Havana

Water Boy,

Thanks for your detailed update on life and jineterisma in Havana. I have to say, though, that I find much of your info incorrect.

[QUOTE=Water Boy]
The supposed existence of "legal casas particulars that do not require you to register the girl" is a great myth. All legal casas will require you to register the girl if she spends more than an hour there. I have not found a legal casa that does not require you to register a girl.
QUOTE]

'Myth' is a strong word. And plain wrong. I have stayed in several casas in different parts of Havana that couldn't care less if I brought home one or ten girls and if they stayed 10 minutes or ten hours. And the owners have seen me many times enter with chicas. I also know several other people who have stayed under the same conditions. Don't call it a myth because you somehow managed not to find one. There are many! (lack of documentation prevents me from using the word 'hundreds' instead of many).

[QUOTE=Water Boy]
Jiniteras: I have heard from the retired providers themselves, that tourists encounter a girl and have sex with her without negotiating a price beforehand. Out of the kindness of the heart, they routinely pay $100 as a parting gift, plus $10. $30 cab fare.
[/QUOTE]

I take it you are using these prices as the example of idiot-tourists running up prices? I never talk price prior to sex (9 out of 10 girls do not bring it up - then again I never go for hardcore pros, and most of these will). If the girl asks more than 50 I laugh. Most times (I would say 7-8 out of 10) they accept 30 and the negotiators make it to 40. This is my rule number one: 40 is maximum, no exceptions.


[QUOTE=Water Boy]
If the cubana charged $10 per trick, she would have all the business she could handle. She could easily do 4 tricks a day, 5 days a week, 4 weeks per month, she would earn $800 per month. A common theme in the Cuban business model is: "maximize the profit per transaction and not the total profits. "
[/QUOTE]

Your calculations are correct and makes sense for visitors looking for prostitutes. Yes, why not fuck more men and make more pesos? For visitors who love Cuba exactly because life is NOT like that, I hope this never changes. For me it is a way bigger kick to pick up a 'normal' girl who is just walking to a party with an amiga and take her home than to hit the hardcore streetwalkers. But I guess it's a matter of different tastes. I love Cuba because 80% of all girls can be turned into a hooker for one night - not because 80% are hookers.

[QUOTE=Water Boy]
I do not understand your logic: If the girl is afraid of the police, why would the foreigner's spanish language skills make any difference?
QUOTE]

Simple: If a girl is contacted by a foreigner who:
1. Speaks Spanish
2. Shows signs of knowing the Cuban ropes
She will have way greater faith that this person will make the nearby policeofficer trust that he allready knows her (whether that be as friends, novios, friend of her bigger brother etc.)

A first-time tourist with no Spanish speaking skills will never in a million years be able to help her. If she speaks with him the police will definately label her as a jinetera.

Because I speak decent Spanish and because I know (without being an expert who can't fail and be wrong) exactly what the cop will ask her and me when he arrives - I am a much safer bet for a Cuban girl to talk to than some guy who has been two days in Havana and who can only say hola and cerveza.

[QUOTE=Travelling Gring] 'Myth' is a strong word. And plain wrong. I have stayed in several casas in different parts of Havana that couldn't care less if I brought home one or ten girls and if they stayed 10 minutes or ten hours. And the owners have seen me many times enter with chicas. [/QUOTE]TG,

My experience was based upon 1 Casa Particular in Habana and many other CPs throughout Cuba. Perhaps Legal CPs in Habana are less restrictive ?

Perhaps I have had extremely bad luck, but I have not found a legal casa that does not require you to register a girl. I hope I have just had bad luck, and you have better luck. Legal CPs that do not require you to register a girl are valuable.

But, are we talking about the same thing here?

1. The issue at hand is whether or not the girl is required to register.

2. We you staying in LEGAL (that is licensed and registered) casa particulars?

3. You say it is OK by the casa manager, to bring in one to ten girls, for one to ten hours, but can the girl stay without registering?

PS - if you know of legal CPs, anywhere in Habana that do not require registration of the girl, I would love to have a list of them for my next visit. Can I hit you up for names via PM?

Thank You

Mongers-
I tend to agree more with the observations of "Travelling Gringo" than with those of "Water Boy" at least in my experience. I did not fuck a single hard core hooker during my stay in Havana; all were local girls from the Centro Havana area that the owner of my Casa Particular arranged. Essentially any girl I saw on the street that I liked the owner was willing to ask her if she wanted to make a few bucks; 85%-90% of the girls asked accepted. "Water Boy" IS correct in his point that normal girls had no problem whatsoever agreeing to register, although the owner of the house told them they had to register, I do not think he ever actually registered them. A few of the girls I was with were the cousins of the owner and he definitely did not register them.
"Water Boy" is also accurate in that the normal girls are generally hesitant to be seen alone with you out on the street, at least in my experience. I went out a few times with the owner, his friends and some of the girls and it was no problem. However, hanging out, drinking rum and fucking all within the house is no problem also, so it all worked out. As for prices, I offered 30/40 CUC each time and the girls accepted it without hesitation and did not ask for any additional "gifts" after the fact. Keep in mind here that I'm 25 and speak fluent Spanish, so YMMV.
On another note, I think the next time I go to Cuba (maybe in a few months) I will rent an entire house with a pool in Miramar or Vedado and have the owner of the casa particular I stayed at in December stock the pond with some regular chicas looking to party (and for some CUC) just to make things more comfortable.
Suerte,
Rock Harders

We all (should) know that the casa owner has to register the guests as WaterBoy suggests.

That the casa owner is willing to take a risk is his/her decision. This may be based on an understanding of current conditions, an understanding with the police or an understanding with the casa inspector.

I know a few casa owners, one who will rent to gringos for short term purposes without registering. He told me when the guy has a chica in his room, he stays up all night. When the chica leaves, he makes sure that she is not stealing from him and checks with the gringo. If there is a knock at the door, he has an emergency exit in another part of the house. He only sleeps once the chica has left. He does this because he wants/needs the money but he does not rent to gringos all the time. Anyone who does not follow the rules during a crackdown is taking huge risks.

I have stayed in hotels, legal casas, friends apartments in Havana and I have stayed in friends family houses in el campo without issue. When I stayed in a friend's apartment in Havana, everyone was careful not to let the neighbours know what was going on.


There is still the 3 strikes rule for chicas and tourists.
The police can usually tell if a chica is from there or not, that is if they are not shaking the chica down.

[QUOTE=Sean EZ]Crazy.. so what if you get caught, you just admit you went to Cuba? If OFAC doesn't fine anymore what's a big deal then?[/QUOTE][QUOTE=Online Article]In all the years of the travel restrictions, up until the Bush 2 administration, very few people had been prosecuted. The Office of Foreign Assets Control in the Treasury Department said in 1999 that there have been only 16 criminal prosecutions for nine violations since 1983. Since 2001, the number has gone up, and prosecutions are much more numerous, with hefty fines imposed of $6,000 to $10,000. The penalties on record are stiff: $250,000 fine and up to 10 years in the pen, but until fairly recently fines have been minimal. Traveler, beware! The situation has gotten to the point where people are getting together to create a legal defense organization to defend the right to travel.

[snip]

When you travel via Cancun, you pass customs in the US. Via Canada, you pass US customs in Canada, but they seem more reasonable and less apt to 'tag' you. Do not bring cigars back, they are very illegal... and if you've been bad and have asked the Cubans and the Mexicans not to stamp your passport (bribing the Mexicans with $20 folded into your passport, although some say that is not necessary), then be sure to tell the truth if later on a US Customs agent asks you where you've been. It's a worse sin (a felony) to lie to a federal officer than to go to Cuba without a license, which is punished by fines, typically hefty these days. Be aware that you have to ask both the Cubans and the Mexicans to not stamp your passport or they will. The Cubans will honor this request for free...

Note: there have been reports of people being fined even though they did not bring anything back with them from Cuba or give themselves away in an obvious manner.... This is true even through Mexico, where they have been known to give the US the passenger manifests...[/QUOTE]See the full article at [url]http://www.afrocubaweb.com/travelcuba.htm[/url]

[QUOTE=Water Boy]TG,

My experience was based upon 1 Casa Particular in Habana and many other CPs throughout Cuba. Perhaps Legal CPs in Habana are less restrictive ?
[/QUOTE]

Absolutely. Havana differs from every other city in Cuba. I have never found a legal casa outside Cuba that does not register girls (carnet AND name in book - the latter is the real problem for the girls).

Well, I once overpaeyd for a casa in Bayamo to make the guy forget about carnet and signing in (price was 20, offered 35). The guy was a nervous wreck for the first 2 days. Then when he realized I only had girls over for 1-2 hour sessions he got all into it and encouraged me to go out and find girl. 'No chica oy? Que pasa?'

Havana is different. I am sure because there are too many casas for the immigración to keep regular control. I have stayed in casas in Havana for many months in total and have never seen immigración stop by.

[QUOTE=Water Boy]Legal CPs that do not require you to register a girl are valuable. [/QUOTE]

These are plentyful. In sdome of the casas I have been in, I don't even bother to bring up the subject if the entrance is totally private. Many of these casas owner want to follow the law, so if you ask them directly they will say 'si, carnet, claro!', but they would in fact rather live knowing nothing. They would rather have discreet guests who bring in chicas quietly. Hear no evil, see no evil.

Even when I stay in casas that have told me directly that it is no problem, I always keep a low profile. I still smuggle in the girl quietly and only talk on the terrace or in my bedroom. This is out of respect for the owners and the risks they are taking. If immigración ever stopped by when I had a girl, I would always say that 'yes, I have been instructed to register this girl, but I smuggled her in without the family knowing'.

[QUOTE=Water Boy]
But, are we talking about the same thing here?

1. The issue at hand is whether or not the girl is required to register.

2. We you staying in LEGAL (that is licensed and registered) casa particulars?

3. You say it is OK by the casa manager, to bring in one to ten girls, for one to ten hours, but can the girl stay without registering?

PS - if you know of legal CPs, anywhere in Habana that do not require registration of the girl, I would love to have a list of them for my next visit. Can I hit you up for names via PM?

Thank You[/QUOTE]

Yes, same thing. Legal casas with the sign outsider the door. Yes, they can stay without registering.

I don't keep a list. I have one sacret casa that I only share with very few for several reasons: 1) I don't want to send anybody there and risk destroying their lenient policy on girls and 2) they only accept guests for at least one month, so they only have regulars and are right now booked beyond christmas.

BUT... Many of the casaproviders, if not all, will respond positively to an e-mail in which you ask for casas that does not register girls. Yes, they might fool you to get the business, but then you just leave and find another. I have been giving many casas to pick from (that do not register) and until now have not been fooled.

I think the issue is discretion. Some people don't know what that is.

Most people will be hesitant take the chance if they do not know you.
I have a few pictures of a morning police raid of an illegal casa across the street from where I was staying. Will post one once I find them again.

You should know that Cubans are paranoid about communicating sensitive issues over the internet as it could be intercepted.

[QUOTE=Water Boy]See the full article at [url]http://www.afrocubaweb.com/travelcuba.htm[/url][/QUOTE]

The link is outdated, probably more than 5-6 years old - the general license to visit family no longer applies as far as I know. Also you don't need to ask cubans not to stamp your passport, everyone said they only stamp your visa form.

Everyone who goes to Cuba does so illegally. Few people get caught however. But going to Cuba is taking a chance nevertheless. Personally if asked directly if I went to Cuba I would say yes, I would never lie to a government official.

The general license is still in effect.

If you are asked where you have been, plead the Fifth. Tell them to spaek to your lawyer. There are many lawyers who handle these issues pro se.

Also there is a good equal protection argument in that cuban americans are permitted to go once every three years (not enough!) and other americans are not permitted to go except for permitted reasons. Hmmmm, so much for your fundamental right of travel.

Customs will do nothing when you plead the fifth. Why? Because they will respect your intelligence and they will also know they will be able to prove nothing. Unless they intend to commit precious resources, which they will not. Because thy will lose.


[QUOTE=Sean EZ]The link is outdated, probably more than 5-6 years old - the general license to visit family no longer applies as far as I know. Also you don't need to ask cubans not to stamp your passport, everyone said they only stamp your visa form.

Everyone who goes to Cuba does so illegally. Few people get caught however. But going to Cuba is taking a chance nevertheless. Personally if asked directly if I went to Cuba I would say yes, I would never lie to a government official.[/QUOTE]

Hi guys. Couldn't resist putting in my 2 cents worth about casas. I also want to apologise for the lack of my report on 2 weeks stay in Cuba in late March/early April. Sheer lazniess but it will appear soon.

Firstly, I would agree with the Rick Harders camp. As he provided details of the casa he stayed at in Havana, I met up with the owner on arrival. The room was inappropriate for me so he set me up at a friend's place along the same street. All I was told was that chicks weren't a problem as long as it wasn't TLN. At this point, I would say that the whole idea of not having a key to the casa was a surprise to me. It was only remotely a problem in Havana, as the family were visiting an ill relative and a couple of times I was left waiting at the door for someone to return home.

Anyway, in a nut shell, it appears that casas in Havana and Santiago are more lenient on girls having to 'punto'. The other thing that came up, mainly in Santa Clara, was that legal casas that do punto the girls, they are only allowed to do so with one girl per rent and not per night. Is this normal? It was such an issue that I ended up getting 2 casas for the 2 days I was there, despite having paid the first casa for 2 days already. I presume the situation was the same in Cienfuegos but I didn't get to find out as no chica was prepared to register there. Various locals told me that Cienfuegos is particularly strict with girls who do register. Don't know if this is true.

The other thing I read that rang true was that the old guy at the casa in Santiago always stayed up till the girl left. The same happened in Havana. Towards the end of my stay in Havana, it appeared the owner was getting troubled about me bringing women back, but was still cool about it really. Finally, I want to say that I never got the feeling that I had to sneak girls in quietly at all. Although various people talked about the informant thing in relation to nosey neighbours. By the way, I'm happy to provide info on casas in Havana/Santiago/Santa Clara/Cienfuegos if anyone wants to PM me.

The rest will be in the report.

Good luck,

Donnylad

Donnylad,

I am just making sure: Are you saying that you could bring in as many girls as you wanted WITHOUT having to register them?

[QUOTE=Donnylad] they are only allowed to do so with one girl per rent and
not per night. Is this normal? [/QUOTE]yes. this is why you never pay the whole rent in advance.

[QUOTE=Donnylad] I presume the situation was the same in Cienfuegos but I didn't get to find out as no chica was prepared to register there. Various locals told me that Cienfuegos is particularly strict with girls who do register. Don't know if this is true. [/QUOTE]This is 100% True. Cienfuegos girls WILL NOT REGISTER. The action in Cienfuegos is 100% hardcore pros, and you have to rent an illegal casa at $5 - $10. (By the way $10 is a ridiculous rip-off, the girl is getting most of that moeny, the cubans themselves pay $1) You can probably do well by paying $5 (I am sure the girl still gets a cut).

I look forward to your report Donnylad, Good luck

Hi there. As promised, this is a report of my trip to Cuba in late March/early April. It was just under 2 weeks long and took in Santiago, Santa Clara and Cienfuegos. I will put the appropriate sections in the different threads. As I had 2 separate spells in Havana, I will put these both together now. Apologies if some of the details have been lost due to the length of time passed.

Day 1 - Mon - Arrived in the evening. Didn't get settled into my casa until about 10pm. Went straight out for some food with the original casa owner, who had arranged my place. He is quite a character. I had already talked to him about a girl. He showed me one whom he said Rock Harders had been annoyed not to have had due to time issues. She was young and quite special, but wanted 60 or more CUC, which was out of my budget. He seemed to suggest that all girls were generally this price. Anyway, after some food on the Prado, I grabbed a cab whom my new friend seemed to know. They took me around quite a bit looking for a girl. I think we ended up at a church somewhere, trying to dodge police. They assured me there was a girl in the churchyard and the driver got out. Soon he returned with this young girl. I couldn't really talk to her as much as I normally do to sort things out. I think we just agreed on 30 CUC for 1 hr. Back at the casa she was quiet and shy. She was early 20's and had a kid I remember. Anyway, her service was decent and did everything I wanted except for anal. Can't remember if she did COF or not.

Day 2 - Tues - Between the sightseeing I tried to find girls around town but it was damned near impossible. I remember coming across a young, slender black girl in the Plaza Mayor. Despite serious police presence she seemed to gesture towards me to talk to her. I tried acting cool, but by the time I tried looking for her she'd gone. I regretted this later. Despite returning here a couple more times during my stay, I saw no one else of interest there again.

In the early evening I ended up at a dodgy bar near Floridita and practically next to Bar Montserrat. As soon as I entered an older, larger black woman started talking to me and got me set at a table. Soon she was talking to me and sitting there. I was practically bullied into buying a drink for her and soon she was flirting with me. Anyway, one thing led to another and in desperation I agreed she would come to my casa for 30 CUC for an hour. We shared a cigar too and had a couple of drinks before getting a taxi.

Back at the casa things were cool. Again she did everything except for anal. I think I went out later but found nothing.

Day 3 - Wed - Again more sightseeing and girl hunting during the day with no success. I think I checked out Vedado and Malecon that day too. That evening I took a bicitaxi on a rip off rate of 10 CUC per hr. He took me to various areas, including around Casa de la Musica. Apparently the police had cracked down recently. We spoke to a few girls bu the price was never right. We curiously met a lesbian pimp and a one handed bicitaxi driver/pimp. It was the latter who arranged a meet with a light-skinned, brunette who was mid 30's. She agreed on everything except anal for 30 CUC. Ended up having to pay my bicitaxi for 2 hrs and the one-handed guy for taking her to my casa. He wanted a tip too, but I don't think I paid one. The casa owner wasn't happy with us all being outside the place at that time. The next problem was that she didn't have her carnet, which was a major issue for the owner. Thankfully he agreed to give her a ride back to her place to pick it up. I paid him a tip for that I think.

Finally we started. Like the other girls and most of the ones I had in future, she was unshaven down there. She was really passionate and DFK'd too. Her oral was pretty impressive. I kept her no. to contact her when I returned again. We agreed she would try anal next time for 40.

Day 4 - Thurs - Left earlyish next morning for Santa Clara. The report for that segment is in the appropriate thread.

Day 11 - Coach from Cienfuegos was delayed so didn't get in till about 11pm. That dashed any plans to get a woman in Havana.

Day 12 - Fri - Searching for women during the day again drew a blank. This included an outdoor bar in Vedado where apparently chicks do hang about. I tried calling the girl from a week ago but some guy kept answering and I couldn't speak to her. I finally got hold of her and we met up. We agreed on what we had before and got a taxi. Back at my place we showered together and she shaved down there. The service wasn't quite as good as I remembered from the last time but was ok. Anal didn't work too well either.

The Bar Montserrat area was quiet again in the evening. I hit the Casa de la Musica area, thinking there might be some local chicks but none showed. A bicitaxi from the area said he knew a chick around there. After waiting a while for him, he showed up with a largish, young black girl. She was mid 20's and agreed to all except anal for 20 or 30. I was desperate so I took it. She wasn't too bad from what I recall but not amazing.

Day 13 - Sat - My last day and I was allowed to move my stuff into another room and not pay anything extra which was nice. The owner jokingly made it clear there would be no women allowed there. I tried various places where I could use another room but no girls showed up so that was the end.


Hope this has helped in some way.

DL