German FKK Clubs - Lounge and chat area [Archive] - Page 5

Yakob

11-08-12, 02:05

it seems that there is no thread that mongers share on the secrets or rather the unwritten law among the ladies of the night. perhaps we could too should talk like the girls would talk with mongers. some of the things i have gathered from oase girls (well most romanian and maybe 2 moldovan) :-

a) the german girls are snobs towards the romanian and secretly they hate each other.

b) no 1 rule never steal a customer but you can steal a regular.

c) the girls have sort of a list (well she said they know) which client has a lot of money and spend on a regular basis.

d) most girls (well actually all the girls i talked with) say they feel nothing with the client. sex feels nothing. talk is also nothing. just get in spend 15 minutes then 50 euro.

the) interesting to wht i read in report here. the girls don't want to cum not because they don't want to feel tired or anything but inside their mind they want this to be bussiness and not pleasure. the men are not their lovers and they are just pr0stitute. so sex is not meant to be enjoyed. the girls would call sex as "fuck" simply because it is just an action. they feel it is stupid when men ask them to make love because there is no love just fuck.

e) most girls prefer young fat men compared to old men. young fat men don't smell and can't fuck long and usually gentle.

f) the girls know most men lie about their occupation and marital status. one girl told me she had a client who says he is a doctor and she saw him in the city as a cab driver (he sees her every month though).

g) old men have weird fantasies and it scares the girls especially young ones. some fantasy that i have heard is choking the girl ([CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) fantasy) , asking the girl for rimming, fingering the mans bum hole (50 euro for this service) , spanking the girl on his lap and the most bizarre a guy actually as a girl to fart on his face lol. wth rite!

anyway those are some weird or talks i had with a working girl. i don't know if others find it amusing or not but if you want to share some experience please do. lol.a.) yes, i can see the love-hate relationship between german girls and romanian girls. you can see the looks of disdain by german girls at the noise and chaos made by the romanian girls in the club and then you hear the romanian girls giggling amongst themselves at how the german girls cannot buy nice italian fashion designs since they are too big boned, broad shouldered and too large for the slim styles.

b.) yes, i hear the stories of girls that try to steal a regular client from another girl. this is linked into your point c if that regular client has a decent budget to spend on the girls each time he is in the club.

c) the girls spend a lot of time in the club, bored so they spend a lot of time seeing who is going with whom and for how long. they work out a minimum spend and put other pieces of information together for extras and likes / dislikes so that it can be used for later.

i mean i just mentioned to a girl trying to get me to go to a zimmer that i just had anal sex so i was not up for another fuck just yet and i did not even mention who i fucked. then 10 minutes later i get the girl i fucked in her tight asshole coming up to me saying she had been talked to by a girl who knows she had been fucked in her ass.

d.) yes, sadly this the case. these are pretend girlfriends. nothing is granted beyond the time slot that you pay for. girls tell me that they think about something else when they are getting fucked or having daty performed on them. they think of their shopping, the ceiling, their laundry, their car repairs. they save their come for their boyfriends (see h below).

e) yes, this makes sense. explains why young fat men are so popular in the clubs and they feel like they are popular too when you talk to them. they are like the coolest.

f) yes. i hear this one all the time. the taxi driver, the dustman, etc. all go to the club and say they are something else. hey, they got euro. let them live the dream. they got wives and family. girls say she tell their wives or family unless they pay money. i recommend you call their bluff.

g) what? you mean you don't do this too? you meat and potatoes man.

h) other discussions are which girls are pimped or have boyfriends that they give all their money and which girls are under a revenue share (around 20%) for protection. how much they need to pay off the boyfriend. some girls quote 8000€ to 25-30, 000€. i hear even more sometimes and each year that they work. i hear that lower end 8000€ is usually for the introduction to a club and getting them set up in a flat and the boy drives them to the club and picks them up. girls see this as not a pimp and gladly pay it off since straight after they work free and make the money to buy that apartment in their home town in romania. problem is when the girl gets a boyfriend who make her work.

Yakob

11-08-12, 09:14

Optimist

11-08-12, 16:43

The discussion is pretty accurate, although my experience is a little more positive as to the character of the girls.

B) Sometimes girls do try to steal a good customer from another girl, but normally they will try to make sure the regular girl / customer meet up. Sometimes girls see me arrive and immediately come to tell me that my "favourite" is busy but I should wait for her, or they run off to find my favourite to tell her I have arrived.

C) Nice story Yakob. Some girls go into enormous detail about their customers, but not to the extent of revealing anything about themselves or what they do in the room. One thing some girls share is whether ir not a customer is "nice" and respectful (obviously most of this does not apply to the sharks who think only of the money and nothing else at all). I recently went with a girl (let us say X) who repeated to me a conversation I had 18 months previously with another girl (Y) at a time when I did not even know of X's existence: basically it indicated that I was known to be a decent customer and X had logged it for her future reference.

D) Some girls do genuinely like many of their customers. However if you ask them they will of course say NO. After all why should they talk to you about this until / unless you become a regular. Some girls do not like anybody. One girl told me she thought about the shopping when she was having sex with her man at home! If they like the customer sometimes they will tend to give free time, or meet outside the club, or take telephone calls etc. But this can of course be a slope leading to complications for all.

I) yes, sometimes a bad girl will spread a rumour that a successful girl is working without a condom.

Additional point. Some girls will tell you anything except the truth if you ask too many questions. They will lie about birthdays, city of origin, age etc. A 50E session obtains the hire of a body for 30minutes, not their feelings, thoughts, or soul.

All part of the fun. But helpful to know the social rules in such a complex environment

Meeps77

11-08-12, 16:59

Additional point. Some girls will tell you anything except the truth if you ask too many questions. They will lie about birthdays, city of origin, age etc. A 50E session obtains the hire of a body for 30minutes, not their feelings, thoughts, or soul.Good point we are well served to remember. I'm not suggesting others here do otherwise, but I personally always treat these girls with the utmost respect. I wouldn't want their job, and I'm happy for their service. I try to be kind to make it as pleasant as possible for them. Of course every so often you run into a real *****, in which case I happily let her know.

Syzygies

11-08-12, 18:03

I) yes, sometimes a bad girl will spread a rumour that a successful girl is working without a condom.Some of you might have heard this exact same story already (it came from a girl) :

Guy G asks girl L1 for a session and they go to the room. He explains he needs BBFS and she refuses. Session does not happen and she leaves. Then she sees G go to girl L2. They go to the room and then come straight back out again. L1 checks with L2. L2 confirms he only would session with BBFS. G approaches girl L3. Same thing happens again. Finally G takes girl L4 to the room and they have a very long session. L1, L2, and L3 are chatting amoung themselves."Wow obviously L4 is doing sex with no condom." Of course its feintly possible that something else occurred. Later G sessions with L4 again after some more refusals. What a surprise!

Yakob

11-08-12, 23:29

D) Some girls do genuinely like many of their customers. However if you ask them they will of course say NO. After all why should they talk to you about this until / unless you become a regular. Some girls do not like anybody. One girl told me she thought about the shopping when she was having sex with her man at home! If they like the customer sometimes they will tend to give free time, or meet outside the club, or take telephone calls etc. But this can of course be a slope leading to complications for all.This is a problem.

It can be quite easy picking up the emails and handy numbers of the girls. Sometimes you do not know what to do with them.

You feel the obligation to go with these girls everytime you in the club. You get SMS when they know you may be coming (e. G. 1-3 days before) but nothing when you say you are taking a break from the clubs.

One of my friends, one day he just go to his handy and he delete them all. He say, it waste his time when they girls ring him and aks when he come to the club or if they can come see him in his home or when will they see each other again. It funny since the girls keep his handy number and they ring him. So he had to go change his number.

Then there are the girls that genuinely do keep in contact with you like a pen friend. You talk about your real lives and your troubles and triumphs. You make a friendship. But mostly these girls are professionals and it is all about the business and maximising the wallet that they take from you.

Yakob

11-08-12, 23:39

Talking about coming in a girl's mouth got me remembering the time after a really long session with Saskia of Palace I had her kneeling in front of me on the bed as I jerked off and, since it'd been a while since I'd come, I shot a massive load into her mouth and she gagged slightly and swallowed some! She said you got me in the throat. She is a girl who will suck every last drop. Drinking a lot of fruit juices makes your come taste sweet-in fact one time the same girl said to me, 'do you drink a lot of pineapple juice because I can taste it in the sweet taste of your cum! 'The girls that swallow my come as opposed to CIM say that my come is okay or even sweet tasting. I am not expecting honey sweet but at least pleasant enough. It is say after the third or fourth come and she take it in her mouth to swallow the sperm she say the taste was not so good. I think we were down to the dregs from the sperm banks and the semen sacs. I really like it when the girl swallow the come since it is more intimate and it really feels like the girl "accepts" the man. We are forever looking for the high mileage girl friend experience in this pay sex scene.

Indi Companion

11-09-12, 13:11

I) Another point that the girls talk about is the small rivalries between Romanian girls that have protection or a boyfriend and those girls that have no protection / boyfriends or work free. For example, a protected girl hates another girl working free since she has a good regular customers, so she goes telling the other girls that she fuck no condom. As you expect the story comes back to her and she worried she lose her job and also the customers. The working free girl usually cannot complain since she has no man to sort the problem out with the other girl. That is what you get for revenue share with man. Sometime you have the problem with your car when you come out of the club. So some girls they move on to another club. It is better.

J) Entry level affiliated men that come to the club looking to recruit girls that are new and work free, offering them companionship and some help with their work. Usually identifiable with emblems.A.) German girls feel usurpated by the Romanian girls who usually are more available also for fun or for spending time with customers intstead being simply business like.

Then not all German girls are like that, I know some who spend time with customers and who like to talk with Romanian girls as well.

The same for Romanian girls, my favorite girl in World is Romanian and she is not into drinking with clients, she does not have many friends between the Romanians' lines but a handful and she does not mind eventually talking with a couple of the German girls. But then she also usually does not like to even sit close to the german girls who enviously look at her perfect body, LOL!

B.) This is a matter of fact, I am such kind of customer in a certain club. Many times happened that girls tried to convince me that they were better than my favorite, that my favorite was telling me lies, that she has boyfriend or children, that she fucks without condom, etc. Etc. But all that did not distract me from my favorite at all as far as I already know that all these things may be true or not but I simply go with her when I am in that club because she has the perfect body for me, she has a brain and gives me the time I like.

Lat attempt the girls tried to take me away from my favorite was a kind of reverse psychology. Some girls went to my favorite telling her stories about me and my life trying to convince her that I was not a recommendable customer. Ok then, I can understand that as of today everygirl would like a regular who gives her everytime he is in the club no less than €300 but usually also €500 or 700 like I am, but there is a limit to decency and dignity!

C) Girls usually always know everything about the regular customers and they are always trying to collect as much infos as they can in order to understand if the customer is really worth and how could be the best approach to steel him away from his favorite girl.

One time a girl came to me and asked steaightforward how much was I usually spending on my favorite and when I told her I was not going to pass this information she started to complain because there were not so many infos around about me (many girls still do not know even my nationality) because my favorite has not so many friends there and never talks about me. I gave a tip to my favorite that day for that, I like when a girl does not share my personal data with the entire club!

D.) That's sadly most of the times true and it has been confirmed to me many times but very different girls that I know since long. There are few simptoms that may indicate something different and there are these indicated by Optimist. My favorite, even during a busy Saturday spends a lot of time with me unpaid and outside the room intead going roaming the club and making money. So when they start to not think only to money, either from you forcing to go to the room or money they could make with others and spend instead a lot of time with you then maybe there is a hint of genuinity in the relation between you amd the girl.

But in my opinion, never forget why the girls are in the club.

E) True, even if sometimes girls refuce when the boys are too "wide". These are the few girls who are either on very high demand or still have a little bit of self-respect left over.

F) Never been subjected to such bluffs, maybe because I am always straight forward about the fact that I have no wife, children or girlfriend as far as I am a workaholic and I enjoy too much, at my still reasonably young age, the fun and variety I have in the fkks.

As per the fake stories of the men about their lives, I really do not understand that, do they really think they will be more respected by the girls for that? Mah.

G) I am a meat and potatoes man as well, LOL! However, it is true, many girls refuse to go with the oldest man because their requests often sound really weird to them. I also heard incredible stories and I must admit that I undestand the girls.

H) Pimps are a reality, call them as you prefer but maybe 95% of the girls have one of a kind, including german girls and I know it for certain.

Yakob the prices you indicate are correct, it happened to me to hear the same and to hear that some customers paid the sum for freeing the girl which seems to me quite horrible in a civilized country like Germany but then, who said that Germany is so civilized, it is a wonderful fake world this of the fkks and sauna clubs, we should never forget this also.

I) See my comments under point B) above, but then the real problem are not the rivaleries between the girls but the pimps who make such moves like ruining your car in order to make clear to the free girl, why his assistance is requested.

As of today it is reasonably easy to get bareback sex in a club, myself know in the clubs where I am a regular who are the girls providing it and who are the customers who ask for it. I think that due to the lack of customers and the crisis, the rules like if you fuck without condom you are banned from the club softened in a certain way. That's the truth. I got the possibility over the last couple of years to fuck without condom in all the biggerst clubs but the girls who made the offer are still working regularly and without any problem.

J) This is also something very tipycal, I usually keep an eye about the girls who usually hang around whith this kind of recruiters / affiliated and honestly do not go with them. I accept and my coscience does the same with cinical pragmatism the single pimp issue but not the pimp (and many others activities) corporation with emblems.

Indi Companion

11-09-12, 13:17

This is a problem.

It can be quite easy picking up the emails and handy numbers of the girls. Sometimes you do not know what to do with them.

You feel the obligation to go with these girls everytime you in the club. You get SMS when they know you may be coming (e. G. 1-3 days before) but nothing when you say you are taking a break from the clubs.

One of my friends, one day he just go to his handy and he delete them all. He say, it waste his time when they girls ring him and aks when he come to the club or if they can come see him in his home or when will they see each other again. It funny since the girls keep his handy number and they ring him. So he had to go change his number.

Then there are the girls that genuinely do keep in contact with you like a pen friend. You talk about your real lives and your troubles and triumphs. You make a friendship. But mostly these girls are professionals and it is all about the business and maximising the wallet that they take from you.My favourite kicks my ass if I do not write her for a few hours but only in the morning or in the evening!

Notwithstanding if I am in a meeting all day and notwithstanding if she knows that I am not back to Germany for a few weeks. That's club's love! Ahahahahahahahah.

However, it is true what Optimist said, sometimes it happens that a girl really likes a customer but however this happens very very seldom, we simply know that statistically exist this case but the truth is that most of the time the girl is taking good care of a good business in the form of a regular client.

Hessen Bub

11-09-12, 20:51

Just go, fuck and forget. You are making complicating things.

HB

Meeps77

11-09-12, 22:28

However, it is true what Optimist said, sometimes it happens that a girl really likes a customer but however this happens very very seldom, we simply know that statistically exist this case but the truth is that most of the time the girl is taking good care of a good business in the form of a regular client.Believing in the fantasy is great for the time you're in the room, but it can be dangerous outside of it. I've heard of guys getting suckered into paying for girls "problems" like rent, etc. I even once invested too much psychologically in a girl in Prague (thank god didn't waste any money!)

It's sure fun to believe that a young attractive girl really wants you; but if that was the case then you'd already have a 22 year old girlfriend LOL. I think some of these girls might have some degree of connection with clients on certain level, but agree that a pure sexual or romantic attraction is rare. There are times that girls respond to you sexually (physical manifestations which can't be faked) , but them wanting to fuck with you in a non commercial fashion isn't realtistc

Hessen Bub

11-09-12, 23:34

but them wanting to fuck with you in a non commercial fashion isn't realtistcStill it does happen. Outside the club with no payment.

HB

Meeps77

11-09-12, 23:37

Still it does happen. Outside the club with no payment.

HBI would imagine this is the exception as opposed to the rule, but yeah, any things possible.

Smoky Jack

11-10-12, 02:20

I would imagine this is the exception as opposed to the rule, but yeah, any things possible.I would think a lot of people have occasionally connected with a HO at a level beyond the usual. We are human beings after all. Chemistry can never really be explained can it? Having said that, the VAST majority of these relationships are business relationships. It so happens that their business is to make you feel desirable. The best way to think of it is. What would you do if you were poor and were a gigolo? You would try to make the old ladies feel like they are attractive to you, and push the envelope on the boundaries to confuse the customer. Everyone secretly thinks that they are special and most people think they are better looking than they really are. So it's very easy to believe that this girl really likes you and wants something real. Try this experiment. If a girl tries to act like she really cares for you, tell her that your business is floundering and you may go bankrupt. You will be struggling for the next year or two, maybe no money for FKKs etc. See what happens.

Meeps77

11-10-12, 03:43

I would think a lot of people have occasionally connected with a HO at a level beyond the usual. We are human beings after all. Chemistry can never really be explained can it? Having said that, the VAST majority of these relationships are business relationships. It so happens that their business is to make you feel desirable. The best way to think of it is. What would you do if you were poor and were a gigolo? You would try to make the old ladies feel like they are attractive to you, and push the envelope on the boundaries to confuse the customer. Everyone secretly thinks that they are special and most people think they are better looking than they really are. So it's very easy to believe that this girl really likes you and wants something real. Try this experiment. If a girl tries to act like she really cares for you, tell her that your business is floundering and you may go bankrupt. You will be struggling for the next year or two, maybe no money for FKKs etc. See what happens.Couldn't agree more.

Neutron Flux

11-10-12, 04:47

Come on. Pretty much all the things on the list CaptCabin and others have compiled can be said about pretty much all women (and in fact also men) if you adjust the social context a little bit. Yes, they lie and cheat a lot and so forth, and so do you. Do you think your W / GF always tells you the truth? Do you think they sleep with you mainly because they think you're so attractive, and not to achieve certain short-time and / or long-time goals? Luring a man into doing what she thinks is right by sexual encounter is a female ability they learn and perfect from a very early age. And do you tell your W / GF that you're in brothels boning young things? Do you always tell your mates the full truth? And so forth.

The world is full of lies and you just have to navigate. I find that the average WG is not any worse than the average woman in that respect. I've had quite a bit to do with a few of them outside their venues. That has led to nothing and a few troubles, but certainly not more troubles than as with other women.

. Try this experiment. If a girl tries to act like she really cares for you, tell her that your business is floundering and you may go bankrupt. You will be struggling for the next year or two, maybe no money for FKKs etc. See what happens.Actually, I do that all the time. Not exactly in the way mentioned, but when the question is about the job, I usually tell them BS (and not something greater, always something ranking below my actual profession). Sometimes I will tell her the truth (without specifics) , sometimes a half-truth. In all cases I do it mainly to see how she reacts. Actually I find it part of the fun of this, that when you have encounters and getting very close in some ways at a stage when you're not supposed to by society's standards, that you have to navigate a few implications in creative ways. I will often lie about a lot of other things too or throw in things with the sole purpose of seeing her reaction. The important point, I think, is just always to keep your radar up, and knowing when you can throw in a truth, and when not. Not always easy though.

CaptCabin

11-10-12, 11:42

The world is full of lies and you just have to navigate. I find that the average WG is not any worse than the average woman in that respect. I've had quite a bit to do with a few of them outside their venues. That has led to nothing and a few troubles, but certainly not more troubles than as with other women.WG = average women. LOL. I am not going to argue with your point. The way you view the world is very interesting to me. If you do have a daughter oneday maybe you can ask her to be a working girl as it is a job yuor normal average women would do anyway LOL.

Neutron flux I would just have to say I agree with everything you have just said LOL

Neutron Flux

11-10-12, 18:09

WG = average women. LOL. I am not going to argue with your point. The way you view the world is very interesting to me. If you do have a daughter oneday maybe you can ask her to be a working girl as it is a job yuor normal average women would do anyway LOL.

Neutron flux I would just have to say I agree with everything you have just said LOLActually if your or my daughter has good looks, not too smart, sexually experienced and in a terrible economic situation, whatever the reason, there's quite a possibility she will become a WG. Very many girls are simply no WGs because they don't need to, not because they are fundamentally different.

Simex

11-10-12, 21:53

Whats wrong with the way NFlux viewed the world. I have come across many working girls in the industry who are pretty, smart and intelligent. OK, I have a tendency to go for the part timers and semi pro's, and attractive to the challenging and sharp tongue girls.

I think your view of the world and girls maybe different from your background / culture / upbringing. I have come across many part time students doing this job. I am still seeing a couple on a regular basis in London. Some have graduated and earning £50K+ in some boring Law firm. But they still enjoy this "hobby" for the double life thrill and gifts and monetary value it brings. Now these are the smart girls.

Actually if your or my daughter has good looks, not too smart, sexually experienced and in a terrible economic situation, whatever the reason, there's quite a possibility she will become a WG. Very many girls are simply no WGs because they don't need to, not because they are fundamentally different.

Meeps77

11-10-12, 22:23

Whats wrong with the way NFlux viewed the world. I have come across many working girls in the industry who are pretty, smart and intelligent. OK, I have a tendency to go for the part timers and semi pro's, and attractive to the challenging and sharp tongue girls.

I think your view of the world and girls maybe different from your background / culture / upbringing. I have come across many part time students doing this job. I am still seeing a couple on a regular basis in London. Some have graduated and earning £50K+ in some boring Law firm. But they still enjoy this "hobby" for the double life thrill and gifts and monetary value it brings. Now these are the smart girls.I've met a couple of these too. I think that even the average working girl at fkk is smarter than what I encounter for similar profession stateside

Sebastiane

11-11-12, 02:25

Neutron Flux

11-11-12, 02:54

Well, I didn't mean to say that I thought WGs in general are stupid (well, a lot of them are, and a lot of them not). What I meant with 'not too smart' was that if a girl is both good looking and very smart, she usually doesn't need to enter this profession even if she's facing a difficult environment. She will find other and better means to improve her situation. And even if she needs to sell pussy she can usually do as an escort where she needs to bang way fewer guys for more money. Smart girls, who have good looks and social and usually language skills and can be taken to venues outside the bedroom, are highly sought after there. As always, there are exceptions. And Simex is absolutely right,

Some have graduated and earning £50K+ in some boring Law firm. But they still enjoy this "hobby" for the double life thrill and gifts and monetary value it brings. Now these are the smart girls.There are also other ways.

With.

has good looks, not too smart, sexually experienced and in a terrible economic situation, whatever the reason, there's quite a possibility she will become a WGI just outlined the most common route to the business. Why do you think the FKKs are full of Romanians? Most of them would be extremely excited about doing 10+ guys a day with CIM, Anal and such if they would've grown up in a family with decent living standards and had the prospect of getting a decent job and life at their home environment.

But, back to my original point, that doesn't mean that these girls have special traits in their behaviour that you won't easily find in a lot of other women also. Some are actually quite honest, others lie and manipulate the moment they open their mouths. And a lot in between.

Free Dude

11-11-12, 09:56

Hi!

I've never yet come across a girl from France. (or even an EE claiming to be French although a few of the Romanian girls and one Bulgarian did speak French!) And, well, I've got something for French girls but from the ISG France itself is pretty poor for mongering therefore does anyone know of any current French girls at the main German FKKs?There was a girl Lisa in Livingroom, who was in Samya recently; it seems her profile isn't on the site anymore. In Babylon you have Iman, who is Belgian but speaks French; quite a few Romanians speak a bit of french as well (if it is a language thing).

Ortos

11-11-12, 10:38

Hi!

I've never yet come across a girl from France. (or even an EE claiming to be French although a few of the Romanian girls and one Bulgarian did speak French!) About 5 months ago, in Oase, there was a petite short-haired blonde Russian / Latv girl, Dina (very good service imo) , who was living / studying in France. She spoke very good French as far as I could tell, although, to be honest, her mouth was busy with DFK and BBBJ most of the time.

That's as close to a French girl I've come across in recent times. I have not been to Oase since June, when I had three sessions with Dina. I imagine she's no longer there, since I've seen no mention of her for months.

O

Myrmidon

11-11-12, 14:16

About 5 months ago, in Oase, there was a petite short-haired blonde Russian / Latv girl, Dina (very good service imo) , who was living / studying in France. She spoke very good French as far as I could tell, although, to be honest, her mouth was busy with DFK and BBBJ most of the time.

That's as close to a French girl I've come across in recent times. I have not been to Oase since June, when I had three sessions with Dina. I imagine she's no longer there, since I've seen no mention of her for months.

OShe spoke good French, and those freckles across her nose, oooh la la.

But, as you said, she was hawt in the zimmer!

Myr.

Optimist

11-11-12, 17:41

There have been a few posts in the Artemis thread making the point that it is very hard for a member going to a club after an absence of some long time to access useful information about that club and the girls. I think this is because the structure of the forum mixes up all sorts of general chat with field reports.

An excellent example of a good structure is the ijsberenforum, which despite being in Dutch, was easy for me to negotiate to get information. Basically for each club there are one or two general themes (i.e. details of prices, lists of current girls working) and then a separate sub-thread for each girl reported on. Some of the German forums have the similar structure. When I want information I find these non-English forums very useful.

Does anyone have any idea of the best way to raise this idea?

Hessen Bub

11-11-12, 17:58

Basically for each club there are one or two general themes (I. E. Details of prices, lists of current girls working) and then a separate sub-thread for each girl reported on. Some of the German forums have the similar structure. When I want information I find these non-English forums very useful.

Does anyone have any idea of the best way to raise this idea?I've raised this question multiple times years ago. I fully support you. ALL the German boards have this structure: One forum for each club or region, one thread for general info on the club, one for hotels / how to get there, one as a description. And them either threads per girl or threads (reports) per visit. Far better to get information.

Also keeps people from asking for the 23rd time how to get to World, where to sleep, which day is dessous day, what's the pricing, where to rent a car and if winter tyres are standard.

Also these boards are moderated, some more strict, others less, but more than here. As there are Römerforum, Lustscout, BW7, Freiercafe, ffm-forum, Rheinforum, Lusthaus etc.

HB

Angus Magee

11-11-12, 18:00

Does anyone have any idea of the best way to raise this idea?You can try petitioning Jackson but I would not hold my breath. As I understand it he is quite comfortable with the income the forum provides over all and does not want to put in the effort that such restructuring would require. Also I think such structure would require mods with administrative powers, something else J seems reluctant to do.

The generally lousy set up of this forum has been discussed many times and fixes offered. Nothing has ever been changed. While I hate to sound so pessimistic (especially to you) I just don't think there is enough motivation from the top.

AM

Optimist

11-11-12, 19:10

HB and AM.

Thanks. Well, I guess you are correct and realistic. I will ask Jackson but it seems to be a well-worn dead end.(at the moment the Admin mailbox is full...)

(AM - Shame on me. Another year has gone by without me visiting Nina at Artemis! . HB - that's because I'm following the girl you warned me about many months ago ......)

Hessen Bub

11-11-12, 19:39

. HB - that's because I'm following the girl you warned me about many months ago .)I am used to get blamed. So put it all on me.

HB

Dreams

11-11-12, 20:44

I've raised this question multiple times years ago. I fully support you. ALL the German boards have this structure: One forum for each club or region, one thread for general info on the club, one for hotels / how to get there, one as a description. And them either threads per girl or threads (reports) per visit. Far better to get information.

Also keeps people from asking for the 23rd time how to get to World, where to sleep, which day is dessous day, what's the pricing, where to rent a car and if winter tyres are standard.

Also these boards are moderated, some more strict, others less, but more than here. As there are Römerforum, Lustscout, BW7, Freiercafe, ffm-forum, Rheinforum, Lusthaus etc.

HBIf you can read French, this is to my opinion the best place to have detaileds review of girls. It is well moderated, so there is no place for useless flaming. Straight to the point and nothing else. IMHO.

Hessen Bub

11-11-12, 22:56

I don't like the structure or board culture there. And there's enough German boards with excellent info and moderation.

HB

Dreams

11-12-12, 11:36

I don't like the structure or board culture there. And there's enough German boards with excellent info and moderation.

HBBut some of us have better understanding of French than German, so this is just another tool at the disposal of international mongers, in addition to the german, and dutch fora.

Indi Companion

11-12-12, 13:24

I don't like the structure or board culture there. And there's enough German boards with excellent info and moderation.

HBI do not like Yuppie either but then I speak German. However, I think that the best structured are the german forums, you can do both, chatting and strictly reporting, without confusion between the two of them. Obviously this also makes the search much easier when you are looking for specific infors about a girl.

Free Dude

11-12-12, 17:46

I stay away from Youppie, because French takes me too long and I spend too much time in sexboards already. For the rest a lot depends on which clubs you are interested in: GT, PHG and H7 you should really read the Dutch board and for Samya, Aca and the Ruhrpot clubs you are better of at Freiercafe. I personally only these boards are set up propperly; I sometimes go to Lustscout and Roemerforum as well, but these aren't that structured either. A subboard for each club, but then a lot of different reports and very few specific lady-threads. Lustscout still by far the best place for Frankfurt clubs.

Smoky Jack

11-12-12, 20:26

But some of us have better understanding of French than German, so this is just another tool at the disposal of international mongers, in addition to the german, and dutch fora.If you use google chrome, it will automatically translate for you. Not perfect translation but you can get the gist easily. No pun intended.

Akibono

11-12-12, 20:45

Hi!

I've never yet come across a girl from France. (or even an EE claiming to be French although a few of the Romanian girls and one Bulgarian did speak French!) And, well, I've got something for French girls but from the ISG France itself is pretty poor for mongering therefore does anyone know of any current French girls at the main German FKKs?There is a girl at living room in Kaarst that is French, but I think she was just working there during the summer.

Sebastiane

11-12-12, 23:59

There is a girl at living room in Kaarst that is French, but I think she was just working there during the summer.Thanks Akibono!

Sebastiane

11-13-12, 00:07

Optimist

11-13-12, 16:32

Based on my own experiences I came perilously close to falling in love with.

I was wondering if anyone has had similar experiences they'd like to share?It happens. Every girl almost will tell you of instances.

And don't think that long experience in clubs will make you immune. It can happen out of the blue.

You need to be very clear headed about what you are doing. It may be a fantasy world in the clubs at first but it can easily become very real.

There are no rules.

If you find it happening you need to ask.

1. What is it in you that needs what the girl is supplying.

2. Vice versa.

3. What are you doing to your family if you have one?

4 The girl may be taking advantage of you but she may also be very vulnerable.

5. If you really are in love then matters of geography will be overcome.

6 To what extent is it a club fuelled fantasy?. Does it survive when you meet her and share the housework?

7 if you do love someone in a club, then maybe the greatest act is to leave them alone? (Or maybe not?)

I suspect the best outcome is that both sides recognise that if they cannot overcome the complexities of the situation then it is best to cool off and become friends. People who have been in love can make good friends - they have shared something valuable

Just my stray thoughts on a very serious subject

Indi Companion

11-13-12, 20:48

It happens. Every girl almost will tell you of instances.

And don't think that long experience in clubs will make you immune. It can happen out of the blue.

You need to be very clear headed about what you are doing. It may be a fantasy world in the clubs at first but it can easily become very real.

There are no rules.

If you find it happening you need to ask.

1. What is it in you that needs what the girl is supplying.

2. Vice versa.

3. What are you doing to your family if you have one?

4 The girl may be taking advantage of you but she may also be very vulnerable.

5. If you really are in love then matters of geography will be overcome.

6 To what extent is it a club fuelled fantasy. Does it survive when you meet her and share the housework?

7 if you do love someone in a club, then maybe the greatest act is to leave them alone? (Or maybe not?)

I suspect the best outcome is that both sides recognise that if they cannot overcome the complexities of the situation then it is best to cool off and become friends. People who have been in love can make good friends. They have shared something valuable.

Just my stray thoughts on a very serious subjectVery wise words as usual Optimist, I think you put in writing what happened to most of us but we hardly admit it. And what is particularly true is that the experience as a monger does not make you immune. It happened to me to have very deep feelings for a girl not when I was a newbie but later on after years of experience.

What is really hard is when it comes to make the decision to leave the girl alone instead pursuing a dream, it happened to me once and it was really hard and got along with it thanks to a one of my very best friends who is also my fateful mate in the clubs but as of today I have no idea if I could have the same coldness I had almosta couple of years ago.

The Cane

11-13-12, 22:29

Based on my own experiences I came perilously close to falling in love. Crazy right over a WG but the heart has its own logic!Affairs of the heart have no logic.

Smoky Jack

11-13-12, 22:57

It happens. Every girl almost will tell you of instances.

And don't think that long experience in clubs will make you immune. It can happen out of the blue.

You need to be very clear headed about what you are doing. It may be a fantasy world in the clubs at first but it can easily become very real.

There are no rules.

If you find it happening you need to ask.

1. What is it in you that needs what the girl is supplying.

2. Vice versa.

3. What are you doing to your family if you have one?

4 The girl may be taking advantage of you but she may also be very vulnerable.

5. If you really are in love then matters of geography will be overcome.

6 To what extent is it a club fuelled fantasy. Does it survive when you meet her and share the housework?

7 if you do love someone in a club, then maybe the greatest act is to leave them alone? (Or maybe not?)

I suspect the best outcome is that both sides recognise that if they cannot overcome the complexities of the situation then it is best to cool off and become friends. People who have been in love can make good friends. They have shared something valuable.

Just my stray thoughts on a very serious subjectJust remember that most people who have been conned had no idea while it was going on. Many of these girls are out to manipulate you for your money. Plain and simple. In the rare instance that there is something real there, think about what will happen when yo bring this girl home to meet your family / friends. A young hottie from Romania / Hungary / Russia with an old fukk like you. Very few relationships can last through this type of thing. Like I said before, see what happens if you say you may be in for a financial crisis, possibly bankrupt. Also, will she trust you, as a confirmed monger? Will you trust her, as a confirmed ho? It's nice to think about a real relationship but keep it in your fantasy world. Better to be wistful than regretful.

Meeps77

11-13-12, 23:00

Based on my own experiences I came perilously close to falling in love with.

A couple of girls at Palace and the only thing that prevented me was in the first case the girl left Palace and the second case I left Germany!

It got to the point where I was spending increasing amounts of time with the girl in the club and thinking about her when not there and then we exchanged numbers and began to communicate outside. If she hadn't left I don't know what would haave happened but I was ready to do anything for her. Crazy right over a WG but the heart has its own logic!

I was wondering if anyone has had similar experiences they'd like to share?I have similar thoughts to smoky and optimist

I can't say that I have ever in been in love with a WG. I don't live in Europe and have never been there long enough to get to that point.

There have been several girls in several countries that I felt an immediate connection with. In these instances we communicated outside of the club but it never came to anthything. Although I had intial desire to keep lines open, I always ended up to a more practical line of thinking that caused me to back off either entirely or to just be SMS friends:

- the girl lives in another country and seeing her on a regular basis if very difficult.

- her profession is not conducive to being a girl friend. I am NOT judging and saying because of what they do they are lower than myself on the social ladder. I view myself as no better than they are because I'm buying what they are selling, we are equals in that respect. What I do mean is that they see 10+ guys a day for weeks on end. Think about your GF or wife taking 50 cocks by Friday, how does that make you feel? Although many have a desire to leave the business (and most will sooner or later) the reality is that they are doing this at this moment in time. If I did get to the point where I loved a girl, I certainly wouldn't want her to work in an FKK and to have her to myself. In the short term, this is simply not going to happen.

- although I felt there was something there, the reality was that sometimes the little head likes to convice the big one that there is more in common than in reality. If we were in a real relationship I don't think I could keep a girl in her early twenties interested nor vice versa. That age is still doing much growing and developing into the person they will ultimately become. I'm a much different man now than I was at that age and my interests are vastly different now.

- Although I never got asked for money or anything else, you sense of reality always clicks in there is a chance she has ulterior motives for making you feel a certain way. I am not saying that a girls sentiments are insincere, they very well may be. But also keep in mind these girls are smart in terms of how to manipulate a man. If you really think about it, for many guys it won't take more than a few choice words and batted eyelashes for them to believe in the fantasy with a girl they found attractive. Of course a man of 40+ WANTS to believe he's still desirable to a 20 something attractive you woman, but in the normal order outside the clubs, this happens infrequently. I have heard stories of girls hooking a guy and getting him emotionally invested; once this was done they need help with rent, or a sick mom, or something else. The carefully constructed house of cards would come crashing down by seeing this behavior for what it is; and the man goes along to perpetuate the fantasy.

- Although I'm not married, I do still date and will eventually be ready for a long term relationship. I found this sort of behavior with a WG in another country to be a distraction from me spending time pursuing a real relationship with a girl whom I'm more compatiable with in the country in which I live. If I spent 6 months chasing a futile relationship with a WG I won't be working to find something with real long term potential.

These are of course my reasons, and despite having been tempted, I'd never say NEVER to the possiblity. As someone else said, sometimes this hits people out of the blue. Sometimes I'm sure it can be real on both sides. Sometimes maybe distances, age, cultural, and socio-economic barries can be overcome to find something truely meaningful. Stranger things have happened, I just wouldn't bet on it.

Indi Companion

11-14-12, 10:50

But would you want to have a relationship with a women that has been used by countless men is also another question? I would have problem to spend my life with such a women. Plus I have never encountered in real life or heard stories of a working girl who lead a healthy life and amazing marriage. Interesting question though!These cases exist, it happened that a WG left the job, got married with the customer she fell in love and they are still happy together. In my monger's life I witnessed at least 3 of these cases and maybe at least one very famous case in Hessen is well known to most of the regular and senior members of this forum but however I will not do names.

It happens, as The Cane wrote there is no logic at all when talking about heart things and love.

Breadman

11-14-12, 15:05

i bought a 5 day train pass that will allow me to go anywhere on the ice high speed train network for 200 euros. good for solo travellers.i really can't see the benefit of touring clubs with a 200 euro five day ice train pass. unless your planning on hitting all the major cities like munich, berlin, frankfurt and dusseldorf and hitting one club before moving on. you'd be much better off renting a car for a week and paying the same 200 euro's on the car and gas combined and being able to visit several clubs in an area like frankfurt or dusseldorf. am i correct in this thinking?

my question to sj: have you used this pass yet or is it for an upcoming trip? how do you plan on using this pass in conjunction with club visits?

Optimist

11-14-12, 17:40

I witnessed at least 3 of these cases and maybe at least one very famous case in Hessen is well known to most of the regular and senior members of this forum but however I will not do names.Ok. Maybe a little more personal response.

I assume you don't mean me?. I know my antics have provided some entertainment for my fellow mongers over many years. I would have asked in a PM but you don't have a PM facility.

All I can say, from bitter / sweet and continuing experience, is you need to be tough as old boots to handle this sort of situation. I find it hard to know how to react when a girl says she wants you to meet her mother in Transylvania!

The chances are that if a girl in a club really has feelings for you, she will be emotionally chaotic (especially given the complexities of her job). One thing I have noticed is that the three girls who have had "feelings" for me seem to have all been deserted by their fathers and to have left their husbands.

I just added these words because the more we are all aware of this situation the better we may cope. Unless we are the admirable sort of monger who does not stray across boundaries

Neutron Flux

11-14-12, 20:53

I really can't see the benefit of touring clubs with a 200 euro five day ICE train pass. Unless your planning on hitting all the major cities like Munich, Berlin, Frankfurt and Dusseldorf and hitting one club before moving on. You'd be much better off renting a car for a week and paying the same 200 euro's on the car and gas combined and being able to visit several clubs in an area like Frankfurt or Dusseldorf. Am I correct in this thinking?Well, he only needs to go from NRW to Frankfurt to Berlin or vice versa and has probably already spent well in excess of 100 on the fuel alone. Unless you rent a really small car that is no fun and drive slowly. And it's hard to get 5 days for 100, those offers usually have restrictions in mileage and / or you need to return it at the same place.

But it does not only depend on the price it really depends what you want. For maximum flexibility a car can't be beat. On the other hand with public transport you can actually get some things done while you travel, you can relax / sleep, watch the scenery, meet people, you can drink, don't need to worry about parking spaces, bad weather, accidents or your car not starting up in the winter.

Simex

11-15-12, 01:49

Presuming you can drive. Go to Europcar and you can pick up a decent Automatic Merc Benz B class from Friday to Monday for €125.

I really can't see the benefit of touring clubs with a 200 euro five day ICE train pass. Unless your planning on hitting all the major cities like Munich, Berlin, Frankfurt and Dusseldorf and hitting one club before moving on. You'd be much better off renting a car for a week and paying the same 200 euro's on the car and gas combined and being able to visit several clubs in an area like Frankfurt or Dusseldorf. Am I correct in this thinking?

My question to SJ: have you used this pass yet or is it for an upcoming trip? How do you plan on using this pass in conjunction with club visits?

Indi Companion

11-15-12, 12:12

Ok. Maybe a little more personal response.

I assume you don't mean me.

All I can say, from bitter / sweet and continuing experience, is you need to be tough as old boots to handle this sort of situation. I find it hard to know how to react when a girl says she wants you to meet her mother in Transylvania!

I just added these words because the more we are all aware of this situation the better we may cope. Unless we are the admirable sort of monger who does not stray across boundariesSorry Optimist, still did not have time to pay for the PM etc. Services as far as I cannot pay by credit card for obvious reasons.

For aswering your question, I did not mean you at all. Unfortunately we have never met even if I think we have common knowledges. But it will happen for sure one of these days that we meet around, at least I hope, it would be my pleasure and honour.

Yes, it is strange how emotionally works such kind of situation for a WG, I also know it first hand but then we can only live and learn. Sometimes I have that feeling tickling in the back of my brain that I did a lot of mistakes in this field and kind of situations

But then I try not to live thinking about the past but the future. For being a professional monger I am still quite young, well under my 40s, so I know that I will face many of these situations in the future and I am facing one also now but I am improving in handling it and in learning what I really want, always keeping in mind that the girls are human beings like we are and they deserve our highest respect in these situations.

I am also trying to be as tough as hold boots but sometimes it is simply not so easy. I am envious sometimes of our colleagues that seem to be so hardened in this respect and look like they are never impacted by any feelings and are always able to keep any relationship within the club like a 100% business transaction. As for me sometimes I can sometimes I cannot, even after many years around. What can I say? I am a soft hearted guy and I like when I get invited to Transilvania to meet the parents, LOL!

Tkae care and thanks for your words, hope we will meet soon somewhere.

IC

Nick The G

11-15-12, 12:57

Just remember that most people who have been conned had no idea while it was going on. Many of these girls are out to manipulate you for your money. Plain and simple. In the rare instance that there is something real there, think about what will happen when yo bring this girl home to meet your family / friends. A young hottie from Romania / Hungary / Russia with an old fukk like you. Very few relationships can last through this type of thing. Like I said before, see what happens if you say you may be in for a financial crisis, possibly bankrupt. Also, will she trust you, as a confirmed monger? Will you trust her, as a confirmed ho? It's nice to think about a real relationship but keep it in your fantasy world. Better to be wistful than regretful."Love brings up anything unlike itself for the purpose of healing." A very famous expression.

The clubs and brothels, market places, where working girls and mongers meet are like alchemistic laboratories. On the surface, it looks like / seems to be an exchange of money versus the licence to use a (female) body for a certain time. But below that, we all bring in our enormous amounts of "lead", hoping that at least there a tiny bit gets transformed into "gold"! All of our beloved and well maintained fears, resulting in our acquired stupid behaviours in relating to others, all of our false identifications (social ladder etc.) we are so proud of, these we bring along into the club! And in this "laboratory", by a mostly and vastly unconscious, but nevertheless highly efficient "magic" network leading to certain encounters, all these will be heated up, put into focus and amplified, amplified, amplified. Many mongers think that they will escape themselves by visiting the clubs and brothels. Only to find, that they are confronted there in an even more intense way with their own deficits.

No one can escape himself. You will always be confronted with what you carry inside and brought along unconsciously."you can't always get what you want, but for sure you will get what you need (to become more conscious!)". Or to put it short: we always attract what we need!

One of the first things, that will happen if we fall in love (there) , we will be directly and massively confronted with our beloved roles (for example as a monger or a working girl). Love directly comes from / involves the core of human beings, and the main purpose is to melt down / remove all those false shields and social artifacts we built up in our life to prevent ourselves from being alive and being our true selves.

I mean trust me these girls know they are damaged goods.
But then they are human.How would you describe yourself?

The chances are that if a girl in a club really has feelings for you, she will be emotionally chaotic (especially given the complexities of her job). One thing I have noticed is that the three girls who have had "feelings" for me seem to have all been deserted by their fathers and to have left their husbands.Any idea about the mental and emotional situation of a man, who has "feelings" for a working girl? Is he still in love with Mama, the only person who abused him so well (emotionally)?
How come, that men are so sure about what is going on with "the girls". Because instead of speaking about themselves they like to only listen and suck in information like a sponge? (you pay for what you hear!)
Hey, what "things" would "girls" notice about you and your former life?

Nick The G

11-15-12, 20:13

Just in case some of you might get the wrong message what I meant was that the girls have very low self esteem of themselves even though they appear tough on the outside.How can you be so sure? Maybe you just look in a mirror seeing yourself!

Let's assume it is true what you say: but then, why are we attracted to girls with "very low self-esteem", in brothels? Because we have such a high (or even an overdose of) self-esteem, at least sort of, that needs to be compensated (or donated)?

And now let's imagine a really tragic story, let's assume it takes place in the best possible setting, in a german brothel: a man with (very) low self esteem, successful in compensating his deficit with money, meets a working girl with (very) low self esteem, trying to compensate her situation with succesfully selling her attractive body. Unconsciously scanning the respective amounts of detectable self-esteem. And then, magic, magic, they both start to have "feelings" for each other. And they confuse "to have feelings" with love.

What outcome would you expect? Optimist already told us: emotionally chaotic!
Of course we know this is only because of the girl's situation ....

NewbieMonger

11-15-12, 20:28

I will be in Zurich in Dec and will have the weekend to monger. Since mongering is expensive in Zurich, I figured it will be better to check out the FKKs in Germany. My dilemma is if I should go to Frankfurt or Munich. There are a lot of reports on Oase and Palace, but I not sure if there are any good ones in Munich. I will be taking a connecting flight from Frankfurt in Feb was planning to check out Oase and Palace then and as such was inclined to check out FKK scene in Munich this time. However if FKK scene in Munich is not worth checking out, then I might as well go to Frankfurt in Dec as well.

Newbie Monger

Meeps77

11-15-12, 20:46

Reminds me what lulu of palace once said to me some time ago.

"you know I am a. If a man tell me he love me in my heart feel sorry and feel stupid for him. Working girls have no love to give"<- it really does sound like that.

But then they are human.Puts it in perspective LOL. I only met Lu Lu once, but that sure sounds like something she would say

Meeps77

11-15-12, 21:03

How would you describe yourself?

Hey, what "things" would "girls" notice about you and your former life?I know personally that I have taken this introspective look at myself many times. I commented the other day that I treat the girls very well and sincerely view them as equals. I feel I am also "damaged goods" in the respect that the hundreds if not over a 1000 women I've been with in 15 years of this would weigh heavy on the mind of a potential mate. I've had girl friends of 6-12 months in this same 15 year time horizon. I never cheated on them, but I always feared of the reaction I'd receive if I disclosed my addiction. In this sense I have every bit as much baggage as the WG and dare not judge them. Despite the obstacles of dating a WG (which are plentiful) there is perhaps this one benefit that its possible a WG and mongerer could accept each others past easier than people who've never been exposed to this sort of life. At least it's eyes wide open.

I feel like a hypocrite, but if a past girlfriend had told me she used to be a prostitute before I met her it might have changed the way I saw her. Realizing that if I may choke on this, how do I expect a normal girl to respond if I tell her this? I've avoided this cross roads to this point, but eventually I will want to marry and have to make a decision as to speak then or forever hold my peace.

Smoky Jack

11-15-12, 21:18

These cases exist, it happened that a WG left the job, got married with the customer she fell in love and they are still happy together. In my monger's life I witnessed at least 3 of these cases and maybe at least one very famous case in Hessen is well known to most of the regular and senior members of this forum but however I will not do names.

It happens, as The Cane wrote there is no logic at all when talking about heart things and love.For the record I did not say it could NEVER happen. I do not look down on these ladies BTW. That is NOT why I think it wouldn't work for the vast majority of people.

Smoky Jack

11-15-12, 21:20

Smoky Jack

11-15-12, 21:27

Just in case some of you might get the wrong message what I meant was that the girls have very low self esteem of themselves eventhough they appear tough on the outside. What lulu is trying to say I think was that prostitute know that they are not worthy of being love. Well that is my interpretation anyway.

That is why you see prostitutes end up with pimps or men who beat them up as subconciously in their mind only these kind of men wants them.Come on man. You are generalizing from one person.

Smoky Jack

11-15-12, 21:28

I know personally that I have taken this introspective look at myself many times. I commented the other day that I treat the girls very well and sincerely view them as equals. I feel I am also "damaged goods" in the respect that the hundreds if not over a 1000 women I've been with in 15 years of this would weigh heavy on the mind of a potential mate. I've had girl friends of 6-12 months in this same 15 year time horizon. I never cheated on them, but I always feared of the reaction I'd receive if I disclosed my addiction. In this sense I have every bit as much baggage as the WG and dare not judge them. Despite the obstacles of dating a WG (which are plentiful) there is perhaps this one benefit that its possible a WG and mongerer could accept each others past easier than people who've never been exposed to this sort of life. At least it's eyes wide open.

I feel like a hypocrite, but if a past girlfriend had told me she used to be a prostitute before I met her it might have changed the way I saw her. Realizing that if I may choke on this, how do I expect a normal girl to respond if I tell her this? I've avoided this cross roads to this point, but eventually I will want to marry and have to make a decision as to speak then or forever hold my peace.I think I could accept that my wife was a prostitute. If I love her, who the fuck cares what other people think? True love is hard to find.

Meeps77

11-15-12, 22:00

I think I could accept that my wife was a prostitute. If I love her, who the fuck cares what other people think? True love is hard to find.I think I ultimately could, but my point around this topic was this: If I met a WG and both parties knew about the others former life from the start. I THINK that would make it easier for both to accept (assuming both quit when it got serious. Another scenario would be dating a girl you met in normal life. After 2 years you are about to get married and out of the blue she discloses she has worked as a prostitue. Let's leave it less complicated and assume this was before you met so there are no infidelity issues. You would think most men would react negatively over this. You would think with my history I would be better prepared than most to understand. But I honestly can't say for sure how I would react to such a shock. Now I reverse my fear and imagine the reaction of my fiancé who has no idea of my mongering life (again assume me faithful to her). How can I hope to think she won't be appalled? Again these are hypotheticals at the moment. I've avoided disclosure to past girlfriends, but sooner or later will have to deal with this

CaptCabin

11-15-12, 22:20

I think I could accept that my wife was a prostitute. If I love her, who the fuck cares what other people think? True love is hard to find.Yes as long as she too can accept the fact that you are a sex tourist from america / canada who travels aborad to mexico, germany and asia just for sex then it is fine. It is hard to find a women like that but if you do all my repesct and compliement to you as a renowned international monger. Your the man dude! LOVE is LOVE.

But I think it would be hard. I mean really hard. Stigma. Insecurities. Trust.

Anywayz anything is possible.

P / s smoky I too harbour interest to have a sex vacation but unfortunately I am unable to due to the fact that my company insist on paying my flights and hotels.

Breadman

11-16-12, 00:37

I have to go to Munich anyway and this was very economical for me. If you are staying in Frankfurt, a rental car works but just remember fuel costs and all the hassle of driving.I'm sorry, I have no clue how your planning on visiting fkk's in Munich using a 200 euro ICE train pass. Can you give me an example on how your planning on touring Germany using this pass and visit Fkk clubs?

You could do an fkk tour in the Frankfurt area without a car but a visit to World using trains and a taxi would run up the tab on your transportation.

Indi Companion

11-16-12, 00:41

I think I could accept that my wife was a prostitute. If I love her, who the fuck cares what other people think? True love is hard to find.I had this discussion with my best friend and he was also a bit disturbed by the thought how would people look at me if I should introduce myself or even only walk along a street with my girlfriend who is (or was) a prostitute?

That's the problem, who does know that your girlfriend was a WG? Sometimes this is also something emotionally blocking us but I mean, we all saw the girls in normal "civil" attires, most of them simply look like any girl on the strees of any city. I mean nobody could ever imagine who they are and what were they doing if you do not tell them.

So sometimes we are afraid also of our shadow, as we say in my Country. The real problem is the individual emotional involvment. And on this I share the point of view of Optimist.

Indi Companion

11-16-12, 00:51

For the record I did not say it could NEVER happen. I do not look down on these ladies BTW. That is NOT why I think it wouldn't work for the vast majority of people.Hey Smoky I didn't quote any post of yours with the post I wrote but a post of RonnyNorway. However, I for sure share a large part of what you say.

Smoky Jack

11-16-12, 02:52

I'm sorry, I have no clue how your planning on visiting fkk's in Munich using a 200 euro ICE train pass. Can you give me an example on how your planning on touring Germany using this pass and visit Fkk clubs?

You could do an fkk tour in the Frankfurt area without a car but a visit to World using trains and a taxi would run up the tab on your transportation.If you look at the ICE network, there are stops in all major cities. I was not planning on an FKK in Munich but in Augsburg (Collosseum). There is a stop there. I can go anywhere I want over a 5 day period, no extra charges other than local transit once I get to a city. I think there is a stop in Darmstadt too, where Sharks is. World, as you say, will be tough so I will probably skip it. I was thinking Oase, Palace, Sharks, Collosseum, then back to wherever my fave (s) is (are).

Smoky Jack

11-16-12, 02:57

I think I ultimately could, but my point around this topic was this: If I met a WG and both parties knew about the others former life from the start. I THINK that would make it easier for both to accept (assuming both quit when it got serious. Another scenario would be dating a girl you met in normal life. After 2 years you are about to get married and out of the blue she discloses she has worked as a prostitue. Let's leave it less complicated and assume this was before you met so there are no infidelity issues. You would think most men would react negatively over this. You would think with my history I would be better prepared than most to understand. But I honestly can't say for sure how I would react to such a shock. Now I reverse my fear and imagine the reaction of my fiancé who has no idea of my mongering life (again assume me faithful to her). How can I hope to think she won't be appalled? Again these are hypotheticals at the moment. I've avoided disclosure to past girlfriends, but sooner or later will have to deal with thisWell, withholding a major topic is always serious. At least your fiance' probably had a reason to be a ho. You have no excuse, other than the fact that you simply love women and like to fuck a lot of girls (which I approve of LOL). And the likelihood that YOU cheat on her is much greater than her cheating on you. My word of advice to you: NEVER EVER tell a woman that you are a monger. Keep that side of you separate if you actually want to keep a girl. Truth is, after a few years of marriage you will probably monger again. These girls are hot, and once you get a taste it is hard to forget.

Optimist

11-16-12, 12:02

Nick the G. Well summarised as usual! Although I wouldn't automatically assume that just because the people are involved are emotional there will be a bad outcome (likely -yes, automatic - no). Maybe even if the outcome involves separation and parting it is actually a good outcome and both sides gain something through the experience. Especially if they are mirrors of each other and understand what is going on. Disaster is most likely when neither side understands what is going on. Which is why it is good to have this discussion.

Indi. Thanks for the kind words. Hope to meet up sometime. My next trip is from 5 Dec.

Ronnie - you can't often go by what girls say in the club. As Smoky says one cannot generalise e.g. to say that working girls have no love to give is to confuse a "professional" boundary with them as people. Very often they are desperate for love as other members have pointed out, but are sensible enough (e.g. loulou) to make sure they do not give it in a club context

Geronimo11

11-16-12, 13:31

Hey brothers. New member.

Me and a couple friends are planning an fkk tour for only 2 days to Dusseldorf. My friends have been in gt before and they insist on going to gt again.

I ve been reading the posts here for days and wanted to take your suggestions. Which one is the best fkk in Germany?

I ve seen gt girls on their website and they seemed less than I think. Only 25 girls. Can there be girls who are not on the website?

Tx for your replies.

"Be cool!"

Nick The G

11-16-12, 18:08

Although I wouldn't automatically assume that just because the people are involved are emotional there will be a bad outcome (likely -yes, automatic - no). Maybe even if the outcome involves separation and parting it is actually a good outcome and both sides gain something through the experience.Some tend to repeat, like in school. So maybe they gained "something", but they didn't learn anything. The more we are entrapped in our (emotional, behavioural) habits / routines, the more we resemble a machine, the more we are in "automatic" mode.

Especially if they are mirrors of each other and understand what is going on.These "fucking mirrors" are even said to have healing qualities. Some can turn blind men into visionary guys!

Wise men and mirror experts say, that the most expensive and most exclusive / illusive mirrors can be found in brothels! Only there! Or why else are we queueing up in front of those "mirrors"? Some guys, by spending large amounts of money, even arrange / insist that no one else should have a look in their favorite mirror on the same day.

Tragic: some guys only feel alive if they can mirror themselves in their favorite mirrors.

Very often they are desperate for love as other members have pointed out, but are sensible enough (e.g. loulou) to make sure they do not give it in a club contextIf someone is in desperate need (for food, money, love, etc) , how can he / she share or give?

Sebastiane

11-16-12, 20:11

Breadman

11-16-12, 21:37

I'm on a local review board where I live and I'm really shocked what these guys post about the girls they've seen and recommend and what they paid for the services. Some guy posts that he saw this escort and provides her link and his recommendation of her. I click on the link and the girl is 5'3" and a whopping 160lbs. Huge like a whale. So had to make a joke out of that guys post only to be 'reported to the admin' by some hack of a senior poster. Asked me who I'd recommend, had to put up a photo off one of the fkk clubs website. I can't figure out why someone would pay a whale 2 bills when the fkk scene offers so much more. And every other week or so I read about some guy who got caught doing something stupid and got fired from his high paying job. Don't hobby where it might come back to haunt you.

Smoky Jack

11-16-12, 22:18

Some tend to repeat, like in school. So maybe they gained "something", but they didn't learn anything. The more we are entrapped in our (emotional, behavioural) habits / routines, the more we resemble a machine, the more we are in "automatic" mode.

These "fucking mirrors" are even said to have healing qualities. Some can turn blind men into visionary guys!

Wise men and mirror experts say, that the most expensive and most exclusive / illusive mirrors can be found in brothels! Only there! Or why else are we queueing up in front of those "mirrors"? Some guys, by spending large amounts of money, even arrange / insist that no one else should have a look in their favorite mirror on the same day.

Tragic: some guys only feel alive if they can mirror themselves in their favorite mirrors.

If someone is in desperate need (for food, money, love, etc) , how can he / she share or give?I do like fucking in front of the mirror!

Hessen Bub

11-16-12, 23:28

If someone is in desperate need (for food, money, love, etc) , how can he / she share or give?Wh should that keep somebody from sharing or giving? One doesn't exclude the other.

HB

ZimmerBaby

11-16-12, 23:56

What is this 200 euro ICE train pass? I have lived and worked in Germany and never heard of such a thing. There are the German RailPasses and also the 25 and 50 Bahncards but never heard of this five day ICE pass?

Sounds good if it is true.I've read an article about this offer which is only for non-europeans.

Source: http://www.bahn.de/i/view/GBR/en/prices/germany/germanrailpass.shtml

Nick The G

11-17-12, 01:55

Wh should that keep somebody from sharing or giving? One doesn't exclude the other.

HBIf you are in desperate need to hide your FKK trips to your important others, why not start sharing, they will love to receive your loving message!

Atooz

11-17-12, 07:55

What is this 200 euro ICE train pass?I think it is only available in your home country, i.e., outside of Germany. You therefore need to purchase it before your trip and bring it with you.

@Smoky, not sure if you know or if it is still true, I think the eruorail pass (assuming that is what you have) is also good for S-Bahn, but not U-Bahn.

Hessen Bub

11-17-12, 09:55

If you are in desperate need to hide your FKK trips to your important others, why not start sharing, they will love to receive your loving message!If you are looking for a change in your life. Why don't try it.

HB

Simex

11-17-12, 17:33

I think there are over 150+ girls not on the website. But don't expect them to be working all at once.

Presuming it's purely down to lineup you're after (not food, facilities etc.) then check out the following

Clubs in priority order:

1) GT.

2) ACA.

3) PHG.

4) YingYang.

5) Living Room.

6) D Vita.

7) VV.

2 full days should cover the top lists.

Hey brothers. New member.

Me and a couple friends are planning an fkk tour for only 2 days to Dusseldorf. My friends have been in gt before and they insist on going to gt again.

I ve been reading the posts here for days and wanted to take your suggestions. Which one is the best fkk in Germany?

I ve seen gt girls on their website and they seemed less than I think. Only 25 girls. Can there be girls who are not on the website?

Tx for your replies.

"Be cool!"

Slither

11-17-12, 22:39

Slither

11-18-12, 18:05

Indi Companion

11-18-12, 18:46

Indi. Thanks for the kind words. Hope to meet up sometime. My next trip is from 5 Dec.I will be for sure around at World for the Christmas Party on 8 Dec.

Maybe World or Mainhattan on 7 Dec.

Meeps77

11-18-12, 19:51

I'd like to ask a question of the professional mongerers who live and work in Germany. I'm from the US and every since I lived in the UK during university I've wanted to go back abroad. Germany is of interest for me for many reasons (not only for fkks. I'm fairly talented in my area of corporate finance and have done well here in the US.

My primary path would be to get to europe, ideally germany, via an expat assignment. My comapny has one slot that would be ideal, I just need the person in it to quit! I'm pretty sure that my options in Germany getting hired with another company directly would be limited until I learn to speak german. Would you agree with this statement?

Even if I found a position that didn't have german as a prerequisite, I'd still want to learn the language. The best method is immersion I've heard, but not too many German speakers where I live. You you guys heard any opinions on the best language software?

Thanks!

Breadman

11-18-12, 20:30

. I'm from the US and every since I lived in the UK during university I've wanted to go back abroad. Germany is of interest for me for many reasons (not only for fkks. I'm fairly talented in my area of corporate finance and have done well here in the US.Transfer to London if that's possible. They have ICE trains running to Frankfurt with a stop in Brussels I think.

Meeps77

11-18-12, 20:36

Transfer to London if that's possible. They have ICE trains running to Frankfurt with a stop in Brussels I think.It would be an option. I take it that this means you think no german = no job in Germany? .

Samplerr

11-18-12, 20:44

Even if I found a position that didn't have german as a prerequisite, I'd still want to learn the language. The best method is immersion I've heard, but not too many German speakers where I live. You you guys heard any opinions on the best language software?

Thanks!Don't know about language software, as I've attended classes instead, but a very useful site is.

http://dict.leo.org/ende?lang=de&lp=ende

Not only is it a very extensive dictionary, but it also gives you many context specific examples, an excellent forum, pronunciation examples etc.

Hessen Bub

11-18-12, 20:55

It would be an option. I take it that this means you think no german = no job in Germany? .No. It depends what company and which financial sector you will be working in.

HB

Meeps77

11-18-12, 20:58

No. It depends what company and which financial sector you will be working in.

HBMy background is financial management of technical companies (semiconductor, aerospace, etc). There are technical companies in the region I can target, but its good to know that I may still have a shot if I'm still learning german.

Thanks

Breadman

11-18-12, 21:43

It would be an option. I take it that this means you think no german = no job in Germany? .No, it means if your asking for software to learn a language you probably only speak english. Learning another language at a later age is extremely difficult. Moving to London would be the simplest solution.

Neutron Flux

11-19-12, 00:19

Learning another language at a later age is extremely difficult.That's true, but it's actually a lot easier if you actually live in the country and are forced to use it all the time. HB is right, it depends a lot, but usually you will not be expected to be perfect when you enter, but you will be expected to catch up later. Actually if you're here for a month per year anyway, why don't you take language classes in the daytime?

Completely moving to another country is of course a big step, and the implications should be well considered. It can help your career though if it's done well (and cause you to have even less time for fun like FKKs haha). And who knows what will happen, maybe a few years from now Germany will be hell for mongering, and the USA will be heaven. Ok, put in another country to make the point, LOL.

Yes, you can go from London to Frankfurt in 7-8 hrs using the Eurostar and change at Brussels or Paris using TGV and / or ICE but it's not cheap. There are some cheap flights but usually you have to take at least the Friday off if you want to go for the weekend (and book well in advance). So it's not quite comparable. Also, London is a very expensive city to live in.

Dufey

11-19-12, 02:34

Hello All,

I have a personal story to relate. I am interested in what view people may have in my experience with a girl in a club.

For 2 and half months now I have been seeing a girl regularly. To date. 11 times to be exact. Of those 11 times, I saw her 3 times outside the club. The third time there was no money involved. I expect to see her again this week for the 12th time in the club. When I see her in the club we usually go to the room for between a total of 3 hours to 6 hours over the course of say 2 or 3 sessions. In the room, we pretty much go at it like the best girlfriend sex I ever had. She does a lot of things that most girls will not do, or if they did do it then they would charge extra. She charges me the normal club rates for time and for extras.

Not only do we spend a lot of time in the room, she also spends a lot of time with me socially in the club, eating, taking a drink, talking and watching the other people in the club.

She says when she goes with me she comes and we joke about that we both come as many times as the other. She says she treats sex with other men as business. She explains that is providing a service to them where they use her body. She says she thinks of other things when with them and by doing so she does not come. With me she says she frees her mind and wants to come and she is quite vocal about it. She comes from DATY and from straight sex. I think she is not faking it since when she screams I coming I feel a sudden warmth and a lot of liquid around my shaft that is furiously fucking her since she is screaming at me not to stop fucking her. I know she comes in DATY as I can taste her sweet juice. If it is not her orgasm juice then she can sure do some Hollywood trickery producing the woman's come. She always wants me to come and is disappointed if I do not come, so I do my hardest to come to please her.

She says she likes me but she says needs time. Take it slow. She has her own personal goals in life, and this is why she does this job, but she wants to see me and get to know me. She also says she does not want me to get my hopes up on a relationship, so she says I can go to other clubs and see other girls. Despite her saying this she regularly emails and calls me and makes plans for us to see each other in the club or outside the club. We are both busy, so for the events planned outside the club, these do not happen but the intention is there. She makes it clear that events outside the club will not be for money.

I really like this girl. She is a really nice caring person. She constantly says she likes me too. She says she likes how I look and my heart, age difference is not a problem.

I am in two minds as to what to do. It is very complicated. I am in the clubs to have fun and go with lots of pretty girls but then I am drawn to this girl since she ticks a lot of my boxes. She plans to work for a number of years. I think I can get over what job she does, especially after I read what Meeps77 wrote below. I hope that this is enough information to generate some insight from others as to how to handle this situation.

Thank you in advance for your thoughts.

Geronimo11

11-19-12, 09:19

Geronimo11

11-19-12, 10:12

I think there are over 150+ girls not on the website. But don't expect them to be working all at once.

Presuming it's purely down to lineup you're after (not food, facilities etc.) then check out the following

Clubs in priority order:

1) GT.

2) ACA.

3) PHG.

4) YingYang.

5) Living Room.

6) D Vita.

7) VV.

2 full days should cover the top lists.I know that Gt is in Brugge. We are going to stay in Dusseldorf. According to your reply, we'll go to Gt first day, and Aca the second day. How many km is Aca to Dusseldorf?

Is it near to go by car?

Thanks again by the way

Ableyone

11-19-12, 22:05

I know that Gt is in Brugge. We are going to stay in Dusseldorf. According to your reply, we'll go to Gt first day, and Aca the second day. How many km is Aca to Dusseldorf?

Is it near to go by car?

Thanks again by the wayGood luck finding GT in Brugge. You really need to buy a decent map.

Geronimo11

11-19-12, 22:50

Good luck finding GT in Brugge. You really need to buy a decent map.Cars have GPRS don't they?

Nick The G

11-20-12, 00:49

Good luck finding GT in Brugge. You really need to buy a decent map.Why not make use of Google Earth or Google Maps? It is so easy to find your way nowadays!

Nick The G

11-20-12, 01:02

She says she likes me but she says needs time. Take it slow. She has her own personal goals in life, and this is why she does this job, but she wants to see me and get to know me. She also says she does not want me to get my hopes up on a relationship, so she says I can go to other clubs and see other girls. Despite her saying this she regularly emails and calls me and makes plans for us to see each other in the club or outside the club.Very good for you! Send emails and tell her you need lots of time too and continue fucking other girls in (other) clubs!

BTW, what are your own personal goals in life?

We are both busy,being so busy, why do you think of a relationship? Continue "being busy", for the sake of your soul!

Simex

11-20-12, 01:43

Brugge to GT is not too far. But Bruggen to GT alot closer.

Why not make use of Google Earth or Google Maps? It is so easy to find your way nowadays!

Simex

11-20-12, 01:45

That's definitely one of many signs you have made a woman come. Good job.

She comes from DATY and from straight sex. I think she is not faking it since when she screams I coming I feel a sudden warmth and a lot of liquid around my shaft that is furiously fucking her since she is screaming at me not to stop fucking her. I know she comes in DATY as I can taste her sweet juice.

Meeps77

11-20-12, 02:03

I think I can get over what job she does, especially after I read what Meeps77 wrote below. I hope that this is enough information to generate some insight from others as to how to handle this situation.

Thank you in advance for your thoughts.It really only matter what you think. But my comments on the benefit off dating a WG were within a very specific context. I was saying I have a deep concern about eventually having to disclose to a future wife my mongering past (or conceal it and lie). This would present obvious risks. My point was a single advantage with dating a WG was that you both know each others past, and it may allow you to accept each other better. If you read my other posts I have serious doubts about the viability of a real realtionship with a WG for many reasons.

Speaking for myself, if I really cared for a girl who was working at an fkk I would want her to quit. You can call this controlling if you want, but its human nature. Who wants their girl taking countless cocks and cum shots in a day, week, or month? I think if you say you are fine with it you either A) don't really care about her B) are lying to yourself about your own emotions present / future or C) are her pimp.

I just can't imagine many scenarios in which a relationship of this endures, but what do I know? It's between the two of you, you have to navigate it. I'd just tread carefully if you are exposing your emotions and your wallet.

SpeedyMike

11-20-12, 02:13

Hello All,

She says when she goes with me she comes and we joke about that we both come as many times as the other. She says she treats sex with other men as business. She explains that is providing a service to them where they use her body. She says she thinks of other things when with them and by doing so she does not come. She always wants me to come and is disappointed if I do not come, so I do my hardest to come to please her.

She says she likes me but she says needs time. Take it slow. She has her own personal goals in life, and this is why she does this job, but she wants to see me and get to know me. She also says she does not want me to get my hopes up on a relationship, so she says I can go to other clubs and see other girls. Despite her saying this she regularly emails and calls me and makes plans for us to see each other in the club or outside the club. We are both busy, so for the events planned outside the club, these do not happen but the intention is there. She makes it clear that events outside the club will not be for money.

I really like this girl. She is a really nice caring person. She constantly says she likes me too. She says she likes how I look and my heart, age difference is not a problem.This sounds like something I heard from a Oase girl a longtime ago.

I think you should do like Nick The G says, Continue "being busy", for the sake of your soul!

Can I ask what her age is, and yours?

Dufey

11-20-12, 04:30

Very good for you! Send emails and tell her you need lots of time too and continue fucking other girls in (other) clubs!

BTW, what are your Own personal goals in life?

Being so busy, why do you think of a relationship? Continue "being busy", for the sake of your soul!Hello Nick The G,

I think I see your point. You are saying just go with the flow. Do not change anything that you would do normally if you were going to a club. Such as stay within budget for your spend, book girls that you would normally book including her. The interesting thing is that I have become really only interested in her. True, I would like to do other girls, but I can control myself for some reason, when at other times I could not and I would just go any girl I wanted. Now I cannot.

Excuse me. I must clarify. When she said it is fine that I go with other girls, she meant that also in the club she is working in as well as other clubs that I visit. She knows I do not exclusively go to the club that she works in. To date, I have only gone with her in her club even though she reminds me it is okay I can go with other girls when I am there. She even asks me how did I enjoy other clubs. I watch her when I say I went to another club last night and I cannot see any change in her emotions, but when I say I only fuck her in this club you can see her relax and feel touch. I mean she really reacted in a caring way. It got to the point that the last time I saw her, when I went to another club the next day I could not bring myself to fuck another girl. I just ate the food, chatted with girls and with other guests and did wellness. I then wrote her how much I enjoyed my day in the other club, but I think I did not explain to her clearly I did not go with any other girls.

The next day she calls me really early in the morning like at 6:45 O'Clock in the morning just to see how I am. We talk some more that evening then she complains that we SMS and call each other too much, she said it was not right we do this since it was too much for her to handle, but when I look back at the emails and phone calls we made since then we virtually chatted to each other everyday in some way.

My personal goals in life? At present I am single. This is why I feel I can go to the clubs in good conscience. I admit I would like a relationship at this time. This girl as I said ticks a lot my boxes in terms of looks, intelligence, just being fun to be with, and she seems to be building a future for herself as well since she is doing activities outside the club. I know these are true since she talks about them all the time and when we have seen each outside the club I have seen what she has been doing. The other goal in my life is that I like my freedom to do as I please, but I know deep down I would like to have someone to come home to and build a life.

She really acts like a girl friend when I am with her. I understand that "acts" is the keyword. The sex is really good with her, and when we sit together in the club, we can sit just with each other for hours just holding hands. She lets me fondle her all over and we constantly kiss in public. I do not see her do this with other customers. I think her girlfriends in the club know we like each other due to how they act and what they say. For example, my girl asks her girlfriend to come sit with us together in the club but she says no since she wanted us to have quality time together. For the events we plan outside the club she asks her club girlfriends to come too. I am not sure about meeting their boyfriends though since from what I hear they are in the industry so to speak. I have bought her some gifts and she seems to really appreciate them and tells me how she uses them or adores them every so often. One gift I gave her she refused to take since she said it was too much for her.

So I take your point about staying "busy" for the sake of my soul. I see what you say, but it is so hard to resist not going to see her since she has really gotten me in my heart. I think I will see how this goes but making sure I do not spend any more than I would normally. I do know I have increased my frequency of going to this club and clubs in general.

Dufey

11-20-12, 04:42

That's definitely one of many signs you have made a woman come. Good job.Thank you, I was expecting some ridicule over my claims that I make her come, but the signs are too natural and real for her to be faking. As said before the taste when she comes from DATY and her pushing me away from licking her her pussy since it is sensitive. The sudden wet warmth in her pussy when she declares she is coming. The natural wetness she has, we hardly ever use lube, its all licking both ways, in fact I sometimes never remember her getting any out of her purse. We come together 4 or 5 times over a day. The game is that we keep count of how many times we come and we keep the number even between us.

Dufey

11-20-12, 05:06

It really only matter what you think. But my comments on the benefit off dating a WG were within a very specific context. I was saying I have a deep concern about eventually having to disclose to a future wife my mongering past (or conceal it and lie). This would present obvious risks. My point was a single advantage with dating a WG was that you both know each others past, and it may allow you to accept each other better. If you read my other posts I have serious doubts about the viability of a real realtionship with a WG for many reasons.

Speaking for myself, if I really cared for a girl who was working at an fkk I would want her to quit. You can call this controlling if you want, but its human nature. Who wants their girl taking countless cocks and cum shots in a day, week, or month? I think if you say you are fine with it you either A) don't really care about her B) are lying to yourself about your own emotions present / future or C) are her pimp.

I just can't imagine many scenarios in which a relationship of this endures, but what do I know? It's between the two of you, you have to navigate it. I'd just tread carefully if you are exposing your emotions and your wallet.I know what you are saying. It does feel comfortable knowing each other's background from the club. I think she knows this from what she has said. It is clear she has no problem that I am a client too. As to your point I am not sure how I could handle telling a girlfriend from normal life what I have been doing since my last serious relationship.

At first I did not think too hard about the future.

It is the conversation below that prompted me to think some more about the situation if this got serious. This has generated questions in my mind whether I pursue this. I know when I have said to her I think this does not work, she has been clearly upset when she think she will not see me anymore, but then she says she is not up for anything concrete or promising me anything. She says she wants to get to know me and this is important for her and explains the emails and phone calls.

I then thought how the living arrangements would work. Could we share cooking and cleaning duties? How will our finances works? Could I handle her tolietry habits and could she stand my tolietry habits? What will be taboo topics to discuss and what would be open topics for conversation. She says her family already know about me and asked me if I had told my family about her! She says to them she met me at work. This is true.

I know we can sleep a night together since we have done that. I really enjoyed that.

You are right that I would prefer she left this job since it really hurts when I see her go with other men in the club. Her friends say to me that it is her job when she looks intimate with other customers and not to worry. After the customer she usually comes back to sit with me unless another man has booked her. You are right that I would be lying to myself if I said to her that it was fine she keeps working at this job if we were together, but the situation is that we are not together. She makes it clear that she is not interested; but the contradictory thing is how she acts with me. She does not pump me for money or asks if we are going to the room. I cannot remember a single time she has asked me to go to the room in all the 11 days we have seen each other. I have to ask. If I do not ask she just sits with me. This is exactly how she was in the first time I met her.

To be clear I would not want her working in a club if this develops.

I hear you about treading carefully. I am exposing my wallet to her since I cannot resist taking her to the room. I just have to make sure that those sessions remain in budget.

Thank you for your help.

Dufey

11-20-12, 09:06

this sounds like something i heard from a oase girl a longtime ago.

i think you should do like nick the g says, continue "being busy", for the sake of your soul!

can i ask what her age is, and yours?hello speedymike,

would you be able to share what you heard from the oase girl a long time ago? i would appreciate the insight since i am really in uncharted territory for me.

the signs are is that she is not playing me i think, she does not hustle me to take her to the room, nor does she ask me to pay her some lump sum. she has talked through her finances to explain to me why she works in the club. a normal job she is suited to would not earn enough to achieve what she wants in the time she wants. i did the math and i agree.

i take nick the g's advice about continuing to be too busy to meet up. the interesting thing is that she is the one that seems to be busier since she juggles club life, homelife and her building her new future. since i am more older than she is i have established myself in my career.

well, this is the interesting thing about the age. using the first age she gave me it was 15 years difference and then as we got to know each other more, she told me another age and it is 14 years difference. i cannot prove what is right.

when i look at us together i can see us as a normal couple. it is not about the age but how we act with each other. what we do together feels all natural. walking together holding hands, or she holds my arm as we walk together, mutually stopping to kiss each other. she tells me her likes and dislikes and so i know what she likes to eat and so forth.

as she says it could be just time.

i have been seeing other club girls for longer and i do not know them as well as this girl or get along with this girl as well. this is why i think this is different.

Nick The G

11-20-12, 12:10

I know when I have said to her I think this does not work, she has been clearly upset when she think she will not see me anymore, but then she says she is not up for anything concrete or promising me anything. She says she wants to get to know me and this is important for her and explains the emails and phone calls.

She makes it clear that she is not interested; but the contradictory thing is how she acts with me.All of your attention is focused on her. You will be interpreting every glimpse of information in favour of your "theory". You will have to make more and more assumptions about her to explain the contradictory patterns. And, maybe you will miss yourself and what you want in life completely this way!

For sure: these conflicting messages (double binds) are bound to drive you crazy, sooner or later!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_bind

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-second-noble-truth/201108/the-relationship-double-bind-frustration-enlightenment

Another thing, just to reframe context: imagine her to come and visit you at your working place. You both sit together there for hours holding hands, kissing each other, and your colleagues will see it. What a nice loving couple at work! How would that feel like? And how long could you do this?

Praj4

11-20-12, 13:46

Hello All,

I have a personal story to relate. I am interested in what view people may have in my experience with a girl in a club.

I am in two minds as to what to do. It is very complicated. I am in the clubs to have fun and go with lots of pretty girls but then I am drawn to this girl since she ticks a lot of my boxes. She plans to work for a number of years. I think I can get over what job she does, especially after I read what Meeps77 wrote below. I hope that this is enough information to generate some insight from others as to how to handle this situation.

Thank you in advance for your thoughts.It seems that you don't understand mechanism of sex. I did visit most of main FKKs' as well as mongered world over. And each time I do love the babe as if she is GF unless the babe is too mechanical!

Now what must be happening? Sex act is like a STAR shinning in the sky while other mechanisms like pair bonding, companionship, brain wavelength matching, platonic love etc are PLANETS hanging around produced as a result of evolutionary processes aiding survival!

The sex act weel executed results into most optimum chemical equilibrium in our brain centers while these other mechanisms produce similar effect but not optimum, not upto the mark in comparison. Thus this is heuristically quantifiable argument unless you want exact numbers then we must refer our brains during and after each act to SPECT study by a nurophysician!

Going ahead with my heuristic argument. Now your brain is saying that the the particular PLANET is more intense / brighter that the STAR itself, we all know that it can't be unless there is some kind of filter or distortion in your view path, I. E in your brain paths! [to be contd]

Ableyone

11-20-12, 23:30

Cars have GPRS don't they?I take it you mean GPS, then yes some do, but enter Brugge as a destination and you will spend a nice day out driving through Belgium.

Smoky Jack

11-20-12, 23:36

hello speedymike,

would you be able to share what you heard from the oase girl a long time ago? i would appreciate the insight since i am really in uncharted territory for me.

the signs are is that she is not playing me i think, she does not hustle me to take her to the room, nor does she ask me to pay her some lump sum. she has talked through her finances to explain to me why she works in the club. a normal job she is suited to would not earn enough to achieve what she wants in the time she wants. i did the math and i agree.

i take nick the g's advice about continuing to be too busy to meet up. the interesting thing is that she is the one that seems to be busier since she juggles club life, homelife and her building her new future. since i am more older than she is i have established myself in my career.

well, this is the interesting thing about the age. using the first age she gave me it was 15 years difference and then as we got to know each other more, she told me another age and it is 14 years difference. i cannot prove what is right.

when i look at us together i can see us as a normal couple. it is not about the age but how we act with each other. what we do together feels all natural. walking together holding hands, or she holds my arm as we walk together, mutually stopping to kiss each other. she tells me her likes and dislikes and so i know what she likes to eat and so forth.

as she says it could be just time.

i have been seeing other club girls for longer and i do not know them as well as this girl or get along with this girl as well. this is why i think this is different.i think you should just go for it captaincabin, err dufey.

Yakob

11-21-12, 01:17

I think you should just go for it captaincabin, err Dufey.Now now Smokey Jack, remember to take your medication.

SpeedyMike

11-21-12, 01:20

hello speedymike,

would you be able to share what you heard from the oase girl a long time ago? i would appreciate the insight since i am really in uncharted territory for me.

well, this is the interesting thing about the age. using the first age she gave me it was 15 years difference and then as we got to know each other more, she told me another age and it is 14 years difference. i cannot prove what is right.what i mean about the oase girl, is that it sounds like something i tryed with a girl from oase, long time ago.

about the age thing. i ask you about hers and yours age becours i think it is more easy to handel the age difference if she's 30 and your 44, then it is if she's 20 and your 34.

becours she's in some other place in her life when she's 30 then 20, and i think the chance is better for you if she's 30.

i don't know if i can share anything with you, maybe if it was the same girl.

a wg will sell you any fantasi or dream you have, some will even go on a week holiday with you, and if she is smart and look in to the future she will set the price low, give you free time, becours it is better for her to give you 2 hours in free. 5 hours in room, makeing 500 euros over 7 hours, and have sex 2-3 times, then it is to have 10, 50 euros fuck.

if you want to know how she feel's about you, then try to tell her how you feel about her, and that you like to see her alot more out side the club with out any money or shoping tripps between you and her, and that you like to become a part of her privat life.

if she smiles and says it is a good idee, then good for you. if she says no, well then you really haven lost anything, becours it would never have work anyway.

if you are so lucky that she says it is a good idee, then try to picture this.

1. you sit and kiss, hold hands and her phone rings and she has to go and meet some guy.

2. she goes away for 1, 2 or 3 days a weekend or a holiday with a guy.

ask your self how you would feel about that and if you can handel that. it can be that it is easy to handel in the start, but i bet you, the more time you have with her the harder it will get.

Smoky Jack

11-21-12, 01:27

Now now Smokey Jack, remember to take your medication.At least change up your writing style for each poster you make up, jeez. It is too obvious now and no longer entertaining. You are not even a competent troll.

Optimist

11-21-12, 12:27

Indi - I'll probably be at GT for a long standing engagement so I'll probably miss you unfortunately. See under Travel Notifications.

I will be for sure around at World for the Christmas Party on 8 Dec.

Maybe World or Mainhattan on 7 Dec.

Howie

11-22-12, 02:30

[QUOTE=Dufey; 1350446]She says when she goes with me she comes and we joke about that we both come as many times as the other. She says she treats sex with other men as business. She explains that is providing a service to them where they use her body. She says she thinks of other things when with them and by doing so she does not come. With me she says she frees her mind and wants to come and she is quite vocal about it.

QUOTE]

Hi Dufey,

This lady of yours, is she considered to be one of the more popular and sought after girls in the club? Or one of the regular main stream ones who have difficulty in luring men into the rooms?

It's interesting but I have found that my feelings for a girl and conversely her feelings for me depends on her popularity. The more she is desired by other hobbyiest, the stronger are my feelings for her.

Are you allowed to say which club she is at?

Howie

Dufey

11-22-12, 07:33

All of your attention is focused on her. You will be interpreting every glimpse of information in favour of your "theory". You will have to make more and more assumptions about her to explain the contradictory patterns. And, maybe you will miss yourself and what you want in life completely this way!

For sure: these conflicting messages (double binds) are bound to drive you crazy, sooner or later!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_bind

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-second-noble-truth/201108/the-relationship-double-bind-frustration-enlightenment

Another thing, just to reframe context: imagine her to come and visit you at your working place. You both sit together there for hours holding hands, kissing each other, and your colleagues will see it. What a nice loving couple at work! How would that feel like? And how long could you do this?Hi Nick the G,

I think I understand what you are saying. If we analyse every single detail that we see in the girl's actions or inactions we will drive ourselves crazy. We can only see what happens. I must stop stressing myself for every detail that is being seen. These details may mean nothing or may mean the worse so no use thinking about them. The key thing is that you do not drive yourself crazy for them.

Regarding your reframe of context. It feels to me that you think that this relationship may work. When wives come to work you can see the social side of a work colleague and see the public displays of affection or none for that matter betwen couples. Of course, you cannot do it for very long since the people have to work.

So how I see what you say if she came to my work and she sat with me for hours, holding my hand and kissing, then it feels like she really likes me. I mean why would someone come to do these public displays of affection unless they really liked a person? You comment seems to contradict evrything else that you have written and actually has a positive spin on the situation.

Like I noted, I do see this girl sit for some time with a client and I have seen her sit for over 1 hour with a client talking, waiting and entertaining a client's friends for her to go off and make just a 50€ session with the guy. But she is not holding his hand, hot sitting really close to him as in side by side with arms around his waist and then kissing him every so often. She does this with me when she is done searching for a customer and she comes back to sit with me to have a smoke and relax for a bit and chat to me about our lives and what she would like to do together.

Dufey

11-22-12, 07:54

It seems that you don't understand mechanism of sex. I did visit most of main FKKs' as well as mongered world over. And each time I do love the babe as if she is GF unless the babe is too mechanical!

Now what must be happening? Sex act is like a STAR shinning in the sky while other mechanisms like pair bonding, companionship, brain wavelength matching, platonic love etc are PLANETS hanging around produced as a result of evolutionary processes aiding survival!

The sex act weel executed results into most optimum chemical equilibrium in our brain centers while these other mechanisms produce similar effect but not optimum, not upto the mark in comparison. Thus this is heuristically quantifiable argument unless you want exact numbers then we must refer our brains during and after each act to SPECT study by a nurophysician!

Going ahead with my heuristic argument. Now your brain is saying that the the particular PLANET is more intense / brighter that the STAR itself, we all know that it can't be unless there is some kind of filter or distortion in your view path, I. E in your brain paths! [to be contd]It has taken a few reads and re-reads and using google translate, google search for some of the acronyms, and a dictionary to understand what you have written. I am still not sure if I really appreciate what you have written and if so I am duly sorry. I know that you are trying to help hence why you have written a number of paragraphs. For this I thank you.

I think what you saying is that the sex acts which we do together is in some way clouding the thinking in that there could potentially be a relationship. I enjoy the sex so much that I think that I want this experience more that I am seeking whatever mechanism whether true or false to think that a realtionship could happen whereby these great sexual experiences will continue and hopefully become exclusive to me.

You are probably right.

Then there is the 10% chance that I think I may have where it could be real. No science to that 10% figure. Just a number picked from the air to give me some comfort for my ego that there is something there but also a nice get out if nothing eventuates and I can tell myself that I told you so and you wasted all your time and money. This is why I have to control myself and not spend more than I usually do when I visit a club. Now the difference is instead of spending on 3-4 girls on a visit the budget goes all on her.

I mean she even had her friend explain to me what she was looking for as she sat there. She wanted to get to know me and did not see me as a customer and she says it too to me. No promises. Take it slow and we will see how it goes. She keeps on saying how she likes me in our varous communications. It is all confusing. She says she does not want this or that but then she does not seem to stop keeping in contact with me asking after me.

Then again she could be just plain playing me. Many girls in clubs do not have really good regular customers that could book them for 4 to 6 hours plus a number of extras on them each visit. This girl from what I have observe and from what she says has one customer who comes maybe once a month and books her for 2 or 3 hours. Another regular who books her for 1 to 1. 5 hours. Apart from that most clients are picked off the club floor where the standard is 50€ half hour sessions and quite a few one hours. So when you add in what I pay her then she knows that if she keeps me sweet then each time I am in the club she really makes her financial target for the day.

This is why I am confused. She does not push for the room like other regular girls that I have been with. Even some of the celebrated girl friend experience girls I have read about when I have been with them will after some time hint at a room or touch you in a way that indicates are we going to a room or are you just wasting my time? This girl does not do any of that. I suspect if I did not even book her at all duiring a visit to the club that she would still come and sit with me, but I have no had the willpower to test that since I enjoy the sex too much with her. Like I said she ticks so many of my boxes.

Dufey

11-22-12, 07:57

It seems that you don't understand mechanism of sex. I did visit most of main FKKs' as well as mongered world over. And each time I do love the babe as if she is GF unless the babe is too mechanical!

Now what must be happening? Sex act is like a STAR shinning in the sky while other mechanisms like pair bonding, companionship, brain wavelength matching, platonic love etc are PLANETS hanging around produced as a result of evolutionary processes aiding survival!

The sex act weel executed results into most optimum chemical equilibrium in our brain centers while these other mechanisms produce similar effect but not optimum, not upto the mark in comparison. Thus this is heuristically quantifiable argument unless you want exact numbers then we must refer our brains during and after each act to SPECT study by a nurophysician!

Going ahead with my heuristic argument. Now your brain is saying that the the particular PLANET is more intense / brighter that the STAR itself, we all know that it can't be unless there is some kind of filter or distortion in your view path, I. E in your brain paths! [to be contd]It has taken a few reads and re-reads and using Google translate, Google search for some of the acronyms, and a dictionary to understand what you have written. I am still not sure if I really appreciate what you have written and if so I am duly sorry. I know that you are trying to help hence why you have written a number of paragraphs. For this I thank you.

I think what you saying is that the sex acts which we do together is in some way clouding the thinking in that there could potentially be a relationship. I enjoy the sex so much that I think that I want this experience more that I am seeking whatever mechanism whether true or false to think that a relationship could happen whereby these great sexual experiences will continue and hopefully become exclusive to me.

You are probably right.

Then there is the 10% chance that I think I may have where it could be real. No science to that 10% figure. Just a number picked from the air to give me some comfort for my ego that there is something there but also a nice get out if nothing eventuates and I can tell myself that I told you so and you wasted all your time and money. This is why I have to control myself and not spend more than I usually do when I visit a club. Now the difference is instead of spending on 3-4 girls on a visit the budget goes all on her.

I mean she even had her friend explain to me what she was looking for as she sat there. She wanted to get to know me and did not see me as a customer and she says it too to me. No promises. Take it slow and we will see how it goes. She keeps on saying how she likes me in our various communications. It is all confusing. She says she does not want this or that but then she does not seem to stop keeping in contact with me asking after me.

Then again she could be just plain playing me. Many girls in clubs do not have really good regular customers that could book them for 4 to 6 hours plus a number of extras on them each visit. This girl from what I have observed and from what she says has one customer who comes maybe once a month and books her for 2 or 3 hours. Another regular client of hers books her for 1 to 1. 5 hours. Apart from that most clients are picked off the club floor where the standard is 50€ half hour sessions and quite a few one hours. So when you add in what I pay her then she knows that if she keeps me sweet then each time I am in the club she really makes her financial target for the day.

This is why I am confused. She does not push for the room like other regular girls that I have been with. Even some of the celebrated girlfriend experience girls I have read about when I have been with them will after some time hint at a room or touch you in a way that indicates are we going to a room or are you just wasting my time? This girl does not do any of that. I suspect if I did not even book her at all during a visit to the club that she would still come and sit with me, but I have not had the willpower to test that since I enjoy the sex too much with her. Like I said she ticks so many of my boxes.

Dufey

11-22-12, 07:59

It seems that you don't understand mechanism of sex. I did visit most of main FKKs' as well as mongered world over. And each time I do love the babe as if she is GF unless the babe is too mechanical!

Now what must be happening? Sex act is like a STAR shinning in the sky while other mechanisms like pair bonding, companionship, brain wavelength matching, platonic love etc are PLANETS hanging around produced as a result of evolutionary processes aiding survival!

The sex act weel executed results into most optimum chemical equilibrium in our brain centers while these other mechanisms produce similar effect but not optimum, not upto the mark in comparison. Thus this is heuristically quantifiable argument unless you want exact numbers then we must refer our brains during and after each act to SPECT study by a nurophysician!

Going ahead with my heuristic argument. Now your brain is saying that the the particular PLANET is more intense / brighter that the STAR itself, we all know that it can't be unless there is some kind of filter or distortion in your view path, I. E in your brain paths! [to be contd]It has taken a few reads and re-reads and using Google translate, Google search for some of the acronyms, and a dictionary to understand what you have written. I am still not sure if I really appreciate what you have written and if so I am duly sorry. I know that you are trying to help hence why you have written a number of paragraphs. For this I thank you.

I think what you saying is that the sex acts which we do together is in some way clouding the thinking in that there could potentially be a relationship. I enjoy the sex so much that I think that I want this experience more that I am seeking whatever mechanism whether true or false to think that a relationship could happen whereby these great sexual experiences will continue and hopefully become exclusive to me.

You are probably right.

Then there is the 10% chance that I think I may have where it could be real. No science to that 10% figure. Just a number picked from the air to give me some comfort for my ego that there is something there but also a nice get out if nothing eventuates and I can tell myself that I told you so and you wasted all your time and money. This is why I have to control myself and not spend more than I usually do when I visit a club. Now the difference is instead of spending on 3-4 girls on a visit the budget goes all on her.

I mean she even had her friend explain to me what she was looking for as she sat there. She wanted to get to know me and did not see me as a customer and she says it too to me. No promises. Take it slow and we will see how it goes. She keeps on saying how she likes me in our various communications. It is all confusing. She says she does not want this or that but then she does not seem to stop keeping in contact with me asking after me.

Then again she could be just plain playing me. Many girls in clubs do not have really good regular customers that could book them for 4 to 6 hours plus a number of extras on them each visit. This girl from what I have observed and from what she says has one customer who comes maybe once a month and books her for 2 or 3 hours. Another regular client of hers books her for 1 to 1. 5 hours. Apart from that most clients are picked off the club floor where the standard is 50€ half hour sessions and quite a few one hours. So when you add in what I pay her then she knows that if she keeps me sweet then each time I am in the club she really makes her financial target for the day.

This is why I am confused. She does not push for the room like other regular girls that I have been with. Even some of the celebrated girlfriend experience girls I have read about when I have been with them will after some time hint at a room or touch you in a way that indicates are we going to a room or are you just wasting my time? This girl does not do any of that. I suspect if I did not even book her at all during a visit to the club that she would still come and sit with me, but I have not had the willpower to test that since I enjoy the sex too much with her. Like I said she ticks so many of my boxes.

Dufey

11-22-12, 08:22

what i mean about the oase girl, is that it sounds like something i tryed with a girl from oase, long time ago.

about the age thing. i ask you about hers and yours age becours i think it is more easy to handel the age difference if she's 30 and your 44, then it is if she's 20 and your 34.

becours she's in some other place in her life when she's 30 then 20, and i think the chance is better for you if she's 30.

i don't know if i can share anything with you, maybe if it was the same girl.

a wg will sell you any fantasi or dream you have, some will even go on a week holiday with you, and if she is smart and look in to the future she will set the price low, give you free time, becours it is better for her to give you 2 hours in free. 5 hours in room, makeing 500 euros over 7 hours, and have sex 2-3 times, then it is to have 10, 50 euros fuck.

if you want to know how she feel's about you, then try to tell her how you feel about her, and that you like to see her alot more out side the club with out any money or shoping tripps between you and her, and that you like to become a part of her privat life.

if she smiles and says it is a good idee, then good for you. if she says no, well then you really haven lost anything, becours it would never have work anyway.

if you are so lucky that she says it is a good idee, then try to picture this.

1. you sit and kiss, hold hands and her phone rings and she has to go and meet some guy.

2. she goes away for 1, 2 or 3 days a weekend or a holiday with a guy.

ask your self how you would feel about that and if you can handel that. it can be that it is easy to handel in the start, but i bet you, the more time you have with her the harder it will get.hi speedymike,

thank you for your comments.

i take it that you do not wish to share your experience of trying to hook a relationship with an oase girl?

i doubt it is the same girl. there are so many girls and our tastes differ so it us unlikely to be the same girl. i do not know who your girl is to say.

well our ages are 14 years apart, but i think she is on the side of knowing where she is going. she has a generic 2 year plan and that includes taking up another profession that i understand well since i do it too. she is not a teenager.

she has had a traumatic background though. then again most of these girls do. why would they do this job if they did not? many girls in the eastern europe work for 300€ a month at lidl or aldi for example but they do not do this job where you can make 300€ off one client.

i know what you are saying about the giving of free time to keep th client sweet and play acting for all those hours when we were outside the club. these outings were not a couple of hours. they were all day here and overnight.

i have already told her how i feel and she understands, she says she is not ready for that. from what i see these girls will tell a man to not come see them if they say what i say but instead this girl says keep in contact and we will see how it goes as friends. she has told me stories before when i am in a club about other men and some she points that have asked her to be their girl friend. the men say, i am so glad i met you, you are the only girl for me, i really enjoy my time with you, you are the best looking girl in the club. she says to them that she will only see them in the club and some she says she does not want to see them anymore since they make her nervous.

when i read reports on her, the note i see is that she is relatively popular, regularly booked. she does not think so, but i do know from what i see is that she makes more than the average girl in a day when i see her, probably mainly because of my contribution.

regarding the point about how would i feel when she says to me i have to go to work and fuck 10-15 guys. i have not reached that stage. i already in some way experience it now when i am in the club with her as i relax between sessions i see her going off with other men and coming back, hugging or kissing them.

from what she has told me, i am her first client that she has seen privately outside the club but then i have my doubts about that. i do not think she does it regularly if she did since she has a normal life too. i do think she is probably going away on world wide trips with clients doing all sorts of sexual deeds. i tell her of all the countries and places i have been to and she can hardly name 3-4 countries outside of her home country where she has been to. she was probably working in those countries i think.

Dufey

11-22-12, 08:31

She says when she goes with me she comes and we joke about that we both come as many times as the other. She says she treats sex with other men as business. She explains that is providing a service to them where they use her body. She says she thinks of other things when with them and by doing so she does not come. With me she says she frees her mind and wants to come and she is quite vocal about it.

Hi Dufey,

This lady of yours, is she considered to be one of the more popular and sought after girls in the club? Or one of the regular main stream ones who have difficulty in luring men into the rooms?

It's interesting but I have found that my feelings for a girl and conversely her feelings for me depends on her popularity. The more she is desired by other hobbyiest, the stronger are my feelings for her.

Are you allowed to say which club she is at?

HowieI think she is one of the more popular girls in the club. I know when she is in the club she is booked fairly regularly. When I do want a session I have to wait quite a few hours before I can catch her attention to come over to me, sit for a while and then ask her if I can fuck her too. She never seems to have difficulty getting a client.

She has several club girlfriends and when they go circulating around the club together, invariably the other gilr or girls coming back and my girl is missing since she has been booked by a man that they have encountered. I have seen men several times waiting for her outisde the girls locker room waiting for her to shower and groom herself after a previous client. I know since I have stood there too outside the girls locker waiting and seen men jump in before me to book her.

I see what you are saying. The most popular girls are the ones that would have the most male admirers that would "fall in love" with them since they are so skilled in making a man feel that they are acting like a girl friend in the room with them. When you see less popular girls putting it on you, it is not the same as the exclusive girl that is hard to book and she is the one that you have to run after to get a session since she is always busy.

I do not feel comfortable to reveal which club that she works at. Things that she has said make me reluctant. To allay fears, no, I do not think she reads these forums.

Optimist

11-22-12, 15:39

take care! remember as nick the g implies, to see it all from her point of view and not to mould her actions into what you desire them to mean.

for a girl in a club it is really nice to have a guy she can relax with, comment about other mongers, and fantasise with. this is really very common. in my years at world it was very rarely that i did not have a girl who was happy to spend down time with me, charge me less than the going rate, etc etc. the long term meaning of this is another matter.

of course i cannot say anything specific about your case as i do not know her or you. maybe speedy mike has the right idea. ask to see her outside the club, no money (and probably also no sex as for her sex is probably at this time too bound up with the job and its emotional consequences). then see how she reacts. my guess is that if she really feels deeply for her, she will find this difficult to agree to. if she doesn't care for you she will say no.

don't fantasise about the longterm. just see how you get on with her. and look at yourself: you talk about trying to get over what she does for a living. this seems to indicate a serious issue for you. why are you judging her for being exactly what you were looking for? as speedy says in effect - what exactly do you want from this girl?

i hope all goes well. i have a favourite ( i cannot say much as some members know who she is) but like speedy says - without the top rate money i give her things would i am sure be different

Meeps77

11-22-12, 16:47

Indi Companion

11-22-12, 21:16

[=optimist; 1351978]take care! remember as nick the g implies, to see it all from her point of view and not to mould her actions into what you desire them to mean.[/quote]this is the greatest truth about how we guys see the girls and sadly this is also because sometimes it happens that we get angry and feel tricked by the girls once we understand it was business and not love. we simply forgot that there is also an other point of view, not only ours.

[=optimist; 1351978]for a girl in a club it is really nice to have a guy she can relax with, comment about other mongers, and fantasise with. this is really very common. in my years at world it was very rarely that i did not have a girl who was happy to spend down time with me, charge me less than the going rate, etc etc. the long term meaning of this is another matter.

of course i cannot say anything specific about your case as i do not know her or you. maybe speedy mike has the right idea. ask to see her outside the club, no money (and probably also no sex as for her sex is probably at this time too bound up with the job and its emotional consequences). then see how she reacts. my guess is that if she really feels deeply for her, she will find this difficult to agree to. if she doesn't care for you she will say no.[/quote][=optimist; 1351978]this is the most difficult part sometimes. we know the girls are doing this job for money and as far as i understand for dufey it is like for me. we are there over the weekend, which means the most profitable time of the week for a wg. it is hard to think to push them and insist because they see you outside the club for free when they can make their best money. ten of course you could point out that this is what would prove they really like us. but then money is what the girls are focused on. it would like to ask them to experience such hard psychological situation of being a prostitute but for free.

[=optimist; 1351978]don't fantasise about the longterm. just see how you get on with her. and look at yourself: you talk about trying to get over what she does for a living. this seems to indicate a serious issue for you. why are you judging her for being exactly what you were looking for? as speedy says in effect. what exactly do you want from this girl?

i hope all goes well. i have a favourite (i cannot say much as some members know who she is) but like speedy says. without the top rate money i give her things would i am sure be different[/quote]this is true, we should never forget that this is a game with two players.

i am going myself to corner very soon my current favourite in order to clarify were we are standing, and this is already making me feel guilty because. thinking in a realistic way and about the realistic outcome of it. i know she is going most likely to loose her best client. and she will be in need of money, doing such life. call me crazy and laugh about it but sometimes feelings appear on the scene, even in the life of a monger.

All For Bb

11-22-12, 22:49

excellent viewpoints! fully agree. let me share my story for duffy to think about relationship with wg:

i am over 60, i rented a club girl for about one year (not in europe) , she is 21 then. we seperated, because of many reasons, one reason was i was no longer interested with her after fk her for one year. i have fk over 2500 wg, all over the world, over 20 years, most of them fkk girls in germany, i feel these club girls all over the world are all for money. if duffy wants a girl friend, he should look for nomal girl. i have had a young 25 years old girl friend, a very nomal, none wg and good looking young girl, with whom i can fk without protection, and drink her love fluid. i am 35 years older then her. generally, no money involved. i still married, no intension to divoce, because of financial consideration and kids. i think best life for a man, particully aged man like me, is have a family as the harbor you can call the home, one or two nomal young mistress that you can fk for no raincoat and confortably lick and drink her / their love fluid, and at the same time, visit fkk etc all over the world and fk these young chicks as more as possible, you would reach the objective for a man and very happy. usually at my age, money is not a problem, but energy and time, then, use some blue pill. my opinion, these club / wg you should play and enjoy only, not trust, no love. you can trust nomal girl only as girl friends / mistress.

what i mean about the oase girl, is that it sounds like something i tryed with a girl from oase, long time ago.

about the age thing. i ask you about hers and yours age becours i think it is more easy to handel the age difference if she's 30 and your 44, then it is if she's 20 and your 34.

becours she's in some other place in her life when she's 30 then 20, and i think the chance is better for you if she's 30.

i don't know if i can share anything with you, maybe if it was the same girl.

a wg will sell you any fantasi or dream you have, some will even go on a week holiday with you, and if she is smart and look in to the future she will set the price low, give you free time, becours it is better for her to give you 2 hours in free. 5 hours in room, makeing 500 euros over 7 hours, and have sex 2-3 times, then it is to have 10, 50 euros fuck.

if you want to know how she feel's about you, then try to tell her how you feel about her, and that you like to see her alot more out side the club with out any money or shoping tripps between you and her, and that you like to become a part of her privat life.

if she smiles and says it is a good idee, then good for you. if she says no, well then you really haven lost anything, becours it would never have work anyway.

if you are so lucky that she says it is a good idee, then try to picture this.

1. you sit and kiss, hold hands and her phone rings and she has to go and meet some guy.

2. she goes away for 1, 2 or 3 days a weekend or a holiday with a guy.

ask your self how you would feel about that and if you can handel that. it can be that it is easy to handel in the start, but i bet you, the more time you have with her the harder it will get.

Nick The G

11-22-12, 23:38

My opinion, these club / wg you should play and enjoy only, not trust, no love. You can trust nomal girl only as girl friends / mistress.As long as you have no trust in yourself and no love to give, why are you looking for trustworthy others? No need to blame it on somebody else.

I think best life for a man, particully aged man like me, is have a family as the harbor you can call the home, one or two normal young mistress that you can fk for no raincoat and confortably lick and drink her / their love fluid, and at the same time, visit fkk etc all over the world and fk these young chicks as many as possible, you would reach the objective for a man and very happy.With an almost dried-out state of mind, that tries to regain the waters of life via licking young pussies in large quantities, isn't it possible one could start to dream of young men that one can fuck in the ass too? I find that with advanced age, one really has to consider that the ancient greeks and romans were wise men! Big Grin!

Neurosynth

11-23-12, 00:49

As long as you have no trust in yourself and no love to give, why are you looking for trustworthy others? No need to blame it on somebody else.

With an almost dried-out state of mind, that tries to regain the waters of life via licking young pussies in large quantities, isn't it possible one could start to dream of young men that one can fuck in the ass too? I find that with advanced age, one really has to consider that the ancient greeks and romans were wise men! Big Grin!I don't know "All for Bb" or you, but damn that sounds harsh. How could you possibly know about him what you assume in these insults. The "Big Grin" is perhaps supposed to let us know you are just joking, but to me it sounds like an attempt to duck responsibility for unwarranted antagonism. Such commentary adds nothing of value and could well repel those with something useful to say.

Dufey

11-23-12, 01:50

take care! remember as nick the g implies, to see it all from her point of view and not to mould her actions into what you desire them to mean.oh right, i did not get what nick the g wrote. to me it was quite confusing what nick the g writes. it was not plain language for me.

so he meant to say simply to see it from the girl's perspective. would you want a customer coming to the club and wanting to a relationship? i guess not since her job is to fuck men for their money. it begs the question why she asks when i come next and confirm when i come next and she confirms if she will be there or not. i know it is good business practice to let customers know when their sex practitioner is working so i should not see anything in this than from all the other girls who i have a phone number or email that writes me their work schedule or who i can ring or sms or email to ask if they work.

for a girl in a club it is really nice to have a guy she can relax with, comment about other mongers, and fantasise with. this is really very common. in my years at world it was very rarely that i did not have a girl who was happy to spend down time with me, charge me less than the going rate, etc etc. the long term meaning of this is another matter.yes, quite right. this has happened many times for me too. it is just that this one feels different and not like any of the others. all others were really business like still regardless of the social time given free of charge and the intimate displays and the keeping in touch by phone, sms, instant messenger, email, and so forth.

it can at times be a chore keeping all these club relationships going.

i think i have really fallen for this particular girl and the thing is she knows it but she has not run away or told me to go away. she has told me of guys who have asked her out before or tried to persuade her to date them and she has refused. if anything she wants me to keep in touch but on her terms. she said take it slowly, start from a friendship and we will see what happens.

maybe all she is doing is keeping me on the hook since i do spend a decent amount of money on her.

of course i cannot say anything specific about your case as i do not know her or you. maybe speedy mike has the right idea. ask to see her outside the club, no money (and probably also no sex as for her sex is probably at this time too bound up with the job and its emotional consequences). then see how she reacts. my guess is that if she really feels deeply for her, she will find this difficult to agree to. if she doesn't care for you she will say no.i have seen her three days outside the club. two days were paid, which at the end she declared she could not charge me anymore for outside club in her heart. so when we had the third day it was unpaid. so i have seen her reaction to going out for no money and it is not a negative. if anything she talks a lot of about the things we can do together outside the club. all of these are for no money which she has made clear since we are friends. i am not going to push her for more since we are going at her pace but there are some dates planned. we will see if they happen at all.

don't fantasise about the longterm. just see how you get on with her. and look at yourself: you talk about trying to get over what she does for a living. this seems to indicate a serious issue for you. why are you judging her for being exactly what you were looking for? as speedy says in effect - what exactly do you want from this girl?you are correct.

i do fantasize a fair bit about what it would be like to be with her. it actual distracts from my normal life and i think this is bad that i like her more than she probably likes me.

on the contrary, her job is not a serious issue for me. what meeps77 wrote made me realise that. i have no idea why you think i am judging her. do you think i am judging her? why do you think i am seeking a relationship then say i am judging her? i am no better than she is. i think i am open minded enough to accept her job, nonetheless, it naturla to feel some jelousey when i see her go with other men.

i am fairly comfortable that she continue in this job until she reaches her goals. i just see the pain she feels from consequences of doing the job. i just want to know from her if there is a future for us after she finishes this job. it is early days yet before we even get there.

i hope all goes well. i have a favourite ( i cannot say much as some members know who she is) but like speedy says - without the top rate money i give her things would i am sure be differentthank you for the well wishes. i hope it goes well too.

i wish you luck with your favourite girl.

Dufey

11-23-12, 01:53

Excellent viewpoints! Fully agree. Let me share my story for Duffy to think about relationship with WG:

I am over 60, I rented a club girl for about one year (not in europe) , she is 21 then. We seperated, because of many reasons, one reason was I was no longer interested with her after fk her for one year. I have fk over 2500 wg, all over the world, over 20 years, most of them FKK girls in Germany, I feel these club girls all over the world are all for money. If Duffy wants a girl friend, he should look for nomal girl. I have had a young 25 years old girl friend, a very nomal, none wg and good looking young girl, with whom I can fk without protection, and drink her love fluid. I am 35 years older then her. Generally, no money involved. I still married, no intension to divoce, because of financial consideration and kids. I think best life for a man, particully aged man like me, is have a family as the harbor you can call the home, one or two nomal young mistress that you can fk for no raincoat and confortably lick and drink her / their love fluid, and at the same time, visit fkk etc all over the world and fk these young chicks as more as possible, you would reach the objective for a man and very happy. Usually at my age, money is not a problem, but energy and time, then, use some blue pill. My opinion, these club / wg you should play and enjoy only, not trust, no love. You can trust nomal girl only as girl friends / mistress.Hi All for BB,

I see your point. Your way was how I saw the hobby that we do. Get all the sex I wanted without the strings. The thing that I could not control is human fraility. I have fallen for a club girl.

I agree a normal girl would not have so many complications. I guess we always find the hard questions to answer instead of the easy ones.

Thank you for contributing and adding to the discussion.

Dufey

11-23-12, 02:47

Good post, I feel the same way about these points you makeI guess I am going to find out. I have invested 2 and a half months into this. I guess I will see where it goes.

There will become a point where if it goes no further than where we are now then I guess I just move on. I hope I do not have to move on.

Meeps77

11-23-12, 07:01

I guess I am going to find out. I have invested 2 and a half months into this. I guess I will see where it goes.

There will become a point where if it goes no further than where we are now then I guess I just move on. I hope I do not have to move on.I sincerely wish you luck, just be careful. Weve all been burned by a girl at one time (like my cheating x girlfriend!) and it really sucks.

In finance we refer to the concept of "sunk cost" when evaluating whether or not to proceed with continuing investment in a project. The mentality is often "we have spent X million dollars which will be wasted if we cut the program." Finance theory says the x million (or 2. 5 months) is sunk and cannot be recovered; therefore it should be ignored when making decisions on future investments. If new information suggests FUTURE forecasts to be poor, then continuing the project will be chasing good money (or time) after bad. I'm not saying you have this bad forecast already, but I'd be prepared to cut bait if some of these points other have made become apparent. If you rationalize all her behavior to fit your theory (as someone else suggested) you'll keep chasing time and money into this ; with a net increase in your EMOTIONAL investment which is worse to lose than money sometimes

Indi Companion

11-23-12, 12:05

Optimist

11-23-12, 13:02

All For Bb

11-24-12, 19:42

SpeedyMike

11-25-12, 02:48

hi speedymike,

thank you for your comments.

i take it that you do not wish to share your experience of trying to hook a relationship with an oase girl?i can share my experience with you, but to do that we would have to meet in a club one day, and not on an open forum.

i doubt it is the same girl. there are so many girls and our tastes differ so it us unlikely to be the same girl. i do not know who your girl is to say.there is always a chance it could be the same girl, many of the things you say she says is the same things, but then again many of them also says that they need money for the dog, mom, dad, house, car and so on.

maybe it is some of the first things they learn to say on the wg school.

well our ages are 14 years apart, but i think she is on the side of knowing where she is going. she has a generic 2 year plan and that includes taking up another profession that i understand well since i do it too. she is not a teenager.they all have a plan when they start doing this job, the problem is just that, the longer they stay in it, the harder it is to stop becours they get use to all the money and the sweet life that comes with it.

i know what you are saying about the giving of free time to keep th client sweet and play acting for all those hours when we were outside the club. these outings were not a couple of hours. they were all day here and overnight.and those days / nights where all with out any money and any shoping trips?

regarding the point about how would i feel when she says to me i have to go to work and fuck 10-15 guys. i have not reached that stage. i already in some way experience it now when i am in the club with her as i relax between sessions i see her going off with other men and coming back, hugging or kissing them.to see her in the club when she goes to a room with some guy for 30 min or 1, 2 or hours, is the easy part.

what i mean you should try to picture is sitting with her at home when she gets a phone call and go to sleep in some other mans home in he's bed and arms, or stay a hole weekend there. try to picture that and tell me what kind of thinking there goes on in your heard.

SpeedyMike

11-25-12, 02:53

Dufey

11-29-12, 07:18

I sincerely wish you luck, just be careful. Weve all been burned by a girl at one time (like my cheating x girlfriend!) and it really sucks.

In finance we refer to the concept of "sunk cost" when evaluating whether or not to proceed with continuing investment in a project. The mentality is often "we have spent X million dollars which will be wasted if we cut the program." Finance theory says the x million (or 2. 5 months) is sunk and cannot be recovered; therefore it should be ignored when making decisions on future investments. If new information suggests FUTURE forecasts to be poor, then continuing the project will be chasing good money (or time) after bad. I'm not saying you have this bad forecast already, but I'd be prepared to cut bait if some of these points other have made become apparent. If you rationalize all her behavior to fit your theory (as someone else suggested) you'll keep chasing time and money into this; with a net increase in your EMOTIONAL investment which is worse to lose than money sometimesI thank you for your well wishes. I am grateful.

I know I have been cheated by girls before and it has cost in terms of emotions and in terms of monetary value. So I have been there before. I feel your pain too.

My 12th visit with my club girl did not happen since she was unwell. She has kept intermittent contact since then by email though and says she is happy to see me when she is back. She also says thank you to me for staying with her. We shall see what happens.

I understand you regarding your sunk cost concept from finance.

I am spending both money and time into this girl. If nothing concrete is generated then why expend that money and time in "investing" in this girl to see if she becomes interested. She has already said she is not interested in a relationship but then says she does not want me to go away either, but for me to stay as a "friend" who comes to see her in the club and fuck her for money. Which is the same as saying she is creating a regular customer. Maybe she is playing me for a fool. And this is where all the doubt is coming from. The contact we have by email and so forth showing her interest but then the distance she keeps with acting like a normal relationship. Also the loud and clear message that the boyfriend situation is off the cards but we will see where there is a slight sliver of hope that she dangles in front of me. I think I would rather prefer she say to me what she says she tells other customers that have come onto her and say she has a boyfriend and that she will only see them in the club. When I think about it she has done the same for me in effect.

So going back to the sunk cost concept. There will be a stage when I have sunk so much money and time trying to see if something develops and then I tire and lose interest and decide to write off that money and time and go off to do something else. I think I may be angry but probably more angry with myself for letting me do this. My only consolation is to spend no more than I would in the clubs anyway on her so it does not feel like I try to buy her.

This adventure and it is an adventure will take some time. I have now come up to 3 months now so maybe another 3-4 months.

Right now I am unsure I have the patience to last the distance. But I found I really like this girl.

Dufey

11-29-12, 07:42

Right and realistic words Meeps77, we should all keep them in mind. I am in a very similar situation as Dufey describes and I am trying my best for realistically face this situation. In other words, I try to plan for the best preparing for the worst but it is very hard sometimes. I know inside myself that if and when the s* will hit the fan it will be very hard for me.I know where you are coming from.

I am keeping Meeps77's words in mind but I know I need to make that investment to see what may come from this. I know the odds are against me especially as she has said she is not interested in a boyfriend but then I have no idea why she sits with me for social time and also plans doing things outside the club as friends (no fucking but kissing okay). Only one of these dates has happened which is the one date I referenced earlier. Another date is in the diary. We will see if it happens.

The biggest problem is containing myself to stay the course rather than give up before I get the negative or positive. I know some of you reading this will say you have the clear negative already with her saying she is not interested in a relationship and I am just being bovine. I am probably wasting my money and time here. Just right now, and this is probably what Nick the G is saying and Optimist is saying about trying not to read too much into it.

Problem is I cannot make myself do I.

This means I will keep doing it and then I realise it is all wrong and then I fall really hard as you say Indi Companion. This is my fear.

Dufey

11-29-12, 07:46

Dufey. Just wanted to wish you good luck. One small optimistic point - I can see no reason why a girl from a club should not be as good as any "normal" girl. In fact their experience, if they have handled it right, should be an assetThank you for your well wishes. They are welcome.

I also think the same way as you. A club girl is in the end still a girl and will have needs and aspirations like anyone else. Her club experience as you say is the bonus. This girl for me hits so many of my buttons in the room and when we are together that I really want to give it a try to see if I can turn her around. She says she will let the fates decide if she hooks up with me but for now she says she wants to get to know me as a friend first but that means seeing her in the club which I know is business and trying to see her more outside the club when she does not have her business mindset on. Then I am doomed if I can only see her in the club.

I can see myself becoming an urban legend of a sad man going the club chasing a girl and spending all my money on them. I do not want that and this is why I am afraid of what I am letting myself get into. I just have to make sure I do not spend no more than I would on a normal club visit for me.

Dufey

11-29-12, 08:09

i can share my experience with you, but to do that we would have to meet in a club one day, and not on an open forum.

there is always a chance it could be the same girl, many of the things you say she says is the same things, but then again many of them also says that they need money for the dog, mom, dad, house, car and so on.

maybe it is some of the first things they learn to say on the wg school.

they all have a plan when they start doing this job, the problem is just that, the longer they stay in it, the harder it is to stop becours they get use to all the money and the sweet life that comes with it.

and those days / nights where all with out any money and any shoping trips?

to see her in the club when she goes to a room with some guy for 30 min or 1, 2 or hours, is the easy part.

what i mean you should try to picture is sitting with her at home when she gets a phone call and go to sleep in some other mans home in he's bed and arms, or stay a hole weekend there. try to picture that and tell me what kind of thinking there goes on in your heard.i do not mind meeting you in a club to swap notes. that would be good. thank you for the offer. when are you around and what place? i am mobile so i can get to most places?

i think what i am doing seems to common. the responses i am getting on this thread seem to have bought out some others with similar experiences so if you are seeing a pattern close to yours then do not feel alone and do not think its the same girl. my girl seems to want this money for her future including a home purchase.

it is a common saying for the girls to say why they do this job. i mean why else do they do it for if it was not for some financial goal which can be achieved in a far quicker time than working at a normal job. so maybe they did learn this in wg school when the experienced girls tell the new girls what to say to the men.

yes, the easy money is the lure. why work at a low paying job in a menial job earning in a month what they can earn in a day working in a club? they like the things that the money can buy.

i have only had 2 days that were paid and the rate was good for what i got. i only paid her what i agreed to pay her and she let me choose the rate as she was actually loathe to ask for a rate. she said she had never seen anyone outside the club before me as an escort. on the third "date" outside the club was for free. no shopping trips. we hung out as two normal people would but the nice thing was lying in bed together and kissing. in fact we have never been to any shops except for resturants for meals and once again modest ones. she even refused a present i bought her since she felt it was too much from a friend. i took it back to the shop for a refund. i am looking forward to the next "date" i have with her but as i said before my time is tight with season we have now and so is her time with her homelife from what she says so i am thinking we may hit an enforced hiatus as christmas comes. i tend to think these homelife things are real since her club girl friends confirm them when i have conversations with them. like i said, her club girlfriends seem to know my girl has a thing for me. i think. if not then it is one big cover up and a great deal of collusion for what i have spent.

from what i know she only ever works in the club and she says that i was her only customer she has seen outside the club but then like you i am skeptical of that claim given some things i heard. regardless, i do not think she will be getting phone calls to go sleep with men in hotels or in their homes if she keeps to her pattern of working in the club. i mean it is her job and this is how i met her so i have to accept that is what she wants to do. i have thought through that situation already. i do not like it but i have to accept it. let say it does work out. if she is staying with me for no money but is paid to go with other men then she is differentiating me in her own way.

Nick The G

11-29-12, 23:57

She says she will let the fates decide if she hooks up with me but for now she says she wants to get to know me as a friend first but that means seeing her in the club which I know is business and trying to see her more outside the club when she does not have her business mindset on. Then I am doomed if I can only see her in the club.He says he will let the fates decide if he hooks up with me but for now he says he wants to get to know me as a friend first but that means seeing me outside the club which I know will not be business. And trying to see me more outside the club when he does not have his guaranteed-sex-for-money mindset on.

Let fate decide: the best way to avoid decisions and to avoid responsibility for ones life. But it sounds so overwhelmingly good!

Neurosynth

11-30-12, 01:54

She has already said she is not interested in a relationship but then says she does not want me to go away either, but for me to stay as a "friend" who comes to see her in the club and fuck her for money. Which is the same as saying she is creating a regular customer.It sounds to me like you already know everything there is to know. If you want to risk heartbreak, then risk it with someone who may want more than friendship and doesn't expect to be paid. This isn't rocket science.

SpeedyMike

11-30-12, 02:29

My 12th visit with my club girl did not happen since she was unwell. She has kept intermittent contact since then by email though and says she is happy to see me when she is back. She also says thank you to me for staying with her. We shall see what happens.Sorry to hear that she got unwell. You should have meet her on Thursday or Friday last week?

I am spending both money and time into this girl. If nothing concrete is generated then why expend that money and time in "investing" in this girl to see if she becomes interested. She has already said she is not interested in a relationship but then says she does not want me to go away either, but for me to stay as a "friend" who comes to see her in the club and fuck her for money. Which is the same as saying she is creating a regular customer. Maybe she is playing me for a fool. And this is where all the doubt is coming from. The contact we have by email and so forth showing her interest but then the distance she keeps with acting like a normal relationship. Also the loud and clear message that the boyfriend situation is off the cards but we will see where there is a slight sliver of hope that she dangles in front of me. I think I would rather prefer she say to me what she says she tells other customers that have come onto her and say she has a boyfriend and that she will only see them in the club. When I think about it she has done the same for me in effect.A "friend" that comes in the club and fuck her for money. Hmmm how dos that sound to you?

You should not see her at her work, that is not a place for you to be if she want something serius with you.

So going back to the sunk cost concept. There will be a stage when I have sunk so much money and time trying to see if something develops and then I tire and lose interest and decide to write off that money and time and go off to do something else. I think I may be angry but probably more angry with myself for letting me do this. My only consolation is to spend no more than I would in the clubs anyway on her so it does not feel like I try to buy her.Fuck the money, it is just money and you can always make some new ones, it is your time and emotional investment that means something.

This adventure and it is an adventure will take some time. I have now come up to 3 months now so maybe another 3-4 months.

Right now I am unsure I have the patience to last the distance. But I found I really like this girl.You can not make her feel something for you no matter how long time you are going to use on her, and she can not make her hart feel something for you, if it is there then it is there.

After 3 months she will already know what she feels, just take a look at you self and see how fast you knew it.

There is just one thing we should keep in mind. A WG deals with cheating husbands and boyfriends every day, and they get so many promise from guys where 90% of them don't come true.

So they have a very low trust on guys, and the same it is with guys and the trust in the WG. How can you trust a girl that can say anything to a guy he want to hear as long as he has some euros in he's hands.

But then again. If you are afraid of love you are afraid of life and that means that you are already half dead.

Indi Companion

11-30-12, 11:12

Meeps77

12-01-12, 06:36

Neurosynth

12-01-12, 06:57

.

My question is this. Have any of you used Viagra recreationally (with no ED)? What are the benefits / issues you've experienced?Viagra works by controlling the blood flow that makes the penis erect. It does not increase desire or stimulation, although the availability of a strong erection "on demand" may contribute to the kind of confidence that makes for good sex. It's widely used recreationally and works well.

But for weekend hobbying you might want to try Cialis. Viagra has a short half life and you may have to time when you take it. 6 hours later you may need to redose. Cialis is effective for 36 to 48 hours, even longer for some. Take one Friday afternoon and you are good to go through Saturday night.

Syzygies

12-01-12, 12:18

Thank you for your well wishes. They are welcome.

I also think the same way as you. A club girl is in the end still a girl and will have needs and aspirations like anyone else. Her club experience as you say is the bonus. This girl for me hits so many of my buttons in the room and when we are together that I really want to give it a try to see if I can turn her around. She says she will let the fates decide if she hooks up with me but for now she says she wants to get to know me as a friend first but that means seeing her in the club which I know is business and trying to see her more outside the club when she does not have her business mindset on. Then I am doomed if I can only see her in the club.

I can see myself becoming an urban legend of a sad man going the club chasing a girl and spending all my money on them. I do not want that and this is why I am afraid of what I am letting myself get into. I just have to make sure I do not spend no more than I would on a normal club visit for me.Dufey,

Girls that work FKK are better off with no boyfriend, however sometimes they suffer from the lack of having a guy in a warm and loving relationship, and want someone there who really cares. However sex can be a thing that doesn't ineterest them much, getting far too much of that, unless you are able to make her enjoy it much more than normal.

However, the girl needs to be spending time with you for free. I have experienced that, and I was required to stop seeing any other girls at the FKK. Actually I was the girl's 2nd BF as she claimed her primary BF was not warm and loving and did not fuck her (she eventually left him completely and left the FKK). Also she needs to be providing adequate levels of sex, and be wanting it. No guy wants a platonic relationship with a girl who fucks lots of others, unless she like a sister to you. If she is trying to test you out to see if you like her on days with no sex, its a dangerous game, but okay if you are enjoying the time and not paying her for it.

In the end, she needs to be a girl that is causing you to save significant money over what you would have spent in the FKK, and also for you to be having a good time so that you feel your time is not wasted, whether the realtionship has a long term future or not.

Really when you say she doesn't want a boyfriend but are lying in bed kissing etc, this obviously means a casual relationship with no strings and with the concept that should not be jealous of what she does with other guys.

Indi Companion

12-01-12, 16:36

Thank you for your well wishes. They are welcome.

I can see myself becoming an urban legend of a sad man going the club chasing a girl and spending all my money on them. I do not want that and this is why I am afraid of what I am letting myself get into. I just have to make sure I do not spend no more than I would on a normal club visit for me.Don't worry, there are many urban legends there out (I am one by myself) who can make you good company without feeling any shame. There is a club where the girls come to me to inform me if my girl has arrived or ask me when she does arrive. In this club no girl approaches me with the hope to get sex from me, I can sit for 10 hours and none of the girls around will ever come to me, with a few exception of the friends of my girl who would get to me to say hello, or to have a chat and a smoke when they want to rest. So more urban legend than that is hard, think about it and you will not feel alone in this kind of situation! LOL!

Smoky Jack

12-01-12, 20:07

I fortunately don't have any issues since I'm still fairly young. But when I go on fkk trips I like to partake as much as possible. This normally starts off in the 5-8 sessions / day range in each of the first two days, then drops to 3-5 in the next two and down from there. Often by the 4th or 5th day I'm exhausted, but since I'm never exactly sure when I'll be back in make the most out of it. If I lived in Germany this wouldn't be an issue, but for now that's not the case.

My question is this. Have any of you used Viagra recreationally (with no ED)? What are the benefits / issues you've experienced?

MI have used Cialis for mongering trips. It is very helpful to be able to keep your erection going after 3-4 sessions. It does not give you more sensation or make you cum more. If anything, there are reports that they may inhibit ejaculation (which could be good for some, bad for others). You should try it and see. I have never needed it for civvie sex, but I am not usually fucking 4-5 girls in my civvie life!

Meeps77

12-01-12, 20:22

I have used Cialis for mongering trips. It is very helpful to be able to keep your erection going after 3-4 sessions. It does not give you more sensation or make you cum more. If anything, there are reports that they may inhibit ejaculation (which could be good for some, bad for others). You should try it and see. I have never needed it for civvie sex, but I am not usually fucking 4-5 girls in my civvie life!Thanks Indy and smoky. You answered my next question about extra cum and sensation. Next question is where can I get some whilst in Germany? I could go to my local doctor in my own country I suppose but I'd rather not

Indi Companion

12-01-12, 20:30

Thanks Indy and smoky. You answered my next question about extra cum and sensation. Next question is where can I get some whilst in Germany? I could go to my local doctor in my own country I suppose but I'd rather notUnfortunately in Germany you cannot by it without a prescription from a doctor. Solutions could be to buy it online and have it delivered to your hotel, there are sites that grant you fast deliveries or sometimes also the girls in the clubs have it and can sell to you, but this is not very common, you may have to ask 10 girls to find one who has it.

Best solution still is buying it online and have it delivered somewhere either your hotel in Germany if you take long trips or somewhere else in your home country.

Hessen Bub

12-01-12, 20:38

Breadman

12-01-12, 21:49

I fortunately don't have any issues since I'm still fairly young.

My question is this. Have any of you used Viagra recreationally (with no ED)? What are the benefits / issues you've experienced?

MAge isn't the issue with deciding to use Viagra or go without, all those hot naked women make it pretty easy to go without using V. What's the benefit of using V at a club? Say your driving down the autobahn and this hot blonde in a convertible waves at you as she flies past. V is the turbo under your hood in case she starts to get away. You don't always need it but its nice to have it handy.

You need a prescription.

HB

Depends on which country and if your willing to buy generics. I get mail order from India mailed to the US.

Hessen Bub

12-01-12, 21:59

Depends on which country and if your willing to buy generics. I get mail order from India mailed to the US.I was talking about Germany. Sure you can mail order from various sources and countries.

HB

Syzygies

12-02-12, 02:23

Unfortunately in Germany you cannot by it without a prescription from a doctor. Solutions could be to buy it online and have it delivered to your hotel, there are sites that grant you fast deliveries or sometimes also the girls in the clubs have it and can sell to you, but this is not very common, you may have to ask 10 girls to find one who has it.

Best solution still is buying it online and have it delivered somewhere either your hotel in Germany if you take long trips or somewhere else in your home country.Buy online and delivery to Germany is not legal, and you could be up for a big fine. For me there is no issue as I pass through Thailand several times a year and can pick up many "prescription only" type stuff and also cheap copies / generics.

BTW, although Viagra / Kamagra has a much shorter half life (time to 50% effective) than Cialis / Apcalis, it is rather stronger and starts working faster. For me 100 mg is far too powerful and I would only dose with small fragments, when deciding to use. With girfriend, I do not use, as she would surely notice how come my dick got so hard so instantly, and also how come it stayed hard so long during the DATY. Girls do notice anything different. Be careful! With a Viagra small dose, you could be just looking at a girl in the lounge showing her ass rather sexily and get a hard on immediately. First time I got hard on just thinking about going to see the girl. Overdose with whole 100mg, and could have a beetroot face, and raging headache. Meanwhile, having tried Cialis, I don't notice much difference from normal erection strength and duration or maybe a slight difference.

Its quite comon for mongers at FKK to take multiple small doses throughout the day. With Viagra, even all the very old fat customers who look to be 70 to 80 can still fuck girls with good hard-ons.

Its useful to have the "turbo charge" particularly when trying a new girl at FKK who may prove to be less than ideal in the room. If a girl was hopeless or had stiff legs (dick scared) , or took an eternity to unskillfully apply a very tight condom, then apply very painful BBBJ, I would normally have lost the erection and sometimes been unable to fuck her. With a turbo charge I have still been able to get it off with catastrophic girls. With your favourite super sexy girls, it won't be necessary as they are an automatic turn on from the first tongue kiss. Its possible to keep fucking for a very long time with a "turbo-charge" too, but girls don't usually like guys to marathon fuck them.

CL2009

12-02-12, 03:03

Neurosynth

12-02-12, 03:51

The best thing to do is to experiment and see what works best for you. There are variations from individual to individual. However, I've not heard of clinical findings that Viagra is stronger than Cialis, just that it doesn't last as long. The fact that with Viagra your response will vary from hour to hour might make it seem like it's stronger because the rate of change is more noticeable. In both cases it will take 1/2 hour to kick in so figure that in.

And by the way, going to your everyday doctor and asking for a prescription really should not be a problem. They hear such requests *all the time* Just tell him / her that you've been worrying about work (who doesn't?) and that anxiety sometimes seems to have an effect in bed. Your doctor can probably give you samples of both, and then a prescription for whatever works best. And if you have good insurance, it may cover some of the drug cost and it will be *much* less expensive than the mail order kind.

Better living through chemistry!

Breadman

12-02-12, 07:05

Best solution still is buying it online and have it delivered somewhere either your hotel in Germany if you take long trips or somewhere else in your home country.When you buy it online it might take a few weeks to get to the address you write down. You might complicate a trip by having a restricted product delivered to your hotel, it might make it way too early or way too late. Or the authorities would like to speak to you as to why your having a prescription medication delivered to an address in Germany without a prescription.

Buy it online, have it shipped to your house. It won't be dropped off because 'you' and only you have to sign for it at the post office. Then you bring the girlfriend home a nice necklace and tell her you mail ordered it for her, hence the post office run.

Breadman

12-02-12, 07:14

. And if you have good insurance, it may cover some of the drug cost and it will be *much* less expensive than the mail order kind.The stuff I get runs me around $1. 20 per 100mg's. I use 1/4 pieces throughout the day when at the clubs, I'll try to take a piece an hour before going on the hunt. I know many guys who's insurance covers all but 15 bucks a pill. A buck is much better than 15 anyday. Be warned though, many websites out there are based in russia and China, you won't know what your getting. There are several reports of Chinese companies using drywall material and coloring it blue to make a quick buck. Some of the stuff will give you headache's like there's no tomorrow. What good is that if you can't enjoy the girl? The stuff I get is from a major pharmaceutical manufacturer in India. And no, I'm not advertising what companies I've found that sell this product.

Dufey

12-02-12, 08:12

He says he will let the fates decide if he hooks up with me but for now he says he wants to get to know me as a friend first but that means seeing me outside the club which I know will not be business. And trying to see me more outside the club when he does not have his guaranteed-sex-for-money mindset on.

Let fate decide: the best way to avoid decisions and to avoid responsibility for ones life. But it sounds so overwhelmingly good!Our aborted 12th visit together was consummated recently. She was pleased to see me in the club. We had several hours in the room. She took just 3 clients including me and made her money.

She had rung me to say we were going to go to a party or go for a drink when she finished so I waited patiently not knowing what would happen as the scheduled shift finished and she continued to work.

Then she says lets go. We leave to go out for a drink in a bar.

She actually said mirroring your words what you wrote me.

She say I come to club for fun and she comes to club for work. Think about it.

We sat in the bar for chatting knowing each other more ages and then said she had to leave. Snow was everywhere and she had hours to drive. I let her go and we had made dates for future and she came up with more opportunities to meet uP with her club girlfriends who all know us as a pair it seems.

It is hard seeing her work on the club spending social time with other customers and doing public affection but she tells me this is her job. I know in the room it does feel she fucks me as if I am not a customer as there are some services she does which I know are difficult to get.

She says we do more of these "dates" to know each other. Funny enough intimatcy past the odd kiss and hug was it

Neurosynth

12-02-12, 09:42

I guess I'm lucky, my cost is about $3 per 100 mg. Knowing it is from the original company and the convenience and safety of the local pharmacy is worth any marginal difference to me.

Syzygies

12-02-12, 10:59

The best thing to do is to experiment and see what works best for you. There are variations from individual to individual. However, I've not heard of clinical findings that Viagra is stronger than Cialis, just that it doesn't last as long. The fact that with Viagra your response will vary from hour to hour might make it seem like it's stronger because the rate of change is more noticeable. In both cases it will take 1/2 hour to kick in so figure that in.Typically Viagra / kamagra is sold in 100mg while Cialis / Apcalis is sold as only 25 mg. Perhaps to discourage people breaking it up into small fragments and to make more money. Perhaps would be fairer to compare power of 1 quarter of a Viagra to a whole Cialis. Yes power could vary depending on the individual. It is reported that time to act is generally a bit shorter for Viagra.

Generics or "fake" varieties can lack quality control and vary in strength. Some fake Cialis can be strong and others like Apcalis can seem weak. Normal price for the real stuff is a lot higher. I have found Kamagra tabs a more reliable than some of the other fake/generics.

Samplerr

12-02-12, 12:57

Typically Viagra / kamagra is sold in 100mg while Cialis / Apcalis is sold as only 25 mg. Perhaps to discourage people breaking it up into small fragments and to make more money. Perhaps would be fairer to compare power of 1 quarter of a Viagra to a whole Cialis. Yes power could vary depending on the individual.Different drugs, similar effects. 100mg of Sildenafil Citrate doesn't equate to 4 x 20mg of Tadalafil.

Ableyone

12-02-12, 14:55

This might sounds really dumb. My flight gets in around 8am, but the place I am staying isn't available until 6pm. I was thinking of spending a few hours in an FKK. Which one in the frankfurt area would be best for a nice long relaxing day? I'm up for a couple sessions, but which ones are ok with more loitering?Mainhattan would be the cheapest, 45 Euro at opening time 11:00, nice breakfast spread. I have spent a few nice afternoons at this club before flying home. This would be my choice.

Palace is the other option in Frankfurt, since it opens at 10:00 you'll have less time to wait after landing in FRA. More expensive though at 75 Euro.

Oase is an option if you have a car, however their breakfast spread is very basic (like Etap hotel) but more girls there.

I've only been to Sharks once so far and this was in the evening so can't really comment on that club.

The Cane

12-02-12, 16:54

Well, another trip has come and gone. It was a relatively short one. Twelve sessions with ten different girls. But, the sample size was large enough that I can honestly say that I set a new record for acquiring butt sex in Ge-MONGER-ry. A full 67 percent of the sessions included anal, thus approaching Rio de Janeiro type numbers where I have a 70 percent LAA (Lifetime Anal Average). My FKK LAA had been at 40 percent. This latest trip will drive that up some. Don't know why I had more success this time. Must be the euro zone crisis haha! Actually, I do know. This time around, I was much more disciplined when it came to getting what I wanted. No matter how pretty she was, if she wasn't giving up the A-hole, then I was much less inclined to give up the euros. I didn't end up doing a lot of stunners this time out, but I did engage in a lot more anal than usual for me at the FKK establishments. I guess it was a trade off.

During this trip, I found myself thinking a lot about some of the conversations that have taken place here on ISG, often with a smile coming to my face. Here are some of the things that came up:

GETTING THROUGH CUSTOMS (conversation between me and the immigration officer) :

Officer: So what brings you to Germany?

Monger: Oh, I'm here for just a few days of vacation.

Officer: Where do you want to go?

Monger: I'll be staying here in Frankfurt.

Officer: Thank you, have a nice trip.

COMING BACK TO AMERICA:

Officer: What were you doing over there?

Monger: I took some time away for vacation.

Officer: Did you travel alone?

Monger: Yes.

Officer: Welcome home sir.

USING YOUR OWN CONDOMS.

As is customary for me, I took my own stash of condoms and used them exclusively during the trip. At no time did a single girl refuse to use my preferred condom. I simply and confidently would take the condoms out of my robe and lay them out on a table or by the side of the bed, and that was pretty much it. Sometimes the girl would just comment,"Oh, you brought your own." Or, maybe they would pick up a package and look at it to see what brand it was. But that was the extent of it. Guys, don't ask permission or sweat this matter. I wouldn't even call it an "issue". Just bring what you want to use and don't act like you're expecting something out of the ordinary.

CIM SERVICE.

I did CIM one time, and the girl did a great job. She really loved to suck dick, and she made me explode jizz all in her greedily sucking mouth. And here's the thing relevant to ISG discussions. When I "nutted", she didn't pull back. No! This girl stayed on my dick and did CIM proper! She ate up every last drop of spunk in her mouth, and only stopped to spit after she made sure she caught all of it in her mouth. That was CIM done right!

THE EGYPTIAN.

I saw Alexandra at Palace. Looked like she had lost some weight, but I still find her to be unattractive. She moved in one me with one of her tag team partners soliciting for a trio. I had wrapped up what I was going to do for the night, and honestly (and conveniently) said I was about to leave. This pissed the "Egyptian" off, who proceeded to insult me by saying that the watch I was wearing was a cheap fake. Classic Alexandra! Be gone witch! The funny thing is, I was at World and a girl saw the watch and said she would fuck me free for a month if I gave her my watch! LOL! I was like no you will have to fuck for free for a year to get this! Ha ha! She came back with eight months. At least once a week for eight months I countered? But then when I pointed out that I lived an ocean away, we both agreed no final deal could be struck. LOL!

THE CONVERSATION.

At one point during the trip, I felt like if I had to go through the conversation one more time, I was going to lose my mind. What's "the conversation" you ask? Well, it goes a little something like this (you fill in the answers) : Hi, how are you? Where are you from? What is your name? Why are you sitting here with nobody? Did you come here alone? Let's go to the kino to sit together. Let's go to the room. I make for you good massage and blow job no condom you sperm in my mouth. You want two girls? Why not? I am the best. You are not ready? I will make you ready! You are a handsome man. So nice. Don't you want me? My friend then?

Sound familiar to anybody? LOL! I finally got to a point near the end of the trip where I told a girl who kept coming back and who wouldn't take no for an answer that I was tired of "the conversation" and just needed a break from it. She became angry and said that it wasn't a normal place you know. I agreed with her and said it wasn't her. She was doing what she was supposed to do, and it was me. Well, she felt better about that, but do you know that she came back to try me one more time?

I had this episode at Oase, a place where there's really no good escape if you want to remove yourself from the action for awhile. I suppose you could go and sit in the locker room, but a monger needs someplace where he can just go and sit and relax and not be subjected to constant sales pitches from the girls, without having to park it in a boring locker room. I fear that Oase's star has fallen a bit in my eyes given the current state of the facilities, but more on that later.

THE TRAIN.

I took the train to Oase and World, and for the first time I saw officials on the train checking to see if all the passengers had their tickets. I'm sure it happens, but it had never happened before when I had been on the train. There were two of them, one checking the tickets and the other one with some kind of machine, I assume to sell a passenger a ticket if they didn't have one or didn't have the right one or something. Anyway, I had my ticket. I suppose that if you don't have a ticket and don't pay for one, then you will be kicked off at the next stop, and maybe even arrested. Moral to the story. Make sure you can show your ticket during your journey.

SHOE SIZE.

I continually forget that the way they assign the lockers is according to shoe size, and that the unit of measure they use is different from what we use in the States. At Palace, my first stop, the woman asked me my shoe size, and I only knew it according to the unit of measure we use in the States. Well, she was familiar with that, and made the conversion for me. Note to self. Remember what your shoe size converts to over in Germany!

A FUNNY.

I was at one of the FKKs in the shower, and I see this guy literally bending over at the waist like he's getting ready to dive into a rugby scrum. The difference was that this guy was washing his hairy arsehole out! LOL! I was like man we all have to do that, but why the hell are you bending over at the waist like that? Hahaha!

Syzygies

12-02-12, 19:34

Different drugs, similar effects. 100mg of Sildenafil Citrate doesn't equate to 4 x 20mg of Tadalafil.Sure, but what I am trying to convey is that half a 100 mg Kamagra seems more powerful than a full Apcalis (Cialis generic supposed to be equivalent) , based on my experience. The reason why is not 100% clear, but Cialis came on the scene later and they probably decided to learn from experience. I have never used the real Cialis as too expensive and never had a script for it, but I have tried another fake cheaper variety that was labelled Cialis but had a taste (similar to Viagra) like it was a lot more powerful than Apcalis (which seemed to have little taste at all). The actual experience was also more powerful than Apcalis, lasted long like Cialis, but probably still not as powerful as Viagra. I assume it was therefore Tadalafil but possibly in a stronger dose.

While Viagra was originally available, in 25mg. 50 mg, and 100 mg, due to the cost, it was far more cost effective to buy 100mg, far too strong, and take a small piece, like one quarter. This defeated the pricing structure rip-off somewhat. I believe that therefore Cialis was made available in just one size weaker dose (compared to a Viagra 100mg) , to make it less likely people would need to break off such a small piece.

The bottom line is, if I took an Apcalis, whole tablet, I would get a fairly weak effect for a long time. If I take a fragment piece of a Kamagra 100, I get a strong effect for up to about 4 hours max. That's just my opinion and experience. I was once a part time Apcalis user. Now I don't buy it any more. It may well have a much stronger result for others.

The way to test how good these drugs, work is to see how many times you can stop sex, loose an erection, and then quickly get it back again. This may be an easy thing for some guys unassisted, depending on body's hormone regulation systems, while other guys may find the number of times can get an erection back quickly is limited. Viagra seems to allow the erection to return in an extremely short time with minimal stimulation. Some guys may find a small dose of Viagra makes it quite difficult to loose the erection.

I have seen young guys in the shower at Oase with full erections already, presumably meaning they took Viagra, and just the anticipation and site of naked girls, made it impossible to keep the dick down, or they may have had a session already but dick would not subside. They probably took too much of the Viagra, at a guess. Fortunately Viagra wears off after 4 hours.

Also I do not like Kamagra jelly. It comes in a 100 mg dose. Its not very practical to take a small portion of a sachet. What do you do with the left over to avoid making a mess? I suppose its okay for those taking a whole sachet or happy to waste the remainder.

I therefore use crumbs of Kamagra 100mg to turbo-boost an experience with an unknown girl, who may or may not turn out to be a very easy hot fuck. With regular girls, that I feel very comftable with, kissing is the usually the most powerful turn-on for me. I also use my own condoms Durex Gefuehlschaft as they thinner, easier to put on, and don't feel so tight as the "london" condoms (I think they are called. Blue and white striped pack) that clubs supply to girls.

The slogan of the gays when Viagra first came out "now we can fuck all night without a problem". It became very popular. Very old guys who used to have no chance of getting it up, could be like young men again. Meanwhile there are many customers at FKKs who do not do full sex prefering to get BBBJ only. These guys may well benefit from Viagra, to renew their interest in regular fucking, or may be they are just to lazy to fuck.

Breadman

12-02-12, 21:17

. But, the sample size was large enough that I can honestly say that I set a new record for acquiring butt sex in Ge-MONGER-ry. A full 67 percent of the sessions included anal, thus approaching Rio de Janeiro type numbers where I have a 70 percent LAA (Lifetime Anal Average).

I was at one of the FKKs in the shower, and I see this guy literally bending over at the waist like he's getting ready to dive into a rugby scrum. The difference was that this guy was washing his hairy arsehole out! LOL!Did this guy count towards your 67% record? We all know some crazy shit happens down in Rio.

Neurosynth

12-02-12, 21:59

Well, again, I think the bottom line is that each individual should experiment and find what works best for him. The other thing is that I wouldn't assume something like Apcalis is the equivalent of Cialis. Both use Tadalafil but may have different binding agents. Also the regulation of Apcalis is going to be looser. In particular drug storage in India is not as controlled as it is in the US and Europe.

Samplerr

12-02-12, 22:24

Cialis is available in doses ranging from 2. 5mg up to 20mg.

Jymondor

12-02-12, 22:41

I am planning to be there starting Jan 10. Will most of girls return from X-mass holidays that time?

Breadman

12-03-12, 00:41

I am planning to be there starting Jan 10. Will most of girls return from X-mass holidays that time?End of January maybe but not by the 10th.

Meeps77

12-03-12, 02:13

I am planning to be there starting Jan 10. Will most of girls return from X-mass holidays that time?For what it's worth I visited palace last year on the 24th (only place that was open) and oase on the 25th. While the selection wasn't as big as normal, there were still more than enough lookers for me to choose from and fill my plate. I couldn't imagine the 10th will be any slower. But I'm sure there will be girls missing of course

Dufey

12-03-12, 02:18

Don't worry, there are many urban legends there out (I am one by myself) who can make you good company without feeling any shame. There is a club where the girls come to me to inform me if my girl has arrived or ask me when she does arrive. In this club no girl approaches me with the hope to get sex from me, I can sit for 10 hours and none of the girls around will ever come to me, with a few exception of the friends of my girl who would get to me to say hello, or to have a chat and a smoke when they want to rest. So more urban legend than that is hard, think about it and you will not feel alone in this kind of situation! LOL!Thank you for the words. It must be very lonely not having any girls approaching you since they know that they do not have any chance with you. I guess it is good that the friends of your girl come sit with you. That is something.

I sometimes have some friends come meet me in the club to spend time when not sitting or booking my club relationship girl. Sometimes I am alone but usually some male guest I know turns up who I can do something with during down time.

Urban legends indeed.

Banana Boi

12-03-12, 02:23

I am planning to be there starting Jan 10. Will most of girls return from X-mass holidays that time?I was at Oase on Jan. 11, 2012 (Wednesday) and there were a ton of girls there. Yes, some girls were just returning from Christmas vacation that day and throughout my stay but by no means was there a lack of girls on Jan. 11.

Dufey

12-03-12, 02:26

It sounds to me like you already know everything there is to know. If you want to risk heartbreak, then risk it with someone who may want more than friendship and doesn't expect to be paid. This isn't rocket science.Excuse me Neurosynth. May I clarify your comment? You mean try a girl in the civilian market like a singles website or a singles bar?

Effectively abandon the club girl relationship which I have set my heart on. Hard to do given where I am. I realised this weekend how much more stressed and hung up on her I am.

I had started a chat when we were in the bar together of what were my 3 top priorities in life and my things were mundane like keeping healthy, my work and then I said it was our relationship. I then asked her what was the 3 things in life she was currently focussed on and one of them was our relationship too. The other two she listed I totally got. Maybe she was saying it for my benefit, probably was. But I can only take this stuff at face value. She wrote me 5 emails today on various things. Her comments and responses were matter of fact compared to my soppy repartee.

Neurosynth

12-03-12, 09:26

Geronimo11

12-03-12, 11:28

Me and 3 friends were in theüsseldorf last Tuesday. There was only 1 purpose, FKK!

Tuesday we were really excited. We went all the way from istanbul-turkey. My friends have been to GT before and we directly went there like kids going to a fair. We parked the car inside, went to the door, a nice lady opened, asked if we can speak dutch, and we said we can speak english. She looked at the bodyguards, the guy approved with his head and we entered. We were paying our 60 euros, suddenly one son of a ***** in shape of a hippopotamus appeared and told us that we can not go in. WHAT THE FUCK? Why? We were really good looking, wearing suits. The kady gave our money back and we went out. I didn't understand anything. As we went out really disappointed. 1 friend who can speak dutch told that guy doesn't like Turks. RACIST son of a *****! All across Europe they do meetings about anti-racism but one dickhead, didn't get us inside. It was really disappointing.

I had taken your suggestions from here before going, and I knew the other FKK's and decided to go to YY where about 20 minutes from GT. Waow! What a nice choice. We thanked that SOAB in GT he didn't enter us in. The place was perfect. Girls, sauna, jakuzi, bar staff, rooms etc. Entry 60 euros, all drinks free, very nice and beautiful about 30-40 ladies mostly 7-8. There were some 9s and only 1 10. She was perfect. We did everything. And inside was only 15-20 guys. Never waited for room. I had the best time here.

The day after we went to Aca, entrance was 35 euros but drinks icluding beer were not free. 5 or 10 euros. Not bad also. As we entered, there were 60-70 ladies which most are 6-7. But some were 9. 20-25 guys ever waited a room here again. Rooms were a little weaker than YY. No showers, toilets in the rooms. And the air condition is not enough, everywhere was smoke.

I prefer everyone to go YY. Perfect place and very friendly. Not racist bodyguards.

StarletVoyager

12-03-12, 19:33

I've checked the website for frankfurt messe for the 12th-19th December and there doesn't seem to be much going on. Could someone confirm this for if I do go during this period I don't want to end up with hoards of bodies everywhere in the clubs.

Many thanks

Dufey

12-04-12, 09:17

Your need to grind on this topic day after day tells me this is a dysfunctional relationship. (Frankly I am at times skeptical as to whether this is real at all).

Tell her (1) you would never ask her to quit her work, but (2) out of respect for your relationship you're going to stop going with other girls at her club, and (3) you want sex with her from now on to be outside the club for free.

This would cost her a minimal amount of money if anything, and would recognize your relationship as being something more than commerce. Whatever her answer you come out ahead, because you will either be with her or you will stop wasting your time.This club girl relationship is on my mind big time so that may come out in my writing. I agree it is dysfunctional. I think my girl is mixed up like most girls that work in the clubs. This is not normal.

Why do you think this is not real? I give a lot of detail which is difficult to make up.

All the things you said about saying I do not want her to quite her work I have said. She wants to work for a couple of more years. This is not fine but we will work it out.

I keep telling her if we hook up I do not go with any other girls in the club. She says that is not a problem I go with other girls. She says this to me regularly and I say I really only want to go with her but she is so busy. I think she is a really popular girl in her club. There have been many times when I am sitting with her and a man comes up to her to ask if they can book her. This is odd in itself since the etiquette is if a girl is with a man then another man usually does not approach so it shows how men are interested enough to break that etiquette to come ask her if she would be free for them.

She can be booked for hours at a time and I just sit around waiting for her to come back to me afterwards. This is why last weekend when I saw her she just did 3 clients and made her money since each man took her for between 2 to 3 hours each. For each man she also spends prolonged social time before going to the room too. So sometimes I wonder if what she does with me is special. There are sex acts we do that I can believe are special since there were 2 acts that I have found are incredibly difficult to get and now on my last time I can add a third one which was truly biazzare one, but showed how much she liked me since she said it was for me. I never asked for it. She just saw the opportunity and just did it. It was a sex act that I think only couples that know each other well would do. I have never come across this act before but only heard about it, I think it would be a lot of money if you wanted it and a girl that is very trusting or reckless for that matter. This is pay for sex. She says only does these for me since I like them and so she enjoys it because I like them. Whatever it is she she has the right words to make you feel special.

If she is sitting with me she even asks me before she goes with a client is it okay to go or would I rather she stay with me. It took some heartache to get her to do that. She realises now it is important she does this if we sit together. I know she has her work mindset on but this is really only when I get to see her since the outside the club time is so little.

She even asks which girls I went with when I was in the club and she was not there. She thought it interesting and one session really funny. The comment was,"never in your life would have a chance to do such things."

The last point about only having sex with her outside the club for free is not going to happen at this point in the as you describe dysfunctional relationship. When we have gone out for no money it has been no sex and if we did do something intimate it would be a hug and a kiss as if it were a first, second or third date in normal life. None of the intimate and prolonged kissing we do in the club and what she does with her clients. The date that we did last she paid for the drinks saying we take turns to pay for our times together. She says we take it slowly as she has a lot of problems in her life right now which she explained to me.

When we did the escort thing which was the first thing we did outside the club, it was actually her idea and not mine. I was surprised. She described it as a way to get to know each other and did not have a price and wanted me to name something. She said she was happy with anything. I gave her something decent which was not excessive but then would be reasonable for 2 days, far far less than what she earns working in the club for 2 days given how popular she is. On the second day she say when we meet like this again all she wants is say petrol money as she drives many hours to come to the club. Her living so far away is another reason why logistics in meeting up is a problem amongst the other things she has going on.

Dufey

12-04-12, 09:18

Indi Companion

12-04-12, 13:00

Nick The G

12-04-12, 19:38

We were paying our 60 euros, suddenly one son of a ***** in shape of a hippopotamus appeared and told us that we can not go in. WHAT THE FUCK? Why? We were really good looking, wearing suits. The lady gave our money back and we went out. I didn't understand anything. As we went out really disappointed. 1 friend who can speak dutch told that guy doesn't like Turks. RACIST son of a *****! All across Europe they do meetings about anti-racism but one dickhead, didn't get us inside. It was really disappointing.Don't forget, GoldenTime is a very successful club. Filled with customers and nice ladies. So I think, over all, they have a good strategy if they stick to this policy.

I wish some of their thinking would be applied in FKK-World too, that would help the women there a lot!

BTW: wearing suits and "looking good" sometimes doesn't help at all.

Neurosynth

12-04-12, 20:50

She can be booked for hours at a time and I just sit around waiting for her to come back to me afterwards. This is why last weekend when I saw her she just did 3 clients and made her money since each man took her for between 2 to 3 hours each. For each man she also spends prolonged social time before going to the room too. So sometimes I wonder if what she does with me is special. There are sex acts we do that I can believe are special since there were 2 acts that I have found are incredibly difficult to get and now on my last time I can add a third one which was truly biazzare one, but showed how much she liked me since she said it was for me. I never asked for it. She just saw the opportunity and just did it. It was a sex act that I think only couples that know each other well would do. I have never come across this act before but only heard about it, I think it would be a lot of money if you wanted it and a girl that is very trusting or reckless for that matter. This is pay for sex. She says only does these for me since I like them and so she enjoys it because I like them. Whatever it is she she has the right words to make you feel special.Gosh, the least you could do is describe the "special" acts to keep things interesting. I suspect it may be BBFS. In that case be careful because when a sexworker says "I only do this with you" it's not true 99.9% of the time.

So you sat around for at least 6 to 9 hours while she was away banging other customers? You're in a paradise of sex and you sit there like a cuckolded husband?

And there's almost no sex outside the club, and if there is it's paid for? That the amount she changes isn't the point. That she insists on that symbolic gesture tells you what you need to know. You're just a customer. Perhaps a favorite customer, but just a customer nevertheless. Wishing for anything more can only end in tears. I'm done.

StarletVoyager

12-05-12, 00:54

Yakob

12-05-12, 02:22

Yakob

12-05-12, 02:26

I am planning to be there starting Jan 10. Will most of girls return from X-mass holidays that time?I hope there are some girls around. I will be driving to the clubs after my working week 4 to 6 January. 11 to 13 January and 18 to 20 January. There is a big Messe in the last week of Janaury that I usually give a miss to.

If in doubt you send an email or an sms to your girls to check who is around anyway to know if you are onto a sure thing or not.

Dufey

12-05-12, 09:29

Gosh, the least you could do is describe the "special" acts to keep things interesting. I suspect it may be BBFS. In that case be careful because when a sexworker says "I only do this with you" it's not true 99. 9% of the time.

So you sat around for at least 6 to 9 hours while she was away banging other customers? You're in a paradise of sex and you sit there like a cuckolded husband?

And there's almost no sex outside the club, and if there is it's paid for? That the amount she changes isn't the point. That she insists on that symbolic gesture tells you what you need to know. You're just a customer. Perhaps a favorite customer, but just a customer nevertheless. Wishing for anything more can only end in tears. I'm done.I thank you for staying with this theme. Your comments are appreciated and it has helped me firm some things in my mind as to what to do. I just need to stay the course. My work is getting affected since I think of this girl so much and with some changes at work I cannot be on the beck and call of such a whimsical girl no matter how interested I am in her. She is dysfunctional and it is driving me crazy.

I fear saying what the special acts we do together are since that could pinpoint us, but I can confirm that we do not perform BBFS. Whatever we do we remain careful. The last special act had the same theme as Twilight if that helps. I do take your point about whatever she is saying that what I do for you is only for you. I know 100% that girls lie about all sorts of things. For example, she may say you are the first customer I have seen outside the club then a few days later they mention in passing about what she and another customer did outside the club together.

Yes, you have it in one about the cukolded husband. I will explain how much waiting I did. First up, I waited 7. 5 hours before I booked her to the room. I got to the club early but she arrived maybe 1 hour later. She had promised to be at the club the same time as me, but she had rung that she was running late and we would be going out that night to an event or a bar. That was a surprise since I was not expecting to go out of the club this visit at all. She said she just wanted to. So she is in the club one hour later than I had expected when I could book her first. Then she spends half hour in the ladies and then I find she has been chatting to her girlfriend, Then she comes and sits with me for say 30 minutes and she smokes while we hug, kiss a bit, hold hands, etc. Then she says she needs to go have lunch with her girlfriend and her girlfriend prefers I not sit with them since I can understand their language so they can talk freely. Ok I say. I get some more lip kisses. So I let them eat together. Then the girls come out to smoke and keep chatting. More of her girlfriends turn up and they are all chatting away for a few minutes. So I go over and join the girls and the girls see this and make their excuses that they have to work and leave us. I then get maybe another 20 minutes with her sitting together touching, kissing, and chatting. Then I spot a regular customer she has who has made a booking come into the club and I stupidly point him out to her since she had not noticed him. He is early by 1 hour. My girl says can she go with him so she can come back to me as quick as possible. I relent and go okay. The guy books her for 2. 5 hours in the room but with half hour social time before the room and after the room she always seems to take half hour to collect money, wash out and re-do her make up it ends up being 3. 5 hours later before she comes back available again. So in that 7 hours she has made just a minimum 250€ without extras or tips and missed me booking an early session and then me doing another session after which I do. She says to me she is in the club to make money but when I see what she does she spends more time socialising with her friends and customers than in the room. It is only then I can book her.

My girl asks me to come have dinner with her and her girlfriend and we go get some food and eat together. Afterwards we sit together and we touch and we kiss in the main bar area. I get worked up and have to ask her to go to the room. In all my bookings she has never asked about the room. I take her for 3 hours after maybe a bit of social time before and a few minutes wait for the room since the club has gotten busy now. I come 3 times and she comes 4 times she claims. I give her 400€ since I do two extras which she charges for, the other extras she does not. She actually cuts the room booking short since she reminds me that we spent the last maybe 20 minutes just talking and she said she did not want to charge for talking and prefer we talk outside the room. She says for customers she does not mind just talking and charging for it but not for me as she feels bad. She says only book her when I want sex but not for talking, since we can talk outside the room. Anyway we are going out tonight she says and we can talk then too.

Then after our booking I think she has some time to sit with me socially. So I wait half hour for her to go shower and re-do her make up. She then comes to me and says another customer has booked her just as she came out of the ladies changing room and he is waiting for her now. She said to him that she wanted to go smoke and came to see me to tell me she was booked again. So she has her smoke and stupidly I point out another customer she knows who comes over to us and she and him chat as I stand with her with my hands around her. She then gives me a kiss on the lips and off she goes. She is away for another 2. 5 hours for I think a 1. 5 hour room booking since again she spends around 30-40 minutes social time sitting with her client and kissing and fondling then after the room her usual half hour showering and re-doing making up. So she makes another minimum 150€ on that booking. I do not know if there were any other extras or tips. So I think she made at least 800€ in the 12-13 hours she was on the club floor. I get told by another popular girl recently written about on the forum a fair bit that she only made 600€ in one week in the same week when I saw her.

I then catch up with her and ask when we are going out and she says yes, sometime, but first she wants to go to talk to her girlfriends and says it okay that I come with her with her friends to chat. The girls are girls I know from other club from a while back and it is good to catch up. Once cigarette finished we go out of the club separately and meet up outside to go out. She pays.

So I take your point about being treated like a customer. I am beginning to feel that too now. I do not want to end in tears. It would be too much. Thank you for clarifying.

Hessen Bub

12-05-12, 09:43

CaptCabin

12-05-12, 11:36

Angus Magee

12-05-12, 11:49

The last special act had the same theme as Twilight if that helps.What, she drinks your blood or something? This is getting weird.

I finally have to have my say. I agree more or less with HB though I think I have a bit more understanding of why the girl may attract you so. Been close to this myself. In the end though, what I realised, was that as long as you are paying her you are first and foremost a customer. You may well be a favoured / favorite customer but you are still a customer. The only way to move it along is to stop the payment.

AM

CaptCabin

12-05-12, 11:51

What, she drinks your blood or something? This is getting weird.

I finally have to have my say. I agree more or less with HB though I think I have a bit more understanding of why the girl may attract you so. Been close to this myself. In the end though, what I realised, was that as long as you are paying her you are first and foremost a customer. You may well be a favoured / favorite customer but you are still a customer. The only way to move it along is to stop the payment.

AMThis is a good benchmark and I totally agree with angus. If she loves you sex would be free.

CaptCabin

12-05-12, 12:20

Do members think fkk's have the best set up of any in the entire world? Having looked at many destinations and not really being a fan of oriental girls I am quickly starting to think this is true? Having done the fkk trip 10 times now and still far from sick of it I have a question; if members had a really deep wallet would they 1) do a mega fkk trip or 2) try somewhere new? The only other places I can think of are either buenos aires or termas in Rio but then you have safety issues; however I do dig white brazilian chicks. Feedback welcomed.Heard termas in Rio is the bomb. But for me if I had sponsored flight and accomodation colmbia would be my 1s choice. My god martha of palace certainly was the most beautifull girl I have fucked in my WHOLE life! If I can her for 100 euro in germany I think I might get more than that in Columbia. To bad no sponsored flight and accomodation for me LOL.

CaptCabin

12-05-12, 12:26

Hessen Bub

12-05-12, 12:47

I agree more or less with HB though I think I have a bit more understanding of why the girl may attract you so.Hey, don't hurt my feelings! I do understand the situation he's facing, but it will get worse and not better.

HB

Angus Magee

12-05-12, 18:04

Hey, don't hurt my feelings! I do understand the situation he's facing, but it will get worse and not better.

HBWell all I meant was that I have been close to falling for a club girl like ou hero seems to have done. It did not go nearly so far though before I had my realisation of being more or less just a favoured customer. It is so easy to believe oneself "special" if this is what you want to believe. Indeed think the girl's feelings are genuine so far as it goes. But unless one can get over the steep hurdle of ponying up every time you want to stick it in, you are a customer.

AM

Burma Jones

12-05-12, 18:31

[QUOTE=Dufey; 1356992]Then after our booking I think she has some time to sit with me socially. So I wait half hour for her to go shower and re-do her make up. She then comes to me and says another customer has booked her just as she came out of the ladies changing room and he is waiting for her now. She said to him that she wanted to go smoke and came to see me to tell me she was booked again. So she has her smoke and stupidly I point out another customer she knows who comes over to us and she and him chat as I stand with her with my hands around her. She then gives me a kiss on the lips and off she goes. She is away for another 2. 5 hours for I think a 1. 5 hour room booking since again she spends around 30-40 minutes social time sitting with her client and kissing and fondling then after the room her usual half hour showering and re-doing making up. So she makes another minimum 150€ on that booking. I do not know if there were any other extras or tips. So I think she made at least 800€ in the 12-13 hours she was on the club floor. I get told by another popular girl recently written about on the forum a fair bit that she only made 600€ in one week in the same week when I saw her / QUOTE]Dufey,

I would be interested to see what her reaction would be if you tried a different tactic. Instead of pointing out clients for her, when she returns from a long session and sees you waiting on her, point out another girl you want and tell your girl that you are booking an extended time with the other girl. Kiss her and tell her you will see her in a couple of hours. You probably are trying not to play games but if she knows you sit there the entire time she is in a session, she is taking you for granted and you will always be taken advantage of. Even if she doesn't get jealous, she will still know that she is not your only option if she doesn't treat you correctly.

Indi Companion

12-05-12, 20:25

I would be interested to see what her reaction would be if you tried a different tactic. Instead of pointing out clients for her, when she returns from a long session and sees you waiting on her, point out another girl you want and tell your girl that you are booking an extended time with the other girl. Kiss her and tell her you will see her in a couple of hours. You probably are trying not to play games but if she knows you sit there the entire time she is in a session, she is taking you for granted and you will always be taken advantage of. Even if she doesn't get jealous, she will still know that she is not your only option if she doesn't treat you correctly.That's a good point! +1 Man, it could be a really interesting tactic with someone who behaves like Dufey's girl. My current favorite would never act like that. She goes from time to time to look for a pray but I am always the first and the last and she spends with me 8/10 hours out of 15 in the club, obviously only charging me for the time in the room and I am still not seeing her outside of the club at the moment.

Indi Companion

12-05-12, 20:35

Heard termas in Rio is the bomb. But for me if I had sponsored flight and accomodation colmbia would be my 1s choice. My god martha of palace certainly was the most beautifull girl I have fucked in my WHOLE life! If I can her for 100 euro in germany I think I might get more than that in Columbia. To bad no sponsored flight and accomodation for me LOL.I have been spending all my money in trip all around the world with all the annexes. South America, Asian Far East included. I think the paradise for all mongers were the Eastern European Countries back in the early 90's. That was a paradise where you were getting the best looking girls for free or for a few money in terms of shopping or dinner to a restaurant. Unfortunately it is no longer like that, currently you have to get despersed in the deep country side of Ukrain or Russia to get it. To hard.

If I think from a quality / quantity / price perspective, my opinion is that in this very moment Germany and its FKKs and Sauna Clubs is unbeatable. But then, it is only my opinion and of course as usual it depends on your taste.

Dufey

12-05-12, 23:03

Dufey,

I would be interested to see what her reaction would be if you tried a different tactic. Instead of pointing out clients for her, when she returns from a long session and sees you waiting on her, point out another girl you want and tell your girl that you are booking an extended time with the other girl. Kiss her and tell her you will see her in a couple of hours. You probably are trying not to play games but if she knows you sit there the entire time she is in a session, she is taking you for granted and you will always be taken advantage of. Even if she doesn't get jealous, she will still know that she is not your only option if she doesn't treat you correctly.Hi Burma Jones,

It was not my intention to point out clients to her. I just happened to recognise a couple that she has gone with and she had told me that one had a booking. That was the first client who "took" my expected booking since I thought having arrived 3-4 hours before he was due I could get in a session before he did but NO, I did not calculate the fallacy of females gossiping to their friends and wasting so much time in the changing room and the tendency to always be late for every appointment.

The second one was someone that she knew who was a good client of one of her friends and just being me I was being polite to say hey looks there is XX XXXXX who likes such and such. Next thing I know she is chatting to him about where her girl friend was since she was not in the club that night and how his work was etc. She is really socialble.

She says she does not mind at all if I go with other girls. She says she is indifferent. She reminds me every so often that I can book other girls. There was one week when she did not come to the club and I ended up being in her club since my friend wanted to go to the club. So we went. I stayed for maybe 8 hours before I got annoyed and booked a series of 5 girls doing 50€ and 100€ sessions. The next week when sitting together she ask me which girls in the club did I book when she was not there. I would have thought her girlfriends would have told her as I know they do in other cases but she seems to not know. So I said I did her and her and her and those two over there pointing out girls in the club. She just nodded and said ok. Then she moved onto another topic. She really did not mind, no reaction.

I mean when we were driving together we talked about how we met each other and I related some of the bucket list of things that I have done in the clubs and her comment was,"No way in your normal life do you have a chance to do such things." I took what she said as meaning, good for you for having done those things you have wanted to do.

So I take your reverse tactics but I think she would not react at all. If anything after I left she would just go off and find another customer or one of her girlfriends to go gossip to. I know this.

My thanks. This discussion has really helped me firm my mind from the confused state it was in previously. I can beginning to see a path and I can see the things that I could not see before in how we interact.

It was the writing down of what I felt but then also describing what happened as well. It is only when it is in black and white on the screen and re-reading it again with an open mind I can see that the differentiation is not here. She really does not care for me. At best I am just a favoured customer regardless of the many notes and exclamations that I am not a customer to her. As has been said, the fact you are paying the going rates when in the room and not getting anything when out of the club means you are a customer. Not even a friend.

The Cane

12-05-12, 23:28

Dufey

12-05-12, 23:37

She's fucking around with you. She treats you like a dog because you are a safe customer for her. She does what she wants, you wait for her, she goes with other customers and has meals with her friends. You wait. You pay her more or less the regular price. Perfect situation for her. She really found somebody she can take advantage of. My 0, 02$: Change the club. Or at least the girl. Fuck other girls.

HBHi HB,

You give some sound advice. I can really see your point of view. I have no idea what concept this girl has of what "friends" are for. On one hand I pay to fuck her but on the other hand we sit together socially and as I have seen gone out together as "friends". I cannot work this one out. She says she does not want a relationship, but wants me as a friend.

From what you have seen is a friend that she can fuck around with and push around with who is a regular customer and pays her a good amount of money albeit she does not an excellent service I must admit.

Given our "dates" have all been chaste affairs of light kisses and the odd tongue kiss here and there and no intimate sex moments then I can conclude I think she really does mean friends. But there are some aspects I find odd as to how she interprets friends. I mean she emails me everyday and sometimes 4-5 times a day saying some inane things. She keeps going on about she does not want a relationship and we are friends then she says she is happy to see me in the club. In the club like I said, she never pushes to go to the room. It is my own volition that asks her to stop and take me as a booking.

One part of me says let us give it some more time and see but another part says leave it alone, come back in a few months and see if the attitude has changed. Right now she is wound up about something that I cannot comprehend and keeps saying we are friends. The tone and topics of what she writes me changes day by day.

If I end it with her then I do give up some really good sex and the "dates" we had planned in late December and into the New Year.

Smoky Jack

12-05-12, 23:42

Hi Burma Jones,

It was not my intention to point out clients to her. I just happened to recognise a couple that she has gone with and she had told me that one had a booking. That was the first client who "took" my expected booking since I thought having arrived 3-4 hours before he was due I could get in a session before he did but NO, I did not calculate the fallacy of females gossiping to their friends and wasting so much time in the changing room and the tendency to always be late for every appointment.

The second one was someone that she knew who was a good client of one of her friends and just being me I was being polite to say hey looks there is XX XXXXX who likes such and such. Next thing I know she is chatting to him about where her girl friend was since she was not in the club that night and how his work was etc. She is really socialble.

She says she does not mind at all if I go with other girls. She says she is indifferent. She reminds me every so often that I can book other girls. There was one week when she did not come to the club and I ended up being in her club since my friend wanted to go to the club. So we went. I stayed for maybe 8 hours before I got annoyed and booked a series of 5 girls doing 50€ and 100€ sessions. The next week when sitting together she ask me which girls in the club did I book when she was not there. I would have thought her girlfriends would have told her as I know they do in other cases but she seems to not know. So I said I did her and her and her and those two over there pointing out girls in the club. She just nodded and said ok. Then she moved onto another topic. She really did not mind, no reaction.

I mean when we were driving together we talked about how we met each other and I related some of the bucket list of things that I have done in the clubs and her comment was,"No way in your normal life do you have a chance to do such things." I took what she said as meaning, good for you for having done those things you have wanted to do.

So I take your reverse tactics but I think she would not react at all. If anything after I left she would just go off and find another customer or one of her girlfriends to go gossip to. I know this.

My thanks. This discussion has really helped me firm my mind from the confused state it was in previously. I can beginning to see a path and I can see the things that I could not see before in how we interact.

It was the writing down of what I felt but then also describing what happened as well. It is only when it is in black and white on the screen and re-reading it again with an open mind I can see that the differentiation is not here. She really does not care for me. At best I am just a favoured customer regardless of the many notes and exclamations that I am not a customer to her. As has been said, the fact you are paying the going rates when in the room and not getting anything when out of the club means you are a customer. Not even a friend.The captain strikes again. All BS, with the same writing style as CaptCabin, Yakob, our past friend Amtripna or whatever. You are not fooling anyone. This is why there has been such a dearth of credible reports lately. I have to admit you keep a nice conversation going with yourself.

Jimmy Boy 99

12-05-12, 23:47

It was the writing down of what I felt but then also describing what happened as well. It is only when it is in black and white on the screen and re-reading it again with an open mind I can see that the differentiation is not here. She really does not care for me. At best I am just a favoured customer regardless of the many notes and exclamations that I am not a customer to her. As has been said, the fact you are paying the going rates when in the room and not getting anything when out of the club means you are a customer. Not even a friend.I have been following your saga since your initial post and am glad that you have come to the above realization. You can confirm it by telling her that you like her too much to continue to be a customer so you will not be coming to her club any more (or at least not sessioning with her anymore if, for some reason, you can't stop going to her club) and will only see her outside the club on a non-pay basis, as that is the only way both of you will be able to tell if there is any future for you together. Her reaction will tell you all you need to know about what she considers you.

Dufey

12-05-12, 23:59

Dufey,

I think this relationship with club girls is really hard as you can't even Trust her. I mean you are always questioning her motives. I agree with hessen but to me if you can get a club girl who is young and hot the I think you should just go outside and find yourself a girl on the outside. With these girls you are always questioning their motives and you can never know in front of you it would seem you mean the word to them but in the girls changing room she might call you her poodle number 3.

But serioudly dufey you already know the answer to this. You can't even trust her hence the reason you are posting all this info in this thread. Maybe it is your gut feeling saying you are getting played.

Fuck other girls or just get a real girlfriend on the outside while age is still on your side.Hi CaptCabin,

Thank you for your input.

You are actually right. You have somehow highlighted something else that I was too blind to see since I was so infatuated with this girl. I realise that I could not trust her since I was seeing so many inconsistencies and contradictions in what she was saying. Then again it could be she does not think.

I really do like this girl. Like how I began this theme, she pushes so many of my buttons.

She claims that she has a trumatic experience before meeting me what could explain how she is and she says she has a lot going on in her life, but then that does not explain all the odd things she says and does. I cannot believe it. So as you say I am questioning her motives. She has given me a lot of insight into the clubs since she has bought me into her group of friends. That has made me cynical about how things are run.

I do take the point on trying to see a normal girl outside of the clubs. I know a good man from southern Germany who has done that. He has given up the clubs now and he looks so happy in the pictures he sends me of him and his girl. He was a master monger and was so full of life when in the clubs fucking 5-6 girls in between saunas, eating and swimming during a visit. I should follow his lead.

I wish that could happen. I think that would be more straightforward and not as biazzare as what I have experienced with this girl who I think is totally confused and does not know what she wants.

My main pain is giving up a girl that really turns me on and not keeping in contact with her. Avoiding her club is going to tough since my friends really enjoy going there because of the line up. I actually prefer another club so I may end up visiting the clubs alone.

Dufey

12-06-12, 00:14

I finally have to have my say. I agree more or less with HB though I think I have a bit more understanding of why the girl may attract you so. Been close to this myself. In the end though, what I realised, was that as long as you are paying her you are first and foremost a customer. You may well be a favoured / favorite customer but you are still a customer. The only way to move it along is to stop the payment.Hi Angus Magee,

This girl is really attractive to me. I would be glad to have her on my arm anyday. I would not call her smart but I think I fell in love with her heart since she was so nice to me and to everyone around her. She does not want to hurt anyone, even those that have done her wrong. The way she can act sometimes can be cold but I think she just does not realise or maybe she is confused. I know she is popular given the guys that book her for extended sessions. I mean the number of times when she is eating a meal and a man would be sitting across from her and he will start talking to her and ask to book her or when I am sitting with her alone together the men that interrupt us to ask her when she is free to be booked.

You are correct, that if I want to book her then I am paying. The interesting thing was at the beginning it was the understanding that this paying aspect would fall away but somehow she changed her mind 2 months in which I still have not fathomed what happened. I guess I will never know the mystery of how the open minded, willing to go out and date me kind of girl who would phone or SMS maybe 1-3 times a week I knew in the first 2 months of seeing her to the more reserved, quiet, protective and distant girl of the last month that writes to me every day and sometimes 5 times a day and somehow needs me to write back to her constantly. Is this me failing the boyfriend test in those first 2 months and now in the circle of doom called friendship in the last month and forever more?

I think it hard for me to spend time in the club when she is there and resist booking her when she sits with me. As you say I still pay so I am really a customer.

I think she takes a break for Christmas and so will I. It will help clear my head.

Dufey

12-06-12, 00:18

This is a good benchmark and I totally agree with angus. If she loves you sex would be free.Hi CaptCabin,

I agree, if someone loves you then the sex is free. It is how we are hardwired.

CaptCabin

12-06-12, 00:30

Hi CaptCabin,

She claims that she has a trumatic experience before meeting me what could explain how she is and she says she has a lot going on in her life, but then that does not explain all the odd things she says and does. I cannot believe it. So as you say I am questioning her motives. She has given me a lot of insight into the clubs since she has bought me into her group of friends. That has made me cynical about how things are run.Dufey,

If your not 50 and above you still have a go at finding real gf. Don't be like me realizing now I have to pay to touch a women but to me it is really to late.

Of course there is a lot of inconsistency because she is lying. What she trades with you is peanuts compared to the money you are giving her. She tells you how things work in a club some girls also tell me the same. If you really calculate cost benefit analysis I am very sure she is at the winning side.

You have to understand she may have a kid or probably a husband in romania or wherever ee country she came from. It seems it is quite common among the girls in the club who com from home where their father or husband don't work. Do you know whether she has a husband or a child at home? Can you accept her if she has a child?

But again if you still have time I mean if you are still young then go outside and find a genuine girl. The girls in fkk club are mostly messed up. When you hear how they justify

Themselves for prostituition you will be shocked.

Anyway I am beginning to spend too much time in the club as well. Once I nearly got suckered by fidan thinking a young small hot petite girl would want me. She told me I was actually the man of her dreams as she is looking for someone to share her problems and bla2 but at the end of the day I still pay her 100 euro for well sometime I get 80 minutes but the amount of time and money I spent on her is way more LOL.

Your a good customer to her and I bet with you she doesn't want a relationship considering she basically selling her soul so that she can buy a house and a car in romania and I don't think she would give up all of that for you considering she is giving everything she has of value when she enter this bussiness. How can you blame her if she is manipulating you.

Dufey

12-06-12, 00:31

Hey, don't hurt my feelings! I do understand the situation he's facing, but it will get worse and not better.

HBHi Hessen Bub,

I am grateful for your honest advice and experience in these matters.

I did hope for the best and maybe it will change for the better but the reality is that it is getting worse and not better. I think our first 2 months together was like a honeymoon period, she was constantly talking about we do this and that and come out to do that or this but then the 3rd month happened and yes it was the 3rd month when the non paid for activities happened but then the sexual intimatcy stopped except when in the club. This is now the married period I guess where we are not having sex.

I really do thank everyone for bearing with me and sticking to the theme. I have been in a really bad way because of this girl and I think she knows it since she keeps saying she does not want to hurt me but then she cannot let me go either.

I just hope these notes can be used for someone else coming after me having been through the same situation since I can believe that it is not just me that has been where I am now.

Dufey

12-06-12, 00:41

Well all I meant was that I have been close to falling for a club girl like ou hero seems to have done. It did not go nearly so far though before I had my realisation of being more or less just a favoured customer. It is so easy to believe oneself "special" if this is what you want to believe. Indeed think the girl's feelings are genuine so far as it goes. But unless one can get over the steep hurdle of ponying up every time you want to stick it in, you are a customer.

AMHi Angus Magee,

I can see I have been reading too much into what she was saying and doing. I mean when I re-read the SMSs and emails we have traded I can see how loving and sincere she was in the first 2 months and it is the 3rd month's notes that somehow the tone has changed. I think she is backtracking realising what she was getting into herself but then also realised she liked me to keep me but still paying. That means I am a customer no matter how often she denies it and somehow feels insulted when I said this to her and she responded saying I cannot say that when we have been outside the club together to do social things. She says she would never do that with a customer. I did not respond by saying then why do I pay to go to the room with you and if we are friends, most friends do not fuck either let alone pay for it. This is a biazzare relationship.

I agree with you that I think this girls feelings are genuine since she does keep in contact and has so many endearing things to say. But then I have many other club girls that I have seen still keep in contact even after I no longer book them or they have even retired. I guess we are friends there too.

I am still reconciling all this but I am in a saner place than where I was in the last few weeks.

Dufey

12-06-12, 00:50

I have been following your saga since your initial post and am glad that you have come to the above realization. You can confirm it by telling her that you like her too much to continue to be a customer so you will not be coming to her club any more (or at least not sessioning with her anymore if, for some reason, you can't stop going to her club) and will only see her outside the club on a non-pay basis, as that is the only way both of you will be able to tell if there is any future for you together. Her reaction will tell you all you need to know about what she considers you.Hi Jimmy Boy 99,

Thank you for your comments. They are appreciated.

Indeed it will be difficult for me to avoid going to her club since the club is popular and my friends all enjoy going there. I actually prefer another club but I get outvoted at times over this.

I may indeed ask her that we keep the dates we have planned for around Christmas and into New Years and that I will not book her in the club but we remain friends as she says. I do wonder what the reaction would be that the main way we see each other which is the club is removed from the situation and whether she can cope with seeing me on those rare times we have planned a "date".

The other thing is to take her at her word that I will book other girls and still have my social time with her but she has no booking from me. That will be tough on me as I find her so attractive. But I am building up a resolve now my mind is in a better place after the infatuation it was under these past 3 months. The discussions here on this thread from so many valued contributors and also how my club girl relationship is developing makes me know that this is not going to work given the state that we are in.

Thank you for your post.

Slither

12-06-12, 01:22

Thank you for your comments.Many girls and many men also say endearing things nothing new This girl learns to be working girl, for this she changes slowly the psycology change. For this girl you can be customer or pimp maybe friendd. Like for all things, when you still have conexion after 1 2 year you can speak again for serios. It make you and her stupid to rite things where ozher girls can see and smile. My idea, see her only outside have other girls for sex in club.

RonnieNorway

12-06-12, 04:18

Hi all,

So my trip was good ended up sessioning with a stunning girl in OASE for a total of 8 times all 1 to 2 hour sessions over 3 days. So I guess I am in a way in the same boat as in dufey. However my experience is a bit different as on my last visit with her I actually ask her for her contact details. She would not give me and told me she knows I like her but I must expect nothing from her and I should forget her (she was very pleasant on all our sessions and even told me this in the most pleasant way). She actually told me to find a girlfriend from outside but not her. She actually told me that she is a prostitue and it is good for both of us just to forget each other. I know not as romantic as Dufey but I really can get her out of my mind. I actually feel like taking a flight back to germany just to see her before she applies her trade in Dubai after new year. It pains me to know she will be fucking people over there though I know it is her trade. I can see that falling in love with a working girl happens a lot.

So my 1 million dollar question "how on earth do I forget her as I think about her day and night".

These women are really deadly.

Angus Magee

12-06-12, 10:32

So my 1 million dollar question "how on earth do I forget her as I think about her day and night".Best method is to see other women. But ultimately I would say that you just have to think of her day and night until you don't anymore. Been through this enough times to know that that will happen. Also knowing that "love" infatuation has a huge chemical element (that is your brain is swamped with certain neurotransmitters that cause you to think / feel certain ways) can be a good knowledge, if not much comfort.

But really the best thing as I say is to get laid again.

You can deposit the million dollars in my account.

AM

RonnieNorway

12-06-12, 14:23

best method is to see other women. but ultimately i would say that you just have to think of her day and night until you don't anymore. been through this enough times to know that that will happen. also knowing that "love" infatuation has a huge chemical element (that is your brain is swamped with certain neurotransmitters that cause you to think / feel certain ways) can be a good knowledge, if not much comfort.

but really the best thing as i say is to get laid again.

you can deposit the million dollars in my account.

amon my second day i tried that. found myself another hot girl and did 2 sessions with her but at the end of the day my mind still lingers to this girl and i ended up spending more time with her. i must be honest she is unforgetable. she seems perfect in everyway. well life goes on!

anyway thanks for the reply am. erm. will a million rupees do. tell you what i will buy you dinner at oase instead. they serve the meanest pork and beef sausage with grilled chicke / pork with potato salad. heck you can order as much as you want. afterwards we can have a cup of sambuca as well.

Indi Companion

12-06-12, 18:07

Hi all,

So my trip was good ended up sessioning with a stunning girl in oase for a total of 8 times all 1 to 2 hour sessions over 3 days. So I guess I am in a way in the same boat as in dufey. However my experience is a bit different as on my last visit with her I actually ask her for her contact details. She would not give me and told me she knows I like her but I must expect nothing from her and I should forget her (she was very pleasant on all our sessions and even told me this in the most pleasant way). She actually told me to find a girlfriend from outside but not her. She actually told me that she is a prostitue and it is good for both of us just to forget each other. I know not as romantic as dufey but I really can get her out of my mind. I actually feel like taking a flight back to germany just to see her before she applies her trade in Dubai after new year. It pains me to know she will be fucking people over there though I know it is her trade. I can see that falling in love with a working girl happens a lot.

So my 1 million dollar question "how on earth do I forget her as I think about her day and night".

These women are really deadly.It is strange, but I think these situations are quite common and remind us all that some of us are still very far away from being able to see WGs as mere means of pleasure but human beings. These situations in my opinion tell us all also a different story, many of us deeply inside are simply looking for a surrogate of a normal relationship that for many reasons cannot be found and built outside the clubs. I could make the example of myself, I am coming fro. Some long term relationships (once even seriously thought to get married) but then at the end my very demanding job got always in the middle and my weird working schedule with no limits in terms of time and no predictability always made my fiancees run away. I cannot plan anything, often I also missed my trips to clubs because something comes up at work and so slowly but relentlessy all this drove me to a recurrent and constant "use" of the clubs. I know I made my choice between carrier and happy family (even if sometimes I am wondering if I will ever be happy when I will get the real money my job can grant.) , but at the end when I am in the clubs I find often myself behaving with the girls as I would do with my girlfriend. It is happening exactly the same with my current favorite, I think it will end as in Dufey's case even if she is much more attentive and she has promised things about her and me in the next couple of months. I drew a line for myself, if these things will not happen I will force myself not quite for a while going in the club where she works in order to forget her or at least in order to get a new balance.

However, the point is, are we sometimes simply looking for a girlfriend in the clubs but we do not admit that because we should say we are so desperate for our normal life that we could accept easily that our girlfriend is a prostitue?

Maybe I am the only one who has come so far by reasoning but I feel sometimes like that. I cannot keep a relationship outside cause my stile of life and my job so maybe an other damaged person could be sensible enough to get along with me.

However, Dufey do not worry about going to that club afterward if you break up with your girl, your friends will do for sure their best to come with you in other clubs, but my advice is always to face your demons to win them. She is the one who wants to be a prostitute, you have nothing to be ashamed of if you should cross her path in the future. It sounds like you did you best and you were a gentleman. So nothing she could complain about you whatever decision you make.

Indi Companion

12-06-12, 18:15

So my 1 million dollar question "how on earth do I forget her as I think about her day and night".

These women are really deadly.However, for answering your question, either you follow the wise advice of AM or you face your destiny and maybe you end up like me that I am seeing my favorite couple of time per month with an astronomic impact on my finances (!) amd so we will end up together with Dufey and we will most likely form the ex-husbands club!

Take care, these girls can be very addictive, they know exactly all our week points and how to make the best profit out of it.

Indi Companion, the one waiting for having his heart broken (again)!

Indi Companion

12-06-12, 20:33

The captain strikes again. All BS, with the same writing style as CaptCabin, Yakob, our past friend Amtripna or whatever. You are not fooling anyone. This is why there has been such a dearth of credible reports lately. I have to admit you keep a nice conversation going with yourself.Hey SJ see'mon stop your useless crusade. Are you really serious saying Dufey and Amriptna are the same? Go back and see what and how the two of them wrote and maybe you will understand why nobody is ever even commenting or taking into consideration your blablabla.

However, obviously you can now say that I am also the same person as Dufey, CaptCabin, Yakob (who actually once I really met in NRW) and Amriptna. One more or one less is all the same!

And if you like a credible report go back and read what people like Yakob and Amriptna wrote and you will see some useful reports.

Now please start attacking also me, otherwise I would feel myself forlorn, LOL!

Breadman

12-06-12, 22:13

Indi Companion

12-06-12, 22:24

Simple question to everyone who's commented about having a crush on a working girl. What's the age gap? If its more than 20 years, your probably older than her father. Simple fact of the matter is if your paying her for sex, she's not your girlfriend. Now if she takes you to the room in the club and fucks your brains out and then tells you there's no charge, then there might be something to build on there. Not a relationship, a threesome.That's true but not 100% tightproof. However, take my current case of favorite, our age gat is 12 years so it is not the fabel of the beaty and the beast. Not always, these are often too easy comments to be done in such situation but not all customers in a club are well over 50 dreaming of a second golden age.

RonnieNorway

12-06-12, 23:19

Simple question to everyone who's commented about having a crush on a working girl. What's the age gap? If its more than 20 years, your probably older than her father. Simple fact of the matter is if your paying her for sex, she's not your girlfriend. Now if she takes you to the room in the club and fucks your brains out and then tells you there's no charge, then there might be something to build on there. Not a relationship, a threesome.Mine is 10 years. She is 20 and I am 30.

I pay for sex only thing I got was extra minutes. However there was one time I got 30 minutes but could be an investment on her part.

But melissa from oase did tell me there was an oase girl who left with a guy she met in the club. He always drop by at oase to see her and somehow they found love. They are still together after 2 years. But of course there is no way I can know whether what this melissa told me is the truth or not. It could happen though duffey.

Pretty women. Anna nicole smith. You germans are so lucky

StarletVoyager

12-07-12, 01:08

This has shown me you do have a heart. For it is completely natural that if you are to become so intimately intertwined with a girl that emotions may or as in your case have arisen. In fact it would be abnormal if a fkk visitor never in all of his visits to the clubs never felt the slightest twinge. Hell on my last trip I even had antonia from mainhatten etched into my psyche as the lufthansa a320 I was on glided in smoothly at night over a beautifully lit up london by night as we came into heathrow. Oh I thought how far away now are those sapphire blue eyes, what beast is devouring her now I wondered as the flaps of the plane came down. This is completely normal, for how long ago was it in your real life in the real world that such a beauty like this did all those special things (which I'd love to know about) , to you.

Now the negatives; we've all been in long term relationships or relationships at some point. Weve all made a decision to enjoy the clubs, but you apparently think that a girl who can make upwards of 5k euros a week is really going to give that up for a young stud let alone a middleaged man? No no no! Its time to get real bro, for even if a fkk girl did feel something and even if you were a millionaire who could pay her way, in which case her independence would be comprimised, and that is the key financal independence, self sufficiency is what these clubs give her, and a model of which unless she becomes a renowned academic or business person later in life, this is the only way now she can afford her flat, her small car and believe me you she cannot give that up. Now you sound like a very kind soul with all this bare naked orgy love romance nonsence, but please 1) give yourself time to forget about her, for it is what you cannot have that you desire, and 2) get back in those friiggen clubs man, and enjoy the nakedness and sex on display and enjoy!

Yakob

12-07-12, 01:18

Meeps77

12-07-12, 01:19

After the number of trips I've taken you think I'd know the answer to this. But is swallowing considered and extra (cim 50 swallow 50) or is it something the girl may / may not do for free with the cim 50? I've never asked for it, and except for a few times they've always spit into a towel.

Simex

12-07-12, 01:23

Depends on the girls Meeps. Some do some don't. CIM not my cup of tea unless it's free.

After the number of trips I've taken you think I'd know the answer to this. But is swallowing considered and extra (cim 50 swallow 50) or is it something the girl may / may not do for free with the cim 50? I've never asked for it, and except for a few times they've always spit into a towel.

Simex

12-07-12, 01:30

Agree with Indi. Although I hit the EE scene in the late late 90's where an hour in Warsaw / Prague was still $30/$50.

FKK & Saunaclubs in Germany are the best for lineup, variety, service and value. Never done South America, so can't comment. But Mongolia.

Is one place to punt for freebies. Plenty of mixed Russian girls with oriental looks. Damn attractive.

I have been spending all my money in trip all around the world with all the annexes. South America, Asian Far East included. I think the paradise for all mongers were the Eastern European Countries back in the early 90's. That was a paradise where you were getting the best looking girls for free or for a few money in terms of shopping or dinner to a restaurant. Unfortunately it is no longer like that, currently you have to get despersed in the deep country side of Ukrain or Russia to get it. To hard.

If I think from a quality / quantity / price perspective, my opinion is that in this very moment Germany and its FKKs and Sauna Clubs is unbeatable. But then, it is only my opinion and of course as usual it depends on your taste.

Simex

12-07-12, 01:34

You're probably right S Jack. We probably need Jackson to smoke these guys (or girls) out.

I do sense all these alias could be the work of one person.

Think Jackson needs to apply the GT door policy and ban any members with more than 1 username per IP address.

The captain strikes again. All BS, with the same writing style as CaptCabin, Yakob, our past friend Amtripna or whatever. You are not fooling anyone. This is why there has been such a dearth of credible reports lately. I have to admit you keep a nice conversation going with yourself.

Meeps77

12-07-12, 01:36

Depends on the girls Meeps. Some do some don't. CIM not my cup of tea unless it's free.For the ones that do, is it a know extra or just a service they provide with the cim?

CaptCabin

12-07-12, 04:09

Agree with Indi. Although I hit the EE scene in the late late 90's where an hour in Warsaw / Prague was still $30/$50.

FKK & Saunaclubs in Germany are the best for lineup, variety, service and value. Never done South America, so can't comment. But Mongolia.

Is one place to punt for freebies. Plenty of mixed Russian girls with oriental looks. Damn attractive.LOL you too simex. Well t seems smoky jack paranoia is getting to you to. Yakob, armpit1111 and me are different people LOL.

Anyway feel free to think what you want but I can attest to you that anyone who goes to the club at the same time and know the girls will see that my reports are correct dead on. Ufortunately it is hard to validate Smoky jack or Ortos report as they have yet to write one yet in spite of claiming to be there. Most of their reports are about trolls, accusation and bla2.

Smoky went on a sex tour of germany so please share your report smokey rather than share crumbs to other fellow members (one or 2 girls only). Nevertheless I did give smokey my Christmas present passed on from my beloved monika, vanessa to smoky. I hope you test positive my good friend smokey. Positive in life I mean.

Simex do you think a short trip to switzerland for monering is good? Would a trip to zurich be too expensive (I mean payment to the ladies). Would probably go there after new year. Flights and accomodation fully paid by the EU.

Hessen Bub

12-07-12, 10:05

But melissa from oase did tell me there was an oase girl who left with a guy she met in the club. He always drop by at oase to see her and somehow they found love. They are still together after 2 years. But of course there is no way I can know whether what this melissa told me is the truth or not.True. These things happen. They may go well forever or just for a short time. Girls have also returened to the clubs after 1. 5 year relationships (with former clients).

HB

Neutron Flux

12-07-12, 18:15

You're probably right S Jack. We probably need Jackson to smoke these guys (or girls) out.

I do sense all these alias could be the work of one person.

Think Jackson needs to apply the GT door policy and ban any members with more than 1 username per IP address.Unfortunately, it's very easy to fake IPs. I doubt they are all one person, but surely there's a lot of BS at present in this and the Oase thread. Moderation based on content is what was urgently needed.

You germans are so luckyLucky and cursed at the same time, that's all I'm saying to this. As you can see in this and other threads, a few things can easily mess with your head, among other stuff.

Catmouse123

12-08-12, 09:56

Angus Magee

12-08-12, 10:30

Does anyone know if the girls will let you finger their pussy for free? Or does this cost extra? Also do you have to ask or can you just stick your fingers in there while she is giving you a blowjob? Thanks for any adviceOne can not give a definitive answer to this question. Generally though the girls are cautious with fingering. I think a lot of guys are less than gentle with it and the hands can carry bacteria, and badly manicured nails, that can lead to bladder infections and worse. Having 8-12 guys fingering the pussy every day can lead to a lot of health problems which will then effect the girl's ability to work.

My experience is that it is something that might happen but usually with a girl after a few sessions. I have been turned down more often than not but when it has been allowed I have never been charged for it.

AM

Praj4

12-08-12, 13:01

The girls in fkk club are mostly messed up. When you hear how they justify themselves for prostituition you will be shocked.

She doesn't want a relationship considering she basically selling her soul so that she can buy a house and a car in romania and I don't think she would give up all of that for you considering she is giving everything she has of value when she enter this bussiness. How can you blame her if she is manipulating you.* There is nothing messed about these girls, only natural for her because

1]Female brain doesnot harbour any concept of morality, it's produce of man's brain! , She doesn't have to worry about morality as evolutionarily speaking whosoever she fucks with the kid will have her 50% genes while man can never know for sure that whichever kid he is feeding many not be his!

2]only other criterias driving her behaviour are

*her status in the minds of her friends and relatives I, e known people.this is a big world / city hence anonimity is guaranteed!

*her financial security-she earns this way many times more than a clark or waitress considering her educational background!

3]Thus there is nothing to lose for her, win a win situation atleast for the present, till she is young and fit! She surely can buy a flat, maintain a car + some equity as bank balance in say 10yrs, just change places.

The Cane

12-08-12, 14:36

Does anyone know if the girls will let you finger their pussy for free? Or does this cost extra? Also do you have to ask or can you just stick your fingers in there while she is giving you a blowjob? Thanks for any adviceI have found that the overwhelming majority of the girls don't allow fingering. It's not that they don't take pleasure from it. Like AM says, they are concerned about getting infections.

ZimmerBaby

12-08-12, 15:53

Really appreciate your input regarding this.Visit your doctor.

Meeps77

12-08-12, 15:59

I tried to do it but none let me put a finger in citing feaar of infection.

By the way I am not sure ho to say this but after coming back from my fkk trip I am having severe sore throoat, lot of coughing and a fever. But nothing on my penis so thank god. Anyway do you think I should be worried but the sore throat I would say bad and I am sort of concern.

Really appreciate your input regarding this.I've had many allow it while permorming BBBJ. Once in a while I'm told no.

See a doctor, how do you expect a bunch of mongerers to diagnose you through a keyboard? .

The Cane

12-08-12, 16:20

By the way I am not sure ho to say this but after coming back from my fkk trip I am having severe sore throat, lot of coughing and a fever.

Really appreciate your input regarding this.This is actually a very common occurrence for mongers who engage in a lot of DFK, and a prime reason why a lot of girls won't do DFK. Again, it's not because they don't like it. It's like the fingers in the pussy thing. They don't want to get sick. Think about it. We're kissing on this one and kissing on that one. You're bound to pick up lots of germs. After my very first trip to Rio where DFK is pretty standard on the menu with most of the girls, I got sick as a dog with sore throat and a light fever. I knew I would definitely be going back and doing the same things, so I had to find a away to engage in "the practice" and remain healthy. Picking up from other mongers, I found the cure. Ever since that first trip to Rio, I now make sure that I gargle regularly. Before and after sessions. In my hotel room before I leave for a club and when I return from one. Gargle, gargle, gargle to disinfect those tonsils AND get sufficient rest and sleep so as not to run your body down and weaken its natural defenses against illness. Slow down! Those tutes aren't going anywhere! This has been my strategy ever since the aftermath of that first trip to Rio, and it has worked. At least for me it has. Gargle frequently. Rest sometimes. Get sufficient sleep. Eat to nourish your body. It definitely won't hurt you to do these things. And it just might prevent sore throats and fever, which is what it has done for me.

CaptCabin

12-08-12, 19:27

I tried to do it but none let me put a finger in citing feaar of infection.

By the way I am not sure ho to say this but after coming back from my fkk trip I am having severe sore throoat, lot of coughing and a fever. But nothing on my penis so thank god. Anyway do you think I should be worried but the sore throat I would say bad and I am sort of concern.

Really appreciate your input regarding this.Jut tell the truth. Better knowing and get it treated. If it Hurts the Treat it.

Catmouse123

12-08-12, 21:06

I've had many allow it while permorming BBBJ. Once in a while I'm told no.

.Thanks for all the great advice. Do you just slowly creep your fingers in as she is giving you the BJ or do you ask first and then stick them in?

Thanks for all the feedback.

Kimino

12-08-12, 22:37

Thanks for all the great advice. Do you just slowly creep your fingers in as she is giving you the BJ or do you ask first and then stick them in?

Thanks for all the feedback.I usually send in a faxed request a couple of days before visiting the club. Make sure you attach a picture of your hand (the one you are going to use for fingering obviously) , but remember, if it's not scale 1:1 use some object on the picture as a reference for real dimensions. A pack of cigarettes is fine or an ipod for non smokers, a wrist watch is also ok but make sure the brand and model is clear. Black and white image is normally accepted.

Kimino

Angus Magee

12-08-12, 22:50

I usually send in a faxed request a couple of days before visiting the club. Make sure you attach a picture of your hand (the one you are going to use for fingering obviously) , but remember, if it's not scale 1:1 use some object on the picture as a reference for real dimensions. A pack of cigarettes is fine or an ipod for non smokers, a wrist watch is also ok but make sure the brand and model is clear. Black and white image is normally accepted.

KiminoDoh....That is why I have been so unsuccessful in my fingering efforts. I have never once informed them by fax....

Thanks for the insight Herr K.

AM

Free Dude

12-08-12, 23:39

What fingering is concerned there can be a whole range of things that play a role. First of all the guy; besides having your nails trimmed, I can imagine the demeanor of the man can also be of influence. I'm always pretty relaxed and not too 'firm' in the way I touch the girls (that's why they're always surprised that I give such crapy massages) , the same with touching her pussy and then slowly 'entering'. Still plenty of girls that tell me 'no' when I am playing around a bit, but more like 60/65% than 'the vast majority'. If you give off the vibe of going to 'fuck her silly', she probably won't want you to do that with your fingers as well.

The club matters a great deal as well; just like kissing, there often is pressure on the girls not to do stuff that 'the girls' decide is not done. In clubs like Bernds, Babylon, Freude and (for some reason) Planet Eden, the percentage lies way above 50% and I would almost say it is rare to be denied fingering. In Livingroom I've never been able to get a girl that allows fingering; Sharks, Oase, World, Samya and GT it is about average: 30/40% that have allowed it.

It can also depend on the day for the girl; during 'her time of the month' she might not allow it (although I've also been in the situation to encounter 'the sponge'). One particluar favorite seems to randomly allow it or not. Mostly gotten to do with how wet she is, so when I'm her first client (often) she encourages it, but if she has already done some Zimmers (this girl is busy) she is noticeably drier and might ask me not to.