Kyiv

[QUOTE=Russel4339;1932760]You can also buy the Indian version of Viagra in most pharmacies in the Ukraine. It is called Konagra and is (I think) about 200 UAH for (4) 50 MG tablets. 100 MG tablets are slightly more.

It is safe and effective using the same sildenafil citrate recipe as viagra. I have found that it works just the same as effectively.[/QUOTE]Taking Ukrainian medicine? Urrgs, is this safe?

[QUOTE=Stevie69;1931483]

Ukrainian girls are turned on by decisive, dominant men. Typical modern western men, who are submissive and accommodating, are viewed as weak. [/QUOTE]So true. The more accommodating you are, the more you have opened yourself to manipulation.

[QUOTE=Riina;1933065]So true. The more accommodating you are, the more you have opened yourself to manipulation.[/QUOTE]What does it mean for a first meeting? I western Europe I am always charming, opening the door, asking what the woman wants to eat and drink, listen to her, do not interrupt her, etc.

Would I have to act differently in Ukraine? Can you please describe?

[QUOTE=MichiT;1933094]What does it mean for a first meeting? I western Europe I am always charming, opening the door, asking what the woman wants to eat and drink, listen to her, do not interrupt her, etc.

Would I have to act differently in Ukraine? Can you please describe?[/QUOTE]No! You do not have to act differently. Here's an example of what I'm talking about. On my first trip to Kiev, I contacted a girl from Mamba. She told me that we can meet at three. Three rolls around and texts me she needs twenty minutes more, then forty five minutes more, and on and on. I sat in my apartment for hours like a complete douche. Girls are always running late but the maximum flexibility should of been one hour before canceling. As simple as this is, I try to remember it in more complicated situations.

Every individual girl has to be evaluated. The more beautiful and experienced, the more manipulation you can expect. I like the college age GND's, it just seems to stay more honest.

[QUOTE=MichiT;1933094]Would I have to act differently in Ukraine? Can you please describe?[/QUOTE]Act like local guys. If your upbringing and cultural background won't allow you to sink that low, imagine how would our most famous gentleman James Bond act in your situation. He definitely doesn't get pushed around by women, or anybody.

[QUOTE=JonathanPine;1933102]Act like local guys. If your upbringing and cultural background won't allow you to sink that low, imagine how would our most famous gentleman James Bond act in your situation. He definitely doesn't get pushed around by women, or anybody.[/QUOTE]Haha, I like that one. So, I will give her money back for bus transport, I will pay for her separate hotel room, I will invite her for dinner and breakfast next day and if she does not want to kiss or let me touch her, I will send her back home immediately without paying for transport back. Or may I even tell her "I paid for transport, accommodation, etc, so I expect some sex? In my culture, that would be unfriendly, but you suggest to act like a local.

[QUOTE=MichiT;1932894]Taking Ukrainian medicine? Urrgs, is this safe?[/QUOTE]Konagra is produced in India and has good reviews worldwide.

There is also a Russian version called "Potential". It is about half the price of Kongra. However, even I am not brave enough to trust Russian pharmaceuticals (especially in Ukraine).

[QUOTE=MichiT;1933094]What does it mean for a first meeting? I western Europe I am always charming, opening the door, asking what the woman wants to eat and drink, listen to her, do not interrupt her, etc.

Would I have to act differently in Ukraine? Can you please describe?[/QUOTE]If this is not a professional lady, by all means treat her like a woman would like to be treated (open the door for her, carry any bag for her, etc.). However, be decisive when it comes to decision making. Know where you are going to go for dinner and tell her (don't ask her). Don't take her advice on every time it is given. Take her hand when you want to (don't wait for that "perfect moment" Pay without hesitation and tip well (for the Ukraine). Take charge in restaurants and other situations (although this can be hard with limited language skills). All of these things show you to be in control, successful, and "manly".

But just to have a expensive dinner, give good tips etc. All of these are fine, but by the end of the day NO guarantee for a bang if she isn't a pro.

LMR is very wide spread among Russians / Ukrainians.

First, have backup plans in case it doesn't workout with this 39 year old woman. You don't want to be stranded in Kiev by yourself. Before you go, arrange for plan be, see, the,.

Second, don't pre pay her hotel room yet. Yon can book it, but don't pay for it yet.

Thirdly, take her for a walk, maybe to a cafe, you'll need to know that she's genuine before you take her to an expensive restaurant.

Locals guys wouldn't simply take some girls to expensive restaurants without first having a sponsorship deal. No sex, no expensive dinner!

Just because you can afford a nice dinner doesn't mean you should. If you do that in Ukraine without demanding sex in return, she'll lose all respect for you.

It's a fucked up mentality I know. But you need to play hard ball with them. I learned it the hard way. Someone, I think it's Riina on the board says that if you accommodate them, you'll open yourself up for manipulation. Very well said. I'll also add that if you accommodate them, you'll bring out their worst behavior.

Treat them like dogs, if they lick your dick. Then you throw them a bone. If they don't play ball, kick them to the curb. Punish them. Now before anybody accuses me of being a *******, I can tell you I'm anything but. It's just the dynamics between local men and women. You must play hard ball with them. No mercy, make no exceptions. The only language they understand is strength.

And don't worry about offending them. Trust me, they're used to this treatment from local guys and expecting it from you. If you don't do it, they'll think you're a fool and will only try to extract money from you without fucking you.

Be tough, Michi! Now go score one for the team!

[QUOTE=MichiT;1933094]What does it mean for a first meeting? I western Europe I am always charming, opening the door, asking what the woman wants to eat and drink, listen to her, do not interrupt her, etc.

Would I have to act differently in Ukraine? Can you please describe?[/QUOTE]Hi Mitchi,

Before you start with anything else. You didn't mention kissing her hand at your first meeting, looking straight into her eyes and in a sexy voice tell her.

"— after all, one must start somewhere" LOL.

I am into only young girls.

I've been here 6 days already, but I haven't found anything that excites me in the up to $100 range!

Only average looking girls next door types around this price range, usually short, small built, too thin, a bit overweight or big built, nothing comes close to standard model figure; so no sex for me yet.

If I have to shell out more than that or have sex with averaging looking girls, I might as well just stay home, where things are better and cheaper.

If I were a sex tourist here (which I am not) , I wouldn't have stayed, and would not come back because there are better pastures elsewhere.

Kiev this year is definitely worse than last year, price wise and quality wise, IMHO.

You may think you get a better deal because of the better exchange rate, but you are WRONG! The girls, especially the better looking ones quote prices in dollars or Euros, 100 $, 200 $.

Lots of agencies pretend to be girls, bait and switch. You've got to be really careful.

For people who want quick P 4 P, pros seem to be the only viable option this year unless you are into old be's, women in their 40's and up; so you might as well go elsewhere, where the pastures are greener.

Don't even mention all the scams that are going around as many have pointed out on this forum.

Think about it for a moment: Is it worth the time, money and the trouble to come here to Kiev for sex?

Good luck to you all. (Blink).

I fully agree. It is hard for us, given our background, to act that way. We have been taught to respect women too much. Whereas that might be necessary at the workplace or with strangers, but not when you are in a relationship, long or short. When you get to the bedroom, even more so, particularly for Eastern European Women. Western women are too brainwashed by feminism, and even if they enjoy the private time, might regret it the next day, or week, or year. Read up on the trial of Ghomeshi in Canada. The guy liked rough sex, and the girls liked it, until they talked with their girlfriends and reasserted their feminist ideals. Luckily, he persevered in court, but lost his job, and lost his status in society.

[URL]http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/jian-ghomeshi-judge-ruling-1.3504250[/URL]

Anyway, back to Ukrainian girls, I never mistreat them, but I am decisive outside the bedroom and certainly dominant in the bedroom. It is the only way they will give you good sex. So, do not be rude, but do not be a pushover either. They actually appreciate a polite but forceful man; for them it is a break from the Ukrainian assholes they usually meet.

[QUOTE=JonathanPine;1933562]First, have backup plans in case it doesn't workout with this 39 year old woman. You don't want to be stranded in Kiev by yourself. Before you go, arrange for plan be, see, the,.

Second, don't pre pay her hotel room yet. Yon can book it, but don't pay for it yet.

Thirdly, take her for a walk, maybe to a cafe, you'll need to know that she's genuine before you take her to an expensive restaurant.

Locals guys wouldn't simply take some girls to expensive restaurants without first having a sponsorship deal. No sex, no expensive dinner!

Just because you can afford a nice dinner doesn't mean you should. If you do that in Ukraine without demanding sex in return, she'll lose all respect for you...[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Uoykucf;1933904]Kiev this year is definitely worse than last year, price wise and quality wise, IMHO.

You may think you get a better deal because of the better exchange rate, but you are WRONG! The girls, especially the better looking ones quote prices in dollars or Euros, 100 $, 200 $.

Lots of agencies pretend to be girls, bait and switch. You've got to be really careful.

For people who want quick P 4 P, pros seem to be the only viable option this year unless you are into old be's, women in their 40's and up; so you might as well go elsewhere, where the pastures are greener.

Don't even mention all the scams that are going around as many have pointed out on this forum.

Think about it for a moment: Is it worth the time, money and the trouble to come here to Kiev for sex?

Good luck to you all. (Blink).[/QUOTE]Yeah, sadly it's become a pervasive business model of throwing shit on the wall and hoping for something to stick by the agencies. Quality girls nowadays have enough local sponsorship opportunities by guys they might even like.