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[QUOTE=Jackyo]Some women just aren't cut out for this work..
.. and it shows in their attitudes and service.[/QUOTE]
Did it ever come to your mind that some women do not do the job on a voluntary basis? That does sometimes explain why they do not provide excellent service.
HB
Repeating a question posed earlier, what will Palace be like in the week after Xmas and surrounding New Years? Do many girls go "home"? Does anyone have any experience in recent years on what the activity level is like after Christmas and through New Year's Day?
[QUOTE=Hessen Bub]Did it ever come to your mind that some women do not do the job on a voluntary basis? That does sometimes explain why they do not provide excellent service.
HB[/QUOTE]
There is the whole theme of [i]Zwangsprostitution[/i] which hangs over the whole scene. This is the reality of things.
I finally took the plunge and tried the much talked about Palace. I have read and acquired lots of information from this forum, so it is only fair that I share the same with fellow readers and contributors (I’ve never done this before). This report is aimed for newbie (especially the beginning part). I’m sure it has been written many times before, but a fresh version will do no harm!
Flew in to Frankfurt Airport on Sat noon, then took a taxi to Flemings Hotel at Neuen Borse. Taxi cost €28, about 20 minutes ride. Flemings charged €75 for Sat, €119 Sun. The hotel is a nice modern contemporary outfit, have pleasant staff; very quiet on the days I stayed. Location is perfect for the Palace, especially for newbie and the more nervous mongers. Palace is literally behind Flemings, very convenient if you’re intending to nip over the hotel in between sessions at the Palace. If you want a busier atmosphere and a central city location, Flemings neuen Borse is not the place; there is nothing to do or see here (apart from Palace). Having said that, this Flemings is only three minutes walk to the Industriehof train station (U6 and U7 lines) and six/seven stations to main downtown shopping centres (Hauptwache / Konstablerwache). By the way, if your budget is more limited, stay at the nearby Ibis Hotel, a five minute walk to Palace, and almost half the price of Flemings.
I strolled nervously to the Palace at 1pm. Paid €75 for the entrance fee. The lady asked my shoe size and then gave me a towel and a key that is attached to a wrist binder (something like bracelet). She also bound a tag around my wrist, possibly a way to confirm that I have entered legitimately. The same key gives access to your locker (where you store your clothes) and to your money locker (where you place your cash). I was confused here but a fellow monger at the front bar explained to me. Here’s what you do. After getting the key, proceed to the changing room. Undress completely and store your clothes in the changing room locker. Wrap yourself with a towel or use a robe Take your cash out (suggest you have Euros in fifties – handy because ironically everything comes in fifties here). Then go back to the front; the much smaller lockers just in front of the front bar are for the cash. Keep your cash here. You do not carry cash around with you in the premises. After a session with a girl, she will follow you back to your cash locker where you pay her.
I was very lucky to hook-up with two friendly punters; one is a regular from Italy and another from Canada. It made my visit more exciting and we had a lot to talk about and exchanged stories in-between sessions. We sat mostly at the front bar by the main entrance. Here, the lighting is much better. We saw new girls coming in to work, and watched other punters settling their dues with the girls. The body language of the men can tell how much they enjoyed (or not) the sessions with the girls.
The available girls are mostly in the main lounge and a few are in the kino (cinema) and smoking room. Make yourself comfortable in the main lounge or the bar in the main lounge. Scan the girls and make eye contact with the one you like. Some of the more aggressive girls will come to you. If you don’t like the girl, just say that you’re tired; no need to be direct or offensive. I also walked around the lounge to assess the girls subtly. The lighting inside is not very bright, so it’s a good idea to walk around.
At 1pm, there was limited number of girls. Probably, about 10. Slim picking. The number increased to about 50 girls by 8pm. By then, from a predominantly Eastern European choice, it expanded to a more international flavour (Chinese, Thai, South and Central America). The ratio between male: female is hard to gauge, but I would say about 50: 50. I finally engaged my first girl after two hours in the place (the common advice in this forum is that yes. Don’t rush, take your time; don’t engage hastily). My preference has always been dark-haired and voluptuous girls.
My first girl was Melissa, about 28-30 years old from Costa Rica, brunette, about 5’ 4", curveous meaty side, B/C natural tits, has reasonable English. Very friendly, lovely wet oral without condom, French kissing. I didn’t last long with her because she is a master in vaginal squeeze. She gripped the penis so tightly with her vaginal muscles. I saw her stomach sunk to enable that vaginal grip. What an experience, but I prefer the natural grip. 30 minutes, €50. Overall, satisfying; pretty good GFE; I gave her 7/7/8 (face/body/sex). I don’t give 10s, and 9 has to be exceptional.
My second was shortly after dinner. This time, was Daniella, a recommendation by fellow forum contributor, raincity. He introduced me to her by the front bar as she readied for the night. She is definitely a stunner, model grade, 25 years old from Romania, blonde, about 5’10-11", tall slender, B/C natural tits, good English. (Blonde and slim not my first choice usually, but I had to try her). Very friendly, great oral without condom, French kissing, great sex. 30 minutes, €50. Overall, satisfying; pretty good GFE; I’d give her 9/9/8 (face/body/sex). (Again, I don’t give 10s, and 9 has to be exceptional). She’s the next closest I could get to fucking a top tier model!
My third was Curly (or Karlie). I eyed her shortly after dinner, but felt that she wasn’t inviting enough (cold). But I gave in around 10pm and asked her for a round. I am a sucker for darker hair, darker toned body. She is tall, 5’11", 20 years old, great body, nice full arse, natural B tits, little passable English. She claimed to be half Venezuelan, half German. She didn’t seem to be engaging too many customers that night (we knew because we hanged out by the front bar). Depending on your taste, this girl is either a big "wow" in bed, or a "never again" type. My first two girls were slow to moderate sensuous kind of sex. Curly was the opposite. She was wild, her blowjob was hard and fast, and the riding was of equal tempo too. When she sucked, she maintained eye contact, very sexy! She did say that she likes to be pumped really hard. So I accommodated her request, and wow. Her screams were very vocal and genuine. Unfortunately, it was my third for the day (and suffering from jetlag), so the stamina was lacking (what an excuse). 30 minutes, €50. Overall, different and satisfying. I’d give her 8/9/9 (face/body/sex). (Remember, I don’t give 10s, 9 has to be exceptional).
At 11pm, I went for a 45 minute massage (called Intensiv). It covers the body, feet and face. Nothing sensual here; not really the best massage I ever had. I fell asleep partway, must be at least 30 minutes of the 45. Cost €45.
Sex with Curly occupied my mind, but there was no way I could do another session on the same night. I remembered she told me that she used to do hotel calls and prefers that. So I approached her again and offered her €200 for two hours at the hotel the next day (well, €50x4 – Palace going rate). She counter offered €400; I turned down and re-countered €300. No deal was reached, and I left it at that.
I left Palace at 1am. Knackered but happy with the experiences. If you are a newbie, Palace is definitely a good place to venture! Don’t think you’ll regret it. I’m thinking of coming back for a quick visit next week, time permitting. (Yes, Curly would be my first target).
[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I certainly hope that the author or somebody else will post a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]
This is my first report ever. As I am new to this, I am justifiably more of a reader than a writer. But I have to thank you folks for all the very throrough and extremely useful reports.
I have recently been at GT, PHG, and this was my first trip to one of the main Frankfurt FKKs. I am currently at the Flemming Hotel looking at the Palace from my window. There is still time to head back, but I need some rest before crossing the atlantic tomorrow.
I clearly liked the Palace over GT (which I liked over PHG). Excellent facilities, very open layout which allows monitoring action and choosing targets, and not bad food. I arrived at 4:30pm, and it was quite empty, maybe a 20:20 ratio. The lineup (througout the day) was good but not outstanding. Roughly similar to what I had seen at GT or PHG, plus/minus personal tastes. My personal summary:
Angelica (Russia)
This is not an obvious choice given other girls at Palace, but decided to start with this based on what I had read on the forum. It was a great choice indeed, very enthusiastic, I think we liked each other and it showed. She truly enjoys this, and has a way of turning you on regardless of your state of mind. I find that much more interesting than the usual checklist of acronyms, most of which where included. With cim, total 100.
Looks:6/7
Performance:9
Vanessa (Russia)
I did not want to get on board the Russian Express, but it seems that I did. Angelica sent Vanessa (from Russia - there are plenty of Vanessa out there) my way. Tall, blonde with curly hair, could loose 8-10 pounds. But her approach was sending all the right signals to the GFE-dar, so I decided to go for it. Very similar to the Angelica experience, more sensual, less intense, but very much worth it. I do not speak German, so it was easier to chat with Vanessa than Angeica. Vanessa was the best person to have a conservation from the girls I met. With cim, total 100.
Looks:7/8
Performance:8/9
After some sauna, food, I decided to go a massage. 50 Euros for 45 minutes of intense massaging is a great deal. I completely followed all your advice and consciously ignored the Romanians which are always at center stage. After some chit/chat, I focused on two targets: Elina (?) from Russia, and Choco (?) a gorgeous black girl. They were two of the stunners in the Palace tonight, and I wanted to have either or both. After some time, I got
Elina(?), Russia
Playboy playmate lookalike, implants, but very sexy body and face. On the way to the room, she suggested a trio with her friend Choco. I would have minded a trio, but only after I had been very satisfied with each of them individually. When I told her that, she quickly started saying all the extras she offers, basically saying that she does not go to the room for a 50E session. I had no problem with that, so we went for a much more limited session (no kissing/DATY), ending with a cim to satisfy her financial requirements. Some may call this an optiflick, but what she did she did well, so I still think it is a great session to have a playboy buny look-alike give an enthusiastic blowjob with cim (100)
Looks: 9
Performance: 7
After this I lost a bit my desire to go with Choco and for any potential trio. Perhaps a mistake as I went for much more mediocre options after this.
Magdalena (Poland)
Probably the best legs in the Palace tonight as well as the tallest/blondest girl. I assumed that she was German but I was wrong. We went for a quick "normal session", no kissing/daty, but ok BJ followed with great doggie, perfect for her body.
Looks: 8
Performance: 7
Isabella (Hungary)
At this point I was thinking of either leaving or waiting for Choco. Neither happenned as Isabella from Budapest jumped on my lap and forced me to a room. Being weak physically and mentally, I decided to go for it, but the session was below average and completely not memorable. No kissing, DATY where she looked on the ceiling, etc. Should have waited for Choco.
Looks : 7
Performance : 6
It was midnight, but after this I decided not to stay any longer. Overall a good day, rough damage 550. I think I will return to the Palace because it is a very good FKK option and is very convenient for frequent travellers.
[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I certainly hope that the author or somebody else will post a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]
[QUOTE=Coolgreek] Elina(?), Russia
Playboy playmate lookalike, implants, but very sexy body and face. On the way to the room, she suggested a trio with her friend Choco. I would have minded a trio, but only after I had been very satisfied with each of them individually. When I told her that, she quickly started saying all the extras she offers, basically saying that she does not go to the room for a 50E session. I had no problem with that, so we went for a much more limited session (no kissing/DATY), ending with a cim to satisfy her financial requirements.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Coolgreek]Magdalena (Poland)
Probably the best legs in the Palace tonight as well as the tallest/blondest girl. I assumed that she was German but I was wrong. We went for a quick "normal session", no kissing/daty, but ok BJ followed with great doggie, perfect for her body.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Coolgreek]Isabella (Hungary)
At this point I was thinking of either leaving or waiting for Choco. Neither happenned as Isabella from Budapest jumped on my lap and forced me to a room. Being weak physically and mentally, I decided to go for it, but the session was below average and completely not memorable. No kissing, DATY where she looked on the ceiling, etc. [/QUOTE]
CG- Nice report and it's always great to read the observations of a new contributor.
I noticed a trend in your session reports- FYI and everyone else's, a standard FKK session should always include kissing and DATY, and any SP who refuses to go to a room for a standard 50Euro session is trying to take advantage of your newness. Never go to aroom if there's no DFK and she won't allow DATY, or if she states outright that she won't go for a standard session. In fact at some clubs, they would not allow her to continue (nor would she manage to attract customers) with that attitude.
[QUOTE=Iseeu]a standard FKK session should always include kissing and DATY[/QUOTE]
Correction: DFK is NOT included in the standard session. Which means: If she does not want to kiss, she doesn't have to. But she should tell you in advance. And there's no way that kissing is charged as an extra. I know that a lot of guys think that kissing is included, but actually it is not. Nevertheless I do usually not go with girls that do not kiss.
HB
[QUOTE=Jackyo]There is the whole theme of [i]Zwangsprostitution[/i] which hangs over the whole scene. This is the reality of things.[/QUOTE]
Explain this in no uncertain terms please. Are you saying girls are forced to work there? I can understand if it is temporary to get into the country and be established, for instance. But I have talked to many girls and they all tell me it's their own choice, they owe nobody, and nobody ever made money bringing them to Germany to work.
By the way, is selection generally better leading up to Christmas as girls come from everywhere to make a little extra money and perhaps take some time off during and after Christmas? I'm thinking about making a trip around mid December and hoping for a smorgasboard. My first trip was in December and I don't remember it being all that much better than subsequent trips though.
[QUOTE=Chicafan]Explain this in no uncertain terms please. Are you saying girls are forced to work there? I can understand if it is temporary to get into the country and be established, for instance. But I have talked to many girls and they all tell me it's their own choice, they owe nobody, and nobody ever made money bringing them to Germany to work.
By the way, is selection generally better leading up to Christmas as girls come from everywhere to make a little extra money and perhaps take some time off during and after Christmas? I'm thinking about making a trip around mid December and hoping for a smorgasboard. My first trip was in December and I don't remember it being all that much better than subsequent trips though.[/QUOTE]
On the first point: Don't be so sure you are always being told the truth...and your random sample may not represent even a significant part of the whole. Also, there are signs in a girl's behaviour that might signal certain things. But how many of these girls always speak English or German? Do you speak Russian, Romanian, Polish, Uzbeki, etc?
On the second point: You want the best selection, go to Palace during a Messe week. However, there are several negatives accompanying this timing: hoards of Messe men, bad environment, rushed service and obsene hotel prices. Since there are major Messe events a few weeks before and after Christmas, that is when you will see siginicantly enlarged line-ups. But it is also the case that if you can swim into the eye of the storm --that is go just in between two large Messe events, you might hit gold: Superlative girl selection and decent hotel rates as well.
Ortos
[QUOTE=Chicafan]Explain this in no uncertain terms please. Are you saying girls are forced to work there? I can understand if it is temporary to get into the country and be established, for instance. But I have talked to many girls and they all tell me it's their own choice, they owe nobody, and nobody ever made money bringing them to Germany to work.[/QUOTE]
[quote=Ortos]On the first point: Don't be so sure you are always being told the truth...and your random sample may not represent even a significant part of the whole. Also, there are signs in a girl's behaviour that might signal certain things. But how many of these girls always speak English or German? Do you speak Russian, Romanian, Polish, Uzbeki, etc?[/quote]
The reality of this is that it does exist and I say it is a hot topic because there are off and on discussions in the government to not just go after those who force women into the profession but also those who patronize these women.
These discussions heated up during the World Cup matches held in Germany last year. Rest assured that is not the last time this topic will be brought to the fore.
According to these proposals, the intent is to have the burden of proof fall on the customers, in other words, customers will have to take steps to make sure their temporary girlfriends are there of their own free will.
I have no idea how one would actually perform this verification step. These proposals open up all sorts of issues.
Prostitution is not illegal in Germany. It is not illegal for punters to patronize prostitutes. Pimping is illegal but it does exist.
[i]Zwangsprostitution[/i] does exist and I say this in no uncertain terms. More accurately, [i]some[/i] women got there via some kind of network which brings them in.
Picture a peasant chick from say Bulgaria. How is it that she'd ever figure out how to make on her own to an FKK club in say, Hessen when she barely speaks five words in German?
My approach to this is simple: stick with Western European women, z. B. German women. They presumably have many more choices than EE women do and presumably also aren't as tainted. (Note I say [i][b]as tainted[/b][/i]. The truth is that some of them do have "boyfriends" or "husbands" who stand in the background.)
I would say that up to 50% of the Eastern European girls do have some kind of friend or manager, whatever you wanna call it. They are not allowed to keep 100% of the money they make, the share will differ immensely. There's not only black or white, there's a lot of grey in this business. And most of the girls will not always tell you the truth about the background they do have, but what do you think how all these young Romanian, Bulgarian, Polish, Hungarian girls do come to Germany? (Most of them do not speak a word of German or English when they start their "carreer" in Germany).
There's organized crime behind it, looking for young girls in these countries and bringing them to Germany and other Western European countries. If the girls want to get away, they are threatened: Violence to themselves or their relatives, telling their family what they really do in Germany and so on. They do have to pay a certain sum of money to quit or to bring a new girls. That's a fact. If you don't wanna live with it, stop clubbing. Stop using prostitution. I've seen this quite a lot of times, and it is not very nice to see, to hold a girl crying in your arms ...
And yes, there's also those very independent girls working for their own pocket, keeping all the money, spending it, sending it back to their family, investing it into a better future or whatsoever. There's girls that do get along with this job quite good, other wil have it in their nightmares forever, some do need drugs and booze, others don't.
So if a girl does not provide passionate service, maybe she's just afraid not to bring up the money she was told to bring up in a week and is frightened to get beaten up again?
Just my 2 cents on the subject. Keep on fucking.
HB
Consider for a moment how girl x living in a very eastern country, let's leave out Czech-Poland-Hungary to make it simpler a) finds out about the FKK club that she is in, b) makes arrangements for entry documents, travel, interview in club, job, accomodation etc. c) purchases a starter set of clothes, knows little of the language etc etc, in other words arrives in the club ready for work. Now consider yourself being that girl and how would you do it ?
There are a few answers. Very lucky if you know a trustworthy friend who has been there and done that and arranges it all for you. This will be a small minority. For the majority, there is an arranger who does it. For a fee. You don't have the euro's to pay it, of course? Well then you agree to "work your passage" - literally and figuratively front and back when you get there. Costs - whatever plus a large margin for the effort. Pay over time. So the majority have an "impressario" who arranges everything and takes a large fee or cut. Most continue to use the services of the agent even on multiple trips. Why? Because the agents have a direct agreement with the clubs to supply girls.
Girls who make the move permanently can indeed "freelance" and as always there are exceptions that can do it once they are established performers. Since the EU has reached a number of Central European countries, it has become somewhat easier and will continue to get easier for girls to enter into Germany on their own.
As bad or worse, is the local 'boyfriend". A number of girls have them possibly because they are somewhat vunerable mentally in their work. After all evening, they leave the club and crawl into bed with the boyfriend in an attempt to establish something akin to a normal life. Many mongers will have heard at one time or another " I don't do "X", only with the boyfriend, or only in my private life".
But two examples from two very well known clubs considered to be very much in the Premiere League- not dumps in the last few months.
Girl "x" has strong bruises to her breasts and body. Tells inquiring clients that she had a session with a rough customer who squeezed her hard during. Real story, the "boyfriend" beat her up badly and took off.
Girl "y" with a bit of wild look in her eye hurls herself literally upon a client demanding a session from him and DFK-ing him instantly before he can react. Client immediately extracts himself from her embrace as it is a bit over the top even for this true monger.
Later in speaking with two other girls, Girl "y" is sitting alone at the other end of a long series of counches, and the the two girls had seen girl "y" hurl herself at the guest. Client says "What was that?" Answer from the girls: "Girl "y" is a bit crazy. Her "boyfriend" stole all her savings and took off. Now she is broke and going a bit mental because he took all her money and her self-respect."
So, there are often "dues" to pay one way or another.
[QUOTE=Excess]Most continue to use the services of the agent even on multiple trips. Why? Because the agents have a direct agreement with the clubs to supply girls. [/QUOTE]This is why it is so hard for the women to escape this vicious circle. The management of the clubs tells the girls: if you want to work here, you have to obey to the rules (of your business partner)! Business partners will have to pay the club management for this commitment-
But this game is driven not only by the management and the business partners. Mainly by us, the mongers, because we fully support this attitude by paying our 65-75 Euro for the gate to the clubs.
I would estimate that 90+% if not all of the women from EE have "business partners" in one form or another (with regards to the share they want). Especially when the women drink a little bit too much, often you can find them as a crying bundle telling bits of the true story.
Many german women working as prostitutes have a "boyfriend" of the type mentioned by Excess. The modern pimp comes in the dress of a "lover" to suit the needs of intelligent and "independant" women.
While most prostitutes try everything to become independent money-wise, they often have very low self-esteem and are so badly dependent and insecure emotionally. That too keeps them in the vicious circle in the "milieu".
@excess
There is sense in what you describe, though I think it is a bit on the downbeat (no pun intended) side. As they have this week begun dismantling border posts between Germany and Poland it is a great deal easier for a girl to make it independently across. And many have family here, genuine family. Also there are girls who travel who already do prostitution in their own country, so they are wised up. Also girls who've done the road trip help others who want to travel the same route. Hungarians are pretty clued up as well, go to any club in Hungary and you are awash in talent. Actually I am more prepared to believe that brutality and pimping are worse in the countries from which these girls come, than in Germany itself. East European pimps hate the idea of their girls doing the charity walk to FKK land. And don't forget there is a whole pay sex scene in Germany outside clubs and laufhäuse, touchingly called the Hobbyhure scene. Mongers should try to branch out while in Germany. If you have a budget of say 500euros why not for a change have a really classy act from one of the 'members' websites such as Freiclub.de, or free sites like nrwerotik.com. 6today.de, or sexrelax.de or eurobella.de - they are easy to understand. It's sex, so it should be!
@Jackyo
It is interesting that this topic is a discussion on an English speaking forum and never raised on the German forums. English speakers worry about the darkside because it is more prevelant in their own countries and 'the sordid world of girls forced into pay sex' is the politically correct attitude of the English/American press.
The furore during the World Cup was farcical. The Swedish government pleaded with Berlin to ban prostitution (how Swedish) the British govt wrote to Beckham and co asking them as examples of chaste behaviour to persuade the fans not to visit sex emporiums while in Germany. Incredible as all brit footballers do is order girls and booze by the gross! The Germans made all sorts of nice noises back, none of which they intended to follow up. The rate at which clubs are opening defies any pretence that somehow paysex is an issue in Germany. Raids are conducted on establishments, which I think is only fair on girls who want to work under good legal conditions. The raids are more akin to the fraud squad in normal business perhaps! Or even consumer protection! I wouldn't lose any sleep over the issue: not until the Russian mafia turn up on your door at least.