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04-14-02, 00:17
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04-22-02, 03:42
Thanks again for posting my URL, Caltrop. I'm a bit miffed that my link was removed from the WA forums with this new board format. Aside from the alternating light-dark posts, I'm not impressed with the new system. Many of the features (search engine, signatures) are turned off because Jackson's server can't handle the added drain. Maybe the next upgrade he does will get us threaded topics--then there will be no compelling reason for street johns to remain at *** and endure the occasional abuse from the snobbish escort crowd (Q-Tip being the most recent victim of that).

It sounds like the great Kingsway sweep of '02 failed. I noticed on *** that Q-Tip scored there last week. I was doubtful that it would be completely successful, which is why I didn't make any changes in my guide when it was announced. From what I've seen over the years, it is virtually impossible for LE to completely eradicate prostitution from an area that has a long history of it, and has many attributes that are conducive to the sex trade. In Everett, the city installed an expensive video surveillance system (like Vancouver may use on the Downtown Eastside) -- primarily to thwart prostitution and drug-dealing -- and there are still occasional hookers there (and johns of course).

04-22-02, 10:23
I am taking my business trip to Vancouver shortly, any suggestions for me to get relaxed out of a busy schedule? Of course, give me clear instructions "on how to do it" as well. Thank you.

04-22-02, 19:01
Just back from post crackdown Vancouver. I didn't cruise Kingsway because I didn't have to. While "tourist track" areas of Yaletown were pretty sparse, Hastings/Cordova streets on East side were pretty busy, near Gore street especially. Found a cute, soft core, part-timer, looking for food money for the kids. Only asked for C50 for everything (I tipped her because she did NOT ever ask for any extra) and was pretty decent (although passive).

04-24-02, 04:07
In case anyone missed the article I posted on my news page yesterday, the specter of car forfeiture has risen its ugly head again. Last year, it was the Union of BC Municipalities calling for this, now its the BC Association of Police Boards. I fear that it's only a matter of time now before this outrageous penalty becomes law.

"If you want to buy sex, you might lose your car":


04-28-02, 01:42
Here's an update on the Lower Mainland, with emphasis on cities other than Vancouver (which gets regular updates from other johns here and at the censored *** board--speaking of which, I noticed that the moderator there completely tossed out a Q Tip-inspired street thread this week for some unfathomable reason).

SURREY: Significantly more activity than last month, with hookers again seen on the lower King George Hwy stroll and 104 Ave. I only cruised the lower King George one night, and saw one definite hooker at 84 Ave. I checked 104 Ave out to 152 St both nights. Most of the activity is at the eastern end, from about 148 to 150 streets--where I saw 2 hookers one night, and approximately 4 the next. The main stroll in the city is in the Whalley area west of King George from 104 to 108. There were around 8-10 different hookers over two nights. The quantity and quality were improved over last month.

NEW WESTMINSTER: The whole length of 12th St was occasionally active in the past, but I've only seen suspected hookers toward the northwestern end in the last year. I saw nothing last month, but one night this week there was a definite hooker (fair-good quality) working near the 7-Eleven between 10th and London.

BURNABY: The eastern end of Kingsway from about 10th to Edmonds was consistently active last year, but now it seems to be abandoned. Last month I saw one or two much further west around Royal Oak or Nelson, but nothing on two nights this week. Hookers don't seem to like this city now, so I suspect there has been an ongoing LE crackdown.

ABBOTSFORD: I didn't check it last month, and was there only one night this week. I only saw one convincing hooker (poor-fair quality) on McDougall between Pauline and McCallum. The quantity and quality were much better last year, and based on local newspaper articles, LE is taking a hard line toward the street trade. I saw one or two suspects on S Fraser Way--the other stroll in the city with past activity--but nothing convincing.

VANCOUVER: Kingsway may be the hottest stroll in the region. Many good-quality hookers, with the classier and more expensive ones favoring the southeastern end toward the city limits at Boundary Rd. There was reportedly an LE sweep of Kingsway recently, but I saw more activity this month than last. The only difference I see is that many of the "new high-track" hookers now stand on the south side of the boulevard rather than the north. I checked Fraser St from Kingsway to King Edward Ave late one night, but didn't see anything. The activity in the mid-track north of Hastings seemed to be up from last month, with some good-quality hookers there nearly all night. In the past, this stroll often dried up after 2 AM or so. No real news about the low-track: I'll just re-emphasize that there is usually a steady decline in activity until around 4 AM, then it picks up for a few hours.

For more detail on stroll locations, news articles, legal info, weather conditions and air quality--see my guide:

Seattle-Vancouver street guide:


05-01-02, 19:56

I am new to this and have a few questions.

Do some of the SW have their own place you can goto and if not where are there cheap rooms you can rent around the low track kingsway area, and for how much.

05-02-02, 16:21
I've never picked up on Kingsway, so I can't say where most dates occur in that area. As for low/mid-track, sometimes the SW will have a suitable place, sometimes not. There is an increased risk of being ripped-off or ambushed if you go to their place, so I always ask them if anyone else lives there (particularly males). Of course there is no guarantee they'll tell the truth, but I've always emphasized that I'll leave immediately if anyone else is there.

For greater security, I recommend using a flophouse hotel room. The one I've used the most over the years is The Gastown Hotel (110 Water St), which charges $20 an hour for a room with a bed and sink. There is another place in the E 1600 block of Franklin St, right next to the corner at Woodland Dr. This place also charges $20, but I've had more trouble getting into it at odd hours. I'm not sure if the place has a name, and it seems to be mainly a low-rent rooming house. I believe there are a few others in the Hastings St area that will rent a room for a short period of time, but I don't remember their locations or names. Many of the low-track hookers live in hotels like this, and you have to pay a $10 or $15 "guest fee" to the desk clerk if you use their room.

If anyone knows of other places, post them!

05-03-02, 01:06
Was cruising the various tracks last night. All seemed to be quite busy from about 9:30 pm until about 11:00 pm and then mid track and Kingsway seemed to get real quiet. Lo track seemed to be consistent even past 11:00 pm. Took a break for an hour and came back out at 12:30. Kingsway was quiet, mid-track was dead, and lo track was still about the same.

Sunday night I was out in Surrey. Haven't been out there for a couple of months cruising and I was pleasantly surprised by the numbers of SWs that were out. Saw a couple of cute ones, but by the time I had circled the block they were gone. Surrey was actually way better for numbers than what I saw last night on any of the Vancouver tracks. The area in Surrey that was the busiest was from 104 Ave to 108 Ave, from King George west to 134 St. Drive any of the side streets in between and there was almiost a SW on any corner. It was like the old days on the mid track. Quite a few were strung out, but there were also quite a few lookers. With the nicer weather the short skirts and low cut tops were plentiful. Nice to look at even if you weren't going to pickup.

05-05-02, 05:39
Thanks un_circumcised that helps alot. Will check them out.
I second that also if anyone knows of other places please post them,


PS great guide thanks for all the hard work!!!

05-06-02, 03:38
Thanks for the praise, John. The guide has really been more fun than work. I started it last year as a lark--I'd already compiled much of the information in it over the years for my own enlightenment, and was posting links to area news articles to ASP on a regular basis.

Thanks for the Surrey update, Embassy. I haven't been able to get there before 11:30 PM on the 3 nights I've checked it this year, so the prospects might even be better earlier in the evening or afternoon. Surrey has generated the most street prostitution newspaper articles in the last year (many of which are still in the News & Analysis page of my guide), and they give the impression that LE is working hard to prevent the city from becoming another Vancouver with unofficially tolerated tracks. The focus of their efforts is now reportedly on the johns--particularly in the lower King George (Newton) and eastern 104 Ave (Guildford) areas--so be on high alert for decoys and unmarked vice units there. LE did decoy stings in the Whalley blocks (west of King George) in recent years, so that area may not be as safe as Vancouver either, but I saw no prostitution-related enforcement there on 3 nights this year, and as you and I have observed, the quantity and quality seem to be improving of late.

05-11-02, 00:45
Was back out in Surrey last night just after the sun went down as it was getting dark. A large number of SWs out walking the streets. Like last week, almost one on every block. Did see some vice action, an unmarked green minivan with dark tint windows. However, they seemed to be more interested in the SWs than the customers. Saw them talking to 3 different girls in three different areas.

Cruised downtown for awhile, but didn't see very much interesting. Then back to Surrey around midnight. It was much quieter than earlier on. Very sporadic and much more marked LE around. Saw a couple of cuties, the nice weather is bringing out the shorts and skirts. Dont like to pick up though when LE is parked a block away in full view.

05-13-02, 11:03
East Hastings: The best track for cheap crack heads. There are some nice young chicks down there if you don't mind cruising for a while. I was in Van May 1-3 and picked up a couple of nice looking Indian girls and a couple of nice white girls. I mainly cruise LATE at night (3-5am). I paid $10-$20 for BJ'S (Yes Canadian, When they flag you down say "Sorry but I am short on Cash" They always say "how much do you have" Say $10 :). I paid $40 for a lay. These prices are almost as good as Cuba :)


05-18-02, 01:31
Was going to my favorite incall yesterday, but no answer. Needed some relief so hit the streets around 11:30 last night. Really quiet probably on account of the rain. Spent about an hour on lo, mid, and part of Kingsway. Was going to head home when all of sudden it picked up. Lots of SWs out and hardly any cruisers. Found a cute brunette in a micro mini on Victoria couple of blocks south of Hastings. One green and one purple for a BJ, offered BBBJ but chose to be safe. Wanted to drive a ways from the tracks so we headed east quite a ways and found a park. Probably spent more time driving than doing the deed. I think that she was happy to be warm and dry.

Said that a lot of the girls have moved to south of Hastings, Commerical and east. Did see a couple on some side streets as I was driving her back.

Swung along Kingsway before heading home. Lots of eye candy, stopped for one, (hey I was horny) but she started at $100. Moved on and headed home.

05-25-02, 22:27
You're referring to the "kiddie stroll", which was reportedly the eastern mid-track area around Victoria Dr and Pandora St. The kiddie stroll hysteria in the media seems to have peaked a few years ago, and from what I saw there in the late '90s, it was quite exaggerated. I've actually seen more under-18 girls in and around the low-track over the years, but their presence has declined as the cops have become more aggressive about identifying and removing them.

Also remember: Picking up hookers under 18 is serious offence, and can result in up to 5 years in prison. I'm not condemning those who do it because I've knowingly crossed the line a few times (and probably unknowingly several more), but just be aware of the increased legal risks.

Seattle-Vancouver street guide:


05-28-02, 02:18
Hi ive read about the hetero sex scene at the Vancouver adult theaters.. the Fox and the Neptune to be specific. Has anyone had any experiences and or opinions of these places? thanks-K

05-30-02, 03:26

You are reffering to the Venus on Main Street. I went there a few years ago and there is sex. Homo sex, although I did see a pimp bring in a ho once but it was too freaky as he wanted to watch.

05-30-02, 03:33
About the Kiddie stroll, the last action I saw there was way back in 1995, and then one time one girl theatend to kill me for just walking past her, and she flagged down some under cover cops who harrased me. I once talked to a 16 year old girl for a few seconds, but the other girls, told me not to talk to them as a cop car was watching the action 2 blocks away near Hastings.

A local Mp was busted for falling for a sting operation at a nearby hotel, so the whole thing is bogus.

06-04-02, 06:05
Are there any Mother/Daughter duos out there looking for some fun? I would like to try this fantasy at leat once in my life.

06-06-02, 02:19
I am interested in mking that drive up to Vancouver for some local fun, but I have a problem heading to an area that I am not familiar with.What would be the best way to go;SW or escort.What's a good descreet hotel to stay at?And when is the best time to cruise?


06-06-02, 04:30
My experience with escorts is nil and I'm obviously biased in favor of the street, but I think it's accurate to say that you can find escort-quality action almost every night on Kingsway and most nights on Franklin St in the mid-track. Of course some of these women can be quite expensive, but considering that you get to look them over before choosing (as opposed to the typical outcall blind date), it appears to be the best way to go if you're seeking a high-quality hooker. If you're looking for bargains, stay away from Kingsway, and focus on the low and mid-tracks. I also recommend the Whalley stroll in Surrey (the one with two dollar signs in my guide). The activity there seems to have picked up in recent months, and there are occasionally some decent-looking women. Whalley is significantly closer to the border than the downtown Vancouver tracks, but the risk of being stopped by LE or encountering decoys may be greater.

As for when to go, there really isn't a wrong time in terms of finding hookers, and if you've never been there, you may be in for a bit of a shock. In contrast to the Seattle area, the cops in Vancouver pretty much leave the hookers alone if they stay in certain tracks and look over 18. There is reportedly more of an emphasis these days on harassing, identifying, and stinging johns; but there are so many guys cruising on most strolls that your odds of being nabbed are not great, and I know you're no newcomer to the street game, either. The only recommendation I'd make about when to go would be to avoid weekends if you can, because that's when the border waits are longest. If you do go then, monitor AM 1130 so you don't waste time and gas waiting in line for a half hour or more. As for cruising times, Kingsway and Whalley peak in the evening or early morning, whereas the downtown strolls (particularly the low-track) often go all night. Whatever you do, don't pick up off the old high-track on Seymour and Richards. The consensus is that it's now a tourist trap that feeds off of newbie and out-of-towner johns. I can't give you any advice on places to stay because I'm strictly a car-napper up there.

You've probably seen all the relevant info in my guide on BC and its strolls, and if you can read a map, you should be able to find your way around. If there are any subjects you want me to address further, don't hesitate to ask.

Seattle-Vancouver street guide:


06-07-02, 00:18
Un Circumcised,

THanks for the info.All I need to do is pickthe day since I work on the weekends anyway,I should be in good shape!


06-07-02, 06:02
Would some one clarify what "Track" refers to. Does it mean an area near a railroad track or switch yard or refer to a circular area like a "Race Track". Any clarification would he helpful for out of towners. Thanks.

06-09-02, 00:12
"Track" is just the Vancouver vernacular for stroll. The city's tracks are shown in light type next to their geographic locations in my guide.

06-11-02, 03:51
As I saw many ppl mentioned that LE did decoy stings in the Whalley or maybe other areas in recent years, just wondering if there is any hints/methods to tell who is a REAL and who is a DECOY without actually communicating with them?

for example, should I assume that DECOY usually won't wear mini skirt or being very sexy? or something like that?

Sorry to ask this stupid question, because I am still very new to this game and lack of experience. Thanks

06-13-02, 20:07
In case you missed it, I tried to cover all the potential legal pitfalls of the street game in my guide:


As for decoy attire, the trend in recent years all over North America seems to be to dress them rather casually with a touch of sleaze--just like most real streetwalkers. It's rare these days to see decoys dressed in extremely provocative clothing like tight, short miniskirts or even high heels.

06-20-02, 23:05

Jeasus Fuckin Christ!That is a place that can Get used to in a hurry!!I hit the high track(Kingsway)and I saw a beauty in front of the Playdium.Black flower dress nice tan,heels.Saw me looking at her and gave me abig smil and waved at me.Traffic was moving slow enough for us to get a good look at each other.She was defnitly top shelf!There was no way I could turn around and see what shee was about!aw another one on Kingswaylater in the day wearing a short jean dress and four inch heals walking across the street like the Queen of England.A keeper and I rate he a 9+.Everyone wasa lookin!Both these women had small purses that couldn't hold a thing and cell phones glued to their ears.Pretty obvious to.

Lover track had quiet a few but I canget that bak in WA.

I give the place a grade B and will return a gain with a better planand more money.My only worries are a car with US plates and spotting stings.I know te place is jumpin and it wasn't even late.


06-21-02, 03:05
Glad to see you made it up, Pariah! I knew you wouldn't be disappointed. I just got back from a two-night / one day relaxation / fact-finding junket in the Lower Mainland myself. I wasn't intending to pick anyone up because I spent some bucks at a legit spa in Surrey, but right before I was about to leave this morning I came across one of my previous good dates on the low-track, so I figured at $50 Canadian ($30 for lay + $20 for room), why not? She's about a 5, but has deteriorated a bit from the street life, so maybe 4.5 is more accurate. Nice personality, probably Native or some mix, 20s, fairly tight pussy. I didn't have my preferred brand of condoms, so we used hers. They seemed on the thin side and the lubricant wasn't the best, but they did the job. Sex was satisfying, but since I wasn't high, not Earth-shaking. Now on to my report:

SURREY: I was only here one night and it was well after midnight, so the scene was probably not at its optimum. I saw one hag on King George near 80 Ave and nothing convincing on 104 Ave. As usual, the majority of the action was in the Whalley blocks west of King George. There were probably 4 or 5 there, with the best being in the upper "fair" category. LE pattern was typical: Regular passes up and down King George and 104, but the Whalley blocks more ignored.

BURNABY: Here's the big news. The stretch of Kingsway from 10th Ave to Edmonds St was active most of last year, but I've seen little or nothing this year until now. I estimate I saw 10 or so different hookers there over two nights, with the best being in the lower "good" category. LE presence was minimal to nonexistent, and like in Vancouver, they showed no interest in the women. Nor did I see any johns being stopped. There were also one or two hookers on Kingsway from Edmonds to Royal Oak Ave, but as usual, nothing beyond that to the Vancouver city limits.

NEW WESTMINSTER: I did the full length of 12th St both nights, but saw nothing convincing. The most likely area now seems to be the block or two of 12th just inside the city limits (10th Ave to Dublin St).

VANCOUVER: No real news about Kingsway and the downtown tracks, but the Franklin St part of mid-track seemed sparser than it was on my previous visits this year. There have been recent reports saying that the whole length of Fraser St now has occasional activity, so I checked it three times: One night after midnight, one night in the early evening, and once during the day. I saw a few hookers in the Broadway to King Edward Ave stretch (most around Kingsway), and one or two from 61st Ave to Marine Dr, but nothing in the long stretch from King Edward to 61st.

With all the cruising I did and the pleasant weather, I was hoping to stumble on to a decoy sting in the city on this visit, but no luck. I didn't even see the vice squad in their unmarked Crown Victoria roaming around and occasionally conversing with johns and hookers. The only stop that might have been prostitution-related was a stop of a vehicle by a marked unit at Gore and Cordova. As for WA johns worrying about being singled out, there may be some truth to that. However, I don't think that those of us who are not wanted felons have much to worry about. I've been stopped 3 or 4 times in recent years, but nothing has come of it. I may be in the "DISC" john database, but so what? I haven't even received a lousy "Dear john" letter in the mail. WA johns should probably be a bit more discreet about their cruising and pickups though, as nothing good can ever come from cops questioning you. As always, be aware of the vehicles around you when stopping to talk with or pick up a hooker, and don't sit idling on the side of the street with her talking to you for more than a few seconds. If you've been cruising a particular area for a long time and you repeatedly pass cops, give it a rest for awhile. If you're in an area with a history of stings (mid-track, Fraser, and possibly Kingsway), be on heightened alert and watch for the decoy indicators in my guide below.

Seattle-Vancouver street guide:


06-24-02, 13:12
First, I'd like to say thanks to un_circumcised for the great write-ups. Next, I know this slightly off topic but, has any US citizens crossed the border lately from Blaine. What type of questions are generally asked to cross into Canada. I have a DWAI on my record from 9 years ago and cant get straight answers as to stuff like is it actually possible to get a Minister's Permit or whatever at the border. I'm going to be in Seattle next week and am just curious as to how difficult it will be to cross the border. Thanks

06-24-02, 23:59

May I suggest that the next time that you decide to cruise, that you park the car and walk around. This would apply to the low and mid track?

Mind you, you have to make sure your car doesn't get broken into, but what you could do is leave your car at your hotel/motel and take the bus. A bus goes down Kingsway and several go down hastings, and when you are in the general area, just walk the circut, so at least you don't look a ssuspious, and the girls might think you are a local and cut you a break.

06-25-02, 05:45
From what I understand, anyone with a drunk-driving conviction is not admissible, no matter how old the violation is. I remember there was a flap about Bush not being able to visit Canada due to his DUI conviction way back in '76, but obviously he was granted a Minister's Permit--or "waiver" as they're known on the U.S. side. As for drugs, any possession conviction (even for 1 joint) results in Canadians being banned from the U.S. I'm not sure if Canada is as harsh on this, but I wouldn't be surprised because marijuana possession isn't broken down into misdemeanor and felony categories like it is in the U.S. Generally speaking, if you have any criminal record, you're screwed, but according to "Beat the Border" the U.S. at least will not ban visitors for petty stuff like drunk & disorderly or minor traffic offenses.

Getting a Minister's Permit or waiver is a long, expensive process, and there is no guarantee it will be granted. You could waste hundreds of dollars and months of time just to provide the authorities with a lot more personal info. If you're determined to get through and you have some acting ability, there's a good chance you could simply lie your way across, and you may be pleasantly surprised to discover that they don't know as much about you as they'd like you to believe. If you're going to lie, though, you better be able to hold to your story without cracking, because if you buckle under pressure and admit to lying you could be in bigger trouble. Criminal records reporting is not foolproof, and mistakes are made. If they ask at the border if
you've ever been arrested or convicted, deny, deny, deny. If they accuse you of having been convicted, tell them their information is inaccurate, tell them you were acquitted on appeal, tell them there was a hung jury and the case wasn't retried, etc. They'll probably turn you around and tell you to bring proof of your claims next time, but you could make it through for a long time using this tactic--particularly if you're not sent inside to secondary inspection.

Other things that will get you sent to secondary for further scrutiny are if you don't work, if you have a medical condition, if you don't have enough money to support yourself during your visit, if you don't have a legitimate reason for visiting, if you or your vehicle have an unkempt, dirtbag look, etc. Again, it's possible to bluff your way through all this stuff, and it's a lot harder for them to verify what you're saying than it is to check for a criminal record. They may also ask if you've been denied entry before, but the inspectors at the primary inspection booth have a "lookout system" for nonadmissible persons, so that may be one case where lying isn't going to do you any good.

Visaman, I've walked around the low and mid-track areas before, and it's kind of creepy! The cops don't worry me as much as leaving my car parked in those areas as I walk around. About all the cops have done is questioned me, occasionally looked in my car, and told me to get out of the area. Big deal. I simply wait several hours until I'm reasonably sure the cops who stopped me are off their shift, then I resume my cruising. As for the hookers, I've never noticed that they tried to get more money out of me or otherwise take advantage of me because I'm American, and most will happily accept U.S. bills.

06-26-02, 08:55
If you want to read an interesting story about crossing the border into Canada, read Nina Hartley's story at www.nina.com It may be still there.

06-29-02, 05:15
Drove around all Vancouver tracks on Wednesday night. Hot night and lots of girls out. Also lots of cars and by the time that I had gone around the block for 4 different SWs they were gone. Kingsway was quiet, but mid and lo track were hopping. Gave up and called a SP that a buddy of mine told me to see. (We have gone cruising together, so know each others tastes).

She is a mature lady, late 40s and sometimes advertises in the B&S as Marie. My preference has been for providers in their early twenties. This was the first one that was older than me. She has her own condo in New West/Burnaby area. She was available and when I mentioned my friends name, she agreed to see me. Appearance was ok. Not great, not bad. Once in the bedroom she asked what I was waiting for. We both stripped down and I was pleasantly surprised to see a nicely shaped figure for a late 40s lady. Started with a massage and progressed to some bum play. Turned over and she continued the massage first with her hands and then with her tongue. Then onto a BBBJ that was out of this world. If this is an example of a mature, experienced lady, give it to me any time over a 20 year old. She had me going to hights like never before. 1/2 hour session stretched into 45 minutes and business was taken care of at the end.

All I can say is that I am hooked on older women. No hangups, not rushed, and sure knew how to please a man. Showed me a few things about pleasing her as well.

07-02-02, 00:57
Hey people. I found a escort related chat room at:

Check it out.

07-13-02, 06:18
hi fellow hobbist, be careful around victoria and pandora area, they have been doing undercover work around there, an overweight blonde police officer and a tall slim , maybe spanish or east indian looking girl as well. be aware. hope this helps. tips, if they are over 5 ft 2 be really careful.

Bearded Clam
07-15-02, 06:30
Hello Fellow Hobbyist!

I will be in Vancouver at the end of the month and would like to get some info on the nudy bar scene. Can anyone help? Please email me with that info at bearded_clam@hotmail.com.



07-16-02, 11:35
Perhaps some of you guys will just laugh at me now. But I'd say take a look at the last 4 pages of Georgia Straight and you'll find someone who matches at least 70% of what you want exactly, unless you're terribly unlucky. It's harder to find an incall service, and always hard to find a polite woman. But patience pays. I ended up finding a 19 year old college student for $170 an hour! She was very clean and 8/10. I didn't ask her for Greek but the chick on the phone said they had 2 girls who did Greek and without any extra cost! So she was probably one of them. $170CDN including Greek, incall and clean. I found this on Georgia Straight. So maybe you guys should try it out as well.

07-21-02, 16:04
No david, prostution is NOT legal in Vancouver. RCMP see the people bargaining with the SW's along Richards, Seymour and Helmcken streets but they don't diturb you much. Though this doesn't mean prostution is legal. It's ok for the girls, they won't be arrested for being prostitutes. But the customer can get into trouble for buying sex. Also, the girl has to be at least 19 or else you could get into even deeper shit. It's illegal to discuss the services explicitly so if you ask the girls what they offer they'll just say let's make a deal on $130 and go to the hotel. But I would advise you to avoid the SW's along the streets I've mentioned because most of them are Barracuda's who will give you absolutely nothing for the price you agreed. If you want real nice time it will cost you around $200 if not more. So go for the escorts instead of hookers. Chances of getting into trouble are lower with them and they're much cleaner.

07-22-02, 04:46
the simple answer is that escorts are legal in canada, streetwalkers are not. however, vancouver at least seems not to enforce the law against sws if they stay in certain strolls--which makes it look like the street trade is legal. there has been a policy throughout the lower mainland of harassing and stinging street johns more in the last several years, but i still think that you're less likely to get busted in bc than in wa. as cachondito said, paying **** girls for sex can get you in serious trouble with possible prison time, but my reading of the law is that the girl has to be under 18, not 19--which is the drinking age. the age of consent for nonpaid sex throughout canada is still a sensible 14 rather than the 18 in wa and most u.s. states. see my legal page for more info and tips:


07-22-02, 05:35
The street scene has been really quite hot the last few nights. Spent quite a bit of time out on Thursday night just cruising. Mid-track was really busy around 11:00 pm. Seemed to be a SW on almost every corner. Kingsway was slower earlier on, but it picked up around 1:00 am. Fraser and Broadway area has reactivated with about 10 to 15 out around 1:00 am. It has been fairly quiet for the last year or so, but obviously has picked up.

Lo-track was busy earlier, then got quiet when a roadblock when up on Hastings. After the roadblock left, it picked up as well. There was several of the SWs that were doing all they could to get some business. Flashing breasts, lifting up their dresses. Must have been slow.

Picked up a brunette on Clark just south of Veneables. Had been standing there for a while. Real talker, which continued during the BJ. Actually quite different, she was not in a rush, and started to talk dirty which just added to the scene. Stopped part way through and asked if I wanted to play with her. Had a great time for only 40. Will pick up again if I see her.

The John patrol was out around Kingsway and Fraser again, right till about 12:30. Only seemed to be hanging at that corner, girls working just one block away.

07-25-02, 11:16
David, it sounds like English may not be your first language. Again, I refer you to my legal page, which should answer all your questions about legality and how to pick up SWs without getting caught. If you have trouble understanding it, all I can suggest is to find someone who can translate it for you.

Laws, tactics, & countermeasures:


Embassy, thanks for the Vancouver update.

Seattle-Vancouver street guide:


World Traveler
07-31-02, 05:49
I was in Vancouver a couple of weeks ago (Wed & Thu nights). The street action does not pick up before 9:30, 10:00 pm and slows down after midnight. But It picks up again around 2:30, 3:00 and it goes on ¡®til 5:30, 6:00 am. ¡¦. This was mentioned in one the earlier reports too.

I noticed the number of girls is down every time I am in Vancouver (last time eight months ago). I also noticed that some cars were pulled over by the Vancouver police at night ... in areas popular by johns. But it looked like they were for traffic violations. So, my advise is to be extra patient when driving in these areas and make sure you obey all traffic signs.

Only cruised Kingsway from Knight to Fraser. More actions on Wed night than Thu but still only a small number. Next time I will try Kingsway from Knight to the east. Did not see anything ¡®decent¡¯ during the day, .. anywhere. ¡¦ And I cruised for hours!

Where is the best 'street' action for during the day? Anyone has any tip?

07-31-02, 18:00
I saw a lot of activity in Surrey last night from around 1 to 2 AM. They were on King George down to 76 Ave or so, 104 Ave near Guildford, and of course the Whalley blocks west of King George--which has been the most reliable area of the city in recent years. I saw a number of marked LE cruising through the Whalley blocks after awhile, but it looked more like for intimidation than anything else. I next checked 12th St in New Westminster, and saw 2 SWs that were upper fair quality, then a few on the nearby stretch of Kingsway in Burnaby. By the time I got to Kingsway in Vancouver it was around 2:30 and the SWs didn't appear until I got well past the "new high track" area beyond Rupert St, but there were a number still out.

08-02-02, 02:52
What happened to the mid-track? I've never seen it so barren as it was last night. I noticed that there's a "detour" sign on Franklin between Commercial and Salsbury, but some johns were just going around it and driving through there anyway, and that doesn't explain why the rest of the track was so deserted. For the record, though, I only checked it twice: Around 8:30 PM and 1 AM. I made a few sightings, but none were solidly in my "good" category. The activity and quality on the low-track also seemed down the last 2 nights, but I did score there with a Native-looking woman. She agreed to intercourse for $40, and we went to her hotel room on Hastings--where I paid a $5 guest fee. I noticed that her anus was moderately stretched, so I asked if she does greek, and she said she would for extra. I pulled out another $20, and she said OK. I did her ass, then finished in her fairly tight
pussy. Wow! Great sex, great orgasm. I was a bit surprised her pussy was so firm because she looked close to 40 years old, but I've noticed age is not always the determining factor is vaginal looseness. Here's the breakdown on the 1-10 scale: Looks: 3.5, Personality: 6, Sex: 9. Not a bad deal for $65 Canadian.

LE tip: Vice may have removed the cop antennas and inside window-mounted flashing lights from their unmarked maroon Ford Crown Victoria to look less noticeable. If so, they must be communicating with hand-held radios or retractable antennas, and using some type of movable flasher that is placed on the roof or dash and held by a magnet or something. I only saw the vehicle once in low-track, but it sure looked like one of their cars, and had two male occupants.

Fireworks tip: Don't try to get anywhere remotely close to the prime viewing areas unless you give yourself a few hours. I didn't head over toward the West End and Kitsilano areas until 9 PM, and all I ended up doing was wasting gas and missing the show. The Sun reported there were 400,000 people at last night's fireworks, so figure the upcoming ones on Saturdays are going to be even more of a madhouse.

08-13-02, 06:46

Hi all..I'm usually on the Seattle Board but...I was up in Richmond BC this weekend and curious if anyone has been to this place?

It was still OPEN at 11pm so I figured it's one of those AMPs or something...does anyone have any experience here?

I've gone through all the pages on this site and searched on the net but not much info.

Thanks all!


09-11-02, 18:28
Hey Guys,

I was in Vancouver the 2nd, 3rd and 4th of September. Over all I would say it was slower then when I was here in May but still better then almost every other city. I spent most of my time on the Hastings track but there was not many new girls out. The girls are all $20 Canadian for a BJ, Some will go $10 but the are hurting. I did score a nice native girl on Mid track (down by comercial) for $20. She wanted $40 for a BJ (daytime around 11am) but I said that all I had was $20 and she took it. One bad mistake I made was I always take the change out of my cup holders (the girls going threw it [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140)'s me off) but this time I left the 7-11 drink cup with the change behind the passenger seat. Some how the girl grabbed it without me knowing. I guess I paid my stupid tax :). Over three days I did 2 dates day 1, 4 dates day 2 and 2 dates day three, Anyone else addicted to this? :).

09-11-02, 19:06
Jimbehr, I think the main way they arrest johns in Vancouver is through decoy stings, and the only locations I've heard about those taking place in recent years are the mid-track around Franklin & Salsbury, and Fraser St near Broadway. However, you may be stopped and questioned if they see you stopping to talk with a SW, picking her up, or merely for circling a track--as has happened to me a couple of times. They'll probably enter your name, car, etc into the DISC john database, and may send you a "Dear john" warning letter in the mail (in the hope that your wife or girlfriend sees it, I guess). Overall, I'd say the risk of getting busted and taken to jail or sent to john school is lower than in WA--particularly if you know the characteristics and behaviors of decoys. Scroll down this forum page for more of my legal thoughts and links.

Vpofkuba, I've also picked up more than one SW in that Hastings area in a day--especially if the first date wasn't satisfying enough for some reason. However, I've never done more than 2 in a 24 hr. period. I guess it takes my balls longer to recharge than yours do.

09-12-02, 00:58
Just wondering about LE in Vancouver. I've read reports of them being present at the various tracks. Do they make lots of arrests? Will they usually arrest you if they see a girl get in your car?

09-12-02, 21:13
about le in vancouver. i have been in town for the past 2 weeks, and have picked up low-track sw almost every day, in the area of hastings, main, gore, jackson, dunleavy, princess, heatley, (heatley is a hot-spot)powell, cordova, oppenheimer park. last week there was a decoy sting in operation, based out of a car marked "john watch" (who the hell's he ?), on the street behind the patricia hotel, where there is also a video camera belonging to mr. watch. on the corner going towards the park, i was propositioned by a cute white girl in blue jeans and pink tank-top, trying to look like an **** hooker i guess. i smelled a rat and just said no. i sat over in the park (i won't do that again, though, as 2 days ago i was nearby when someone was murdered there !), and observed, as she walked in the park with 2 suitably scruffy-looking plain-clothed cops. the locals (druggies etc.) knew they were cops. yesterday, i picked up a girl i had dated the day before, at her place on dunleavy just below the park. there were cops near her building, and she came out to my car and we drove off right under their noses. so i guess that was the murder-prevention detail, and not vice squad...

09-13-02, 00:02
Did you see any johns caught in this sting? I know there have been decoy stings in the low-track before, but I haven't heard of any in recent years. The cops have seemed to prefer to sting in the mid-track since the late '90s at least (based on newspaper reports and eyewitness accounts of johns actually being busted for soliciting suspected decoys). As for the "john watch" stuff, it's widely thought to be just for intimidation. I don't think anyone in a "john watch" vehicle would have the power to arrest or even question you. The people running this operation are local anti-prostitution zealots, not cops. Some have suggested that the cams are dummies, and it kind of makes sense. Why would someone put flashing strobe lights on a real surveillance cam?

The people you really need to watch out for are the vice goons in their unmarked vehicles. They used to be easy to identify because they used a maroon Ford Crown Victoria with two odd antennas on the back, and the cop flashers permanently mounted in the rear window. In the last year or so, I've also seen cops in the Hastings St area using an unmarked full-size SUV (maroon or some similarly dark color), and possibly a maroon Ford Crown Victoria with the telltale antennas and flashers removed. The reason I thought it was LE was because of the two male occupants--which looked out of place compared to the usual solo john cruising the area. You also need to be wary of units in marked vehicles--particularly during slow times of the day. I've been harassed by both types of LE in Vancouver, and some of those cops in marked units can be greater blusterers than vice.

09-13-02, 16:47
The street action is really up and down lately. Been out doing a fair amount of crusing and noticed that some nights are good and others are really bad. Monday night was great, all Vancouver strips had lots of girls outs. Lots of new ones that I haven't seen before. Tuesday night it was soooooo quiet. The few that were out seemed to get picked up quick.

What I have noticed is that Kingsway in Burnaby seems to have come alive again. It has been picking up in numbers, but last night I counted 10 SWs on Kingsway from Royal Oak east to Edmonds, and that was just making one cruise east bound. Coming back westbound there were not as many, but a couple of new faces so that would make 12 in about 10 minutes.

In Vancouver, Kingsway between Fraser and Clark has slowed down, probably due to the John Patrol. They have been more active and actually patrolling most of Kingsway in the earlier evening instead of just hanging around Fraser. Also Broadway between Clark and St. Georges is seeing more action these days.

Be safe.

09-13-02, 20:12
If you are stopped for circling a area will the cops automatically sen you a letter???

Under the law what can the cops due if you are stopped with a girl???

Does Vancouver have a suspicion of prostitution law, whereby the cops can seize your car??

How heavy is the police action?? Are the cops running stings every week if so on what days???

09-14-02, 03:40
Thanks for the update, Embassy.

As for Hargow's questions:

I've been stopped a few times in recent years, and suspect I'm in the DISC ( http://www.city.vancouver.bc.ca/police/InvesServDiv/sis/vice/discObjectives.htm ) database. However, I've never received a "Dear john" letter. I do reside in the U.S., but I don't know why that would make any difference with them sending me a warning letter or not.

As for being stopped with a hooker, my understanding is that the cops can't make an arrest based on that alone--even if both the hooker and john confess to a prostitution deal (and this is a huge difference with the situation in WA, where anything that looks like prostitution is illegal, and can get you locked up). What is outlawed in Canada is "communication in a public place for the purpose of obtaining the sexual services of a prostitute" -- so once the hooker is in your vehicle (and particularly if the cops didn't see her get in), you're probably immune from arrest. Read the law yourself:

http://lois.justice.gc.ca/en/C-46/38983.html (It's Section 213 at the bottom of the page).

Car seizure: I first heard about the possibility of Lower Mainland cities seizing johns' vehicles a year ago on CKNW, and have only seen one other thing about it since: An item in the Abbotsford News back in April. Neither the news broadcast or article definitively indicated this policy is currently in effect. I don't see it in the Vancouver By-Laws ( http://www.city.vancouver.bc.ca/bylaws/ ) or on the vice page ( http://www.city.vancouver.bc.ca/police/InvesServDiv/sis/vice/viceunit.html ), and my sense is that the city isn't currently doing this.

I only come up once or twice a month on average, so I'm not the best person to judge how heavy the LE harassment is on a daily basis. I can tell you that in 17 years, I've been stopped strictly for
prostitution reasons in Vancouver about 3 times, have never been arrested, and have seen only one decoy sting.

As always, if anyone disagrees with my interpretations of laws or has additional legal info I'm not aware of, please contribute.

09-14-02, 07:02
Well, as for the Cas seizure bit, I think it's a "no go" The debate has kinda run itself in circle. The thinking was, "How can we take the cars of people for a crime that usually sees fines around $200 (if that), when we can only impound a car on a DD charge for 30 days?"
As for LE, that really depends on the cop. for most cops, busting you for prostitution is a waste of time and effort (but they MAY do it if you act like a jerk to them) It is only the vice cops that will make the effort. (or when the major has his panties in a twist)

I have been stopped several times with known workers in my car (in one case the girl Knew the cop by his profile as he came to the car!) usually they ask a bunch of questions (who you are, where you're from, what you're doing, where you're going.) and ask to see ID. Be nice, answer the questions as truthfully as you can with out incriminating yourself. (I told the cop point blank that I was taking "shelly" to my home, and he said "ok"!)

Mind you, I live in a small city a few hours from Vancouver (but I have done some "shopping" there too) but the Law is the Law, and it applies everywhere.

09-17-02, 14:31
Can anyone recommend any Asian-style massage parlours in Richmond or greater Vancouver? Thanks.

09-25-02, 06:36
The specter of car seizure has risen its ugly head yet again:


This is the second time this year that I've seen authorities in Abbotsford calling for this draconian tactic. From what I understand, the Abbotsford-Mission area is the "Bible Belt" of BC, so I guess it's not surprising that the impetus for such a policy is coming from there. It sounds like the provincial government must still give approval before cities can start doing this. Does anyone have an idea what the predisposition of the Liberal government in Victoria would be on this?

Speaking of Mission, its strolls are now listed in my guide, based on an article that came out in the Abbotsford Times last week. If anyone gets out there before I do, post a report on what the scene looks like.

Seattle-Vancouver street guide: http://www.geocities.com/un_csd/streetguide.html

Sour Honey
09-26-02, 12:28
Oh..... sorry for "publicity", but I have to share this with you.

Been in Vancouver last week, and I have met the BEST WG in all my life. (....and I'm 49, with 28 years of punting....)

She's a philipina woman, about 25 yo, that's incredibly nice, expert and giv the best GF experience I've never had

She does outcalls and incalls (and the cost is absolutely not so high) CAN$250 per hour

her site is http://www.laiya.com
The pics are real, maybe she's better than the pics themselves!!!!

I am sorry for this sort of advertisement, it's the first time in my life I do a thing like this but..... it worth the money and the time

09-29-02, 05:30
with a head full of thc, happy pop in the tape deck, and a full tank of quality u.s. gas, i took off friday night to check as many lower mainland strolls as i could, and hopefully find some cheap sex kicks. times are approximate:

mission (8-10:30 pm). my first stop was this small city where the local paper reported increasing prostitution a week ago. i didn't see anything convincing, but narrowed down the most promising area to n railway ave and 1st ave (aka lougheed hwy) from grand st to horne st. this is arguably the most remote lower mainland city that street action has been reported in, and my impression is that it's definitely not worth going out of your way for. it's also perhaps the only local prostitution city you can't get to by freeway: the only way in and out of town is on high-speed, two-lane highways--the deadliest kind of roads--and indeed there was an accident on the hwy 11 bridge over the fraser river as i was heading to...

abbotsford (11 pm-12 am). fear & loathing in abbotsford: this is the city where the mayor is pushing the provincial government to steal johns' cars. i've been here several times and have never seen more than 3 or 4 hookers, and this night was no different. the "old downtown" stroll (blocks around mcdougall & pauline) seems to be abandoned now, and the new hotbed of activity is the clearbrook area: s fraser way, clearbrook rd, and a few side streets like pineview ave. the newspapers last week also mentioned madiera pl and grant park, but i saw nothing there. i saw 2 definite hookers: one nice-looking blonde on clearbrook (maybe a 7.5 as sws go), and another that looked more ragged and drugged-out wandering the clearbrook-pineview area. the blonde really turned me on and she was covering too much ground to be a decoy, but i'm always paranoid of picking up in cities i never have before, and the le presence was rather heavy.

surrey (1:15 to 1:45 am). two hookers on 104 ave near guildford
(with le lurking nearby), and another one or two further west. two on king george hwy from about 96 to 91 ave, and a couple more on or around 135 st (city parkway) between 104 and 108. nothing spectacular in this city tonight.

new westminster (2 am) i saw two on the bottom of 12th st (from about queens to 3rd--an area where i haven't seen action in a long time--and one looked pretty good.

burnaby (2:05 am) i made one pass through kingsway and saw a few sws out from 10th to royal oak or nelson, but nothing memorable.

vancouver (2:15 to 5 am) lots of hookers (many of them high quality) on kingsway from about joyce to fraser. i also saw a fair amount of le activity, but didn't scrutinize it to see if it was prostitution-related. the numbers on the low-track were below normal, and the mid-track had a few on franklin and victoria--but nothing great in my opinion. i went to mcdonald's, watched some porno loops, and decided that i had to get laid before i left town. i went back to hastings st and picked up a younger female (maybe 20?) at jackson ave. she agreed to anal sex for $40, and i paid a $15 "guest fee" to use her room at a nearby hotel. normally i prefer to use the gastown hotel ($20) rather than go to the hooker's place, but she promised me there was no one there. well, she opens the door of the room and there's this double amputee guy in a wheelchair. she tells him to beat it, and he seemed cool, so after making sure there was no one else in the room, i deadbolted the door and got down to business. before sex (and after i paid her) she insisted on smoking some crack. i've seen this numerous times and usually it doesn't bother me, but sometimes it makes the girl agitated and more confrontational. this one seemed ok after the hits, and she laid down and revealed a moderately-stretched pussy and fairly tight anus. i put some lube on a finger and started working it into her asshole. the anal play made me hard, i put a condom on, lubed the head, then tried to insert it in her ass. it was a struggle and i was just about to give up, but finally it passed the point of no return, and penetrated her sphincter. she was crying out in pain and was obviously no anal pro, so i decided to cut the ass business short after a minute or so, then finished in her pussy. her pussy wasn't tight, but it wasn't unusually loose either, and it did the trick. the orgasm was insane (undoubtedly due to the
eaten marijuana i was still under the influence of), and i was nearly screaming and in tears during it. all i could think for the next half hour was "wow!" looks: 4. personality: 8. service: 8.

seattle-vancouver street guide: http://www.geocities.com/un_csd/streetguide.html

10-03-02, 13:28
not so great experience in downtown- went to vancouver couple weeks ago , cruisin between main and richards seen this cute sw
workin,asked how much she said 100.00 minimum,reluctently i agreed.took me to this dumpy hotel (that i had to pay for) her name is issabelle, says she's from france.after haggling about price i finally ended paying her 200.00 for very little action.stay away from this girl!total bullshit!won't do this again .i'll stick to ms,thank you.

10-04-02, 02:47
You just fell into the dreaded Tourist Trap track. Yes those hookers look clean and beautiful, but that's all there is about them. $100 is their absolute minimum.

10-05-02, 01:45
Hi all, I'm back! You guys in Vancouver don't know, but I used to post on the old WSG on the Seattle forum. Uncircumsized should remember me. Anyway, down to business...

I was thinking about heading up to Vancouver in a couple weeks (on a weekend) and just wanted some suggestions: I don't have a car, so I'll probably be taking a train. I'll probably have my bike with me, so I can cover a fair amount of ground. I was going to get a motel and go looking for SWs. Is it safe to cruise for SWs on a bike, or should I just forget the bike and walk. Secondly, since I won't be able to cover all that much area without a car, where do you think the best area is for me to stay? Lastly, it looks like you can get Vancouver SWs to do anal; what is the usual charge (approx) for this service? Thanks!

10-07-02, 03:39
Hi Horndog. I've walked around the Low and Mid-track strolls before (to stretch my legs) and it's rather creepy (especially at night), so I recommend that you cruise on your bike. It's also a fairly big area, and would probably take you 30 or 40 minutes just to walk from the west end around Gore Ave to the east end around Victoria Dr. If you're looking for bargains, these strolls are the best bet in the city. Kingsway tends to have higher quality girls, but you get what you pay for, and I've never picked up there because they look too expensive for my budget. Whatever you do, avoid the Seymour / Richards (Old High-track / Tourist Track) stroll: It's been getting bad reviews for years because of high prices and lousy service.

As for anal, like everywhere else not all SWs will do it, but I've never paid more than $60 (Canadian) for it on the Low-Track, and my last date was $40 for anal with a vaginal finish. In retrospect, I could tell she was no anal pro beforehand because her anus wasn't stretched enough--meaning it didn't have the stretch marks and enlarged radius of an anal pro. My policy from now on is not to even attempt it unless the SW's asshole is moderately stretched, because it's too hard to penetrate otherwise--and when you do, it's clearly extremely painful for the girl. I have an ass dildo called "The Anal Probe" that I've used on hookers before. It has a somewhat smaller diameter than my dick, so it kind of satisfies my desire for anal violation without the struggle and STD risk of trying to penetrate a tight sphincter. Another thing I've long suspected about anal sex is that some SWs who don't normally do it will tighten their sphincter while the john is trying to put his dick in--thereby making penetration difficult if not impossible. One more thing about this anal business: Don't forget the water-based lubricant, regardless of whether the condoms you're using are lubricated or not.

As for where to stay, I can't recommend a place, but the Downtown Eastside (where the Low & Mid-tracks are) is the poorest part of the city, so you should be able to find the cheapest rooms there.

As for LE, I haven't heard of any credible reports of decoy stings in the Low-Track in years, but the cops have done stings in the Mid-Track (Salsbury & Franklin seems to be the favored spot). LE might also stop and question you just for repeatedly circling the tracks, but there isn't much they can do except threaten you and tell you to leave. If that happens, my advice is to give the cruising a rest for several hours or move to another stroll. The Skytrain generally runs down the Kingsway / 12th St / King George Hwy corridor through Vancouver, Burnaby, New Westminster, and Surrey; so you might be able to easily move to distant strolls if the train allows bikes.

Good luck, and post a report on what you saw and did!

10-07-02, 06:36
I have a question about the hotels along E. Hastings. Sometimes while I am passing through the area to work, I notice some SW's going in and out of the pubs in the afternoons and evenings near the hotels, especially the Balmoral Hotel. Are they soliciting inside the pubs are bars?

One time during a Friday night as the bars closed around 2 AMish, I noticed a really hot SW come out of one of the buildings between Main and Pidgeon Park along Hastings, get into a taxi. She certainly turned heads as she walked by. Anyways, just wondering if it's worth it to enter those dangerous bars and hotel lounges just to get some dates or not.

10-07-02, 07:54

the police won't harrass you if you pick up the nice hookers that aren't addicted to crack and aren't 12 years old.

cops won't give a shit if you're paying top dollar for a respectable

they will however bust your ass if your trying to get your middle aged jollies from a ****d crack hooker street kid. almost every girl on hastings st is a drug addict. most of them are **** and even if they tell you they are 20 they are probably 16. almost all of them have aids. basically what you are doing is taking advantage of the horrible situation down there by giving the girl more crack and heroin through paying her for demeaning sexual services.

in the buy and sell/westender/georgia st there are alot of cheap hookers who aren't cracked out poor sw on hastings. i mean c'mon you cheap cunts, if your going to pay a girl for sex she isn't going to just give it away unless she's really screwed out of her mind on crack or is a slave to a chinese mafia
snakehead pimp.

and a warning about that area

when we were kids living on the streets and living out of those hotels we used to get the girlfriend's we knew (we were all 16-17 at the time) to go onto hastings and street walk and lure old perverts back to our room by telling them she was ****. when they got back there we would severely beat these guys with baseball bats and a big chain with a masterlock on the end of it then take their wallets.

you are much better off seeking the services of the more high end hookers.

10-08-02, 03:08
I wish I could pick up a better quality prostitute, but after paying for the essentials (food, shelter, gas, etc.) of living, I figure I have about $120 (US) left for this month. I'd be crazy to spend most of that on one session with one hooker--which is what you're suggesting. I think most of the johns picking up low-track or low-track quality hookers are in a similar financial situation as I--and some are clearly worse off because they're car-less and cruising strolls on bicycle or foot (which I seem to be hearing more of lately). You might argue that if we can't afford anyone better than drug addicts that we should do the noble thing and drop out of the hobby, but that means that many of us might not get laid for a long time--if ever again. Let's face it: There's usually some hustle involved in getting the penis into the vagina, and I strongly believe there is a direct correlation in the fatness of a man's wallet and his ability to score so-called "free" and legal pussy.

As for contributing to the Downtown Eastside mess, I think that the primary problem is the criminalization of drugs, not the influx of money from johns. If drugs were legal and a daily fix of cocaine or heroin cost the same as a day's supply of cigarettes, you'd see a lot fewer women selling their mouths, vaginas, and anus' for $20-$40. I'm doing my part to make that neighbourhood a better place by endorsing Marc Emery ( http://www.pot-tv.net/archive/shows/pottvshowse-1551.html )
for mayor.

Your warnings about the D.E. seem a bit exaggerated, based on my experience. An ambush situation is always possible when a john goes to the prostitute's place (no matter how high-quality she is), and in going to countless Hastings St fleabag hotel rooms of hookers for over a decade, I only came close to being ambushed once--and I could see it coming and escaped in time. Similarly, the HIV / STD risk isn't that great if you always practice safe sex. I've had intercourse (mostly vaginal, but also some anal) with over 100 low-trackers, tested HIV-negative again last month, and have never had any other STD to my knowledge.

I don't really agree with you about LE, either. I think the cops tend to ignore the sex trade in the low-track more because the residents of that area have less political clout, so they sting johns in the eastern mid-track (according to newspaper & eyewitness accounts) and the Fraser - Kingsway area (according to an eyewitness account).

Finally, I just want to say that I do have compassion and empathy for these poor women I pick up. In fact, I think I have more compassion for them than the cops, media, and others who claim to know what's best for them. I think we need to adopt a "harm reduction" approach toward street prostitution: Get rid of the "Bawdy House" law which prohibits the operation of safe, cheap, monitored trick pads. Stop arresting hookers (I know they don't seem to do this in certain Vancouver tracks already). And stop criminalizing street johns: When you declare a whole class of otherwise law-abiding men to be criminals, it should be no surprise that many will over time morph into real criminals--and start abusing, beating, or even killing hookers.

10-09-02, 03:34

Just want to say basically agree with everything you say. Some criticize and ridicule us for not being able to or choosing not to have sex in coventional relationship. It's absolutely true that a man's ability to attract women is strongly correlated with his socioeconomic status. I don't just know this from personal experience, I have a psychology BA and there is a huge body of research (done in many cultures) that supports this trend. I've been in "relationships" before and after all the time, expense, and other BS we males have to tolerate, it's really just easier to get a prostitute.

I also agree with decriminalization. When you make something that is in high demand illegal, you simply invite the criminal element to take over. Also, there's nothing inherently immoral about prostitution; in some ways I actually thinks it's' more moral because it's honest. I'm not saying being johns makes us noble, but turning us into pariahs the way they do in the U.S. is ridiculous and unjust. Thanks for this web site, you're providing a great service.

10-10-02, 04:20
thanks, horndog. i kind of see myself as an advocate for the working-class or even poor john, and think there is a fair amount of classism in how the street trade vs. the escort, massage parlour, and legal brothel (in nevada) scenes are tolerated by society. i have nothing against johns who can afford the higher class women, but i would like them to put themselves in our shoes before demanding that we upgrade from the druggies and other low-track types. i'm not complaining about my financial situation--and indeed i've willingly traded being better off for having more leisure time--but i'm cognizant of the fact that this makes me less desirable as a mate compared to men who have their own house, drive a better car, etc. in other words, the pool of non-pro women who might screw me for free is considerably smaller, and i basically have to find females who are financially worse off than i. the other thing in all this is that i've become addicted to the john lifestyle of getting sex without having to go through courting or dating--processes that i find incredibly distasteful and demeaning now. part of the motivation for creating my stroll guide was because i feared that eventually i would be busted, and i wanted to have a comprehensive list of area strolls so that i could easily move my hobbying to another city if i was banned from the strolls where i was caught.

in my previous post i forgot to address the [CodeWord901] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord901) issue that street punk raised. yes, it's true that there are occasionally some sws on the low and mid-tracks who are under 18, but this is a problem on all strolls, and indeed in the indoor sex trade as well. i think that any john who has been in this hobby for a long time will probably have encountered an under-18 hooker who he believed to be older. i try to point out as clearly as i can in my guide the legal dangers of picking up girls that age, but i've knowingly crossed the line before, and am not going to condemn johns who specialize in [CodeWord900] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord900)*. whether i ever will do it again, i can't say. i am more aware of the legal risks now than before i created my guide, and don't want to go to prison and / or be banned from canada. however, i am human and therefore fallible, and sometimes still do reckless things in the heat of passion.

*i want to make a distinction between what i term "[CodeWord900] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord900)" (females age 13 or 14 to 17) and true ****philia (sex with girls below puberty). i think canada's current age of consent (14) is fair, and consistent with nature. i hope canada doesn't follow the draconian u.s. model on this issue and start imprisoning adults who have nonpaid consensual sex with postpubescent females.

10-11-02, 02:38
i totally agree with you, especially about the distinction between those who have sex with minors and true ****s. [here's my psych background again]. a true **** is someone is attracted to prepubescents (pre-puberty children). most people in the u.s. consider any sex with a minor ****philia, which is totally incorrect: there isn't anything abnormal about being attracted to minors who are sexually mature. i won't argue it's necessarily alright to have sex with them, but it isn't the same kind of abnormal attraction to children that ****philia is. the u.s. populace in general is still very sexually ignorant. we've come a long way over the last couple decades, but we still have a ways to go.

10-13-02, 07:55
Well, I'm kinda in the middle of both you. My income is the shits (I'm a returning student) AND I do date on occasion. However, when I date, it is because I truly want to get to know that woman better. If she is willing to put out, great! If not, oh well, I don't ask and I don't push.
And yes, I do use SWs, and when I have some extra cash, massauge parlors. I have never 'dated' a minor, nor do I shop too much. I go out with X amount of money and knowing what I want. If I can't get the trick for that amount, from that girl, I thank her for her time, and turn her loose.
Personally, I find nothing wrong with prostitution, as it is honest (which has been stated) You want to fuck, she wants cash. In dating (if you're doing it for a fuck) there is deciet, fakery, and, in the end, contemnt (sp?). However, most laws are not made on logical or reasoned decisions/ideals. They are made on moral opinions/beliefs. As such, they are flawed, missplaced,illogical, and/or down right stupid!
Thankfully, morality changes as time goes on, and as clearer heads move into positions of power. Perhaps, in a few years (many decades) prostitution will be de-criminalized.

Side note for you. In Canada, Prostitutes are NOT viewed as fellons! They are viewed as troubled victims. As such, they are hardly ever charged with a crime! (good for the girls) All Canadian laws are in place to "protect" the poor, helpless victims(the prostitutes) from the evil scourge that is man (i.e: the john and the pimp).

Prostitution = legal (techically)

Engaging in a Conversation for the purpose of sexual contact in
public ( the conversation) = illegal

Living off the avails of prostitution = illegal (i.e: pimps)

running a brawdy house = illegal (i.e: madams/Mr.'s)

Exchange of monies for sexual contact = illegal

Your car, while on a public street is NOT considered a private place. A private place is a room/house/appartment that you owned/rent/use.

Some ways that I have heard of tripping up L.E. stings are (and work due to technicalities)
A: picking up a SW to give her a ride to your place. (no talk of sex, no crime!)

B: asking the girl (in a private place) to spend some "time" with you, for some cash (mentioning you'd like a BJ, or what ever. NOT saying that you'll pay her FOR the BJ)

C: having sex (with a SW/escort) and then giving her some cash to help her out with her rent/food/utlities

These work cause in A: you are just going to a place, she wasn't hitch-hicking, you stopped for her with out her attracting your attention. In B: cause you are paying for her time (think of it like paying for the plumber/lawyer/accountant) and not for the sex act. and in C: cause the cash was a gift, and wasn't used to purchase anything.
Yea, I know that thses are all paper thin to you, to the cop and the judge. But remember, the laws are only written on paper too!

Apac Boy
10-16-02, 02:50
ok, i'm looking thru this thread and all i c r posts about sw's...
i'm coming up for about 3 days and would appreciate if anybody can let me know of strip clubs or massage parlours that are worth visiting.

email me!

or just put it here!


10-16-02, 16:23
Hi. I've recently moved to Vancouver, so I don't quite know the ropes yet. I've usually used independent escorts, but as the current thread suggests, times are tight, I've been laid off and I've got a job that pays a pittance, so I'd like to start seeing SWs. I have several questions, and I was thinking that I'll probably break them off into a couple of separate posts, but this is easier.

1. I went for a "practice run" yesterday on E. Cordova street (thanks for the street guide!!) and SWs were all over the place, in plain daylight (this was at 6pm) soliciting. One was even "hitch-hiking". First, don't cops stop them? And if not, what's the safest way to pick up someone in plain daylight like this and in traffic? Should I wait for night?

2. what's the "lingo"? what do you ask for and how do you make sure it's not a sting. From readint the archives of this list, it seems that i should just stop and let her open the door and get in. No mention of sex at first. That's all and well, but how DO you get around to it without mentioning it ?? :-)

3. un_circumcised, you mentioned you have some favourite hotel in gastown. Mind sharing? Also, where can you get anonymous HIV testing done?

Thanks all for your patience and for this great forum!!

10-16-02, 21:30
Came to Vancouver yesterday for some"sight seeing", and was not disapponted.i rented a room because I didn't want to drivee back and deal with alll the border crossing BS.Went to a strip club to get my head straight and have a few.

Later on I went down Kingsway to look for some action.Picked up a great looking blonde named Becca.5'6" nice legs and ass.Wasnated 200Canadian for FS.Got her down to 140(don't know if that was good because my conversions may hay been off.She came back to my room with a little has.(she was nervous I guess)The service was great and I would do it again in a heartbeat.!!She wasreallly sweet,didn't make a lot of stupid small talk.When I dropped her off I saw acouple more full blow hotties!

Next time I'll play it more cool,it was my first time picking up a SW in Vancouver and I was really nervous.But I guess the same rules apply.I've read about a bad experience by some of the high track girls but I guess I just got lucky.I'll try a mid or low track like my homie UNcirc.

you Canadians got it good!!


10-17-02, 01:47
I'm glad to see you made it up and had fun, Pariah. Wow, those Kingsway prices are steeper than I thought, and are definitely beyond my budget. I've never rented a room up there to sleep in, either. My usual pattern now is to go up in the evening, cruise around that night (unless I'm too stoned--in which case I hang out at clubs and porno arcades), then catch some sleep at a park the next day. Then I go into shopping mode at night, pick someone up, and head back across the border before it gets clogged up with daytime motorists.

I used to cruise the low and mid-tracks during the day for many years--and sometimes found some great dates--but the heavy traffic seems to get on my nerves more now. If you're going to cruise Cordova during the day, my suggestion is to do it after 3 PM--when the curb lane opens to traffic. If you see someone you want, try to pick them up off a nearby side street rather than stopping on Cordova and angering the rush hour motorists. If you have to pick them up off Cordova, turn on your 4-way flashers when you stop. Same advice applies to Hastings during the day. As for LE, my perception is that they give the low-track the lowest priority when it comes to policing prostitution, but they might hassle you if they have nothing better to do, so common sense dictates that you don't pick someone up if the cops are in view. I haven't heard of any decoy stings in low-track in many years. Here's another tip: If you're picking someone up at night, pull over to the curb and turn your headlights off while you're soliciting the hooker. Put your emergency brake on insteading of holding the brake pedal--which illuminates the brake lights. That way you appear to be a parked car at first glance, and less likely to draw LE's attention. Once the hooker gets in your car (and especially after she closes the door and you begin to drive away), there is virtually no chance of her being a cop. Just to be safe, though (and especially if she might be under 18), you might want to drive a few blocks to make sure no one is tailing you before you negotiate. Like RX said, the best way to avoid decoys is to just offer a ride and never mention sex or money until the SW gets in the car--but that precaution might not be necessary on the low-track.

The hotels I've used the most are the Gastown (110 Water St) and the unnamed one on the corner of Franklin & Woodland. Both charge about $20 for a half hour or hour, but if you're buying more than a blowjob I recommend using a hotel rather than doing a car date. You can usually save money by going to the hooker's place, but of course there is always the risk of being robbed and beat up. I think veteran johns develop a sense of when a situation isn't right, and it's hard to easily convey this to newbies, so my recommendation is not to use the hooker's place for awhile if you're new to this hobby--until you gain some experience with these type of women.

Well, I could ramble on longer, but hopefully I've answered most of Pilot's questions. There's a lot more about legalities, pickup strategies, and strolls in my guide:


10-18-02, 07:27
un_circumsised, thanks very much for the tips. I went for another "practice run" today and actually made eye contact with a few :-). The thing that tripped me up was the follow-up. Once in the car, what do you say?? let's drive? :-) How do you get to the actual nitty gritty without discussing sex? Sorry if I seem naive about this, but this is very different from calling an escort where it's a lot more comfortable. Thanks!

Your street guide RULES!

10-18-02, 08:31
Well, generally, I start off with "Hi!" :)
then usually fallow up with a "how are you tonight?"

In all seriousness, I do use those lines, the girl usually comes back with a "blah, blah, blah, So, what are you looking for tonight?" and I ask what she does and for how much. (If she humms and haws, be careful! it could be LE!!!) and she will then tell you the favors and the price. If she doesn't list something you want, ask her and she'll either tell you a price or say "NO WAY!"

remember, if she starts off the conversation for sex, you're basically safe cause if she LE and gets in her car, then she is wired and YOU can demand a copy of the tape for evidence. And on that tape, SHE is asking YOU to pay her, not the other way around, and it might be enough to get you off.

10-18-02, 08:37
remember, to be safe, DON'T say "I want a blowjob/sex/anal sex/bridge sex."
Say "I'm not sure." (if she a pro, she'll tell what she does and for how much. If not, she'll respond another way.)
Remember, in Canada, LE can lie to you if you ask if they are cops! so try to work you way around to the details in a way that has HER list what she offers and for how much. Why? cause sollicitation for the purposes of sex is illegal and that is what SHE has done if she lists the activities and the costs, not you.

10-19-02, 07:28
Great, thanks! You guys are great. Ok, so this week-end I take my first "real" run (enough practice! :-)) I'll report back here. Thanks again.

Apac Boy
10-22-02, 07:47
can anybody recommend a strip club there that has good looking girls?


10-23-02, 00:53
well, in Canada, most places rotate the strippers they get so the line up changes every week or so. but in the Vancouver area I recommend Ceceils! nice bar, deceit prices, no cover charge (when I was there) and great girls!

11-09-02, 11:44
Hello Guys

I am planning a trip to Vancouver in early December and would like to visit a massage palor/relaxation center. I'm interested in the Swedish Touch, Club Platinum, Madame Cleo's or any other establishment. Info on prices would be greatly appreciated. Thank you in advance. I'll be glad to return favor in the Bay area. Any info on strip clubs would be great as well.

11-16-02, 17:29

I was on the low and mid-tracks Thursday before dawn,
and the low & mid + most of the other Lower Mainland strolls late Thursday night / early Friday morning--which was a dry weather night. I saw more activity in Vancouver this week than on my last visit in September--particularly on the low and mid-tracks, but Kingsway was also very active. I saw a couple of girls on the low-track that I even rated "good" -- reminiscent of the early and mid- '90s when the overall quality there seemed to be better. I saw no LE prostitution-related stops in Surrey, New Westminster, Burnaby, or Kingsway and the mid-track in Vancouver. There were two probable stops on the low-track: One on Hastings around Hawks where the cops were questioning a motorist who was apparently trying to pick up a SW (who was apparently detained on the sidewalk), and another on Heatley between Cordova and Powell--where they had a car stopped. Since that isn't a normal pick-up spot, I'm guessing the car might have been parked there when the cops rolled up on it--possibly a car date in progress. Both of these stops were by marked units, if I remember correctly. I picked up a SW on Cordova between Campbell and Raymur that I've reportedly had before: She remembered me, but I didn't recall her at first. Caucasian, mid to late 20s, about a "5" on the 1-10 scale. She agreed to $30 for intercourse, and we went to that shitty no-name hotel at 1610 Franklin St (Franklin & Woodland). The clerk was adamant at wanting $25 minimum, so I'm recommending the Gastown Hotel now--which charges $20. These are the only two trick hotels I'm aware of in Vancouver, so if you guys know anymore, let me know because I'm now compiling a "Sleazy Motels" list on my site. Also check out the review of "The Urban Shaman" psychedelic plant shop on Commercial Dr I'm writing for the "Subversion" page. Finally, will one of you johns who lives in Vancouver do me a favor today (November 16), and cast a vote for Marc Emery since I'm not allowed to?

11-18-02, 20:08
hey un-Circ You seem to have a nose for cheap action :-)

I am a Vanc resident and spend a bit of time on the low and mid tracks. I don't think 25 for the un-named hotel is too bad, it is more convenient than the Gastown Hotel, hell you can often pick up within ten feet of the door... :-)

I have seen very little LE activity over the last year, HOWEVER I am out earlier than you after dark but usually before midnight. Also i occasioinally go out for a nooner, less girls but basically zero LE. Seems to me if you are out earlier and exercise some common sense LE in Vancouver is no problem, the new city governement should help, it is more concerned with harm reduction that criminal prosecution (at least that is what they say).. have to see how it plays out over the next few months.

got about 3 regulars from the mid track and I can usually find one any given afternoon. All are more like 80-100 for FS but that is at their place so more layed back that hotels all are arount 6-7s but they all are easy going and not druggies (at least not real bad).

thansk for all the effort, interesting to get so much info form a different country :-), wish i was paying in US $$.

11-20-02, 09:02
Good to hear from you, Oberon. I've kind of been wondering if there is some board or forum where Vancouver-area street johns hang out that I'm not aware of, because there hasn't been much activity on this board relative to the amount of SWs in the Lower Mainland. I know most of them were at alt.sex.prostitution (ASP), then moved to ***-Vancouver (at the beginning of last year, if I remember right). *** was always dominated by escorts and their clients, and the posts from street johns there have become so infrequent in recent months that I dropped the link from my guide. Q-Tip (one of the longtime cruisers still at ***) went out as far as New Westminster recently ( http://www.*********.net/messageboards/vancouver/msgs/posts/39012.html ), but I seem to be the only one checking Surrey these days, and I'm pretty sure I'm the only john who has ever filed reports from Abbotsford and Mission.

I'm also hopeful that the new mayor and city council will make positive changes to drug and prostitution policy. I was excited that Marc Emery made a statement in favor of johns' rights before the election (see my "News" page). I don't recall any candidate (U.S. or Canadian) speaking up for johns like that before. I wrote to Emery a few months ago but received no response. Who knows--maybe he did look at my site, and it had an effect on his thinking.

I check several Lower Mainland newspapers every week for street prostitution news, but if you see anything I've missed, let me know. The Sun and Province only put a small percentage of their content on their websites, so I suspect I've missed a fair number of items in those papers. Also, let me know if you see or hear anything on TV or radio.

As for LE harassment on the low-track (which I'm most familiar with), my perception is that the marked units only do it if they have nothing better to do. Most of the stops I've seen lately seem to be from 2 AM to the beginning of morning rush hour. I didn't see any unmarked units on my last visit.

11-20-02, 21:29
un-circ, yeah Mission and Abbotsford are not talked about much, there was some new a few months ago about a park in Abbotsford that was a "haven" for the trade but that was all, Surrey definately has some action but the mid/low track is on my regular commuter route ;-)

FYI unmarked LE is still Corwn Victoria but the antennas are gone (replaced by small bumps). See it around now and then. never seen a verified sting but a few situations that looked odd so i just avoided them..


11-21-02, 21:39
Regarding the unmarkeds, that's what I thought too. I saw one within recent months, and it looked exactly like the cars the vice squad previously used: Maroon Ford Crown Victoria, two male occupants, but without the telltale antennas on the back. I figured it was them, but with a slyer look. I also saw the cops using a full-size SUV with the flashing lights stealthily embedded in it to pull someone over at Hastings & Glen, and a plain white van or delivery truck -like vehicle (again, with cop-type flashers) stopped someone on Commercial just north of Hastings. Both of those vehicles were seen last year or in 2000, and I haven't seen them since. I have seen one decoy sting I was convinced of: At Franklin & Salsbury. I think this was in 2000, and it occurred around 8 PM. I saw them handcuff one male motorist who apparently stopped to talk with a lone female standing on that corner, then another about 10-15 minutes later.

11-21-02, 23:06
i often see le stopped talking to girls, probably looking for **** ones but other than that not much. just had a usa guy tell me he thought working streets must have been legal in canada as a result of his last visit to vancouver.

fyi i am in a reverse situation down in ca now for a few days, sticker shock when you convert $ from us to cdn..


11-23-02, 09:57
Call me dumb but what on earth does LE stand for? Sorry for the silly question but it was killing me..

11-23-02, 12:43
it's not a dumb question so don't worry.

LE = Law Enforcement.

11-25-02, 06:47
Hello Guys

Will some of you please answer my question below about the massage places? I am going soon and would like to know.

Thank you.

I am planning a trip to Vancouver in early December and would like to visit a massage palor/relaxation center. I'm interested in the Swedish Touch, Club Platinum, Madame Cleo's or any other establishment. Info on prices would be greatly appreciated. Thank you in advance. I'll be glad to return favor in the Bay area. Any info on strip clubs would be great as well.

11-27-02, 23:03
Not my area of expertise but try here http://www.sexwork.com/vancouver/july02report.html


12-01-02, 03:02
hey Brandon Lee
There is a place in Burnaby near Lougheed Mall called Lotus Relaxation. The general rule is the farther away you get from downtown Vancouver the cheaper it is. Lotus is easy to get to from anywhere because you can take the skytrain there. Was there one early evening and there were only 3 girls there. Chose a blonde named Kelly who was cute, curvy, and easy going. It was $150 for half an hour, but had a $15 coupon from the Province newspaper. There was no need to pay anything on top of that. It was a fun time.
I was at Swedish Touch quite a while ago, it seemed to be a rip-off, but they probably have better looking girls. Don't think it is worth it.
While you are in Burnaby it is quite easy to get to New Westminster's Paramount Club. Only 10 min by train from Lougheed Mall. It is a non-alcoholic strip club with couch dances. They are normally $25 upstairs in the VIP area. YMMV
Have fun

12-02-02, 18:03
Just a quick note on LE on the Midtrack this weekend. I did a lot of crusin Satuday night between 10:30pm and 12:00am on the low and mid track. Every cruise I made through the Mid track one of the unmarked Crown Victorias had someone pulled over. Looks like they were just hasseling people, since I made some fast loops and they had a different car everytime, no paddy wagon etc. Found some cheap fun on the Low track no problem.

One stop had a man and woman in car but again they were gone and had a different car stopped next time. So obviously no arrests, not illegal to have a woman in your car (unless she is an undercover cop).

There have been a few teenage runnaways on the news in the last week so LE may have been looking for them??? Who knows probably DISKing a few drivers too???


12-14-02, 04:08
I've been reading the comments from the last few weeks and, as a local, have a few comments:
1. Best strip joints in Vancouver: Cecil, Drake, No. 5 Orange. Brandi's is also good but pricey - lot's of celebs, sports stars, etc. frequent the place and it's a little too "yuppie" for my taste. Also the VIP seats are a waste of money since people can stand in front of the seats and eliminate the view. In Burnaby, the NBI is the best place.
2. I don't know why anyone would pick up a SW in Vancouver when:
a. You CAN get busted. If there aren't a lot of SW around, then there's probably been a LE sweep. They alternate between SW and johns. There's also tricky street signs and rules in the popular areas so it's easy for someone unfamiliar with the locale to make a minor traffic error. The cops are ready to pounce if you do.
b. There's a good chance of accidentally picking up a TV
c. Quite a few are whacked out on drugs and carry weapons (the two don't mix very well)
d. Vancouver has one of the highest populations of heroin addicts in North America due to the relatively free market for the drug in Vancouver's east end. This also means your Pro may have HIV and not care if you want to ride bareback.
e. It's mostly the ugly or juvenile ones that are on the street. The ugly ones may look okay in the dark but watch out when the clothes come off. As they say about juveniles "15 will get you 20" so if they look young, they probably are and you should look elsewhere.
3. Why look on the street when there is such a great choice of brothels and independants. If you're reading this, you have access to the Internet so check out the websites - you can get a photo and a phone number and have a reasonable idea of what you're going to get ahead of time.
To find your girl, check out:
website: Hollywood North http://www.hollywoodnorthescorts.com/
The Buy and Sell (no, I'm not kidding) Personals

AND if you want to read about other John's experiences with the girls that are advertising on these sites, check out The Erotic Review:

Do your work/research ahead of time and you will find Vancouver to be the next Vankok. Good luck and happy hunting.

12-15-02, 03:35

I hope everyone will like this change as much as I do. I've also reinstated unique stroll sightings from the Vancouver board for the April to October period, and will be holding them for 11 months.

12-25-02, 09:35
I agree with Whistle830. I just got back from Vancouver. There are so many quality independent, massage parlors, etc. Why would any of you use SW?? By the way, what happened to the strip club scene in Vancouver? I was there a few years ago and there was a lot of contact in the clubs. Now, most have a "no touching" rule.

12-25-02, 12:13
Cold winter temperatures = less skin on the SW's! Which highly frequented Hastings Street bar/hotel lobby can I check out some SW's?

Also I haven't taken the plunge for a lay yet, just all blowjobs. Could anyone give me some first time advice on what to watch out for? I've heard people mention the no-name hotel on Franklin St. Best to approach the SW walking? etc etc.

01-04-03, 00:56
I don't know what happened to the girls in the strip clubs. Many of the clubs have the same owners or the dancers work for them (let's just say they like to ride motorcycles...). Things were getting pretty hot - like in Toronto and Montreal but more expensive - and then suddenly, nada. I suspect the cops put the word out that too much contact will mean the end to table dancing.
Whatever happened, it was pretty quiet because it would otherwise have attracted media attention. Best bet is to ask one of the dancers. If you DO find out - please post it.

If you INSIST on SW's despite my advice to the contrary and all of the much better alternatives...there are several skidrow hotels on both sides of Hastings near Main St and then all the way east to the Astoria Hotel. The problem is, you may not be able to tell the SW's from the drug-addicts and alcoholics. On a positive note, you may get laid for the price of a few beers in the hotel by a non-SW. The quality of what you'd pick up there is the same as what you'd pay for outside.
If you want to approach them on the streets, you should walk (as the LE may decide to ticket you) slowly by one. The SW's are aggressive enough to approach you.
There are much more attractive, high class, cleaner SW's along Seymour St. and Richards near Helmchen but the prices may be too high for your budget ($150+ as opposed to a $40 bj on the East End)


01-09-03, 08:33
I went to the NBI Last Saturday Night, and I saw the best dancers, I've seen in a long time. One girl(I forget her name) danced to music from the Phantom of the Opera. I also got a really good chair massage there too.

01-11-03, 21:40
I just returned from Seattle and my visit to Rick's. Seattle sucks, man! What a waste of money.
I got some good action from some of the lap dancers but it was over-all overpriced and disappointing. Thank God I live here.

01-13-03, 04:42
I was in Seattle last October. I went to Deja Vu. I paid $20 cover charge and recieved 2 tickets for soft drinks. The lap dnces were topless only and no contact and I had to buy a drink($10) for the girl each time. I wasn't in their an hour and I spent $80.

I got out of there pretty fast and found next door a sex boutique and a girl got behind a glass booth and put on a show for me for $60.

That was different. I wish they would have that here.

01-13-03, 07:17
Seattle has nothing on Vancouver when it coms to sex for sale..Way to many hassels down there to make it worth while.

just got back from California, what a pain trying to get off.

Sorry Un-circ don't know how you stand it..


01-14-03, 18:34
Have you tried the Paramount in New Westminster?
They have a lap dance happy hour - I think it starts around 4:00 pm. The Happy Hour prices are $10.00 ($6.50US).
Couch dances are $20.00 (about $13.00US) and VIP's are $25.00. The VIP's are upstairs, and from what I hear, are the same as the couch dances. The girls make quite a bit of $$ there as opposed to regular strippers so there's usually a good assortment of attractive women. The club is pretty quiet in the late afternoon but really gets going on Friday and Saturday nights.
One thing I enjoy is the continuous shows - one after another - complete 3-act shows so you can get a look at the goods first.
I've found the waitresses a little too aggressive. If you don't want to get bugged, let them know it right away.


01-15-03, 19:21
oberon, i "stand it" by doing most of my hobbying in vancouver. fortunately i live significantly closer to the border than most seattle-area johns, so it's no big deal for me to take off about 8 in the evening and be in downtown van around 10. i do on rare occasion pick up in wa, but i'm more of a chronicler of the scene here than a participant. i regularly encourage johns on the seattle board to check out vancouver, and believe most would be astonished if they did. there really is that much difference with the number of sws, the overall quality, and le's concern with the scene on a typical night. as for california, i haven't been to los angeles since the mid-'80s, but from what i understand, le down there has tightened the screws on street prostitution over the years--with the latest news being that the city is now confirep001ing johns' cars. i still expect that draconian tactic will arrive in our region eventually, and the latest calls for it to my knowledge have come from mayoral candidates and youth counselors in abbotsford.

01-15-03, 21:31
Hey UC I thnks I sounded a bit pissed in my last post, obviously my lack of "fun" in California (San Jose area) put me in a bad mood, sorry.

I don't understand how LE can get away with this car theft thing since you have not been convicted of anything when they do it... but so far just talk up here the biggest threat is DISK and unless your married it is not much of one.

Abbotsford (and Mission) are definately the bible belt up here so their view do not always reflect the rest of the lower mainland.

IN San Jose i stuck out on the street and in Massage parlors (desparate) any hint i found of a good place had been raided and put out of business earlier, guess i hit some kind of crackdown.

Now that I am back in Vancouver I am going to partake in a good local tradition, the nooner, that should put me in a better mood.. ;-))



01-16-03, 00:46
Well went out to look for a "nooner" between 12:30 and 1:30pm. Cruised the low and Mid tracks about 7 girls working the low and maybe 5 on the mid, seemed pretty busy a few 6-7s on the mid and missed a good 6 on the low. (my big problem is always actually picking someone, I always want to look around the next corner).

Anyway ended up picking up Tina cute face but not exactly a light weight... 60 for 1/2 & 1/2 back at her place which was spartan but clean.

bumped into her boyfriend in the lobby on the way out, seemed unconcerned with everything...

Neither looked like a druggie (she said she was not)

all in all not a bad lunch hour.


I feel much better now..............

01-19-03, 08:15
Anybody ever take a SW to one of the local XXX theaters for some fun? Risky I know, I've never even been in one and don't know if I would even want to try.

I have been to the sauna on Hastings $25 for the two of you in a private sauna, not too bad and I feel better than going to a scummy hotel in the same area. Just give a fake name on the register (didn't ask for ID)

Picked up a redhead name Krista just before Xmas and took her there, got a great BBBJ for 2 greens. She looked like a recent addition since she didn't have that druggie skinniness or vacant look.

01-20-03, 18:45

I have often wondered about the Sauna on Hastings, sounds like it might be a good alternative, can you tell me a bit more about what it is like??


01-21-03, 00:55

I hope by "two greens" you mean $40.00 because that's all it should cost for a Hastings SW. If she didn't have that vacant look or the druggie look, try her again in 6 months.
Note to Americans: Use CANADIAN dollars. These girls aren't going to give you a proper exchange rate, if any.

I've never heard of anyone using the XXX theatres. They usually have a deal for couples admission so maybe it's just something I'm not aware of. Be interesting to find out - I've never been in one because I'm not a fan of sticky seats...


01-22-03, 22:07
Hey Oberon,

I think I saw the Tina you were talking about.......did she have a pretty big birthmark? Asian boyfriend? I had pretty much the same experience.

01-23-03, 04:44

it wasn't too bad, there's public and private rooms, I was suprised at how big the rooms were, there's a changing room , not so private as there's a large gap at the top of the door (like a shower stall), there's a large shower room and then the sauna itself (typical small sauna). Towels are supplied (clean too), it wasn't bad and I'll use it again.

Whistle, yeah it was 40.00 I use debit everywhere and can't remember out damn money colour ;)

I really don't expect her to last, but she could become that diamond in the rough. I wouldn't bet on it though. The couples admission is what got me thinking about the theaters.

01-23-03, 23:14
Namaimo1 --

Does not sound like her, i did not notice a birth mark and I had a good look all over ;-) and the boyfriend was white (maybe she has two)... usually has a yellow jacket on, I've seen her a couple of other time since then and her place is on Great Northern Way. She was not bad but I might not bother again (lots of fish in the sea)

Hojo --

Thanks is there any place to do "it" other than the sauna or am I missing something (perhaps you used the change room??)..

oh and where exactly did you find Krista, sounds like I should try and find her soon :-))...


01-24-03, 04:57
The Fox cinema is the only 35mm in North America, but where you want to go is the Venus on Main and East Georgia. They have a balcony, that's where the action is, although most of it is gay, so don't be surprised to find someone giving you a free hand job lol. Occasionaly you'll find a stoned scuzzy sw but the gay guys are a better deal lol.

As for the Hastings Sauna, that too is a gay pick up place so avoid the public sauna if you don't feel like an anal surprise in the dark.

I once took a visiting sw from West Virginia there. She was a hoot with her accent. She had never been in a sauna befofre and she siad that this is what Africa must feel like!

Make sure that the lady gets undressed before you give her the money, it's not uncommon for the lady to take a hike while you have your pant around your ankles, but have fun!

01-26-03, 09:03
questions for the vancover forum
i am from seattle and havent been upto vancover for about a year. whats the going rate on the low/ mid and high tracks? last time i was at high track it cost me 200 can for half and half albeit it was with a very nice looking lady.also i am thinking about staying for a couple days. are their any decent ie holiday inn express or motel 6 style hotels that do not have a problem with you bringing girls to your hotel room. thanks in advance

01-27-03, 18:30

I can't help you with the rates for the high track but on the low 40.00 cdn should get you a BJ , and maybe FS, depending on the girl I would say add 20.00 Cdn for the Midtrack, i personnally pay a bit higher but have a few regulars that have their own clean place so that is worth something.

Of course if you are a good negotiator you can always get a BJ of some sort for 20.00 Cdn in the low track especially later in the evening.

I personnally perfer going out at lunch time as I think the quality is better, but then the price is also a bit higher.


01-27-03, 19:14
We started in the sauna room then moved to the change room when she started to get hot. I don't think the sudden change in temperature was good for her (really cold that day). Once we moved to the change room I just had to quiet down a bit.

Can't remember exactly where she was, IIRC it was near the funeral parlor alleyway.

Don't know about prices on 1/2 & 1/2 but for a BJ on the low track will be 20-40 mid 40-100 and I stay away from the high. Go with an incall instead of the hightrack. Make sure you convert to cdn $, don't give em us$

01-28-03, 01:37
Sweet, I've only had experience picking up low-trackers in the past year, and haven't paid more than $40 Canadian for vaginal or anal intercourse, or a double penetration (start in the anus, finish in the vagina). Mid-track is generally better quality and higher-priced (got to have at least $60, according to "Two Fives" on the *** board). I haven't messed with the old high-track downtown in over a decade, and have dubbed it the "tourist track" because of the bad reviews it has received in recent years. I've never picked up on Kingsway, but from what I've heard it seems to be the better deal if you're looking for pricey, high-quality SWs.

Seattle-Vancouver street guide:

01-28-03, 18:00
Hoju... I just put 2 and 2 together and figured out who Krista is, I've seen her a few times and just missed picking her up once. You are right she looks good...

Un-Circ, man you always are 20.00 better than the prices I get??I bow to your negotiating skills....actually I think it has more to do with the day and night rate thing ;-)


01-29-03, 10:14
hey un circ thanks i am probly gonna go up wed. night and stay the weekend any advice on hotels? thanks in advance

01-29-03, 17:55

I have never stayed there but you might try some of the motels on kingsway, there are a number of independent motels that looks inexpensive and also look like they might be discreet.

I'd be curious if anyone has used them for a short or long stay.

Look forward to hearing what you think of our fair city.


01-29-03, 21:40
Just an note on second hand report of LE activity...

I have been told by 2 girls now that LE has run a few traps on Kingsway in the last while.

This is second hand so who knows.

Also for those of you who look for the unmarked red Crown Victoria with antennas that Vice uses, you might look out for a new black CV with no antennas, now most of VPD's unmarked cars seem to be removing the whip type antennas and going to a low profile pod style, usually 2 mounted on the roof, a bit harder to spot.

enjoy yourself


01-30-03, 00:02
Sweet, being the cheapskate that I am, I just take naps in my car up there rather than get a motel room. That's why you'll never see me in town during frigid weather spells. The two Vancouver hotels I list on my "Sleazy Motels" page are more trick pads than places you'd want to spend the night--unless you don't mind shacking up in a building full of addicts, drunkards, hookers, johns, and assorted cads. They also lack toilets in the rooms (though some have a sink that can double as a urinal), or TV (though some have radios).

Oberon, I should emphasize that I never want blow jobs, so the $40 figure I quote is usually only for one form of intercourse, not "full service". Sometimes I can get a double penetration for that, sometimes I have to kick in up to $20 extra. Usually if I buy anal, they let me finish in the vagina for no extra charge. However, it usually costs to upgrade from vaginal to anal during the date. Another reason why my prices may seem on the low side is that I typically pick up in the dead of night: 3 AM to dawn. As you point out, the overall quality then is generally lower.

01-30-03, 01:27
Originally posted by un_circumcised
Usually if I buy anal, they let me finish in the vagina for no extra charge.

hehe yeah I guess that would be the case ....

I should say that I often say FS when I mean intercourse, but most will usually start you off with a BJ which I don't mind..

i just did my normal nooner drive around the low and mid and even today in the pissing rain there were about 4 per track. Also i saw the John Watch car around the middle of the Low track I am trying to figure out just what the hell this is. I have seen various cars with the magnetic door sticker saying JOHN WATCH on the side there ares are a few signs around occasionally saying "AREA PATROLED BY JOHN WATCH". this time the john watch vehicle was a private security company vehicle with the john watch deal added (temporary i am sure). i did a bit of looking on the web and found the following:


Basically looks like some sort of neighbourhood watch /vigilante group. web site does not appear to be too active but sounds like the folks behind the john watch cars and posters....

Looks like local businesses are paying the bill.

I have only ever seen this vehile and signs in the west and central area of the low track. never the east end of the low and never the mid (my fav area)..

looks like a pain in the ass at worst...


01-30-03, 20:16
I'm at an Internet cafe in Vancouver, so this is a quick round-up of what I saw in just two hours of cruising last night (weather was dry) from 12 AM to 2 AM:

SURREY: I can see why Mayor McCallum is so upset: The Whalley blocks were crawling with SWs! I saw at least 9, and some of them looked pretty young (as in under 18). The city has put up a concrete barrier on 135-A St in a lame attempt to thwart drug and prostitution activity (there's a story on it in today's Sun). I saw at least 6 on the lower King George stroll (104 Ave down to possibly 68 Ave), but the overall quality there isn't as good. There was also 1 (fair quality) on 104 Ave near 149-A St.

BURNABY: Saw 5 total on Kingsway from 10th Ave to McMurray Ave, but aside from one, they were poor or near-poor quality.

VANCOUVER: Kingsway had at least 13, with the best being (as usual) good quality. I counted 7 in mid-track (the best being "good"), and at least 10 in low-track (the best being "fair").
There were at least 2 on Clark Dr a few blocks south of Hastings, and the usual 3 or 4 trannies in their regular low-track locales.

I got hassled at the border because I didn't have a birth certificate or passport (the first time the Canadians have demanded that from me since 9-11), but they waved me through after a brief stop in Immigration.

01-30-03, 21:13
Originally posted by un_circumcised

SURREY: I can see why Mayor McCallum is so upset: The Whalley blocks were crawling with SWs! I saw at least 9, and some of them looked pretty young (as in under 18). The city has put up a concrete barrier on 135-A St in a lame attempt to thwart drug and prostitution activity (there's a story on it in today's Sun). I saw at least 6 on the lower King George stroll (104 Ave down to possibly 68 Ave), but the overall quality there isn't as good. There was also 1 (fair quality) on 104 Ave near 149-A St.

VANCOUVER: Kingsway had at least 13, with the best being (as usual) good quality. I counted 7 in mid-track (the best being "good"), and at least 10 in low-track (the best being "fair").
There were at least 2 on Clark Dr a few blocks south of Hastings, and the usual 3 or 4 trannies in their regular low-track locales.

Interesting, I have not seen much action on Clark South of Hasting, i'll keep any eye out in that area.

I guess at some point I should at least go and LOOK on Kingsway, sounds quite active.

As for Surrey/Walley since they are in the middle of a much publicized crackdown on drug and prostitution in the area, it would be an area I would avoid until the current media frenzy blows over, I would be LE would be running stings since the Mayor has been very vocal about "cleaning up" the area, he has actually backed himself into a bit of a corner IMHO even the police are saying don't expect aqny quick changes, we all know LE does not fix social problems (I think they know it too). i case you did not know the area has had several vilolent crimes recently and that is what started this...

I'd be interested to know who you found for anal as I occasional would like that and none of the regulars I see are into it..

Hope you enjoy your visit :-)


01-31-03, 19:25
i did another reconnaissance cruise last night from about 11:30 pm to 2 am. the weather was dry, but it had been raining most of the evening.

vancouver: the quantity and quality on the low and mid-tracks weren't much different than wednesday night, so i didn't take any notes on them. i saw one (fair quality) on broadway near guelph st, but nothing else on broadway between about clark and cambie. i saw nothing on fraser st from broadway to 41st ave. on my first pass down kingsway to boundary rd, i only saw a few sws, but on my return (about a half hour later), i counted 12--with most being better than average quality--so the scene there was also similar to the previous night. finally, i logged 6 on the "old high track" on the seymour-nelson-richards-helmcken block, with all or most of them in the "good" category.

burnaby: there were only two on the burnaby kingsway stroll thursday night--one "poor" and one "fair".

new westminster: unlike wednesday, last night there were two on 12th st in new westminster near 6th ave: both poor quality. i didn't make it out to surrey this night.

low-track score! i picked up a sw on hastings near gore around 5 am. she was about a "6" on the 1-10 scale (maybe even a 7 as far as sws go), and looked early 20s and part first nations, part caucasian (like a large percentage of the sws on this stroll). she agreed to straight sex for $35, and we went to the gastown hotel--which charges $20. she immediately won my favor by getting completely naked without me even asking, and revealed excellent skin--not the track-mark, sore, and bruise-riddled skin many sws on this stroll have. the sex was good (it was almost gfe-quality), and i didn't try to upgrade to buggery because her anus wasn't stretched and i'd given her my last bill, so there was no incentive for her to submit to it. her personality was nice, but she wasn't much of a conversationalist. overall, i give her an "8", and would definitely try for a longer, more gfe-type session if i see her again. i might even try working on enlarging her sphincter with an "anal probe" i always carry on dates. once she's comfortable with the probe, then it's time for my dick (which has a larger radius).

oberon, i really can't give you any leads regarding anal-friendly sws. i've always been terrible at remembering sw names, and since i only get to town once a month on average, there is always a substantial turnover in talent every time i visit. i do think that it's probably easier to find anal on the low-track than any other lower mainland stroll. i don't ask for it every time, but i'd estimate that 25 or 30% of the low-trackers will do it if the price is right--and i've never paid more than $60 for it there.

as for surrey, yeah, it seems like mccallum has a lot in common with the "zero tolerance", "law-and-order" mentality that is more prevalent in the us. america probably locks up a greater percentage of drug and prostitution offenders than any other advanced democracy, yet this hasn't eliminated the drug or prostitution "problem" here. i saw a cartoon of what appeared to be mccallum in thursday's province that i didn't quite understand: he was holding a fish with a clothespin on its "nose", and the fish was saying "peeyew" while stench fumes rose from "mccallum's" head. was this a slap at mccallum's sledgehammer approach to social problems?

01-31-03, 20:37
originally posted by un_circumcised
oberon, i really can't give you any leads regarding anal-friendly sws. i've always been terrible at remembering sw names, and since i only get to town once a month on average, there is always a substantial turnover in talent every time i visit. i do think that it's probably easier to find anal on the low-track than any other lower mainland stroll. i don't ask for it every time, but i'd estimate that 25 or 30% of the low-trackers will do it if the price is right--and i've never paid more than $60 for it there.

as for surrey, yeah, it seems like mccallum has a lot in common with the "zero tolerance", "law-and-order" mentality that is more prevalent in the us. america probably locks up a greater percentage of drug and prostitution offenders than any other advanced democracy, yet this hasn't eliminated the drug or prostitution "problem" here. i saw a cartoon of what appeared to be mccallum in thursday's province that i didn't quite understand: he was holding a fish with a clothespin on its "nose", and the fish was saying "peeyew" while stench fumes rose from "mccallum's" head. was this a slap at mccallum's sledgehammer approach to social problems?

yeah i can understand the name thing, looks, dress and location are often as good a clue as name, but if you are only around once a month or so well yeah i would have a hard time too...

as for the cartoon ????? guess i'ma bit slow... don't get it

more sensationalist news today from surrey about an elderly woman being beaten up by robbers, more fuel for the fire....

looks like weather might be ok today so maybe i'll do a nooner run around the low and mid track, will report if i do.


02-01-03, 00:29
Vancouver Low and Mid Track Jan 31 12:30 to 13:30

No rain today so I did a drive around, about 6 on the low with the best fair, also about 4 on the mid (low activity) withj most only fair and 1 good.

Saw two regulars, Kara on the mid at her usual corner of Salisbury and Franklin, she's a blonde often in a peasant style skirt and blue jacket and often wares a blue hat. She is not thin but not fat either. Has her own place a 5-7 min drive up Victoria, pretty cluttered but better than a skid row hotel and free (sort of). She wil probably ask 120 for everything and can be bargained down to 80. Not bad service everything covered and no anal (might be able to talk her into it). good for a no hassel time.

Also saw Tina a big blonde usually near the corner hastings and maclean (just down towards franklina bit) Like I said she is bigger usually wares bright red lipstick and has a yellow jacket when it is colder. Also has her own place down Great Northern Way (by Finning offices) cleaner less cluttered place (but still a dive) she is not for those who like them thin but she is an ok lay 60 is all I would ever pay.

I was hoping to find Krista than Hoju mentioned some time back since I have seen her and thought she was worth checking out, but no luck, no others interested me so I passed this afternoon.

Saw the John watch car again sort of center of low track, this looks like it is where they are paid to patrol since i have never seen them anywhere else.


02-01-03, 11:59
How much clothing do you guys take off yourselves before intercourse? Just the pants and underwear?

That lady who took everything off without extras is pretty rare!

02-02-03, 06:11
Oberon, I forgot to mention that on my Lower Mainland junket this week I saw no suspected prostitution-related LE harassment in Surrey, Burnaby, or New Westminster. The only possible occurrence of such was early Friday morning (3:30 AM-ish) on the low-track: The cops (a marked unit, an unmarked maroon Crown Victoria, and a paddy wagon) had a SUV-type vehicle stopped on Hastings near Heatley or Princess for quite awhile. It could have been a john they wanted to tag for their DISC quota, but perhaps the stop was triggered by suspected DUI. I was stopped on the low about a year ago, and the cops seemed more concerned that I was DUI than cruising for ho's. I don't drink, but I had done some magic mushrooms within recent days, so there may have been some residual dilation of my pupils which might have made them suspicious. Anyway, they let me go after realizing that I wasn't impaired. I still haven't seen the "John Watch" car, but I did see the unmarked Crown Vic prowling the low-track on more than one occasion.

Poor Guy, I usually take everything off but my socks. It was kind of chilly in the room they gave us at the Gastown, so I initially left my shirt on, but soon found that it blocked my view of the coital action, so I pulled it off. I think you're right about SWs not usually getting completely naked unless you request it, but some of the low-trackers have such bad skin that you want them to keep as much of it covered as possible!

02-02-03, 10:14
The editorial cartoon in Thursday's Province is about corruption at a fish farm. The man in the cartoon is a provincial minister who resigned. I know they all look alike.

02-03-03, 17:42
LE On Vancouver low and mid tracks

My experience is: I have seen zero stings, I have heard the odd rumor of one on the mid but never proven. The worst I have seen is cars being stopped on the mid one afternoon but they were just stopped and then gone, not sure what was going on, runaways were in the headlines at that time so they might have been looking for them.

Months ago their use to be a motorcycle LE who hing around the end of the mid track but he was just intereseted in catching people making illegal left turns and generally being an a**hole.

Drunk driving is one thing that will get you stopped up here, if LE has any reason to think you are drunk you are going to get stopped, personnally when I am crusin I am a very careful to obey all the traffic laws..


02-04-03, 07:42
Was heading home from Kamloops on Saturday night and decided to cruise through Abbotsford to see what was happenning on the streets. I had checked out un_circumsised's guide before leaving Kamloops so that I could get right to it.

Spent about an hour in total cruising and spotted 5 SWs. There were 3 that were working S Fraser Way between Gladwin and McCallum Road. One really cute blonde in a short skirt, nice high heels that really showed off her legs. As I went around the block she discretely opened her black jacket to show off her bra covered boobs. Decided that she was the one, but got around the block and she was gone. The other two SWs weren't my type.

Made a wrong turn and ended up going down Gladwin Rd. which turns into Peardonville Rd. There were two SWs walking alond Peardonville near the park. This is more of a residential area and was surprise to see them there. Again, neither one were my type, both dressed in baggy jeans or sweats. The one in sweats actually got picked up just as I was making my third pass.

Came back to S Fraser Way just in time to see the blonde get picked up. Struck out.

Took the long way home through the Surrey area. Definitely crawling with SWs. A couple of real knockouts, but they were attracting too much attention for a discrete pickup. Saw lots of LE cruising the area, but didn't seem to be bothering the cruisers or the girls. Saw a couple that I thought I would stop for, but once up close decided that I needed long distance glasses.

Ended up going home with Rosey.

Thanks to un_circumsised for his great guide.

02-05-03, 19:15
Thanks for that Abbotsford update, Embassy, and I'm glad my guide helped direct you to the general areas. You can read my last report from there on 9-29 (Lower Mainland Gonzo Cruise) on this board. I was seriously considering picking up a decent blonde I saw on Clearbrook Rd, but was too paranoid because of all the news reports from this city about LE stings and harassment. She didn't seem to be a decoy (seemed to be moving around too much), but I wasn't 100% sure. As for finding SWs on Peardonville in a residential area, that doesn't surprise me. I saw at least one low-quality ho on Pineview Ave--well off the Clearbrook commercial strip, and I seem to recall news reports indicating that SWs work the general area--which includes Peardonville Rd. There have also been news reports that SWs work (or at least do dates) at Grant Park at the end of Madiera Pl--which is a dead end off Clearbrook near the freeway. The sightings on S Fraser Way from Gladwin to McCallum are news to me: I've never seen activity in that stretch before, or seen reports of busts there.

Seattle-Vancouver street guide:

02-05-03, 20:36
Originally posted by un_circumcised
There have also been news reports that SWs work (or at least do dates) at Grant Park at the end of Madiera Pl--which is a dead end off Clearbrook near the freeway. Seattle-Vancouver street guide:


Grant park has got some press for having SWs working out of washrooms there, I imagine they are taking dates to the same area. Local residents are up in arms about it, as you can imagine say if a father and son out playing catch went into the washroom and found ....

I have looked around the area and found some prospects but due to its proximity to residental area i would avoid it (also got some long slow looks from two people I assume where locals).

Maybe if you coudl pick up and go someplace outside the area i would give it a try i remember one i saw was a good looking brunette..who might have tempted me if I had someplace out of area to go, but this is a bit off my normal track....


02-06-03, 01:40
Vancouver Low and Mid Feb 5 1200-13:30

I took a drive around the Low and Mid tracks today, actually pretty slow for a nice sunny day, about 3-4 working the low all rated poor.

About 4-6 working the mid BUT most (4) were on the corner of Victoria and Triumph, I have seen 3-6 girls hanging around this corner a lot lately either at the corner (northwest side) or across the street on the stepps of some of the row housing. There is are two skid row rooming houses on Triumph that I believe they are working out of, i have been taked there in the past by SWs.
Most of these SWs i would rate poor to fair at best and they would be about like the average for the Low track (I like to think the Mid is usually a BIT better in general)

Spotted what looked like a pretty hot blonde on the corner of Clarke and Franklin, picked her up, she looked about 20ish said her name was Dawn dirty blond hair pulled back in a pony tail. Agreed on 60.00 fs and went to no name Hotel on Franklin (25.00 room as per Un-circ's comments). She did strip fully, not bad skin but BIG C section scar, nice rack, lots oF stubble down low (not a look I like), tight but not responsive all in all at best so so and when you include the room 5.00 more than i could get from one of my regulars with at least a better job of faking it ;-)

A note on the no name Hotel, the desk clerk (owner) was not there when we showed up at the door, and the door was locked but the girl had a key. Still had to wait for the clerk to get back to rent a room. Just thought it was interesting that she had a key..


Granola Boy
02-06-03, 06:08
Does anyone have any information about the "new high-track"? (in Vancouver on Kingsway). Can anyone give me any suggestions about bargaining there or "standard" rates? & I must be blind, but I can't find anything in Surrey! What time do people go there?!

02-08-03, 11:05
From Boundary to Rupert on Kingsway, it's 1-2-3, or $, $$, $$$. Plus the cost of a motel room.

From Rupert onward to the East King Edward turnoff, it's negotiable. Haven't asked about prices.

02-10-03, 07:43
Hi, all.
From Rupert west along Kingsway until Fraser the prices go down. Many sw are asking for 60 for a bj and some will negotiate. The closer you get to Fraser the lower the price is, but there are still john patrols there. Many of the girls want to get picked up fast as to avoid getting hassled by these patrols. Daytime hours also seems to bring out better pricing, for those sw who cannot wait for the cover of darkness.

02-10-03, 09:17
The "new high-track" has been really quiet lately. I have seen a lot of unmarked LE cruising the area. Used to be nice for some great eye candy, but that has dried up for the most part. Used to be several SWs by the London Drugs parking lot, but since the 24 hour cafe has opened it's doors, they are not there.

Was out on Friday night and did the Kingsway strip several times over about 3 hours. Most of the action was centered between Knight and Slocan. From Slocan to Boundary there was virtually nothing (except LE).

02-10-03, 17:58
Originally posted by PoorGuy
From Boundary to Rupert on Kingsway, it's 1-2-3, or $, $$, $$$. Plus the cost of a motel room.Hey PoorGuy, any recommendations for motel in the area, i know there are several but are any more "friendly" to johns than others??

I have been hearing lots of LE rumours about the hight track, but have seen nothing concrete, John watch is a pain..


02-10-03, 23:40
New Low and Mid Report (afternoon)

Took a drive around the low and mid today, lots of sw around -- of special note a BSW on the "Tranny" corner (99% sure she was not one) rate her fair to good.. looked like she was really hot once but a few too may mile now still not bad for the area.

Also on the Mid there was a very good lookin blonde, short hair (just off shoulder) faced looked nice and clean, body ?? under clothes ;-) but wh was the most promising addition I've seen in weeks, -- gone by the time I went around the block... anyone out there think they know her??

No LE no john watch, skin startin to return with the sun.. god I lcan't wait for summer hobbying...


02-10-03, 23:41
I had Kingsway broken into two sections (one called "new high track" from Boundary to Rupert or so) in my guide for awhile because it seemed like there was a definite stroll near the eastern end that was comprised entirely of obviously high-priced ho's--the same Seymour / Richards quality, dress, and attitude that are clearly beyond many of our budgets (can you say "$80 hand job"?). However, in the last 6 months or so it seemed to me that this track became less obvious as these groups of "union" girls shifted westward and became more integrated with the more affordable Kingsway fare. On my last passes a couple of weeks ago, I saw nothing from Boundary to Joyce (or was it closer to Rupert?) on two nights. I'm not sure if it makes sense to again break the strip up into two strolls, but agree that there still seems to be a westward point that the high-track SWs do not pass. From what I recall, this point has moved west to at least Victoria Dr, and possibly as far as Knight St. I'm willing to abide by what the majority thinks about this.

Ashroid, I was in Surrey a couple of weeks ago around midnight to 1 AM when I saw all the action. Weather was dry.

02-11-03, 02:45
First, I have recently discovered your board. Thanks! I have not partaken of the SW scene here. I do like to lurk. I prefer something more comfortable such as a massage table, or better yet, a bed without the lice and MSO sheets. To the point - Kingsway from Fraser to New West at 12 St and Queens is an interesting drive. February 8, Midnight-1:30 AM. 12 St at Queens to 6 Ave 2 SW hidden in the dark. 9th Ave near Mirabella 1 SW looked “young”. Burnaby 10th to 14th the usual 2, really rough looking. Total 3 LE marked cruisers so far. Kingsway between A&W and Gilley 1 SW average looking blond. 1 more LE cruiser. Vancouver High Track from Boundary 1 South side near Rogers video, 1 north side exotic looking long black hair. Along strip north side 1 before and 1 at Starbucks. West of Joyce 2 blocks north side younger looking 19-21, Across from DQ by building 2 SW best looking (in the dark) on the strip, Renfrew 1 young looking SW works 3 corners, 1 at bus stop Eldorado. Low track Victoria to Knight 1 rough looking north side by bread place, Past Knight hitchhiking old Chinese, really bad, 1 south side at Fraser bus stop best of the worst. Noticed 1 LE in Vancouver. Sometimes you can drive this strip and see no SW. The johns seem to pick up the girls in waves. If you cruise K’way enough there can be SW literally anywhere from one end to the other any time of night or day. By the way, with the new pervert in Vancouver, LE will be (should be) watching closer.

02-11-03, 06:56
I would agree that the Kingsway strip is probably just one strip. The union girls are definitely mingling in with the regular ones. Un_circ, I also agree that the westward point is safely Victoria Dr. although I have occasionally run across a "Can you spend a hundred" west of Victoria, but not very often. The chances of running across a high track gal west of Victoria is quite low.

02-12-03, 00:34
Vancouver Low and Mid nooner report

Film crews working on the east ends of both the low and mid tracks today, which means a few LE also so that section of each was a bit quite but since it was a nice sunny day lots of activity on the other parts of both low and mid.

6-8 sw and 2-3 pimps on the corner of Triumph and Victoria, I have reported some groups here before but thiss was the largest yet, an hour later most were gone...

Lots of good prospects on both tracks, no pick up for me today just window shopping

Vancouver LE must have got a new batch of shinny new Crown Victoria's they all look new and have the new bump antennas... no LE activity however just leaving and entering the station...

As for the new pervert Regal mentions, you would think he would be easy to spot, suppose to have one eye that looks off in the wrong direction...picks up girls chokes and robs, good time for Van LE to prove they care about that happens to SW...


Granola Boy
02-12-03, 03:57
Hello, I'm new to the forum (as you can tell)

What would be considered a good rate for fs on the "new high track"?

Is there a tactful way to ask a SW for CIM?

Would there be less likely chance for SWs on the "new high track" to less addicted to crack, etc. than on the low track?

Thanks for your time.

02-12-03, 08:16
Hey Oberon. Just wondering if you make a pickup for a nooner, do you go to the girls place or a cheap hotel?

I have only usually done car "dates" as it has been at night, but I can't see one being able to do that very well during the day.

02-12-03, 10:00
Thanks for those detailed observations, Regal. However, I can't find "9th Ave near Mirabella" on my map of New Westminster. Was this location way off the 12th St stroll in another part of town?

02-12-03, 14:12
Sorry, I guessed at the street. Forgot that 12 ST has a few named Streets crossing it but she was by the Mirabella. Yes that track was all 12th St. By the way I was out in Surrey tonite. The low track City P'kway 104 to 108 had at least 6 SW for the guy that couldn't finfd them. Took a stop at the Byrd for the amateurs 2 out of 5 okay. The regulars are not a bad lineup. The Kingsway track was it's typical self at 2-3 AM. Nicki by Fairmont & Kingsway will take $80 CBJ. She quoted $500 for an hour of her time on an outcall scenario. WOW! However, she is cute and claims to be 19.

02-12-03, 18:13
Originally posted by embassy
Hey Oberon. Just wondering if you make a pickup for a nooner, do you go to the girls place or a cheap hotel?

I have only usually done car "dates" as it has been at night, but I can't see one being able to do that very well during the day. W-e-l-l I have done a few (1-2) car dates during the day but yeah it's not like the cover of darkness. makes me a bit too nervous these days (getting old I guess). I have some "regular girls" I know and I go to there place. I also use the no name hotel on Franklin and if I see someone new I like the first question I ask is "do you have someplace to go besides the car?"

Now there is a risk in going to someones place, i am always on alert if I do this and if they say yes i always ask where it is and if it is a skidrow hotel room I will usualy pay the extra to get my own room (assuming she looks worth it) that way it is actually cleaner and no surprises.

If their places is in a reasonable apt building I'll go there, usually you can tell if they are trying to insure the landlord does not know they are hooking out of their place then I assume they are not going to do anything stupid there (never 100% sure).

I have had one time when "her" place turned out to be a crack house (could tell it was from a mile away) I booted here out and called it a night, I never pay until we are in the room where ever it my be, that means if something is not feeling right I just bail out no loss.

While we are on the subject of being ripped off etc in at least 10 year of on and off hobbying I have been ripped off a few times all when I was more active at night never so far in the day, touch wood.

Several were grab the cash and run (hard to chase with pants around ankles :-) had one girl even start bj then just as i was getting into it she opened the car door and ran, not sure what she gained by doing that???

Very early on had a hooker steal the keys out of the ignition and I had to buy them back.. now I just use a single key when I am out and have my REAL keys well hidden in the vehicle.

Worst experience I had was just off HAsting on the low track i was parked and had just dropped my pants and the girl was about to start when her pimp walks up to the car and tells her to get out, not much i could do so i let her go (pants around ankles again). I was stupid and saw her with the pimp but did the date close to where i picked her up.

All of these happened when i was a learner, been lucky for years now other than one grab cash and run a year or two ago. In general make sure you are in control of the situation and know the area you are in and never pay until the last minute.


02-13-03, 20:34
Oberon, great advice. The key suggestion is excellent. Never thought about that one. I also agree with the location scenario. Try to avoid where she wants to go 1. cause you can get ripped off and 2. because LE must get to know their favorite spots.

A general question for everyone. Has anyone ever been busted? Tell us your story. Fact is if I had a choice I would rather get ripped off than busted. One is a [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140) off the other is a disaster for me.

02-14-03, 09:24
This happened about a month ago but I thought I should post this WARNING. I picked up a girl off of E.Hastings, It was about E. Cordova and Princess. She was young looking 18-19, red hair, 5'6 skinny 110-115 pounds and looked fairly new to the game. Anyway, I picked her up without negotiating first, She gets in and I start to drive and ask how much? She says "60.00" for a B.J and I laugh and say that I will drop her back off. She says "you have to pay me $10.00 for picking me up" And I laugh some more. Then she says "I am not leaving until you pay me". I tell her that I am not paying her shit. She says "That's not fair, Because I am not a hooker". I laugh some more :) I ask her why is she turning tricks on a low track then?. She says nothing. Then she wants me to drop her of at the park.....Then back to Princess....Then she wants to go to main....I was driving around for 10 minutes.....Now I am pissed and tell her I am taking her to the cop station on Main.
I start driving towards Main on Hastings when across from the little 24 hour store at Hastings and Jackson I see a cop car parked across the street. So I pull in front of the store and tell her "I have a 20.00 and I need change" "but you have to come in with me because I am not leaving you alone in my car". She gets out and so do I, When she is 3 feet from the car I tell her "I am not paying you shit and if you want to make a seen there are the cops". She says "do you know how old I am" I said "I don't give a fuck,lets go talk to the cops" I walk over and she books down Jackson towards the park. I went up to the cops and said "I picked up that girl hitch hiking and when I found out she was a hooker I tried to let her out and she wanted money". The cop said "don't pick up girls and don't worry about it". I kept cruising and picked up two girls for $20 each..... Saw her again walking but she didn't see me.

02-14-03, 09:32
Un_circumcised- I am a night lurker too, I find the best time to stroll is between 2am-4am. There is not allot of LE and bargains can be had. The other good time is when it is raining all day and stops around 12am... Lots of girls come out.
I picked up the skinny blonde (hair always in a ponytail) that is always near E.Hastings and Jackson. She sometimes where's a white dress, She stays near that Hotel on Main.... Anyway she usually wants $30-$40 but she waived me down and it was a slow night so she gave me a BJ for $20. Ratings looks 7 Attitude 6 BJ 5 It was ok but nothing special.

Tom Thompson
02-15-03, 13:28
Hey everyone, just found this message board a few days ago, great information base you have here, first post for me. Just came back from a quick cruise of the Kingsway strip, Friday night 2am-3am. Saw a cougar on 13th St, just over the New West/Burnaby border. Saw a young blond dressed all in black (she was a looker) strutting around across from Arbys at Gilley. Tried to doubleback, but she was gone by the time I got there. Saw 2 across from Safeway, just past Boundary. Saw another at Slocan, so I picked her up. She looked a little Native, but more Caucasian, long brown leather jacket, paid $40. She was kind of nervous, said she was still new to the biz. It was my first time out since around Halloween, so I was a bit nervous myself. Service was good, Looks 7.5, Attitude 7.5, BJ 8, took her time, nice girl. Spotted 1 LE near Metrotown and some UC busting some kids at Victoria. Keep posting and keep up the good work guys!

02-16-03, 01:44
tom, i just want to make sure you were referring to a hooker and not a mountain lion in new west, and to clarify that you did mean 13th st--not 12th (the usual stroll there).

oberon, that is a good idea about cruising with a single spare key, and i've incorporated that tip into my essay on john countermeasures:


i was a victim of the key-grab on the low-track many years ago. the sw was a total rip-off: i don't think she had any intention of performing a sex act. she directed me to a parking lot of an apartment complex (the first bad omen). as soon as we parked, she demanded payment (the deal was that we would go into her apartment there for intercourse). of course i refused, and she yanked the keys and demanded $40 for their return. i refused, and there was a standoff of at least five minutes where she kept insinuating that her friends were nearby and going to beat me up unless i complied. i sensed that she was bluffing, so held out until she agreed to $20 for the keys. i believe i could have physically extracted them from her, but it probably would have generated a commotion that could indeed have brought her allies to the scene--or even the cops. she also may have had some sort of blade, so i just swallowed the $20 loss and chalked it up to lesson learned. the key-grab is apparently a fairly common sw tactic: i've seen it on a "cops" episode from portland, and there was a newspaper item mentioning it from bremerton, wa recently.

as for going to the sw's place, i still occasionally do it, and believe it can be safely done if you're experienced and know what signs to watch out for. first of all, i have to have a good vibe about the sw. if i detect any bad attitude in her, i won't do it. then i tell her that there can't be anyone else in the room--particularly males. i emphasize that if there is, i'm going to turn around and walk out. next, i watch for any signs of her signaling shady characters loitering in the building, or knocking on other peoples' doors. finally, i cautiously enter the room, focusing on spots where someone may be waiting in ambush. i've only had one real bad experience using a sw's place, and that was close to 10 years ago--when i was much less experienced. we went to her hotel room on hastings, i gave her the money before she had started to undress (my first mistake), and then she signaled to someone out the window (big red flag!). in retrospect, i should have cut my losses and gotten the hell out of there, but i was stoned, and like i said--more naive. then she left the room (another red flag!), and i nervously waited at the door, peering down the hall. a few minutes later, some dude came running down the hall screaming at me, and i flew down the stairs with him chasing me. i didn't look back even when i got out on hastings, but i think he stopped chasing me at the entrance to the hotel.

i have had pretty good luck on the low-track in the last couple of years, and can only recall one sw who may have been planning a rip-off: we went to the no-name hotel on franklin, but she didn't want me paying $25 (i intitially thought she was hoping i might give her some of the hotel money if she could find a place where we could screw cheaper or for free). then we went to the gastown, but the innkeeper wasn't around. then she suggested we go to her place--even though it was well away from the downtown eastside. she directed me to some apartment building near broadway. when we neared the place, she admitted that her friends might be there, but insisted they were "cool". i got a bad vibe about the situation, balked, and drove back to the track. i really wanted to do this chick, and suggested we go to stanley park (where i have done a regular a few times). she refused (not surprisingly, since i'm pretty big and she was rather small), and suggested some place on hastings. the door was locked or something, so i suggested we go back to the no-name. again she refused, so i finally decided to bail on her, and jumped back in my car and split. of course she was irate over all that time wasted and no money in hand, but tough: i figure she really wasn't looking to do a prostitution deal, but some way to rip me off without having to screw me.

02-16-03, 02:44
Thanks un.... I have not been active on the street scene and I appreciated when you experienced guys can provide a few stories. Also thanks for the link. What I am having trouble with is I can get top drawer SP's in Vancouver for ~$200 and sometimes less. The risk of a rip is very low particularly if you follow the boards. What is the street draw? I don't know but it fascinates me.

02-17-03, 19:11
The recent talk of ripoffs has got me reviewing my previous ones, like I said there have been several and trying to think what I could have done to prevent them since most all were car dates and most involved me being parked and then paying and droping the pants only to have the girl split, I can't think of much I could have done top prevent them, so those i just put off to the cost of doing business.

Early on I let a girl get out of the car with the cash I put that off to me being stupid.

Once I picked up a girl with a guy (pimp) close by and then only went a short way from there for a car date, the guy showed up and the girl left, that was another stupid one on my part now I never pick up girls who are hanging around with guys and I go a decent distance away if I am doing a car date.

The one key grab was a typical if it is too good to be true then it probably is story. Hooker flaged me down (actualy jumped in form of car) on rainy day said she really needed a ride home, I said I was broke and did not want to pick her up (she was a 4-5 maybe) she said I could have a freebee if I would take her back to her place after. I said yes....got a BJ and then she said I should really pay her, I said I was broke she bitched and whined and then told me where to drive her. when we got there is was a reasonably busy spot in Chinatown (right by a ATM, DUH) she grabed the keys and started yelling at me to get her some cash. I was stuck so she got 30.00 and I got my keys...My rule only pick up what YOU want.

Other interesting things are several girls just trying to open doors and get in mostly in alleys on the low track (always lock doors, duh).

Regal, I agree the street has a draw for me, part sex part just adrenalin but too much adrenalin is a bad thing :-) It is a rush seeing how good a girl you can score for how little cash, sometimes you find yourself in a situation where you just have to laugh, the last daytime car date I did (I do them very rarely in the day) was with a thin blonde, actually the best BJ I have had in ages we went to one of the parking lots off Commissoner St (north side of tracks from the Mid track) and were between two cars doing it, she was getting into it and was kneeling on the passenger seat, miniskirt no panties ass in the air, it would have been quite a sight if someone had walked up.... almost started to laugh thinking about it..

Like many sw that was the only time i have seen her too bad..

have fun


Tom Thompson
02-18-03, 08:22
Yes an older lady, not the actual animal, and yes ai meant on 12 ave at 13 st

02-18-03, 08:47
Just a word of warning: If you are on the mid track in an alley behind some blue bins, and you have your pants around your ankles, make sure you have your wallet in your jacket or the next time you open your wallet it may be a litle lighter(if you know what I mean).

02-18-03, 18:22
Mid Track

Visaman, afew years ago I might have done what you describe, but in the last year or so and particularly in the last couple of months I have seen a lot more guys, pimps male druggies, who really knows hanging around the mid track, I do not think I would do anything out of my car or in an ally that close to the action for that matter.

Anybody else seen this change?


02-19-03, 08:39
I think that the number of guys hanging around the girls has increased even since Christmas. Clark Dr between Hastings and Venables used to be a fairly good pickup spot, but for every SW I usually see some dubious guy hangin on a corner, usually across the street.

There is one SW who hangs out on Clark, one block north of Venables, usually on the west side. Quite a good looker, but there is always a guy sitting in a car about 1/2 block away. I have seen her get picked up and then the car is off and following. Uh!

02-19-03, 18:30

Interesting, I will have ot keep an eye out for stuff like that...

A bit un-nerving........


02-19-03, 23:35
that kinda sounds like what one girl in my city does. about 3 years ago, we had a string of sw getting picked up, robbed, beaten and raped. all the girls took to some sort of "protective" measure. for "cherry" it was having her pimp fallow in the car.
now i admit, the first time i picked her up and noticed the car fallowing she told me plainly it was her pimp. i just went to a spot that i could get the deed done and keep an eye on the car. no problem at all. in fact, i have become a regular of cherry's (she gives the best bj i have ever had) and i have never met or talked to the pimp.
so, that could be what the girl was doing. lets face it it's a risky business for all involved especially the girl. but that's not to say that you yourself shouldn't be careful!

i have a simple strategy with sw. be honest, be fair, be frank.
if you try to rip them off, well, they just might end up ripping you off. if a car seems to be fallowing you, ask her if she has a friend keeping an eye on her. if you're nervous about it, tell her. and if you have to cut the date short cause of you nervousness, thank her for her time!
i have never been ripped off, never placed in undo risk, and never cheated.

02-20-03, 21:12

What you say is true BUT, it all depends, I mean lets face it a lot of girls on the street are doing this because they are in desparate need of $$$ a lot of guys(pimps) are just plain scum. so how much do you trust them. FOr me the answer is not much, sure I have a girl or two i have know for some time now and I trust them about some things but am i going to lend them money NO. Any girl I pick up who I do not know I am VERY wary of. I do understand that girls are nervous too hell in Vancouver they have ample reason to be with all the recent stuff going on, but I gotta look out for No.1.

We all make our own decisions on what is safe, you made yours and so far it sounds like they have worked for you.. I've made mine and so far they have worked for me, in reality we only change these decisions when something goes wrong or when the small head in the pants takes over from the big head on the shoulders, something I think we all try and avoid.


02-21-03, 01:12
Low and Mid Track report 1:00pm-2:30pm Feb 20

Pouring rain but still about 4 working on the Low and 5 working on the Mid most were poor exxcept one fair-good (from a distance) blonde on the Low by Jackson.. Gave her a pass as I still had the mid to checkout.

All the girls on the mid were regulars and not too good looking ones at that...I have noticed the nooner crowd on the Mid is getting a little old and a lot uglier lately (still some nice stuff but some girls are working the wrong track IMHO).
I've commented before about the skidrow housing around Triumph and Victoria and seems alot of the old used up girls are associated with them and a crowd of folks (girls and pimps) that hang around there, a few are young but most would look right at home on the LOW, in fact I'll go as far as saying the last few trips the low has been better quality (from the car at least).

You night time guys notice any of this, am I going to have to go back to working nights??

Anyway settled on the one girl I had not seen before (forgot name) an Aussie looked good from the car and was fair close-up 50 for bbbj and cowgirl. Nice skin and good rack a few tattoos (no biggy for me) Did a good job of starting out bbbj and licking then covered for the cowgirl, talked a bit much but not real bad, all in all worth it. Said she was making $ for the trip home...who knows certainly acted pro..


02-22-03, 07:22
I usually don't cruise during the day, but yesterday I made several passes around the tracks after 3 PM--after the rain had stopped or subsided. I wasn't taking notes, but I recall seeing little on the low-track, and virtually nothing on the mid. I went over to Wendy's, then an Internet cafe, then resumed cruising around 6:30.

About 20 minutes later there was a wild car chase around E Hastings, and all the traffic came to a standstill while at least 8 cop cars (marked & unmarked) chased a jeep-type vehicle. I was stopped at the curb on Hastings near Campbell at the time while the nutcase zipped around the corner, jumped the curb, then flew down the sidewalk to pass me and other vehicles. When traffic began cautiously moving again a minute or two later, I could see the cops still chasing the guy over on Pender, so I decided to get the hell out of there and parked over near the mid-track for awhile. The scene looked like something out of "Cops" or "World's Wildest Poice Videos". I've seen enough of these pursuits on TV to know that many end when the fleeing vehicle crashes into another vehicle, and I didn't want to die or have my car totaled.

I resumed cruising around 9:30, and saw more activity than earlier (particularly on the mid--where there was the usual group or two of nicely-dressed SWs on the western end of Franklin). The rain was only intermittent and light, but I was still fairly high from the THC and psilocybin I ingested the previous night, so decided not to survey other parts of the city or beyond, and instead went over to Shine (corner of Cordova & Water) for their '80s night. The place was packed, the dancing was cool, and there were some lookers in there; but as usual with clubs it was basically a cock-tease fest for gold-digging chicks (the crowd was about 70% male), and I ended up heading back to the track after the music stopped and the "ugly lights" came on at 2:15. By the way, I keep hearing that "Funcouver" is going to extend the bar-closing time from 2 AM to 4 AM, but it obviously hasn't happened yet.

Cruised around (mostly on the low) for a couple of hours, the pickings were slim, so I settled on an older Native SW (about a "4") on Dunlevy who agreed to a double penetration (anal + vaginal) for $40 at the Gastown. It wasn't spectacular (her skin was pretty bad, so this definitely wasn't a GFE candidate), but it did the trick. I started by loosening up her moderately-stretched sphincter with an Anal Probe dildo covered with K-Y jelly, then buggered her with my dick, put on a fresh condom, then finished in her pussy.

LE seemed to be harassing more motorists after 2 AM, and they spent about 30 minutes interrogating and searching an Asian guy in a SUV on Hastings near Heatley. I don't know if he was a suspected john or drunk. They had someone else pulled over on
or near that end of Hastings for awhile as well. I also noticed LE driving an unmarked sporty little silver Grand Am around Robson and Granville. You never would have guessed this was a cop: No weird antennas, no antenna "bumps" like the ummarked Ford Crown Victorias, but of course it did have the flashers on the inside of the windows. Maybe they use this one at that part of town to mostly hunt DUIs, thiefs, and hooligans.

Seattle-Vancouver street guide:

02-22-03, 19:31
bar hours in vancouver

hey uncirc sound like an interesting night..

as far as bar/club hours go the provincial government has passed legislation allowing bars and clubs to be open later but most cities also have bylaws governing this, it is now up to the cities to decide how long they want bars open.

i am surprised the picking were so slim on the low and mid they have been good during my trips ( at least goood numbers). this am (sat) at 8 there were 3 girls on the mid and 3-4 on the low, one good looker on the mid was gone by the time i made my second pass...oh well had to get to work anyway.

le was talking to a girl on victoria, looked liek she might have been ****?? also had a woman in a bmw stopped right behind her, who knows maybe something more complicated (they were marked le cars).

i might go look for something later today, if i do i will report....


02-23-03, 12:02
i have found nervana
i am normally a poster on the seattle/everett forums, but today i finally got up to the great city of vancover.i have been here before on the high track/tourist track a long time ago but anyway i got to town at 430 and after getting lost and screwing off i landed on the low and mid tracks at 530. i cruised the scene and saw a few but i thought i would wait till dark at about 630 then the scene came alive i saw more sw's on one block than i would all night in seattle. i finally saw what i thought was a asian girl in nice black streatch pants i stopped i cant remember the name but she was exteremly nice she ended up being a native girl but looked like she had mexican or something.she wanted 50can. for half and half at her place. i thought that was a good deal but i offered 40can.she accepted got to her place which was a apartment and i was treated to a great time.i got back on the road looking for a place to stay for the night and saw a totally hot [CodeWord901] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord901) blonde in a black mini and dressed to impress i had to pass i had already been with a girl in the us also today. so i thought i would just go home and plan a longer stay next time
ps thanks un circ for continually telling us in seattle the great and cheap times to be had on the low/mid tracks

02-24-03, 03:26
Un-Circ, the next time you are in Vancouver, how about we go crusing together, I live near the Mid track, but I've never cruised the Kingsway Strip. We also could go the No. 5 Orange and trade some war stories.

02-24-03, 19:06
Originally posted by sweetwillyp
i cruised the scene and saw a few but i thought i would wait till dark at about 630 then the scene came alive i saw more sw's on one block than i would all night in seattle.
i thought i would just go home and plan a longer stay next time
ps thanks un circ for continually telling us in seattle the great and cheap times to be had on the low/mid tracks

LOL, yeah Willy I got to admit it is nice to be up here, the only thing that would make it better for me is if I got paid in US $$ :-)

I do a few trips to California each year and I always end up coming home pissed off and horny no where near as easy to connect in the USA....

I work not far from the low and mid and can go out for a nooner anytime,,,, makes for a nice break from work :-)

Can you give me a better description of the SW you picked up, I'm always looking for new girls with thier own clean place...

Also Picked up CJ a blonde SW on Saturday afternoon right across the street from the no name hotel on the Mid, 50 for half and half, not too bad looking with nice rack but pretty mechanical and unispired, not worth a second try... oh well..

Willy also I see relatively few Asian SW in Vancouver if you are looking for Asian girls the massage parlor scene is a good but more expensive alternative...

Hey Vancouver has a thriving tourist industry, might not be the one they advertize but it is thriving...LOL still


02-24-03, 23:22
Will be visiting Vancouver, BC soon for a quick business trip. can anyone recommend good massage parlors and in-call girls near downtown Vancouver under a reasonable price? Thanks in advance.

02-25-03, 00:04
Originally posted by amateur
Will be visiting Vancouver, BC soon for a quick business trip. can anyone recommend good massage parlors and in-call girls near downtown Vancouver under a reasonable price? Thanks in advance.

Bex comes to mind as a massage parlor or college cuties, both I believe are in the phonebook. I don't use them but the rumour is they are good you should try PERB also.

02-25-03, 05:08
Sweetwilly, I'm happy you made it up, scored, and have seen for yourself that I haven't been overhyping Vancouver to the WA boards! Like you said, one can cruise all night on a typical night in Seattle and only see a fraction of what you'd find in just a couple of hours cruising Vancouver. I just received an e-mail from a guy who lives in Montana but occasionally travels to BC on business, and he estimated he saw 200 SWs cruising Vancouver over a 2 or 3 day period. That total sounds a bit high, but I wouldn't be surprised if at least 50 different SWs could be counted throughout the city on a typical night. The main reason I started showing number of SWs on my site was to try to show how much more active the Vancouver strolls are compared to the Seattle area, but as you've seen for yourself, this new methodology still doesn't really convey the difference. And it's not just quantity--the overall quality is also superior, in my opinion. In addition to Vancouver, I also recommend Surrey to WA johns. There's usually a fair amount of action there and it's closer to the border, but LE might not be as tolerant of the scene (according to newspaper articles I've read over the years) -- so be more cautious. I usually see at least one or two other WA plates cruising the low and mid-tracks, and such was the case last Wed and Thu nights. I also seem to see at least one California plate--not surprising, given that CA has a population comparable to the whole of Canada--but rarely any Oregon plates. My hope is that more US johns will get turned on to this city--then I won't stand out so much.

Did you have any trouble at the border? Since 9-11, I've been sent into Canada Customs & Immigration more often for further scrutiny, but last week I got some easy chick in the booth who seemed half asleep, asked me the usual 3 or 4 questions, and waved me through without even asking for my driver's license! I was treated to the royal search and interrogation coming back, though--the first time that's happened in a couple of years. It was the first time I recall seeing Dubya & President Cheney's ugly mugs (instead of Clit-on & Bore) on the wall, anyway. I also noticed that the whole ceiling is now saturated with those little black dome surveillance cams. I almost thought I was hallucinating there were so many of them. Talk about paranoia overkill.

Oberon, the only US west coast city that might have a street scene remotely comparable to Vancouver's is San Francisco, from what I understand. Even there, though, the vice goons are far more prevalent and active--from what I've seen on TV. Los Angeles is getting more intolerant, having recently adopted a vehicle forfeiture law aimed at johns (solicit a ho, lose your car). I think they also do this in Sacramento and Oakland. I never visit Portland, but from what I've heard over the years the street scene is better than Seattle's (hell, even Tacoma is often better than Seattle, with about a third the population). Portland was aggressively seizing johns' cars for years, but had to scale back or abandon the practice after OR voters approved an anti-forfeiture initiative.

Visaman, thanks for the offer of getting together. I have to warn you, though, that I'm a real "spur-of-the-moment" person, and never decide whether I'm coming up until a couple of hours before I take off. I also must warn you that I usually cruise high. I came up Wed evening, but was too fried on marijuana (and some residual psilocybin mushroom that was still in my system from a few days earlier) to do any cruising that night. I was going to hang out at the Luv-a-Fair, but it was closed down (now reincarnated on Granville as the snooty, upscale "Plaza Club"), so I ended up parked somewhere on Burrard for most of the night, totally fuked-up, tunes cranked,
and watching the occasional oblivious LE whizz by. I don't know if I'm somwhat of an anomaly among johns, but I prefer to be high (no alcohol) when I pick up a SW--it makes the experience far sweeter. I've been using these drugs for so much of my life now that they're really like my second nature, and I find I can usually think straight on them and not take any inordinate risks that I wouldn't have done if sober. As for the driving, I know when I'm too high to be on the road, and wait until I come down to a safer level. I've passed through the border, BC DUI checkpoints, and even been interrogated by cops while quite high, and have never been busted. An interview I posted on my "Subversion" page with an expert on marijuana driving bolsters my belief that the risk isn't remotely as bad as alcohol.

02-25-03, 22:55
Originally posted by un_circumcised
Oberon, the only US west coast city that might have a street scene remotely comparable to Vancouver's is San Francisco, from what I understand. Even there, though, the vice goons are far more prevalent and active--from what I've seen on TV. Los Angeles is getting more intolerant, having recently adopted a vehicle forfeiture law aimed at johns (solicit a ho, lose your car). I think they also do this in Sacramento and Oakland. I never visit Portland, but from what I've heard over the years the street scene is better than Seattle's (hell, even Tacoma is often better than Seattle, with about a third the population). Portland was aggressively seizing johns' cars for years, but had to scale back or abandon the practice after OR voters approved an anti-forfeiture initiative.

Yeah my trips are to the San Jose area, dead, dead, dead... Sanfran seemed better but I am always just passing through real quick so hard to tell.

My experinece at the border is have an answer to their questions don't hum and haw and you'll be fine. There was a big bust at the border last week, guy caught smuggling 40 guns into Canada supose to be to trade for drugs to smuggle back to USA so that might have had US customs on alert, or just terrosist stuff, who know s these days.


02-26-03, 00:23
hey un circ
no probs at the border:) i use a passport they seem to be happy about that. as of current i am planning to spend a weekend on the mid/low tracks as soon as possible. it is approx. 120 miles from lynnwood/seattle and thats only 2hours drive plus half hour at the crossing. hey does anybody now about nexxus passes

02-26-03, 19:13
Originally posted by sweetwillyp
hey un circ
no probs at the border:) i use a passport they seem to be happy about that. as of current i am planning to spend a weekend on the mid/low tracks as soon as possible. it is approx. 120 miles from lynnwood/seattle and thats only 2hours drive plus half hour at the crossing. hey does anybody now about nexxus passes

Another convert to Canada.... :-) Nexxus I believe is more expensive than the old PACE system and requires more of a background check, So far I don't know anyone how has it.

I'm sure you will enjoy your weekend :-) Let me know if I can provide any info or of course Un-circ knows more about the scene up here than most Canadians, he certainly knows more about the Surrey scene than I do. I got to admit however I find enough to keep me happy on the low and mid in Vancouver. My impression is that with recent enforcment push in Surrey things are safer in Vnacouver too.

There was just a radio report of business and residents complaining that the enforcment push on the Surrey stroll had caused hookers to move into area they were never in before DUH nobody thought of that??? Also businesses in the enforcement area are complaining they are losing money...Its like you have to hit some people over the head witha 2x4 before they realize that prostitution is not going to go away EVER and you are better off regulating it... oh well putting my soapbox away for now...

I think I might go out today and looka round, Willy I'm looking for the native girl you picked up, so anything along the lines of a better description would help. (you know the hunt is half the fun, ok maybe not half but it is fun).


02-27-03, 03:18
Interesting Sighting

Cruised the mid and low today not much activity (today is welfare Wednesday I think) but I did see two cars parked oddly just west of Clarke on Hastings, one on each side of the road up on the sidewalk both had orange cones around them and people in them, definately NOT LE one car was old junker and the other new subcompact. No idea what they were doing, John watch (no signs), maybe traffic monitor for the city, they usually just sit in chairs but maybe on Hastings they get to sit in a car because of the area???

I almost did not mention this because i don't think it is anything important.

Hopefully the pickings are better tomorrow.


02-27-03, 08:07
It's been my experience(some 8 years now) that the action is slow the week following Welfare Wednsday. The best time is the weekend just before WW. To be fair I haven't cruised the low track in a year or so, and I don't recongize anybody from 8 years ago.

On the mid track it was not uncommon to see several girls on every block on the mid track, even on Sunday afternoon. Mind you that was when the kiddie stroll was in full bloom, so to speak, now it's deader than dead, which is a good thing.

02-27-03, 08:09
Un-Circ, I think, I'll pass, no offence but drugs make me nervous, be careful ok?

02-27-03, 09:29
I'm glad you didn't have any problems at the border, Sweet. However, if you go up often enough it is inevitable that you'll eventually have your car searched (Customs) and / or be interrogated (Immigration). This normally is no big deal unless--like me--you're a fan of prohibited substances. I started taking personal use quantities of marijuana (along with my bong) across the border after I started patronizing the Vancouver SW scene in 1985, but became more paranoid about doing that because of the "War on Drugs" hysteria of the late '80s and early '90s. In '91 I came up with a better strategy: I would eat the weed just prior to crossing. Unlike smoking, the eating high takes a good 20-30 minutes to kick in (and up to 2 hours to peak), so I was usually well past the border when that happened, and parked somewhere (usually at a fast-food place, strip club, nightclub, or park) during the peak. With the increased post 9-11 scrutiny, though, I became more paranoid that I could be delayed at Customs or Immigration long enough to be too high to safely drive out of there (especially if I was turned around for some unforseen reason and sent back to the US), so I'm now using the "brownie method": Cooking the herb into an innocuous-looking foodstuff and ingesting it when I park in Vancouver. Of course the danger with this method is that a drug dog might "hit" on it, but it's also possible that the cooking process neutralizes the smell enough so that it doesn't cross the threshold of a dog alert. Anyway, relief for we cross-border stoners may be on the horizon: Marc Emery has announced that he is opening a formal recreational marijuana distribution point somewhere in Vancouver this year, apparently calculating that the new COPE administration will not interfere. As for psychedelics like magic mushrooms, I've never tried to cross into the Lower Mainland with them or just after taking them because of a close call I had taking the ferry from Anacortes to Sidney as a walk-on passenger: I believe Immigration suspected I was on something but decided the easiest thing to do was to just turn me around, so they found some technicality to exclude me (lack of funds), and turned me over to the ferry captain--who escorted me back to the boat. As a measure of how disoriented I was, I remember asking him if we were heading to Vancouver next. :cool:

I know all this border drug brinkmanship probably sounds incredibly risky or even crazy to many of you, but amazingly I've never been busted, and have had an enormous amount of fun in the process. Who knows--maybe someday my luck will run out, I'll get caught, and be banned from Canada. Then I'll say: "Oh well, it was a fantastic ride for the better part of 2 decades, and at least I know where to find a ho in WA." :)

My border tips:

02-27-03, 10:13
You know it's Welfare Wednesday when you hang around the low track for 2 hours (1-3 PM) and not bump into a single SW.

02-28-03, 05:34
Hey Oberon, saw one of those cars on Hastings as well the other night. It was just west of Clark and parked on the grass median just before the Loomis yard. A guy and girl sitting in it, with orange cones around it and two sitting on the roof. Definitely not discrete, both in the choice of parking spot as well as the cones. This was around 10:00 pm. They must have been fairly legit otherwise I am sure that LE would have given them the boot. Parking at the side of the road is one thing, on the grass median is another.

02-28-03, 18:26
Various Vancouver Stuff

embasy --- that's the cars i was talking about, like you said had to be legit since it was way too obvious, I sort of assumed it was city monitoring traffic but who knows..... Gone the next day..

PoorGuy --- yeah a quiet week on the low track, still a few girls out on the mid but no more than 2 or 3, I'm too busy today to look so with my schedule it will be Monday before I am out again, so I'll be desparate by then... Yesterday I saw on hot one on the low but had no time, she was a tall blonde dressed in good clean jeans and shirt, looked a little out of place on Heatley st...

For those who might not know, like our US neighbours Welfare Wednesday is the 3rd Wednesday of the month.

Un-circ --- I would think that if a drug dog was going to hit on you it would have done so already, you must have a certain "air" about you and your vehicle ;-))) Seriously I would assume the big worry would be US custons since most of the drug traffic is north to south (BC Bud and all) Could you not purchase in Canada and consume here and go back empty? Just trying to help one of the major BC industries ;-)


03-01-03, 02:53
hey oberon
about the native chick. she was approx 5foot4 to 5foot7inchs tall. probly no more than 100 pounds. long almost to her waist black hair she looks totally asian from 10feet away.she lives in a apartment complex about a block off of what i think is low track.she lives in a decent low/mid level apartment. i hope that helps. i wasnt paying to much attention other than getting well you know.
ps sorry about the non-metric references i dont know the metric system that well

03-01-03, 03:09
Originally posted by sweetwillyp
hey oberon
about the native chick. she was approx 5foot4 to 5foot7inchs tall. probly no more than 100 pounds. long almost to her waist black hair she looks totally asian from 10feet away.<<SNIP>>ps sorry about the non-metric references i dont know the metric system that well

Willy thanks man that is enough to go on.. The hair should standout.

Don't worry I'm old enough to be pre-metric funny lots of people still quote familiar things in imperial measurments... a pound of meat, a persons height etc.


03-01-03, 05:14
Originally posted by oberon1999
Yesterday I saw on hot one on the low but had no time, she was a tall blonde dressed in good clean jeans and shirt, looked a little out of place on Heatley st...n Sounds like a girl I picked up a few weeks ago, she had I beauty rack (why I picked her up) and offered her 40$ for a topless BJ, she agreed but I didn't get to handle the rack much at all though the BJ was decent. Her name was Kelli and I didn't enquire about anything else, so take the info FWIW.

03-01-03, 09:06
I added some different live webcams to the top of my site--including ones of the Burrard Bridge / Kitsilano Point area and the Pacific Hwy "truck" border crossing--which links to the Aldergrove and Huntingdon border cams (for some reason they've rarely had Peach Arch). The Burrard cam is only updated during daylight and I know it's far from where the action is, so if someone is aware of a more appropriate Lower Mainland cam, let me know. There used to be one pointed at a stretch of Kingsway in Burnaby, but I never saw it working.

Oberon, I know it's relatively easy to score weed on Vancouver streets (the Montana correspondent I recently mentioned did so), but my problem is that I'm a marijuana eater--not smoker--and cannabis must be cooked into a food with a high oil content before the THC is orally active. As I've said, the eating high is quite different from the smoked--where you go up quickly, peak in about an hour, then go down relatively quickly (unless you "rehit"). The usual course of an eaten high for me is that the effect will take 10-15 minutes to just become noticeable, then gradually build to a peak in 90 minutes to 2 1/2 hours, then plateau for at least an hour, then VERY gradually start to decline. This gradual decline is the real appeal of the eaten high, in my opinion, because it means I can still be adequately stoned (yet below a threshold where it isn't safe for me to drive) for a good 24-48 hours later, with ZERO pot smoke smell on my clothes or in my car. Many times I've still been quite high upon returning home after spending 2 nights in Vancouver. And I want to emphasize that I don't do this just to break the law (even though the marijuana laws are as absurd as the prostitution laws, in my view, and deserve to be flouted), but because I get a much better orgasm and overall sex experience on cannabis. Plus, marijuana makes music sound amazingly better, and I'm a huge pop music fan and always bring a custom-made tape along. I know my drug boosterism is a bit off-topic for this board, but I couldn't resist thumbing my nose at the border goons I've "highly" smirked at for all these years--including the US oafs who screwed up my car seat last week, apparently poking around for narcotics.

Seattle-Vancouver street guide:

03-03-03, 17:33
Originally posted by un_circumcised
<<SNIP>>The Burrard cam is only updated during daylight and I know it's far from where the action is, so if someone is aware of a more appropriate Lower Mainland cam, let me know.
I'm a marijuana eater--not smoker--and cannabis must be cooked into a food with a high oil content before the THC is orally active.

Un-circ.. No Idea about web cams but, I'll keep it in mind..

As far as the marijuana, hmm learn something new everyday.. long ago for various reasons booze became my drug of choice. I see the advantages of yours, I can't cruise high, and booze dose nto enhance anything (does not cause me any problems however).. To each his own, enjoy

After a quite weekend I'm going to try and find some action at lunch..


Later that same day :-))
Ok went out and lots of girls out about 6 each on mid and low, but started todrop off after 1:30. Nobody I was interested in (nobody on my current hunt list). Ended up calling a dependable standby, Tammi, 100.00 for a massage and half and half back at her nice clean apt off commercial dr. It's a bit expensive but dependble and unrushed not a druggie, I think she will do a naked CBJ at her place for 60.00. Still got my eye open for the girl WillyP mentioned and one other thin native gal that I have had a good time with.

Tammi mentioned she had been hasseled by our friends John Watch, just hanging around scaring off customers (she will do incalls or works the street too).


03-04-03, 22:52
A Canadian company (MedMira) has a 3-minute HIV test kit called Reveal that is about to get final FDA approval in the US. My question: Is this kit available over the counter in Vancouver?

There is an on-going discussion about using such test kits for prescreening providers (in the safe sex section under special interests).

03-06-03, 17:59
Some days you just feel stupid. Well after several recent post talking about how safe I tryand be and not doing daytime car dates, guess what...

Picked up the Aussie girls I mentioned awhile ago, agreed on 40 for bbbj, went to no-name hotel and the front door was locked with no one around (often locked but knock and someone comes right away)... Hung around for a few minutes but no one showed up.. So small head doing the thinking we decided to drive around and find a spot to park....picked a mostly empty parking lot off hastings and got down to business..was just getting into things when a security guard showed up on the scene, high tailed it before he got to close. now I still am thinking with small head not big one so we find another spot and finish the job, good bbbjtc BUT too close a call for comfort.....just goes to show do somthing stupid and it will come back to bite ya.

Should have just called it quits when I could not get a room or even drove down to Gastown Hotel (bit of a drive) and done it there.

Lots of other girls out especially on the low, also John Watch car this time down by Loomis courier warehouse, first time I have seen him down that far..

Live and learn (I hope)


Granola Boy
03-09-03, 21:20
March 9, 2003. I was going home & passed by Kingsway around 3:30 am. I don't know if it's because of the IOC in town or if it's because it was colder, but there was no one out at that time. I thought I might have seen one at a bus stop by Knight, but I didn't double back. I thought I had seen one SW by Slocan, but I doubled back & there was no one there. There seems to be a lot of LE by the Safeway on Joyce lately though. I went a few days ago as well & saw two SW's but they were alking "home"...there was an LE a few blocks away.

I know the Kingsway strip is a little more costly, but how tough can you bargain?

03-10-03, 12:19
I'm currently in Seattle, but am planning a vacation to Vancouver in several weeks. What areas or tracks do you recommend and what areas should I avoid. Not too familiar with Vancouver, so the more detailed the better. Ooh, and what are the rates you fellas pay? Really appreciate the feedback.


03-11-03, 00:52
hi guys-

i'm a monger currently residing in the sf bay area- good mongering territory- but i'm moving to vancover shortly.

i have visited vancouver before and have tasted the scene there, but i do have some questions for those who might know:

- what is "john watch?" what do they do?

- heard reports of "john cameras" - are they related? what's the scoop?

- what other common legal issues does one usually encounter up there? car confirep001ion, etc?

03-11-03, 23:31
originally posted by johnnycomet
hi guys-

- what is "john watch?" what do they do?

- heard reports of "john cameras" - are they related? what's the scoop?

- what other common legal issues does one usually encounter up there? car confirep001ion, etc?

john watch is private security hired by local businesses, they seem to be only on the low track and only during the day (anyone seen them out at night??)

all they do it "intimidate by presence" that is they drive around and park by sw and deter customers, they might take down license paltes or call le if they see something illegal going on.

have seen some cameras up but not lately they all seemed to disapeared... not sure if the ones i saw up were real.

in canada no car confirep001ion yet, the only thig illegal about picking up a sw is communicating for the purtposes fo prostitution so if you pick up and drive off before discussing anything you are usually safe, nothing illegal about having a sw in car. also outcall is legal but in call could get busted under body house law (rare). check un-circ's site for a good lowdown on the law.

so about the bay area?? i go to san jose mountian view area often and find it dry dry dry, any advice (besides driving so sf).


03-12-03, 00:31
depends on what you're looking for. for street action, sf, oakland, and hayward are ok- but beware of car confirep001ion laws in the east bay. lots of robs, but some hidden gems. stings aplenty too.

san jose and the peninsula are dead for sw. there are some iffy mp and a bunch of incall /outcall providers.

sf is the best. amazing strip clubs, mp's and lots of providers of all types. it's worth the drive.

check out www.sfredbook.com for more info. the message boards have info as well as classifieds. i've had a vip membership and found it invaluable.

if you have any more tips about vancouver, i could use it- i'll be there in 2 weeks. i checked out www.perb.ca but found it a little lacking...


originally posted by oberon1999

so about the bay area?? i go to san jose mountian view area often and find it dry dry dry, any advice (besides driving so sf).

oberon [/i]

03-12-03, 05:14
actually there are a few provinces already confirep001iong johns' cars: manitoba, nova scotia, and possibly saskatchewan. there have been calls for this outrageous tactic (mostly from the abbotsford area) in bc in recent years, but i haven't heard of any proposals currently before the bc legislature (or parliament) in victoria. the next province to fall could be alberta, according to an item i came across yesterday:


i don't know about the rest of you, but much of the reasoning for adopting this seems pretty flimsy to me ("this bill will reduce sexual assaults..."). do you really think the pickton's and similar johns who get off on beating, torturing, or killing hookers are going to be deterred because their beater vehicles might be confirep001ed? it's more likely to deter the otherwise upstanding yuppie and novice johns, while veterans like myself will surely find a way around it--possibly by making the initial contact on foot or bicycle. in canada, these car forfeiture laws are being enacted at the provincial level (while in the u.s. they seem to be exclusively enacted at the city level), so i guess the question is whether the current liberal regime (which seems far from the literal definition of "liberal" from what i've seen) would pass such a law.

here's the link to my legal page, for those interested:


03-12-03, 21:08

As always give un-circ's site a good read. Here are my thoughts on the various tracks in Vancouver.

Low--> Cordova St from Gore Ave east to Clarke (last bit is actually an alley behind Loomis Courier warehouse.

Mid--> Franklin and Pandora St on the North; Hastings St to the south, Clarke to the West and Victoria to the East.

Those are the only areas I frequent, there are more on Kingsway in Surrey etc but I don't go there so I have no comments on them.


03-14-03, 18:33
originally posted by un_circumcised
actually there are a few provinces already confirep001iong johns' cars: manitoba, nova scotia, and possibly saskatchewan. there have been calls for this outrageous tactic (mostly from the abbotsford area) in bc in recent years, but i haven't heard of any proposals currently before the bc legislature (or parliament) in victoria. the next province to fall could be alberta, according to an item i came across yesterday:


<<<snip>>>here's the link to my legal page, for those interested:


the alberta bill in the link is in first reading, so it has a ways to go before becoming law.

here is one amendment porposed....

(3) in determining an appeal of a seizure or immobilization under section 173.1, the board may order the release of the motor vehicle if the board is satisfied that

(a) the owner could not reasonably have known that the vehicle was being operated in the course of committing an offence referred to in section 173.1,

(b) at the time the vehicle was seized, the driver was in possession of it without the knowledge and consent of its owner, or

(c) it is the first time that the person has been charged with an offence referred to in section 173.1 and that person is eligible for, and consents to be dealt with by way of, a program of alternative measures under section 717(1)(a) of the criminal code (canada

so first time offenders might get lucky.... all in all i never understand how these things can happen if you have been convicted of nothing!!!!!!


03-15-03, 05:33
Thanks for pointing that out. I didn't bother to click on the link to the bill on the CBC page. The way I understand it, the government can't take OWNERSHIP of the vehicle until the john is convicted--yet they can still seize and hold it until then--based solely on the cops' view of the situation. It does sound outrageous, but with much of forfeiture taking place in the U.S. the various federal, state, and local governments can and do take ownership of property absent a conviction. The stolen goods
in the Seattle area are unloaded at something called "The Woodinville Public Auto Auction" -- with the proceeds usually going to the LE agency responsible for the seizure. This heavy-handedness and blatant conflict of interest has spurred forfeiture reform efforts in some states (the voters approved one in Oregon, but a similar initiative here in WA failed to make the ballot the last 2 years, and it looks like supporters are taking this year off). I think this forfeiture tactic really took off in the U.S. during the "war on drugs" hysteria of the late '80s, and was expanded to include other "crimes" like prostitution in the '90s. Of course the notion that a john should lose a vehicle worth thousands of dollars over a $50 sex deal is absurd, but it illustrates the degree to which our hobby is reviled by much of society.

My editorial on why johns should be angry about forfeiture (even if they're currently not subjected to it):


03-17-03, 04:20
I've revamped my legal page. It now has links to the VPD's pages on DISC and the Lower Mainland john school (which was being held in New Westminster the last I heard). I also added more links to Canadian federal law related to prostitution, and moved my recommended list of legal books to this page. If anyone knows of other links they think should be on this page, or disagrees with my interpretation of laws (I'm not a lawyer), don't hesitate to let me know.


03-17-03, 19:05
Vancouver MID Track in News

There was a TV new story over the weekend about the MID track. The North Hastings Merchants assc. was compaining about the increased drug trafficing and the amount of druggies on the streets in the area. Several mechants were interviewed saying they had had incounters with high addicts... You should no that most of the businesses in the area are not retail but are warehouses and things like processing or fabrication plants.

They were asking the city to "do something" about the problem, at least to their credit they said that they understood that increased enforcement would not fix the problem, just cause it to move elsewhere.

I must admit I have noticed an increase in drug activity on the MID and have posed about it here. It use to be that you saw lots of hookers but no real drug trafficing, that tookplace on the LOW track. But in the last few months I have seen tons of drug deals going down and lots of suspicious guys hanging around.

It may be that increased enforcement int he HAstings and Main area is the cause of this. LE now has officers doing 24hr patrols around the Carnegie Community Center on hastings and main where once there was a thriving drug market....

I'll keep ya posted if I hear or see more (no mention of the low track they showed a map of the effected area that was an exact match to the MID)


03-19-03, 12:33
Oberon, do you recall if that was on CTV (channel 32, cable 9, I think) ? That's the only station that offers some of their newscasts on the Web in the Real Player format. I looked at the beginning of the newscasts for Fri-Sun, but didn't see anything about prostitution in the headlines, and wasn't motivated to wade through hours of news to find it. I did come across an item on the CKNW site about the story, and put that on my news page:


03-19-03, 17:51
Originally posted by un_circumcised
Oberon, do you recall if that was on CTV (channel 32, cable 9, I think) ? That's the only station that offers some of their newscasts on the Web in the Real Player format. I looked at the beginning of the newscasts for Fri-Sun, but didn't see anything about prostitution in the headlines, and wasn't motivated to wade through hours of news to find it. I did come across an item on the CKNW site about the story, and put that on my news page:


I believe it was on City TV, I was just channel surfing and stopped there for a bit. I have not heard or seen any other mention of it since. I was onm the MID yesterday and other than heavey rain and thus not much action I saw no LE increase.


03-21-03, 19:42
I cruised around Surrey last night from around 12:20-2:15 AM. I wasn't expecting to see much because of the nasty weather, but I logged 3 on the lower King George Hwy stroll--the best being fair quality. There were at least 3 on 104 Ave between King George and 152 St (the best being upper fair quality), and another who I first spotted walking east on 104 bewteen 150 and 152. Then she went south on 152 to 99 Ave, then east on 99 and disappeared in some apartment complexes. This girl was top of the line in my book: late teens (probably no more than 20), nice body, nice face, light hair, Caucasian. I wasn't 100% certain she was working, but my assessment is that she probably was, based on the following: She was strolling alone on commercial streets in a high prostitution area in the middle of the night, she was carrying the classic small purse, she seemed to be checking out the passing cars (though she wasn't blatantly soliciting like other ho's in the area were), and she didn't flip me off when I slowed to a crawl to gawk at her from the other side of the street. The Whalley blocks west of King George were unusually sparse--I only logged 2 definites there (the best being fair quality). Maybe the much-publicized Whalley crackdown is having an effect. I saw marked LE making occasional sweeps of the area--but I also saw them prowling around the Guildford area (104 & 152) -- where the action seemed up from normal. I was going to check out a "24-hour" porno place on King George near 108 because I've seen suspected ho's loitering around it before, but the doors were locked. So much for truth in advertising. I decided not to continue into New West, Burnaby, and Vancouver because of the bad weather.

I used the truck crossing to enter Canada last night because I wanted to be on the border cam at the top of my site, and considered parking at the duty-free shop and waving for a couple of minutes (the cam goes through a cycle of 4 or 5 views--one of them looking at the duty-free from across the street), but I had something to do and was pressed for time. Something I noticed again last night about the Canadian side of the border is the foxy women you lot tend to have working there. In contrast, the U.S. side is mostly populated by males with precision military haircuts (one I saw recently even looked like Colin Powell--only uglier), and an occasional "dog" female. As I have since 9-11, I made it through with no birth certificate or passport again.

Seattle-Vancouver street guide:

03-22-03, 00:32
Something I noticed again last night about the Canadian side of the border is the foxy women you lot tend to have working there. In contrast, the U.S. side is mostly populated by males with precision military haircuts (one I saw recently even looked like Colin Powell--only uglier), and an occasional "dog" female. As I have since 9-11, I made it through with no birth certificate or passport again.

Seattle-Vancouver street guide:
http://www.geocities.com/un_csd/streetguide.html [/i]

It use to be in the old days you hated to get a woman customs officer, always a *****, something to prove I guess, but now a days that is not really the case. In the summer Canada Customs actually hires university students (nice babes) ....


03-25-03, 00:26
Out on the MID and LOW this noon hour, lately I have been disappointed with the MID (during daylight hours no night time experience lately).. Most of the girls I see on the MID fall in to two classes 1. old time mid track regulars like Kara or Tammi who I see when I am in a pinch but are a bit pricy (but not druggies and consistent service also you can just call up either in a pinch so why bother cruising for them) and 2. stuff that is as bad as the low end of the LOW track.

Today I saw 7 on the LOW and 4 on the MID one on the mid was Kara who disapeared quickly (not surprising since she was the best on the track) and 3 spaced druggies obviously dirty and out of it only one even looked liek she had the possiblility of cleaning up. Now on the LOW there were 7 girls in 45 min 2 of which were 7s (good) and 2 more were fair (I have problems with numbers ;-). I am sure things are different at night (certainly more choice) but I am surprised at the qulaity or lack of on the MID. Pretty soon I am going to start looking there for my 20.00 just before payday fix (I mean sex fix)...

I would be interested in hearing other peoples finding lately... anyone out there?????


03-25-03, 09:00
It's been a while since I went cruising, after my my experience behingd the dumpster, I haven't been all that keen, but I have been seeing this girl Katt who has several websites.
www.thepillowbook.com and www.eroticmania.com. she is into the BDSM scene. I am her foot lover, she is not a pro in the true sense of the word, but she does like getting "gifts" from her men. I bought her two pairs of fuck me shoes and some tights etc, and she gave me a really good foot job and foot fucking and some trampling, her husband isn't into feet, so I take care of that. She is into shaving her head and wigs and other freaky stuff, but she is very sweet, check out her websites.

Last weekend I took the pop bottles to the the depot near the MID track and saw just one girl who was tweaking, so I stayed away from her. The best times to cruise are around 5pm on the MId track as guys are getting off work expecially a week after welfare Wedsday.

Well, you wanted a report, so here it is long as it is too. enjoy!

03-27-03, 20:46

I know the feeling, i really do enjoy the "hunt" on the strret but there certainly are time when a sure thing with a known level of service is what you want.. I go through phases where I spend a lot of time on the street looking and doing but then I seem to go back to just looking for awhile (usually means I can't find anything new so I take a break until a new crop shows up).


03-28-03, 20:40
Dawn on the MID

Picked up Dawn on the MID track yesterday, initial looks were good, naked she has a large scar on stomach (probably C section). Dawn is a strawberry blonde, once she got naked I realized i had picked here up before she has changed hair colour and style so that tricked me... bottom line not worth the 50 I paid for FS... SHe is good looking (for MID) and nice body other than the scar BUT this was without a doubt the most rushed time i have ever spent with a SW (and I have a few rushed ones). She was on her back with legs spread before I had my pants down and was dressed and heading out the door before I had them back up :-(

Too bad, she could be a good f*** if she slowed down some. Also hardly said a word..

Used the usual hotel, they knew here and were not too keen about letting her in?? she was also very nervous when cops came by..


03-30-03, 22:31
Friday night, low track, 10pm to midnight, decent numbers but high turnover so when anyone over a 3 appeared she got snapped up quick. Several girls I recognized from previous cruises would appear but be gone on the next circuit. Found Ashley, med height blond, slim figure, black sweater buttoned to the neck but unfastened between the breasts so that her chest flashed through as she walked. Caught my attention immediately, turned the corner to circle back and as I approached she flicked up her skirt, revealing her bare bum. I thought she was wearing a thong, but later found out she was sans panties. Found a quiet spot only to discover she'd falled asleep. She woke up when I parked, then woke me up. I said I had a green, she said that was fine and immediately did a bbbjtc without another word then opened the car door to spit. She fell asleep again on the way back to Hastings (I'd picked her up on Cordova and Heatley) and I had to nudge her shoulder to wake her. On the way home there was a pudgy blond on the north side of Cordova, on either Princess or Heatley, who looked a dead ringer for the wife of a coworker of mine. I'd seen her before, she doesn't come out often but if I see her again with the cash in my pocket I'll see if I can greek the proxy doxy. Heck, if she's as close of a resemblance as she seems from cruising distance maybe she'll let me take a picture of her slurping on my schlong that I could pin to the bulletin board...

04-01-03, 06:59
I live in Seattle, but will be spending some weekends in Vancouver as the weather gets nicer. I'd really appreciate if you experienced BC hobbyists could offer some suggestions:

I don't have a car and will be gettting around via bicycle. I'd like to get a motel/hotel relatively close to mid-track stroll(s), and would prefer to stay in an area that is at least "decent". The more specific you can be, the better.

Also, I'd like to get a general idea of what the price range is: Specifically, how much for BJ (CBJ & BBBJ), FS, and greek (this is what I'm most interested in). Thanks...

04-01-03, 17:47
Originally posted by EastlakeHorndog
I don't have a car and will be gettting around via bicycle. I'd like to get a motel/hotel relatively close to mid-track stroll(s), and would prefer to stay in an area that is at least "decent". The more specific you can be, the better.

Also, I'd like to get a general idea of what the price range is: Specifically, how much for BJ (CBJ & BBBJ), FS, and greek (this is what I'm most interested in). Thanks...


Short of the no name hotel there is nothing right in the MID area, you might try the Patricia on the LOW. I have never been in it but from the outside it looks passable... It advertizes itself as a "economy tourist Hotel" whatever that is. I doubt they would allow you girls in the room so where you go with the girl and you bike I don't know..????

Also I assume you ride your bike a fair bit so staying in downtown Vancouver (West end) would only be 10 min from the MID of course again I don't know where you go with the girl.

As for prices, I normally cruise during the day when prices seem higher but last greek was 50 last BBBJ was 40 last FS was 60 (yeah I know more than the greek, I had a big hard on and was in a rush). At night I am sue you could knock 10 off each of those if you have nay negotiation skills. (these prices were all on the MID). I also have regulars I pay 100 to for 50-50 back at their place, a bit expaensive but reliable.

I'm sure you'll enjoy yourself


04-02-03, 02:42
Originally posted by EastlakeHorndog
I don't have a car and will be gettting around via bicycle. I'd like to get a motel/hotel relatively close to mid-track stroll(s), and would prefer to stay in an area that is at least "decent". The more specific you can be, the better.

Also, I'd like to get a general idea of what the price range is: Specifically, how much for BJ (CBJ & BBBJ), FS, and greek (this is what I'm most interested in). Thanks... Last I checked the Patricia was preternaturally pricey, they jacked their prices up for the '86 expo and kept them that way. Check out www.translink.bc.ca because there are buses running 24 hrs a day along Hastings or if you get a nice hotel downtown you're barely a $5 (can) taxi ride from the two tracks. Buy a beer at the Astoria Hotel (for god's sake don't get a room there) on the corner of Hastings and Hawks and stroll the low track. There are really a lot of gems hidden amongst the broken windshield glass, and as Oberon points out prices are good late at night. I routinely offer .2 for bj (which is often bareback if girls forget to bring rubbers) which halfway through can be upgraded to fs for another .1, and hey after a while of that you can offer another .1 or .2 for greek. Um, if you're going this far I should repeat that part about the girls sometimes forgetting to bring their own condoms.

04-02-03, 17:44
Patricia Hotel..

I always wondered if they were cheap or expensive, I guess they are worried about what would happen if they lowered their prices. Speaking of the Astoria, ever been in Pats Pub (pub attached to patricia)? Eastlake , phil is right the distances from the "good" part of downtown to the low are very short and the MID is just beyond the LOW.

I'll also restate a recent obesrvation that lately I see as many good lookers on the LOW as I do on the MID...



04-03-03, 00:10
John Watch -- bicycles

I notice on the East end of the LOW today two guys sitting on bikes about 50 ft from a couple of SW, they were in gray and black jackets that said York Security, this is the same company that does the John Watch car patrols..

I took another look at www.johnwatch.com today, not much there.. These guy cn of course do nothing to you, I have talked to a few girls who say they have been hasseled by them.

I also don't know if these guys are around at night... anyone seen them


04-03-03, 07:35
Thanks for pointing out that JohnWatch site, Oberon--I added the link to my legal page:


I don't know if you saw the list of vehicle descriptions they've been compiling, but they don't contain any part of the license plate number, so it seems quite meaningless:


04-03-03, 10:20
Originally posted by un_circumcised
...I don't know if you saw the list of vehicle descriptions they've been compiling, but they don't contain any part of the license plate number, so it seems quite meaningless:

http://www.johnwatch.com/cgi-bin/csvsearch.pl?search=Search+for&method=any [/i]They also stopped adding vehicles January 15th. Keeping web pages up to date is hard work.

I also have a query... there is a trim figured sw appearing intermittently on either Heatley or Hawks from early evening to well after midnight, 1920s style bobbed hair cut, looks as if she could be cast as Wallice Simpson (the American divorcee Duchess of Edinborough) on PBS' Masterpiece Theatre. She disappeared for a few months, was back the other night but was gone before I could catch her on the return circuit. It's obvious she's developed a loyal clientele. Does anyone have a name (or review) to go with the face?

04-03-03, 17:45
I don't know if you saw the list of vehicle descriptions they've been compiling, but they don't contain any part of the license plate number, so it seems quite meaningless:

http://www.johnwatch.com/cgi-bin/csvsearch.pl?search=Search+for&method=any [/i]

Yeah saw that, does make it useless......

As I said I think the whole thing is just based on waht the military would call a visible deterent. I assume if the rent a cops found you doing something obviously illegal they would call the real cops... Also I do not know if they are around after business hours??

Was out twice yesterday just looking saw good numbers on LOW and MID...

LE on the MID, the last 2 days I have noticed more LE on the MID especially arounf triumph and victoria, Mostly seem concerned with drug dealing at least that is who they were busting today, I see lots of obvious "buys" going down...


Tom Thumb
04-06-03, 04:09
I'm planing A trip to Vancouver And would like some advice on escort services in the area?are they any good or is it better to look for A SW?. Tell me what is low and mid?? Will SW be willing to go with you to your hotel?and is this A good idea to do this.

Thanks for any help.


04-07-03, 17:09
Originally posted by Tom Thumb
I'm planing A trip to Vancouver And would like some advice on escort services in the area?are they any good or is it better to look for A SW?. Tell me what is low and mid?? Will SW be willing to go with you to your hotel?and is this A good idea to do this.

Escort services are usually more expensive but might be better looking etc. Costs run around 200.00 cdn for 30-60 min maybe more with popular girls, there are LOTS of escorts in Vancouver best to look on www.perb.ca to find some info...

Because Vancouver has a reasonablby open sex trade the SW tend to group by price so LOW is low price area generally low quality MID, and HIGH are the other rpice ranges. Now in myu opinion LOW and MID are blending into one.

Check out Un-circ's web page (link a few posts below) for a geographic description of where the tracks are.


Tom Thumb
04-07-03, 22:53
Hey Oberon,

Thanks so much for that advice.It was helpful,I guess I well check it out when I get up there.


04-08-03, 04:25
Thanks for the suggestions everyone. What I'll probably do is just get a motel/hotel room in the downtown area, then check out the strolls on foot. When I find something I like, we can just take a cab back to my room, or else just go to her place (if it's safe).

As far as bringing a SW back to your hotel, I think it's probably OK. I was up in Vancouver about five years ago. I stayed in a decent hotel downtown, and when I checked in the clerk told that if I have any visitors, there is a $15 'visitors fee' (of course he was talking about prostitutes).

04-08-03, 07:21
I had a wild time last Saturday(29th). I went out late and ended up at the Drake, I had a double rum & coke, and had a good lap dance, but no she wouldn't go home with me :-)

I went walking(stumbling) around the low track, when I spotted a sw, I hadn't seen before(sorry forgot her name), she was dressed in a nice skirt, hand had grey hair, at first she didn't want to go ut with me, but after walking around in the rain, I agreed to go to her place and pay the $20 guest fee at the West Hotel.

She is a talker, so I thought I would get a decent GFE, but it fell short along the way. I paid $40 and got a covered bj, but she was too rough, so I just gave myself a handjob. Her body is ok, but, she had too many restrictions, no kissing no boob sucking no going down no this and no that. It was over soon, and she saw me out.

Now here is the wild part: I live just a mile or so from the low track, so getting home shouldn't have been a problem. Well, I lost my watch somewhere along the way, so I missed my bus and tried to get a cab, well furgitaboutit!

No busses and no cabs, and I didn't feel like walking home in the rain, so I had to find a hotel. I walked and walked and finaly got a room at the Crown Plazza( the old Georgia Hotel), the room was $125, when I got to the room, I found out it was 2:30am! Well, I couldn't sleep, so I found the Naked News on the Pay Per View and got re-introduced to Mr. Hand!

So guys, here's the lesson, Watch out for the girls shoe look good in clothes, don't use you watch and when you see a cab grab it!

04-08-03, 22:50

Vancover LE have said they have tripled the number of LE patroling the downtown east side in an effort to crack down on drug dealers. Apparently this is a 3 month trial with it's continuation depending on city providing $$ which is far from a sure thing.

I did a drive around the LOW and MID today and saw a few SW (it was pouring rain) and one unmarked LE with 1 person in the car. Hardly a massive enforcement..

We will have to see what happens, my bet long term not much.


Wed AM The city did not provide funding so the crackdown runs for 3 months max. it appears to be targeted at drug dealers and stolen property (sold to buy drugs)...

oberon (again)

04-12-03, 17:06
Watch out, visitors and denizens of Vancouver, because the car thieves here are aggressive as hell. I went to the Shine disco in Gastown Thursday night, and someone broke into my car and stole my speakers. They also ripped out my tuner / tape deck, but decided they didn't want it. The thing that really surprised me was the brazenness of the robbery: I was parked on Cordova at Cambie, and there was a regular stream of vehicles passing by. In addition, there was a club on the opposite side of the intersection from where I was parked with a fair number of people loitering around the front when I left. These thieves weren't as subtle as the ones who grabbed my cell phone last year, and they shattered my driver's side window with a rock to gain access to the inside. I'm surprised no pedestrian or driver saw the attack--or at least dared not to inervene. The window and speakers can be replaced, but the thing that most upset me is that I was astonishingly high on marijuana and psychedelics--and would have remained deliciously so for the next 24 hours (I'm still noticeably high as I type this Saturday morning) -- so my plan was to stay in town through Friday night, check all the strolls out to New Westminster, and pick up a ho or two. Instead, I had to drive back to Snohomish County very high with no driver's side window and no tunes. Not fun!

The only stroll I passed by that night was the old high track--and there were the usual half-dozen good quality (but surely overpriced) women.

Seattle-Vancouver street guide:

04-13-03, 11:56

Sorry to hear about your vehicle being broken into. With all the pedestrians and passing cummuters in plain sight of your vehicle, I am surprised of the perpetrators tenacity of such a crime. As I mentioned before in the past in the Seattle forum, I would not be surprised if it were some anti-American gesture initiated by some young punks that would commit such an act. Maybe they thought that fellow Canadians would be more than happy to turn a blind eye on in extending their disappointment of Americans and the geopolitical stance we have taken as of late. I had heard that some tourist up from the U.S. have experienced a rash of vehicle vandalism in the recent months. Border agents also warned visiting americans to be vigilant when travelling abroad. I can't tell you how many Canadians i have talked to, explicitly voice their outrage at our behavior regarding our foreign relations. Hopefully, time will heal all wounds and once more, Americans and Canadians can be, once more, congenial to one another.


04-13-03, 15:34
low mid high and tourist tracks
me and a buddy decided to get a map and mark all the relative spots on uncirc's site. here are the unofficial results. the tourist track had one tranny on richards and davie streets not my cup of tea. we then cruised the kingsway hwy saw about 10 good quality mid track girls and about three absolute stunners.went around the mid and low saw various nice looking women and girls but like a kids in a candy shop my buddy nor i could choose. we drove from mid to approx 3 am even checking out the tranny sub track on raymur. i think there were about 5 tranny,s working under or by that overpass. we passed by one time to witness a guy getting a fast and furious blowjob by a brunette tranny pretty hiliarious if ya ask me.so we finnally settled on this jenny girl nice and young we both wanted bj's and she said 20 each i was dumfounded we immediatly found a place to park i took a walk while my buddy took care of his business and then it was my turn i got a bbbj and as soon as i saw her ti#s i had to have full service she asked for 20 more i said no prob and i got unwrapped full service.now normally i would not do this so all you aids activist i just dont want to here it this time okay.anyway great night 60 canadian for 2 bbbj and full service.a incredible deal oh yeah the girl i would rate a 8-9 on a seattle scale and a 7-8 on a vancover scale. she is about 5-5 to 5-8 shorter straight brown hair she was wearing red pants. i picked her up on the western end of the mid track sorry i cant remember the streets all i can say now is viva canada

04-14-03, 00:21

That really sucks about your car. I can't say I blame Candadians for being pissed at the U.S. for the war (I'm pissed off myself), but it's unfortunate that the person who broke into your car didn't car that this act would have no positive impact. After all, the more money we Americans spend in Canada, the better it is for them.

On a related subject, has anyone had any experiences strolling of SWs on foot? Before I make my trip, I just wanted to check. It sounds like SWs are so abundant in Vancouver, taking one back to my hotel/motel shouldn't be a problem.

04-14-03, 03:29
I don't think they are picking on Americans down there. Thieves will just as happily steal from my car as well as yours. The areas is well known for car robberies & there have been many reports of break-ins in the past. I have seen 1 report on BCTV where they park in Gastown, and within a few minutes (this was at noon), a guy would walk by and give the car a shake. When they realize there is no alarm they come back with a tire iron and break in. After the news crew stopped the guy he admitted he had been caught over 70 times, with some of the cases still pending. They followed the story to the courts where the guy got off with a suspended sentence!
If you don't have an alarm I suggest you don't park there. If you have a club, it is useless since most of the crimes are "smash & grab"
Though I have not been out with a sw for a while, I was getting home late on Saturday night and though the Kingsway area between Rupert & Boundry was dead, going west was much more active than usual. There must have been over a dozen girls out with 5 of them at the Blockbuster/KFC corner. This is usually a good sign as prices are better west.

04-14-03, 06:36
[QUOTE]Originally posted by EastlakeHorndog

On a related subject, has anyone had any experiences strolling of SWs on foot?

Not having a car, that's how I do it. It has it's advantages, such as not getting my car broken in while being high on ilegal substances, but if you have read my past postings, if you can't find a cab then you are sunk.

The "guest" fees in the SOR's is $20 and some girls may not want you to pay that, but as long as you have a room it should be ok, but be carefull who you pick up especially on the low track.

04-14-03, 09:28
"On a related subject, has anyone had any experiences strolling of SWs on foot?"

Yes, this can be pretty fun. You get to see the girls up close and personal, which can also be kinda scary. During the day they'll want to go back to their place, but at night you can usually pick up someone off the low track and just walk a few blocks north or south and find a secluded spot. I'll try for a kiss, as she'll either be willing or will jump right for your johnson to avoid the lip lock. Several words of warning; you'll want to do this on a night when it's not raining (which we don't receive with any more frequency than Seattle) and you'll damn sure not want to be carrying your wallet in your back pocket when you drop your trousers, as it might not make it back up again. On the plus side nothing will go missing from your car or even worse nothing will appear when you least expect it (condom wrappers, used condoms, syringes etc.) Some girls won't go with you if you don't have a car, but there was one girl once who was too shy to go all the way to the curb where the cruising hobbyists could see her and would just smile and shyly say "hi" when I walked past. I gave her a green and she started a cbj, but obviously didn't know what she was doing so I stood her up, pulled down her pants and bent her over some wooden crates in the alley, and when I was done she gave me a hug and wandered off. Never saw her again, but I still walk through the low track from time to time.

04-14-03, 17:22
Car Break ins and US Canada Relations

Un-circ, sorry man I know what a pain it is to have your vehicle broken into or stolen (I'm at 4 breakins and 1 theft in 15 year in Vancouver).... As has been said in previous posts I hope it was not targeted attack due to US plates, actually I doubt it was, vandalism maybe but theft is for drug money in Vancouver. Thieves are brazen no doubt about it and our courts appear useless, cops are pissed and feeling like they are wasing their time. I mean I am all for giving someone a change to change their ways but F**k at some point you have to do something.

The reason the thieves are so daring is they know nothing is going to happen to them.

I have heard a few stories of Canadians being hasseled or refused service for not suporting the USA, hopefully not a trend and cooler heads will prevail soon.


04-14-03, 23:55

Please be really careful around the low track area. There have been a lot of "smash & grab" type of crimes and I personally know few Asians (Chinatown is nearby) were robbed at knife point. These crimes will never be reported to the public as Asians tend not to report even violent crimes. Good luck and stay safe.

04-15-03, 23:12
Tuesday Report

Got a hard on so went and found one of my regulars working the edge of the MID, asked her how things were going in light of the reported LE crackdown. She said that during the day when she works she noticed no difference, but talking to other girls she said there was more LE around at night at least until midnight then maybe back to normal again (overtime on the night shift is expensive I guess). My daytime travels confirm her statements.

Sounds like an increased LE presense but no increase in stings (YMMV).... Girls said they wer just getting told to move on or quizzed a lot.......,

Went back to her place and had a good time.


04-17-03, 04:56
Thanks for all your suggestions everyone. When on foot, it sounds like my safest bet is to focus on the mid-track strolls. Since SWs are so prevalent in Vancouver (at least relative to here in Seattle), it sounds like you can find decent quality for a reasonable price. Before I leave for Vancouver, I'll be sure to check out Uncirc's stroll guide and read this board thoroughly.

04-18-03, 18:56
Cruised the Surrey strolls last night at about 11PM then 1:30AM. Dead! Maybe saw 3 the whole drive. Anyone know what's happening? Even 104 & KG strip was empty.

04-19-03, 07:48
I cruised by the Surrey/Whalley strolls last night also. Didn't spend too much time, make a couple of passes through and out. I did notice that it was real quiet compared to what it had been. Noticed several LE stops of vehicles. Could be that, or could be that there were lots of cruisers out. I counted about 4 or 5 SWs and all had been picked up when I did my second swing around. Maybe with Friday being a holiday there were more guys out.

04-19-03, 09:43
eastlakehorndog, since you are from seattle, maybe you can explain something to me? what is the deal with the pike street area? i was in seattle last october, and i went to deja vu. it looks fun from the ouside, but it's a real dump inside, then i went next door to the bookstore, and i was solicited inside the bookstore and i went for the peep show. and they were quite open about the masturbation show she would put on and of course i followed suit on the other side of the glass. if soliciting is illegal, then how do they get away with it?

i had a very curious time to say the least!

Granola Boy
04-19-03, 12:21
I took a look at un_circumcised's stroll guide tonight & on my way home (around 11:30), headed towards the low & mid-tracks. There were 3 LE on Hastings...one of them was just idling the car at the corner of Hastings & Main.

I stopped up near Clark & turned the corner. I guess it was on the edge of the low-mid track, but still part of the low-track. Got a girl for CBJ for 20.00. Terrible CBJ. She looked a little tricked out. It was my first time in my car & it's really uncomfortable. She said her name is Michelle & I felt her breasts. They must've been around 34 A.

Dropped her off near Gore & Hastings. After that experience, I doubt I'll do that again.

I drove up some more into the mid-track, but I didn't stop in the mid-track. Should have, but with the reports of LE stings...

Went onto the Kingsway track around 12:30...noticed 6 SWs...There were no LE in sight. Wasn't too confident on bargaining & headed on Kingsway into New West. Saw one girl on Kingsway & 13th...ewww...saw two on Kingsway & 11th. One was about 5'6"...name was Dominique...the other was about 6'1"...major BBW...name's Morgan...went with Morgan...she wanted 80 for CBJ! Little head was talking & I'd never been with BBW, so I thought I'd try it out. She asked if I had extra to show her chest...they were huge...she mentioned 42DD. I don't think she was joking. She gave a really good CBJ & was very talkative.

All in all an interesting night. Maybe I'll have more gumption to try the Kingsway strip...although...MSOG is for me...

Sailor Guy
04-23-03, 08:46
Tricia (I think) on the mid,

Hi all, been cruising for awhile and figured I would start sharing. Was out at around 4pm and spotted a cute one I hadn't seen on Salsbury just north of Franklin. 20ish, petite, medium blond ponytail, nicely dressed. Anyway, I'm a sucker for nice petite blondes so off we go. When back to her place for 1/2 and 1/2. VERY nice cbj with deep throat...a very nice surprise. No rush followed by cowgirl, mish and doggie. Very active and aimed to please. Definitely one of my better mid-track experiences. Price did reflect better service with a cutie...80 + 10 room fee but definitely beat out some of the lame $60 car dates I've experienced.

04-24-03, 00:04
I received the following e-mail yesterday:

"You may want to place a little dot on the Kingsway section of your street guide -- I observed stings there last Thursday evening/night in 2 separate locations. One was on St. Catherines St near "Broco Auto Glass", where 2 stings were successful, and the other near Nanaimo on the side street south of Kingsway between the Canadian Tire and the Eldorado motel. In both cases 2 of the Crown Victorias with the small funny lights in the roof were used, and entailed about 5 or 6 people besides the decoy."

Of course this report would have more credibility if it came from a longtime poster to this board, but the detail tends to support its veracity. Then again, maybe it's LE trying to create some paranoia on the cheap.

Seattle-Vancouver street guide (http://www.geocities.com/un_csd/streetguide.html)

04-24-03, 04:12
Originally posted by visaman
[QUOTE]Originally posted by EastlakeHorndog

On a related subject, has anyone had any experiences strolling of SWs on foot?

Not having a car, that's how I do it. It has it's advantages, such as not getting my car broken in while being high on ilegal substances, but if you have read my past postings, if you can't find a cab then you are sunk.

The "guest" fees in the SOR's is $20 and some girls may not want you to pay that, but as long as you have a room it should be ok, but be carefull who you pick up especially on the low track.


I don't frequent adult bookstores or stripclubs that often. To me it's like stare at food you can't eat; very frustrating. As far as I know of someone openly solicited you in a bookstore, it's illegal. There are two possibilities: 1) it's a sting, 2) you got lucky.

04-24-03, 07:10
well, i don't know horndog, it seemed like a legit operation, or as leget as you can get. it was like the peep booth i was in in las vegas, and from what i've seen on tv.

04-24-03, 22:33
Surrey bylaw Proposal

I heard on the radio this Am that Sureey is considering a new bylaw to ban SW from working around schools....

How you would inforce this I don't know???\

Apparently Calgary use to have a similar law that was never inforced, go figure...

Also Surrey removed the roadblocks they put up a week or so ago, supposidly to make it easier for LE and Paramedics to get around???


04-25-03, 00:29
Not exposing young kids to SWs might be a good idea, but how the hell do you enforce it. Ticket the SW, haul her off to court. How many times would she have to be in court for a bylaw infraction before the court gave her a no go area? This would be a bylaw infraction, not the criminal code.

People (media) always seem to be using Calgary as a successful model. They still have SWs on their streets, they have at least 3 different strolls, the only difference between Calgary and say Vancouver is that there isn't as many SWs on the street. It probably has a lot more to do with the bloody cold weather more than enforcement.

Just look what happens in Vancouver when it rains - the numbers of SWs out drop significantly. Even worse when it snows.

I used to live in Calgary for several years and we went through periods of heavy LE presence and then it would stop for a while.

Granola Boy
04-25-03, 02:01
I did a check on the Terms & Abbreviations page, but there is no mention of:

"SOR's" as in the quote of:

"The "guest" fees in the SOR's is $20 and some girls may not want you to pay that, but as long as you have a room it should be ok, but be carefull who you pick up especially on the low track. "

Please advise?

04-25-03, 02:59
SOR's are Single Occupancy Rooms. Such as Hotels and the like.

04-25-03, 08:21
During rush hour 3:30 PM, or an hour after that, there's always this tall black girl (5'11)? who hangs around Heatley, Jackson, and Dunlevy. I spotted an older gentleman in business suit and trench coat furnishings, probably an senior executive in his late fiftes, approach her, talk, then they walked all the way to the side hotel on Jackson between Cordova and Hastings. Heh she kept looking sideways both ways, but up they went. Seemed like a regular customer.

I've seen this girl out a lot. Anyone try her?

Granola Boy
04-25-03, 09:50
Went out on the mid-track...according to un_circ's guide...saw a First Nations girl & a caucasian girl...spoke up with the F.N. girl. After a lot of humming & hawing...we agreed to 45.00 for FS...I was a little stunned. Got a room for 20.00 at a "home"...it was kind of a gross place...brought in my own blanket...

She did a fairly good CBJ, then missionary, then cowgirl...then missionary & finished with a covered HJ...

She was fairly big chested (she mentioned 38D)...I was shocked...

She looks like she's done her share of rock, but didn't seem like it when I saw her.

One thing to note though...there was one notice of LE paddywagon in the mid-...

04-25-03, 15:43
I'll reply to a few posts below..

EMBASY -- Yeah I agree with you, how do you inforce this, be kinda funny if some kids mom got a ticket, that would probably be the end of it :-))

POORGUY -- hmm I am often in that area at that time and have not seen her, I'll have to keep my eyes open, I got a thing for leggy black women (got a thing for most women actually)... :-))

ASHROID -- I went through the mid 6am today 5 girls out one looked like your F.N. girl, I've seen here out a lot, today she looked better than most times I've seen her, usually looks pretty strung out during the day. By "home" do mean one of the rooming houses in Triumph by Victoria, I was in one once, pretty grim. By the way two other on the mid were ok lookin both regulars..