FKK Sharks - Darmstadt

[QUOTE=HappyTour;2887227]Before covid, the price schema 50/30 or 100/60 lasted almost 20 years.

At 2019, some girls such as Melissa, Denise (now Kitty), Anna-Mari, Anastasia (Kathleen) etc, started to raise prices to 150/60 and usually refused 30 min sessions only for one hour or longer sessions.

Stingy customers didn't want to pay 150 for one pop.

So around 2021, some average girls smartly offered "cheaper" packages for these guys 100 for one cum but 30 min should finish. So these customers accepted 100/30 in order to save 50 for each pop.

Since then we entered 100/30 era.

However these cheap customers actually ruined prices system. Because their actions potentially gave girls expectations to further hike prices. Since 30 min session charge 100 euro, why not 200 for one hour.

Then soon top girls who originally charged 150/60 now charge 200/60.

All other average girls followed the trend since mid-2023 .

Now some girls start to offer 150/30 with "GFE". Customers who don't like 200/60 but they accept 150/30 for fast cum because they could "save" 50.

The vicious cycle has begun. 300/60 in the near future? Cheap Charlies makes it.[/QUOTE]Sounds like mental gymnastics for the guys who gave up the 200 e per hour ask. If a theory takes that many conditions to connect, it's probably been over complicated. Gymnastics.

I do my 1 hour rooms but appreciate the 30 minute try outs too. But many guys don't even want more than a 25 minute quick pop. The 30 minute room has always been the cornerstone of the FKK style. It still is. It has a plurality if not a majority of room times. And who's to say there's a wrong way to fuck hookers? Calling them stingy for seeing that it's a bad deal to pay 150 e when all they need or even want is to get a nut out with a brothel hooker. So many just decided to only pay for what they want, not because they're stingy, but because they have no desire to spend 1 hour with a hooker.

It's like telling someone to pay $150 for 2 hotel nights when you just need one night. Who cares if the second night is a better deal when you don't need or want it.

The 100/30 and 150/ HR point was the final acceptable compromise. The 200 e per hour guys, those are the ones who pushed it to the final breaking point.

[QUOTE=HappyTour;2887227]Before covid, the price schema 50/30 or 100/60 lasted almost 20 years.

At 2019, some girls such as Melissa, Denise (now Kitty), Anna-Mari, Anastasia (Kathleen) etc, started to raise prices to 150/60 and usually refused 30 min sessions only for one hour or longer sessions.

Stingy customers didn't want to pay 150 for one pop.

So around 2021, some average girls smartly offered "cheaper" packages for these guys 100 for one cum but 30 min should finish. So these customers accepted 100/30 in order to save 50 for each pop.

Since then we entered 100/30 era.

However these cheap customers actually ruined prices system. Because their actions potentially gave girls expectations to further hike prices. Since 30 min session charge 100 euro, why not 200 for one hour.

Then soon top girls who originally charged 150/60 now charge 200/60.

All other average girls followed the trend since mid-2023 .

Now some girls start to offer 150/30 with "GFE". Customers who don't like 200/60 but they accept 150/30 for fast cum because they could "save" 50.

The vicious cycle has begun. 300/60 in the near future? Cheap Charlies makes it.[/QUOTE]You know so few: 100/30 and 150/60 became after covid lockdown when Germans and locals paid this. Nevertheless, in 2021 with only very few tourists and Asians, could still find some high level girls for still 100/60 and I had many and with my best 2021 Sharks girl and I also gave her 150/80 on August 2023 for a great room with great sex, not a small pussy but a woman. But why to pay more expensive for lower quality where most Sharks girls fell, when now higher quality elsewhere in Germany.

[QUOTE=HappyTour;2887227]Before covid, the price schema 50/30 or 100/60 lasted almost 20 years.

At 2019, some girls such as Melissa, Denise (now Kitty), Anna-Mari, Anastasia (Kathleen) etc, started to raise prices to 150/60 and usually refused 30 min sessions only for one hour or longer sessions.

Stingy customers didn't want to pay 150 for one pop.

So around 2021, some average girls smartly offered "cheaper" packages for these guys 100 for one cum but 30 min should finish. So these customers accepted 100/30 in order to save 50 for each pop.

Since then we entered 100/30 era.

However these cheap customers actually ruined prices system. Because their actions potentially gave girls expectations to further hike prices. Since 30 min session charge 100 euro, why not 200 for one hour.

Then soon top girls who originally charged 150/60 now charge 200/60.

All other average girls followed the trend since mid-2023 .

Now some girls start to offer 150/30 with "GFE". Customers who don't like 200/60 but they accept 150/30 for fast cum because they could "save" 50.

The vicious cycle has begun. 300/60 in the near future? Cheap Charlies makes it.[/QUOTE]Sorry but much of this is just factually incorrect. The 100/30 started with the change to German law of 2017. Basically paying for BBBJ became illegal. And so girls would say fine to fully covered 50/30. But would do illegal BBBJ for 100/30. This started right after the 2017 law. And then it spread like a disease. If I can charge extra for BBBJ why not extra for kissing. And DATY. All started in 2017 w change of the law.

Absolutely nothing to do with COVID. At all.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2887554]Sorry but much of this is just factually incorrect. The 100/30 started with the change to German law of 2017. Basically paying for BBBJ became illegal. And so girls would say fine to fully covered 50/30. But would do illegal BBBJ for 100/30. This started right after the 2017 law. And then it spread like a disease. If I can charge extra for BBBJ why not extra for kissing. And DATY. All started in 2017 w change of the law.

Absolutely nothing to do with COVID. At all.[/QUOTE]There were plenty of girls who would charge extra for things like kissing, DATY, rimming (and whatever else you can imagine) well [B]before[/B] the 2017 law. You negotiated for what you wanted YMMV. The thing about post 2017 law change is that a 50 euros upcharge for a BBBJ became damn near universal! That's the unique thing around BJs. Pretty much every FKK tute in Germany now tacks on 50 euros extra for providing a BBBJ. And then depending on the girl, they went on continuing to do things they were doing pre-2017, like up charging for kissing, etc. Charging extra for a BBBJ may be only an FKK thing. I don't know. I mean I don't recall reading a lot of reports of RLD tutes doing that. And what about pricing for independent escorts? I wonder if there was a pricing impact from the 2017 law on that part of the business too? Don't know as I don't like going the escort route, but it's interesting to think about.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2887554]Sorry but much of this is just factually incorrect. The 100/30 started with the change to German law of 2017. Basically paying for BBBJ became illegal. And so girls would say fine to fully covered 50/30. But would do illegal BBBJ for 100/30. This started right after the 2017 law. And then it spread like a disease. If I can charge extra for BBBJ why not extra for kissing. And DATY. All started in 2017 w change of the law.

Absolutely nothing to do with COVID. At all.[/QUOTE]The last time I was in Germany was from January to March, 2020 and 50/30 and 100/60 was the norm. I paid no more than that and I went with many girls including the hottest ones.

[QUOTE=Turgid;2887662]The last time I was in Germany was from January to March, 2020 and 50/30 and 100/60 was the norm. I paid no more than that and I went with many girls including the hottest ones.[/QUOTE]50/30 with BBBJ?

[QUOTE=Turgid;2887662]The last time I was in Germany was from January to March, 2020 and 50/30 and 100/60 was the norm. I paid no more than that and I went with many girls including the hottest ones.[/QUOTE]I confirm, til March 2020 , including FK, DATY and BBBJ, for most Sharks girls, except Melissa who also worked at Palace on 2019 . When law played on 1 July 2017,0 upselling at Sharks for BBBJ when they wish for CIM for extra and saving vagina, til March 2020 , but increasing under covid for business in hotels or appartments. On 2021 , could still find 100/60 with full GFE at Sharks, had more than 10 rooms. Yesterday at Oase, 100/40+ and she was really not rushing to leave the room, I think my way and behavior relaxed her, when she would be one of the prettiest at Sharks and Globe, my eyes preferring Oase casting.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2887649]There were plenty of girls who would charge extra for things like kissing, DATY, rimming (and whatever else you can imagine) well [B]before[/B] the 2017 law. You negotiated for what you wanted YMMV. The thing about post 2017 law change is that a 50 euros upcharge for a BBBJ became damn near universal! That's the unique thing around BJs. Pretty much every FKK tute in Germany now tacks on 50 euros extra for providing a BBBJ. And then depending on the girl, they went on continuing to do things they were doing pre-2017, like up charging for kissing, etc. Charging extra for a BBBJ may be only an FKK thing. I don't know. I mean I don't recall reading a lot of reports of RLD tutes doing that. And what about pricing for independent escorts? I wonder if there was a pricing impact from the 2017 law on that part of the business too? Don't know as I don't like going the escort route, but it's interesting to think about.[/QUOTE]Once again, or they really must love to swallow my seminal, no Sharks and same in other German clubs never charged me extra 50 after 1 July 2017 , when I had to explain new law to some girls, explaining customer would be guilty, not the girl. Still BBBJ and even AO despite law. Law only worked for registration, Mio. De leaving German business and my beloved Daria. Ro leaving business. Not EU or not living in Germany since 5 years can t register. Reason why no fresh Ukrainian nor Russian nor even Moldavia from Republic. Few exceptions about war in Ukraine.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2887554]Sorry but much of this is just factually incorrect. The 100/30 started with the change to German law of 2017. Basically paying for BBBJ became illegal. And so girls would say fine to fully covered 50/30. But would do illegal BBBJ for 100/30. This started right after the 2017 law. And then it spread like a disease. If I can charge extra for BBBJ why not extra for kissing. And DATY. All started in 2017 w change of the law.

Absolutely nothing to do with COVID. At all.[/QUOTE]You know nothing at all about FKK.

Stay with your romance novels writing about fat woman at Scandallo Brazil and Seeking arrangements.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2887554]This started right after the 2017 law. And then it spread like a disease. If I can charge extra for BBBJ why not extra for kissing. And DATY. All started in 2017 w change of the law.[/QUOTE]Sorry Steve, you lack some experience. Hehe.

I have been around since early 00's. Before the time of Sharks and Mainhattan. But after the closedown of the legendary Atlantis (hey, I am not that old!). The first time I experienced upselling (for GF-package of BBBJ / DATY / DFK) and 100 E /30 was around 2007. At Palace. During exhibitions with huge crowds. Upselling is nothing new.

The problem was easy to solve. ISG worked perfectly then with warnings from experienced mongers. Oase and World were still solid (better) upselling-free alternatives with hotter girls. The regulars to FKK clubs moved to these two clubs and left Palace to the "tourists".

Around 5 years later the upselling "disease" had spread to Oase and new clubs Mainhattan and Sharks. But only among a minority of girls who could easily be replaced by better options. ISG still functioned perfectly with warnings about who the upsellers were and constant reminders that BBBJ/DFK/DATY are NOT extras. Some "tourists" would never listen and paid an overprice. Usually the ones with few visits and plenty of money, or the ignorant/weak ones with lack of self confidence. Either way, the "two price system" that we see today has in fact been around for at least 10- 15 years.

Then the 2017 law. Two things happened:

1.

More girls (but far from all) took advantage and started upselling.

2.

The "Kondomplicht" made it complicated to talk about BBBJ. The more experienced mongers stopped reporting or moved to local forums leaving ISG to the "tourists" who were willing to accept upselling.

We can endlessly debate whether the going rate for a GFE session with the hottest girls changed from 100 E /60 to 150/60 in 2017,2018, 2019,2020, 2021 or 2022. The truth is that for some it already started around 2012 (or perhaps 2007 if you are a Palace fanboy). Personally the struggle started around ten years after (post covid).

I still (2023) got hot/great looking regulars at the Hessen FKK clubs providing amazing 100 E /60 sessions. But they are few. And I read on ISG a couple of years ago that one of them charged 150/60 with reduced performance. That is just so funny. I am curious to know if they charge some guys 200 E /60 or 250E/60 now, but I have not dared to ask. LOL!

Sorry about another boring price discussion. Everyone have their own experience. The only thing that is important is to spread the awareness of a two price system. And it varies from girl to girl, from gent to gent, and from day to day. How we deal with that is up to each and every one.

- S16.

[QUOTE=Shark16;2887871]Personally the struggle started around ten years after (post covid).[/QUOTE]I apologize for my horrible English. What I meant was that I started struggling with finding good 100 E /60 sessions with new girls from around 2021 or 2022. Thus, accordring to my my own experiences, the going rate changed to 150 E /60 during this period.

I am still (2023) not paying 200 E /60 as I find girls with those quotes easily replaceable. But to each their own. And of course, I still don't know what 2024 will bring.

[QUOTE=Shark16;2887903]I apologize for my horrible English. What I meant was that I started struggling with finding good 100 E /60 sessions with new girls from around 2021 or 2022. Thus, accordring to my my own experiences, the going rate changed to 150 E /60 during this period.

I am still (2023) not paying 200 E /60 as I find girls with those quotes easily replaceable. But to each their own. And of course, I still don't know what 2024 will bring.[/QUOTE][QUOTE=Shark16;2887871]Sorry Steve, you lack some experience. Hehe.

I have been around since early 00's. Before the time of Sharks and Mainhattan. But after the closedown of the legendary Atlantis (hey, I am not that old!). The first time I experienced upselling (for GF-package of BBBJ / DATY / DFK) and 100 E /30 was around 2007. At Palace. During exhibitions with huge crowds. Upselling is nothing new.

The problem was easy to solve. ISG worked perfectly then with warnings from experienced mongers. Oase and World were still solid (better) upselling-free alternatives with hotter girls. The regulars to FKK clubs moved to these two clubs and left Palace to the "tourists".

Around 5 years later the upselling "disease" had spread to Oase and new clubs Mainhattan and Sharks. But only among a minority of girls who could easily be replaced by better options. ISG still functioned perfectly with warnings about who the upsellers were and constant reminders that BBBJ/DFK/DATY are NOT extras. Some "tourists" would never listen and paid an overprice. Usually the ones with few visits and plenty of money, or the ignorant/weak ones with lack of self confidence. Either way, the "two price system" that we see today has in fact been around for at least 10- 15 years.

Then the 2017 law. Two things happened:

1.

More girls (but far from all) took advantage and started upselling.

2.

The "Kondomplicht" made it complicated to talk about BBBJ. The more experienced mongers stopped reporting or moved to local forums leaving ISG to the "tourists" who were willing to accept upselling..[/QUOTE]The bottom line is that upcharging has been a part of the FKK scene in Germany for a long, long time. Like a couple of decades at least? Prior to 2017 and the condom law there were two standard, "official" upcharges: 50 euros for CIM and 100 euros for anal (50 in the NRW). I always did have the most expensive tastes LOL! But then you would find girls trying to impose "unofficial" upcharges for all sorts of other things. Some guys found it worth it to pay for those extras while others did not. For example, I have never paid extra for kissing and never will. I don't value it that much while others do. And so on and so forth regarding other types of upcharges. What 2017 served to do is usher in a new, standard but still unofficial upcharge: 50 euros extra for a BBBJ.

The problem for mongers is that this particular unofficial upcharge is more far reaching and impactful than other unsanctioned upcharges because it's the result of a law that applies to everybody, and not the result of an individual girl's particular preferences or whims. So now pretty much all of the girls feel they have leverage to demand 50 euros more for providing this now illegal service (BBBJs), and as a result, the financial dynamics of the business have been altered, with some mongers even being priced out. And to make matters worse, some tutes are "pushing the envelope" trying to charge 200+ euros for an hour without really adding anything additional to the package! Hell, I'm willing to pay 300+ per hour, but I better be getting value for my money. For that kind of money I better be getting a BBBJ, CIM, vaginal sex, and anal sex. No? Then she can gets to stepping right out of my face!

[QUOTE=SobeLizard;2887852]You know nothing at all about FKK.

Stay with your romance novels writing about fat woman at Scandallo Brazil and Seeking arrangements.[/QUOTE]I've seen a lot of the chicks he's banged and I can maybe count on 1 hand the thick ones. 🤣 Dude is a legend not sure why the hate. He's literally done it all and is the most experienced monger I know.

[QUOTE=BlueMoon22;2887257]I don't think any of the clubs I went in they would do anything for 50. I forget which ones said but 2 of the clubs said the minimum for girls. I think Artemis said maybe 70? Maybe 90. Then OASE said min was 50.[/QUOTE]Some WGs still do 50 for 30. They're not easy to find, and they won't be the best looking, but they do exist.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2887909]But then you would find girls trying to impose "unofficial" upcharges for all sorts of other things. Some guys found it worth it to pay for those extras while others did not. For example, I have never paid extra for kissing and never will. I don't value it that much while others do. And so on and so forth regarding other types of upcharges. [/QUOTE]That's right. If you show weakness, some girls will try to upcharge for anything, like:

- BLS
- DFK.
- DATY.
- Massage.
- COB.
- COT.

- FIP.
- FIA.
- Rimming.

NONE of the above did qualify for an extra back in the day. And the decent providers STILL do not quote extras for these "services". Of course, the three bottom services are not standard services and you risk a "no" that must be respected (or the use of condom in the case of FIP/FIA). The first six a large majority of girls will consider included in the base price of 100E/30 or 150E/60. Most of the time without saying. But you may want to check 1- 2 of them with the girl if this is crucial to you (typically a DFK fundamentalist need to check this service with the girl before the session).

That is from a Hessen perspective of course. Those who visit Hamburg / Bavira will know that many of these "services" have been extra for more than 20 years. They have a totally different tradition.