Moscow [Archive] - Page 5 - InternationalSexGuide

Stravinsky

02-18-07, 08:58

Well, I am ashamed to admit it, but I got skunked.

I thought I would try the Erotic-Massage.ru salon at Stundencheskaya. There's a new girl there, Zhenya, who looks worthwhile. I've never been there before, and there aren't a lot of reports coming out of there, and now I know why.

I called first, of course, before I left, to get the location (495) 109-00-64, and I discovered a new twist on Moscow addresses. The girl I spoke with told me that the salon is located at 22 Studenchyeskaya, Korpus 1. I wasn't quite sure what that meant, but the map made it clear. There are 3 large buildings at 22 Studencheskaya, Korpus 1, 2 and 3. The 3 of them together make up the "body" of that address. The girl told me to call back when I was at the building and she would give me the podyezd/kvartira.

The problem with Studencheskaya is... you can't get there from here. I had to transfer to 4 different Metro stations before I finally arrived, at the Studencheskaya stop. I was down in the Metro for almost an hour and by the time I arrived, it was past 17:00. But then, of course you have to get to the salon from the Metro station.

The salon is located in a purely residential neighborhood, so there is no public transportation. No buses, no taxis, no marshroots, not even a promising Zhiguli I could flag down. My only option would be to walk. If this were August, no problem. But the weather has turned cold again (cold in Moscow being anything below freezing). It's probably close to -10C. And then, of course, by the time I was finished, I would have to walk back. So, I decided that discretion is the better part of valor and turned around and left. This one will be a tough nut to crack.

Puzir isn't too far away, so I thought I'd head over there. Back to the circle line and over to Park Kultury to get the train to Universitet. My, my, my... there are a LOT of people down here. How many Russians can you fit through a turnstile at rush hour? Take the maximum babushka circumference (in cm.) and subtract the minimum dyeffki waist (in cm.). Multiply that by the maximum attainable compression factor, divide that by the standard deviation of the number of people not directly in the stream of traffic and
that should give you pretty good idea.

The train to Universitet is packed with (surprise, surprise) college kids. They are waving red and white flags, singing songs and generally carrying on. At Sportivnaya, they all pile off. Must be some kind of sporting event? In -10 weather? Could only be hockey.

Puzir is quiet, it's about 18:00. The day girls are leaving and the night girls haven't showed up yet. The shashlik and a couple of beers are 540r. I know that Erotic-Massage.ru has one of their salons not too far from here, on Leninski, but unfortunately, I neglected to add their phone number to my mobilni, so I can't call to get the address. Bummer, I guess this means I don't qualify for my prostitutki locating merit badge.

So, I decide to head back home. But, before I get there I have one last chance to salvage the evening. I have the number of a girl on intimcity.ru that advertises as tol'ka vuiyezd (outcall only). Her name is Olesa, and, I actually have her number in my mobilni 8-(905)-731-66-48.

I give her a call, and, miracle of miracles, she answers the phone. Yes, she is working tonight. No, she's not busy right now. Yes, she can be at my apartment in 1 hour.

I head back to the apt. to get ready for my guest and a little over an hour later, the phone rings and she is downstairs. I buzz her in, but when I open the door there are 2 girls. Olesa and Alyona. Hmmm... interesting.

So, I'm not quite sure what to make of this. Turns out Olesa and Alyona are the same age, 18, have the same birthday, in a couple of days, grew up right next to each other in the same apartment building, so they are sort of inseperable. Whatever Olesa does, Alyona does. Well, almost... I asked Alyona if she wanted to join Olesa and me in bed, but she declined. She preferred to make herself some chai and sit in the kitchen.

"You two go ahead, don't mind me".

Olesa is tiny, less than 5 feet, maybe 4 foot 8 inches. But she's got a great bod for her small stature. http://www.intimcity.ru/persons.php?id=34736 She is also a diligent worker. Begins with an excellent covered BJ, which probably would have gone on forever if I didn't prompt her so change positions. We do it this way for a while and then that way, and then we skochki po preriya to the finish.

Meanwhile, Alyona is in the kitchen, doing the dishes.....

After we finish, Alyona calls a car service to pick them up and I bid them farewell.

So, I like this outcall business, particularly during the winter. For 4,000r, they come to me, I get my ashes hauled and my kitchen cleaned. Not a bad deal.

счастливо....

Stravinsky

02-18-07, 09:07

Some pictures I took...

There's no nikked woman, so I won't put them in the photos section

Stravinsky

02-19-07, 05:53

It's cold.

I mean... it's cold.

Too cold to be running around at night. Best to go out during the day. If the sun is shining, it can't be too bad.

I think I'll try the salon at Universitet. I give them a call, 495-107-6773, and yes, they are open, but the girl tells me that Kira is not working today. Zhalko. I was hoping to meet her, she had an excellent review in sextalk.ru, but that's the problem with weekends.

One nice thing about the weekends is that the city doesn't seem so crowded, or crazy. There are lots of people in the metro, but they're mainly families out shopping, none of that crazed pushing and shoving that you get during the week.

I come up from the metro at Universitet, and there is a group of guys, standing outside, drinking beer.... in sub-freezing temperature. Because the temperature hasn't risen above freezing in the past several days, the sidewalks have acquired a permanent layer of ice. On top of that is what's left of the last snowfall, which makes for some slippery going. In fact, it's impossible to walk, you just have to sort of skate. It's great fun for the kids, no wonder Russians make such good hockey players. What's really amazing is how the women can slide along on those 3" heels.

There is a tram station right there at the Metro station, which will take you to Leninskii Prospect. From there, it's about 70 or 80 meters pyeshkom (by foot) to 71 Leninskii. The podyezd is around in back.

They buzz me in, and the girl who opens the door ushers me into one of the rooms. A few minutes later, 2 girls enter the room and wait patiently for me to choose. There's not much to chose from, that's the problem with coming on a Saturday afternoon. The first girl is a blonde, and she looks pissed as hell about something, so I think I'll leave her alone. The second one, a brunette, has a quick smile, kind eyes, and is very soft-spoken. She looks promising. Her name is Marina http://www.erotic-massage.ru/showgirls/100/4

The girls leave and Marina returns with some chai and a towel for the shower. Marina is a sweetie pie. She's 20 and a student at the university, finishing her studies. She's from Novosibirsk, she has dark hair and almondish eyes and is very spakoina. She is in no rush at all. She's a little plump, but that just serves to fill out her figure. She gives a decent massage, first with her hands, then a body massage, which has me ready for action in no time. She is very compliant with sex, any position I want, which she seems to be able to anticipate in advance. She's a good partner.

Not a bad way to spend an afternoon...

The salon at Universitet is actually fairly easy to get to. Take the red line to
Universitet. When you exit the metro, don't go straight up the escalator, take the underground transfer to the other side of Vernadskogo, that saves you having to negotiate the traffic at the intersection.

When you come up, keep walking straight ahead towards Lomonosovski. Puzir will be on your right. Just past Puzir is the tram stop. Take any of the trams and they will take you down to Leninski. I prefer to get off at the stop on the other side of Leninski, that saves you having to negotiate the intersection on foot. Walk north on Leninski until you reach No. 71. The podyezd is around in back.

Stravinsky

02-19-07, 17:19

OK...

I'm tired of shlepping all over town trying to get laid. There's a salon within walking distance of where I'm staying. I should try that.

http://www.fantasys.nu is the website for the salon. They advertise themselves as a massazhni salon, but from the reviews I read on sextalk, the offer the polni program.

I call their number, 799-4657, and a woman answers. They are working today and will be happy to see me, but it seems important to her to know whether I have been there before or not. I tell her I haven't, and she wants to know how I heard about them. I tell her through the internet. "Podozhdi, pozhaluista" (wait a minute please), and another woman comes on the phone. She also seems to be concerned whether I have been there before and how I heard about them. She tells me to go to Strastnoi Blvd Дом 4. and call her from there.

So, I head out to Pushkinskaya. Дом 4. looks to be the buıldıng rıght next to Garazh Club. I call the salon again and speak to the woman. She asks me to find some landmarks, which lead me to an arch on Strastnoi. So, then she wants to know what I am wearing. Huh??? She says Yuri, or Dima, or someone will be down to meet me. Five minutes later, a young guy comes walking through the arch and stares around, must be him.

He takes me back through the arch and a big dvor, which opens out again on Kozitsii pereulok. We enter through the podyezd and we walk up a couple flights of stairs. This building looks like Pushkin himself might have lived here.

But, once inside the apartment, it is very nice. This place is obviously a class joint. The mistress ushers me into a big bedroom. She opens the door and the room is packed with a dozen or so gorgeous babes, all in their lingerie. They are all waiting for me to make my choice. The effect is very spectacular, but, undaunted, I quickly choose the tallest blonde I can find and away we go. Her name is Veronica.

First things first, she asks for the money, 3,000r, which I place on the dresser. She disappears with the money and then, comes back with the money. I guess they just wanted to make sure that I had it?. "Chai/kofe?", tapochki (slippers), polotyents (towel), doosh (shower), and we are ready to go.

This girl is gorgeous! And she's all mine for an hour. ;) I'm thinking that we're going to start with a massage, but Veronica is not much of a massazhistka. OK, so let's move on to the BJ, covered of course. Excellent BJ does the trick. She hops on and we skotchkii po preriya for a while until she decides that she wants to do it doggy style. OK, gorgeous, I'm with ya. The problem is, her legs are so damn long, I can't quite get the elevation lined up. Damn, that's the first time that's happened! But I sure ain't gonna waste a perfectly good hard-on trying to figure that out. I roll her over and continue to pound away missionary style.

Veronica is "nye protiv".

After we finish, I sip my chai on the bed and Veroica stares at me with these big hazel eyes, like some kind of gooney-bird. OK, gorgeous, I know you can fuck, what else you got? I try to engage her in a conversation, which is easier said than done. She's 25, from Ivanono, has been working at the salon for about six months. Graduated from the institute as an Economist (which in Russia is more like an accountant) and came to Москва looking for work. But, of course, the salon pays better (where have I heard that before?).

The hour is up, quick shower and back out on the street. On the way back to Pushkinskaya, I realize that this place is almost directly across the street from Night Flight, since Kozitsii pereulok intersects Tverskaya. So, if any of you guys are tired of buying dyevs out of NF for 300/400 bucks a pop, this place is a good alternative, the same quality, for a fraction of the price.

Best make sure you call first, you definately don't want to show up at this place unannounced.

Here's a couple pictures of Veronica I took from the website.

WYSIWYG...

Gentleman Travel

02-19-07, 22:31

OK...

http://www.fantasys.nu is the website for the salon. They advertise themselves as a massazhni salon, but from the reviews I read on sextalk, the offer the polni program.
.... On the way back to Pushkinskaya, I realize that this place is almost directly across the street from Night Flight, since Kozitsii pereulok intersects Tverskaya. So, if any of you guys are tired of buying dyevs out of NF for 300/400 bucks a pop, this place is a good alternative, the same quality, for a fraction of the price.

Best make sure you call first, you definately don't want to show up at this place unannounced.

This is an interesting option.
Would it be possible to get there and get serviced with no Russian?

Stravinsky

02-20-07, 05:04

GT,

You know...

You could try calling and speaking English. There might be someone there who speaks enough English to get by. It's worth a try. But wait until you are there in the neighborhood.

Other than that you will have to speak Russian. But remember, the salon wants your business. They are not going to hang up on you just because your Russian is not perfect. They will do their best to try and get you in.

Stravinsky

02-22-07, 15:49

Cruiser D

02-22-07, 15:52

Excuse my laziness, but how much is 3000r?

Doctor_Skank

02-22-07, 16:30

OK, back in sex prison.....

I'm sure there are arguments for visiting Moscow at any time of the year, but I think summer is the best time. It's too difficult, and expensive, to get around in the winter.

Plus, in summer, the dyeffki are all on display in their summer clothes, or lack thereof. It's an added benefit.

Something I noticed this last trip is that the taxists have stopped quoting fares. Now the way it works is... you tell them where you are going and they ask you what you are willing to pay. If you don't offer enough, they will ask for more. Sort of like an auction. It could be a winter thing, in the summer it's too easy to walk.

Taxi fares go in increments of 100 Rubles. So best to know how to count by hundreds.

100 - сто "stoh"
200 - двести "dvyesti"
300 - триста "tree-stah"
400 - четыреста "chi-tuir-es-tah"
500 - пятьсот "pyat-soht"

500 Rubles is the maximum you should pay for a short trip within the center of town. And that's maybe late at night, in a blizzard, in a Mercedes. Most trips should be 200r to 300r

счастливо...

Strav:

I am in Moscow right now, and agree that the brutal cold makes life here a bit rough... but a couple of comments...

* taxis:

I stopped asking them how much they want years ago. It's best to know your destination, make an offer 50-100 rubles below what you are willing to pay. He'll counteroffer and you settle in the middle... or accept his offer if it's -20° C like today... :)

The worst bargainers are old pensioners... they accept almost any price. The best bargainers are Armenians, Azeris and Georgians. They are tough.

* time of year:

Both seasons have their merits. Summer obviously is more pleasant in terms of viewing mini-skirt clad girls or sitting outside, walking around etc. It's also the best time of year to wander around looking for that elusive salon in D.24, Proezd 5, kv. 24... :)

However half of Moscow leaves the city in the summer, including many of it's hottest women. Even the top clubs are half empty in July and August. Winter is the best non-pro hunting season...

Cruiser:

You are lazy! 3000 Rubles is about $120, but who is counting.. :)

Kiev vs. Moscow vs. Odessa:

I've spent time in all 3 in the last month... and in terms of eye candy and really classy, thin, sexy girls Moscow wins hands down. Not even close.

Or maybe I'm just spoiled here. It is a businessman's town. Two days ago my buddy and I, dressed in the classic dark suit/white shirt/dark wool longcoat combo, picked up two hot tanned teens in Etazh with the cleverest of pick-up lines... "wanna get some sushi?"*

Hell, even Moscow's TGIF is chock-full of hotties... can't say that about Kiev's TGIF... it's only full of horny ISG sexpats... :)

* no, we didn't buy them a fucking phone... just about $150 worth of cocktails and sushi at Vision and taxi fare back to my apartment...

Big Bro AJ

02-22-07, 16:34

Doctor_Skank

02-22-07, 17:02

Using the irregular taxi at night is a necessity in Moscow. Especially, after dark foreigners should not use the metro unless they are with a group of people.

I have always stayed at my friend’s apartment at Kolomenskaya, which is 3 stops to center. In summer I try not to pay more than 150Rb, but in winter it's too cold and it may be too difficult to find warm cars so instead of negotiating, I directly make my offer- 250Rb.

In summer, if you don't like the price, you don't need to accept his offer. The next one or the other ones may take you to the price you want.

Don’t use the irregular taxi;

-if there are other passengers,
-if you don’t feel secure,

My favorite car is VOLGA. Unfortunately, most of the time I find Jiguli or Skoda. :(

Georgian, Azeri and young Russian drivers love to chit chat.

If I am not wrong, currenty $1 is 26,2 Ruble and 1 Euro is 34,3 Ruble.

Big Bro:

Your prices are normal... prices are a bit high now, due to the cold. But honestly... arguing over 50 rubles in Moscow is a sure sign you are in the wrong city... so I agree with you that endless haggling over price is silly.

Caucasian guys are a lot of fun... they'll chat your ear off if you get them started... and they love to talk about women and food... those are my favorite things too... actually my girlfriend's here tell me that when I speak Russian I have a Georgian accent... :)

Your absolutely right about cars.. only 5 types stop:

* Skodas:

Pieces of shit but fast. Young poor Russians love this car... and it's amazing sometimes what kind of stereo equipment they put in there. Still though, shitty.

* Ladas:

The shittiest of the shitty. I hate this fucking car. Usually driven by old pensioners and Caucasians. The second cheapest car on the road... the cheapest is the so-called "death-capsule", the dreaded Oka.

* New European or Japanese cars driven by young Russians:

Pure luxury when they stop... especially during the day they stop.. but only take you if you are going in the same direction as they are, they don't take you to "out of the way" destinations.

* Volgas:

Super comfortable, but smells like gas... still the best of the "Russian" cars... my favorite taxi too... unfortunately they are getting more and more rare. Preferred by middle-aged Russians, many of whom were drivers for politicians before these started getting Audis, BMWs and Fords.

* Luxury limos driven by politican chaffeurs. I've ridden in limos, Audis and BMWs. Drivers try to earn a few bucks when driving the "official car" around while their employers are in meetings or at work... this is getting rarer and rarer, but still happens... especially if you are wearing business clothes.

I've ridden in a hearse, an ambulance and a militia car... so you never know who will stop!

Thomas01

02-22-07, 18:40

Hi everyone,

I am a frequent reader of this particular forum but I have never had a chance to place a report myself since I have never been to Moscow before. Luckily I will be in Moscow for a week this March (10-18).

Thus, I have a few questions to prepare my trip. I would be very grateful for some advice and I promise to report once I am in Moscow.

Bars/Clubs:

With respect to clubs NF and Hungry Duck seem to be fairly good but expensive places to pick up professionals while Karma Bar and Mc Coy provide some chance of picking up non professional girls? Are there any other bars that you would recommend?

Tochka:

The tochka scene seems to be a bit difficult to track down since the places change and one must be by car to get there. Are there any tochkas one can recommend at present? Does anyone know an English speaking taxi driver one could call and hire for this purpose?

Mobile Phones:

What kind of SIM card should I get in Moscow? From what I understand there is hardly any chance to get to a massage or private apartment if one does not have a mobile handy. My German prepaid card won’t get me anywhere in that case. Since I also want to check out some of the places advertised on intimcity.ru I will need a local card for sure.

I know that for someone new I ask a bit much but I would greatly appreciate your support.

Cruiser D

02-22-07, 21:31

Excuse me for being a little more then a bit off topic. But for anyone that knows me talking about taxi's and taxi economics in the FSU is one of my favorite pass times...

I know you didn't spend much time in Kiev, so 109 feel free to chime in, did you notice much less private cars picking people up then before. I don't think I took a single private car the entire 7 weeks I was in Kiev. Which is too bad because it's something I always enjoyed - last year I did catch a ride from a police car, that was too funny. And as we know taxi drivers are a great source of usually useful information.

Ash1001

02-23-07, 01:26

Bez Bezarra

02-23-07, 02:41

In Moscow I want to experience elitny club scene.

Would $100-150 budget for a night in this kind of place?

$100 for a night? :D

What ever you're smoking, let us all have a puff. We'd like
to try the time machine you're stuck in from 1991.

Bez Bezarra

02-23-07, 04:37

Veronica stares at me like some gooney-bird.

OK, She's 25.

Here's Veronica from the website.

Do the pics look MUCH younger than 25?
Or is it me?

Doctor_Skank

02-23-07, 07:54

I'll be in Moscow over the Western Easter break (Fri Apr 06 - Sun Apr 09). I may need some looking after (;)) as I am a total Moscow newbie. However, I'm an old hand in Kiev and imagine Moscow to be the Ukrainian capital's bigger, nastier, more expensive older brother? Where your game needs to be that much sharper?

I really want to experience the 'elitny' clubs such as First, Gazgolder etc. I'd appreciate the chance to go with some regulars who know the scene. Would $100-150 be a decent budget for a night in this kind of place? More if you're in the VIP section? Mid range clubs (particularly on 'hot' nights) would be good too.

Initially I want focus on the 'free' hotties rather than P4P. But if results don't materialise I'll definitely be on for a trip to NF, Boarhouse or a good 'take home' strip club like 911.

Skank, from your Etazh experience it looks like the businessman-who-knows-how-to-treat-a-girl-well approach works a treat. There will always be girls in any FSU city who have the desire, but not the means to have a classy night out, so we (and our wallet) can make it happen for them, so to speak :)

I'll be staying in the Tverskaya Marriott. I figured it's worth going for somewhere safe and central for a first visit. It's not cheap ($300 pn for a queen sized room) to say the least. Even the overpriced Kiev joints look good value compared to this - and in Kiev it's relatively easy to find a nice central apartment at fairly low cost. Not here, from what I gather.

So..

Shostakovich? Cicciolino? Skank? 109? Anyone else on for some upscale debauchery? Please post or PM me

Well Moscow just keeps getting more expensive and obviously the elite clubs are going to be quite pricey. I don't think you'll get far on $100... that's probably only about 5 or 6 drinks. Even beer is like $10 in an elite club... but frankly, not many people drink beer there. It's mostly champagne and whisky.

VIP? Bring a bag of cash... :)

You should give it a go though, the clubs are a sight to behold. The major issue, as discussed before, is going to be just getting in. Make sure you have a plan B if you don't make it in. The politics of face control were discussed before in detail. BTW, you cannot bribe your way past the doorman at most top clubs... not for a token 1000 rubles anyway.

Sorry I won't be in Moscow in April... am just leaving the city now... I really, really, really love this place. Feels like home...

As for money, I wouldn't count on it being your ticket. You'll need to combine charm with money to get anywhere. The two teens we picked up had lots of cash themselves, they just liked our confident nature and classy clothes.

Playing "the money card" will work with some (but not all) girls of moderate means, but upper class girls aren't inherently impressed by cash alone. You'll need to use your people skills... :)

If I were you, I'd get a pro on my first night to take the pressure off, then work on freebies. The salons are a good value for this, if you prefer take home, than try NF/CF.

BTW, in terms of quality of girls, don't underestimate the mid-level clubs. I go to both elite, mid and lower level clubs and have fun in all.

Big Bro AJ

02-23-07, 08:27

….CASH IS KING IN MOSCOW….

Damm work….I want to be in Moscow. The goddess of all the MILFs is back on business. I met her last July and had a ultra wonderful 12 hours. I paid $500 for 12 hours but she invited her girl friend for threesome that I didn’t even ask.

We smoke weed, drank bottles of Chile red, had PSE experience. I remember it as it is today. No limits at all. I had to take 50mg blue to handle both of them.

When I met her she preferred to call herself Miyarı. She is burning hot for her age. She loves anal and rough sex. We had sex more than 5 times.

She was a ex-model and her ex was connected with the mafia. She has a classy and modern 2 room apartment close to the Colombian Embassy. There were security cameras that recording the hallway, main entrance of the apartment and the main door.

It looks like she changed her location and her name.

http://www.intimcity.ru/persons.php?id=38331

:( I want to be in Moscow. :( I want to be in Moscow. :(

Not all the irregular taxis take you to Tochkas. Even some might find the request insulting. Georgians and Azeri drivers take you anywhere you want. Most of them know the best spots.

Doctor_Skank

02-23-07, 10:32

….CASH IS KING IN MOSCOW….
Not all the irregular taxis take you to Tochkas. Even some might find the request insulting. Georgians and Azeri drivers take you anywhere you want. Most of them know the best spots.

For those who are worried about asking a taxi driver to take them to tochka, I suggest going to Boarhouse/CF and asking one of the drivers there. They will charge you more (500-700 rubles depending on length of trip, how many tochkas etc.) but they will know where to go, are experienced in dealing with the police and certainly won't be offended by the request... :)

BBAJ is right though, some Russians both old and young aren't interested in driving around looking for tochkas and many aren't good at finding them.

Stravinsky

02-23-07, 15:29

Do the pics look MUCH younger than 25?
Or is it me?
Yes they do. I was surprised when she told me she was 25. Her vital stats are 24 y.o., 178 cm, so I guess she had a birthday since they were posted. But she really does look exactly like the pix, except that she wears her hair differently. It's shorter now.

Ash1001

02-24-07, 01:04

The two teens we picked up had lots of cash themselves, they just liked our confident nature and classy clothes.

Understood. But.. I would love to see the look on their faces if you had suggested going Dutch after the sushi and cocktails :D

I'll agree that confidence is everything in this part of the world: the whole being a real man thing, showing the girl she's the one you really want. Don't mention or make any reference to money, what you earn etc. as it will be considered vulgar. BUT at some point you are simply going to have to pick up a bill, or you won't get taken seriously. I'm sure there is the odd gem or two that likes you so much that she'll insist on paying, but so far this species has eluded me :)

BTW when you say champagne is normally drunk in elitny clubs, I assume you mean Veuve Clicquot and Bollinger, not the cheap and cheerful Sovietskoye that so delights the Kiev student types?

Frankly if I can't take a girl by the hand and drag her home after 2 or 3 drinks then she can fuck off and stop wasting my time, 'elitny' or not. I'm sure most of the 'models' in these overpriced sponsorship parades end up taking a 2hr metro ride back to a 2 room flat in zhopa which they share with 10 family members

And if the VIP section is full of aging (b/m)illionaires who need to order a jeroboam of Krug before a girl will look at them, well.. perhaps VIP is not good ROI? :)

Bez Bezarra

02-24-07, 01:26

Is the VIP section full of aging millionaires
who need to order Krug before a girl will look at them?

The VIP rooms are full of flat heads drinking vodka.
It is their town, after all. And their klub.

Ash1001

02-24-07, 14:16

The VIP rooms are full of flat heads drinking vodka.
It is their town, after all. And their klub.

And what are their molls drinking? Shampanskoye, I would have thought.

Have you ever joined these charming chaps for a shot or two? :)

The Moscow mafia is primarily Georgian, is it not?

Helena Moscow

02-24-07, 19:59

The Moscow mafia is primarily Georgian, is it not?

Not at all ;). We have enough guys from everywhere, including the locals.

Doctor_Skank

02-24-07, 23:28

And what are their molls drinking? Shampanskoye, I would have thought.

Have you ever joined these charming chaps for a shot or two? :)

The Moscow mafia is primarily Georgian, is it not?

It's not all Bollinger, Soviet shampanskoye is OK too... although not all places have it on the menu.

As for the mafia, they aren't bad guys once you get to know them... most of them have long since become "legitimate biznessmen" anyway. Most of the mafia types I know are Russian, and it's entirely wrong to characterize them as mindless flatheads. Russians aren't all pasty pale Putin-clones, they are a muti-ethnic mix... one of the reasons their women are so beautiful is the mix.

New Russians and the mafia, which are hard to seperate visually, have long since given up their black suit and sunglasses uniform for more stylish clothes and behavior. The old stereotype does of course still rear its ridiculous head, especially in the province, but Moscow is more international and the real joy of the elite clubs is they are genuinely full of elite people... lots of high-powered businessmen, artists, actors and other members of high society. There is a good mix of foreigners there too, but the days when 'rich' foreigners ruled the Moscow club scene are long, long, long gone. We are more of a curiousity than anything else. Displaying some cultural understanding will go a lot farther than just good looks or money. The clubs are already full of good-looking, rich people.

As for drinks, most seem to drink hard alcohol straight with juice and water on the side. The VIP tables are usually adorned with various kinds of drinks and plates of fresh fruit or food. The girls drink various drinks.. champagne, cocktails or sometimes straight alcohol as well. The girl I banged on Thursday drank double whiskies straight all night without flinching. It was all part of my plan, since I told her she couldn't possibly drive her car home anymore now and I was going to kidnap her and take her home and fuck her all night. Which I did.

As for the age of the Russian power base, Moscow's elite is aged 30-45. Politicians are older, but they rarely go to clubs. Most of the guys in the clubs are some sort of businessman directly or indirectly living off of oil money.

When is Russia and out on the town the men pay for everything, period. This admittedly does spoil a lot of the girls. I have met countless girls who just live.. don't work, don't study... just party and live off of other guys money. It isn't all about sex for money either. New Russians are generous with their money, especially when it comes to young females.

I really suggest you 3-tier your approach between pros, student types and the elite types. All have their positive and negative aspects. It's unpredictable too, you never know when you are going home with a sexy girl after a single drink or when you are going to spend $150 wining and dining and end up with nothing but the bill and a peck on the cheek.

And I suggest never going into an elite club thinking you have to score that night and that just buying drinks is going to get it done. With that attitude, you'll run into brick walls. It's better to be relaxed and go with the flow. Your chances are much higher if you are just charming and in a positive, confident mood.

You aren't going to teach the Russians anything about partying, but you might just learn something from them. :)

Saunter

02-25-07, 05:47

When is Russia and out on the town the men pay for everything, period. This admittedly does spoil a lot of the girls. I have met countless girls who just live.. don't work, don't study... just party and live off of other guys money. It isn't all about sex for money either. New Russians are generous with their money, especially when it comes to young females.Exactly the Russian girls (which is supposedly 50% of the population) I saw in Riga.

I remember you mentioned that you hardly ever spend anything on your girls, except the really close ones are lucky enough to receive 'gifts'. If this is the case in Russia, how do you overcome this (with students, club-goers, elite girls) considering they're all being spoilt by the NEW Russians on a nightly basis? As we all know, 99% of us can forget about going toe-to-toe with the NEW Russians as the funds from their bottom-less oil money can buy out your entire month's expenditure within 30 seconds.

Ash1001

02-25-07, 06:38

Hmm, looks likes I've got some serious competition! Then again Skank, at least you won't be there :D I do see what you mean about foreigners being a curiosity. I guess the relative predominance of businessmen over sex tourists keeps us at least a little bit special. I just hope they'll find an Indian speaking broken Russian in an English accent enough of a curiosity :)

To be honest I've never been one to open my wallet and see what sticks to it. I think that approach will either get you laughed at or used - anywhere in the world. The correct approach to spending money is to use it to underline a feeling of warmth and connection that you've already established through conversation and charm.

I'm keen on both the student and elite types - and intend to give both a damn good shot - but at the moment I've got something of a mental block against P4P. I just feel it shouldn't be so easy, so on a plate. Dunno, maybe I have something to prove.

Ash1001

02-25-07, 15:14

It isn't all about sex for money either. New Russians are generous with their money, especially when it comes to young females.

So they hand out their cash to girlies without even expecting sex in return?

Bloody hell :(

Resovad

03-05-07, 13:56

Hey everybody,

as a new poster I do have a question, I will stay in March in the Marriott Grand. Can somebody tell me if they have girls at the bar and if they are girlfriendly or what do you request (i.e. homepages etc.). It is my first time in Moscow and certainly I will post my experience after words here in the thread. Since I do not speak Russian, please no advise for homepages in Russia.

Thank you so much and looking forward to a lot of answers hopefully.

Resovad

03-05-07, 21:06

Hello all,

I will be visiting Moscow this months and I will stay at the Marriott Grand. Can anybody tells me if they have Pro's at the bar or do you have any recommendation for escort services (homepage should be in english). Certainly I will post my experience here afterwords.

Big Bro AJ

03-06-07, 15:13

Why don't you read the first 10 pages.

You'll get your answers...

Floflo

03-06-07, 23:39

Hi everybody,

Have read several reports and finally decided to offer something for those honnest players.We all know the problem foriegners face in moscow,rip off, langauge,and securityThis is a socail game and as we all know in every game, the must be an honnest play maker.If you are to visit moscow and need flowers of all kinds, contact (www.dreammoscownights.com)

Ruggie

03-09-07, 17:39

Hi there,

I will be getting to Moscow early evening (about 6pm) and landing at Sheremetyevo airport. Have long wanted to visit Moscow and have some fun (!), can anybdy please advise the best course of action (hotel/club etc.) please that will be relaitily straighforward, reasonable cost and successful? I will need to leave lunchtime the next day.

Thanks in advance.

LifeSavour

03-09-07, 19:09

Floflo

03-09-07, 21:05

Hi Ruggie,

Look at my last report, contact the web link below, they are experience!

Doctor_Skank

03-09-07, 23:05

Saunter... don't ya know this INFO on here is too 'be taken with a huge GRAIN of SOVIET SALT!

LS Guy

LS I think you are wrong.

The ISG forum is here for us mongers to present real information.

We do so from our own perspective, which greatly adds to the accuracy of the overall picture if enough posters provide their information and their perspective on the scene... which as we know is varied and huge in Moscow.

No single monger "absolutely" knows the market... only collectively do we get a clearer picture. Your experience will always be an individual one anyway.

As for me, every experience I ever wrote about is true... and I won't bore you with hundreds more. I do hope and trust that the majority of other posters here post accurate information as well.

Doctor_Skank

03-09-07, 23:26

Exactly the Russian girls (which is supposedly 50% of the population) I saw in Riga.

I remember you mentioned that you hardly ever spend anything on your girls, except the really close ones are lucky enough to receive 'gifts'. If this is the case in Russia, how do you overcome this (with students, club-goers, elite girls) considering they're all being spoilt by the NEW Russians on a nightly basis? As we all know, 99% of us can forget about going toe-to-toe with the NEW Russians as the funds from their bottom-less oil money can buy out your entire month's expenditure within 30 seconds.

You simply approach girls that mesh well with you. My instinct is pretty good at choosing the ones I'll build the best attraction with. This includes banging girls from all society tiers... students, elite girls, intellectual or arty girls and down to girls working in shops, as housewives etc.

If she indeed is one of those that is being spoiled by New Russians every night, indeed you may have problems approaching her. Girls frequently going to glam clubs can be very mercenary and I do get blown off by them sometimes too if I refuse to be generous from day 1... what has worked is finding some unique thing about her or saying something clever that catches her off guard that can allow a conversation to develop. What won't work is "you're so beautiful", "can I talk to you?" or something lame like that.

But even that doesn't always work. I've run into a few brick walls over the years and soon discovered that its a waste of time to smash your head through a wall of stone just to get to the other side for a fuck. It's rarely worth it.

The lifestyle of clubbing will cost you money though.... going out to bars and clubs, buying drinks (even if just for yourself) or eating in restaurants all the time... creating a fun atmosphere can cost some cash and adds up quickly before you even bought a girl a cheap-o but effective $2 paperback present of your favorite author.

Whether or not spoiling all the girls with flash cash presents may have gotten me laid even more often than I did is ultimately irrelevant... because it is a method I refuse to employ simply because it makes me feel more fool than cool.

Everybody has their own methods, but I am happiest and most successful sticking to mine.

Ash1001

03-10-07, 12:28

Look at my last report, contact the web link below, they are experience!

Actually I have made arrangements to use their services for my forthcoming trip 06-09 April. As a Moscow newbie, I thought I'd give myself an edge by hiring an insider as a guide.

The guide himself is a cool-looking black guy who, from what I've heard, is an ex nightclub bouncer - is that correct? Do tell me more about exactly what he does for his clients.

From my correspondence with him it seems that he knows which clubs are the best on particular nights and how to get us in. Plus he's got a collection of lady friends to accompany us. I'm certainly expecting more than a glorified pimp (although he's made it clear that a full service is offered in that area too!).

He's charging me EUR 300 for the 3 days.

Doctor_Skank

03-10-07, 14:09

Actually I have made arrangements to use their services for my forthcoming trip 06-09 April. As a Moscow newbie, I thought I'd give myself an edge by hiring an insider as a guide.

The guide himself is a cool-looking black guy who, from what I've heard, is an ex nightclub bouncer - is that correct? Do tell me more about exactly what he does for his clients.

From my correspondence with him it seems that he knows which clubs are the best on particular nights and how to get us in. Plus he's got a collection of lady friends to accompany us. I'm certainly expecting more than a glorified pimp (although he's made it clear that a full service is offered in that area too!).

He's charging me EUR 300 for the 3 days.

Looking forward to hearing about your experiences!

Saunter

03-10-07, 17:29

LS I think you are wrong.

The ISG forum is here for us mongers to present real information.

We do so from our own perspective, which greatly adds to the accuracy of the overall picture if enough posters provide their information and their perspective on the scene... which as we know is varied and huge in Moscow.

No single monger "absolutely" knows the market... only collectively do we get a clearer picture. Your experience will always be an individual one anyway.

As for me, every experience I ever wrote about is true... and I won't bore you with hundreds more. I do hope and trust that the majority of other posters here post accurate information as well.LS,

Of course I'm not that stupid to take everything on here WORD FOR WORD. It was a general question and I also post information base on what actually happened to me and from what I saw/learnt. When enough posts are put up that closely relates to one another, as Dr Skank said "it adds more accuracy to the OVERALL picture". You need to chill out a bit.

Saunter

03-10-07, 17:30

Whether or not spoiling all the girls with flash cash presents may have gotten me laid even more often than I did is ultimately irrelevant... because it is a method I refuse to employ simply because it makes me feel more fool than cool.Mate,

I couldn't agree more with you. :)

Across69

03-11-07, 09:25

Catalyst

03-11-07, 19:23

On my last trip the wildest time I had had by far was the night I took two girls from Chesterfields, got them to do lesbian action, and we took pictures of everything. I wanted to repeat that experience on this trip. But Chesterfields didn’t open until late, so I decided to warm up at Safari, which opened early in the day.

I arrived before they were open and they told me when to come back, but when I came back the club still wasn’t open, only the restaurant was, and there was an entrance fee, which wasn’t there the last time a year ago. I hadn’t eaten yet, so I decided not to resist the scam. I had an ok meal and when I was done the club downstairs was open and I found a decent selection of girls. There were two in particular who looked good and they said they would go with me. They told me their price and the price for the room, but I stupidly hadn’t brought enough money.

Mariella, Russia, 23?, looks 9, attitude 7

My hotel wasn’t too far, so went back and got more money, but when I returned only one of the two girls was there, and the other began pressuring me, telling me that the other girl had left. I didn’t know whether to believe her but she was nice, so I decided to go with her. Her name was Mariella. She had jet black hair and a great figure.

Then I discovered that the room had somehow gotten more expensive in the past 30 minutes. I was supposed to pay separately for it at the bar but Mariella insisted on taking my money and paying for the room herself since I didn’t speak Russian. Obviously I was being ripped off, but it was only for an additional 5-10 dollars, and no one at the bar spoke any English, so I didn’t see how to avoid it without telling Mariella to take a hike, and she was the best girl in the club by far at that moment.

So I committed the intolerable sin of agreeing to a rip off, albeit a small one, and off we went. Then there was another problem. The electricity wasn’t working in the rooms, so they were completely dark and we had to get candles, which turned out to be much prettier than a light bulb anyway. There was a good supply of candles on hand, so this didn’t seem to be the first time the power had gone out. There was also no air conditioning, and it was hot, too hot to keep the door closed, so we left it open, which was fun since there were people walking by outside. It was even more fun when one of the hot waitresses came by with more candles and spoke with us to see if everything was ok. The girls had a conversation in Russian while I remained focused on the task at hand. Mariella had to talk between kisses and I finished before the conversation did. It was great having a beautiful sexy girl standing over us watching. Unfortunately I don’t think the waitress was available.

When we were done it was late enough to head over to Chesterfields, which is a 15 minute walk away. When I got to Chesterfields I saw a few familiar faces. Jeanette was there, as was the business oriented black haired girl who still charged $150 and came over still wanting to know why I didn’t want to pay that much. The rest of the selection was mediocre. I danced with a couple of girls who were very nice, but not super knockouts, and all of them wanted $150. One gorgeous girl with red hair danced with me even after I said I didn’t want to spend that much. Maybe it was just a sales technique, but she was very nice and I was tempted, and when I eventually decided against I detected no signs of bitterness. I was really looking for a two girl experience, and I had already had some pleasure that night. But I might have passed up on a nice experience.

As I was leaving I saw Jeanette and mentioned that she never said hello to me. She said it is up to me to approach her if I want to do business with her. She had a harder edge than I remembered from my last visit. I asked her if her blonde friend was around and she said not lately, but that she had another friend. I took a look and the friend was not bad, but it was late so I said we could go together the next night. Jeanette made a face and said that it might not be the same price the next night. I normally don’t buy crap like that, but I was having a hard time finding a threesome, so I said ok for $100 each.

We went outside and Jeanette bitched when I didn’t want to take one of the rip-off taxis that charge 3 times the normal rate. I gave in, but I was starting to have mixed feelings. It was 3 or 4 AM, I had to meet my normal Russian girlfriend for lunch the next day, and I didn’t want to be wiped out. But I had already made a deal ... or had I.

The taxi dropped us off at my hotel and for some reason Jeanette wanted us to hurry inside. She seemed to think someone was watching us or was going to see us. I knew that there were guards inside the hotel who would shake us down if they saw us, but I expected them to be asleep, so we could sneak past them if we were quiet. When we started to walk, however, the girls’ heels made a clattering racket on the hard floor. I should have stopped them and told them to take their shoes off, but Jeanette was in a hurry and I didn’t want to have another argument with her. When we turned the corner into the lobby the guards were out cold. It looked like a scene in a spy movie where they had been drugged or gassed. But no one was going to sleep through those hard shoes banging away on marble. When they woke up and saw us trying to sneak past they didn’t seem happy, but they only charged us a guest fee of 30 dollars, which I think was just the normal rate with no surcharge for trying to sneak in free.

The costs were adding up. $200 for the girls, $30 for the guards, $10 for the rip off taxi, maybe more taxi money afterwards. I was ambivalent already and this gave me a nice excuse to back out. I also liked telling the guards that their bribe price was too high and showing Jeanette that Mr. Moneybags didn’t have infinitely deep pockets for all the me too-ers on that she seemed to attract. I gave them 300 rubles for taxi money and Jeanette pouted and said “it isn’t much.” I looked back at her and she could see in my face that I knew perfectly well it was plenty and didn’t want any s--- about it. I was happy with my decision.

The next couple of days with my girlfriend went well, but then I got a night off. I went back to Safari. I didn’t fall for the restaurant scam again, but I did get hit up for the entrance fee. There were several nice looking girls and I took my time deciding. Meanwhile the lap dance girls were very aggressive. They didn’t seem to like me taking up space on the sofas and not spending money on them.

One girl came by and asked me to move over. I did and she sat down, but right away I realized she didn’t want to sit down, she wanted to do a lap dance for me, so I immediately said no. She told me I owed her 100 rubles and I told her to get lost. She started arguing, threw a tantrum, and then spat at me. This definitely made me nervous. We stared at each other for a moment and then she punched me in the mouth. Any of you who have seen the bouncers at Safari know what a dangerous situation this was. I have no idea how they would have responded if I had hit her back, but the potential downside was catastrophic. I stood up and started shouting what the hell is going on here, what kind of lousy place is this, etc ... A massive bouncer quickly lumbered over with an angry expression on his face, wanting to know what had happened.

I told him that she tried to force me to take a lap dance, then spat on me and punched me, and yet I never touched her. “Ask him” I said, pointing at a Russian guy who was sitting around the same table and had seen the whole thing. He was a complete stranger. I had no way of knowing how much attention he had been paying, whether he might harbor some secret grudge against foreigners, or whether he was the type who liked pulling the wings off of flies. In that moment he was going to decide whether I lived or died, or whether I would ever walk again. The bouncer said something to him and he replied in a dispassionate voice. There was a brief moment of silence and then the bouncer turned to stare at the girl. My life had been spared.

I continued milking my outrage. I was leaving and I was never coming back. I told a couple of cute girls that I had wanted go with them but now I was leaving, so the dancer had cost them money. No one did anything to stop me or quiet me down. I left in a huff. I did everything I could to get the ***** fired, which is what she deserved. Looking back on it I wonder if I could have grabbed her by both arms and dragged her to the bouncer as long as I didn’t hit her, but I can’t imagine that I would ever have taken the chance. What really sticks in my memory is that moment after she spat at me when we were staring at each other and she could see that there was nothing I dared do about it. That infuriates me.

As I walked to Chesterfield’s I could even feel some swelling in my lip, but I was pretty sure it wouldn’t show. The selection was better than on the first night, with a couple of new young faces. I quickly identified two young girls who were friends with each other, and realized that this was a golden opportunity to arrange a threeway. But as I muddled over how to approach them a couple of greasy potbellied older guys got there first. I cursed my luck. They looked pretty and innocent, just what I wanted, and I had a good feeling about their willingness to do each other. It was a waste to separate them. The potbellied guys would have been just as happy with two separate girls who didn’t even know each other. It also disgusted me to think of these fat slobs sweating away on top of such nice girls.

At the bar I started a conversation with an expat who had been living in Moscow for a long time and we compared notes on different places. He was tired and jaded. We agreed that Nightflight had the girls who had been the most gorgeous of any in Moscow ten or fifteen years ago but were no longer at their peak. He encouraged me to go up to any girl anywhere on the street, no matter how gorgeous, and just talk to her. About the same time, I’m not sure if it was before or after I started talking to him, I noticed another pair of young hotties, and started exchanging glances with them. He noticed and told me that if I wanted he was sure I could have both of them for the night for $150. Was I interested?

Hell, yes. He spoke to them in Russian. He did most of the talking and they just nodded, glancing at me occasionally and smiling. He turned to me and said the story was that I was a businessman who was going to be in Moscow for two weeks and was looking for a couple of girls who could keep me happy the whole time. He said for $150 they would stay all night and would leave at about 9 in the morning. He said I should also give them some cab fare to get home. The girls smiled at me while he explained all of this. I told him I was eternally grateful and bought him a drink. I wondered if there was something more I should have done, but I couldn’t think what and he didn’t seem to expect it. We went outside and I flagged down a normal taxi, not one of the leeches who wait in front of the club.

Alona, Ukraine, 21, looks 8, attitude 9 and
Jean, Ukraine, 20, looks 7, attitude 8

They were both from Ukraine. Alona had short curly black hair and a girlish look, with nice b cups. Her friend was Jean, a skinny girl with limp wavy blonde hair, who was almost as good looking, but with a flatter chest. Jean got in the taxi first, and Alona got in the middle. As soon as the car got moving Alona undid the top couple of buttons of her shirt, took my hand and put it inside. We started deep kissing and I took my hand out of her shirt, reached across, and put it in Jean’s shirt. I took Alona’s hand and put it in my pants. I wondered how far we could go in the car, but the hotel was only a few minutes away and we could get stopped by the police.

When we got to the hotel I told them to be quiet, but it was only 1 or 2 AM and this time the goons were awake. The guest fee was the same as it had been a couple of nights before with Jeanette and her friend and it bothered me to have to admit that maybe on second though the amount was reasonable after all. Up in my room we showered and got down to business. They got on either side of me and we started making out. I asked them if they would kiss, and they hesitated, but then said ok, and did it nicely. They each took turns blowing me while I made out with the other, and then they did a double blowjob. I started inside Jean, then did Alona. I had them make out with each other while I was inside them. I asked Alona if I could do cim and she said ok.

Then there was an unpleasant surprise. We showered and they started to get dressed. I stopped them and asked where they were going. They didn’t speak a word of English, but they understood. I wrote 9 AM on a piece of paper and drew a clock. Alona made a rocking motion with her arms; she had to get back to her baby. It was 3 or 4 AM, so I wrote on the paper $150 next to the 9 AM, then drew the current time and wrote $100. They understood and agreed to stay. They were somewhat reluctant, but once the deal had been made suddenly we were very good friends again. Alona began making out with me like crazy and we went straight into another round, with Jean coming over to kiss me once I was inside Alona, and then making out with Alona and rubbing her breasts. This time I came inside Alona.

We washed up and lay down to go to sleep, with each of them on either side of me, lying on my chest. It was great, except for a couple of things. First I had to get up again the next day to meet my girlfriend for lunch, so I needed to get a good sleep. But the mini fridge in the room had a really loud motor, so I got up and unplugged it. When I got back into bed Alona had rolled over and I couldn’t get her to roll back on me. Then I could see that the sky was no longer black, the sun was coming up, so I got up to pull the curtains. Now both girls had rolled over and when I got back into bed I was lying there alone unless I picked one and curled up to her, but then I didn’t get the two girl effect. It was now about 5 AM and they wanted to go at 9, so even if I did manage to get to sleep I was just going to have to wake up in a few hours. There wasn’t going to be another round unless I really pushed them, and I had already gotten spectacular value, so I decided to let them go early.

This was easier said than done. I tried to wake Alona, but couldn’t. She made grumpy faces and pushed my arm away. I woke Jean and let her try to get Alona up. She finally managed, but it took about 5 minutes. It occurred to me that they probably didn’t get a lot of sleep. They nodded right off when I couldn’t get to sleep at all. When Alona woke up and realized why she had been awaken she was happy. I thought of giving them $200 but was cheap in the end, partly because I was letting them go early. They seemed happy with the $150 and I also gave them 500 for taxi fare. Alona gave me her number and told me to call. I didn’t think I was going to have another night free from my girlfriend (I didn’t), and even if I did I didn’t know how we were supposed to communicate on the phone.

Catalyst

03-11-07, 19:23

Day 1 - Chesterfields

I began my first ever trip to Moscow in Chesterfields. I liked the fun bar atmosphere when I walked it, but it wasn’t clear to me who was working and who wasn’t. My first conversation was with a US serviceman who was with his US girlfriend. He told me that you could meet girls in a lot of the bars in Moscow, but in Chesterfields he knew guys who thought they had gotten lucky and then in the morning the girl wanted money. I said I would be on the lookout for that.

Jeanette, 20?, Russian, looks 7.5, Attitude 9
Friend (name?), 20?, Russian, looks 10, attitude 7

There was a very obvious superstar in the bar that I noticed while I was talking to this guy. She had golden blonde hair, was short, and had a perfect slim hourglass figure and a nice chest. I hoped that she was working (or better yet, that she wasn’t, but wanted to meet me). After a nice conversation I excused myself and tried to catch her attention. I walked past her a couple of times or stood in front of her and tried to make eye contact, but she wouldn’t look at me. So I started to think that she wasn’t working and wasn’t interested in me. Finally I decided that before giving up what the hell I might as well take a direct shot and remove all doubt, so I went up to her and said hello. I think she said hello and when I said how are you she responded by declaring that she only works with her friend and they get 100 dollars each. That wasn’t what I expected. I couldn’t figure out why she ignored me hovering around her if she was working. But it was the second best answer she could have given me, and if her friend looked anything like she did this would be a no brainer.

Her friend wasn’t quite as hot, but was perfectly nice. She was taller and not quite as slim. Her name was Jeanette. She had straight bright red shoulder length hair. Both of them, I later realized, liked to play pool and were good at it. I asked if 200 was for all night and Jeanette said “maybe all night is boring” but they said it would be for a few hours, so they wouldn’t be sleeping over, but that sounded pretty good.

I hoped the couple I had talked to and played innocent with didn’t notice me leaving with two girls. We got a taxi outside. I insisted on getting one that was driving down the street instead of one of the leeches in front of the club. Half way to my hotel we got pulled over by the police. They made me get out of the car and Jeanette translated for me. She said that I needed to show them my passport. Well, I don’t bring my passport to places like Chesterfields. She spoke with them again and then said to me a phrase that I later found to be quite common in Russia: “It is a problem.”

“Problem” meant that I had to get into the car and go with them to the station. I wasn’t scared. In fact I thought it might actually be fun to go down to the police station and watch the bureaucracy at work, even if I was going to be kept up late and miss out on sex that night. I was pretty sure I wasn’t in any real trouble. So I got in the police car.

This wasn’t what they expected. I think they expected I would break down in tears and offer anything at all if only they would please let me go. It was awkward for them when they had to ask me to get back out of the car so we could negotiate a bribe. They asked for 500 rubles and I said it was too much. Jeanette asked me how much I would pay and I said 300 and they accepted that. Only I didn’t have 300 in change, so Jeanette paid for me, which I felt bad about.

So 300 rubles later we were on our way to my hotel and when we arrived there was more corruption to deal with. Hotel security wouldn’t let the girls upstairs unless I paid a fee. It was $30 non-negotiable. So with bribes and taxi this was going to cost about $250 and I was starting to worry that I wasn’t likely to get my money’s worth.

Upstairs there was a woman sitting at a desk, guarding the floor, but she was sound asleep. Jeanette and her friend quickly tiptoed to my room with big smiles, eager to get there before the woman woke up. In the room we chatted before getting started. I tried to act relaxed and not let on that these were the first working girls I had ever picked up in Moscow and didn’t know what to expect. They asked for something to drink, but weren’t fussy when all I had was filtered tap water, so that was a good sign.

My mood improved significantly when the blonde took her shirt off. She was perfect. And when the sex started all worries quickly dissipated. They did an incredible double blow job that included both of them running their tongues up and down me in unison. When I asked them if they would kiss each other they did it passionately. I didn’t ask them to go down on each other because everything was going great, I was much more interested in the kissing, and I didn’t want to risk spoiling the mood. (Or maybe I did ask and they said no. I can’t remember.) I asked if I could do cim and they said no. I finished inside the blonde and we got half dressed and hung out.

We talked and drank water for maybe an hour or more. After a while I was eager to get started again. I thought there was only going to be one more round, and it was already late, so if they weren’t going to spend the night with me I didn’t see any point in staying up all night just to chat. I held out my arms to them and they got up, though I had the impression that they liked hanging out and wanted to be the ones to decide when we got started again. As we started getting undressed I showed them my digital camera, which they were very interested in. I demonstrated it by taking some pictures of them and showing them the results. They liked seeing themselves. They posed and wanted to see the results. Then the pictures became topless. Then they were kissing for the camera (though not nearly as passionately as when we were having sex). Before I knew it I was on top of Jeanette, banging her brains out, and her friend was eagerly clicking away.

After a while I tried to get the friend to come over and make out with me while I finished inside Jeanette, but she would only sit nearby and let me rub her tits. She seemed to think she was done. I wished I had some pictures of me doing her too, but I had been at it for a while and could hardly complain at that point, so I finished up in side Jeanette. They got dressed and I paid. When I was looking through my wallet I saw that I had a few hundred ruble notes that I hadn’t realized were there, so in addition to the dollars I owed them I gave Jeanette back the 300 rubles bribe money that she had paid for me, which I think surprised her. Maybe I also gave them some cab money, I can’t remember. They were really nice, but I wanted them to go so I could get some sleep. Unlike them I wanted to get up before the sun went down the next day.

Day 2 – Chesterfields

I went back the next night, but I felt ambivalent about finding Jeanette and her friend since the hot friend had been standoffish at the end of our encounter. I worried that we might pick up where we left off. The previous night with them had been wild, but there wasn’t much of a personal connection. When I got to the club they were there, but just like the night before they wouldn’t make eye contact with me. Maybe they didn’t want to jump on me and make me feel like I had to take them again just because we were together the night before, or maybe they just weren’t very hard up for customers. I’m sure I could have approached them, but I wasn’t that interested, and since they were only my first Moscow girls I wanted to see if I could do even better.

Unfortunately there wasn’t as much happening this night other than Jeanette and her friend being there. I talked to a couple of girls who didn’t interest me much. One in particular - a dark haired girl who was all business - didn’t look bad, but she wanted 150. There was no way I was going to give her 50% more than Jeanette and her gorgeous friend when she wasn’t even going to mix it up with another girl. I approached several girls who I had mixed feelings about and either didn’t bother to negotiate or if I did I was quoted a high price. In some cases I wasn’t even sure if the girls were available. They didn’t seem to be with guys, but they wouldn’t make eye contact, and some of them stayed in places where it was hard to approach them, like a crowded table. Not everyone there was working, so it wasn’t ok to just walk up to a girl and start talking business to her.

Irena, 23?, Russian, looks 7, attitude 10

I noticed Irena looking at me from the bar a couple of times. She had nice wavy dark blonde hair over her shoulders and a happy, friendly smile. I went over to her and we struck up a conversation. She never mentioned money and didn’t approach me in a direct way, so it looked like I had scored a real pick up. Back at my hotel the guards were asleep when we arrived, so getting to my room was no problem. I didn’t care much since I had a double room and thought that if she wasn’t a prostitute they would have no business telling me I couldn’t bring a guest. In the room there was nothing to make me think she wasn’t my girlfriend. We had a great round of sex that night, followed by another one in the morning. We took our time getting dressed and went out for lunch at a nice place that wasn’t very expensive. (Or maybe it was, by Russian standards. It was that popular buffet place next to the Kremlin.) In any case, she certainly deserved it and I enjoyed it too. Afterwards we toured the Kremlin. Then we came back to my hotel to say goodbye.

I kissed her good bye I was unpleasantly surprised when she asked for money. I said how much, and she said $100, which was reasonable, and I gave it to her, remembering what the serviceman had said to me. I was upset at first that I had been tricked, but I quickly realized that she had not been devious. The night before when we were discussing how long I was in Moscow and what I had seen yadda yadda she asked me where I was staying and then went out of her way to talk about what the rooms were like in different hotels in Moscow, including some nice ones that I’m sure she couldn’t afford. Later when she said she wanted to come with me she wouldn’t leave until the bar closed. Actually, I’m still puzzled by that one, but it should have made me think a little more.

Day 3 - Safari

Safari is a 10 minute walk from Chesterfields and is open during the day. Inside there is a basement with a couple of large rooms that have a bar and lots of soft seating. There are gorgeous girls who walk around and give lap dances, and there are other gorgeous girls who will go to the room with you. You can tell which are the ones who will go to the room with you because they stand around, while the lap dance girls are constantly moving about soliciting or lap dancing.

Natalia, 18, Russian, looks 10, attitude 10

There was an obvious pick for going to the room who was gorgeous with long straight silky blonde hair halfway down her back. Natalia was 18, and she spoke good English. We got a room, which was across an outdoor courtyard. The bj was covered, which was a disappointment and was surprising since I expected everything in Moscow to be on the wild side. But everything else was great, including the kissing. I had an hour with her for one hundred dollars. It wasn’t cheap, but it was for an hour, and I got to do her two times. She gave me her number, but she was leaving the next day to go somewhere with friends. She said I could come see her at the club in the afternoon, but I had already done that and wanted to see her outside. She said ok, but the next day when I called her she was leaving earlier than she thought so it fell through.

Chesterfields

That night I went to Chesterfields again, and again the selection was just soso. Jeanette and her friend were there and the dark haired girl who wanted 150 the night before came over and was pushy about wanting to know why I wouldn’t go with her. Irena was also there, and I went over and had a drink with her. A Russian guy also there tried to get me to do shots of vodka with him, but I couldn’t keep up with him. I didn’t go with Irena even though she was being nice to me and smiling at me whenever I looked over at her. I would have liked her as a girlfriend, but if I was going to pay I might as well have a different girl every night. I did meet a nice girl who didn’t seem to be working, though. She came over and danced with me. I got her number and we agreed to meet the next day.

Day 4 – Safari

Elorussia, 27?, Russian, looks 7, attitude 8

I had time to go to Safari again the next day before meeting the girl from Chesterfields. Natalia was unfortunately not there, so I picked Elorussa, who couldn’t compare, but was fine. She was a mid-20s girl with light brown hair and an ok figure. Same as before, $100, two rounds, and cbj. She was very sweet and attentive. After that I had a nice time with the girl from Chesterfields. We went sightseeing and had dinner together, but nothing happened.

Day 5 – Chesterfields

Zina, 20?, Khazak, looks 9, attitude 8

I spent another day with the nonworking girl from Chesterfields. It was nice, though still nothing happened. My flight left early the next morning, so we said goodbye but exchanged numbers and emails and off I went to Chesterfields to make a bit more of my last night. Same crowd, more or less, but I found Zina, a thin, fit, hot looking girl from Khazakstan, with long black hair. This time the guards were awake when we returned and I had to bribe them to let us up. Another cbj, even though I complained, but again everything else was great. If I had been staying longer I would have tried to spend more time with her. We did a round as soon as we arrived and a round early in the morning. I was packing as she was getting dressed and right after she left I checked out and went to catch my plane.

Catalyst

03-11-07, 19:26

Here are a couple of reports from two trips I took a few years ago. I didn't post them at the time, so I thought I'd share them now. I hope they bring back some memories of how things used to be (and hopefully they aren't too different now).

Blaked

03-12-07, 21:27

They should have an age limit for Moscow hoes. They should be about 23 MAX. I don't care if they barely have pubes, but they've got to retire at some point. I went to a salon at 9 Tatarskaya (the door to the left, ring #39 and walk to the top floor) and there was a gaggle of girls to be picked from last 3am Saturday morning, but no cute nubile under-20's. I picked a blonde, and then when she took off her top I could see that she had this big tattoo running down her arm. To her credit, she gave me an A+ blowjob (with condom, but she was goood) and we fucked twice for 3000 rubles, but. She was 27. She had an 8 year old girl (maybe it was a boy. Doesn't fucking matter). Nothing less sexy than a mother pushing 30 with a fatherless child. I could have had that shit for free.

On the other hand, I'm saving money and little blue pills for the week after school lets out. That's when all of the girls from the sticks come to Moscow to seek out job opportunities and get trapped into prostitution. You can always find er, 18ish girls then. Recent high school grads or college dropouts. That's when you get rich pickings. First week of June.

Riku58

03-13-07, 21:35

Guess your mentioned prices do not exist anymore!

Maybe experts in this section can add up some advises about current prices.

Any updated info. will be appreciated especialy for threesomes.

Doctor_Skank

03-14-07, 08:07

Thanks Catalyst and Blaked for the reports!

Here my take on current prices in Moscow:

As of about 3 months ago, these were the prices I was faced with:

Boarhouse: Starting prices $200-250, later on (or with some persuasion) the prices drop to $150-200. You can find girls in 6-7 quality for $150 with some patience, luck and negotiation. You may have to pay an additional "security fee" of 500 rubles though and on the weekend entrance fee of 250 rubles.

Nigh Flight: Starting prices $300-500, later(or with some persuasion) the prices drop to $200-300. You can find girls in 7-8 quality for $200 with some patience, luck and negotiation. You will have to pay 750 ruble entrance (unless you eat at restaurant first).

Both places have their advantages and disadvantages.

Boarhouse:
+ fun "drink pub" atmosphere w/sports on TV
+ large selection of girls
+ easy to find location across from Kursky Voksal
+ cheaper than NF
+ girls usually with very good attitude
+ no dress code/face control for foreigners
+ sometimes can find absolute newbies
+ occassional freebies
- sometimes girl selection is really shitty
- early in night (0000-0130) prices almost as high as Night Flight
- long expensive taxi ride home, potential militia troubles
- can be smoky and dirty inside
- can be almost as expensive as Night Flight
- occassional drugging/"spiking" of drinks
- some girls been in game too long

Night Flight:
+ refined, classy atmosphere
+ large, good quality selection of women
+ very central location on Tverskaya near Pushkin square
+ nice restaurant in same facility
- prices early in night quite high
- girls can be very mercenary regarding price
- some girls have bad attitude
- some girls been in game too long

Of the two clubs (and although pros can be found in many discos in limited number, these 2 clubs really are the only real "dedicated" pickup bars in Moscow) I prefer Boarhouse... but if prices continue to rise, at some point there will be no difference between the two in terms of price.... and then NF becomes the more attractive club.

Strip clubs, salons/apartments, escort agencies, tochkas and internet are the other primary sources for pro action.

Doctor_Skank

03-14-07, 08:45

I am returning to Russia after a too long absence.

Are Night Flight (very expensive) and Doug and Marty's Boar House (cheap)still good mongering locations?

Has the Safari Club returned as the best strip club ever? It had constant full song lap dances for 100 rbl per song with dozens of beautiful women.

Is the Hungry Duck still the wildest dance club ever?

Are Russian women still brutally honest and excited by foreingers?

I fear that after constant tourism I will need to move my mongering out to the smaller towns to get to meet the "real" Russians I fell in love with years ago.

Across69:

Of course everything is subjective, but here's my take:

* Boarhouse and Night Flight still the only "true" pickup bars... see my report below. Boarhouse has gotten more expensive, but can still be fun and affordable.

* Safari Lodge, to my knowledge, still one of the best strip bars.

* Never liked Hungry Duck, but it still exists. I assume you are talking about the 2nd Hungry Duck near Kusnetzky Most. The original Hungry Duck closed several years ago.

* Russian women are still intrigued by foreigners to a degree... but much less so than 5 years ago. The mystique of the foreign man, or even dreams of escape from Russia, have been tempered with time and although it's still remarkably easy to get laid in Moscow for free, it isn't by any means "automatic".

Best targets for "playing the foreigner card" seeking easy sex are young impressionable fun-seeking students (particularly those studying foreign languages), secretaries interested in foreign countries, divorcees and housewife-types looking for romance and adventure. High-octane club girls couldn't care less if you are foreign or not... they are interested in glam lifestyle and in most cases, see the local mini-millionaires as their best option to achieve their goals. Foreigners are considered notoriously cheap in those circles. Don't expect your foreign status to really impress them.

Of course, YMMV and any number of other factors come in to play... looks, sexual attraction, style, money, communication skills and all those things we call "game". A major factor is TIME. If you can spend more than a week in Moscow... even 10 days to 2 weeks... the pussy really starts rolling in.

Having been to many places in Russia and Ukraine, I still find that Moscow for me personally is the easiest place to get laid and has the best women.

Prosal

03-14-07, 13:07

High-octane club girls

Doc, are the elite clubs in Moscow really that filled with so many SMOKING HOT BEAUTIES ?

Nightlife at L'ETO (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wprx6IKZUmU&mode=related&search=)

Nightlife at OSEN (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=89ttdfj5lVs&mode=related&search=)

Holy shit !

:)

Doctor_Skank

03-14-07, 13:14

Doc, are the elite clubs in Moscow really THAT filled with so many HOT BEAUTIES ?

Nightlife at L'ETO (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wprx6IKZUmU&mode=related&search=)

Nightlife at OSEN (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=89ttdfj5lVs&mode=related&search=)

:)

As a matter of fact, yes they are... :)

Saunter

03-14-07, 20:34

...the week after school lets out. That's when all of the girls from the sticks come to Moscow to seek out job opportunities and get trapped into prostitution. You can always find er, 18ish girls then. Recent high school grads or college dropouts. That's when you get rich pickings. First week of June.Dr Skank. Is this true? :) Just speaking in general and from your own experience, what time of the year is your most fruitful season anyway?

Doctor_Skank

03-15-07, 08:17

Dr Skank. Is this true? :) Just speaking in general and from your own experience, what time of the year is your most fruitful season anyway?

It's true that early June is when exams are over. Not sure if it is best time to hunt for girls coming to the city looking for money, but sounds reasonable to me. Never really noticed a difference personally though.

Generally speaking, the summer months July-August are the slowest in Moscow... many people leave the city and in general club action... even business... slows down. This is true for much of EE.

That doesn't mean you can't have fun in Moscow in the summer... in other ways it's very pleasant. Clubs aren't nearly as full as in the fall/winter season and there are some really nice outdoor discos and events which are very good for meeting people.

My favorite seasons for girl-hunting are the dead of winter and spring. Spring feelings, this biological instinct to reproduce (or at least go through the motions) is real and Russian girls feel it too. It used to be called miniskirt season as many girls started wearing skimpy clothes in April-May, however Moscow girls switched to tight jeans a few years ago and regrettably the mini-skirt isn't as omnipresent as it was in the late 90's-2002.

In any case, Spring is good. Only thing to watch out for is exam times... Russian institute/university is pretty tough and girls take their studies quite seriously.

Overall though, there really is no bad season... every time of year has it's charms.

Ruggie

03-15-07, 14:57

Hi,

I will be passing through Moscow. Albeit briefly. Is there a decent hotel that will allow meeting some WG's etc?

Thanks

Saunter

03-15-07, 19:38

My favorite seasons for girl-hunting are the dead of winter and spring.Thanks. It seems your favourite seasons in Russia and Ukraine are the same as mine for Latvia and Lithuania!!

No surprise there with Spring but I actually thought late-May/June was better? Since as you said, they do take their studies quite seriously and would be pretty busy with end of semester exams, ie. April/mid-May. After all, getting a degree is all they have going for them before they graduate to either end up in a low paid job or bite the bullet to start tricking in its various forms.

I used to dread the winter onslaught and when it hit -35c once, I couldn't figure out how these people could put up with that shit and why I would ever want to visit EE again, let alone relocate. Then I realised there is absolutely nothing else to do but stay indoors and fuck the brains out of your girls, for hours on end... for the whole of winter :) However, they do seem to make an effort to all get together with the family during Christmas and this is a good time to take a break for yourself, IMO. Besides that, most of October-March is an absolute goldmine out in the clubs/bars.

Sometimes I prefer not to know their silhouette as easily as Spring-time. When they rip their coats off to show a 5'9" lith slavic body and strip their lingerie off like a pro-stripper, then charge at you like a tiger in heat... now that's HOT ;)

Ash1001

03-19-07, 02:25

After all, getting a degree is all they have going for them before they graduate to either end up in a low paid job or bite the bullet to start tricking in its various forms

Quite true for the rest of the FSU but I think Moscow is the exception. There are women in their 20s and 30s earning very good (by Western standards) salaries in law and banking.

They're probably not that common but, just think - that dyev you're chatting up in some glam club may well be earning more than you..

Guy #2

03-19-07, 10:04

I have been reading your posts. There are places where you can find better looking white women for less money. I envy Moscow because there is so much selection. But there are places with better looking white women for slightly more money in Europe an where the percentage of people living with AIDs is. 1%, lesser than the US. I know that on my first trip to Europe, wearing a condom, I still caught a bacterial infection that grew into a cyst from the first girl I fucked. Fortunately, it was only a skin infection. I have learned a lot from this Board. I picked up a 19 year old American girl in the US and a month later threw her out. I still roam the bars by myself. I had a bad night one night and sat there by myself and around 2: 00 am, a young blonde came over and sat on my lap. I had not said anything; she just chose to get drunk and come sit on the lap of a middle age man. I go to Europe when I have had a few bad months. But I still keep my costs down because I need the money for the future. I still look for girls in the US because long term, this is a very dangerous game. I don't get desperate. That is why I threw the 19 year old girl out. I don't worry about what people think. That is why I had enough balls to sit in a bar like a loser long enough for the blonde to get drunk and come sit on my lap. Yes, I know that if I were in Europe, I would not have had to wait that long and would not have to do all that work. But then I would also be at a greater risk of getting AIDS. It's all about managing risk. You have to diversify and have a variety of strategy. I would continue looking for a freebie in your home country regardless of how people look at U. Europe is a good escape when you have a few dry months of no sex with a hot girl. Choose your country wisely. There are countries out there with girls for less money and less AIDs risk. But that is something you need to find on your own. This Board has a lot of information.

Excess

03-19-07, 14:34

My favorite seasons for girl-hunting are ................... when I am in heat which covers every month of the year. :-))

Overall though, there really is no bad season... every time of year has it's charms.

with apologies to Dr. Skank, but I simply could not resist butchering his response.

Cruiser D

03-20-07, 14:41

Guy#2, what is your home country, the place where you were born?

Doctor_Skank

03-25-07, 11:08

Fire breaks out at Moscow strip club 911, killing 10...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070325/ap_on_re_eu/russia_nightclub_fire
http://top.rbc.ru/index1.shtml?ext=1
RIP to our fallen soldiers. Hope all the babes made it out OK.

One O Nine

03-25-07, 17:25

Man, the news of 911 burning done on the front page of CNN even brought me out of slumber.

Two foreigners among the dead, supposedly Bulgarians. How embarassing. This is pretty much on top of my list of the shittiest ways to die, next to being slowly devoured by a horse.

And now where am I going to pick up strippers next time I'm in Moscow?

Guy #2

03-25-07, 17:52

Don't get me wrong. I appreciate and applaud all of your reports. I went to the same bar last night and left after an hour. I guess I am spoiled by Europe. The great thing about Europe is that I can say fuck you to the girls in the States. I have a few friends who are married and one guys makes almost 500k a year but he is miserable because his wife runs the whole show. It is all about money as I suspected. I know there is a Baptist church in Texas where all the men are in their 60s and the women are in their 20s and they are just starting to have kids. But a lot of these women are former *****s, I. E. Prior boyfriends and husbands. And I know that the young girls on MySpace are fucking 6-7 guys a year. So there really is no difference between a freebie and an escort. Either way, you pay for it. Yes, there is a slight exception if you find a beautiful girl who likes you for who you are, though that is rare because white girls are fucking at a young age. In any event, that is why you want to find a strategy to continue doing this and not giving away the house. Keep posting.

Thanks.

Titurel

03-26-07, 10:55

Hi!

Yes, I tried Veronika and Ira last week. The performance was just ok - her attitude - ok

I tried as well Marina - she was active and very willing to please. Very tight pussy...

100$ for 1 hour

The pictures on website are heavily "photoshopped" - but anyway body of girls 7-8

Location very close to Tverskaya and rooms and bath definetely clean.

I stayed at Marriot Aurora(overpriced!!!) - waited in Lobby for friend and I mentioned a young tall and slim girl coming into the hotel. Model type body but with small firm butt...she sat down after a while she went to reception and asked if she can use the elevator. Answer was no. Phone call to a room. Bel- boy brought her to room.

I really would like to know this escort service of such classy girls. So in hotel which choice you have ? "Where" - www.viprest.ru or com ?? Can somebody give me an advice?

Titurel

03-26-07, 15:53

Somebody Has Experience With This Agency?

===============================================

Hi,

I sincerely appreciate your reports, but...

Would you please STOP capitalizing the first letter of EVERY word in your reports!

It's difficult to read, it's time consuming to fix, and it takes you more work to write like that.

On behalf of myself and your fellow Forum Members: Thank You!

Jackson

Starchild2012

03-26-07, 22:23

Yeahh..agree...married or not..one way or the other...money goes to women at the end...If you make 1000 dollar a month or 10,000 dollars a month..you will spend it proportionality on women :)

After 10 years of living like an animal, im begining to find..there is more to this world than p4p...for start socialising is the best way to meet normal women around you.

In our neighborhood or town itself..if we socialise we could get 10 to 15 women easily from desperate house wifes to college chicks all are within our range..we just need to socialise more.

Don't get me wrong. I appreciate and applaud all of your reports. I went to the same bar last night and left after an hour. I guess I am spoiled by Europe. The great thing about Europe is that I can say fuck you to the girls in the States. I have a few friends who are married and one guys makes almost 500k a year but he is miserable because his wife runs the whole show. It is all about money as I suspected. I know there is a Baptist church in Texas where all the men are in their 60s and the women are in their 20s and they are just starting to have kids. But a lot of these women are former *****s, I. E. Prior boyfriends and husbands. And I know that the young girls on MySpace are fucking 6-7 guys a year. So there really is no difference between a freebie and an escort. Either way, you pay for it. Yes, there is a slight exception if you find a beautiful girl who likes you for who you are, though that is rare because white girls are fucking at a young age. In any event, that is why you want to find a strategy to continue doing this and not giving away the house. Keep posting.

Thanks.

Zycke

04-01-07, 01:26

hi,

I'm back from Moscow and I think it is nothing compared to St -Pete!
The salons some members mentionned are about 6000 r. which I think is overpriced for Russia
Also, they seem to be much less client-oriented in Moscow, as if there are so many clients that you are nothing to them. So I didn't go to these salons (maybe next time).

Rather l had some OK experiences by calling some girls to my home for 3500-4000 two hours... most of the times Ukrainians and not so good looking, maybe 4-7 . I got the newspaper "Rendez-vous" (Randevou) and tried the phone numbers of agencies. Some will accept outcalls, some not. The system is that a dispatcher wright down your expectations and address. Shortly after some other smaller agency calls you back and asks you the same questions. If you are lucky one or 2 girls will come in 30 minutes, if you are not lucky one ugly girl will come in 1 or 2 hours...
tip: meet them down the building, rather than at your door. Then it will be easy to refuse if you are not interested.

Also had a strange experience in a massage salon, as I discovered there is no sex service (first time I see that in Russia). But it was cheap and still a good experience, as the girl really tries to please you by doing good erotic massage, she was wearing panties but finished naked on demand. She wanked my cock in 69 position so I could see all her ass from close.
At the end I am sure she was expecting a tip but I tip only if that was something extraordinary and I am in an extraoridnary mood. I would rather tip a girl who gets fucked hard, than a massagist that only wanks cocks. Please don't tip also, otherwise all girls will expect tips all the times and start showing bad attitude if you don't. The price you pay is quite high for your own finances and should include everything. A great service should be the norm. And there are other ways to retribute a girl than giving extra money at the end... cheers

Spanish Fly

04-03-07, 03:25

With the smell of one nice dyev from N.F. still in my bed, I wanted to write a few lines before the memories start fading away....
I arrived to Moscow last saturday night from Barcelona via Praga.... not so bad if you compare with other options like amsterdam or even Stockolm!
Well, following some of the advices of the forum, I had made my homework and had contacted a few normal ladies in advance through one of the dating sites around....
With a few dates in the pocket scheduled for sunday morning, sunday evening and monday (early afternoon and late evening), I decided to go hunting on saturday night... despite of the fact that I had to wake up early and that I was exhausted from an ultra complicated week at work...
First stop, Real Mcoy, 250m from my apartment, so it seemed perfect for a first beer. As the guys from exile.ru like to say "I bet that you can't leave Real Mcoy after only one drink". Well, I have to say that it's not my favorite place, but it was certainly lively and with a lot of potential material. IMHO, 99.99% perfectly normal girls, students, assistants, etc... Mosty 4-6, a few solid 7's and maybe one good 8. I started talking to one of the 7's, Natasha (hey, aren't they always called Natasha?), 21y.o. student from the university. Surprinsingly approachable, specially if you compare to western standards (did I say that I love Russia?? ----and Ukraine too!!!). Unfortunately, the place was crowded, and when I went to order a drink, I needed almost 10-15min to come back , and some other guy was playing his cards with Natasha... (if you are in the same situation as me, imagina thaat, nice 21 Moscow student laughing and holding your hand, and suddenly you want a drink......go and bite your tongue or buy a tequila from the nice girl selling tequila shots right on the dance floor....) but DON'T LEAVE THE GIRL!!!, hey, it's a jungle outthere... ;-)
After loosing my chances with Natasha (I even couldn't get her number, shame on me!), it was late (around 2:30) and wanting to play moderately safe, and being almost a Moscow newbie, I ended, just you can imagine..., in D&M Boar House... Horny as hell, and wanting a nice double act to compensate my bad movement before, I started to look for two nice blondikas to share my bad for the night... At that time on a saturday, not an incredible good selection... not a single 8, very few 7's (and all of them alone --- meaning not in pairs, and I have learned that if you want a decent duo/lesbi action, they need to be friends before....) being quoted 400USD EACH, at 3:30am or 4:00am!!!!! ridiculous, and I promise that I wasn't flagging a 20k Euros watch or anything.... ;-) I declined and went to Night Flight, were I wasn't able to get in because they had just closed, last shot, Rasputin, no way, also closed... Damn Luck, time was running out, and my first night in moscow wasn't going too well. I tried a few phone numbers collected from a dating site (from scorts), but considering my almost not-existant russian, i couldn't get much results... it wasn't my night, so I decided to cut my losses, go to sleep and save the almost zero energy left for the following night....
But that's another story... It's 6:20am and I should get some rest before my 9:00am meeting.
---to be continued....

It Travel

04-04-07, 17:10

I'll soon be in Moscow again!

And I'm searching for a couple of twins, unfortunately I found them on www.dosug.nu only when I was not in Moscow! Of course the price was hagh (in 2005-6 600/800 USD a night).

Somebody knows a couple, or a internet site, or a brothel?

I enclose some olad pictures from dosug, so you understand what I'm searching for.

Help will be greatly appreciated!

IT

PS in the pics there are three couple of twins, the last is the best!

Ash1001

04-05-07, 02:22

Man, the news of 911 burning done on the front page of CNN even brought me out of slumber...

...And now where am I going to pick up strippers next time I'm in Moscow?

Safari Lodge, maybe? Just be careful that you don't get spat at and punched :) (see #1080)

Schillacci

04-05-07, 22:11

Hi Guys!

I am in Moscow right now till the 7 april. If anybody wants to join for a night let me know. You can leave me your number or send a PM. I have not chosen where to go yet!Hey Fredyann,

I am in Moscow right now also until the 8th. It would be fun to hit some bars with somebody that does speak English!. Send me a PM if you are still around.

Fredyann

04-07-07, 19:33

I was back to Moscow for a few days. I have visited some classical places. I went out 3 night. 2 night I went to Boar House and was always many girls. Just a few are good (in my opinion) but this place is changing too much and prices are nearly same as Night Flight for the best girls. So each time I finished at Night Flight as this place is really great for the eyes (and more ;-)) So first night I picked up a Kazak girl named Sayora. Very nice kisses, sweet, BBBJTC, classic sex. She is very good looking with an asian type. We had a good fun. Fee 300 Euros for the short night (2 AM till morning). Second night I went back again to NF and she was not there. As she sent me few SMS during th day I sent her a SMS while I was at the club and surprise she came in half an hour after. I stopped my discussion with other girls and picked Soraya again for 200 Euros.

For my last evening I had another visit at Boar House to try to meet one member from the forum but we didn't catch each others so I decided to go back to Night Flight because it is really one of the place in this worl where you have the best density of top girls and this makes me mad !! For the last night I went for Oksana, a tall girl with very long black haired girl (she is 1,77 meter talled). She has really a model look with perfect slim body, nice tits siliconed. I asked her what she likes and she was offering a total full service. For those who like Anal sex well, this is the most powerfull experience of my life. This girl really like Anal and takes a full pleasure. I rarely see this and she has a so wonderful butt... I have also kept her number because she was really amazing. Not as sweet as Soraya but a very strong physical sex experience !! Fee : 300 euros.

So about this trip I would say that moscow is getting very expensive now if you want top girls. Some years ago it was much less. I think Night Flight is still better with better girls than Boar House. I would be very happy if some melmbers have some other places in Moscow for my next trip. I'm sure there must be some other places maybe with more "less pro" girls.

Chenheyan9

04-09-07, 10:20

Doctor_Skank

04-09-07, 21:38

Hi all,

I will be visiting Moscow next week, I am kind of scared of getting laid because I am a native Chinese, I don't know if the girls at Moscow will do a Chinese person. But I live in the USA For a long time. Any advice for getting the hotties in moscow?

In terms of pros, if you pay, they play. For any race.

For freebies, methinks you'll have a tougher time. The more modern or monied you look in terms of style and dress, the better. Asian looking guys dressing average or "local" could get confused with central Asian guys (Kazaks, Kirgizi etc.) and those guys aren't exactly known as ladies men. You'd probably be well-advised to advertise the fact that you live in the US. From my understanding, Chinese guys aren't the most popular in Russia. Just my 2 cents, but I am not really an expert on Asian dudes in Moscow... maybe some Asians who have been there can offer better and current advice... :)

Do you guys ever seen a asian dude get laid in moscow, especially 3somes? Thx

And no, I've never actually SEEN an Asian dude get laid in Moscow, but I am sure it has happened... :)

Blaked

04-10-07, 11:47

There's this salon (brothel) at 9 Tatarskaya, apartment 39 that has about 60 girls and high turnover. It's pretty good on the weekends, and it's about 3000 rubles per hour. None of them speak English. Some girls come in from other cities to work there on the weekends for a few hundred easy bucks. Again, I don't recommend Moscow for ***** trips - your best bet is somewhere more out-of-the way unless money is no object.

So about this trip I would say that moscow is getting very expensive now if you want top girls. Some years ago it was much less. I think Night Flight is still better with better girls than Boar House. I would be very happy if some melmbers have some other places in Moscow for my next trip. I'm sure there must be some other places maybe with more "less pro" girls.

Saunter

04-10-07, 19:27

Asian looking guys dressing average or "local" could get confused with central Asian guys (Kazaks, Kirgizi etc.) and those guys aren't exactly known as ladies men.

Hey Doc

True.

A lot of Russians look down on THESE Asians because in general, they regard them as the (colored-skinned mixed Russians) lower-class coming in for a better life from their shit-hole towns or 'stan' countries. With a lack of tertiary education and professional qualification, they end up doing the most menial jobs or most commonly, selling their wares in those open air markets and stalls. But that is all changed now due to the recent retail law changes. In spite of this 'those low lifes', the average white Russians are not happy because now they have to buy the same stuff with jacked up prices in modern supermarkets.

Of course they are not known as 'ladies men'. These 'Asian' men aren't exactly the cream of the crop (if there is even one) from their countries. They're in Russia because their life back home is so fucked up that Russia (which is fucked up to us if you were an average joe) seems to promise a better future.

This is the same as all the Eastern Europeans who flooded the UK and parts of the EU for work, when 10 new member states joined in 2005. They're also not known to be 'ladies men' either. The Russian dispora around the world are probably also being looked at in this same way too, through the eyes of a westerner. So it's different if a guy was Polish/American and visiting England, comparing to a labourer from Poland who speaks little English and picking up shit all over London and still manages to send money home every month.

Which brings up the following rant...

From my understanding, Chinese guys aren't the most popular in Russia.

I would say even as a generalisation, it's near bullseye. I have a mixed Asian heritage as well. Because of who I am, I tend to take more notice of these things and am probably better in spotting this directed to myself or others around me who are in the same boat.

I'm only speaking from a the point of view of someone who has seen the Baltic countries, so I can't comment on the real situation within Russia/Ukraine/Romania etc... What I can say is that Latvia (50% of its population are Russians) certainly gave me an eye opener and a good guide in the mentality of Russians towards East Asians.

I can summarise the Russians in Latvia into two types.

1. Racists - they just don't like you because of your skin color and there's nothing you can do about it. It can be open, subtle, or just ignoring your existence. Doesn't have to be a skinhead. You will see many Russians trying to impress their girlfriends by taking them to Chinese restaurants because its 'classy and expensive' but still they look down on them.

2. Xenophobic - broken into two types.

- a. They are generally curious and interested about Eastern culture and even study it as a side major in university. They will talk to you because they are curious and are blown away by the fact that this Asian is speaking perfect English and is as western as any European, if not for his skin, he could be 'more' interesting. So this is generally a simple 'out of curious' friendship.

- b. They even become very, very close friends with you and you become part of their social group. But they can never imagine doing anything intimate with you. Because they just don't get off on it automatically.

Now there are always exception to the rule. And when you play the numbers game, you'll still score for sure. Especially in these parts of the world, MONEY TALKS. Sometimes, it simply comes down to your game and you might even surprise yourself (with all these hurdles) that it's also possible to pull a model-type from various places of the social scene. I know this from personal experience.

My advice to you is, you've obviously made the decision to go. So don't concentrate on the negative. Make the most of it and you will come out further and feel more rewarded when you have conquered in spite of the extra hurdles due to the color of your skin.

Don't take things too personally from these hoes. Why?

Only ~15yrs ago, the USSR was still rationing people to 2 pairs of shoes every 5 years. Their entry to the Western lifestyle was not built like ours which took the last 60yrs to build after WWII.

No. They have just been bombarded with ads, shopping malls, brands etc... all within a mere 10yrs. That does something funny to their minds. It's call culture shock/overload. They only understand what is marketed to them and have absolutely no sense in their own identity.

In Latvia, I saw ethnic Russians falling all over the most ugly African/Americans or full blooded Indians because its the closest thing they can get to Diddy, Usher... from all the MTV they're watching. Even the Indians got in on the act. They fly over on their $99 Ryannair flights and say 'oh I'm mixed Indian/Black and from England' to score. But if you were to say you were just Indian or African (as in, actually from Africa), they'd stick a ten foot pole in between because they would consider you dirty and 'low'. So their taste for you as an 'exotic' black person rest solely on being sold by the media, entertainment, fashion industry - pretty much the same thing for the middle-class white girls in England and USA.

So why are Asians more short changed? Well, how are they represented in the American media and entertainment? Can you name one Asian as the lead anchor or acting role that carries a show? They're still slipped in as the 'token' Asian guy. Not someone like a Denzel Washington.

It is not just in this region, but back home in comfortable America, Asians are still only regarded as the book worms, geeks, white collar soldiers, point dexter bodies. How many Asians you know are regarded for their looks or body?

Until Asians in the western world find their own vibe and somehow shake off this stereotype, these hurdles will remain everywhere around the world.

RANT ENDS.

Now if you bother to take some time in reading the previous posts by so many veterans here, there's a lot of heads-up you can walk away with. Follow the tried and tested methods while testing your own experiments. DRESS SMART, act like a gentleman, know how to play and control the (mind) game, take hints from watching the local men (I'm not asking you to treat them like a Russian but you learn about them by understanding what a woman's world is like in these conditions) and you'll know what buttons to push or not push.

Doc ... are my views wrong as to why Chinese Asians aren't exactly popular in Russia or Ukraine?

Starchild2012

04-10-07, 21:12

Now there are always exception to the rule. And when you play the numbers game, you'll still score for sure. Especially in these parts of the world, MONEY TALKS. Sometimes, it simply comes down to your game and you might even surprise yourself (with all these hurdles) that it's also possible to pull a model-type from various places of the social scene. I know this from personal experience.

Wow great post dude..hats off...I'm asian myself and couldn't have said better.

Ash1001

04-11-07, 04:49

1. Timing & Weather
I thought that the week end I picked to visit Moscow for the first time - the one just gone - would be a normal weekend in the Slavic world as it coincided with the Western Easter, and the Orthodox and Western calendars are 'out' by a few weeks. This is always true for Christmas BUT once every few years or so Easter is actually on the same day! And that is what happened this time. So I guess I was experiencing Moscow in quieter-than-normal mode. This, coupled with the schizophrenic weather - alternating hourly between snow and sun - made me think that I would be seeing Moscow in a rather untypical state.

2. The Guide
As I was a total Moscow newbie visiting on my own, I thought I might need some help. To this end, I hired a local guide by the name of Raphael (still don't know his surname, but PM me for his email address) to show me the best of Moscow by day and night, and generally provide some security whilst walking around and travelling on the metro. He also arranged my transport and accommodation (a 1 bed flat in Tverskaya Ulitsa about 150m from the Kremlin).

Raphael (www.dreammoscownights.com) specializes in showing the best of Moscow to Westerners with some cash to spend. He's really very good at what he does: apart from being fluent in Russian, English, French and Italian, he can strike up a conversation with just about any girl or group of girls on the street or in a nightclub or shopping centre. Part of his service is to make such introductions on your behalf. I'm usually pretty good at this myself (we were playfully competing at one stage) but if you're naturally shy or reserved, then this could be particularly useful for freebies. Being black in Moscow, he tends to get more than his fair share of attention. On the first night, whilst eating in La Cantina, a late 30s woman said to him: "I like black. I want you" and gave him her number. Surely it can't be that easy?

He's also got an interesting outsider's perspective on the Russian way of doing things and their attitudes to money, spending, sex, girls, foreigners, race and just about anything else. I felt his insights were invaluable - more about this later.

3. Nightlife
The first night, Friday, after eating at La Cantina and checking out the talent, we decided to do CF/Boarhouse followed by Fabrique. He rates the latter as his favourite club in Moscow.

The first thing that strikes you about CF is the sheer number of working girls, all hanging around the entrance and pool table. Most of them were quite attractive I thought, in a rather girl next door kind of way. No supermodels, but I've always preferred natural looking girls. And, Moscow WGs seem to be very into their sexy thigh length boots.. I didn't pick one that night as I thought I'd hunt for a freebie instead. To find the freebies you have to go much deeper inside the place, to where the dancefloor is. Unfortunately, maybe due to the Easter effect, non WGs were thin on the ground. I struck up a conversation with a red haired girl called Anya who didn't speak much English but after about 5 minutes a Turkish-looking guy came along and grabbed her, sweeping her onto the dancefloor. Anya had a fat friend with her, who spoke perfect English, and explained that he and Anya were 'sort of' together. 'Sort of?' I asked, or 'Actually?'. 'Sort of' came the reply..

I danced with a couple of nice looking WGs and spoke to one. She was friendly and fun but wanted RBL 10 000 for the night. And she didn't budge from that price. Is this normal for CF? I thought this was what you could expect to be quoted at NightFlight, but I suppose there's no reason why the CF girls should rate themselves any lower.

I made a mental note of the hot WGs at CF and left for Fabrique with Raphael. Fabrique is a large and impressive club that seems to get an interesting mix of affluent business types and students. Lots of attractive girls, many of them in small groups without guys, some with men sitting at expensive looking reserved tables. I made many approaches and I'd say about 1 girl in 3 spoke English well. I must say I found it hard to get any real traction. Most girls seemed uninterested in talking until I mentioned I was from London. London seems to ring a bell in this city due to all the high profile oligarchs who have moved there. Being from London seemed to suggest money to them, and the conversation soon progressed to getting a table together. But I wasn't playing that game. The local guys were buying drinks right, left and centre and I felt that splashing the cash here wasn't really going to achieve much. Raphael told me that a Russian guy here would think nothing of spending $1 000 on a table with a couple of girls, and not expect any sexual favours from them. Christ.

One 'interesting' experience I had at Fabrique was that a huge (6'6" and fat) Russian guy kept coming up to me, slapping me on the shoulder and demanding to know where I was from. Using words like "Hey you, you from Saudi, yes? You African? What?" (I'm of Indian origin). When I coolly said I was from London he said "No you not English, you Saudi, you from Dubai. Or you African". He wasn't giving up, and kept following me around the club. I asked Raphael what I should do in this situation, and he said I should relax because the guy was probably just trying to be friendly. So, I went up to him and told him I was from India but living in London. Which was the answer he wanted - he became very friendly, shook my hand and introduced himself, telling me he did a lot of business in India and knew the country very well. Quite a nice guy really. In the Russian style.. We called it a night at Fabrique around 4am.

The plan for the following night (Saturday) was that Raphael was going to line up one of his friends for me as a freebie. They had an understanding, said Raphael, which meant that if he told her to 'do' one of his friends, she would, as a favour to him. Right-o. But please give her $30 or so taxi fare at the end as a token of your appreciation, he explained. After some sightseeing during the day we went shopping for Martini, potato chips and zakuski, the things that unpretentious Russian girls like. Raphael gave me her number and told me she was a banker who speaks perfect English. We spent the day SMS flirting, which I found quite a turn on. Unfortunately, when she turned up she was actually not very good looking at all, and I felt that I had to end this house party quickly and get out of the situation (In all fairness to Raphael, most of his other close female friends had gone home for Easter so he'd had to improvise). So we made something up about just having got a text from an old friend of mine who's in Moscow for 1 night only and is waiting for me in Diagilev. Raphael did seem a little irritated by my rejection of his efforts. He told me "In Russia we don't behave like this. It doesn't matter whether you like a girl so much or not. Even if you are not moved by her looks you behave like a man and sex her (sic) anyway. Now you have insulted her." I agreed that I had something to learn about the Russian way of doing things and we took a taxi to Diagilev. May as well live the lie!

By the time we got to Diagilev - the newest and hottest of the 'elite' clubs - it was late, the weather was cold and the situation was looking grim. A large group of people was waiting outside, everyone eagerly awaiting the nod from the clipboard nazi that confers entry. The situation was exacerbated by the fact that First had temporarily closed for some reason connected with tax/drugs/whatever and that clientele was coming to Diagilev. There were some very glam girls who looked like they had been waiting a long time, and we figured that our chances didn't look too good. It appeared that those people who got straight in were the ones who had pre-booked minimum spend tables. (This is just the type of shit you get in London. Exactly the same.)

So instead we went to the next-door Parizhskaya Zhizn, or Parisian Life, which appeared to be absorbing the Diagilev rejects, some of whom were pretty decent looking girls. Now, this club is a different cup of tea. Inside, it's quite homely, with pool tables on the lower floor. It's basically like a bar with an attached dancefloor rather than a dance club per se. Once again, some nice girls, but many of them with boyfriends or in groups with guys. They seemed much less interested in talking than the ones at Fabrique. Far fewer spoke English and they weren't particularly keen to understand my Russian. Even in this rather more down to earth place there were guys buying several rounds of Tequila shots for their group, easily spending $100 or more. Doing this at 112 in Kiev, say, will get you admiration from a group of student hotties on a night out. I wasn't even going to bother here.

At around 3am I went to Safari Lodge. I actually had trouble getting in! The bouncer made up something about needing a club card on that particular night. His bluff was called when a group of Scandinavians, including a black guy, were all let straight in. They stuck up for me and managed to talk the bouncer into letting me in. Emphasising I'm from London appeared to do the trick (what a surprise). Once inside, things were happier. At only RBL 200 a time for a hands-on, climb-on-top-of-you lap dance, I had about 10 from a really cute little blonde. I even gave her a foot massage. After about an hour and a half of this I was tired so went home to sleep.

My final night, Sunday, was going to be devoted to ladies of the P4P persuasion. I hit NightFlight at 10.30pm and had dinner at their (truly excellent) restaurant. Later I went downstairs to the bar/pick up area and saw about 5 WGs at the most, and about twice as many guys. Including a group of Australians who found it highly amusing to offer 500 rubles every time a girl asked for $500 !! I can imagine that the place would be packed on a normal week end. Since it was Easter Sunday, the regular crowd of girls must have all been in church.. where else.. ?

I ended up choosing Natalia, a tall, curvy, friendly and cute blonde. All the negotiation in the world wouldn't get her below $400. Nice DFK, but no BBBJ so didn't bother with oral sex at all. I don't think this is a great deal by any means, but I was really running out of options and wanted to fit something in before my flight the next day.

4. Day Game
This, in my opinion, is where Moscow really comes into its own and justifies the large costs incurred in staying here. Whilst sightseeing in Victory Park, I struck up a conversation with two eighteen year old students. I basically went up to them and asked "Zravstvuite, vui govoritye po angliski?" They did speak angliski, and in about 10 minutes I had persuaded them to take the metro with me to Tverskaya for coffee and cake. It's a shame I was leaving the next day but this incident really shows what's possible with ORDINARY girls.

5. Costs
I live in London and am used to very high prices, but Moscow is expensive by global standards, particularly good restaurants and decent accommodation. It is in NO WAY a cheap mongering destination. Although the prices for WGs are probably half those for girls of a comparable standard in London, what you'll pay to get here, eat and stay here will make it cheaper to stay in London and hire an escort. But if you like the atmosphere - the combination of glamour and edginess - I suppose there's no substitute for actually being here. But from the girl/sex perspective the clubs have nothing that far cheaper places in the FSU don't have.

Raphael, the Moscow guide: EUR 300 + expenses for 3 days and nights
Accommodation: $190 per night
NightFlight Girl: $400-$500
Chesterfields Girl: $300-$400
Regular nightclub: $70++
Elite club: $20 000 is by no means unusual :)
Decent restaurant: $100+ per head
Top restaurant $250+ per head

6. General Thoughts
Moscow has an undercurrent of racism that is reminiscent of the UK in 1950s. It generally manifests itself as some low paid loser deciding not to let you into 'his' club. I have to emphasise that the girls themselves don't seem to be racist. But some of the guys who think you might get them definitely are! Of course, the men with cash, prospects and girls have far better things to do than hate people of a different appearance or nationality.

Otherwise, Moscow really is a LOT like London. Similar clubs, similar cool-to-cold attitude, similar sky high prices and affluent, free spending locals. At least in the clubs, no one's interested in meeting you just because you can afford to buy drinks or because you are foreign and 'interesting'.

To be honest I perhaps didn't get the club angle quite right, but at this stage I can't say exactly what I did wrong: I'm a confident, decent looking guy who dresses smartly and speaks some Russian. The thing is, you never know exactly what's going on in their heads. Then again, maybe it was just bad luck.

However, I'm convinced that if I'd had more time I would have really made headway with the freebies you meet on the street. With the weather improving and university holidays approaching, more and more young studentkas will be flocking to Moscow for their holidays. These are the girls to go for - unpretentious, unspoilt and genuine, they will really appreciate being taken out for dinner and be thrilled that you live in the centre of town.

The dead-eyed, vapid glamour girls leaching off rich men in the elite clubs are just expensive dross and not worth a damn. Every city has them.

One Eyed Man

04-11-07, 05:30

A lot of Russians look down on THESE Asians because in general, they regard them as the (colored-skinned mixed Russians) lower-class coming in for a better life from their shit-hole towns or 'stan' countries.

Sorry if this is slightly off-topic (and possibly in the wrong folder), but the thread sparked my interest. A couple of girls from Russian Mongolia (but be warned: they consider themselves Russians!) work in a restaurant in my neighborhood, and they're cute as the dickens with their Asian features and European manners. (They speak Russian and a Mongolian dialect, and I've been following the discussion of Mongolians in the Beijing thread.) Most Americans don't know what to make of them--recently a customer asked one if she was Japanese. The one I'm friendly with said that they like to marry Asians--Chinese and Koreans--probably due to their vicinity. Don't have time during an upcoming trip, but Lake Baikal is definitely on the agenda for the next one.

Doctor_Skank

04-11-07, 07:56

Saunter:

Great report, some of the cultural aspects you pointed out are right on target.

Ash1001:

Great report, sorry things didn't pan out as well as you'd hoped. Don't worry, nobody tames Moscow on a single trip... if ever... :) Comparing Moscow to London is pretty accurate in terms of some aspects of the club scene. One striking difference in my opinion though is the relatively few top clubs in Moscow compared to the number of super rich guys going to them. That is one of the reasons there is so much money at these clubs being thrown around. There really aren't more than 4-5 "elite" clubs in Moscow. Even Fabrique, a club I also like, isn't considered elite. It's second tier or middle tier. By the way, it would be interesting if you could write down some of your (and Raphael's) thoughts on Russian girls, their mentality etc. Would be interesting to see how it corresponds with what us mongers think.

One eyed man:

Yeah, central Asian girls are hot and sexy, that's fo sho.

Boarhouse:

Sounds like prices have really skyrocketed... jeezus.

Prosal

04-11-07, 11:12

Ash

Thanks for this comprehensive and well-balanced report. I'm astonished by everything prices. It seems that unfortunatly I will never be able to afford a consequent stay (three weeks is IMHO the strict minimun for decent results) in Moscow, even if it's at the top position on my dream-trip list.

C'est la vie. :)

Blastoff

04-11-07, 11:17

Bbois77

04-11-07, 13:40

Ash...great stuff, its a pity that in a country which is relatively so poor that an oasis of absolute wealthy exists cheek by jowl with those who have not got the price of a loaf of bread.

The extremes of wealth, power and beauty (versus, ugly/poor/powerless) do not bode well for the future, extreme unrealistic expectations are not good for society, even less so for us guys who like to spread out seed on foreign(cheap) soil.

Hope you get to know local girls much better and enjoy the delights of this great nations beauties (non-WGS of course)!

Bois

Toptraveler1

04-11-07, 14:23

You are so far from the reality, my friend.

Ash...great stuff, its a pity that in a country which is relatively so poor that an oasis of absolute wealthy exists cheek by jowl with those who have not got the price of a loaf of bread.

The extremes of wealth, power and beauty (versus, ugly/poor/powerless) do not bode well for the future, extreme unrealistic expectations are not good for society, even less so for us guys who like to spread out seed on foreign(cheap) soil.

Hope you get to know local girls much better and enjoy the delights of this great nations beauties (non-WGS of course)!

Bois

Ash1001

04-11-07, 15:00

Prosal:
Don't be too put off by the prices. True, you will pay a lot for accommodation anywhere inside the central Garden Ring, but you can save a lot of money by eating cheaply. And in my opinion, you can give the nightclubs a complete miss. Trying to impress girls by buying drinks will get you nowhere and can be financially suicidal.

Your expenditure should be focussed on entertaining the freebies - modestly - once you have got their phone numbers from street / shopping mall chat ups. Coffee & meals at La Cantina are fine. That's really all you need to do. Wait till the weather is good and try to spend 2-3 weeks there. Then the results will come rolling in.

As for P4P, remember that ordinary (non-elite) Russian guys also enjoy WGs and are getting them at a lower rate than CF/NF. It's not THAT cheap for them either (it's Moscow after all) but certainly cheaper. I think having a like-minded Russian friend would be a great help for local knowledge like this. As I was pressed for time, I did things in a touristy way.

It's always important to think of a city like Moscow as being primarily a business and cultural capital. No one automatically associates London with cheap girls and nor should you make that association with Moscow. Try to have some other reason for being there (anything from business to ballet) rather than just pussy. It'll help keep you sane!

Skank:
Don't worry, I realise that taming Moscow in 3 days is a pretty tall order! Even 3 months for that matter.

Some thoughts on Russian females and sexual attitudes:

1. Russian girls believe in free love. Sleeping with your boyfriend's brother or best friend is no big deal and just about par for the course.
2. 'Free love' does not necessarily mean it will be free of charge :) If she senses you've got means, are particularly taken with her or in some way 'weak', you will pay more than you have to. It's therefore best to be slightly off hand with a girl here. Always give the impression you have other options. But don't be mean. It's part of the culture to show you care by buying gifts and giving small cash presents. Just make sure it's you who initiates the gifts.
3. A Russian girl wants a man to be a real man: to make the approach, make the decisions, take charge of situations and have his own money.
4. Russian girls are slightly schizo about foreigners - particularly non white ones. On the one hand they've been conditioned to shun them, and on the other they are often genuinely interested in and attracted to something that's different. What they actually do will depend on their mood and how drunk they are at the time :)
5. Moscow girls are certainly NOT interested in being 'rescued' by a foreigner and brought to the West. Their main interest is in meeting a local guy with money. They do go for foreigners, sure, but generally not because of an automatic association with money.
6. Sponsorship: Raphael explained that many rich Russian guys in Moscow are sponsoring around 10 girls at any time. This means paying their rent and monthly spending money. The guys are generally not having regular sex with the girls and don't even expect to. The girls often have a steady boyfriend or husband. The only requirement is that she must be available at a moment's notice whenever the rich dude wants her. This situation is considered (by the girls) not only normal but desirable.

But then again... How many British or American girls would behave like this if they could? ;)

Doctor_Skank

04-11-07, 16:19

Ash1001:

Thanks again for your thoughts.

I think the prices paid were slightly higher than they had to be or could be, this is the way I break down Moscow prices:

Pros:
NightFlight Girl: $250-$400
Chesterfields Girl: $150-$200 (may actually be more now, last time I was there I paid $150)
Stripper: $400-600 (includes “bar fine” etc.)
Salons: $80-100/hour (take out slightly more, often restricted “options” like no DFK, BBBJ etc.)
Internet “sponsorship”: $250+/night
Internet pro sites: $250+/night

There are of course always going to be slightly cheaper and slightly more expensive versions of the above, but that’s pretty average.

Regular costs:
Taxi to/from airport: $35+ each way
Short trip taxi: $5
Long trip taxi: $10
Apartment (central): $160/night
Hotel (central): $250+/night
Café meal: $30/person
Decent restaurant: $60/person
Elite restaurant: $100/person
Regular nightclub (drinks etc.): $70+
Elite club: $100 if only drinks, tables about $1000-2000 minimum charge

I’m no gazillionaire either, so I beat costs by:

* staying in apartments
* eating breakfast and sometimes lunch at home
* rarely eating at expensive restaurants on dates
* having cheap dates, like walk in the park, kino, museum, café
* controlling club drinking… I still do way too much though… .:)
* I don’t reserve VIP tables unless on business with other guys and split costs
* only occasionally use pros
* use the metro during the day, taxis at night

Regarding the futility of buying drinks in glam clubs, I did warn you that just buying drinks won’t get you laid. You do have to create atmosphere and get them to come to you. And no, it doesn’t always work. Glam clubs are very fun (you didn’t actually even visit one if I understood correctly, but Fabrique is semi-glam and a good place) but they are expensive. There is almost no way to avoid that even if you limit yourself to drinking $20 jack and cokes all night.

As for freebies, it is Moscow’s best feature now that pro action is so cost-prohibitive. I still swear it is the easiest place to get freebies… but you will have to get a feel for the city first. Get out of the center, see where these student girls actually live.

And as I suggested before, if someone is looking to combine a freebie-chasing monger weekend with some pro action, get the pro action done on day one to ease the pressure you automatically put on yourself. I know we all want to dive right in and go for the opening night kill… me too… but unloading early will improve your game and you won’t have that look of desperation in your eyes.

Ideally you’ll get laid in the evening with a $150 pro and then go out at night with that “I just got laid, fuck you bee-och-ezz” look on your face. Chances are, your subsequent approach will be better received.

Doctor_Skank

04-11-07, 16:26

This P4P site below is written in Russian but the prices are not clear to me if they are quoting in Rubbles or in U.S.$.

Can some one help me out here?

http://www.putana.nu/ancets.php?city=%D1.-%CF%E5%F2%E5%F0%E1%F3%F0%E3

Thanks.

That link puts you on the St.Pete pros. The prices are $. Prices seem a bit higher than average though.

St.Pete should be:
Magrib/Tribunal: $150-$200
Stripper: $400-600 (includes “bar fine” etc.)
Salons: $50-80/hour (take out slightly more, often restricted “options” like no DFK, BBBJ etc.)
Internet “sponsorship”: $150+/night
Internet pro sites (takeout): $200/2 hours or $250+/night

You can switch to Moscow by clicking on:
http://www.putana.nu/ancets.php

Prices vary wildly as you see. Don't trust the pictures. The girls are often really quite beautiful, but the pics are photoshopped and only "approximations".

Tiger1974

04-11-07, 19:19

I am new, planing to go to moscow.

What is Internet “sponsorship”: $150+/night?

Any website for those girls?

What do they provide?

That link puts you on the St.Pete pros. The prices are $. Prices seem a bit higher than average though.

St.Pete should be:
Magrib/Tribunal: $150-$200
Stripper: $400-600 (includes “bar fine” etc.)
Salons: $50-80/hour (take out slightly more, often restricted “options” like no DFK, BBBJ etc.)
Internet “sponsorship”: $150+/night
Internet pro sites (takeout): $200/2 hours or $250+/night

You can switch to Moscow by clicking on:
http://www.putana.nu/ancets.php

Prices vary wildly as you see. Don't trust the pictures. The girls are often really quite beautiful, but the pics are photoshopped and only "approximations".

Ash1001

04-11-07, 22:27

I did warn you that just buying drinks won’t get you laid

And I heeded the warning. I possibly went to the other extreme and didn't buy drinks for girls at all. All the spending I did in the clubs was on drinks for myself and Raphael.

I'd generally buy a drink after 10 minutes of talking to a girl if she's being warm and friendly and if she doesn't suggest something stupid like getting a table. That's the rule I apply everywhere in Eastern Europe. In poorer places, opening with the line "Do you like champagne?" can and sometimes has worked wonders, but it's WAY too expensive to try this in Moscow. (But DO try it in Kiev - it's a great way to break the ice with a group of girls and will cost you all of $12 :))

If you meet a girl in a bar or club, she is a) on display, and b) aware that she's in a place where money can be lavished on her.

If you meet her in a public place, she'll be off-guard and you'll actually have to take her to a different location before it's even possible to spend money. Therein lies your advantage.

BTW is it really necessary to leave the centre of Moscow for freebies? The centre itself is huge, and I was always under the impression that anyone living in the suburbs was desperate to get the hell out and hang in the centre. True / not true?

And - if I were to leave the centre - where should I go?

Doctor_Skank

04-12-07, 00:31

I am new, planing to go to moscow.

What is Internet “sponsorship”: $150+/night?

Any website for those girls?

What do they provide?

You are planning to go to Moscow and then refer to my post about St.Petersburg? That's a bad start.

Sponsorship has been discussed again and again on this board and you are still asking what it is?

Doctor_Skank

04-12-07, 00:42

And I heeded the warning. I possibly went to the other extreme and didn't buy drinks for girls at all. All the spending I did in the clubs was on drinks for myself and Raphael.

I'd generally buy a drink after 10 minutes of talking to a girl if she's being warm and friendly and if she doesn't suggest something stupid like getting a table. That's the rule I apply everywhere in Eastern Europe. In poorer places, opening with the line "Do you like champagne?" can and sometimes has worked wonders, but it's WAY too expensive to try this in Moscow. (But DO try it in Kiev - it's a great way to break the ice with a group of girls and will cost you all of $12 :))

If you meet a girl in a bar or club, she is a) on display, and b) aware that she's in a place where money can be lavished on her.

If you meet her in a public place, she'll be off-guard and you'll actually have to take her to a different location before it's even possible to spend money. Therein lies your advantage.

BTW is it really necessary to leave the centre of Moscow for freebies? The centre itself is huge, and I was always under the impression that anyone living in the suburbs was desperate to get the hell out and hang in the centre. True / not true?

And - if I were to leave the centre - where should I go?

I think my last post was a bit lacking in explanation, sorry.

First of all I agree with you totally that buying drinks can be appropriate, fun and effective... under the right circumstances. In Moscow glam clubs it can also work, but isn't necessarily the major impulse into getting her naked as it might be in the boondocks... and Kiev is still the boondocks compared to Moscow. Kiev is changing too though as they try to copy Moscow style. Many of the changes aren't positive.

By saying leave the center, I mean do it to get an idea of where these girls live and how they live. The contrasts are huge. From super rich secure country estates to nameless block-shaped highrises outside of town with entryways and elevators that smell of cold ash, stale beer, cat food and [CodeWord140] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140). That's a nasty stench.

True that many come to the center or at least to Manezhnaya Ploshad and Pushkinskaya Ploshad. But many stay on the Garden Ring, where there are also a lot of big popular clubs, or on Leninsky. Some stay in the suburbs and country almost all the time.

Still, you really don't need to leave the center, that's true.

Ash1001

04-12-07, 18:35

Doctor_Skank

04-12-07, 20:48

Right, got your meaning. Thanks for that Skank.

Can you recommend any of these 'outside the centre' clubs? Basically where your drinks budget will go a *lot* further in impressing the dyevs? :)

I've been looking for the equivalent in Kiev and was told Hidropark is where the 'real' Ukainians go. And also that it's very dangerous for foreigners! Not sure how much of an exaggeration this may be.

I thought Parizhskaya Zhizn was quite homely looking - but then again, it was in the centre, and the guys there had plenty of money.

Any club really. Places I've enjoyed are Slava (big club, mid-level prices, wildy varied clientele, Shosse Entusiastov), Neo (mid-sized techno club on Warshawskoe Schosse) and Lionheart (mid-sized club on Leninsky).

Just the same, very enjoyable are also some centrally located clubs with average prices:

Fabrique-you've been there, its a good place.

Karma Bar. m.Kuznetsky Most- basically an expat disco, sometimes very nice student-aged women though.

Che-I personally don't like this place because I hate the idiotic Che Guevara cult, but it is a good place to score 25-30 year old secretaries etc... especially if you can dance a bit.

Voodoo Club- near Belorussky Voksal and Krasnaya Presnaya: smallish club- either great or horrible. If its full, great. If its half-full or empty, leave immediately and go somewhere else. When its been full, getting girls drunk and/or dancing always worked wonders for me.

Other central clubs:
Some people swear by Dirty Dancing, which is also near Belorussky Voksal, but I hate that place.

Also hate Hippopotam.

Haven't been happy with 16 tonnes lately either.

B2 can be good.

I have gotten laid at Parizhskaya Zhizn very often. It is a pretty easy place to score actually, but I prefer it in the week. On the weekends its too crowded. In the week you can maneuver, drink with girls, get them drunk and fuck them. Quality of girl is average, 5-7, but it is a collecting point for wayward souls... lots of secretaries or other low-wage earning girls out on their mid-week night off, some country girls on their first weeks in Moscow looking for new "friends", some expats, occasionally a working girl or two sitting at the bar smoking and nursing a single drink, sometimes the CSKA basketball team turns up there, often on Monday or Tuesday night. They usually make for a fun atmosphere getting silly drunk.

Krisis Zhanra plays great music on the weekends, Britpop and Indie. Boy/girl ratio sucks and there are lots of foreigners there, but I did bang the cute skinny chick with the straight blonde hair that's there nearly every weekend. She asked me to dance to "Hey jude", we did and I told her "let's go" and we went for coats. Still, not a great place to score if you ask me, just for drinks and laughs.

Garazh is a cellar club that's cramped and smoky, but a good teen crowd gathers there. I find it almost impossible to score there though... I almost always leave there soon... and empty handed.

It's not always possible to say which clubs will be good... sometimes I hate 2 or even 3 before settling on one. Best to choose a club before 2 am thouogh.. as we know, crunch time is usually between 0200-0330. Your chances of establishing new contact decrease rapidly after 0330 and then you are left bottom-feeding. That's a good time to go to Chesterfields/Boarhouse or NF.

Of the glam clubs I prefer Dagielev and Gazgolder, but also heard that Opera was good.

There are tons of other clubs and dozens I've never even been to, so I think rating the clubs is pretty subjective. The price level variance is pretty extreme, with glam clubs or cocktail bars (the new thing) considerably more expensive and then a large drop to the second tier and third tier clubs. Expat clubs are usually on the expensive side. Student clubs obviously cheaper.

It Travel

04-13-07, 07:48

Genrally speaking I completely agree with Doc and Ash on the price scene. Of course thy are starting prices upwards I even sow Internet girls (for Russians) at 800 USD/night :(

On sponsorship: of course it's different with long and short (I mean weekend based, mostly for sex, and monthly based...).

Some girls sponosored I know are fucked nearly every evening, some times with two or other theee girls usually nice blonde Russian teens!

Why am not in the Russian gaz business? :(

By the way some economic suggestion is to try hotels and flats far from the center, but near metro stations, and then use the metro, qwicker than a taxi, sometimes even in the evening.

Usually I stay at Izmailovo (business suites with the price of a studio in centrum), but now for a fair they rised the prices... I'll see what's happening if future and otherwise switch over to apartments...

IT

Toptraveler1

04-13-07, 09:38

Thx, but do you know any place to dance latino ( salsa, merengue, etc)?

Any club really. Places I've enjoyed are Slava (big club, mid-level prices, wildy varied clientele, Shosse Entusiastov), Neo (mid-sized techno club on Warshawskoe Schosse) and Lionheart (mid-sized club on Leninsky).

Just the same, very enjoyable are also some centrally located clubs with average prices:

Fabrique-you've been there, its a good place.

Karma Bar. m.Kuznetsky Most- basically an expat disco, sometimes very nice student-aged women though.

Che-I personally don't like this place because I hate the idiotic Che Guevara cult, but it is a good place to score 25-30 year old secretaries etc... especially if you can dance a bit.

Voodoo Club- near Belorussky Voksal and Krasnaya Presnaya: smallish club- either great or horrible. If its full, great. If its half-full or empty, leave immediately and go somewhere else. When its been full, getting girls drunk and/or dancing always worked wonders for me.

Other central clubs:
Some people swear by Dirty Dancing, which is also near Belorussky Voksal, but I hate that place.

Also hate Hippopotam.

Haven't been happy with 16 tonnes lately either.

B2 can be good.

I have gotten laid at Parizhskaya Zhizn very often. It is a pretty easy place to score actually, but I prefer it in the week. On the weekends its too crowded. In the week you can maneuver, drink with girls, get them drunk and fuck them. Quality of girl is average, 5-7, but it is a collecting point for wayward souls... lots of secretaries or other low-wage earning girls out on their mid-week night off, some country girls on their first weeks in Moscow looking for new "friends", some expats, occasionally a working girl or two sitting at the bar smoking and nursing a single drink, sometimes the CSKA basketball team turns up there, often on Monday or Tuesday night. They usually make for a fun atmosphere getting silly drunk.

Krisis Zhanra plays great music on the weekends, Britpop and Indie. Boy/girl ratio sucks and there are lots of foreigners there, but I did bang the cute skinny chick with the straight blonde hair that's there nearly every weekend. She asked me to dance to "Hey jude", we did and I told her "let's go" and we went for coats. Still, not a great place to score if you ask me, just for drinks and laughs.

Garazh is a cellar club that's cramped and smoky, but a good teen crowd gathers there. I find it almost impossible to score there though... I almost always leave there soon... and empty handed.

It's not always possible to say which clubs will be good... sometimes I hate 2 or even 3 before settling on one. Best to choose a club before 2 am thouogh.. as we know, crunch time is usually between 0200-0330. Your chances of establishing new contact decrease rapidly after 0330 and then you are left bottom-feeding. That's a good time to go to Chesterfields/Boarhouse or NF.

Of the glam clubs I prefer Dagielev and Gazgolder, but also heard that Opera was good.

There are tons of other clubs and dozens I've never even been to, so I think rating the clubs is pretty subjective. The price level variance is pretty extreme, with glam clubs or cocktail bars (the new thing) considerably more expensive and then a large drop to the second tier and third tier clubs. Expat clubs are usually on the expensive side. Student clubs obviously cheaper.

Master Sergeant

04-13-07, 13:28

Any club really. Places I've enjoyed are Slava (big club, mid-level prices, wildy varied clientele, Shosse Entusiastov)For your information Doc, Slava closed at November 22, 2006 and will not re-open as a night club any more. So, no reason to recommend this place to another users. ;) Please be updated.

Of the glam clubs I prefer Dagielev and Gazgolder, but also heard that Opera was good.Good choise. But you forget about RAЙ (Elysium) opened in February. This club much better than Dagielev and Opera, IMHO.

Kind regards,

Msgnt

Master Sergeant

04-13-07, 19:54

Thx, but do you know any place to dance latino ( salsa, merengue, etc)?As Doc Skank said - Karma Bar. (m.Kuznetsky Most) are specialized in salsa dancing party!

Doctor_Skank

04-13-07, 21:54

For your information Doc, Slava closed at November 22, 2006 and will not re-open as a night club any more. So, no reason to recommend this place to another users. ;) Please be updated.

Good choise. But you forget about RAЙ (Elysium) opened in February. This club much better than Dagielev and Opera, IMHO.

Kind regards,

Msgnt

Thanks for info! Haven't been to Slava in ages obviously. It's pretty typical for Moscow... clubs open and close with regularity. Sorry to see Slava go though, it was an institution... even if it was too far out of town for my taste.

A good reference for all: www.afisha.ru

Check it out for up to date club info. As Msgt just pointed out to me, it's nearly impossible to follow all the major clubs in Moscow, things change fairly rapidly.

Doctor_Skank

04-13-07, 21:56

Thx, but do you know any place to dance latino ( salsa, merengue, etc)?

Che, Papa Johns, Old Havana, Karma Bar.... but check the night. Many clubs have a "Latin Night", usually a Wednesday or Thursday. Only Cuban or Spanish clubs offer salsa every night. Karma has a separate salsa section even on weekends, but I've never felt it was very good or very popular. On "dedicated" salsa or latin nights, usually a good crowd of cute students shows up though.

A good reference for all: www.afisha.ru

Check it out for up to date club info. As Msgt just pointed out to me, it's nearly impossible to follow all the major clubs in Moscow, things change fairly rapidly.

It Travel

04-17-07, 06:58

Answer here on ground of PM requests.

You can get guests to your rooms (no matter on number or sex and no correlation to the room type) up to 23.00, but they have to be registered at one of the elevator desks, they simply take name and room number and Passport datas (of the guest).

In my opinion a good policy perhaps a little imbasrassing when you are with a teen which could be your grand child: but nobody cares and everybody know what you will do to her in the room!

The procedure is useful on ground it’s protecting (at least partially) from theft and so. Around 23.00 the bell men will go to the room they know there are guests and say that she or they have to go: there is a fixed tariff 1.000 RUR per pussy! Just give the bell man and he will disappear.

If you get inside after 23.00 go with nonchalance to the right elevator block, show your card and discreetly handle over 1.000 RUR per girl to the bell man! Nothing will happen and he will let you through.

If you want to avoid this practice do as I do. I have always one of my favourite girls when making the check in and so on ground the room is booked for two (the difference is usually 8 USD for breakfast) I get two cards and I can come and go with my girlfriend as I like. Of course you have to trust her (but I know her and her sister since ¾ years and have copies of the passport of both, they gave me soo…) When I’m not nailing them I nail others I know I use the second card I get, if I feel something wrong I get the girl registered.

I Think it’s all.

PS Mind that this is only valid fot Izmailovo Gamma and Delta, I’ve heard despite they have a night club, that Alpha is less girlfriendly, don’t know on Vega and Beta.

Fredyann

04-17-07, 10:30

Rasman77

04-17-07, 15:41

Rasman77

04-17-07, 22:32

A good hotel and friendly is the BUDAPEST hotel, closed from the Kremlin and Tverskaya, 30 seconds from Marriott and one of the cheapest "good level" hotel in Moscow. Only thing the breakfast is not good and no restaurant but you can always have your breakfast at cafe "vogue" which is 2 minutes by walk.Could you give a little more info in this. Like what kind of price level are we talking about for a double room, and can you just bring a girl there witout documents, or how does it work ?

Actually I have never used other hotels than Izmailovo, but I would be happy to hear about other options. In Izmailovo you pay about 3.400 rubles for a business class ( renovated ) double room on weekdays and about 3.000 in weekends, if you have stayed there more than 3 times, you will get a discount of 10 %

I the weekends you will also have the option of getting a cheap room through the companys who have their representives placed in the street between the metro and the hotels. These companys buy a certain amount of rooms from the hotels every day, and then they sell them on to guests who didnt book directly with the hotel. On weekdays when the hotel is fully booked, they turn up the price, up to the double of hotel rates, but in weekend they sell really cheap, because there is usually not enough guests. For example this weekend I got a 1st class double room in Vega for 1.500 rubles, the hotel rate for this is 3.700 ! Then you just ask them to make the bill at the normal rate ( if your company is paying ), and you got your expences for security and a taxi to pick up a girl covered ! :-))

It Travel

04-18-07, 07:37

It,

Thanks for your always useful information.

I use the same practice as you, only I usually check in alone, otherwise I am worried that the girls name will appear on the bill, which is not so nice, when the company is paying your bills !! ( dont they put her name on the bill if you check in together ? )

Because of this I check in alone, in a double room, and later I just have the girl checked in seperatly, it cost you 1 ruble !

The problems only start if the girl is without documents, then you have to pay 1.000 rubles for security as you say, but sometimes you can be lucky in Delta, one of the security gues there only ask for 500.

I dont know about Alfa and Beta, but in Vega it is exactly the same practice.

By the way, have you experienced problems with the police patroling in the hotel complex ? I've had a "meeting" with them a couple of times with a girl without passport, it costs 1.000 - 2.000 rubles, and then you have to pay in the hotel afterwards, so it all ads up.

Also I have tried to be stopped by police a couple of times just after leaving the tochka, according to the "mama' she pays them to run her business, but still they try to get money from the clients as well, are we dealing with corrupt "militsia" or what ?? The cost is the same as the police in the hotel, but still I prefer to pay a little cash, rather than having a closer encounter with the russian police. But anyway they will not harm you, if you refuse to pay, all they will do is to take the girl to the policestation, and keep her there for 3 hours, after this she will be back in business again !

Usually I do not use tockas (I know you find sometimes young stunners) but I do not want to get in to the risk that they find you in bed with a girl with no documents and who is may be 16…. And you just go to jail!

A question Rasman where you go to tocka? You take cars or taxis in the Metro station area in front of Izmailovo (always overpriced) or what… Are there some tockas in the hotel/market area? Let me know, might be usueful.

There is a very simple thing to avoid all hassles… Buy the hotel from a Company like Intourist or Akademservice (they both have desks in the Lobby Delta/Gamma) and you can get invoices for all the services you need transfer, tickets hotel etc in the name of your company. Usually the fee you pay is even lower than the fee you pay at the hotel front desk (and you get the best rooms…)

On ground I’m usually shortly in Moscow in these times I do not even have registration problems of the girls, because the If I stay three or four nights my scheme is usually the same first I do Valentina, then the day after her sister; she usually come with a bi girlfriend so I have some fun, no beauties but real pigs! Unfortunately the girlfriend is usually shy and reserved, so in most cases no pictures :(, but they come with such dildos! The third night Valantina again (so I’m sure to get a good morning anal service before leaving, usually twice). :) :)

Never had any kind of problem with the police. They never stopped us at all, in any case the girls are registered and have proper documents so even if they stop…

Alfa seems, in my opinion, but never tested, to have strict rules. I think they have to protect their own market of the night club girls, wher, by the way, I have never been.

IT

Rasman77

04-18-07, 10:56

A question Rasman where you go to tocka? You take cars or taxis in the Metro station area in front of Izmailovo (always overpriced) or what. Are there some tockas in the hotel/market area? Let me know, might be usueful.

Before I just took a taxi near the hotel, but as you say, they are really overpriced, so now that I have a better knowledge of russian and Russia, either I talk them down to a fair price, or I take the metro to the center and find a cheaper taxi. I know a couple of private taxi drivers, so usually I just phone one of them, and we agree on what metro to meet and then we go on the hunt ! :-))

Lately I've had some really good experience with finding girls on the net, but there is still something exciting about going to the tochkas. I find it very convinient that you in a very short time can check out maybe 100 girls in 2-4 tochkas, and sometimes you really do find gold ! Also I think that it ads to the excitement that you know there's the risk of getting stopped by police etc. it's some kind of a mysterious game in the Moscow night.

The nearest tochkas from Izmailovo are located in the center on Prospect Mira or on the Garden Ring. But sometimes it can pay off to go to Jaroslavskoe Shosse, especially if your taxi is not too expensive, here the girls are normally cheaper, sometimes on weekdays you can get a really good deal, because clients are fewer than in the weekends. Another option is to go to Leningradskoe Shosse, but it is even further away, last time I was there the last tochka was only about a kilometre from the Sheremetyevo Airport!

Floflo

04-19-07, 06:16

Hi Guys, I think most people coming to moscow are in for either pleassure or buissness. As concernce logistics and arrangements, you could go for a europain standard apartment in the heart of the city (tverskaya). Contact (www.dreammoscownights.com) for more info. You would not have problems with the girls beign check by police and the apartment are really cheap. Many families and mongers do use his means to run away from futher problems. Restaurantas are always near your flats and dailly clinning services too. He gives you daily info on the city and provides you with physical options. He could confortable take to to tockas and back to your hotel safely. Moscow is not very safe like europain cities and most protitudes work with the police to ripe forieners off. Its a game, believe me. I recomennd you this site because the owner is always ready to keep his clients confortable and has the goods too. He also provides a cheap airport transfer. So try him and tell me later!

Starchild2012

04-19-07, 19:10

Mr. FloFlo...

Don't try to get your business by FEAR FACTOR..What do you mean "Moscow is not very safe like europain cities and most protitudes work with the police to ripe forieners off. Its a game, believe me"

So what you suggest, we only have option with you or the site else we die.

Its ok to spam the site but its NOT ok to play with peoples minds with fear..a newbie monger is already scared and with your so called experience..he will not even venture out to moscow.

There are people living in Moscow, not some monsters from Animal Planet...You can always talk your way out to militia..there are so many tips from senior members on how to deal with police with the help of dollars or gifts.

There are good reviews about this guy below but to advert. throgh fear is not the way.

FYI...the contact us, gallery, news etc pages in the website is not working.

Hi Guys, I think most people coming to moscow are in for either pleassure or buissness. As concernce logistics and arrangements, you could go for a europain standard apartment in the heart of the city (tverskaya). Contact (www.dreammoscownights.com) for more info. You would not have problems with the girls beign check by police and the apartment are really cheap. Many families and mongers do use his means to run away from futher problems. Restaurantas are always near your flats and dailly clinning services too. He gives you daily info on the city and provides you with physical options. He could confortable take to to tockas and back to your hotel safely. Moscow is not very safe like europain cities and most protitudes work with the police to ripe forieners off. Its a game, believe me. I recomennd you this site because the owner is always ready to keep his clients confortable and has the goods too. He also provides a cheap airport transfer. So try him and tell me later!

Firebird

04-23-07, 12:41

Came across the Intimcity site which also has the RUSDOSUG site with the "escorts".

I tried doing a search on the "rusdosug" in the Moscow forum but came up with "zero" info.

I am quite sure that most (all) the pictures are doctored up for the girl to look perfect. Not quite sure if the pricing is on the level.

Has anyone had any "experience" ordering "talent" from using the "english" speaking girls from the RUSDOSUG site??

Master Sergeant

04-25-07, 10:48

Spearmint Rhino club, closed about 3 months ago, now re-opened at the same place, by the same management but under name of DEJA VU. Deja Vu - New York style gentlemen's club is now open everyday from 20.00 to 06.00. There's nothing going on at your table; all the dances are of the privat type, at 1000 rubles for 2 or 3. So you just need the 1000s, plus some smaller bills for the tips (normaly 100r).
Moscow. New Arbat. 17 Bolshoi Nikolopeskovsky Pereulok (at the location of the legendary club Spearmint Rhino).

Aolini

04-25-07, 19:15

Firebird

04-26-07, 16:01

Is this site showing English speaking Escorts legitimate or is this another "bait and switch"??

http://www.rusdosug.com/search.php?type=0&ilang=eng

Anyone has any experience??

Avi27

04-26-07, 21:43

$300 for an hour? I can not understand this.

Dear friends you are spoiling the ladies.

Rasman77

04-26-07, 22:34

Lindenwirt

04-27-07, 14:34

Just wanna give a short report about some real good customer service!

My company organized a corporate party celebrating the anniversary of the company last night and only the same morning my boss asked me organize three girls to provide special service to some top company representatives coming from abroad if requested.

So what I was looking for was three girls to wait in a room of the hotel where the event took place. In case of need the guy would pass bye, make his choice and take the girl to his room. All damage covered by me in advance! So I quickly consulted the forum for help!

First try: victoria (although she has already some pretty bad feedback here) well, what can I say? All that bad things told about her are actually true! All I needed was three girls, but she just told me that she has no girls willing to work, and she was not interested too! Damn victoria! Why are you running two different websites (with all the same girls never updated since ages by the way), when you are not interested in doing any business?

Second try: helena

Very nice conversation and friendly! But she said that she works only for herself and cannot bring two more girls. Ok, I respect that!

Third try: www.dreammoscownights.com

Short conversation about my needs! After 30 minutes I was called back and got the deal and conditions confirmed.

As agreed (ok, some minutes late), the three girls showed up with an administrator. I brought them to their room (I took care of the security of the hotel already in advance! ) where we had prepared some food and drinks for them (they serve to please, so we should do the same. No? )

The girls were really friendly and all looked extremely good (age between 19 and 21 I'd say). They were kept pretty busy for four hours serving. Unfortunately too busy for me! So I could not taste the buffet myself! Anyways, everybody was extremly satisfied. So I think my next payraise is secured!

The cost? Who cares? I was spending some company money here! But I am sure that the next time I call there for private purpose I will be granted some discount!

Thanks again to the team of DMN, you saved my day!

Greez,

Der wirt

Cruiser D

04-27-07, 21:01

Just think how embaressed you would have been if your neighbour knew you had paid $300/hr for an average looking girl in Moscow. Girls like that are $200/hr in NYC

A bit embarassing to confront my neighbour next day in the hotel but what the hell. It was worth the money. If you're interested I think her name is Alina.

Street Sleuth

04-27-07, 21:26

I think you are giving this guy an exceptionally hard time, when you all know very well that Moscow is not a cheap mongering ground - if anything, its one of the more expensive ones, on a world-wide basis.

True, I wouldn't pay $300 for one hour - but, then again, I generally steer clear of Moscow. Also true, the same girl would probably be more like $20 in Kazakhstan - but that's why she moved to Moscow :).

I rarely see credible reports of reasonable prices for pros in Moscow.

Avi27

04-27-07, 21:50

Its about time that mongers will stop pay so much ,maby the prices will go down.Its the same pussy in Moscow its not made out of Gold.

Kosmos

04-28-07, 15:50

Went on a trip to Russia a couple of months ago and picked up this "lady" for $300 (a bargain for her looks and skills in bed, given that most pros in there wanted around $400). Anyone who has been to NF pls share your experiences regarding PRICING.

She said she was from Kazakhstan and from her sayings she's probably slept with half of Moscow. Went back to my hotel for an hour of fun. She was screaming like a lamb being slaughtered. A bit embarassing to confront my neighbour next day in the hotel but what the hell. It was worth the money. If you're interested I think her name is Alina.

I had the same girl in Feb. She's half Russian half Kazakh. Picked her up at the same place. It was during the week, and we were the only guys out of 25 or so girls there (it was early, around 10:30). Anyway, I got her down to $200 for 1hr. While she was nice at the club, she was a realy ***** at the hotel, complaining that she's fucking me for $200 all the time. It ruined it for me. She agreed for $200 - *****! Her screams were fake, but she knows what she was doing. She let me cum on her tits the second time. I would not recommend her.
My friend negotiated $100 per night - his girl was from Sakhalin island, tall, dark hair, about 25. I think her name was Natasha. So, don't fall for $400 trap. Some of the tricks at Night Flight - the girl you talk to, will tell you that she fucked that guy in the corner for $1000 a night, and she's doing you a favor for $400. It's a bull-shit. Come early and be nice to them and you can get them for as low as $100, as my friend did.

Kosmos

Dealdo

04-28-07, 18:01

I don't think this guy is spoiling the girls at NF.. the girls are already spoiled and their high rates are not new..
Is being long time since last time I went to Night Flight...
300 DLLS was the common rate for most of them.. 200 could be possible all depends of your skills on negotiation ...
I do not recommend to go there if you have the time to explore some..
Especially if you're short of money.. there are many girls same quality all over the city..

It Travel

05-01-07, 13:52

This is just an exemplification of what I intend for this... It's just a role playing nothing more... she gets well paid for that.

I write this on ground many were saying something against my tastes! :D

Just 20 seconds after the last picture she got a fresh and hard piece of meat in her tight (not enough anymore :( ) little hole!

IT

http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=592772&postcount=711

Garden Gnome

05-01-07, 20:09

Gentlemen,

I first want to express my gratitude to all the members who contributed to this forum. Furthermore, being a relative newbie I did my part of the job and read most of the messages in this forum. However after doing so, I still have a practical problem which needs help from our veterans. That problem is: I will be located for one week in the very south of Moscow near metro station Bitsevky Park (off all places) and probably be chaperoned by my Russian business contacts most of the day and probably part of the evening. How do I get laid?

I checked virtually all websites that were referenced at this forum (about 25) and I could only find a mere 3 (three!) working girls are available near Yasenevo (zero at Bitsevky Park).

What would be my best strategy to get laid under these circumstances? Any chance to find freebees during the evening hours (21:00 – 0:00) in my area? The hotel is probably small and I don’t know their attitude against incalls (probably demotivating), so I might have to visit WGs.

Compared to my first visit to Russia years ago (I didn’t know this forum at that time) prices have risen dramatically. The price have doubled, tripled or sometimes even quadrupled. It seems that Moscow WGs are charging international prices (and more) and probably find enough customers willing to pay. Does anyone know of web sites or salons that focus on the local (Russian speaking) market for Russian prices? I read somewhere it is estimated that there are about 10,000 WGs in the Moscow area. I might have seen about 1,000 on web sites. Do I only see the top 10% expensive WGs? And if so, Where’s the other 90%?

Finally I want to share my humble experience with this forum.

The link below which I found contains a map with the geographical location of all individualkis, salons and saunas in the Moscow area. It was very convenient but a shame for me to see that I was too far away from business.
http://www.rusdosug.com/interactive.php

www.Omen.ru was once a reliable source, however they changed their policy and one of the most important items of a WG (her price) is not listed anymore (though you can still search on price but you never know the price of the WG you found). Furthermore Omen.ru has now an annoying feature which tries to install an ad server in your browser by downloading a file called adv.dll every so many clicks on photos.

It Travel

05-02-07, 17:15

SlutLover

05-02-07, 17:29

Garden Gnome,

I always go for freebies so that's all I can comment on. I would guess however that for P4P incalls are the only option so far away from the action. Alternatively, if you speak Russian you could try a site such as mamba.ru to find a semi-pro or pro in your area (can search for metro station).

Freebies: There are lots of clubs and bars outside the Garden Ring of course; if you don't mind somewhat shabbier surroundings and a more provincial clientele you will be fine.

A search on moscowout.ru, usually fairly comprehensive, shows no clubs at Bittsevsky Park and nothing special at Yasenevo (though some smaller and faraway clubs are not listed online).

Your best bet is probably Yugo-Zapadnaya (end of the red line), quite close by taxi and a very densely populated area. Try www.tonnelclub.ru (Prospekt Vernadskogo 86), if the photos on the site are representative it seems like a reasonable place for freebies. Also, on Fridays and Saturdays "Novaya Stsena" (Leninskii Prospekt 150) has a singles evening called "Formula of Love" (quote: "here you can find a partner for one evening or your whole life" ;)

Blaked

05-03-07, 13:44

Do you remember the banker's name? Just wondering if I know her. lol

It Travel

05-07-07, 07:52

as usual when in moscow i take valentina… now she is red instead of blond!

her skin is smooth and white like china bone, but very delicate and i fucked her so hardly in missionary position that she got some abrasion on her back due to the fact she is so slim her back bones are protruding a little bit.. poor girl!

the pics (links) are made the on the second meeting!

in the first i arrived late (missed the connection) and she was waiting for me in the lobby so we avoided the “rouble control” made by the guards, just paid 3 rur for three days!

she is always a nice gfe, but the first day i did not fuck her so much, then the second day i got her older sister you can see here:

http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=592723&postcount=1126

but the third day (the second time with her) was really nice!

i had slept really good and was terribly horny (thanks to a cialis therapy too!). the evening went so.

i met her in the lobby and we just had a tea around 6 pm. then we went up we played one of my favourite role game… the punishment of the secretary with an anal [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123)!

http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=592772&postcount=711

after she had been well drilled (anally of course!) on the desk (without taking off her clothes) we went to the restaurant… nice food and nice conversation (not so deep her english is like my russian!). a nice gfe. unfortunately she is not like her sister. you can go with her sister, plugged, to the restaurant!

after a couple of hours we went back to the room some jokes, bathing (there is a two place jacuzzi there), then she went to the bed and started cow riding… of course after some minutes i took her round and just got her missionary anal for the second time!

the third time was even better… no bj (she does only covered) no fucking nothing… only anal! approx 30-40 minutes of deep pounding! it's the time i need to cum when i'm horny but i have already fucked.

her anus was really stretched and opened, but she did not want more pink pictures! but if you want some pink of valentina you find them here:

http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=583345&postcount=704

then we were sleeping… you can see the shots… it’s usually a pleasure to sleep with a such girl: light and tiny, and always sleeping embraced to you! :)

i usually wake up early and like looking and photographing her sleeping… so nice! ;)

http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=594459&postcount=1129

in the last two pics she is sleeping…

of course in the morning i’m really horny so, as usual, i woke up her took her in all three holes, and then we went to breakfast. she thought all was over, but morning horny, cialis and so on.. when we got back to the room she got the best of all… approx 45 minutes of anal fucking in missionary with no preliminary or bj! :d she was just devastated… and my best friend was very happy and relaxed!

total damage for two nights
300 usd for valentina firs day from 11.30 pm to 11 am)
300 usd for valentina (from 6 pm to 11 am!)
1.240 rur (dinner for two)
2 x 270 rur breakfast for her (my was included)
3 rur registration
two cialis 20 mg tablets.
some drinks and juice.

it

Garden Gnome

05-07-07, 19:47

IT and SL

Thanks for the info.

I tried a semi-pro near Yasenevo but she wanted $300 per meeting where a “meeting” was defined as “2-3 hours”. OK That’s more than a good half monthly wage in Russia (but maybe not in Moscow). Compared to US standards this would be about $1000/hour. She was not interested in even discussing my bid.

Yasenevo is the closest place for action but I follow your advice and travel north for a few stations. I don’t know whether I can find time to travel to Yugo-Zapadnaya and check some clubs for freebies. My time might be too limited.

GG

Berger99

05-08-07, 21:50

Dear friends,

Moscow is amazing for freebies even if you just know english but you have time and alot of energy to find girls. They are everywere but my best point of view is next to garden in the way to the Kremlin. I got just today phone numbers of great looking students but again you should build some realtionship with then before going bed.

I know There are lots of clubs and bars with semi Pro-pro girls which are more easyly to get for money. But I need day-time action.

Could you tell me what are the best place to find these women (names of bars and hotels.) in day like 12:00-16:00.

Any help welcomed and I have lots f photos and phone of amazing freebies.most of then I didn't fuck.

Doctor_Skank

05-09-07, 15:08

Why you shouldn't give up so easy...

Just got this mail from a mongering buddy of mine who was in Moscow:

"Ok ... well I stayed at the Marriott Courtyard, which is on Voznesensky Per (parallel to Bryusov Per) right near the Conservatoria imeni Chaikovskogo. Got upgraded to a suite -so had a good base for operations

I traveled with 3 other guys ... 1 from Frankfurt, 1 from London and 1 from NY. The NY guy and the London guy had never been to Moscow before. So first night we had dinner at Night Flight, and I left them all in the bar to amuse themselves while I jetted to meet Olga at the Kofemaniya at the Conservatoria at 11pm. She looked good and asked where I was staying. I told her I was in the new Marriott and that I will show her later.

An hour or so later, we jetted and lo and behold, my hotel was only 100 yards away ... she was reluctant at first to come in, but relented after some groping outside. Once in the room there was not a lot more time wasting, She went to the bathroom to freshen up, as dyevs do, then I went down on her. I don't think she was as good a poke as your Nastya, she is quite self conscious, especially about her small hooters. We poked for a long time, and again in the morning. She left about 8am. To my surprise (I shouldn't be surprised anymore) she had a change of clothes in her bag. She had fully planned to spend the night!"

I just love the part about her at first refusing to come in and protesting and then when she finally does, she was all kitted out to fuck. Just like the "innocent" types you finally drag into your apartment after protests and some serious convincing only to find out that they are wearing their best $200 la Perla lingerie and brought their own condoms.... :)

It's all about theater boys, life's a stage...

Ricardo Cabro

05-10-07, 02:58

This is a very belated report and covers 2 visits to Moscow at the end of February and early March. I look at the forum almost daily and wonder why I’m not a senior member. Truth is, its because I don’t contribute often enough.

In Feb I arrived in Moscow from Piter full of flu. Most of the week was spent in bed with occasional visits to my hotel by concerned business clients. I also invited a girl I met on omen. Ru who was looking for a sponsor. After a light lunch and 3 glasses of red wine she asked for 100 Euro’s for her visit. I took her upstairs and exacted my money’s worth. Not a bad price for today’s Moscow and the girl was a solid 7. Her BBJTC was a 9.

On my last night I was feeling somewhat better and ventured to the lobby bar for a couple of shots of Russki Standart. I got talking to a German banker on his first visit to Moscow and felt duty bound to show him the sights. After a couple more shots we were in a cab en route to CF.

On the way I explained what CF is/was and that he should enjoy scoping the girls and flirting a little before making a choice. I stressed that he should not accept the first girl that propositioned him. My words fell on the deaf ears of a newbie with too much money.

We arrived at CF, walked into the bar from the coat check and I was immediately enveloped by Laura, a 30 something chick from Chechnya. I explained we had just arrived, wanted a beer and extracted myself from her. I bought the german guy and myself a beer and when I turned away from the bar I found that Laura had already concluded the deal with him and they were ready to leave. So much for my wingman. I stayed and was hit on by a stunning brunette. After a few drinks we settled on $200 for the night and went back to the hotel. In the morning she started asking me a lot of questions and mentioned the name of my Moscow business associate (BP1 if you RTFF). It was only then that I realised I had taken this girl (Victoria) from CF before – but she was a blond (wearing a wig) previously and I had been 3 sheets to the wind at the time. She found it highly amusing that I didn’t recognise her, I found it strange to have fucked two different women only to discover they were one and the same. The second, and more sober experience was better (I think).

Two weeks later, and at short notice, I found myself back in Moscow principally to hold the hands of some visiting associates from a third world country. I stayed in an apartment for the first time (thanks for the help Doc) which was within spitting distance of NF. It was difficult getting free time from my charges but the second night I managed to escape at midnight and took a walk around the corner to NF. In 20+ visits I have never been to NF. Actually that’s not quite true. On my first ever visit in July 2001 I fell out of a cab in front of NF and picked myself up and approached the door. The gentleman guarding the entrance politely explained that I was too drunk to enter and helped me back into a cab.

This time I was more or less sober and was going more out of curiosity than determined to spend my Ben Franklins. There were probably 15 guys inside and 25-30 girls. I have to say that the quality of the eye candy was generally high but the attitude was lacking. I’m a self confessed CF addict and I like the fact that at CF you can get to know your target, flirt a little and generally have a good time.

NF is purely a meat market. There is no atmosphere (IMHO) and precious little opportunity to spark with the girls. All asked for $400 for a couple of hours, so after 3 shots I left and headed off to my favourite late night haunt.

It was Friday night and CF was jumping with the usual collection of expats and working girls, though the number of Russian men splashing the cash was a noticeable change. Guess what. As soon as I approached the bar Laura, the chick from Chechnya, jumped all over me asking for info about my friend from Germany. It took a while to lose her and she periodically returned to hassle me during the night, but all good natured.

Standard rate amongst the keepers was 8, 000 rubles, some asked for 9, 000 and the odd idiot thought she was worth 10, 000 rubles. Plus the standard bar fine is now 800 rubles. It was interesting that all prices quoted were now in rubles rather than greenbacks or the stronger Euro.

I bided my time, chatted with some girls that recognised me and finally did a deal with Nadya, yet another brunette ($200 for the night). It was already 2:30 so we left and took a CF cab. A few minutes into our journey and we were stopped by the police. Because I had arrived on a Thursday and was staying in an apartment my visa registration hadn’t been completed. As the previously dumb cops realised, this was a problem. Nadya worked her socks off trying to reason with them explaining that I had 72 hours to be registered, etc. I had $35 in small bills and this was offered and refused.

I was invited to sit in the back of their squad car and reluctantly offered $100 (this was all I had in change) but again it was refused. So I said OK take me down town and lets see what happens (I figured they would hold me for 3 hours and then let me go). A few minutes later we were at Police station number 40, or was it 41, and I sat in the Captains office waiting to be processed. When he finally arrived I asked for a drink (meaning water) and he produced a bottle of Diamond Vodka and some cok. Ten minutes later he offered me the 2 skanky drunk girls he was holding in the tank and five minutes later he was calling me a cab.

When the cab arrived I redirected it back to CF to see if I could salvage the deal with Nadya. She wasn’t there so I took a blond with a plump ass who provided a truly GF experience, demanded anal, prepared my breakfast and asked just 5000 rubles. Another surreal night in Moscow was over. I’d escaped jail, been to CF twice and NF once and had breakfast made for me by a sweet and cheap *****. This stuff doesn’t happen anywhere else. Much is said about Moscow – the various options, the costs (increasing rapidly) but no-one ever mentions the adrenalin buzz. It’s a great city and, although this is a contradiction, it’s a place where I always feel completely safe and completely terrified at the same time. The vodka does help though)

EDITOR'S NOTE: I certainly hope that the author or somebody else will post a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please Click Here (http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?) for more information.

Doctor_Skank

05-10-07, 07:52

This is a very belated report and covers 2 visits to Moscow at the end of February and early March.... She found it highly amusing that I didn’t recognise her, I found it strange to have fucked two different women only to discover they were one and the same. The second, and more sober experience was better (I think)...

Because I had arrived on a Thursday and was staying in an apartment my visa registration hadn’t been completed... the Captains office waiting to be processed. When he finally arrived I asked for a drink (meaning water) and he produced a bottle of Diamond Vodka and some cok. ... but no-one ever mentions the adrenalin buzz. It’s a great city and, although this is a contradiction, it’s a place where I always feel completely safe and completely terrified at the same time. The vodka does help though)

Drinking vodka-sok with the captain... outstanding RC!

CF is still fun, but damn... the prices keep going up... :(

You do realize that next time you take home a redhead it will be Nadya in disguise...

Really sorry to hear that the apartment didn't work out... I mean in terms of the militia flagging you down.

Registration: the laws have changed again! You no longer get a registration card from the hotels nor do you get a stamp on your arrival card... so theoretically, you don't have to show the militia this anymore. You only need to show them your hotel room card. If you are in an apartment, you won't have one.. so I suggest if you do stay in a hotel, just keep the room card for future visits where you are in an apartment. It's a bit murky, but you should be OK with it. And you do still have 72 hours to register. I think the captain was just lonely and told his squaddies to bring him home someone to chat and drink with.

Had you already paid Nadya? If so, call her on it and have her service you next time for free. Even pros have to have a code of honor, right?!?!

And I agree on the adrenalin part... you really don't get that in St.Pete or Kiev.

CharlieH

05-10-07, 08:45

Drinking vodka-sok with the captain... outstanding RC!

CF is still fun, but damn... the prices keep going up... :(

You do realize that next time you take home a redhead it will be Nadya in disguise...

Really sorry to hear that the apartment didn't work out... I mean in terms of the militia flagging you down.

Registration: the laws have changed again! You no longer get a registration card from the hotels nor do you get a stamp on your arrival card... so theoretically, you don't have to show the militia this anymore. You only need to show them your hotel room card. If you are in an apartment, you won't have one.. so I suggest if you do stay in a hotel, just keep the room card for future visits where you are in an apartment. It's a bit murky, but you should be OK with it. And you do still have 72 hours to register. I think the captain was just lonely and told his squaddies to bring him home someone to chat and drink with.

Had you already paid Nadya? If so, call her on it and have her service you next time for free. Even pros have to have a code of honor, right?!?!

And I agree on the adrenalin part... you really don't get that in St.Pete or Kiev.

Doc, when did the law change regarding registration?

If one does not get a stamp at the airport, how do the police know when he arrived? If hotels no longer give registration card, where does one need to go to get registered? How does the new law affect visitors that stay at apartments? And some crappy hotels don't even have a room card. There is only a key and you leave it at the front desk.

Ricardo Cabro

05-10-07, 08:57

Doctor_Skank

05-10-07, 09:45

Doc, Nothing quite so strange as life. Although I speak very little Russian BP1 insists that I am more Russian than many Russians. Perhaps my genuine empathy struck a chord with the Captain.

the appartment really worked out well - excellent position, comfortable and approx half the price of a Marriott - no rewards points tho'.

The militsia thing was just bad luck. Apart from a couple of (polite) document checks in Red Square I've never been pulled over before. It was probably just my turn on the law of averages.

The registration system changed in January and my guess is that the militsia know this and will play on the grey area created - especially with foreign businessmen leaving drinking establishments with hired company.

Did I pay Nadya up front? Never, ever done that. If a girl asks for pre-payment in CF I walk away.

Good for you not paying up front. Never do it either.

As for yappin' with the capt'n, that's pretty cool. You read my story about how I ended up outside the militsia station with the Chechen girl? Ah... Moscow... :)

Doc, when did the law change regarding registration?

If one does not get a stamp at the airport, how do the police know when he arrived? If hotels no longer give registration card, where does one need to go to get registered? How does the new law affect visitors that stay at apartments? And some crappy hotels don't even have a room card. There is only a key and you leave it at the front desk.

As for registration, the law changed a couple of months back and as with many things in Russia, nobody is quite sure about the exact law.

You do get your arrival card stamped coming in, so they can check when you arrived. You just don't get your registration stamped on the card anymore. When flying out sometimes they didn't even take my arrival card... so this seems to have lost almost all significance... but hold onto it anyway. You never know.

When in hotel, you get the hotel key card + the little booklet. That is supposedly enough. The hotel registers you... you just don't get a piece of paper saying so. So if the militia stops you just say that you are in Hotel So and So. If it's a cheap-o Russky hotel, then keep a receipt or something from the hotel.

People in apartments are supposed to have their landlord register them... but of course no landlord will do this for short-term visitors. It is indeed a grey area now and I don't know exactly how apartment-staying mongers should handle it. I am trying to find out and will inform you all as soon as I know.

Bez Bezarra

05-10-07, 12:39

As for registration, the law changed a couple of months back and as with many things in Russia, nobody is quite sure about the exact law.

You do get your arrival card stamped coming in, so they can check when you arrived. You just don't get your registration stamped on the card anymore. When flying out sometimes they didn't even take my arrival card... so this seems to have lost almost all significance... but hold onto it anyway. You never know.

People in apartments are supposed to have their landlord register them... but of course no landlord will do this for short-term visitors. It is indeed a grey area now and I don't know exactly how apartment-staying mongers should handle it. I am trying to find out and will inform you all as soon as I know.

Having just returned myself from an extended MRE, (Mongering Research Expedition), my registration experience was certainly better than last summer, but still ridiculously expensive. Last summer I completely fucked up the on the 72 hour deadline, but it was because I arrived on a Friday night and I waited until Tuesday to even go to the local government SIDA clinic to get jabbed with a hypodermic by a bitchy medical assistant for my HIV test. 2 days later I went back to get my dokumenti saying I'm not infected, and then proceeded to have my travel agent drag me down for 4 hours to the politzi station for fingerprints, mug shots, and a 5000 ruble payment.

At least this year, the HIV test is not required, so I got right over to the travel agent on Monday morning, but they're not gonna let me off easy this time either. They claimed that because my apartment was not previously registered with the police for renting out to foreigners, they would be required to register it for me, for an extra 3000 rubles.

On arrival, my immigration card WAS stamped, and the back of it WAS stamped again for registration by the politzi, and they did take it from me when I flew home going through immigration.

My question to Richard Cabro is about your passport. Did you have it on you when you were pulled over, because I never carry mine around, I just keep a copy with me with my visa. I don't even carry my registration with me, though I think next time I'll stop into some magazine and make a copy to keep with me. But after 16 different visits, I've yet to have any "fun" with the authorities, short of having 2 uniforms with AK-47's locked and loaded pounding on my flat door demanding I open up for 10 minutes, only to realize that since my landlady was too cheap to put a sticker with the flat number on the door, that they were knocking on the wrong flat, and they finally said, "Oh. Ti nyet Dvatsit Shest? Iz vinitsye, das vidanya," and then they proceeded upstairs and I changed my underwear.

Anyway, my only other politzi contact was initiated BY my taxi driver, who after driving around and not finding any working girls other than junkies, brought me to Vladimir, an off duty cop working security at the main hotel side entrance, who made a few calls on my behalf, to have a couple of car fulls of girls paraded for my choice of "bride for the night".

Now that's what I call "Serving the Public"!

Bez Bezarra

05-10-07, 13:15

There was another mistaken indirect "buzz" I got from the cops, and it WAS just last month.

I had been with an incredible dyevochka. Probably the most GFE experience I may have ever had, at least for the first two hours and forty-five minutes. I lit her passion on fire and turned up the heat to supernova, and everything was amazing until we found SOMETHING to fight about at the very end, and turned a magical night into a pretty upsetting ending. I even wondered if she might try to pull something on me later during my stay.

Of course the next morning around 11:30, as I was trudging back home from a run to the bazaar market with 2 arm fulls of groceries and coming through the back entrance, I see the politizi standing around at my front gate. We made a brief eye contact, and I scurried inside my podyest and upstairs. Then I look out my balcon window and see a second cop, with Uzi in tow, sniffing around my podyest.

That's when all the fun starts in your head. You start wondering did she really make up some story to fuck me over? Would they actually believe some dyev that works for an agency? Isn't this Russia and not the US, where a girl CAN'T just lie and they instantly believe her? Bla, bla bla...

Ok, stop panicking! Don't you remember stupid? Its fucking Hitler's birthday! The cops are looking for skinheads who have invaded the city from all the surrounding villages for their Nazi drinking binges! That's all the cops were looking for. Not me, duh! Love that adrenaline, though!

It Travel

05-10-07, 21:43

Having just returned myself from an extended MRE, (Mongering Research Expedition), my registration experience was certainly better than last summer, but still ridiculously expensive. Last summer I completely fucked up the on the 72 hour deadline, but it was because I arrived on a Friday night and I waited until Tuesday to even go to the local government SIDA clinic to get jabbed with a hypodermic by a bitchy medical assistant for my HIV test. 2 days later I went back to get my dokumenti saying I'm not infected, and then proceeded to have my travel agent drag me down for 4 hours to the politzi station for fingerprints, mug shots, and a 5000 ruble payment.

At least this year, the HIV test is not required, so I got right over to the travel agent on Monday morning, but they're not gonna let me off easy this time either. They claimed that because my apartment was not previously registered with the police for renting out to foreigners, they would be required to register it for me, for an extra 3000 rubles.

On arrival, my immigration card WAS stamped, and the back of it WAS stamped again for registration by the politzi, and they did take it from me when I flew home going through immigration.

My question to Richard Cabro is about your passport. Did you have it on you when you were pulled over, because I never carry mine around, I just keep a copy with me with my visa. I don't even carry my registration with me, though I think next time I'll stop into some magazine and make a copy to keep with me. But after 16 different visits, I've yet to have any "fun" with the authorities, short of having 2 uniforms with AK-47's locked and loaded pounding on my flat door demanding I open up for 10 minutes, only to realize that since my landlady was too cheap to by a sticker with the flat number to put on the door, that they were pounding on the wrong flat, and they finally said, "Oh. Ti nyet Dvatsit Shest? Iz vinitsye, das vidanya," and then they proceeded upstairs and I changed my underwear.

Anyway, my only other politzi contact was initiated BY my taxi driver, who after driving around and not finding any working girls other than junkies, brought me to Vladimir, an off duty cop working security at the main hotel side entrance, who made a few calls on my behalf, to have a couple of car fulls of girls paraded for my choice of "bride for the night".

Now that's what I call "Serving the Public"!

On ground I had a lot of problems too in the past here is what the chief of protocol of one of the biggest Russian companies said litteraly...

Past:

You have to register withion the third day of your arrival (it's not 72 hours, it's less!) excluding from the count Saturday, Sunday and all holidays (this on ground of the hotel I was didi not register foreigner (can you imagine...) So the company took care of it not even in the city, but they wanted the passport, in original, and the immigration card.

Now:

You have to resgister before 13.00 (I do not know if local time or Moscow time, like railways) of the day after your arrival. It' does not matter which day it is the former OVIR should be always open... Militia too...
In my hotel they do it on spot (informatically) and you get your card stamped with the protocol number of registration (on the back side), and you gett all back with the room keys so it takes not more than 40 seconds.

Just my two cents...
IT

Ricardo Cabro

05-11-07, 00:35

Bez, I was carrying my passport, I always do. However, I have two passports so I figure I can always lose one. That said, only one has my visa in it.

In Feb I stayed in a Marriott and they stamped my immigration card. In March the appartment rental company took my imigration card on the Thursday and returned it on the Monday with a stamp. My business partner said he could make the same stamp for $10 less - its not as impressive as the old visa reg stamp.

When I was stopped I had my passport and retained boarding card stub to show when my flight had arrived. Apparently, the oldest trick in the book is for non registered people to say they only arrived yesterday. Your boarding card proves when you arrived. The militsia seemed unaware of the new system and ignored my explanation of the old 72 hour rule. The girl I was with had her papers in order so she got no hassle - tho' they pulled her from the cab first.

What really got me was the refusal to accept a small bribe, the refusal to accept a much bigger bribe, followed by several drinks together, the offer to fuck girls in the slammer and parting like old friends.

A roller coaster of a ride - but thats Moscow.

Doctor_Skank

05-11-07, 10:15

On ground I had a lot of problems too in the past here is what the chief of protocol of one of the biggest Russian companies said litteraly...

Past:

You have to register withion the third day of your arrival (it's not 72 hours, it's less!) excluding from the count Saturday, Sunday and all holidays (this on ground of the hotel I was didi not register foreigner (can you imagine...) So the company took care of it not even in the city, but they wanted the passport, in original, and the immigration card.

Now:

You have to resgister before 13.00 (I do not know if local time or Moscow time, like railways) of the day after your arrival. It' does not matter which day it is the former OVIR should be always open... Militia too...
In my hotel they do it on spot (informatically) and you get your card stamped with the protocol number of registration (on the back side), and you gett all back with the room keys so it takes not more than 40 seconds.

Just my two cents...
IT

And I spoke yesterday with another "expert" who told me you still have 72 hours, not including Saturday or Sunday or holidays or the day you arrive.... so in other words it's a clusterfuck galore as always with Russian law.

I honestly don't really even fucking care anymore. Sometimes I get registered, sometimes I don't... depends on length of stay. Most trips I don't even have time to get registered. I've always been able to talk my way out of it or get by with a minimal bribe not exceeding 500 rubles. Kind of dangerous I suppose, like BB sex... they don't call it Russian roulette for nothing.

Funny how priorities change... years ago I used to BB everything... now I am very careful... and won't go near a pro pussy without my jimmy cap on.

My question to Richard Cabro is about your passport. Did you have it on you when you were pulled over, because I never carry mine around, I just keep a copy with me with my visa. I don't even carry my registration with me, though I think next time I'll stop into some magazine and make a copy to keep with me. But after 16 different visits, I've yet to have any "fun" with the authorities, short of having 2 uniforms with AK-47's locked and loaded pounding on my flat door demanding I open up for 10 minutes, only to realize that since my landlady was too cheap to put a sticker with the flat number on the door, that they were knocking on the wrong flat, and they finally said, "Oh. Ti nyet Dvatsit Shest? Iz vinitsye, das vidanya," and then they proceeded upstairs and I changed my underwear.
Now that's what I call "Serving the Public"!

Bez:

Moscow is pretty much the only place the militia is going to care about your registration anyway. In the boondocks the cops are just in it for the cool uniforms, the big hat and the sweet Lada ride.

Oecmr

05-12-07, 12:21

Blaked

05-16-07, 14:13

Hi fellow mongers,

As I am in Moscow now quite freuqently I am wondering about this "Sponsor Thing" As far as I understand the Guy pays a monthly amount to a girl, to support her in studies or whatnot.

What kind of revard can one expect, is sex always in the game? What would be a reasonable amount? I don't want to offend any girls by offering too little/much (won't be offended by that one;.)) or by asking for something not normally in the "package"

CheersA good site for that sort of thing is omen. Ru. Unfortunately it's not as cheap as it once was. Back in the day, you could sponsor a girl for 1, 000 bucks a month, and we're talkin' 5 years ago. Now they want 4 grand. I can't get a quote right now because I sit next to my (female) boss. Your best bet is to find a girl on camcontacts and make an offer. It could save you a few thousand.

Guy #2

05-20-07, 10:54

I want to give you a guys an update on my efforts to apply your experiences to the US. Last night and tonight I went bar happing by myself. I walked up to women and taled to them and put arms around them and grabbed their asses and kiss them. Sometimes their boyrfiends were in the bathroom. So I said kiss me on the lips before he gets back. Tonight I took it to the next level and groped their tits with their consent. Okay I will keep working on this. I am just trying to save some money. I will probably go to Prague and fuck 20 girls again. Really want to fuck Russian chicks but am afraid to get STD. Go get em guys. I was really surprised that you could just walk up to women in a bar and talk to them and grope their asses. A few wiggled away but most seem to enjoy it. Yeah they are all hot and early 20s and blonde. I am middle age, short and ugly.

Member #3411

05-20-07, 11:37

sorry for occupying valuable space on board with this help request but I need a centrally located, decent apartment to rent for 3 nights..

any help will be very much appreciated. apologies for not RFF.

thanks

Atreides

Captain Fire

05-20-07, 16:12

My company is sending me to Sakhalin Island on a temp position. I know its hell and gone east just above Japan, but anyone have any idea about action there. Some guys I talked to says its heaven as a lot of the workforce are Russian women. Anybody been there, any info on travel routes from Europe or North America. I RTFF but cannot find any mention of this paradise
Cap
PM me or post if others are interested

Guido88

05-21-07, 01:56

Firebird

05-21-07, 02:39

Guy #2

Why are you posting this on the Moscow board?

If you have never had Russian pussy you have missed out. Think of the best Czech experience you have had and multiply x 10.

Your groping exploits in the US are off topic and of no benefit to this board.

Please stay on topic.

Guido88

I have read many of Guy #2's "weird" posts in the other forums. I can't figure him out but it appears he is "not playing with a full deck". IMHO

Guido88

05-21-07, 15:53

Bez,

Very funny,

I only follow three boards Montreal, Prague and the RU boards. Unfortunately Guy #2 has chosen those same 3 to share his lack of knowledge and troll like mentality with.

After 2+ years his inane dribble does get a little tiring. Self-described RU expert yet has never made the trip.

The Montreal board was ready to create a national holiday after he left and went on to the RU boards. Unfortunately he has returned there as well.

Clearly the guy needs to get laid, you may be correct about latent tendencies.

Just my 2 cents

Guido88

Big Bro AJ

05-21-07, 20:03

Bez Bezarra

05-22-07, 00:01

It's a clusterfuck with Russian law. I don't have time to get registered.

I get by with a bribe.

Bez is in the boondocks for the cool hats.

AJ, just call your travel agent and they'll hook you up. Its a breeze.

It Travel

05-22-07, 14:55

I was just here doing nothing, so I just wanted to remind some good old things in Moscow around 1994-6.

So you all notice how the city is changed.

If you could not afford National or Metropol (expensive as today) you could get the suites at the Intourist Hotel (now it’s demolished, It was on Tverskaya just behind National), the corner ones were comfortable with A/C and all you needed, even a nice view over the Kreml.

Here a picture: http://archives.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/europe/01/08/moscow.hotel/

Already at the bar in the lobby and in the sofa you could see some girls, just two or three, the real thing was going on at the third floor…

I remember taking the lift typical six elevator soviet block… 8x8 meters, when the door opened you could see, around 10-11 pm, already 15 or 20 girls, then you had to go to the bar… at the right (in front there was still a beriozka!) The girls were living in the hotel, in the cheap rooms at CIS citizen prices (at that time there were still double prices).

You just got right from the elevators (at the left there was a pantera bar with older girls, around 25-30 y.o. usually very cultured and well English speaking), got in the bar making your steps in a corridor full of willing teens…

The bar went restructured… firs it had the classical desk like a pub plus a lot of “closed” tables… you just had to sit there take a drink, look around and smile to a chosen girl, in a couple of minutes she was sitting there usually asking for a coke or a beer (they had no idea of night club concept making you spending on drinks!). After renovation there was a dance podium in the middle, so you could choose the girls even better!

The standard rate was 100 USD/night, often including BBBJ and anal! 150 for 24 hours!

I met two sisters (18 and 20) and tried to do them both, but they did not want… (I was already a pig :D ) One (18teen obviously) stayed a whole week in my room…

Another time two friends got two interpreters (Russian-Hungarian!), ya they were called so… Interpreters, of course they did a lot of togue work (on cocks!). My friends got tired on them, but living with their mates they had (for saving money) reserved other days for their room… Two nights and no place to go! The hotel was full for a religious meeting so low chanches in getting customers so I got them for two days for free, offering room/food, etc, but on ground they had no hotel card they could not get out of the hotel, really funny! A real 2 day orgy... I did not need Cialis at that time!

As in the pics section I wrote another thing this kind of Moscow do not exists anymore! Unfortunately! :(

IT

Lindenwirt

05-24-07, 12:19

Fellow Mongers,

Has anybody ever heard of this service provider or has already some experience with it?

http://www.russian-escorting.com/

Thank you for your kind feedback,

L.

Blaked

05-24-07, 12:24

I enjoy the mixed blessing of living next to an apartment brothel (or "salon" as the girls like to call it) in central Moscow. For 'defender's day' my company gave me a pair of binoculars, ostensibly to defend the motherland from fascists. I managed to put them to good use spying on the brothel,which keeps its windows open now that the weather is warmer. Anyway, the set up goes as follows - you ring #39 and they let you in (it's at 7 Tatarskaya, btw) and proceed to the top floor. There's a decked-out pink flat with neoclassical trim, where you're given a selection of about 5 girls to choose from - more on the weekends when they come in from the other cities. They charge either 2000 or 3000 roubles (80 or 120 bucks) based on quality. The salon has done well and now maintains satellite apartments in the surrounding buildings. I managed to get one of the cheaper ones, and on my way out I saw these fellow i-bankers. One of them had hooked up with this girl that had fallen for me months before, who I was surprised and happy to see - I had thought she was back in Tambov. I wanted to switch but mine was a few shades shorter, quality-wise. I should have slipped the banker 50 bones to close the deal.

Anyway the provincial girls are coming - school is out in a week and all of the new recruits are going to start to arrive at the city's open-air ***** markets. This 19-year old girl I got for about 20 bucks/hour in Saratov (the agency takes half- ha ha ha) called me at 2am last night because her dog had died and she felt depressed. Where else in the world does that happen?

Blaked

05-24-07, 13:25

Doc, Bez,

What's the new info about the registration?

I am planing to stay at my friend's apartment and register at travel agency(that I used several times).

Is this still possible or there are new regulations on registration procedures.

As usual I will be there for the weekend(approx. 38 hours)

Thnx.Registration is no longer the mind-boggling hassle it once was. I used to use www.visalink.ru, which will register you for about 40 bucks for a month. I'm here with a work permit and so now my company registers me.

Blaked

05-24-07, 13:38

You are planning to go to Moscow and then refer to my post about St.Petersburg? That's a bad start.

Sponsorship has been discussed again and again on this board and you are still asking what it is?When you talk about 'internet' sponsorship specifically, I assume you mean finding a girl on one of the camslut sites (camcontacts, imlive) and making an offer, or do you mean finding a girl cold on icq or love.mail.ru that's po' and will jump at the chance? Many girls at this time of the year want to move to Moscow, and are more likely to sleep with you if you lie and say you own your flat, because owning a flat in Moscow is one of the few ways a 'normal' guy can become amazingly rich... (apartments are worth $4,000/m2 and up)

Member #3411

05-24-07, 22:48

just arrived home from 6 day first time visit to moscow.

fascinating city. had some old friends (married couple) living there and I had spent the first three nights with them. although it was nice and off the beaten track nothing to report here.

on my last last night (unfortunately) moved to a friends rented house on tverskaya 6. fabulous apartment just for $250 night and it was serviced very professionally. Their addy can be found on Moscow Times (free english newspaper) which also has a website version.

After work, we eat at a place called pyramide cafe on tverskaya..mind you it was 30-35 celcius in moscow this week and you can NOT imagine what an eye-candy girls walking on Tverskaya were. I have travelled to more than 20 countries which some of which are holy monger destinations (cuba, thailand, brazil, ukraine) never seen anything like that. After dinner, my friend took me to a strip club called Safari. Brothers, that place rocked. Imagine a small place, like Luomo in Rio, put 50-60 half naked gorgeous slav women who walk around, tease and beg you for a lap dance with their gorgeous bodies, tight little asses and firm handful breasts. I thought I like bigger breasts but after this experience I changed my mind. Lap dance costs 200 rubles per song where you can do almost anything except fingering and kissing. You can have a more intimate 2 song version in a private cabin for 2000 rubles and fuck suck is also on the menu for app $200 per 30 minutes. So almost a Russian version of a Therma. After Safari, we head for the infamous Night Flight to complete my Moscow pilgramage. We got a cab and got off about 100 meters from NF. I saw 2 militia checking the ids of some local teenagers. For some stupid reason, I thought we could pass by while they were busy with them but the moment they saw us, they kind of launched on us. The thing is, you need to register within 3 working days. Since I have been told that it was a lot of hassle and I was leaving on the 4th day, I of course did not bother with registiring. The militia was very kind but said that it is a problem and that they will take us to the police station. My friend, who speaks sufficient russian, did not want me to spend my last hours in Moscow in a police station, so he settled a bribe of USD 250 (he was not registered either) with them. Guess their starting price for USD 400.

We got away and entered NF. One of the owners, was a friend of my friend so he treated us in. Wow. Its worth all the reputation. Although it was almost 2 am and probably most of the cute ones were already taken there were lots lots lots of beautiful women. They were quite agressive too. Some were jaded directly getting to the subject but some were quite nice to talk. My friend got a 10 face brunette and managed to get her down to USD 200 for 1 hour. I have been told that she worth every penny. I did some market research but the Newbie written on my forehead with zero russian skills the prices offered to me were mainly in the range of USD 400. Well it might worth if you got her early and fuck her all night long, maybe. Anyway, could not find the girl who would worth that in my book so I left empty handed.

Despite its crazy expensive nightlife, snobbish but at the same time the most unfucking belivable beautiful women, chaotic logistics for a non-russian speaker, Moscow is a place where each monger should see before he dies.

Ash1001

05-25-07, 00:35

... Guess their starting price for USD 400.

Just like an NF ho? :)

Guy #2

05-27-07, 03:48

You're still paying for sex. I spend about 20 dollars a night on my own drinks and I am still grabbing asses and kisses with consent IN THE US. I am reducing my costs over time. Russian is a backup plan that I haven't had to use yet. The risks are too high. I'll go as a far as prague. But heh, keep doing what you are doing. I am down to 20 a weekend to meet women in their 20s and I am middle age and average looking and I am doing this in the states. I try to use the experience over seas and apply it to the states. Anyone can pay for it but who wants to live like this where money does not grow on trees. I am just looking to come up with creative ideas. But sometimes you can't teach a monkey to dance.

Guy #2

05-27-07, 04:30

Doctor_Skank

05-27-07, 15:58

Privetprivet

05-30-07, 14:23

It Travel,

Its changed beyond recognition. Even back in 1999 I could get $150/night at the National just by turning up (although the room they usually gave me was like a broom cupboard in size), whilst the turn-up rate at the Intourist was $99. Although going upstairs to the Travel Agency in the building allowed you to buy vouchers often for $60. A weird and wonderful system alas no longer with us. Once turned up on-spec at the Intourist. Told me it was full. Walked around the corner and managed to persuade them to take $150/night at the National. National NEVER questioned the girls, at least if they were accompanied by you on the way in. I loved that place. Still do. Although its very pricy now. (it actually used to be part of the intourist chain in the 50s/60s/70s and 80s), as did the Savoy (also a nice hotel, perhaps not as good as the National but excellent Restaurant on the corner).

Before my seven years working in Moscow I actually stayed at probably all the major Hotels. I liked the National the best, Marriot Tverskaya the worst, others in between.

Once left $1000 in my room at the national. Forgot about it for a week (was busy.) remembered. Called them. And they had found it and kept it for me in the safe. Amazing. That was 1999 for you.

Firebird

05-30-07, 16:39

I have been checking out some of the sites like intimcity and devushki - I know that these are mostly "glammed up" but WOW, even if they are only 10% "real", these are women to spend the night of fun. Nice long, slim legs from floor to "heaven". Hope to find some of this talent in some of the clubs mentioned in the various ISG reports.
Can't wait for my first time trip to Moscow later part of this year.

Doctor_Skank

05-30-07, 21:10

Although its very pricy now. (it actually used to be part of the intourist chain in the 50s/60s/70s and 80s), as did the Savoy (also a nice hotel, perhaps not as good as the National but excellent Restaurant on the corner).

Before my seven years working in Moscow I actually stayed at probably all the major Hotels. I liked the National the best, Marriot Tverskaya the worst, others in between.

Once left $1000 in my room at the national. Forgot about it for a week (was busy.) remembered. Called them. And they had found it and kept it for me in the safe. Amazing. That was 1999 for you.

You mean "Grand Opera" near Savoy? Nice place, but haven't been there in years. Friend of mine once paid a 500 ruble bill with 500 euros (both approx same color) at Akademiya on Kamergersky and the waiter brought it back saying he couldn't change it. Sometimes in a city as cutthroat and corrupt as Moscow the honesty can be astounding.

Which hotels you like now?

I like SwissOtel for the best rooms, but location is impractical.

Hyatt Ararat has great lobby and roof terrace, rooms OK.

Budapest/Peter 1 also have good location and OK price, but average rooms.

Everything central 4*+seems to run at least $350/night these days, the new Ritz Carlton supposedly will "start" at $700/night... crazy ass prices.

As for me, I always liked Marriott Tverskaya, despite its less than ideal location and average facilities... but banging 2 of their staff in 1999-2000 might have influenced my decision. Life was too easy back then. Even strippers would meet you for free if they thought you might rescue them from economic doom. Tsunami was my favorite strip club, little podunk club in the basement. Closed years ago. Things changed about 2002 as Russia suddenly felt the money really flowing in and many Russian women decided there was more opportunity for them (i.e.$$$) by staying in Moscow with the locals as opposed to abandoning ship, at least that's the impression I got. Not that things ever got truly bad (they still aren't), but things definitely changed.

Doctor_Skank

05-30-07, 21:19

When you talk about 'internet' sponsorship specifically, I assume you mean finding a girl on one of the camslut sites (camcontacts, imlive) and making an offer, or do you mean finding a girl cold on icq or love.mail.ru that's po' and will jump at the chance? Many girls at this time of the year want to move to Moscow, and are more likely to sleep with you if you lie and say you own your flat, because owning a flat in Moscow is one of the few ways a 'normal' guy can become amazingly rich... (apartments are worth $4,000/m2 and up)

I mean those actively looking for sponsors, for example on love.mail.ru. They are getting more aggresive too... they write me all the time. Many of them turn out to simply be girls working in salons. Seems that regular pros and agencies are infiltrating the sponsorship market, which actually is something between prostitution and girlfriend depending on how you choose to see it... sponsorship doesn't make much sense for me personally, but for some I suppose its a good deal.

Privetprivet

05-31-07, 01:06

You mean "Grand Opera" near Savoy? Nice place, but haven't been there in years. Friend of mine once paid a 500 ruble bill with 500 euros (both approx same color) at Akademiya on Kamergersky and the waiter brought it back saying he couldn't change it. Sometimes in a city as cutthroat and corrupt as Moscow the honesty can be astounding.

Which hotels you like now?I had an apartment so haven't used Hotels (at least in Moscow) for years. As for chains... Intercontinentals are outstanding, Marriot Grande/5* great, Marriot any less than this varies greatly. Thats about all I know. On my trips to Moscow now I rent apartments or stay with friends. I will be back full time next year and I hate to see what prices will be then (I was paying $3000/month for a Western Remont 2 Room however it was overlooking the Kremlin almost so great location).

As for me, I always liked Marriott Tverskaya, despite its less than ideal location and average facilities... but banging 2 of their staff in 1999-2000 might have influenced my decision. Life was too easy back then. Even strippers would meet you for free if they thought you might rescue them from economic doom. Tsunami was my favorite strip club, little podunk club in the basement. Closed years ago. Things changed about 2002 as Russia suddenly felt the money really flowing in and many Russian women decided there was more opportunity for them (i.e.$$$) by staying in Moscow with the locals as opposed to abandoning ship, at least that's the impression I got. Not that things ever got truly bad (they still aren't), but things definitely changed.Well 2002 was they year the "remont" signs were so frequent it was unreal, ever since it has of course go crazier. Moscow has changed, its no longer the good old days of 1998/1999 with Rick at the Duck and Marty running the ship at the BH like a King in splendour and 8's at $50. I don't even recommend the Duck anymore... it will never return to its former glory.... those days are gone. Duck used to be great for freebies... god I miss those days. Remember Dillon? Think he's still in Moscow as I saw him fairly recently at the BH.

Ever go to "Territoriya" just off tverskaya? Closed now I believe. Haven't checked. I just loved that place. A few 9's freebies. It was heaven.

Moscow is a shadow of its former days and to be honest for mongering I don't now recommend it. The BH is truly scary with the same girls.. and aggressive if they think you are a newbie (who stick out like a sore thumb).

Even Territoriya on a Thursday is noweher near as good as even 2-3 years ago. PJ's is OK (but hard to pick up in), Karma/Buddha is variable (although Jose is a good friend of mine so I keep going), ROG's can sometimes be a good choice, Molly G's is hopeless (too small, but I managed to get a 8-9 barmaid!), RMCoys too small, The JB's variable... I might post a guide to Moscow clubs up here (or at least the ones I have frequented). I might add my Fahkie factor varies from the exiles... :)

Gentleman Travel

05-31-07, 19:26

I understand that Moscow is in the middle of a record heat wave.
This must do amazing things for the dyev dress code!
Please anyone who is in Moscow currently post some prose about the miniskirt factor for those of us who are dyev-deprived!

Under Plan A I was supposed to go to Moscow tonight.
But instead I am stuck back here in the hinterland for another few months until the miniskirt season has safely passed....

So anyone on-site, be a pal and let the rest of us live vicariously through your exploits....

Eros74

05-31-07, 20:56

Hi all, when I was in Moscow couple of years ago, I met a smart young who went to Moscow to study russian. He told me in which school he stayed, but I forgot, however he paid something as 500 euro to stay one month in single room inside campus of the university+everyday russian lesson.

Beside the really chance to learn russian, he got for free so many girls living inside the university that often, he said, was not able to manage all his female friends. (sometime he told me had to lock the door when he went to sleep or the girls knocked on his door and get into if he did not open the door..).

He told me the chances to score the students were amazing, easier than your fantasy could imagine, it was enough to cook something good for dinner in the kitchen inside the campus and immediately he got new friends, some vodka and often he slept the same night with new one girl.

Beside this, during the weekend when he went out, he was....in Moscow with all what we very well know Moscow offers...

I think it is almost impossible to stay in Moscow one month with 500 euro, so it is a very good cheap way to live there and to get many girls too.

I remember the kind of light in his eyes when he told me his adventures there, that I am enough sure, he did not lie!
He was not rich, not Brad Pitt and he lived spending in one month there much less than what we could spend in one weekend in Moscow....having houndreds pussy more...

Anybody...never thought about this? Anybody really studied in university in Moscow?

For those who can take couple of month of holiday or stop from work can be really a--totally--unforgettable experience!

I am really interested to know the opinions of the best experienced Moscow master as Doc Skank, Bez Bezzarra, It Travel and the others. What you think guys?

The good and the bad points of an experience like this???
Better in Moscow or maybe in Piter can be better? (for example smaller city, less dangerous,cheaper price?)

Not for this year,but for the next year, I am thinking pretty seriously about that! ( so during the weekend I can be your sex-turistic guide for free in the city ;) most important with knowledge of language too...)

Waiting your answers...have fun out there! :)

Privetprivet

06-01-07, 02:05

Even Territoriya on a Thursday is noweher near as good as even 2-3 years ago. PJ's is OK (but hard to pick up in), Karma/Buddha is variable (although Jose is a good friend of mine so I keep going), ROG's can sometimes be a good choice, Molly G's is hopeless (too small, but I managed to get a 8-9 barmaid!), RMCoys too small, The JB's variable... I might post a guide to Moscow clubs up here (or at least the ones I have frequented). I might add my Fahkie factor varies from the exiles... :)Sorry I mean't Thurs at Propaganda obviously.

Territoriya is closed and has been a while!

Doctor_Skank

06-01-07, 07:49

Hi all, when I was in Moscow couple of years ago, I met a smart young who went to Moscow to study russian. He told me in which school he stayed, but I forgot, however he paid something as 500 euro to stay one month in single room inside campus of the university+everyday russian lesson.

I am really interested to know the opinions of the best experienced Moscow master as Doc Skank, Bez Bezzarra, It Travel and the others. What you think guys?

Waiting your answers...have fun out there! :)

Lukasek,

I take a week-long Russian course every year, which is more vacation than anything else. I've been to Kiev and Odessa and am seriously considering Moscow for this fall, even though I cannot stay longer than 10 days due to my work. Staying in a dorm could be quite the adventure. Basically I am thinking like you... staying in the dorm might get some easy sex with co-eds... :)

Here are links for MSU/MGU/Lomonosov
http://www.ruslanguage.ru/
http://www.rlcentre.com/index_e.shtml

Other places I've looked at are Kaliningrad, Donetsk, St.Petersburg, Volgograd, Crimea... there really is an endless list of possibilities.

Many of the courses have a 2-week minimum stay, some of them even longer. So look at the requirements closely when reading up on them.

I can only repeat again and again that learning Russian, even just a little bit, will improve your scoring rate with Russian women. Some real hotties out there that simply do not speak English (or are afraid to) and if they can't communicate with you, it's hard to get something started. Just spent 3 wonderful days in Sochi with a Kylie-Minogue clone that didn't speak a word of English. Without my "average" Russian, I wouldn't have gotten past first base. As it turned out, she came home with me on the first night.

Doctor_Skank

06-01-07, 08:14

I had an apartment so haven't used Hotels (at least in Moscow) for years. As for chains... Intercontinentals are outstanding, Marriot Grande/5* great, Marriot any less than this varies greatly. Thats about all I know. On my trips to Moscow now I rent apartments or stay with friends. I will be back full time next year and I hate to see what prices will be then (I was paying $3000/month for a Western Remont 2 Room however it was overlooking the Kremlin almost so great location).

... I might post a guide to Moscow clubs up here (or at least the ones I have frequented). I might add my Fahkie factor varies from the exiles... :)

That'd be great. I'd do the same. Interesting to see how different clubs work in different ways for different guys.

I for example have always hated PJs but have done very well in Real McCoy.

Any tips you could give would be great, as lately I've been meeting all my girls through work (danger Will Robinson danger!) and through the internet (lazy man's dating but highly effective) and haven't done much clubbing in the last 6 months.

Molly G's: the only girls there ARE the wait staff. :)

Karma: still draws some major babes sometimes, many of them getting their first club experience and first experience with foreigners. Negative aspect is that every foreigner that goes to Moscow seems to start at Karma as well... :)

Prop: Always found that place to be hopelessly claustrophobic.

Really miss the long-since defunct Pfleg Dog too.. concerts there sometimes drew very cute girls.

How's the cocktail bar scene? For awhile 30-7 etc. was THE place... but now there are a lot of these type places. Went to Alex Alcohall for example and wasn't impressed. Same story on Tema etc.

eXile's list is a nice starting point, but is also highly influenced by their staffs personal favorites and doesn't really correspond with my list.

As for apartments vs. hotels, I've been staying in apartments since 2001, but have never been really happy with the quality in Moscow... even St.Petersburg and Kiev have better flats available for short-term let. Guess it doesn't make sense to rent out flats short-term in Moscow so we get whatever scraps are left.

By the way, is www.moscow-star.com still running? Rick hasn't answered my mail in a long time. Have been using www.gotorussia.com which is quite ok, but averaging $160-180/night.

$3000/month was a great price by the way... but you knew that already... :)

Lelee

06-01-07, 08:34

I understand that Moscow is in the middle of a record heat wave.

This must do amazing things for the dyev dress code!

Please anyone who is in Moscow currently post some prose about the miniskirt factor for those of us who are dyev-deprived!Check my picture post. I was in the middle of 30+C heatwave. And the dyev were coming out of the woodworks

Bez Bezarra

06-01-07, 12:04

I understand that Moscow is in the middle of a record heat wave.

Yeah it said Moscow was 93 degrees F, the same day that Warsaw and Paris were only about 72, so it looked like a mistake.

Piper1

06-01-07, 12:19

Helena Moscow

06-01-07, 18:14

Yeah it said Moscow was 93 degrees F, the same day that Warsaw and Paris were only about 72, so it looked like a mistake.

Prague was awful this week, too. First about +30C, then down to 7-10 or less (I was in boots which I wear in Moscow in winter, thanks god I had them in my suitcase), now getting hot again, everybody is in sandals. In Moscow my friends said it was a hurricane today, but hope it's still quieter than Prague. And we don't have such terrible roads as here. Guys, don't believe when you here that roads in Russia are worst in the world. In Czech Republic they are much, much, much worse.

Helena Moscow

06-01-07, 19:02

There are producers and there are consumers. I don't want to be a consumer. Women have needs. Even good looking chicks like to fuck. They are fucking someone for free and it is not you. There are guys out there who are getting laid without paying for it. That's why I don't want to pay for an escort, because I know she is giving it away for free and laughing at you. I analyze the Moscow posts to try to understand how the freebies think. I do not believe that freebies just exist in Moscow. I think the Girls Gone Wild culture in the States is just a more subtle version of the freebies.

Dear Guy, now good girls in Russia suddenly began to believe in family values. Life is getting better, girls want to multiply, to be loved and cared for. Almost no decent girls want just to fuck (especially to become a free-fuck-friend of a foreigner who may any moment disappear). Even escorts this year began to believe in family values, can you imagine? It seems to be the trend. Russian women no more want to invest their precious life-time in temporary things (though I don't know too much about distant villages, but can speak about Moscow). So for honest guys there are still 2 save possibilities: to pay or to marry. For honest+brave ones there is one more: to approach a girl you like and honestly inform her that you want to fuck her. Then to hear the answer. If you find the one who agrees, post about your experience, this will be really interesting. If you don't worn the girl about your plans she will automatically consider you searching for serious relatioships and when she discovers your real plans (very fast) you are very fast kicked out with a huge ugly scandal. You are lucky if you by accident don't cross in a dark street boxer-brother or bandit-father :) Things like "yes, I liked you but I didn't promise you anything" don't work any more. Everybody is fed up with this shit. Women in Russia are no more desperate, the learned how to survive (including surviving without a man due to our bad situation with their amount). For fun and fuck they now prefer to go to special strip-clubs with men dancing. The most popular ones are "Egoistka" and "Red Hat". Compare yourself with the dancers. If you look the same or better, your chances grow. Each decent girl now has a stip-teaser fun-and-fuck-friend (they are quite affortable and sometimes free, because they also need fun and tired of serving ugly old women from Rublevka). And the girls are becoming so terribly picky... Even in a fuck-and-fun-boy they search now not just phisical beauty, but also kind heart and intelligence. Inperfections are forgiven only to real men for real relationships (with marriage, kids... I guess you already understood - just dating is no more fashionable). And to tell you the truth even professionals are so terribly tired of cinizm, you can't emagine.

Privetprivet

06-01-07, 19:39

I for example have always hated PJs but have done very well in Real McCoy.I have never liked PJ's... if their were a fire there.... we'd all be toast. Its a death trap. Just like the Manezh (according to my architect friend). Russian Health&Safety leaves a lot to be desired. PJ's is hard to score, RMC's is OK I guess.. I have scored a freebie 9 there.... once :)

Any tips you could give would be great, as lately I've been meeting all my girls through work (danger Will Robinson danger!) and through the internet (lazy man's dating but highly effective) and haven't done much clubbing in the last 6 months.Nor me as I have been away from Moscow. The old favorites neve rgo away of course.

Molly G's: the only girls there ARE the wait staff. :)Surprisingly it sometimes attracts single intellectual girls and I had a threesome once with two Scandanavian (female!) diplomats I met there.... long story.

Karma: still draws some major babes sometimes, many of them getting their first club experience and first experience with foreigners. Negative aspect is that every foreigner that goes to Moscow seems to start at Karma as well... :)
I only go now as I have VIP and avoid the queue. I know the staff quite well which helps. But it not cheap...

Prop: Always found that place to be hopelessly claustrophobic.Yeh... hard to pull because of this. It's too popular and the bouncers are heavy handed. Rarely go now.

Really miss the long-since defunct Pfleg Dog too.. concerts there sometimes drew very cute girls.Still hold a Phleg Dog VIP Card no 13XX (the one with the Albion Logo in the corner). I liked the place.. esp the Albion as it was often empty so I could get drunk in peace!

How's the cocktail bar scene? For awhile 30-7 etc. was THE place... but now there are a lot of these type places. Went to Alex Alcohall for example and wasn't impressed. Same story on Tema etc.Only ever drink Cocktails at Karma (to get the girls drunk)... often spent/spend $100-250 a night on Cocktails there. It isn't cheap. Usually my drink is Troika (Baltika 3).

eXile's list is a nice starting point, but is also highly influenced by their staffs personal favorites and doesn't really correspond with my list.Exiles list is based upon how much advertising they get from the place. Ever heard them say anything bad about Doug (Steeles) places? Not that they are bad.. they are good in fact.... but the exile is $$$ based. And Mark I hear isn't safe in half the bars in Moscow so he can't personally review them :)

By the way, is www.moscow-star.com still running? Rick hasn't answered my mail in a long time. Have been using www.gotorussia.com which is quite ok, but averaging $160-180/night.Haven't spoken to Rick in a few years. He rarely ventures to my venues... occasionally prop and exceptionally the BH. He's a damned good guy.

$3000/month was a great price by the way... but you knew that already... :)The landlady was putting it up as I left. Company paid though. However I could have stayed. More fool me some may say.

Eros74

06-01-07, 20:08

Doctor Skank thanks,

it really seems you already tried and tested everything about Russia!

Very useful links, here what I found:

www.pushkin.edu.ru

Which is the best,between these three, in Moscow in your opinion?

Maybe do you have one link of school in Piter too?

Could you please write the negative aspects of this experience? (maybe the low quality of the room you get inside the campus? maybe the safety factor?)

However I think the most important thing is if, once you stayed there, you can be free as if you was in hotel? I mean, could you leave the room at the evening and comeback late night or the campus is closed during the night and if you go out to disco you have to stay out till morning?

In my opinion you are one of the best contributor in Russia photo gallery, you posted there 4 years ago the first photo, you started the photo gallery with a girl with amazing body and you keep on posting in all these years really models type, so I guess, some of them are girls you met during your stay there as "student" too, or the typical student girl you can get in school is not so beautiful?

When you have a while, why you do not write one report about the adventures/girls you got during your stay in Russia as student??
I am sure, everybody will enjoy it so much as me :) and it will be obviously very interesting and something totally new in this thread.

I agree totally with you, russian is so difficult that even with very poor knowledge you can get a big plus with the girls,my experience of this month is with a russian SW here at my home, 20yo from Moscow, from the first meeting, nice sex but nothing special, became very good sex with bbbj+covered sex, (with only 50 euro), from the second meeting once I started to speak my poor russian+put in mp3 in the car songs of Gosti iz buduchego and told her I love Russia and all about Russia.
Never get tired of studing russian, it worth it!

Hello Piper1,

could you please explain better what happened to your friend? If he did some mistakes or if he was just unlucky or what exactly?

I guess when you live there, together the chance to get much more pussy, you increase the risk to get some troubles too, for example it is enough to make jealous a wrong girl that one of her friends or brother or so on,can give you problems.

Ash1001

06-02-07, 00:10

Compare yourself with the dancers. If you look the same or better, your chances grow. Each decent girl now has a stip-teaser fun-and-fuck-friend (they are quite affortable and sometimes free, because they also need fun and tired of serving ugly old women from Rublevka). And the girls are becoming so terribly picky... Even in a fuck-and-fun-boy they search now not just phisical beauty, but also kind heart and intelligence. Inperfections are forgiven only to real men for real relationships

This sounds just like the situation in London, or any Western city - i.e. the girls are the consumers, the pickers and the choosers, and the guys have to be the pretty ones. Same BS.

It's understandable that Dr Skank devotes a great deal of time and research to sussing out this difficult and expensive place. He's here for work, and the fact that you're making money does justify spending it.

But, for the rest of us, surely the Samaras, Volgograds and Nizhny Novgorods are the places to be? All big cities, plenty of good looking girls (no, they haven't all moved to the capital) and none of the snooty-arsed "I live in Moscow" attitude. And MUCH lower prices.

It's a cliche, but the FSU is known for being both poor and stuffed full of hotties. It does seem oddly perverse to go to the ONLY place in the entire ex Communist world that's actually richer than the West in order to get girls 'cheaply'.

I can't quite figure it out.

Doctor_Skank

06-02-07, 00:59

This sounds just like the situation in London, or any Western city - i.e. the girls are the consumers, the pickers and the choosers, and the guys have to be the pretty ones. Same BS.

It's understandable that Dr Skank devotes a great deal of time and research to sussing out this difficult and expensive place. He's here for work, and the fact that you're making money does justify spending it.

But, for the rest of us, surely the Samaras, Volgograds and Nizhny Novgorods are the places to be? All big cities, plenty of good looking girls (no, they haven't all moved to the capital) and none of the snooty-arsed "I live in Moscow" attitude. And MUCH lower prices.

It's a cliche, but the FSU is known for being both poor and stuffed full of hotties. It does seem oddly perverse to go to the ONLY place in the entire ex Communist world that's actually richer than the West in order to get girls 'cheaply'.

I can't quite figure it out.

Well IMHO Helen is right that a lot of Russian girls have rediscovered their female calling to reproduce and have a family (after all demigod Putin says every women should have 3 children), but it's a massive exaggeration to say that most girls are banging strippers in their free time or completely uninterested in casual sex. I was there 2 weeks ago and screwed a married woman and 2 girls with steady boyfriends and a girl I just met off the internet in 6 days... so don't start thinking they've suddenly discovered morality.

And no, I don't look like a stripper.

One thing has been true for awhile though, it's obviously much easier to score if you have some connection with Moscow that allows you to return there on a regular basis. Girls somehow sense this. And learn some Russian. Even if you don't necessarily need it to communicate, it gives you some kind of credibility as something beyond just another girl-crazy tourist or wide-eyed horny businessman on his first trip to Moscow.

As for the regional cities, they're still a couple years behind Moscow in every form of development and your foreign status will go farther. Be wary of race issues and take care of yourself though. A lot of Russian guys hate to see their women with foreign guys. It's a cliche that drives them nuts. Their own damn fault it is that way too.

Moscow as a freebie destination? It's expensive, but I still prefer it to Kiev. If you've got the courage, give the regional cities a go. I always enjoy myself there too... and there are so many... :)

Bez Bezarra

06-02-07, 14:16

Dr Skank's here for work.

But for the rest of us, surely Samara, Volgograd and Novgorod are the places to be?

All big cities good looking girls haven't the snooty-arsed attitude.
And MUCH lower prices.

FSU is poor and full of hotties.

Its odd to go to the ONLY place that's actually richer than the West to get girls 'cheaply'.

I can't quite figure it out.

Because its not true. Nobody's going to Moscow for cheap, anymore. And in the provinces, its not as cheap as you think, at least not now. Sure, starting prices are much lower, but that usually comes with all the restrictions and rules. 2 hours will be 3000 rubles, but that doesn't mean you'll get GFE treatment. You want GFE, BBBJ, fotos, etc., you'll probably need to throw in another $50 to $100. And anal is still rare. So when you start asking for everything extra, its not a low price anymore. But in comparison, you can usually get anything, for what is now around the Moscow starting prices. But then again, you find the right girl with the right attitude, and you quickly forget about money.

As far as the other places to be, trust me when I tell you, that it all depends on the girl. There is definitely snooty attitude in the other cities, though its all about how pretty the girls look. I had opportunities to meet as many girls as I had time to, though like I already said, they're all working or in Institutes, so they limit when they'll meet you to 17:00 to about 19:00. That's the first problem, when you have to figure out how to squeeze 2 or 3 meetings into 2 hours! It does get tricky!

But the real issue is that most of them that are interested to meet, are not hot. They're just plain janes, nothing special, and certainly not up to my standards. Maybe the rest of you are not picky, and will fuck anything with a hole and a heartbeat, but I won't.

Yes, of course I did meet A FEW super hot ones. If you keep up a furious pace and devote maximum time to this effort, in a 2 week period, its always going to happen. BUT these are the girls with the attitude. Not necessarily snootiness, but basically impossible to get into bed unless you have more than a few weeks. On my last 3 trips, the hottest of all the models/students I met, were more than happy to go to cafe's, even come to my flat, but would not put out. The hottest one, I tried offering her "big" money, but she kept saying about her boyfirned. In these cases, though I should know better than to waste too much time on them on second and thrid dates without them starting to show promise, they are just so fucking hot, I let myself be fooled into thinking something will develop, but it doesn't. When I think back about the last girl, a med student who was too cute to believe, she dressed to kill when we met, but was so sweet and friendly, I decided against offering her a bunch of cash, and just pursued her as a serious relationship. Now that I think back, the way she was dressed when we met, maybe she was expecting a big sponsorship. I should have learned by now, that these girls aren't really offended when you propose to be their sponsor, they're SO hot that they must get offers from locals with money too. So if they do turn it down, then you just apologize and its forgotten. At least I think.

At the next level are the girls who are NOT dressing up to show off how hot they are, so on first glance, they look kind of pretty, just not really hot. These girls ARE doable. Dressed plainly, you really can't tell what's hiding underneath, but when they show you, they have great tits and nice asses. They're just modest about their looks, therefore NO attitude. These are the ones that make it worth all the hassles. The problem is that for every one of these girls, I meet about 7 others that are the plain jane type that are either chubby or too homely to waste my time, because I know that there's always the chance to meet a cutie, an hour or two later.

I don't know about you guys, but I just have to draw a line somewhere, and not settle for mediocrity, when siginificant talent is out there waiting to be found.

Piper1

06-02-07, 16:24

Hello Piper1,

could you please explain better what happened to your friend? If he did some mistakes or if he was just unlucky or what exactly?

I guess when you live there, together the chance to get much more pussy, you increase the risk to get some troubles too, for example it is enough to make jealous a wrong girl that one of her friends or brother or so on,can give you problems.He was unusually vague on the details, as he told me the story while my wife was with us. He said it was a mugging or maybe a racist bashing. I do know he's overly-confident and sometimes pushy in approaching girls in clubs, coffee shops, on campus, on the street, anywhere. Maybe he rubbed up a boyfriend the wrong way. Maybe it was because he was an Arab in a small Russian town (Petrovodstok - pardon my spelling).

Ash1001

06-03-07, 20:56

Skank and Bez, thanks for the perspectives.

Bez, I'm not an expert in the Russian market, being a frequent visitor to Kiev and Ukraine's provinces, but I think the exact relationship between a girl's attractiveness and market price is not so tightly defined. I've met beautiful girls who really want to spend time getting to know you and don't mind if the dates you take them on are $10 ones at a coffee shop. And somewhat chubby ones who won't settle for anything less than 'true love', which they define financially as an allowance of $3000 per month :) (Kiev prices). I don't need to say this, but it's all about getting lucky.

I personally think that all women classify men into 2 types: the reliable provider (the type that would be suitable for marriage, sponsor or generous boyfriend) with whom they will delay having sex, and the exciting 'bad boy', with whom they'd love to have a one night stand but can't be sure if he'll ever phone after the event.

What probably distinguishes Skank (and maybe a few others on this site) is the ability to come across as the second type, which opens to doors to no-strings freebie action, often shortly after the initial approach. I think that until we've really honed our 'game' to the stage where we're percieved this way - and, I suppose, believe it ourselves - it will be a case of mentally juggling the time and financial costs of getting a girl to say yes with the price of p4p.

True, going to a Russian provincial city will cost you less once you're there, but the extra travelling and less developed p4p market will waste more of your time. As a consultant who charges a daily rate, every day I'm not at work costs me dear so I'm probably best off arriving in Moscow on a Friday, doing an NF girl that night, a CF girl the next night and going home Sunday :) I'm beginning to lose any sense of pride about getting it more 'wholesomely' with a freebie. I'm just going to look at the Quality / (Time x Cost) ratio.

For those of you interested in what (some) Russian ladies in London are up to, and fancy a laugh, read this article: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/femail/article.html?in_article_id=458832&in_page_id=1879

If any guy thinks he can get top quality for free, he's kidding himself :)

Doctor_Skank

06-03-07, 23:11

Skank and Bez, thanks for the perspectives.

I personally think that all women classify men into 2 types: the reliable provider (the type that would be suitable for marriage, sponsor or generous boyfriend) with whom they will delay having sex, and the exciting 'bad boy', with whom they'd love to have a one night stand but can't be sure if he'll ever phone after the event.

What probably distinguishes Skank (and maybe a few others on this site) is the ability to come across as the second type, which opens to doors to no-strings freebie action, often shortly after the initial approach.

For those of you interested in what (some) Russian ladies in London are up to, and fancy a laugh, read this article: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/femail/article.html?in_article_id=458832&in_page_id=1879

If any guy thinks he can get top quality for free, he's kidding himself :)

There's definitely a degree of truth to that and it is advantageous to be perceived as mischevious/bad/unpredicatable/exciting in my experience. It's so self-evident that it's like autopilot for me when I am in my good phases. When in a dry spell, I usually discover that I am trying too hard and overpursuing.

Be bad, but don't be rude. Rude they don't like, but they do like games. I often find it's easier to get 3 or 4 girls essentially at the same time as it is to just get one you focus on.

When juggling 3 or 4 you are cool... you don't answer SMSs immediately, you don't desperately pursue dates and you don't overdote. This sparks their interest.

Girls like to be chased... but only to a degree. They also like to chase a bit too. Don't make it to easy on them, they lose interest if you are too interested.

This of course applies mainly to the casual type relationship. If she is looking for something more serious and you've already headed down that road, she'll lap up as much attention as you can give her. There is no point holding back then... if you want the same thing. I've BTDT and it has it's rewards... but being an EE junkie I know it's virtually impossible to stay faithful to one woman there. A closet romantic, I don't count out the possibility entirely and have met a few girls worthy of a serious commitment, but there is just too much temptation. Most EE vets and especially expats living in EE say the same to me.

A lot of my girls were initially interested in something more than just casual sex, but I try to establish early on that only a casual relationship is possible... mentioning that I travel a lot, not denying having other girls in other cities etc. Most go for it anyway. Makes things easier in the long run. And the number that have regular boyfriends on the side and still fuck me is disturbing. Makes me wonder how common that kind of stuff is. Maybe an advantage being foreign in that aspect, taking the role of their sex toy or "fuck friend" as they put it.

One thing that definitely scores big time for me is that I can go from bad boy to sentimental guy in a heartbeat. Switching gears goes a long way with them, both in conversation, flirting and in bed. Keeps them guessing. And despite any of their faults, Russian women are very emotional and passionate. Don't ignore these aspects. And they are great conversationalists. If you can get them into a conversation and break down any defensive barriers they have, that'll usually lead to sex if you play your cards right. Most women have admitted to me that being able to talk to a guy is important to them. It's definitely not the only thing and not sure where it actually ranks in importance, but they often mention it. Go figure. :)

Most of all though, you have to find things that work for you. Some guys employ methods very successfully that don't work for me at all and vice-versa.... it's all relative.

All the "strategy talk" is useful and fun on a superficial basis, but ultimately you are face-to-face with her alone and it comes down to adapting your game accordingly. Every girl is different as is every guy. And keep the initiative on your side.

Thanks for the article on London BTW. That's horrible... and there are girls like that in Moscow too obviously. What I hate the most is the probing/demeaning "is money a problem for you?" question. High-priced *****s like to ask it too. Suki.

Those women deserve a polite response like:
"Is fitting my fat cock in your ass a problem for you b1tch?"

Nothing a bit of lube can't fix... :)

It Travel

06-04-07, 13:39

Hecker

06-04-07, 20:55

Dear Guy, now good girls in Russia suddenly began to believe in family values. Life is getting better, girls want to multiply, to be loved and cared for. Almost no decent girls want just to fuck (especially to become a free-fuck-friend of a foreigner who may any moment disappear). Even escorts this year began to believe in family values, can you imagine? It seems to be the trend. Russian women no more want to invest their precious life-time in temporary things (though I don't know too much about distant villages, but can speak about Moscow). So for honest guys there are still 2 save possibilities: to pay or to marry. For honest+brave ones there is one more: to approach a girl you like and honestly inform her that you want to fuck her. Then to hear the answer. If you find the one who agrees, post about your experience, this will be really interesting. If you don't worn the girl about your plans she will automatically consider you searching for serious relatioships and when she discovers your real plans (very fast) you are very fast kicked out with a huge ugly scandal. You are lucky if you by accident don't cross in a dark street boxer-brother or bandit-father :) Things like "yes, I liked you but I didn't promise you anything" don't work any more. Everybody is fed up with this shit. Women in Russia are no more desperate, the learned how to survive (including surviving without a man due to our bad situation with their amount). For fun and fuck they now prefer to go to special strip-clubs with men dancing. The most popular ones are "Egoistka" and "Red Hat". Compare yourself with the dancers. If you look the same or better, your chances grow. Each decent girl now has a stip-teaser fun-and-fuck-friend (they are quite affortable and sometimes free, because they also need fun and tired of serving ugly old women from Rublevka). And the girls are becoming so terribly picky... Even in a fuck-and-fun-boy they search now not just phisical beauty, but also kind heart and intelligence. Inperfections are forgiven only to real men for real relationships (with marriage, kids... I guess you already understood - just dating is no more fashionable). And to tell you the truth even professionals are so terribly tired of cinizm, you can't emagine.Helena Moscow describes the way russian girls think and ukrainian girls maybe wish to think. Anyway I meet everything Helena describes from the opposite site and reflects the reality. I wanted to ask Helena if:

1. Are there differences between czech and russian girls? Who are more available, open minded, cost less etc? Did she feel jealous of czech girls like many western women?

2. Does she think ukrainian and moldovan girls are different from russian ones and in what way? (Russian women claim ukrainian girls are dumb).

3. In her opinion foreigners are cheap and cannot compete the local oligarches? Her opinions would be of interest for mongers.

Ash1001

06-04-07, 23:24

Thanks for the article on London BTW. That's horrible... and there are girls like that in Moscow too obviously. What I hate the most is the probing/demeaning "is money a problem for you?" question. High-priced *****s like to ask it too. Suki.

With reference to that watch she wanted, I'm not sure I'd have thought of it in the heat of the moment but the perfect response would have been: "Of course my darling, tomorrow that timepiece will be on your wrist. Right now, back to mine, it's time for a meeting of souls... "

And when dawn breaks you tell her all about your debt problems.. :D

Goldfinger

06-04-07, 23:40

I got asked for a laptop by a pre-op pamela anderson in Kiev three years ago. That night she got talking to the 18 year old son of a local "big man", after about an hour of this humiliation, I manufactured a row to get out of it. I had met her within 24 hours of landing but within three days and so much eye candy it was time to move on.

Privetprivet

06-05-07, 00:05

If you want to be out of money you gan just sponsor this teen...

http://www.flirt.com.ua/dev_ll444/

Taskent, but I think if you are rich enough she will come to Moscow... simply incredible, an 18teen just out from the high school and look at some pics..

I think if you sponsor such a girl (it would be so for me in any case) you would be with no work and completely out of money in some months.

IT

PS But if you are a Russian billionare... she can be a benefit for one of your directors :(Profile says Moscow (maybe it changed). However having spent a considerable time in Tashkent, I have come to the conclussion it is a VERY underrated mongering destination. Hanging out at Juliano's on a Friday evening as a VIP was a life experience you gotta have. No so much for the Uzbek chicks (some of whom were available) but the ethnic Russians were stunning (you could get away with $40) - some of them even know where to find rooms (which is a requirement as no Western Hotel chain - i.e. Intercontinental) would let them pass. The Intercont Manager "Helen" a black chick from the States had an eagle eye believe me.

Eros74

06-05-07, 00:18

....
And when dawn breaks you tell her all about your debt problems.. :D

Or...tell all about her...that she kisses as student, she is so cold in sex..you need and deserve much more...she is nice,but her body miss the "fire"...she miss the most important thing in a woman...she is just a Ferrari without engine! :)

However joking aside, in couple of years I am afraid we all members ISG we will meet in Siberia to get nice pussy at good price...

P.S: thanks for the article Ash1001..we have something to reflect...

Hecker

06-05-07, 00:32

Gold diggers are generally cunning and want cash in advance.I also found that dating EE girls in western countries(except Germany) is considerably more expensive than in EE.It has to do with the attitude of natives towards the girls and the level of competition.Probably the russian girls in London know there are lots of suckers willing to pay for them considerable amounts.

The appearance of western girls who are supposed to compete with them makes them even more selfish and greedy.That is why I prefer chasing in EE and never bring EE girls outside EE.(except polish and czech girls who are now in EU).

Bez Bezarra

06-05-07, 01:54

Or tell her she is cold in sex and her body miss the "fire"!

However joking aside, in couple of years I am afraid we all members ISG will meet in Siberia to get nice pussy at good price...

If you get some hot piece of ass, and YOU can't figure out HOW to
set her on fire, perhaps YOU are missing something? :D

Joking aside, who needs to wait for Sibr pussy? :p

Helena Moscow

06-05-07, 16:33

I wanted to ask Helena if:

1. Are there differences between czech and russian girls? Who are more available, open minded, cost less etc? Did she feel jealous of czech girls like many western women?

2. Does she think ukrainian and moldovan girls are different from russian ones and in what way? (Russian women claim ukrainian girls are dumb).

3. In her opinion foreigners are cheap and cannot compete the local oligarches? Her opinions would be of interest for mongers.

OK, here are my answers:
1. About Russian and Czech girls. Being in Czech Republic, of course, I paid attention to girls. I found them very pretty, didn't notice anybody who would look really ugly, and some girls really impressed me by the way they looked. Definetely they have a different sort of beauty - their features are thinner than the Russians and they have a different eyes expression, I'd say there is something wild and misterious about them. I'd be often unable to say with certainty what they are thinking about. With Russians it's much easier for me, may be because I am a Russian myself. I had no chance yet to know any Czech girls (or boys) very well, I only began to learn about the Czech and their culture. So I can't say anything about the difference in our attitudes, for this I need more time and information. I didn't feel jealous, not for a second. I don't think Russian and Czechs are rivals or something like this. We are just slightly different, but for sure must have much in common, because we are both slav. Some people may prefer Czech, others may prefer Russians. I didn't feel lack of attention to my person, felt OK. By the way, I think it's an exaggeration that western women are jealous of Czech or Russian girls or girls of any other country. I traveled a lot, and in every country you can meet many wonderful women, men, girls and boys. Teenagers are cute everywhere. Nobody is better or worse than others. In general the cost of living in Prague is less than in Moscow, so I suspect that escorts in general can be slightly cheaper. But at the same time I saw a lot of advertisement of rather expensive Czech escorts. There must be a market for them, too. Anyway this small difference in rates can be important only for clients whose choice a provider is based on price only. When the choice is more personal, 30% price difference doesn't change the weather.
2. Ukrainean women are OK, I have some Ukrainean friends, they are both smart and good-looking. Moldavians I don't know, never met them.
3. Foreigners have different possibilities from oligarches. There are enough cheap and good people in any part of society and in any nation. I'd judge people by what they do, not by where they belong to.

Helena Moscow

06-05-07, 17:34

Be bad, but don't be rude. Rude they don't like, but they do like games. I often find it's easier to get 3 or 4 girls essentially at the same time as it is to just get one you focus on.

When juggling 3 or 4 you are cool... you don't answer SMSs immediately, you don't desperately pursue dates and you don't overdote. This sparks their interest.

Girls like to be chased... but only to a degree. They also like to chase a bit too. Don't make it to easy on them, they lose interest if you are too interested.

This of course applies mainly to the casual type relationship.

I really don't know where you find this sort of girls. I don't know any who would like this sort of games. For example, when I discover that a man plays tricks, I get rid of him even if he is a well-paying client. I think that playing tricks is disrespect to a person you are with, and it's absolutely not fun. Right, it makes women nervous and attracts attention. But then it depends on a women. If she likes to have things clear and feel happy (most of women I know prefer this), she will soon explain you the rules, and if after this you continue playing games, will soon turn you off. Probably after a huge histeric (because she will feel upset, used and humiliated). A man who responds sms with a dealy? - you kidding, a woman who has at least a drop of selfrespect will not be with a man who is so much uninterested in her that he doesn't even bother to respond in the proper time. The explanation like "sorry, dear, I was busy" is the synonim of "sorry, dear, I am an asshole, kick me out as soon as possible". All women who ever had relationships with men playing tricks always say to their friends: "I just don't understand, why he had to perform this ugly spectacular? He is an attractive man, and I liked him. If he didn't do this shit, I'd continue meeting him, but he behaved as a completely sick person... for what?" To me, for example, in any relationships - short, long or just business - my own comfort is the most important thing. I don't meet a person who tease me after I discover the game. And I don't have sex with him after this. Never. Under no condition, it's absolutely impossible, because my own quietness is more important. To my mind the only acceptable type of a "bad boy" is a fun-guy who entertains, but not playing tricks and keeps situation clear and fun for both. And, of course, this boy should say at the very first moment: "I'm just a bad boy, I'm here for fun only, I don't need serious relationships". Then if a girl feels OK about this, she may continue. This is at least honest.

Tone

06-05-07, 18:32

To my mind the only acceptable type of a "bad boy" is a fun-guy who entertains, but not playing tricks and keeps situation clear and fun for both. And, of course, this boy should say at the very first moment: "I'm just a bad boy, I'm here for fun only, I don't need serious relationships". Then if a girl feels OK about this, she may continue. This is at least honest.Helena,

Perhaps you miss the point entirely but being a woman it is not entirely your fault. You think that a man is going to be straight, honest and upfront with a woman? But to my mind this only applies to women you pay by the hour, this being the only honest relationship a man can have.

For everyone else, casual or otherwise the cardinal rule is to tell them only what they need to know, no more no less.

Honestly telling them you are only looking for casual sex or a quick fuck may work for the esteemed Dr Skank but for us lesser mortals, bullshit is the dish of the day and the thicker you lay it on they more they will lap it up.

Lastly, Russian women might come across as very tough, but dig a little deeper they will put up with a hell of alot of shit and still jump into bed with you. More so than in Western Europe.

Eros74

06-05-07, 21:49

I really do not know where I could start to answer you Helena,however let's start from the words of our dear Doc:

....

I often find it's easier to get 3 or 4 girls essentially at the same time as it is to just get one you focus on.....

I think this is the best suggest to get regulars written in all the forum in the last years!

We desire what we cannot have, we want what we cannot get, we fall in love of somebody who is close to us but "so far" we cannot bring, it is part of human nature,it is so...obviously,that it is impossible to deny it!

Almost every good looking woman, can have almost every man she wants, and she get soon boring about all these men who are good as "dogs", who always answer to sms immediately, who are so polite,so good....and she wants-needs the man who doesn't care about her! Cause this man..is different from all the others,cause she is never sure about this man,he has no interest or he only plays? Who knows...he is different and it seems he is hard to catch too...

I think that every man that have enough experience with girls-regulars, can agree that to be a "bad" guy increases so much your chance to get women!
And with "bad" I do not mean to be alcholist or to kick her ass....(typical male hobbies in the east europe...and this is not MY opinion,but what you learn speaking with the girls and travelling to east europe..)

Show to a woman that you can live without her pussy and she get in trouble, show her that you do not need sex with her and she immediately loses her super-ultra-fanta-mega-powers....WHY?

Every woman believes that it is enough she has a mini skirt and you immediately get horny as bull,but keep on look into her eyes when you are talking with her even if she dress very sexy,never look to any part of her body and she immediately feels as a child lost in the wood in the middle of night....WHY?

After the first or second meeting with a girl, if you do not kiss her even if was very pleasent meeting, she come back home and feels ugly, feels she did something wrong...or at least you do not like her,but keep on writing to her and she will do not understand what is wrong with her,that you are not trying to get into her tanga...

I always am the good guy I am with pro, no reason to play games,cause from the beginning is all clear, sex for money, usually most of pro are much better than thousands of regulars playing tons of games.
But be good with regulars and they fall asleep, they will get soon boring about you and start to search for the "bad" guy who make her heart beats...

I agree that it is said, but it is true,it is the real word!

Helena I have no reasons to not believe you,but you are...just one in a million! Nothing more than that!

My best friend always says:" if girls did not have pussy,nobody will talk with them". And there is a big truth in this too...
But talk with them AS IF they had not pussy and you will see how much you can spark their interest about you....

As our Doc very well said, why if you are writing with 3 or 4 girls at same time it is, MUCH,very MUCH easier to get them all than if you focus only with one?
WHY Helena? Have you ever tried but seriously to answer to this question that describes so well the real word?
This sentence is so true,it is in front of all the persons who have...eyes open and why this sentence is true if all the girls are as Helena said they are???

The answer is that only one girl in a million is as Helena thinks they are, not more!

I do not have bad opinion about women, ( I have my personal opinion..), I only tried to be a good man and then to be a "bad" man and saw very well the BIG difference there is from get some regulars and get many regulars at the same time!

Be a gentleman and she will forget your name, cause you are the same as all the others men...(however if you are rich or Brad Pitt, she "maybe" remember who you are...)

But if you want to score many girls, not "play" with 3 or 4, but play with 30 or 40 at the same time, not answer with delay, but just forget sometimes to answer at all and...call me when you will not be able to afford all your contacts... :)

Let's speak in this forum about the real world and not about the world as it should be...

Doctor_Skank

06-05-07, 21:55

I really don't know where you find this sort of girls. I don't know any who would like this sort of games. For example, when I discover that a man plays tricks, I get rid of him even if he is a well-paying client. I think that playing tricks is disrespect to a person you are with, and it's absolutely not fun. Right, it makes women nervous and attracts attention. But then it depends on a women. If she likes to have things clear and feel happy (most of women I know prefer this), she will soon explain you the rules, and if after this you continue playing games, will soon turn you off. Probably after a huge histeric (because she will feel upset, used and humiliated). A man who responds sms with a dealy? - you kidding, a woman who has at least a drop of selfrespect will not be with a man who is so much uninterested in her that he doesn't even bother to respond in the proper time. The explanation like "sorry, dear, I was busy" is the synonim of "sorry, dear, I am an asshole, kick me out as soon as possible". All women who ever had relationships with men playing tricks always say to their friends: "I just don't understand, why he had to perform this ugly spectacular? He is an attractive man, and I liked him. If he didn't do this shit, I'd continue meeting him, but he behaved as a completely sick person... for what?" To me, for example, in any relationships - short, long or just business - my own comfort is the most important thing. I don't meet a person who tease me after I discover the game. And I don't have sex with him after this. Never. Under no condition, it's absolutely impossible, because my own quietness is more important. To my mind the only acceptable type of a "bad boy" is a fun-guy who entertains, but not playing tricks and keeps situation clear and fun for both. And, of course, this boy should say at the very first moment: "I'm just a bad boy, I'm here for fun only, I don't need serious relationships". Then if a girl feels OK about this, she may continue. This is at least honest.

Perhaps you are right Helena, but I have a system that works for me. It is of course self-serving and dishonest at times, but I do manage to avoid hurting too many feelings (including my own), do manage to have sex with new girls almost as often as I please and many of them maintain contact with me for years... so apparently they don't hate it, otherwise they wouldn't keep coming back. All types from 18-year old students from Himki to 21 year old oligarch daughters and catalog models. Could very well be that they judge foreign men differently than their own Russian men... as they know very soon that they can expect nothing in the way of marriage from me. Could be I'm (and guys like me) just a pleasant distraction.

Besides that, when juggling several girls at the same time and having a dozen in reserve, it's not possible to answer all of the SMSs.

she will soon explain you the rules
You've never been a man Helena, our "game", our "war" is different than yours. You have no idea about some of the shit we have to go through. We're here to get as much pussy as we can and it is much easier being a bit bad as opposed to being good. Merely saying "I am bad boy, let's fuck for fun" isn't going to get it done for most of us. The game has to be played and it is better to play it by your own rules, as opposed to the woman's. Experience proves my point and I think a lot of the guys will agree.

Very few women can impress us enough to keep us interested for a long time anyway... but they do exist. Some of the girls I met along the way have become an important part of my life... but I'm not ready to stop playing yet.

You'd probably hate me.

A man who responds sms with a dealy? - you kidding, a woman who has at least a drop of selfrespect will not be with a man who is so much uninterested in her that he doesn't even bother to respond in the proper time. The explanation like "sorry, dear, I was busy" is the synonim of "sorry, dear, I am an asshole, kick me out as soon as possible".

Being a girl's trick pony who reacts to every SMS dutifully, who allows himself to be controlled and monitored by a woman... and Russian women are ALMOST as guilty as their anglo cousins when it comes to attempting to control their men... gets you NOWHERE in the dating game. It makes you a tool, a stooge. I never said you should be universally rude, but you definitely have to remind the girls that they don't own you. Russian women are notorious for testing the boundaries of controlling men... buy me this, buy me that. Ordering shit from the menu that don't even want... I don't let this happen anymore, I learned this long ago and since have adopted to controlling the situation as best possible and have been much happier since. The girls in my opinion also live better this way. Longer term relations develop somewhat differently, but for short term relations... and most guys here only are really interested in that... are played by different rules.

Helena Moscow

06-05-07, 22:14

Helena Moscow

06-05-07, 23:15

My best friend always says:" if girls did not have pussy,nobody will talk with them". And there is a big truth in this too...
But talk with them AS IF they had not pussy and you will see how much you can spark their interest about you....
But it's fun that women have pussies, isn't it? By the way, men without dicks and balls are also not too interesting.

As our Doc very well said, why if you are writing with 3 or 4 girls at same time it is, MUCH,very MUCH easier to get them all than if you focus only with one?
WHY Helena? Have you ever tried but seriously to answer to this question that describes so well the real word? - This is statistics. The more shots you make the more goals you hit. Has nothing to do with girls. Works in any field.

The answer is that only one girl in a million is as Helena thinks they are, not more! - May be I am one in a million. There is nothing wrong in being unique. But I know at least 10 girls who think and act very similar.

Be a gentleman and she will forget your name, cause you are the same as all the others men...

Let's speak in this forum about the real world and not about the world as it should be... - I guess, both the worlds are real, but our realities seem to be very different. The matter of taste probably.

Doctor_Skank

06-05-07, 23:30

You'd probably hate me.

Skank, you are a stranger from the forum, not a piece of my life. How can I hate you or like? It would be silly. I don't share your opinion, but it's not a big deal. I have no idea what should happen to a man to make him treat women this way. May be you really went through so much shit... In this case I can just feel sorry for you.

I didn't say you hate me, but rather that you probably would if you met me.

There is no need to feel sorry for me, I'm quite happy with my "plight".

I honestly don't think I treat women that badly either. One of the keys to successful mongering is knowing how to be nice and focus on one woman when it is the appropriate time. The number that stick around and keep seeing me does suggest that they don't generally disagree with my company, both in the bed and out. I've rarely had "ugly" breakups or hysterics. And like I said, the number of women who have nice guy boyfriends or husbands and still fuck me or guys like me is a bit disturbing. Certainly not all... but more than I thought would be possible. I don't know if this says something negative about me, them or their men... or just life.

As for going through shit, I've actually rarely been treated badly by women. I do think most women have big hearts and want a happy life, but have also discovered that especially the younger ones are not looking for "the" nice pleasant man, at least not when it comes down to having sex and adventure. Sure when they are about 30 they suddenly panic and want to get married and have kids and "mysteriously" the guys they ignored during their wild youth are now "good enough" to pay the bills and raise the kids, but that's not the market we are looking for.

This phenomenon is more prominent in our European and American home countries, but especially in Moscow and Kiev it is also largely true of EE as well.

Moscow girls are different than country girls obviously, who marry much younger... and often have a stronger "morality" as well as a more earnest desire to find a good provider, regardless of his image. Moscow girls on the contrary are generally quite wild and want to experience life at its fullest. I think that is good and natural, even if sometimes stereotypically comical in an unfunny way.

Besides that, most of us mongers are not in Russia (or Ukraine etc.) long enough to really develop long-term relations. We are looking to score some sex with the best looking girls we can get. Sometimes we pay, sometimes we play. That's why we are mongers. We're sexual deviants in a way, sexually insatiable.

Guys luck us keep you and your sisters in business.

Guido88

06-06-07, 04:15

Helena,

Surely you are joking!

Such girls are found worldwide in every country. Women are frequently playing multiple games/men at the same time everywhere in the world. It’s the nature of life with women looking for improved security, financial, social status and men looking to spread seed.

Russia is my top choice for females because they are different in that:

Overall many are absolutely gorgeous, fun, aggressive, and clever.

Dammed good at sex, not afraid to use it with pride of their fucking and sucking skills.

Pheromones like heroin, better sexual response than any other country I have been in.

In my humble opinion-

1st off it’s all about sex for men and women alike, money coming a close second. Some women like to delude themselves that they are somehow above this. On this I have to call Bullshit, I’d put the female game’s player ratio at least 70% or more. The type of women you describe maybe 1 out of 10 at best.

Milking a foreign man or multiples of men for money is many Russian women’s national sport. There is a reason they call us wallets, it’s a game for us as well.

In Russia the opportunity exists to meet very pretty women, fuck them and to have the mind-blowing sexual encounter that in other countries simply is not so easy to accomplish. Worth every bit of a 14 hour plane trip.

Course I could be wrong and need more in depth research. Looking forward to the next trip.

Did I mention it’s all about sex………….

Guido88

It Travel

06-06-07, 10:15

If you want to be out of money you gan just sponsor this teen...

http://www.flirt.com.ua/dev_ll444/

Taskent, but I think if you are rich enough she will come to Moscow... simply incredible, an 18teen just out from the high school and look at some pics..

I think if you sponsor such a girl (it would be so for me in any case) you would be with no work and completely out of money in some months...

IT

PS But if you are a Russian billionare... she can be a benefit for one of your directors :(

I quote myself so you have the link too...

For those who do not have the registration, and the password, for flirt…

Here the incredible girl in Tashkent searching for a sponsor, she answered me and said she is in Tashkent… by the way she says she is working for a model agency (what kind of models???) there! But seldom she comes to Moscow.

I can imagine who shot the first picture I put here… I should have been like a cocktail of Viagra, Cialis and Levitra… all together. :D

I think I could fuck this teen up to when I get a heart attack, if she is even good in bed….

IT

PS when I see the pic Kristina 1 I just have an immmediate erection! she is, in my opinion, something incredible, just 18teen.

Hecker

06-06-07, 14:00

I think Helena describes what is in the women's mind, most what is in the women's reasonable mind, the one that justifies their actions. Yes they may sleep with a bad boy but afterwards they will justify it by chick logic, I do not know why it happened, it seemed so natural etc.

In the words they always claim they want a nice man, a husband etc. But they act differently.

On the other hand bad boy quality alone does not bring results in EE. You need sth more and it depends on the place.

So maybe the women are eager for sex but they have ready the excuse. I believed him and he cheated me, that is they imagine every relationship leading to marriage so they can have sex.

There is also the bargain. The dilemma you marry me or you pay me is central in the part of women's mind that is reasonable but it leads to a bargain. Not all men are ready to accept these terms. So it becomes sth like I will marry you if. , I pay you if. And there are a lot of compromises and intermediate stages. In general I think Helena's views reflect slavic women's mind (the logical part) and are easily understood by the foreigners who come in contact with these girls. The effects vary. One effect is that it is rare to have a gf but girls want a sponsor, a groom or a sugar daddy. Many men like that since they also do not want a girlfriend. On the practical field it has consequences only on the long term, that is you cannot keep a girl who hopes for marriage a long time if you do not marry her actually. You must propose to her very soon, maybe in six months, otherwise she leaves. So the competition sets the terms. If there are many available good standing grooms, a girl will not risk sex. If there are few (as it happens actually) she will give sex in order to gain a positive attitude from future groom. Sex is a bargaining weapon. (in women's reason).

Practically the dilemma either you marry or you pay leads to a girl being in bed one hour after first meeting and starting to speak about marriage! This is also common in Poland.

The other possibility (you pay) leads to the gold digger who in any case will win since she can ask for money in advance. I mean it is more difficult to ask for marriage before sex than to ask for money before sex. So the bargain is beneficial for the gold digger unless there are many good girls who give it for free. In this case the gold digger lowers the price and in some cases she may not ask for money in advance in order to set the trap in a not beneficial for her environment of good girls giving it for free. Experienced men can handle the gold digger, the rest cannot. Everybody can handle the nice girls.

I definitely disagree with mongers describing themselves as serious persons with marriage as goal with purpose to cheat and sleep with good girls. I disagree with this attitude because it makes girls distrust foreigners influenced by their frisnds' experiences and gives more power to gold diggers since it moves many good girls away from foreigners. In this perspective Helena's suggestions are right, I mean to promise marriage only to have quick sex is unacceptable. (not only from girls' side but also from mongers' by doing with this attitude a lot of harm to next mongers).

Helena Moscow

06-06-07, 19:00

I definitely disagree with mongers describing themselves as serious persons with marriage as goal with purpose to cheat and sleep with good girls. I disagree with this attitude because it makes girls distrust foreigners influenced by their frisnds' experiences and gives more power to gold diggers since it moves many good girls away from foreigners. In this perspective Helena's suggestions are right, I mean to promise marriage only to have quick sex is unacceptable. (not only from girls' side but also from mongers' by doing with this attitude a lot of harm to next mongers).

That's exactly what I meant. It's correct that women need sex as well as men. And sometimes they don't mind spending fun-time with a nice man without any further obligations. If the man is really attractive and the girl has nothing against sex for entertainment, it's good for both. It's impossible and sensless to marry each man you meet. There are many ways to be honest and still get what you want. For example, one of my friends dates a stripteaser. He is a very good-looking guy with pleasant manners. He looks like a macho, but he has the hart, too. When they got acquainted (in a strip-club she paid him for a private dance) he showed that he was not against to continue for free after work, then he said that she had to be aware that he was not going to leave his business, and plus to this he had a permanent rich girlfriend in America who he planned to marry if she doesn't change her mind. So he showed very clearly that there is nothing to expect in terms of marriage for my friend, but he likes her very much and wouldn't mind meeting her just for pleasant time. Friendship with a privilege of sex. She was also well-aware that he might have some other friends besides her. She liked him personally and had no permanent boyfriend at that time, she works in an office and has no time to search in clubs every night, so for her it was quite an acceptable way to have a time of fun and relaxation. She told me that she respected his honesty a lot and that it was an additional plus of relationships, because she felt free to search someone else with who she would have a chance for marriage at the same time without feeling guilty. They remain friends already for about 2 years, still have sex and share with each other their love-storys which happen during their friendship. No tricks, no games, no cheating, only pleasure. This sort of relatioships I find quite OK. I just hate when a man plays tricks and gives hints to a woman that there is a chance for the future only to get sex or a temporary girlfriend for the time untill the expats contract finishes. This became very common since foreigners appeared in Russia. Before such things were unheard of. This way is terrible and can't have any exuse. I know many examples when a foreign guy pretended (sometimes for years) that he plans to marry a girl, and later she by accident discovered that he was already successfully married or he left for his own country without a worning - the girl didn't even know that his contract was over. I think there must be a law against it. When someone steals your money or things you only loose money or things - and the robbery is already a crime. When someone steals by cheating precious months or years of your life and you believe in people - it's much a harder crime, and it's still legal. Probably these guys are even proud of how smart they are, probably they become heroes for the same sort of freaks as themselves. But no matter what these guys say, I will never believe that being a monster is normal and realistic, and being a normal person is naive and stupid. And I'll never agree that a man who is cheating a woman calling it "his own game" is mentally healthy and all right. To me any fucking trick means that a man who plays it has no confidence, full of complex, mentally sick and needs a help of a doctor. If he really believes that women like being hurt and considers himself a great lover, he needs an ambulance immediately. A really good lover doesn't need to cheat, women like him the way he is. Even if he is married or engaged, or just fucks everything around. They can accept it he is amusing, if they are worned and have no prejudice against short-term fun. Only loosers cheat and play these hot-cold-games to attract attention. Normal people are attractive without them.

Hecker

06-06-07, 19:23

That's exactly what I meant. It's correct that women need sex as well as men. And sometimes they don't mind spending fun-time with a nice man without any further obligations. If the man is really attractive and the girl has nothing against sex for entertainment, it's good for both. It's impossible and sensless to marry each man you meet. There are many ways to be honest and still get what you want. For example, one of my friends dates a stripteaser. He is a very good-looking guy with pleasant manners. He looks like a macho, but he has the hart, too. When they got acquainted (in a strip-club she paid him for a private dance) he showed that he was not against to continue even for free after work, then he said that she had to be aware that he was not going to leave his business, and plus to this he had a permanent rich girlfriend in America who he planned to marry if she doesn't change her mind. So he showed very clearly that there is nothing to expect in terms of marriage for my friend, but he likes her very much and wouldn't mind meeting her just for pleasant time. Friendship with a privilege of sex. She was also well-aware that he might have some other friends besides her. She liked him personally and had no permanent boyfriend at that time, she works in an office and has no time to search in clubs every night, so for her it was quite an acceptable way to have a time of fun and relaxation. She told me that she respected his honesty a lot and that it was an additional plus of relationships, because she felt free to search someone else with who she would have a chance for marriage at the same time without feeling guilty. They remain friends already for about 2 years, still have sex and share with each other their love-storys which happen during their friendship. No tricks, no games, no cheating, only pleasure. This sort of relatioships I find quite OK. I just hate when a man plays tricks and gives hints to a woman that there is a chance for the future only to get sex or a temporary girlfriend for the time untill the expats contract finishes. This became very common since foreigners appeared in Russia. Before such things were unheard of. This way is terrible and can't have any exuse. I know many examples when a foreign guy pretended (sometimes for years) that he plans to marry a girl, and later she by accident discovered that he was already successfully married. I think there must be a law against it. When someone steals your money or things you only loose money or things - and the robbery is already a crime. When someone steals by cheating years of your life and you believe in people - it's much a harder crime. And somehow these guys go off without any punishment. Probably they are even proud of how smart they are. But no matter what these guys say, I will never believe that being a monster is normal and realistic, and being a normal person is naive and stupid. And I'll never agree that a man who is cheating a woman calling it "his own game" is mentally healthy and all right. To me any fucking trick means that a man who plays it has no confidence, full of complex, mentally sick and needs a help of a doctor. If he really believes that women like being hurt and considers himself a great lover, he needs an ambulance immediately. A really good lover doesn't need to cheat, women like him the way he is. Even if he is married or engaged, or just fucks everything around. They can accept it if they are worned and have no prejudice against short-term fun.First of all I have to add that this behaviour was not totally unknown before foreigners came. Some ukrainian girls complained to me that russian guys did exactly the same in Ukraine in some cases leaving the girls when they became pregnant.

Second there are many foreigners who are really interested in marrying a russian girl. They pay a lot of money to trips, agencies and search for a wife.

It is these men that have created a relatively good reputation for foreign guys. If every foreigner behaved like monger, mongers could not survive anymore in Russia. So a girl thinks this man is either a serious future husband or a sex tourist. How do I find out? There is when the game begins.

Now she is likely to offer sex because 70-80% of foreigners are serious. So she risks a 20-30% danger. Her benefit is bigger than her losses. If bad foreigners constituted more than 50%, good girls would seldom risk. (especially as they are not in particular need now).

I only want to say to Helena that if a girls starts thinking about marriage it is not the foreigner's fault. I mean if the foreigner does not propose to her or is not asked why should he tell her, look I am not serious I just go for fun.

I mean is there any girl who says straight, look I do not like you at all, I am interested in your money only?

Eros74

06-06-07, 19:58

....
Only loosers cheat and play these hot-cold-games to attract attention....

So all the women that always plays as well are loosers? LOL

You are right Helena, why we should play, if with most of women is enough to show some Franklin...

Helena Moscow

06-06-07, 20:27

So all the women that always plays as well are loosers? LOL
Womens games are different, mostly women are more straight. Probably what you took for a game was just a real "no" to you.

You are right Helena, why we should play, if with most of women is enough to show some Franklin... May be with most of women you meet. But don't forget about those to who you should give some Franklin, not only show. And those who will not go with you even after this, if they don't want.

Doctor_Skank

06-06-07, 22:59

i just hate when a man plays tricks and gives hints to a woman that there is a chance for the future only to get sex or a temporary girlfriend for the time untill the expats contract finishes. this became very common since foreigners appeared in russia. before such things were unheard of.
i agree 100% that leading women on under false pretenses is wrong and not very sportsmanlike... in fact it's been discussed on this forum before and most agreed that it goes against the yet undefined "monger's code", which attempts to define honor and good behavior in our underworld sport.

surely leading girls on with fake promises has been used by foreigners before, or perhaps the russian or ukrainian girl just read something into the relationship that the man saw completely differently.

nonetheless, i don't see how this can be considered a phenomenon with only foreign men. maybe russian men didn't do this in soviet times, but surely the new russians and their habit of trading in their "aging" 26 year old molls for a fresh new 18-year old model from siberia every few years isn't exactly to the satisfaction of the 26-yr old girl who gave up her best years only to be shown the curb when her tits showed the first signs of sag.

nor can new russian wives be happy with their men sending them shopping to shut them up while they entertain themselves with sponsored teens and twens on the weekends.

for example, one of my friends dates a stripteaser. he is a very good-looking guy with pleasant manners.

and *****s himself out to whatever women pay him for their time. that's like falling in love with a female stripper or prostitute. hardly a real world example. it's a rock star example.

your girlfriend lives out a fantasy with a living doll... more power to her, but i doubt she'd behave the same with someone from the real world.

when someone steals by cheating precious months or years of your life and you believe in people - it's much a harder crime, and it's still legal. probably these guys are even proud of how smart they are, probably they become heroes for the same sort of freaks as themselves. but no matter what these guys say, i will never believe that being a monster is normal and realistic, and being a normal person is naive and stupid.

it is wrong to deceive women in this way, it's low and unfair. but nobody here is talking about that. the dynamics of club life and dating are much different. we aren't talking about tricks and fooling women... there is no fun in that, but rather playing the club game better than others. we still have to look at ourselves in the mirror the next day.

many of us serial mongers have had to deal with ugly breakups or disappointed, hurt girls. it's a mutual pain that makes one careful to not promise anything and end relationships before they get to serious. when it happens anyway, it's unfortunate but a hazard of the hobby.

usually however, it's not even necessary to worry about it too much, as club and dating life have their own dynamics. it's not conventional dating.

or how many girls met their future husband at a club?

no, most girls going there are not looking to meet the guy to spend the rest of their life with. they go there to have fun and if the mood is right, they might go home with someone. for us, it's all about being that someone. if it doesn't happen on the first night, it probably will on the second. it's about making that happen.

look at the profiles on dating sites. not everybody is looking for love and long-term relationships. casual sex is as common as ever. i've even had the women tell me to not take things so seriously... it was just sex. most girls know exactly what they are getting into when dating and/or fucking foreign businessmen and tourists.

and no, it's not just foreigners doing it... so are local russian boys. they have a different set of parameters to work with... some advantages like time and language... some disadvantages, like proximity and lack of exoticism.

only loosers cheat and play these hot-cold-games to attract attention. normal people are attractive without them.

i find it somewhat amusing that the women that lecture me most about my dating habits are prostitutes. wonder why? because some of us get for free what you offer for $300? and the girls throw in bbbj, real kisses and honest laughs and fun for free?

i don't understand why you are complaining though. by conventional wisdom, normal people don't use prostitutes either. we do.

it's a system that works for me and you. i greatly value some prostitutes and have met many i have really liked. pro sex can be a great thing. the bad pros are just another hazard of the game.

- this is statistics. the more shots you make the more goals you hit. has nothing to do with girls. works in any field.

here you missed the point dear. we're saying sometimes it's easier to get all 4 girls by juggling them at the same time than it would be to get all 4 individually by concentrating on them. there is some truth in saying that some women are like cats... if you pay too much attention to them they run away... if you ignore them for awhile they jump on your lap and purr.

in the words they always claim they want a nice man, a husband etc. but they act differently.

excellent point. it's like the [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) fantasy. [CodeWord123] (http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123) is a woman's worst real world nightmare. but nearly every woman likes to play out the fantasy sometimes.

i definitely disagree with mongers describing themselves as serious persons with marriage as goal with purpose to cheat and sleep with good girls. i disagree with this attitude because it makes girls distrust foreigners influenced by their frisnds' experiences and gives more power to gold diggers since it moves many good girls away from foreigners. in this perspective helena's suggestions are right, i mean to promise marriage only to have quick sex is unacceptable. (not only from girls' side but also from mongers' by doing with this attitude a lot of harm to next mongers).

again, well said. this kind of manipulation is unacceptable. it's really cheating. it's not only bad for the girl and could damage her capacity to trust men, but ultimately it must be bad for the psyche of the guy doing it as well.

Guido88

06-07-07, 02:32

Doc,

"Monger's code, which attempts to define honor and good behavior in our underworld sport”

The only monger’s code I am aware of is dick into pussy however possible. At that you are an expert that I have watched in action. Honor and good behavior are laughable terms; bullshit and fast-talking are the preferred methods.

Hecker,

“Not only from girls' side but also from mongers' by doing with this attitude a lot of harm to next mongers”

The word naïve comes to mind immediately along with “Are you fucking kidding? Mongers are there to get fucked period. Those with contrary outlooks are called faithful husbands or delusional idiots. The Russian women will eat you alive.

Helana,

By your posts you have considerable knowledge of both Russian and foreign men. With your life experience you have to know that men are basically the same regardless of country of origin. We are all looking for a place to put our dicks. Methods used to achieve that goal are in no way different than methods women use to achieve their goals. Get real; anything else is fantasy or delusion.

Guido88

Hecker

06-07-07, 11:36

Hecker,

"Not only from girls' side but also from mongers' by doing with this attitude a lot of harm to next mongers"

The word naïve comes to mind immediately along with "Are you fucking kidding? Mongers are there to get fucked period. Those with contrary outlooks are called faithful husbands or delusional idiots. The Russian women will eat you alive.

I know mongers are there to get fucked. But their methods to achieve this matter as well. If they use marriage agencies or promise straight marriage, this has adverse consequences for mongers who come next.

For example if a girl had before Dr. Skank a monger has still chances with her cause she finds foreigners interesting, attractive, smooth talking etc. But if she had an experience with sb who proposed marriage and vanished she will be very careful and reluctant to do anything with any foreigner. Moreover she will have spread the rumour to her friends turning more girls unavailable.

The former is valid mainly in smaller cities.

On the other hand I do not think that a girl who presents her girlfriend and encourages you to have sex with her as well can claim that she is looking for serious relationship or that she feels lonely etc. There is so much contradiction between actions and words in EE that it is always better to ignore the words.

Helena Moscow

06-07-07, 12:47

And *****s himself out to whatever women pay him for their time. That's like falling in love with a female stripper or prostitute. Hardly a real world example. It's a rock star example.Your girlfriend lives out a fantasy with a living doll... more power to her, but I doubt she'd behave the same with someone from the real world. - She sais it's much better to have this perfect and honest paid companion than have an unperfect and dishonest companion for free, which she had a lot in the "real" life. At least everybody knows what he gets and what gives. I ones had relationshios with a gigolo myself, and they were the best relationships in my life and the most clear. Unfortunately at that time we were both poor like rats and for this reason couldn't keep faith to each other too long. There were just no decent jobs in the early 90th. He tried to work as a taxi driver, but the money was enough only for food. I couldn't find any job at all. And we both liked luxury and had dreams about better life when we can travel, eat in restaurants, drive cars and live in beautiful houses. I don't think that relationships with a provider are too much different or not real (for me they were very comfortable, because we understood each other perfectly, new how to entertain each other and could speak about everything without hiding). People are people everywhere. The only difference is that with a pro situation has to be clearer than ever, because to keep relationships, a pro has to make dramatic changes in his (or her) own life - to loose one sort of income and find another - practically to start life anew. Such things can't be done for a joke, or a game, or just casual sex. There must be something solid.

I don't understand why you are complaining though. By conventional wisdom, normal people don't use prostitutes either. We do. - You know, in Russia during the past 15 years things mixed so much that we already can't say what normal people do and what they don't. The point is that normal people do use pros, normal people do marry pros, normal people do become pros, and pros become normal people, as well as their clients. Im complaining, as you call it, because after the years of escorting I'm getting really sick and tired of clients who try to pretend that they want to build relationships when their real goal is to get a discount for sex (which they never get though). Every week I turn away 1 or 2 clients who try to play the same trick. It's like listening to the same record every day, makes you crazy. I know that it's a part of business, and as long as I do it I have to deal with this, too. In my business it's quite easy to find out the trick, because the man who really by accident falls in love with a pro immediately offers some realistic plan of keeping her away from business. Immediately because he has to deal with jealousy. And if he doesn't take any serious action, then it's the most probably just a game (or something else which is not going to work out in such situation). More or less we can handle it. But it makes me absolutely mad that tricks are also played on normal young girls who are not pros. Because I have a wonderful younger sister, who as every normal girl wants to find a nice guy, to fall in love and to have real beautiful relationships leading to a family. When I think that she may go with some idiot through this shit, I get in panic, because I have no idea how to help her and what advise to give. Because in the so called "real life" I don't know myself how to make difference between truth and a lie. May be you can explain? Just from a man's point of view.

It is wrong to deceive women in this way, it's low and unfair. But nobody here is talking about that. The dynamics of club life and dating are much different. We aren't talking about tricks and fooling women... there is no fun in that, but rather playing the club game better than others. We still have to look at ourselves in the mirror the next day. - Then it's OK, because from what you wrote before I thought that you were not against using all sorts of tricks including false promises if they lead you to success. Now I see that I misunderstood you, and I'm glad that it's clear now, because it's never too pleasant to assume about someone like "-1 person" even if this person is just one of the forum posters.

Usually however, it's not even necessary to worry about it too much, as club and dating life have their own dynamics. It's not conventional dating.

Or how many girls met their future husband AT A CLUB? - I know some. You can meet anybody anywhere, you never know. People get acquainted at work, in the street, in gyms, in metro... It makes no difference. Pros usually marry clients. I know one old Night Flight pro, a former Intourist girl from the Soviet time. By the time of NF she was already around 45. When she was closer to 50 she married an NF client, English millionere who was during the same years mongering in NF. Almost every day they saw each other in action, then suddenly something changed ;) They live for about 5 or 6 years together by now and both look great and happy. I know many stories like that. Normal girls can meet normal guys anywhere, too. Even if the background of the story is strange the decent legends are created later, if needed.

No, most girls going there are not looking to meet the guy to spend the rest of their life with. They go there to have fun and if the mood is right, they MIGHT go home with someone. For us, it's all about being that someone. If it doesn't happen on the first night, it probably will on the second. It's about making that happen. - I think it doesn't work exactly the way: I search a husband or I search someone for one night. When you deal with emotions all can change any moment. You may find someone for a night, and the situation may seem to be not suitable for something serious, but you may suddenly fall in love with this person, after which you justify anything and all your logic disappears. Or the opposite, you may search someone for serious relationships, do all the proper things, and after a while you understand that things don't work out for you. Probably you understand it after the first night spent together =). But I think no matter how it happens, both parts each moment of any relationships must understand where they are, because when their views on this are different, it leads to problem.

Here you missed the point dear. We're saying sometimes it's easier to get all 4 girls by juggling them at the same time than it would be to get all 4 individually by concentrating on them. There is some truth in saying that SOME women are like cats... if you pay too much attention to them they run away... if you ignore them for awhile they jump on your lap and purr. - May be it depends on a woman. To me it's quite the opposite. I can get interested in a man only when I begin to think that he is a piece of my property. I have no time and desire to "deserve" attention of those who are not interested. I think it's not worth it. The more attention the man offers because of his own desire the better it is for our relationships. If the man sees good things in me and considers me special, I begin think that we probably have something in common, which makes him special, too. The more he cares about my comfort the more I care about his. If a man disappears for a while or doesn't respond sms in the proper time or becomes greedy, or something like that I begin to suspect that I'm not the only women in his life. If so, then probably his interest to me was not real, but a game. If so, it's very unsafe to invest my time and imotions in him. Because the longer you stay with someone, the more you get used to this person and the more pain you get if relationships break. If things don't correct after a short time, I just put a block on him and loose interest. Even if it's hard. I make myself to forget. But this is about long-term relationships.
With clients it's different, because they are absolutely free. I even dislike it when they cross the border and try to get in contact between appointments, because it make situation uncertain - is he trying to pretend a lover to save some money or what? :)
After what you wrote here I think may be there is a third type of relationships about which I don't know too much because I never was interested in it and never had it. May be there are really some women who search sex for entertainment and enjoy games and tricks. May be these tricks really give them a portion of adrenalin or something else (otherwise why whould they treat you better after tricks as you say?) May be if they really disliked tricks the way I do, they would also turn you off very soon, the way I would turn off any man who would try to play with my feelings, but if they stay by you for years, may be they feel fine. I think that the end of this discussion can be that we shouldn't generalize too much and say "all women, all men, most of them, everybody" ect. Because there are always parts of reality in which we are not experts ;)

Helana,
With your life experience you have to know that men are basically the same regardless of country of origin. We are all looking for a place to put our dicks. Methods used to achieve that goal are in no way different than methods women use to achieve their goals. Get real; anything else is fantasy or delusion.
Guido88

Guido, let’s not mix men with dicks on legs, OK?

Hecker

06-07-07, 14:19

[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]-

- I can get interested in a man only when I begin to think that he is a piece of my property.

What? The man piece of your property? The whole man or only his property?

How many more pieces does this property contain?

I don't think this constitutes any monger's dream.

==============================================

Greetings Hecker,

It appears that you inadverently forgot to correctly place the quote tags in this report. Usually I can fix this sort of thing before it's displayed, but I don't have a clue as to how you intended this report to appear.

The quote tags are simple to use, all you have to do is look for them in the text. Anything that you want to appear in quotes must start with "[quote]" and end with "[/quote ]". It's that simple.

In addition, you can preview your report before it's posted, so it's easy to check if you got it right before it's displayed in The Forum.

Thanks,

Jackson

Gentleman Travel

06-07-07, 15:38

A very interesting discussion, and I thank Helena for her valuable insights.
Clearly we all approach this issue from our own points of view and personal experiences.
We all live in somewhat different worlds.

Helena's original point - the party is over boys, the girls don't need you so much anymore - seems valid; many mongers have made it before.

But no matter how dramatic the changes in Russia are, surely there is still a large pool of young women being left behind by Putin's economic miracle. Girls trying to get by on ordinary workers wages in an increasingly expensive Moscow. In fact, they see all these bright baubles and fun lifestyles becoming more widespread, but still beyond their reach...

And surely Russian men are not getting any nicer to them - sure now many have more money, but that just means they can afford more girls. So foreigner men still offer a change, if not an escape, from this. And there are still a lot more pretty Russian women than rich Russian men, and they have to do something on a Saturday night...

But I think the biggest "trick" that some of the main mongers here are talking about is simply adopting the right attitude - that of master rather than supplicant. Helena, you have no idea how far western society has moved into being "pussy whipped" - which in itself would be more acceptable if the quantity and quality of pussy was higher. But here, we can "have it all" - marriage, mortgage, munchkins, mother-in-law - and still get no sex!!

So the "bad boy" attitude being espoused is really just about ditching the "pathetic nice guy/loser" persona we struggle with. Sure, bring on dinners and flowers and little treats - but let the woman know she is not the only game in town. The iron fist in a velvet glove. It is a simple matter of not being taken for granted. I don't think this dynamic is unique to Russian women, it is just easier and clearer and more worthwhile to practice it there.

Understanding this concept, and stopping being such a wimp has vastly improved my own domestic situation - since learning to "lay down the law" I get three times as much sex and twice the quality as I did a year ago.
That is not going to stop me from screwing around in Russia whenever I get a chance, after all I have many years of sexual poverty to make up for!

-
May be there are really some women who search sex for entertainment and enjoy games and tricks. May be these tricks really give them a portion of adrenalin or something else (otherwise why whould they treat you better after tricks as you say?)

I don't think that is really the kind girl we are talking about, although no doubt such girls exist. We are talking about ordinary girls who need to be reminded that what they have is valuable, but not priceless or irreplacable.

The photo below shows us the face of evil that must be defeated, a wooden dildo driven through her hearst, so that men can be men and sex can be fun again ...

Hecker

06-08-07, 13:52

The whole man, of course. I think long-term relationships (and I spoke this about long-term relationships, read better, please, not about mongers) are a always somewhat about ownship. When you really like someone you want to make sure that this person belongs to you, and you also want to belong to this person. At best cases you want to belong to each other till the end of life. I consider that all my family, for example, belongs to me, and I belong to my family. It doesn't mean that we are slaves of each other, but it means that our relationships are solid, no matter what happens, we are parts of each others life. If they are happy, I'm happy, too. If not, this is also my problem. I care so much about them, because I believe that they will not disappear from my life, that I also mean something for them, and that they will stay with me forever. What I can do for them I will never do for a stranger or for any person about whose attitude I have doubts. And what do you personally have against property? Don't you, for example, take care of your own house? Would you take care of the house which belongs to somebody esle and never to you? On what conditions would you take care of somebody else's house? Of course, people are not houses or things, but in general this principal works. At least I know many people who think and live the same way. There are others, of course. The ones who say: I don't belong to anybody, I'm absolutely free, I'm not obliged to anybody, I will not give anything to anybody, which finally ends in "just give me what I want without expecting anything in return", and finally "give me what I want no matter what it cost you and get out". Is this in your opinion a mongers dream?Actually I believe this is a monger's dream. But it is totally unrealistic in the real world. So you have to compromise and give something. And I believe mongers offer a lot more to women than many men without any skills at all who try to appear as super ethical and exploit situations to their own purpose. Real mongers do not use marriage agencies, do not promise marriages and do not say I am a serious person with values etc, etc. These are done by the weak ethicisits who have no other way to achieve sth. And their best allies are the femi-nazis whose purpose is that men will fall and get rejected by fat, unattractive, rude women who also appear as superethical.

Hopefully feminism has not penetrated deep into slavic culture and we enjoy some freedom. This is due to the great attitude of slavic men who refuse to comply to the exacerbated demands of women and treat them like they should. Western culture has made women divine and turned them not easily approachable.

So slavic women yes, they can be part of our lives since they have such an easy going attitude. And more men should imitate the example of slavic men to teach western women some precious lessons.

I disagreed about the whole idea of ownage. To own and to be owned is a distinct part of western culture. Men try to own women and women try to own men. Where does it lead? To noone being satisfied, everybody quarreling and being angry. On the opposite hand Slavs seem to have not big problem to share even girls. So they are more happy and manage to get what they want.

Doctor_Skank

06-08-07, 18:34

The whole man, of course. I think long-term relationships (and I spoke this about long-term relationships, read better, please, not about mongers) are a always somewhat about ownship. When you really like someone you want to make sure that this person belongs to you, and you also want to belong to this person. At best cases you want to belong to each other till the end of life. I consider that all my family, for example, belongs to me, and I belong to my family. It doesn't mean that we are slaves of each other, but it means that our relationships are solid, no matter what happens, we are parts of each others life. If they are happy, I'm happy, too. If not, this is also my problem. I care so much about them, because I believe that they will not disappear from my life, that I also mean something for them, and that they will stay with me forever. What I can do for them I will never do for a stranger or for any person about whose attitude I have doubts. And what do you personally have against property? Don't you, for example, take care of your own house? Would you take care of the house which belongs to somebody esle and never to you? On what conditions would you take care of somebody else's house? Of course, people are not houses or things, but in general this principal works. At least I know many people who think and live the same way. There are others, of course. The ones who say: I don't belong to anybody, I'm absolutely free, I'm not obliged to anybody, I will not give anything to anybody, which finally ends in "just give me what I want without expecting anything in return", and finally "give me what I want no matter what it cost you and get out". Is this in your opinion a mongers dream?

I think many men (and obviously women) would agree with your assessment about the kind of unconditional love you describe. Most people feel this way about their family and any good parent certainly feels this way about their children.

But men, at least the men I know and most certainly the majority of mongers and ISG readers, despise the word property in the context of relationships. In fact, it's one of the reasons we monger in the first place, to express our freedom to be men.

In our view, marriage is a control mechanism. Men have almost nothing to gain from it.

The women's fidelity is not guaranteed by marriage.
The tax benefits are minimal and less every year.

Perhaps marriage is good for a man's career... married men are deemed more trustworthy and "solid" for some reason... and it is certainly good for the children, which is the only reason to marry in the first place as far as I am concerned.

But in every other aspect, it seems negative for us men, at least in western society.

By marrying, you sign away anywhere from 30-50% of your income FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIFE. Even if the women is an evil, deceiving wench, she has you by the balls. This in itself is reason enough for men to be suspicious of Russian wives, who are reputed to be money-hungry and conniving by some. My personal experience with most Russian women and "real" girlfriends has NOT been this way, but I've never married one either.

By marrying, you are expected socially and in some cases even LEGALLY to remain faithful to one woman, to never again sleep with another woman, never again experience ultimate intimacy with another female. That's an unbearable and inhuman sacrifice for some of us. It goes against our nature. It's like caging a panther.

By marrying, you'll be expected to spend every holiday with one single woman, to express every affectionate emotion to a female to her and only her and to accept any of the bullshit she dishes out.

Say the word "own" or "property" around our breed of men and you'll never see us again.

We're wolves. We'd rather chew off our own paw than be stuck in a trap.

Ultimately I harbor romance in my heart and believe that there is THE woman out there for me. If the word "own" or "property" is mentioned however, even if in some context it may be well-meant, I start looking for a way out.

Women hate this attitude in some men... and every monger I've personally met feels this way... just as we hate the idea of every being owned by someone.

Imperfect world.

Doctor_Skank

06-09-07, 00:50

- She sais it's much better to have this perfect and honest paid companion than have an unperfect and dishonest companion for free, which she had a lot in the "real" life. At least everybody knows what he gets and what gives.

That's why we use pros even though we don't "have" to. There is something refreshingly simple and honest about it.

- You know, in Russia during the past 15 years things mixed so much that we already can't say what normal people do and what they don't. The point is that normal people do use pros, normal people do marry pros, normal people do become pros, and pros become normal people, as well as their clients. Im complaining, as you call it, because after the years of escorting I'm getting really sick and tired of clients who try to pretend that they want to build relationships when their real goal is to get a discount for sex (which they never get though). Every week I turn away 1 or 2 clients who try to play the same trick.

I can imagine. And I really respect pros for some of the shit they have to put up with too. Some pros can be such emotionally, humanly strong individuals.

A lot of pros do give discounts to regulars, especially if they work for agencies. At the end of the day, they still get their cut.

-More or less we can handle it. But it makes me absolutely mad that tricks are also played on normal young girls who are not pros. Because I have a wonderful younger sister, who as every normal girl wants to find a nice guy, to fall in love and to have real beautiful relationships leading to a family. When I think that she may go with some idiot through this shit, I get in panic, because I have no idea how to help her and what advise to give.

That is a difficult question. Normally you'd tell her to follow her heart... but you never know where that will lead. Could lead to disaster or heartbreak, some guy she met on holiday, some "player" she met at a club. But do not think you'll understand what she needs.

I told this story before, but it's relevant. I met this 18 year old virgin online, a pretty girl. She actually contacted me first. We first met at Pyramida and she was nervous as young girls often are. We talked and I realized (or thought) what an innocent creature she was. I told her, WARNED her not to believe what men said and not to think that attraction to the exotic (foreign men) was the basis for a long term relationship. I gave her every chance to leave or "escape". I knew she was a virgin (it was somehow written all over her face) and didn't want to abuse my position. Moral of the story is that we went to my apartment, I kissed her and we had sex about 20 minutes later.

SHE wanted it even more than I did. Who knows what is going through your sister's head. Curiousity and excitement is a powerful drug.

BTW, I still communicate with the Virgin and she seems well-adjusted. Girls get their sexual experience somewhere. The first, second or tenth one doesn't have to be "the One".

I honestly believe that some short-term relationships can be more valuable and honest than some long-term ones. It's all relative to the situation, the need.

-
I have no time and desire to "deserve" attention of those who are not interested. I think it's not worth it. The more attention the man offers because of his own desire the better it is for our relationships. If the man sees good things in me and considers me special, I begin think that we probably have something in common, which makes him special, too. The more he cares about my comfort the more I care about his. If a man disappears for a while or doesn't respond sms in the proper time or becomes greedy, or something like that I begin to suspect that I'm not the only women in his life. If so, then probably his interest to me was not real, but a game.

Could also be that through your experience you have a different perspective than other women. You've screwed hundreds of guys... most girls have less than 10. It's often really surprising to me how desperate some women are for attention and affection... and even more surprising is how beautiful these women sometimes are. You have more experience... you know what you want. Many girls just want experience, passion and fun in their lives. They come from all walks of life, all social strata.

- May be if they really disliked tricks the way I do, they would also turn you off very soon, the way I would turn off any man who would try to play with my feelings, but if they stay by you for years, may be they feel fine. I think that the end of this discussion can be that we shouldn't generalize too much and say "all women, all men, most of them, everybody" ect. Because there are always parts of reality in which we are not experts ;)

I will never claim to be an expert. It's so much more fun being a student.

- because I have no idea how to help her and what advise to give. Because in the so called "real life" I don't know myself how to make difference between truth and a lie. May be you can explain? Just from a man's point of view.

That's a fundemental question, and perhaps impossible to answer. I think for me truth is a decision I can live with, meaning I can look at myself in the mirror and be happy with what I see.

Truth is being true to your nature.

Truth is something beyond logic, tangible yet inexplicable.

Truth can be a one-night stand just as much as a 3-year relationship. If your heart is in it, it is true.

Ffmbud

06-09-07, 04:48

Perhaps a separate topic should be set up called "dialogues with Helena", instead of taking up space on the Moscow board. This stream is getting rather boring and it isn't much about Moscow is it?

Helena Moscow

06-09-07, 15:22

Real mongers do not use marriage agencies, do not promise marriages and do not say I am a serious person with values etc, etc. These are done by the weak ethicisits who have no other way to achieve sth.
. - Wow, you have some principles. You didn't say this before.

Say the word "own" or "property" around our breed of men and you'll never see us again. – Seems to be an easy way to control bullshit in the “real life”. I’ll tell my sister ;) Thanks.

I will never claim to be an expert. It's so much more fun being a student.
- Wonderful words. Makes life feel fresh ;)

Perhaps a separate topic should be set up called "dialogues with Helena", instead of taking up space on the Moscow board. This stream is getting rather boring and it isn't much about Moscow is it? – Don’t like, don’t read. Offer your own topic. May be someone will want to discuss it. It’s quite about Moscow. We are all here.

Ash1001

06-10-07, 15:04

But here [in the West], we can "have it all" - marriage, mortgage, munchkins, mother-in-law - and still get no sex!!

The simple fact is, the rules are heavily stacked in the women's favour. This isn't a Russian/Western thing, just a feature of our evolutionary history. Men are simple souls; we seek sex from attractive young women, full stop. Women exploit this basic drive to secure control, money, gifts, romance, attention and often their entire financial future. This all falls under the banner of a 'relationship', which a man must provide unquestioningly to be considered a nice decent guy and not a womanising SOB. Our Judeo-Christian system of morality is also to blame. Sex for its own sake is BAD and must be sanctified by marriage, being a provider, a good father/husband/doormat etc.

It's clear that in the West it's game over. We've already lost. Women have as much money as us and are spending it on Big Macs and beer rather than manicures. In the FSU, the game's still on, because Russian men are still real men and refuse to be pussy whipped. Imagine a job advert for a secretary who must be a "slim attractive brunette, 170cm". Pretty much par for the course in Moscow, but try that in New York and you'll be in jail.

So, here are some facts:

1. Men always make the approach, women always say 'yes' or 'no' depending on their mood or how much they need the next bill paid. Nothing about that will ever change. Men are the risk takers.

2. Men ALWAYS pay for EVERYTHING. No ifs, no buts. I occasionally insist that a girl pays for the odd coffee or bus ticket but beyond that you supply the $$$.

3. The above in no way restricts what she does and with whom when she's not with you. After all, it's not your wallet then.

4. Grown women think it's perfectly acceptable to pout and simper when they want a present bought for them. Acting like a cute 5 year old is not beneath them.

5. Without exception, a woman will want to marry you for your money and social position. If she's attractive she'll have enough opportunity to meet and have casual affairs with men who are fun, interesting, handsome, good at sex etc. and doesn't need to sacrifice HER freedom just for that. It's $$$ that makes the trade worthwhile for her.

Have you ever seen a couple on their wedding day? The bride is beaming, ecstatic. This is totally the end of her problems. And the look on the guy's face just says: "Shit, what the hell am I doing? This is the end of my freedom, my batchelorhood, the real me". The most classic example of this was the Prince Charles/Lady Di union.

6. Marriage agencies: most guys are stunned by the array of gorgeous young women pouring out their romantic longings to them. Assuming you don't actually get scammed and send $500 to a young lovely who needs English lessons or has a sick grandmother - what's actually going on here? From you, Mr Westerner, they want a Visa - that golden document that will enable them to leave their desparate hole forever and be in a place where they can fully realise their market value.

Play your cards right and use these girls as a resource. By being on a site like that, they've asked for it. Just don't bring them back to your home town where they'll quickly decide that they've married a loser because you don't have a mansion or drive a Ferrari.

I haven't had the pleasure of being married to - and divorced from - that 'special' lady who after x years of defining and controlling my life decides that she can enjoy my money and property better without me actually being in the way. But it's one I'll forgo.

Hell, what I really need is:

1) A good cook

2) A reliable housekeeper

3) Great hoes, whether from marriage sites, nightclubs, agencies or the redoubtable NF, CF and RP. There are many in the FSU, and you don't need to marry any of them. There are hoes/users in the West too, but either not very good looking, OR insanely overpriced.

If you're really totally desperate to reproduce yourself, knock up some provincial gal in the poorer parts of the FSU and send her $100 a month. It's cost effective fatherhood.

Be clear and honest with *yourself* and you'll never be gamed. That, and only that, should be the mongers' code. We're dealing with sharp, wily girls here who have been trained from the age of about 7 to use their charms to meet their financial objectives. Just look at the reality of the actual deal you're getting and what you're paying for it.

Guido88

06-10-07, 23:26

Ash 1001

Very eloquently phrased and directly on target. The Russian girls can and will take good care of themselves.

Good move on your part not to join the 50% club (Marriage).

Guido88

Eros74

06-10-07, 23:55

Great Ash1001!

I am sure Helena will never agree with you ;) but you wrote golden words and I think almost everybody agree with you, included me!

I never thought seriously to marry...actually even less...

Cheers!

Helena Moscow

06-11-07, 00:27

To Ash1001

- It's funny to read how scary we are, as if your mother wasn't a woman ;) I saw many weddings with both people happy. It's not a favour for a woman, we think it's more comfortable for a man. By the way, we don't get so much of men's property from it in Russia (unfortunately).

Bez Bezarra

06-11-07, 03:37

Our perspectives vary greatly because western norms have changed so drastically in the last 100 and even 50 years.

American women and their intolerable attitudes have motivated mongers to invest our time, energy, and resources into global exploration.

The expats get the best outlook and benefit from their investment of time, and can fine tune their game to a sharp honed edge, slicing and dicing their way through the foreign pussy like a samurai sword through KY jelly.

Gentleman Travel

06-11-07, 17:54

Have you ever seen a couple on their wedding day? The bride is beaming, ecstatic. This is totally the end of her problems. And the look on the guy's face just says: "Shit, what the hell am I doing? This is the end of my freedom, my batchelorhood, the real me".

Q: Why does the bride always smile at her wedding?
A: She has given her last blow-job!

Seriously Ash, I don't really agree with you (or most of the others here) that marriage is such a bad and one-sided deal.

However, it does baffle me that so many married women ignore the sex needs of their husbands. What do they think is going to happen? And really, aside from some of you who are real addicts or adventurers, it is ridiculously easy to please a man and keep him satisfied - wouldn't you agree Helena?

To my mind, this is what is appealing (in theory) about a long-term relationship with an FSU woman. I think they understand a little better about keeping their man happy and the dangers of aging ungracefully. They have seen what happens to women who fail to deliver in bed.... at least until they are fully westernized and realize that the game is different here...

Ash1001

06-12-07, 00:51

Q: Why does the bride always smile at her wedding?
A: She has given her last blow-job!

Which raises one vitally important point: a woman is always at her best when she thinks that proposal, the ring on her finger, is just round the corner. What can she do to make him pop the question? Something REALLY special... ;)

Keep them dangling guys.

Helena Moscow

06-12-07, 22:03

However, it does baffle me that so many married women ignore the sex needs of their husbands. What do they think is going to happen? And really, aside from some of you who are real addicts or adventurers, it is ridiculously easy to please a man and keep him satisfied - wouldn't you agree Helena?

Dear Gentleman Travel, I agree with you totally. I will tell you more: I don't understand why some husbands ignore their wives sex needs. What do they think is going to happen? I think it's about both people being satisfied, happy and adventurous. Just have no idea why it works out so seldom in all sorts of permanent relationships. But I still hope and search ;) A naive Russian girl you may think...

Ash1001

06-12-07, 23:48

By the way, we don't get so much of men's property from it in Russia (unfortunately).

That's why Roman Abramovich divorced Irina in Russia :)

I think he actually got a very good deal with her. She married him before he made his stash. She does seem like a very decent person.

Himself

06-13-07, 22:43

Ash, Gent Travel, Bez

Let's admit (at least to ourselves) how life is:

There are only to kind of males:

1. The ones who are married, working day and night, and having a wife consuming the outcome

2. The other ones who are divorced, working day and night, and having the ex-wife consuming the outcome

(ok may be there is the third catagory:
3. The other ones who are married again, working day and night, and having the both the wife and ex-wife consuming the outcome)

Marriage is the strangest contract in the world: You agree that half of all you have you give to a woman, and in addition to this you agree that half of all you earn in the future you also agree to give in case the contract is terminated, even if the female part terminate the contract....

.... and why:

because God made a serious design error: He (he is still a he!) did not fill engough blood into us to run our brain and an erected penis at the same time (an old joke but true...)

himself (again)

Alfifi

06-14-07, 05:50

I am going the first time to Russia, to Moscow and our partner made a reservation at the Holiday Inn Suschevsky in Moscow.

I would like to know, is there some action arround this hotel, and if there is, where exactly. Please let me know if you had any kind of experience over there.

Thank you

Gentleman Travel

06-14-07, 14:32

Dear Gentleman Travel, I agree with you totally. I will tell you more: I don't understand why some husbands ignore their wives sex needs.

Fortunately, we are here to help those under-serviced ladies!
If you can just post a list of their names and phone #s please!

Samsarai

06-16-07, 16:10

Hi Guys,

I will be in Moscow from June 26th to 29th. Staying at EuroCity Hotel.

Could you please give advices on where to find a WG or a CG to bring back in my hotel room for a good price (not more than 100 € for the night).

I do not speak russian.

Which place / Street to go? Trustable taxi drivers?

Nice brothels in the Center with girls to take out?

Best web links for english speaking privates?

Phone numbers?

Thanks

Russia Fan

06-17-07, 08:08

I’Ve not seen this topic often mentioned on this site, but would appreciate some input from the Moscow cognoscenti here on, what I consider to be, an important mongering tactical question.

Where to take girls for a first date? I am assuming that the girl in question is more likely not to be a pro, rather a girl met on the street, in a club or even on a dating site (although I might still go with a pro for dinner beforehand).

Maybe my whole approach is flawed here, maybe the question itself is wrong, but I have the mindset that a reasonably stylish restaurant with low-lighting together with a few cocktails provides a nice starting point for what should hopefully turn out to be a wonderfully debauched evening. As I am over 40 and not often mistaken for Tom Cruise, I feel the need to get these things right.

Now, on the one hand, any halfway attractive Russian girl having a first date with a foreigner will be hoping he is not poor and the choice of restaurant provides a certain signal. Of course, it is easy to impress but there are so many rip-off restaurants around that this is probably badly invested cash (a meal and drinks alone in some of these places, often $150-200 and more, will provide hours of entertainment with some of the pros here). Going to a really cheap lowlife place (which Tom could get away with) will puncture the aura of wealth.

So, the challenge is to identify those little diamonds which offer the right level of style and ambience but at realistic prices which for me should preferably be $100 or less. .

Where do you guys go? What do the girls here think?

It Travel

06-17-07, 12:55

Golfplayer

06-17-07, 14:40

My opinion is that for 100 € night you can get the expences to try to get to bed a normal girl... At 100 €, or 130 $ you can't even get an oldie in central Moscow!!!

ITOk, then there still is the tochka possibility.

Here is what I copy-pasted from other posts/sources on tochkas:

Go to a tochka. Just hail a cab at 10-12 pm from around Sukharevskaya Metro and say "Mojne py-dyohm - tochka - chatersta rublay" - which translates into - take me to the *****s and then take me and the ***** back to my hotel and I'll give you 13-14 bucks. Or go to the one in the Alekseevskaya underpass under Prospect Mira near Cafe Mu Mu and Collins and the metro station. Mark Ames of the Exile always seems to mention a tochka at Leninsky and one at Leningradsky prospekt. Whatever. Girls are in 3 categories - 70, 100 and 150. All for the night. Generally the 70 dollar girls are dogs, the 100 dollar girls can be cute but are usually average and all 18-19ish and the 150 dollar girls are fairly hot - almost Night Flight category but new in town. Few if any will speak English.

There will be this woman called a Mammuchka (Mamma-san) and she'll ask you how much you want to spend. You can say, for examle, sto dollariv (100 bucks) and she'll say "devushki, devushki sto dollariv, py-ee-tee" and a gaggle of girls will step forward for you to pick from. Here it's good to know "na lyeva" (on the left) "na prava" (on the right) and "sledooshie" (next) and "vot eta" - (there - that one.) You'll then hand off the cash - usually 100 bucks plus a 100 ruble tip for the woman (she doesn't run the show, the pimps and cops do) and the cab driver will ask "Dokuda cechas" (where to now), and you'll say "gostinitsa, pajalusta" (hotel please - helps to include a name) You pay after you get out of the cab.

If it seems too intimidating, there are some good web sites in Russian that don't charge the rates this 33 whatever guy is charging. www.translate.ru can help with the translation. My personal favorite these days is www.pikant.ru but here are others -

www.pikant.ru
www.omen.ru
www.otsos.ru
www.publichouse.ru
www.dosug.nu
www.prostitutki.ru

to find local girls servicing the locals from apartments (not from tochka) get a copy of znakomstvo in the metro. u have 2 ask 4 it specially, they keep it hidden behind newspapers. this mag has girls operating from apartments. u can find 8s 9s and 10s if u r willing to call on the phone and get the directions to their apartment. a few words of russian to be nice then u can speak english if u want (dobrii dyen, mozhno po angliiski?). take a cab. spend about 80 - 100 usd u will be glad u did.

Tochka means "point" and is essentially Moscow's form of street prostitution. The tochkas (actually tochki) are organised by the mafia (there's your mafia if you are really looking for it) and are conducted nightly from about dusk til dawn. There can be numerous tochkas all over the city, anywhere from the outskirts to the center.

For example, you will usually find tochkas on Leninsky prospekt, Leningradsky prospekt, behind the "3 train stations", on the Garden Ring, Mira Prospekt, near Lubyanka etc. They aren't confined to a single place and can often be in the same place for a few days or weeks, or move nightly. There is no way you can just "go to a tochka" that is at a particular place. You will have to take a taxi.

Finding tochkas:

Take a taxi as stated above. The best time to look is after about 9pm, that's when most girls show up for duty. When you flag down a taxi, ask him to take you to a tochka. Either he will say ok and try and drive you around until he finds one, or he will refuse and drive away. Some people dont want to take you there because of the danger of the police stopping them. The police often hang around known tochka areas hoping to stop your car and get a bribe. Before you go on a tochka tour, make sure your docs are in order, including your visa registration. Some drivers, particularly older ones, may be offended by your request or simply not know what you mean or where to go. If you cant find a taxi, you may pick up a taxi in front of CF (Boarhouse), which is across from Kursky train station. The drivers there will charge you more, but they will also know where to go.

The driver will drive on the road to those areas where he thinks he might find a tochka, usually the areas I mentioned above, Leninsky prospekt, Leningradsky prospekt, behind the "3 train stations", on the Garden Ring, Mira Prospekt, near Lubyanka etc. There he will see a woman standing along side the road seeking eye contact with drivers. She is the "beacon girl". He will stop in front of her and she will tell him which way to drive to find the tochka. Usually it is in a back alley or side street near her. Then the driver will drive to the area and you will see a mamachka (madam who organises the girls) and probably some other customers. Often there will be a few vans parked nearby in which the girls wait for customers. In the summer the girls may be milling about outside.

Viewing the menu:

Once there, you will have to talk to the mamachka. It definitely helps to speak at least basic Russian, don't expect her to speak English. She will tell you the prices at that particular tochka and ask you which girls you want to see. The prices may be in rubles or dollars.

Lately the prices are as follows:
$100 (3000 rubles): entry level girls, usually pretty skanky, 4-6 in quality
$150 (4500 rubles): mid-level girls, 6-7 in quality, occasional gems
$200 (6000 rubles): so-called top girls, 6-8 in quality

Sometimes there are $80 (2500 rubles) categories (really skanky) or even $250 (7500 rubles) categories.

Price for a particular girl may vary depending on time of day and particularly day of the week. For example a $100 girl may go for $150 on a Saturday night or a $200 girl for $150 on a Monday night etc. Generally Monday-Wednesday are my favorite nights in terms of price and selection, since there is less competition.

After you tell the mamachka which category you want, she will yell out loud "$100" or "4500 rubles" or whatever and the girls will line up in front of the car.

The size of the tochka also varies, from 1 girl to 50. On average there are about 10 girls in each category.

After making your selection, you pay the mamachka, wait for your girl to arrive and leave.

You should select wisely and pay attention to details. Of course it is at night, but try to get a look at her body (she will open her coat if you tell her to do so), look at her teeth or whatever. If nothing is available, you may go to another tochka.

Driving to the apartment or hotel:

This is the "fun part", as the police do prowl the streets looking to stop cars with tochka girls and their customers. Some tochkas are in cahoots with the police and may set you up. If you are stopped, remain calm. You are in no physical danger. It is all about a bribe. They will examine your docs and if all is ok leave you alone. They will probably find a problem with her docs, as she is probably not from Moscow and may not even be Russian, instead being from Ukraine, Moldava or Belarus. If they take her back to the squad car or say she must go to station you can either let her go (and lose your money) or bribe the cops. It should cost between ($20-50) 500-1500 rubles "straff".

If you make it back to the hotel or apartment ok (90% of the time you will not be stopped) you are home free.

Paying the taxi:

The taxi should get between 500-700 rubles for his services, depending on the length of your tour and how many tochkas were visited.

The deal:

The girl is yours until about 8am the next day, as much sex as you want or can handle. Normally they will kiss and give great GFE. Anal is an option, but up to her. Money talks.