View Full Version : German FKK Clubs - Lounge and chat area
BrownFish1234
05-22-19, 04:18
My first post here.
I've done all of my hobbying in Tijuana and USA, but I'm about venture out to Frankfurt in August for 3 days and Paris for 2 days. I've been doing research on the FKK clubs for a couple of months. But I'm ready to soak up as much info as I can.
I'm looking for some detailed info on the four Frankfurt area FKK 's. Mainhattan. Palace. Sharks. Oase.
1 . Size of the clubs and the average female attendance during daytime / night time and weekday / weekend.
2. $$ required for GFE (DFK DATY MSOG mpcfs bbjcim).
3 . Rough estimate on the age of the ladies and their ethnicity.
4 . How to make it to the clubs using bus, train or tram, NOT taxi, from the Frankfurt main hbf station.
I am also interested in visiting the RLD area if time permits. Any info would be appreciated.
I understand everybody has their own views and opinions of the clubs. I'm trying to look at it from all points of views. Thanks.
Sebastiane
05-22-19, 15:05
1. Since I have a thing for Romanian girls (as many of us FKK old timers do!) I'm thinking of going to Romania for a holiday. What are the best places to go to say for a week? Off the top of my head I can think of Constanta, Bucharest and Transylvania (for Dracula 's castle). Any other suggestions would be welcome. What if I wanted to monger whilst there?
2. Option 2 is to take a Romanian regular (if she agrees!) to a holiday with me to either Romania or another country (eg Turkish Riviera) for a few days.
Which option is better?
This is my first post here.
My first trip to Frankfurt is coming up on August 14 . I'll be there for 3 days. I've done all of my hobbying in Tijuana and USA.
I've been doing research for the past couple of months about the German FKK clubs.
I would appreciate it very much if some of you can provide me with some info about mainhattan, palace, sharks, Oase.
1. Size of the clubs and the general number of ladies during the time of the day, weekday and weekend.
2. $$ if I'm looking for GFE. DFK DATY MSOG mpcfs bbjcim.
3 . Average age and ethnicity of the ladies.
4 . Ways to get to the club other than taxi from the Frankfurt hbf train station.
Any other info about what to do and what not to do is very much appreciated.
If time permits I might venture into the RLD as well. Will appreciate some input on this.
After Frankfurt I have a two day trip to Paris.You posted in the right thread of this forum, so I assume you already read at least some posts throughout ISG? If yes, all you need to do is some more reading (you have couple of months to read enough and prep anyway) and you will have all questions answered.
Knowing what I know now, if I were you, for my first ever FKK trip of only 3 days, I would go 1 day Oase, 1 day Sharks and repeat the club I liked better on the 3rd day. I prefer girls fully nude, so l would avoid Sharks on Tuesdays and Oase on Thursdays.
Welcome to ISG, good luck and enjoy. Very likely your only problem after your first FKK trip will be that you will not enjoy any of the sex traps in USA.
Kosher Kowboy
05-22-19, 16:37
Welcome to ISG, good luck and enjoy. Very likely your only problem after your first FKK trip will be that you will not enjoy any of the sex traps in USA.I agree Gino he will be forever yearning for FKK clubs back in the states but this guy doesn't come from too shitty an area for mongering in the states ( or at least travels to such) rather a very affordable one and has quite a good resume here and knows Tijuana quite well; looks like adding in the FKKs will give him a good balance if he joins us for good.
I welcome him aboard too and hope some of you mainstream guys can assist him in his questions. Sometimes the ISG despite all the info we all provide can be a tad overwhelming at first but you are right he has plenty of time. Starting early in one's hunt is always a good move.
You know, if you maybe rent a Passat or a car that is not a two person vehicle perhaps we can take him to see Amira and Diana with us :D
I cross with the guy maybe I will take care of the Mainhatten part if he goes there and go with him. And perhaps Lanthano if he comes out of hiding can complete his tour as I think he posted he does not wish to visit the red toweled Gypsies alone. And speaking of Lanthano I think all newbies to Germany would greatly benefit by reading his reviews many in the ROD section' well written, easy to follow and all provide a good walk thru of each place.
Brownfish.
For public transport bahn.de is invaluable. Go to the English version. It will tell you everything (times, prices, maps, and so on) door to door.
Ethnicity. Primarily Romanian or Romanian Roma. Aged between 18 to 30. English is the lingua franca ;) in the bigger clubs
As for service and price that is up to you. I never pay more than 50 per 30 minutes and expect dfk and daty. However this level of price/service can be a bit elusive in Palace, Sharks, Mainhatten, and Oase. In some other clubs it is fairly easy to find, plus additional services. My mantra is : the individual girl needs my money more than I need her
Although a newbie to FKK, make sure you don't appear so. Some girls specialise in catching new guys who don't know the ropes. But if you take your time and relax you will do fine: as long as you have euros :D
Good luck.
Neurosynth
05-22-19, 21:45
I have a business trip coming up to the Bielefeld area- which seems in the middle of nowhere in club's geography. Most clubs that I am familiar with around Dusseldorf / Cologne area are at least 2 hours away; same to Hamburg. Any info suggestions in this are appreciated.There is this Eros Center. The nice thing about such places is that you can just walk through and pick a girl without the overhead of an FKK. Great for a quickie or even a not-so-quickie. But quality varies from one to the next, and I'm not sure how this one is rated. The price I've seen quoted is 50 e for 15 minutes, but keep in mind there is no entry fee.
https://www.eros-bielefeld.com/galerie
http://jako.dapnet.de/lgp-bielefeld.htm
https://www.google.com/maps/@52.0330371,8.5530325,3a,75y,279.19h,92.32t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sUrABazsxsgXO13xgWM2vyg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en
I prefer girls fully nude, so l would avoid Sharks on Tuesdays and Oase on Thursdays.Unless he is like me and prefers a bit of sexy lingerie. As all the nudity can get a bit boring. Lingerie is a bit of exotic spice on a dish of meat.
There is this Eros Center. The nice thing about such places is that you can just walk through and pick a girl without the overhead of an FKK. Great for a quickie or even a not-so-quickie. But quality varies from one to the next, and I'm not sure how this one is rated. The price I've seen quoted is 50 e for 15 minutes, but keep in mind there is no entry fee.
https://www.eros-bielefeld.com/galerie
http://jako.dapnet.de/lgp-bielefeld.htm
https://www.google.com/maps/@52.0330371,8.5530325,3a,75y,279.19h,92.32t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sUrABazsxsgXO13xgWM2vyg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en.I totally agree. Just walk in and hit and walk out and eat a nice meal after.
Unless he is like me and prefers a bit of sexy lingerie. As all the nudity can get a bit boring. Lingerie is a bit of exotic spice on a dish of meat.Many girls are not anymore full naked at Oase or Sharks, many bra at Oase, even for Katrin. Bu who has beautiful natural tits.
1. Since I have a thing for Romanian girls (as many of us FKK old timers do!) I'm thinking of going to Romania for a holiday. What are the best places to go to say for a week? Off the top of my head I can think of Constanta, Bucharest and Transylvania (for Dracula 's castle). Any other suggestions would be welcome. What if I wanted to monger whilst there?
2. Option 2 is to take a Romanian regular (if she agrees!) to a holiday with me to either Romania or another country (eg Turkish Riviera) for a few days.
Which option is better?I prefer to avoid Romanian invitations for shopping, for visiting. Even some of them react, not only about money business, becoming so jealous or angry or wet eyes, but this is business money and I m not interested to have a prostitute who is fucked by everybody for girlfriend. FKK pleasures are better to stay in FKK land. But I was often said Romania is a beautiful country: mountains around Brasov, around Danube to back sea.
I prefer to avoid Romanian invitations for shopping, for visiting. Even some of them react, not only about money business, becoming so jealous or angry or wet eyes, but this is business money and I m not interested to have a prostitute who is fucked by everybody for girlfriend. FKK pleasures are better to stay in FKK land. But I was often said Romania is a beautiful country: mountains around Brasov, around Danube to back sea.Danube finishing in black sea.
"Das gibt's doch gar nicht"!
Seriously, I doubt that you will find any good clubs around this area or else we would hear about them. The best I can offer is a few places you could reach if you had a car. FKK Villa in Hanover, Golden Night in Herford, Love Toxic in Enger, Sauna Club Yasmin in Melle, Zeus FKK Club in Osnabruk and finally Wellness Sauna Club in Bad Lippspringe. I know absolutely nothing about them but if the Autobahn exit to Bielefeld is still closed then maybe you could take a chance.Thank you very much for the suggestions, Downandup; I will be renting a car. Website of some of these look promising!
There is this Eros Center. The nice thing about such places is that you can just walk through and pick a girl without the overhead of an FKK. Great for a quickie or even a not-so-quickie. But quality varies from one to the next, and I'm not sure how this one is rated. The price I've seen quoted is 50 e for 15 minutes, but keep in mind there is no entry fee. Thank you, Neurosynth. Very good information and links.
DiverOyster
05-24-19, 05:33
1. Since I have a thing for Romanian girls (as many of us FKK old timers do!) I'm thinking of going to Romania for a holiday. What are the best places to go to say for a week? Off the top of my head I can think of Constanta, Bucharest and Transylvania (for Dracula 's castle). Any other suggestions would be welcome. What if I wanted to monger whilst there?
2. Option 2 is to take a Romanian regular (if she agrees!) to a holiday with me to either Romania or another country (eg Turkish Riviera) for a few days.
Which option is better?1. I thought about visiting Romania too since I love Romanian women at FKKs. However, there are more negative reports than positive reports in ISG's Romania section. Therefore, I am hesitated to take the chance since I don't have a lot of vacation time to waste. I play safe and keep going back to FKKs, especially Globe, Club Swiss, and Westside in CH since I am guaranteed to have good services at these clubs.
2. I inquired one Globe regular about her escort rate per day (24 hours) if I were to visit her in Romania when she's not on tour. She wanted 2,500 CHF a day. She's super hot though.
I have been drinking coffee for over 30 years every day like many people do. And I know it is not big deal substance by media and by our experience including mine. But anyways, I decided to stop drinking coffee cold turkey like a month ago.
Oddly, ever since I stopped drinking coffee my erection got much more stronger and I am back to my 20's able to cum over 5 times per day without any problem. And sperm volume increased dramatically. I never knew caffeine / coffee was doing me some kind of negative thing to my body.
1. I thought about visiting Romania too since I love Romanian women at FKKs. However, there are more negative reports than positive reports in ISG's Romania section. Therefore, I am hesitated to take the chance since I don't have a lot of vacation time to waste. I play safe and keep going back to FKKs, especially Globe, Club Swiss, and Westside in CH since I am guaranteed to have good services at these clubs.
2. I inquired one Globe regular about her escort rate per day (24 hours) if I were to visit her in Romania when she's not on tour. She wanted 2,500 CHF a day. She's super hot though.She doesn't like You much to ask you such expensive rate 2500 CHF for a day when she is in poor Romania, about 8 months average salary in deep miserable Romania where they come from, not in expensive Zurich. I think for less expensive I can have a Russian escort out of agency for whole week end. I'm not interested, I prefer other places for my holidays, for real sports, free riding or bicycle climbing, but if I decided to go for visit when they propose, I would never pay and they can decide what we would do. I think You should better keep on enjoying fucking her in public at Globe. FKK are very different from real life.
Frankfurt.
I'm a newbie and I'll visit Frankfurt at 6th June maybe for 3 days.
I've been doing research for the past couple of months about the German FKK clubs but a little bit confused about my choice.
I would appreciate it very much if some of you can provide me with some info about Sharks and Oase.
1. Probably I m considering visit Sharks or Oase on Thursdays. Is it a good day? I'm searching for best line up. How many girls probably will be up?
Are they fully naked or in lingerie?
2. I'm looking for PSE DFK DATY BBJ.
3 . The half an hour session exists or always you have to take the 1 hour program? Is it possible to one of the services that I mention on half an hour program?
4 . Is on June open the pool outdoors always or depending the weather?
5. Is a jacuzzi on both clubs available?
6. Do you think the choice of these clubs worth? Do you propose something else better?
Thanks a lot for your answers and your time.
Polyamorist
05-24-19, 14:47
I inquired one Globe regular about her escort rate per day (24 hours) if I were to visit her in Romania when she's not on tour. She wanted 2,500 CHF a day. She's super hot though.Only 2,500 a day? Where's her ambition? MacKenzie Bezos earned $35 billion from her marriage. That works out as $3,666,092 a day, or, if you can only afford an hour, $155,670. I think there was also a documentary where a woman called Demi Moore was getting a cool million for overnighters.
First, I should preface by saying that I personally have not done this yet. So, take my view FWIW. I would have a tough time explaining why I suddenly have a Romanian Visa stamp in my passport to my spouse, whereas she knows I go to DE a fair amount on business.
But I do know people who have done this.
In my view, if you are going to try it then first choose a girl that you know and like well. Find someone who is reliable. I would only go with someone who has spent sometime with you outside the club, such as your hotel rooms in DE. That gives you a sense of her demeanor outside the club walls.
Many FKK girls are not super reliable. Many of them may catfish or ghost you. If you are going to spend a lot of money and book flights and hotel rooms, then it makes sense to make sure you have a girl (s) lined up. The last thing you want to do is travel all the way to Romania and having to masturbate to the same porn you could have watched in your own bed (unless your primary reason for going there is the sightseeing part itself and not the mongering hobby).
As other people said below, the negotiation should include all aspects such as how many days she will stay with you, how much you will pay her and how often you expect to have sex, would you be responsible for any of her other expenses and incidentals and so on.
It is not a good idea in my opinion to first go there and look for girls that are new to you. Romania is not known as an attractive mongering destination. Lacking local knowledge, it is not easy to find good WGs in a hurry. Your frustration will increase with each passing hour and there is a risk that you will make sub-optimal decisions.
1. Since I have a thing for Romanian girls (as many of us FKK old timers do!) I'm thinking of going to Romania for a holiday. What are the best places to go to say for a week? Off the top of my head I can think of Constanta, Bucharest and Transylvania (for Dracula 's castle). Any other suggestions would be welcome. What if I wanted to monger whilst there?
2. Option 2 is to take a Romanian regular (if she agrees!) to a holiday with me to either Romania or another country (eg Turkish Riviera) for a few days.
Which option is better?
Sebastiane
05-24-19, 16:20
1. I thought about visiting Romania too since I love Romanian women at FKKs. However, there are more negative reports than positive reports in ISG's Romania section. Therefore, I am hesitated to take the chance since I don't have a lot of vacation time to waste. I play safe and keep going back to FKKs, especially Globe, Club Swiss, and Westside in CH since I am guaranteed to have good services at these clubs.
2. I inquired one Globe regular about her escort rate per day (24 hours) if I were to visit her in Romania when she's not on tour. She wanted 2,500 CHF a day. She's super hot though.2500 for 24 hours? That's about the going rate for high end escorts in Switzerland and London and ex pornstars. Which Globe regular was it? (You can PM if you want). Globe is 280/ HR so I guess that's a bargain from their perspective!
2500 for 24 hours? That's about the going rate for high end escorts in Switzerland and London and ex pornstars. Which Globe regular was it? (You can PM if you want). Globe is 280/ HR so I guess that's a bargain from their perspective!From German FKKs, if the girl is comfortable with you and even slightly enjoys your company, you can get her for 600-800 e per day, and even cheaper for multiple days. This includes even the most beautiful or most in-demand girls in big FKKs. Visiting Romania with her is even cheaper, about 400-500 e per day, or could even be free if she really likes you (doesn't need to "love" you). I haven't tried anyone from Globe yet, but still I think 2200 e (2500 CHF) per day sounds way too high. For all day or all week, these girls charge much less as they know you won't be fucking her 24 times, at the most 8-10 times, plus she will have zero other expenses for club fees, food, travel etc, she may get to visit some nice new places or restaurants or nightclubs with someone she likes (even if very slightly). And she doesn't have to hustle to get any business those days, much easier than a club day as long as she enjoys your company, not like gets headaches from you talking LOL. Key is to have that human connection, more so for longer term appointments or trips together, even in her business of prostitution and your act of buying sex.
Another good reasonably priced alternate all day or all week option is the girls from some of the legitimate Czech operations, eg the famous https://roycedolls.com/models. But they are not as open to (read "used to") being naked in public or having sex in public as the FKK girls, so that's a negative if you want such fantasies come true.
There is this Eros Center. The nice thing about such places is that you can just walk through and pick a girl without the overhead of an FKK. Great for a quickie or even a not-so-quickie. But quality varies from one to the next, and I'm not sure how this one is rated. The price I've seen quoted is 50 e for 15 minutes, but keep in mind there is no entry fee.I've only experienced the Eros Center in Frankfurt, and as you noted, the quality varies. For me the quality was always sub par. But again, the nice thing is you walk in, take a walk through. If you find someone you like, you stay, if not you just keep going.
2500 for 24 hours? That's about the going rate for high end escorts in Switzerland and London and ex pornstars. Which Globe regular was it? (You can PM if you want). Globe is 280/ HR so I guess that's a bargain from their perspective!That actually is about 100 per hour, so it is not too bad of price though long hours should given some discount, but who want to spend 24 hours with prostitute, max I can stay with them is let say 2 hours, I do not want to be with them for longer than that since I only seek sex with prostitute and not more.
Hank Moody 69
05-25-19, 00:40
Frankfurt.
I'm a newbie and I'll visit Frankfurt at 6th June maybe for 3 days.
I've been doing research for the past couple of months about the German FKK clubs but a little bit confused about my choice.
I would appreciate it very much if some of you can provide me with some info about Sharks and Oase.
1. Probably I m considering visit Sharks or Oase on Thursdays. Is it a good day? I'm searching for best line up. How many girls probably will be up?
Are they fully naked or in lingerie?
2. I'm looking for PSE DFK DATY BBJ.
3 . The half an hour session exists or always you have to take the 1 hour program? Is it possible to one of the services that I mention on half an hour program?
4 . Is on June open the pool outdoors always or depending the weather?
5. Is a jacuzzi on both clubs available?
6. Do you think the choice of these clubs worth? Do you propose something else better?
Thanks a lot for your answers and your time.Prepare to be overwhelmed.
1. Thursday should be ok. These clubs are huge and there are plenty of women throughout the week. Some only work the weekends. Most girls are fully naked. Some wear a hint of lingerie. If they're covered up, beware.
2. Yeah, sure. Just negotiate up front. Don't go to the room without a full agreement re: services and cost. Ask for anything you think you might want just in case. I usually ask for DATY and only occasionally partake.
3. I find that it's easy to get a 30 min session at Oase. At Sharks I have always chosen a 60 min session because we had great chemistry and I really liked the girl from the start. I've started to prefer 60 min sessions partially because I've gotten better at picking girls. Also, you sometimes get burned on a 30 min session. You probably want to do 30 min for your first session of the trip, and maybe even all of them, but some girls might refuse and other girls might give a poor performance or severely limit what you can do--possibly even limiting you to 1-2 positions. There is no recourse.
4. The pools at both clubs are already open. The weather in Frankfurt has been beautiful.
5. Yes, there are three on the upper floor of Sharks. I used one tonight. Oase has one you simply can't miss.
6. You'll be fine. These are both good clubs. Good luck!
Prepare to be overwhelmed.
1. Thursday should be ok.Thursday is dessous day at Oase, most girls will be wearing some lingerie. If you want to see most girls fully FKK naked on a Thursday, Sharks would be a better choice and an "wow! Experience" for a newbie.
I just left Oase for a Sunday afternoon. Lineup was awful. Like a bad RLD quality. Nothing above a 6. Very disappointing. Worst lineup I have seen in my 2 years FKKing.
Palace Saturday night was OK for me. 4 possibilities, with 1 stunner.
Sharks Friday night was also disappointing. 0 stunners for my eyes.
I love the FKK format with taking your pick from a room full of girls, but I am starting to think it is not worth the time and cost of traveling from the US. Unfortunately it sounds like the new law ruined FKKs and I missed the golden years.
BigBuddy69
05-26-19, 21:33
Just avoid all the tourists shitty clubs and you should be fine.
I just left Oase for a Sunday afternoon. Lineup was awful. Like a bad RLD quality. Nothing above a 6. Very disappointing. Worst lineup I have seen in my 2 years FKKing.
Palace Saturday night was OK for me. 4 possibilities, with 1 stunner.
Sharks Friday night was also disappointing. 0 stunners for my eyes.
I love the FKK format with taking your pick from a room full of girls, but I am starting to think it is not worth the time and cost of traveling from the US. Unfortunately it sounds like the new law ruined FKKs and I missed the golden years.Did you Ike these clubs before the law change in 2017?
It is interesting that you like the visuals of girls in Palace but not Oase and Sharks. That is not the opinion of a majority I would think. However, for any monger, the non opinion that counts is what his own brain and dick tells him.
By and large, the law led to prices going up for certain services as girls feel they can offer just covered blow jobs and charge extra for a BBBJ. It has not led to a reduction of the number of girls nor their looks in my view, at least in the mega clubs.
Unfortunately, I didn't start visiting Frankfurt until January 2018, so I don't know what is what like before the law change, but from reading the forums it sounds like the quality has gone downhill. And I am referring to the registration law, not the condom law. It has to be 95%+ Romanian girls in these clubs. I'd like to see a wider variety.
I'm moving on to Switzerland now. Sounds like Globe has more of what I am looking for.
Did you Ike these clubs before the law change in 2017?
It is interesting that you like the visuals of girls in Palace but not Oase and Sharks. That is not the opinion of a majority I would think. However, for any monger, the non opinion that counts is what his own brain and dick tells him.
By and large, the law led to prices going up for certain services as girls feel they can offer just covered blow jobs and charge extra for a BBBJ. It has not led to a reduction of the number of girls nor their looks in my view, at least in the mega clubs.
I just left Oase for a Sunday afternoon. Lineup was awful. Like a bad RLD quality. Nothing above a 6. Very disappointing. Worst lineup I have seen in my 2 years FKKing.
Palace Saturday night was OK for me. 4 possibilities, with 1 stunner.
Sharks Friday night was also disappointing. 0 stunners for my eyes.
I love the FKK format with taking your pick from a room full of girls, but I am starting to think it is not worth the time and cost of traveling from the US. Unfortunately it sounds like the new law ruined FKKs and I missed the golden years.If you want to see few beauties who are in clubs, better to go on best casting days. Sunday at Oase is for sure not the best casting day, even on Friday 24 May, 3 of my 4 girls were not working, 1 is at home since Easter, 1 also at home, 1 should work but not, but I repeated with my last beauty and I wish she will understand. Also Michele, Estefania, Adela, Isabela, black Sara, a black model type, blond Stefani, Mady, Vera, Roxana, Alice silicon, Alina / Marina, blond Miki, Selena, Erika, also 1 with a bit reddish long hair who doesn't want to give her name, were working on this Friday. I was disappointed because I returned for my hot woman type who told me she would work, but didn t and next time we will have to talk again, I also don t go with many Oase girls because they are not interesting behavior for me, but at the moment, I don t see higher level for looks in Germany. Except Melissa and black Sara, I confirm for disappointing casting at Sharks on Friday 17 May, even Evita, Brenda, Rebeka, Jellis, ex claimed Greek Elektra, Leoni. De, Ester now silicon, Karin, Inca, Jenifer, Paloma, Debora, Selina, Selena, Sade, Edina, were working. Yes at Palace can sometimes find a beauty, but have to be lucky. Better to choose best days to visit to enjoy beauties.
For higher level for looks, Globe Zurich for 130€/30 mn. Best days from Thursday to Saturday. Sometimes can find Globe level for look and in bed in Germany, sometimes even for 100 for 1 hour, I even had one for only 50 € for 30 very full minutes for our discovery and I returned to World on next Saturday, but for 1 hour.
...Visiting Romania with her is even cheaper, about 400-500 e per day, or could even be free if she really likes you (doesn't need to "love" you)...Why it is better deal when you visiting Romania with the girl? While inside Romanian she will want to visiting her family and not the customer I think. Does she expecting you to pay her plane ticket from Frankfurt? And why not take the girl to other Schengen vacation area instead for 400-500 daily?
Also there is concern of safety when customer is alone in Romania outside of FKK. The girl, no matter how nice she was in saunanclub, can make you easy target for robbing in Romania by the Romanian boyfriend, pimp, or mafia gangs.
In my limited experience it is not necessary to pay extra for services which always used to be the basic standard. To get this service for the price of 50 euros per 30 minutes does not require any compromise on optics.
Of course, as perhaps BB69 was suggesting, I don't bother going to Sharks or Oase as I am not in a position to establish myself as a weekly regular.
Unfortunately, I didn't start visiting Frankfurt until January 2018, so I don't know what is what like before the law change, but from reading the forums it sounds like the quality has gone downhill. And I am referring to the registration law, not the condom law. It has to be 95%+ Romanian girls in these clubs. I'd like to see a wider variety.
I'm moving on to Switzerland now. Sounds like Globe has more of what I am looking for.The Forum is good for getting technical info or perhaps sightings of specific girls. Just remember that many posts are fueled by emotion and can be irrational. Mountains are often made out of a mole hill because you are getting a lot of very subjective and disjunct reports and experiences. Quality has not dropped as much as many say. As for variety, from my experience, Switzerland and Austria is also very Romanian dominant. If Germany are 90% Romanian, Switzerland is at best 80% Romanian.
Unfortunately, I didn't start visiting Frankfurt until January 2018, so I don't know what is what like before the law change, but from reading the forums it sounds like the quality has gone downhill. And I am referring to the registration law, not the condom law. It has to be 95%+ Romanian girls in these clubs. I'd like to see a wider variety.
I'm moving on to Switzerland now. Sounds like Globe has more of what I am looking for.To be honest, if you have not visited prior to Jan 2018, there is no way to say that standard have declined in certain clubs in any way. It is all hearsay.
Plus, one or two vocal writing members might influence others to concur with them. Pretty soon, that becomes a common view. The last thing we should do is propagate this myth, as if it is a given fact. We should simply state what we observe and then add our own personal views and not restate what the dominant view is on the platform. Anyway, that's my view.
I am a new writer and have lurked here on and off. From what I recall writers here were saying club standards have been deteriorating even 2 or 3 or 4 years ago or what have you. As far as where the standards declined the most, there is no consensus. Vocal members play up their favorite clubs and denigrate other clubs.
As they say grass is always greener on the other side and sometimes it would appear that grass was always greener in the past.
Polyamorist
05-28-19, 04:06
Unfortunately, I didn't start visiting Frankfurt until January 2018, so I don't know what is what like before the law change, but from reading the forums it sounds like the quality has gone downhill. And I am referring to the registration law, not the condom law. It has to be 95%+ Romanian girls in these clubs. I'd like to see a wider variety.Colonel Forbin I know why you've come here
And I'll help you with your quest to gain the knowledge that you lack
It's true, the bureaucracy discourages local girls and high-quality girls in general from coming in to FKKs, so the ones that show up are increasingly the products of an assembly line and feel less and less real. They are dependent on their "managers" for accommodation, visas, etc.
I'm moving on to Switzerland now. Sounds like Globe has more of what I am looking for.Globe is better, but even there the stars are starting to age and are in short supply, while the system is flooded with factory types.
Just my 2 dirhams. 👳.
Why it is better deal when you visiting Romania with the girl? While inside Romanian she will want to visiting her family and not the customer I think. Does she expecting you to pay her plane ticket from Frankfurt? And why not take the girl to other Schengen vacation area instead for 400-500 daily?
Also there is concern of safety when customer is alone in Romania outside of FKK. The girl, no matter how nice she was in saunanclub, can make you easy target for robbing in Romania by the Romanian boyfriend, pimp, or mafia gangs.Sounds like you never had the luck of knowing a WG in a personal level. Try to have that human connection, then comment on the rates, safety etc? You might have a different opinion when an WG invites you to her home country, even buys your flight tickets and arranges your accommodation.
To be honest, if you have not visited prior to Jan 2018, there is no way to say that standard have declined in certain clubs in any way. It is all hearsay.
Plus, one or two vocal writing members might influence others to concur with them. Pretty soon, that becomes a common view. The last thing we should do is propagate this myth, as if it is a given fact. We should simply state what we observe and then add our own personal views and not restate what the dominant view is on the platform. Anyway, that's my view.
I am a new writer and have lurked here on and off. From what I recall writers here were saying club standards have been deteriorating even 2 or 3 or 4 years ago or what have you. As far as where the standards declined the most, there is no consensus. Vocal members play up their favorite clubs and denigrate other clubs.
As they say grass is always greener on the other side and sometimes it would appear that grass was always greener in the past.If it helps some of the newer mongers to feel good by thinking the FKK lineups were same quality 3-4 years back as it is now on average, let's go with that. It's like kids in today's high schools and colleges see mostly obese girls (or guys) and think that's the definition of beauty. No point bursting that bubble with the reference of history.
If it helps some of the newer mongers to feel good by thinking the FKK lineups were same quality 3-4 years back as it is now on average, let's go with that. It's like kids in today's high schools and colleges see mostly obese girls (or guys) and think that's the definition of beauty. No point bursting that bubble with the reference of history.I'm not a newer monger and I agree with Pesismist on this one, a few vocal members portray a skewed image of the club scene. Things go up and down from month to month and year to year but I do not notice a huge drop off. I do recognize that I look back fondly on some former stunners and even yearn for them.
ExpatLover
05-28-19, 08:57
To be honest, if you have not visited prior to Jan 2018, there is no way to say that standard have declined in certain clubs in any way. It is all hearsay.
Plus, one or two vocal writing members might influence others to concur with them. Pretty soon, that becomes a common view. The last thing we should do is propagate this myth, as if it is a given fact. We should simply state what we observe and then add our own personal views and not restate what the dominant view is on the platform. Anyway, that's my view.
I am a new writer and have lurked here on and off. From what I recall writers here were saying club standards have been deteriorating even 2 or 3 or 4 years ago or what have you. As far as where the standards declined the most, there is no consensus. Vocal members play up their favorite clubs and denigrate other clubs.
As they say grass is always greener on the other side and sometimes it would appear that grass was always greener in the past.I have 15 years of FKK visits behind me, and I don t agree at all with your opinion, several years back the LU were far more diverse many girls from Germany, Hungary, Poland, even some from Italy or France today 95% are from Romania and they try to control the clubs by increasing prices and decreasing the service. I guess that many nice girls are doing escort and left the FKK scene. Also the girls need less to be a prostitutes just because the economical situation of those countries improved a lot. It has nothing to do with nostalgia but for sure for me before it was better.
Sebastiane
05-28-19, 14:38
I agree that the line ups haven't declined (I've been mongering since 2007 in Germany FKK clubs) but what has tended to happen is that non Romanians have declined in numbers compared to before. I don't know why. What has definitely happened since July 2017 and the new law is many girls have started to charge extra for BBBJ. Other than that it's a case I think of memory being golden and rose tinted. Also when a man visits an FKK for the first time ever or even for the first few times the sheer spectacle of naked women in their 20's, all available, overwhelms the senses. It's how every one says that 'things were better in my days' or 'in the Olsen daya'! I myself have written wonderful descriptions of beauties at Palace from my early trips mongering and I have fond memories of Saskia, Martha, Natascha, Indira etc. Sure they were beautiful and I had great sex with all of them but if I saw them now for the first time with my many years of experience would I be as blown away as I was back then? Would I say Saskia is better than Megan? Was Indira hotter than Carmen? Was famous Marie of Oase as beautiful as some of the Globe girls or Marthaat Harmony? Who knows? The mind and memory are wonderful things but also unreliable. I was in a bookshop today and saw a photography book which had a cover photo of Giselle Bundchen. She's probably the most famous supermodel in the world in the last 20 years (she was naked on the cover showing her ass back) and sure she is a 10 but if she was just one of 50 naked girls at a Globe or Sharks or Oase would she stand out that much? I hope you understand my point. I've been with over 200 girls now and honestly now no matter how hot a girl seems I know when she is baked it won't be much different to the other 200+ I've seen. Having said that I've an addict and I know that so I get some girls whom I sometimes fall for who blow my mind for a while (currently Megan for example) but that's only until the next hottest one comes along. I guess I'm saying enjoy the present while you can and feel privileged to live experiences most men can only dream about and don't dream about the mythical past so much!
If it helps some of the newer mongers to feel good by thinking the FKK lineups were same quality 3-4 years back as it is now on average, let's go with that. It's like kids in today's high schools and colleges see mostly obese girls (or guys) and think that's the definition of beauty. No point bursting that bubble with the reference of history.I told him that one should be able to judge a lineup without reference to a mythical LU from the past. What does it matter that another monger feels girls were prettier and more plentiful in the past? He can't time travel and fuck them -- the only ones available are the ones in the club on the day you attend.
With time, some things get exaggerated and defects glossed over. A 70 year old guy might say girls from his youth and middle age were pretty and better.
Whose opinion is valid and authoritative? Not mine for sure, far from it. If you feel your voice is authoritative on this subject and he agrees with you, he will certainly follow that advice.
All of us are writing on German FKK forums now and presumably attending German FKKs. So, we are still able to find good sessions with attractive girls, no? If we can, others can. Takes some diligence but it can be done. It has always taken some diligence to find good sessions- this is true for all good stuff in life.
Well obesity is easy to monitor. Beauty is not. Especially when Romanians are not obese. What has gone up on the other hand is upselling. And the industry in Germany is in danger of ending up the same way it is in certain east European, south american, African or south east Asian countries, where integrity is low, and scams are high.
the bureaucracy discourages local girls and high-quality girls in general from coming in to FKKs, so the ones that show up are increasingly the products of an assembly line and feel less and less real. I agree with your above statement although in my view you are getting increasingly more eccentric and radicalized since we both started to post on certain threads about the same time and we both are locals.
From my experience as a local (so is Polyamorist), the lineup in German sex industry is getting stiller and lower in quality in the past 2 years. Due to the registration required by the new law, the turnover of WGs is much slower and the quality of new WGs is lower than 2 years ago because many girls wanted to try out as WGs, but they didn't want to go through the registration process. The ones who did go through the registration were the ones who had less concern about the registration impact on their future life, so they tended to be lower educated and with lower quality in general. I think that, more importantly in a practical terms, the lineup is getting stiller and static and there are much less new girls who have been getting into this business even for a brief time because of the registration. This phenomenon is more obvious in normal brothels where I regularly go than FKK clubs because vast majority of WGs in brothels are non-Romanians.
This somehow didn't impact me. The sim stays active as long as it's reloaded every 90 days. So for me I have no costs for the sim between visits. The new law only applies to the new sim card activated after July xx, 2018.
The ones who did go through the registration were the ones who had less concern about the registration impact on their future life, so they tended to be lower educated and with lower quality in general.Can anyone tell me how registration impacts their future? Does their status as working girls get shared w / other countries? I know of one that I would like her to visit me but I'm afraid if her status is available it might lead to in auto denial of visa. Thanks.
As much as we shouldn't live in the past and rather enjoy what's available currently, we shouldn't forget or ignore the history. Same goes for the FKK lineups (beauty, service, cost, quantity, quality, ethnic mix, background, personality etc etc) and it's history. Best is to feel it how you feel, no point arguing about it, same as no point arguing with today's obese kids about obesity that I mentioned earlier.
A wise man once said. To each his own.
I think you are absolutely correct that the turnover has come to a crawl. I also agree that quality is in general lower than 2-3 years ago. I just feel that it is not as terrible as it is made out to be. I don't visit normal brothels but in the Sauna club scene, I'd say the drop off is around a half point lower.
From my experience as a local (so is Polyamorist), the lineup in German sex industry is getting stiller and lower in quality in the past 2 years. Due to the registration required by the new law, the turnover of WGs is much slower and the quality of new WGs is lower than 2 years ago because many girls wanted to try out as WGs, but they didn't want to go through the registration process. The ones who did go through the registration were the ones who had less concern about the registration impact on their future life, so they tended to be lower educated and with lower quality in general. I think that, more importantly in a practical terms, the lineup is getting stiller and there are much less new girls who have been getting into this business even for a brief time because of the registration. The phenomenon is more obvious in normal brothels where I regularly go than FKK clubs because vast majority of WGs in brothels are non-Romanians.
Well obesity is easy to monitor. Beauty is not. Especially when Romanians are not obese. What has gone up on the other hand is upselling. And the industry in Germany is in danger of ending up the same way it is in certain east European, south american, African or south east Asian countries, where integrity is low, and scams are high.Are there clubs in any of those regions where you can pay one uniform price such as 50 E and guaranteed at least a fuck and suck, condom or not, in a relatively clean room and in a safe environment? Let alone all the other amenities that you find in a FKK club?
I feel that FKKs are still a great deal despite some mild deterioration in some aspects of service in some of the clubs.
Sancho Panza
05-29-19, 00:15
Can anyone tell me how registration impacts their future? Does their status as working girls get shared w / other countries? I know of one that I would like her to visit me but I'm afraid if her status is available it might lead to in auto denial of visa. Thanks.The very act of registering officially as a prostitute is enough to dissuade some ladies from participating in the business. It is no longer possible so much to casually participate as a hobbyheuren or part time hooker.
the quality of new WGs is lower than 2 years ago because many girls wanted to try out as WGs, but they didn't want to go through the registration process. The ones who did go through the registration were the ones who had less concern about the registration impact on their future life, so they tended to be lower educated and with lower quality in general. I think that, more importantly in a practical terms, the lineup is getting stiller and static and there are much less new girls who have been getting into this business even for a brief time because of the registration. This phenomenon is more obvious in normal brothels where I regularly go than FKK clubs because vast majority of WGs in brothels are non-Romanians.
Very well analyzed, similar to what I was concerned about since 2015.
I tend to miss German girls who are legal age enough to work in FKK trying out working girl as summer job or short period job to get fast cash. Once upon a time in FKK, there were some German teens who are basically real hottest girl in college type with no tattoo just pure young beauty girls just auditioned for model casting type. Each visit I used to find few new of these girls and now I miss these type of girls a lot because it is much rarer than before by far.
From 2009 to 2015, I was based in Artemis, but since 2015, I have been basing my self in Hessen and NRW due to younger line up with better service. But this end of summer season, I am returning to Artemis after 4 years of absence, so I hope they improved line up during this 4 years and I hope I will find rare young beauty cast I was talking about earlier in this post, which I did find back in the day mostly in low summer season. Most of top optical levels girls I had in Artemis for me was oddly mostly in summer low season is my experience.
On the other hand, I am also facing risk that Artemis did not change much with line up in this past 4 years and I end up seeing mostly just old same line up girls just 4 years later with more weight on, more plastic surgeries and more tattoos and more hate on male clients powered with extreme upsell LOL.
...Best is to feel it how you feel, no point arguing about it, same as no point arguing with today's obese kids about obesity that I mentioned earlier.
I have to disagree with you on this one. If the FKK lineup is getting stiller and static and fewer new girls with lower quality are getting into FKK business, maybe not you and other die-hard FKK fans, but some readers here with FKK experience may consider to monger in other countries instead of FKK clubs. It is about information. I actually wrote my previous post out of sadness and frustration which I share with Polyamorist and which forced me to start to look into other countries for mongering now.
I have to disagree with you on this one. If the FKK lineup is getting stiller and static and fewer new girls with lower quality are getting into FKK business, maybe not you and other die-hard FKK fans, but some readers here with FKK experience may consider to monger in other countries instead of FKK clubs. It is about information. I actually wrote my previous post out of sadness and frustration which I share with Polyamorist and which forced me to start to look into other countries for mongering now.It's easy to understand why. Prices are the same as ten years ago. You get what you pay for.
It's easy to understand why. Prices are the same as ten years ago. You get what you pay for.Well I consider these same prices for past ten years as minimum service charge in most of the cases LOL.
Sometimes I get lucky and get maximum service with these minimum service charge, which is rather more often before than recent few years.
I spent 2 days at Sharks and enjoyed a blast from the past weekend while also trying out Alexandria and her new hair do. I only make 6-7 Sharks visits a year these days, opting to spend more time in NRW but had a nice time going to rooms with former greats and old time regulars.
I went with Evita for the first time in nearly 2 years and can say that she is still a classy provider. We didn't recapture old magic but enjoyed a top notch one hour room.
Mila was just back from holiday so I went with her on day 2. She's still a top notch provider that is fun in the room. All services provided, with no upsell during the half hour session. I think I benefit from being known to her and her crew as I know she usually wants the 1 hour room.
The cherry on top of my visit was a surprise visit from Yvette who has been at Palace for some time. She popped in for one night so I immediately took her. Perhaps it was that I hadn't gone with her in a while but she seemed to somehow gotten even better in the 2 years since I've sessioned with her. Her small frame, thin body, and enthusiasm in the room made for a top 3 session in 2019. I don't remember her BJ being an 11 out of 10 but this time, it was easily the best BJ I've had this year. I still remember the new girl 4 years ago that barely spoke any English so was ecstatic to spend quality time with a now veteran provider who has one of the best party attitudes and skill sets out there. Repeating with her might be cause for me to make a Palace visit soon.
I finally repeated with Betty after over a year hiatus and can say that she is still a solid provider. I can't say that she is skillful in anyway but she does have unbelievable stamina in the room. I do miss the slim Betty of the past but she carries the weight reasonably well. She's continued to get bigger but a bit of that is solid muscle in her hips and not just all fat.
Estra is becoming a regular optic fuck for me as I absolutely love her body. She provides decent service in the one hour room, allowing for FIV, DATY, DFK, and BBBJ. She's not particularly skillful either but girls with great tits and absolutely no body fat will always a get regular rooms from me as long as they show some sort of enjoyment in the room. I end up having to do all the work but it's okay as I said she's a borderline optic fuck.
The lone new to me girl I tried was Alexandra. A friend said that her curly hairstyle is new. Perhaps that is why I didn't recognize her. She has a seductive aura and a tight body with fist size tits. She does not have a classic beautiful face but rather a sultry, seductive look. In the room, she was absolutely amazing. The BBBJ was enthusiastic, wet, and deep. The kissing was the same. And fucking, well the fucking was carnal. One of the toughest positions for a girl is from behind while lying down as it allows for full penetration and the girl is subject to every inch of the guy with him being in full control. Alexandra was able to tolerate that position for an extended amount of time, probably 10-15 minutes straight in that one position alone without a reprieve and me progressively pumping faster and faster until climax.
All in all a nice weekend at Sharks, pulling me away from NRW and Austria for a brief period.
Steve 9696
05-30-19, 01:05
It's easy to understand why. Prices are the same as ten years ago. You get what you pay for.I guess I never thought about it. But My first FKK 10 ish years ago was 50/ half + 50 CIM. And that hasn't really changed that much in ten years. Prices of everything have been going up. But not FKK? Got to admit that doesn't seem right in the abstract. If This was manufacturing and prices were fixed, the solution of the manufacturer is to just use cheaper parts. And then make money on the options. Same thing here I guess.
Those who are trying to keep the price the same as 2009 are the same ones complaining that the product quality has gone down. Well guess what. That is the way the world works.
Well, some people like to think "tourists are to blame" and if border walls were erected, the world would still be sunny and bright and 50 E would fetch the highest quality sex, all included.
Of course, these border walls should go up only for men. Otherwise, there would be only 3 old obese German girls per club and all the E EU girls would be plying their trade elsewhere.
I guess I never thought about it. But My first FKK 10 ish years ago was 50/ half + 50 CIM. And that hasn't really changed that much in ten years. Prices of everything have been going up. But not FKK? Got to admit that doesn't seem right in the abstract. If This was manufacturing and prices were fixed, the solution of the manufacturer is to just use cheaper parts. And then make money on the options. Same thing here I guess.
Those who are trying to keep the price the same as 2009 are the same ones complaining that the product quality has gone down. Well guess what. That is the way the world works.
I guess I never thought about it. But My first FKK 10 ish years ago was 50/ half + 50 CIM. And that hasn't really changed that much in ten years. Prices of everything have been going up. But not FKK? Got to admit that doesn't seem right in the abstract. If This was manufacturing and prices were fixed, the solution of the manufacturer is to just use cheaper parts. And then make money on the options. Same thing here I guess.
Those who are trying to keep the price the same as 2009 are the same ones complaining that the product quality has gone down. Well guess what. That is the way the world works.I agree that cost of living (and prices of almost everything) has increased significantly (30% or more) in USA and most of the Asian countries in last ten years, but do you guys really think that cost of living has increased as much in Germany in the same time frame? I don't think so, and so do the researchers (eg https://tradingeconomics.com/germany/consumer-price-index-cpi and other data analytics sites). Germany CPI in 2019 increased only about 6% from 2010, and if we consider all sorts of wage and prices data, maybe a total 10% increase in FKK prices can be justified for over last 10 years. So the 50 e for 30 minutes service in 2010 now maybe should cost maximum 55 e, not 100 e or any other outrageous number some people want to believe. We are not talking about this FKK service in USA or Asia, but in Germany. FKK owners are not dumb fucks, they would have increased the entry fees if all other prices as well as German incomes have increased like you guys (mostly the flying-in mongers) are suggesting.
ExpatLover
05-30-19, 03:17
I agree that cost of living (and prices of almost everything) has increased significantly (30% or more) in USA and most of the Asian countries in last ten years, but do you guys really think that cost of living has increased as much in Germany in the same time frame? I don't think so, and so do the researchers (eg https://tradingeconomics.com/germany/consumer-price-index-cpi and other data analytics sites). Germany CPI in 2019 increased only about 6% from 2010, and if we consider all sorts of wage and prices data, maybe a total 10% increase in FKK prices can be justified for over last 10 years. So the 50 e for 30 minutes service in 2010 now maybe should cost maximum 55 e, not 100 e or any other outrageous number some people want to believe. We are not talking about this FKK service in USA or Asia, but in Germany. FKK owners are not dumb fucks, they would have increased the entry fees if all other prices as well as German incomes have increased like you guys (mostly the flying-in mongers) are suggesting.Costs of living have skyrocket mainly due to the costs of the rental but this is true in most of the European countries.
I agree that cost of living (and prices of almost everything) has increased significantly (30% or more) in USA and most of the Asian countries in last ten years, but do you guys really think that cost of living has increased as much in Germany in the same time frame? I don't think so, and so do the researchers (eg https://tradingeconomics.com/germany/consumer-price-index-cpi and other data analytics sites). Germany CPI in 2019 increased only about 6% from 2010, and if we consider all sorts of wage and prices data, maybe a total 10% increase in FKK prices can be justified for over last 10 years. So the 50 e for 30 minutes service in 2010 now maybe should cost maximum 55 e, not 100 e or any other outrageous number some people want to believe. We are not talking about this FKK service in USA or Asia, but in Germany. FKK owners are not dumb fucks, they would have increased the entry fees if all other prices as well as German incomes have increased like you guys (mostly the flying-in mongers) are suggesting.CPI is a top down number, aggregated over a basket of goods. Prices for individual goods and services is driven by a bottom up process, by the supply demand of the specific market in question and trade flows. In the US, we had very little inflation or even deflation in some markets notably consumer electronics and many other goods where China is a dominant supplier while education and healthcare prices have been significantly above CPI. I believe what Steve is saying is not that prices should increase for FKK girls, but that a fiat flat pricing imposed on them incents them to not provide high quality services.
Also, the external factors can't be ignored. Due to trade flows, prices for several goods in US remained stable or even declined, courtesy cheap labor of China. A pair of jeans at Walmart costs as much or even less now than they did in 1990. In FKKs, the trade flows are in the opposite direction in that a large influx of well heeled Asian and other tourists (I will get flamed for using the word Asian tourist) who tend to pay more than locals sometimes and that can eventually make some girls provide subpar service to men paying just 50.
One way of also looking at the euro inflation is to consider how much it has increased in value compared to neighbouring currencies. The Romanian currency has fallen compared to the euro. So has my own currency done. So that is already a 20-30% price increase and gain for the Romanian girls who send money back home. When that is said, there are calculators online to measure this, and a fair increase is at about 25% increase in price since 2007. So 12 years ago. Making 50 e into 62.5 euro.
When that is said, some Asian currencies and the dollar has also gone up quite a bit in the past decade. It has really not been Europe's decade lately. Mainly driven by the lack of big overpriced IT companies in Europe I think. And international IT companies not paying their taxes. So the sentiment on this coming from outside Europe is probably different than from within.
I agree that cost of living (and prices of almost everything) has increased significantly (30% or more) in USA and most of the Asian countries in last ten years, but do you guys really think that cost of living has increased as much in Germany in the same time frame? I don't think so, and so do the researchers (eg https://tradingeconomics.com/germany/consumer-price-index-cpi and other data analytics sites). Germany CPI in 2019 increased only about 6% from 2010, and if we consider all sorts of wage and prices data, maybe a total 10% increase in FKK prices can be justified for over last 10 years. So the 50 e for 30 minutes service in 2010 now maybe should cost maximum 55 e, not 100 e or any other outrageous number some people want to believe. We are not talking about this FKK service in USA or Asia, but in Germany. FKK owners are not dumb fucks, they would have increased the entry fees if all other prices as well as German incomes have increased like you guys (mostly the flying-in mongers) are suggesting.Very well put.
I can understand that a gent tip 10 E per half hour for excellent service. But the upselling and overpayment you often read about is not justified.
The prices for FKK services have been the same for nearly 20 years (before the euro was introduced). But indeed, Germany CPI has been VERY low in the same period.
BigBuddy69
05-30-19, 14:43
Actually keeping the inflation low is a big point of the Maastricht treaty and one of the goals of the European Central Bank. So please act European.
Gino,
Moving the conversation here, as it does not belong in the Mainhattan thread.
You say you are not trying to be preachy but you also call a marriage or relation sham if one of the two is cheating sexually. What you mean to say is that you do not intend to be preachy and moralizing. It is very much possible to be preachy and moralizing while not intending to be that way.
Millions if not billions of men (and women) have been cheating on their partner now and have done so in the past and will do in the future. I would not call all those relationships and marriages sham. That is the viewpoint of someone who has never been in a relationship. Marriages and relationships are far more complex and with a million calculations related to emotional, spiritual, financial, family, children, security and other factors thrown in. Sex is just one aspect of it. May be this is tough to understand if you have never been in that situation and I related a conversation on Clinton in the other thread, but all I can say is that I am able to compartmentalize my paid sex life very easily from everything else I do. I bet PFI and Zumboit can too and so are many other men.
People say prostitution is the oldest profession and if so the first monger ever must have been a married man.
To your other question-- I have no idea how I would feel the roles were reversed and I caught my spouse cheating. Yes, we all understand that you are trying to point the inherent hypocrisy in our stance; it doesn't take a genius to see your point. And if a cheating married man feels jealous when he catches his spouse cheating, so what?! This is a raw emotion. Emotions, by definition, are not logical. We are not a bunch of Data the Android in Star Trek. I see mongers here being jealous and bitter when their favorite FKK girl is seemingly giving better service to another guy. Mongers here constantly discuss growing attachment with FKK girls, knowing full well that she is fucking at least 10 guys a day. What's the point of scoring a hypocrisy point against a married cheater?
As I said, I'm fully comfortable in my own skin. If there is any guilt, that's between my wife and me and no one else. I'm certainly not apologizing to anybody in the world, and definitely not to other mongers who are doing the same exact thing as I'm doing.
Anyway, my intent was not to stir up a controversy nor seek approval from unmarried mongers but to connect and exchange views with like minded men in a great and open forum such as ISG. What if there are many married men out there that want to share their view points but have stayed silent for fear of being ridiculed, being called hypocrites? Isn't the forum richer for having more views and more diverse and differentiated views? I stand by my earlier statement that being inclusive is always better for a social forum and the first step is to not ridicule a nonconformist voice.
Steve 9696
05-31-19, 03:30
Gino,
Moving the conversation here, as it does not belong in the Mainhattan thread.
You say you are not trying to be preachy but you also call a marriage or relation sham if one of the two is cheating sexually. What you mean to say is that you do not intend to be preachy and moralizing. It is very much possible to be preachy and moralizing while not intending to be that way.
Millions if not billions of men (and women) have been cheating on their partner now and have done so in the past and will do in the future. I would not call all those relationships and marriages sham. That is the viewpoint of someone who has never been in a relationship. Marriages and relationships are far more complex and with a million calculations related to emotional, spiritual, financial, family, children, security and other factors thrown in. Sex is just one aspect of it. May be this is tough to understand if you have never been in that situation and I related a conversation on Clinton in the other thread, but all I can say is that I am able to compartmentalize my paid sex life very easily from everything else I do. I bet PFI and Zumboit can too and so are many other men.
People say prostitution is the oldest profession and if so the first monger ever must have been a married man.
To your other question-- I have no idea how I would feel the roles were reversed and I caught my spouse cheating. Yes, we all understand that you are trying to point the inherent hypocrisy in our stance; it doesn't take a genius to see your point. And if a cheating married man feels jealous when he catches his spouse cheating, so what?! This is a raw emotion. Emotions, by definition, are not logical. We are not a bunch of Data the Android in Star Trek. I see mongers here being jealous and bitter when their favorite FKK girl is seemingly giving better service to another guy. Mongers here constantly discuss growing attachment with FKK girls, knowing full well that she is fucking at least 10 guys a day. What's the point of scoring a hypocrisy point against a married cheater?
As I said, I'm fully comfortable in my own skin. If there is any guilt, that's between my wife and me and no one else. I'm certainly not apologizing to anybody in the world, and definitely not to other mongers who are doing the same exact thing as I'm doing.
Anyway, my intent was not to stir up a controversy nor seek approval from unmarried mongers but to connect and exchange views with like minded men in a great and open forum such as ISG. What if there are many married men out there that want to share their view points but have stayed silent for fear of being ridiculed, being called hypocrites? Isn't the forum richer for having more views and more diverse and differentiated views? I stand by my earlier statement that being inclusive is always better for a social forum and the first step is to not ridicule a nonconformist voice.As a married man with a wife that I love but who I am not in love with I'd make two points:
1. It is quite possible to love your wife and have a pleasant relationship and not be having sex. I love my sister and do not have sex with her. I think we really need two words for these things. One where you love somebody because you share some common bond and perhaps enjoy their company and one where you love someone in a passionate way, partly because you share the bond of sex. These are two different things and I would say RARELY come in the same relationship. I would venture to say the number of men over forty who are passionately in love with their wife is vanishingly small. At least in the US see point 2.
2. Society condemns the man for "cheating" on his wife. I would say in most cases she cheated on him first in the following way: Significantly reduced or no sex or Became fat and unattractive or in many cases both. I went for more than 10 years with NO sex before I went outside the home. And I'm the one who cheated? I don't think so. I have absolutely no guilt finding affection elsewhere.
Honestly it is an epidemic in the United States. Overweight women not holding up their end of the bargain and crying foul. It is appalling.
Polyamorist
05-31-19, 04:44
1. It is quite possible to love your wife and have a pleasant relationship and not be having sex. I love my sister and do not have sex with her.
I surmise you are not Japanese.
I think we really need two words for these things. One where you love somebody because you share some common bond and perhaps enjoy their company and one where you love someone in a passionate way, partly because you share the bond of sex.
The Greeks, such as Plato, had four words:
Éros -- sexual love.
Storgē -- family love.
Philía -- friendship.
Agāpe -- universal love (altruism).
These are two different things and I would say RARELY come in the same relationship. I would venture to say the number of men over forty who are passionately in love with their wife is vanishingly small.I guess this applies worldwide, and it also leads me to suspect that the number of visits to ladies of easy virtue is greatly underestimated / undereported everywhere.
Personally during Ramadan I try to keep it to one a day unless I am feeling really horny. It ends June 4. Hamdulillah!
ExpatLover
05-31-19, 05:03
As a married man with a wife that I love but who I am not in love with I'd make two points:
1. It is quite possible to love your wife and have a pleasant relationship and not be having sex. I love my sister and do not have sex with her. I think we really need two words for these things. One where you love somebody because you share some common bond and perhaps enjoy their company and one where you love someone in a passionate way, partly because you share the bond of sex. These are two different things and I would say RARELY come in the same relationship. I would venture to say the number of men over forty who are passionately in love with their wife is vanishingly small. At least in the US see point 2.
2. Society condemns the man for "cheating" on his wife. I would say in most cases she cheated on him first in the following way: Significantly reduced or no sex or Became fat and unattractive or in many cases both. I went for more than 10 years with NO sex before I went outside the home. And I'm the one who cheated? I don't think so. I have absolutely no guilt finding affection elsewhere.
Honestly it is an epidemic in the United States. Overweight women not holding up their end of the bargain and crying foul. It is appalling.In that case is it not better to rebuild the life with someone else, for me no reason to stay that is the reason I divorced 15 years back. There is no future in P6 except having less money and feeling shortly good after fucking a prostitutes, my best sex and I had many was never with a prostitute, that is why I am extremely selective and the girls must be very pretty if she wants me to spend money, we just buy illusion nothing more.
Steve 9696
05-31-19, 14:47
I surmise you are not Japanese.
The Greeks, such as Plato, had four words:
ros -- sexual love.
Storgē -- family love.
Phila -- friendship.
Agāpe -- universal love (altruism).
I guess this applies worldwide, and it also leads me to suspect that the number of visits to ladies of easy virtue is greatly underestimated / undereported everywhere.
Personally during Ramadan I try to keep it to one a day unless I am feeling really horny. It ends June 4. Hamdulillah!Many thanks to the erudite Polyamorist! I have Storge and Phila with my wife but not Eros!
155 cm and 50 kg with big tits.
5' 1.5" and 110 lbs with big tits.
Would people here consider that considered slim?
I will get flamed for using the word Asian tourist) who tend to pay more than locals sometimes and that can eventually make some girls provide subpar service to men paying just 50.To be clear without rewriting history. I think the original post was blaming Cosmina for introducing another provider to the dark side. The perpetuation of negative association was what you were flamed for.
Gino,
Moving the conversation here, as it does not belong in the Mainhattan thread.
You say you are not trying to be preachy but you also call a marriage or relation sham if one of the two is cheating sexually. What you mean to say is that you do not intend to be preachy and moralizing. It is very much possible to be preachy and moralizing while not intending to be that way.
Millions if not billions of men (and women) have been cheating on their partner now and have done so in the past and will do in the future. I would not call all those relationships and marriages sham. That is the viewpoint of someone who has never been in a relationship. Marriages and relationships are far more complex and with a million calculations related to emotional, spiritual, financial, family, children, security and other factors thrown in. Sex is just one aspect of it. May be this is tough to understand if you have never been in that situation and I related a conversation on Clinton in the other thread, but all I can say is that I am able to compartmentalize my paid sex life very easily from everything else I do. I bet PFI and Zumboit can too and so are many other men..Pessimist,
First, thanks for moving the conversation here and thanks for taking the time to answer my questions, appreciate your insight. I actually like to read your posts, they are nicely written, and mostly with valuable information for a forum like ISG. Rest assured, I will never even think of asking or pushing any forum contributor to stop writing. That said, we should be able to call something what it is, if a topic comes up. You and few other guys brought up the topic of "how wonderful your marriage is due to extramarital mongering", I'm merely trying to understand how you do (or say) that given how marriage and related sexual relationships are defined by the society.
Next, I think you are making few assumptions without knowing my (or someone with my point of view) background. How do you know if I was married to my high school sweetheart for decades then started mongering after her death from cancer, or not? How do you know if I'm one of those folks who goes to FKKs only when he's not in a relationship, or not? Maybe some of us are wired differently and do not like the emotional drain of having multiple lives at the same time, after experiencing many long term relationships?
Now, we can try to spin our activities however it fits us, and try to justify our actions and emotions, but a pig is a pig doesn't matter how much lipstick we put on it. If I cannot tell my loving wife (or girlfriend) that I need sex with other girls but do not want her to have sex with anyone else, it is pretty obvious that we do not trust each other and we do not even want each other to be happy. I don't know if I can really call that a mutually "loving relationship" even if we want to think that "love" is "Storg -- family love" or "Phila -- friendship" as Polyamorist elaborated, for the simple reason that we cannot tell each other what it is. It's still based on lies and hypocrisy, to describe in your own words. Basically a sham marriage. We can probably call it "marital arrangement". Just because billions of people are in such "marital arrangement", doesn't qualify it to be called a "mutually loving, honest and successful marriage". Nothing wrong with that relationship itself, just the wrong use of calling what it is.
In any case, it's our personal lives. We can choose how we want to live it and what we want to call it (or what we want to believe it is). No point arguing about our own personal believes and points of view, more so on a mongering forum like ISG, so why even discussing it anymore? We can agree to disagree on what we want call or believe about it. When you guys brought the topic, I was just trying to understand how you guys do it as I'm debating if I should get into a relationship or not with my so much liking for FKKs. I think I got it now. You simply compartmentalize your actions, feelings and emotions, and tell yourself that you have "loving relationship" and "successful marriage" despite constant cheating on your wives.
To be clear without rewriting history. I think the original post was blaming Cosmina for introducing another provider to the dark side. The perpetuation of negative association was what you were flamed for.Not to reopen a can of worms after we already shook hands on a truce in the Sharks thread -- but the Cosmina and Evita pair bonding in search of Asian customers was indeed a real and tangible one and pointing it is not negative.
Secondly, as I said, this association such as it was, was commented upon by many many members dozens of times but for some reason you picked on a new writer, which is always an easy fight to pick I suppose.
The negative stereotype if it exists is in the minds of WGs. I have personally talked many who say they will only do anal with Asian men. Other girls, through the way they seek out Asian customers, make it very clear who their most sought after clients are. Evita and Cosmina being among them in the last 3 years, when they did work.
If a group of women are acting on a view they internally have about a group of men, simply pointing out that fact does not merit flaming in a forum dedicated to open discussions about exactly that sort of thing in FKK clubs.
As for perpetuating, if I kept on harping this subject that is one thing but that was my first time ever and a simple search would show that other members have made that "negative association" more than once and yet I did not see any flames from you in their direction.
155 cm and 50 kg with big tits.
5' 1.5" and 110 lbs with big tits.
Would people here consider that considered slim?Usually for girls, I go by height minus 10. So 1.55 cm should be 45 kg. Or 1.65 cm should be 55 kg. But if she goes to the gym and is top fit, then only 5 below can be more correct. But usually when girls are that fit, their fat percentage also falls, so the tits are small, and not big.
Result: a 1.55 m girl at 50 kg with big natural tits either has some crazy genes to give her extra large tits while still being a fitness babe, or she is a little overweight.
As a guy who has never been married, but would like to have a family someday, and now has been bitten by the FKK life, I'd like to hear how some of you married guys from the US get away with taking random trips to Germany?
I've never been in a relationship where I don't get tired of the sex. In my last 3-year relationship, we might have had sex once in the last year. In the beginning we had Eros. And at the end for me it was just Storage and Phila. As much as I would want to be faithful if I were married, I know I will eventually want to scratch the itch.
Colonel Forbin I know why you've come here
And I'll help you with your quest to gain the knowledge that you lack
👳.Thank you great and knowledgeable Icculus! I bow in reverence!
Now, we can try to spin our activities however it fits us, and try to justify our actions and emotions, but a pig is a pig doesn't matter how much lipstick we put on it. If I cannot tell my loving wife (or girlfriend) that I need sex with other girls but do not want her to have sex with anyone else, it is pretty obvious that we do not trust each other and we do not even want each other to be happy. I don't know if I can really call that a mutually "loving relationship" even if we want to think that "love" is "Storgē -- family love" or "Phila -- friendship" as Polyamorist elaborated, for the simple reason that we cannot tell each other what it is. It's still based on lies and hypocrisy, to describe in your own words. Basically a sham marriage. We can probably call it "marital arrangement". Just because billions of people are in such "marital arrangement", doesn't qualify it to be called a "mutually loving, honest and successful marriage". Nothing wrong with that relationship itself, just the wrong use of calling what it is.I haven't been following the discussion but did read your comment.
I disagree completely, although understand your point of view. I am married 22 years and am 27 years in my relationship. I know it to be happy and loving. I haven't mongered for a while but did so regularly for five years or so. I consider it nothing more than a hobby. I enjoyed meeting different people, seeing different places and the brief emotional connection. And time to myself.
My wife is unaware. I know that she would not approve. I understand that makes me deceitful, but rationalise it as fine as long as I don't hurt her. And fine as long as it is always a paid for service. Her happiness is more important to me than my own. That is an honest statement.
I'm not saying that I am right or wrong but I strongly believe that I am a loyal husband. Many, including my wife, would disagree. I understand the hypocrisy but I am self-aware. I am wired in a way that means this works for me. That doesn't make me right or wrong, just comfortable in the knowledge that, for me, this can fit around a very happy marriage.
I don't want to give away all my trade secrets. But you hit the nail on the head. For married people especially and for men in relationships in general, there are two constraints: (1) explaining your absence (2) explaining a big hole in the bank balances in case everything you have are in joint accounts.
For 1. The trick is to not arouse the slightest of suspicions. If there is the smallest hint of suspicion, she will search and dig and seek and sooner or later truth can come out, especially in these days where so much of our life exists in electrons and cloud. This is especially if you are in a relationship with a capable and tech savvy woman.
2. For the second, make sure you spend such low and inconspicuous amounts that she will not notice it. Any notice of missing large amounts can end up in 1. Above.
As a guy who has never been married, but would like to have a family someday, and now has been bitten by the FKK life, I'd like to hear how some of you married guys from the US get away with taking random trips to Germany?
I've never been in a relationship where I don't get tired of the sex. In my last 3-year relationship, we might have had sex once in the last year. In the beginning we had Eros. And at the end for me it was just Storage and Phila. As much as I would want to be faithful if I were married, I know I will eventually want to scratch the itch.
Not to reopen a can of worms after we already shook hands on a truce in the Sharks thread -- but the Cosmina and Evita pair bonding in search of Asian customers was indeed a real and tangible one and pointing it is not negative.
Secondly, as I said, this association such as it was, was commented upon by many many members dozens of times but for some reason you picked on a new writer, which is always an easy fight to pick I suppose.
The negative stereotype if it exists is in the minds of WGs. I have personally talked many who say they will only do anal with Asian men. Other girls, through the way they seek out Asian customers, make it very clear who their most sought after clients are. Evita and Cosmina being among them in the last 3 years, when they did work.
If a group of women are acting on a view they internally have about a group of men, simply pointing out that fact does not merit flaming in a forum dedicated to open discussions about exactly that sort of thing in FKK clubs.
As for perpetuating, if I kept on harping this subject that is one thing but that was my first time ever and a simple search would show that other members have made that "negative association" more than once and yet I did not see any flames from you in their direction.This remains a civil discussion in my point of view. No worries there. Don't feel targeted as that is not the point. See the recent Sharks thread for worse offenders, which I promptly also criticized. Still, the fact remains, you can't deny your participation in the scapegoating when you write that Cosmina introducing Evita into the Asian specialist world by using terms like blame and dark side. People certainly do not "blame" anyone for anything good. Whether, intentional or subconscious, and whether the worst offender or not, your post was an example of the scapegoating and animosity that is prevalent.
155 cm and 50 kg with big tits.
5' 1.5" and 110 lbs with big tits.
Would people here consider that considered slim?An ISGer sent me a PM criticizing my description of slim. Another posted that these stats show an overweight person. This chart obviously shows they are both quite wrong. Those height-weight stats puts this person near the bottom of the BMI-obesity scale, a measurement that is already notorious for overestimating obesity.
How is the FKK generally in Summer ? will many girls go on vacation ?
TeaInTheSun
06-01-19, 05:34
How is the FKK generally in Summer ? will many girls go on vacation ?Hey there, most of ladies know they will get certain peak season during summer and they prefer to stay working for us during our vacation. Just few ladies take holidays on August but just for few days or before IAA on September. Then, they back until Christmas normally. July is always great for me.
How is the FKK generally in Summer ? will many girls go on vacation ?Beside, summer supposed to be the low season due to many regular girls taking summer holiday and clubs are slightly less in numbers of girls, I actually found most of most beautiful girls I found in FKK during summer season of July and August.
I am guessing this is because before the new law, there were some walk in girls who do it for summer jobs to make quick big cash in two months during summer. Also different clubs do switch girls around during summer the most to keep the lineup numbers, so it may increased girls quality optically.
However, given the new law, it is mystery zone once again during summer time in FKK. I am going in end of August to early September too, so I hope line up is good optically.
I went before the law in both July and August, and I did find real beautiful girls more than normal season and clubs are less full than usual, so it is more relaxed atmosphere. Many regular girls are on holiday thought.
How is the FKK generally in Summer ? will many girls go on vacation ?August can be slow for beauties, same like Easter or Christmas / Sylvester. Second level can t take long time off. Exceptions are Globe and clubs close to Italian border due to Ferragosto party.
Usually for girls, I go by height minus 10. So 1.55 cm should be 45 kg. Or 1.65 cm should be 55 kg. But if she goes to the gym and is top fit, then only 5 below can be more correct. But usually when girls are that fit, their fat percentage also falls, so the tits are small, and not big.
Result: a 1.55 m girl at 50 kg with big natural tits either has some crazy genes to give her extra large tits while still being a fitness babe, or she is a little overweight.Megan 172 50/52 kg slim, Kate 168 50 kg curvy sexy. Model type is more than 170 and maximum 52 kg, more is not slim, so a 155 with 50 kg girl is really not slim even if she is high level sporty, maximum 45 kg for 155 to be slim even with big 90 C cup which are just water fat, no bones, no muscles which weight.
How is the FKK generally in Summer ? will many girls go on vacation ?Yes, in August many girls go on holiday. But also men, so ratios are normal.
I love visiting during the summer. Particularly at Sharks which has a great outdoor area, including beds. Some of my best sessions have been outdoors but you will have to deal with the voyeurs.
Sebastiane
06-01-19, 11:32
Do any clubs in Germany have any Chinese, Japanese, Thai, Filipino, Malaysian girls? I remember years ago Bea at Palace but that's it. I haven't been with an Oriental girl since then and would like to.
An ISGer sent me a PM criticizing my description of slim. Another posted that these stats show an overweight person. This chart obviously shows they are both quite wrong. Those height-weight stats puts this person near the bottom of the BMI-obesity scale, a measurement that is already notorious for overestimating obesity.But haven't those BMI charts been changed repeatedly the last two decades? To make people especially in ysa feel more good about themselves?
I found this one too:
But haven't those BMI charts been changed repeatedly the last two decades? To make people especially in ysa feel more good about themselves?
I found this one too:And I kinda agree with this chart quite a lot. But if you don't do fitness, the lower end is about where you should be. And if you do fitness, you can push it up towards the upper end the more you work out.
But haven't those BMI charts been changed repeatedly the last two decades? To make people especially in ysa feel more good about themselves?
I found this one too:No they don't really change all that much. But even on that chart found on tumbler and typed in neon print, 5 foot 1.5 inch is considered ideal, not overweight. Are you sure that you read your source correctly? Mistakes happen.
Megan 172 50/52 kg slim, Kate 168 50 kg curvy sexy. Model type is more than 170 and maximum 52 kg, more is not slim, so a 155 with 50 kg girl is really not slim even if she is high level sporty, maximum 45 kg for 155 to be slim even with big 90 C cup which are just water fat, no bones, no muscles which weight.Absolutely agree. I think only an obese person himself / herself might consider any girl of 155 cm height with more than 45 kg weight to be slim, irrespective of the slight variation of weight due to breast sizes.
Absolutely agree. I think only an obese person himself / herself might consider any girl of 155 cm height with more than 45 kg weight to be slim, irrespective of the slight variation of weight due to breast sizes.Clinicians disagree with you. 45 kg is less than 100 lbs.
http://www.hunterdiabetescentre.com.au/clinical-trials/attachment/bmichartmetric/
Kate and Megan are both well over 50 kg, at least 5 kg over. In comparison, Betty at Sharks is self reported over 50 kg at 155 cm. She is bottom heavy but by no means obese. And if she is over 50 kg, there is no way Kate and Megan weigh less than her.
Steve 9696
06-02-19, 01:15
So certainly a bit off topic but I know many of you enjoy a good FR. This particular one is relevant in a general chat way because it emphasizes the importance of a) Not being so picky as to miss an opportunity and b) Going with the flow. The highlight was definitively blasting through town in HER car with AC / DC full volume. Enjoy!
Caxias do Sul Brazil FR.
Boate Ilha and the World's ugliest Girls Name.
Boate (pronounced bow ah Che) is a nightclub with WGs and onsite rooms for fucking. Great format.
OK before I go any farther let me mention that of perhaps 20 girls I talked to and considered so far on this trip, three were named Eduarda! What a horrible fuckin name! And if that isn't bad enough, the short version of that is Duda. Who wants to fuck someone named Duda? Well apparently I do because I did twice!
So CDS is NOT an easy city to find tons of girls. I researched for months online and only came up with two indies I would do! And hard to find Boates also. Boate Ilha was the only one I found with enough decent review to bother.
Went to BI pretty early on Wednesday. Around 10:30. There was NOT A SINGLE girl and three guys including me (stay with me here it gets better). After about 15 minutes one girl shows up. Thigh high boots and mini skirt. Maybe a 6-7 and as luck would have it she came to sit with me. Her name is Duda and as you will see she grows on me and in fact I would put her more in a 7/8 category having seen her in various different positions.
Even though she is sitting with me she is not very affectionate, enough so that at one point I actually tell her I can't tell if she likes me. She says she does, but clearly I am not going to be Making out like with Tifhany. Anyhow she grows on me and eventually she offers to do a table dance for R50 ($13). Ok bring it! Wow. She is actually quite sexy and has the perfect Brasileira butt. Actually a work of art.
At some point I agree to take her friend also. Definitely more a 6 for me but quite handsy and affectionate. R600 for the pair. By the time we leave there are probably 20 girls there but I would say mostly 5 and 6's. Still the only game in town that I could see. Beware your bar bill may be a lot higher than you expect they have a large card fee and ladies drinks are about 2 x guy drinks. Total damage US $300 including drinks, bar fine and two girls so who am I to complain.
Just like SP the girls had to register with me at the front desk. Not a problem at 12:30. The sex was pretty OK but I would rank it towards the bottom of my other epic experiences. Nonetheless I developed quite some chemistry with Duda and I came to love her bubble butt and massively tattooed body. She's just kind of badass in a sweet way.
Wrapped up after one round. Plenty tired. Summary Boate Ilha will get the job done but not at the level of SP boates. But it's about the only game in town. (There is one called Boate Castelo) but it only had one review.
Next Day Take it Easy not.
So on my final night I was pretty bushed. So I decided to avoid the chase and go for the known thing. Unfortunately Tifhany, Carolina, and Mary all live up north. But Duda has really grown on me and I thought a one on one encounter would have different chemistry and I was 70% right. We Whatsapped ahead of time and I spelled out what I thought I needed in a GFE and she agreed for $100. Not bad!
I got some wine and she came to my room around 11. This was a slightly odd date because she is not naturally affectionate. But in the end I got her worked up and we got it done. Started with some naked kissing me on top on the bed. She kinda gave me the downward hint and down I went. I thought maybe she should be paying me. She had a good time then rode me strong cowgirl for a long while. I'm pretty sure it was real because she really had to work at it to get there rather than the quicknfake moans.
But at some point I was thinking "uh yeah and what about me" She started to head for CBJ which was NOT part of the deal. Eventually I softly persuaded her to move to BBBJ and it was really quite good after some coaching. I really give her the benefit of the doubt here. She is a pretty girl but not a very professional hooker. I gave her some BJ pointers and guidance by hand and she gamely brought things to a close in front of the mirror her on her knees and me standing. With a quality CIM finish.
Even tho we agreed 2 x I knew I was too tired and would need a goodly waiting period. I suggested a wild and crazy idea which she accepted. She had to be back at the Boate at a certain time to avoid a fine. So I said I would go with her and she could help me pick out another girl. So Duda became my wingman for the rest of the night and a sexy wingman she was.
So Duda and I had concluded a nice CIM finish in front of the mirror and agreed she'd be my wingman at Boate Ilha. We ubered over there (Uber is ridiculously cheap here. Like $3 for a ten minute ride).
Let me tell you, BI is different on Thursday. Clearly 40+ girls and as many guys. It is packed. And the quality is higher. Really no 9's, but no 5's either.
Duda and I are given a table (it pays to have a club girl wingman!) And we just take it all in over a drink. After a while we just kind of work the field independently. I pass on a couple girls after intros. And she comes back saying she's been trying to get someone to bite on a table dance. Well it is only $13 so I say let's see it. She lights up like you wouldn't believe. Amazing what $13 can do in certain places.
Now that we have some BFGF going she gives me the ultimate table dance with 10 or so guys drooling around us. Yes the Bunda remains spectacular. Really a top ten butt no lie. And when she drops it down low you can imagine her cowgirling and it's quite hot.
Some time later there is this Barbie blond doing a table dance and I have NEVER seen a woman ooze sex appeal like that. Has 20 guys with boners just standing in awe. I commit right then to trying to get her to go but know there will be a line!
So when she finishes Duda says "you like her" and I say sure. She says she will get her for me. Sure enough she grabs her just outside the bathroom and brings her over. Just sexy as hell. Thanks wing girl!
We agree to head off. She says 350 on-site and 550 off-site. I say let's go on-site. Then she tells me the rooms are shit and convinced me for R550. Remember this is a hot Jennifer Love Hewitt clone but with blond hair past her ass for $140!
Well the adventures continue. She is going to drive and she loves ACDC. We are blasting "She's Got the Jack" atfull volume as we pull in to the love motel (I am not joking!) Just riding in HER car is a thrill (did this with a chick in Moscow also) but it was the music that sealed the deal. Windows down. Air rushing by. Her hair flying everywhere. These are life experiences you take with you.
She's clearly a professional which is sometimes off-putting but she does love her trade. Gets quite worked up during DATY and several positions. So much so that while I finger her while she blows me that she is so wet inside. Just a sexy sloppy mess.
Eventually I blow a load (she gestures no CIM but takes it right till the last second). And we Rock and roll back to my hotel at 4 AM.
Good thing I took it easy my last night!
It is this kind of thing that pays off if you go with the flow. Had I walked out of BI that first night, then no Duda. And no chance to coach her on a proper BBBJ and CIM in front of the mirror. And no wing girl. And no Barbie and driving in her car with She's Got The Jack playing. It was too priceless. And all because I gave a dead club and a single 6/7 a chance.
Project Jaw
06-02-19, 18:33
Hey all,
Been a lurker here, trying to research and read as much as I can. I'm headed to Frankfurt in July and have a few days to play around with. I'm trying to decide if FKK's are more "bang for your buck" than regular escort agencies. Beyond that, when visiting FKK's, should one take a bag with them for toiletries (deodorant, cologne, mouthwash, etc)?
Sub-question, I've read that rooms at Sharks are not air conditioned and can be a bit stuffy for activities during the summer months. Would Oase or Mainhattan be a better alternative, and how do current lineups compare? Thanks in advance.
Even with her weight gain, most people will still consider a girl like Evita of Sharks slim. When she says she is 55 kg and Betty of Sharks says she is over 50 kg, logic dictates that Kate of GT and Megan of Globe who are several inches taller then them are not lighter. What is more likely, a man with a lower vantage point due to stature misjudging a woman's weight or the shorter girls claiming to be heavier than they actually are?
Who would believe that Megan who is over 6 inches taller than Betty is lighter than her? That statement is inconsistent with the facts and logic.
This 50 kg estimate is grossly inaccurate and misleads readers. (If looking for Kate at GT, don't look for the 168 cm girl who is 50 kg. You will not find her). Instead, look for the 168 kg girl with the big ass who is closer to 55 kg.
Global obesity and optic standards aside, a kg is still a kg whether in America or in Europe.
These girls are normal attractive women, not Victoria Secret or runway models. Slim by VS model standards is a silly and useless standard of the word for FKK mongering purposes.
No they don't really change all that much. But even on that chart found on tumbler and typed in neon print, 5 foot 1.5 inch is considered ideal, not overweight. Are you sure that you read your source correctly? Mistakes happen.From what I know, every single country has its own official BMI chart on average, overweight, obese. And it less and less about health, and more and more about politics. So we might as well make our own.
I'm going to put both of you in each Ignore List if ever again you complain or quote him, I'm going to Ban you.
Admin3
From what I know, every single country has its own official BMI chart on average, overweight, obese. And it less and less about health, and more and more about politics. So we might as well make our own.BMI is not country dependent. And the chart you yourself presented showed the stats quoted was for an ideal woman. It would be easier to just say that your personal definition of slim and overweight is different than mainstream accepted values rather than construct scenarios for argument's sake. Saying that the presented stats represents an overweight person while presenting a chart that contradicts that, well, I can't explain the logic in that.
Do any clubs in Germany have any Chinese, Japanese, Thai, Filipino, Malaysian girls? I remember years ago Bea at Palace but that's it. I haven't been with an Oriental girl since then and would like to.The best looking girl in any FKK I've been to is Thai massage girl Sukanya at Sharks, and I'm not generally into Asians. But all you will get from her is a great massage.
I haven't seen any Asian WGs at an FKK.
Hey all,
Been a lurker here, trying to research and read as much as I can. I'm headed to Frankfurt in July and have a few days to play around with. I'm trying to decide if FKK's are more "bang for your buck" than regular escort agencies. Beyond that, when visiting FKK's, should one take a bag with them for toiletries (deodorant, cologne, mouthwash, etc)?
Sub-question, I've read that rooms at Sharks are not air conditioned and can be a bit stuffy for activities during the summer months. Would Oase or Mainhattan be a better alternative, and how do current lineups compare? Thanks in advance.FKKs are more bang for your buck if you plan on doing multiple girls or truly enjoy the spa, pool, garden, food amenities. Being able to see the girls is also a strong benefit.
I bring my own toiletries but you do not have to. Deodorant, mouthwash, and hair product are supplied at Sharks but not at Oase.
Sharks rooms are miserable in July especially if you are a perfuse sweater. The "air conditioned" cabins outside makes it slightly better. There are some sex caves near the Jacuzzis but the air conditioning units are more often malfunctioning. Oase is almost as bad but at least the public areas are air conditioned although the rooms are still stuffy.
Palace is well ventilated and conditioned. I can; t recall Mainhattan being all that bad.
Too many opinions on line up quality to comment much except to say that Sharks by far gets the most visitors, and that includes local Germans as well as tourists.
Clinicians disagree with you. 45 kg is less than 100 lbs.
http://www.hunterdiabetescentre.com.au/clinical-trials/attachment/bmichartmetric/
Kate and Megan are both well over 50 kg, at least 5 kg over. In comparison, Betty at Sharks is self reported over 50 kg at 155 cm. She is bottom heavy but by no means obese. And if she is over 50 kg, there is no way Kate and Megan weigh less than her.Well Takedown, your original question was this:
155 cm and 50 kg with big tits.
5' 1.5" and 110 lbs with big tits.
Would people here consider that considered slim?And I merely stated what I think, essentially what I would consider slim or not. We can agree to disagree, because it's just a matter of personal preference or taste.
Well Takedown, your original question was this:
And I merely stated what I think, essentially what I would consider slim or not. We can agree to disagree, because it's just a matter of personal preference or taste.I never noticed Betty at Sharks, I would say Evita is 165 but not anymore slim, no more waist, even not fat. Megan was refused at Globe on her first try on February 2017, then she returned for 1 month at Sharks to lose weight she got at home with Romanian foods and she tried again and was accepted on April, she is much more slim than Evita, Kate even with curvy ass is also more slim above ass, with narrow waist which make her ratio waist / ass so sexy, compare to Evita who is quite straight body shape. Madi World also had a so sexy ratio ass / waist. Maybe we don t have same standards for slim girls, for sure I find most of American women fat. I remember my first visit on 1996 landing in the morning in Miami, I walked on the beach for more than 6 hours, I think more than 20 km, when I returned to hotel exhausted and so disappointed, I asked I didn't see any Pamela Anderson like she was on playboy before silicon, and I was answered: But Pamela Anderson is not American, she is Western Canadian. Prettiest seen in Florida were Puerto Rican girls, much more sexy and firm than Americans who are really not slim. Some blond Puerto Ricans were really attractive.
Do any clubs in Germany have any Chinese, Japanese, Thai, Filipino, Malaysian girls? I remember years ago Bea at Palace but that's it. I haven't been with an Oriental girl since then and would like to.Two older Thai ladies working at GT Bruggen. There were a couple younger Thai ladies, Mai, and Pim working there but I haven't seen them recently. There was a Filipina lady at GT when I was there about e weeks ago. Reports from last Thursday were that a nice Asian lady was working at LR last Thursday.
Do any clubs in Germany have any Chinese, Japanese, Thai, Filipino, Malaysian girls? I remember years ago Bea at Palace but that's it. I haven't been with an Oriental girl since then and would like to.You can get in Shark.
Sebastiane
06-03-19, 22:37
I am planning a summer trip to the Frankfurt area FKKs in the next few weeks and want to ask about current Top Beauties / Top Girls at the following clubs:
Palace.
Oase.
Sharks.
World.
Mainhattan.
Thanks in advance. (I know beauty is subjective but it is still helpful to have a list of top lookers / performers).
Thanos2019
06-04-19, 03:26
+1.
I am American and I do not disagree! Many American girls, or men for that matter, are quite fat. Too many calories and too little exercise, I'm afraid.
Evita used to be slim. But she has been eating Sharks food that makes all the girls fat. She is better than other girls that have worked at Sharks for this many years but she is no longer young nor slim. However, her Asian customers still seem to like her. This is surprising to me as she is not even a fake blonde.
You are right about Puerto Rican girls in Florida. Some pretty Cuban girls too on the South beach.
I never noticed Betty at Sharks, I would say Evita is 165 but not anymore slim, no more waist, even not fat. Megan was refused at Globe on her first try on February 2017, then she returned for 1 month at Sharks to lose weight she got at home with Romanian foods and she tried again and was accepted on April, she is much more slim than Evita, Kate even with curvy ass is also more slim above ass, with narrow waist which make her ratio waist / ass so sexy, compare to Evita who is quite straight body shape. Madi World also had a so sexy ratio ass / waist. Maybe we don t have same standards for slim girls, for sure I find most of American women fat. I remember my first visit on 1996 landing in the morning in Miami, I walked on the beach for more than 6 hours, I think more than 20 km, when I returned to hotel exhausted and so disappointed, I asked I didn't see any Pamela Anderson like she was on playboy before silicon, and I was answered: But Pamela Anderson is not American, she is Western Canadian. Prettiest seen in Florida were Puerto Rican girls, much more sexy and firm than Americans who are really not slim. Some blond Puerto Ricans were really attractive.
TankTank123
06-04-19, 09:19
Do any clubs in Germany have any Chinese, Japanese, Thai, Filipino, Malaysian girls? I remember years ago Bea at Palace but that's it. I haven't been with an Oriental girl since then and would like to.If 'Bea' is the Thai girl at Palace in 2009/2010, then there is currently at Sharks, a Filipina called Marlyn whom I find even better than Bee/Bea. Top class service, and with bob hair, cute pixie look. Usually heavily booked.
There is also a very very fat oriental-looking girl at Sharks (ex-World) whom you probably would not want to try, unless you are very short of cash.
There are 3 groups of people on ISG.
First group members think 50 is 50 and a girl needs to provide all services for 50. This includes BBBJ and kissing for sure, sex in multiple positions, perhaps even some ball sucking, FIV, fia, and even rimming. They do not like guys who pay extra money for any of the above services and they call such men tourists and suckers and clueless and worse.
Second group members think 50 is not very much money. Typically members of this group are somewhat affluent or at least they can afford to spend some amount of money in the clubs. These men are willing to pay 100 E or even more for 30 minute sessions to obtain many of the services mentioned above, especially if the girl is pretty. They also look down on members of group 1 and call them cheap Charlie's.
The third group is not very vocal here but they exist. They think it is best to be flexible. Sometimes these men pay extra money for some services and at other times they are strict in their purchases of services. I fall into group 3 most of the time, and perhaps you do as well.
Moving the discussion from Mainhattan to Lounge thread.
Eight European countries have legalized prostitution - Austria, Germany, Greece, Hungary, Latvia, Switzerland, Turkey and partially UK. But only Germany and some parts of Austria and Switzerland has any significant FKK type businesses. Greece, Hungary and Turkey are much closer to Romania and Bulgaria from where most of the FKK girls come to Germany for prostitution work. Now, why do you think all these girls come all the way to Germany instead of going to the countries closer (some still goes), which also brings some sex tourists (some stopover travelers too) in turn to Germany? Because besides the strength of economy, Germans built an infrastructure, security and system for this business that no other country provides. That system includes an implied Service vs. Pricing vs. Cost of Living model that keeps the business alive and going. Now, if most of us fucks up that service / pricing model by paying more than what is suggested by that well balanced model due to whatever the reason / justification we may have, what do you think will happen to the overall business and service environment in Germany? My guess, it will become similar to all the other countries in few years. Good luck in having good 30 minutes service for even 200-300 e in couple of years from now, and then slowly the FKKs will die due to lack of customers. So my advice. Let's not to cut the branch of the tree on which we are sitting. Let's not support so much inflation in this business that the business itself falls apart. I don't expect the WGs to understand this economic model albeit simple, but I do expect any monger reading here to at least think twice before next time paying more than the standard rates.
For our reference again, standard rates are: 50 e for 30 minutes of service including BBBJ, DFK, FIV, BLS, COB etc, with each additional 30 minutes unit of time for additional 50e.
Only extras are: CIM or COF for additional 50e, anal additional 100e. Both one time charge irrespective of how many times that activity happened when you stayed with her for multiple units of time.
There is absolutely no extra charge for multiple positions, it's not even a thing, never was and never should be. Obviously you cannot expect the girl to be in a position of cartwheel or pile-driver unless she wants to do that. Only normal sex positions please.
Interestingly, this is exactly what a new receptionist at Oase told me as prices for services, when I asked couple of years back.
Moving the discussion from Mainhattan to Lounge thread.
Eight European countries have legalized prostitution - Austria, Germany, Greece, Hungary, Latvia, Switzerland, Turkey and partially UK. But only Germany and some parts of Austria and Switzerland has any significant FKK type businesses. Greece, Hungary and Turkey are much closer to Romania and Bulgaria from where most of the FKK girls come to Germany for prostitution work. Now, why do you think all these girls come all the way to Germany instead of going to the countries closer (some still goes), which also brings some sex tourists (some stopover travelers too) in turn to Germany? Because besides the strength of economy, Germans built an infrastructure, security and system for this business that no other country provides. That system includes an implied Service vs. Pricing vs. Cost of Living model that keeps the business alive and going. Now, if most of us fucks up that service / pricing model by paying more than what is suggested by that well balanced model due to whatever the reason / justification we may have, what do you think will happen to the overall business and service environment in Germany? My guess, it will become similar to all the other countries in few years. Good luck in having good 30 minutes service for even 200-300 e in couple of years from now, and then slowly the FKKs will die due to lack of customers. So my advice. Let's not to cut the branch of the tree on which we are sitting. Let's not support so much inflation in this business that the business itself falls apart. I don't expect the WGs to understand this economic model albeit simple, but I do expect any monger reading here to at least think twice before next time paying more than the standard rates..Well said Gino, well said. Every monger should consider this.
Member #4636
06-04-19, 20:15
Moving the discussion from Mainhattan to Lounge thread.
Interestingly, this is exactly what a new receptionist at Oase told me as prices for services, when I asked couple of years back.Regarding Germany and why all girls go there: It is simply because of its economy and especially Frankfurt and NRW. Just look at the cars that park outside the clubs.
Regarding the price list: Why not just two types of service a. Classic and be Full.
Classic could be 150 / h including everything except anal and full 200 including anal. Then girls would stop charging everything for extra and the clients would know that for 150 they get what they want. Of course there will always be those mongers who go to clubs for 3 50's rounds but leaving the club I don't think they would be more happier. It is the quality that counts not the quantity.
+1.
I am American and I do not disagree! Many American girls, or men for that matter, are quite fat. Too many calories and too little exercise, I'm afraid.
Evita used to be slim. But she has been eating Sharks food that makes all the girls fat. She is better than other girls that have worked at Sharks for this many years but she is no longer young nor slim. However, her Asian customers still seem to like her. This is surprising to me as she is not even a fake blonde.
You are right about Puerto Rican girls in Florida. Some pretty Cuban girls too on the South beach.I never been with her, she thought my writings about her Asian business were critics, but even not so slim than Megan, but usually and even Megan enjoy good Romanian foods for them, at home, I think they miss their origin when they are in brothels, but among a poor casting on Friday 17 May, Evita was still above many GND even not a tight waist, but at least a bit glamour look with her hair. Not yet on American women body look level, fortunately she is still more fresh. I think Romanians are far prettier than most of American girls.
Cubans are too dark for me, some Puerto Ricans are quite Caucasian type.
I am planning a summer trip to the Frankfurt area FKKs in the next few weeks and want to ask about current Top Beauties / Top Girls at the following clubs:
Palace.
Oase.
Sharks.
World.
Mainhattan.
Thanks in advance. (I know beauty is subjective but it is still helpful to have a list of top lookers / performers).For my subjective tastes used to get beauties in clubs, I like Sharks for the club, but I m not anymore good to find chic beauties at Sharks, when I had many, but I would be happy to find a new one like high class one found on last June for a week end and next Friday.
From what I saw on a April Saturday, I think World worth a look, but only on Friday or Saturday.
Sometimes, can find a top girl at Palace.
Oase is a real good surprise for me since beginning of April, I found 5 beauties, last coming from Mainhattan, I have a new really attractive target, I got really good rooms. My best playfield at the moment with sports in the garden.
Sebastiane
06-04-19, 23:37
Please empty your inbox monsieur -- I tried to message you but couldn't because it's full.
Sancho Panza
06-05-19, 01:16
[Deleted by Admin]
EDITOR'S NOTE: This report was redacted or deleted to remove sections of the report that were largely argumentative. Please read the Forum FAQ and the Forum's Posting Guidelines for more information. Thank You!
Regarding Germany and why all girls go there: It is simply because of its economy and especially Frankfurt and NRW. Just look at the cars that park outside the clubs.
Regarding the price list: Why not just two types of service a. Classic and be Full.
Classic could be 150 / h including everything except anal and full 200 including anal. Then girls would stop charging everything for extra and the clients would know that for 150 they get what they want. Of course there will always be those mongers who go to clubs for 3 50's rounds but leaving the club I don't think they would be more happier. It is the quality that counts not the quantity.Well, if you are going to pay so much higher than current German standard rates, why not go to Switzerland where standard rates are 2 to 5 times higher than Germany. Also girls can go to Switzerland to follow your extra money, but they do have to be of a minimum beautiful look and have to provide solid service or they are out. You can find more on this on the ISG Switzerland thread. I think you will also learn why there are so fewer number of FKKs and fewer number of FKK girls in Switzerland compared to Germany, despite having much more disposable or floating money than Germany.
I doubt that the German FKK ecosystem can survive too much price inflation. If rates go too high compared to average German income and cost of living increases, locals will reduce visits, girls won't be able to compensate income only from the 20-30% tourists, less girls will remain or enter in the FKK system, clubs will make less money due to reduced number of customers and girls, eventually many clubs will collapse. So please be careful when you disrupt this unique German FKK ecosystem and turn it into similar to rest of the world.
ExpatLover
06-05-19, 04:55
How is the FKK generally in Summer ? will many girls go on vacation ?Just go through the forum every year the same question is coming, but in fact nobody is able to tell you what will be the LU in any FKK tomorrow so also impossible next month but in the big clubs there will be always enough girls if you are not too demanding you will find one for you.
+1.
I am American and I do not disagree! Many American girls, or men for that matter, are quite fat. Too many calories and too little exercise, I'm afraid.
Evita used to be slim. But she has been eating Sharks food that makes all the girls fat. She is better than other girls that have worked at Sharks for this many years but she is no longer young nor slim. However, her Asian customers still seem to like her. This is surprising to me as she is not even a fake blonde.
You are right about Puerto Rican girls in Florida. Some pretty Cuban girls too on the South beach.Only FKK I can think of that has the gym is Artemis, where I have seen many girls working out both weight lifting and cardio, so in Artemis you have a choice to do extra work out on top of sex. But beside that in most other FKK, when girls stay too long, they tend to expand in size. I guess just sex is not enough to keep them in shape.
Member #4636
06-05-19, 19:22
Well, if you are going to pay so much higher than current German standard rates, .I know that these are the current German standard rates but in reality how many people pay 50 for 30 minutes?
I think that when you know that you will pay 150/ hour and have BBBJ, FIV, DATY, CIM / COF you would rather prefer to do that. 2 sessions with super sexy women doing everything you like and walking out of a club with 300 euro less is not so bad. Many people pay much more and they are nor happy. Of course I understand this is not good for the clubs who want to have as much as fee entrance clients even if they don't spend a euro on girls because they can't find what they want. I hear that Globe has this elegance style that is similar to my taste and as far as I know it is surviving so if in Swiss why not in Germany?
I know that these are the current German standard rates but in reality how many people pay 50 for 30 minutes?
I think that when you know that you will pay 150/ hour and have BBBJ, FIV, DATY, CIM / COF you would rather prefer to do that. 2 sessions with super sexy women doing everything you like and walking out of a club with 300 euro less is not so bad. Many people pay much more and they are nor happy. Of course I understand this is not good for the clubs who want to have as much as fee entrance clients even if they don't spend a euro on girls because they can't find what they want. I hear that Globe has this elegance style that is similar to my taste and as far as I know it is surviving so if in Swiss why not in Germany?Once you visit Switzerland (Globe and other clubs there) and observe, you will see yourself why this would not work in Germany, at least not at the massive scale the FKKs are run in Germany. For now, I will tell you this. Globe being the most famous and largest in Switzerland, limits only 55-60 girls per day (except for special occasions like Halloween, NYE etc when they bring about 20-30 additional girls from their other smaller clubs). They keep very tight leash on the girls, both for keeping their looks (not becoming fat, not getting too many new tattoos etc etc) and quality of service (eg CIM with swallow means truly swallow my sperm that I can see, not turn away from me and spit it out). Each new girl has to answer Yes / No to 30 different services questions during their hiring interview, these services questions include some pretty nasty things eg NS active, NS passive, Kaviar play active and passive, sperm swallow, public gangbang etc etc, and doesn't mater how beautiful the girl is, she won't be hired if she doesn't check Yes to at least 20 of those 30 services. Even after being hired, if more than 3 customers complain about service, the girl will be either terminated or put in reserve bench or at least transferred to one of their smaller cheaper clubs as a punishment, unless the girl is a special favorite of the management which is not very often. More girls apply for working in Globe in every month than actually working in that month. Even with these strict standards for looks and services for girls and so much more affluent customers in the country, Globe gets maybe 100-200 customers per day, average being less. Do you think Sharks or Oase will like to run their business with so few entry fees? Can they even get 50-60 Globe quality girls every week, and 100 Globe level affluent customers who usually spend minimum 600 CHF per visit (many spend 2000-4000 CHF per visit, even poor me had spent 3600 CHF in one night once with my average being 600-1000 CHF per visit)? German FKK business thrives with large middle class customer base being serviced by large base of average quality girls for a lower standard prices; not the same as the Swiss high-end business model. Of course things can change, but I doubt we will see German FKKs doing better with increased rates anytime soon, rather they will struggle to stay open if their micro-economic model gets disrupted without improvement of the German macro-economic situation (increased income level of local Germans). Only tourists paying higher rates will not be enough for German FKKs to survive long term at the same scale.
Besides, as a tourist myself, I refuse to pay higher (or lower) than the standard rates in the country I am visiting. I respect the country I am visiting, I am grateful that they let me in to experience something that is not there in my home country, and I will not do anything to break something they have and cherish, even if I want something else or something more. For me, the standard FKK service rates are defined by the clubs and / or locals, not by travelers or tourists like me. Also, I have no issue paying higher rates in Globe as the club guarantees service quality from the optifick girls (mostly top 1% level of the German FKK girls), but I do not see justification to pay similar rates for some girl who for whatever reason is not working at Globe or at a similar club with service guarantee.
Member #4636
06-06-19, 14:58
Once you visit Switzerland (Globe and other clubs there) and observe, you will see yourself why this would not work in Germany, at least not at the massive scale the FKKs are run in Germany. For now, I will tell you this. Globe being the most famous and largest in Switzerland, limits only 55-60 girls per day (except for special occasions like Halloween, NYE etc when they bring about 20-30 additional girls from their other smaller clubs). They keep very tight leash on the girls, both for keeping their looks (not becoming fat, not getting too many new tattoos etc etc) and quality of service (eg CIM with swallow means truly swallow my sperm that I can see, not turn away from me and spit it out). Each new girl has to answer Yes / No to 30 different services questions during their hiring interview, these services questions include some pretty nasty things eg NS active, NS passive, Kaviar play active and passive, sperm swallow, public gangbang etc etc, and doesn't mater how beautiful the girl is, she won't be hired if she doesn't check Yes to at least 20 of those 30 services. Even after being hired, if more than 3 customers complain about service, the girl will be either terminated or put in reserve bench or at least transferred to one of their smaller cheaper clubs as a punishment, unless the girl is a special favorite of the management which is not very often. More girls apply for working in Globe in every month than actually working in that month. Even with these strict standards for looks and services for girls and so much more affluent customers in the country, Globe gets maybe 100-200 customers per day, average being less. Do you think Sharks or Oase will like to run their business with so few entry fees?.Wow your post was very informative about Globe and I get your point now, thank you! Also makes me want to catch the plane to Zurich right away!
Milfotronic
06-06-19, 18:19
Planning a trip to Frankfurt this summer. I'm still waiting for my FKK debut and want it to be successful. I want to enjoy the good weather hence would like the club to at least have a garden. Seems to me World would be the obvious choice.
Is / are there any reason / s I should pick some other FKK over World? I'd say most women look good with a suntan why I wouldn't care too much if World doesn't have the prettiest girls. And even though the facilities of Sharks and Oase seem better and more modern still they can't compete with World's outdoors area. Let me know what you think.
Only FKK I can think of that has the gym is Artemis, where I have seen many girls working out both weight lifting and cardio, so in Artemis you have a choice to do extra work out on top of sex. But beside that in most other FKK, when girls stay too long, they tend to expand in size. I guess just sex is not enough to keep them in shape.You can easily see it in some clubs where the girls have an inherent culture of fitness, while in other clubs nobody hits the gym. Acapulco Velbert for example comes to mind when I think of this. There was a gym many of them used just down the road. Very close by the club.
Polyamorist
06-07-19, 15:54
Globe being the most famous and largest in Switzerland, limits only 55-60 girls per day (except for special occasions like Halloween, NYE etc when they bring about 20-30 additional girls from their other smaller clubs). They keep very tight leash on the girls, both for keeping their looks (not becoming fat, not getting too many new tattoos etc etc) and quality of service (eg CIM with swallow means truly swallow my sperm that I can see, not turn away from me and spit it out). Each new girl has to answer Yes / No to 30 different services questions during their hiring interview, these services questions include some pretty nasty things eg NS active, NS passive, Kaviar play active and passive, sperm swallow, public gangbang etc etc, and doesn't mater how beautiful the girl is, she won't be hired if she doesn't check Yes to at least 20 of those 30 services. Even after being hired, if more than 3 customers complain about service, the girl will be either terminated or put in reserve bench or at least transferred to one of their smaller cheaper clubs as a punishment, unless the girl is a special favorite of the management which is not very often.
Wow your post was very informative about Globe and I get your point now, thank you! Also makes me want to catch the plane to Zurich right away!Salaam Pksimar,
Although Globe is one of my favorite FKKs, Gino's description is exaggerated in my opinion. If you read the Globe thread you will read many reports of "princess attitude". Some of the prettier girls will simply refuse to go with most customers, sticking to their personal favorites. I have experienced this personally. This kind of behavior would be impossible if Globe management were keeping as tight a ship as Gino suggests.
The idea of a "service guarantee" is a myth, no matter how much mongers want to believe in it. It is true that if you make a complaint Globe management will listen to it, or at least make a much better act of listening to it than at German FKKs. However, the reality is that, even at Globe, most mongers are loathe to complain when they are cheated because they are afraid it will reflect on them more than the girl -- and unfortunately, they may be right.
Wow your post was very informative about Globe and I get your point now, thank you! Also makes me want to catch the plane to Zurich right away!Pksimar69, glad this was informative for you. I think you will enjoy Globe and other clubs in Switzerland as you are willing to pay for guaranted solid service by beautiful non-fat no-cellulite girls. FYI, if you are already in Frankfurt area and have a car, you can simply drive to Globe, it's only about 3:30 to 4 hours drive thru mostly little traffic on autobahn except near Frankfurt and Stuttgart. But make sure that you have insurance to drive in Switzerland, it's separate from insurance in Germany. Also speed limits are much lower in Switzerland, so be careful to not get a ticket by many many speed checking cameras they have. Flying into Zurich is obviously another option, though usually much more expensive. I fly into Zurich only if I'm coming from far and know that I'm not going to be in Frankfurt area in that trip. Good luck and enjoy!
Salaam Pksimar,
Although Globe is one of my favorite FKKs, Gino's description is exaggerated in my opinion. If you read the Globe thread you will read many reports of "princess attitude". Some of the prettier girls will simply refuse to go with most customers, sticking to their personal favorites. I have experienced this personally. This kind of behavior would be impossible if Globe management were keeping as tight a ship as Gino suggests.
The idea of a "service guarantee" is a myth, no matter how much mongers want to believe in it. It is true that if you make a complaint Globe management will listen to it, or at least make a much better act of listening to it than at German FKKs. However, the reality is that, even at Globe, most mongers are loathe to complain when they are cheated because they are afraid it will reflect on them more than the girl -- and unfortunately, they may be right.Yeah Poly, I also read some of those "princess attitude" and refusals reports, but I personally experienced any sort of refusal (not really any princess attitude) only couple of times in last 4-5 years of 25+ visits to Globe. Once was Kate on NYE party couple of years back but she was all day booked by a customer (interestingly an Asian guy paying for the whole night, so probably 3000 CHF or more for 10-12 hours at 280 CHF per hour!) And the other was when I stopped a girl who just started her day but she said her customer is coming to the club in few minutes and she wants to keep herself fresh for the 6 hours session he booked ahead. I don't think we can call these "princess attitude" or refusals to go with me, these are simply schedule conflicts in my opinion. Kate found me in my next visit which happened to be a public sex Tuesday, apologized for the NYE busy night situation, and then we had sex in public all over the club, she even showed off her blowjob and cowgirl skills on me on the stage. We had too much fun that day. Few of her regulars were in the front row seats when we were fucking on the stage, she said "let me make my regulars a bit jealous, this will be fun" LOL. Only mediocre session I ever had in Globe was with Megan, I don't think she really enjoys sex, at least was not with me, though still way better than the upsellers and sharky girls in Germany now. My next goal is to do Carmen and Romina at the main bar on those bar stools, on a day other than Tuesday.
Are you sure that "service guarantee" is a myth at Globe? Over the years, many girls requested me to give good reviews after our sessions in case I was asked by the front desk guy or the manager, as they didn't want to be transferred to smaller cheaper sister clubs or be put in reserve or terminated; some of these girls almost sounded scared about bad reviews! Front desk guy almost always (and the manager on duty sometimes) asks me about the session quality when I pay or leave, and I am yet to complain as I haven't had any reason yet.
With regards to Service vs. Payment Discussion, IDEALLY Gino02's view is correct. But in reality, only very small percentage of the new fly-in FKK mongers read this FKK forum. I think that most of the new fly-in FKK mongers who don't read this forum overpay the WGs anyway, so the WGs will still try or insist to overcharge any new fly-in monger because overcharging works for them. If the readers here, who are FKK newbies, refuse to pay overcharge or extra as Gino02 hopes, it would very often end up with no deal for them. But they visit FKK clubs for having a good time, if they can't get what they want within their budget, it would be unfair to them because the FKK newbies who don't read this forum get what they want within their budget.
So my view is that you (the FKK newbie) should try to negotiate a best deal for you. If you want to do the WG badly and can afford the final deal with her, don't refuse the deal even if you overpay it, because you come to FKK clubs to have a good time.
BigBuddy69
06-07-19, 18:11
Other solution: change clubs. Everyone knows in which clubs you can find the biggest scammers and guess what, they are the most discussed clubs on this board. Oase: 26 000 posts. Sharks: 21.000 posts. Artemis: 11 000 posts. Palace: 11 000 posts. World: 11 000 posts.
Maybe the fly in mongers like to pay more actually.
Other solution: change clubs. Everyone knows in which clubs you can find the biggest scammers and guess what, they are the most discussed clubs on this board. Oase: 26 000 posts. Sharks: 21.000 posts. Artemis: 11 000 posts. Palace: 11 000 posts. World: 11 000 posts.
Well said (although nearly all the World posts are from its heydays). I go to a club where there is no scamming, DFK is ubiquitous, girls are relaxed, and where there are enough super slim girls to keep me more than busy. It is just so pleasant to know that I do not have to negotiate before going to a room.
Of course a few girls are always pushing the boundaries. Today there was a conversation with me, another guy, and a stunning girl, who was having trouble believing that guys were refusing to go with her because she refused to kiss. She clearly had never encountered this problem during her career at certain other clubs. She said she would reflect on her service standard. Lovely girl but not for me.
And of course there are other clubs where, with certain compromises on the optics, superb service is available with ultra friendly girls for 30 euros.
I will consider reporting on my recent visits to these clubs, but probably will not as such reports tend to be denigrated by aficionados of certain other clubs. So I will just say, if you are not happy with the price / service of the club you are going to, just walk away and try another one.
I know that these are the current German standard rates but in reality how many people pay 50 for 30 minutes?I raise my hand. . I just had 8 gals between Oase and Mainhatten (5 and 3) and stuck to $50 sessions. I have long travelog will try and post in some appropriate section. Am in Frankfurt for 10 days /9 nights.
You can easily see it in some clubs where the girls have an inherent culture of fitness, while in other clubs nobody hits the gym. Acapulco Velbert for example comes to mind when I think of this. There was a gym many of them used just down the road. Very close by the club.Yes, I also think that having gym near by helps considering hard working hours / type of job of FKK girls. In case of Artemis, it is in house gym down stairs and I even saw security guy doing personal training to some girls.
LR also has gym near by, I see one on the way to LR like few minutes walk.
Other solution: change clubs. Everyone knows in which clubs you can find the biggest scammers and guess what, they are the most discussed clubs on this board. Oase: 26 000 posts. Sharks: 21.000 posts. Artemis: 11 000 posts. Palace: 11 000 posts. World: 11 000 posts.
If the optics and sizes of the lineup in the clubs outside Frankfurt area were at the same level as the above clubs in Frankfurt area, I would agree with you. But from what I read here, the optics and sizes in the clubs in Frankfurt are better than the optics and sizes in other area, which I think makes sense logically although I have never been to any club in Frankfurt area. If the newbies look for good time with top-optic WGs, more choices of WGs and geographic convenience and have abundant mongering budgets. I think that they would prefer to go to the clubs in Frankfurt because they have better chance to find the WGs they like. As the seasoned FKK veterans with years experience, you and Optimist have been visiting Germany several times a year and already did many top-optic WGs, so it is much easier for you guys to stay away from the clubs most likely with top-optic WGs like the clubs you mentioned. This is like a rock star or movie star who already did at least several supermodels advises an aspiring musician, an aspiring actor or an ordinary person to walk away from his first opportunity to fuck a supermodel. We have to consider the factor that they are newbies when we talk about this subject.
Bfsie. I agree that what suits one person may not be appropriate for another. And especially for some it may be that the wow factor of the biggest clubs overrides other considerations. I am sorry if I came across as being prescriptive. I do repeat my point that if a club does not suit a person in terms of service level or anything else, they would be well advised to quickly explore elsewhere. No need to settle for higher prices or poor service.
I disagree that this means compromising on optics, except maybe in quantity. I totally think Oase opticswise has a wow factor simply because of the numbers. But if you mean optics of girls with whom one goes to room with, there is no need to compromise (unless going to the red carpet clubs). In fact, personally, as time goes on I have become more uncompromising in my optics assessments.
Each to his own.
Cheers.
ExpatLover
06-08-19, 11:27
Bfsie. I agree that what suits one person may not be appropriate for another. And especially for some it may be that the wow factor of the biggest clubs overrides other considerations. I am sorry if I came across as being prescriptive. I do repeat my point that if a club does not suit a person in terms of service level or anything else, they would be well advised to quickly explore elsewhere. No need to settle for higher prices or poor service.
I disagree that this means compromising on optics, except maybe in quantity. I totally think Oase opticswise has a wow factor simply because of the numbers. But if you mean optics of girls with whom one goes to room with, there is no need to compromise (unless going to the red carpet clubs). In fact, personally, as time goes on I have become more uncompromising in my optics assessments.
Each to his own.
Cheers.I have 0 compromises on optic, the girls must be a stunner for me or I don t go, I don t care what she is speaking or how she fucks, just beauty matters, for all the rest I don t need to go to a prostitutes, I consider that in a FKK everything is fake, cheating only beauty is true if you check carefully the girls: sili, botox, poor skin, smoking are all no go.
Polyamorist
06-08-19, 19:48
Yeah Poly, I also read some of those "princess attitude" and refusals reports, but I personally experienced any sort of refusal (not really any princess attitude) only couple of times in last 4-5 years of 25+ visits to Globe.
Are you sure that "service guarantee" is a myth at Globe?
Sure you have a guarantee. Your guarantee is "Things will go right until they go wrong."
Suppose you go to a fancy restaurant ten times and get a delicious meal each time. But on your eleventh visit you ask for a steak sandwich and your order gets mixed up and instead you get served a shit sandwich. After your first juicy bite you may be sufficiently shocked never to visit the establishment again. The manager might apologize but you will wonder, "Jeez but why did they even have that on the menu in the first place?" And even if you return for the good stuff you will never speak of "guarantees" again.
Well something like that happened to me at Globe and I didn't want to waste time dick-aching about #firstworldproblems, but you used the word "guarantee" and there are no guarantees in life. OK maybe at a high-class restaurant but not at an FKK.
Still I don't deny the club is worth a visit if you happen to be stuck in that somewhat decadent neighborhood (i.e. Europe).
"Whenever we manage to love without expectations, calculations, negotiations, we are indeed in heaven. " -- Rumi.
Planning a trip to Frankfurt this summer. I'm still waiting for my FKK debut and want it to be successful. I want to enjoy the good weather hence would like the club to at least have a garden. Seems to me World would be the obvious choice.
Is / are there any reason / s I should pick some other FKK over World? I'd say most women look good with a suntan why I wouldn't care too much if World doesn't have the prettiest girls. And even though the facilities of Sharks and Oase seem better and more modern still they can't compete with World's outdoors area. Let me know what you think.My preference in summer is Sharks. The outdoor area is great.
I'm not a fan of the Oase outdoor space.
It is a long time since I was at World.
ExpatLover
06-09-19, 00:19
Planning a trip to Frankfurt this summer. I'm still waiting for my FKK debut and want it to be successful. I want to enjoy the good weather hence would like the club to at least have a garden. Seems to me World would be the obvious choice.
Is / are there any reason / s I should pick some other FKK over World? I'd say most women look good with a suntan why I wouldn't care too much if World doesn't have the prettiest girls. And even though the facilities of Sharks and Oase seem better and more modern still they can't compete with World's outdoors area. Let me know what you think.World LU in summer can be quite reduced, no good for first timer to stick to one club, if the weather is bad it will be useless to have that big outside premises, the club is also a bit updated. The garden is important but not the key for a great time, LU is the key and better you also give a visit to Shark at least if not Oase. German forums are still negative about World.
Salaam Pksimar,
Although Globe is one of my favorite FKKs, Gino's description is exaggerated in my opinion. If you read the Globe thread you will read many reports of "princess attitude". Some of the prettier girls will simply refuse to go with most customers, sticking to their personal favorites. I have experienced this personally. This kind of behavior would be impossible if Globe management were keeping as tight a ship as Gino suggests.
The idea of a "service guarantee" is a myth, no matter how much mongers want to believe in it. It is true that if you make a complaint Globe management will listen to it, or at least make a much better act of listening to it than at German FKKs. However, the reality is that, even at Globe, most mongers are loathe to complain when they are cheated because they are afraid it will reflect on them more than the girl -- and unfortunately, they may be right.Yes, Globe girls are more inspected, so they have better care and look, when you can find little monkeys with very average teeth in Germany, but Globe is not hell for girls, Megan there since 2 years now, Larissa, Sofia and even Kate, are not warriors, if it was so difficult, they would not be able to resist, even for big money. I would like to see Kate trying to make me jealous being fucked in public in front of me, when she stopped with her client in September and I was not even close to them, about 10 meters far, but as soon she saw me, but it was already too late, killing my desire for her, then she could have seen in my eyes how a dreamed princess can become just a prostitute. It was not on a Tuesday but Friday, most often, she takes voyeur Tuesdays off, she really doesn't need this kind of business.
What is true is some girls, even Joana when she started, are afraid of bad report to desk after room. Never experienced princess behavior, girls usually return to me, at Globe or in Germany I don t run after our discovery, they can choose and they have to show me they choose me, to interest me.
Globe is the highest level I know in FKK land for looks and level in bed, when I was really disappointed by Aphrodisia average level of looks, but I understood this is not a good club for me, about image of women I look for, I'm not excited by prostitutes, but more by chic, elegance and charm, and also Swiss administration mafia don t help, so maybe on my way to my mountains, through Albanian go fast holes, but I prefer to work harder in Germany to get good from girls, even I hate when I waste my money, even less expensive, with average girls, like 50 wasted with Magdalena ex Mainhattan at Finca, who is on Globe level for look, but not for care, ashtray, and level in bed, just suck and fuck level.
Other solution: change clubs. Everyone knows in which clubs you can find the biggest scammers and guess what, they are the most discussed clubs on this board. Oase: 26 000 posts. Sharks: 21.000 posts. Artemis: 11 000 posts. Palace: 11 000 posts. World: 11 000 posts.
Maybe the fly in mongers like to pay more actually.Oase and Sharks are fine clubs which fit the need for the most number of mongers but perhaps some mongers with a lot of miles on their bodies have specialized needs and can't have fun there.
Thread post counts in Oase and Sharks are inflated due to the frequent, regular posters here and less due to newbie postings. Search function shows quite a few members who regularly bash the megaclubs are nevertheless posting very frequently in those threads. Conversely, while they love smaller clubs and undiscovered gems with outstanding service, the smaller club threads still have few and infrequent posts. Only Finca is getting some traffic of late, and it is not a truly small club either nor is it undiscovered.
I understand many senior members like to keep the good clubs and better girls a secret to themselves and discuss them in PMs with each other but not write in the public threads. That may be a good strategy for them. Perhaps that explains why the megaclubs have more participation from the senior regular members in terms of posting count while they actually seem to like the smaller clubs but post less in those threads.
However, the forum will be better off if information is shared openly and equally with all members, whether they post or not. Keep in mind, at some point all of us were newbies and all of us posted for the first time and attended a club for the first time. If megaclubs are crap as you believe but have much better options elsewhere, sharing openly will grab the attention of all readers, and traffic (both on ISG and attendance at the club) will be redirected to those clubs.
Due to their location, Frankfurt and Berlin will always have the most attendees but open sharing can help. That is also better than putting down the newbies and megaclubs and sex tourists.
My preference in summer is Sharks. The outdoor area is great.
I'm not a fan of the Oase outdoor space.
It is a long time since I was at World.I love outside chalets at Sharks, just have desperately to find a beauty. I dream to take a Jane, not vulgar one at LR, in tree room at World. Oase garden is the most sporty and not only for football. On Summer, Hessen is where you feel the most on holidays, compare to NRW, only Villa Vanilla ex Vertigo garden with swimming pool is really enjoyable and YY is really missing for garden with swimming pool. New Magnum will have outside swimming pool, wait and see for casting. DV is a beautiful club, but unfortunately, very average casting for my eyes.
I disagree that this means compromising on optics, except maybe in quantity. I totally think Oase opticswise has a wow factor simply because of the numbers. But if you mean optics of girls with whom one goes to room with, there is no need to compromise (unless going to the red carpet clubs). In fact, personally, as time goes on I have become more uncompromising in my optics assessments.
Each to his own.
Cheers.Optimist,
As I said, I have never been to any club in Frankfurt area, so I can't agree or disagree with you personally. From what I read here from the posters, I have firm impression that the level of WG's optics in the clubs in Frankfurt area, particularly Sharks and Oase, is higher than elsewhere. I wish I had visited there and found it out by myself. Cheers.
BigBuddy69
06-09-19, 19:59
Actually they're not, that's mainly self persuasion. The number of girls is higher but you're not walking in a model agency.
Optimist,
As I said, I have never been to any club in Frankfurt area, so I can't agree or disagree with you personally. From what I read here from the posters, I have firm impression that the level of WG's optics in the clubs in Frankfurt area, particularly Sharks and Oase, is higher than elsewhere. I wish I had visited there and found it out by myself. Cheers.I don't think you have missed anything apart from the sheer numbers and the nakedness. There are many superb looking girls in NRW. I shall never forget Linda's breasts at LR :D
Enjoy.
Sirioja. You mention Magdalena. I think she is a case of YMMV. I had several discussions with her before going to a room, and she delivered on all the promises. Absolutely not suck and fuck only. On that occasion at least. She was very sweet with me
Oase and Sharks are fine clubs which fit the need for the most number of mongers but perhaps some mongers with a lot of miles on their bodies have specialized needs and can't have fun there.
Thread post counts in Oase and Sharks are inflated due to the frequent, regular posters here and less due to newbie postings. Search function shows quite a few members who regularly bash the megaclubs are nevertheless posting very frequently in those threads. Conversely, while they love smaller clubs and undiscovered gems with outstanding service, the smaller club threads still have few and infrequent posts. Only Finca is getting some traffic of late, and it is not a truly small club either nor is it undiscovered.
I understand many senior members like to keep the good clubs and better girls a secret to themselves and discuss them in PMs with each other but not write in the public threads.
The reference to mongers with a lot of miles on their bodies, and the connection to recent reports on Finca would appear to relate to me :)
Regardless of who you are referring to, you are assuming that you know the motivations and private actions of people you do not know personally, even if you have gathered information about them. I suggest it is a good idea for all of us to refrain from attributing motives and hidden actions to other members. What we claim about other members is more likely to reveal more about our own view of the world. Do you feel you are being excluded from something?I can't believe any member thinks they can keep a good club from you. I am more than happy to answer any questions you might have about things you feel are being hidden. Anyway, I agree, the more information posted, the better, even if some weird guys then use it to diss other members to the girls. Now that your handle has been active for some time I look forward to some field reports from you to convert me to a Sharks' aficionado :D. I had hoped to run into you at Sharks today
I am continually amazed :confused: at the ongoing battle between avid supporters of the mega clubs and any criticism of them. Everybody is entitled to have their own preferences and to explain why. I love Oase and World, have always hated Palace, and just don't enjoy Sharks. But in all these clubs there are girls worth travelling long distances for. What I don't like is having to deal with sharks, of which there are many at these clubs. So, newbies, locals, flyin guests, megarich guests, all can go to the club which suits them
Sorry that I gave the impression you articulated below. I am not yet knowledgeable about most of the senior members here although I have been lurking for a while before I began finally writing. What I want to say, my comment was not most certainly not related to any person and certainly not you.
In a way, it could be about me. I find that I become jaded as I age, and need more to stimulate me to the same degree. I was married and that was sufficient to make me and keep me happy, then I needed more, and more and more. In the mainstream clubs, the services tend to be, well mainstream. So, it kinda makes sense that as one becomes more experienced they may want more things and seek out specialized clubs. It was most certainly not derogatory comment.
I quite agree with your second paragraph and this is exactly my intent in making my prior comment. There is a lot of bashing of the megaclubs here. The gentleman to whom I had responded referred to the post counts as a way to prove that megaclubs are overrun with newbies and tourists and implied that they are happy to be ripped off and I believe you expressed your own agreement with that comment.
What I am saying is that all if you senior members who are so experienced and have such vast knowledge actually publish it in a more open manner, the clueless tourists as you guys call them might benefit from that insight and visit other clubs. I see that you said in the Sharks thread that it is not your favorite club at all and yet you have more posts in Sharks than say, Finca (I could be wrong in this). I am a newbie writer and haven't the talent to write super reports as you do. I will strive to do it, even if it can't match the quality of senior writers.
But to your last paragraph, I am in total agreement. I am not as experienced as you are I am sure, but I have visited a few clubs in my life and enjoyed all of them in their own way. I am recently enjoying the megaclubs more than the smaller ones due to my requirement of volume consumption but I am also not going to go around and bash the smaller clubs in those threads, nor will I be bashing the attendees of those clubs whoever they may be because I am also an attendee of the smaller clubs as well occasionally.
The reference to mongers with a lot of miles on their bodies, and the connection to recent reports on Finca would appear to relate to me :)
Regardless of who you are referring to, you are assuming that you know the motivations and private actions of people you do not know personally, even if you have gathered information about them. I suggest it is a good idea for all of us to refrain from attributing motives and hidden actions to other members. What we claim about other members is more likely to reveal more about our own view of the world.
Sirioja. You mention Magdalena. I think she is a case of YMMV. I had several discussions with her before going to a room, and she delivered on all the promises. Absolutely not suck and fuck only. On that occasion at least. She was very sweet with meEven I would run to her look in any club, but with her breathe, I can't have pleasure with her and also not into foreplay, so even she smiled to me on next day, but 50 wasted for me and I hate that. I prefer to spend 500 for a top girl at Globe. Just my subjective experience of course, like always, and I m very different. Only positive was no upselling, even coming from Mainhattan.
BigBuddy69
06-09-19, 22:09
Oase and Sharks are fine clubs which fit the need for the most number of mongers but perhaps some mongers with a lot of miles on their bodies have specialized needs and can't have fun there.
It depends. If you're only into optics and don't care if the girl acts as a starfish or of you're ready to pay twice the price, it can be very good. If you're more into service and don't want to pay more than the normal price, I don't think that's the best place for you.
sharing openly will grab the attention of all readers, and traffic (both on ISG and attendance at the club) will be redirected to those clubs.
I'm not sure it's a good idea since some of the posters / readers here are overpayers or are constantly bragging that they're so full of money that they can do 3 hours rooms as much as they want. I don't want to take the upsell epidemy out of Frankfurt. Don't forget the few morons who like to talk shit to the girls about other posters.
I am continually amazed :confused: at the ongoing battle between avid supporters of the mega clubs and any criticism of them. I'm equally amazed that Optimist and Pessimist have different opinions.
I mostly visit Oase of the mega clubs as the others never really done anything for me (Artemis used to) but to each their own. Agree it's too bad when people get too invested in the clubs.
If there's anything visiting the clubs taught me is what I really like and where it deviates from what others like. Hence, different clubs for different people and it doesn't mean one is objectively better than the other.
I have been to Globe BTW and the girls were beautiful and so on but surprisingly the actual club felt a bit rundown. I know that people say they don't care and only visit clubs for girls but I still wonder if others agree.
Escape Artist
06-10-19, 01:14
Bfsie,
I visit both small NRW clubs and Frankfurt mega clubs and I find value in both scenes. When a poster advises you that you are "not missing" anything at the megaclubs is a bit wishful thinking. I do agree that one can find equally beautiful girls in NRW, but feel that I have had sessions with every single girl on my "wish list" within that region. I generally go to each club in NRW already knowing which girls with whom I will session. Occasionally, I will find a new girl that wows me. In Frankfurt, there are still girls who look great that I have yet to take to a room. I seem to always see a new face that perks my interest.
Secondly, while the service in NRW is on average better, it is hardly a guarantee. Look at Oceans, Samya, Magnum, Dolce Vita, Mondial, PHG, and even Acapulco. Amazing sex is hardly guaranteed at those clubs. I believe you were the one who mentioned that Turkish clientele oriented clubs generally do not provide as reliable service as the German oriented ones and I think you hit the nail on the head. And well, there are many more clubs in NRW that are geared towards Turkish clients. I dare say that Turkish service is just as bad as tourist service.
Anyway, Frankfurt clubs are absolutely worth a visit as you just have so many more girls and more fresh girls under one roof.
Is it just me, or is the 18-21 year old, as in the youngest new recruits in the past 2 years, more greedy than just 3 years ago? Thinking especially about Sharks and Oase now.
Pessimist's post offers some perspective. Financial priorities matter: http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?3172-FKK-Mainhattan-Frankfurt&p=2325359&viewfull=1#post2325359.
Income is only one variable. All things being equal, a single, childless bachelors who are approaching retirement can spend more money on luxuries such as mongering. Stage of life also matters too (I. E. Whether one will soon receive an inheritance from parents). I recently heard of one monger in his 50's who is dumping large sums into the coffers of his FKK wife. This monger in his 50's reportedly told his friends "I can sell my flat, because I do not have any kids to hand it down to. And I can't take that money with me". The implication is that he could blow through his money and live life to the fullest.
More important is the fact that each person values things differently. Just because a person has expensive tastes when it comes to cars, does not necessarily mean he has expensive tastes when it comes to WGs. ISGers are hardcore mongers. We only make up 10-15 percent of the FKK population. How much we are prepared to spend for a session with that superstar WG is not reflective of how much casual mongers are prepared to spend on her. I will make an analogy here to customers in the restaurant industry. Majority of diners do not write food reviews on Yelp, Google or Facebook, except the 5 percent who are obsessed with food! When you are obsessed with food, you tend to allocate more of your financial resources to food. For instance, due to the influence of social media, food has become somewhat of a status symbol for millennial. A single female, 33-year old millennial foodie can spend 30-60 percent of her paycheck on food. (https://www.bustle.com/p/what-14-millennial-women-spend-on-food-every-month-40431) So if she is making $50 K per year, she may be conceivably spending $30 K per year on food. Most American fly-in mongers make significantly more than $50 K, but as KK noted, many are quite happy eating cold packaged meats from Rewe. Again, priorities.
Lastly, many Americans here are not familiar with compensation packages in Europe. In America, a company car is not a common perk. But in Europe it is fairly standard. This article provides a scenario of an employee who makes 5000 EUR (before taxes) who is issued a company car worth 50000 EUR (https://medium.com/@tobias.ulrich/company-cars-in-germany-pro-and-cons-of-living-in-the-car-country-21d87caf9d62). In Belgium, company cars are issued to even the most junior employees. an estimated 50% of university graduates are offered a company car at their first job (https://www.thebulletin.be/half-grads-offered-company-car-first-job).
Here is what I think should be expected as the bare minimum when I go to these clubs from the girls in the room.
1. Forplay Kissing, light touching of all parts of the girl, caressing, handjob.
2. Blow Job without condom.
3. Sex in multiple positions.
4. Cum in condom.
5. The girl at least pretending like she is into it and cares about my pleasure.
Am I being Greedy for having this standard? Or have things changed?
In the good clubs (Goldentime, Living Room, (Sharks 40 percent of the time, most AO clubs) You can get service like this without having to ask, it just happens and there is no extra charge.
In some of the other clubs (Oase, Mainhatten, Oceans, etc) It is not and you need to ask. Is like any kind of foreplay is up-sell. Then when you tell the girls this and you agree to give them extra money they don't do it or do other things in the room half halfheartedly.
It depends. If you're only into optics and don't care if the girl acts as a starfish or of you're ready to pay twice the price, it can be very good. If you're more into service and don't want to pay more than the normal price, I don't think that's the best place for you.
I'm not sure it's a good idea since some of the posters / readers here are overpayers or are constantly bragging that they're so full of money that they can do 3 hours rooms as much as they want. I don't want to take the upsell epidemy out of Frankfurt. Don't forget the few morons who like to talk shit to the girls about other posters.Well, it is totally understandable you do not like Hessen megaclubs and also do not want to share info about your best clubs and best girls for fear of spoiling a good thing. What a man wants to share or not is his own prerogative. All the senior members who write anything at all here are owed a huge thanks — for a long time I was just a lurker without writing anything and I still haven't written any reviews as the other gentleman just pointed out.
However, what I do not get is what purpose is then served by bashing megaclubs and bashing "the newbies and clueless foreign sex tourists" that attend these big Hessen clubs. I mean, if you say "XX is a bad place, do not go there" isn't it better to also add "but go to YY because it is good for these reasons"? Simply saying "XX is bad place and all people that attend XX are clueless" does not serve any significantly productive utility, in my view.
I'm not sure I agree with the last sentence. Some guy is probably talking shit to some girl in some place, that kinda thing is always happening and no one can ever stop it. That however is not a reason enough to stop sharing in open forums. Info can always be shared without giving too many specifics and particulars, IMHO.
Is it just me, or is the 18-21 year old, as in the youngest new recruits in the past 2 years, more greedy than just 3 years ago? Thinking especially about Sharks and Oase now.I don't think they are any more greedy. But that's just me being technical and semantics focused. They were always greedy in my opinion, but in the past they balanced their greed with a better sense of prevailing reality in those days.
I agree with the gist of your proposition. The new recruits are openly demanding extras for standard stuff and withholding 30 M sessions for 50 E more brazenly and openly, and in general trying to make a faster buck and believing that they can easily make 15 to 20 grand per month very easily. I have also seen this attitude. I blame this partly on the change in the law, partly on the higher mix of tourists (agreeing with Big Buddy on this one), more than partly on the tutorials they are probably receiving from their older sisters in the clubs.
What I mean is that the new recruits of a few years ago were mentored by their senior WGs who probably joined the business nine to ten years ago. So, they received some good lessons. As time went on, they probably became a bit greedy but their own behavior was still shaped by the early club lesions. But these new recruits of today are mentored by girls who joined 4,5 years ago and there is not any good service manners being drilled into them.
That's my guess.
Yes, I also think that having gym near by helps considering hard working hours / type of job of FKK girls. In case of Artemis, it is in house gym down stairs and I even saw security guy doing personal training to some girls.
LR also has gym near by, I see one on the way to LR like few minutes walk.Mr Ho Mr Ho, my theory is many FKK girls have their nice body primarily due to win genetic lottery and youth of being in early 20's. Many work long hour with only maybe 4-5 hour sleep, exposure to loud music, bad diet and smoking all day which suppress appetite and eat less. I believe most are too tired for gym when not on holiday. Their nice figure was not created from go to gym for most these girls, they are just born with it.
I have been to artemis, babylon (hamburg), LR, GT, Samya, Yin Yang and Oceans and I think the few top optics were at GT. I'm trying to fulfill a fantasy of mine and trying to find a blonde like Daniela Rosch (german BTW and gorgeous) https://www.erosberry.com/daniela-rosch-alias-corina Do you guys know of any girls that resemble her or which clubs have girls w / her body type and natural. Thanks.
I don't think they are any more greedy. But that's just me being technical and semantics focused. They were always greedy in my opinion, but in the past they balanced their greed with a better sense of prevailing reality in those days.
I agree with the gist of your proposition. The new recruits are openly demanding extras for standard stuff and withholding 30 M sessions for 50 E more brazenly and openly, and in general trying to make a faster buck and believing that they can easily make 15 to 20 grand per month very easily. I have also seen this attitude. I blame this partly on the change in the law, partly on the higher mix of tourists (agreeing with Big Buddy on this one), more than partly on the tutorials they are probably receiving from their older sisters in the clubs.
What I mean is that the new recruits of a few years ago were mentored by their senior WGs who probably joined the business nine to ten years ago. So, they received some good lessons. As time went on, they probably became a bit greedy but their own behavior was still shaped by the early club lesions. But these new recruits of today are mentored by girls who joined 4,5 years ago and there is not any good service manners being drilled into them.
That's my guess.Are these new poor service upselling recruits in last 2 years actually making more money per month compared to the new good service no-upselling recruits before that? I remember Aylice at Sharks or Elizabeth CZ at Oase in 2015-2016 used to easily make 1000-1500 e per day, 15000 - 20000 e per month by doing 50 e 30 min sessions or multiple units of that with giving really good service and zero upselling. How many of these poor service upselling new recruits in last 2 years make that kind of money in Oase or Sharks nowadays? I don't know any, do anybody here know? If they are not making similar to Elizabeth CZ or Aylice, maybe they can learn from the history? Maybe we mongers can help today's new recruits by coaching them about how to maximize net income by balancing good products and solid services with attractive pricing, commitment to quality, volume and discounts, value of repeat business etc, when we get any chance to talk with them?
Pessimist. Thank you for your thoughtful response. You have taken the trouble to count my posts in Finca and in Sharks, and note that although Sharks is not my favourite club, I have more posts there. No need to see that as a contradiction. I have been to Sharks many more times (although not much recently) so, as I believe in reporting when possible, I have more posts in the Sharks threads.
I certainly do not want to bash the megaclubs. I love Oase for the wow factor. My only point is that if a member here does not like the overcharging (my phrase) not only are there girls who do not (as Turgid just reports) but there are other clubs where overcharging is almost unknown, and where optics are still good. Up to each member to go with what works for him.
You make a very good point about the way the culture in clubs changes over time
BigBuddy69
06-10-19, 08:55
However, what I do not get is what purpose is then served by bashing megaclubs and bashing "the newbies and clueless foreign sex tourists" that attend these big Hessen clubs. I mean, if you say "XX is a bad place, do not go there" isn't it better to also add "but go to YY because it is good for these reasons"? Simply saying "XX is bad place and all people that attend XX are clueless" does not serve any significantly productive utility, in my view.Actually I think I reported more than enough. I also gave frequent advises for where to get a good service for the normal price and I still do. But when I read serial-tippers who go to 40 euros clubs and tip every time 10 euros, I'm not sure that they got the message loud and clear.
BigBuddy69
06-10-19, 09:42
Here is what I think should be expected as the bare minimum when I go to these clubs from the girls in the room.
1. Forplay Kissing, light touching of all parts of the girl, caressing, handjob.
2. Blow Job without condom.
3. Sex in multiple positions.
4. Cum in condom.
5. The girl at least pretending like she is into it and cares about my pleasure.
Am I being Greedy for having this standard? Or have things changedYou're not greedy you're honest and reasonably demanding. Go to LR, 6 sens, Finca, you'll find girls for your tastes. Around Frankfurt Bahamas and Dietz may be your better choices. The 40 euros clubs around Dusseldorf (Aca gold and H7) could suit you but you have to interview the girls a little bit more.
Pessimist. Thank you for your thoughtful response. You have taken the trouble to count my posts in Finca and in Sharks, and note that although Sharks is not my favourite club, I have more posts there. No need to see that as a contradiction. I have been to Sharks many more times (although not much recently) so, as I believe in reporting when possible, I have more posts in the Sharks threads.
I certainly do not want to bash the megaclubs. I love Oase for the wow factor. My only point is that if a member here does not like the overcharging (my phrase) not only are there girls who do not (as Turgid just reports) but there are other clubs where overcharging is almost unknown, and where optics are still good. Up to each member to go with what works for him.
You make a very good point about the way the culture in clubs changes over timeThank you. It was no trouble at all since the search function on this site is quite efficient. It takes no more than a couple of seconds to obtain these stats, although the search history is cut off at a couple of years and hence I was not sure if your actual posting history differs materially from the search result.
And I agree that there is no contradiction. I have no interest in AO but might post in those threads if a topic or post piques my interest. The original post was made in response to Big Buddy's hypothesis that Sharks and Oase have the largest number of posts and ipso facto those clubs must be overrun with newbies and tourists. I was immediately stuck with the idea that a large number of posts is not necessarily a bad thing at all, but also that a majority of those posts in even the megaclubs threads must be from frequently posting senior members. I did that search query on a few senior members to satisfy myself whether I was right, and you just happened to post your reply at that same time so I just gave your own Finca v Sharks posting count as an example. My broader point is that even in Sharks and Oase threads it is the regular members posting the most and while that is out of the well intentioned concern that Newbie writers like myself are getting trapped in mediocre clubs, it would also help if they posted even more reports in their favorite smaller club threads showcasing their favorite best girls.
In the end, a lot of guys can figure for themselves that a specific girl or club is not particularly good. It may take one session, one trip or perhaps two. What most of us need help with is knowing which are the good replacements.
Are these new poor service upselling recruits in last 2 years actually making more money per month compared to the new good service no-upselling recruits before that? I remember Aylice at Sharks or Elizabeth CZ at Oase in 2015-2016 used to easily make 1000-1500 e per day, 15000 - 20000 e per month by doing 50 e 30 min sessions or multiple units of that with giving really good service and zero upselling. How many of these poor service upselling new recruits in last 2 years make that kind of money in Oase or Sharks nowadays? I don't know any, do anybody here know? If they are not making similar to Elizabeth CZ or Aylice, maybe they can learn from the history? Maybe we mongers can help today's new recruits by coaching them about how to maximize net income by balancing good products and solid services with attractive pricing, commitment to quality, volume and discounts, value of repeat business etc, when we get any chance to talk with them?You make good points. I doubt that many girls are at the level of Sharks' Aylice or Oase'Elizabeth CZ in terms of service levels. Those two were such nice sweethearts for me and probably many guys.
Aylice didn't even have many mentors either, and was good friends with Manuela and a couple of girls as I recall.
But today's new girls are probably acting on mistaken advice, own internal expectations, and bad early habits. They may be thinking that acting in the manner they are doing is a good way of maximizing their monthly take and when that is not happening, I am not sure they are doing a proper introspection and correcting their behavior. Such honest and critical introspection is a hard thing to do for even well educated, mature adults. I suspect not many of these girls are at that level. So, they are more likely to blame some other external factor, perhaps change a club or whatnot but not truly change their own behavior and service level.
I also don't think us mongers can truly coach them to make changes. First, the girls under discussion IE bad service inflated expectation girls are not sitting down with experienced mongers for any length of time, as they think it is a waste of their time and money and are more likely to yap away with fellow WG friends. They don't view the monger as a potential mentor in any sense. They view us as a John with Euro notes attached to cock. At the same time, few mongers are likely to take the time and patiently pursue a single girl to drill into her head what's good for her business. Our interest is to obtain a good session, keep the session pleasant enough such that she is inclined to provide a good session in future if we picked that girl again and have an equally good session with another pretty girl as soon as we leave the room. I have heard of very few girls who changed their set ways in any meaningful manner because a monger advised and influenced her.
Massimoweb
06-10-19, 17:02
On the first week of July I will be in Dusseldorf for a short business trip of three days.
As my last visit to an FKK in NRW was in 2012 at Dolce Vita, I kindly ask some info about the DV, LR and Aca Gold. I would have the chance to visit these clubs in the evening, after 9 pm, I do not have problems of transportation, as I will rent a car.
What is the actual average rate for the std 30 minutes and for 60 minutes in these clubs?
I saw that with the new law, BBBJ is not a std anymore. In January, at Babylon Hamburg I had to pay 10 euros more for it. Is it same now in NRW?
Thanks in advance for your answers and suggestions!
On the first week of July I will be in Dusseldorf for a short business trip of three days.
As my last visit to an FKK in NRW was in 2012 at Dolce Vita, I kindly ask some info about the DV, LR and Aca Gold. I would have the chance to visit these clubs in the evening, after 9 pm, I do not have problems of transportation, as I will rent a car.
What is the actual average rate for the std 30 minutes and for 60 minutes in these clubs?
I saw that with the new law, BBBJ is not a std anymore. In January, at Babylon Hamburg I had to pay 10 euros more for it. Is it same now in NRW?
Thanks in advance for your answers and suggestions!Good BJ stay quite standard in NRW and Hessen, some girls interested by extra for CIM. Usual clubs rate is 40 or 50/30 mn in NRW which is not Hamburg.
BigBuddy69
06-10-19, 18:18
Aca Gold: 40 € / 30 min. LR: 50 € / 30 min. DV: I don't know.
No overcharge for BBBJ or DFK in the two clubs above. If a girl tells you there is one, use the magical word: "no". Or else you'll pay the tourist rate. Make up an excuse like "my good Belgian friend comes often here and he told me there is no upsell in this club" or something like that. And please don't tip or commit to a one hour session before the start.
Are these new poor service upselling recruits in last 2 years actually making more money per month compared to the new good service no-upselling recruits before that? I remember Aylice at Sharks or Elizabeth CZ at Oase in 2015-2016 used to easily make 1000-1500 e per day, 15000 - 20000 e per month by doing 50 e 30 min sessions or multiple units of that with giving really good service and zero upselling. How many of these poor service upselling new recruits in last 2 years make that kind of money in Oase or Sharks nowadays? I don't know any, do anybody here know? If they are not making similar to Elizabeth CZ or Aylice, maybe they can learn from the history? Maybe we mongers can help today's new recruits by coaching them about how to maximize net income by balancing good products and solid services with attractive pricing, commitment to quality, volume and discounts, value of repeat business etc, when we get any chance to talk with them?Yes, little Bulgarian Aylice at Sharks, was high level in bed, but not a top beauty, and even she was so lovely with a beautiful smile, I was not anymore attracted when she became silicon. When I think you could get what you look for with her, but I had higher level girls at Sharks like now Kate Globe for Sharks rate, and Megan was higher level for me, I don't mean about extreme performances, but more than 30 rooms with Megan only at Sharks, versus less than 10 rooms with Aylice.
About Elisabet. Cz at Oase, also really lovely, but nothing exceptional for me in bed, only technique but no sensuality, had also higher level girls for me at Oase, like Tatiana. Ru or my April girls.
After my last real life girlfriend, when I found some Russian escorts met in Paris were not pretty enough and was criticized when I wrote this on another forum before this one, it was really difficult for me to find pretty girls when I started in FKK land on end of 2012, looking for Siberian types, I often left most famous clubs like GT, Sharks, Oase with full, heavy balls, taking appointment with one of my regular escort when driving back to Paris, for a Russian night, but I succeeded to find few beauties, I learned to love Romanian beauties and understood the most difficult for me is to find pretty girls, so when I succeed, even when they are not performers, I prefer to work to make a beauty improving for me. At LR, I chose one for her look and charm, even first room was really average with her small pussy. At the end of our discovery, I didn't think to repeat, but nothing better on end of 2016 at LR, so I looked again at her look and I returned to her few hours later, I was her first to repeat on same day with her, I met her weekly when she worked, she followed me in bed and became my best ever girl in whole FKK land, even including Globe superstars, not for her performances in bed, but for complicity and trusting for sex, with so erotic games. I loved when I put her sticky, white liquid on my fingers to make her taste, but she turned head, so I put in my mouth and kissed her to put in her mouth, and some other sexual games, and I also understood when you make your girls feel woman, making them cum, some will ask you for again, and most will treat you in different way than others, you are not anymore only for money, but then they think, when they are most often just a piece of meat to fuck, you are in love, and some will become jealous, asking you not to go with other girls, or very angry when you stop, but I always stop when I think their behavior don't deserve anymore my money I work to make, and I only returned to this one, because she had exceptional behavior to welcome me when we met again on beginning of September 2017, and immediately on this day, she adapted her schedule like before. On the week end I stopped, she was booked all week end, but delayed her appointment to be free for me, but I couldn't anymore, I was too bored, but I know how she really tried to keep me, when I was not her biggest money, and I m sure she is not so angry about her other lost clients. Also interesting at the moment, when we don't have room together, but relation going on with another very regular, saying I'm so kind with her, when no money between us. But I m not interested to meet for shopping, or holidays. I have my own plans for my busy holidays.
What is the actual average rate for the std 30 minutes and for 60 minutes in these clubs?
I saw that with the new law, BBBJ is not a std anymore. In January, at Babylon Hamburg I had to pay 10 euros more for it. Is it same now in NRW?
50EUR for 30 minutes, 100EUR for 60 minutes, and don't agree to BBBJ for extra, the girls are taking advantage of the law change to try to get more money out of you.
You're not greedy you're honest and reasonably demanding. Go to LR, 6 sens, Finca, you'll find girls for your tastes. Around Frankfurt Bahamas and Dietz may be your better choices. The 40 euros clubs around Dusseldorf (Aca gold and H7) could suit you but you have to interview the girls a little bit more.Dietzenbach only worth, like Villa Venus or Arabella, if you want AO sex, but certainly not for high level of sex, when no beauty, no sensuality. Some new LR girls don't kiss, among some of the prettiest like Reina or Georgi. Few try to upsell at Finca like one of the prettiest, Deniz, when I had high level girls at Sharks for club rate, a really top class on June 2018 , and Oase was really high level, higher level than my LR 2019 girls and prettier, and even higher level than most of my last GT girls, on last months, with my only 2019 wow girl, at Oase. But we don't all have same tastes for looks and level in bed.
50EUR for 30 minutes, 100EUR for 60 minutes, and don't agree to BBBJ for extra, the girls are taking advantage of the law change to try to get more money out of you.I second what DownandUp and BB69 say.
Sebastiane
06-10-19, 20:45
I doubt that many girls are at the level of Sharks' Aylice ...in terms of service levels...
Aylice didn't even have many mentors either.Aylice was a magnificent performer and also very beautiful with charisma. Her BBBJ skills were legendary and she was a sweetheart too. I think she stopped working before the new anti-BBBJ laws came in. At least I haven't seen her since.
You make good points. I doubt that many girls are at the level of Sharks' Aylice or Oase'Elizabeth CZ in terms of service levels. Those two were such nice sweethearts for me and probably many guys.
Aylice didn't even have many mentors either, and was good friends with Manuela and a couple of girls as I recall.
But today's new girls are probably acting on mistaken advice, own internal expectations, and bad early habits. They may be thinking that acting in the manner they are doing is a good way of maximizing their monthly take and when that is not happening, I am not sure they are doing a proper introspection and correcting their behavior. Such honest and critical introspection is a hard thing to do for even well educated, mature adults. I suspect not many of these girls are at that level. So, they are more likely to blame some other external factor, perhaps change a club or whatnot but not truly change their own behavior and service level.
I also don't think us mongers can truly coach them to make changes. First, the girls under discussion IE bad service inflated expectation girls are not sitting down with experienced mongers for any length of time, as they think it is a waste of their time and money and are more likely to yap away with fellow WG friends. They don't view the monger as a potential mentor in any sense. They view us as a John with Euro notes attached to cock. At the same time, few mongers are likely to take the time and patiently pursue a single girl to drill into her head what's good for her business. Our interest is to obtain a good session, keep the session pleasant enough such that she is inclined to provide a good session in future if we picked that girl again and have an equally good session with another pretty girl as soon as we leave the room. I have heard of very few girls who changed their set ways in any meaningful manner because a monger advised and influenced her.Pessimist, thanks for appreciating my points.
Yeah most of these new girls won't take any advice from mongers about how to make more money in this business, but given how much time they now spend on Instagram, Snapchat, TikTok, Boomerang etc when back in their sleeping beds and on their off days, don't you think that even if only 1 or 2 of the 200+ girls on the Sharks roasters try the advice and succeed making more net money at the end of the day / month, this success story can get viral thru the social media and many more girls will follow the path of success? Obviously some girls will also notice the successful girls in the club itself and try to understand or mimic the steps, but it can be a hit or miss to notice 1 or 2 successes out of 100+ girls and few hundred guys at any given day in Sharks. Same goes for the other upselling clubs like Oase, Mainhattan, Palace etc; in fact social media has a much better chance of making this success story viral across clubs. In the end, everyone wins - WGs, mongers, clubs - all.
FYI, this is the same "viral by social media" strategy that most businesses and think tanks are using these days to influence effectiveness of marketing, ideas etc - I'm sure you already thought of it by now.
Pessimist, thanks for appreciating my points.
Yeah most of these new girls won't take any advice from mongers about how to make more money in this business, but given how much time they now spends on Instagram, Snapchat, TikTok, Boomerang etc when back in their sleeping beds and on their off days, don't you think that even if only 1 or 2 of the 200+ girls on the Sharks roasters try the advice and succeed making more net money at the end of the day / month, this success story can get viral thru the social media and many more girls will follow the path of success? Obviously some girls will also notice the successful girls in the club itself and try to understand or mimic the steps, but it can be a hit or miss to notice 1 or 2 successes out of 100+ girls and few hundred guys at any given day in Sharks. Same goes for the other upselling clubs like Oase, Mainhattan, Palace etc; in fact social media has a much better chance of making this success story viral across clubs. In the end, everyone wins - WGs, mongers, clubs - all.
FYI, this is the same "viral by social media" strategy that most businesses and think tanks are using these days to influence effectiveness of marketing, ideas etc - you probably already guessed it.I agree that not all girls are not uncoachable. Some girls are certainly likely to take a pragmatic, business minded approach to their careers, analyze what's working well and not, look at other successful girls and what is the factor helping those girls and try to copy them. Copying may be the greatest form of flattery but that's also how all of us human beings improve — from the time as babies imitating grownups how to talk, walk, eat and potty. The sensible girls in the clubs should be copying the habits of the more successful girls as you rightly said.
Some or perhaps many girls read ISG as well, from what I have observed and from what members wrote here. So, some of them know what men are thinking of them. This is also a form of feedback — the sensible girls do not take offense and try to learn from it — or they should anyway. The narrow minded girls try to track down who wrote what and blacklist their existing clients. Talk about stupidity — if you are a business owner that received negative feedback from an existing customer in an anonymous survey, would you track that customer down and refuse to accept his business? For any business that wants to survive and thrive such an act would be considered colossal idiocy. But that's precisely the behavior exhibited by many FKK girls.
There is also the question of how many of us would go to the trouble of reforming and helping a girl with bad habits. Remember, we are talking here about girls with bad service levels, bad attitude, prone to upselling, etc. The good girls are already good, there is no reason to reform them or help them in any way. It is the bad ones needing help, in order to make a whole club better. But most of us are likely to avoid the bad ones, try to get a time slot with the good ones, perhaps write a good review about the better service girls and recommend her to a friend, and perhaps even pan the bad service girl in a ISG review. The hope is that the bad service girl has to possess some amount of self realization, recognize the facts in a bad review and also recognize why another girl is getting a good review + more business and change herself.
Unfortunately, many of these girls took the exact wrong lesson to heart, came to the faulty conclusion that the best way to increase their business is to target mild mannered people, foreign tourists, dare I say even Asians, and otherwise scam unsuspecting mongers.
I agree that not all girls are not uncoachable. Some girls are certainly likely to take a pragmatic, business minded approach to their careers, analyze what's working well and not, look at other successful girls and what is the factor helping those girls and try to copy them. Copying may be the greatest form of flattery but that's also how all of us human beings improve from the time as babies imitating grownups how to talk, walk, eat and potty. The sensible girls in the clubs should be copying the habits of the more successful girls as you rightly said.
Some or perhaps many girls read ISG as well, from what I have observed and from what members wrote here. So, some of them know what men are thinking of them. This is also a form of feedback the sensible girls do not take offense and try to learn from it or they should anyway. The narrow minded girls try to track down who wrote what and blacklist their existing clients. Talk about stupidity if you are a business owner that received negative feedback from an existing customer in an anonymous survey, would you track that customer down and refuse to accept his business? For any business that wants to survive and thrive such an act would be considered colossal idiocy..The girls that work at an FKK are usually not the most educated girls. The FKK provides a safe environment. Which attracts the girls. Usually, girls are controlled by pimps that tell them what to do. Most think pretty short term and want fast money. When you were that age, did you really think about long term prospects? That is why you see the more educated and older girls in the high end escort business. These girls know that their looks alone will not get them far. They understand the art of seduction and many have mad skills (I. E. Globe). They understand that proper grooming, being able to speak well, being adaptable to a variety of situations, and older professional men is where the money is. They are not looking at 100 E / hour, but 1-2 K over a day or two with possible foreign trips and shopping excursions. Sex is just one part of the equation. They know wealthy men want to be pampered. They must be available at a moments notice. And they can't look like a WG. By the time a girl is close to 30, she knows this or is struggling to earn a living. Ever wonder why a 30 year old escort can command 400-500 an hour and a 21 year old cannot? The experienced girl knows it is not about the orgams. She knows she can make a guy want to have sex and keep him interested until he is exhausted and satisfied. This does not have to mean doing the nasty stuff. She knows she can give him what no other girl can. That is why he pays and keeps coming back. There is nothing that keeps a girl from learning this except her ego and inexperience.
Aylice was a magnificent performer and also very beautiful with charisma. Her BBBJ skills were legendary and she was a sweetheart too. I think she stopped working before the new anti-BBBJ laws came in. At least I haven't seen her since.Are we all speaking about small Bulgarian brunette Aylice who became silicon? Who was really high level in bed, or maybe about blond, Marilyn look, model type, Hellis? But average face.
Yes, some WGs, at Sharks, at LR, at Oase, read this forum.
Yes, some guys tell to girls what we are writing, some even pay for time in room spent to bullshit about other guys, and how could I know if I was not told by my girls.
From my experiences, high level, smart girls don't speak about money, they prefer to make regular clients who return often, sometimes weekly, driving so many kilometers for me. Usually, upselling girls won t be the highest level. For example, at Sharks you have Mandy, busy for club rate, and some who try to upsell, but sitting waiting. Girls are often on their clients level, look at their clients and You know a bit about the girl, but with few you can sometimes make them go on your level.
Have to play and make the job to get what we want.
ExpatLover
06-11-19, 10:16
I agree that not all girls are not uncoachable. Some girls are certainly likely to take a pragmatic, business minded approach to their careers, analyze what's working well and not, look at other successful girls and what is the factor helping those girls and try to copy them. Copying may be the greatest form of flattery but that's also how all of us human beings improve from the time as babies imitating grownups how to talk, walk, eat and potty. The sensible girls in the clubs should be copying the habits of the more successful girls as you rightly said.
Some or perhaps many girls read ISG as well, from what I have observed and from what members wrote here. So, some of them know what men are thinking of them. This is also a form of feedback the sensible girls do not take offense and try to learn from it or they should anyway. The narrow minded girls try to track down who wrote what and blacklist their existing clients. Talk about stupidity if you are a business owner that received negative feedback from an existing customer in an anonymous survey, would you track that customer down and refuse to accept his business? For any business that wants to survive and thrive such an act would be considered colossal idiocy. But that's precisely the behavior exhibited by many FKK girls.What a theoretical approach, I spent many months in several cities in Romania with Romanian girls working in FKK and I really don t believe that any girl in a club have this kind of approach, they just try to earn as much as possible by providing the less service possible. Be a prostitute is not a business, is also not without health issues for most of the girls, 90% of the girls have pimp or a BF or are married.
I agree that not all girls are not uncoachable. Some girls are certainly likely to take a pragmatic, business minded approach to their careers, analyze what's working well and not, look at other successful girls and what is the factor helping those girls and try to copy them.
Unfortunately, many of these girls took the exact wrong lesson to heart, came to the faulty conclusion that the best way to increase their business is to target mild mannered people, foreign tourists, dare I say even Asians, and otherwise scam unsuspecting mongers.I have enjoyed this conversation and the thoughtful replies. As to the topic of service: I am reminded of comments that people make about NYC service in any clubs or stores. It was perfunctory even abrupt and cold. People would say in a city that large there is almost always another customer right behind you! So don't expect the majority of stores to care! As you and several others pointed out, how many people in FKK clubs are tourists, newbies or just so desperate after leaving their own home that any service is fine as long as they get laid. Most never post and I suspect many don't read this forum or any other except to look at prices. If you come from London a 20 Euro upsell compared to your wife saying "I'll Give you a BJ when he'll freezes over" is pretty darn good.
Most people don't post and the girls probably don't care. If 2 or 3 girls are successful and the rest are all upsellers my first thought would be why would 90%change to match 10%. Honestly if I were in a club and two girls were really busy I'the suspect they were offering something I'the rather not ask do. Just a different view of the Rorschach inkblot from my perspective AND as many of you pointed out. As long as they keep coming through the front door- why change.
I agree that not all girls are not uncoachable. Some girls are certainly likely to take a pragmatic, business minded approach to their careers, analyze what's working well and not, look at other successful girls and what is the factor helping those girls and try to copy them.
Unfortunately, many of these girls took the exact wrong lesson to heart, came to the faulty conclusion that the best way to increase their business is to target mild mannered people, foreign tourists, dare I say even Asians, and otherwise scam unsuspecting mongers.I appreciate the conversation here! I am reminded of the comments people made when they used to visit me in NYC and would ask "How can the shopkeepers keep customers with that attitude. Really abrupt and almost rude". And I would think, well with so many people walking through the door each day? It's whatever it takes to keep the door open and not too much more. Nothing personal! Life in the FKK seems to be like that. Lots of tourists, men who visit at best, 1 or 2 times a year or once in their life!!
Do the girls really care what the 1 or 2 girls do who are successful, maybe 5% of the ladies? Does that happen in many businesses? Sure some will follow but most come to work, do what they can to get through the day and leave. And if enough people come through the door who only care about that one visit, maybe even a couple visits a year, then the attitude prevails. When I see one or two girls extremely busy, I don't just think: I bet their service is incredible. Sometimes I think what extra things are they offering that the regulars all know? Consider the guy sitting in the FKK thinking: 20 or 50 for a BJ, versus going home to his wife who says: You want a BJ, when hell freezes over.
I admit it, I'm going for my first visit to an FKK, having traveled to other countries and indulged mostly in North America with its own messed up rules. And sadly, if a girl says to me 20 for kissing and she's cute enough, maybe I'll be stupid enough to pay, because when I'm in a club with naked women who may or may not be rubbing my dick, I'm not sure how in control of things I really am.
Member #4636
06-11-19, 17:36
The girls that work at an FKK are usually not the most educated girls. The FKK provides a safe environment. Which attracts the girls. Usually, girls are controlled by pimps that tell them what to do. Most think pretty short term and want fast money. When you were that age, did you really think about long term prospects? That is why you see the more educated and older girls in the high end escort business. These girls know that their looks alone will not get them far. They understand the art of seduction and many have mad skills (I. E. Globe). They understand that proper grooming, being able to speak well, being adaptable to a variety of situations, and older professional men is where the money is. They are not looking at 100 E / hour, but 1-2 K over a day or two with possible foreign trips and shopping excursions. Sex is just one part of the equation. They know wealthy men want to be pampered. They must be available at a moments notice. And they can't look like a WG. By the time a girl is close to 30, she knows this or is struggling to earn a living. Ever wonder why a 30 year old escort can command 400-500 an hour and a 21 year old cannot? The experienced girl knows it is not about the orgams. She knows she can make a guy want to have sex and keep him interested until he is exhausted and satisfied. This does not have to mean doing the nasty stuff. She knows she can give him what no other girl can. That is why he pays and keeps coming back. There is nothing that keeps a girl from learning this except her ego and inexperience.Fantastic report and so true!! Men want women that know how to make them exhausted and satisfied and want to come back to enjoy those moments I think that what attracts more these women is their level and class, the way they speak and behave etc. In FKK almost all girls are un educated and you can see that from the way they behave.
Member #4636
06-11-19, 17:37
For example, at Sharks you have Mandy, busy for club rate, and some who try to upsell, but sitting waiting. Girls are often on their clients level, look at their clients and You know a bit about the girl, but with few you can sometimes make them go on your level..Is Mandy still there?
Thank you Tintin.
And what a nice name! Tintin was one of my favorite comic characters when I was growing up. I wish I had thought of that handle first. Perhaps I will change my name to Captain Haddock or Colonel Sponz!
Agree with all you said. Not much to add when you said it so well.
"20 Euro upsell compared to your wife saying "I will give you a BJ when hell freezes over".
I was at work when I pulled this up on my phone and had to work hard to stop from ROTFL. Priceless!! Best quote of the year for me.
I have enjoyed this conversation and the thoughtful replies. As to the topic of service: I am reminded of comments that people make about NYC service in any clubs or stores. It was perfunctory even abrupt and cold. People would say in a city that large there is almost always another customer right behind you! So don't expect the majority of stores to care! As you and several others pointed out, how many people in FKK clubs are tourists, newbies or just so desperate after leaving their own home that any service is fine as long as they get laid. Most never post and I suspect many don't read this forum or any other except to look at prices. If you come from London a 20 Euro upsell compared to your wife saying "I'll Give you a BJ when he'll freezes over" is pretty darn good.
Most people don't post and the girls probably don't care. If 2 or 3 girls are successful and the rest are all upsellers my first thought would be why would 90%change to match 10%. Honestly if I were in a club and two girls were really busy I'the suspect they were offering something I'the rather not ask do. Just a different view of the Rorschach inkblot from my perspective AND as many of you pointed out. As long as they keep coming through the front door- why change.
BigBuddy69
06-11-19, 18:31
In FKK almost all girls are un educated and you can see that from the way they behave.Very nice and respectful, you should tell it to the girls next time you come. That's funny but most of the girls I meet in sauna clubs are smart, speak a lot of languages [Deleted by Admin].
smart girls don't speak about money, they prefer to make regular clients who return often, sometimes weekly, driving so many kilometers for me. Usually, upselling girls won t be the highest level.My opinion too. It takes some effort and patience to find these girls, but it is worth it. The girls who can turn an encounter into something much more than just fun. I have never met an upselling / over charging girl who was top level.
Sebastiane
06-11-19, 20:43
about blond, Marilyn look, model type, Hellis? But average face.The blonde Marilyn-Monroe model type. I liked her face too. She was an angel! And a sweetheart and fantastic in bed with no upsell when she went with me last time I saw her at Paradise.
My opinion too. It takes some effort and patience to find these girls, but it is worth it. The girls who can turn an encounter into something much more than just fun. I have never met an upselling / over charging girl who was top level.Sometimes, you need to be patient to make a elegant girl improving for your way for sex, but you don't build chic and charm, she has inside of her, or not, like she is pretty or not. Only a few are, but can sometimes be lucky, and then you are motivated to get what you like from her. Fortunately for me, I usually attract high level girls, and most of low level girls are afraid of me.
Some girls are certainly likely to take a pragmatic, business minded approach to their careers, analyze what's working well and not, look at other successful girls and what is the factor helping those girls and try to copy them. Copying may be the greatest form of flattery but that's also how all of us human beings improve from the time as babies imitating grownups how to talk, walk, eat and potty. The sensible girls in the clubs should be copying the habits of the more successful girls as you rightly said.The younger WGs at the tourist clubs often choose NOT to copy the most successful WGs. They often choose to model themselves after the sharkiest WGs. In fact, as WGs gain experience, their service and attitude generally starts to deteriorate, skewing more towards the sharkiest WGs then towards the most successful WGs. Those two facts alone should speak volumes.
I believe these sharky WGs have observed other WGs as well as learned their own experience. They know what their threshold is for tolerating customers. The annoying customers, the delusional customers, the suffocating and emotionally needy customers, the stalker customers.[/QUOTE]My final thought is that some of these WGs have already made more money than they ever dreamed possible. Once you have reached major financial milestones, money ceases to be the primary motivating factor. Plenty of mongers in their 40-50's, particularly the ones that are not married with kids, have admitted to me that they are no longer working long hours towards a promotion like they did in their younger years. Instead, they are looking to coast to the finish line. More work-life balance. More FKK trips. I suspect the WGs are the same. For instance, the WG's financial goal might be to just net 300 EUR per 12 hour shift. As long as they are making that, they are fine with more smoke breaks in the lounge. Less time dealing with customers. And less stress.
Yes. I do not disagree with what you said. Gino and I and Tintin were discussing a slightly different point, I. E. Whether it is possible for bad service girls to reform themselves and become aware that their attitude and lack of good service is impacting their business in the long term for them? And whether it is possible for mongers to guide these bad attitude / service girls in any way so that they can up their service. That is different from the point you are making which is that most of these girls come from poorly educated backgrounds and are at an immature age and are held back because of these disadvantages. While no doubt what you say is true, the fact remains that a few of those WGs who are also equally uneducated and suffer the same disadvantages have somehow sufficient business savvy and realize that good services and good attitude are actually good for them personally in the long term.
The question we were discussing was whether this good attitude / service comes to those girls inherently or is there something in the environment that made a few girls give good service while most give bad service. And whether this has degraded over time. Remember, the starting point of all this was a post from Pistons that new recruits of recent past are more money grubby with bad attitude than new recruits of 4 years ago. We were discussing how much of that was due to influence of other WGs and can we do something to counteract this?
Of course, the strong minded among us would say "just withhold paying any extras to the girls and do not give business to the bad service girls, and eventually they will be so devoid of any business and either have to change their ways or leave the business altogether". In effect, these guys have faith in the market and suggest that if only the mongers stayed united and stopped rewarding the bad service girls, the world would be alright.
I do not disagree with this view, but the flaw is that mongers are no more united than the girls. Invariably, the tourists, newbies, mongers flush with excess cash, and many others do not care about paying a few euros extra and break ranks. As in any market, it is the *marginal buyer and marginal seller* that sets the clearing price.
Some of the new WG recruits are probably getting the reverse advice from the jaded older girls "do not give kissing, BBBJ, etc etc unless the guy forks over 100 E for 30 M". Those jaded girls probably feel that if only all the girls were united then the mongers will give up, give in, and pay up wither exorbitant amounts they demand.
BTW, I have done escorts, porn stars, escorts who embed themselves in Tinder and other such sites, sugar babes and many other kinds. You are absolutely right. If looking for pure sex in a hassle free environment, the FKK price can't be beat if you are looking for young Caucasian girls.
The girls that work at an FKK are usually not the most educated girls. The FKK provides a safe environment. Which attracts the girls. Usually, girls are controlled by pimps that tell them what to do. Most think pretty short term and want fast money. When you were that age, did you really think about long term prospects? That is why you see the more educated and older girls in the high end escort business. These girls know that their looks alone will not get them far. They understand the art of seduction and many have mad skills (I. E. Globe). They understand that proper grooming, being able to speak well, being adaptable to a variety of situations, and older professional men is where the money is. They are not looking at 100 E / hour, but 1-2 K over a day or two with possible foreign trips and shopping excursions. Sex is just one part of the equation. They know wealthy men want to be pampered..
The younger WGs at the tourist clubs often choose NOT to copy the most successful WGs. They often choose to model themselves after the sharkiest WGs. In fact, as WGs gain experience, their service and attitude generally starts to deteriorate, skewing more towards the sharkiest WGs then towards the most successful WGs. Those two facts alone should speak volumes.
I believe these sharky WGs have observed other WGs as well as learned their own experience. They know what their threshold is for tolerating customers. The annoying customers, the delusional customers, the suffocating and emotionally needy customers, the stalker customers..I often hear from girls I became regular with that: I want to reach 1000 euro today. So I guess 1000 Euro per shift is good income? So let be optimistic and they have 80 days like this per year, that is 80000 euro.
They work let say max another 200 days to be optimistic making 500 euro per shift, that is another 100000 euro.
So they can make about 150000 euro to 200000 euro if you are good FKK girl per year?
Then they get taxed on that one.
However, with simple mild observation above, they could make 1 million euro after working about 10 years in FKK, let say began at age 21 and finished by age 31 ish.
It is not bad amount for FKK girls living in eastern Europe or related emerging nations.
This is maybe too optimistic numbers though, because not all are top girls and also these girls tend to have expenses of their own as well.
So working in FKK may give them big capital, but they still got to do something life after FKK, well, it is better with such capital.
In closing, I tend to think younger just began recent months FKK girls are better at service than experienced one and more soft on you to negotiate fairly serving both of our interest. Experienced FKK girls tend to begin negotiation only to their favor, but similar to Donald Trump way of negotiation really LOL.
Very nice and respectful, you should tell it to the girls next time you come. That's funny but most of the girls I meet in sauna clubs are smart, speak a lot of languages They may not be educated in school, but some of them are street smart, they have to be in their nation and also in German FKK to survive.
However, I have some FKK girl who retired in my sns for a while and by looking at their pictures, some of them are in university, so I guess in part, they did their FKK years to build their capital for better life.
They were street smart, got even tougher in FKK industries, then now they went for university education, I hope they will do well in their life after FKK. It is sometimes odd to see some innocent looking husband or boyfriend by their side, well who knows what is the real stories are, but I guess it does not matter in their world and our world of mongering.
Once wise forum poster posted, we are all in movie industry where we mongers are director who direct actress to give us the sexual act that we mongers want. It is all beautiful illusions that somehow last forever, it is priceless experience to find new stunner level young beauty in FKK every year.
Pahllus Maximus
06-12-19, 05:00
Mainhatten has an "ash room" but what other clubs have no smoking or controlled isolated smoking?
Was at Mainhatten recently. Very once 3 D action in the kino, *very* hung guy screwing this chick who loved the attention and seemed to be definitely liking it. Quite amusing to see big balls slapping against her and a huge horse like dick crammed in. Needless to say I booked her but she was a bit sore so finished with a nice BBJ.
I suspect the WGs are the same. For instance, the WG's financial goal might be to just net 300 EUR per 12 hour shift. As long as they are making that, they are fine with more smoke breaks in the lounge. Less time dealing with customers. And less stress.Indeed, I have noticed the same too. The exception however is if they have kids. If that is the case, then they tend to think more long term in order to save up a lot more. Although most girls won't admit to having kids even if they do.
Are these new poor service upselling recruits in last 2 years actually making more money per month compared to the new good service no-upselling recruits before that? I remember Aylice at Sharks or Elizabeth CZ at Oase in 2015-2016 used to easily make 1000-1500 e per day, 15000 - 20000 e per month by doing 50 e 30 min sessions or multiple units of that with giving really good service and zero upselling. How many of these poor service upselling new recruits in last 2 years make that kind of money in Oase or Sharks nowadays? I don't know any, do anybody here know? If they are not making similar to Elizabeth CZ or Aylice, maybe they can learn from the history? Maybe we mongers can help today's new recruits by coaching them about how to maximize net income by balancing good products and solid services with attractive pricing, commitment to quality, volume and discounts, value of repeat business etc, when we get any chance to talk with them?Not sure. If any, it would probably have to be Estephania. Maybe other girls tries to copy her tactics. She over analyzed the sharks market. At Oase I've seen her make tons of money on a busy night. But perhaps not so much on slower days. Maybe over a month she did make more at sharks. That might just be the case with many new girls now too. They test the market more than girls in the past did. So heavy tourist clubs can make rates skyrocket, and girls can misjudge everything. Leading to lower income in the long run.
I read a few 3 or 4 year old posts of Sidonia at Sharks. And they all seemed to be very poor. But my own experience with her is only the best. Close to 10/10 last time. Maybe she is one who now has noticed the importance of improved reputation. I didn't do her 3-4 years ago when she was new. Maybe that was a good call. Maybe it is best to let the girls start with a slow year, and then try them later on. Also these sub 20 year old sometimes have a tendency to whine about size way too much. And the extra year or two may be good for others to have stretched them out a bit also, LOL!
5. The girl at least pretending like she is into it and cares about my pleasure.There are a few girls around who specialize in faking orgasms. So I just ask them mid session if they do that. Try it! Worst case, they laugh about it, and while doing so, tense their stomach muscles when doing so.
Mainhatten has an "ash room" but what other clubs have no smoking or controlled isolated smoking?
Was at Mainhatten recently. Very once 3 D action in the kino, *very* hung guy screwing this chick who loved the attention and seemed to be definitely liking it. Quite amusing to see big balls slapping against her and a huge horse like dick crammed in. Needless to say I booked her but she was a bit sore so finished with a nice BBJ.Oceans has separate smoking room in the club, also by the garden there is another smoking room, then finally you can go outside to smoke as well.
Palace had, but I hear they got rid of smoking room and now became like Artemis, the ultimate of chimney club at main bar.
I think slowly, cigarettes will be replaced by e-cigarette. So soon it will be like a steam room instead in main bar LOL.
The younger WGs at the tourist clubs often choose NOT to copy the most successful WGs. They often choose to model themselves after the sharkiest WGs. In fact, as WGs gain experience, their service and attitude generally starts to deteriorate, skewing more towards the sharkiest WGs then towards the most successful WGs. Those two facts alone should speak volumes.
I believe these sharky WGs have observed other WGs as well as learned their own experience. They know what their threshold is for tolerating customers. The annoying customers, the delusional customers, the suffocating and emotionally needy customers, the stalker customers. My final thought is that some of these WGs have already made more money than they ever dreamed possible. Once you have reached major financial milestones, money ceases to be the primary motivating factor. Plenty of mongers in their 40-50's, particularly the ones that are not married with kids, have admitted to me that they are no longer working long hours towards a promotion like they did in their younger years. Instead, they are looking to coast to the finish line. More work-life balance. More FKK trips. I suspect the WGs are the same. For instance, the WG's financial goal might be to just net 300 EUR per 12 hour shift. As long as they are making that, they are fine with more smoke breaks in the lounge. Less time dealing with customers. And less stress.Everyone here had excellent points in favor or against the ability and willingness to learn good business practice by the masses of current snarky FKK girls. But all that said, isn't it still beneficial to us mongers to try to coach at least some of these girls if / when we talk with them? Even if only 5% girls improve after 3 or 6 months, isn't it still better than what we get from them now? Why should we not try (maybe in between sessions when sometimes we do useless banter with the girls, particularly when a girl complains about not making enough money or not many customers etc etc) when we have nothing to lose, only chances of some gain even if that's only incremental? I plan to do my part of that "trying" going forward, hope some of you here will too. 😊.
I plan to post individual reviews in the threads for each of these clubs, but here's my overall impression of Duss-area FKKs:
They are not as good as Frankfurt, not even close.
Living Room on Friday night had the full complement of girls (about 20 - 30). But only three were do-able to my taste, and I only got one. This club is way too small and barebones to charge a 60 Euro entry fee. But more on this greedy management later. I got a green-eyed, all natural Romanian brunette called Renata for a 130 Euro (1 HR) session with many of the extras I like (I'll include details in my Living Room thread review). As I mentioned, there were a couple of other girls I could have done at least a basic session with, but I was saving up for the following day. It may have been a mistake.
I drove out to Golden Time on Saturday afternoon. It's run by the same management at LR, and charged the same overpriced 60 Euro entry fee. This visit was a disgrace! It was my first FKK visit ever without even getting a single girl. It's my first-ever bad review of an FKK, or even bad forum review period. The club was infested with mongers at 3 in the afternoon. It seemed there were at least 100 guys. They ran out of lockers! They claimed to have 75 girls working, but all I saw was 25 ugly ones. Fake, old, and defensive (from all the guys). It was a disaster. When I left in a huff after only two hours of aimless wandering, the management ran out to ask what was wrong. They wouldn't offer to refund even a part of the entry fee, of course. Not even a free transfer to Living Room (just the standard discount).
I said to hell with them and both their clubs, driving down to Dolce Vita, and paying the same 35 Euro entry I would have paid at LR (with the damn discount). Dolce Vita was very low-key, with few mongers and girls even through Saturday evening. But I sessioned with a blonde petit Bulgarian named Victoria for 100 Euro (incl extras), and a modellesque, blonde, tattoo-free Romanian beauty named Laora that had one of the most memorable bodies I've seen in a while. More in my DV thread review.
In short, some hard work and a few diamonds in the rough saved the weekend. But Dusseldorf is not Frankfurt. Not by a long shot!
Mainhatten has an "ash room" but what other clubs have no smoking or controlled isolated smoking?
Was at Mainhatten recently. Very once 3 D action in the kino, *very* hung guy screwing this chick who loved the attention and seemed to be definitely liking it. Quite amusing to see big balls slapping against her and a huge horse like dick crammed in. Needless to say I booked her but she was a bit sore so finished with a nice BBJ.Clubs with ash / smoking rooms are in a decline it seems. Marina had it (closed now), and Palace had it before the renovation.
Off the top of my head I can only think of Oceans still having an ash / smoke room now (it is pretty new also. And before they got it last summer, smokers had to go out in the backyard to smoke). And at Paradise Stuttgart it is allowed to smoke in the bar room, but not in the main lounge. At Magnum I think there were sectioned off areas where smoking was allowed, and where it wasn't also.
,,,My final thought is that some of these WGs have already made more money than they ever dreamed possible. Once you have reached major financial milestones, money ceases to be the primary motivating factor. ,,,For instance, the WG's financial goal might be to just net 300 EUR per 12 hour shift. As long as they are making that, they are fine with more smoke breaks in the lounge. Less time dealing with customers. And less stress.It is likely only minority of girls have successfully save their FKK earning responsibly for education, home, retirements. Those who do I believe quit FKK entirely once financial goal are reach, then to move on to better life. I hearing girls expressing displeasure of the FKK unhealthy bad food, the smoke, listen to the same music every hour, no sun, little sleep, long work hour, crazy customer, vagina become sore but still must to work through such soreness, not enjoy sex anymore, cannot have real boyfriend so stay lonely, unlikely a girl would stay in FKK if she having worked enough to reach significant financial successes.
The girl you are mention who deal less with customer likely still need the moneys, but they wishing to make most money with least amount of customer and least amount of wear on the body. These are such girls who demand 100 for 30 minute, typically prefer more expensive anal customer to save their sore vagina, and have client list of lonely widower type man who just wish talk them several hours in room without any or much actual service. Such girl avoid regular clients who only give normal 100 for 60 min. Instead these girl seek the "extras" customer or overpaying tourist they can exploiting with 5 minute session. Agreeing with you that such girl seek less stress and more smoke break, but for them I believing money is still a main motivation for remain in FKK.
Everyone here had excellent points in favor or against the ability and willingness to learn good business practice by the masses of current snarky FKK girls. But all that said, isn't it still beneficial to us mongers to try to coach at least some of these girls if / when we talk with them? Even if only 5% girls improve after 3 or 6 months, isn't it still better than what we get from them now? Why should we not try (maybe in between sessions when sometimes we do useless banter with the girls, particularly when a girl complains about not making enough money or not many customers etc etc) when we have nothing to lose, only chances of some gain even if that's only incremental? I plan to do my part of that "trying" going forward, hope some of you here will too..Gino,
In theory, what you say makes sense. As you said, if each of us can influence even just one girl to better herself and her service and attitude and energy levels, the club will be a much better place.
Perhaps it would be helpful if you have specific and concrete ideas. What are the things you have in mind that can set a badly performing girl down the path of becoming better?
Remember, it has to be a girl whose service and attitude are not satisfactory. Sharks' Mandy does not need help from any of us to improve her service, it is the Casseys of Oase that the other gent mentioned in a different thread who need mending and reform.
And simply saying "don't entertain such girls, walk away from them, do not agree to their demands for extras, do not pay extra for BBBJ and kissing etc" will not cut it. Sensible mongers are already doing all those things and that did not bring about any noticeable change in their behavior and service.
If you can lay out your concrete suggestions and if you have already tried these on any girl and what the result has been, that will inspire more of us to follow the path you are recommending.
LaBambaBoy
06-12-19, 14:10
Mainhatten has an "ash room" but what other clubs have no smoking or controlled isolated smoking?
Was at Mainhatten recently. Very once 3 D action in the kino, *very* hung guy screwing this chick who loved the attention and seemed to be definitely liking it. Quite amusing to see big balls slapping against her and a huge horse like dick crammed in. Needless to say I booked her but she was a bit sore so finished with a nice BBJ.Finca has smoking only in the back room area, with fans mounted high on the wall to exhaust the smoke. Works pretty well.
From my experiences, most of German girls working in FKK really come from low level, why many are often marked like cow with pimp name, brother name as they say, written on them. Highest level Romanian girls don t work in FKK, but in normal job, even they make less money. Even some speak different languages, but I don t meet many who sound clever, most are bad liars, think they can drive most of guys like little dogs and become angry when they can't control one. This business is full of frustration for WGs and some guys.
Member #4636
06-12-19, 17:05
Then they get taxed on that one.They don't get taxed on that amount, they get taxed on what they declare. You get my point!
Remember their money is without invoice, without receipt, even the entry in many clubs is without a POS machine, and no credit=debit cards accepted.
Polyamorist
06-12-19, 19:06
There are a few girls around who specialize in faking orgasms. So I just ask them mid session if they do that. Try it! Worst case, they laugh about it, and while doing so, tense their stomach muscles when doing so.As long as you are pleased with the lesser, you cannot have the highest. Whatever pleases you, holds you back.
-- Nisargadatta Maharaj.
Member #4636
06-12-19, 20:12
From my experiences, most of German girls working in FKK really come from low level, why many are often marked like cow with pimp name, brother name as they say, written on them. Highest level Romanian girls don t work in FKK, but in normal job, even they make less money. Even some speak different languages, but I don t meet many who sound clever, most are bad liars, think they can drive most of guys like little dogs and become angry when they can't control one. This business is full of frustration for WGs and some guys.I agree 100 %. Siri couldn't say it better.
I believe there is high level however but that is less than 5 %.
Not sure. If any, it would probably have to be Estephania. Maybe other girls tries to copy her tactics. She over analyzed the sharks market. At Oase I've seen her make tons of money on a busy night. But perhaps not so much on slower days. Maybe over a month she did make more at sharks. That might just be the case with many new girls now too. They test the market more than girls in the past did. So heavy tourist clubs can make rates skyrocket, and girls can misjudge everything. Leading to lower income in the long run.
I read a few 3 or 4 year old posts of Sidonia at Sharks. And they all seemed to be very poor. But my own experience with her is only the best. Close to 10/10 last time. Maybe she is one who now has noticed the importance of improved reputation. I didn't do her 3-4 years ago when she was new. Maybe that was a good call. Maybe it is best to let the girls start with a slow year, and then try them later on. Also these sub 20 year old sometimes have a tendency to whine about size way too much. And the extra year or two may be good for others to have stretched them out a bit also, LOL!Small doll Estefania doesn't seem so busy now at Oase, same for Adela, and I visit only on Friday or Saturday.
Of course, the strong minded among us would say "just withhold paying any extras to the girls and do not give business to the bad service girls, and eventually they will be so devoid of any business and either have to change their ways or leave the business altogether". In effect, these guys have faith in the market and suggest that if only the mongers stayed united and stopped rewarding the bad service girls, the world would be alright.
I do not disagree with this view, but the flaw is that mongers are no more united than the girls. Invariably, the tourists, newbies, mongers flush with excess cash, and many others do not care about paying a few euros extra and break ranks. As in any market, it is the *marginal buyer and marginal seller* that sets the clearing price.
At smaller clubs where management is more hands-on and male customers are more socially interconnected and sharing information with one another, that sharky WG will not survive for long. She will need to conform or find a megaclub.
The girl you are mention who deal less with customer likely still need the moneys, but they wishing to make most money with least amount of customer and least amount of wear on the body. These are such girls who demand 100 for 30 minute, typically prefer more expensive anal customer to save their sore vagina, and have client list of lonely widower type man who just wish talk them several hours in room without any or much actual service. Such girl avoid regular clients who only give normal 100 for 60 min. Instead these girl seek the "extras" customer or overpaying tourist they can exploiting with 5 minute session. Agreeing with you that such girl seek less stress and more smoke break, but for them I believing money is still a main motivation for remain in FKK.My stance is most WGs hate their jobs. And that the WGs do indeed observe other WGs. They see that superstar WG making 1000 EUR, but spending a full 10-12 full hours interacting with customers (pre, post, and actual zimmer time). Then they see a sharky WG making 500 EUR but spending only about 2-3 hours interacting with customers and on "smoke break" the other 9-10 hours. Many WGs choose to model themselves after the sharky WG, even though it is glaringly obvious that the superstar WG makes more.
If the WG truly hates her job, then the second option is more preferable because it allows her to maintain her sanity. The superstar WG, although she makes more per 12 hour shift, may be looked upon as a "sucker". Romanians grew up in a corrupt system, so finding ways to outsmart the system and cut corners became a survival skill for them. They are sometimes ambivalent about dishonesty. If executed in a clever way, cheating, unscrupulous behavior, and pilfering is often looked upon with admiration. They even have a word for this: smecherie.
https://books.google.de/books?id=rXoFAQAAQBAJ&pg=PT54&lpg=PT54&dq=romanians%2Bcut%2Bcorners
Pretending and "faking emotions" is mentally and emotionally draining. Have you guys never had a job you hated? Or worked for a boss that you wanted to punch in the face? You find ways to take longer breaks, avoid, disengage, and mentally recharge between each dreaded interaction. When you hate a large portion of your waking hours, being always "present" sucks your will to live. And you stay only at the job because you are comfortable and secure. Doing the bare minimum and mentally checking out is then the key to longevity and the key to avoiding burnout.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/markmurphy/2017/05/14/research-shows-that-if-you-have-to-fake-your-emotions-at-work-youre-probably-going-to-be-miserable
Indeed, I have noticed the same too. The exception however is if they have kids. If that is the case, then they tend to think more long term in order to save up a lot more. Although most girls won't admit to having kids even if they do.I believe that superstar WGs exhibit two qualities in abundance: (1) mature for their age, and (2) patient beyond belief. Becoming a mother generally enhances both of those traits. Using my stubborn, 21 year old self as a point of reference, the immature ones often have more attitude and are more prone to mouth off and they already think they know everything. Being patient is useful when dealing with the crazy, annoying, and mentally unstable customers. Or dealing with customers that think they know it all and want to dispense advice to you. Impatient, immature WGs would roll their eyes to these customers' faces, whereas the mature, patient ones would do it after these customers paid them.
They don't get taxed on that amount, they get taxed on what they declare. You get my point!
Remember their money is without invoice, without receipt, even the entry in many clubs is without a POS machine, and no credit=debit cards accepted.Soon or later, authority may enforce cashless payment in brothels LOL.
I think prostitutes should be entitled to be tax exempted and tax free because actually what they do decrease crime rate, give energy to many men's lives, and take the gas out of stressful society for men and above all they sell dreams to men and make us feel complete as man in area of lust and desire. Prostitution as occupation is so underrated by society.
I plan to post individual reviews in the threads for each of these clubs, but here's my overall impression of Duss-area FKKs:
They are not as good as Frankfurt, not even close.
Living Room on Friday night had the full complement of girls (about 20 - 30). But only three were do-able to my taste, and I only got one. This club is way too small and barebones to charge a 60 Euro entry fee. But more on this greedy management later. I got a green-eyed, all natural Romanian brunette called Renata for a 130 Euro (1 HR) session with many of the extras I like (I'll include details in my Living Room thread review). As I mentioned, there were a couple of other girls I could have done at least a basic session with, but I was saving up for the following day. It may have been a mistake.
I drove out to Golden Time on Saturday afternoon. It's run by the same management at LR, and charged the same overpriced 60 Euro entry fee. This visit was a disgrace! It was my first FKK visit ever without even getting a single girl. It's my first-ever bad review of an FKK, or even bad forum review period. The club was infested with mongers at 3 in the afternoon. It seemed there were at least 100 guys. They ran out of lockers! They claimed to have 75 girls working, but all I saw was 25 ugly ones. Fake, old, and defensive (from all the guys). It was a disaster. When I left in a huff after only two hours of aimless wandering, the management ran out to ask what was wrong. They wouldn't offer to refund even a part of the entry fee, of course. Not even a free transfer to Living Room (just the standard discount).NRW clubs tend to provide better service than Hessen or Berlin clubs, but yeah, I also noticed line up being rather mediocre with almost no stunner in line up, some day I got lucky, but optically NRW is lower than Frankfurt or Berlin clubs.
Oddly, best girls I had optically in past 10 years in German FKK were all in palace and also Artemis. Both are near city upsell clubs, so I guess most beautiful girls go where the money is.
At smaller clubs where management is more hands-on and male customers are more socially interconnected and sharing information with one another, that sharky WG will not survive for long. She will need to conform or find a megaclub.Yes, you are right. My example was more suited to a megaclub with neither a cartel of WGs nor a united monger group existing in that place. In a small club, as you say, some customers can gang up and blacklist the bad service WGs (or in some clubs a few sharky WGs May form a cartel). But as you pointed out, all the clubs are part of a larger paid sex system; so they are not truly islands on their own. Girls can leave and go to other clubs. Likewise, if a group of men are able to boycott a few sharky WGs thereby improving standards in that club, then word will leak out which brings other men (who are not related to the aforementioned united gang) to that club, some of them tourists too, and they can be preyed upon by the sharky WGs. So, the market clearing mechanism will still work as long as we have a large number of clubs.
NRW clubs tend to provide better service than Hessen or Berlin clubs, but yeah, I also noticed line up being rather mediocre with almost no stunner in line up, some day I got lucky, but optically NRW is lower than Frankfurt or Berlin clubs.
Oddly, best girls I had optically in past 10 years in German FKK were all in palace and also Artemis. Both are near city upsell clubs, so I guess most beautiful girls go where the money is.While not getting into the same debate again, I broadly agree with you. I am however able to obtain good service at standard prices from a sufficient number of good looking girls in the megaclubs, and hence I have been going to those more often. The converse, I. E. Finding a sufficient number of high optics girls in the smaller, service oriented clubs has not been as easy a task, at least for me.
Soon or later, authority may enforce cashless payment in brothels LOL.
I think prostitutes should be entitled to be tax exempted and tax free because actually what they do decrease crime rate, give energy to many men's lives, and take the gas out of stressful society for men and above all they sell dreams to men and make us feel complete as man in area of lust and desire. Prostitution as occupation is so underrated by society.I agree. And we men should be able to itemize and deduct our FKK / mongering related expenses as healthcare costs in our Tax Returns. These are truly medical expenses in my case, similar to medical marijuana. Without the FKK medications, my pain from the blue balls is excruciating, totally unbearable.
Member #4636
06-13-19, 06:30
Soon or later, authority may enforce cashless payment in brothels LOL.
I think prostitutes should be entitled to be tax exempted and tax free because actually what they do decrease crime rate, give energy to many men's lives, and take the gas out of stressful society for men and above all they sell dreams to men and make us feel complete as man in area of lust and desire. Prostitution as occupation is so underrated by society.On that point what could we say about teachers or doctors then?
But it is not the girls that I mind they are tax avoiding but the clubs. In my country every company must by law have the ability to accept credit or debit cards and not only cash.
Only cash in business environment is not a good thing and causes many problems. And FKK clubs are legal companies right so why not plastic money? The only club I know so far accepting cards is Artemis.
ExpatLover
06-13-19, 07:28
Soon or later, authority may enforce cashless payment in brothels LOL.
I think prostitutes should be entitled to be tax exempted and tax free because actually what they do decrease crime rate, give energy to many men's lives, and take the gas out of stressful society for men and above all they sell dreams to men and make us feel complete as man in area of lust and desire. Prostitution as occupation is so underrated by society.Not so sure that prostitutes decrease crime rates, how many man are never going to prostitutes and are a lot happier than those going every week several times. I reduced drastically my FKK visits in the last 2 years and I feel a lot better, when I see all those man mostly over 50 seating in the FKK waiting hours and hours in a dark bar area for eventually find a girl and after sometime coming out of the room even walking 3 meters from the girl he just had sex with, I am really happy to be able to change my sex addiction to far more positive things. The best sex is never with a prostitute and many of us are leaving the room after sessioning more frustrated than when we entered.
I agree. And we men should be able to itemize and deduct our FKK / mongering related expenses as healthcare costs in our Tax Returns. These are truly medical expenses in my case, similar to medical marijuana. Without the FKK medications, my pain from the blue balls is excruciating, totally unbearable.One of my favourites had been a nurse. She said she saw her new job as prostitute to be even more effective mental healthcare than being a nurse LOL.
I agree 100 %. Siri couldn't say it better.
I believe there is high level however but that is less than 5 %.I meant about cleverness, which is quite different from studies, or speaking many languages. Even my chic with charm were not so high level cleverness, one of the very rare for me is Kate, certainly why she has such success in her new business, without needing to gossip or bullshit, but charming companionship.
One of my favourites had been a nurse. She said she saw her new job as prostitute to be even more effective mental healthcare than being a nurse LOL.She should become a nursery teacher!
I mean, how can feminists claim sex for money is derogatory when nurses clean the butts of sick 90 year old with diarrhea?
Polyamorist
06-14-19, 04:38
I mean, how can feminists claim sex for money is derogatory when nurses clean the butts of sick 90 year old with diarrhea?Salaam Pistons. At least nurses do something useful. Many girls in "respectable" jobs are doing make-work or worse.
I was recently smooching with a girl who was fresh from a call center. In her last job she was talking to people being rude to her all day. In her new job, guys were telling her how beautiful she was all day. Guess which job she preferred? Which job is better for people's mental health?
How about the pols switch their focus to outlawing telemarketing jobs, or any other industry that sets people against each other, instead of a service that people actually want?
While not getting into the same debate again, I broadly agree with you. I am however able to obtain good service at standard prices from a sufficient number of good looking girls in the megaclubs, and hence I have been going to those more often. The converse, I. E. Finding a sufficient number of high optics girls in the smaller, service oriented clubs has not been as easy a task, at least for me.LR and GT is rather small club, especially LR. And personally, when it comes to service for standard 30 min rate, these two are the best I went from known clubs.
Oddly, in Artemis I got lucky few times of getting it all for 60 euro per 30 min session, meaning DFK, rimjob, DATY, BBBJ (it was before law) and fuck with condom, but I can count that in 6 years I went there till 2015. I am returning to Artemis this late summer, so I will see how that club changed after absences of few years.
NRW is good for service, but I tend to find optic of line up better in rip off club like palace and Artemis, underneath many many plastic monsters with ink on their body, I often found real beauty in those two clubs, usually they come with higher price tag LOL. Artemis disappointed me, let see if they change the line up to be better like it once used to be.
She should become a nursery teacher!
I mean, how can feminists claim sex for money is derogatory when nurses clean the butts of sick 90 year old with diarrhea?What you say is exactly what the girl said to me (apart from the feminist bits). She is now in a different healthcare career having retrained in Germany using her earnings from prostitution.
Three useful jobs. Some people have brains.
Member #4636
06-14-19, 09:17
I meant about cleverness, which is quite different from studies, or speaking many languages. Even my chic with charm were not so high level cleverness, one of the very rare for me is Kate, certainly why she has such success in her new business, without needing to gossip or bullshit, but charming companionship.Yes they are clever and smart but this has nothing to do with behave and attitude. I think FKK girls are either very smart or very dumb there is no between. But regarding behave and attitude which is something you learn among education they are far from that.
Even WGs do this job for big fast, not easy, money, even sometimes pimps behind when some claim to be high class, but they provide a social job for guys who need sex, some in both parts even sometimes looking for a bit of love they need. According to girls, many married guys who can t get from their wife. When I say I m not married and if I was I would not come, girls don t believe me and look if I have mark on finger. Maybe for tax they get, but Germans are more clever than French to understand guys need to empty balls, when Sweden is just a shame about sex boats from Tallin. USA, land of porn close to LA, is just hypocrite joke. In France, prostitution is not forbidden, many escorts advertise on internet, but prosecution for clients, just stupid politics, You can look at beautiful Russians photos, but You can t taste, better guys go to make problems to girls they see in streets.
Here is the list of the clubs I visited and my rankings based on experience.
1. FKK Dietzenbach 1230 pm Thursday 6/6.
Food / Facilities 2. This place is a well known dump. They did have the little hotdogs and soda.
Casting 4. There were about 8 girls working. 2 would be average in a normal club. The rest were gross.
Service Levels. Did not have a session. Too busy.
Value for $. This place is cheap but did not session.
Crowd / Environment 2 - Lots of local Germans love this place. Every time I go in here its full of clientele with pop bellies, amputees, old guys who look like Smeagol from Lord of the Rings Creeping around very slowly. There were about 20 guys in the place when I arrived and 8 women working. 2 were doable. Lost Patience waiting my turn after an hour sitting on the red cum coach. Girl to guy 1 to 4.
2. FKK Sharks Friday 6/14.
Food / Facilities 8 - Had good BBQ. Place is clean. Nice full bar with decent service. Good outdoor area. NO AC in rooms.
Casting 7 - Hundreds of girls to choose from. So many they all start to look the same. Not as good as Living Room or Oase.
Service Levels - 6 Some Gems to be found here that will provide good service.
Value for $ 6 About half the girls here try to do the upsell but not as bad as Mainhatten and Palace. If you find a few gems that you see regularly expect better service.
Crowd / Environment 8 - Met one of the senior posters here had a good conversation. I have been to this club 20 times since 2017. My most visited club and favorite place on earth. Lots of energy in this place and good staff. Girl to guy 3 to 1 early 1 to 1 evening.
3. FKK Mainhatten Sunday 6/9 1030 pm to 1 am.
Food / Facilities 6 - They had a good spread in the Bistro. Schnitzel and Fries. I do like it better when they have the BBQ going during the day. Pool is nice. Beer included (if you can get the bar tenders attention) Large Kino awkward set up though. Weird glass doors in between main room and sauna area. Smoking room is where most of the girls hang out. If you don't want to smell like smoke can be hard to get a girls attention without going in there.
Casting 4 - Most of the girls here look the same. The most generic casting I have ever seen in FKK.
Service Levels 2 - This is an upsell place. Constant up-sell from all the girls. Then you give them the extra money they want and it is still terrible. Rushed terrible service from most providers. Even if you discuss before going to the room and agree they then try and upsell more.
Value for $ 1 - Upsell that never stops. Talked to the receptionist she told me to stop being so cheap and to leave. Avoid this place. ("erotic massage extra 50 euros, kiss extra 50 euros, BBBJ extra 50 euros, get the fuck out of here.).
Crowd / Environment 2 - Scum people in this place. I hate this club. Had a good experience back on 2017 during the day. Since then its been terrible. You can get Cocaine and Viagra here though. Girl to guy 1 to 1.
4. FKK Oase Thursday 6/6 230 pm to 2 am.
Food / Facilities - 8 Place was under construction. Had everyone in the Bistro and Pool Room. Staff here can be kind of rude. The food was OK, they have average made to order pizzas certain times of the day.
Casting - 8 - One step above sharks. I like that they have very young new girls here that still have sex like they do with normal guys back home.
Service Levels - 6 Varies here. Usually one out of every 3 sessions I have is good. If you can find a group of friends and one of the providers is good the others will probably be too. 65% of the girls will try and upsell you here. Make expectations clear before going to room.
Value for $- 4 Some stunners here, they want extra though. Don't expect many great 50 or 100 euro rooms.
Crowd / Environment 7 - Find some cool people to chat with in this club. Night time on weekends they have a DJ. Good vibes up until about midnight then it starts to decline. Was not crowded when I visited girl to guy 3 to 1.
5. FKK Palace Monday 6/10 11 pm to 1 am.
Food / Facilities - 8 Very Nice Club. AC in the rooms. I'm not a fan of the food but its ok. Heated floor in locker room. Nice Bar, Large Kino, Nice Suana.
Casting - 7 Casting here varies. Sometimes its hot, sometimes its generic. They don't let girls under 21 work here if you like the younger ones.
Service Levels - 5 Hit of miss here. 30% are good providers. The rest are up-selling scum.
Value for $ - 3 This is an up-sell place. Very high pressure non fun time. Can find a few Gems especially during day time hours. Night time it gets more difficult. High entry fee 70 euro.
Crowd / Environment. Nothing notable. Quiet Clientele. Girls are the same as most other places. Was not crowed. Girl to guy 2 to 1.
6. Sauna Club Living Room Saturday 6/8 1030 pm to 4 am.
Food / Facilities - 7 Had good BBQ, Pizza at midnight. Beers in fridge you can grab yourself. Fastest bartending service I have seen in FKK. MGMT is on top of shit here.
Casting 8 - Good variety here, Some stunners, along with girl next door types, to tatted milfs.
Service Levels - 8 About as good as your going to find for the quality of girls. Standard BBBJ, kissing, etc no upsell.
Value for $ - 8 No upsell here can get good service from most girls for the standard 50 to 100.
Crowd / Environment. Girl to guy ratio 1 to 1. Good party atmosphere at night. Night time club, lots of people visit here after Goldentyme during the day. Was crowded at night prime-time lots of wait for rooms. Would be better to visit on non weekend night.
7. Suana Club Acapulco Gold Sunday 6/9 2 pm to 430 pm.
Food / Facilities 8 - Very nice place for the low entry fee. Not Gourmet food but good enough for the low entry. Mouthwash provided. Kino was shrunk to add two more rooms.
Casting 7 - Good variety of girls here. Quality not too much lower then the 50 E clubs. Lots of young girls who just start work here.
Service Levels 8 - Kissing is standard here. Good energy and foreplay in most rooms. Not rushed. BBBJ 50/50 chance here depending on girl. No upsell.
Value for $ -8 Good service with decent looking girls for 40 U.
Crowd / Environment - 5 When I went this place was packed. Girl to Guy 1 to 4. Had to park 400 meters away. Long lines for food. Hard to find a place to sit. Just found the girls I wanted and took them immediately. When the Velbert location opens back up it will go down.
9. FKK Villa Venus Sat 6/8 230 pm to 430 pm.
Food / Facilities - 3 a slight step up from Dietz. They had some prepackaged pastries and such.
Casting - 3 - There were 10 girls here. 1 who would be average at other FKK's. 3 others fuckable the rest blah.
Service Levels - 10- You get whatever you want here no upsell. AO DFK CIM CIP.
Value for $ 10 - Everything you want. 30 Euros LOL!
Crowd / Environment. Very Nice girls. Lady at desk chainsmokeing cigs. Regular German customers. There was a guy sitting in the corner on his macbook for like 3 hours. Girl to guy ratio 1 to 1.
10. FKK Arabella.
Food / Facilities - 4 same as VV.
Casting - 6- Step up from VV. But the younger cuter girls are not AO.
Service Levels 5 - The girl I had Cindi was a bust. Still BBBJ but not AO. She wasn't into it.
Value for $ 8 - 30 Euros for some of the girls they have is a value. Just got to interview properly before to make sure you get the right one.
Crowd / Environment 8 - Had a nice chat with some of the men there and women. Almost has a swingers club vibe. Was asked if I wanted to have group sex with another guy and girl. Girl to guy ration 2 to 1.
It's very interesting that people who say prostitution is bad for women are either the women who never worked as a prostitute (and thus actually understood the benefits of prostitution) or the men who has something to gain by saying that (eg some politicians or lawyers). Of course there are some exceptions that prove the norm.
NRW clubs tend to provide better service than Hessen or Berlin clubs, but yeah, I also noticed line up being rather mediocre with almost no stunner in line up, some day I got lucky, but optically NRW is lower than Frankfurt or Berlin clubs.
Oddly, best girls I had optically in past 10 years in German FKK were all in palace and also Artemis. Both are near city upsell clubs, so I guess most beautiful girls go where the money is.I had my first time to Artemis last night, after my previous weekend in Duss. Will leave a review in the Artemis thread, but you're absolutely right. Some better talent "optically". The service didn't suffer either, it was just more expensive.
I had my first time to Artemis last night, after my previous weekend in Duss. Will leave a review in the Artemis thread, but you're absolutely right. Some better talent "optically". The service didn't suffer either, it was just more expensive.Trend nowadays are 100 euro for 30 min full package with BBBJ, DFK and DATY and condom fuck in palace. As for Artemis I have not been there since 2015, but I guess line up got better again with some good optic girls back again? Artemis was the place to be in 2010 till 2014 when there always were new stunner level beauty each time I visit, which was nice feeling to know that I was going to fuck new young beauty every time I visited that club back then.
As for optic, that is what I noticed as well going around NRW 4 years, Hessen 4 years and Berlin 6 years, absolute stunner optically are in palace and Artemis with bit of digging based on my experience, there usually are one to three stunners, max five back in golden days, but for me two stunners in line per day is enough, more is better, but I cannot complain because golden days are over, though according to you, it maybe back again considering top girls go where they can upsell their beauty. I will be back in Artemis in late summer and I cannot wait how that clubs line up changed. Hopefully.
Theo:
You give LR and Oase both an 8 for casting. And it seems this is not including service as you have a separate category for that. But I am guessing there is the usual aprox 8-10 lookers at Oase. Which is fair enough to give it an 8. Has LR really got the same amount of lookers?
Also you give Aca Gold the same score as you give Sharks. Both a 7! Now I truly wonder which Acapulco V girls have gone over? And who has not gone up to Great Palace. I assume Hannah and her group is still at Aca G. Maybe Lucy? If both of them are there, it is a big bonus, but there should be more numerous girls at such high quality to have that score. I recall my only Aca Gold visit 18 months ago, I gave it a complete no for lineup score in my review. So the lineup better have changed drastically to be on Sharks level!
Yes they are clever and smart but this has nothing to do with behave and attitude. I think FKK girls are either very smart or very dumb there is no between. But regarding behave and attitude which is something you learn among education they are far from that.My meaning: most of WGs are not really clever, only a very few are smart. If they were more, most would get better business, smart girls are usually busier, like Kate at GT.
WG's service is not a matter of WG's cleverness or dumbness. WG's service, IMHO, is mainly a WG's character issue, not a WG's intelligence issue, I. E. How good a WG's service is is mainly determined by the WG's character, not by her intelligence or her other factors. We here discussed in the past week about whether WG's service is teachable and changeable. I think that most WG's services are almost unteachable and unchangeable after their initial several-week internship in the business because their characters are almost unchangeable at their ages. Some WG's service may be YMMV, but this is because the character of very small percentage of WGs is YMMV, I. E. They treat people differently by their character.
I think the implication of my view is:
1) If one fellow monger or friend TRUTHFULLY recommends a WG for her good service and you know what is his standard of defining WG's good service, you most likely will get good service from this WG if you have at most the same standard as this monger or friend. Even if her service is YMMV, her YMMV service would be within the margin of her good service.
2) If you have good judgement about women' characters in real life, just apply this skill of your judgement to the WGs with the emphasis on their kindness and niceness as first screening of your evaluation of WGs, because girl's character won't change that much after she becomes a prostitute.
Bfsie. I totally agree with your para re character For me what you suggest works 100%. I choose according to their character, simply niceness or kindness. If a girl radiates these her optics are radically improved (although of course a size 40 won't turn into my preferred 30/32, German sizing).
I do think the job can be taught, but they have to have the right disposition/character first. And if put in a club with the wrong cultural norms even a good girl can fall into bad ways
Cheers
Theo:
You give LR and Oase both an 8 for casting. And it seems this is not including service as you have a separate category for that. But I am guessing there is the usual aprox 8-10 lookers at Oase. Which is fair enough to give it an 8. Has LR really got the same amount of lookers?
Also you give Aca Gold the same score as you give Sharks. Both a 7! Now I truly wonder which Acapulco V girls have gone over? And who has not gone up to Great Palace. I assume Hannah and her group is still at Aca G. Maybe Lucy? If both of them are there, it is a big bonus, but there should be more numerous girls at such high quality to have that score. I recall my only Aca Gold visit 18 months ago, I gave it a complete no for lineup score in my review. So the lineup better have changed drastically to be on Sharks level!Living Room had several lookers when I was there on the Saturday Night. Very good quality looks wise probably the best of my trip. ACA Gold had more girls there than usual currently with the Velbert location closed. ACA usually has about 30 percent worth it for me to room with, this last trip it was so packed every time I saw one that was up to my standard I just took her to the room. At one point that day every girl in the place was getting fucked except for 3.
Also my opinion may be skewed differently based on my taste which is I like the younger non tatted, non plastic, petite, innocent, girl next door looking girls. The girls who just start and have this look tend to work at ACA Gold, Oase, and living room, (before being promoted to Goldentime).
When I first started going to FKKs Sharks was my favorite but not so many girls there anymore. Also since I have been there so many times (more than 20 since Jan 2017) I keep seeing the same girls and it may be boring me.
Anyone have any clubs I didn't visit where the casting skews to my taste as stated above?
Polyamorist
06-16-19, 02:50
Salaam zusammen,
Is prostitution the only profession where experience is a liability rather than an advantage? Be honest.
Salaam zusammen,
Is prostitution the only profession where experience is a liability rather than an advantage? Be honest.It is traumatizing for some or fair to say most girls. I mean girls in FKK take about around 1000 different strangers penis each year, every year.
But I have came across some FKK girls who love being prostitute in FKK environment and one of them claim to tell her future husband about her job in FKK because it is such a big part of her life she said.
As a client side as a monger, it is priceless experience that echoes in eternity, which also secure us good sex life we men all dreamed of when we were young teen. Well that part of lustful dream came true for us mongers.
However, not only for girls, FKK prostitution environment mess with mongers head too because things that supposed to be limited experience become unlimited experience for us mongers as long as you pay entrance and fee per 30 min, then sky is the limit. Personally, I am loving such experiences.
ExpatLover
06-16-19, 07:20
Living Room had several lookers when I was there on the Saturday Night. Very good quality looks wise probably the best of my trip. ACA Gold had more girls there than usual currently with the Velbert location closed. ACA usually has about 30 percent worth it for me to room with, this last trip it was so packed every time I saw one that was up to my standard I just took her to the room. At one point that day every girl in the place was getting fucked except for 3.
Also my opinion may be skewed differently based on my taste which is I like the younger non tatted, non plastic, petite, innocent, girl next door looking girls. The girls who just start and have this look tend to work at ACA Gold, Oase, and living room, (before being promoted to Goldentime).
When I first started going to FKKs Sharks was my favorite but not so many girls there anymore. Also since I have been there so many times (more than 20 since Jan 2017) I keep seeing the same girls and it may be boring me.
Anyone have any clubs I didn't visit where the casting skews to my taste as stated above?You are looking for the same thing than me and it is difficult to find, like you say always the same girls around. Try your chance in any Starbucks: it is working for me but only in China where the things are quite easier for the white guys.
It's very interesting that people who say prostitution is bad for women are either the women who never worked as a prostitute (and thus actually understood the benefits of prostitution) or the men who has something to gain by saying that (eg some politicians or lawyers). Of course there are some exceptions that prove the norm.For me, better for women to never try this bad job, but some are ready for anything for money, you can see some changing for money, and guys need sex, even in hypocrite religion.
Theo:
You give LR and Oase both an 8 for casting. And it seems this is not including service as you have a separate category for that. But I am guessing there is the usual aprox 8-10 lookers at Oase. Which is fair enough to give it an 8. Has LR really got the same amount of lookers?
Also you give Aca Gold the same score as you give Sharks. Both a 7! Now I truly wonder which Acapulco V girls have gone over? And who has not gone up to Great Palace. I assume Hannah and her group is still at Aca G. Maybe Lucy? If both of them are there, it is a big bonus, but there should be more numerous girls at such high quality to have that score. I recall my only Aca Gold visit 18 months ago, I gave it a complete no for lineup score in my review. So the lineup better have changed drastically to be on Sharks level!I cannot agree that LR has good casting optically, it is OK, only good point I can say about LR is amazing service for just 50 euro 30 min session and girls being more younger than other clubs. But optically, it is OK level, no stunner at LR.
Oase is the one I am not sure about. Due to extreme upsell, I only went once to Oase, but come to think about it, there were some stunner level girl optically like at palace and Artemis. Only few, but I saw and went with them in Oase, so maybe Oase is like palace and Artemis where there are few stunners in line up? Most are plastic at Artemis, but underneath them and between, there are real stunners in both palace and Artemis.
(before being promoted to Goldentime).For girls maybe GT is a promotion, but I am not so sure. For guys it is a demotion having to go there nowadays.
For girls maybe GT is a promotion, but I am not so sure. For guys it is a demotion having to go there nowadays.I only went to GT once in January 2017. When I went on the FKK tour service trip. The guide and other guests hyped the place up big time. "They said Its the best club, blah blah". I did find one girl and have one great session. However the place was packed to the rafters with men. There was not any place to sit or enjoy anything. Most of the girls were heavily tatted, tons of makeup, plastic surgery everywhere. It made me uncomfortable. I Wanted out. The guide kept going back multiple times during that trip instead I just decided to stay in the hotel room, sleep in, and meet them later at another club. I thought maybe my experience was based on just a very busy day at the club but from other reports my experience seems typical.
Escape Artist
06-16-19, 21:40
I cannot agree that LR has good casting optically, it is OK, only good point I can say about LR is amazing service for just 50 euro 30 min session and girls being more younger than other clubs. But optically, it is OK level, no stunner at LR.In your opinion, who is the best looking girl at Living Room? And what number would you give her for optics and for service?
Pessimist's post offers some perspective. Financial priorities matter: http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?3172-FKK-Mainhattan-Frankfurt&p=2325359&viewfull=1#post2325359.
Income is only one variable. All things being equal, a single, childless bachelors who are approaching retirement can spend more money on luxuries such as mongering. Stage of life also matters too (I. E. Whether one will soon receive an inheritance from parents). I recently heard of one monger in his 50's who is dumping large sums into the coffers of his FKK wife. This monger in his 50's reportedly told his friends "I can sell my flat, because I do not have any kids to hand it down to. And I can't take that money with me". The implication is that he could blow through his money and live life to the fullest..When I was in b-school, I interviewed with a management consultancy. The case study involved what should a credit card company do? It turned out that the stable income earning, high credit score customers who pay their balance every month were money losing for the company, as they never roll any balances, and in fact the card issuer ends up providing free credit to them for a large portion of the year (from the time of their purchases to the time of their payment every month). At the same time, the bad Fico score, low income customers who have massive balances on several cards are also not good customers, as there is a real risk that many of them may default and collection is a huge problem. The best customers for the banks and card issuers were the middle range, OK income customers with expensive habits who perpetually have large balances, are financially not truly savvy even if they think they are, paying at 16% rate forever and not being smart enough to realize they are being fleeced.
One girl I was banging for payment and gifts (not an FKK girl) once asked me how much money I make or what's my net worth or something along those lines. I asked "why do you care, the only thing that should matter to you is if I have enough money to give your few hundred dollar payment". She reconsidered that statement and agreed with me.
From the perspective of any WG, the best customers are not the high net, fiscally prudent men. They are the equivalent of the high income customers of bank who always pay off the balance at the end of the month. The best customers for WGs are the men who make a hundred to 120 grand a year but spend 40 of that on prostitutes and clubs. If the WG snares enough such men as her regulars, her own career in the club is made.
In your opinion, who is the best looking girl at Living Room? And what number would you give her for optics and for service?Exotic type girl, I like Rose. Very sportive body, she claim she works out and I believe her by looking at her body, small face, somehow bit oriental though she is 100% Hungarian, very structured face with big eye, long neck and all natural fit body and really good service.
White type girl: I liked this blonde girl from Romania. I cannot recall her name, most of time, I do not bother to remember or sometimes even ask her name, but she is natural blonde, beautiful natural breast, quite big breast, shaped nice, she is white Romanian blonde, no tattoo, apparently law student and good service. Once I told Sirioja this before and he mentioned couple of names. Good service.
Another white type girl: It was one of the sister, I think and they do not lookalike. She was Romanian who was introduced to by one of the poster here, I will not say his name for his privacy, but he is welcome to jump in if he read this post. She was also natural body, blonde, but I think this one is colored blonde. Good service.
However, I do not think LR is stunner club optically, you do get lucky once in awhile, but it is not same level of stunner you find like in palace or Artemis in early 2010's. I think LR is more younger, natural girls, with limited or no tattoo and they provide good service for just 50 euro per 30 min, you go loner it even get much better. It is only club you will get DFK that easily in 50 euro 30 min session. I think LR serve me as this kinda club.
GT on the other end, I found bit more stunner and level of stunner is same level that you would find in Artemis and palace, but problem is they are booked mostly whole day, so hard to get them into room. And GT clearly has over crowded issues of mongers.
It is odd thing to say, but oddly, I also find Oceans to be best optic stunner to be possibly found club in nrw, it is close to center, and is upsell club, but again more beautiful girls get drawn to the club where they can maximize their superior beauty to other girls, so they tend to gather more to near city center upsell club? This is something I began to notice.
Banana Boi
06-17-19, 04:40
there are real stunners in both palace and Artemis.Can I ask when you were last at each of Palace and Artemis? I find on ISG, at least in the Pattaya forum, there are so many frequent posters who have strong opinions of a club but when you read between the lines you find out they have not been to that club or even Pattaya in 2 years or only went once or twice ever to that club.
Can I ask when you were last at each of Palace and Artemis? I find on ISG, at least in the Pattaya forum, there are so many frequent posters who have strong opinions of a club but when you read between the lines you find out they have not been to that club or even Pattaya in 2 years or only went once or twice ever to that club.Well Palace last February, been there since 2015, I make one to three trips per year to Germany just for FKK. Usually each trip ranging from minimum 5 FKK days to 10 FKK days, max was 14 FKK days. During trip, I go to FKK everyday. This FKK trips began since 2009 when I first discover FKK Artemis.
My last visit to Artemis was 2015, went from 2009 till 2015, I stopped from 2015 due to lack of stunner in line up, switch to Hessen and nrw. I thought I will never return to Artemis, but this late summer, I am returning to Artemis and Artemis only trip to see if things changed back to how it used to be in early 2010's.
Is this going to turn into another one has not been enough to FKK, or I am more experienced in FKK than you or Pattaya as you mention etc debate? LOL. I mean I am fly in monger and I cannot go everyday from here to German FKK man. It is so for many fly in mongers posters here too, I fly 12 hours man just for FKK.
Let this lounge and chat be liberal, instead of pointing fingers at other people will you? I mean we are just chatting here, not debating in court room pointing finger at each other as you do like in Pattaya forum or this forum or whatever. So what if someone has been once and he has opinion about club, I just read it and I may learn something fresh from him. I think everyone is entitled to their opinion about clubs or place and I am glad to listen to his opinion.
Like there are clubs I only been once. Like Oase and Globe, but even with those two clubs, I do have my own opinion too, can't I have one?
For girls maybe GT is a promotion, but I am not so sure. For guys it is a demotion having to go there nowadays.GT is just the best business for girls in Germany. A Hungarian from Sharks, real fire in bed, prefers GT business than everything for 50 at Sharks with night clients there, and she asked for pleasure in bed. A really bloody room with her, she screamed when she saw my Hanibal Lecter face. LR girls who are now at GT, seem happy about their new business, even those who said they didn't like GT when they were at LR, but money talk and change girls, only Amira preferred to stay at LR. Even German Mio touring at Globe, regret GT, but she can t work anymore because she doesn't want to register.
Banana Boi
06-17-19, 16:17
Let this lounge and chat be liberal, instead of pointing fingers at other people will you? I mean we are just chatting here, not debating in court room pointing finger at each other as you do like in Pattaya forum or this forum or whatever. So what if someone has been once and he has opinion about club, I just read it and I may learn something fresh from him. I think everyone is entitled to their opinion about clubs or place and I am glad to listen to his opinion.I was not pointing fingers at you specifically but you actually proved the point of my post. Making comments on how great a place is when you haven't been there in 4 years imo is ludicrous. Met a guy who told me and McA how great Brazil is then we find out he hadn't been for 8 years. Met another guy who told me Dubrovnik was the best then we find out he last visited 20+ years ago! How relevant is that info to the current scene?
The problem with posting information that is not current is that many guys who read these posts are not as knowledgeable as you are. They may only have a couple of days in Germany. If you post outdated information they may rely on your post to go to a specific club that used to be good but no longer is good.
I was not pointing fingers at you specifically but you actually proved the point of my post. Making comments on how great a place is when you haven't been there in 4 years imo is ludicrous. Met a guy who told me and McA how great Brazil is then we find out he hadn't been for 8 years. Met another guy who told me Dubrovnik was the best then we find out he last visited 20+ years ago! How relevant is that info to the current scene?
The problem with posting information that is not current is that many guys who read these posts are not as knowledgeable as you are. They may only have a couple of days in Germany. If you post outdated information they may rely on your post to go to a specific club that used to be good but no longer is good.There is a lot of logic and truth in what you say but it is a bit tricky.
Ideally, yes it is true that if members who make comments on specific girls and clubs would disclose some additional info such as when they last visited, how many times they have been with that girl or at that club etc, it would be immensely helpful. But that is something up to each member. This forum remains one where we all write on a voluntary basis, and it is probably better to write too much than to write too little. A forum where rules are so strict and one has to put boilerplate legalese around fun reports and expresses views may lead to reduced participation and we all agree that's not a good outcome.
There is a strong dose of caveat emptor in these scenarios. Any experienced and sensible monger would read multiple reports, do a lot of research and also keep in mind that there is a degree of uncertainty and randomness in his choice. No one report can guarantee anything - - not even multiple recent and well informed reports can. His taste may well be different from that of the writers whose advice he followed, for example.
If the monger is a newbie and did not do enough research and followed a single report that happened to be outdated and has a bad experience, I say tough luck but that is also a valuable lesson and a good thing. He would learn the value of proper due diligence and would be careful in the future.
Optimist wrote a report 3 days ago about Sharks. He went earlier in the day and immediately several members pulled him up that he went at a bad time and was misleading. My point, even if the report is so real time and came from a well traveled monger as him, there is still context around each report. Any experienced man would know this when following anonymous advice and recommendations on internet. Or he should. This is true for mongering tips and anything else on internet.
GT is just the best business for girls in Germany. A Hungarian from Sharks, real fire in bed, prefers GT business than everything for 50 at Sharks with night clients there, and she asked for pleasure in bed. A really bloody room with her, she screamed when she saw my Hanibal Lecter face. LR girls who are now at GT, seem happy about their new business, even those who said they didn't like GT when they were at LR, but money talk and change girls, only Amira preferred to stay at LR. Even German Mio touring at Globe, regret GT, but she can t work anymore because she doesn't want to register.I fucked Mio last week in Globe. She liked my 260 Euro instead of 100 Euro for an hour at GT. And she told me, that she is very happy with the Swiss guys at Globe.
But you are right, she told me, that she also liked GT with the garden and with the friendly and generous Dutchmen (it's a big market at the border, there are some people, who underestimate that fact).
And Amira (and Nelly) at LR, yes they make big money, because sometimes they have clients with 5-10 hour bookings.
But in the end, good Girls must make more money in Globe than GT or LR or Sharks, because of the prices (despite the new discount fuck without kisses at Globe).
(Maybe I don't know every tax regulation).
Exotic type girl, I like Rose. Very sportive body, she claim she works out and I believe her by looking at her body, small face, somehow bit oriental though she is 100% Hungarian, very structured face with big eye, long neck and all natural fit body and really good service.
White type girl: I liked this blonde girl from Romania. I cannot recall her name, most of time, I do not bother to remember or sometimes even ask her name, but she is natural blonde, beautiful natural breast, quite big breast, shaped nice, she is white Romanian blonde, no tattoo, apparently law student and good service. Once I told Sirioja this before and he mentioned couple of names. Good service.
Another white type girl: It was one of the sister, I think and they do not lookalike. She was Romanian who was introduced to by one of the poster here, I will not say his name for his privacy, but he is welcome to jump in if he read this post. She was also natural body, blonde, but I think this one is colored blonde. Good service.
However, I do not think LR is stunner club optically, you do get lucky once in awhile, but it is not same level of stunner you find like in palace or Artemis in early 2010's. I think LR is more younger, natural girls, with limited or no tattoo and they provide good service for just 50 euro per 30 min, you go loner it even get much better. It is only club you will get DFK that easily in 50 euro 30 min session. I think LR serve me as this kinda club..Maybe Luana now Florentina at GT, for your blond, white skin and masterpiece tits. Never heard of sisters at LR.
The best customers for WGs are the men who make a hundred to 120 grand a year but spend 40 of that on prostitutes and clubsSpending a third of their gross income on WGs? There are even more extreme examples than this. Someone who makes 50 grand a year can spend 80 grand per year on prostitutes. It can be done by liquidating all assets, (property, investments, inheritances, bank accounts) and then going on a 5-20 year spending spree.
The monger who I heard about is a number cruncher and the frugal type. Prior to falling for his current FKK wife, he was exclusively a 50 EUR guy. From what I heard, he has flirted the idea with selling off everything and depleting the nest egg. Given his frugal lifestyle, he believes he can subsist on his state pension. I suspect he would even be willing move to a country with lower cost of living for retirement. I will not pass judgement. I do not know what men's life circumstances are. And I cannot argue with his primary point, which is he cannot take that money with him to the grave. And he has nobody to leave that money to.
I was not pointing fingers at you specifically but you actually proved the point of my post. Making comments on how great a place is when you haven't been there in 4 years imo is ludicrous. Met a guy who told me and McA how great Brazil is then we find out he hadn't been for 8 years. Met another guy who told me Dubrovnik was the best then we find out he last visited 20+ years ago! How relevant is that info to the current scene?
The problem with posting information that is not current is that many guys who read these posts are not as knowledgeable as you are. They may only have a couple of days in Germany. If you post outdated information they may rely on your post to go to a specific club that used to be good but no longer is good.OK as for Artemis, it is fair enough. I stopped going there in 2015 and switch to Hessen, then I mixed land in Frankfurt, then move on to nrw region via ice train in one trip, doing FKK in both regions. I did so because stunners in line up of Artemis began to disappear from 2014 ish and 2015 visit made me, OK what am I doing here, then kept distance.
However, I do have good knowledge of how Artemis works, I mean I went there rapidly from 2009 till 2015 spending around 10 k euro per trip just for girls including entrance. As for recent trend, this is something I do not know though what I am seeking to find out is if it went back to more or less how it was line up wise. Meaning, mostly plastic older monsters, but you do find few stunner level beautiful girls between those monster girls.
Either way, I think keeping lounge and chat more liberal place is better for each one of us, if some post may not suit you, just skip it. Because administrations do filter many posts here and we do not need more self volunteer police or administrators I think.
All in all, Artemis seems to catch up with line up recently by looking at recent report and I am glad I am going back this late summer to try it out once again. It was my first FKK I visited, so a lot of memories there. As for upsell, it seems it got stronger, but Artemis was always upsell club, it is just that after major police raid and false indictment of owner of Artemis, and with new law, management got more weak on grip over girls because I think management is bit scared and they do not want another such police raid again. After all, that police raid happened originating from one of the girl working there tipping information to police, which turned out to be mostly false accusation.
Maybe Luana now Florentina at GT, for your blond, white skin and masterpiece tits. Never heard of sisters at LR.Maybe, she has classic beauty look. Supposed to be law student in Romania, she says. And yes, white skin and master piece natural tits, good right size big and all natural, I think she had zero tattoo. I took her and rose together because I kinda liked white skin natural blonde girl and tanned sportive fit body exotic Hungarian rose together sucking my dick. It was nice view under morning light as I kept the curtain open a bit.
Never saw her in GT though.
I had girl named not Florentina I think, but Fiorentina who worked in GT, she also worked in Artemis with name Coco. She supposed to be half Greek and Albanian from cologne. She was also real exotic beauty who looked like she is half Arab and half white and half Mexican and half white. Maybe Florentina and Fiorentina is different girl? In FKK, I never bother too much with their fake names especially they often move around in clubs to clubs.
OK as for Artemis, it is fair enough. I stopped going there in 2015 and switch to Hessen, then I mixed land in Frankfurt, then move on to nrw region via ice train in one trip, doing FKK in both regions. I did so because stunners in line up of Artemis began to disappear from 2014 ish and 2015 visit made me, OK what am I doing here, then kept distance.
However, I do have good knowledge of how Artemis works, I mean I went there rapidly from 2009 till 2015 spending around 10 k euro per trip just for girls including entrance. As for recent trend, this is something I do not know though what I am seeking to find out is if it went back to more or less how it was line up wise. Meaning, mostly plastic older monsters, but you do find few stunner level beautiful girls between those monster girls.
Either way, I think keeping lounge and chat more liberal place is better for each one of us, if some post may not suit you, just skip it. Because administrations do filter many posts here and we do not need more self volunteer police or administrators I think..Four year old experience are just that. Stale and useless in a field where six months is an eternity.
Maybe, she has classic beauty look. Supposed to be law student in Romania, she says. And yes, white skin and master piece natural tits, good right size big and all natural, I think she had zero tattoo. I took her and rose together because I kinda liked white skin natural blonde girl and tanned sportive fit body exotic Hungarian rose together sucking my dick. It was nice view under morning light as I kept the curtain open a bit.
Never saw her in GT though.
I had girl named not Florentina I think, but Fiorentina who worked in GT, she also worked in Artemis with name Coco. She supposed to be half Greek and Albanian from cologne. She was also real exotic beauty who looked like she is half Arab and half white and half Mexican and half white. Maybe Florentina and Fiorentina is different girl? In FKK, I never bother too much with their fake names especially they often move around in clubs to clubs.Not so sure ex Luana LR who moved to GT, becoming Florentina, is really natural blond, but natural masterpiece tits, milky skin and no big tattoos, at least she is natural beauty. Romanian. She moved to GT on 2018, like some of other LR girls, but Rose still at LR.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.1.4 Copyright © 2025 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.