Kyiv

[QUOTE=Gsi2810;2248020]Guys was in Pattaya a couple of weeks ago and I make it a point to go to the Russian clubs on my last day just for the sake of variety, can't afford them but good to see attractive girls who share the common language. One thing which struck me odd was that Russians and Ukranian girls were work mates, colleagues and even friends in these clubs, I thought the relationship between the two nations were strained to say the least and wondered if such a situation is there in Kiev or Moscow, do the girls of other nationalities work there as well? On a sidenote Kiev sounds like a great place to monger and I long to monger in a place where I can speak English as flirting is always a great deal maker, will be doing my research before posting anything for my vacation in a couple of months. Talk to you guys soon.[/QUOTE]From what I've experienced, Ukrainians in Kiev are predominantly blind to nationality and race. Not all, but younger ones do not care. It is obvious at all levels: applauding to Russian Dance at National Opera in Nutcracker ballet performance, speaking Russian language in the company with Ukrainians from Western parts of the country, and more.

This is not to say that gradually percentage of Russian language on TV, in the offices (government, medical, etc.) is shrinking, because use of Ukrainian, English and even Turkish is increasing. Normal evolution process. Many of my friends still send their children to schools where they would learn Russian, as it is considered important for future career.

And certainly, there is no illusion within the wide society categories about who is the real aggressor, despite deep corruption within the Ukrainian government. Still I spoke to one of the leading Kiev restaurateurs, and in the middle of all this, he travels to Moscow to learn new ideas from his competition and such.

Let's not start a political discussion here. This is Forum about them girls!

[QUOTE=Sorbonne;2248052]That's a good point. Yes, I, as a gentleman, do prefer blondes, like Scandinavians.

Anyway, I was not even sure how many of Ukrainians were blondes. I had a preconception that Slavic girls have blonde hair but noticed some years ago that there were so many brunettes in Ukraine and have been wondering if they were dying their hair brunette. So most Slavic girls have brunette? The Polish are Slavic, too, though.[/QUOTE]Very simple explanation:

Many Ukrainian blondes from Bila Cerkva, L'viv, Sumy and other Ukrainian Centers of Civilization upon further investigation confessed to have Polish heritage. Do not forget that in 18th century Polish was the main spoken language not only in Kiev, but also to the West from Dnipro River (right bank). L'viv was Polish. So were many other cities. Ruling class in cities and villages was Polish.

As far as brunettes, there's undeniable Turkish influence, as well as many other ethnic groups: tatars, kypchaks, sarmats, khazars, to name just a few.

From the other hand there's a lot of immensely beautiful blonde Turkish ladies. Therefore, no need to stereotype here.

Are Polish girls more beautiful? In what respect? With or without makeup? With or without Winter clothes? In or out of lace underwear? Is there attitude better? Are they more skillful in bed? Are they more educated, more intelligent, more fun in conversation?

I would be first to admit that in the art of presentation and emphasizing their best features (and hiding deficiencies), Ukrainian ladies are unsurpassed. I did see them quite uncomfortable out of their element in the morning. Hiding the face before cosmetics is on.

Still for me there is nothing better than an Ukrainian girl waking up at 7 am with sincere smile even before she first opens her eyes. And then it takes about 10-15 minutes for her loud moaning to wake up neighbors upstairs, and another 20-30 minutes for both of us to fall back in bed exhausted and happy. I can still see in my mind the sparks in her eyes, while she hides part of her face under the blanket. I ask:

- How are you, my dear?

- Thank you, I'm doing grrrreat!

That was a mere 4 weeks ago, and she was 25 years old blonde from L'viv.

Also remember some 5 years ago another 18 years old blonde from Sumy had put my T-shirt on before joining me in bed for the very first second time. Meaning the first first time we met was for P4P, and then she became my GF. Anyway, I suggested to her taking off the bra to feel more comfortable, and she visibly hesitated. I thought she was shy, but couple months later she explained that she's been thinking which way her breasts would look better. With or without bra? She ran me out off condoms rather quickly, then took by the hand after a dinner and directed towards the nearest pharmacy. 18 years old. More than 30 years younger than me at the time.

[QUOTE=Riina;2248131]Polish girls dress like shit. Greater wealth in Poland actually converts to dressing down as other things are perceived as more important. Kinda like Americans are generally richer then everybody else and dress like crap. Beauty is everything to an Ukrainian girl. Most will never have careers and have to do everything they can to attract the best man possible. It's the reason why the incredible attraction to Ukraine by foreigners.[/QUOTE]Interesting, I met a lot of Ukrainians in Russia but there's not a lot of Russians going to you Kiev, no opportunities. If you Ukraine are not careful, and does not clamp down on their immigration Policies, leaving and coming the country. Turkish will be the second language.

[QUOTE=Jojosun;2247434]To fuck UA girls one needs to fly to the main source, a very simple reason.[/QUOTE]To have a substantiated opinion about UA girls behavior in their major congregation hub, one needs to fly there.

And I do not know what I like better, to fuck UA girls at the main source, or make observations about the process?

I did have them UA girls in Spain, Poland, Russia and many other countries. And nowhere else they are sweeter, than in Kiev!

[QUOTE=Jojosun;2246644]Its been 4 days and you could hear a pin drop on this thread as I don' t think anyone who knows the Kiev scene well could've disputed most of the main points in your observations.

Just few points to bear in mind.

Unlike The US and many countries, Prostitution isn't illegal in London & The UK but other activities associated with it are. [URL]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prostitution_in_the_United_Kingdom[/URL].[/QUOTE]My mistake, thanks much for pointing that out, Jojo. There were also a few orthographic errors noticed upon second reading. Too bad I cannot edit after posting. Guess that policy makes sense.

Thanks for your wise words and support! It means a lot coming from well seasoned expert.[QUOTE]Nowhere and I mean Nowhere in (Eastern or Central Europe) at present compares to Kiev when it comes to the availability & number of attractive (Semi Pro Girls, my main interest in Kiev) who are available for sponsoring. Maybe Moscow or SP, European part of Russia are in the same league or even better. But I wouldn't know as Russia sounds to me as a much harder nut to crack compared to Kiev.

Anyone with solid experience of both Kiev and Moscow, SP, please post your observations, comparisons with facts & figures relating to the total cost of a mongering experience.[/QUOTE]What would be the facts and figures criteria for such a comparison?

There's crime in both cities. Not sure which is worse. Somehow I feel very safe in Kiev, despite occasional explosions and shooting, and have no desire to face Russian police, border guards or customs.

Most of us, stinking foreigners)) doesn't need a visa to go to Ukraine. Russia is another story.

[URL]https://www.expatistan.com/cost-of-living/comparison/moscow/kiev[/URL]

Average cost of living is 31% less in Kiev. But there's no way transportation in Moscow is only 3% more. Looking at what makes up this average shows that taxi and gas is 50% less in Kiev, and public transportation is more. Questionable conclusion.

Besides I can walk downtown Kiev on foot, and reach 95% of what I need within 30-45 minutes without any transportation. Moscow is substantially larger in all dimensions. Even Manhattan is more compact than Moscow.

By no means Kiev is cheap, but I lived in both cities for years, and learned to love Moscow against my initial prejudice. Kiev IMHO is 2-3 times cheaper for me personally, especially the way I spend my time and money away from the main residence.

What else would be considered a true criteria, not based on belief or "my friends said"?

Let me consider few scenarios:

1. Can I fuck 50 girls in 5+ weeks in Moscow and be content with 80-90% of them? Show me someone who did it. How much would it cost, -- in a purely hypothetical sense?

2. Can I stay 10 days for free with a 9-10 rated girl who has multiple orgasms with me in bed one night after another? Did you do it?

3. Good luck pulling off Kozerog's approach to mongering in Moscow.

The rest is a pure emotion, and has no measurable meaning.

[QUOTE=DramaFree11;2246712]...Girls are attainable and approachable, And like foreign guys. Moscow is much better, I love the energy and the people....[/QUOTE]Looool! Girls are also attainable and open in Kiev! That's why I will be back there in three days. Meet some of my October girls. But in December will go to Georgia. Again.

Ukraine = very open and very easy to approach but money focused, b i t c h e s
Georgia = conservative and difficult (but I met my girl on first day on arrival - and bingo! no need for other search)

[QUOTE=PhotoSlider;2248166]From what I've experienced, Ukrainians in Kiev are predominantly blind to nationality and race. Not all, but younger ones do not care. It is obvious at all levels: applauding to Russian Dance at National Opera in Nutcracker ballet performance, speaking Russian language in the company with Ukrainians from Western parts of the country, and more.

This is not to say that gradually percentage of Russian language on TV, in the offices (government, medical, etc.) is shrinking, because use of Ukrainian, English and even Turkish is increasing. Normal evolution process. Many of my friends still send their children to schools where they would learn Russian, as it is considered important for future career.

And certainly, there is no illusion within the wide society categories about who is the real aggressor, despite deep corruption within the Ukrainian government. Still I spoke to one of the leading Kiev restaurateurs, and in the middle of all this, he travels to Moscow to learn new ideas from his competition and such.

Let's not start a political discussion here. This is Forum about them girls![/QUOTE]Thanks for the response, wasn't my intention to have a political debate was just curious that's all.

[QUOTE=PhotoSlider;2248181]Very simple explanation:

Many Ukrainian blondes from Bila Cerkva, L'viv, Sumy and other Ukrainian Centers of Civilization upon further investigation confessed to have Polish heritage. Do not forget that in 18th century Polish was the main spoken language not only in Kiev, but also to the West from Dnipro River (right bank). L'viv was Polish. So were many other cities. Ruling class in cities and villages was Polish.

As far as brunettes, there's undeniable Turkish influence, as well as many other ethnic groups: tatars, kypchaks, sarmats, khazars, to name just a few.

From the other hand there's a lot of immensely beautiful blonde Turkish ladies. Therefore, no need to stereotype here.

Are Polish girls more beautiful? In what respect? With or without makeup? With or without Winter clothes? In or out of lace underwear? Is there attitude better? Are they more skillful in bed? Are they more educated, more intelligent, more fun in conversation?

I would be first to admit that in the art of presentation and emphasizing their best features (and hiding deficiencies), Ukrainian ladies are unsurpassed. I did see them quite uncomfortable out of their element in the morning. Hiding the face before cosmetics is on.

Still for me there is nothing better than an Ukrainian girl waking up at 7 am with sincere smile even before she first opens her eyes. And then it takes about 10-15 minutes for her loud moaning to wake up neighbors upstairs, and another 20-30 minutes for both of us to fall back in bed exhausted and happy. I can still see in my mind the sparks in her eyes, while she hides part of her face under the blanket. I ask:

- How are you, my dear?

- Thank you, I'm doing grrrreat!

That was a mere 4 weeks ago, and she was 25 years old blonde from L'viv.

Also remember some 5 years ago another 18 years old blonde from Sumy had put my T-shirt on before joining me in bed for the very first second time. Meaning the first first time we met was for P4P, and then she became my GF. Anyway, I suggested to her taking off the bra to feel more comfortable, and she visibly hesitated. I thought she was shy, but couple months later she explained that she's been thinking which way her breasts would look better. With or without bra? She ran me out off condoms rather quickly, then took by the hand after a dinner and directed towards the nearest pharmacy. 18 years old. More than 30 years younger than me at the time.[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the simple explanations. Yes, when I was in Bila Tserkva, I remember seeing some Polish monuments.

Make no mistake, I love Ukraine. That is why one of my residences is currently located in Ukraine. Nice young girls can be had at fairly good prices.

But as I indicated, I prefer Scandinavian types to Slavic types. I am not into Slavic features. So in Ukraine I have to seek Scandi types in vain and settle with Polish types.

[QUOTE=Riina;2248131]Polish girls dress like shit. Greater wealth in Poland actually converts to dressing down as other things are perceived as more important. Kinda like Americans are generally richer then everybody else and dress like crap. Beauty is everything to an Ukrainian girl. Most will never have careers and have to do everything they can to attract the best man possible. It's the reason why the incredible attraction to Ukraine by foreigners.[/QUOTE]

I have no idea what you are talking about. Maybe just difference in perception.

But the Polish are certainly not yet in the same league in wealth as the Americans, and it is difficult to believe such mentality has already developed in Poland. As I said, for me at least, I can't walk about my city in Poland without seeing top-notch girls every few minutes.

It should also be noted that girls in Kiev or in larger cities may dress nice, but once outside these cities, it seems most of them, not all, simply cannot afford looking nice.

[QUOTE=Sorbonne;2248911]I have no idea what you are talking about. Maybe just difference in perception.

But the Polish are certainly not yet in the same league in wealth as the Americans, and it is difficult to believe such mentality has already developed in Poland. As I said, for me at least, I can't walk about my city in Poland without seeing top-notch girls every few minutes.

It should also be noted that girls in Kiev or in larger cities may dress nice, but once outside these cities, it seems most of them, not all, simply cannot afford looking nice.[/QUOTE][URL]https://www.facebook.com/stereochicago/[/URL]

I have no idea what you are talking about. I patronize the above Euro bar posted above regularly just to watch the Ukrainian girls. Polish girls go there too. How do you tell the difference? The Ukrainian girls know how to dress and are about fifteen pounds less. Polish girls are quite open to doing meaningless work like baby sitting and cleaning. That work is an anathema to UKs. I scan FB gallery photos all the time in Ukraine and Poland. The difference could not be more obvious. Are sure you've been to these countries?

[QUOTE=MichiT;2248247]Looool! Girls are also attainable and open in Kiev! That's why I will be back there in three days. Meet some of my October girls. But in December will go to Georgia. Again.

Ukraine = very open and very easy to approach but money focused, b i t c h e s
Georgia = conservative and difficult (but I met my girl on first day on arrival - and bingo! no need for other search)[/QUOTE]How did you meet your Georgian girl? I scanned through Tinder, but did not see too many profiles. I guess the only real way is to just in-person. I have yet to go, but love Georgia food and wine. So, it is on my list.

[QUOTE=Riina;2248938][URL]https://www.facebook.com/stereochicago/[/URL]

I have no idea what you are talking about. I patronize the above Euro bar posted above regularly just to watch the Ukrainian girls. Polish girls go there too. How do you tell the difference? The Ukrainian girls know how to dress and are about fifteen pounds less. Polish girls are quite open to doing meaningless work like baby sitting and cleaning. That work is an anathema to UKs. I scan FB gallery photos all the time in Ukraine and Poland. The difference could not be more obvious. Are sure you've been to these countries?[/QUOTE]

I wouldn't claim to know these girls or have been to these countries just by watching them in Chicago or in photos.

Hi guys,

Planning on mongering in Kiev pretty soon over a few days.

1) Does someone have a suggestion which escort service to use? Seems like quite some gone out of business reading the forum:

2) How is the erotic massage experience? I found Salon Dream, Dolly, Luxmassage and Moulin Rouge. However: the offer a variety of services and prices. Which service would you recommend and what massage outlet?

Thanks guys for your hints.

[QUOTE=TinyHippo;2249186]How did you meet your Georgian girl? I scanned through Tinder, but did not see too many profiles. I guess the only real way is to just in-person. I have yet to go, but love Georgia food and wine. So, it is on my list.[/QUOTE]That's actually more a discussion for the Georgia forum. I have no idea about Tinder. I met her in real life. On my first day. She was working in the hotel lobby, I asked her for help with the computer, she helped me, we then talked almost four hours, we liked each other, agreed to meet on that same evening, had some follow ups and in December I will go back to see her. Easy as that.