Vienna

[QUOTE=DeltaIndigo;2181086]I really do not understand this answer, you acknowledge the increased upselling and I argued that it was not justified, are you saying that in your opinion it is okay since it is still good value for money?

If that is what you are saying in your answer, that is fine.[/QUOTE]I don't like upselling at all and I wanted to point it out. I was actually surprised that an indiviual provider like Angela is doing it now as well and even to a local regular. That was my initial point. I don't really think it is ok, and it is for sure not justified, but I see why it is happening and it will not affect my frequency with which I go to GT. And even if they start upselling to me, which is not impossible at all, it won't stop me from going there as long as it stays within certain boundaries.

But I don't think it makes sense to put a universal "value" stamp on anything here. I mean also to say that calling Babylon and Maxim line-ups "horrible availability" and "ulterior motifs" being in place is utter nonsense which makes me feel like I can't contribute anything on those grounds anymore hence the crossroads reference. Not even entertaining the notion of calling Babylon or Maxim scam clubs.

To sum it up: the economic principles which were discussed are not really universal in the sex industry and I find it inappropriate to try and apply them especially when terms like "value" are being used. Not to speak of "idle time" which for human beings in the sex industry might often be rather desirable and by no means is a bad thing.

It's really all relative. I mean, in the German FKK threads there recently were examples how to sleep in your car and therefore saving money otherwise spent on hotel rooms. I guess, with that in mind, Babylon, Maxim, GT are horrible deals for sure and we should all bond over camping.

[QUOTE=MassimoPotente;2181107]I don't like upselling at all and I wanted to point it out. I was actually surprised that an indiviual provider like Angela is doing it now as well and even to a local regular. That was my initial point. I don't really think it is ok, and it is for sure not justified, but I see why it is happening and it will not affect my frequency with which I go to GT. And even if they start upselling to me, which is not impossible at all, it won't stop me from going there as long as it stays within certain boundaries.

But I don't think it makes sense to put a universal "value" stamp on anything here. I mean also to say that calling Babylon and Maxim line-ups "horrible availability" and "ulterior motifs" being in place is utter nonsense which makes me feel like I can't contribute anything on those grounds anymore hence the crossroads reference. Not even entertaining the notion of calling Babylon or Maxim scam clubs.

To sum it up: the economic principles which were discussed are not really universal in the sex industry and I find it inappropriate to try and apply them especially when terms like "value" are being used. Not to speak of "idle time" which for human beings in the sex industry might often be rather desirable and by no means is a bad thing.

It's really all relative. I mean, in the German FKK threads there recently were examples how to sleep in your car and therefore saving money otherwise spent on hotel rooms. I guess, with that in mind, Babylon, Maxim, GT are horrible deals for sure and we should all bond over camping.[/QUOTE]I just want to reiterate that I did not accuse you of having any ulterior motives, in fact I tried to put this allegation to rest. I never ever heard you defend Bablyon, if anything you state your preference for Goldentime and Maxim providers.

I think you have a wealth of information about the Austrian scene and really value your contributions. Since Germany, in my view, and Switzerland are not tipping countries I was surprised that Austria is. I recently met a friend of mine from Vienna and we shared a meal and he was adamant about tipping 10%, I was surprised about this.

I do think the dynamics of the girl's behavior and strategy are influenced by the local culture and I am actually interested, I betray my social science education here, in how you and Austrians see things. My opinions on what influence tipping does differ from yours, but I am actually very interested in how you and other Austrians and Viennese see things.

As you say, and I have learned this from you, the scene and options in Vienna have improved markedly during the last 20 years.

About Fun Palast, I unquestionably liked Golden Time better, but Fun Palast is (was) so much nicer than cheaper venues in Germany, those can really be awful places and Fun Palast was so far removed from that reality I wonder why it is considered in such a bad light by locals? When I did visit the place it was early in the day and the rambunctious crowd did not show much, so maybe I have been spared the worst of it.

But I very much doubt Fun Palast would be considered a low end club in Germany, not a high end one, but certainly not low end.

I value your contributions and your generosity in sharing your wealth of knowledge enormously.

Massimo,

Can you please make a clarification. You mentioned half hour premium service at GT is being pushed. This is €100. What do you get for that? Classic intercourse with kissing and BBBJ? Is this correct? Also, How much extra would CIM + swallow be?

Thanks,

Chubzy.

[QUOTE=ChubzyMaximus;2181175]Massimo,

Can you please make a clarification. You mentioned half hour premium service at GT is being pushed. This is 100. What do you get for that? Classic intercourse with kissing and BBBJ? Is this correct? Also, How much extra would CIM + swallow be?

Thanks,

Chubzy.[/QUOTE]If I may, I will answer my pov.

Yes, for a 100 they will often offer BBBJ and kissing. I don't think that I am generally considered a regular in GT. I suppose not all of the ladies know me and some don't recognise me. I am rock solid when they tried if with me recently. Many girls can be persuaded to provide very good service for 60 or so. But not all of them and all the new ones are certainly instructed to ask extra money for everything. The regular girls are smart like that, making it hard for inexperienced girls to get a first foot in the door.

CIM is 60 on top and swallow the same on top.

[QUOTE=MassimoPotente;2181107]But I don't think it makes sense to put a universal "value" stamp on anything here. I mean also to say that calling Babylon and Maxim line-ups "horrible availability" and "ulterior motifs" being in place is utter nonsense which makes me feel like I can't contribute anything on those grounds anymore hence the crossroads reference. Not even entertaining the notion of calling Babylon or Maxim scam clubs.

To sum it up: the economic principles which were discussed are not really universal in the sex industry and I find it inappropriate to try and apply them especially when terms like "value" are being used. Not to speak of "idle time" which for human beings in the sex industry might often be rather desirable and by no means is a bad thing.

It's really all relative. I mean, in the German FKK threads there recently were examples how to sleep in your car and therefore saving money otherwise spent on hotel rooms. I guess, with that in mind, Babylon, Maxim, GT are horrible deals for sure and we should all bond over camping.[/QUOTE]OK, I admit to have gotten a bit carried away in that post, LOL! Applying some impossibility rethorics. Either way, Maxim is pretty far from what I consider worth it. Got a strip club where I live with about the same rates too, so I find it weird to discuss it here compared to FKK's which I find to be in a different league.

Regarding sleeping in cars, indeed it only works well in Germany when you can leave one club and enter the next 4-5 hours later at opening. One hour will be spent driving anyway. In other areas with less competition in clubs it is a bit useless as a strategy. But with so short time between clubs, it adds tome to sleep as all the hassle with check ins are lost. The hotel on site idea at Wellcum is therefore a great FKK idea.

[QUOTE=MonSooner;2181307]
CIM is 60 on top and swallow the same on top.[/QUOTE]That's right, CIM + Swallow amounts to 120 EURO plus the 60 EURO for half an hour or 120 EURO for an hour.

[QUOTE=MassimoPotente;2181557]That's right, CIM + Swallow amounts to 120 EURO plus the 60 EURO for half an hour or 120 EURO for an hour.[/QUOTE]So this clarification helps a lot actually.

For me, this is the way I see it. It's tough when you fly into town on biz to spend hours at GT. Cost would be as such for me.

Entry- €90.

Premium half hour,-€ 100.

CIM+SW- €120.

Additional half hour as sometimes 30 min is not enough. -€60.

Comes out to €370 total for one hour, wow! That's a lot for a guy who wants to go and blow some steam off after a hard day at work.

Also, when it comes to an establishment like GT or maxim where providers are seeing multiple clients a day, it takes a very good provider to give their 4th or 5th client for the night the same passion as the 1st client.

For me, I would prefer to use the services of an outcall provider. I can speak from experience that Elena Frances, Sofia Ivanova, and Daisy were all stunningly beautiful and stellar in service and way more cost effective.

I think GT would make more sense if you head there after dinner and stay till early am next day. That's something I'the prob want to do with the lads and not solo. You would get more out of that €90 entry fee.

I'm not trying to pitch providers and sway someone one way vs the other. Just think there are other blokes out there like me who could benefit from this discussion.

Can someone answer the following questions for me please:

What is there to do between sessions at GT? Is there a billiards table? Are there TVs playing sports where you can sit and have a beer? Can you get a massage? I know there is an outdoor space where you can escape too any other sitting areas?

All in all I got to say to the native Viennese you should be proud of your city and the people, I'm truly jealous at how good you have it!

I do realize I have to eventually just go and experience it. But any info would be greatly appreciated!

[QUOTE=ChubzyMaximus;2181722] Cost would be as such for me.

Entry- 90.

Premium half hour,- 100.

CIM+SW- 120.

Additional half hour as sometimes 30 min is not enough. -60.

Comes out to 370 total for one hour, wow!.[/QUOTE]In 99 out of 100 cases there will NE no Premium if you let her know a full hour and CIM swallow will be in play.

90 + 120 + 120 = 330 first hour. Less any further session. It's not unreasonably high and you have food and drinks.

Nice to hear you voicing your appreciation for the city. Sometimes we need to have it in written form!

[QUOTE=ChubzyMaximus;2181722]So this clarification helps a lot actually.

For me, this is the way I see it. It's tough when you fly into town on biz to spend hours at GT. Cost would be as such for me.

Entry- 90.

Premium half hour,- 100.

CIM+SW- 120.

Additional half hour as sometimes 30 min is not enough. -60.

Comes out to 370 total for one hour, wow! That's a lot for a guy who wants to go and blow some steam off after a hard day at work.

Also, when it comes to an establishment like GT or maxim where providers are seeing multiple clients a day, it takes a very good provider to give their 4th or 5th client for the night the same passion as the 1st client.

For me, I would prefer to use the services of an outcall provider. I can speak from experience that Elena Frances, Sofia Ivanova, and Daisy were all stunningly beautiful and stellar in service and way more cost effective.

I think GT would make more sense if you head there after dinner and stay till early am next day. That's something I'the prob want to do with the lads and not solo. You would get more out of that 90 entry fee.

I'm not trying to pitch providers and sway someone one way vs the other. Just think there are other blokes out there like me who could benefit from this discussion.

Can someone answer the following questions for me please:

What is there to do between sessions at GT? Is there a billiards table? Are there TVs playing sports where you can sit and have a beer? Can you get a massage? I know there is an outdoor space where you can escape too any other sitting areas?

All in all I got to say to the native Viennese you should be proud of your city and the people, I'm truly jealous at how good you have it!

I do realize I have to eventually just go and experience it. But any info would be greatly appreciated![/QUOTE]Billard table would be an actual good idea but that's definitely a no on that in GT and I have never seen one in any FKK TBH. They have a TV and dining room where sports or whatever is televised. Outside area exists of course.

And I don't think your math adds up because you have to stand your ground and deny the girls the premium by all means. After all you are giving them a highly profitable room with CIM and so on. If you let them get away with the overcharge, sorry to say, it would almost be your own fault in a way. Not that don't think they deserve it but it 100 is simply not the base rate that was intended to be charged always.

Going out with the lads is always more fun as long as no one starts judging and stuff.

[QUOTE=Pistons;2181488] so I find it weird to discuss it here compared to FKK's which I find to be in a different league.
[/QUOTE]It's called ISG for a reason and not International FKK Guide. In Austria the FKKs are the niche in total numbers. And outnumbered they are by a very high rate. Sorry that I sound like a broken record, though, but what is not worth it for you still comes more natural to many sex seeking fellows, than going to an FKK. I see where you are coming from, it is quite all right and understandable. But let people spend or waste their money in which ever joint they please.

[QUOTE=Pistons;2181488]The hotel on site idea at Wellcum is therefore a great FKK idea.[/QUOTE]It is a terrific brothel idea. But in all fairness, the Wellcum guys are the cream of the crop in their field. I admire their work immensely and they are tremendous professionals. But, they are not based in Vienna.

[QUOTE=MassimoPotente;2181557]That's right, CIM + Swallow amounts to 120 EURO plus the 60 EURO for half an hour or 120 EURO for an hour.[/QUOTE]This I have not heard of anywhere, CIM usually costs 50 Euros more in Hessen and 60 Euros more in GT, I understand that.

I never heard there is an additional charge to swallow on top of that, I remember in GT in 2010 I think, I paid for CIM and the girls swallowed at the end although I had not asked her to, I just paid an additional 60. A lot of girls asked me if I want CIM, but no one mentioned swallowing or an extra charge for it, that is truly strange in my book.

I myself would never pay extra for a girl to swallow, I would not derive any additional pleasure from it. After all my FKK experiences and reading this forum, I have never heard of this before, the swallowing surcharge.

[QUOTE=ChubzyMaximus;2181722]Also, when it comes to an establishment like GT or maxim where providers are seeing multiple clients a day, it takes a very good provider to give their 4th or 5th client for the night the same passion as the 1st client![/QUOTE]Depends on how long the sessions last. 5 sessions lasting 30 minutes each doesn't seem to tire many girls unless they are in very bad shape. Some bunnies can do 10 sessions without getting tired also. But above 10 times 30 min you may enter a dangerous territory if all the time is spent for sex. A fit girl can do this once or twice a week perhaps without getting very tired, but not every day. I have personally heard girls use the excuse of being tired before our room. But then the room turned out to be superb anyway. So it feels sometimes as if they are just trying to cover themselves just in case too. And that is also partly a cover in case you (the guy) are not up to it also. As chemistry goes both ways.

[QUOTE=DeltaIndigo;2181882]This I have not heard of anywhere, CIM usually costs 50 Euros more in Hessen and 60 Euros more in GT, I understand that.

I never heard there is an additional charge to swallow on top of that, I remember in GT in 2010 I think, I paid for CIM and the girls swallowed at the end although I had not asked her to, I just paid an additional 60. [/QUOTE]I am positive that Swallow is 60 extra. What happened in your case was maybe an individual experience in which the girl decided to do it but since it wasn't requested, she didn't try charging for it. I don't think people pay 120 on top that often and will often pass when they hear the amount.

[QUOTE=MassimoPotente;2181788]And I don't think your math adds up because you have to stand your ground and deny the girls the premium by all means. After all you are giving them a highly profitable room with CIM and so on. If you let them get away with the overcharge, sorry to say, it would almost be your own fault in a way. Not that don't think they deserve it but it 100 is simply not the base rate that was intended to be charged always.

Going out with the lads is always more fun as long as no one starts judging and stuff.[/QUOTE]Understood, I was under the impression that the new €100 will be the mainstay. And no, no judging at all only good vibes.

Thanks Massimo.

[QUOTE=Pistons;2181884]Depends on how long the sessions last. 5 sessions lasting 30 minutes each doesn't seem to tire many girls unless they are in very bad shape. Some bunnies can do 10 sessions without getting tired also. But above 10 times 30 min you may enter a dangerous territory if all the time is spent for sex. A fit girl can do this once or twice a week perhaps without getting very tired, but not every day. I have personally heard girls use the excuse of being tired before our room. But then the room turned out to be superb anyway. So it feels sometimes as if they are just trying to cover themselves just in case too. And that is also partly a cover in case you (the guy) are not up to it also. As chemistry goes both ways.[/QUOTE]10 sessions! That's hard to imagine! For me it's very difficult to imagine Guy #6 getting the same level of service vs guy 1. But like you say chemistry counts for a lot.