. In the old times, (a) they couldn't get away with it due to competition and (b) service for the price was generally good enough that not many customers had any misgivings about paying even more than the going rate.Just to play devil's advocate here, there may be another reason for the change to pay first. In recent years the tourist demographics have changed, with an increase of Asian tourists. Most westerners will pay without argument or problem, regardless of the service quality.

However, there are groups with a reputation for being more argumentative, especially when money is involved. Is it possible, there have been a few too many problems with arguments over payment, after the fact, recently?

Just thinking out loud.

[Syzygies]

I frequent many of the shops in the area on a random and definatly not regular basis, and the only suk MP shop that insists on paymet upfront is Annies. I had actually forgotten about Annies until another poster mentioned it. I normally will hit the same spot for a few times in a row and then move on and repeat the same pattern. I won't end up back at the same shop again for maybe 3 months after I decide to change it up. You don't need to be a regular. You just need to insist on not paying upfront and not look like a broke dick with no money. Smell good, enough with the flip flops, and tank tops. Honestly I work in BKK, speak moderate Thai, and wear a suit everyday so maybe it helps.You surprise me. I don't know about insist, but most MPs where I am not well known are taking payment up front. Anyway it makes no difference. The price is all inclusive at many shops and you are expected to pay regardless of on the way in or way out. Probably only Mango knows me well enough to allow me to pay whenever. All soapies take all inclusive payment up front in the modern day, Annies is no exception.

So interesting you would insist to pay afterwards. Don't see the advantage in doing that, unless you intend to cancel after 5 minutes or something. Can you explain?

[Syzygies]

Just to play devil's advocate here, there may be another reason for the change to pay first. In recent years the tourist demographics have changed, with an increase of Asian tourists. Most westerners will pay without argument or problem, regardless of the service quality.

However, there are groups with a reputation for being more argumentative, especially when money is involved. Is it possible, there have been a few too many problems with arguments over payment, after the fact, recently?

Just thinking out loud.I don't see the difference between this reason and the others I gave.

I don't know the exact racial demographic of guys that want a free fuck or get angry that service wasn't all they expected. However I assure you that westerners are some of them.

Certainly a common problem with Thais at Soapies. I remember the old days when some soapies had a separate Thai Booran massage fee paid up front and girl was paid separately for the special. I was quite close to a soapy girl 15 years ago, even I dislike Thai massage. LOL. She commented on being cheated by the Thai customers plenty of times. Wasn't too long before they changed to all inclusive fee. It then became clear you could not just go get an "ancient healing massage" alone any more. You had to pay for more than that up front.

I am sure Indians and Chinese, and the full spectrum, suddenly found themselves with no money to pay the girl when girl and massage payments were separate. So shops decided to bring in all inclusive charges.

Is there one super trustworthy race or nationality? I don't know of one, but maybe.

[Sum12]

I thought I might share my recent trip to Bangkok although I have a few more days here. Went to Annies the first day but the selection was not to my liking, mostly older women or simply did not fit my taster. Although a number of you pointed out Thailand for Thais, CIS in Russia or Europe, I do not have the necessary means to travel there. For me CIS was to be the highlight of my trip while I would definitely stick to more Thais. So I thought about trying the Rajah and Grace. Went to Rajah at after 10 as instructed by a few members here and as per my previous trip to Bangkok where I was fortunately enough to get a line up of 7-8 looking CIS. The doorman approached me but told me 'no more no more'. What a pity. Is its possible he did so cause I look a bit Indian? I am young, decent looking, dressed smartly but he still did so. I tried looking inside Rajah a few time too but never did I see any CIS in the lobby or coming out to smoke. I presume either they do not have them anymore or because of the reason I mentioned earlier because I did see a few girls turn down Indian clients, my bad. Any other places where we can get CIS? I also tried Grace a couple of times around 12 am but the quality is seriously lacking.

Visited Nana, Spankies too crowded but great shows, Angelwitch no show and girls lacking quality, Bangkok Bunnies was alright but I picked up twice from Rainbow 3 and both times were better to be forgotten. Visited Mitu Japanese Massage (not the no hands massage) soi33 and booked for 70 minutes, service was the same and half the time she was on her phone pretending to massage me when the deed was done, no second round and CBJ. Nyan Nyan soi 33 was amazing and was eager to please but cannot recall her name. Went to EZMassage 1 and though she was not a looker had an amazing conversation, CBJ and decent time. Also tried the Bangkok backpage and booked Kate who claims to be a model, 170 cm tall but she was a good looker though not the same as her picture. Again the service was horrible, CBJ but popped twice in 1 hour and sent her off as she could not hold a decent conversation though I booked her for 2 hours. Booked Bovi from new Bangkok escorts Picture was heavily photoshopped but it was her and had an amazing session with her, BBBJ and great conversation.

Thinking of checking out Crazy House tonight. Will keep you all posted. Any help on where I can find CIS?

[Goatscrot]

I have never heard this story from the girls I have been with. But it seems other customers hear these stories from the girls they have been with, so I suppose there are such stories to tell. I know there are assholes out there. But how often would a man who wants to find a beautiful girl for the night who treats him well in the room decide upon striking gold with that damned hard to find combination that this is the perfect opportunity to save 2000-2500 baht, never be treated to her treasures and service again and most certainly be marked lousy in that bar forever by dodging payment entirely? Something just doesn't smell right about this story some bargirls tell other customers but have never told me.

This Ging girl is beautiful, supposedly the best looking girl in one of the hottest go-go bars in Asia if not the entire world and apparently gives decent service in the room worth the money she demands. Yet she has managed with only a few months off and on in the business over a couple of years to be plagued by enough (several?) guys willing to scoff at the presumably utterly disposable combination of fabulous looks and worthy service / performance in the room to rip her off that her standard policy now with any newcomers is to get the mamasan to collect it all upfront? Seriously?

Something doesn't compute. Either she has discovered she really isn't worth the money once the hotel room door closes and she is alone with the customer or that girl has the worst luck in all of Thailand's go-go bars in choosing new customers.

Personally, if a mamasan or a girl in one of the most popular, standing room only go-go bars on the planet told me that the reason she needs to collect the money upfront is because "several customers did not pay for (her) ST at all", I would take that as a flashing red warning sign to move on to another girl. I mean, there has got to be a reason for that beyond that there are a lot of assholes out there and/or that she is that unlucky to have been targeted by so many of them in the past and fully expects to be targeted by more of them from now on. One customer who just up and ran out without paying a beautiful girl for decent service, ok. Two customers who shorted her by trying to get away with only paying her 1000 baht or something like that, sure. But SEVERAL customers over the course of a few months during a couple of years who didn't pay her anything at all?! I don't know, man. I guess I'd like to hear those customers' side of the story before I only blame them and not her for that so often recurring outcome.Agreed wholeheartedly. If lots of customers aren't paying then there is something wrong with the service and we are right to be wary. At the prices these gals are charging I expect that door to close and for them to have sex with me like they are with a BF they really like or as if they are starring in a porn flick. No ifs, ands, or buts about it. Now, if I am paying 1 k Baht my service standards would be very different, but if you want 100 USD or close to it honey, then you better well perform. And no trying to skip out with 15 min of sex and then begging me to "finish. " Of course I can normally tell in the first few minutes how the session will go. The second that door closes I am DFKing the gal like a horny young man. Groping and getting with it. If she responds favorably, I know that I am in business. If she pushes me away and says, "shower, shower," then trouble might be afoot. I still proceed though. Once we are done with the shower if she refuses DFK, does not want to be fingered, and refuses DATY, then the session is over. I get up, get dressed, leave a couple of hundred Baht and am out of there. Sorry, no one should be compensated the full amount for poor service. What really gets me is how this kind of service has become acceptable with so many punters, and in fact they will defend gals who do not perform. When I moved here it was the kiss of death for a gal to get a reputation as a non-performer. Dudes just would not take them.

So, pay upfront? No way. And I never pay upfront in oilies and have never been asked. Of course you never run the risk of extremely awful service at any of the PSE shops. Just sometimes extremely awful looks.

[Goatscrot]

The trend towards demanding payment upfront is worrying.

In most service businesses where quality is variable, you pay after the fact. Take restaurants, for instance: you only pay ahead at fast food chains (where you know exactly what you're getting), while in any place with variable quality (even street food if you sit down), they'll let you pay after eating. Most customers don't run away without paying, there is a punishment for that.

In the sex industry, those most at risk of customer not paying are freelancers, and yet, they are rarely in a position to demand money upfront. Bars hire security staff and have police on a retainer, MPs also have doors that can be locked until the customer pays. Sure, there are cheaters and psychopaths out there and non-payment happens, but I don't believe it's too frequent.

In my experience (and it's fairly broad), prostitutes usually insist on upfront payment when they intend to deliver a subpar service for a (relatively) high price, knowing that the customer will contemplate paying less. When they intend to provide standard or good GFE service, they are OK with the customer paying afterwards too. Some take a gamble with "up to you" pricing, and often win big (at least in the old day when sex was cheap and a typical session amazing value from a western perspective).

Most venues with sex on the premises demand payment upfront. It's still a somewhat bad sign (basically that service is borderline value for most customers), but it might be OK at PSE oilies since they have a good reputation for service. Do note that decent oilies give refunds too, I had a flake once at Snow White, and got a full refund (of course, we haven't fucked yet, but did take a shower with some touching and the session went downhill in the first 10 min), so props to them. For whatever reason, that girl no longer works there.

Paying upfront shifts all the risk to the customer, and they're doing it because they can get away with it. In the old times, (a) they couldn't get away with it due to competition and (b) service for the price was generally good enough that not many customers had any misgivings about paying even more than the going rate.We are purchasing a service. When I purchase other services I pay when the service has been completed. I don't pay for my car repair beforehand and I don't pay for sexual services beforehand. Guys, it is important to keep the tide on our side. There is enough of it against us with as has been stated changing demographics, etc. Having the money be the reward for a good time given is the power we need to keep. Stick to your guns.

[OneRose]

3rd Night: Thai girl from Sukhumvit soi 4.

After a few drinks in Angelwitch and Spanky s, I decided to go out for a walk on soi 4. In a few minutes a beautiful, sexy body white skin girl caught my eye. She looked very chang maish. She was wearing a very tight pair of blue shorts and a very nice top.

We went to the room, and we did as we agreed a short time session with blow job uncovered, sex, COF and video. She was quite friendly, a little bit fake during the sex but her pussy was very tight. A quite average GFE. In a word, a good experience.

Looks: 8.5 (she looked great, except for a big scar on her belly, her red lipstick was amazing, and her perfectly shave tight pussy was a delight).

Sex: 7 5 nothing extraordinary (she did all that we agreed, she smiled to the camera, she was friendly, no initiative).

[Crocodilexp]

What is a good place to buy sex toys in Bangkok? The street vendors on Suk between Nana and Asoke have only cheap junk.

There are no real legal sex shops, since sex toys might be technically illegal (like porn is illegal, one of those absurd laws).

In addition to vendors on Sukhumvit, there are also street vendors at Silom who have cheap junk at very expensive prices, and won't come down.

Khlong Thom market (at Worachak Road in Chinatown) used to be a decent place for this. Cheap junk at cheap prices after you negotiate a bit.

For instance, the same vibrator I paid 300 baht for at Khlong Thom has the asking price of 1200 at Silom, and they won't come below 600.

[OneRose]

I thought I might share my recent trip to.

Thinking of checking out Crazy House tonight. Will keep you all posted. Any help on where I can find CIS?I've seen a few non Thai girls around Rajak. 3 of them were Uzbek, a few said they were from Iran (don t think so) - if you are in fucking a woman in hijab.

One night I've seen an amazing looking tall one leaving Rajak and heading to Sukhumvit. I immediately approached and asked her about the price. She told me she only worked for dollars. She quoted me 300 dollars at first, than went down to 200. She was so beautiful, that I would be willing to pay 300 , but she refused letting me to take a video so I declined the offer. She told me she is from Colombia, which I don't really believe, but she was Latina for sure.

I've looked myself sometimes inside the Rajak hotel (from outside, didn't got inside) but never saw anyone else that would look like a WG.

At the end of my trip, I found an Indian nice girl on Sukhumvit around McDonald's but I'll write about that a complete review later.

Enjoy your holiday! We are waiting for your reports!

[OneRose]

4th girl was a bar girl, even though I didn't technically got her from the bar.

So I went out for some drinks and ended up in Angel witch. Somehow I find it the only bar that still has a few beautiful girls, and I still like the show. The show has decreased in quality in the last years but it's still good. As I really don't like Soi Cowboy and Patpong (even though the latter is making a come back) , I had to choose from the one in Nana. And my personal top is (since a few years now): Angewitch, Spanky's and mandarin (the top one).

As I was saying, I stopped in Angelwitch for the show. One of the dancing girls caught my eye as I haven't seen her in the previous nights. I asked the mamasan that I trust as we go way back, and she told me it was the first day for the girl and that she didn't really work anywhere else before. Hard to believe of course, but whatever, she was a newbie. I am very into farm fresh, naive, willing to do anything girls so I liked her. I bought her some drinks but her total lack of English (I mean, she couldn't even quote a price) made me a little reluctant. At the end of the night, I was kind of tired and not really in the mood for fucking, I was fully feeling my jet lagged so I decided to go home. As it was almost closing time there weren't really a lot of customers left and only a few girls. My company for the night was still not barfined. The mamasan told me that she will go for 3000 baht for LT (which is strange as the others girl charge 4000 baht, but I thought she was new and maybe she had a lower starting price). I payed my bill, thanked everyone and left. Her beautiful Chinese eyes were following me and looking in such a special way I wouldn't forget. I went out of the bar but she followed me. She showed me her phone and basically told me in a gesture language to give her my phone number. I was intrigued. I added her on line immediately. Google translate transformed her non existing English skills and she started telling me that she likes me and so on. I told her good night and went to sleep.

Next morning she started texting me, telling me how much she likes me and how much she wants to meet me. As any other john, I love a woman with initiative, so I offered her 2000 baht for the whole day and next night (so about 24 hours) which she, surprisingly, accepted. She only told me that I have to pay for the bar as well the 700 baht bar fine, which I happily agreed.

In less than one hour she came to me. In the sun of BKK and without my drinks, half of the beauty that she had in the bar faded away. She was smiling so beautiful, she seemed so happy to see me, that I totally fell for it. We went straight to the room where she blew me covered and then I fucked her hard. She was very opened to everything from the first moment. The only thing that made her reluctant was taking a little video, but I explained her (good old Google translate) that it's only for my personal use so she agreed. She even gave me a great rimming and than I finished in her face and mouth. It was marvelous.

We went out to eat something and I was amazed that I didn't got bored immediately with someone with whom I couldn't basically communicate. We used Google translate a few times, but most of the time we just sat and enjoyed the time. That was surprisingly enjoyable.

We went back to the room, we had another session with a lot of rimming and fucking and sucking and of course another finish in her face, which made a great video memory.

At this point (around 8 pm) I was kind of bored. I wasn't in the mood for one more session, I would rather go out drinking and hitting some more bars. So I told her I have something to do. After a lot of explanations via Google translate she left (again, I was totally surprised that she was really sad to leave, even though she got the full 2000 that she would get if she would spend the night with me) .

The next day I left to Pattaya so I haven't seen her for a couple of weeks but we kept texting. When I came back, I stopped regularly at the bar but she changed. She was always really drunk, to a point at which no one wanted to bar fine her, the light in her eyes had faded away and she was colder (I guess that's what a few weeks will do to a girl) .

In my last night I wanted to bar fine her but she asked me for 3000 which I found to be too much given the fact that she came with me for 2000. I don't regret the decision, as I barfined another girl in that particular night and a blast she was (I'll make a separate review for her).

Back to the girl:

Looks: 8 in the bar, 6 at the hotel (rarely have I seen such a difference) , her eyes were great, and her innocent looks was so arousing.

GFE: 9 (as much as you can get from someone that can not speak your language, but I really had a great non sexual time with her).

Sex: 8 (good initiative, great rimming, she even finished at some point, she enjoyed it, extra points for COF, rimming and video).

[Syzygies]

There are no real legal sex shops, since sex toys might be technically illegal (like porn is illegal, one of those absurd laws).

In addition to vendors on Sukhumvit, there are also street vendors at Silom who have cheap junk at very expensive prices, and won't come down.

Khlong Thom market (at Worachak Road in Chinatown) used to be a decent place for this. Cheap junk at cheap prices after you negotiate a bit.

For instance, the same vibrator I paid 300 baht for at Khlong Thom has the asking price of 1200 at Silom, and they won't come below 600.I agree, everything in Thailand is made dirt cheap in China or similar and quality is crap. You have to buy these things in a western country and put in your suitcase. Germany has particularly good range of quality stuff.

Thai girls like Vibes (not all girls).

[Syzygies]

We are purchasing a service. When I purchase other services I pay when the service has been completed. I don't pay for my car repair beforehand and I don't pay for sexual services beforehand. Guys, it is important to keep the tide on our side. There is enough of it against us with as has been stated changing demographics, etc. Having the money be the reward for a good time given is the power we need to keep. Stick to your guns.In my home country brothels charge for sex in advance. In many you don't even get to go inside without paying first. Why? Its simply a statement about the perceived reliability of the customers. BTW, the service of the girls is generally pretty crap for my taste. No GFE.

Really, getting your car serviced has no relevance whatsoever. If you don't pay, you don't get your car back.

In my country, very late at night, some petrol pumps require the customer to prepay, before getting their fuel. It's simply a reaction to cheats. If you are well trusted, you don't have these problems.

Please explain why it is so important to pay afterward in an MP. I usually pay up front and many Oily MPs expect that. They certainly ask me to pay before I go upstairs. It means that you intend to maintain the right not to pay or dicker over the final price or what?

[Goatscrot]

In my home country brothels charge for sex in advance. In many you don't even get to go inside without paying first. Why? Its simply a statement about the perceived reliability of the customers. BTW, the service of the girls is generally pretty crap for my taste. No GFE.

Really, getting your car serviced has no relevance whatsoever. If you don't pay, you don't get your car back.

In my country, very late at night, some petrol pumps require the customer to prepay, before getting their fuel. It's simply a reaction to cheats. If you are well trusted, you don't have these problems.

Please explain why it is so important to pay afterward in an MP. I usually pay up front and many Oily MPs expect that. They certainly ask me to pay before I go upstairs. It means that you intend to maintain the right not to pay or dicker over the final price or what?If the service to you car is rendered and it is not completed or the car is not fixed, you can take it back. And again, you don't pay till it is completed. And yes, you pay in advance in your home country and the service is mostly crap. That is exactly the point. Why is is so important? Because it allows for the degradation of service. They have your money and you are not getting it back no matter how crappy the service it. Would you accept that from a car repair place? Pay us up front; we'll take a shot at fixing your car; if we can't then your out of luck and out of money. Don't think you would take that deal. I view P4 P in the same way. Yes, there are cheats, but a service business needs to be based around good customers, not cheats. The cheats are the exception, not the rule. Take soapies. Do you get the same service level you get at oilies? Nope, and my guess is because the gals know they really don't have to earn that money. My guess is that if all massage shops go pre-pay we will see service like your home country overall very quickly. Why? Humans do as little as possible. It is just our nature. With that money already in pocket, well I don't think I need to elaborate any more.

[LA Guy 5]

If the service to you car is rendered and it is not completed or the car is not fixed, you can take it back. And again, you don't pay till it is completed. And yes, you pay in advance in your home country and the service is mostly crap. That is exactly the point. Why is is so important? Because it allows for the degradation of service. They have your money and you are not getting it back no matter how crappy the service it. Would you accept that from a car repair place? Pay us up front; we'll take a shot at fixing your car; if we can't then your out of luck and out of money. Don't think you would take that deal. I view P4 P in the same way. Yes, there are cheats, but a service business needs to be based around good customers, not cheats. The cheats are the exception, not the rule. Take soapies. Do you get the same service level you get at oilies? Nope, and my guess is because the gals know they really don't have to earn that money. My guess is that if all massage shops go pre-pay we will see service like your home country overall very quickly. Why? Humans do as little as possible. It is just our nature. With that money already in pocket, well I don't think I need to elaborate any more.Although at oilies I usually tell them I'll pay afterwards, mainly because that is how it has been historically at these places, I'm not so sure whether one pays in advance at places like the oilies and MPs is that predictive of the service one will get. In these places, it really depends on whether management gives a s**t how the girls perform. And what constitutes good service in the eyes of the management may also be influenced by which nationalities the place cater to primarily (e.g., different target customers at Nataree and the PSE oilies). The girls know at well-managed places that if they do not perform to the standards management expects there will be consequences.

Moreover, if some place like Nataree allowed men to pay after the sessions, I doubt many would consider not paying an option as I suspect one might end up in a similar state as would one who refused to pay a second-floor bar in Patpong.

All in all then, I'm not sure paying up front or afterwards matters much at the tightly run businesses, such as soapies and oilies.

However, where I agree is with go-go dancers and freelancers. Although go-go dancers should be accountable to their mama-sans and management, often mama-sans and management only care about getting their payments without really caring about the service provided (there are, of course, exceptions). So the level of accountability is less. And with freelancers there essentially is no accountability. So, yeah, for go-go dancers and freelancers, payment afterwards is greatly preferred. Although even here there are exceptions: one of my best go go sessions was at a bar in Patpong where they required payment in advance to the mama-san; this had no negative impact at all on the session although I'm sure if I paid in advance as a matter of course, at some point it would catch up with me.

[Wolvenvacht]

What is a good place to buy sex toys in Bangkok?

The street vendors on Suk between Nana and Asoke have only cheap junk.I have never seen any shop in Bangkok (other than steet vendors) selling sex toys. Perhaps there are some places where they are available "under the counter", but you will need to be very local to get access to those.

If you are in need of some good quaity sex toys, bring some from you home country.

[Syzygies]

If the service to you car is rendered and it is not completed or the car is not fixed, you can take it back. And again, you don't pay till it is completed. And yes, you pay in advance in your home country and the service is mostly crap. That is exactly the point. Why is is so important? Because it allows for the degradation of service. They have your money and you are not getting it back no matter how crappy the service it. Would you accept that from a car repair place? Pay us up front; we'll take a shot at fixing your car; if we can't then your out of luck and out of money. Don't think you would take that deal. I view P4 P in the same way. Yes, there are cheats, but a service business needs to be based around good customers, not cheats. The cheats are the exception, not the rule. Take soapies. Do you get the same service level you get at oilies? Nope, and my guess is because the gals know they really don't have to earn that money. My guess is that if all massage shops go pre-pay we will see service like your home country overall very quickly. Why? Humans do as little as possible. It is just our nature. With that money already in pocket, well I don't think I need to elaborate any more.You keep on with your car servicing crap. Its not relevant. You didn't answer the question about why you need the power to pay afterwards. Or maybe you justt hinted at it "money back". What is the power you want?

[Blanquiceleste]

I've seen a few non Thai girls around Rajak. Interesting reports OneRose. FYI the hotel's name is RAJAH. Many people spell it as you have because the signage appears like a K but in reality its a H.

[Syzygies]

Moreover, if some place like Nataree allowed men to pay after the sessions, I doubt many would consider not paying an option as I suspect one might end up in a similar state as would one who refused to pay a second-floor bar in Patpong.

All in all then, I'm not sure paying up front or afterwards matters much at the tightly run businesses, such as soapies and oilies.Your specualtion about what would happen at Nataree is pointless. Nataree requires guys tonpay upfront. As do other soapies. In past girls in soapies did fail to get paid for aex and there was little they could do about. Most soapies did nor hire a team of bouncers ro belt the crap out of the customers.

Indeed 24 years ago a buddy and I visited a 2nd floor Pat Ping bar. My buddy had to leave in a hurry before me. I got presented with a bill for all sorts of shows we did not intend to pay for and despite a couple of menacing guys, I refused to pay for it and indicated I would pay for the deinks only. We had been guaranteed no cover charge by the outside staff. They asked what badge number of the doir guys were who said no cover charge? Ha Ha. I don't remember now if I had sufficient money to pay their bill or not. I kbviously did nor look too scared since the standover guys let me leave. I don't know if anyone ever got seriously bashed if they remained calm. I think many people paid up assuming the worst. Obviously if physical harm happenwd, the police would have got involved as well. I don't know if the tourist police were good or not.

They maybe better than the normal police.

Both Soapy girls and Tulip girls have told me of cuatomers who did not pay for the sex when the payment was seperated. These were girls that provided the very best service in my opinion.

Tightly run? I do agree though that paying first or paying the same amount after obviously makes no difference unless the customer intends not to pay when he did not like the service provided. Otherwise he is just psychologically fooling himself.

Of course each guy's view of good service varies so much as well. What I like and what Goatscrot likes are completely different, it seems.

I am not a campaigner in favour of paying up front. It makes no difference to me for oilies and soapies. It would make a huge difference for freelancers that I don't trust at all. I just explain the reasons places have changed to pay all in and to payment up front. There is no allowance for the customer not to pay, and you don't get your money back in nirmal circumstances.

Sometimes the money is blown. The girl was pathetic. E.g. Vodka at Candy was totally pathetic for me. I have no idea why. Money was paid. I did not have the gall to ask for it back. I may have made an off comment on the way out. Cannot remember. What is the point? The girl can always make up some excuse why we terminated so quick like I was demanding bareback. It would just be my word against hers.

[Blanquiceleste]

I've never heard of these Sephan Kwai bars. Can you elaborate a little on this area? Are there a lot of bars there? How does it compare to Soi cowboy?Simply put, Saphan Kwai means Buffalo Bridge. Experts can correct me if I am wrong.

Google "Saphan Kwai" and you will come across plenty of information. I am not sure the forum has a lot on SK gogo bars. Take the Green line towards Mo Chit, get off at Saphan Kwai and take a short walk. You will get to the stretch of 150 m to 200 m that has around 10 to 12 bars. Small establishments mostly. Take a chance. Not many Farangs there. But all are welcome. One word of advice, travel extremely light and do not get into any sort of argument. It is simply not like Nana or Cowboy or Patpong.

[Syzygies]

Never in my time in BKK has it been standard practice to pay upfront to the Momason in a Suk area go go, Nana or Soi Cowboy. I can think of only one reason she chose this and it's that CH is becoming the most popular bar on Soi Cowboy and they are testing the waters now to see what they can get away with. However paying upfront in the bar is common practice at the Thai go go bars frequented by the locals. I have been spending a great deal of time in the Sephan Kwai bars recently and always pay 2000ST or 2600 LT at the bar and not once did I have a problem with bad service. I can speak mediocor Thai and I always make friends with the staff and tip well. This scene is great. 2600 LT, 1,000 for Lady drinks and my beers, and 500 tip for the moma. 4,100 for a night out drinking and sex with a white skinned 22 year old hottie. On Nana or Soi cowboy I would have been in for about 6,000-8,000 for the same. Love it!I don't quite understand. Why is the difference between ST and LT so low? Is this basically due to girl only having the chance to make one ST per night? Does the girl keep all the 2000 ST or is someone taking a cut out of that? since you aren't paying that to her directly. Is this a set fee?

Why so much as 500 ti the moma. She must be raking it in?

I have been to T Det. My buddy took a short time but I did not. I found it a bit less easy to get to the most desirable girl than at cowboy. I. e. She was busy or assigned to other tables. I didn't find the next best level good enough to my taste.

Do you often end up getting your first choce girl easily? I guess there is always returning another night, but I couldn't be bothered, as not immediately hooked by the setup.

I suppose I did not know the system on how to get a lap dance from the most desired girl when she was not in the vicinity. Most of the customers sit politely and don't run around chasing a girl like I was tempted to do but resisted.

Its too spread out for me. This limits. the girls that are dancing nearby. If I like a girl, I would like to be near where she is dancing but this is not practical.

I guess this place is designed for guys that are not fussy and should like all the girls equally well. Not how I operate. I like a very small portion of the girls and ignore all the rest. You take a long time to see all the girls there wirh their rotation system and then by the time you have worked out which one you like, she is bound to be busy already with a customer.

Perhaps there are ways for a regular to overcome this?

[Syzygies]

In a bar, I am not a hard netotiator of a price, but I prefer to discuss it only with the girl. I don't want to discuss with a girl and a mamasan interfering as well. Sone girls actually agree to go with me without a price negotiation. It definitely is not paid upfront in this case. Nor have I ever had to pay up front as yet in a bar. Although I know it is happening in Crazy House.

So I never let a mamsan get invovled in it even if that is what they are for. If the girl and I cannot reach agreement by ourselves, end of story for me. I give the bar fine to the girl directly to pass on to a mamasan. Its a good idea to have correct money for a barfine but I don't always have it. I have been known to tip the mamasan if she is okay And doesn't hassle me.

Dollhouse has a really great mamasan last I checked. She was recently promoted from being a waitress. I really liked that particular waitress.

Don't know what will happen there with the owner dead from that building fall.

I guess my avoidance of mamasan involvement is also related to question of paying up front. I never have paid up front and would be concerned about mamasan jacking the price up. I don't see that all girls should be the same price. There are champaigne class girls and there are cheap wine class.

I don't go with girls if we are not happy about anything. I don't believe a girl can be in the right frame of mind if she is not really happy about the price. So no protracted negotiation. She sometimes asks for too much possibly. I counter with my top amount and that is it. I am not interested in negotiation. If I must have her, she will win of course within reason. Depends on level of desperation.

You can't effectively negotiate the price with the most popular girls. They have too many potential customers. You can be lucky to get to her.

With Number 4 Jaeng / Jane, she sat with me briefly once, I was too slow to get to Bfing her before one of her regulars arrived, so after her dance set, she did not return. So never had a chance to fuck het as yet. Wasn't my first choice when I first met her anyway. By the time I thought would like to try, never found her available at all. Its like she has a customer lined up for every night. No big deal. Hasn't got much tits but very popualr anyway.

[Goatscrot]

You keep on with your car servicing crap. Its not relevant. You didn't answer the question about why you need the power to pay afterwards. Or maybe you justt hinted at it "money back". What is the power you want?It's very relevant. P4 P is purchasing a service, same as any other service. Why do we need to pay after? Because if the money has changed hands before the service is rendered there is no need to provide good service. The incentive is gone. This is especially true in Thailand where almost no one is concerned with tomorrow or repeat business. And you yourself say the mamasans don't care and they don't. The power that we have is our wallets. So if the service is not what has been agreed upon then less money is paid, which is only fair.

[Goatscrot]

Tightly run? I do agree though that paying first or paying the same amount after obviously makes no difference unless the customer intends not to pay when he did not like the service provided. Otherwise he is just psychologically fooling himself.

Of course each guy's view of good service varies so much as well. What I like and what Goatscrot likes are completely different, it seems.

Sometimes the money is blown. The girl was pathetic. E.g. Vodka at Candy was totally pathetic for me. I have no idea why. Money was paid. I did not have the gall to ask for it back. I may have made an off comment on the way out. Cannot remember. What is the point? The girl can always make up some excuse why we terminated so quick like I was demanding bareback. It would just be my word against hers.Was at Annie's once and the gal was a complete dud. I was only in the room for about 15 min and went out and asked for my money back. Mamasan asked if I had "finished" and the answer was no. She gave me a complete refund. I always have stones to ask for money back if services promised are not delivered. And yes, we have every right to do that. Yes, paying after makes a psychological difference to the provider. She is then more apt to perform with the knowledge that good service might result in more money and less service might present her with a problem. And as well it should be.

What's the point? I am sure you are not the only one who received poor service from her. If guys tell the mamasan and ask for money back and this gal has it happen several times the mamasan will do something about it. An excuse from the gal may work once, but if she continues to do that she will be "found out. " Don't complain and she will continue to get away with poor service.

[EihTooms]

Your first paragraph is just your knowledgeable fantasizing. You always know would happen if you did something. You cannot accept real information that is contrary to your fantasies. Must always be lies. I report what I see and hear from actual experiences, not imaginings.Syzygies, the only way you could report from what you actually saw and heard about a bargirl deliverying decent service as negotiated or agreed upon yet still being ripped off several times over the course of a few months by customers who paid her nothing at all for ST is if you were in the room at the time as either that customer or as a witness.

Were you that customer who ripped off the girls? Were you a witness to everything that happened in the room?

Neither you nor I nor the mamasan nor that girl's best friend nor her closest blood relative could possibly know what you say you know from what you saw and heard. It is all opinion and, at most, informed judgement. Including yours.

And my opinion and informed judgement tells me that if a Thai P4 P girl is plagued by a significant pattern of 100% non payment of any money at all for her services, the best advice she could get for how to solve that problem would have much to do with improving her service level. Going to a pay upfront system would only exacerbate the most likely problems rather than solve them.

[EihTooms]

Was at Annie's once and the gal was a complete dud. I was only in the room for about 15 min and went out and asked for my money back. Mamasan asked if I had "finished" and the answer was no. She gave me a complete refund. I always have stones to ask for money back if services promised are not delivered. And yes, we have every right to do that. Yes, paying after makes a psychological difference to the provider. She is then more apt to perform with the knowledge that good service might result in more money and less service might present her with a problem. And as well it should be.

What's the point? I am sure you are not the only one who received poor service from her. If guys tell the mamasan and ask for money back and this gal has it happen several times the mamasan will do something about it. An excuse from the gal may work once, but if she continues to do that she will be "found out. " Don't complain and she will continue to get away with poor service.Agree. Also, a customer who shrugs off being scammed by a P4 P provider when the situation clearly calls for a complaint or at least the request for a refund is essentially a passive contributor to the economic hardship of the "honest" and conscientious providers in that venue. We are the only quality control agents in the system. Low demand customers armed with one excuse after another for it is the bane of any P4 P destination. Far more damaging to it than overpaying, IMO.

[KenDavis03]

Day time freelancers at Gulivers? The place on Soi 5? Good to know.Back in the US now after a nice trip to BKK. I can confirm that day time freelancers are happening at Gullivers. I haven't been there in years, and it was pretty quiet when I went in at around 4. But, there were a handful of girls hanging around and at least 2 or 3 of them were obviously pros. One was extremely nice looking!

[Goatscrot]

Agree. Also, a customer who shrugs off being scammed by a P4 P provider when the situation clearly calls for a complaint or at least the request for a refund is essentially a passive contributor to the economic hardship of the "honest" and conscientious providers in that venue. We are the only quality control agents in the system. Low demand customers armed with one excuse after another for it is the bane of any P4 P destination. Far more damaging to it than overpaying, IMO.Very well stated. Same goes for any service or product one purchases. When I have a bad meal in a restaurant, I tell them. And hey, it's not just for my satisfaction but it is doing them a favor as well. If they want to be successful they need to improve. If they don't they might be out of business. Business owners want to make money and want to know. I have found that the owners at most PSE places are quite interested in ensuring that the customer is happy and will be back. If a gal needs a bit more training or has some holes in her skill set I will tell the mamasan nicely. The only time I "complain" is if there is no effort on the part of the gal and / or if she does not deliver what was agreed upon.

The amount of money a P4 P gal can earn almost anywhere in the world is astronomical compared to average wages. For the punter to "feel sorry" for or as the Thais say "song san" the worker is really ludicrous. The top two earners at Baccarat are pulling in about 300 K Baht per month. And folks that is a lot of money; that puts them way into the top 1% in Thailand. And I'll just bet that's a lot of money in your home nation as well. A mediocre looking gal who provides great service can bank as well. I know quite a few oily gals who are just a 6 or so on the looks scale and average about 4 to 5 bookings a day. And that's over 150 K per month. So feel sorry for them and cut them slack when they don't perform? A thousand times no. I am spending my hard earned and saved money. If I don't get value I will let them know.

[Golfinho]

The amount of money a P4 P gal can earn almost anywhere in the world is astronomical compared to average wages. The top two earners at Baccarat are pulling in about 300 K Baht per month. And folks that is a lot of money; that puts them way into the top 1% in Thailand. And I'll just bet that's a lot of money in your home nation as well. I am spending my hard earned and saved money. Why does this topic keep coming up? And from this guy who says he lives here and keeps posting over and over about more or less the same things?

For what these girls have to do for their money, there is no comparison to 'average wage. ' No comparison. The only comparison would be to Mister Scrot who talks about his 'hard earned' cash and for whom $7000 usd (equivalent) a month in his home nation is 'a lot'.

[Breadman]

Buddy and I were walking along Sukhumvit and this short middle eastern guy came down some stairs and bumped into me. Luckily all my stuff was in the other pockets and I always wear shorts with velcro closers. Anyway, he starts to follow behind us so I tell my buddy to wait a minute and we walk into a hotel drive. The guy was coming up fast behind us and since I didn't look back before deciding to change our direction he went right past us. We then continued on and the guy tried again to get behind us. After several glances back he went the other way. We then turn a corner and see another middle eastern guy on some steps scoping out our pockets as we passed.

[LA Guy 5]

It's very relevant. P4 P is purchasing a service, same as any other service. Why do we need to pay after? Because if the money has changed hands before the service is rendered there is no need to provide good service. The incentive is gone. This is especially true in Thailand where almost no one is concerned with tomorrow or repeat business. And you yourself say the mamasans don't care and they don't. The power that we have is our wallets. So if the service is not what has been agreed upon then less money is paid, which is only fair.


Was at Annie's once and the gal was a complete dud. I was only in the room for about 15 min and went out and asked for my money back. Mamasan asked if I had "finished" and the answer was no. She gave me a complete refund. I always have stones to ask for money back if services promised are not delivered. And yes, we have every right to do that. Yes, paying after makes a psychological difference to the provider. She is then more apt to perform with the knowledge that good service might result in more money and less service might present her with a problem. And as well it should be.

What's the point? I am sure you are not the only one who received poor service from her. If guys tell the mamasan and ask for money back and this gal has it happen several times the mamasan will do something about it. An excuse from the gal may work once, but if she continues to do that she will be "found out. " Don't complain and she will continue to get away with poor service.There is a bit of tension between your two posts Goatscrot. On the one hand you relate an experience where 15 minutes into the session you knew it was a dud and the mamasan then gave you your money back (and I'm sure this did not redound well to the girl's standing with her employer), but in the other post you state that if we pay before a session the girl will have no incentive to give good service. The fact is if a girl knows she will for bad service receive complaints, or bad internet reviews, or what have you, there still maybe an incentive to perform well (although perhaps it doesn't register with some girls).

I earlier suggested the danger of paying in advance correlates with the type of establishment you are dealing with. For example, I don't think there is a big risk paying in advance at a PSE Oily, particularly if well-managed, but there would be a big risk paying in advance at a go-go that has mama-sans who don't give a s**t so long as they get their barfines that day. And there are, of course, situations between these two extremes.

So, I'm not sure there are strict rules to follow; rather one should assess the particular situation and let that guide what you are willing to do. And although if one is particularly low-risk insisting on never paying in advance in every situation might work, it also will mean missing some good opportunities, at least that would have been the case in my experience where I have had a few fantastic sessions where I paid in advance.

[Goatscrot]

There is a bit of tension between your two posts Goatscrot. On the one hand you relate an experience where 15 minutes into the session you knew it was a dud and the mamasan then gave you your money back (and I'm sure this did not redound well to the girl's standing with her employer), but in the other post you state that if we pay before a session the girl will have no incentive to give good service.

I earlier suggested the danger of paying in advance correlates with the type of establishment you are dealing with. For example, I don't think there is a big risk paying in advance at a PSE Oily, particularly if well-managed, but there would be a big risk paying in advance at a go-go that has mama-sans who don't give a s**t so long as they get their barfines that day. And there are, of course, situations between these two extremes.

So, I'm not sure there are strict rules to follow; rather one should access the particular situation and let that guide what you are willing to do. And although if one is particularly low-risk insisting on never paying in advance in every situation might work, it also will mean missing some good opportunities, at least that would have been the case in my experience where I have had a few fantastic sessions where I paid in advance.LA Guy, point taken, although I really don't see tension in the posts. And yes, the mamasan at Annie's actually cares about repeat business. Many, dare I say most, do not, and that is why I made the point that I did.

Perhaps my worst experience was at Nancy about 6 or 7 years ago. Took a gal, paid, and went to the room. No kissing, no fingering, no BBBJ. Got dressed, went out, spoke to the papasan, and got no satisfaction. Dude just shrugged his shoulders. Never went back. In hindsight I should have never gotten dressed, rather called the papasan to the room. Think at that point I would have at least gotten a change of gals.

[EihTooms]

I earlier suggested the danger of paying in advance correlates with the type of establishment you are dealing with. For example, I don't think there is a big risk paying in advance at a PSE Oily, particularly if well-managed, but there would be a big risk paying in advance at a go-go that has mama-sans who don't give a s**t so long as they get their barfines that day. And there are, of course, situations between these two extremes.One the risks of paying upfront in almost any venue, including some so-called PSE oilies, but particularly with go-go girls, beer bar girls and so on is something I don't think I have seen anyone mention here during this particular discussion. And this is one case where I am 100% certain no P4 P girls encouraged to supply tales of woe about their customers' bad behavior would ever voluntarily admit they have ever done when it stands to reason they have done it in at least some cases.

But there are many times when these girls deserve to be shorted on their pay by a large percentage if not reduced right down to nothing but taxi fare EVEN THOUGH Full Service with you was very much on offer in the room and arguably even if she has performed a BBBJ for you.

That would be when a private discussion between the two of you in the bar established that she would be fine with BBFS or BBBJ CIM with you but that isn't the way it turned out in the room at all after she pulls one of those infamous Jekyll & Hyde transformations or threw the "Yes in the bar-No in the room" bit at you. Sure, she can change her mind right up to the moment of truth. No problem. We're not talking about forcing her to do anything. But that means you can also change your mind about how much you will pay her as well. If you have paid some mamasan all of it upfront, you've got nothing but thin air on your side when it comes to getting some or all of that money back and discouraging the lies.

Of course, the only part of it the girls are likely to fill a sympathetic ear to those tales of woe with is the part where "He wanted me to boom boom without condom!" or "He wanted to cum in my mouth! I cannot do!!", followed by, "Then he refused to pay me anything!!!"

But my guess is none of them will ever admit that one or both of those activities was precisely what she agreed to in the bar in order to convince him to pay her barfine in the first place and maybe buy her a couple of extra Lady Drinks while we're at it.

[LA Guy 5]

One the risks of paying upfront in almost any venue, including some so-called PSE oilies, but particularly with go-go girls, beer bar girls and so on is something I don't think I have seen anyone mention here during this particular discussion. And this is one case where I am 100% certain no P4 P girls encouraged to supply tales of woe about their customers' bad behavior would ever admit they have ever done when it stands to reason they have done it in at least some cases.

But there are many times when these girls deserve to be shorted on their pay by a large percentage if not reduced right down to nothing but taxi fare EVEN THOUGH Full Service with you was very much on offer in the room and arguably even if she has performed a BBBJ for you.

That would be when a private discussion between the two of you in the bar established that she would be fine with BBFS or BBBJ CIM with you but that isn't the way it turned out in the room at all after she pulls one of those infamous Jekyll & Hyde transformations or threw the "Yes in the bar-No in the room" bit at you. Sure, she can change her mind right up to the moment of truth. No problem. We're not talking about forcing her to do anything. But that means you can also change your mind about how much you will pay her as well. If you have paid some mamasan all of it upfront, you've got nothing but thin air on your side when it comes to getting some or all of that money back and discouraging the lies.

The only part of it the girls are likely to fill a sympathetic ear to those tales of woe is the part where "He wanted me to boom boom without condom!" or "He wanted to cum in my mouth! I cannot do!!", followed by, "Then he refused to pay me anything!!!"

But my guess is none of them will ever admit that one or both of those activities was precisely what she agreed to in the bar in order to convince him to pay her barfine in the first place and maybe an extra Lady Drink or two while we're at it.Well out of curiosity, and since you mentioned this example among others in your post, have you actually negotiated BBFS at any PSE oily in advance of the session? My question is not to be confused with whether you have gotten BBFS at a PSE oily, rather whether you actually raised this before taking the girl upstairs. It seems to me that probably wouldn't work out too well, but maybe I'm wrong.

[EihTooms]

Well out of curiosity, and since you mentioned this example among others in your post, have you actually negotiated BBFS at any PSE oily in advance of the session? My question is not to be confused with whether you have gotten BBFS at a PSE oily, rather whether you actually raised this before taking the girl upstairs. It seems to me that probably wouldn't work out too well, but maybe I'm wrong.I have gotten agreements for BBFS and BBBJ CIM with girls sitting outside MPs / PSE oilies and not even gone into the shop, just paid their barfine and taken them back to my apartment. Have to say, those have been the only note-worthy times I have ever spent with MP girls. I have never had an experience worth repeating inside their shops and most have been downright horrible. I have gone to PSE oilies and been assured by the mamasan that BBBJ CIM is "standard, all the girls do that" when in one case the girl said within 2 minutes of walking into the VIP room that, BTW, CIM is NOT something she ever does and won't be doing this time either. lol

[Syzygies]

The amount of money a P4 P gal can earn almost anywhere in the world is astronomical compared to average wages. For the punter to "feel sorry" for or as the Thais say "song san" the worker is really ludicrous. The top two earners at Baccarat are pulling in about 300 K Baht per month. And folks that is a lot of money; that puts them way into the top 1% in Thailand. And I'll just bet that's a lot of money in your home nation as well. A mediocre looking gal who provides great service can bank as well. I know quite a few oily gals who are just a 6 or so on the looks scale and average about 4 to 5 bookings a day. And that's over 150 K per month. So feel sorry for them and cut them slack when they don't perform? A thousand times no. I am spending my hard earned and saved money. If I don't get value I will let them know.Can earn and does earn are not exactly the same. I believe a very low percentage of Bangkok working girls are getting over 150 K per month consistently. I don't see many girls getting multiple Barfines per night. I don't see so many girls are getting lots of bookings per day in Oilies. Most Oilies seem to be very quiet. Even a busy shop like addict has a large number of girls to share the customers.

What about girls doing LT? They would need to make 5 K, 30 days per month to get to 150 K. Ha ha. No that is unreasonable. They just don't make it to that amount. They need time off. Okay I neglected her monthly salary which could be 14 K if she was reliable and did not get docked earnings at all. Many girls lose large parts of monthly salary and often get no salary at all. A few diligent ones retain most of the salary. I also neglected her drink commissions. If she sold 100 drinks at 60 baht each, that is another 6 K (not huge) and difficult to achieve for girls doing a lot of LT bookings. They often arrive at bar with the customer in tow, or already waiting, and get barfined almost immediately and soon head off.

Plenty of girls got no fuck for their day's work. Lucky if they managed more than money for taxi home on some days. In one portable bar on the street I saw that one girl was getting barfined consistently each night and one ladyboy the same, and the others struggled somewhat. One or two don't go with customers at all, just trying to sell drinks.

Sure there are the big earners. But what percentage of girls are in that category? 5% or less? Well done to those who make big money despite some what average looks. That is not easy.

I believe only the "Super Stars" are making 150 K per month, and I haven't found so many of them.

I do see the motivation to get business get a bit more desperate in bars when coming time to pay the rent. LOL

[Goatscrot]

Can earn and does earn are not exactly the same. I believe a very low percentage of Bangkok working girls are getting over 150 K per month consistently. I don't see many girls getting multiple Barfines per night. I don't see so many girls are getting lots of bookings per day in Oilies. Most Oilies seem to be very quiet. Even a busy shop like addict has a large number of girls to share the customers.

What about girls doing LT? They would need to make 5 K, 30 days per month to get to 150 K. Ha ha. No that is unreasonable. They just don't make it to that amount. They need time off. Okay I neglected her monthly salary which could be 14 K if she was reliable and did not get docked earnings at all. Many girls lose large parts of monthly salary and often get no salary at all. A few diligent ones retain most of the salary. I also neglected her drink commissions. If she sold 100 drinks at 60 baht each, that is another 6 K (not huge) and difficult to achieve for girls doing a lot of LT bookings. They often arrive at bar with the customer in tow, or already waiting, and get barfined almost immediately and soon head off.

Plenty of girls got no fuck for their day's work. Lucky if they managed more than money for taxi home on some days. In one portable bar on the street I saw that one girl was getting barfined consistently each night and one ladyboy the same, and the others struggled somewhat. One or two don't go with customers at all, just trying to sell drinks.

Sure there are the big earners. But what percentage of girls are in that category? 5% or less? Well done to those who make big money despite some what average looks. That is not easy.

I believe only the "Super Stars" are making 150 K per month, and I haven't found so many of them.

I do see the motivation to get business get a bit more desperate in bars when coming time to pay the rent. LOLI think there are far more gals earning quite a bit of money than you think Syz. And hey, it is really up to the gal. As I stated if she is mediocre looking but knows how to hustles and gives great service, she will be very busy. I know quite a few oily gals who aren't so pretty, but are booking 4 customers per day. Why? They know how to dish it out and that keeps 'them coming back. GoGo gals have to be a bit better looking. But as I said, the top two earners at Baccara are pulling in close to 300 k per month. I would imagine a decent looking one can easily make 100 k plus if she is dedicated to her job. If not, that is her loss. The customer's money is there for the taking. It is up to her to provide good service with a smile.

[Goatscrot]

One the risks of paying upfront in almost any venue, including some so-called PSE oilies, but particularly with go-go girls, beer bar girls and so on is something I don't think I have seen anyone mention here during this particular discussion. And this is one case where I am 100% certain no P4 P girls encouraged to supply tales of woe about their customers' bad behavior would ever voluntarily admit they have ever done when it stands to reason they have done it in at least some cases.

But there are many times when these girls deserve to be shorted on their pay by a large percentage if not reduced right down to nothing but taxi fare EVEN THOUGH Full Service with you was very much on offer in the room and arguably even if she has performed a BBBJ for you.

That would be when a private discussion between the two of you in the bar established that she would be fine with BBFS or BBBJ CIM with you but that isn't the way it turned out in the room at all after she pulls one of those infamous Jekyll & Hyde transformations or threw the "Yes in the bar-No in the room" bit at you. Sure, she can change her mind right up to the moment of truth. No problem. We're not talking about forcing her to do anything. But that means you can also change your mind about how much you will pay her as well. If you have paid some mamasan all of it upfront, you've got nothing but thin air on your side when it comes to getting some or all of that money back and discouraging the lies.

Of course, the only part of it the girls are likely to fill a sympathetic ear to those tales of woe with is the part where "He wanted me to boom boom without condom!" or "He wanted to cum in my mouth! I cannot do!!", followed by, "Then he refused to pay me anything!!!"

But my guess is none of them will ever admit that one or both of those activities was precisely what she agreed to in the bar in order to convince him to pay her barfine in the first place and maybe buy her a couple of extra Lady Drinks while we're at it.Although I am not into BBFS, I am with you on your point completely. If she agrees and then reneges, then she deserves less than the amount agreed upon. In order for her to pull this stunt in the first place there must have been plenty of dudes who let her get away with it. Many punters just don't have the stones to express their displeasure to a working girl. I really don't get that. First of all when she agree and then refuses it completely kills the mood. Second of all it is bad business and a rip-off. Sorry, I will not take a mai pen rai attitude towards either. Of course I never show anger when this happens. I just get up, get dressed, and if she asks I tell her why I am calling the session short, and then I leave what I think is fair for services rendered. Most of the time this is met with a look of complete astonishment, again because most dudes accept whatever is given to them. Of course this is also one reason many gals don't like going with locals or guys who have visited many times. The best times are when you meet gals that really like sex. But they not so large in number here. I have a few of those in the oilies. They just love doing the nasty. They are indeed a treasure.

[EihTooms]

Although I am not into BBFS, I am with you on your point completely. If she agrees and then reneges, then she deserves less than the amount agreed upon. In order for her to pull this stunt in the first place there must have been plenty of dudes who let her get away with it. Many punters just don't have the stones to express their displeasure to a working girl. I really don't get that. First of all when she agree and then refuses it completely kills the mood. Second of all it is bad business and a rip-off. Sorry, I will not take a mai pen rai attitude towards either. Of course I never show anger when this happens. I just get up, get dressed, and if she asks I tell her why I am calling the session short, and then I leave what I think is fair for services rendered. Most of the time this is met with a look of complete astonishment, again because most dudes accept whatever is given to them. Of course this is also one reason many gals don't like going with locals or guys who have visited many times. The best times are when you meet gals that really like sex. But they not so large in number here. I have a few of those in the oilies. They just love doing the nasty. They are indeed a treasure.So true on all counts. Pay upfront would put the "Yes in the bar-No in the Room" con / scam on steroids. Why not say anything in the bar to get the customer to pony up the full amount and hand it to a third party (who was not part of the verbal agreement) when you know from experience it would take the extremely rare customer with stones as big as the Rockies to return to that bar and ask for some or all of the "money back"? That is assuming he even knows he has just been conned / scammed.

And when he is going overboard trying to show what a a "good heart" he has in this regard she knows damn well most guys would rather walk away telling themselves and anyone else who will listen that, for example, he just got a fine BJ from this hot go-go girl when the reality is he just got a lame handjob with a bit of oral foreplay thrown in for 2,500 baht++ or whatever. Or, for another example, that he just had the most memorable GFE with that top looker at such-and-such Massage Shop even though she refused to engage in DFK or uncovered oral foreplay. For a customer like that to even make a ripple of displeasure or confront a classic cum-dodger would be admitting something out loud that he would rather not admit out loud, even to himself.

Bear in mind that the slickest cons never leave their marks thinking they have just been conned. Only the clumsy ones do. The slickest cons leave the mark feeling like he just saved a damsel in distress, helped feed a child or heal a sick mother, gave a girl (or guy) down on their luck a boost up, has added another notch to his achievements in understanding the exotic culture better than the rest of us and so on. The goal is to make sure the mark walks away feeling good about just having been conned. But mostly that damsel in distress stuff is so much hogwash. What actually happened was that customer just got beautifully conned by an expert in the field of man / woman dynamics regarding sex and money.

[Goatscrot]

So true on all counts. Pay upfront would put the "Yes in the bar-No in the Room" con / scam on steroids. Why not say anything in the bar to get the customer to pony up the full amount and hand it to a third party (who was not part of the verbal agreement) when you know from experience it would take the extremely rare customer with stones as big as the Rockies to return to that bar and ask for some or all of the "money back"? That is assuming he even knows he has just been conned / scammed.

And when he is going overboard trying to show what a a "good heart" he has in this regard she knows damn well most guys would rather walk away telling themselves and anyone else who will listen that, for example, he just got a fine BJ from this hot go-go girl when the reality is he just got a lame handjob with a bit of oral foreplay thrown in for 2,500 baht++ or whatever. Or, for another example, that he just had the most memorable GFE with that top looker at such-and-such Massage Shop even though she refused to engage in DFK or uncovered oral foreplay. For a customer like that to even make a ripple of displeasure or confront a classic cum-dodger would be admitting something out loud that he would rather not admit out loud, even to himself.

Bear in mind that the slickest cons never leave their marks thinking they have just been conned. Only the clumsy ones do. The slickest cons leave the mark feeling like he just saved a damsel in distress, helped feed a child or heal a sick mother, gave a girl (or guy) down on their luck a boost up, has added another notch to his achievements in understanding the exotic culture better than the rest of us and so on. The goal is to make sure the mark walks away feeling good about just having been conned. But mostly that damsel in distress stuff is so much hogwash. What actually happened was that customer just got beautifully conned by an expert in the field of man / woman dynamics regarding sex and money.Don't you know it. And these gals know it to. It is their job. They are very convincing, but it is an act. Merely an act. They know what to say to make punters feel for them on many different levels. That is why so many avoid long timers like the plague. One thing that I always liked to do was tell GoGo gals and FLs that I lived in On Nut when they would inevitably ask. That would help to weed out the chaff. Now of course I lived in Asoke and had no intention of taking them anywhere but to a ST Hotel close by, but if the gal was willing to go to On Nut, then chances are she was not going to be in a hurry. If she blew me off then; well I knew her game.

Syz often mentions how much a gal can make in one night rattling off multiple short times. Good for her, but personally I am not at all interested in gals with that business plan, no matter how good looking they are.

[FallenMamber]

I am planning a trip to BKK in may or June. In preparation I have been chatting up a number of ladies on Thai friendly. I will only be in town a couple weeks. What are my chances with these ladies? Am I wasting my time? Or do most Thai women like to bang on a first date?

[Wolvenvacht]

I am planning a trip to BKK in may or June. In preparation I have been chatting up a number of ladies on Thai friendly. I will only be in town a couple weeks. What are my chances with these ladies?That depends on your definition of "my chances" and your and her profile. Many girls on ThaiFriendly are genuinely looking for a friend, a lover or perhaps even a husband.

If your and her actual profiles and intentions match, then it is very likely you will get what you expected. On the other hand if she expects future marriage material and you are only looking for a free one night stand then things may go awry soon. I had good success on ThaiFriendly and Date-In-Asia, but I always made my intentions very clear so there was no misunderstanding when we met.


Am I wasting my time? Or do most Thai women like to bang on a first date?I can only offer personal anecdotal evidence, but I had sex on the first night with every girl I met through these dating sites and it was their initiative to engage in making love.

[Tomasb]

I was walking around Asoke near Soi Cowboy late last night and early morning. In the past, I just rushed past on my way to
Soi Cowboy but a cute non pro looking girl caught my eye at one of the carts. So for the first time, I stopped and ordered a drink. The girl sat down with me at a nearby table and figuring that a waitress would ask if I wanted to buy her a drink, I immediately asked her if she leaves with guys. This was because several weeks ago I sat down with a cute university aged girl around a Soi 19 Alcocart and bought her a drink only to find she does not go out.

This SYT said she did go out and provided a brief bio. Lives in Bang Na area and a taxi from there to Asok cost 150 bt, attends a university studying hotel management, borderline English, and finally available for short or long term. Also, dressed modestly in a sort of Girl Scout looking blouse and shorts. Also, pretty, no babies with this one and a nice spinner body. How much? I asked. She hesitated briefly and then said 3000 bt, not specifying the duration, whereupon I asked if that was long term. No, she said it was 4000 baht for long term.

Then she asked how much I could pay and stated my usual limit for short term is 2000. I also noted long term depends on how well short term would go. She kind of chuckled, not budging on her price, and I found myself in a stalemate as I finished my drink. No attempt on her part at negotiation. She was definitely a hottie but would it not cost around 3000 bt for a girl at one of the go-go's? I never BF but I think this forum is replete with stories of 2000 bt for short term and 700 for the BF in go go's. Throw in a few drinks and you are paying a minimum of 3000. However, I wonder if 3000 bt is a common rate at the alcocarts or was this girl attempting to get a premium based on her looks? I suspected that other girls don't ask nearly that much but wondering if anyone has any comments about rates at the alcocarts? The other factor for me in not pursuing this girl was her overall demeanor suggested starfish in the room.

Basically, she just sat there and did not take the initiative in any way. Also, before I get flamed, yes, it could just be she was not interested in me. I found most of the girls at the alcocarts below average in looks and in a few isolated cases LB's so did not pursue it further. If I am going to pay 3000 bt, then, I might as well go the clubs.

[EihTooms]

I can only offer personal anecdotal evidence, but I had sex on the first night with every girl I met through these dating sites and it was their initiative to engage in making love.I concur. Although I think there might have been one or two out of a couple of dozen who couldn't immediately go to my apartment after the first afternoon coffee meeting due to prior commitments, a second meeting most certainly ended there. In my case, I had better results with ThaiCupid than ThaiFriendly. Making my intentions clear, as you did, and those intentions being to pretty much wind up naked and enjoying each other's minds, bodies and souls ASAP doesn't seem to deter most of the women on those sites that clicked "Interest" in me first even if their profiles say they are looking for "Serious Relationship, Marriage" while mine only says I am interested in, "Romance, Dating".

I read worries all over the 'net about the decline of the usual venues like go-go bars, beer bars, street walking freelancers and the like because of the increase in smartphone use, among other reasons. But I have to say that between the dating sites, just meeting girls at the mall or on the bts / mrt, in restaurants and so on with smartphone at the ready, I'm not sure my already full schedule of bedding down sweet, healthy, young, lovely Thai girls would be altered much if all the go-go bars, beer bars, blowjob bars and MPs in the city were shut down tomorrow. It wouldn't be as much fun because I do like the go-go bar scene for the most part. But it would be cheaper and the fresh 20-something pussy would still be on parade and easily available. The emotional maneuvering downsides to dating "amateur" girls vs the emotional ease of dealing with "pros" certainly exist, of course. But they can be dealt with and the "amateurs" will still love you despite knowing you're a confirmed hound dog. Or maybe because of it. LOL.

[EihTooms]

I was walking around Asoke near Soi Cowboy late last night and early morning. In the past, I just rushed past on my way to
Soi Cowboy but a cute non pro looking girl caught my eye at one of the carts. So for the first time, I stopped and ordered a drink. The girl sat down with me at a nearby table and figuring that a waitress would ask if I wanted to buy her a drink, I immediately asked her if she leaves with guys. This was because several weeks ago I sat down with a cute university aged girl around a Soi 19 Alcocart and bought her a drink only to find she does not go out.

This SYT said she did go out and provided a brief bio. Lives in Bang Na area and a taxi from there to Asok cost 150 bt, attends a university studying hotel management, borderline English, and finally available for short or long term. Also, dressed modestly in a sort of Girl Scout looking blouse and shorts. Also, pretty, no babies with this one and a nice spinner body. How much? I asked. She hesitated briefly and then said 3000 bt, not specifying the duration, whereupon I asked if that was long term. No, she said it was 4000 baht for long term.

Then she asked how much I could pay and stated my usual limit for short term is 2000. I also noted long term depends on how well short term would go. She kind of chuckled, not budging on her price, and I found myself in a stalemate as I finished my drink. No attempt on her part at negotiation. She was definitely a hottie but would it not cost around 3000 bt for a girl at one of the go-go's? I never BF but I think this forum is replete with stories of 2000 bt for short term and 700 for the BF in go go's. Throw in a few drinks and you are paying a minimum of 3000. However, I wonder if 3000 bt is a common rate at the alcocarts or was this girl attempting to get a premium based on her looks? I suspected that other girls don't ask nearly that much but wondering if anyone has any comments about rates at the alcocarts? The other factor for me in not pursuing this girl was her overall demeanor suggested starfish in the room.

Basically, she just sat there and did not take the initiative in any way. Also, before I get flamed, yes, it could just be she was not interested in me. I found most of the girls at the alcocarts below average in looks and in a few isolated cases LB's so did not pursue it further. If I am going to pay 3000 bt, then, I might as well go the clubs.I would say 3,000 baht for ST with one of those portable bar bargirls is a bit high unless she is a special case and the performance level is high and, as much as possible, certain. Sounds to me like you found her to be special, at least in looks. But your numbers vs the go-go girls are about right. You could get a ST with a cute or better go-go girl, whose body you see more of beforehand, for around 3,000 total or maybe a couple of hundred baht more depending on the drink costs. BTW, if she was not just standing around but working at the portable bar, which it sounds like she was, there would be a barfine to pay them as well. Maybe 500 baht. It isn't like the 3,000 baht she cited would include the barfine and the drink costs, right? So she was essentially asking a top end ST rate, even for a go-go dancer. Barfine, drinks and her 3,000 baht asking price was already tickling around the 4,000 baht range. For Short Time.

But that doesn't mean she wouldn't be worth it any more than it would mean a certain go-go dancer isn't worth it. My style would have been not to balk or negotiate on price at all. Not directly, that is. First I wouldn't have asked her "how much?", I would have left that for her to mention first, if at all. But once the 3,000 number was out there, I would have told her what I would expect of her if I paid her 3,000 baht. And I wouldn't have held back on any dream sexual activities and finishes in my head (including turning the ST into a LT for that 3,000). If she hadn't flinched about making good on my expectations, I might very well have been fine with paying her the amount she expected. But if she balked at fulfilling all my ST dream desires, then that is when I would start chipping away at that 3,000 baht price. But, you see, then there is a REASON for chipping away at it beyond my simply either not having the money, maintaining some weird across the board rule or immediately suggesting she doesn't deserve 3,000 baht for the use of her time and body no matter what she did for me.

[Member #4591]

Simply put, Saphan Kwai means Buffalo Bridge. Experts can correct me if I am wrong.

Google "Saphan Kwai" and you will come across plenty of information. I am not sure the forum has a lot on SK gogo bars. Take the Green line towards Mo Chit, get off at Saphan Kwai and take a short walk. You will get to the stretch of 150 m to 200 m that has around 10 to 12 bars. Small establishments mostly. Take a chance. Not many Farangs there. But all are welcome. One word of advice, travel extremely light and do not get into any sort of argument. It is simply not like Nana or Cowboy or Patpong.Why does he need to travel extremely light? Your advice regarding arguments would also be relevant to Nana, Soi Cowboy, or any other bar in the world. You are implying that these bars are not safe, but actually I feel 1000% safer at a Sephan Kwai bar than in a farang oriented Go Go like Nana, Patpong, or Soi Cowboy. Why do you ask? It's simple. No toots trying to rip you off, no padded bar bills, no drunk farangs falling all over the place, no pushy bouncers refusing entry or demanding entry fees, no Lady drink scams, no coyote dancers with 2000 Baht bar fines, no taxis refusing you or refusing to use the metre, and 99% percent of the time when other customers hear me speaking some Thai, they come over to cheers a few drinks. Thais in these places keep to themselves if they see a farang who can't speak Thai, they will not even give you a second look or be a danger to your money, so no need to travel heavier or lighter than what you would normally do.

[ParkVille]

Why does he need to travel extremely light? Your advice regarding arguments would also be relevant to Nana, Soi Cowboy, or any other bar in the world. You are implying that these bars are not safe, but actually I feel 1000% safer at a Sephan Kwai bar than in a farang oriented Go Go like Nana, Patpong, or Soi Cowboy. Why do you ask? It's simple. No toots trying to rip you off, no padded bar bills, no drunk farangs falling all over the place, no pushy bouncers refusing entry or demanding entry fees, no Lady drink scams, no coyote dancers with 2000 Baht bar fines, no taxis refusing you or refusing to use the metre, and 99% percent of the time when other customers hear me speaking some Thai, they come over to cheers a few drinks. Thais in these places keep to themselves if they see a farang who can't speak Thai, they will not even give you a second look or be a danger to your money, so no need to travel heavier or lighter than what you would normally do.Never been to saphan Kwai, but I can certainly chime in and say Soi Cowboy isn't safe. There are various news reports of falangs getting mugged there. I once saw an asian man (not sure origin nation) just beating the crap out of some white guy who clearly had no intentions of fighting at all, not even defensively. This was at Afterskool, on the outdoor patio area. He was bleeding from his eyes after getting hit so hard. There didn't seem to be anything he could do (he was alone), and the guy who beat the shit out of him was never arrested or asked to leave. He just stayed there, bragging to the girls.

[Tomasb]

Actually, it never occurred to me that the alcocarts had barfines but I guess they do. When she caught my eye walking by, she was sitting at a stool at the bar. As soon as I asked for a drink, she came over and sat down. Thought she may have been an FL just hanging at the bar except the waitress came over immediately to see if I wanted to buy her a drink. Upon reflection, this prob means she is employed as bait at bar but a BF was not mentioned.

Your right, if I wanted to pursue it, I could have asked all the standard questions but don't like to do it as I always forget something (DATY, DFK? Etc.). I think my intuition told me I would be disappointed so let it go. If her personality was a bit saucier I may have been more inclined but as she sat there like a bump on a log, I quickly lost interest But, yeah, with a BF, that's a tad high for a street girl. I.

[ShinShin]

Why does he need to travel extremely light? Your advice regarding arguments would also be relevant to Nana, Soi Cowboy, or any other bar in the world. You are implying that these bars are not safe, but actually I feel 1000% safer at a Sephan Kwai bar than in a farang oriented Go Go like Nana, Patpong, or Soi Cowboy. Why do you ask? It's simple. No toots trying to rip you off, no padded bar bills, no drunk farangs falling all over the place, no pushy bouncers refusing entry or demanding entry fees, no Lady drink scamsOne thing different about Saphan Kawai gogo is that they will bring whole bunch of things even you don't order or even you say no, they will bring them anyways. Things like peanuts, fruit plates, wet towels, ice buckets, ect, all these are almost automatic, these things add up. My experiences there was if you go alone, expect to pay around minimum 300-400 for one entry without lady sitting. So to me it is sort of padded bill. Girls usually drink from your drink, or they may ask you for lady drink, but you don't have to buy, there you pay them a sitting fee only, this is one of the good things of these SK bars as compared to SC.

About the farang customers, recently, there seem to be more and more farang and east Asian customers coming to these places. But you need some extend of Thai language to have fun, because all these girls are basically speak no words in English. I think these areas are still safe for foreigners as long as they do not make any issues with the shops even they are scammed on the bill, they write all the items on bill all in Thais so there is no way to check them correctly also there is not enough light to see the bill, when I get a bill which I think they added a hundred or two, I just pay and leave, I would never take a risk argue in these Thai dominated areas, in past 15 years of occasionally coming here, have seen Thai fights two times. Both times group against group. I would be very careful in both SK and SC.

[CaptCabins]

Guys,

This coming March I would be heading to bkk. I booked a hotel at tulip in. I think it would be around 5 minutes from nana and maybe 15 minutes from sow cowboi. In this case if I were to take a girl for short time from nana or cowboi will I need to take a taxi or would the lady walk with me to the hotel. I honestly don't want to waste money on cabs.

My second question was tht I read thr now the ongoing rate for mediocre to good looking gurls are 3000 bht for 1 hour short time. Is negotiating a norm especially for a farang? Or is it in general girls would only accept 3000 baht for short time. By the way is time taken walking / going to your hotel is considered as part of your short time? By the way are CIM and anal considered as extra and if yes what are the rates? Where can I find good looking girls in eithet nana or cowboi that does anal and CIM.

[KenDavis03]

Guys,

This coming March I would be heading to bkk. I booked a hotel at tulip in. I think it would be around 5 minutes from nana and maybe 15 minutes from sow cowboi. In this case if I were to take a girl for short time from nana or cowboi will I need to take a taxi or would the lady walk with me to the hotel. I honestly don't want to waste money on cabs.

My second question was tht I read thr now the ongoing rate for mediocre to good looking gurls are 3000 bht for 1 hour short time. Is negotiating a norm especially for a farang? Or is it in general girls would only accept 3000 baht for short time. By the way is time taken walking / going to your hotel is considered as part of your short time? By the way are CIM and anal considered as extra and if yes what are the rates? Where can I find good looking girls in either Nana or Cowboi that does anal and CIM.Rates seem to be all over the place as more Russians, Chinese, and yet more Japanese invade BKK over the recent years. One thing for sure is that learning basic Thai numbers and discussing price in Thai (even if you only know the numbers!) somehow makes a difference in pricing. It also seems to distinguish you as 'at least not a totally newbie farang' which helps the service!

[Syzygies]

I was walking around Asoke near Soi Cowboy late last night and early morning. In the past, I just rushed past on my way to
Soi Cowboy but a cute non pro looking girl caught my eye at one of the carts. So for the first time, I stopped and ordered a drink. The girl sat down with me at a nearby table and figuring that a waitress would ask if I wanted to buy her a drink, I immediately asked her if she leaves with guys. This was because several weeks ago I sat down with a cute university aged girl around a Soi 19 Alcocart and bought her a drink only to find she does not go out.

This SYT said she did go out and provided a brief bio. Lives in Bang Na area and a taxi from there to Asok cost 150 bt, attends a university studying hotel management, borderline English, and finally available for short or long term. Also, dressed modestly in a sort of Girl Scout looking blouse and shorts. Also, pretty, no babies with this one and a nice spinner body. How much? I asked. She hesitated briefly and then said 3000 bt, not specifying the duration, whereupon I asked if that was long term. No, she said it was 4000 baht for long term.

Then she asked how much I could pay and stated my usual limit for short term is 2000. I also noted long term depends on how well short term would go. She kind of chuckled, not budging on her price, and I found myself in a stalemate as I finished my drink. No attempt on her part at negotiation. She was definitely a hottie but would it not cost around 3000 bt for a girl at one of the go-go's? I never BF but I think this forum is replete with stories of 2000 bt for short term and 700 for the BF in go go's. Throw in a few drinks and you are paying a minimum of 3000. However, I wonder if 3000 bt is a common rate at the alcocarts or was this girl attempting to get a premium based on her looks? I suspected that other girls don't ask nearly that much but wondering if anyone has any comments about rates at the alcocarts? The other factor for me in not pursuing this girl was her overall demeanor suggested starfish in the room.

Basically, she just sat there and did not take the initiative in any way. Also, before I get flamed, yes, it could just be she was not interested in me. I found most of the girls at the alcocarts below average in looks and in a few isolated cases LB's so did not pursue it further. If I am going to pay 3000 bt, then, I might as well go the clubs.I believe that most of these portable cart girls will go ST for 2 K baht, and some won't even negotiate a price. Some guys are trying to get much less than 2 K and I don't know if they manage it.

I am surprised by the girl wanting 3 K. I went with one of these girls similar to how you describe. I did not enjoy it at all. She had 3 babies, very saggy tits and no-feel pussy, and very little sex and kissing ability at all despite her sex experience with Thai men. I paid her 2 K but was a complete waste of money in this particular case. She acted very nice and very honest and was very cute (with clothes on). All those things were not enough to make it work for me at all. I would rather have paid more for one of my favorite hot hot gogo girls. YMMV.

[Syzygies]

Syz often mentions how much a gal can make in one night rattling off multiple short times. Good for her, but personally I am not at all interested in gals with that business plan, no matter how good looking they are.That was only 1 particularly diligent girl that I knew (she is retired now) that hooked customers very easily. I don't see many girls getting multiple STs per night even though I know it exists at Bacarra and Rainbow type bars.

Don't know why such a girl puts you off so badly. It purely depends how well she treats the customers, just like top girls in Oilies doing 5 to 10 customers per day.

[Syzygies]

I don't quite understand. Why is the difference between ST and LT so low? Is this basically due to girl only having the chance to make one ST per night? Does the girl keep all the 2000 ST or is someone taking a cut out of that? Since you aren't paying that to her directly. Is this a set fee?

Why so much as 500 to the momasan? She must be raking it in?

I have been to T Det. My buddy took a short time but I did not. I found it a bit less easy to get to the most desirable girl than at cowboy. I. e. She was busy or assigned to other tables. I didn't find the next best level good enough to my taste.

Do you often end up getting your first choice girl easily? I guess there is always returning another night, but I couldn't be bothered, as not immediately hooked by the setup.

I suppose I did not know the system on how to get a lap dance from the most desired girl when she was not in the vicinity. Most of the customers sit politely and don't run around chasing a girl like I was tempted to do but resisted.

Its too spread out for me. This limits. the girls that are dancing nearby. If I like a girl, I would like to be near where she is dancing but this is not practical.

I guess this place is designed for guys that are not fussy and should like all the girls equally well. Not how I operate. I like a very small portion of the girls and ignore all the rest. You take a long time to see all the girls there wirh their rotation system and then by the time you have worked out which one you like, she is bound to be busy already with a customer.

Perhaps there are ways for a regular to overcome this?BKKDog,

Any chance to enlighten us on any of these questions? I thought perhaps some questions could be answered easily. Of course I can understand if you don't like the questions for one reason or another. Just that my one visit there did not give me enough knowledge to understand the workings that well myself?

Syzy.

[ShinShin]

A few more things I want to mention about Saphan Kawai gogos, after all these years going there occasionally, I still do not get much fun from there. One really annoying thing is that the concierge will try to push you with all these most least attractive ones constantly, one that tip concierge to find customers for them. They will simply sit the girl down next to you and coerce you to take her. You really have to be brave to turn them away one by one, until the concierge get pissed. This happen to me constantly there in Dted as well. Maybe I can kind of answer some of the questions by other poster. You would be very lucky to get the cuter girl as a newbie customer, these cuter ones are all taken or reserved by their Thai regular VIPs who tip their regular concierge very well, a few times I asked to bring some cuties over, the concierge always say things like she is with customer, or she is waiting for her customer, in my memory I never got the one I wanted, almost always have to compromise with what's left or accept what concierge force you to take.

Another annoying thing is these waiter and waitress constantly try to persuade you to order food and drinks, I always end up order a very overpriced fried rice or fried chicken to keep them away. At the end, I always end up sitting with someone I don't have much interest, and then be persuaded to get a lap dance, another 100 gone to the drain for 3 min which you don't even get excited to hug and touch with. SK is always a bit frustrated experience for me. Maybe these SK pros may have different experience. A few weeks ago, I was in BKK for a transit and went to Rainbow in SK, I think no relation to Rainbow in Nana, it was another frustrated experience there, saw a few semi cuties, asked 3 different ladies to go ST, but got rejected by all, saying they don't do outing or saying only go dance or drink or eat okay, WTF. These girls in some of the shops like Rainbow really play hard games.

[Syzygies]

A few more things I want to mention about Saphan Kawai gogos, after all these years going there occasionally, I still do not get much fun from there. One really annoying thing is that the concierge will try to push you with all these most least attractive ones constantly, one that tip concierge to find customers for them. They will simply sit the girl down next to you and coerce you to take her. You really have to be brave to turn them away one by one, until the concierge get pissed. This happen to me constantly there in Dted as well. Maybe I can kind of answer some of the questions by other poster. You would be very lucky to get the cuter girl as a newbie customer, these cuter ones are all taken or reserved by their Thai regular VIPs who tip their regular concierge very well, a few times I asked to bring some cuties over, the concierge always say things like she is with customer, or she is waiting for her customer, in my memory I never got the one I wanted, almost always have to compromise with what's left or accept what concierge force you to take.
Saying no to rubbish food is not hard for me, I don't really do "gup gaam" too often, and I believe I also told them don't bother bringing girls to me, as I am far too fussy, and that I would point out any girls of interest. So I would not even be polite enough to allow some random girl to sit with me. I would simply say no thanks. However I take your point about the few hot girls being booked by regular Thais already. The rest were of little interest. It seems very weird to Thais that I don't drink alcohol, like beers or whiskey, and they are quite surprised I speak Thai well.

So I ended up with some medium good girl sitting with me, but not that exciting. Seemed to get charged for somewhat more time than she was actually with me, as she would come and go for various reasons. So a bit of a con job really, and yes probably charged for various silly things that were never ordered. I don't need wet towels, and other blah blah. They probably had no diet drinks other than water or soda. That was my experience from a one off visit. I used my girl mainly to chat and find out how the place worked somewhat. Of course quite a few things forgotten, was too long ago (1 year?).

In a Cowboy bar, I am more aware of how much is spent on a girl. 160 Baht times the number of drinks. If I really like the girl and she is truly my choice, that is not a big deal for me. In Crazy House I can often get to the girls I like by being quite pro active. Like just get my waitress to go tell the girl I would like to buy her a drink, if I haven't managed to catch her eye and signal myself. This is as soon as possible after she starts working. Sometimes fails. Sometimes too slow. LOL. Like Number 4 Jane / Jaeng rarely is available. Usually arrives with her customer already in tow, just to get the BF arrangements done etc. She is not the best looking but not from from it, very cute and very sexy. I can only assume she must be good for her customers, since she is so booked out.

At T Det, we arrived very early, but girls did not parade around past guys as they arrived. Seemed to be much more oriented towards having girls foisted on you, as Sin Shin described. So I would love to know how to get to the good ones. Probably there were no than 3 or girls in 150 that really interested me, given my desires for real Thai looks without surgeries.

The place is pretty huge. I might be better off in a much smaller bar where girls were not far away. Cowboy bars are too cramped. There it was very much the opposite. Too spread out. The whole place is really boring till the dancing got started some time after 11PM, so clearly we had arrived to early, but that did not help to get the good girls. I like when a bar has girls start dancing at 7.30PM or 8PM. What am I going to do waiting around till 11:30 PM, to really get going? If you don't find something, end up getting back to Sukhumvit far too late for my liking.

Perhaps with early closing times, they may start up a bit quicker now?

I speak Thai but clearly do not act like a Thai. I have much preferred a Thai entertainment venue with bands, singers, dancers on a stage such as Tawan Daeng, or Saeng Jun, even though everything is far too loud to have any conversation. I don't like Thai entertainment venues that alternate bands with Coyote Dancers much. Usually the "music" does not suit my generation. At T Det the dancing entertainment was pretty boring to me. I am more used to naked girls or g-strings.

[Kazeu]

Thanks for the response. I'd love to try this area out, as I usually enjoy venturing off the beaten path, but I did some research further back in the thread, and correct me if I'm wrong but it seems like this area is mostly for Thai speaking folk only. I speak very very little Thai.


Simply put, Saphan Kwai means Buffalo Bridge. Experts can correct me if I am wrong.

Google "Saphan Kwai" and you will come across plenty of information. I am not sure the forum has a lot on SK gogo bars. Take the Green line towards Mo Chit, get off at Saphan Kwai and take a short walk. You will get to the stretch of 150 m to 200 m that has around 10 to 12 bars. Small establishments mostly. Take a chance. Not many Farangs there. But all are welcome. One word of advice, travel extremely light and do not get into any sort of argument. It is simply not like Nana or Cowboy or Patpong.

[Kazeu]

I think its all about lack of competition and options. I think the number of girls out there has gone down from a few years ago. At best, it's stayed the same. I remember Bangkok in 2012 ish. You would see portable drinking carts all along Suhkumvit. Now a days you only see a few near Soi Cowboy / Asok. Three years ago I pulled a cart girl for 1200 plus 300 cart fine. Cute, and young with braces, no kids. She was great, I miss her. Lost her number unfortunately.


I believe that most of these portable cart girls will go ST for 2 K baht, and some won't even negotiate a price. Some guys are trying to get much less than 2 K and I don't know if they manage it.

I am surprised by the girl wanting 3 K. I went with one of these girls similar to how you describe. I did not enjoy it at all. She had 3 babies, very saggy tits and no-feel pussy, and very little sex and kissing ability at all despite her sex experience with Thai men. I paid her 2 K but was a complete waste of money in this particular case. She acted very nice and very honest and was very cute (with clothes on). All those things were not enough to make it work for me at all. I would rather have paid more for one of my favorite hot hot gogo girls. YMMV.

[Breadman]

Anyone know what happened to stumble inn? Prime location and used to be packed day and night. Girl I know quit and went to work at Hillary, something must have happened. New owners?

[Goatscrot]

Spent a little less than an hour at CH last night as some friends insisted we go there. Guys, honestly, I don't see the attraction. It is very crowded, loud, with horrid music, and they allow smoking. Can't see how it is in anyway fun. The gals are just not all that. Quite a few are plastic surgery nightmares, looking like they had their noses and breasts done by Somchai the plastic surgeon on a street corner in Ubon. Their attitudes are very lacking; almost all of them will smile when looking at their "customer" and then give a blank stare or even a scowl when looking away or at their friends. I used to love GoGos. But jeez, if this is the best BKK has to offer, I'm glad the biz is flagging. Saw only one or two that I would even think about paying 1500ST and not a single one would I even consider to pay the insane prices they are asking. I mean honestly, dudes pay 4 k when all is added in for ST with these gals? Huh? Really I don't see what many of you guys are raving about.

[Breadman]

Spent a little less than an hour at CH last night as some friends insisted we go there. Guys, honestly, I don't see the attraction. It is very crowded, loud, with horrid music, and they allow smoking. Can't see how it is in anyway fun. The gals are just not all that. Quite a few are plastic surgery nightmares, looking like they had their noses and breasts done by Somchai the plastic surgeon on a street corner in Ubon. Their attitudes are very lacking; almost all of them will smile when looking at their "customer" and then give a blank stare or even a scowl when looking away or at their friends. I used to love GoGos. But jeez, if this is the best BKK has to offer, I'm glad the biz is flagging. Saw only one or two that I would even think about paying 1500ST and not a single one would I even consider to pay the insane prices they are asking. I mean honestly, dudes pay 4 k when all is added in for ST with these gals? Huh? Really I don't see what many of you guys are raving about.I've been there 3 times this trip, once when I first arrived and they had a smoking hot chick (who I didn't see the last 2 times). Then the second visit there was another smoking hot chick who looked to be 16 years old (but its hard to guess the age of these girls). And then last night. Last night pure and simple sucked. We were there from 7:20 until 9 pm, there was no huge rush of gorgeous girls being barfined by a ton of guys and being led out of the bar (one excuse guys post here to explain why it was lame). Another excuse is we arrived too early (ohhh, all of the girls show up at 9:30 on the dot. Fact of the matter is the nudity attracts guys, not the quality of the girls. My buddy paid 4 k short time for one smoking hot chick, there's no way any of the other girls get half that.

What really sucks about the gogo scene in Bangkok is the whopping price for drinks. Doesn't matter what you order, your always going to be paying 150 baht or more for a beer. Even the regular dive bars along the nana strip charge 140 baht after 8 pm. One reason I love the Pattaya gogo's, their drink specials (45 to 65 baht for a draft) blow away Bangkok prices.

[EihTooms]

Guys,

This coming March I would be heading to bkk. I booked a hotel at tulip in. I think it would be around 5 minutes from nana and maybe 15 minutes from sow cowboi. In this case if I were to take a girl for short time from nana or cowboi will I need to take a taxi or would the lady walk with me to the hotel. I honestly don't want to waste money on cabs.

My second question was tht I read thr now the ongoing rate for mediocre to good looking gurls are 3000 bht for 1 hour short time. Is negotiating a norm especially for a farang? Or is it in general girls would only accept 3000 baht for short time. By the way is time taken walking / going to your hotel is considered as part of your short time? By the way are CIM and anal considered as extra and if yes what are the rates? Where can I find good looking girls in eithet nana or cowboi that does anal and CIM.I am not familiar with Tulip Inn near Nana / Soi Cowboy, but if it is really as close as you say it is to those locations, you shouldn't have a problem getting a girl to walk 5-15 minutes with you to go to your room for ST. 20 minutes is pushing it. It might even be faster to walk a 10-15 minute distance than to take a taxi depending on time of day / night. The girl will usually ask you "Where you stay?" if you are taking her out and one of the many reasons she asks that question is so she'll know whether to change into heels (taxi) or flat shoes (walking). So even if she doesn't ask and you are expecting her to walk 15 minutes with you, you might want to mention, "Oh, we go to Tulip Inn, about 15 minute walk. You ok?

BTW, even if traffic is very thick, a taxi ride (with meter running) to what would ordinarily be a 15 minute walk would probably only be about 50 baht, at most. That is about $1. 45 at today's exchange rate, no tip expected. Not really enough to alter your budget, right? Just make sure you walk the short distance across Sukhumvit Road to or from either Soi 4/ Nana or Asoke / Soi Cowboy and to or from your hotel so the taxi you flag down is already heading in the direction you're going. Where the taxi fares start stacking up is when you hop into a taxi right outside your hotel or outside the bar in either location and then the driver has to circle the Earth in bumper to bumper traffic just to get back to square one facing the right direction you are headed, which happened to be only a 3 minute walk from where you started. Know your location enough to at least catch a taxi heading in the right direction on Sukhumvit Road and simply walk to that spot from the hotel or from the bar where you can do it.

The girl will totally get why you are doing that, why you didn't just hop into the first taxi where the driver approached you at the entrance to Soi Cowboy, for instance. She will totally understand why you walked with her across Asoke (or through the MRT passway) to the escalator up to the BTS Skywalk, then crossed Sukhumvit Road on the BTS Skywalk, walked down the stairs and THEN flagged down a taxi on the proper side of Sukhumvit Road to get you back to your hotel heading in the direction toward Nana or wherever. Just do it that way. She will be with you on that. She will not think you are being silly to pass up those first taxi offers. She will understand why you want to walk to the other side of Sukhumvit Road before hailing a taxi, as in this example.

On your other questions, 2000-2500 baht is certainly do-able for STs with perfectly attractive Soi Cowboy / Nana go-go girls. Plus 700-800 baht barfine and whatever you spend on Lady Drinks, of course. There will be exceptions. But that is what they are; exceptions. And, yes, for that amount you will find go-go girls who will perform BBBJ CIM for you. Just ask before committing to paying the barfine. I am not into anal or any other butt play so I cannot speak from experience on that. Others might know.

IMO, for those of us who CARE if a BJ from a go-go girl is uncovered / no condom rather than covered / condom and that the BBBJ leads to CIM and isn't converted into a Hand Job with a bit of oral foreplay thrown in, the best way to negotiate with the girl in the bar is NOT to negotiate on price exactly. In other words, if the girl says something like, "You pay me 2,500? Don't start naming lower prices like 1500 baht or something like that. That is what most guys do and, again IMO, that is exactly the wrong way to wind up with a go-go girl giving you a real blowjob in your room later. Instead, with a big smile and a pleasant, playful demeanor YOU tell her that if you pay a lady 2,500 baht for ST you would need to get a very sweet blowjob (or "sa-moke" if she doesn't understand the word "blowjob") that finishes 100% inside (point to her mouth). Will you do that for me?" And then wait for a clear "yes" response, not a head nod, not raised eyebrows and a big smile. Only a clear and unambiguous "yes" will do here.

Apply your own style of fun and playful "negotiation" to this, but the point is to make whatever amount of payment she mentions to you (within reason) conditional on her DOING what you want her to do (also within reason). In my examples, 2,500 baht for an unrushed Short Time with a cute or better go-go dancer giving you a BBBJ CIM is "reasonable" as far as I am concerned. Getting a BBBJ CIM with a near stunner go-go dancer for, say, 3,000 baht might also be totally reasonable. Very subjective.

Oh, and reasonable, say 5-15 minute travel time one-way, is not going to count against your hour, 90 minute or two hour Short Time agreement.

[CaptCabins]

Can anyone suggest a guest friendly hotel between Nana and Cowboy? By the way if you use your own hotel as a short time will the girl walk with you to the hotel or insist on using a cab? Is anal and CIM considered as extra or inclusive in short time? Which bar can I go to final light skin anal providers?

[Pipe Layer99]

I was walking around Asoke near Soi Cowboy late last night and early morning. In the past, I just rushed past on my way to
Soi Cowboy but a cute non pro looking girl caught my eye at one of the carts. So for the first time, I stopped and ordered a drink. The girl sat down with me at a nearby table and figuring that a waitress would ask if I wanted to buy her a drink, I immediately asked her if she leaves with guys. This was because several weeks ago I sat down with a cute university aged girl around a Soi 19 Alcocart and bought her a drink only to find she does not go out....
Then she asked how much I could pay and stated my usual limit for short term is 2000. I also noted long term depends on how well short term would go. She kind of chuckled, not budging on her price, and I found myself in a stalemate as I finished my drink. No attempt on her part at negotiation. She was definitely a hottie but would it not cost around 3000 bt for a girl at one of the go-go's? I never BF but I think this forum is replete with stories of 2000 bt for short term and 700 for the BF in go go's. Throw in a few drinks and you are paying a minimum of 3000. However, I wonder if 3000 bt is a common rate at the alcocarts or was this girl attempting to get a premium based on her looks? I suspected that other girls don't ask nearly that much but wondering if anyone has any comments about rates at the alcocarts? The other factor for me in not pursuing this girl was her overall demeanor suggested starfish in the room.....Best thing to do is just ask them right upfront if they can go with you. If they aren't working, nothing lost.

As for prices, the three that I have taken from one the carts were 1000 (for 2 girls) and one for 1500. All three stayed LT.

IMO 2000 for a girl working outside is high.

[Syzygies]

Guys,

This coming March I would be heading to bkk. I booked a hotel at tulip in. I think it would be around 5 minutes from nana and maybe 15 minutes from sow cowboi. In this case if I were to take a girl for short time from nana or cowboi will I need to take a taxi or would the lady walk with me to the hotel. I honestly don't want to waste money on cabs.
"I booked a hotel at tulip in" doesn't make good sense. Golden Tulip or something else?

Naturally a girl doesn't want to walk that far. Quite likely has high heels. Sometime a girl agreed to walk 5 minutes to my Hotel sometimes we took a very short taxi ride anyway. 15 minutes? Forget it. You might like walking and walk very fast. 9 times out of 10 the girl doesn't.

300 metres is the maximum walk for the girl unless she knows where she is going and has stated she wants to walk.

You are going to be flashing you gold chain and fancy watch, right? Just kidding. Hope I am wrong. However you can afford a taxi.

There maybe a special case if your Hotel is very close, but very difficult to get to by taxi.

Pre prepare where you will catch the taxi and where you will get off to make it real easy. E. g. Taxis cannot turn right out of Sukhumvit Soi 4, so you might want to cross Sukhumvit before catching a taxi, if going to the odd numbered Soi side, unless the walk is like only 300 or 400 hundred metres. Taxis can exit out of Sukkhumvit Soi 6 or Soi 10 if necessary if you are going to the even numbered Soi side.

[Syzygies]

Spent a little less than an hour at CH last night as some friends insisted we go there. Guys, honestly, I don't see the attraction. It is very crowded, loud, with horrid music, and they allow smoking. Can't see how it is in anyway fun. The gals are just not all that. Quite a few are plastic surgery nightmares, looking like they had their noses and breasts done by Somchai the plastic surgeon on a street corner in Ubon. Their attitudes are very lacking; almost all of them will smile when looking at their "customer" and then give a blank stare or even a scowl when looking away or at their friends. I used to love GoGos. But jeez, if this is the best BKK has to offer, I'm glad the biz is flagging. Saw only one or two that I would even think about paying 1500ST and not a single one would I even consider to pay the insane prices they are asking. I mean honestly, dudes pay 4 k when all is added in for ST with these gals? Huh? Really I don't see what many of you guys are raving about.The plastic surgery nightmares are in every bar but less in some like CH, unfortunately on the rise. Nice to be able to see them clearly and avoid. Surgeries are also there in the Oilies, e. G. Addict packed with fake noses, and lots of silly tits I am sure, without being able to see all the tits properly. I like no surgery girls, which is why I use CH. Majority of girls still don't have. Nosejobs is on the rise. Worrying.

The line up varies considerably. Very ordinary some days. Hot girls show up sometimes. Have to be there early for best chance to catch them when they arrive. That is my opinion. Girls like Jane and Donut are not seen that often.

No, the business is not flagging. You said it was packed. Bar is going so well, they are intending an expansion, probably into the Dutch Ship restaurant next door. Yes music is too loud. Cannot sit in some locations. Young people like too loud.

[Hiete]

...300 metres is the maximum walk for the girl unless she knows where she is going and has stated she wants to walk.What are my chances to take a Soi Cowboy girl out to Hotel Mermaid? Is still considered to be an acceptable walking distance or should I look for a closer by hotel?

Are there better options than bringing a Go-Go girl "home" at night?

[EihTooms]

"I booked a hotel at tulip in" doesn't make good sense. Golden Tulip or something else?

Naturally a girl doesn't want to walk that far. Quite likely has high heels. Sometime a girl agreed to walk 5 minutes to my Hotel sometimes we took a very short taxi ride anyway. 15 minutes? Forget it. You might like walking and walk very fast. 9 times out of 10 the girl doesn't.

300 metres is the maximum walk for the girl unless she knows where she is going and has stated she wants to walk.

You are going to be flashing you gold chain and fancy watch, right? Just kidding. Hope I am wrong. However you can afford a taxi.If it is Golden Tulip then it is too far to walk from Soi Cowboy, not necessarily too far to walk from Nana.

My experience with girls willing, scratch that, choosing to walk with me to my apartment from Nana or Soi Cowboy is very different from yours. Some girls love to be outdoors for several minutes for a change, not rush out of an AC bar, hop into an AC taxi and hurry into an AC hotel or apartment every time. Depending on several factors, they might enjoy walking with a customer.

My apartment is a good 12-15 minute walk minimum for me from both Nana and Soi Cowboy, might even approach 20 minutes (but not more) depending on how slow the girl wants to walk. It isn't difficult to guage ones walking speed to suit a lady in heels. It is way more than 300 metres from those bar areas for sure.

For me, the ratio would easily be reversed; 9 times out of 10 I tell a new girl where I live, she is well aware how far it is but insists on not taking a taxi but walking instead. But not walking fast of course. Plenty o' smiles on that hand-in-hand walk. Doesn't do any harm and might improve conditions in the room, too, us having those 12-15 minutes or a bit more to chat it up and play tickle ribs on the way to the room. I never notice discomfort or displeasure in the experience on the girl's part. There is something to be said for a bit of fun and communication, blissfully outside that noisy bar, in anticipation for what is to cum I believe.

Girls I have taken to my apartment multiple times from those bar areas generally have to be convinced to take a taxi or motor bike taxi (which would be faster but usually double the cost of an auto taxi) instead of taking that 15 minute stroll to my room with me when I have preferred to ride instead of walk.

Hmm. Maybe those poor girls just want to delay a fate worse than death by an extra 10 minutes or so by walking with me to my room instead of riding. .

[JesseJames]

Spent a little less than an hour at CH last night as some friends insisted we go there. Guys, honestly, I don't see the attraction. It is very crowded, loud, with horrid music, and they allow smoking. Can't see how it is in anyway fun. The gals are just not all that. Quite a few are plastic surgery nightmares, looking like they had their noses and breasts done by Somchai the plastic surgeon on a street corner in Ubon. Their attitudes are very lacking; almost all of them will smile when looking at their "customer" and then give a blank stare or even a scowl when looking away or at their friends. I used to love GoGos. But jeez, if this is the best BKK has to offer, I'm glad the biz is flagging. Saw only one or two that I would even think about paying 1500ST and not a single one would I even consider to pay the insane prices they are asking. I mean honestly, dudes pay 4 k when all is added in for ST with these gals? Huh? Really I don't see what many of you guys are raving about.I don't get that hot beautiful girls are 1000 to 1,5000 Bt on Soi 4 sidewalk and suckers pay LD, BF, tips, & 4000 Bt+ in those stupid bars.

[Goatscrot]

No, the business is not flagging.Very few GoGos do a good biz these days. CH is one of the few exceptions, though for the life of me I can't see why. Poke your head into most GoGos and they are quite empty. The GoGo biz is on the decline in BKK. Can't speak for Pattaya as I have only been there for three nights in the past three years.

[D Cups]

How are things at the Biergarten? Anyone getting lucky there?

[Mr Enternational]

I don't get that hot beautiful girls are 1000 to 1,5000 Bt on Soi 4 sidewalk and suckers pay LD, BF, tips, & 4000 Bt+ in those stupid bars.It cost more so it must be better.

[Wolvenvacht]

Can anyone suggest a guest friendly hotel between Nana and Cowboy? By the way if you use your own hotel as a short time will the girl walk with you to the hotel or insist on using a cab?I like Citypoint Hotel a lot (https://www.booking.com/hotel/th/citypoint.en-gb.html) when I stay a few days in Bangkok. For a longer stay, I'd rather book a studio at Citadines Soi 23. Both places are within easy walking distance from Soi Cowboy and none of the girls I brought there complained or wanted a taxi.

Of course, both places are guest-friendly and will take a photocopy of the girl's ID-card.


Is anal and CIM considered as extra or inclusive in short time?You will have to negotiate that with the girl before you barfine her. Some will do, some won't, some may ask extra money.


Which bar can I go to find light skin anal providers?Cockatoo in Soi Cowboy? .

[MusicalToM]

I'm reading all the posts related to Freelancers from some time spread across various pages both in BKK / Pattaya forums.

What I understood form the reports is "Never bargain / consider a Freelancer for LT even if she is looking like a stunner". The reason behind this is obvious & known to all. Instead bargain with them for ST and while bargaining surely mention that you might continue LT with them if they perform well in ST. This option gives flexibility in terms of examining the girl based on her body & performance. It also somehow indicates the girl that she can earn for the whole night if perform well. Not sure whether all Freelancers agree to these kind of terms but I believe it's possible.

This is just my view, anyone have any better way to deal with Freelancers feel free to suggest.

[Christian G]

Can anyone suggest a guest friendly hotel between Nana and Cowboy? I like Salil Hotel on soi 11, because you can bring 2 girls for a threesome without pay any extra charge for second guest.


By the way if you use your own hotel as a short time will the girl walk with you to the hotel or insist on using a cab? I found many girls that are lazy to walk for 10 minutes and this is a bad sign for me.


Is anal and CIM considered as extra or inclusive in short time? Always ask in advance what you want.


Which bar can I go to final light skin anal providers?For be sure about anal you can go to Eden Club on soi 7/1 or check the PSE oils massage around soi 24/26.

[Gannaton48]

How are things at the Biergarten? Anyone getting lucky there?I was there in October and very satisfied. Thai women, even being 30 old or more, keep thin bodies and all provided self-evidently BBBJ and CIM (one even anal, but I don't like). Had 3 women in 2 days, all very nice, handsome and. ;cheap. For me it is necessarily my 1st destination when going back. AT Nataree, you will see plenty of really beautiful girls but you will pay at least 2500 and even not get a BBBJ! So think about.

[Blanquiceleste]

Cockatoo in Soi Cowboy? .555555555.

[Goatscrot]

How are things at the Biergarten? Anyone getting lucky there?Was there last night. Almost all of the women are old. I would say the average age in the evenings is over 40 with some clocking in at well over 50. Pretty scary actually. There is always a few gals worth taking though.

[Tomasb]

Thanks. That sounds more like it and more in tune with Nana parking lot girls. Can't say that I saw many good looking girls in and around the Alcocarts on my visit but timing is everything -- same as in Nana. As much as I hate to admit this, it's possible the Alcocart girl I interacted with simply did not want to go with me and quoted a high price to discourage me. Be*.


Best thing to do is just ask them right upfront if they can go with you. If they aren't working, nothing lost.

As for prices, the three that I have taken from one the carts were 1000 (for 2 girls) and one for 1500. All three stayed LT.

IMO 2000 for a girl working outside is high.

[EihTooms]

What are my chances to take a Soi Cowboy girl out to Hotel Mermaid? Is still considered to be an acceptable walking distance or should I look for a closer by hotel?

Are there better options than bringing a Go-Go girl "home" at night?Unless the girl is wearing spike heels or is wobbly on her feet from alcohol, I wouldn't waste the time trying to flag down a taxi who will agree to take me to Hotel Mermaid. I would just walk there with her. Go by way of Soi 23 where Crazy House is rather than back toward Asoke and it couldn't take you more than 6-8 minutes.

[EihTooms]

I don't get that hot beautiful girls are 1000 to 1,5000 Bt on Soi 4 sidewalk and suckers pay LD, BF, tips, & 4000 Bt+ in those stupid bars.I would say that if the top 20% better looking girls working in many if not most of the Nana / Soi Cowboy go-go bars didn't show up for work at their bar tonight but instead began to stand on Sukhumvit Road and Soi 4 looking for customers at 1,000-1,500 baht per ST, this night would go down in history as one of the most remarkable buyer's opportunities of the past decade.

You can find diamonds in the rough on those streets. But the reality is you will find a much more concentrated selection of good bodies, attractive faces, young and healthy girls as well as better performance level in the go-go bars than in any other option in the city. And it isn't as though you are getting nothing of value by paying those additional charges. You are sitting in an air-conditioned bar, can order something to drink while you scan the ladies, see the girls much more in the flesh rather than bundled up hiding all the usual problem areas, watch how they move their bodies (or not), she will sit next to you nearly naked for a time so you can find out if there is a critical body-to-body chemistry going between the two of you before you say let's go and so on.

So, yes, it can be a cheaper option to just pick a girl standing on Soi 4 and go to your hotel room. But I don't think customers are suckers for looking for a girl in a go-go bar instead. They are getting something of value in those go-go bars that the freelancer customer is not getting. Where they fall into the sucker category, IMO, is in the way they do or do not choose to negotiate and communicate with the girls what they want in exchange for what the girl expects them to pay. But that can be the case with the freelancer customer just as well as with the go-go bar customer.

[Goatscrot]

as well as better performance level in the go-go bars than in any other option in the city. I beg to differ. GoGo gal's performance pales in comparison to what you get at oilies, where a well polished skill set, rimming, CIM, DFK, MSOG, good attitudes, getting performance for the full time you pay for is standard. And in many cases A+ is available. I frequented GoGos back in the "Good Ole Days" and even then the best gals were not up to the performance standards one gets in the PSE oilies today.

[EihTooms]

I beg to differ. GoGo gal's performance pales in comparison to what you get at oilies, where a well polished skill set, rimming, CIM, DFK, MSOG, good attitudes, getting performance for the full time you pay for is standard. And in many cases A+ is available. I frequented GoGos back in the "Good Ole Days" and even then the best gals were not up to the performance standards one gets in the PSE oilies today.You're talking about specific acts, not level or maybe I should have said quality of performance. I have found that the quality of FS and BBBJ CIM I have gotten with go-go girls is WAY better than the best of either I have ever gotten in an oily, most of which were mechanical, misguided auto-pilot disasters.

But, yes, if I were looking for a girl to rim my butt with her tongue (doubtful that I ever would, but just saying), I would go to an oily to find her, not a go-go bar.

[Mr Enternational]

What I understood form the reports is "Never bargain / consider a Freelancer for LT even if she is looking like a stunner". The reason behind this is obvious & known to all. Instead bargain with them for ST and while bargaining surely mention that you might continue LT with them if they perform well in ST. I don't know dude. In all of these years I can not really remember having a bad performing FL in Thailand. And in general all I do is FL and LT. Just to give a margin of error I will say there have been 2 bad performers out of hundreds in the last 11 years. Now if we were talking about Dominican Republic then that would be good advice. But in my experience bad performance from a Thai FL is few and far between.

[Syzygies]

Was there last night. Almost all of the women are old. I would say the average age in the evenings is over 40 with some clocking in at well over 50. Pretty scary actually. There is always a few gals worth taking though.Without even thinking too much about age, I have visited Biergarten several times, but never actually took a girl from there. May have visited at non ideal time. Maybe found the place a little boring. Probably my fruitless search for a stunner interfered with relaxing and enjoying myself properly.

I have enjoyed spending a bit of time at a bar like Stumble Inn a bit more so, but did find that spending any length of time there used up money with limited rewards. Its okay For guys needing a bit of female company I guess.

I have had some really pathetic experiences with freelancers, and only a very small number of free lancers were ever worth repeating. This is quite the opposite of Mr Enternational, who never had a bad one. Maybe his selection method is far better than mine and I am too looks oriented (not that I can really see the body properly).

I have also met some freelancers of amazingly nice character. One or two from Thermae many years ago come to mind. Not necessarily best bodies but very superior attitude. The real part timers, just a bit short of money at some point, were probably the best for attitutude. I would be doubtful about free lancers that work every day at the same spot. In that case, probably just looking for quick Baht could be the norm.

The only time I ever met a really stunning freelancer, she was outside my Hotel after midnight, I had just returned from a fuck, and badly needed some sleep before catching a very early flight. Worst possible scenario, so I passed. Recently have met a good looking free lancer or two. Don't like the pushiness of one of them, and whining if did not buy her a drink. The other was no fun on the bed.

My overall view of freelance. Can be very cheap, but the quality ain't there. It's easier to just go to an Oily MP and view the line up, unless you want to spend a lot of time chatting girls up first.

I am always thinking, what sort of disaster will greet me when the FL takes her clothes off. I don't expect perfection, however would be a nice surprise.

[Syzygies]

Very few GoGos do a good biz these days. CH is one of the few exceptions, though for the life of me I can't see why. Poke your head into most GoGos and they are quite empty. The GoGo biz is on the decline in BKK. Can't speak for Pattaya as I have only been there for three nights in the past three years.Agreed. Bargirls have got too expensive. The punter wants a cheap freelancer to cut the overheads. I don't want cheap. I want stunning dream girls if possible. I am also not looking for the so called "skill" sets that are really just service sets provided. Some of the well trained Oily "super" girls for me give weak kissing, weak BJ, and weak GFE. I just like it differently. Probably some girls are happier with the man that just lies back and does nothing, and lets her run the show. I don't care where a girl works, I just want her to be adaptable to me, not running to a script.

Different bars have to know exactly what they are catering for to pull the customer. Bacarra undeniably works very well, just not for me. I don't go for all the fake surgeried girls, and the place is too crowded (can't see the girls properly in the throng). It's also a bit too boring.

CH works as well but for a slightly different set of customers. Those who are not so keen on the surgeries, even I have to admit nose jobs are badly on the rise and boob jobs too. The music is a bit more danceable for the girls, the stage is less crowded, you can see the overall line up a bit better. Doesn't take that long to see all the top girls are missing on certain occasions. Nudity is useful for making bar less boring, and being able to fully evaluate a girl's body.

Suzi Wong still struggles along and has tried to boost customer by going the ugly Pat Pong shows route in addition to their sexy shows. Too many fatty girls in the modern day however a recent visit showed reduced fatties. I guess only the shows keeps them going.

Long Gun became a boring bar after they lost their fabulous Cabaret shows a few years back, in my opinion. Business is low. Doll House has had a refit, but failing to draw customers much. Some girls are nude.

Essentially there is only one way to succeed. The bar has to find ways to pull lots of new girls that are good looking. CH initially did this by paying girl much higher monthly salaries than other bars. The CH quality now has dropped off. The supply of stunning girls wanting to work gogo is just not high enough. Some girls don't want to be nude. Its against social values. Girls often change later to nude, if they get body into shape, or overcome their shyness.

Many of the young good looking girls want to become Coyotes, even they don't have the Coyote dancing ability. A high proportion of young girls are being wrecked by: junk food, babies, surgeries, and taken by other roles like Coyotes. What is left for pretty girls, is getting so scarce. Now new lawas have excluded the under 20 YO girls. In the old days a large portion of young beauties did not meet this rule, and some of the girls were not even really Thai nationals.

Bars are mainly for the tourists, but I still use them. I don't really give a shit about shops or establishments. I go purely where I have found a girl or girls that I like and are well above the average surgeried looks. A single girl can pull me to a place, but in that case, I would usually contact her by LINE, first.

Any place that consistently delivers me something, is worth calling in for a quick look. If don't find it, move on.

[Goatscrot]

Agreed. Bargirls have got too expensive. The punter wants a cheap freelancer to cut the overheads. I don't want cheap. I want stunning dream girls if possible. I am also not looking for the so called "skill" sets that are really just service sets provided. Some of the well trained Oily "super" girls for me give weak kissing, weak BJ, and weak GFE. I just like it differently. Probably some girls are happier with the man that just lies back and does nothing, and lets her run the show. I don't care where a girl works, I just want her to be adaptable to me, not running to a script.

Many of the young good looking girls want to become Coyotes, even they don't have the Coyote dancing ability. A high proportion of young girls are being wrecked by: junk food, babies, surgeries, and taken by other roles like Coyotes. What is left for pretty girls, is getting so scarce. Now new lawas have excluded the under 20 YO girls. In the old days a large portion of young beauties did not meet this rule, and some of the girls were not even really Thai nationals.Agreed! I hate scripts and that is why I have found oily gals to be so great. They seem to adapt to what I want, hell, even to what mood I am in that day very quickly. Sometimes I want to be the aggressor and sometimes I want to lay back and be serviced. Most of the gals I take in the oilies can monitor and adjust.

And honestly, if I saw a "stunning dream girl" who performed like a porn star or a girlfriend I would have no problem at all paying top dollar for it. But honestly, I don't see any of those in any establishments.

[CaptCabins]

Guys,

How do you be discrete for our activities in Thailand. I booked my ticket and my hotel together to get cheaper rates but now I am guessing the hotel staff would have my my full name and passport and etc. If I were to bring a girl to the hotel wouldn't they know? On another note I believe in Thailand you have to carry your passport everywhere so how do you guys make sure the lady does not open your passport and find out your identity? Could you guys share some tips on how to remain discrete and make sure nothing gets stolen? By the way I did a quite search on youtubr and it seems there is a poster who takes video and exposes guys soliciting ladies. He would sit in front of the short time hotel and switch on his camera. You can see mostly farang with younger ladies and etc. Am I being paranoid here?

[ParkVille]

How do you be discrete for our activities in Thailand.I just visit the places with rooms, such as oillies, massage shops and soapies. If I go to a gogo, I just get a ST room, or ask the girl if she knows of a LT room. There are rooms that provide LT for pretty reasonable rates. I think there is one on Soi 33, maybe the compact hotel or behind it.



If I were to bring a girl to the hotel wouldn't they know?
They don't care the slightest. It's not like in the west, where sex / nudity is somehow worse than violence. (EG: America prohibits the slightest nipple slip on television, but viewing decapitation is somehow acceptable.).



On another note I believe in Thailand you have to carry your passport everywhere so how do you guys make sure the lady does not open your passport and find out your identity?
Simply not true, and very, very bad idea to carry your passport. It must be kept locked in your safe. On my first trip, I originally thought I had to carry my passport with me. And got drunk, and I thought I lost my passport on my first trip. I didn't as it was in my room.



Could you guys share some tips on how to remain discrete and make sure nothing gets stolen?
Well, I can tell you are new. And if I can, a hooker can spot it a mile away. But you seem to have some smarts if you are planning things out so you'll probably be fine. Just a few rules: 1. Don't drink anything in the room 2. Don't let girls buy drinks for you. 3. Keep your drink in your hand or very nearby, to prevent a girl from spiking it in a club. 4. If you're new, and alone, better to avoid meeting in clubs (freelancers). In fact, some say better to avoid freelancers for a number of reasons (quality, looks and price are all bad in Bangkok freelancer market it seems?



By the way I did a quite search on youtubr and it seems there is a poster who takes video and exposes guys soliciting ladies.
Everything is on youtube these days. That's just the world we live in now. A lot of noise really, nobody really hones in on that particular video of something so boring. A lot of people put random crap on youtube just to try to make money. Wouldn't be surprised if the guy who uploaded that video was also a frequenter of the same brothels he was video taping.

[Christian G]

Am I being paranoid here?Yes, too much.



Simply not true, and very, very bad idea to carry your passport. It must be kept locked in your safe. Are you sure? http://pattayaone.net/pattaya-news/221631/30-foreigners-detained-during-id-checks-in-pattaya-nightclubs/.


In fact, some say better to avoid freelancers for a number of reasons In fact is very difficult get scammed from freelancers. With a little care, avoiding to be too much drunk and use a hotel where the staff check girl's ID and call you in the room when you finish the session is enough for not have problem with a freelancers.

Recommend to avoid freelancers is a simply no sense, IMHO.

[Goatscrot]

Agreed. Bargirls have got too expensive. The punter wants a cheap freelancer to cut the overheads. I don't want cheap. I want stunning dream girls if possible. I am also not looking for the so called "skill" sets that are really just service sets provided. Some of the well trained Oily "super" girls for me give weak kissing, weak BJ, and weak GFE. I just like it differently. Probably some girls are happier with the man that just lies back and does nothing, and lets her run the show. I don't care where a girl works, I just want her to be adaptable to me, not running to a script.

Different bars have to know exactly what they are catering for to pull the customer. Bacarra undeniably works very well, just not for me. I don't go for all the fake surgeried girls, and the place is too crowded (can't see the girls properly in the throng). It's also a bit too boring.

CH works as well but for a slightly different set of customers. Those who are not so keen on the surgeries, even I have to admit nose jobs are badly on the rise and boob jobs too. The music is a bit more danceable for the girls, the stage is less crowded, you can see the overall line up a bit better. Doesn't take that long to see all the top girls are missing on certain occasions. Nudity is useful for making bar less boring, and being able to fully evaluate a girl's body.

Suzi Wong still struggles along and has tried to boost customer by going the ugly Pat Pong shows route in addition to their sexy shows. Too many fatty girls in the modern day however a recent visit showed reduced fatties. I guess only the shows keeps them going.

Long Gun became a boring bar after they lost their fabulous Cabaret shows a few years back, in my opinion. Business is low. Doll House has had a refit, but failing to draw customers much. Some girls are nude.

Essentially there is only one way to succeed. The bar has to find ways to pull lots of new girls that are good looking. CH initially did this by paying girl much higher monthly salaries than other bars. The CH quality now has dropped off. The supply of stunning girls wanting to work gogo is just not high enough. Some girls don't want to be nude. Its against social values. Girls often change later to nude, if they get body into shape, or overcome their shyness.

Many of the young good looking girls want to become Coyotes, even they don't have the Coyote dancing ability. A high proportion of young girls are being wrecked by: junk food, babies, surgeries, and taken by other roles like Coyotes. What is left for pretty girls, is getting so scarce. Now new lawas have excluded the under 20 YO girls. In the old days a large portion of young beauties did not meet this rule, and some of the girls were not even really Thai nationals.

Bars are mainly for the tourists, but I still use them. I don't really give a shit about shops or establishments. I go purely where I have found a girl or girls that I like and are well above the average surgeried looks. A single girl can pull me to a place, but in that case, I would usually contact her by LINE, first.

Any place that consistently delivers me something, is worth calling in for a quick look. If don't find it, move on.Go over and read the first few posts in the Angeles City forum. Same same as Thailand. High prices, bad attitudes, and poor service. Our hobby is morphing into something that we all won't enjoy so much.

[Syzygies]

Go over and read the first few posts in the Angeles City forum. Same same as Thailand. High prices, bad attitudes, and poor service. Our hobby is morphing into something that we all won't enjoy so much.Actually my biggest problems are different: Surgeries, increase in over weight young girls, and dick scared girls with no stamina, lack of stunners, and sometimes poor GFE. In terms of price, I woud prefer to say many girls are not really good value for money, specially in Soapies and bars. If the girl is fabulous, I don't mind paying a bit more, but alas the fabulous ones are less common. Hard to build up a set of favorite girls. Hard to find the special ones.

The biggest problem is we get harder to please and like a much narrower range of girls. I always have to compare to my GF, who Is still pretty hot to look at, at least. Her attitude is not so hot as I would like. If only she was horny very often and acted provocative. She remains far too shy to be provocative.

I guess by bad attitude you mean wanting easy money and not being very service oriented, which sort of goes with high prices and poor service.

[Goatscrot]

Actually my biggest problems are different: Surgeries, increase in over weight young girls, and dick scared girls with no stamina, lack of stunners, and sometimes poor GFE. In terms of price, I woud prefer to say many girls are not really good value for money, specially in Soapies and bars. If the girl is fabulous, I don't mind paying a bit more, but alas the fabulous ones are less common. Hard to build up a set of favorite girls. Hard to find the special ones.

The biggest problem is we get harder to please and like a much narrower range of girls. I always have to compare to my GF, who Is still pretty hot to look at, at least. Her attitude is not so hot as I would like. If only she was horny very often and acted provocative. She remains far too shy to be provocative.

I guess by bad attitude you mean wanting easy money and not being very service oriented, which sort of goes with high prices and poor service.Very good post Syz. I would agree. I have no problem paying more money for top notch looks and top notch service. It is very hard to find gals that "float my boat" these days. Had a nice one last night. A FL I have not seen for about 8 years. Late 30's, no kid, rocking body, light skin, pink nips, wonderfully pleasant attitude, no rush, and great performance. Saw her on Suk, she said, "Pay duay" and we were off to the ST Hotel. Great sesh of about 45 min - 1 h, paid her 1 K. She was happy, and so was I. I remember when that was the norm. Sigh.

[Wolvenvacht]

Guys,

How do you be discrete for our activities in Thailand. I booked my ticket and my hotel together to get cheaper rates but now I am guessing the hotel staff would have my my full name and passport and etc.All hotels in Thailand are required by law to take down name and passport details of all their guests. It doesn't matter whether you bought a package holiday or booked directly with the hotel or through a web-site or even simply walked in and got yourself a room.

Some "short time hotels" may be a bit more lenient on the registration requirement, but actually nobody cares.

Contrary to what many seem to believe, Thai people are friendly and not out to take advantage of you or scam you or black-mail you. And actually they don't care who you bring to your room: your wife, your girlfriend, your "mia noi", a hooker or your maiden aunt. Even those very cute reception desk girls don't loose their smiles if you bring yet another lady to your room.


If I were to bring a girl to the hotel wouldn't they know?Of course they know and I think it amuses them to no end if you somehow try to hide it, like trying to sneak past reception without showing her ID. I always walk up boldly to the reception desk and ask my companion to show her ID card. In some hotels they take a copy, in other they keep the ID card. If anything, the reception girls seem to appreciate your honesty and openeness and making it more easy on them to process "guest" registration.


On another note I believe in Thailand you have to carry your pasport everywhere so how do you guys make sure the lady does not open your passport and find out your identity?Huh? Why would she do that? I must say I never heard stories about nosy girls trying to find out the identity of their customers. Yes, I do use a nickname when in Thailand, but mainly because my real name is unpronounceable for Thais. Even my Thai GF uses my nickname rather then my real name.

I know that on many sites it is advised to only carry a copy of your passport when going out. I find this a bad advice, at least in Thailand. I always carry my passport with me, just as I always carry my ID-card in my home country. What's the difference? Thai people carry their ID-cards too al the time. If it's OK for them, it will be OK for us too.


Could you guys share some tips on how to remain discrete and make sure nothing gets stolen?You are probably more likely to get mugged in an average big Western city than in Thailand, but pick-pockets are everywhere unfortunately. Just don't carry more money than you actually need, pay most things with your credit card so you limit the amount of cash you need. In your room, keep the real valuable stuff (spare cash, tablet, camera) in the safe box and don't bring unecessary luxuries: a Casio watch keeps the time at least as well, if not better than your expensive Rolex. Gold necklaces, diamond rings, rubies and emeralds are best kept at home.


By the way I did a quite search on youtubr and it seems there is a poster who takes video and exposes guys soliciting ladies. He would sit in front of the short time hotel and switch on his camera. You can see mostly farang with younger ladies and etc. Am I being paranoid here?Yes, you are. And that guy is the best reason to take the girls to your normal hotel rather than a short time hotel. He is not going to video all hotels in Bangkok, is he?. Besides, every second, hours of video footage is being uploaded on YouTube. You and and your temporary girlfriend will "drown" in a sea of cute internet kittens and badly filmed holiday pictures.

[Member #4591]

A few more things I want to mention about Saphan Kawai gogos, after all these years going there occasionally, I still do not get much fun from there. One really annoying thing is that the concierge will try to push you with all these most least attractive ones constantly, one that tip concierge to find customers for them. They will simply sit the girl down next to you and coerce you to take her. You really have to be brave to turn them away one by one, until the concierge get pissed. This happen to me constantly there in Dted as well. Maybe I can kind of answer some of the questions by other poster. You would be very lucky to get the cuter girl as a newbie customer, these cuter ones are all taken or reserved by their Thai regular VIPs who tip their regular concierge very well, a few times I asked to bring some cuties over, the concierge always say things like she is with customer, or she is waiting for her customer, in my memory I never got the one I wanted, almost always have to compromise with what's left or accept what concierge force you to take.

Another annoying thing is these waiter and waitress constantly try to persuade you to order food and drinks, I always end up order a very overpriced fried rice or fried chicken to keep them away. At the end, I always end up sitting with someone I don't have much interest, and then be persuaded to get a lap dance, another 100 gone to the drain for 3 min which you don't even get excited to hug and touch with. SK is always a bit frustrated experience for me. Maybe these SK pros may have different experience. A few weeks ago, I was in BKK for a transit and went to Rainbow in SK, I think no relation to Rainbow in Nana, it was another frustrated experience there, saw a few semi cuties, asked 3 different ladies to go ST, but got rejected by all, saying they don't do outing or saying only go dance or drink or eat okay, WTF. These girls in some of the shops like Rainbow really play hard games.I think the problem might be you my brother. Every time I go, if I'm not hungry, I decline the food. Beer is much cheaper than Soi cowboy or Nana, I just tell them I'm not hungry and keep ordering beer. If you don't want to drink and you sit there and order 1 beer every hour, then of course, any bar won't be happy. Think about it, it's common sense.

[Nixonbd]

Very good post Syz. I would agree. I have no problem paying more money for top notch looks and top notch service. It is very hard to find gals that "float my boat" these days. Had a nice one last night. A FL I have not seen for about 8 years. Late 30's, no kid, rocking body, light skin, pink nips, wonderfully pleasant attitude, no rush, and great performance. Saw her on Suk, she said, "Pay duay" and we were off to the ST Hotel. Great sesh of about 45 min - 1 h, paid her 1 K. She was happy, and so was I. I remember when that was the norm. Sigh.I seldom pick up a FL due to safety concerns. Always heard that it's better to have a bar girl because you know where to track her down. Also, I like to have drinks and chat with someone before I decide whether she will be fun in bed too.