Sosua Reports

[QUOTE=GringoItaliano;1991462]I was not intoxicated. I do not drink alcohol when I am mongering, for security reasons and other reasons. I did not have a single alcoholic beverage during my entire trip.[/QUOTE]I was not specifically referring to you but it was a general observation that when one is drunk, one is likely to attract dodgy characters. I mentioned the dark roads around New Garden hotel, because that is a bad spot and people have been approached there with wrong intentions.

Overall, I have to say that I am amazed that someone physically hit you for just saying NO. It is somewhat uncharacteristic even though I can barely say that I know them all. I am at the airport now and I dare say, nothing out of the ordinary happened. Well one woman I had liked the look of, in front of Merengue, and had given me her number, told me the next afternoon that she was looking for 3000 pesos for an hour, at 3 pm. She just got a "Gracias and buenas suerte". My average was about 1250 pesos for a rendezvous, on average.

[QUOTE=SubCmdr;1991612]Mr. GringoItaliano,

Thank you for you excellent MitA (Man in the Arena) report. You have been spending a lot of time defending yourself from critics. They don't matter!

Your experiences are valid and they cannot be invalidated. You got people calling for self examination. Seriously? Someone posting about buying prostitutes in Sousa has the nerve to call out another person doing the same thing but having a different experience. GTF! You stated the reasons you believed you had a bad experience on your second visit. They remain valid. But you have to remember three things:

1. The Law of Supply and Demand.

2. Theft is deeply embedded within Dominican Society. There are few at any level, position or station that feels it's not OK to straight up steal.

3. The character of the individuals you are dealing with.

4. The Law of Personal Preferences.

Number two and three tie into each other and each of us on an individual level can only be aware and cannot do much to change. 1 & 4 are within our complete control. It's hard to tell somebody who they should be fucking and how much they should be paying. But hey these critical motherfuckers are here doing exactly that.

My Sosua experience is limited. But of the three women I dealt with there only one made a deal, provided great service and stuck to it. The other two both tried to steal from me in some way. Or if hustling isn't considered theft (I think it is). Then only one didn't try to hustle me in someway.

During my trip had a gang of girls try to accost me while while walking home similar to what you experienced. That was pre-crackdown. Now it was not a pleasant experience but I would file it under "there are worse problems to have. " The more challenges we face in life and overcome the better we get at handling similar problems in the future. For those who feel Mr. GringoItaliano is a heretic speaking among the Sosua faithful, chill the fuck out! You don't have to burn him at the stake. He has chosen self exile.

I enjoyed your post Mr. GringoItaliano. It's current and I have no reason not to believe it. It won't ever stop me from returning to Sosua. But hey, I got more pussy in Santo Domingo that I have time to fuck and Boca Chica is right down the road.[/QUOTE]Well said MrSub.

We have so many different takes on Sosua, I sometime find it hard to believe we are talking about the same place.

Sosua, Dominican Republic, right?

Everybody is different, and a newbie can luck out or have a bad time on any single day, but veteran posters here have such different experiences and attitudes towards the locals and chicas, that it is obvious that they see everyday Sosua through a different pair of glasses. It's like the 3 blind men describing an elephant.

Sosua is what it is. It is not for everybody.

Aside from the seasonal highs and lows, it is pretty much unchanging, and the locals are the same from year to year. The locals I met 8 years ago are still doing basically the same work in different spots all over town. Life there goes on.

Remember, it is what YOU bring to Sosua, that primarily determines the quality of your experience.

Any idiot can get a general idea of what to expect by checking out YouTube, or even a detailed blow by blow account and a budget, by reading recent posts here. My first time, I was happy that it was more or less as described here!

There is no use whatsoever in complaining about the chicas because they are not Asian, Brazilian, Columbian, European, too fat, too ugly, whatever.

There is no use whatsoever in complaining about the character of the putas, or the morals of the locals. They are mostly dirt poor families surviving on the avails of prostitution. They are in survival mode, living from day to day. Prositution is a legitimate profession there, but unregulated and most grown ups know what that can entail, so keep a weather eye out, always!

If you drop the tendency to compare them with others, at home, or abroad, and understand who you are dealing with, and adjust your demands and expectations accordingly, you can, like a lot of us, have variety of very enjoyable relationships, and casual experiences that you cannot wait to go back and repeat.

All set against a backdrop of beautiful, colorful, safe tropical restaurants and beaches.

(On another level, there is a mutual respect involved, but not the hooker / john / pimp / mama shit that is so despised in the West, but I won't get into THAT flame war here!

Why none of those Haitian chicks in Sosua resemble Miss Haiti?

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;1992169]Why none of those Haitian chicks in Sosua resemble Miss Haiti?[/QUOTE]Why would they need to go to Sousa? If they look like Miss Haiti they probably don't need too.

Mr. Oakie,

We got individuals comparing girls in Sosua Forum to girls in (name the country of your choice). Why? We got individuals posting pictures of girls from other countries in the Sosua Forum. Why? We got individuals hating on other individuals who either have more money than them or are willing to spend more money than them. Why?

[QUOTE=Wrx2005;1991575]IMO the influx of mongers coming to Sosua and throwing money at these chicas is what I think has more impact on driving the price of pussy up. The "make it rain" mob of guys spending hundreds of dollars on these chicas, that IMO has contributed greatly to these price gouging monsters. . .The heavy numbers of WU novios and suckers sending tons of regular and upon request money to these women. Getting chicas set up in apartments, helping them get a salon up and running, buying them cars, furniture. A lot of guys are spoiling these women to the 10th power. You sit down at any restaurant, bar, club, in their villas and see how many guys are spending money like water on these women. . .I will sit down to talk to guys who openly tell me how much money they spend to get a chica they want up in Classicos or Merengue. Over 100 dollars bro, and proud of it. . .Guys are spending money on chicas back in the states and elsewhere and bringing earned and unearned gifts.[/QUOTE]You got guys hating on the music being played in different establishments.

[QUOTE=Manizales911;1990466]I'm almost 60 and can't fucking stand the thug life rap bullshit music scene there, to each their own but it's not for me, you won't find that rap shit at City Lights[/QUOTE]I don't understand it.

There are so many options out there. A beach, so many places to eat, so many places to drink, so many ways to find Ho's and it's all in such a compact area where you can walk. And as for the dangers of taking a moto I don't really see it. The streets of Sosua when it comes to traffic is nothing compared to Santo Domingo. I'll jump on one in a minute in Sosua or Boca Chica. In Santo Domingo I'll walk until my feet are bloody, then I'll crawl until I pass out, before I get on one. It's hard for me to fathom how you could go to Sosua and not have a good time. I used to own a on-premises sex club. On the inside of the front door I had a sign. It said: "If you came here and you didn't have a good time. It was your own damn fault"! I feel that way about Sosua.

Now I've read where people say it's Adult Disneyland. I have to take issue with that characterization of Sosua. Because my man Walt ran his operation with a strong pimp hand. He had his rules and standards and if you were working for him and got out of line, he would pimp slap you in a minute or let you go (depending upon your violation). He controlled everything that went on inside of his park. Sosua is no where near that. It's not even a all inclusive. It's more like a open air market where you have to fend for yourself to get good deals.

Over the years my perspective of Disneyland has changed dramatically. From when I used to go there all the time as a kid. One summer had so many relatives come and visit us that I went 7 times in one summer. I was sick of the rat house. My perspective changed again when I was a little older and My Dad took my brother and I there on a trip for the "men". Then my perspective changed on it again when I returned with my daughter as an adult and parent.

Now, if I had of written a trip report with those three different perspectives they would have read dramatically different. Although I suspect Walt and his successors have done a excellent job continuing to provide consistent level of service. A fact proven by continued growth and the fat bottom line they post on a quarterly basis.

[QUOTE=Oakie;1991954]We have so many different takes on Sosua, I sometime find it hard to believe we are talking about the same place.

Sosua, Dominican Republic, right?

Everybody is different, and a newbie can luck out or have a bad time on any single day, but veteran posters here have such different experiences and attitudes towards the locals and chicas, that it is obvious that they see everyday Sosua through a different pair of glasses. It's like the 3 blind men describing an elephant.[/QUOTE]Damn straight Mr. Oakie. Everyone overlooks the idea of the paradigm (a distinct set of concepts or thought patterns). Taken from Wikipedia "Paradigms have two aspects. Firstly, within normal science, the term refers to the set of exemplary experiments that are likely to be copied or emulated. Secondly, underpinning this set of exemplars are shared preconceptions, made prior to and conditioning the collection of evidence. These preconceptions embody both hidden assumptions and elements that he describes as quasi-metaphysical; the interpretations of the paradigm may vary among individual scientists."

Mr. GringoItaliano actual did a excellent job comparing one of his trips to another. When I return to Sosua it will not be the same as my first time there. When we write a report we are all exhibiting these preconceptions and hidden assumptions that cause each of use to interpret our experiences differently. What is really important is accurate useful information. Where the ho's at? How much did you pay? I enjoy reading about the personal experiences of others. I read to learn how to enhance my own experiences. If someone writes they got ATM for a 1000 pesos, I'm like damn brother was she really that freaky!

Unfortunately there is always some character willing to clown someone over their stories or trip report. You paid too much. You couldn't have paid that and received that. I've been going there for years and that's never happen. My experiences differ from yours. There must be something wrong with you. Goto Thailand (or insert the county of your choice) the girls there are better and here is a picture. I monger all over the world and Sosua ain't shit! (But you go there right)? WTF?

[QUOTE=Oakie;1991954]Sosua is what it is. It is not for everybody. . .Aside from the seasonal highs and lows, it is pretty much unchanging, and the locals are the same from year to year. The locals I met 8 years ago are still doing basically the same work in different spots all over town. Life there goes on. . .Remember, it is what YOU bring to Sosua, that primarily determines the quality of your experience. . .If you drop the tendency to compare them with others, at home, or abroad, and understand who you are dealing with, and adjust your demands and expectations accordingly, you can, like a lot of us, have variety of very enjoyable relationships, and casual experiences that you cannot wait to go back and repeat. . .All set against a backdrop of beautiful, colorful, safe tropical restaurants and beaches.[/QUOTE]I couldn't have said it better my man. Preach my brother!

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;1992169]Why none of those Haitian chicks in Sosua resemble Miss Haiti?[/QUOTE]They, and their cousins, beautiful Dominicanas, can be found all over the Island.

But you won't find them being passed around by old fart mongers sitting around the New Garden, for 1000 pesos.

Believe it or not, my buddy and I bring in stunners like that from around the country, usually with a friend or relative for their comfort level and fun. There is no menu, no meter running. But you take care of their expenses while in town. We get a nice large beachfront condo (or two) to party in. They like to cook.

But these are semi pros who have other lives, and the respect I was talking about earlier, prevents me from posting their pictures.

It's not mongering, it's steak vs hamburger and obviously costs more. But not as much as one would think. These are top shelf girls who are happy to hang around a nice condo for a few days. And, unlike big city escorts or Vegas strippers, they are domesticated, unassuming, compliant, will wash your T shirts, shorts and socks, and are in no hurry to go home!

But on our last trip after all the imports had gone home, I mongered in town and found two stunners, one pro who wouldn't be seen on the main drag, (she works from her phone only) and one semi, a bartender in Sosua, but was too jaded by that time to do more than one of them twice.

Yes, the next Miss Haiti, and Miss Dominican Republic can be found, but not hanging around the New Garden pool at 8 am, unless you are are very, very lucky. :)

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;1992169]Why none of those Haitian chicks in Sosua resemble Miss Haiti?[/QUOTE]Because they are real Haitians and she is not.

Mr. GringoItaliano reported the following negotiating conditions. And the techniques he used:

[QUOTE=GringoItaliano;1990892]On average, I paid twice what I paid seven months before. According to some chicas, they want higher rates because they need a larger stash to bribe themselves out of jail or in order to justify the risk of arrest. Perhaps skyrocketing prices may also attract new chicas that would normally avoid this business but find the higher rates irresistible, and perhaps such chicas may provide lower-quality service. Chicas were also less flexible on rates this time. Many chicas on my last trip asked me to name my price, and they always accepted my first offer. Seven months later, only a few asked me to name my price, and none of them accepted my first offers.[/QUOTE][QUOTE=GringoItaliano;1991331]Prices might not double just because a chica says so, but chicas do control what offers they will or will not accept. Prices do effectively double if chicas only accept offers twice as high as what they used to accept. I either had to accept that prices have increased across the board or go back to NG with blue balls, as I could not find any attractive chicas that would accept the same prices from seven months ago, or even moderate increases. The "Sosua Puta Union" must have decided to push for higher rates.

At the beginning of this trip, I was proactive in naming my price, not passive. I offered rates comparable to what I paid on my last trip; chicas rejected such offers, and some of them seemed to take offense at what may have genuinely struck them as low ball offers in the new, post-crackdown market. Yes, I had the power to walk way, and I exercised it. I made similar offers to other chicas and received similar reactions..[/QUOTE]Let's talk a minute about negotiating skills. I've seen positions that the man should state what he is willing to spend and not move off it. If the she doesn't accept, move on.

Mr. WRX is in this camp:

[QUOTE=Wrx2005;1991575]It's not like you don't have power in this game. You also have control over what offers you will or will not accept. And you also have control over who you choose to hire to fuck. If a chick you choose, doesn't choose to work for you, you simply find another who will. There is nothing wrong with a guy taking the night off if he doesnt find someone suitable. If tons of chicas had returned to Sosua, including a lot of new chicas just getting started, that there might have been more chicas available to accept your offers? Competition has a way of humbling enough of these chicas.

But you arent likely to see much of that competition with a skeleton crew of chicas on hand to choose from.[/QUOTE]Opportunities for having your offer accepted depends on the amount of the offer and number of choices available for both parties on the supply and the demand side.

A few general Negotiating Advice / Tips.

Be dignified: One should maintain the decorum of the place and should not stoop to any level for getting the best deal. Remember it is just a discussion, not a battle field. If you are not satisfied with the deal.

Be very clear in your communication: Stay firm on your quotes and do not change statements quite often. Don't play with words or try to confuse others. One needs to be straightforward from the very beginning.

Be a good listener: Don't jump to conclusions; instead listen to what the other party offers. Understand their situation well. If the deal is not benefiting the other party, they will obviously not accept it. When a customer goes to purchase something, he must not forget that the seller needs to earn a profits also. The seller should also understand the customer's needs and pocket. Negotiation depends on mutual understanding.

This aligns with what Mr. Oakie as said in the past:

Mr. Oakie adds the following insights:

[QUOTE=Oakie;1991125]Street hookers will always ask you for money, or a propina, or a regalo para bambina, even after you have paid them.[/QUOTE][QUOTE=Oakie;1991954]On another level, there is a mutual respect involved, but not the hooker / john / pimp / mama shit that is so despised in the West![/QUOTE]Be reasonable: Don't quote anything just for the sake of it. Be reasonable. Don't quote imaginary or unusually high figures. Don't ask for anything you yourself know is not possible. It will just be wastage of time and no one would benefit out of it.

This last point would seem to play into what Mr. Frannie was saying:

[QUOTE=Frannie;1991397]Another way to look at it is that the chicas are all in competition with each other, casting doubt on the notion of a "union". Perhaps it is simply a question of a rising cost of living in the DR. 1000 pesos is less than $25. What can you buy for that price in the DR these days?[/QUOTE]I like to hear a girl's offer. If it's in range then we have a place to start from. I can offer something below what I know she will accept and see if I can get a lower offer. Often times a pause of indifference or rejection will get them to negotiate against themselves. Immediately lowering their first offer and putting into an acceptable range or at least getting us in the same ballpark. I don't do a lot of negotiating in person. I work the phone much more. But even in that situation I don't change how negotiate. But I you do lose the immediacy of action right now. But I'm comfortable with that. I like to have everything in place prior to meeting.

I know there is more than one way to negotiate a deal. I would like to hear more thoughts from others on this issue.

[QUOTE=CharlesPooter;1992342]Because they are real Haitians and she is not.[/QUOTE]Because she is part Filipina on her mother's side. Do I win the prize for the correct answer?

[QUOTE=Frannie;1992524]Because she is part Filipina on her mother's side. Do I win the prize for the correct answer?[/QUOTE]You could get one for taste, but only if if you subscribed to the theory that mixed race girls are the most attractive.

[QUOTE=Oakie;1992525]You could get one for taste, but only if if you subscribed to the theory that mixed race girls are the most attractive.[/QUOTE]The question was why do the Haitians in Sosua not resemble Miss Haiti, and the answer is because she is part Filipina and they are not. Attractiveness has nothing to do with it. I don't find her particularly attractive and in fact I find her personality ingratiating and I don't like the way she claims some additional virtue by reason of having survived the earthquake of 2010. Raquel Pelissier was raising funds on Gofundme for her participation in Ms. Universe, and yet she is apparently sufficiently well-funded to attend graduate school in Madrid and seems to come from a family with some means. Very little seems to be written about her or her family background, but she is described as a 'professional model', whatever that means.

[QUOTE=Frannie;1992541]The question was why do the Haitians in Sosua not resemble Miss Haiti, and the answer is because she is part Filipina and they are not. Attractiveness has nothing to do with it. I don't find her particularly attractive and in fact I find her personality ingratiating and I don't like the way she claims some additional virtue by reason of having survived the earthquake of 2010. Raquel Pelissier was raising funds on Gofundme for her participation in Ms. Universe, and yet she is apparently sufficiently well-funded to attend graduate school in Madrid and seems to come from a family with some means. Very little seems to be written about her or her family background, but she is described as a 'professional model', whatever that means.[/QUOTE]This is her without all the tarting up. Attractive girl, but I saw three who were better looking and more typically Haitian in Pedro Clisante the other day. One was really stunning.

[QUOTE=CharlesPooter;1992546]This is her without all the tarting up. Attractive girl, but I saw three who were better looking and more typically Haitian in Pedro Clisante the other day. One was really stunning.[/QUOTE]Looks better there, to me, than in her Miss Universe pictures. Kind of clean-cut, girl next door type. Probably looking for more than 1000 pesos, though her Twitter account includes a photograph of Boca Chica, though not Sosua.

Look, let's not kid ourselves. Miss Haiti is a very attractive woman. She's more attractive than 95% of the Haitianas in Sosua. But not 100%. And every one of us who has done this hobby for any length of time has experienced a 7 in looks who was a 10 in attitude, whom we'd much rather spend time with and certainly rather repeat with, than anyone who is a 10 in looks but a 3 in attitude.

[QUOTE=Frannie;1992541]The question was why do the Haitians in Sosua not resemble Miss Haiti, and the answer is because she is part Filipina and they are not. Attractiveness has nothing to do with it. I don't find her particularly attractive and in fact I find her personality ingratiating and I don't like the way she claims some additional virtue by reason of having survived the earthquake of 2010. Raquel Pelissier was raising funds on Gofundme for her participation in Ms. Universe, and yet she is apparently sufficiently well-funded to attend graduate school in Madrid and seems to come from a family with some means. Very little seems to be written about her or her family background, but she is described as a 'professional model', whatever that means.[/QUOTE]Here's a good example of what I why one man's experience in Sosua, is not transferable to another.

Frannie finds her ingratiating and not attractive.

Which is fine for him personally, but she is chosen to represent her country by mainstream Universally acknowledged beauty standards, and she will fit right in with her fellow competitors from around the world in the Miss Universe Contest.

One man's meat is another man's poison, so be wary of following one individual's appraisal and approval rating of chicas.

He could be out of the mainstream.

For most, the scale of 1 to 10, when applied to external appearance, is universally understood.

(And I do believe the question as posed, inferred comparative attractiveness, because this is a mongers forum!, not Anthropology Today) :)