Filipinas - Opinions and Advice

Sorry I forgot to mention some other forms of escapism. Nascar, cars driving circles to thrill the masses, and large men throwing balls in the air. Or reading a book, as I like to do. Is is so different than huffing glue?

Won't happen. 6-7 million will line up to see the Pope, thinking and hoping for a miracle to change their lives. At the same time 6-7 million will not line up to say enough is enough with the present system.

Agree that that particular piece of obnoxious moralizing (Ash Wednesday,) was a sour point in the commentary. However, that doesn't make the remainder of the article any less accurate. Particularly, the notion that expats are exempted from the right to point out the flaws in the society they are living in, strikes me as total bull patties. It's not a competition. What sucks, sucks, end of story.

I think the comparisons concerning the shittiness of American culture are quite entertaining. Although, I would say that a closer analogy, might be, as long as they've got an Ipod and Netflix, ad nauseum, then whatever. A parallel might also be drawn between ESDA and Occupy Wall Street. Especially in the zero meaningful impact.

But again, the fact that the US has degenerated to the point that it has virtually the same income inequality as the Philippines or other third world cesspools, and is facing a similar total absence of hope to retrieve itself from that situation, in no way invalidates what someone from country X why or Z has to say about the shittiness they find themselves in, because shit is shit.

I'm not sure why these kind of observations often turn into shouting matches about who's got the worse culture, or how someone from a first-world country isn't allowed to comment, but it just doesn't seem relevant. Unless, there was something in the original article I missed, that said "We're better than you, nah nah. " Perhaps some members have a higher cultural norm of national identification, and therefore assume that that's what's going on. I'm pretty much sure it's not. Just a thought.

[QUOTE=RollAides;1698650] A parallel might also be drawn between ESDA and Occupy Wall Street. Especially in the zero meaningful impact.
[/QUOTE]Occupy Wall Street was starting to have a meaningful impact because it was shut down by Homeland Security when they decided enough was enough. Don't know what would happen here if anything big ever got started again.

[QUOTE=RedKilt;1698412]Check out this post from Carlos Celdran. A well-known activist.

[URL]https://correctphilippines.org/pinoy_escapism/[/URL][/QUOTE]Good article, but too many of dem big words in it for me to understand; come ta tink of it, probly too many big words for about 95% of any Filipino's to understand it too.

[QUOTE=AsianRain;1698608]Juan Six Pack. [/QUOTE]Don't really see six pack's sold here, beer seems to be sold like most other products = single use. Maybe One-Litre-Juan might be a better label, LOL.

[QUOTE=Sam14;1698658]Occupy Wall Street was starting to have a meaningful impact because it was shut down by Homeland Security when they decided enough was enough. Don't know what would happen here if anything big ever got started again.[/QUOTE]Occupy Wall Street died of its own weight, especially outside of NY. Most other sites quickly got co-opted by other parties, and the encampments quickly became populated often times by the homeless. Philly in particular became a smelly cesspool. Oakland was a particular outlier in that they were more likely to escalate to violence.

The fact that OWS had no coherent idea what they actually wanted, other than to voice frustration, was a big contributor to their demise. Sacrifice and discomfort is difficult to sustain when you make no discernible progress.

Homeland Security played little to no role at all in OWS withering away.

[QUOTE=AsianRain;1698608]Interesting read, but the same tripe we always see from people who live here on the "higher moral ground" of being an expat. Had this guy pegged at the statement "today is "Ash Wednesday" and when you see hookers with the mark of the cross, written in ash on their foreheads, whilst selling their bodies on the streets. It says something about how far off the rails this place has gone". Really? What does it say? Prostitutes can't show their Catholicism?

Lots and lots of petty gripes and sniping at the system, but I would challenge any of the expat critics to come up with any tangible practical solutions to the socioeconomic ills of this country.l. ".[/QUOTE]Peter Wallace, who has been a near permaent expat in the Philippines and who does many things including a regular column in The Inquirer frequently comes up with great suggestions as to how to improve traffic, FDI, tax collections etc. In a reasoned and intelligent presentation.

[QUOTE=AsianRain;1698608]. . <SNIP> . .
Lots and lots of petty gripes and sniping at the system, but I would challenge any of the expat critics to come up with any tangible practical solutions to the socioeconomic ills of this country. . <SNIP> . . .[/QUOTE]I didn't make any comment when I posted the link AR because I thought the expat's point of view was worth sharing. The "editor", who I believe was Carlos Celdran, is a staunch advocate of change and a patriotic lover of Manila. His view that there is a large mass of citizens waiting to 'explode' may not be too far off provided there is a big enough spark to ignite it.

FWIW, I have been here now for an extended time in the Philippines working in the education area, and every day I try to "make a difference" in some small way by pointing out what I believe are better, more effective and more efficient ways to do things (and not only in education).

Just last weekend at the condo home-owners association meeting I made several suggestions regarding ways to improve our elevator service and trash collection and removal, and my suggestions were accepted and already acted upon. The suggestions were blatantly obvious and no-brainers, but nobody had bothered to suggest them as better alternatives until I did, which is, in itself, rather sad.

Occasionally the recipients of my advice are very grateful for it and actually CHANGE; other (most) times, they nod and smile and then go on doing whatever they do in the same inefficient way.

I also dislike petty gripes and sniping at the system, especially from those who have lived here for extended periods.

For me, there are many 'pros' and 'cons' about living in the Philippines, but for me to stay here for 18 years, the 'pros' obviously far outweigh the 'cons', as I am certainly not a masochist.

However, sometimes the 'cons' are extremely annoying and frustrating and take an enormous amount of restraint to suppress the urge to implode.

[QUOTE=Ebauche;1698771]The fact that OWS had no coherent idea what they actually wanted, other than to voice frustration, was a big contributor to their demise. [/QUOTE]I see this differently. It is not clear whether Mitt Romney ever had a path to victory, but he surely harmed himself with his comments, surreptitiously recorded at a private meeting with potential donors, in which he declared he didn't care about the 47% whose principal orientation was to living off the government trough. Criticism of his comments would arguably have withered on the vine had it not been for the narrative of 99% against the one %, which had been clearly articulated by the occupy movement. Against the backdrop of the 99%/1% refrain, frequently repeated during the 2012 election year by various folks, Mitt made himself conspicuously a member of the 1%--and out of touch with the 99%. The movement may have accomplished little else, but to say they crumbled under their own weight misses a significant historical lesson.

In addition, I am not convinced that a narrowly construed objective was consistent with their grievances. To take another lesson from history, the masses of poor who stormed the Bastille in 1789 did not have an explicitly stated objective. Some accounts say there were no more than seven prisoners in the Bastille at the time. But the Bastille was a symbol of the monarchy, and its overthrow probably ignited the French Revolution.

[QUOTE=GoodEnough;1698532]Excellent article RK. Thanks for the link. I wasn't familiar with the organization. My only disagreement with the Editor's Comments is that I doubt Filipinos, no matter the wretchedness of their situation, will ever "run amok" on the epic scale required to evince meaningful change. Granted that it's happened twice in the recent past, with no discernible improvement. Even the two Edsa "revolutions" however involved only a relatively small percentage of the population, and only in Manila. I believe that for the majority of Filipinos, that is for the 70 or 80 million who don't live in Metro Manila, the latter is irrelevant to their lives and they don't, for the most part, believe in the feasibility of meaningful change.

GE.[/QUOTE]Obviously this discussion is not about "Filipinas--Opinions and Advice--except to the extent it paints a picture of Filipina / Filipino worldview. But in the interest of understanding the Filipino worldview, it is important to note that GE put "revolution" in quotations. I think it is safe to say neither EDSA was truly a revolution. EDSA I, which removed Marcos, would probably never have occurred without a coup within the defense institutions and open support from Cardinals Vidal and Sin. Coup conspirators in the Defense Department included the Secretary of Defense, Juan Ponce Enrile, and Lt. Col. Gregorio Honason, then an informal leader among field grade officers apparently disenchanted with Marcos' martial law. The lynchpin was Fidel Ramos, Vice Commander of the Armed Forces and head of the national police, who sensed the fragile balance of power between Marcos and the rebels and decided to embrace the rebels. Perhaps more than anybody else, Ramos was crucial to success of the rebellion, because he commanded respect among other police and military officials and convinced them to stand down when Marcos attempted to press them into action to arrest the rebels. It is true that a million or more average Filipinos massed on EDSA between Fort Aguinaldo and Camp Crame, thus preventing the few forces still loyal to Marcos from arresting the rebels encamped in Camp Crame. But this would not have happened had it not been for the appeals of Cardinal Sin and communications between the encamped rebels and a rogue radio station. Bottom line: EDSA I was not a bottom-up revolution by the masses. Interestingly, both Enrile and Honason, both of whom served many years in the Philippine Senate, proved themselves to be opportunists. Enrile was involved in plots to overthrow Cory Aquino and recently ended up in jail from his apparent involvement in the Pork-Barrel scam. ,

EDSA II was, if anything, even more driven from the top down. There is little question that Erap took a bunch of bribes from illegal gambling promoters and from an Argentine power company, but his removal from office occurred, I will suggest, from the intervention of Cardinal Sin and other power brokers who wished to see him removed from office. It is not clear the assemblage of people who massed on EDSA had any independent commitment to the issues at hand other than what Cardinal Sin and others had convinced them to think. Interestingly, there was a nominal EDSA III, consisting of Erap supporters. There commitment to the defense of Erap was arguably little different than the commitment of EDSA II supporters to his removal from office. Many observers believe that Erap's replacement, Gloria Macapagal Arroyo, who was supported by Cardinal Sin and others, led a more corrupt presidency than Erap's.

GE is right to question the bottom-up nature of the so-called EDSA "revolutions. " The question remains, in my mind, whether there is a legitimate bottom-up impetus for real reform from the marginalized masses of Filipinos.

[QUOTE=RollAides;1698587]Found the foreigner's comments spot on, good read. The guy who wrote the ensuing editorial seems to be indulging in some heavy-duty escapism, himself, if he believes that the masses are ever going to rise up and overthrow the elite here. Wishful thinking.[/QUOTE]First, thanks to RK for posting the link. The ensuing discussion has been interesting. I think the intention of the ensuing editorial had little concern with the masses. The overall argument is to weaken barriers to foreign investment and multi-national corporations. The possibility of mass upheaval is thrown in there to try to frighten the oligarchs. Once the masses figure out that MNCs and direct foreign investment create all these jobs, they will figure out they don't need you (oligarchs).

Please look more carefully at this organization's prescriptions; it is noteworthy that they call themselves "correct government. " I return to that name later. But what do they propose? They want: 1) "economic liberalization. " I presume some in ISG who are engaged in bringing business to the Philippines will agree. Sorry to upset you, but economic liberalization leads to a mixed bag of results. There is some evidence that relaxed economic institutions lead to economic development. But there is also evidence that so-called neo-liberal policies--shrinking government and business regulation--have had very negative results in some counties. Poor people suffer the consequences, not the original oligarchs. The wisdom of this strategy for outside developers is apparent; its benefits for the country are less clear.

Their second strategy is regional decentralization. This make some sense, but their argument that the cause of urban drift to Manila is found in the constitution is nonsense. Virtually all developing countries experience urban migration. It is not because the constitution places the national government and departmental offices in Manila. It is because poor rural people find that life in rural agricultural settings is always lived at the margins, and Manila offers some hope of prosperity, no matter how unrealistic. Poverty and rural marginal economies are the cause of urban migration. No changes to the constitution are going to change this.

Third, they propose a constitutional change to replace the presidentialist system with a parliamentary system. This may make sense. Nearly 80% of surviving democracies have parliamentary rather than presidentialist systems. The difficulty in making a parliamentary system work in a developing country is that multiple party groups emerge, and it is often difficult to negotiate a parliamentary majority based on commitments from numerous minority parties. In a presidentialist system, any individual party needs only get their presidential candidate elected. Compared to parliamentary majorities, often difficult to maneuver, the path from President to dictator is comparatively short.

There are some arguments that support a parliamentary system in the Philippines. Assuming a viable ruling majority can be constructed, prime ministers who are aligned with Parliamentary structures have much greater success enacting legislation than do presidents interacting with congressional bodies controlled by another party.

Before swallowing an argument like this whole cloth, please consider the real underlying interests of its advocates. To argue that one has the "correct government" in one's plan is more than arrogant. The notion of a "correct government" assumes that there is "one best way," and thus any expectation that citizens might contest their preferred expectations would be, under this model, inappropriate. This one is not that hard to unpack.

Thank you Skip for your lucid argument. While I agree with most of your major points, I think what we're all ignoring, or at least glossing over is the huge range of interlocking problems that have culminated in the present level of dysfunction. For me there are numerous variables that would need to be addressed before the form of government, or changing the form of government becomes a paramount concern. Some, but by no means all of the concerns that need to be addressed well prior to any meaningful debate on whether to develop a parliamentary system are as follows:

1. The education system must be brought to some semblance of international standards and completion rates improved substantially throughout the country. The simple fact is that hundreds of thousands of public school graduates are ill equipped for jobs in a modern, technological society;.

2. Ditto for the tertiary education system. Outside of a few institutions in Manila--which are fairly mediocre by international standards--the university system doesn't prepare technically savvy critical thinkers.

3. Reduce the birth rate. At its present level, there's no possibility that the number of people entering the labor force each year could have a reasonable expectation of being absorbed into a workforce, not even under the rosiest economic expansion projections. Achieving this objective will mean diminishing significantly the power and influence of the Catholic Church, which doesn't seem likely.

4. Distribute economic expansion opportunities more evenly throughout the country before Metro Manila sinks into the sea from the continuous influx of people. Davao and Cebu are both viable potential hub cities for the creation of new economic corridors.

5. Develop a functional justice system that actually punishes corruption, and administers justice swiftly.

6. Create and implement simplified, enforceable tax codes and significantly reduce the cost of compliance.

7. Design and build efficient transport systems and electrical distribution systems.

8. Revise the investment codes so that there's at least a snowball's chance in hell of attracting foreign investment.

Those are some of the key priorities that occur to me, though the list could run on for several pages. None of the above would necessarily be improved through the imposition of a Parliamentary system, which would likely be dominate by the same dynasts who control the current system.

GE.

A really stimulating debate here guys. But I can sense some will be saying this is way away from the theme of Filipina Opinion and Advice! But let's continue.

[QUOTE=AsianRain;1698608].......... but I would challenge any of the expat critics to come up with any tangible practical solutions to the socioeconomic ills of this country. [/QUOTE]Perhaps a generation or two too late but the Philippines would have benefitted from a Lee Kuan Yew. Forty plus years ago the GDP per capita for both Singapore and the Philippines were much on a par. Today Singapore ranks third in the world with a GDP per capita of $US64,000 whereas the Philippines languishes at 120+ in the world at $5,200 per capita. As a leader the late Lee Kuan Yew with is strategic vision and implementation plan took his Singapore from third-world to first-world status in a single generation. So a strategic vision, an emphasis on economic growth and international investment, almost dictatorial control that quashed opposition and dissenters, and strong anti-corruption measures helped lift Singapore by the bootstraps to the enviable position it holds today.

[QUOTE=GoodEnough;1698914]Thank you Skip for your lucid argument. While I agree with most of your major points, I think what we're all ignoring, or at least glossing over is the huge range of interlocking problems that have culminated in the present level of dysfunction. For me there are numerous variables that would need to be addressed before the form of government, or changing the form of government becomes a paramount concern. Some, but by no means all of the concerns that need to be addressed well prior to any meaningful debate on whether to develop a parliamentary system are as follows:,,,,[/QUOTE]Great post GE.

[QUOTE=SkipKost;1698863]The question remains, in my mind, whether there is a legitimate bottom-up impetus for real reform from the marginalized masses of Filipinos.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=GoodEnough;1698532].......I doubt Filipinos, no matter the wretchedness of their situation, will ever "run amok" on the epic scale required to evince meaningful change. Granted that it's happened twice in the recent past, with no discernible improvement. Even the two Edsa "revolutions" however involved only a relatively small percentage of the population, and only in Manila. I believe that for the majority of Filipinos, that is for the 70 or 80 million who don't live in Metro Manila, the latter is irrelevant to their lives and they don't, for the most part, believe in the feasibility of meaningful change. [/QUOTE]Yes I doubt there is any appetite for bottoms up revolutionary reform. What is required is a leader with strategic vision, thinking of country first, and strong and charismatic enough to lead the country and get genuine change. And no, I am not thinking of Manny Pacquiao!

KongKing.

I am reposting this because MANY OF YOU NEED TO READ IT!

I have been in Cebu for a few days and my pace is slow as I have met an actual keeper, thanks to FC. But that is not my story kids.

Prior to meeting my KEEPER I met the Devil. I dare not share to many details here as it seems most of you know her and almost all of you have sent her money. I would hate for her men to find out about her although if her men are readers then that's simply Karma.

I spent several hours with the woman and 2 nights and I listened to her talk and talk and talk. OMG. Right now she has a Fiancee who is a "multi millionaire" yet gave her a micro diamond ring, she has a BF who sends her cash that she has not met and she fucks me because 'its been awhile", I was respectfully quiet when her benefactors kept calling.

She does not have a pot to [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140][CodeWord140][/url] in despite having received MILLIONS of PESOS, yes MILLIONS you see she likes to shop! She has alot of shit but nothing of real value.

She won't see me again (I have invited her out) because despite the fact I only listen to her and fuck her well as she will fall for me and does not want to just be a fling? She might be a total pyscho!

She is the best internet fisherwoman I have ever heard of, at one point she had a man sending her 30 k a WEEK! And then she fucked around on him while he was in town no less.

She has been married a few times got deported from one country cause she was double married and is a bullshit artist extraordinaire.

I don't think she is a pure scammer, but she sure aint honest she is just a dumb classless jungle cat and boy does she use you dumb mother fuckers. She is the worst listener I have ever met, her body is far from even really good yet she is covered in men.

I did her cause we had breakfast and I knew I could fuck her so I did and she can suck a decent cock and she is certainly interesting to listen to. Its nice to fuck sober women that you spend an hour with that you can tell need it.

I did not pay her but she borrowed 500 pesos.

MEN ARE STUPID it is amazing what some men will do for a little attention in fact its sad and it is a truly sad statement on how Western Men are treated by Western Women! MY suggestion to some of you, get a dog, they are loyal and will love you inexpensively.

So far this trip I have had 3 women only; one refused money and was angry when I secretly stuffed some in her purse, 1 was the Devil and 1 is a keeper who takes nothing!

Think men think!

PP.

[QUOTE=GoodEnough;1698914]Thank you Skip for your lucid argument. While I agree with most of your major points, I think what we're all ignoring, or at least glossing over is the huge range of interlocking problems that have culminated in the present level of dysfunction. For me there are numerous variables that would need to be addressed before the form of government, or changing the form of government becomes a paramount concern. Some, but by no means all of the concerns that need to be addressed well prior to any meaningful debate on whether to develop a parliamentary system are as follows:


GE.[/QUOTE]I completely agree with you on this and you need to add a culture change that makes getting ahead a priority instead of "don't worry be happy" I love that the are so relaxed the West can learn from some of this BUT crap you need to actually try to get ahead and expect to succeed.

And man are some of them legendarily stupid! Read a newspaper here for the first time and you simply won't believe your eyes, there are 3 murders a day here in cebu and at least half involve cops getting shot!

It is a a happy fail society with the worst men on the planet which simply lays the groundowork for a sweetheart like MOI thank you Pinoy men!

PP.