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Ccu2401
05-20-08, 13:08
Taking up Tung's challenge below are the murder rates/100,000 compared between Colombia and the US from 1990 up to the latest 2007. I removed the TABS hoping it would display consistently across various PCs and Browsers. Displays best with a non-proportional typeface like Courier New.

I've been to Colombia 5-6 times. I try and travel in groups. When I am by myself I alway am very aware of my surroundings and like Tung I use my peripheral vision. To add validity, below the stats is the link to the reference page.

1990s 1990 1991 1992 1993 1994 1995 1996 1997 1998 1999
Colombia 70.0 79.0 78.0 76.0 71.0 66.0 67.8 63.3 56.6 58.6
US 9.4 9.8 9.3 9.5 9.0 8.22 7.41 6.80 6.3 5.7

2000s 2000 2001 2003 2004 2005 2006 2007
Colombia 62.7 64.6 65.8 51.8 44.6 39.3 37.3
US 7.5 7.6 7.6 7.7 7.5 5.9

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_homicide_rate

But I wonder what the murder rate would be in the US if we had been living with 50 years of a Civil War? Even with these dramatic number differences I'm still visiting in July.

Happy Mongering

Sandman0011
05-20-08, 19:55
If you took the stats from cities like Washington DC, New Orleans, Detroit and LA against the Colombian numbers!


Taking up Tung's challenge below are the murder rates/100,000 compared between Colombia and the US from 1990 up to the latest 2007. I removed the TABS hoping it would display consistently across various PCs and Browsers. Displays best with a non-proportional typeface like Courier New.

I've been to Colombia 5-6 times. I try and travel in groups. When I am by myself I alway am very aware of my surroundings and like Tung I use my peripheral vision. To add validity, below the stats is the link to the reference page.

1990s 1990 1991 1992 1993 1994 1995 1996 1997 1998 1999
Colombia 70.0 79.0 78.0 76.0 71.0 66.0 67.8 63.3 56.6 58.6
US 9.4 9.8 9.3 9.5 9.0 8.22 7.41 6.80 6.3 5.7

2000s 2000 2001 2003 2004 2005 2006 2007
Colombia 62.7 64.6 65.8 51.8 44.6 39.3 37.3
US 7.5 7.6 7.6 7.7 7.5 5.9

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_homicide_rate

But I wonder what the murder rate would be in the US if we had been living with 50 years of a Civil War? Even with these dramatic number differences I'm still visiting in July.

Happy Mongering

AddictedToWomen
05-20-08, 22:40
Taking up Tung's challenge below are the murder rates/100,000 compared between Colombia and the US from 1990 up to the latest 2007. I removed the TABS hoping it would display consistently across various PCs and Browsers. Displays best with a non-proportional typeface like Courier New.

I've been to Colombia 5-6 times. I try and travel in groups. When I am by myself I alway am very aware of my surroundings and like Tung I use my peripheral vision. To add validity, below the stats is the link to the reference page.

1990s 1990 1991 1992 1993 1994 1995 1996 1997 1998 1999
Colombia 70.0 79.0 78.0 76.0 71.0 66.0 67.8 63.3 56.6 58.6
US 9.4 9.8 9.3 9.5 9.0 8.22 7.41 6.80 6.3 5.7

2000s 2000 2001 2003 2004 2005 2006 2007
Colombia 62.7 64.6 65.8 51.8 44.6 39.3 37.3
US 7.5 7.6 7.6 7.7 7.5 5.9

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_homicide_rate

But I wonder what the murder rate would be in the US if we had been living with 50 years of a Civil War? Even with these dramatic number differences I'm still visiting in July.

Happy MongeringAny idea what the rates are for NYC and DC?

Halcyon901
05-20-08, 23:54
Hey everybody. I kind of thought the previous posts were interesting. Have any of you guys heard of Freakonomics? According to the authors, they found a statisticl correlation between declining crime rates and abortion. Their primary focus was on crime stats in New York, between the 80s and late 90s. Now, I don't have the precise numbers with me, but here is their explanation.

Roe v. Wade legalized abortion, I believe, in 1972. Crime is usually associated with the lower socio-economic group (note: I am not saying "race"). Before Roe v. Wade, it was fairly expensive to have an abortion. After Roe v. Wade, it became more widely available, and cheaper. Now, the group of women, who couldn't afford it, can now abort (I know this sounds horrible) unwanted children. Consequently, this led to a reduction of the criminal pool. If you look at stats, crime began to decline in the early 90s (Giuliani era), approximately the age at which these aborted would be 18.

I know I'm missing a lot, so I truly suggest you guys read Freakonomics. Maybe there's correlation betweeen the declining murder rates in Colombia and a decline of the criminal pool. Flame away!

Ccu2401
05-21-08, 05:09
only found number of homicides per 100,000 persons for 2004
--------2004 ------
city rate
new york city 7.0
los angeles 13.4
chicago 15.5
houston 13.3
philadelphia 22.2
phoenix 14.1
san antonio 7.6
san diego 4.8
dallas 20.2
san jose 2.6
san francisco 11.6
seattle 4.3

colombia(2004) 7.5

these are just the homicide rates for 2004 - these don't include other violent crimes such as [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123), robber or assault nor does it include burroughs or surrounding cities. for example i live in a small suburban town north of dallas and my city is significantly less than dallas proper.
below is the link to this info:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/crime_in_the_united_states#large_cities

enjoy,

ccu2401

AddictedToWomen
05-21-08, 08:09
Only found Number of Homicides per 100,000 persons for 2004

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_the_United_States#Large_cities

Enjoy,

ccu2401Thanks for the link. The table doesn't seem to include what's in the graph: Baltimore, Detroit, and DC have rates comparable to Colombia.

Ccu2401
05-21-08, 12:24
sorry - i put in the incorrect value previously for colombia. apologies

only found number of homicides per 100,000 persons for 2004

--------2004 ------
city rate
new york city 7.0
los angeles 13.4
chicago 15.5
houston 13.3
philadelphia 22.2
phoenix 14.1
san antonio 7.6
san diego 4.8
dallas 20.2
san jose 2.6
san francisco 11.6
seattle 4.3

colombia(2004) 44.6 <--- still higher than any major us city!

these are just the homicide rates for 2004 per 100,000 population - these don't include other violent crimes such as [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123), robber or assault nor does it include burroughs or surrounding cities. for example i live in a small suburban town north of dallas and my city is significantly less than dallas proper.
below is the link to this info:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/crime_...es#large_cities

enjoy,

ccu2401

Ricker
05-21-08, 18:19
Hey everybody. I kind of thought the previous posts were interesting. Have any of you guys heard of Freakonomics? According to the authors, they found a statisticl correlation between declining crime rates and abortion. Their primary focus was on crime stats in New York, between the 80s and late 90s. Now, I don't have the precise numbers with me, but here is their explanation.

Roe v. Wade legalized abortion, I believe, in 1972. Crime is usually associated with the lower socio-economic group (note: I am not saying "race"). Before Roe v. Wade, it was fairly expensive to have an abortion. After Roe v. Wade, it became more widely available, and cheaper. Now, the group of women, who couldn't afford it, can now abort (I know this sounds horrible) unwanted children. Consequently, this led to a reduction of the criminal pool. If you look at stats, crime began to decline in the early 90s (Giuliani era), approximately the age at which these aborted would be 18.

I know I'm missing a lot, so I truly suggest you guys read Freakonomics. Maybe there's correlation betweeen the declining murder rates in Colombia and a decline of the criminal pool. Flame away!So what? I think you need to forget about all that nonsense and concentrate on getting layed.

Dirty Willy
05-22-08, 00:31
Lonely Planet writes "murders are down 40%." So does that mean in 2002 there were ten people murdered, in 2007 only six? Hardly. Generic statements like this are misleading and annoying.

[b]EDITOR'S NOTE: I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.Ok Mr. 'I'm going to run statistics until everyone else pukes all over the floor'

You got this one from me and I'm going to have to say that you're incorrect.

It's not a misleading statement precisely because the number was so high to begin with. Your example of murders declining from 10 to 6 and then claiming a decline of 40% would be a misleading statistic. It wouldn't really be very meaningful because the number is so small to begin with.

Here's a good case of a misleading statistic. Peaceful Happy Valley (a made up place) with 100, 000 residents had 1 murder from 1985-1994, and then 3 murders from 1995-2004 without any meaningful change in population. If you would say that their murder rate tripled in that ten year period, that would definitely be a misleading statistic, because you are giving the impression that PH Valley is a really dangerous place, or at least much more dangerous than it used to be, but then again relative changes are actually pretty meaningless, because the number is so small to begin with.

Because Columbia's murder rate was so high to begin with, the 40% decline is impressive. It's definitely safer there, even if it's not safe, and that's the point of the number.

Also, I'm one of those travellers you mention who tried convincing you to go to Columbia and you curse me! ? ! Come on Tung, you should be thanking me. You sound like you're having fun and if you weren't in Columbia now, you'd be back home looking for work. Now that (I'd make that all caps if it were allowed) is something to be afraid of!

Have fun you crazy MF, as I, along with many others, will continue to live vicariously through you.

Rock Harders
05-22-08, 08:39
Mongers,

I do not think anyone can reasonably argue that crime rates have not plummeted in Medellin (and Colombia in general, but not as signficantly in other areas) over the past five years. Dozens of locals in Medellin told me (in their native tongue) that just three or four years ago, it was not safe to go out at night, even in areas that now seem inoccuous such as Parque Lleras and the rest of Poblado. Also, I was informed that the road between the airport in Rio Negro and Medellin city was an extremely dangerous route and the scene of numerous attacks by criminals on passing vehicles. In addition, the surrounding areas of Antioquia were once prime time guerrilla country until the last several years. Uribe has cleaned up Medellin and many parts of Colombia big-time, the economy is booming and many people who previously had nothing better to do than involve themselves in crime now have more economic opportunities. However, this is Colombia. Life is cheap here, the socio-economic divide is gargantuan, and there are desperate wolves around who will take a piece of your ass if you let yourself be the lamb. Although probably the safest (and best) city in Colombia at this point, Medellin is not Disneyland (its not Buenos Aires either, which is the safest big-time city in Latin America) and you've got to watch your ass there.

Suerte,

Rock Harders

EDITOR'S NOTE: I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.

Halcyon901
05-24-08, 00:43
So what? I think you need to forget about all that nonsense and concentrate on getting layed.Ricker,

First of all, what is "layed? "

Second, this is a mongering forum, how difficult would it be to "concentrate" on getting "layed" when the majority of the forum is about P4P? Cash talks, Bulls--t walks. You give the paisa money and then screw, or get screwed.

Finally, I think its a fairly valid explanation on why crime has declined in NYC. Most people assume Giuliani cleaned up the city. Freakonomics only attempts to bring an alternative view.

Tungurahua
06-06-08, 02:58
http://news.scotsman.com/world/Farc39s-female-Rambo-surrenders-to.4099201.jp

Published Date: 20 May 2008
By Jeremy McDermott in Medellin

ONE of the Colombia's most renowned rebel fighters, and the guerrillas' senior female commander, has surrendered in yet another victory for the United States-backed war policy of president Alvaro Uribe.

"We have been after this woman for a long time," said Juan Manuel Santos, the defence minister, "but she always gave us the slip."

Half-starved and wounded, Nelly Avila Moreno, who was better known by her guerrilla alias, "Karina", surrendered to the secret police, the DAS, ending one of the legends of the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia (Farc). Accompanying her was her bodyguard and lover known only by his alias of Michin.

"To become a Farc leader you have to be utterly ruthless and vicious, even more so if you are a woman," said an army intelligence source. "Karina was both."

A glance at Karina shows why she was known as a female "Rambo" in the Farc and a role model for the women that make up more than 30 per cent of the supposedly Marxist guerrilla army. She has lost the sight of one eye and has scars on her face from combat. She also has lost a breast and has bullet wounds along an arm.

Yet she gave far worse than she got. She was wanted for a battery of charges, among them murder, extortion and kidnapping.

She has been linked to a series of massacres in the banana-growing region of Uraba, near the Caribbean Coast, close to where she was born. Many businessmen and ranchers suffered extortion, kidnapping and murder at her hands.

Yet by negotiating her surrender under the government amnesty legislation known as the Peace and Justice Law, she can be sentenced only to a maximum of eight years in prison.

She came to public attention during the peace process between the Farc and the former president, Andres Pastrana, who granted the rebels a 16,000sq mile safe haven in the south of the country as a venue for peace talks.

During a ceremony in the safe haven, attended by thousands of rebels, Karina addressed the rows of uniformed and heavily armed guerrillas – the proof that women in the Farc had acquired the fame of being even more vicious fighters than their male counterparts.

She became a priority target for the authorities in June 2002 after the town of Arboleda-Pensilvania in the province of Caldas was attacked by a rebel column. They killed 13 policemen along with four civilians, including one woman burned alive for being married to a policeman. It was then that Oxford-educated president Uribe called upon his security forces to capture or kill Karina and put a £400,000 bounty on her head.

The guerrilla commander, with more than 20 years in rebel ranks, was known to be equally without pity on her own troops. Intelligence sources believe that she personally executed a dozen Farc members accused of being informers or breaking the revolutionary rule book.

Karina, 45, commanded the Farc's 47th Front which, at the height of its power, had 350 members operating in and around the northern province of Antioquia, the capital of which, Medellin, is where she now sits in a police cell, awaiting her fate.

Parts of her criminal empire sit astride drugs and arms smuggling routes, ensuring that she was never short of money to carry out operations.

However over the last eight months, the US-trained and equipped army has launched a series of offensives against the Farc in Antioquia and the surrounding provinces, putting the guerrillas on the defensive and forcing them to abandon camps and move on to a permanently mobile footing. This meant that guerrillas were tired, often hungry and in frequent combat with the military, leading to mass desertions, which gave the army more information to concentrate their operations.

Karina came under greater pressure in March, after her boss, Ivan Rios, a member of the Farc's ruling seven-man body, the Secretariat, was murdered by one of his bodyguards.

The bodyguard, alias "Rojas", cut off Rios's hand as proof of his act and turned himself in to the authorities, where he promptly claimed and later received, a reward for more than £500,000.

The Farc has had a year of setbacks. On 1 March, a raid by the Colombian police and armed forces killed the Farc's second-in-command, Luis Edgar Devia Silva, also known as Raul Reyes.

He was the most senior Farc leader killed by the Colombian government in nearly 40 years of war. He was also the first member of the Farc's leadership council to be killed in combat.

Tungurahua
06-06-08, 03:01
http://edition.cnn.com/2008/world/americas/05/24/farc.leader/

may 25, 2008 -- updated 2317 gmt

(cnn) -- the leader of colombia's largest leftist rebel group has died, a senior commander of the revolutionary armed forces of colombia said sunday.

pedro antonio marin, also known as manuel marulanda velez, died in the arms of his companion, senior farc rebel commander timoleon jimenez said in a taped speech.

marulanda died march 26 of a heart attack in a forested hideout, said jimenez, also known as timochenko.

"we say goodbye physically, in the name of thousands of farc guerrillas," jimenez said. "a great leader has marched away."

jimenez said marulanda, 74, was replaced by alfonso cano, a longtime ideologue for the group.

marulanda joined farc -- the oldest and most resilient insurgent group in latin america -- in the 1940s. a marxist devotee, he was feared by some but viewed as a revolutionary leader by rebels, who revered him. he promised equality in poor agricultural regions, gaining many farc adherents.

while widely anticipated, marulanda's death is a huge blow for farc, which has recently lost commanders including raul reyes and ivan rios, both killed in military operations. chief financier simon trinidad is serving a 60-year sentence in a u.s. prison after being convicted of conspiracy to take three u.s. military contractors hostage in 2003.

juan manuel santos, colombian defense minister, hinted to a reporter saturday that the government believed marulanda dead. "the information that we have is that he has gone already," he told a reporter from semana magazine.

santos said that the colombian military had bombed three areas where marulanda -- also known as "tirofijo" and "sure shot" -- was believed to be around the time of his death but that the fighting was not believed to have killed him.

colombian president alvaro uribe, speaking at a town hall-style meeting, said his government is creating a reward fund of up to $100 million for rebel soldiers who leave farc.

he also said he's working on a way to grant former rebels what he called "conditional freedom" -- suggesting that they'd receive some form of amnesty for criminal acts.

the president said his government has been contacted by farc members who apparently want to leave the group but fear for their safety.

he did not say whether the fighters were high-level or rank-and-file members, but said they had expressed a willingness to release some of the hundreds of hostages that farc is believed to be holding in the jungles along the border of colombia and ecuador.

established as the military wing of the colombian communist party in 1964, farc is colombia's oldest, largest and best-equipped marxist rebel group, according to the u.s. department of state. several nations, including the united states, classify it as a terrorist group. farc has been embroiled in a complex guerilla conflict with the colombian government and right-wing paramilitary groups working in tandem with the government.

the group has defended the taking of hostages, including ailing former presidential candidate ingrid betancourt, as a legitimate technique in the conflict, although nations including the united states consider it a terrorist organization.

as the group's leader, marulanda was the ultimate decision maker who decided to approve the farc's expanded efforts into cocaine trafficking, according to the u.s. state department.

Tungurahua
06-06-08, 03:13
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/la-fg-rebel20-2008may20,0,4227749.story

Nelly Avila Moreno, a notoriously brutal commander, said she turned herself in because of army pressure and a $900,000 price on her head that made her fear her own troops.

... She said the leftist group was "crumbling" and she had not had any direct communication with the top FARC leadership in two years.

... Moreno's surrender Sunday in southern Antioquia state brings to six the number of commanders who have surrendered, been killed or been captured in the last year.

... In March, two members of the seven-person FARC secretariat, known by their aliases Raul Reyes and Ivan Rios, were killed. Reyes died in a Colombian raid in Ecuador, and Rios was shot to death in southwestern Colombia by his bodyguard, who later sought a $2.5-million reward.

... Colombian officials say 1,181 rebels have turned themselves in this year for "reinsertion" into Colombian society, an 8% increase from the 1,098 who surrendered over the same period last year.

Ricker
06-08-08, 03:10
Ricker,

First of all, what is "layed? "

Second, this is a mongering forum, how difficult would it be to "concentrate" on getting "layed" when the majority of the forum is about P4P? Cash talks, Bulls--t walks. You give the paisa money and then screw, or get screwed.

Finally, I think its a fairly valid explanation on why crime has declined in NYC. Most people assume Giuliani cleaned up the city. Freakonomics only attempts to bring an alternative view.Relax dude. I think I know what this board is about, since maybe I've been posting on it long before you had any clue what a Paisa might be.

If you enjoy posting about Giuliani and Freakonomics in NYC, have at it.

Tungurahua
06-15-08, 21:52
Originally posted in the Medellin forum, for future reference this information properly belongs on the Crime In Colombia board. For those interested in comparing homicide rates of Colombian cities to US cities I found the FBI had the best and most current information.

http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/cius2006/offenses/violent_crime/murder_homicide.html

The original post reads:

For the last two years I have been listening to dozens of travellers say "Colombia is safe!" All I have to say is: %&*Ç@ off. Mirroring the thoughts of other board members I too am weary of individuals trying to downplay the risks of Colombia. Yes today is better compared to what it was but the country's murder rate is still very high -- never mind all the other crime stats.

There is one thing I find lacking on the ISG-Colombia forum(s). There is a lot of chatter about how dangerous Colombia is -- individual cities like Cali, Bogota, Medellin, the countryside, etc. -- but I have yet to find a hard reference to what individuals may be familiar with. Give me context! How dangerous is dangerous? What are the specifics? Lonely Planet writes "murders are down 40%." So does that mean in 2002 there were ten people murdered, in 2007 only six? Hardly. Generic statements like this are misleading and annoying.

On the ISG-Rio Crime & Safety board I once broke down the numbers to prove what country was more dangerous, Brazil or the US. Time to do the same thing for Colombia and the US. Here are the official numbers for Colombia:

Countrywide murders 2007: 15,400 (citizens only, not including combat deaths). Population 44,000,000 makes for 35 murders per 100,000.
Countrywide murders 2006: 17,206
Countrywide murders 2005: 17,726.
Countrywide murders 2003: 23,013
Countrywide murders 2002: 28,837

The numbers for the United States are:

Countrywide murders/manslaughters 2006: 17,034. Population 301,000,000 makes for 5.7 murders per 100,000.
Countrywide murders/manslaughters 2005: 16,900

First of all I trust the US numbers more than I do Colombia's. Each year in Colombia I think there is an additional few thousand individuals who are slaughtered, shot, macheted, gutted, etc., then thrown into open pits like road kill -- and they never make the official police counts. But let us use what we have.

Colombia has 14.6% of the US population yet has 90.4% of its murders.

Put another way, Colombia has 1/7 of the US population but 6x the murder rate.

If we extrapolated Colombia to have an equal US population of 301,000,000 its murder rate at 35 per 100,000 would be the equivalent of 105,350 individuals per year (301,000,000 * 35 / 100,000 = x, x = 105350).

This is "safe" Colombia in 2008.

How can I justify being here? It is simple: half lunacy, half rationality. In 2006 while in Ecuador I watched Uribe's re-election, then while travelling other S. American countries over the course of two years I waited for confirmation of the improving trend. I got it. Uribe has two more years to go. While I would like to be optimistic about Colombia's future I am wary of Latin American politics: two steps forward, three steps back. Is Colombia's next president going to continue improvements? Is it different for Colombia this time around? I don't know. So I am sliding into Colombia on the tail end of Uribe's terms to take a look at the country.

For interest the latest city specific numbers I can find are: Bogotá's kill rate is 23 per 100,000. Cartagena is 22 per 100,000 (275 murders in 2006 using population 1,240,000). Medellin 29 per 100,000 (2007 article). Cali 65 per 100,000 (year unknown).

Cabroncito
06-17-08, 02:55
The statistics are misleading. Crimes in the largest cities are generally reported and investigated. However if you look at the numbers some will have above average murder rates, yet they are not really dangerous relative to areas with less law enforcement.

The neighboring cities may not have many "murders" but sometimes an epidemic number of "missing persons" (not revealed in the statistics).

ElCastillo
06-19-08, 19:15
Hi guys,

I know this one subject causes more fighting and anger than most but I really want to discuss this without upsetting anyone. I have been living in Medellin for about a year and a half. I feel safer here than back in Sacramento, CA. I have been walking around Elcentro in the day time for all of this time. I have felt threaten once. This guy was obiously following us and we just took a taxi to ditch him.

Ok! Back to my thoughts. I was given a paper by a traffic cop saying 275 people were ran over and killed by cars. My point is how can you calculate the danger of a city when you consider only murder rates? Statistics show many different ways people die. Falling down, drowning, car accidents.

Personally I think you don't have as much control over your life as you think you do. No gold chains, expensive watches helps. That is why Ricker is saying to just enjoy life because you can't analytically figure out your safety. The reputation of crime the country has is the most important. I will go by word of mouth before I trust statistics.

Justafool
06-20-08, 17:54
The Colombians "the happy people" really do no value life of their fellow man in a way others in the world do. They drive the way most of South America and some of Europe and the middle east, hell most of the world drive, as if you are in their way; get out.

Some appear to drive right at you as you walk across a street (motorcycles included). You have to walk with your head on a swivel as turning cars do not care that you might not have eyes in the back of your heard while you are in the middle of a intersection.

Be careful for those, motorcyclists included, who go through red lights while no other vehicle is in the intersection.

Caution for the "5 second exception" (my term and rule) in that a vehicle might go through a red if they are still in motion within five seconds after it has turned red.

Yellow gold is a big no no (though the 14k is not wanted in Colombia a robber will not know it is 14k until after the grab. If you, like me prefer white, most will think it is silver and keep away. Leave rings and expensive watches at home, you do not need them and they will only get you more attention (most not of the mongering kind).

I the places you will be looking to hang the expensive stuff will only impress enough to get you asked for more money. Hell, most over there are into the friendship bracelets. Even as a gift from a gringo an expensive gift will likely be sold unless you find a "real love" or someone who is seeking to bait you for more.

Be SMART safe but LIVE!


Hi guys,

I know this one subject causes more fighting and anger than most but I really want to discuss this without upsetting anyone. I have been living in Medellin for about a year and a half. I feel safer here than back in Sacramento, CA. I have been walking around Elcentro in the day time for all of this time. I have felt threaten once. This guy was obiously following us and we just took a taxi to ditch him.

Ok! Back to my thoughts. I was given a paper by a traffic cop saying 275 people were ran over and killed by cars. My point is how can you calculate the danger of a city when you consider only murder rates? Statistics show many different ways people die. Falling down, drowning, car accidents.

Personally I think you don't have as much control over your life as you think you do. No gold chains, expensive watches helps. That is why Ricker is saying to just enjoy life because you can't analytically figure out your safety. The reputation of crime the country has is the most important. I will go by word of mouth before I trust statistics.

Halcyon901
06-23-08, 22:55
Relax dude. I think I know what this board is about, since maybe I've been posting on it long before you had any clue what a Paisa might be.

If you enjoy posting about Giuliani and Freakonomics in NYC, have at it.Ricker,

You are correct, you have been posting much longer than I have on Colombia, and I humbly acknowledge all the information you have acquired in this part of the world. I, too, have posted enough information about my experiences, if you look through my reports, so I dont lack the "credentials" in mongering-experience.

However, as the titles of this thread states, it is about "crime" in Colombia. I think the posts I made are pretty relevant for this thread. I just dont think your original response to my post was warranted. Let's just leave it at that, and move on.

Halcyon901
06-23-08, 23:03
Hi guys,

I will go by word of mouth before I trust statistics.El Castillo,

This is a pretty absurd comment. I dont think i even have to explain the rationale behind it. This isnt a knock on you, per se, maybe it could just be phrased better.

Having only visited Medellin once, I felt pretty safe, even in Centro and Mayorista. And considering I'm Asian, I was probably an even bigger minority than other gringos. Of course, the non-stop stares was disconcerting, but I realized that it was more out of curiosity, than anger. As for general advice, just respect the people and city, because I was treated very well. But always keep an eye out and have some common street-sense.

Ricker
06-24-08, 17:15
Ricker,

You are correct, you have been posting much longer than I have on Colombia, and I humbly acknowledge all the information you have acquired in this part of the world. I, too, have posted enough information about my experiences, if you look through my reports, so I dont lack the "credentials" in mongering-experience.

However, as the titles of this thread states, it is about "crime" in Colombia. I think the posts I made are pretty relevant for this thread. I just dont think your original response to my post was warranted. Let's just leave it at that, and move on.Ok amigo sounds good to me. Not like I was challenging you to a duel at 20 paces or anything :)

Have fun out there!

Subaculture
07-18-08, 12:13
Economist has a report on S.A murder rates.

Big Drop in Colombia, especially Medellin! (but still compared to the US relatively dangerous)

http://www.economist.com/world/la/displaystory.cfm?story_id=11750858

SC

Mr Enternational
07-19-08, 17:03
I remember someone asking about Buenaventura and somebody else replying that it is so dangerous there that Colombians don't even want to go. This article mentions that 5. 8 tons of cocaine was shipped from there about a week ago on a submarine and was intercepted by the Mexican navy.

http://news.aol.com/article/us-helped-mexico-find-drug-submarine/89995?icid=200100397x1205903883x1200296683

Gary Groundwork
08-23-08, 21:31
Can someone confirm that two carfore shopping centres were bombed in Bogota last week and the farc set off another bomb in medellin?

My mate just told me but I haven't heard anything.

Tom 33
08-24-08, 01:55
Can someone confirm that two carfore shopping centres were bombed in Bogota last week and the farc set off another bomb in medellin?

My mate just told me but I haven't heard anything.http://www.reuters.com/article/worldNews/idUSN1545634520080815

The "Medellín" bomb was actually set off in a small pueblo some distance from Medellín.

I think I did hear about some bombings in Bogotá as well. You may have meant Carrefour.

The FARC is a little pissed about being snookered out of Ingrid and the 3 US contractors.

Blaster54
08-24-08, 11:31
There was a small bomb, I. E. D. (Improvised Explosive Device that was set off in Bogota and three people were injured but not life threatening last week.

Outside Medellin, the FARC had placed several IED's in one of the townships outside Medellin. Seven people killed and several more injured. I don't have exact details yet, but should see them in the near future.

There is a major push against the FARC but there still remains a few cells with those working for the drug cartels. MAybe soon, this will end.

Be safe

Parcero
02-13-09, 04:34
I don´t usually post but I found this topic to be interesting.

So, here goes:

Regardless of whatever the murder rate was or is:

How many murdered were Gringos?

There´s the number that you should concern yourself with.

Tom 33
02-13-09, 13:40
How many murdered were GringosIf there will only be one in the next 5 years, it would be quite meaningful to me if I were to be that one.

Frankly, things are becoming more dangerous in Colombia these days. As the world malaise catches up with Colombia, it will not get any better in the near future.

Henry R
03-28-09, 22:24
I don't have a computer and am now using the library, which only gives me a short time on the Internet. I just do not have the time to spend hours browsing this website to find the answers to this question:

Would like to know which cities or areas in Columbia have babe "action", and are not too dangerous. Also, is the babe action just "houses", or are there bars or discos with action? If so, can you name the houses, bars and discos so I can find them?

I assume Medellin is not safe. I would probably travel this coming Fall (2009). Also, any nice beaches where I probably won't get killed? Please be honest. I won't go to Columbia if it is too dangerous. You can answer here or PM me. Appreciate anyone's help.

UrbanWildlife
03-30-09, 02:17
I don't have a computer and am now using the library, which only gives me a short time on the Internet. I just do not have the time to spend hours browsing this website to find the answers to this question:

Would like to know which cities or areas in Columbia have babe "action", and are not too dangerous. Also, is the babe action just "houses", or are there bars or discos with action? If so, can you name the houses, bars and discos so I can find them?

I assume Medellin is not safe. I would probably travel this coming Fall (2009). Also, any nice beaches where I probably won't get killed? Please be honest. I won't go to Columbia if it is too dangerous. You can answer here or PM me. Appreciate anyone's help.I suggest you go to Medellin Henry R! You will be just fine there, and that is why it has become a monger haven for gringos and europeans.

Manizales911
03-30-09, 03:49
I don't have a computer and am now using the library, which only gives me a short time on the Internet. I just do not have the time to spend hours browsing this website to find the answers to this question:

Would like to know which cities or areas in Columbia have babe "action", and are not too dangerous. Also, is the babe action just "houses", or are there bars or discos with action? If so, can you name the houses, bars and discos so I can find them?

I assume Medellin is not safe. I would probably travel this coming Fall (2009). Also, any nice beaches where I probably won't get killed? Please be honest. I won't go to Columbia if it is too dangerous. You can answer here or PM me. Appreciate anyone's help.You should probably start by learning the correct spelling of the country you intend on visiting. C-o-l-o-m-b-i-a.

Tiny 12
03-31-09, 00:26
I don't have a computer and am now using the library, which only gives me a short time on the Internet. I just do not have the time to spend hours browsing this website to find the answers to this question:

Would like to know which cities or areas in Columbia have babe "action", and are not too dangerous. Also, is the babe action just "houses", or are there bars or discos with action? If so, can you name the houses, bars and discos so I can find them?

I assume Medellin is not safe. I would probably travel this coming Fall (2009). Also, any nice beaches where I probably won't get killed? Please be honest. I won't go to Columbia if it is too dangerous. You can answer here or PM me. Appreciate anyone's help.Cartagena is the safest city in Colombia, as long as you stick to the tourist areas. It has houses, bars, discos and a beach. Read the thread. It doesn't have nice beaches, but you'll find them a boat ride away.

Goga Fung
04-02-09, 06:07
Would like to know which cities or areas in Columbia have babe "action", and are not too dangerous.For example for Medellin places, there is a thread Medellin Lists:

http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?t=2418


Also, any nice beaches where I probably won't get killed? Please be honest. I won't go to Columbia if it is too dangerous.Why would you be killed? There is much better chance to get arrested or harassed by police on a USA beach for drinking beer and not getting any, than being killed on a Colombian beach. I would chose the second option.

Errol Flynn
04-02-09, 07:54
As Pablo Escobar said:

I'd rather lie in a grave in Colombia than spend my life in Sex Prison (at least I think that's what he meant to say).

Ricker
04-02-09, 14:52
For example for Medellin places, there is a thread Medellin Lists:

http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?t=2418

Why would you be killed? There is much better chance to get arrested or harassed by police on a USA beach for drinking beer and not getting any, than being killed on a Colombian beach. I would chose the second option.That's funny!

I was on a beach the other day in Florida and saw a cop patrolling, giving citations for having bottles of beer on the beach.

Probably keeps the beach clean of empty bottles, but it was interesting to watch.

And as all the gorgeous, young girls were ignoring me. I was missing the beaches of Brasil actually.

Henry R
04-04-09, 21:36
You should probably start by learning the correct spelling of the country you intend on visiting. C-o-l-o-m-b-i-a.Actually, I meant I want to visit Columbia University in New York (ha ha).

Doronto
04-05-09, 01:04
I've met a dominican guy, he was visiting his girlfriend in Buenaventura. She lives there in a "shithole". A life does not count anything there, you can hire a killer for 40 US.

He hired two bodyguards, and had a private taxi driver, all wearing guns all the time.

Colombia can be really dangerous. Stay in the good areas of the cities, use common sense, and don't make anybody angry and you will be fine.

Information is the key. Try to find out, what you can do and what not. Example: Parque Lleras in Medellin is safe, no problem to walk. Though you should not walk in Belo at nighttime (anyway, there is nothing to see or to do there, so why should you go there? ).

Do some risk management. Can you trust the taxi driver? Probably yes. Maybe no, when he knows that you've got 5000US in your pocket.

Avoid to be a target: asking somebody on the street for the next ATM might be really stupid. Ask at the hotel, or better just try to find one in one of the nice shopping centers. Walking at night and shouting in english? Better be quiet. And so on.

Goga Fung
04-05-09, 03:08
That's funny!

I was on a beach the other day in Florida and saw a cop patrolling, giving citations for having bottles of beer on the beach.

Probably keeps the beach clean of empty bottles, but it was interesting to watch.
I'm not sure if it's about bottles. I think it's about that cops do not have anything better to do, or more likely they prefer harass normal people than catch criminals.

I've been to different beaches in Aruba, Curacao, Cyprus, Russia, Turkey, Rio, Colombia/Cartagena and everywhere they sell alcohol or you can bring your own, never saw problems with garbage.

BTW, in USA where alcohol is prohibited I've seen some of the dirtiest beaches.

Tom 33
04-05-09, 12:20
I've met a dominican guy, he was visiting his girlfriend in Buenaventura. She lives there in a "shithole". A life does not count anything there, you can hire a killer for 40 US.

He hired two bodyguards, and had a private taxi driver, all wearing guns all the time.

Colombia can be really dangerous. Stay in the good areas of the cities, use common sense, and don't make anybody angry and you will be fine.

Information is the key. Try to find out, what you can do and what not. Example: Parque Lleras in Medellin is safe, no problem to walk. Though you should not walk in Belo at nighttime (anyway, there is nothing to see or to do there, so why should you go there? ).

Do some risk management. Can you trust the taxi driver? Probably yes. Maybe no, when he knows that you've got 5000US in your pocket.

Avoid to be a target: asking somebody on the street for the next ATM might be really stupid. Ask at the hotel, or better just try to find one in one of the nice shopping centers. Walking at night and shouting in english? Better be quiet. And so on.Parts of Bello are quite nice and safe, even at night. With a population of nearly 400,000 there is plenty to do there.

A friend of mine was the victim of a home invasion during the day not far from Parque Lleras.

Don't trust any taxi driver that you do not know at night.

Henry R
04-26-09, 22:54
Cartagena is the safest city in Colombia, as long as you stick to the tourist areas. It has houses, bars, discos and a beach. Read the thread. It doesn't have nice beaches, but you'll find them a boat ride away.I have never been to Columbia but :Do some of the discos in Cartagena have ladies available for $$, or are they non-pros. Can you recommend and give the names of any discos in Cartagena that have pros or semi-pros? (I would ask for the prices they charge for short time and also for all nite but my experience with the Brazil site of this forum is that posters usually understate the prices).

Rover2
07-04-09, 09:43
Just read this on a forum in Poor But Happy In Colombia. Just F.Y.I.

on Jun 30, 2009, 19:43: flag

I was near plaza botero, actually heading that way to get a map from the tousit info there. Just one road away where all the compraventas are. I was walking down and had earphones that lead into my pocket when some guy grabbed me from behind and there was a slight struggle. I was shocked for a second before realising what happened, i checked my pockets and they had got my phone but not my wallet.

I turned round and saw the guy simply walking off and the first thing that came into my head was to get him. I think it was probably a bad idea now but at the time it was just instincts. As i got close a couple of his mates appeared from what i could remember and squared up to me saying things like ´´que pasa?´´etc

Thats when i realised it was probably time for me to leave, but luckily a policeman popped out of nowhere and asked what was up. I pointed at the guy (by this point the group were backing off) and told him he had robbed me (bad idea??) he got the lad but he´d already passed the phone to a mate. A large group of witnesses had gathered around us by this point but were too scared to back me up. The policemen simply took the lad off in one direction but didn´t really say much to me, only what sort of phone it was.

I looked around and the group of people basically told me to run. I looked at them for a second and they got really serious saying get out of here now before the rest come back for you... so I did just that. I got away quickly and got the map i wanted as its next to a police stand anyway, then just got the metro back to El Poblado and made sure no one was following me.

The ting is i´m not sure what the protocol is in that situation... I asked another colombian and he said i did the right thing telling the police. I´m sure it could have been much worse. I wasn´t really shook up, just adrenaline really. Its something i always new could happen and there´s been a lot of people in the hostal i was in that have been held up with knives.

I just wish i hadn´t been stupid with the headphones... ifs and buts.

Does anyone know the road on which the police station is where i can go. Thanks for the help. By the way, it hasn´t knocked my confidence at all, i just liked my phone a lot. Ill be more careful next time.

Mule69
07-05-09, 14:08
I have never been to Columbia but :Do some of the discos in Cartagena have ladies available for $$, or are they non-pros. Can you recommend and give the names of any discos in Cartagena that have pros or semi-pros? (I would ask for the prices they charge for short time and also for all nite but my experience with the Brazil site of this forum is that posters usually understate the prices).LDV (La Dolce Vida) is the premier place to get chicas in Ctg.It is a disco in Laguito beside a casino.Any girl in there is a pro and short time is 150-200K.A good night will have 50 to 75 chicas there.It is known to all in the Bocagrande/Laguito area of Cartagena.

Simone01
03-30-10, 23:02
You can go to Colombia without any problem, cause safety now is a lot better that some year ago, but it depends on you if you will havo or not problems in this country. If you stay in the northern side of the bigest colombian towns(Bogota, Medellin o Barranquilla) or the turistic side of Cartagena, especialy during the day there is not problem. But you must avoid the popular barrios(slums) and the majority of rural countrysideS areas(Choco, Cauca, ValledelCauca, Guaviare, Meta, Caqueta etc) and the Border sides, close Venezuela and Ecuador, that are full of Farc men that can easly kidnap you.

Other thing if you are caucasian you must stay more carefull than if you are not white, because colombian people think that all white men are wealthy.

Othe thing if you do not speack a very good spanish avoid to talk a lot during the nites in colombian streets.

U can go to Colombia without problem but you need to remeber that Colombia is not Switzerland so be carefull abd use any caution durin the nite.

Chivass
08-03-10, 22:32
Hey, which areas of Bogota one shud avoid during day/nite. How are the taxi drivers there, do they all go by meter.

Arjay
08-21-10, 04:11
Colombian Theft Suspect Shot and Injured as he Attempts to Escape from Custody. Link to story here: http://www.pattayaone.net/pattaya-news/26826/colombian-theft-suspect-shot-and-injured-as-he-attempts-to-escape-from-custody/

Seems you don't need to go to Colombia for crime.

Arjay
08-23-10, 14:43
Colombian Theft Suspect Shot and Injured as he Attempts to Escape from Custody. Link to story here: http://www.pattayaone.net/pattaya-news/26826/colombian-theft-suspect-shot-and-injured-as-he-attempts-to-escape-from-custody/

Seems you don't need to go to Colombia for crime.Here's a follow up on the story link is here: http://www.pattayadailynews.com/en/2010/08/23/colombian-menace-shot-during-two-failed-escape-attempts/

Arjay
08-24-10, 04:34
Here's a follow up on the story link is here: http://www.pattayadailynews.com/en/2010/08/23/colombian-menace-shot-during-two-failed-escape-attempts/A very persistent/desperate criminal. I guess he's heard about Thai prisons.

GringoLoco2
03-15-11, 08:16
Be careful when you're out and about and don't wear anything flashy like gold chains or nice watches. This British guy was killed for a gold chain. It's not worth your life!

http://www.ntn24news.com/latinamericanews/3711-colombia-man-killed-necklace-medellin

Louie OK
03-08-12, 00:34
LDV (La Dolce Vida) is the premier place to get chicas in Ctg.It is a disco in Laguito beside a casino.Any girl in there is a pro and short time is 150-200K.A good night will have 50 to 75 chicas there.It is known to all in the Bocagrande/Laguito area of Cartagena.At 1800 to 1 USD, that's like 75-100 USD for short time. That's a good deal? How short is this "short time"? 15 min. 60 min?

BuddyGoodness
03-30-12, 00:24
How about carrying a camera in a backpack that I hold on to tightly? I want to be able to photograph things while I am there. I will only bring it out in the daytime. Is it just a matter of staying on the populated streets?

Manizales911
03-30-12, 15:18
How about carrying a camera in a backpack that I hold on to tightly? I want to be able to photograph things while I am there. I will only bring it out in the daytime. Is it just a matter of staying on the populated streets?Personally I wouldn't wear a backpack walking the streets night or day but it depends on where you are walking. But my question is why you need to be wearing a backpack in the first place, what the heck kind of camera are you carrying? I would strongly advise against bringing an SLR, a simple point and shoot is fine and you can put that in your pocket.

Artisttyp
03-30-12, 16:51
How about carrying a camera in a backpack that I hold on to tightly? I want to be able to photograph things while I am there. I will only bring it out in the daytime. Is it just a matter of staying on the populated streets?You might want to look into the Canon S95. I gave up on my SLR a few years ago. You will get to take photos of people and places that you would never get to do with an SLR. It fits neatly in your pocket. It does just about 80% of what an SLR can do.

BuddyGoodness
03-31-12, 06:43
It is a DSLR Nikon. Besides the women, seeing cool things and photographing them are my favorite things to do on trips. I enjoy photography and I want quality photos which point and shoots usually cannot produce.


Personally I wouldn't wear a backpack walking the streets night or day but it depends on where you are walking. But my question is why you need to be wearing a backpack in the first place, what the heck kind of camera are you carrying? I would strongly advise against bringing an SLR, a simple point and shoot is fine and you can put that in your pocket.Yeah, might have to look into that. I have my camera insured in case of loss while traveling but in poorer countries it does make me a target. I would be hesitant to carry it walking around alone. I was thinking more along the lines of only bringing it when I am going on an excursion with other people.


You might want to look into the Canon S95. I gave up on my SLR a few years ago. You will get to take photos of people and places that you would never get to do with an SLR. It fits neatly in your pocket. It does just about 80% of what an SLR can do.

Artisttyp
03-31-12, 08:59
it is a dslr nikon. i was thinking more along the lines of only bringing it when i am going on an excursion with other people.you can't predict an event. trust me once you get a really good pocket camera you will not want to carry an slr with you. i used to do exactly what you described (wait for tours) and the result was hardly getting any pictures at all. *you can whip out a pocket camera in a bad area if you are quick about it. no can do with an slr.

i always shoot on p which is semi automatic. once the iso speed flash and image size are set i leave the rest for later. that is the beauty of digital.

i forgot to mention that the s95 has a raw mode. you can't go wrong for under $400. you can't buy a camera body without the lens for less than $600.

BuddyGoodness
03-31-12, 19:32
thank you for the advice. on last thing since i don't want to derail the topic of the thread. should i get the s100 or s95?


you can't predict an event. trust me once you get a really good pocket camera you will not want to carry an slr with you. i used to do exactly what you described (wait for tours) and the result was hardly getting any pictures at all. *you can whip out a pocket camera in a bad area if you are quick about it. no can do with an slr.

i always shoot on p which is semi automatic. once the iso speed flash and image size are set i leave the rest for later. that is the beauty of digital.

i forgot to mention that the s95 has a raw mode. you can't go wrong for under $400. you can't buy a camera body without the lens for less than $600.

Artisttyp
03-31-12, 21:42
Thank you for the advice. On last thing since I don't want to derail the topic of the thread. Should I get the S100 or S95?Go over the Amazon reviews. Great place to start when you want to research an item.

Speaking of "PURCHASE" it sounds like you may want to be a SENIOR MEMBER. You could be having these types of conversations via PM with other well experienced mongers. Send me a PM when you join.

It is the best $20 you will spend all year. The gift that keeps on giving.

Welcome

Amb832
04-19-12, 14:00
I was thinking about getting a Canon G1X. It's good as a dslr camera up to 3200 ISO. Only thing sucks is that it's slightly larger than a Canon G12. It won't fit in a pants pocket without bulging.

MiamiHeatLuver
04-19-12, 15:20
I was thinking about getting a Canon G1X. It's good as a dslr camera up to 3200 ISO. Only thing sucks is that it's slightly larger than a Canon G12. It won't fit in a pants pocket without bulging.You should have 2 cameras. 1 for clubbing and casual shooting and one for "in the room" good high-def pictures. The casual one should fit snuggly in your front pocket or back pocket with the strap not sticking out. That G9 is huge and bulky and wouldn't recommend you walking around with it in plain sight any time of the day. Get the girls accustomed to taking pics by taking a lot in common areas. So you don't spook them when you go private. Good rule of thumb.

Hillbilly69
05-27-12, 23:03
An inside view of the plant used in drinks or blown in your face.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ToQ8PWYnu04

Stinky Squid
06-07-21, 04:37
An inside view of the plant used in drinks or blown in your face.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ToQ8PWYnu04I have heard this for years. Scopolamine. But checking on Wikipedia, it is said to be doubtful and rather an urban legend.

Has anybody had it happen to them? Anybody seen it happen to someone they know?

I believe if this is even real, the key is a rapid exit strategy. An antidote, physostigmine, but that only makes sense if it's real. I think if something like this happens you need to make a huge ruckus and stay active and involve as many people as you can in order to avoid falling into the hands of the one remote controller. But then again, I am not sure this is really true.

Another thing, don't get drunk. I have no joy in being alcoholized and it isn't good for enjoying sex anyway. Most crime victims of this sort were drunk.

Xpartan
06-07-21, 07:32
I have heard this for years. Scopolamine. But checking on Wikipedia, it is said to be doubtful and rather an urban legend.

Has anybody had it happen to them? Anybody seen it happen to someone they know?

I believe if this is even real, the key is a rapid exit strategy. An antidote, physostigmine, but that only makes sense if it's real. I think if something like this happens you need to make a huge ruckus and stay active and involve as many people as you can in order to avoid falling into the hands of the one remote controller. But then again, I am not sure this is really true.

Another thing, don't get drunk. I have no joy in being alcoholized and it isn't good for enjoying sex anyway. Most crime victims of this sort were drunk.1. I'm not sure what makes you think it's not real. Read the Bogota forum a few pages back. Someone posted how he helped the villains take out his own stuff while having no recollection of that 2 days later.

2. Who's going to give you the antidote while you're out?

3. Doesn't have to be alcohol. I don't see why they couldn't drop something in your ginger ale if you live it unattended.

This shit really scares me. More than a street mugging would.