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[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1837774]I admire your patience. I really have no desire to get that involved in a working girls business or the politics of a GoGo bar. I would find it very tedious. The only think I really care about is how skilled they are in the sack.[/QUOTE]That's a sucker. Waiting for a working girl to come. That's a joke.
If I am willing to pay the barfine, she is coming NOW. Otherwise, I'm out of there and going to get another one. I'm not waiting for a prostitute.
[QUOTE=PipeLayer99;1838197]That's a sucker. Waiting for a working girl to come. That's a joke.
If I am willing to pay the barfine, she is coming NOW. Otherwise, I'm out of there and going to get another one. I'm not waiting for a prostitute.[/QUOTE]Amen. At the end of the day I am the customer and expect to be catered to. I am not going to "*****mance," wait around or cater to her whims. Methinks that is one of the big problems and one of the reasons the scene has declined so much. Mongers 15-20 years ago were a different breed. More demanding and with higher expectations. A gal that pulled that crap would not make a thing. Dudes would just not stand for it. That has all changed. If I have to cater to them I might as well move back home. Of course I feel the same about the ridiculous prices. Have a buddy who is friends with the owner of Baccara. His top earners are making close to 300 K Baht per month. Really guys, let that sink in. Do you really know how much money that is in Thailand? I don't blame the gals at all. It is the sucker customers that are dishing out big bucks for 15 min of action. Amazing really, but yes, it screws it up for all of us. Now don't get me wrong, there were 15 min quickies back in the day, but you paid between 500 and 1k Baht for them and at the time that was 12.50 - 25 USD and that is still about what a 15 min quickie is worth.
[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1838202]Amen. At the end of the day I am the customer and expect to be catered to. I am not going to "*****mance," wait around or cater to her whims. Methinks that is one of the big problems and one of the reasons the scene has declined so much. Mongers 15-20 years ago were a different breed. More demanding and with higher expectations. A gal that pulled that crap would not make a thing. Dudes would just not stand for it. That has all changed. If I have to cater to them I might as well move back home. Of course I feel the same about the ridiculous prices. Have a buddy who is friends with the owner of Baccara. His top earners are making close to 300 K Baht per month. Really guys, let that sink in. Do you really know how much money that is in Thailand? I don't blame the gals at all. It is the sucker customers that are dishing out big bucks for 15 min of action. Amazing really, but yes, it screws it up for all of us.[/QUOTE]Too many suckers out there putting up with that crap. I treat the ladies right. But at the same time I'm a paying customer. I expect her to take care of me (now). If you can't, you lose. Bye bye.
I told a girl to come tonight via message. She said, I just came to the club 5 minutes. I replied ok, Come to my room? (as if I care that she just went to the club). She said, I wait for my friend to come. I replied, I don't wait for you long time. I want you come soon. You come now you win money.
8 minutes later she replies asking if I can wait 1. 5 hours. I didn't answer that message. I already told her I am not waiting. (no I am not waiting for her to come. She needs to come now. If she wants to work).
5 minutes after that she asks where is my room now. And she wants to know if I want her to come now. (How many times do I need to tell her to come now?)
I didn't answer. Why? She is in the club looking for a man. I told her to come. She wants to wait for a friend. Yeah right. IMO she can tell her friend she has a customer and get on that motorbike. She lost money.
I don't play that crap.
In the meantime, during those 15 minutes, I already called 2-3 more and the first one to reply won.
[QUOTE=MusicalToM;1838117]LOL. It's business everywhere & it's their (waitresses) job to get it done somehow. They simply don't care whether you want it or not. Perhaps it's an attitude they have built over time. I wonder how they handle it in their initial days as an amateur, may be they get some training of some sort. And this is the same story everywhere in the world (more in developing countries though).
[/QUOTE]The management of many bars is not great. The waiting staff can be pretty shit. Some need to be fired, however maybe they are not paid well enough to hire better ones. If I find a good waitress that looks after me, I hang on to her.
In Mandarin Upstairs, the whole place was slack. Girls supposed to be dancing were just standing there half the time. If the music is no good fire the DJ. Otherwise fine the girls for not dancing. Some places have very poor lighting, some have very poor music. Some very poor or annoying waiting staff.
It may not be rocket science to improve the bar overall experience.
[QUOTE=PipeLayer99;1838208]Too many suckers out there putting up with that crap. I treat the ladies right. But at the same time I'm a paying customer. I expect her to take care of me (now). If you can't, you lose. Bye bye.
I told a girl to come tonight via message. She said, I just came to the club 5 minutes. I replied ok, Come to my room? (as if I care that she just went to the club). She said, I wait for my friend to come. I replied, I don't wait for you long time. I want you come soon. You come now you win money.
8 minutes later she replies asking if I can wait 1. 5 hours. I didn't answer that message. I already told her I am not waiting. (no I am not waiting for her to come. She needs to come now. If she wants to work).
5 minutes after that she asks where is my room now. And she wants to know if I want her to come now. (How many times do I need to tell her to come now?)
I didn't answer. Why? She is in the club looking for a man. I told her to come. She wants to wait for a friend. Yeah right. IMO she can tell her friend she has a customer and get on that motorbike. She lost money.
I don't play that crap.
In the meantime, during those 15 minutes, I already called 2-3 more and the first one to reply won.[/QUOTE]If the majority of mongers took this approach we would all receive better service and see better attitudes, like we did in the past. Sadly, I don't think that is going to happen. Dudes have brought their Western ways to LOS.
[QUOTE=PipeLayer99;1838208]
In the meantime, during those 15 minutes, I already called 2-3 more and the first one to reply won.[/QUOTE]Thais cannot be on time even if money depends on it. Maybe they are just not desperate enough.
Plenty of bar girls will not come to work purely because its raining and more difficult to get a taxi organised to pick her up at her front door, even if they know they will miss out on some good money.
My GF takes hours to get ready to go somewhere, e. G. Out to dinner, entertainment, etc. Pushing her to be quick just makes her angry and then she won't go at all, so it's useless. Don't expect to Thais to work by Farang values of punctuality. Just won't happen for working girls.
Just try going into a Thai oriented Coffee shop, and tell them you are in a hurry for your order. Even so they can be incredibly slow and mucking around, despite no other customers to serve. A western oriented coffee shop has to be better or the customers will not come back. How many Thais and how much time does it take to buy a simple item in a department store?
In my local sports pub, one girl was incredibly efficient. She was from Myanmar. The Thai staff varied from medium fast to one incredibly slow and only able to do one thing at a time. That one should have been fired for slowness in my opinion. She was considered to have good English, her only asset.
After a very long time in Thailand, you get used to Thai slowness but find places and staff who are better. Sure if a P4 P girl cannot come at the right time, she misses out if have a good option. Sometimes we have no time. Sometimes we have plenty of time. I remember well a girl that was very slow to show up (too busy partying with friends or whatever), so did not bother to contact her any more. It's much easier to go to place and take something available than make appointments with girls. Rather few are on time.
Lollitas shop makes it difficult to book a girl. Fortunately 90% of the time my girl is available, otherwise I could not be bothered to go there.
[QUOTE=PipeLayer99;1838208]Too many suckers out there putting up with that crap. I treat the ladies right. But at the same time I'm a paying customer. I expect her to take care of me (now). If you can't, you lose. Bye bye.
.......
I didn't answer. Why? She is in the club looking for a man. I told her to come. She wants to wait for a friend. Yeah right. IMO she can tell her friend she has a customer and get on that motorbike. She lost money.
I don't play that crap.
In the meantime, during those 15 minutes, I already called 2-3 more and the first one to reply won.[/QUOTE]I total agree with your approach and usually do the same. Yeah she lost money, up to her. In the last years it seems that many girls prefer to spend time in party drinking with friends first and looking for customer later, up to them. I'm paying customer and I don't waiting for their schedules.
I've been to Soi Cowboy before, as well as Nana plaza, but for this trip, I decided to try something different.
So instead of going to those places, I walked towards Phrom Phong skytrain station. About midway between Asoke and Phrom Phong, there are a few bars. I stopped at the "penalty spot", good place to watch a football game surrounded by girls.
Girls working there are waitresses, but are available for pick up, bar fine 600 baths.
I left with a girl called Miaouw (like a cat begging for food). Not the prettiest, but very GFE.
Paid 1500 baths for short time, but since it was late, she stayed overnight.
It was good fun with all my fav. Positions (BBBJ, DATY, doggy, etc.). To my surprise, she gave me a really good BBBJ when we woke up in the morning, so that was a plus.
I thought that it was a nice experience, a good change from the more famous (and aggressive) bars in cowboy and Nana.
[QUOTE=ChristianG;1838412]I total agree with your approach and usually do the same. Yeah she lost money, up to her. In the last years it seems that many girls prefer to spend time in party drinking with friends first and looking for customer later, up to them. I'm paying customer and I don't waiting for their schedules.[/QUOTE]That's been going on for quite a few years now. The gals make enough money to only work when they feel like it. And hey, good on on 'them. That's what happens when they can make 5-15 times the daily minimum wage in 15 minutes. Blame the punters for that. I remember fondly just a decade ago when being on Cowboy or right outside Nana at closing time was just amazing. You were confronted with literally hundreds of gals approaching you asking, "go with you?" Like being a bear during a salmon upstream spawning run. But once the ST fees and salaries started creeping up, this ended. Gals would rather party with their friends.
[QUOTE=Syzygies;1838013] Some Crazy House dancing girls commented to me that they were scared of me when I first started to go to Crazy House due to dark rings around eye sockets, and maybe deadpan expression (not smiling constantly). Soon they learned from waitresses that in fact I was a nice guy. I proved the assumptions to be wrong.[/QUOTE]Man, from the physical condition and demeanor of some of the guys I've seen the girls at Crazy House walk out with (me too, who knows?), including the top lookers dancing there, I would say mere dark rings around the eyes and not smiling constantly should be a welcome relief! LOL.
Geez, it must be contagious. Went into one of the Suk BJ bars (I will not name it as I think this is a one off issue), grabbed the best looking gal and headed upstairs. She was all smiles and I was anticipating a great little sesh. Started to attempt to disrobe her and she immediately started with, "I take off you tip 500 Baht. " What? Really? I was a bit taken aback as I have never had an issue getting a BJ gal to disrobe. When I said, no, but you will get a tip, she continued to press me for the amount I would tip her. When I told her it depended on her service her mood soured even more. At this point I was done and I headed for the exit and I made sure to relay my experience to the owner on the way out. In the real world treating a customer like this would get you fired.
[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1838750]Geez, it must be contagious. Went into one of the Suk BJ bars (I will not name it as I think this is a one off issue), grabbed the best looking gal and headed upstairs. She was all smiles and I was anticipating a great little sesh. Started to attempt to disrobe her and she immediately started with, "I take off you tip 500 Baht. " What? Really? I was a bit taken aback as I have never had an issue getting a BJ gal to disrobe. When I said, no, but you will get a tip, she continued to press me for the amount I would tip her. When I told her it depended on her service her mood soured even more. At this point I was done and I headed for the exit and I made sure to relay my experience to the owner on the way out. In the real world treating a customer like this would get you fired.[/QUOTE]Many now have the attitude that they make so little from a BJ, half the fee or less, that you won't won't get anything extra at all without paying something more. That is how they make make money.
Girl's first BJ of the day could be the boss gets 500 and girl 300. That is only 10 bucks. The ratio may improve if she does more BJs, I can't know precisely for every shop.
You could offer her at least something to take to the gear off. Maybe not 500, but not zero. Even 200 would be a significant increase for some girls that are stuggling.
In my case, I almost always want the girl to be nude and fuck her as well. So its always going to cost me extra, however the extra isn't split with the boss if only pay for BJ up front.
[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1838750]Geez, it must be contagious. Went into one of the Suk BJ bars (I will not name it as I think this is a one off issue), grabbed the best looking gal and headed upstairs. She was all smiles and I was anticipating a great little sesh. Started to attempt to disrobe her and she immediately started with, "I take off you tip 500 Baht. " What? Really? I was a bit taken aback as I have never had an issue getting a BJ gal to disrobe. When I said, no, but you will get a tip, she continued to press me for the amount I would tip her. When I told her it depended on her service her mood soured even more. At this point I was done and I headed for the exit and I made sure to relay my experience to the owner on the way out. In the real world treating a customer like this would get you fired.[/QUOTE]I have seen similar actions at other BJ bars. I inform the management and more importantly I inform the other girls downstairs that their colleague is no good and will drive away customers if she continues. Usually doesn't happen again.
[QUOTE=Syzygies;1838813]Many now have the attitude that they make so little from a BJ, half the fee or less, that you won't won't get anything extra at all without paying something more. That is how they make make money.
Girl's first BJ of the day could be the boss gets 500 and girl 300. That is only 10 bucks. The ratio may improve if she does more BJs, I can't know precisely for every shop.
You could offer her at least something to take to the gear off. Maybe not 500, but not zero. Even 200 would be a significant increase for some girls that are stuggling.
In my case, I almost always want the girl to be nude and fuck her as well. So its always going to cost me extra, however the extra isn't split with the boss if only pay for BJ up front.[/QUOTE]I always tip a bit, even if the gal is not so skilled. But a bigger tip has to be earned.
[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1838750]Geez, it must be contagious. Went into one of the Suk BJ bars (I will not name it as I think this is a one off issue), grabbed the best looking gal and headed upstairs. She was all smiles and I was anticipating a great little sesh. Started to attempt to disrobe her and she immediately started with, "I take off you tip 500 Baht. " What? Really? I was a bit taken aback as I have never had an issue getting a BJ gal to disrobe. When I said, no, but you will get a tip, she continued to press me for the amount I would tip her. When I told her it depended on her service her mood soured even more. At this point I was done and I headed for the exit and I made sure to relay my experience to the owner on the way out. In the real world treating a customer like this would get you fired.[/QUOTE]Goatscrot, you didn't specify but I assume you and your girl were using one of the BJ bar's cubicles or curtained booths instead of one of their Short Time rooms? If so, I can't say full nudity has ever been a given in the BJ cubicles / booths for me over the years. I only tried to unbutton a blouse or unhook a bra a couple of times in the past when using those locations and both times it was met with resistence so I stopped. No tip in exchange was even mentioned at the time. And I am talking about starting from a few years back with the more seasoned, better performers I had in those bars, girls with whom I became a repeat customer, not some one week wonder who made up her own rules contrary to house rules and was gone by the following weekend.
When I have wanted full nudity and / or FS along with more time with a girl at a BJ bar, I pop for the typically 1700 baht or so Short Time room. Of course, I have never seen a menu at Dr BJ, L0 lita's, Kasalong, Lolipop1 or Som's Haven stipulating exactly what should be expected in the BJ cubicles / booths, I. E. BBBJ CIM, nudity, FS, whatever, but always assumed the only givens for the BJ cubicles / booths, especially in places where the girls wear theme uniforms, were BBBJ CIM while still in uniform. Isn't that why that experience is only 700-800 baht vs 1700 baht? I never assumed full nudity with or without FS was a realistic much less an expected option in a location where there is no shower and bath towels as there is in the Short Time rooms.
However, if what you described happened in one of their Short Time rooms that you chose and were paying more for, then that was truly inappropriate behavior on the girl's part.