Kyiv

Pretty girl. Lucky you.

I do not think you have to convince them to have sex for money. When they ask for "a gift", everyone knows what it means. It just allows them to save face. They call is "plausible deniability" in Washington DC.

The fact that life in Ukraine is relatively expensive (if it is?) means that sex is more readily available. When there are more sellers, the price goes down. It is simple economics.

Yes, they think that "westerners" have money to burn. With your girl, was that 2500 for the whole night? If so, it was a good deal. However, you made the mistake of introducing them to more buyers, with more money. No wonder that she started to ask for more money. If the demand goes up, the price goes up. It is simple economics. Next time you go, she will ask not 2500 UAH, but rather 250 USD. That is why I keep my gems to myself.

[QUOTE=Tomek123;2044789]For pure mongering is certainly better countries where developed legal sex industry like FKK Clubs or poor color countries. Where your white skin color will be your advantage.

The problem is also that Ukrainian women love money and are ready to suck the dick for money but they do not have the mentality of a prostitute and being a prostitute is not always comfortable for them. This is the main psychological problem. The majority of veterans of mongering in Thailand or Latin America are accustomed to a simple and understandable game -You do not need any game. You are just a gringo from Canada and that's why everything is clear. The Colombian babe understands that you are a,gringo, and therefore you do not need to convince her. She just understands that she need to suck your dick. If you want anal sex she will give you this. In Ukraine there is a slightly different mentality. Therefore, such cunning guys as Steve 69 and others talk about, friendship, about,help, little nice gift etc.

The second reason is that life in Ukraine is more expensive than in south color countries. The food is not very cheap and you can not walk all year round in shorts like it does in Brazil or Manila and do not pay for heating. In my native Poland, meat and milk are cheaper than in Ukraine. And the average wage is several times higher than in Ukraine-700-800 EURO in Poland and 140-170 EURO in Ukraine. Many girls in Ukraine in the province work for 120-130 euros a month. Also many girls in Ukraine have a distorted picture of the life and work of a Westerner. They are often so stupid that they think so,-Okay. This guy in America earns 4,000 dollars. So he can easily spend 2-3,000 dollars on entertainment? . They do not understand that all your 3000-4 000 USD money goes for a loan for cars, for a house, for insurance and for food, for a school for your children..[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=BobSmith1;2044920]Was it just me or everyone else? Backpage only has United States sections. No Ukraine or Europe or any where else. Why is that?[/QUOTE]Because back page was forced to remove adult advertisements in the USA. This includes being able to see ads in other countries. You get redirected to the US version. If you are in a different country or you use a proxy in a different country, it will work for you.

I've got about a week off from work and am debating on where to go. I had heard some good things about Kiev, and now some not so good things. I've done Bangkok, but something about Kiev caught my eye. Money is some what of an object. I'd like to not spend more than 100/ HR ish. Any advice for this newbie would be much appreciated!

[QUOTE=YummyPL;2045606]Because back page was forced to remove adult advertisements in the USA. This includes being able to see ads in other countries. You get redirected to the US version. If you are in a different country or you use a proxy in a different country, it will work for you.[/QUOTE]I finally got backpage working by proxy. I see a lot of beautiful girls OMG! All 10+ models. Are you going to meet the girls look like those photos Are they real or only half of them are real? These are all 10+ in San Francisco bay area standard. If I can tap on those ass, I'll be super man.

[QUOTE=BobSmith1;2045895]I finally got backpage working by proxy. I see a lot of beautiful girls OMG! All 10+ models. Are you going to meet the girls look like those photos Are they real or only half of them are real? These are all 10+ in San Francisco bay area standard. If I can tap on those ass, I'll be super man.[/QUOTE]Why not 20+.

You have been reading these pages for a while BobSmith, you know that everything is true. What you see is what you get. No surprise at all.

Girls are proud to show to their friends, their family that they work as escort, so they put their own photos.

[QUOTE=Volpone;2046028]Why not 20+.

You have been reading these pages for a while BobSmith, you know that everything is true. What you see is what you get. No surprise at all.

Girls are proud to show to their friends, their family that they work as escort, so they put their own photos.[/QUOTE]I forget how they all turn out and I would love to get some advice again. Who is in Kiev next month? I maybe there next month and planning for a longer stay this time.

[QUOTE=DayBlazer;2045685]I've got about a week off from work and am debating on where to go.![/QUOTE]To be honest, it's not a great idea. Kiev itself is a wonderful city, and the nightlife is pretty damn good but the monger scene is not suitable for first time visitors unless you have spent time and energy cultivating contacts on the ground. You'll be able to get by without Russian, but it will limit your ability to communicate when contacting service providers.

My advice would be fish where the fish are, and the fish aren't in Kiev (at least not without the right level of groundwork).

[URL]http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-40241348[/URL]

For some reason I still feel this is the final nail on the coffin of the Kiev P4P.

Let us hope I'm wrong.

[QUOTE=Sorbonne;2046784][URL]http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-40241348[/URL]

For some reason I still feel this is the final nail on the coffin of the Kiev P4P.

Let us hope I'm wrong.[/QUOTE]For the Ukrainians who have the money to travel and the desire to travel to EU, they would have done it even no visa-free. No all women have the desire to travel to EU to sell their bodies while they can wait for guys like us to go there to buy their bodies in their homeland. Its safer for them. But ya some may go and slowly their economy will pick up and they won't be as desperate. Altho I know Ukrainians are not that desperate anyways to begin with. Kiev maybe done but we can try 2nd and 3rd tier cities. I live in San Francisco but I usually travel to poor cities like Sacramento, Vallejo, Stockton etc for girls.

I raised this issue some time ago and was advised by some senior members that visa free travel by Ukraine Citizens will make no difference to our hobby as those who want to go, have already gone. No matter how much I wish this to be true, my mind tells me otherwise. At the very least, I think it will affect the price and may well affect availability as well. According to the piece below, they expect an increase of 30% for Ukraine citizens armed with bio metric passports, going abroad. Certainly, they have will have no work visa but when did that stop working girls? They pay no tax anyway and what they do is not legal in all places.

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QpXw3Vf8n10[/URL]

[QUOTE=Sorbonne;2046784][URL]http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-40241348[/URL]

For some reason I still feel this is the final nail on the coffin of the Kiev P4P.

Let us hope I'm wrong.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=CallSignPapa;2046055]To be honest, it's not a great idea. Kiev itself is a wonderful city, and the nightlife is pretty damn good but the monger scene is not suitable for first time visitors unless you have spent time and energy cultivating contacts on the ground. You'll be able to get by without Russian, but it will limit your ability to communicate when contacting service providers.

My advice would be fish where the fish are, and the fish aren't in Kiev (at least not without the right level of groundwork).[/QUOTE]Good post, Kiev is a great place to visit, but I have to respectfully disagree the nightlife is pretty bad with the exception of Friday night. The rest of the week is not very good, even Saturday night is hit or miss. I would not go to Kiev for the girls or the nightlife. If you do not have local knowledge you will probably be disappointed. Money will help a little, but not much.

I will be visiting the Caribbean again this year and was wondering what it was like now-a-days. Posts that I read seem to say that it is slow. Slow, but still possible -- or gone?

I was used to 2000 UAH plus a small extra for Security to let the girl leave. Is that still the case?

What are the going rates? Recommendations always welcome.

My favorite was Annaitchka.

Norm.

Open visa is very good in some way.

1- those who have already gone are a lot of girl who wanted a lot of money and already were impossible to bang.

2- visa free open chance to normal girl to travel behind invitation.

3- 2 weeks in Europe cost them 1400 euro. Practically 1% of girl can have this sum working or by family. Now you can meet the girl in Kiev and even if you not bang them you can invite just paying flight. (I read somewhere they need to show money for the period of stay abroad and hotel reservation anyway, so it must be understood how this will impact invitation. If I invite a girl 2 weeks, I pay flight, but if she not have money, she need to show for europe at least 500 600 euro, near 50 euro day of holiday, so at this point was better old visa method for them also.

4- in case they need only flight many will come without problem if they get you in Kiev, and once at your place they bang like crazy, more than in Kiev for sure.

5- once visa scheme was mostly a rip off from usr girls or agency who asked a lot of money to do visa and buy ticket and at the end didn't even come to Europe. Now they can't steal any money. Biometric passport cost 40 50 euro. That's it.

6- Schengen will de fact change the flux of tourism to turkey to europe. Most girl travel to turkey and deal with turkish cause turkish men could invite them to sea easily. Now that in europe is the same, most of girl will be more interested to european who goes Kiev.

Personally I already have three girl, one a model very beautiful, line up to come summer. But I want understand everything before invite. If they can only come with flight ticket, I will cut my cost and reduce staying in Kiev by half.

Most girl will dream to spend lot off money on holiday when they come, thinking a lot of gift also. I don't care. When they arrive I will cook at home, sometimes dinner, beach all day, and one gift only, and from first night bang them like hell, if they not bang I open the door and kick them in the road. I'm sure they decide to fuck.

I repeat be strong with these girl. Ukrainian man who pay for holiday fuck the hell out of them. If they come to your place and act like princess put them in the road with their suitcase and tell them pay hotel. They will be back in room in 12 nanoseconds.

[QUOTE=Sorbonne;2046784][URL]http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-40241348[/URL]

For some reason I still feel this is the final nail on the coffin of the Kiev P4P.

Let us hope I'm wrong.[/QUOTE]Sorry, Kiev has been dead for a couple of years now. It is very easy to get Visa's, my friend provides Visa's for girls and has 95% approval rate, to the States and Europe. (Multi Entry) Mostly all fake financial information, they just pay someone to do the face financial statements.

Certainly, this development is positive for inviting girls to visit you in your home country but I am not sure how it can be good for price and availability of girls in Kiev.

[QUOTE=LuisVega11;2047622]Open visa is very good in some way.

1- those who have already gone are a lot of girl who wanted a lot of money and already were impossible to bang.

2- visa free open chance to normal girl to travel behind invitation.

3- 2 weeks in Europe cost them 1400 euro. Practically 1% of girl can have this sum working or by family. Now you can meet the girl in Kiev and even if you not bang them you can invite just paying flight. (I read somewhere they need to show money for the period of stay abroad and hotel reservation anyway, so it must be understood how this will impact invitation. If I invite a girl 2 weeks, I pay flight, but if she not have money, she need to show for europe at least 500 600 euro, near 50 euro day of holiday, so at this point was better old visa method for them also.

4- in case they need only flight many will come without problem if they get you in Kiev, and once at your place they bang like crazy, more than in Kiev for sure.

5- once visa scheme was mostly a rip off from usr girls or agency who asked a lot of money to do visa and buy ticket and at the end didn't even come to Europe. Now they can't steal any money. Biometric passport cost 40 50 euro. That's it.

6- Schengen will de fact change the flux of tourism to turkey to europe. Most girl travel to turkey and deal with turkish cause turkish men could invite them to sea easily. Now that in europe is the same, most of girl will be more interested to european who goes Kiev.

Personally I already have three girl, one a model very beautiful, line up to come summer. But I want understand everything before invite. If they can only come with flight ticket, I will cut my cost and reduce staying in Kiev by half.

Most girl will dream to spend lot off money on holiday when they come, thinking a lot of gift also. I don't care. When they arrive I will cook at home, sometimes dinner, beach all day, and one gift only, and from first night bang them like hell, if they not bang I open the door and kick them in the road. I'm sure they decide to fuck.

I repeat be strong with these girl. Ukrainian man who pay for holiday fuck the hell out of them. If they come to your place and act like princess put them in the road with their suitcase and tell them pay hotel. They will be back in room in 12 nanoseconds.[/QUOTE]