Safe Sex and Sex Related Discussions in Thailand

[QUOTE=Luvpuss;1285744]All the stats are real interesting but the fact is 95% of dudes going to Pattaya are wanting BB.[/QUOTE]BBFS, I. E. Bareback in a working girls pussy or ass? What evidence do you have for this claim? I think a guy would have to be omnipotent to know that.

[QUOTE=Luvpuss; 1285744]I know most on here say they glove up. ?

How do I know this. Because I ask the girls. There answer always goes "I usually use condom (which is a lie) but every man want without".[/QUOTE]That is your assumption that it "is a lie". Furthermore, many men do not prefer to go "without".

"Percentage of sex workers reporting the use of condom with their most recent client"

FSW (venue based) 95. 7 percent. 2011.

[url]http://www.unaids.org/en/dataanalysis/monitoringcountryprogress/progressreports/2012countries/ce_TH_Narrative_Report[/url]

%5B1%5D. Pdf.

[QUOTE=Luvpuss;1285744]I have asked many, many Beach Road SW's, MP girls, Soi 6 you name it.[/QUOTE]How many is many? What is your solitary experience of the percentage / breakdown & numbers between SWs, MP's, gogos, soi 6 beer bars, etc?

[QUOTE=Luvpuss;1285744]Men do not care about the stats. Even if it was 1 in 10 chance, I bet BB would be the penetration of choice. Dudes want their dick nice and wet in warm Thai pussy. That is why they go to these places.[/QUOTE]This is a generalized statement. So, as such, it is false. Obviously, I, for one,"care about the stats". One would probably be foolish not to consider them. Don't you? Do you have BBFS with "beach road" Pattaya TGs without having any idea if they are HIV positive or not?

[QUOTE=PinkPearl;1285785]Why would you say that?[/QUOTE]Because circumcised is supposed to be less risky, so the math is the other way

[QUOTE=Luvpuss; 1285744]All the stats are real interesting but the fact is 95% of dudes going to Pattaya are wanting BB.

Men do not care about the stats. Even if it was 1 in 10 chance, I bet BB would be the penetration of choice. Dudes want their dick nice and wet in warm Thai pussy. That is why they go to these places.[/QUOTE]Wishing and desiring is something, practicing is something else.

[QUOTE=Bionicman;1285859]Because circumcised is supposed to be less risky, so the math is the other way[/QUOTE]Using a condom is safer than circumcision, hence the higher number (meaning more safe) for condom use:

2. Without a condom + circumcised, maybe 1 in 250,000 chance.

3. With a condom + not circumcised, maybe 1 in 500,000 chance.

[QUOTE=PinkPearl; 1285794]BBFS, I. E. Bareback in a working girls pussy or ass? What evidence do you have for this claim? I think a guy would have to be omnipotent to know that.

That is your assumption that it "is a lie". Furthermore, many men do not prefer to go "without".

"Percentage of sex workers reporting the use of condom with their most recent client"

FSW (venue based) 95. 7 percent. 2011.

[url]http://www.unaids.org/en/dataanalysis/monitoringcountryprogress/progressreports/2012countries/ce_TH_Narrative_Report[/url]

%5B1%5D. Pdf.

How many is many? What is your solitary experience of the percentage / breakdown & numbers between SWs, MP's, gogos, soi 6 beer bars, etc?

This is a generalized statement. So, as such, it is false. Obviously, I, for one,"care about the stats". One would probably be foolish not to consider them. Don't you? Do you have BBFS with "beach road" Pattaya TGs without having any idea if they are HIV positive or not?[/QUOTE]You are a closed minded stat man but have no knowledge of what is really going on on the streets and in these places.

How many have I asked? I have spent over the years a total of 6 months in Pattaya and asked a 100+ girls.

But I guess that does not equate for your stats.

Guys do not want to admit on here or other forums because they dont want to get called out by the holier than thou judgementals.

You are pretty stupid about this. 95% of dudes are asking no condom. That is from the girls mouths, not your bogus stats.



But believe what you want.

[QUOTE=Luvpuss; 1286016]You are pretty stupid about this. 95% of dudes are asking no condom. That is from the girls mouths, not your bogus stats.

But believe what you want.[/QUOTE]So these girls are carefully taking notes about each customer. No. They can't remember how many customers ask for BB. Its merely a lot. They would forget the guys like me who never ask for BB.

Elsewhere I think you wrote that many girls said they usually use condoms (but were lying). So that means you don't trust any of their answers. You just believe what you want regardless.

But believe what you want. Logical thinking and stats might be lost on some.

If most guys here say they use condoms, I would tend to believe a fair number of them (not all). Some of us don't see any point in writing total lies, even if we have unpopular beliefs.

[QUOTE=Luvpuss;1286016]95% of dudes are asking no condom. That is from the girls mouths, not your bogus stats.[/QUOTE]I have no stats to back this up or deny it, but one thing always struck me as very odd.

I never go BBFS and I always carry my own condoms with me. Most of the times I barfine agogo girls LT and when back in the hotel room I have never noticed that they took condoms with them to the bedroom. Do they expect the man to have condoms ready or don't they care? On the other had they never offered me the option of BBFS either.

Soapies (Annies) and Eden Club have condoms ready and seem quite strict in using them.

[QUOTE=Luvpuss; 1286016]You are a closed minded stat man but have no knowledge of what is really going on on the streets and in these places.

How many have I asked? I have spent over the years a total of 6 months in Pattaya and asked a 100+ girls.

But I guess that does not equate for your stats.

Guys do not want to admit on here or other forums because they don't want to get called out by the holier than thou judgementals.

You are pretty stupid about this. 95% of dudes are asking no condom. That is from the girls mouths, not your bogus stats.

But believe what you want.[/QUOTE]Sorry if my post came across as harsh while drunk, but I was hoping you'ld comment on this subject, as I had recalled you doing so before, & thought you might be able to add to what you had said about high rates of bareback sex, BBFS, occuring in Thailand.

Admitedly my knowledge of what is going on is quite limited, but so is yours, since you can only speak from experience of Pattaya, not the rest of Thailand, and of only about 100 girls out of thousands of female sex workers in that city. And even then you only speak of this based on talk with them, not having actually tested them by trying to put your uncovered dick in their bare pussy, and succeeding 95 times out of 100.

As to stats, your stats are stats, just as other stats are stats. What one concludes from them may be inaccurate and merely guesswork. It does not follow that stats from 100 TGs will apply to all TGs. Still, it is interesting to hear what you found out and your research may give some idea of what's going on out there. Perhaps you could share more details, like how many of these 100 were Beach Road street walkers, how many you actually did without a latex, how much you paid, were they hot, etc?

I agree some guys probably don't want to admit to doing BBFS on forums for fear of criticism. IME & opinion that can even be a major factor in being banned or threatened with the same when the powers that be take a moral stance against you. This can include even deleting posts of articles re HIV, etc. Here on ISG, though, there has long been more toleration with, for example, Opebo being vocally pro BBFS since many years ago, and more recently I've noticed several threads in the German section on BBFS. Also in this thread a few guys including yourself have been speaking up.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1286044]Some of us don't see any point in writing total lies, even if we have unpopular beliefs.[/QUOTE]I agree, my personal reputation or your judgement on the real me will not bother if I tell I do BB or whatever weird one is doing. So the lie is nonsense in an anonimous forum. I agree.

If one ever comes to meet someone else, it will be clear that most likely the two will share the same interest. So if they like BB. They will not be surprised or bad judging the other.

[QUOTE=Sammon; 1285981]It is no different with regard foreign mongers who visit. They too make babies with local girls (BAR as well as NON-BAR ). And run away.

Girls are used to it. I am sure they are dissappointed but it is fact of life. Very few girls request to wear condom in Thailand, Cambodia and Philippines.

Chinese, Vietnam girls always do. So do south American girls.[/QUOTE]I wonder if you are basing these claims on personal experience, or what girls have told you, or something else.

According to the "Thailand AIDS Response Progress Report 2012" the "Percentage of sex workers reporting the use of condom with their most recent client", in particular the venue based female sex workers (FSW) , was 95. 7 percent in 2011.

[url]http://aidsdatahub.org/en/reference-librarycols2/surveillance-situational-analysis-assessments[/url]

In Bangkok I've found that at least 50 percent of street walkers will go without a condom for sex. But they never volunteered to do so, and only agreed if asked, sometimes requiring a tip or large bonus.

Freelancers in Bangkok were reported in 2007 to have an HIV positive rate of 19 percent. Venue based P4P TGs in Thailand, OTOH, had less than a 2 percent HIV infection rate in 2011. Freelancers, BTW, means street walkers or other independent sex workers, for example those who go to Beergarden and Thermae in BKK.

Re making babies, they can be made from farangs who use condoms, too. Even with perfect condom use 1 in 50 couples will experience a pregnancy per year with condoms as the only means of birth control. Real world use is at least 10% or 5 in 50 re the pregnancy rate. Moreover, working girls often have more sex than the average couple, so their rates would be even higher.

BTW, coitus interruptus, pulling out before ejaculating, with bareback vaginal sex, is about as effective as condoms in preventing pregnancy. It is also obviously much safer for the lady as regards STIs than unloading within her.

[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coitus_interruptus[/url]

[QUOTE=Sammon; 1285981]It is no different with regard foreign mongers who visit. They too make babies with local girls (BAR as well as NON-BAR ). And run away.

Girls are used to it. I am sure they are dissappointed but it is fact of life. Very few girls request to wear condom in Thailand, Cambodia and Philippines.

Chinese, Vietnam girls always do. So do south American girls.[/QUOTE]I wonder if you are basing these claims on personal experience, or what girls have told you, or something else.

According to the "Thailand AIDS Response Progress Report 2012" the "Percentage of sex workers reporting the use of condom with their most recent client", in particular the venue based female sex workers (FSW) , was 95. 7 percent in 2011.

[url]http://aidsdatahub.org/en/reference-librarycols2/surveillance-situational-analysis-assessments[/url]

In Bangkok I've found that at least 50 percent of street walkers will go without a condom for sex. But they never volunteered to do so, and only agreed if asked, sometimes requiring a tip or large bonus.

Freelancers in Bangkok were reported in 2007 to have an HIV positive rate of 19 percent. Venue based P4P TGs in Thailand, OTOH, had less than a 2 percent HIV infection rate in 2011. Freelancers, BTW, means street walkers or other independent sex workers, for example those who go to Beergarden and Thermae in BKK.

Re making babies, they can be made from farangs who use condoms, too. Even with perfect condom use 1 in 50 couples will experience a pregnancy per year with condoms as the only means of birth control. Real world use is at least 10% or 5 in 50 re the pregnancy rate. Moreover, working girls often have more sex than the average couple, so their rates would be even higher.

BTW, coitus interruptus, pulling out before ejaculating, with bareback vaginal sex, is about as effective as condoms in preventing pregnancy. It is also obviously much safer for the lady as regards STIs than unloading within her.

[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coitus_interruptus[/url]

Over the last 6 to 9 months I have engaged in very foolish and extremely high risk sexual practices. I have probably slept with around 25 to 30 women without wearing a condom and some of those women were in the high risk category (prostitutes). Worryingly none of them were concerned about condom use and in many cases we engaged in both vaginal and anal sex.

I took my HIV test today and thank goodness it came back all clear.

But this now leaves me in an odd predicament. On the one hand I thank the lord that I have "dodged a bullet" and feel that I should swear to never be so foolish again but on the other hand I think that maybe there is not that much to worry about after all and why not carry on bare backing?

Of course I think common sense will prevail but in some ways it has made me less worried about the chances of catching HIV.

[QUOTE=Bowerboy; 1289734]Over the last 6 to 9 months I have engaged in very foolish and extremely high risk sexual practices. I have probably slept with around 25 to 30 women without wearing a condom and some of those women were in the high risk category (prostitutes). Worryingly none of them were concerned about condom use and in many cases we engaged in both vaginal and anal sex.

I took my HIV test today and thank goodness it came back all clear.

But this now leaves me in an odd predicament. On the one hand I thank the lord that I have "dodged a bullet" and feel that I should swear to never be so foolish again but on the other hand I think that maybe there is not that much to worry about after all and why not carry on bare backing?

Of course I think common sense will prevail but in some ways it has made me less worried about the chances of catching HIV.[/QUOTE]I wish you luck you will need it!

LBM

[QUOTE=Bowerboy;1289734]some ways it has made me less worried about the chances of catching HIV.[/QUOTE]Why don't you utilize the time and energy you are devoting to worrying and just investigate the statistical probabilities of catching it. There are a bunch of paranoid individuals on ISG who even cover up for BJs and there are also a large number of forum members who happily go about their mongering activities without worrying about using a condom and haven't caught anything. Just get the facts and then decide what you want to do.

I don't usually write or contribute but thought I would add my experience to this thread. I have been travelling to Thailand several times a year for work, for 10 years or so. I have met and slept with more women than I can remember, but it must be 200 to 300. I had bareback sex with every one of these women and usually bareback anal as well. None of them ever asked me to use a condom when I said I wanted bareback. Looking back, I have been very fortunate not to contract any STIs but my tests have always been negative. I don't recommend anyone to engage in unsafe sex, but my point is that if my experience is any basis for conclusions, then clearly many Thai women are either ignoring the risks of HIV or do not understand the risks. I suspect the latter. In response to the post by Bowerboy, I wouldn't presume to advise you, except to say that I myself am no longer indulging in such risky behaviour.