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[QUOTE=Dg8787;2025256]The only difference it makes is in life of the recipient.[/QUOTE]And if the recipient knows her worth, then she would also know that this was the day she won the state lottery. It won't happen every day. I doubt she would even mention it to her friends as they might simply laugh it off.
It's for moments like these the expression "once in a blue moon" was invented.
Flak3 I'm enjoying your posts and I have no criticism of the lessons that you are learning. I do wince at some of the costs but only in the sense that I feel bad for you. I also realize that it can be a steep learning curve on a new playground. Members will always advise to RTFF and I do not disagree. What is true about that though is the TFF is now a mature beast and a best practice from years gone by of listing the price of an encounter in every report is not always adhered to. Actual reports like yours are harder to find too. As a local sexpat, here is an exchange that I had about pricing. The ladies keep tuned in to price structure and if they work in a bar they have a "set price" based on that fact. This story happened in BKK in a dive bar where I sometimes play pool. If I'm having a good time with the lady over drinks and pool I might agree to take out. She said she needed 2,000 baht for ST. Meanwhile she has set aside the fact that she looks like someone pulled from the Beer Garden. Older and not as attractive as the average BJ bar worker. So I reign her in, humorously (I hope) asking her if she is a gogo dancer and if not then why the 2,000 price. Anyway she does agree to 1,000 and in the end we are both happy. She was a really good fuck in spite of being past what most would consider her expiration date. She probably does not get taken out very often. It's not that she was ugly, it's just that she was 36 not 22. Anyway, now you know, a 1000 baht tip in Pattaya will buy you a good ST on BR and from beer bar girls (plus the bar fine of course).
So I have been reading a ton, watching YouTube videos and trying to sponge up as much intel as possible. A few things I have not come across in my reading so far though:
- What is a coyote girl? Lady boy in a normal bar? Or a really hot one to lure guys in that you can't actually get your hands on?
- Hooters girls, I know they are not supposed to hook up with customers but I am sure some will do it on the sly. Anyone had luck slipping one your contact info? Seems to be some really tasty choices there.
- Ping pong show girls ever available for fun? Seems someone with that kind of muscle control has to be worth trying even if the looks aren't quite there.
- The girls out front trying to get guys in bars are all bait and switch or if you see one you really like can you take her in for a drink and see if you like her?
My take so far is the top end girls work the gogos but generally don't seem worth the effort unless all you care about is looks, beer bars are good choice to get your feet wet if you find a cute girl as you have someone to complain to if it's shit and discos are the best bang for the buck as far as looks / price go if you have the confidence to get after what you want. To be clear I intend to try them all once at least just to be thorough in my research but I'm trying to develop a general rule of thumb. From the sound of it online hunting is not worth the effort so I will skip that one for this trip at least.
Thanks for all the great info here and I appreciate not having to learn everything the hard way.
[QUOTE=Cool;2025135]Flak definitely made rookie mistakes. I don't recall if this is his first LOS visit. The greedy girl raised red flags during the first encounter.[/QUOTE]Advice for the Rookies:
The girls always chat you up to size you up. Stuff like [I]is it your first trip to Thailand?[/I] and [I]how long are your staying?[/I] NEVER admit it is your first (or second) time in Thailand, and always say you are in town for 30 days and not just 3 days. Don't set yourself up as a mark.
Paying above the going rate (or spending whatever is in your pocket) does not make you a generous man in the eyes of the ladies. It makes you a chump who does not know the local prices. They actually look down on you for it. Best practice is: pay the going rate, and treat them with respect.
SL.
As a general rule, nothing is out of reach in Pattaya for the right price and the right guy.
[QUOTE=Savethe7;2025296]So I have been reading a ton, watching YouTube videos and trying to sponge up as much intel as possible. A few things I have not come across in my reading so far though:[/QUOTE]Really glad you are reading up and coming up with good questions.
[QUOTE=Savethe7;2025296]- What is a coyote girl? Lady boy in a normal bar? Or a really hot one to lure guys in that you can't actually get your hands on?
- Hooters girls, I know they are not supposed to hook up with customers but I am sure some will do it on the sly. Anyone had luck slipping one your contact info? Seems to be some really tasty choices there.
- Ping pong show girls ever available for fun? Seems someone with that kind of muscle control has to be worth trying even if the looks aren't quite there.
- The girls out front trying to get guys in bars are all bait and switch or if you see one you really like can you take her in for a drink and see if you like her?
My take so far is the top end girls work the gogos but generally don't seem worth the effort unless all you care about is looks, beer bars are good choice to get your feet wet if you find a cute girl as you have someone to complain to if it's shit and discos are the best bang for the buck as far as looks / price go if you have the confidence to get after what you want. To be clear I intend to try them all once at least just to be thorough in my research but I'm trying to develop a general rule of thumb. From the sound of it online hunting is not worth the effort so I will skip that one for this trip at least.[/QUOTE]A coyote girl is a girl alright, not a ladyboy. They are usually dressed differently from the rest of the girls. They usually have a higher barfine and asking price but I suspect they would be better in bed to justify the extra buck. Some might refuse to go with a customer, but that is just playing hard to get. A man in an inebriated state twill take refusal personally and end up making some bad decisions about choice and price. That is where these girls come in.
I have chatted online extensively with a couple of chicks working at Hooters and they were fine to meet up on their off day. But then I found so much more talent on ground that I did not bother contacting them again. No prices were discussed. To this end I must point out that one must keep all options open. Do not rule out online. There are some gems to be found there. It can be painstaking to separate the grain from the chaff though.
I have never thought about taking out a ping pong show girl. Now that you mention it my interest is piqued.
The girls outside the GOGO bars are not just bait and switch. If you like one of them, ask for her to come sit with you for a drink. With some navigation she will go out too. I have had some good experiences at Skyfall and Sensations in the past. But lately I have steered clear of GOGO bars.
The general impression (not ill founded) is that a GOGO girl will perform less enthusiastically compared to a freelancer / beer bar girl. But that is empirical. You could find one that totally blows you away. I had reported last year of taking a couple of girls from Iron Club on a trip to Koh Samet and having a wonderful time. The forum has plenty of reports from veterans who swear by their steady GOGO girls. And do not make the mistake of thinking that looks can only be found inside a GOGO bar.
You have not talked about Soi 6. It is something you must visit.
Keep an open mind and as you said try everything before you settle on your poison of choice.
[QUOTE=Savethe7;2025296]So I have been reading a ton, watching YouTube videos and trying to sponge up as much intel as possible. A few things I have not come across in my reading so far though:
My take so far is the top end girls work the gogos but generally don't seem worth the effort unless all you care about is looks, beer bars are good choice to get your feet wet if you find a cute girl as you have someone to complain to if it's shit and discos are the best bang for the buck as far as looks / price go if you have the confidence to get after what you want. To be clear I intend to try them all once at least just to be thorough in my research but I'm trying to develop a general rule of thumb. From the sound of it online hunting is not worth the effort so I will skip that one for this trip at least.
Thanks for all the great info here and I appreciate not having to learn everything the hard way.[/QUOTE]Disco girls come from all walks of life. There are hybrid beach girls, gogo, beer garden, white women, civilians who hit the disco for a good time. The downside to the disco is they have an age rule of 20+. Second girls come with friends who can alter her decisions. Next, some girls only want to party / become too wasted as the night goes on. Discos run until 5 AM to 7 am so you might want to get a massage / BJ beforehand if you go home empty handed. Discos are not always a slam dunk and you are at a disadvantage 3 am. You can turn the lateness into your advantage if a girl wants one last customer for the night because sometimes rates drop. Beware of girls who want to run up drink tabs. A couple round of drinks will put you in the hole 700 baht before the lovely is pointed in the direction of your room. Another warning, recently I noticed discos have a high male to female ratio. The good news is some guys come with dates or are not looking for a bed mate at the moment. I've seen my favorite disco have a 1 :1 ratio at 1 am. I never paid attention to the guy to girl ratio until my friends complain about anything less than 3 girls to a guy.
The problem with paying above market rates with a girl is that if you want to repeat with her she will expect the same amount. Over a decade ago, I once gave a BR girl 700 baht instead of the market rate of 500 baht thinking I would be nice to her, help her out, etc, etc. Then when I tried to take her again several days later she wouldn't budge off the 700 baht. I wanted to stick to the market rate of 500 baht. We didn't get any agreement, so I had to take off.
Taught me a big lesson. These girls don't give a shite about you. You are not their family, just some stupid punter, a walking ATM.
Now, I always pay market rates, and only tip up to 100 baht if they give me a photo. Most overpayers are just insecure chumps IMO.
[QUOTE=Savethe7;2025296]- Hooters girls, I know they are not supposed to hook up with customers but I am sure some will do it on the sly. Anyone had luck slipping one your contact info? Seems to be some really tasty choices there.[/QUOTE]I'm not sure why you feel the need to hook up with a Hooters girls at one of the nation's two Hooters locations, other than to fulfill some fantasy that you haven't accomplished at home. BTW, Thai food is some of the tastiest in the world, and you can eat it breakfast, lunch and dinner. But if you are hooked on the domestic junk, well? Point is, that Hooters should be a rather obscure place to look to pick up a girl in a town that is inundated with women vying for your attention. A waitress from Hooters would be low on most guys list. I expect you will forget about Hooters in short order once you hit the streets.
As someone mentioned, check out Soi 6. If you wear shorts, then I suggest you go commando as I did. Your new friend at the bar might slide her hand up your leg and fiddle about. Then the last thing you will have on your mind is burgers and hot wings. Also try Beach Road and haggle for ST for under 1000 baht. Its like a giant flea market of flesh. You will find some real dolls there (just watch out for the ladyboys. They are very convincing to the inexperienced).
[QUOTE=Sunlover2;2025299]Paying above the going rate (or spending whatever is in your pocket) does not make you a generous man in the eyes of the ladies. It makes you a chump who does not know the local prices. They actually look down on you for it. [/QUOTE]Exactly.
[QUOTE=Franga;2025504]The problem with paying above market rates with a girl is that if you want to repeat with her she will expect the same amount. [/QUOTE]Agree. I am always conscious what I pay the girl the first time even if she provided me with amazing service.
[QUOTE=Franga;2025504] only tip up to 100 baht if they give me a photo. Most overpayers are just insecure chumps IMO.[/QUOTE]Agree. I will always tip if I get photos.
[QUOTE=Sunlover2;2025299]It makes you a chump who does not know the local prices. They actually look down on you for it.[/QUOTE]I never realised a hoe's opinion was that valuable to some people.
[QUOTE=Blanquiceleste;2025593]I never realised a hoe's opinion was that valuable to some people.[/QUOTE]Don't worry, you are the king already.
[QUOTE=Franga;2025504]The problem with paying above market rates with a girl is that if you want to repeat with her she will expect the same amount. Over a decade ago, I once gave a BR girl 700 baht instead of the market rate of 500 baht thinking I would be nice to her, help her out, etc, etc. Then when I tried to take her again several days later she wouldn't budge off the 700 baht. I wanted to stick to the market rate of 500 baht. We didn't get any agreement, so I had to take off.[/QUOTE]Absolutely correct. It confuses the girls no end, when I don't always pay the same amount, when I made adjustments based on her effort, the duration, how much hard work was needed to make me cum, etc. And when I can't even remember what I previously paid her.
Also you thought they you were already tipping them good, then another time they will ask for an extra tip on top of that. LOL.
If you buy the mamas an a drink, she will expect one every time she sees you, for no reason whatsoever.
Be careful with setting precedents. Even the freelancer on the street, knew how much I paid a previous free lancer in a similar location a week earlier. They gossip. Of course girls are not all worth exactly the same, same as costs a lot more to rent a Porsche over a Hyundai.
If ever paying a girl extra, it is a good idea to state very clearly that it is a one off bonus that won't be repeated.
I definitely plan on spending the first 4 or 5 days trying all the different areas and styles of places, Hooters gets mentioned a lot so I figure it worth seeing once but if I knew in advance that if I saw a girl I really liked there was no chance of hooking up then I'd skip it as a waste of time.
I'm going over Christmas and New Years so I know it will be super busy so in cheaper places I will probably just bar fine anyone I hit it off with just to avoid getting scooped before I make up my mind. I'm sort of hoping to find one girl I really like that doesn't get annoying to spend a few days with as well, I might take some time out to do some sight seeing, some company and a translator would be nice for that.
[QUOTE=Franga;2025504]The problem with paying above market rates with a girl is that if you want to repeat with her she will expect the same amount. Over a decade ago, I once gave a BR girl 700 baht instead of the market rate of 500 baht thinking I would be nice to her, help her out, etc, etc. Then when I tried to take her again several days later she wouldn't budge off the 700 baht. I wanted to stick to the market rate of 500 baht. We didn't get any agreement, so I had to take off.
Taught me a big lesson. These girls don't give a shite about you. You are not their family, just some stupid punter, a walking ATM.
Now, I always pay market rates, and only tip up to 100 baht if they give me a photo. Most overpayers are just insecure chumps IMO.[/QUOTE]I often wonder about guys like this who have absolutely no respect for women. I for one love this hobby and most of the time, if you show a girl respect and treat her right, she will return it ten fold to you in the bedroom. At least that's been my experience. I could turn the tables on you and say you don't give at rats ass about the girl either and she's only a piece of meat to you. So in the end, she gets her money and you get what you want. So be it.
The only thing you said that makes sense is the part about setting prescedents with the ladies. If you tip them big or be overly generous the first time. They expect the same every time. The best way to overcome this that has always worked for me is to tell the lady a reason why you are paying more. By doing this, the next time you see her and the same situation does not happen again, she won't expect the same. This meathod has never backfired on me before. I've overpaid and underpaid the same girl and never had any complaints. It all evens out in the end.
As for you calling other punters chumps for paying over the so called market rates. It is our business what we pay and not for you to complain about. When I see a girl and she quotes me her rate, I look at her, evaluate her personality and looks. Then I decide if I will pay her price or not. I never counter offer. I agree with her price or walk away. However, 80% of my encounters with bar girls and freelancers happen with no fee discussed for ST or LT. If the lady is from a go go, I will only know the bar fine amount. In the morning I pay her what I think she deserves. The same has been my experience with freelancers except with no barfine.
[QUOTE=Franga;1947102]Here is a list of prices I paid for girls during my one month stay in Pattaya in Sept 2016. I don't do go-go or beer bar girls, just Beach Rd FL's and girls in lower budget massage joints around Soi Buakao mainly.
45 yr massage girl: 1000 baht FS+oilie at Refresh Massage start of Soi Chaiyapoon.
32 yr Beach Rd FL: 700 baht FS. Plus 200 baht ST room at Tipp Plaza.
40 yr massage girl: 1200 baht FS +oilie at Lanna Massage Soi Chaiyapoon (yes, I know I overpaid by 200 baht).
45 yr massage girl: 1000 baht FS +oil massage just off Soi Chaiyapoon.
45 yr massage girl: 500 baht HJ +200 baht Thai massage at Soi 13 massage parlor.
30 yr Beach Rd FL: 1000 baht FS. Plus 200 baht ST room. One of the prettiest on BR.
43 yr Beach Rd FL: 800 baht FS. Plus 120 baht ST room on 2nd Rd.
Surprisingly I ended up with quite a lot of 40 something year old girls And they were all pretty good lays (and of course better attitudes).
The 1000 baht Beach Rd FL's were very pretty and thin. These would not lower their price so I decided to pay up. One couldn't take a cock (and asked for money in advance-but I didn't oblige), but the other loved sex and couldn't get enough.
I took a walk one time along Soi6 and there were so many girls there. Some quite attractive. I have never taken a Soi 6 girl before but I think next trip I will pay up and look for a few gems here as it is hard to find something attractive on Beach Rd and in the low budget massage parlors.
One time I took a walk along Soi Buakao from Soi Diana to Pattaya South Rd and the massage chicks are all pretty old and / or skanky so I didn't partake.[/QUOTE]
So in the future, while you're puddling around Pattaya in your cargo shorts and flip flops with a 700-1000Baht old hage from beach road or hanging out in low budget massage parlours, the rest of us will have young beautiful stunners from the Gogos, discos, Soapies, and oilies with no problem paying. The choice is yours mate.
[QUOTE=Franga;2025504]The problem with paying above market rates with a girl is that if you want to repeat with her she will expect the same amount. Over a decade ago, I once gave a BR girl 700 baht instead of the market rate of 500 baht thinking I would be nice to her, help her out, etc, etc. Then when I tried to take her again several days later she wouldn't budge off the 700 baht. I wanted to stick to the market rate of 500 baht. We didn't get any agreement, so I had to take off.
Taught me a big lesson. These girls don't give a shite about you. You are not their family, just some stupid punter, a walking ATM.
Now, I always pay market rates, and only tip up to 100 baht if they give me a photo. Most overpayers are just insecure chumps IMO.[/QUOTE]
Each to their own is what I say. If some nights I am in the mood for spending money, so be it. If some nights I feel like being more trifty, that works too. I don't worry about such things. I am too busy having fun to care what others think.
If anyone has a problem with whether I over pay or under pay for services, I just chuckle and remember it is they that have the problem. ☺.