General Info

[SwingerLover]

And she was always unreachable! I've met her 3 times in Reichelsheim, I never even got to touch her, much less fuck her. Not even watching was possible most of the time, since she was always surrounded by 10 to 20 guys. So don't be sad for missing her, you would propably not get to her anyway. I'm even considering to actively avoid parties with her, because they get overcrowded because of her, which decreases your chances to fuck at all. (Like the report about the GB01-party with her in Mörfelden would suggest.)

[Ableyone]

Wow Sportsman, spot on! If the action is as good as the pictures of the women this seems like a must. Thanks!It is! I would fly to Berlin just to visit this club.

[Creature2]

Wow Sportsman, spot on! If the action is as good as the pictures of the women this seems like a must. Thanks!Can safely say 90 % of the girls have the best FKK looks and the girls are mostly Germsn, not Romanians or EE like the most of the FKKs, I was there this weekend for two days in a row and hadlots of fun.

[Wanking]

I was there this weekend for two days in a row and hadlots of fun.Well C2 you are like James Bond in his new movie Skyfall, you just can't stay retired for too long. Glad to have you back in the game man.

[Sportsman]

Wow Sportsman, spot on! If the action is as good as the pictures of the women this seems like a must. Thanks!Check out the video on Youporn: http://www.youporn.com/watch/7753777/erlebniswohnung-berlin/

The blonde without a mask starting at 13:30 is Elina.

[Creature2]

Well C2 you are like James Bond in his new movie Skyfall, you just can't stay retired for too long. Glad to have you back in the game man.Will do less trips in the future, I tried to quit but I am kinda addicted in germany scene but I will do less trips snd will choose wisely and selectively for pretty girls and also for good value for money. This means clever poppen?

[Neurosynth]

Check out the video on Youporn:

http://www.youporn.com/watch/7753777/erlebniswohnung-berlin/

The blonde without a mask starting at 13:30 is Elina.Wow! Just. Wow! I am so there.

[SwingerLover]

I put a report into the Berlin thread (since it's come up there) in the regular Gernamy forum, which might be of general interest. It's about how to quote only part of a post here on ISG, also about how to get an URL to work properly when it's put in only after editing an already uploaded report. If interested, look here:

http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?668-Berlin&p=1376715&viewfull=1#post1376715

[Kavorca]

Thanks to all the great posters here, Wanking and Swingerlover especially. I am going to use FF miles for a free trip from JFK to DUS next month for my first trip to Germany. I would like to try flat rate clubs mostly as gangbangs are not my style. Anyway I have got 5 days and I hope people here can recommend where I should stay and the five best AO flat rate places within a couple of hours drive. Looking at Wanking's map it seems Essen is in the center. I need a hotel with good internet that isn't too expensive. Any recommendations?

Also I am a bit overweight with a beer gut. Will that be a problem with the women at the clubs?

Thanks in advance for any and all help.

[Wanking]

Also I am a bit overweight with a beer gut. Will that be a problem with the women at the clubs?

Thanks in advance for any and all help.Mate, no problem being a bit fat with a beergut, so am I. Some women might ask you to take it easy so as not to squash them to death!!

If its your first trip then I recommended taking in a couple of FKK clubs. See the Fkk thread for more. You can't beat the sight of 50 plus beautiful naked or nearly naked girls, it will blow ur mind. Goldentime, Living room and Magnum are all not too far from Dusseldorf with car.

As for Flat rate clubs, most clubs that operate a party every day are shit these days IMHO. Exceptions might be Pauschal Bochum and its sister clubs in Dortmund and Munster which has higher quality rom/bulg girls in terms of looks than most pts.

Also Mettmann has mostly good service from mostly ugly women.

My current fav is Cleopatra Arena party Wednesday only party. Women are mostly bad looking but service is reasonable and u can get some bareback there if u want. Everyone else seems to think its shit though.

Other than that it comes down to the random Bareback parties that Swingerlover talks about in the bareback threads. They can be good but some are in shitty little apartments with really dirty toilets etc, women are usually washed though.

A visit to Beverly swingers club would be recommended especially on a Fri/Sat night, usually a couple of house ladies there if u fail with the real swingers. The spectacle there will keep u in jerk off fantasies for years to come, it has done for me anyway.

Last important thing: please write reports here.

[Wanking]

I would like to try flat rate clubs mostly as gangbangs are not my style. Anyway I have got 5 days and I hope people here can recommend where I should stay and the five best AO flat rate places within a couple of hours drive. .I just reread your post. There are no flat rate AO clubs that operate everyday that I can know of. Since you don't like gangbang then most of the AO parties which are random ones won't appeal to you, because they are mostly gangbang style.

Cleopatra arena Wednesday party has 4 bareback girls and you take them for private sessions, but this party is only on a Wednesday.

Other than that your best bet are clubs like FKK Arabella and Villa Venus where you get 3 x AO sessions for €110.

http://fkk-arabella.com/

http://www.fkk-venus.com/

Dolce Vita Raubach is a dedicated AO club with €40 entry and every session €40.

http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?3177-Dolce-Vita-Raubach

I suppose its only a matter of time before one of the regular covered Partytreff clubs, offers flat rate Bareback everyday all inclusive but that doesnt exist at the moment.

Also have a long hard look at SW's excellent AO map http://goo.gl/maps/DKtbY

Actually The Bad girls in Kreleld have 2 parties everyday and the sessions there are kind of private in that the doors are open, but its mostly one on one AO action http://www.kontakt24.de/hobbyhuren/26532/krefeld-47799-bad-girls.html

La Luna Moers have regular parties these days but u are limited to 8 sessions for €129 http://www.club-laluna-moers.de/

[Kavorca]

Thanks Wanking. Right now based on what I have read recently I think I will be spending a lot of time at Villa Venus. The reports say many beautiful AO girls. At 110 for 3X it sounds perfect. I also plan on trying the Krefeld everyday 50 Euro partys. I also found some great hotels via booking. Com. Thanks again.

[SwingerLover]

Also have a long hard look at SW's excellent AO map.

http://goo.gl/maps/DKtbY

Actually The Bad girls in Kreleld have 2 parties everyday and the sessions there are kind of private in that the doors are open, but its mostly one on one AO action.

http://www.kontakt24.de/hobbyhuren/26532/krefeld-47799-bad-girls.htmlThanks for the praise on the AO-map. I just gave it an overhaul which is almost complete. But how come you have a different short-URL than I do, but which also works?

About Bad Girls Krefeld: What you wrote is not entirely correct. As you can see on the February party-map http://goo.gl/maps/8OVf2 The two-party-schedule is at their second place at Hülser Straße 109, ("Holiday Bad Girls", because the place formerly was "Holiday Bar") whereas they do only one party per day at the original location at Oppumer Straße 6. All those 5-hour-for-50-€-parties are with only 3 women right now. If there's a big party, like on the past Saturdays, then that's advertised seperately and costs 80 € for all. www.kontakt24.de/club/37304/krefeld-47803-holiday-bad-girls.html

And it's not mostly one-on-one action either, although it happens a lot, depending on the number of guys being there. You ALWAYS have to expect another guy to enter the room and play along!

[Dark Vader]

And it's not mostly one-on-one action either, although it happens a lot, depending on the number of guys being there. You ALWAYS have to expect another guy to enter the room and play along!Correct! I've been to their Saturday parties at Hülser Straße a couple of times this month and it's mainly group action apart from a couple of the latino's who largely insisted on one-on-one.

[Wanking]

Correct! I've been to their Saturday parties at Hülser Straße a couple of times this month and it's mainly group action apart from a couple of the latino's who largely insisted on one-on-one.I was going on the experience I had when I visited with Ed setra last year at their Oppumer Straße 6 location, and the 3 or 4 sessions I had there were all one on one but it was quiet that day.

DV,

I love your big long trip reports, but I suspect you don't write them as often now because they take so long to write, so why not write short reports about your recent trips, even just a couple of paragraphs. Would be so much better than nothing.

[Ccseeka]

Been on another trip and will do the following.

Wednesday. Rattingen Zhuzha Gang Bang.

Thursday. Dortmund Caro AO party.

Friday. This day started out as the worst possible going to a particular club but ended with a great finish at FKK Arabella instead, that day felt like John Cleese in that film 'Clockwise'.

Saturday. Bad girls Krefeld.

This is the third trip in a row now that when I go that particular week there are no AO parties in Krefeld apart from Badgirls.

[Wanking]

Looking forward to those reports Ccseeka

[SwingerLover]

Yeah, me too! Especially to confirmation about the Lies-R-us advertising from Bad Girls Krefeld!

[Wanking]

Yeah, me too! Especially to confirmation about the Lies-R-us advertising from Bad Girls Krefeld!What lies are they telling?

[Dark Vader]

DV,

I love your big long trip reports, but I suspect you don't write them as often now because they take so long to write, so why not write short reports about your recent trips, even just a couple of paragraphs. Would be so much better than nothing.Yep been really busy at work recently but I guess that you're right and a few words by way of feedback wouldn't hurt.

[SwingerLover]

What lies are they telling?The usual lies in the ads, like 11 AO-girls being there when there were actually only five, as I was told. Wrote about that in the Krefeld thread.

Not much further info from me right now, no updates either; due to LAN-systems crash. (I'm writing this from elsewhere; not much time.)

[Dark Vader]

I've only been managing to do weekend trips for the last couple of months and so I'm delighted to be able to do a slightly longer trip at last this week.

Still finalising the exact itineraryWell finally got back from my trip in the early hours of this morning despite Ryanair's best endeavours to keep us stranded in Germany all night. Always the way when you want the flight to be late it leaves on time and vice-versa.

Anyway my eventual itinerary was:

Thursday Eva-Freundin Party. Verdict: I had a much better time here this time round but I still feel that the fuck per hour ratio can sometimes be poor. Sexslavinnen at Circle-O-Club. Verdict: A mix of gang bang club and swinger club. Think Insomnia or maybe Beverly. The house girls are better looking than the Beverly crew but it's a much smaller club and the food offer is crap in comparison. Had a really good time here despite the lower attendance than usual and gangbang lovers should definitely put it on their itinerary. Friday Club LaLuna party. Verdict: First time at the club although I have visited the Lippkick swinger club before which shares the same building. Ok for a flat rate AO club I suppose but not really the best to my mind. Turned into a mini – ISG convention with four of us their including Sportsman. Kasteel Waterloo. Verdict pretty low turnout and so I didn't get much action with just the one fuck all night although a few BJs and gropes of course. Saturday BadGirls. Verdict : Partied again with Sportsman, Usual false advertising on the line-up but I had a pretty good time and got to fuck Laura at last Club Fortuna Swinger Club. Verdict: Crap evening as unbeknown to me it was disco night with a pole dancing competition. Lots of hot young clubbers there but most came to dance and not to fuck. Just the one solitary session and no gropes or BJs either! But them's the breaks at swinger clubs and the one session I did have was stellar although slightly comicalSunday Erotiktreff 95. Verdict: Repeat session with Xandy and Tina and just as good as last time


Look forward to your visit / report of sexslavinnen I have also wanted to do this club but the lure of Germany has been too strong for some time. May consider it in future after seeing how you get on there.

Looking at your plans of travel have you considered changing your name to Thomas Cock heh heh.Don't know about Thomas Cock. More like Sore Cock! Definitely time for a longish break.

[Wanking]

I have visited the Lippkick swinger club before which shares the same building.Hey DV,

I was in Lippkick beside La Luna before when it was Swingertreff Moers. It was a Sunday afternoon, summer 2010 and very quiet there. Highlight was I got a good bareback session off a hottish Blonde who was attached to the club, so I suppose a sort of House Lady.

Whats it like now, and what day did you visit?

I see they do a Wednesday Orgy now, with single man only €28 entry. I might pop by if cleopatra arena has a shite line up of women.

http://www.lippkick.de/Veranstaltungen.html

[Dark Vader]

Hey DV,

I was in Lippkick beside La Luna before when it was Swingertreff Moers. It was a Sunday afternoon, summer 2010 and very quiet there. Highlight was I got a good bareback session off a hottish Blonde who was attached to the club, so I suppose a sort of House Lady.

Whats it like now, and what day did you visit?

I see they do a Wednesday Orgy now, with single man only €28 entry. I might pop by if cleopatra arena has a shite line up of women.

http://www.lippkick.de/Veranstaltungen.htmlI've been there three times now. Twice last year and once this year. My last two visits have been Saturday B&W parties and so obviously that attracts a particular clientele. The other time I've been was a Sunday "male surplus" event. The Sunday attendance was pretty poor although there were a few hardcore swinger ladies there who fucked quite a few guys. The B&W parties were much better attended and so I got better action. Still don't think that the club is as good as some of the other swinger clubs but the pricing is so much better.

Typical MILF type attendees and as ever don't go to swinger clubs, with no in-house girls, if you want guaranteed sex unless you look like Brad Pitt but I've generally always done OK and generally manage to always get at least one session.

[SwingerLover]

From Sunday until Monday afternoon, Saskia Farell's website was not available because the operator of the server went bancrupt. I suppose that's why Fickanzeigen wasn't available either.

Now both sites are working again:

www.saskia-farell.com

www.fickanzeigen.net

[SwingerLover]

Both Fickanzeigen and the Saskia-Farell-site are not working again, likewise the page of Gangbang-NDS. So I guess they again have trouble with their server.

[Ccseeka]

Because I am usually in the partytreff section want to big up Redbull691 again for passing on his genuine pills which helped greatly on the latest trip.

I post a section of what was in the Viagra section. The info may help concerning Blue viprogra which had not been posted much before.


Some weeks back I contacted Redbull via the PM and wanted to try out some decent pills for a change. Up to this point via two websites got some batches of normal kamagra. They did not seem to do the trick at times mostly only being effective for around four hours and not producing full hardness.

I was beginning to think it could be a recent underling health issue to why I was not fully responding to those batches of pills. Well I am no spring chicken so also thought age was a factor. But having got the ones from Redbull it has disproved that worry. In other words they must have been not quite the full deal!

I ordered the following, which had not mostly tried yet apart from the gels.

Kamagra gold pills, Kamagra gels, Blue viprogra, generic levitra

The transaction was straight forward as I used the bank transfer method into his account. The parcel arrived two days later and was in a plastic bag inside a good strong jiffy bag. The pills and gels go onto 2014 and 2015 being the large chunk of the expiry date. The packs have far more blue colored time and info stamps on them than the ones I have seen on some websites. They all worked perfectly fine and for many more hours than expected and good hardness. So no lack of strength with these pills and gels!

What I will write about below is not a reflection of the quality of the pills he has provided just that some pills suit me better than others.

I want go into more detail about the Blue viprogra as there are very little reports in this forum of these. They are now my favourite for long-term use, they just suit me perfectly.

It was amazing when I took one 100mg for the first time. After a few hours it set in got a raging longer and harder erection than have been getting for a while, it seemed to reach its full potential lengthwise. The effect was in my system for at least 14 hours. The side effect was of a little strain on the shoulders but since the first time have had no effects.

I am one of those people that when taking a pill the first time, it is at it's most potent. So what I did the next few times with the blue pill was split it in half. Popped in 50mg then about 6 hours later popped in the second one and again it reached the same raging levels and stayed in my system till next morning.

Perhaps for some people the effect would be more in the first hour as it stipulates on most websites but for me personally it always hits me a few hours later. So on any given trip just pop a half before breakfast then again within the first few hours of hitting a partytreff or event.

I want again to thank Redbull for the excellent service he has provided.

[SwingerLover]

www.fickanzeigen.netThe Fickanzeigen website is finally back online. But there are no ads on there yet, seems to have restarted just this morning with a clean slate.

[Wanking]

Hi all,

I've been busy since my short trip last week but Ill try to get my reports up tomorrow.

[Wanking]

Back from another trip, but while I had some good sex I also had some minor disasters.

The Disasters were:

1) On day two I mislaid my travel card from the hotel but luckily got away with it. I explained what happened to 3 train inspectors and they all let me away with it!

2) I left Cleopatra Arena early to go to the Orgy in Lippkick swingers but the U bahn I need was massively delayed so I had to catch another train which delayed me an hour.

3) The orgy at Lippkick Swingers in Moers failed to get going and there was no one at all there. I didn't pay in. More in that report.

4) Later that night after having a sauna in Dusselstand I managed to drop my spectacles on the floor, and I scratched one of the lenses.

My Reports:

Day 1 : Duisburg RLD. (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?3407-Duisburg&p=1395383&viewfull=1#post1395383)

Day 2 : Cleopatra Arena (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?3243-Cleopatra-Arena-Gelsenkirchen&p=1395385&viewfull=1#post1395385)

Day 2 : Lippkick Swingers (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?3170-Other-Swinger-Clubs&p=1395386&viewfull=1#post1395386)

Day 2 : BahnDamm Dusseldorf (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?676-Dusseldorf&p=1395387&viewfull=1#post1395387)

Day 3 : AO Party Dusseldorf (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?3433-D%FCsseldorf-Bareback-AO-Parties&p=1395389&viewfull=1#post1395389)

[Myrrh]

1) On day two I mislaid my travel card from the hotel

2) I left Cleopatra Arena early to go to the Orgy in Lippkick swingers but the U bahn I need was massively delayed so I had to catch another train which delayed me an hour.

3) The orgy at Lippkick Swingers in Moers failed to get going and there was no one at all there.

4) Later that night after having a sauna in Dusselstand I managed to drop my spectacles on the floor, and I scratched one of the lenses.Wanking you are becoming more and more Myrrh like with each trip.

I thought I was the only one with a monopoly on comical disasters, ha ha.

[Myrrh]

On day two I mislaid my travel card from the hotel but luckily got away with it. I explained what happened to 3 train inspectors and they all let me away with it!I have often wondered what the penalties are if the ticket inspectors find you on the train in Germany without a ticket.

I noticed whilst travelling around Germany that unlike much of the UK rail system there are no ticket barriers and often there are no ticket inspectors on the trains. In the UK you will most likely come across both on a typical journey.

In the UK if a ticket inspector thinks that someone is generally a foreign visitor without a permanent address in the UK and they say that they don't have enough money for the full fare then they will most likely let them off. It is no point sending a demand for payment to some non UK citizen in a foreign country.

So I wonder whether the same approach would work on the German railways if you happened to be unscrupulous.

I can remember paying for tickets for the first few journeys on a trip to Germany but when I realised that there was no one checking my tickets the resolve to buy tickets weakened.

One a couple of occasions when there was a ticket inspector, as the trains were quite full and many passengers were standing, they would just wonder casually through the carriages not really checking tickets even when passengers offered it to them.

[Vito Corleone]

I can remember paying for tickets for the first few journeys on a trip to Germany but when I realised that there was no one checking my tickets the resolve to buy tickets weakened.If you ride the ICE, many train inspectors walking around making sure you have a ticket.

[Wanking]

Wanking you are becoming more and more Myrrh like with each trip.

I thought I was the only one with a monopoly on comical disasters, ha ha.Hahahah Well Myrrh I doubt my disasters will ever reach your level, but who knows!

[Wanking]

I can remember paying for tickets for the first few journeys on a trip to Germany but when I realised that there was no one checking my tickets the resolve to buy tickets weakened.Thats why these days I always try and stay in a hotel that has a Bahn travel card included in the price. The manager of the BismarckHotel told me that cards are worth upto €28 euro per day, so not bad when you are paying less than €50 per night for the hotel room.

[Member #4297]

Hi guys,

I am doing my homework for my first Partytreffs mongering trip and everything sounds perfect, except that from reading the reports here I guess that sessions are kinda short in Partytreffs clubs. So I wil be glad if someone will share his experience with me if there any Partytreffs clubs that known for kinda long sessions or at least lets say unrushed sessions?

Happy mongering everybody!

[SwingerLover]

that sessions are kinda short in Partytreffs clubs. So I wil be glad if someone will share his experience with me if there any Partytreffs clubs that known for kinda long sessions or at least lets say unrushed sessions?First: It depends on the club and the women, like everywhere. Next: What do you consider long sessions? If you want to occupy the girls and rooms for an hour, then that might be a problem. Remember that those are flatrate places, so everybody wants to fuck as much as possible. If, at Treff 188 for instance. 5 guys would disappear with all 5 girls into all 5 rooms and will not be seen for an hour, then the crowd might get restless. And rightfully so.

So for really long, unrushed sessions, you might be better off with Pay 4 Play, like at an FKK. Although I've heard that lately in some FKKs in Hessen it has become customary to get rushed as well, despite having paid 50-80 € for half an hour. And that the half hour sometimes becomes 25 minutes, after which the woman likes to charge an additional session. A guy I met at my last two AO-GBs (Susi&Aymie & Spermagames) had told me this; that's why he quit the FKKs and went for the AO Gangbangs.

How rushed or relaxed it becomes also depends on how many guys are there. If traffic is slow and the girl likes you, an uninterrupted hour might happen. It might also happen that I win 20 million € in the lottery next month. Remember that it's a PARTYtreff you are asking about. If it's good, it's more likely to be a groupsex party than one-on-one. But my info on regular PTs is a bit out of date, since I'm particularly looking for bareback groupsex- and gangbang-parties now. Maybe someone else has more recent info on the rubber-scene.

[SvenFKK]

I am doing my homework for my first Partytreffs mongering trip and everything sounds perfect, except that from reading the reports here I guess that sessions are kinda short in Partytreffs clubs. So I wil be glad if someone will share his experience with me if there any Partytreffs clubs that known for kinda long sessions or at least lets say unrushed sessions?I've never been rushed at Mettmann. Yes, the girls do want to make you come, but that is orthogonal to the question of rushing. I've had several sessions there 45-60 minutes, usually with Ute or Moni.

[Member #4297]

Thank you SvenFKK and SwingerLover for your helpful answers

The short sessions are defiantly understandable because girls have to satisfy other customers also, and it sounds like Mettmann will be my first choice to try.

Thanks again guys, happy mongering.

[SvenFKK]

The short sessions are defiantly understandable because girls have to satisfy other customers also, and it sounds like Mettmann will be my first choice to try.If you want the best sex you have ever had in your life, be sure to try Ute at Mettmann. She is tall (like many of the women there) , black hair, piercings and tattoos, in her early late 40s or early 50s. Wears glasses when not fucking. Others might comment that the women at Mettmann are not as young and not as pretty as elsewhere. This is true for at least most of the Mettmann women. Of course, beauty is in the eye of the beholder and whether one prefers older or younger as also a matter of taste. However, even if the girls are not your type, just close your eyes and enjoy them.

[Member #4297]

If you want the best sex you have ever had in your life, be sure to try Ute at Mettmann. She is tall (like many of the women there) , black hair, piercings and tattoos, in her early late 40s or early 50s. Wears glasses when not fucking. Others might comment that the women at Mettmann are not as young and not as pretty as elsewhere. This is true for at least most of the Mettmann women. Of course, beauty is in the eye of the beholder and whether one prefers older or younger as also a matter of taste. However, even if the girls are not your type, just close your eyes and enjoy them.Yeah Mettmann is defiantly on my list and I will try it first thing because of the positive reviews. But I want to take your opinion about what might be the best Pauschal or Partytreffs or flat rate clubs for sessions in private rooms not public activities.

All I want is a place that I am not going to face the nightmare situation where its crowded with men having a race-war to get a girl.

After finishing my homework I ended up thinking that pauschalclub dortmund and mc sex in Hamm (the new one) might be the best for that. What do you think about these 2 places? And do you have any recommendation for a place for private sessions?

Sorry for asking you again but when I was doing my homework I saw your comments everywhere so it seemed that you are the right guy to ask.

[Dark Vader]

But I want to take your opinion about what might be the best Pauschal or Partytreffs or flat rate clubs for sessions in private rooms not public activities.

All I want is a place that I am not going to face the nightmare situation where its crowded with men having a race-war to get a girl.

After finishing my homework I ended up thinking that pauschalclub dortmund and mc sex in Hamm (the new one) might be the best for that. What do you think about these 2 places? And do you have any recommendation for a place for private sessions?If you definitely want a Pauschalclub or Partytreff then the PC Dortmund / Bochum / Munster chain is probably one of the best around although Bochum does get a bit crowded.

However, why not consider a low cost FKK or sauna club? The former red carpet clubs of FKK Belami, Venus, Grimberg, Arabella, Penelope all offer 3 sessions for around 110€. Or if you can stretch a little more then you could get 3 sessions at Sauna Club Acapulco for 155€ and the ladies at these places will in general be prettier as well.

[SwingerLover]

http://sexdo.de/

This site seems to be kind of a replacement for the Kontakt24-site, which has been dead for months. At least it works the same way; you enter a city-name and get all the ads from that city. (Plus more search options, but that's the main one.)

[Member #4297]

If you definitely want a Pauschalclub or Partytreff then the PC Dortmund / Bochum / Munster chain is probably one of the best around although Bochum does get a bit crowded.

However, why not consider a low cost FKK or sauna club? The former red carpet clubs of FKK Belami, Venus, Grimberg, Arabella, Penelope all offer 3 sessions for around 110€. Or if you can stretch a little more then you could get 3 sessions at Sauna Club Acapulco for 155€ and the ladies at these places will in general be prettier as well.Thank you very much for confirming that the PC chain is a good choice (I am happy that I have done my homework right) , I am even going to live in Dortmund just so I will be close to them.

The low cost FKK that you mentioned sounds good and the prices are reasonable for 3 sessions but since (I am in my 20s + going to take pills + planning to spend my whole time in the clubs). So I am hoping for much higher than 3 sessions.

Thanks a lot guys, I will defiantly write reports when I come back.

[SvenFKK]

All I want is a place that I am not going to face the nightmare situation where its crowded with men having a race-war to get a girl.Surprisingly, this rarely happens at Mettmann.

[Angus Magee]

seems there is a new gb party place in berlin. from reports it seems to be similar to and probably competition to erlebniswohnung. from the reporti read there did not seem to be that many ladies present at the opening party but the writer seemed satisfied by what was there.

the web page seems to be a bit shy of information. as far as i can tell it might take some time to get up to speed but i will kepp you all posted if interested.

http://www.gentleman-loft.de/

am

[BrooklynNY]

I was curious and would like to hear opinions on which places people think are the best for Party Treff or FKK Clubs?

I hear so many people say they have been to various ones. But is there consensus on which are the best to visit?

[SvenFKK]

I was curious and would like to hear opinions on which places people think are the best for Party Treff or FKK Clubs?

I hear so many people say they have been to various ones. But is there consensus on which are the best to visit?You have to read the posts to get an idea what is available where. What is best for someone might not be good at all for someone else. There will be consensus, of course, on whether the management is fair, the girls are friendly etc but "best" depends on what you want.

Concentrate on the recent posts, since things change over time.

[Breadman]

Anyone know how this place works? Pricing, meeting the girls etc?

[Rupert Pupkin2]

I am going to visit Germany some time within the next few months and am planning to check out some Pauschalclubs, Partytreffs, and maybe some FKK clubs. I have been doing a lot of research on these clubs through this site and also the clubs' official sites, and even compiling my own manual database of these clubs to take with me to Germany. But I was wondering, are there any books / manuals / magazines / pamphlets etc. Which list all of these clubs? Better still anything that has a bit of a write up or reviews of all these clubs? It would be very convenient for me to have something like this when I am in Germany.

I have seen Wanking's map, which is excellent, and have been using it to do my research and compile my database, but a book or something would be very convenient for me to have on the road with me.

[SvenFKK]

I am going to visit Germany some time within the next few months and am planning to check out some Pauschalclubs, Partytreffs, and maybe some FKK clubs. I have been doing a lot of research on these clubs through this site and also the clubs' official sites, and even compiling my own manual database of these clubs to take with me to Germany. But I was wondering, are there any books / manuals / magazines / pamphlets etc. Which list all of these clubs? Better still anything that has a bit of a write up or reviews of all these clubs? It would be very convenient for me to have something like this when I am in Germany.

I have seen Wanking's map, which is excellent, and have been using it to do my research and compile my database, but a book or something would be very convenient for me to have on the road with me.I don't think you'll find a book. There probably isn't enough demand for one, and in any case, by the time it was published it would be out of date. Some clubs remain at the same level over the years, but others get better or worse. The best guide is probably right here.

[RedBull691]

I don't think you'll find a book. There probably isn't enough demand for one, and in any case, by the time it was published it would be out of date. Some clubs remain at the same level over the years, but others get better or worse. The best guide is probably right here.I'm sure if you go into most sex shops in germany there are swingers mags also with info on partytreffs, huren, bordelle ffks etc. Have seen some on my travels. But like been said here by SVEN, and others most info is on here so why pay for a magazine.

[Rupert Pupkin2]

Cheers lads. No doubt this forum is a great resource, but I'm going to be doing a road trip. Living out of a van. So it's not like I'll be able to just jump on this forum whenever I want to. That's why I'm compiling a manual database of these clubs, and why any up to date publications would be especially handy.

[SwingerLover]

and why any up to date publications would be especially handy.I don't know if you are into bareback action, but maybe my AO-maps could help too. Most places are bareback groupsex and gangbang party venues, condoms can still be used at most of them and a lot of them offer P4P as well.
And I think my April- and May-party-maps are among the most up-to-date publications you can find.
http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?3384-Swingerlover-s-AO-map

[Batman 2]

Hi SwingerLover,

I will be in Germany from 5-9 and would like to spend a very good time. I have visited flatrate clubs before and very interested to repeat the experience. But it was more than one year back and I have no idea about the changes in lineups.

I have planned to stay somewhere in NRW. I will rent a car for sure (because I'm coming with one of my friends and I'm sure this will reduce our costs).

I would like you help and guide me to have the best experience again.

I can give you some of my prefrences:

- I don't like public sex.

- I like DATY, CIM, BBBJ, . I don't like just fucking, so the girl attitude is so important for me.

- I like full day stay (I know some of the clubs offering 3 hours plan. But my first option is full day service.

- I want the club to have lots of options to select from. Clubs with 4-5 girls are not on my wish list (unless the majority of girls are on high quality!)

- The quality of girls are also important (tall, slim and average body girls). Generally I don't like old girls more than 35!

- I have visited Harem at Dormagen and Wuppertal partytreffs last year and both of them were good (Harem was much better). I'm not sure if they are at the same quality or have been changed.

- Someone asked me to check Mettmann and Harem at Bochum. But I have no idea how's their lineup.

May be I can find this place only in paradise. But if there is any alternative to paradise in Germany (which I'm sure existing) , let me know.

I want to spend all my 5 nights in clubs. So if the suggestions are more than 3, it will fit my plan.

I appreciate if you can also help me also for hotel (somewhere to sleep with a budget of Euro 50-80 with 2 beds and breakfast and of course wifi).

Cheers,

Batman 2

[Rupert Pupkin2]

I don't know if you are into bareback action, but maybe my AO-maps could help too. Most places are bareback groupsex and gangbang party venues, condoms can still be used at most of them and a lot of them offer P4P as well.

And I think my April- and May-party-maps are among the most up-to-date publications you can find.

http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?3384-Swingerlover-s-AO-mapThanks champ. Those sort of clubs are not at the top of my list of preferences but certainly I am still interested in them and will check out your maps.

Cheers

[Creature2]

Anyone know how this place works? Pricing, meeting the girls etc?The one in Duisburg runs like a normal house. This must be a flat in second floor if I recall well. You enter without an entry, quite the contrsry the on in Viersen. There is usualy 3 girls if they are not busy you can see the whole line up. The prices of sessions were slightly 10 euro more expensive when I visited. And no 20 min sessions available. Now I guess they reduce again the prices. No club atmosphere there like you find in Viersen, I'd rather to go to viersen if I were in your shoes uness you are not in search of a special girl you know already, working in viersen that week.

[SwingerLover]

- I don't like public sex.

I appreciate if you can also help me also for hotelSorry, but ou're barking up the wrong tree here. I'm not from NRW and usually drive back home after the parties, so I can't help you much with hotels.

And since you don't like public sex, we have opposite preferances. So I can't help you much here either. Maybe the FKKs would be best for you. (Or LaLuna in Moers on a regular non-flatrate day.) Check in the FKK-forum.

Good luck!

[Batman 2]

Sorry, but ou're barking up the wrong tree here. I'm not from NRW and usually drive back home after the parties, so I can't help you much with hotels.

And since you don't like public sex, we have opposite preferances. So I can't help you much here either. Maybe the FKKs would be best for you. (Or LaLuna in Moers on a regular non-flatrate day.) Check in the FKK-forum.

Good luck!Oooh, I think I didn't express what I'm looking for.

FKK is not my favourite as it will cost for me a lot if I'm going to have 5-7 sessions per day.

Flat rate is the best option, just I wanted to say that I don't like sex in front of others.

[Batman 2]

I was digging into different forums of the site and could realize the site has a negative issue.

The reports about partytreff clubs are all old. In fact the visitors can't rely on reports which posted more than one year back.

If you look at reports, the old ones had detailed overview on clubs and the girls one by one. But the new reports are very short and have bo useful information on them.

We all know that there frequent changes in the clubs situations and the girls.

So I'm requesting the frequent visitors to update the clubs' status and specially the girls situation.

ISG was famous because of its up to date data. I afraid if it continues like this, the visitors prefer to not rely on its data.

For example myself having a trip to NRW in next 2 weeks. But when I searched for my favorite clubs, all data were very old. Now I feel a high risk revisiting the clubs which were good before. And I feel I might miss some improved clubs (which previously were bad reports on them in the forum).

I think the forum leaders can help a lot for this issue.

Cheers,

Batman 2

[Free Dude]

Not my scene, but I believe the Pauschal Club chain is supposed to be ok (although sometimes a bit busy with men). At the moment there are three in Bochum, Munster and Dortmund. There us also McSex in Hamm. These are pauschalclubs (like Harem) and not partytreffs BTW. No clue what partytreffs are hot nowadays. For flat rate there are also plenty of gangbang parties, with or without condom.

[Maxime]

atBatman2: if you like 5-7 sessions with beautiful girls with good service, and don't want groupsex / gangbangs, but still a flat rate (do you?) , you are looking for the holy grail we all are looking for!

Serious: in FKK / Saunaclubs are the most good looking girls, and if you choose the right club, offer very good service also, but you have to pay for what you get (it is like normal life) , so if you go to the room 7 times, you have to pay seven times.

If you like good sex, and only want to pay one entrance fee, forget most Partytreffs (terrible girls IMHO) , but you can choose one of the good "organised gb parties" around, SL made a special AO map for this, and there are many reviews about it (SG, SS and GB01 have very good girls normally). But since you don't like group sex, this is maybe not for you, but the sex can be great!

If you want one-on-one sex, but with a flat rate, there are many Pauschalclubs, or clubs with flat-rate days, but, as you would expect, not the most beautiful girls and certainly not offering the best service (imagine, the guy already paid a fixed fee, why should you as a girl give a super performance on the room, since it does not matter at all). There are few exceptions, like Free Dude is mentioning the 3 PSC clubs are the best (least bad) you can get, and some say La Luna, but you can not compare it to the girls in FKK clubs.

You can also decide to go to a FKK / saunaclub which has low prices AND good service of nice girls, so it is not flat rate, but you can calculate your maximum exposure if you go 5-7 times to the room. Good examples are FKK van Goch and Luders Lounge. Both have 20-30 euro entrance, plus 30 euro for 20 minutes on the room. Most girls are very good in service, and some of them look very good. Given your stamina, you max exposure would be Euro 170-240, so a "virtual flat rate" (compare this with the Euro 150 for "real" flat rate clubs when you decide to stay longer than 3 hours, not so much difference, and in LuLo and Goch you have better choice of girls!).

About actual reviews: most of the frequent visitors are from Germany, Holland and Belgium, so it is quite understandable most actual updates can be found on the German, Dutch and Belgian fora, but then you have to understand German, Dutch or French.

Enjoy, where ever you go!

[Free Dude]

He maxime, don't knock the pauschal clubs just yet. You're girl Anka (formerly Babylon) is now in Pauschalclub Bochum;). Knowing that actually makes me want to try the concept again.

Good advise in general though!

[Justume]

Hi all and esp Swingerlover,

I had been reading the Germany thread with great interest as I plan to be there in August. I am a Asian dude. Yes, a little early but good to prepare myself for this trip. At first I only know about the famous FKK in Germany. But then through this forum I found out about Partythreff and then there is partycluf and partyhaus or something. I have some questions which after reading this forum I haven't found any answers.

1. I read that partythreff is a place where you pay one fee and you can feast the girls. But how much is the entrance fee and what then is partyclub?

2. What is AO?

3. Bareback gangbang-do they do HIV test first? No fear of contacting any STD?

4. I notice most partythreff is at Dusseldorf, are there any in Frankfurt as I will mostly be staying there.

5. Porn filming, where are they, does it mean we can watch and can we join?

Thanks for all the help.

[Batman 2]

Hi Maxim,

Very good and complete explanation. Especially the FKK which you offered with low enterance cost. I will definitely try it during my stay on early May.


About actual reviews: most of the frequent visitors are from Germany, Holland and Belgium, so it is quite understandable most actual updates can be found on the German, Dutch and Belgian fora, but then you have to understand German, Dutch or French.

Enjoy, where ever you go!Can you tell me what is the address for the German version ot he Forum? As I'm using a translator to access those forums, I don't think I face any problem in reading them.

[Maxime]

He maxime, don't knock the pauschal clubs just yet. You're girl Anka (formerly Babylon) is now in Pauschalclub Bochum. Knowing that actually makes me want to try the concept again.

Good advise in general though!I know, unbelievable she works there. The first (and only) stunner in a PC I have ever met. Pity she will be on holiday in 22 minutes from now. Let's she if she returns and we can try to meet there one day.). :)

[Maxime]

Hi all and esp Swingerlover,
I have some questions which after reading this forum I haven't found any answers.



1. I read that partythreff is a place where you pay one fee and you can feast the girls. But how much is the entrance fee and what then is partyclub?

Euro 99-149 depending on the club.


2. What is AO?

Alles Ohne (Gummi) , so the same as Bareback.


3. Bareback gangbang-do they do HIV test first? No fear of contacting any STD?

In some BB gangbangs they do HIV test. Most AO places / clubs not, so be careful where you go (and in any case, be careful in this field!)


4. I notice most partythreff is at Dusseldorf, are there any in Frankfurt as I will mostly be staying there.

Spermagames and GB01 have sometimes AO parties in that area (see SL AO map)


5. Porn filming, where are they, does it mean we can watch and can we join?

Many places: Spermastudio, GB01, Boris Senking, etc.

[Maxime]

Hi Maxim,

Very good and complete explanation. Especially the FKK which you offered with low enterance cost. I will definitely try it during my stay on early May.

Can you tell me what is the address for the German version ot he Forum? As I'm using a translator to access those forums, I don't think I face any problem in reading them.FC: http://freiercafe.com/forum.php

LS: http://www.lustscout.tk/forum/index.php

RF: http://www.rheinforum.com/forum/private.php

YBF: http://www.ijsberenforum.com/forum/forum.php

Youppie: http://www.youppie.net/forum/forum.php?

Have fun!

[Breadman]

I think the forum leaders can help a lot for this issue.How much per day do you have to spend? What's your age bracket and what type of girls are you looking for (age, looks, service)? What city is your main hunting ground or do you plan on renting a car or using public transportation? You've got to be more specific with your questions.

I agree 100% with maxime, you pay for what you get. Cheap club entrance, you get a cheap club (in most cases). Low rates for the girls, etc (follow my drift).

I visited a partytreff up in Wagenfeld (dolce vita) many years back. 4 really good lookers (one of which was a 9 in my book). The other 10 were 5 in looks or less (chunky, saggy tits, big stomachs, just ugly). Went back again and the one hot one answered the door. Paid entrance only to find out she was now the bartender and off limits. All the good lookers were gone, only the ugly ones remained.

[Batman 2]

How much per day do you have to spend? What's your age bracket and what type of girls are you looking for (age, looks, service)? What city is your main hunting ground or do you plan on renting a car or using public transportation? You've got to be more specific with your questions.I can spend 100-150 per day per person (as we are 2 guys).

We are around 40 years old.

Looking for young aged girls (max 35!). Look is first priority and service ofcourse is important!

We will rent a car.

We will stay in Dusseldorf (but have no limitation to stay somewhere else as we didn't book our hotel and planning to get our room everynight based on the location we go for party. Is this a good idea?)

Hope I became more specific now.

[Justume]

Spermagames and GB01 have sometimes AO parties in that area (see SL AO map)

So that means our timing being in Frankfurt must be right. So looks like Spermagames moves about using various venue?

Many places: Spermastudio, GB01, Boris Senking, etc.[/QUOTE]In these studio, we are allowed to watch. How about joining in. Not that we want to be pornstar, we don't qualify anyway.

Thanks

[Breadman]

I can spend 100-150 per day per person (as we are 2 guys).Do you have the map of all the clubs around Dusseldorf? If not google "google monger map" and click on the first link, it will show you 'all' the clubs around your area and then some.

I'm going to assume 150 per day is just for the clubs, that's not a whole lot to spread around. If your factoring in hotel and gas into that amount it won't be enough. Most hotels charge extra for a second person, you might want to try sneaking in your friend and only paying a single person fee. This is easy if you stay in one of those old etap hotels if their still around up there. Otherwise make sure you get free breakfast at every hotel. I would suggest you budget a weekend and visit Acapulco if possible. Get there for the happy hour 30 euro entry and budget yourself to 5 girls, total for 5 half hours without any extra's should run you 230 euro's total. You'll see some nice looking girls and get an idea what the bigger clubs are like. Couple of years back I was talking to two asian guys at World and they mentioned they rented a large car and they'd sleep in it, one in the front and one in the back. Wouldn't be too comfortable for two guys in one car but if your at a club like Acapulco that closes at 3am, it would only be for a couple of hours.

Partytreff Dorsten probably has some decent looking girls http://www.partytreff-dorsten.de/preise.php?language=en And the price is right. Just don't expect to see the playboy playmate they have on their price list page.

Have you considered other options like Penelope, Belami etc? The smaller clubs where you get low entry into the club and the girls are cheaper. Belami looks to have a 3 girls for 100 deal that includes entry.

As to getting the best looks and service, id have to say Acapulco is your best bet (and cheapest money wise for the highest looks to pay factor). I'd also suggest you budget your driving, gas will kill a budget fast if your driving all over the countryside trying to find these clubs. Get a gps, that will save money in the long run.

[Breadman]

http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/poor-hygiene-standards-germany-closes-two-flat-rate-brothels-a-638594.html

Two pussy clubs closed down by the government.

"Some 700 officers raided so-called "Pussy Clubs" in Berlin, Fellbach near Stuttgart, Heidelberg and Wuppertal and two of them -- in Fellbach and Heidelberg -- have been closed due to poor sanitary conditions, officials said."

[Rupert Pupkin2]

Just a couple of simple questions about the language thing.

I only speak English. I am learning a little bit of Dutch and will do the same with German, but nowhere near enough to communicate properly with anybody. So I was wondering if it's very disadvantageous to only be able to speak English in these flat rate clubs? Do the employees generally speak English? Roughly what percentage of the girls would speak English? Do English speakers often get unfavourable treatment from the girls, as opposed to people who speak their language? And very importantly, if I'm to call these clubs on the phone, will I generally be able to speak to a representative of the club in English?

[Creature2]

http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/poor-hygiene-standards-germany-closes-two-flat-rate-brothels-a-638594.html

Two pussy clubs closed down by the government.

"Some 700 officers raided so-called "Pussy Clubs" in Berlin, Fellbach near Stuttgart, Heidelberg and Wuppertal and two of them. In Fellbach and Heidelberg. Have been closed due to poor sanitary conditions, officials said."Are those up to date info? As far as I know those clubs should already been closed 3 years ago.

[SwingerLover]

Are those up to date info? As far as I know those clubs should already been closed 3 years ago.And you are quite right. The posted link leads to an article from July 27th 2009.


if I'm to call these clubs on the phone, will I generally be able to speak to a representative of the club in English?There's no general answer possible here, it will depend on the club. Some personnel or even girls might speak English, at other places no one might speak English at all.


I can spend 100-150 per day per person (as we are 2 guys).

We didn't book our hotel and planning to get our room everynight based on the location we go for party. Is this a good idea?) Switching hotels might be a good idea if you don't mind the hassle that comes along with it. (Like packing and unpacking and registering and such.) It also depends on how far your party locations are apart. If for instance you stay in Gelsenkirchen, then I wouldn't bother switching hotels for a trip to Bochum. If you intend to go to Moers, Mönchengladbach or Köln from there, then switching hotels might be a good idea.

100-150 € per day for partying without public sex but with young beauties might become a difficult task. I think Maxime, Breadman and FreeDude covered most of this question already. I cannot help much here, since I'm very much into the groupsex thing and my info on behind-closed-doors-Partytreffs is out of date. Still, here's what little I can tell:

At Treff188 in Eschborn near Frankfurt you get to stay from 11:00 or 13:00 to 1:00 or 3:00 (depending on the day) for 90 €, softdrinks & snacks & covered sex with all girls behind closed doors included. Can't say about quality these days. http://treff-188.de/

Then there's Cleopatra-Arena in Gelsenkirchen with their Flatrate-Wednesday. 80 € for covered; 100 € for bareback (with the girls who offer it) as often as you like, including snacks & drinks and using the facilities while staying there from 11-2:00. You will propably have to downgrade your expectations on looks here a lot. But according to Wanking you can get one-on-one action behind closed doors most of the time. http://www.cleopatra-arena.de/events.htm

Another place in Gelsenkirchen is Partyclub Gelsenkirchen-Buer. 80 € for 15 hours of partying, including AO. http://www.partyclub-gelsenkirchen-buer.de/

LaLuna in Moers on the All-Inclusive days is another option; 100 € for covered; 130 € for bareback. Propably better looking girls, but I don't know about closed-doors-sex on those days. www.club-laluna-moers.de

In Mönchengladbach is Partytreff MG-Rheydt. http://partytreff-mg-rheydt.de/

Except for Treff188 I haven't been to any of those clubs. I have been to Schneewittchen in Viersen and relax-today in Kerpen however, which I do not recommend!

[SwingerLover]

Hi all and esp Swingerlover, Maxime already answered most of your question. In addition:

1. Partytreff, Partyclub and Pauschalclub generally describes the same thing. I'd say the price range is from 50 to 150 €. Most Partytreffs provide only covered sex.

2. AO = Alles Ohne; translates as: All without. Meaning without condoms.

3. If you look at my Bareback / AO maps, you will see which places require or even provide HIV-testing. No fear of contracting STDs, at least no greater fear than getting lung cancer from the sometimes chain-smoking girls.

4. I don't consider Frankfurt to be the best place to stay; you will have to drive a lot. Düsseldorf itself isn't any better; pick another city, in the area where you like to party.


So that means our timing being in Frankfurt must be right. So looks like Spermagames moves about using various venue?

Many places: Spermastudio, GB01, Boris Senking, etc. In these studio, we are allowed to watch. How about joining in. Not that we want to be pornstar, we don't qualify anyway.Spermagames currently uses two locations, one in Karlsruhe and one in Köln, and they are planning for a third one in Bürstadt near Darmstadt. Currently there is one party per week, mostly on Thursdays and switching between the two locations.

5. Porn filming: Of course you can watch and join if you paid for it. And don't need to "qualify". It's mostly like a Spermagames-Gangbang, only with a camera and propably some "stage directing" from the filmteam. For options check the pornstars' and organizer's websites and my AO-maps.

Are you looking for Bareback only or covered sex as well?

[Batman 2]

Dear SwingerLover,

Thanks for the time spent and detailed explanation.


Switching hotels might be a good idea if you don't mind the hassle that comes along with it. (Like packing and unpacking and registering and such.) It also depends on how far your party locations are apart. If for instance you stay in Gelsenkirchen, then I wouldn't bother switching hotels for a trip to Bochum. If you intend to go to Moers, Mönchengladbach or Köln from there, then switching hotels might be a good idea.I'm totally agree with you and definitely follow your guidelines.


100-150 € per day for partying without public sex but with young beauties might become a difficult task.I have been in a partytreff flatrate club in Hannover last year and apart from the (monstly) public and group sex existing there, it was possible to approach the girls to go with me in a room for action and non of the girls were recusing. Is it something I can expect in clubs with public action? And what's the re-action of girls if I approach them this?


At Treff188 in Eschborn near Frankfurt you get to stay from 11:00 or 13:00 to 1:00 or 3:00 (depending on the day) for 90 €, softdrinks & snacks & covered sex with all girls behind closed doors included. Can't say about quality these days.

http://treff-188.de/How can I know about the quality? How many girls are there? Anybody had experience recently? Do they provide details on their girls and lineups on their website?


Then there's Cleopatra-Arena in Gelsenkirchen with their Flatrate-Wednesday. 80 € for covered; 100 € for bareback (with the girls who offer it) as often as you like, including snacks & drinks and using the facilities while staying there from 11-2:00. You will propably have to downgrade your expectations on looks here a lot. But according to Wanking you can get one-on-one action behind closed doors most of the time.

http://www.cleopatra-arena.de/events.htm

Another place in Gelsenkirchen is Partyclub Gelsenkirchen-Buer. 80 € for 15 hours of partying, including AO.

http://www.partyclub-gelsenkirchen-buer.de/

LaLuna in Moers on the All-Inclusive days is another option; 100 € for covered; 130 € for bareback. Propably better looking girls, but I don't know about closed-doors-sex on those days.

www.club-laluna-moers.de

In Mönchengladbach is Partytreff MG-Rheydt.

http://partytreff-mg-rheydt.de/Interesting to see your recommendation on these clubs. Generally on posts related to these clubs (which are quite old!) I see mainly negative posts from visitors.

On the other side Pauschal clubs like Harrem have good lineups and most of reports are positive. Myself last year were in Harrem and experienced a fantastic time. The manager told me at 5pm the number of girls will reach to 35. I thought she is joking but at 6pm there were more than 20 girls free (I think more than 10 girls at that tine very busy in rooms or sranding behind a room to become empty.

But I'm not sure if it's the same in these days as last year because there is no useful update since a long time back.


Except for Treff188 I haven't been to any of those clubs. I have been to Schneewittchen in Viersen and relax-today in Kerpen however, which I do not recommend!Can you somehow explain more details on this club and its girls? After your post, it's becoming in my interest now.

[Member #4297]

On Tuesday I just had the worst experience of my life in mc sex in hamm, the girls just wanted to be left alone and even when they go to rooms they offer a bad service so the customer will not take them again.

In my opinion one of the main reasons for this disaster day was the way the girls get paid Olivia explained to me that at the end of every day the club divides the money on the girls, so of course it make sense that the girls are not going to give a fuck about the attitude, service etc.

So guys I was thinking if we can share some information about clubs where the girls get paid per session, of course other than the PC chain.

Because personally there is no way that I am going to visit a place again where the girls does not get paid per session.

Happy mongering everybody!

[SwingerLover]

On Tuesday I just had the worst experience of my life in mc sex in hamm,

Because personally there is no way that I am going to visit a place again where the girls does not get paid per session.I have heard and read nothing but negative reports about MC-Sex in Hamm so far. But I don't think it's fair to not visit other flatrate PTs anymore because of one lousy place. And yes, it's not the only lousy place.

I for one had bad experiences at Schneewittchen in Viersen, relax-today in Kerpen and Hindenburgstraße 218 in Mönchengladbach. Based on reports, I would add MC-Sex to that blacklist without ever having been there.

No such trouble at the bareback parties in Krefeld (groupsex) or Treff 188 in Eschborn (mostly one-on-one these days) when I had been there.


Dear SwingerLover, Thanks for the time spent and detailed explanation.

Is it something I can expect in clubs with public action? And what's the re-action of girls if I approach them this?You're welcome. And I don't know what reaction to expect, I guess it's different at different clubs.


How can I know about the quality? How many girls are there? Anybody had experience recently? Do they provide details on their girls and lineups on their website?http://treff-188.de/girls.html

I recall reading something about Treff 188 a while back, propably in the Other Partytreffs thread or in the Frankfurt thread of the Germany forum. About quality? Well, just give it a try and have a little patience if necessary. I'm curious about their current quality status myself. It will surely be better that what GoldenTiger described about MC-Sex in Hamm.


Interesting to see your recommendation on these clubs. Generally on posts related to these clubs (which are quite old!) I see mainly negative posts from visitors.I'm waiting on reports about those places I haven't been to myself. BareBacker74 was at LaLuna in Moers last week and wrote a report.


Can you somehow explain more details on this club and its girls? After your post, it's becoming in my interest now.No. I don't know any of those girls that are there now. I haven't been there for nearly two years, because I didn't like the behind-closed-doors-only attitude of the girls at that time. So I cannot give any more info.

[Member #4297]

Yes SwingerLover, defiantly add MC sex to your black list, its a waste of money, time and if you were lucky to get the girls to the rooms then it will be a waste of sperm also, the only people who seemed to enjoy their time in MC sex are regular customers. Even in German forums when I translated a bit people were talking about the idea of investment in MC sex (they mean visiting the club over and over again until you become regular so you will have a good time)

About Treff 188 and the other good places that you know about do you know if any of these clubs pay the girls per session just like the PC chain? , if there isn't any I am thinking about switching to low cost FKK just like what Dark Vader advice me 1 month ago in this thread.

[SvenFKK]

I recall reading something about Treff 188 a while back, propably in the Other Partytreffs thread or in the Frankfurt thread of the Germany forum.Older reports here and elsewhere tend to be negative. I have never been there myself. However, more recent reports sound more encouraging. Their website has also been revamped (no pun intended). Single-room service is available; I don't know if this is the only option or if there is public sex as well. Sauna, whirlpool (outside). Not that large, but probably reasonably OK.

No AO (good in my book). FO (BBBJ) seems to be standard. It appears that only FT (CIM) and AV (A-levels) cost EUR 20 extra per pop. Personally, I can do without both. AV is not that different than pussy sex, so no big loss. (The real advantage is that girls who do it are usually better otherwise.) BBBJ is essential; CBJ is not for me. CIM is better, but really I like her to swallow, which is rare for paysex (and probably with girlfriends as well, though my wife happily swallows). If she doesn't swallow, then CIM is not that essential.

They have 2 or 3 FKK days per week. That has become rare at Partytreffs.

I might check them out in the next couple of weeks.

This club is very near Frankfurt. If you take S3 or S4 from downtown, get off at Eschborn Süthe and it's a ten-minute walk. It's also right near the Autobahn, so a taxi from the airport shouldn't be that expensive.

Their FAQ has a link to the FAQ at Pauschalclub Münster, so perhaps they are affiliated. (I know I've read about Pauschalclub Münster here, but it doesn't have a thread. Where are the reports on it?)

[SwingerLover]

Single-room service is available; I don't know if this is the only option or if there is public sex as well. Sauna, whirlpool (outside). Not that large, but probably reasonably OK.There is one big room at the end of the hallway which is meant for gangbang and public sex. The last times I had been there, it was hardly ever used. Even if all five single-rooms were occupied, the sixth girl rather waited outside with her current guest for the room to become available again instead of using the big room. This hideaway-behind-closed-doors behaviour is the main reason why I had stopped going there. When I looked for other options, I discovered the AO parties...

The small whirlpool and sauna used to be outside, when you passed through the locker room. Nothing fancy, but a nice enough small outside area too, if the weather was good enough to spend time outside.


They have 2 or 3 FKK days per week. That has become rare at Partytreffs.

I might check them out in the next couple of weeks.Well, FKK-days must be a recent installment then, definitely an upside. ('Recent' meaning somewhere last year.) There was no FKK there when I was there last in 2011.

If you check it out, we expect a detailed report of course. I'm tempted to say: "Give my regards to Joana.", who is managing the club, but she doesn't know who is behind my nickname.

[MammothMeat]

Any suggestions as to wich city is the "best" for me?

I want to experience almost all sides of this "hobby", meaning swingers-clubs, fkk, flatrate incl. Gangbang, PartyTreffen.

Budget traveler, but no job that I have to return home for, I am retired and living on my pension.

Tips?

[Maxime]

Any suggestions as to wich city is the "best" for me?

I want to experience almost all sides of this "hobby", meaning swingers-clubs, fkk, flatrate incl. Gangbang, PartyTreffen.

Budget traveler, but no job that I have to return home for, I am retired and living on my pension.

Tips?Welcome to the club!

It is a very broad question you ask.

Gangbang parties are the most widespread in NRW (around Dusseldorf) and Hamburg (mainly GB01).

A flatrate club where you can have 1-on-1 sessiones you find also on many places, but there are only few good ones, PC Bochum (+ Dortmund + Munster, same chain) is good exception, only covered, if you want AO flatrate, you get in clubs with (much) lesser looking girls, but if you don't care, you can try LaLuna on Monday and Friday, Cleopetra Arena, etc.

For me, the best girls you find in the better FKK and sauna clubs, but these are seldom flat-rate. Good ones are Oase in Frankfurt (more than 100 stunners with good service!) but smaller ones are mostly again in NRW (Babylon, Freude, Luder Lounge and Bernds are considered high0service clubs). Avoid the big clubs like Golden Time, PHG, Living Room, Villa Vertigo, etc, since there are many "sharks" that ask lot of money, but offer little service (exceptions of course are present in these big clubs). Of course if you are "new" you might be easily impressed by the line up in e. G. GT, but chances you find a stunner offering good service are much lower than in the "service clubs" mentioned.

Enjoy!

[Batman 2]

Any suggestions as to wich city is the "best" for me?

I want to experience almost all sides of this "hobby", meaning swingers-clubs, fkk, flatrate incl. Gangbang, PartyTreffen.

Budget traveler, but no job that I have to return home for, I am retired and living on my pension.

Tips?I'm not an experienced person. But personally I always prefer to stay in NRW (specially in Dusseldorf region). Because you will have lots of options and it is more easy to search for a proper and fitting club. Unless there is a target which you know it and would like to go. In this case, you may go directly to that location.

[SwingerLover]

Club Angelique Gold in Duisburg is closed for "organisatorial reasons"! (Whatever that means.) The original Club Angelique in Viersen remains open. www.club-angelique.de/

[Free Dude]

The club announced this almost a week ago on freiercafe; it sounds like it is a permanent thing (they used the word 'aufgeben') , all the girls can now be found in Vierssen-Dulken.

[Member #4297]

Guys,

I am really sorry for asking this for the second time, its just the type of questions that RTFF won't help.

Any one knows any partytreffs or pauschal clubs where the girls get paid per session just like the PC chain? (you pay the money at the entrance, and every time a girl go with you to a room she gets a little money from the club)

Sorry again for repeating the question for the second time and defiantly there is no third time.

[SwingerLover]

Any one knows any partytreffs or pauschal clubs where the girls get paid per session just like the PC chain? (you pay the money at the entrance, and every time a girl go with you to a room she gets a little money from the club) No wonder that RTFF didn't help. Pauschal (= flatrate) Clubs with pay per session is kind of asking for cold heat or wet dryness. If you pay only the flatrate entrance fee with sex included and no extra pay for each session, then that's the regular Partytreff concept. How the entrance fee is divided and the women are paid is up to the club and girls themselves, so it's a little difficult to tell if they all get an equal share of the flatrete fee or if they are paid by sessions.

I recall reading somewhere that some places keep some kind of tally sheets about which girl went to the rooms how often, but I can't remember the clubs. No place I remember being to. Maybe LaLuna Moers on their All-inclusive day?

I suppose your question is based on the fear that if they don't get paid by sessions, they would not perform properly? If so then I don't think that's anything to worry about. However the money is divided, even if you pay for each women seperate like at an FKK, there's always hit & miss! So the only way to find out is the trial-and-error-method. And sharing info on open forum.

I've heard from guys who felt cheated at an FKK where they had paid seperately for half an hour with a woman and got lousy service, while the half hour was shrunk to 25 minutes and the girl tried to charge for another half hour for the missing 5 minutes. Others seem to be happy at the same place, maybe with different women.

At a flatrate place, I don't think it matters if they get paid flat or by session. If paid per session, then they might have an incentive to fuck more; but if the number of sessions increases along with it, then they must get paid less for each session. I would prefer a payment of same money for every girl. Because if one of them should underperform and try to slide through the day without working, then there will be major "Zickenterror" from the other women. I've seen this occasionally at AO-parties in Krefeld. The use of "Bitchcraft" usually keeps everybody in check, and if one girl tries to avoid customers too much, then she gets hell from the other. Or is there for the last time.

And if they should ALL be crap and the avoiding kind at the same place, then that club should not be open for very long and word should get around quickly in the meantime. That's what a forum is for as well, to share info about bad experiences.

[Varenne]

How the entrance fee is divided and the women are paid is up to the club and girls themselves, so it's a little difficult to tell if they all get an equal share of the flatrete fee or if they are paid by sessions.It's unlikely that a club will pay the girls per session without any limitation, that will be too risky. At Laluna the girls are paid per session, but the customer is limited in the number of sessions available. At PC chain, the girls get a share of the club daily income, which is proportional to the number of session they performed on the day. This surely limits the risks for the management, as the total sum which is paid to the girls will always be only a part of the daily income, even if all the customers fucked like rabbits all day long. It SHOULD also stimulate the girls to offer good service to maximize the number of sessions, and therefore the revenue. What happens really is that the girls don't compete, but agree that each provider should have offer the same limited number of sessions. This way they as a team will work the least, while the total sum paid by the club is unchanged. When a girl starts to reach the number of agreed sessions, she will try to let down the customers (pretending she must take a rest, have a cigarette, go to restroom, is already booked.). In this kind of clubs the sessions will be usually unrushed, with post coital conversation, massages or the like. Actually there's no reason for a girl to become available again too soon, she will have to stay in the club till closing time even if she has reached the agreed number of sessions and must therefore go on idle state. But getting a session isn't easy, especially with the most attractive girls. If you paid only for a short stay on a busy day, you'll probably regret not having visited a normal FKK instead. Club Globe tried to stimulate competition by setting targets for the girls, like "you get a 50€ bonus if you do at least 20 sessions". The outcome was that the girls were pushy only as long as they though the target could be reached. Towards the evening, the hopeless ones started to plainly refuse to session, as the token they received anyway for each session was not worth the effort.

[Member #4297]

Thanks SwingerLover and Varenne, its always helpful to get info from experienced members on how things works.

When I talked with Olivia in MC sex in Hamm (a club where the girls get paid only by the divided daily income) she said to me "this paying system is much better because its fair, everybody will get the same money at the end of the day", she was very relaxed about this system because the girl who will work restlessly and a girl who will spend most of the day playing on her mobile will get the same money at the end of the day.

I am not talking about MC sex specifically but what I am saying is that if I was a sex worker (that is an awkward example LOL) in a club that pay the girls only by dividing the club daily income then it make sense that I am not going to be motivated to satisfy a tourist who is visiting the club for the first time and leaving Germany after few days which mean 99% he is not visiting and paying the Tagesticket again.

But since my opinion is based only on a few visits so I must say that your opinions is much more likely to be accurate than mine.

I am going to add La Luna and even club Globe to my list and report about them, (BTW club globe turned into sauna club or a low cost FKK with 30 Euro entrance but according to few other forums its still possible to pay the normal 100 Euro for 4 hours or 150 Euro for full day)

Thanks again guys, very helpful comments.

Happy mongering everybody.

[ThomasNorway]

As far as my impression goes, Partytreff clubs are supposed to be geared towards "public action" as opposed to private rooms. Yet, from my rather modest experience, this is not always the case. I've only been to four places and my experience has leaned towards the private version.

- At LaLuna on all-inclusive-tag, at least in the old location, there was one large room for action, two rooms with couches and three small rooms for action. The girls consistently favored the private rooms if they were available. Never saw any action in the couch-rooms.

- At Mettman there were no private rooms, so public action there was a given.

- At Cleopatra Arena I only had one session, even though it was an all-inclusive party, but this was in a private room. Never saw any public action here either.

- For the life of me, I can't remember the name or place of the last club I went to (it's been two and a half years. It might no longer exist) , but I do remember that there was no action in public areas.

My question then is this; does anyone know which clubs are good for public action? I'd love to visit a place that has something of that "roman orgy" feel to it.

[SwingerLover]

My question then is this; does anyone know which clubs are good for public action? I'd love to visit a place that has something of that "roman orgy" feel to it.Yes, I love that too. The AO-parties (bareback) I go to are always like that. Have a look at my AO-maps.

As for regular rubber-Partytreffs, I don't know. I don't go to those anymore, and the few I know also seem to tend more towards the go-to-the-room-and-close-the-door system. Although I'm sure that there are PTs with public action. Erlebniswohnung in Berlin most definitely, judging from the reports on ISG. I think Erotiktreff 95 (in Schwerte?) too, if I remember correctly. For everything else check the German advertising sites and look for "Gangbang" or "Orgie": www.fickanzeigen.net www.fickreklame.com

The parties at Private-Sunshine in Mönchengladbach are likewise public, but they happen only sporadically. Like next Thursday, May 16th: http://privat-sunshine.de/index.php/de/

[Dark Vader]

As far as my impression goes, Partytreff clubs are supposed to be geared towards "public action" as opposed to private rooms. Yet, from my rather modest experience, this is not always the case. I've only been to four places and my experience has leaned towards the private version.As a general rule, Pauschal clubs will have closed door action whilst Partytreffs will have public action.

Examples of the latter would include Mettmann, Wagenfeld, Baldis, Xantener, Bielefeld and Dorsten (although the latest report has it that this has now changed to closed door action).

As you say though this is still no guarantee and clubs are liable to change their policies on a whim and so you need to keep up to date with the latest forum reports.

Gangbang clubs and swinger clubs are much safer bets for public action. Examples of the former would include: Erotiktreff-95, Seesternchen, Anjas leidenschafte, Erlebniswohhnung, Zhuzha, Saskia Farell whilst the latter would include Beverly, Caesars, Le Coq, P3 Frivole Lounge, Lippkick etc.

WanKing does his best to keep tabs on the scene via his map http://goo.gl/maps/HHXB0 but it's daunting task akin to painting the Forth Bridge given the rapidity with which clubs open and close and change their genre.

[ThomasNorway]

Yes, I love that too. The AO-parties (bareback) I go to are always like that. Have a look at my AO-maps.

As for regular rubber-Partytreffs, I don't know. I don't go to those anymore, and the few I know also seem to tend more towards the go-to-the-room-and-close-the-door system. Although I'm sure that there are PTs with public action. Erlebniswohnung in Berlin most definitely, judging from the reports on ISG. I think Erotiktreff 95 (in Schwerte?) too, if I remember correctly. For everything else check the German advertising sites and look for "Gangbang" or "Orgie":

www.fickanzeigen.net

www.fickreklame.com

The parties at Private-Sunshine in Mönchengladbach are likewise public, but they happen only sporadically. Like next Thursday, May 16th:

http://privat-sunshine.de/index.php/de/I'm inclined to lean towards AO, but I'd do a good rubber-party as well if that's what's on offer. Private-Sunshine looks like a great line-up. Pity they only party sporadically as I'm going to have a fairly limited window of opportunity.


As a general rule, Pauschal clubs will have closed door action whilst Partytreffs will have public action.

Examples of the latter would include Mettmann, Wagenfeld, Baldis, Xantener, Bielefeld and Dorsten (although the latest report has it that this has now changed to closed door action).

As you say though this is still no guarantee and clubs are liable to change their policies on a whim and so you need to keep up to date with the latest forum reports.

Gangbang clubs and swinger clubs are much safer bets for public action. Examples of the former would include: Erotiktreff-95, Seesternchen, Anjas leidenschafte, Erlebniswohhnung, Zhuzha, Saskia Farell whilst the latter would include Beverly, Caesars, Le Coq, P3 Frivole Lounge, Lippkick etc.

WanKing does his best to keep tabs on the scene via his map.

http://goo.gl/maps/HHXB0

But it's daunting task akin to painting the Forth Bridge given the rapidity with which clubs open and close and change their genre.Thanks for all tips. I'll try keeping tabs on everything for my trip. I'm heading for Germany in late-June, and then again in mid-August. Hopefully I'll get some memorable experiences on both trips! .

[Sammi123]

I have spent many a wonderful day / night at FFKs (Oase, World, Palace, Aca, Sharks, Hawaii, etc, etc). I am really intrigued by Pauschaclubs.

I am going to be coming to the NRW again soon for just a day, I was plan on going to Aca as I have many times before, but I was thinking to go to a Pauschaclub instead. I've gotten some idea reading through the thread, but can someone highlight the pluses and minuses of choosing one over the other? For a first time Pauschaclub goer (but FKK-experienced) , which club would you suggest?

Thanks in advance.

[Maxime]

I have spent many a wonderful day / night at FFKs (Oase, World, Palace, Aca, Sharks, Hawaii, etc, etc). I am really intrigued by Pauschaclubs.

I am going to be coming to the NRW again soon for just a day, I was plan on going to Aca as I have many times before, but I was thinking to go to a Pauschaclub instead. I've gotten some idea reading through the thread, but can someone highlight the pluses and minuses of choosing one over the other? For a first time Pauschaclub goer (but FKK-experienced) , which club would you suggest?

Thanks in advance.When you are used to FKKs, most PCs will be a major disappoitment (regarding looks and service of the girls). The only exception might be PauschalClub Bochum (and Dortmund and Munster, same chain) which can be ok. Each other PC is rubbish IMHO, so don't spent your time (and money) to it, certainly not if you like the other clubs you mention. If you want to try something much better than Aca (regarding to service of the girls) try the service clubs Babylon or Panthera. Less girls than in Aca, but chances on bad service are zero-to-nothing, also with all the very good looking girls (compare that to all the beauties in Aca that tend to not kiss, not be willing to do anything at all etc, etc)

[Sammi123]

When you are used to FKKs, most PCs will be a major disappoitment (regarding looks and service of the girls). The only exception might be PauschalClub Bochum (and Dortmund and Munster, same chain) which can be ok. Each other PC is rubbish IMHO, so don't spent your time (and money) to it, certainly not if you like the other clubs you mention. If you want to try something much better than Aca (regarding to service of the girls) try the service clubs Babylon or Panthera. Less girls than in Aca, but chances on bad service are zero-to-nothing, also with all the very good looking girls (compare that to all the beauties in Aca that tend to not kiss, not be willing to do anything at all etc, etc)This is very helpful. Thank you.

[Rintin4]

When you are used to FKKs, most PCs will be a major disappoitment (regarding looks and service of the girls). The only exception might be PauschalClub Bochum (and Dortmund and Munster, same chain) which can be ok. Each other PC is rubbish IMHO, so don't spent your time (and money) to it, certainly not if you like the other clubs you mention. If you want to try something much better than Aca (regarding to service of the girls) try the service clubs Babylon or Panthera. Less girls than in Aca, but chances on bad service are zero-to-nothing, also with all the very good looking girls (compare that to all the beauties in Aca that tend to not kiss, not be willing to do anything at all etc, etc)It sound like PC Bochum / Dortmund / Munster offers the best looking girls in the PC circuit? Are there any PT clubs that are known for scoring high in terms of the physical attractiveness of the women?

Going to NRW area and am interested in trying my first flatrate club. Have been to FKK's before but never a flatrate. I actually like the "orgy" open air type clubs and would prefer that. But at least for this first trip I think the main variable I would like to maximize in my forumla is finding the flatrate (whether PC or PT) that has the best looking women (I know that's not always the most important factor. But at least on this trip that is what I would like to search for).

[Ossian]

Interesting article by The Guardian (UK Broadsheet). With 90%+ of the Romanian / Bulgarian hookers in Germany in debt to Managers / Pimps can changes to the 2002 Sex Laws be far away?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/shortcuts/2013/jun/12/germany-now-europes-biggest-brothel

Does the German nation want this type of publicity? I think not!

[SvenFKK]

Interesting article by The Guardian (UK Broadsheet). With 90%+ of the Romanian / Bulgarian hookers in Germany in debt to Managers / Pimps can changes to the 2002 Sex Laws be far away?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/shortcuts/2013/jun/12/germany-now-europes-biggest-brothel

Does the German nation want this type of publicity? I think not!Well, pimping is illegal now, so changing the laws would not affect this. If a person does X and Y, and X is illegal, then how could outlawing Y prevent him from doing X?

Yes, it might be that many people from Romania and Bulgaria (not just sex workers) are attracted to Germany via unrealistic promises from various agents etc. Either one wants the possibility for people from one EU country to work in another, or not.

Certainly restricting prostitution itself would make their situation worse: no customer could report suspicious stuff to the police without incriminating himself, the lack of legal prostitution would make illegal prostitution more attractive, if prostitution itself is illegal people will have fewer qualms about doing other things related to it which are already illegal and should stay illegal.

[Ossian]

The rest of Europe (excluding the German Countries) are moving towards a Scandinavian (Swedish) model which has both reduced the number of prostitutes working and the number of customers seeking prostitutes. We may not like it but that is the way that most Western European Countries are moving (particularly France and to a lesser extent the United Kingdom and Republic of Ireland). The Scandinanvian Countries (particularly Sweden and Norway) have already put in place severe restrictions not against prostitution itself but against those who seek prostitutes. Even Netherlands may change the current laws because they encourage trafficking. Germany is under pressure (from the European Union) to change the current Laws relating to Prostitution because of the perception that the current system encourages prostitution.

[F Nature]

I'm not german myself, but I understand most of what they said in the documentary Sex Made in Germany.

It wasn't some big undercover journalism revealing terrible conditions as the article in that english newspaper would have you believe.

They just got to the conclusion that the german state is now the biggest "pimp" since they benefit greatly from various taxes in the sex business, LOL.

Here is the short preview of the documentary, the journalists say they don't think prostitution in Germany should be banned but it needs some more regulations, all is not functioning well. Sorana who worked at the now closed down Pussy Club, that WK visited several times LOL, says conditions there were very bad, she had to work almost non-stop with very little sleep or other breaks. On the other hand Bettina who works at Paradise in Stuttgart says the job is fun, she gets paid to provide a service.

http://www.stern.de/kultur/tv/ard-doku-sex-made-in-germany-der-staat-ist-der-groesste-zuhaelter-2022993.html

[MrLowKey]

What statistics do you refer to when you write that the "swedish model" has both reduced the number of prostitutes and the number of customers seeking prostitutes?

From other sources I have heard that it has just "moved" underground. I don't say you are wrong, since I am not seeking prostitutes in Sweden any longer. I go to Germany instead LOL.


The rest of Europe (excluding the German Countries) are moving towards a Scandinavian (Swedish) model which has both reduced the number of prostitutes working and the number of customers seeking prostitutes. We may not like it but that is the way that most Western European Countries are moving (particularly France and to a lesser extent the United Kingdom and Republic of Ireland). The Scandinanvian Countries (particularly Sweden and Norway) have already put in place severe restrictions not against prostitution itself but against those who seek prostitutes. Even Netherlands may change the current laws because they encourage trafficking. Germany is under pressure (from the European Union) to change the current Laws relating to Prostitution because of the perception that the current system encourages prostitution.

[Wanking]

Sorana who worked at the now closed down Pussy Club, that WK visited several times LOL, says conditions there were very bad, she had to work almost non-stop with very little sleep or other breaks.I visited the Pussy club in Wuppertal 6 or 8 times while it was going in 2009. I'd say conditions for the girls were no worse than any other flat rate clubs, infact the vibe seemed positive there with all the dancing and stuff. I had some memorable sessions there, and great times. My only complaint is that there was no AO there!

[Kommodore]

I'd say conditions for the girls were no worse than any other flat rate clubs, infact the vibe seemed positive there with all the dancing and stuff.That's the problem. Conditions in any of these flat rate clubs are not proving to be acceptable. If everything is so good why all this negative publicity? Why all this talk about bad conditions and trafficking? Why all these TV Programmes on German Television (there have been several in the last 12 to 18 months) and why all the articles in the domestic and foreign press. The business has got too big, with too much criminal involvement and too many foreigners travelling to Germany for sex tourism. Everything was ok up until about 5 years ago. The market catered primarily for German mongers and there were fewer clubs and significantly less criminal involvement. The whole business has got bigger and bigger and bigger and now the spotlight of international media is focussing on the subject. In my opinion big change is inevitable.

[SvenFKK]

First, while it is true that Norway, Sweden and Iceland (but not Denmark) have criminalized the customers (but not the prostitutes) , there are plans in Norway to reverse this, as it didn't have the desired effect. Yes, there are some tendencies in France, but probably the French sex workers will protest publicly, which wouldn't have been the case in Sweden.

Negative publicity? Even in the case of ideal working conditions, there will be many who find prostitution wrong, and will do anything they can to put it in a negative light.

Some of the claims are just ridiculous, such as the one that all prostitutes are forced into it, practically slaves. There are many brothels in Germany directly next to police stations. Do people really believe that there are slaves just next door?

[Neurosynth]

Considering going to Xanten partytreff this Monday the 8th but would be willing to pay more for better looking and younger girls. Is there a better flat rate choice on that Monday? AO not required but also not avoided.

[Mrknowitall]

The weather that is, not the sex. I am so horned up, that I want to bone some working girls this week. However it is too fucking hot here in NRW!

Which of the clubs have air conditioning (AC)? Klimaanlage?

Or a pool to dip in afterwards?

I wonder if this heat is affecting the business at the clubs?

[Mrknowitall]

The weather that is, not the sex. I am so horned up, that I want to bone some working girls this week. However it is too fucking hot here in NRW!

Which of the clubs have air conditioning (AC)? Klimaanlage?

Or a pool to dip in afterwards?

I wonder if this heat is affecting the business at the clubs?Funny how the site replaced my initial "W*H*O*R*E*S" with "working girls". I guess that is more polite.

[Mrknowitall]

First, while it is true that Norway, Sweden and Iceland (but not Denmark) have criminalized the customers (but not the prostitutes) , there are plans in Norway to reverse this, as it didn't have the desired effect. Yes, there are some tendencies in France, but probably the French sex workers will protest publicly, which wouldn't have been the case in Sweden.

Negative publicity? Even in the case of ideal working conditions, there will be many who find prostitution wrong, and will do anything they can to put it in a negative light.

Some of the claims are just ridiculous, such as the one that all prostitutes are forced into it, practically slaves. There are many brothels in Germany directly next to police stations. Do people really believe that there are slaves just next door?I saw a documentary on ZDF on the situation here in Germany. IT appears that prostitution is very welcome here as the TAX man gets paid first. He is first in line, followed by the clubs, then finally the girls.

If the other country's knew just how much money that the finanzamt is raking in, then it would be legal everywhere, even the USA.

[SvenFKK]

If the other country's knew just how much money that the finanzamt is raking in, then it would be legal everywhere, even the USA.No way. Those opposed to sex on moral grounds will do so even if it makes them poorer. How much money changes hands in the drug trade in the US? I have never heard anyone say it should be legal because of the tax revenue.

[Maxime]

No way. Those opposed to sex on moral grounds will do so even if it makes them poorer. How much money changes hands in the drug trade in the US? I have never heard anyone say it should be legal because of the tax revenue.Interesting discussion: in the USA weapons (to kill people) are legal, and (paid) sex (that gives energy, and worst / best case, creates life!) is illegal, as opposite to some EU countries (Germany, Netherlands, etc) where it is the other way around.

[Wanking]

Well I'm many guys will be delighted that the AO clubs have been given their own forum at last.

http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/forumdisplay.php?774-Germany-AO-Clubs

[Kapoios]

Could you suggest any Partytreff for public.only- action? I've seen Mettman is suggested by many people here, but I've seen reports about not good looking girls there and with small tits (I prefer big). Anything better, ideally with more than 4-5 girls? I will be on next Friday or Saturday.

[SvenFKK]

Could you suggest any Partytreff for public.only- action? I've seen Mettman is suggested by many people here, but I've seen reports about not good looking girls there and with small tits (I prefer big). Anything better, ideally with more than 4-5 girls? I will be on next Friday or Saturday.Well, let me say again that what the girls at Mettmann (perhaps) lack in looks they more than make up for it in the sheer quality of the sex there. I challenge you to find any woman at any club better than Ute at Mettmann! Small tits? Well, until recently Joy (E) and Chantal (H).both natural, by the way-were there. I think they are both gone now, but there are new girls, so read up on the reports if big tits float your boat.

What qualifies as "big" in your book?

[Muenchen]

Hi Kapoios,

Arround 6 month ago, I transfered as a long time customer of PT Mettmann to Erotiktreff 95 in Schwerte.

Until now, I am very satiesfied with this Partytreff. Please see the homepage.

Regards,

Muenchen.

Remark: very horny ladies.

http://www.erotiktreff95.de/partytermine-erotiktreff95.html

[Kapoios]

Thanks for the answer. It just happens that I ve read here mixed opinions, but I am considering it as an option.

By the way, since the weather is going to be good, is there any place with public outdoors action?


Well, let me say again that what the girls at Mettmann (perhaps) lack in looks they more than make up for it in the sheer quality of the sex there. I challenge you to find any woman at any club better than Ute at Mettmann! Small tits? Well, until recently Joy (E) and Chantal (H). Both natural, by the way-were there. I think they are both gone now, but there are new girls, so read up on the reports if big tits float your boat.

What qualifies as "big" in your book?

[Leifeide]

When you are used to FKKs, most PCs will be a major disappoitment (regarding looks and service of the girls). The only exception might be PauschalClub Bochum (and Dortmund and Munster, same chain) which can be ok. Each other PC is rubbish IMHO, so don't spent your time (and money) to it, certainly not if you like the other clubs you mention. If you want to try something much better than Aca (regarding to service of the girls) try the service clubs Babylon or Panthera. Less girls than in Aca, but chances on bad service are zero-to-nothing, also with all the very good looking girls (compare that to all the beauties in Aca that tend to not kiss, not be willing to do anything at all etc, etc)I don't really agree with you. After 15 years on the German brothel scene, I know most places there. In my opinion far too many girls in FKK clubs have a menu with extra charge for this and that. To me that is a major turn-off and I try to avoid these places.

I have tried Pauschalclub Dortmund and Pauschalclub Bochum. Not bad, but in my opinion too many eastern Europeans. They are rather cold, they don't like kissing and don't like cum in mouth / face. Whereas the German girls are very much more friendly and accommodating.

Around Osnabruck there are several good flat rate clubs. Totalclub Osnabruck is not my favorite, but still pretty good. In particular I like that they have a girls menu on their site. They arrange parties with famous pornstars at a very reasonable price. Recommended!

Another good club is Lavita in Wallenhorst. http://www.partytreff-lavita.de I was there 4-5 times the last year and was extremely happy when I left. However it seems they have a problem now as the best girls seems to have left the club; Dunya, Angelique and the hottest of them all: Alina. If anyone here have information about where these 3 girls can be found, I would be very grateful.

Also I recommend the Dolce Vita: http://www.partytreff-dolcevita.com They have very many great pornstars every week. The variety of girls is huge and nice.

[Leifeide]

Guys,

I am really sorry for asking this for the second time, its just the type of questions that RTFF won't help.

Any one knows any partytreffs or pauschal clubs where the girls get paid per session just like the PC chain? (you pay the money at the entrance, and every time a girl go with you to a room she gets a little money from the club)

Sorry again for repeating the question for the second time and defiantly there is no third time.At Lavita in Wallenhorst the girls get a token for each session. I guess the reason is to get paid for each session. I have been there many times. Normally good to fantastic. However it seems the best girls have left the club now.

Marion is still there. She is one of all times best!

[SvenFKK]

At Lavita in Wallenhorst the girls get a token for each session. I guess the reason is to get paid for each session. I have been there many times. Normally good to fantastic. However it seems the best girls have left the club now.

Marion is still there. She is one of all times best!The same Marion who was at Osnabrück (and perhaps at Dorsten at one time)? A bit older, very thin, does anal and CIM? If so, I agree: One of the best.

[Tiger Genius]

Guys,

I am really sorry for asking this for the second time, its just the type of questions that RTFF won't help.

Any one knows any partytreffs or pauschal clubs where the girls get paid per session just like the PC chain? (you pay the money at the entrance, and every time a girl go with you to a room she gets a little money from the club)

Sorry again for repeating the question for the second time and defiantly there is no third time.Partytreff Xanten and Pauschalclub 69 MG-Rheydt.

[Maxime]

I don't really agree with you. After 15 years on the German brothel scene, I know most places there. In my opinion far too many girls in FKK clubs have a menu with extra charge for this and that. To me that is a major turn-off and I try to avoid these places.

I have tried Pauschalclub Dortmund and Pauschalclub Bochum. Not bad, but in my opinion too many eastern Europeans. They are rather cold, they don't like kissing and don't like cum in mouth / face. Whereas the German girls are very much more friendly and accommodating.So we have complete different taste: I have the best sessions with East-EU girls, and the worst with German girls (only 2 good German girls for my taste, in 10 years). But for the East-EU girls, it depends a lot in which club: in GT, Acapulco, etc I avoid those girls too, but in Freude, Panthera, Babylon, Bernds, etc they are top!

[BrooklynNY]

Xanten, Paschaclub Bochum, Pauschaclub Dortmund Moers so whivh better for a Wednesday or Thursday fun fest? I have time this week. Finally!

[Maxime]

Xanten, Paschaclub Bochum, Pauschaclub Dortmund Moers so whivh better for a Wednesday or Thursday fun fest? I have time this week. Finally!Avoid Xanten, you can try PSC Bochum, but also try to go to Club Neby or Luder Lunge and have much better sex with better looking girls and spend almost the same amount of money (see message before).

[Tiger Genius]

Xanten, Paschaclub Bochum, Pauschaclub Dortmund Moers so whivh better for a Wednesday or Thursday fun fest? I have time this week. Finally!I spent a very good day in Xanten on Wednesday (fkk day) , but this place is not for all as I explained in my report.

Maybe in future I want to try one of the Pauschalclub, but I'm worried because too much people can be there or to be refused at entry like happened to some people.

[Woofiee]

I spent a very good day in Xanten on Wednesday (fkk day) , but this place is not for all as I explained in my report.

Maybe in future I want to try one of the Pauschalclub, but I'm worried because too much people can be there or to be refused at entry like happened to some people.Bochum can get busy on a Wednesday. Tuesdays are best I've found, but it's not too bad. I did 4 girls in 3 hours last week (Monday) which worked out fine. Otherwise do the day pass and enjoy. Joanna is an absolute sweetheart!

[Kempis]

I'll be hitting Frankfurt in a couple of week's time (mainly for the FKKs) and it being my first time in Germany, I'd like to sample as much as I can of all the weird and wonderful things it offers.

I am extremely curious about simply experiencing a partytreff-style club. From what I can gather Treff188 is the only one close enough to Frankfurt to be reachable via public transport and a bit of walking without wasting a whole day on it, while reports range from "meh" to fairly decent, if a bit outdated.

Frankly, unless you guys say it's a flat out bad experience / dirty place, I'll probably give it a go just to see what it's about. Given that I can't speak German, would the experience be at least worth the trouble?

What day / time would you recommend for it? Midday? Evening?

Thanks in advance.

[SwingerLover]

Judging from when I was there the last time (around 2 years ago) it was pretty quiet from around 14-17:00. Then it got crowded again until late at night. No German at all might get boring between sessions, since there will be no one to talk to. Unless you speak Turkish or Russian. Management didn't speak much English either, but usually one of the girls knew enough English to handle the basics.

Current info on this place would be nice.

[SvenFKK]

I'll be hitting Frankfurt in a couple of week's time (mainly for the FKKs) and it being my first time in Germany, I'd like to sample as much as I can of all the weird and wonderful things it offers.

I am extremely curious about simply experiencing a partytreff-style club. From what I can gather Treff188 is the only one close enough to Frankfurt to be reachable via public transport and a bit of walking without wasting a whole day on it, while reports range from "meh" to fairly decent, if a bit outdated.I haven't been there nor, indeed, to any Partytreff-style club in or near Frankfurt. Reports seem to indicate that Swing-In in Rodgau or Maxi's Swing near the airport would be better options. Suggestion: Try one of these. If satisfied, try the other. If not, visit Dietzenbach. Not a flatrate club, but reasonable pricing and reports tend to be good.

[Smili]

Judging from when I was there the last time (around 2 years ago) it was pretty quiet from around 14-17:00. Then it got crowded again until late at night. No German at all might get boring between sessions, since there will be no one to talk to. Unless you speak Turkish or Russian. Management didn't speak much English either, but usually one of the girls knew enough English to handle the basics.

Current info on this place would be nice.Hi again Mr. Swing.

I checked out club 188 in June this year and must say I was positively surprised. A beautiful girl from Brazil was present, Great silicone tits, unfortunately her attitude didn't match her looks and tits. But she was ok, even though she just did the job, I had her 2 or thre times. Nice to find a girl that beautiful at a partytreff. I also found a white skinned redhead, which turned out to be a goldmine. Not as goodlooking as the brazilian, but cute enough and with close to perfect performance, if she had kissed it would be perfect. She made me come once more, after I thought nothing more were possible. The 10th time or so. The other girls were ok for a partytreff.

I will visit again If in the area, but won't rush to Frankfurt for the purpose.

No public action, which I prefer, since it was fairly easy to get a session, even with the most attractive girls.

[Sad Sam]

I am a newbie to the German scene and was hoping that I could get some help in narrowing down my choice to a few clubs for my upcoming trip.

GFE style service is very important (BBBJ, DFK girl's attitude etc. CIM would be highly desirable and if a few offer anal that would be a big plus but not essential) and in terms of looks I lean firmly towards voluptuous women than spinners. I am not looking for any bare back or public action. Hopefully there are many others who would be interested in similar suggestions.

I am looking more for flat rate or t least multi session discount clubs as I plan to go for multiple sessions.

I have been reading the forum a lot but it seems like some of the clubs, the incentive system is one that the ladies not seem to be too interested! Also, things seem to change with the lineup and so on.

Thanks in advance for the help. Would you consider other clubs if it is for the weekend vs a week day?

[Member #4297]

I am a newbie to the German scene and was hoping that I could get some help in narrowing down my choice to a few clubs for my upcoming trip.

Thanks in advance for the help. Would you consider other clubs if it is for the weekend vs a week day?When I was preparing my first trip to Germany I asked almost the same questions, now I had visited dozens of clubs and had sex with over 100 girls in German Partytreffs, Pauschalclubs and my conclusion is that with those clubs there are no logic! . It happened to me more than once to visit a club and have a great day then visited it again in the same trip and have a very bad day.

In all of those trips I couldn't really find a Partytreff that I can recommend and say that its almost guaranteed to have a good day there. There are a number of around 10 clubs where the possibility of having a good day is around 60% (and those are the clubs with active threads in this forum and in German forums). Maybe in the PC chain (Dortmund, Bochum, Munster) the percentage of having a good day is higher than 60% but if you are not a Caucasian they aren't going to let you in. In my last 2 trips I just put the active clubs names in German forums in my list and wished for the best.

Good luck and have fun.

[Maxime]

GFE style service is very important (BBBJ, DFK girl's attitude etc. CIM would be highly desirable and if a few offer anal that would be a big plus but not essential) and in terms of looks I lean firmly towards voluptuous women than spinners. I am not looking for any bare back or public action. Hopefully there are many others who would be interested in similar suggestions.

I am looking more for flat rate or t least multi session discount clubs as I plan to go for multiple sessions.The combi of teal good GFE and flat-rate is kind of difficult. You can be lucky, but than it mainly narrows down to PSC Bochum.

Low budget clubs with high (GFE) service girls is more common, and I would recommend: Club Neby, Luder Lounge, FKK van Goch or Haus Panthera. If you are planning to have 3-4 sessions, the total price of these is not much higher than a good flat=rate, but the quality / service is much more consistent!

[JohnnyO]

Hi all,

A day off work next Wed 2nd and I am keen on getting some recommendations on where to go. As usual I can never make up my mind where I want to go so I'll try to be specific with my preferences.

After my visit to TC Osnabruck I am now definitely in need of some sort of public action. It does not have been to be constant but at least at regular intervals.

The reports on Mettmann look good but the hours of operation are too short. The same with GB01 and Spermagames although they are on my must do list for the future.

I will be travelling from muenster by public transport so it has to be accessible, I don't mind 2. 3 hours travel. I know there are plenty of clubs advertising gangbangs for next wed such as Ambrosia which would be ideal but not all of these are genuine giving the latest reports on The love factory. Also the girls don't have to be the best looking I'm just keen on public action.

I had considered Farell lounge but the latest reports don't look too great either. At the moment I'm leaning towards Cleopatra Arena as there have been plenty of reports of public action on a German speaking forum which I had to translate.

[SvenFKK]

I am a newbie to the German scene and was hoping that I could get some help in narrowing down my choice to a few clubs for my upcoming trip.

GFE style service is very important (BBBJ, DFK girl's attitude etc. CIM would be highly desirable and if a few offer anal that would be a big plus but not essential) and in terms of looks I lean firmly towards voluptuous women than spinners. I am not looking for any bare back or public action. Hopefully there are many others who would be interested in similar suggestions.

I am looking more for flat rate or ta least multi session discount clubs as I plan to go for multiple sessions.Mettmann. No really voluptuous women there now but there have been in the past. Moni is often there and is C or D.

GFE? Check. DFK? Check. CIM? Check. Swallow? Check. Anal? Check. Rimming? Check. Not all women offer everything, but CIM is standard at Mettmann. GFE certainly possible with many. DFK with Ute, maybe others. Ute swallows and does anal. She will also rim you (and you can rim her).

Maybe not the youngest and best-looking women, but definitely the best value for money.

[Xplorer007]

Mettmann. No really voluptuous women there now but there have been in the past. Moni is often there and is C or D.

GFE? Check. DFK? Check. CIM? Check. Swallow? Check. Anal? Check. Rimming? Check. Not all women offer everything, but CIM is standard at Mettmann. GFE certainly possible with many. DFK with Ute, maybe others. Ute swallows and does anal. She will also rim you (and you can rim her).

Maybe not the youngest and best-looking women, but definitely the best value for money.It's a true partytreff experience definitely best value for money especially when ute is there. The women certainly don't lack enthusiasm.

[DrPorn]

This will be my first time in Berlin and I like what I read about Partytreff clubs. Are there any near Berlin? What is the entrance fee? Are the girls there attractive?

Thank you!

[Dark Vader]

This will be my first time in Berlin and I like what I read about Partytreff clubs. Are there any near Berlin? What is the entrance fee? Are the girls there attractive?

Thank you!I'd recommend a trip to Erlebniswohnung. See separate thread:

http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?3290-Erlebniswohnung-GangBang-Club-Berlin

[Wanking]

Had a great time again in Berlin from Sept 9th to Sept 13th. This time I stayed in the Neukölln area, in a new hotel http://motelplus-berlin.de/ Good value for €39 per night.

This hotel was in a good location only a mile from swingeroase-zwiespalt and 2 miles from Insomnia-berlin

Day 1 - Kino 44 (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?3532-Sex-Kinos-Berlin&p=1476684&viewfull=1#post1476684)

Day 2 & 3 - Swingeroase (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?3170-Other-Swinger-Clubs&p=1485826&viewfull=1#post1485826)

Day 4 - Insomnia (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?3353-Insomnia-Swingers-Club-Berlin)

Day 5 - Kino Tinas - My 6 euro Shit !!! (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?3532-Sex-Kinos-Berlin&p=1485828&viewfull=1#post1485828)

[YoungPro]

I am new to gangbang. I have done it with friends in the past but never with strangers. My favorite one is DP, especially putting together into one hole is the best for me. But is it awkward to do with strangers? Does it happen during the gangbangs? I am just trying to find the line that I should not cross. Respect is very important in this context. How do I know what is the comfort zone for others at these venues?

[Mathias037]

Hello,

As far as we are following creation of the new German government, we noticed, that there are some dark clouds approaching to the prostitution scene. There is some blonde female politician very active and threating with the "Scandinavian approach" and claiming that "Flatrate-Sex gehört verboten".

http://www.tagesschau.de/inland/prostitutionsgesetz-verschaerfen100.html

Can any of our German colleagues explain us what is to be expected?

Regards

[SwingerLover]

Can any of our German colleagues explain us what is to be expected?Business as usual. Nothing will change. If she wanted to prohibit flatrate-sex, then she would have to prohibit flatrate drinking, flatrate all-you-can-eat or flatrate travelling with a Bahncard as well. Prostitution is a regular business since they changed the laws over 10 years ago, so there's no reason to treat it differently than flatrate offers from any other branch. This is just another attempt of some no-name feminist to get her face into the news.

[SvenFKK]

Business as usual. Nothing will change. If she wanted to prohibit flatrate-sex, then she would have to prohibit flatrate drinking, flatrate all-you-can-eat or flatrate travelling with a Bahncard as well. Prostitution is a regular business since they changed the laws over 10 years ago, so there's no reason to treat it differently than flatrate offers from any other branch. This is just another attempt of some no-name feminist to get her face into the news.Well, it is of course possible to change the law. Some people are suggesting that, and there has been a lot of media coverage. It is certainly possible that it will happen, but personally I would estimate the probability at about 10 per cent. By the way, this discussion has little to do with the coalition negotiations. The main objective of the campaign led by Alice Schwarzer is to forbid prostitution completely, not just flat-rate clubs or whatever. A few people have suggested that only certain things such as flat-rate clubs should be prohibited. They are clueless. This business model works because most punters overestimate themselves. In the RLD, fuck and such is EUR 25, so at EUR 100 for a flat-rate club, one would have to come 4 times for it to be a better deal for the punter. Most think they can, but don't.

The problem, of course, is that most punters who know that the world is not the one Alice Schwarzer thinks it is are unwilling to speak out publicly. Fortunately, some prostitutes have spoken out publicly, against a change in the law, and for more respect for their work.

[SvenFKK]

This is just another attempt of some no-name feminist to get her face into the news.No, she's not a no-name feminist, but rather the vice chairman (nice pun there) of the Social Democrats. She has a lot of influence. It is certainly not an attempt to drum up publicity for herself or whatever. She really believes this.

[SwingerLover]

Alice Schwarzer
She really believes this.That's the problem right there: Some clueless women have an opinion about something they know absolutely nothing about and then try to impose those opinions on others. A subject matter like prostitution is the perfect playground for them, because the usually necessary discretion towards the male clients keeps most of them quiet. So the only ones able to shut the feminists up for good are the sex-workers themselves.

I recall a TV report from a few years back when the Pussyclub-chain got closed, where the ones who complained the loudest about the clubs shutdown where the oh so exploited women that had worked there. So where was the problem? Everybody was happy with the arrangement, then the state moved in and trashed it all. (I believe it was because they considered the women to be employees and therefore social-securitarized the place to death?)

I'd say it's about time to do as in Orwell's Animal Farm and chase the pigs off the grounds!

As for the current debated prohibition of flatrate-sex: That's just stupid. Because it will only get those who do it back into the illegal zone of the business. That is if anybody bothers at all enforcing it. And if they should, there are more loopholes to avoid it than there are women at a Partytreff.

[Smili]

I love the antifascistic tone in your last message mr Swing.

Important to be conscous about these mechanisms, which you put the finger at better than I can, even though I am aware of them.

Over to some general info, Which one of love factorys or Tekohas party would you choose?

Before my flight from Koln / Bonn at 22 o clock.

Ps! I am very found of Brazilian girls.

[Tiger Genius]

In Saunaclub Anubis there is a pauschal-tag tabulos party every Wednesday for 59€, like happened in Cleopatra Arena.

[SwingerLover]

In Saunaclub Anubis there is a pauschal-tag tabulos party every Wednesday for 59€, like happened in Cleopatra Arena.Good to know. Why the fuck don't they advertise this? CA had at least a Sexdo-ad where the Flatrate WED was mentioned. Does "Tabulos" still mean AO under this new management? http://saunaclub-anubis.de/site/


Before my flight from Koln / Bonn at 22 o clock.Already too late by now to give advice for right now. But still: If you are into Brazilian girls, then Tekohas should work for you. I nevertheless recommend to you against this gangbang today, since you will have to cut it short to be at CGN airport at 22:00 and Gelsenkirchen is about an hour away from there.

So I hope you chose LoveFactory, since it is much closer to CGN and you'll have more girls and more time for nearly the same money. Plus: The best ones there (like Sylvia and Alexandra) can certainly compete with Tekohas.
Hope you had a lot of fun!

[Zee Dude]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/10488755/Germany-to-ban-flat-rate-sex-offers-in-brothels.html

ZD

[Wanking]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/10488755/Germany-to-ban-flat-rate-sex-offers-in-brothels.html

ZDMost Flat rate places are gone completely shit anyway so I wouldn't be too worried about it.

If the ban does come in, I wonder would swingerclubs like Insomnia, be able to continue with their weekly Thursday gangbang that is made of up of mostly hired in women??

[SvenFKK]

Everybody was happy with the arrangement, then the state moved in and trashed it all. (I believe it was because they considered the women to be employees and therefore social-securitarized the place to death?)I agree with everything you wrote except the stuff quoted above. Certain obligatory types of insurance were not paid, that is, a form of tax evasion. Yes, they tried to claim that they had a different situation, but if it were that easy, then there would be little point in the law. They did violate the law, and that was the reason for the closure. Note that no other flat-rate clubs have been shut down, just the PussyClub chain.

[SvenFKK]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/10488755/Germany-to-ban-flat-rate-sex-offers-in-brothels.htmlI've seen similar headlines, but the corresponding articles (in German) are generally less clear. Sure, certain people have suggested this, but a) it is not yet a concrete suggestion and be) it is not clear that it would be constitutional. The previous government was forced to repeal many laws in various court cases, so just because someone says it will be it law doesn't mean it will and even if it does become law, it is not clear that it will last.

I would be really surprised if things like Partytreffs are forbidden.

One can be pretty sure that swinger clubs won't be forbidden. At worst, what could happen would be that Partytreffs declare themselves to be swinger clubs. Even now, some have hired women and / or allow single men.

This might even backfire. If the hired women can't officially be on the books, then they can come "as guests". Maybe the owner will give them some money on the side. As long as they have enough other income to live on, no-one would notice this.

[Tiger Genius]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/10488755/Germany-to-ban-flat-rate-sex-offers-in-brothels.html

ZDI didn't know nothing about a German politics, if will happen what are the timelines for a ban of flat-rate sex?

I made three trips in three months and I didn't think to come to Germany before the next summer, but maybe could be better make a last trip during the Christmas Holyday.

I don't agree with Wanking and for me the flat-rate places are like a paradise and hope that nothing happens, because my sexual life is completely changed after my first trip in Germany and I enjoy sex only if I can have sex many time during the day (from July or August I had sex only in Germany because I'm not interested to pay a single girl outside of Privat Sunshine, but they are 1000Km from me and made a trip only for going there is not cheap).

[SwingerLover]

Certain obligatory types of insurance were not paid, that is, a form of tax evasion.Thanks for clearing that up again. I wasn't quite sure anymore what the reason for their close-down was, since I really hadn't followed it back then.


I would be really surprised if things like Partytreffs are forbidden.Me too. They would then also implement this legislation on flatrate drinking, all-you-can-eat offers and a flatrate Bahncard, as well as any other flatrate offer in any kind of business.


One can be pretty sure that swinger clubs won't be forbidden. At worst, what could happen would be that Partytreffs declare themselves to be swinger clubs. Even now, some have hired women and / or allow single men.That's one of the loopholes I was thinking off. Spritzehaus112 in Mainz-Weisenau has operated like this ever since I've first been there and Treff188 (now in Eschborn) had been a real Swingerclub, but then was changed to a partytreff. They did however continue to call themselves a Swingerclub for as long as they were still in Sossenheim.

Then there's the gangbang parties. Those are flatrate too, so why should they be banned? Because Melanie Moon gets exploited by herself when she does her filmparties and Spermabang-events at her own place in Saarbrücken?

Also: This chimerical flatrate-ban pertains to prostitution. I've been told that there already is a court ruling which says that gangbangs are no prostitution."Prostitution is when one person pays and goes to a room behind closed doors with the recipient of the payment." That was pretty much the justification for denying a certain CreampieSlut the right to pay flatrate taxes for her gangbangs, like the prostitutes can. So if gangbangs aren't prostitution, then the flatrate prohibition doesn't apply here. Should they pass this stupid law, then I foresee all flatrate places becoming gangbang locations. That is if the law should actually hold and doesn't get voided as soon as the first concerened people go to court over it.

[Max #01]

I saw it on none other than Foxnews. Com today: http://www.foxnews.com/world/2013/12/02/next-german-government-plans-to-ban-flat-rate-sex-offers-in-brothels/?intcmp=HPBucket. Thanks to Swingerlover and SvenFKK for commenting from a more detailed perspective. I can sleep well tonight across the pond!

[SwingerLover]

i don't think this flatrate law will hold, so i wouldn't worry too much about the situation in germany.

but the french governement seems to be on dope. they are passing a law right now that criminalizes the punters, but lets the hookers get away scot-free. this is pretty much like punishing the drug abusers while letting the dealers off the hook. or selling porn or alcohol to a minor and then punish the minor for having bought it, instead of the person who sold it to him / her. what kind of a perverted course of justice and complete bastardisation of the principles of law is this?

i guess we will be seeing a lot more french punters in germany pretty soon. or the number of [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) cases will sky-rocket in france, until they realize that cheap prostitution helps to keep avoid a lot of [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123)-assaults.

[Chopsticks31]

I think that is how it is in Norway.

You are allowed to sell sex, but not buy. Doesn't really make any sence.

If they wanted to stop prostitution I would have thought it would be better to stop the people who are offering, instead of punishing people who are buying what is legally being offered.

Just read in a newpaper today that a guy had been caught buying sex. The funny thing is that the police had randomly checked out the car they were inn cause the windows were covered. They hadn't even started yet, but the guy was half undressed.

Now they could easily just have made some kind of excuse that they were just having casual sex, people having sex in a car isn't that unusual.

But as the escort wasn't legally doing anything wrong she had just confessed that the guy had actually paid her for sex.

While the guy had made up some story that they knew each other.

So because of this "honest" escort the guy had to show up in court and got a big fine. Think I read something in the lines of 25000 nok, which is like 2500 British pounds I think.

And they hadn't even started yet, which probably saved him a bit.

Basically he has been charged for paying for something that never happend, wich legally sounds a bit fishy.

[Member #4297]

I was scared when I first read the ban news but after thinking about it its not really a problem even if it happened because the clubs can easily changes to the tickets system just like (partytreff oase, pauschalclub paradiso, time x club) in those 3 clubs you pay 80 Euro for 5 tickets, so its almost partytreff system, atmosphere for the customer but its not flat rate club when it comes to the law.

But the really scary thing for mongers around the world is what SwingerLover mentioned about France and criminalizing the client, I live in a country that criminalize the client and regardless of how dumb the law sounds but unfortunately it works, the law is based on the idea that prostitutes don't give a fuck about the rules and the laws and they will always be there, while the gentlemen's would most likely try to avoid breaking the laws so unfortunately this dumb law works and I think in the future a lot of countries that decides to be against prostitution will follow this law.

[SwingerLover]

I think that is how it is in Norway.

You are allowed to sell sex, but not buy. Doesn't really make any sence.

Basically he has been charged for paying for something that never happend, wich legally sounds a bit fishy.It does indeed. But that's not all: Norwegians can even get prosecuted if they go mongering outside of Norway, even if it's legal in those countries. (I was told about this by a Norwegian guy I had met at a party in Krefeld last year.)


so unfortunately this dumb law works and I think in the future a lot of countries that decides to be against prostitution will follow this law.It will definitely NEVER work in Germany like this! You just cannot criminalize a buyer for buying something that is legally offered and sold. And if it's illegal, then offering or selling it is illegal as well.

As for the current French idea: I'm confident that it will get nullified by the European Court of Justice, as soon as someone challenges this law. If it actually becomes a law.

Pretty much like the stupid Bavarian idea of charging foreigners a toll for the use of German highways, while letting Germans continue to use them for free. If that should become a law, it will get nullified by the European Court of Justice faster than you can say "Horst Seehofer".

[Leifeide]

It is true that it's not legal to buy sex in Norway. The Norwegian government copied the Swedish law as it apparently seemed efficient against trafficking. The problem seems to be all the horrible trafficking, but after some years with the new law, it doesn't seem to have any effect at all. Men are still willing to take the risk of fines up to insane €3000!

One Norwegian politician was filmed by the slimy Norwegian TV2 as he was leaving an establishment in Riga. Believe it or not, he was fined!

This law is simply insane and with no positive sides at all. We still have trafficking here and the customers are criminalized.

I am very surprised that France have plans to introduce a similar ban against buying sex, but then again, they have a socialist as president there. I pity the french who have to accept that. My guess is that this ban will cease to exist in Norway in 2014.

They should much rather look to Germany and follow their example. Also they should put in the efforts to fight trafficking.


It does indeed. But that's not all: Norwegians can even get prosecuted if they go mongering outside of Norway, even if it's legal in those countries. (I was told about this by a Norwegian guy I had met at a party in Krefeld last year.)

It will definitely NEVER work in Germany like this! You just cannot criminalize a buyer for buying something that is legally offered and sold. And if it's illegal, then offering or selling it is illegal as well.

As for the current French idea: I'm confident that it will get nullified by the European Court of Justice, as soon as someone challenges this law. If it actually becomes a law.

Pretty much like the stupid Bavarian idea of charging foreigners a toll for the use of German highways, while letting Germans continue to use them for free. If that should become a law, it will get nullified by the European Court of Justice faster than you can say "Horst Seehofer".

[Mrknowitall]

http://www.thelocal.de/20131213/couple-arrested-for-sex-party-tax-fraud

Anybody know who they were, or have been to their parties?

[SvenFKK]

but the french governement seems to be on dope. they are passing a law right now that criminalizes the punters, but lets the hookers get away scot-free.if prostitution becomes less legal in germany, then the same thing will happen here. there are similar laws in sweden, finland, norway and iceland (though norway might be reconsidering). denmark never had such a law though. these are the role models for proposed legislation in germany and france.


this is pretty much like punishing the drug abusers while letting the dealers off the hook. or selling porn or alcohol to a minor and then punish the minor for having bought it, instead of the person who sold it to him / her. what kind of a perverted course of justice and complete bastardisation of the principles of law is this?the idea is that no-one is voluntarily a prostitute. i don't agree with this, but if you believe this, then the law is a logical development. the comparison with drug trafficking is not really valid. again, i'm not saying that i agree with the proposed law, but it does have its own internal logic.


i guess we will be seeing a lot more french punters in germany pretty soon. or the number of [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) cases will sky-rocket in france, until they realize that cheap prostitution helps to keep avoid a lot of [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123)-assaults.i don't think that that will be the case. and even if it were, it wouldn't be good to publicize it: we punters will [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) if prostitution becomes illegal. that's not good pr.

the real problem is that most people who actually really know how things are won't speak out openly.

[SwingerLover]

, but it does have its own internal logic.I have to agree. It's the same kind of logic that gave us concentration camps and caused people to get shot at the barbed wire fence when they wanted to leave the oh so superb "GDR".


The real problem is that most people who actually really know how things are won't speak out openly.THAT is the problem.


No, she's not a no-name feminist, but rather the vice chairman (nice pun there) of the Social Democrats. She has a lot of influence. It is certainly not an attempt to drum up publicity for herself or whatever. She really believes this.To me, she was a no-name until now. I had never seen her or even heard her name before. Now she gets to be Minister for Families & Women's Affairs.

[Ibn Buttita]

I'll be in NRW in January and want to fit in a flatrate (partytreff or pauschalclub) visit, and do it while I still have the chance before they change any laws! But reports have been scarce, and when there is a recent report it's usually less than complimentary. Any thoughts on where to go? I'll be using trains, and will be based in Dusseldorf. Right now Pauschalclub Bochum is a leading contender, maybe PT Dorsten but I want to weigh other options as well.

Thanks in advance!

[Maxime]

I'll be in NRW in January and want to fit in a flatrate (partytreff or pauschalclub) visit, and do it while I still have the chance before they change any laws! But reports have been scarce, and when there is a recent report it's usually less than complimentary. Any thoughts on where to go? I'll be using trains, and will be based in Dusseldorf. Right now Pauschalclub Bochum is a leading contender, maybe PT Dorsten but I want to weigh other options as well.

Thanks in advance!Don't be worried about the law, nothing will prevent these PT / PCs to dissappear any time on.

The best (only) PC that offers some decent quality is indeed PC Bochum.

Since you are in Duseldorf, better visit one of the service clubs around there: Panthera (10 minutes from the airport) , Club Neby or Luder Lounge. If you combine entrance price with 3-4 sessions in the room, it will cost you about the same, and you will get a great GFE / PSE service, including extensive pre / after sales!

[Dublin Mick]

Avoid Dorsten at all costs!

If you are driving then remember to check out Kirmes Platz as well as a look on Stahl platz and Eir weg in Bochum, I'm not saying you will get great sex there but you may enjoy window shopping or you may need a quickie.

[SvenFKK]

Don't be worried about the law, nothing will prevent these PT / PCs to dissappear any time on.Last night, a major German television information program had a report about the campaign to change prostitution laws:

http://daserste.ndr.de/panorama/archiv/2013/prostitution169.html

The report was highly critical of the campaign. So, it's nice that someone-in this case, quite a respectable institution-apart from the punters and prostitutes is standing up for what is right.

Even if a law is passed, I think that a court would overturn it. This has happened quite often in recent years. Also, the fact that prostitution-which has been legal in Germany since 1927-is now a "normal job" is due to a court case about 15 years ago.

Laws are not checked automatically by the courts. If the Bundespräsident thinks a law is unconstitutional, then-and only then-can he refuse to sign it, and it is checked by the constitutional court. Or, someone affected by the law can challenge it. If a law restricting prostitution is passed, I think that someone would challenge it and the court would overturn it.

What does seem to be coming is punishment for customers of forced prostitutes. It doesn't look like the new government will cave in to the campaign and try to outlaw prostitution per se. However, even if one is opposed to forced prostitution, penalizing customers is a bit difficult, since it might not be obvious that it is a case of forced prostitution. Also, punters will be hesitant to talk to the police, so it might actually make things worse.

Fortunately, Alice Schwarzer is making such a fool of herself that she is probably doing more than anyone else to undermine her campaign!

[SwingerLover]

fortunately, alice schwarzer is making such a fool of herself that she is probably doing more than anyone else to undermine her campaign!i hope she continues to do so! why anybody is still listening to her is beyond me. if there's an opportunity for her to speak with some pros that tell her that they are doing it willingly and without being forced into it, she doesn't even let them finish their sentences because she doesn't want to hear the truth. typical leftwing feminist behaviour: if you are proven wrong, then try to shut everybody else up. how about a law that prohibits alice schwätzer?


and even if it were, it wouldn't be good to publicize it: we punters will [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) if prostitution becomes illegal. that's not good pr.i agree. however: http://www.ndr.de/apps/php/forum/showthread.php?t=53575&p=84408#post84408

[Otari]

Do you know if there is there any Party Treff club in NRW open on 25 or 26 December?

[SwingerLover]

Do you know if there is there any Party Treff club in NRW open on 25 or 26 December?LoveFactory in Kerpen-Sindorf is definitely open on the Holidays, even giving a 20 % discount. http://lovefactory.info/

Ambrosia Partyclub in Herten-Westerholt also state explicitly on their website, that they are open; I just don't know if the usual Wednesday's AO-motto will also be on Christmas day. http://partytreff-ambrosia.de/deutsch/

Saunaclub Anubis in Gelsenkirchen is also open, but I'm not sure if they treat Christmas Day like a regular Wednesday (and do their Flatrate Wednesday) or if it's P4P only. http://saunaclub-anubis.de/site/

Xantener Partytreff is only open on the 26th, as are Erotiktreff95 in Schwerte and Partytreff Mettmann. http://www.xantener-partytreff.de/ http://www.erotiktreff95.de/ http://www.partytreff-me.de/

For more click on "Sexparty" here: http://www.nrwerotik.com/index2.htm

[Tiger Genius]

Do you know if there is there any Party Treff club in NRW open on 25 or 26 December?Pauschalclub 69 MG-Rheydt.

http://www.pauschalclub-69.de/site/home.htm

[Winthorp]

It has been a few years since I was in Germany last, I am thinking of making a trip back this springtime, last time I was there I visited four clubs; Pauschal Club Munster, Partytreff Osnabruck, Partytreff DolceVita Wagenfeld and Partytreff Dorsten. I found each of them good and will probably just there for about 3 or 4 days so can probably only take in about 3 places. I also would like to hear some recommendations about swinger type clubs as I have never been to one of those.

I have a fantasy I would love to fulfill of being cuckolded and just getting to watch a black guy with a white blonde woman, that would be really hot and if I could do it in a Partytreff that would be awesome. I have only been to Germany twice before and have never been to an FKK club, some reports indicate they have hotter women, I'd love to watch a black guy with a white blonde woman and once he is finished get to have a go myself.

[Dark Vader]

I also would like to hear some recommendations about swinger type clubs as I have never been to one of those.

I have a fantasy I would love to fulfill of being cuckolded and just getting to watch a black guy with a white blonde woman, that would be really hot and if I could do it in a Partytreff that would be awesome. I'd love to watch a black guy with a white blonde woman and once he is finished get to have a go myself.Check out the separate swinger club thread:

http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?3170-Other-Swinger-Clubs

I can also recommend www.joyclub.de. If you look out for Black and White parties then you should get to see and experience what you want. Depending on the date of your trip then I can specifically recommend the Le Coq (http://www.lecoq.de/) B&W party which they hold monthly in the middle of the month and which is one of my favourite events.

PM me when you know the dates of your trip

[JohnnyO]

Check out the separate swinger club thread:

http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?3170-Other-Swinger-Clubs

I can also recommend [b]

B&W party which they hold monthly in the middle of the month and which is one of my favourite events.

PM me when you know the dates of your tripHi Dark Vader,

Thanks for the info. Could you please tell me a bit more about JC. I had a browse of the website and it seems interesting. I know it says registration is free however I'm wondering if there will be paid options to get the most out of it, not that thats a problem. Are you a member and if so is it worth it compared to the usual contact sites such as poppen etc. Also I don't read good German and would be just relying on G translate.

Thanks

[SwingerLover]

is it worth it compared to the usual contact sites such as poppenNothing compares to "Poppen.de"! I don't think there is any portal that hosts more fakes, frauds and wanna-be types. There are a few couples and women that are for real, such as "AO_PaarMG" for instance, but most of them are either fakes or have their filters set in a way that you practically have to construct the guys first who would then be able to pass it. (And Brad Pitt or George Clooney type guys usually don't need a Poppen-portal to get women.)

In addition, a lot of real women and couples, such as "Rudelfotze" Inken, Asian "GBLily" Lilly-Fick,"Benutz-Mich" and "AmelieO" have been kicked out for violating some rules (mainly for advertising for events that weren't their own).

So Poppen keeps the fakes and kicks off the well-known REAL women; brilliant strategy!

I mainly just check the forum nowdays to see if "AO_PaarMG" is active anywhere, and when I see something AO that MIGHT be for real, then I post that too in the Bareback Calendar thread. But I see no sense in actually registering there again, because I don't expect anything to happen sexwise. And the few real ones that are there can usually be contacted otherwise, since they are either on other portals (like Eronity) as well or advertise their events on the known advertising sites like Fickanzeigen etc. The couples "paarluebeck807" and "nordseepaar6" for instance have advertised their Silvester-AO-Party with "Rudelfotze" in Lübeck at Eronity and at Fickanzeigen24 as well. So there's no need for the Poppen-portal to get in touch with them, and "Rudelfotze" Inken can be reached via her Eroprofile profile.

www.fickanzeigen24.com/partytermine/index.php?id=1388235493

www.eronity.com/thread.php?id=102163

www.poppen.de/forum/t-2602167-ao-silvester-party

http://www.poppen.de/paarluebeck807

http://www.poppen.de/nordseepaar6

www.eroprofile.com/Rudelfotze

So Joyclub will definitely be better than "Poppen.de", because I think it's simply not possible to be worse. Nevertheless I do not recommend Joyclub either, because they are not only total anti-bareback militants, but because the few Joyclub-couples I have met at previous Swingerclub visits are exactly the kind you don't want to meet: Good looking, but only there to show off, to talk, to drink, to eat, to smoke and to do everything under the sun except fuck; and if they do, then only with their partners or their friends. Almost as bad as "Augenweide"-couples, if they aren't the same ones anyway. ("Augenweide" is the portal where the crème de la crème of arrogance among "swinger" couples used to congregate. Luckily I haven't had any contact with any of them in the past years, propably because I stay away from regular Swingerclub "parties" nowdays.)

[MooseNibbler]

Would someone please explain to me the difference between a Partytreff and an FKK Saunaclub? I see them used almost interchangeably in the forum sometimes, and I'm a little confused. I've been to a few of the Saunaclubs, so I have a pretty fair understanding of what that experience is like now.

[SvenFKK]

Would someone please explain to me the difference between a Partytreff and an FKK Saunaclub? I see them used almost interchangeably in the forum sometimes, and I'm a little confused. I've been to a few of the Saunaclubs, so I have a pretty fair understanding of what that experience is like now.Three main differences. First, more or less by definition, a Partytreff has a flat rate. In other words, pay a one-time fee and everything is included, I. E. As many sessions with as many girls as you can manage. Second, the girls are nude at most FKK clubs (in this context, FKK=nude) while this is the exception, rather than the rule, at Partytreffs (though many or most will be nude during a session, just not when not in a session). Third, most Partytreffs have public sex, I. E. A big room or even a big bed for several people, or at least rooms with no doors or with open doors. In other words, watching and being watched is part of the concept.

Clubs which have a flat rate without public sex are sometimes known as Pauschalclubs.

[Rintin4]

Three main differences. First, more or less by definition, a Partytreff has a flat rate. In other words, pay a one-time fee and everything is included, I. E. As many sessions with as many girls as you can manage. Second, the girls are nude at most FKK clubs (in this context, FKK=nude) while this is the exception, rather than the rule, at Partytreffs (though many or most will be nude during a session, just not when not in a session). Third, most Partytreffs have public sex, I. E. A big room or even a big bed for several people, or at least rooms with no doors or with open doors. In other words, watching and being watched is part of the concept.

Clubs which have a flat rate without public sex are sometimes known as Pauschalclubs.In the partytreffs, are you able to have more than one at once? And if you were to take a partytreff vacation in either nrw or Berlin, would you have a preference?

[SBTiger]

Three main differences. First, more or less by definition, a Partytreff has a flat rate. In other words, pay a one-time fee and everything is included, I. E. As many sessions with as many girls as you can manage. Second, the girls are nude at most FKK clubs (in this context, FKK=nude) while this is the exception, rather than the rule, at Partytreffs (though many or most will be nude during a session, just not when not in a session). Third, most Partytreffs have public sex, I. E. A big room or even a big bed for several people, or at least rooms with no doors or with open doors. In other words, watching and being watched is part of the concept.

Clubs which have a flat rate without public sex are sometimes known as Pauschalclubs.
What is the quality of girls in Partytreffs- similar / comparable to FKKs? Also since you are not paying the girl- how easy it is to actually get sex and quality of service- does it also involve tipping girls?

Any good ones in the FRA area?

Thanks.

Sam

[Dark Vader]

What is the quality of girls in Partytreffs- similar / comparable to FKKs?Defintely not. You may find the odd gem from time to time but best figure on 5's and 6's or worse.


Also since you are not paying the girl- how easy it is to actually get sex and quality of service- does it also involve tipping girls?Generally it's fine. Some clubs are busier than others and some girls will be more popular than others so whilst you may miss your turn if you stay the course then like the mounties you will generally get your girl. Service is more variable and as with everything can depend upon whether you can build any rapport with the girl.

As for tipping. You almost made me choke on my cornflakes! There is no need to tip any girl at a Partytreff or at at an FKK for that matter. You're not in Kansas anymore.


Any good ones in the FRA area?In short NO. There are clubs in the area like Treff-188, Maxi-Swing Walldorf, Swing-In Rodgau and Pauschalclub Coconut Beach Wallau but I don't rate any of them. If you're on a budget then you'll probably find that a lower cost FKK like FKK-Dietzenbach will give you better service.

[SvenFKK]

Defintely not. You may find the odd gem from time to time but best figure on 5's and 6's or worse.In general true with regard to looks. However, with regard to quality, it is a different story. I'm a big fan of Mettmann (now known as Frivolity-I haven't been there since the change in ownership, but I gather that the concept is the same) , where I have had some sessions far better than in any FKK club or other Partytreff. I think Dark Vader will agree that here the quality really is better and also these are all German girls who are really there because they are horny. While forced prostitution is very rare in Germany (despite what Alice Schwarzer claims) , most girls are there for the money (which is true of any job).


Generally it's fine. Some clubs are busier than others and some girls will be more popular than others so whilst you may miss your turn if you stay the course then like the mounties you will generally get your girl. Service is more variable and as with everything can depend upon whether you can build any rapport with the girl.While it is true that at an FKK club you can essentially have any girl just by asking her (and paying) , it's really not a problem at a Partytreff either, though you might have to wait a few more minutes. You might think that there is no motiviation, but of course any girl who doesn't provide enough service will be fired, just like at any other job.


As for tipping. You almost made me choke on my cornflakes! There is no need to tip any girl at a Partytreff or at at an FKK for that matter. You're not in Kansas anymore.And please don't start doing it. One of the main advantages of Partytreffs and FKK clubs in Germany is that the costs are clear.


In short NO. There are clubs in the area like Treff-188, Maxi-Swing Walldorf, Swing-In Rodgau and Pauschalclub Coconut Beach Wallau but I don't rate any of them. If you're on a budget then you'll probably find that a lower cost FKK like FKK-Dietzenbach will give you better service.Right. However, Dietzenbach is not far from Frankfurt and both Dark Vader and I have had some good times there.

[Jazzy001]

I Have visit FKK Clubs. Now I'm thinking about visiting Partytreff. What are some of the best clubs to visit? Cost to visit Partytreff. Any recommendations?

[Xnij96]

I'm new here and planning a trip to the Bremen region. Has anyone been to the PT's in the area recently? I don't seem to find any new reports. How does PT Bremen compare to Dolce Vita now? Any recommendations would be appreciated. My first time ever and excited!

Is there a better club within Bremen? I will be using public transport. But all in all looking for a great time so can travel if I need too.

Thanks

[SvenFKK]

I Have visit FKK Clubs. Now I'm thinking about visiting Partytreff. What are some of the best clubs to visit? Cost to visit Partytreff. Any recommendations?Cost will be about EUR 100 for all day, no limit on sessions, food or non-alcoholic drinks. Prices vary somewhat, as do opening times, number of girls, quality of the girls, quality of the facilities etc.

Read up on recent reports here.

It really depends on what you want. If you want to go Partytreff instead of FKK club, then presumably you want more sessions for your money. You can get that at any Partytreff.

What else, in particular, are you looking for?

[Jazzy001]

Yes, I want more sex for money. What are some of the best partytreff to visit? Dusseldorf or Frankfurt area.

[SvenFKK]

Yes, I want more sex for money. What are some of the best partytreff to visit? Dusseldorf or Frankfurt area.Again, read the reports. Personally, I recommend Mettmann for quality of service and Dietzenbach for the best in the Frankfurt area (not really a Partytreff, but you can have 3 sessions for at most EUR 120 and extras (depending on the girl) such as CIM, swallowing, she rimming you, anal etc are included.

[SneakSneak]

Will probably go this weekend to Germany (Fri-Sat-Sun).

How crowded are those during the weekends?

Oase Pauschalclub.

Total Osnabruck.

Partyreff Lavita.

Club verona.

(maybe Pauschaclub Munster / Dortmund)

Also, is there any club where showers are shared (with girls)?

[SvenFKK]

It seems to have gone quite quiet here! I plan to visit Frivolity (Mettmann) tomorrow, will report. Does anyone know if the Sandra there now has been there in the past? If so, then I've met her once or twice before. Ute and Moni, my favourites, are there, and also Petra, who is very nice (I'm pretty sure it is the one I know, and am definitely sure Ute and Moni are the same).

Has everyone else stopped mongerin?

Not really a Partytreff, so look for a report in the next few days in the FKK-clubs section; I had a very enjoyable day at Dietzenbach on Thursday.

[Wanking]

It seems to have gone quite quiet here!Yeah its a shame how quiet it has become. Seems to be very few willing to write reports anymore.

[Tiger Genius]

Yeah its a shame how quiet it has become. Seems to be very few willing to write reports anymore.I'm sorry but I can't return in Germany before this summer, I hope that the partytreff will be open and I will write for sure some reports.

[Tiger Genius]

http://partytreff-riva.de/riva.html

[YoungPro]

Any info on this party? Couldn't find decent info.

www.gang-bang-stuttgart.com/

[SwingerLover]

Any info on this party?Look in the Bareback AO thread of the Germany AO Clubs forum; I recall someone writing a report about his visit to Yvonne. I also think I posted a like to that report in the ROD-thread of the Germany or Germany Partytreff Clubs forum.

For Yvonne's parties look also here: www.gangbang-partytreff.com/home.html.

You can find the location on my May-map as well: http://goo.go/maps/InJy7.

[YoungPro]

Look in the Bareback AO thread of the Germany AO Clubs forum; I recall someone writing a report about his visit to Yvonne. I also think I posted a like to that report in the ROD-thread of the Germany or Germany Partytreff Clubs forum.

For Yvonne's parties look also here: www.gangbang-partytreff.com/home.html.

You can find the location on my May-map as well: http://goo.go/maps/InJy7.Thanks, found the review. The link for the map doesn't work for me, any tricks to be able to see the map?

[SwingerLover]

Thanks, found the review. The link for the map doesn't work for me, any tricks to be able to see the map?A very simple trick: You just need an original poster who doesn't put any typos into the link. No wonder it didn't work. Here's the correct link: http://goo.gl/maps/InJy7.

[YoungPro]

A very simple trick: You just need an original poster who doesn't put any typos into the link. No wonder it didn't work. Here's the correct link: http://goo.gl/maps/InJy7.Super helpful!

[YoungPro]

A very simple trick: You just need an original poster who doesn't put any typos into the link. No wonder it didn't work. Here's the correct link: http://goo.gl/maps/InJy7.Now, I am thinking of joining one of these. Is it difficult for someone who doesn't speak German to join? And I saw some guys with black mask, is that always available at the parties?

[SwingerLover]

Now, I am thinking of joining one of these. Is it difficult for someone who doesn't speak German to join? And I saw some guys with black mask, is that always available at the parties?I guess the masks were only for the guys who did the photos. I don't think that they take pictures during normal gangbangs.

I don't think the language issue will be much of a problem, except that you might not have someone to talk to. But with a 2-hour gangbang, that should be manageable.

[YoungPro]

I guess the masks were only for the guys who did the photos. I don't think that they take pictures during normal gangbangs.

I don't think the language issue will be much of a problem, except that you might not have someone to talk to. But with a 2-hour gangbang, that should be manageable.Thanks for the helpful info!

[TravelinDude]

Hey all,

I had the FKK experience a few years ago and really enjoyed it but for my next visit to Germany I'm curious about the Partyreff experience. I've read most of the suggestions and reports with a great deal of interest. I only have a couple of questions.

I'm a major fan of daty and I generally enjoy that more than anything else (especially given the limitations of the hardware). On the surface, it seems like the all inclusive rate at a partyreff would be the way to go to get the most daty for my buck. But given the everything goes kind of scenarios, is that something that I might want to shy away from at a partyreff? Would I be able to enjoy DATY with any expectations of general cleanliness?

I'm also more inclined to visit a partyreff club during the week than over the weekend, but I'm not sure if that'd be a good time to visit or not. It seemed fine at FKKs but I could see how there might be a lot fewer girls at a partyreff club, which would offer a considerably lower payoff. Any thoughts from the rest of you?

Thanks so much for your help.

[Wanking]

Would I be able to enjoy DATY with any expectations of general cleanliness?
I been licking pussy in treffs for years with no probs.

[Dublin Mick]

Stop worrying about the cleanliness, the girls freshen up between every session with showers etc. Its no different than taking a girl for a session in any other brothel, she will have also been with someone before you and showered etc. The only exception to this would be if you insisted on licking a pussey in the middle of a gangbang when some blokes had just been inside her.

Couple of my fav girls in Osnabruck don't do DATY, personally speaking I don't go to these places for DATY, I like to go for long quality BBBJ but under the right conditions, I will happily DATY.

[EastGoing]

Enjoy until you have the chance.

http://www.spiegel.de/politik/deutschland/prostitution-koalition-will-per-gesetz-regeln-fuer-bordelle-aufstellen-a-986198.html

[Christian G]

Enjoy until you have the chance.

http://www.spiegel.de/politik/deutschland/prostitution-koalition-will-per-gesetz-regeln-fuer-bordelle-aufstellen-a-986198.htmlWTF.

Is known when this law comes into force and will close gangbangs and partytreff?

This is a real bad news!

[EastGoing]

WTF.

Is known when this law comes into force and will close gangbangs and partytreff?

This is a real bad news!
They are discussing it. Anyway I'm sure that when you travel to Germany in October it will not be effective. If not, even better, you will have more time and more chances to go to AO clubs and post field experiences in "my personal blog", won't you? ;-)

[Christian G]

They are discussing it. Anyway I'm sure that when you travel to Germany in October it will not be effective. If not, even better, you will have more time and more chances to go to AO clubs and post field experiences in "my personal blog", won't you? ;-)
I hope it will not be effective.
Also I will post my experiens in "your great personal blog" for sure.
I will have 6 days in Dusseldorf, and I would like to spend 3 days for AO clubs. More if the gangbang party will expire.

Anyway, is you will have more info about the closure of GB party and PT, please let me know, thanks in advance.

[Mr Styles]

Hey all,

I had the FKK experience a few years ago and really enjoyed it but for my next visit to Germany I'm curious about the Partyreff experience. I've read most of the suggestions and reports with a great deal of interest. I only have a couple of questions.

I'm a major fan of daty and I generally enjoy that more than anything else (especially given the limitations of the hardware). On the surface, it seems like the all inclusive rate at a partyreff would be the way to go to get the most daty for my buck. But given the everything goes kind of scenarios, is that something that I might want to shy away from at a partyreff? Would I be able to enjoy DATY with any expectations of general cleanliness?

I'm also more inclined to visit a partyreff club during the week than over the weekend, but I'm not sure if that'd be a good time to visit or not. It seemed fine at FKKs but I could see how there might be a lot fewer girls at a partyreff club, which would offer a considerably lower payoff. Any thoughts from the rest of you?

Thanks so much for your help.I can only talk about my experience at erlebniswohnung in Berlin. Yes, you can, but that depends on the girl. Some girls allow it, and some not. There is no general rule. BBBJ is common. About visiting during the week, the advantage is that there are fewer men, and therefore the chances for one on one increase, however, there are not that many girls either. I prefer weekdays, weekends for me are like sausage fests. So you trade more quality time with a fewer girls during weekdays for more girls and a huge rush on the weekends.

[Dublin Mick]

There is already a thread going here about this crap talk of closing down flat rate brothels. I live in De and this has been getting discussed for a while mostly due to the fact they think the girls are getting exploited.

[Gowda]

Dear fellow mongers,

Greetings from India. Last year I had visited Frankfurt and Hildesheim on work. During my stay I had tried Treff188 and Party Inn. They were fine as I got some nice girls. This time I would like to try a few more as I will be visiting Frankfurt, Hildesheim, Hamburg may stop over at Berlin while heading out to Prague. I have searched and finalised on the following partytreffs that I would like to visit. Please advise me as being of Indian Origin will I be accepted and the +ves and -ves of these places.

1) Treff188, Frankfurt.

2) Party Inn, Hildesheim.

3) Le Desir, Hildesheim.

4) Chateau Gottingen.

5) Total Club, Hannover.

Your advise and comments will be most valuable. When in India you can PM for any help in mongering.

Cheers

[Mahaba]

Cora seems to have departed Privat Sunshine. Any idea where she is working?

Thanks!!

[Mangga]

Hello guys, what are the TOP5 treffs in NWR area at the moment? Thank you very much.

[SwingerLover]

What a silly question! Depending on personal preferences, you'll propably get 6 different answers from 5 different guys!

[Wanking]

What a silly question! Depending on personal preferences, you'll propably get 6 different answers from 5 different guys!LOL.

Some of the better run flatrate covered sex clubs seem to be -

http://www.totalclub-osnabrueck.com

http://www.pauschalclub-69.de/page/en

http://www.pauschalclub.de - 3 clubs

[Ceshen]

Hello guys, what are the TOP5 treffs in NWR area at the moment? Thank you very much.See ranks by counting numbers of new posts, positive ones for sure.

[Mangga]

What a silly question! Depending on personal preferences, you'll propably get 6 different answers from 5 different guys!That's very true man, but it's also true that, even if everyone have their own different opinions, in the end the best clubs are always going to stand out, that's what objectivity is for. But anyway I made up my mind, and I'm going to visit some pauschalclubs / partytreff at the beginning of November.

I'm trying to decide if it would be better to visit them during weekdays or Friday+weekend, I don't like very crowded places but I'm afraid that during weekdays there will be less girls inside these types of clubs, what do you think? Thank you.

[Dublin Mick]

Yes of course there will be less girls during the week as opposed to Weekends but then again there will be also less customers so it balances itself out! What ratio of girls to guys are you hoping for? I mean you could go on a Tuesday evening to Osnabruck with 8 or 9 girls working and the same amount of punters there or you could hit it on a Saturday with 15 girls working and 30+ punters there!

[IndStallion31]

Hello friends,

I'm in Berlin from tomorrow till 7th.

I'm planning to attend the royal gentlemen party of the royal escorts tomorrow. Any review about it? Anyone has attended? They are promising 3 girls for 3 hours for 150 euros.

I would like to attend some other places too. Kindly help me with few suggestions for good party treffs or gangbangs. Thank you.

Surya

[SeekerM]

LOL.

Some of the better run flatrate covered sex clubs seem to be -

http://www.totalclub-osnabrueck.com

http://www.pauschalclub-69.de/page/en

http://www.pauschalclub.de - 3 clubsWanking, thank you for your suggestions they were amazing. I went to Totalclub Osnabruck day 1 and the service was awesome. Very clean and they take care about keeping hygienic. Anni and Alina (the second one, 75 be size) were awesome in their service. BBBJ and tight fuck.

Day 2 went to Pauschalclub Munster (chose that one out of the 3 because the picture of the girls looked best to me) and had my mind blown away again. The place was big and all the girls are top notch in looks and attitude. Totally recommend, the price is worth it.

[RandomTraveler]

Hello friends,

I'm planning to attend the royal gentlemen party of the royal escorts tomorrow. Any review about it? Anyone has attended? They are promising 3 girls for 3 hours for 150 euros.

I would like to attend some other places too. Kindly help me with few suggestions for good party treffs or gangbangs. Thank you.

Surya3 girls for 3 hours 150€? I'm guessing you're not getting them all to yourself. Do you have a link to that event?

As for gangbangs, I've only tried two, EW and Annie Porsche. You can read about my experience here http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?3195-Gangbang-Clubs&p=1640956#post1640956.

EW never disappoints.

[Wanking]

Day 2 went to Pauschalclub Munster (chose that one out of the 3 because the picture of the girls looked best to me) and had my mind blown away again. The place was big and all the girls are top notch in looks and attitude. Totally recommend, the price is worth it.Glad it worked out dude and thanks for reporting.

[Banana Boi]

I'm a FKK guy and am looking to try PT clubs. Like FKK's I will likely hit 2-3 PT clubs in a day.

My concern is arriving at a PT club on a Saturday night and there are 30+ guys and less than 10 girls. Do guys all run up to girls when they come out or strategically stand in hallways grabbing girls before other guys can even see them?

I also read that sessions are about 10 minutes long. Is this the norm? Is there a maximum time you can stay with a girl? Am I allowed to repeat with the same girl later in the day or is it once a day maximum?

Read some reviews that PT clubs have rooms. I thought PT clubs were all public sex. Am I mistaken?

Can someone let me know the PT / pauschalclub between Frankfurt and Osnabruck that has the most German girls?

Finally did M-Exclusiv in Munster open today as scheduled?

Thanks for helping the newb.

[Teomir]

LOL.

Some of the better run flatrate covered sex clubs seem to be -

http://www.totalclub-osnabrueck.com

http://www.pauschalclub-69.de/page/en

http://www.pauschalclub.de - 3 clubsHow would you rank PT Xanten compared with those mentioned here?

[Wanking]

How would you rank PT Xanten compared with those mentioned here?I think its good as well.

[NF4591]

Hi. I'm an American who has experience with FKK clubs, and I will be visiting Frankfurt soon. The Partyreff scene seems fun, so I've read this forum but still not sure which Partyreff is the best for me to try. I am looking for a Partyreff that meets my preferences:

1 - in or near Frankfurt.

2 - no problems for minorities (I am a minority in the US).

3 - People speak English.

4 - I want BBBJ, ball licking, ass licking, and covered sex and anal.

5 (preferred) - Wet sauna / steam room.

6 (preferred) - Hookah / shisha available.

7 (preferred) - beer included.

Are there any Partyreff clubs to recommend, that I would like from the above preferences? #1,2,3 are needed, and #4,5,6,7 are nice to have.

[SwingerLover]

3 - People speak English.Not sure about the English language skills these days, but otherways: http://treff-188.de/.
Most recent report about it: http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?678-Frankfurt&p=1677672&viewfull=1#post1677672

[Maxime]

Not only AO, but also flatrate will be forbidden in Germany soon: http://www.bild.de/politik/inland/prostitutionsgesetz/kondompflicht-fuer-freier-kommt-39630342.bild.html.

(this means also partytreffs, workaround will be to ask 5 euro per session or so).

[SwingerLover]

Not only AO, but also flatrate will be forbidden in Germany soon:That's the problem right there: "will be"? No law has been passed yet, what is "supposed" to be regulated changes every half year, but even you write already about "will be". Even Bild writes "soll", meaning "supposed to be", you toss around the term "will be" already, and MC Sex in Hamm implements a condom-duty at their own place out of their own volition from next month on without any law requiring them to do so. What's with that?

[Mr Styles]

Hi,

My German is not good enough to translate it, but here are the details.

Maybe someone can go through it.

[Willi69]

That's the problem right there: "will be"? No law has been passed yet.At the moment the situation in Germany is as follows:

The two largest parties in Germany (CDU and SPD) form a grand coalition ("GROKO") and have an absolute majority in the "Bundestag". The other parties together do not have a veto-way. The supervisory authority "Bundesrat" is also dominated by CDU and SPD. This means everything CDU and SPD decide will be the law.

[Neurosynth]

German Bundestag.

Printed matter.

17. Election Period.

Bill.

By the CDU / CSU and FDP.

Draft Law on Combating [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) and.

Monitoring Prostitution Sites.

A. Problem and objective.

The bill is intended both to Directive 2011/36 / EU of the European.

Parliament and of the Council of 5 April 2011 on preventing and combating.

Trafficking in human beings and protecting its victims, and replacing the.

Council Framework Decision 2002/629 / JHA (OJ. L 101,15. 4. 2011, p. 1).

Implement.

Secondly, to be subjected to prostitution sites of industrial law surveillance.

Be. Solution.

To implement the above-mentioned Directive, the following measures are proposed:

- Extension of the penal provision of § 233 of the Penal Code (StGB) on.

The cases of trafficking for the purpose of exploitation of criminal.

Actions and begging; also to human beings for the purpose.

Organ trafficking, which is currently only an aid to offenses under the.

Transplant Act is punishable explicitly in § 233 of the Criminal Code punishable.

Are provided.

- Extension of the qualification of § 233 a StGB facts on the cases.

Where the victim is under 18 years old, and to cases of grossly negligent endangerment of life of the victim; due to the need for synchronous operation these extensions should also apply to the facts of relevant qualifications §§ 232,233 of the Criminal Code.

In order to improve the framework conditions for persons working in prostitution to prostitution sites in the catalog of requiring supervision.

Commercial are taken according to § 38 paragraph 1 of the Commercial Code. In addition, the business enterprise of conditions to protect the general public, customers, the prostitute or the inhabitants of the business property or neighborhood from dangers, significant disadvantages or.

Significant nuisances be subject.

See. Alternatives.

None.

17/13706.

04.06. 2013.

Printed matter 17/13706.

-2-.

German Bundestag - 17th electoral term.

The. Budgetary expenditure without compliance costs.

For federal, state and local governments in expenditure without any performance overhead.

E. compliance costs.

Due to the expansion of existing criminal legislation and the extension of the.

§ 38 Industrial Code can state budgets procedural and enforcement costs incurred, the exact amount is not currently be quantified in detail.

F. Additional costs.

Impact on individual prices and the general price level, particularly.

On the consumer price level, are not to be expected.

German Bundestag - 17th electoral term.

-3-.

Printed matter 17/13706.

Draft Law on Combating [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) and.

Monitoring Prostitution Sites.

From the.

The Bundestag has passed the following law:

Article 1.

Amending the Penal Code.

The Criminal Code in the version published.

Of 13 November 1998 (BGBl. I S. 3322), the last.

By. Has been changed, is amended as follows:

1. In the table of contents of the statement to § 233, the.

Words "and otherwise exploit" is added.

2. In § 6 Issue 4, after the word "labor".

The words "and otherwise exploit" is inserted.

3. § 232 paragraph 3 shall be amended as follows:

A) In paragraph 1, the words "a child (§ 176.

Para. 1), a person under eighteen years "shall be replaced by the words" ".

B) in paragraph 2 shall be before the word "in" the words.

"At least recklessly" shall be inserted.

4. § 233 is amended as follows:

A) The title, the words "and otherwise exploit" is added.

B) Paragraph 1 shall read as follows:

"(1) Whoever another person taking advantage.

A predicament or the helplessness that connected with their stay in a foreign country.

Is,

1. in slavery, servitude or debt bondage.

2. to engage in or continue begging or employment for the offender.

Or a third party to working conditions, in.

Clearly disproportionate to the working conditions of other workers or workers are having the same or a.

Comparable activity on exercise.

3. to commit a criminal offense threatened actions.

Or.

4. to can be found in an organ.

Brings with imprisonment of six months.

Fined up to ten years. Likewise, anyone who.

A person under twenty-one years to the.

Berlin, June 4, 2013.

Volker Kauder, Gerda Hasselfeldt and fraction.

Rainer Brüderle and fraction.

In Theorem 1 designated acts or in one of the.

Referred to in that situation brings. ".

5. § 233 a paragraph 2 is amended as follows:

A) In paragraph 1, the words "a child (§ 176.

Para. 1), a person under eighteen years "shall be replaced by the words" ".

B) in paragraph 2 shall be before the word "in" the words.

"At least recklessly" shall be inserted.

Article 2.

Amendment of the Commercial Code.

§ 38 paragraph 1 of the Commercial Code, as amended by.

Published on 22 February 1999 (BGBl. I, p 202).

Last amended by Article 3 of the Law of 24 April 2013.

(BGBl. I S. 930) has been amended, is hereby amended as follows:

1st set 1 is amended as follows:

A) The number 6 is a comma added.

B) the following paragraph 7 is added:

'7. Operation of prostitution sites ".

2. The following sentence is added:

"The competent authority may, in the case of the number 7.

The commercial operation of certain conditions depending.

Make the extent of public safety, the.

Is customizable, the prostitute or the inhabitants of the business property or neighborhood from dangers, significant disadvantages or significant nuisances required. ".

Article 3.

Change in the Code of Criminal Procedure.

In § 100 c paragraph 2, point 1 letter g of the Criminal Procedure Code in the version published on.

April 7, 1987 (BGBl. I S. 1074,1319), the most recent.

Has been changed after the word "labor".

The words "and otherwise exploit" is inserted.

Article 4.

Come Into Effect.

This Act shall take effect on the day following its promulgation.

Printed matter 17/13706.

-4-.

German Bundestag - 17th electoral term.

Grounds.

A. General.

I. Objectives and main content of the bill.

The bill is intended both to Directive 2011/36 /.

EU of the European Parliament and of the Council of.

5 April 2011 on preventing and combating trafficking in human beings and protecting its victims, and replacing Council Framework Decision 2002/629 / JHA.

Implement (OJ. L 101,15. 4. 2011, p 1) and to meet.

This end, the following legislative measures:

- Extension of the penal provision of § 233 of the Penal Code (StGB) to cases of [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908).

For the purpose of exploitation of criminal activities and.

Of begging; also to human beings for the purpose of organ removal, which is currently only an aid.

Punishable for offenses under the Act transplantation.

Is explicitly in § 233 a paragraph 1 sentence 1 number 4.

Criminal Code are punishable.

- Extension of the qualifying facts of § 233 a.

Criminal Code to cases in which the victim is under 18 years of age.

, and the cases of grossly negligent endangerment.

The life of the victim. In the interest of consistency.

The rules are to be the same for the corresponding.

Qualifying offenses of §§ 232,233 of the Criminal Code apply.

The design is intentionally limited to the implementation.

Directive 2011/36 / EU of the above.

Measures. The to improve the fight against.

Trafficking in professional circles, particularly on the part of representatives of victims' interests, and of.

Law-enforcement bodies discussed further.

Proposals would have an intensive review and discussion requires that in the targeted because of the time constraint of the implementation of the Directive coming into force of the Law.

Hardly make it appear feasible this legislature.

In the area of the Penal Code is part, notably.

By representatives of law as well as police and public prosecution.

Side, a fundamental revision of offenses.

Of §§ 232,233 and 233 a of the Criminal Code sought. In support of.

Reference is made to the relatively small number of convictions for these rules, which does not correspond to the actual extent of this type of crime. Responsible for this is the text of the provisions as interpreted by case law. Specifically refers to the.

Criticism that the offender, the victim, utilizing.

Certain circumstances (predicament, foreign specific.

Helplessness, violence, threat with a sensitive.

Evil or List) for exploitation (including commence or continue prostitution, other sexual exploitation, labor exploitation) brings. The "This achievement" requires a.

Causal induction of success; the exploitation of a predicament etc. Moreover, that the success straight.

Back to the predicament etc. The causal link between predicament etc. And exploitation must.

Are produced by the actions of the perpetrator (see FIG.

To you. A. Fischer, Penal Code, 60th ed. , § 232 para. 12 to 14).

Not sufficient, it is that the victim in a.

Predicament is, and without that the culprit exploits this fact decides why prostitution.

(continued) For the investigation or to go to an exploitative employment. The police and public prosecution practice criticized that the proof of this.

Circumstances be legally difficult. Was essential in the.

Testimony of the victims and witnesses -zeuginnen, but not often.

Or is very difficult to obtain.

These and other possible suggestions and outside the.

Criminal law to improve the fight against [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) and the betterment of his victims are in.

The next term to examine in depth and be to develop legislative proposals in accordance with this test.

Secondly, to improve the conditions for working people in prostitution prostitution sites in the catalog of requiring surveillance industry according to § 38 paragraph 1 of the Industrial Code (GewO).

Be included. Thus an automatic review of the reliability of the trader is connected immediately after reimbursement of business registration or re-registration of trade. The competent authorities.

Are also monitoring the operation of the Auskunftsund lookup rights of § 29 GewO available. In addition, the business enterprise of requirements for.

Protection of the public, customers, the prostitute.

Or the inhabitants of the business property or neighborhood from dangers, significant disadvantages or.

Significant nuisances be subject.

II. Legislative competence.

The legislative competence of the federal follows from Article 74, paragraph 1, point 1 of the Basic Law (Criminal Law.

Judicial proceedings), and Article 74, paragraph 1.

Number 11 of the Basic Law (Business Law).

III. Compatibility with the law of the European.

Union and international treaties.

The draft law is the law of the European.

Union and international treaties to which the Federal Republic of Germany has been completed, and is compatible.

(Article 1) the implementation of a Directive of the European Parliament and of the Council.

IV. Regulatory impacts.

1. Household expenditure without compliance costs.

Household expenditure without compliance costs are for the federal government.

State and local governments can not be expected by the design.

2. compliance costs.

The compliance costs of administration in relation to the.

Regulations for the implementation of Directive 2011/36 / EU is limited to that by extending.

Offenses in the countries involved for.

German Bundestag - 17th electoral term.

-5-.

Law enforcement agencies can develop. The state budgets for the expected additional expenditure can be.

Not specifically quantified, but are not considered to be significant. In addition, in the countries compliance costs arises in the implementation of the Industrial Code § 38.

Competent authorities. This must continue without delay.

After reimbursement of business registration or reregistration a commercial reliability testing of the trader to perform.

Printed matter 17/13706.

On the implementation of Directive 2011/36 / EU required (see.

The reasons given for the number 5 letter b).

At number 4.

(§ 233 StGB).

To point a (headline).

The extension of the scope of § 233 of the Criminal Code.

To other purposes of trafficking (begging.

Committing criminal acts, organ removal) should.

Are also expressed in the title.

3. Additional costs.

The proposed legislative changes do not impact on the economy additional charges. Impact on.

Unit prices, the price level, and in particular the consumer price level, or the environment are not expected.

4. Sustainability aspects.

The bill does not affect any aspects of sustainable development in the interests of national sustainability strategy.

V. Effects of gender equality policy.

Importance.

The regulations are gender neutral content and affect women and men equally.

At point be (paragraph 1).

Takes into account the revised version of § 233 paragraph 1 of the Criminal Code.

The exploitation of begging and committing criminal.

Actions as well as the removal of organs other purposes.

Trafficking in human beings. In addition, the provision unchanged and only in § 233 paragraph 1, sentence 2 of the Criminal Code editorial adjusted to this extension.

Theorem 1.

To Number 1.

§ 233 paragraph 1 sentence 1 number 1 of the Criminal Code corresponds to the first.

Group of the forms of exploitation (slavery, servitude or debt bondage) of the previous § 233.

Paragraph 1 sentence 1 of the Criminal Code (trafficking in human beings for the purpose of.

Exploitation of the labor force).

At number 2.

Be. Special Section.

Article 1.

(Amendment of the Criminal Code -.

Penal Code).

To Number 1.

(Table of Contents).

Due to the change in the heading of § 233 StGB there is a change of the TOC.

At number 2.

(§ 6, paragraph 4 of the Criminal Code).

It is a consequence of the amendment of the.

Heading of § 233 of the Criminal Code.

Point 3.

(§ 232, paragraph 3 of the Criminal Code).

To point a (number 1).

By raising the age of consent in the qualifying elements of § 232, paragraph 3, paragraph 1 of the Criminal Code.

Is the constant velocity to the provisions of § 233 a paragraph 2.

Number 1 SCC-E produced. Here it is to implement.

Directive 2011/36 / EU necessary, the age limit.

To increase from 14 to 18 years (cf. The justification to number 5 letter a).

At point be (number 2).

With the expansion of the qualification of the facts.

§ 232, paragraph 3, paragraph 2 of the Criminal Code, which now also the variant that the offender, the victim "at least recklessly" in the.

Risk of death brings detected, the synchronization is to.

Provision of § 233 a, paragraph 2, point 2 of the Criminal Code-E produced. Here is the extension of the qualifying facts.

§ 233 paragraph 1 sentence 1 number 2 of the Criminal Code corresponds to the second group of the forms of exploitation (exploitative working conditions) of the previous § 233 paragraph 1 sentence 1.

Criminal Code. In addition, here in Directive 2011/36 / EU.

Said the purpose of exploitation of begging.

Provided (Article 2, paragraph 3) a criminal offense. In this respect, serves.

This revision of the implementation of the Directive required.

Point 3.

By § 233 paragraph 1 sentence 1 number 3 of the Criminal Code is in the.

Asked the Directive shall end the exploitation of criminal offenses (Article 2, paragraph 3) a criminal offense.

The term "exploitation of criminal activities" is to be understood as exploitation of a person to commit, inter alia, pickpocketing, shoplifting, drug trafficking.

And similar acts are understood to be under.

Punishment and are used in particular for financial gain.

At number 4.

In § 233 paragraph 1 sentence 1 number 4 of the Criminal Code, in view.

Article 2, paragraph 3 of the Directive trafficking.

For the purpose of organ removal explicitly criminalized.

Found; yet such acts were punishable only as aid to offenses under the Act transplantation.

Theorem 2.

§ 233 paragraph 1 sentence 2 StGB same content as the current regime, but bears editorial enlargement.

Of § 233 paragraph 1 sentence 1 of the Criminal Code on the begging, the perpetration.

Printed matter 17/13706.

-6-.

Increase of criminal acts and statements organ removal.

At number 5.

(§ 233 a paragraph 2 of the Criminal Code).

To point a (number 1).

In § 233 a, paragraph 2, point 1 of the Criminal Code, the age of consent is raised from 14 to 18 years. This is the requirements of Article 4, paragraph 2 letter a in conjunction.

Article 2, paragraph 6 of Directive 2011/36 / EU account.

Which declares that for offenses relating to the.

[CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908) a maximum term of imprisonment of ten years must be at least threatened unless the.

Victims of crime a person under 18 years of age. In the.

Article 2, paragraph 1 of Directive 2011/36 / EU factual facts described (recruitment, transportation, transfer, harboring or receipt of persons) corresponds to § 233 a StGB (promotion of [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908)), the.

In the basic offense with imprisonment of three months.

Is threatened up to five years. For the implementation of the Directive.

Must thus the term of imprisonment of six months to.

Ten years threatened qualification elements of § 233 a.

Paragraph 2, point 1 of the Criminal Code applicable to the case.

Be that the victim is indeed a person under 18 years of age.

At point be (number 2).

In § 233 a, paragraph 2, point 2 of the Criminal Code and the least reckless endangerment of life of the victim is under the in.

Paragraph 2 shall set increased penalties. In Order To.

Is the requirements of Article 4, paragraph 2 letter see.

Directive worn 2011/36 / EU bill that increased penalties for "gross negligence" life hazard.

Calls. This is in § 233 a, paragraph 2, point 2 of the Criminal Code so far.

Not the case, since it is generally considered not a so-called performance-qualified offense.

Is in accordance with § 18 of the Criminal Code and thus intent with respect to the occurring threats to human life is required.

(see, only fishermen, the Criminal Code, 59th ed. , § 232 para. 23).

To Article 2.

(Amendment of the Commercial Code -.

Industrial Code).

§ 38 Industrial Code is used for general, special occasion independent verification of the reliability of traders in.

Certain police trade-sensitive sectors. § 38.

Industrial Code contains an exhaustive list requiring monitoring services, for which the competent authority immediately after reimbursement of business registration or.

Commercial re-registration of a review of the reliability.

Performs. For this purpose, the trader has in accordance with § 38.

Paragraph 1, sentence 2 Trade Regulation Act, a certificate and information from the Central Trade Register for submission to the.

To apply for authority.

German Bundestag - 17th electoral term.

Furthermore, the competent authority in accordance with § 29 has.

Paragraph 1, point 3 GewO to monitor in § 38.

Commercial Industrial Code referred to in paragraph 1 to enter comprehensive trade law control options such information and lookup rights, including the power to the business premises of the person concerned for the purpose of monitoring and to carry out inspections and checks (§ 29 paragraph 2 Industrial Code). The list in § 38.

Paragraph 1 GewO listed requiring monitoring.

Industry should be expanded to include the operation of prostitution sites. Operation of prostitution sites is from.

Forensic point of view sensitive. For the prevention of criminal side effects such as [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908), forced prostitution and sexual exploitation is a preventive.

Reliability testing of the trader makes sense.

And necessary.

As prostitution site are especially brothels.

A *****house, brothel-like enterprises and other enterprises with.

To look with regard to commercial sexual services, the visible to the outside as prostitution sites.

Are and are perceived as such. Purely private.

Premises thus being excluded because they a.

Economic regulatory review are not accessible. This also applies to renting an apartment.

For the purpose of the exercise of commercial prostitution.

May be due to the newly inserted § 38 paragraph 1 sentence 4.

The competent authority shall make the commercial operation of certain conditions dependent. A similar instruments are in the right of assembly. These conditions.

May be necessary to protect the public, customers, prostitutes or the inhabitants of the business property or neighborhood ago hazards, significant disadvantages or serious nuisance to.

Protect.

To Article 3.

(Amendment of Criminal Procedure -.

Code of Criminal Procedure).

It is a consequence of the amendment of the.

Heading and the extension of the scope.

Of § 233 of the Criminal Code, making the list of offenses § 100 c.

Paragraph 2, Code of Criminal Procedure, the specific cases of [CodeWord908] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908).

(the most serious offenses) comprises an occasion as deeds for the acoustic monitoring of living space, only in the.

Same scale is expanded as the revised § 233.

Criminal Code.

Article 4.

(Come Into Effect).

Article 4 deals with the entry into force of the law.

Production: H. Heenemann GmbH & Co. , letterpress and offset printing, Bessemer Road 83-91,12103 Berlin www.heenemann-druck.de.

Distribution: Federal Verlagsgesellschaft mbH, Postfach 10 05 34,50445 Cologne, phone (02 21) 97 66 83 40, Fax (02 21) 97 66 83 44 www.betrifft-gesetze.de.

ISSN 0722-8333.

[Neurosynth]

So where is the part about no BBFS and no flat rate clubs?

[SwingerLover]

This means everything CDU and SPD decide will be the law.As long as it's not in conflict with other laws and superior rights!


So where is the part about no BBFS and no flat rate clubs?It's not in there, since this "draft law" is from June 4th 2013 and therefore more than a year older than the "basic points paper" from August 14th 2014 to which I have posted several links already. And the 2013 "draft law" is all that is required by the EU. Everything else is the doing of "Küstenbarbie" and the German feminism industry!

[Member #4359]

I am confused as to the difference between "no AO" and "Condom-Duty". Can someone explain this, exactly what the condom-duty provision of the coming law will mean?

[SwingerLover]

It's pertty much like splitting hairs, but as you know: That's what lawyers and politicians like to do best!

So here goes: If a condom-duty is in fact put into a by-law the way it is in Bavaria and the Saarland, then that means that a condom has to be used whenever there's paid sex. Prohibiting AO (= bareback sex) would mean that they would have to prohibit the natural way to have sex, and I think that this is quite frankly IMPOSSIBLE! Because they would have to apply that to everybody else too. Since they can't prohibit people from having sex the natural way, they can't do that to prostitutes (and their customers) either. So they invent a condom-duty and call it "hygiene". Then they try to apply that to prostitution like they apply other hygiene rules to all other businesses where it's applicable.

In effect, regarding prostitution, there is actually no difference between AO prohibition and a condom-duty. But as a matter of law, there is very much a difference between prohibiting something natural and demanding a "hygiene" duty, however far fetched that duty may be. And there must also be a difference regarding punishment: Breaking a law is usually a crime, ignoring a rule based on a by-law can never be more than a misdemeanor.

Have I split enough hairs?

[Member #4359]

It's pertty much like splitting hairs, but as you know: That's what lawyers and politicians like to do best!

So here goes: If a condom-duty is in fact put into a by-law the way it is in Bavaria and the Saarland, then that means that a condom has to be used whenever there's paid sex. Prohibiting AO (= bareback sex) would mean that they would have to prohibit the natural way to have sex, and I think that this is quite frankly IMPOSSIBLE! Because they would have to apply that to everybody else too. Since they can't prohibit people from having sex the natural way, they can't do that to prostitutes (and their customers) either. So they invent a condom-duty and call it "hygiene". Then they try to apply that to prostitution like they apply other hygiene rules to all other businesses where it's applicable.

In effect, regarding prostitution, there is actually no difference between AO prohibition and a condom-duty. But as a matter of law, there is very much a difference between prohibiting something natural and demanding a "hygiene" duty, however far fetched that duty may be. And there must also be a difference regarding punishment: Breaking a law is usually a crime, ignoring a rule based on a by-law can never be more than a misdemeanor.

Have I split enough hairs?As a matter of practicality, with a condom-duty in effect, what happens when a hobbyist requests BBFS (either in the negotiating phase before going to a room or afterwards in the room)? Does she press the AO alarm button? Report him to the authorities? Nothing? Since BBFS is all I'm interested in, does this mean I will have to stop traveling to Germany?

[Neurosynth]

Have I split enough hairs?Actually splitting pubic hairs. And that's difficult because they tend to be curly.

[Neurosynth]

As a matter of practicality, with a condom-duty in effect, what happens when a hobbyist requests BBFS (either in the negotiating phase before going to a room or afterwards in the room)? Does she press the AO alarm button? Report him to the authorities? Nothing? Since BBFS is all I'm interested in, does this mean I will have to stop traveling to Germany?I'm no expert on German law, but from what I've heard so far it sounds like what is illegal is the act, not asking about the act.

I think everyone should take a deep breath and wait and see how this plays out. Nobody knows. It might be, for example, that a strong law passes. But is ignored or easily bypassed and life goes on. Then the politicians can puff up and act like they did something, and those who know nothing about the realities of commercial sex will think the did something, and those like us will still do what they want to do.

[SwingerLover]

Since BBFS is all I'm interested in, does this mean I will have to stop traveling to Germany?Let's wait and see what they will actually come up with. If at all. Neurosynth has pretty much summed it up:


I'm no expert on German law, but from what I've heard so far it sounds like what is illegal is the act, not asking about the act.

I think everyone should take a deep breath and wait and see how this plays out. Nobody knows. It might be, for example, that a strong law passes. But is ignored or easily bypassed and life goes on. Then the politicians can puff up and act like they did something, and those who know nothing about the realities of commercial sex will think the did something, and those like us will still do what they want to do."But is ignored or easily bypassed and life goes on. " seems to be a fairly accurate description of the situation in the Saarland.

[Member #4359]

Let's wait and see what they will actually come up with. If at all. Neurosynth has pretty much summed it up:

"But is ignored or easily bypassed and life goes on. " seems to be a fairly accurate description of the situation in the Saarland.What I can see already, even while still sitting here in the USA, is that more and more websites are dropping advertising for AO. While the girls may still offer it, it's going to be harder to find, especially for those not familiar with which girls have offered it in the past.

[SwingerLover]

What I can see already, even while still sitting here in the USA, is that more and more websites are dropping advertising for AO. While the girls may still offer it, it's going to be harder to find, especially for those not familiar with which girls have offered it in the past.Quite right. Some sites (like Fickanzeiger) have changed their "AO-Sex" or "AO-Girls" section to "GirlfriendSex". The Sexdo ads now show "Gf6" instead of AO. Which will get very confusing, since a lot of the condom girls also offer "Girlfriendsex", which in their case doesn't necessarily mean "AO", but rather kissing, kuddling and such. Indeed difficult to see what's what, if you don't already know the girls.

Aside from that: My biggest fear was that everybody would fall in line and obey this stupid law (however if may unfold) without putting up a fight. I was too optimistic. Quite a number of people already cancelled AO-advertising already, (and even AO completely) despite the fact that no law has even been passed yet, much less put in effect. When I see such obedience-in-advance to a law that doesn't even exist, then there is no hope and you can forget about everything. It seems as if you don't even need a law anymore these days, it suffices just nicely to put out some newspaper articles and lots of people already stick to what's written in there. Even if it is only half-true, incomplete and not (yet) valid.

And the biggest joke was one certain non-AO-club that had written on it's website that they would offer no AO from March 1st "because of the new law", when in fact they didn't offer any AO in the first place with. (They removed that stupidity from their website by now, so don't bother asking which club it was.).

[ThomasNorway]

Aside from that: My biggest fear was that everybody would fall in line and obey this stupid law (however if may unfold) without putting up a fight. I was too optimistic. Quite a number of people already cancelled AO-advertising already, (and even AO completely) despite the fact that no law has even been passed yet, much less put in effect. When I see such obedience-in-advance to a law that doesn't even exist, then there is no hope and you can forget about everything. It seems as if you don't even need a law anymore these days, it suffices just nicely to put out some newspaper articles and lots of people already stick to what's written in there. Even if it is only half-true, incomplete and not (yet) valid.
I wouldn't give up hope just yet. Remember that this is a very money-driven business, and AO is clearly an option that works as a selling point for some girls / clubs that can't stand up to the competition of others in other areas (super-model looks etc.). That selling point won't go away no matter what laws are passed. Assuming the law is passed, I see two scenarios;.

1: AO is off the menu, and all the girls who has used AO as their hook in the market move to a different country where this is still legal. I find this to be unlikely however, since few places in Europe come close to Germany and NRW as far as prostitution is concerned.

2: AO is still on the menu but, as has been previously discussed, becomes slightly more covert. The details of how this will work is still unclear, but some sort of convoluted advertising seems likely. So long as there is a market, there will always be a supply.

There might be a dip in the market first, where the authorities, customers and providers all try to wrap their heads around the new reality, but I remain optimistic as far as the future is concerned!

[IndiMann]

Hi Seniors,

Please guide me if there is any good partytreff / pauschalclub with good looking girls around Dusseldorf, I don't have a car. I don't like shitty looking girls.

Ideally, looking for a balance of service and good looks. ARE the girls at partytreffs beautiful? Even pleasant would do.

I have never been to a partytreff before, but would like to try once, as it seems one can fuck as many times as possible in one flat price. WOW. Too good to be true.

For FKK visits in first week July, would Sharks and Oase prove a better option than say Acapulco / Living room / Dolce Vita? Have to plan trip accordingly.

Please help. Thanks a lot.

Indimann

[Adindas]

Is there any PT with FKK quality girls??

I am fully aware, it is unreasonable to expect that all of them are FKK quality in a PartyTreff. But let say about half of them are FKK quality ??

Examples of what I mean here is such as ERW (although I am not recommending this place) or Airport Girls in Berlin or Farell Lounge in Kaarst (have not been there but I have heard from trusted members here).

I am not looking into Porn Stars but I am more into FKK quality girls.

Any lead, recommendation will be highly appreciated.

Thanks.

[Adindas]

Hi Seniors,

Please guide me if there is any good partytreff / pauschalclub with good looking girls around Dusseldorf, I don't have a car. I don't like shitty looking girls.

Ideally, looking for a balance of service and good looks. ARE the girls at partytreffs beautiful? Even pleasant would do.

I have never been to a partytreff before, but would like to try once, as it seems one can fuck as many times as possible in one flat price. WOW. Too good to be true.

For FKK visits in first week July, would Sharks and Oase prove a better option than say Acapulco / Living room / Dolce Vita? Have to plan trip accordingly.

Please help. Thanks a lot.

IndimannIn many cases most of PartyTreffs girls are dogs. This is also one of the reason why they are there in the first place. Otherwise they will be working in FKK club or becoming an escort working for an agent or as an Indie.

But there must be a few exception outthere. ERW or Airport Girls in Berlin for instance are a few to name with some FKK quality girls. But I am also still looking for the trail of the holy grail of FKK quality girls in PT in NRW.

Any recomendation and lead will ber very much appreciated ...

[BrooklynNY]

I was thinking about going to one of the Pauscha Clubs on Thursday. Bochum, Münster or Dortmund. Which one is the easiest to get to via public transportation?

I live here. I know the time travel varies. But some look you would have to walk a little to get to. Like there is nonearby public transpo.

Funny thing is also. Was at the Kirmes and swear I saw a girl that looked like Kasandra. I saw her twice not knowing who she was. Same day I did see the guy who runs all the big clubs in theüsseldorf. So anything is posdible.

Also does anyone have the code to see more on there sites. If so pm me.

[Dublin Mick]

The girls in Osnabruck are quite decent and some of them could scrape through into the FKK world with relative ease. Really is worth checking them out, being honest I wouldn't say any of them at all there are actually dogs.

[Bfsie]

Hi Everybody,

Does anybody have experience with swingertref-18 (www.swingertreff-18.de) in Cologne? I am a single man, any chance to score there? Thank you for your advice.

[Wanking]

Hi Everybody,

Does anybody have experience with swingertref-18 (www.swingertreff-18.de) in Cologne? I am a single man, any chance to score there? Thank you for your advice.I been there a few times. Last time a couple of years ago. Very few actual real swingers there. A few house women providing mostly basic mechanical service. One older house lady in her 50's was horny enough.

ID imagine there are 1 to 2 house ladies in the daytime and 3 or 4 at night.

Please report back if you do go.

Seems hard to beat insomnia in Berlin for actual active Swingers.