-
[QUOTE=Tiny12;3022517]Good points by all. A week's time has shown Questner and Blood Red were correct in their skepticism. We're back to where we were months ago.
It's a pity. This situation needs to be settled, for the benefit of all involved. Certainly Russia has plenty of good reasons to be aggrieved, going back to the broken promises made to Gorbachev. Certainly if the tables were turned the United States wouldn't sit still if Mexico were on track to become a member of the Warsaw Pact.
But why can't the sides fast forward and take this to an end before there are a million more casualties? Russia and Europe and Ukraine and the USA should be on the same side. Imagine the effect on the prosperity of the countries if they could, say, each cut defense expenditures by 2% or 3% of GDP. Sanctions need to go. Unfortunately, they have a way of dragging on forever, like Cuba. Look at Iran. That country was dragged into penury and remains there. Admittedly Russia has weathered sanctions much better, but they're still a drag.
With Trump in the United States presidency, there's a good chance they could be lifted. Also Trump would appear to be more sympathetic to Russia's positions than most western leaders..[/QUOTE]Fortunately, Europe support much more Ukraine than robber senile Trump who forgot what he told about Crimea invasion years ago. When Ukraine became independent, Putin was only nothing in FSB, not even known by dogs. Now we have Putin and Trump for liars, Ukraine and Europe can t trust.
-
[QUOTE=Tiny12;3022517]Good points by all. A week's time has shown Questner and Blood Red were correct in their skepticism. We're back to where we were months ago. And you know Elvis, yes you have to give Trump credit for at least trying. I hope he doesn't give up.[/QUOTE]I do not agree we are back where we were. A ceasefire is easy to agree to, but Putin and Trump both said they were not going to do a ceasefire. There is a helluva lot stuff to hammer out. All the players have had their input. They need to work out details. Whether a deal is done is up in the air, but Russia has been able to sell their oil and gas with relative ease despite the so called sanctions. If that stops, and Trump has been bullshitted by Putin for months now and wants to get serious, then I think you can call this a failure.
-
[QUOTE=Elvis2008;3022706]I do not agree we are back where we were. A ceasefire is easy to agree to, but Putin and Trump both said they were not going to do a ceasefire. There is a helluva lot stuff to hammer out. All the players have had their input. They need to work out details. Whether a deal is done is up in the air, but Russia has been able to sell their oil and gas with relative ease despite the so called sanctions. If that stops, and Trump has been bullshitted by Putin for months now and wants to get serious, then I think you can call this a failure.[/QUOTE]Stopping war in 1 day, orange clown bad joke, when he is fucked deeply in the ass and even more since Alaska, since months. Only way to stop Putin is to make him broke and Russia under starvation to eat him, when already inflation.
-
I think what is happening here is Trump washing his hands off slowly and as much as he can. He knows this can't be settled via negotiations, the gaps are too wide and you just can't square that circle. Hence why Trump said let Putin and Zelensky meet. He knows that is not going to happen.
So yes, IMHO, we are back to square one and this will be settled on the battlefield with an ugly Russian victory and a frozen conflict.
-
[QUOTE=BloodRed;3022862]I think what is happening here is Trump washing his hands off slowly and as much as he can. He knows this can't be settled via negotiations, the gaps are too wide and you just can't square that circle. Hence why Trump said let Putin and Zelensky meet. He knows that is not going to happen.
So yes, IMHO, we are back to square one and this will be settled on the battlefield with an ugly Russian victory and a frozen conflict.[/QUOTE]But Trump who told to stop in 1 day, is just ridiculous now, fucked by Putin who shoot US company in West Ukraine, despite MAGA sucked a lot criminal dictator Putin and also supporting other criminal Netanyahou.
-
[QUOTE=BloodRed;3022862]I think what is happening here is Trump washing his hands off slowly and as much as he can. He knows this can't be settled via negotiations, the gaps are too wide and you just can't square that circle. Hence why Trump said let Putin and Zelensky meet. He knows that is not going to happen.
So yes, IMHO, we are back to square one and this will be settled on the battlefield with an ugly Russian victory and a frozen conflict.[/QUOTE]Sigh. Yeah, you are right. Thing is with all the slop in journalism these days you often do not who to listen to. As such I trust the guys I pay for on Substack.
Seymour Hersh seems to have better contacts than anyone in government. He had Biden blowing up Nordstream and I was laughing my ass off at the cover story of a bunch of drunken Ukrainian divers taking out Nordstream. OMG was that a terrible story. He also got the USA bombing Iran story right days before it happened.
Anyway, here is what he has said about the summit: The much anticipated summit earlier this month in Anchorage was a flop: Putin rebuffed Trump's request for a ceasefire, and the woefully unprepared Trump seemed more intent on finding a way to earn a Nobel Peace Prize than striking a realistic bargain on Ukraine.
That is sad. It cracks me up when we people who like Trump get bashed as cultists. We know who he is and his flaws. I do not like the whole Russiagate bullshit narrative, but I do think that Putin knows how to kiss Trump's ass the right way and push Trump's buttons. South Park did a hilarious bit about the line of international and domestic leaders who lined up in the White House to kiss Trump's ass and give him gifts. That is sad but true. Trump gets disarmed by flattery.
So I do not know what we in the USA do at this point. We have most of the crap that went on from Russiagate. It is clear that the Democrats made Putin into this Hitleresque like character to distract from all the shit they were doing.
Thing is the old USSR had half of Germany. What is the big deal to the USA if Russia has the Eastern part of Ukraine that is mostly Russian? Why is that the end of the world?
The bullshit is always the same with war. If you do not stop him in Ukraine, then it is onto all of Europe and the USA! I am sick of it. I want our budget balanced. We cannot afford these forever wars anymore.
The big difference between Hitler and Putin is the German people suffered after WW One. The Germans were humiliated, bankrupted, and stabbed in the back. The Russian people have had it pretty good lately. It was rough in 2000 or so, but things had been going well for them.
I remember the videos of the Russian soldiers in the gas pipelines in the Kursk region of Russia. They were not happy and were cursing Putin by name.
I watched that documentary on Chernobyl, and if it was accurate, the workers were hardly in lockstep with the government. They were pissed at being asked to do what the government wanted. They did it but they were pissed.
So yeah, you can sell the Russian people on their own being abused in Ukraine, but I do not think you can go more than that. You will lose the support of the Russian people. I think the Russians have lost somewhere between half a million and a million men and how many more have been disabled? And it is not like people are not suffering at home as well. Ukraine has been taking out many Russian facilities and there have been casualties there as well.
So yeah, I agree with you, Bloodred. The Russians will continue to grind it out and take the parts of Ukraine they want, and we are just going to be throwing money down the drain trying to stop that.
I agree with you. Sadly, I cannot see this stopping until the Russians get what they want.
-
[QUOTE=Elvis2008;3023084]Sigh. Yeah, you are right. Thing is with all the slop in journalism these days you often do not who to listen to. As such I trust the guys I pay for on Substack.
Seymour Hersh seems to have better contacts than anyone in government. He had Biden blowing up Nordstream and I was laughing my ass off at the cover story of a bunch of drunken Ukrainian divers taking out Nordstream. OMG was that a terrible story. He also got the USA bombing Iran story right days before it happened.
Anyway, here is what he has said about the summit: The much anticipated summit earlier this month in Anchorage was a flop: Putin rebuffed Trump's request for a ceasefire, and the woefully unprepared Trump seemed more intent on finding a way to earn a Nobel Peace Prize than striking a realistic bargain on Ukraine.
That is sad. It cracks me up when we people who like Trump get bashed as cultists. We know who he is and his flaws. I do not like the whole Russiagate bullshit narrative, but I do think that Putin knows how to kiss Trump's ass the right way and push Trump's buttons. South Park did a hilarious bit about the line of international and domestic leaders who lined up in the White House to kiss Trump's ass and give him gifts. That is sad but true. Trump gets disarmed by flattery.
So I do not know what we in the USA do at this point. We have most of the crap that went on from Russiagate. It is clear that the Democrats made Putin into this Hitleresque like character to distract from all the shit they were doing.
Thing is the old USSR had half of Germany. What is the big deal to the USA if Russia has the Eastern part of Ukraine that is mostly Russian? Why is that the end of the world?
The bullshit is always the same with war. If you do not stop him in Ukraine, then it is onto all of Europe and the USA! I am sick of it. I want our budget balanced. We cannot afford these forever wars anymore.
The big difference between Hitler and Putin is the German people suffered after WW One. The Germans were humiliated, bankrupted, and stabbed in the back. The Russian people have had it pretty good lately. It was rough in 2000 or so, but things had been going well for them.
I remember the videos of the Russian soldiers in the gas pipelines in the Kursk region of Russia. They were not happy and were cursing Putin by name.
I watched that documentary on Chernobyl, and if it was accurate, the workers were hardly in lockstep with the government. They were pissed at being asked to do what the government wanted. They did it but they were pissed.
So yeah, you can sell the Russian people on their own being abused in Ukraine, but I do not think you can go more than that. You will lose the support of the Russian people. I think the Russians have lost somewhere between half a million and a million men and how many more have been disabled? And it is not like people are not suffering at home as well. Ukraine has been taking out many Russian facilities and there have been casualties there as well.
So yeah, I agree with you, Bloodred. The Russians will continue to grind it out and take the parts of Ukraine they want, and we are just going to be throwing money down the drain trying to stop that.
I agree with you. Sadly, I cannot see this stopping until the Russians get what they want.[/QUOTE]Inflation for Russians under war and even less freedom. They would live better if they got rid of Putin.
-
[QUOTE=Elvis2008;3023084]
Anyway, here is what he has said about the summit: The much anticipated summit earlier this month in Anchorage was a flop: Putin rebuffed Trump's request for a ceasefire, and the woefully unprepared Trump seemed more intent on finding a way to earn a Nobel Peace Prize than striking a realistic bargain on Ukraine.[/QUOTE]He won't get a noble peace prize for Ukraine since it will be settled on the battlefield. Credit to Trump for at least talking to the Russians though. And one more thing to remember. Let's say Trump agrees to the Russian demands, there are still 2 other parties that need to agree and won't. The Europeans and especially the Zelensky regime.
[QUOTE=Elvis2008;3023084]
The bullshit is always the same with war. If you do not stop him in Ukraine, then it is onto all of Europe and the USA! [/QUOTE]I can't believe some people actually buy into this horseshit. And what is funny is this. On one hand, we hear the collective west say Russia is weak, their army is shit, they are suffering such huge losses, the situation on the ground is a stalemate, blah blah blah. And then they tell us that Russia will go after Poland, the Baltic republics, etc afterwards. Laughable.
[QUOTE=Elvis2008;3023084]
So yeah, I agree with you, Bloodred. The Russians will continue to grind it out and take the parts of Ukraine they want, and we are just going to be throwing money down the drain trying to stop that.
I agree with you. Sadly, I cannot see this stopping until the Russians get what they want.[/QUOTE]The best deal the Ukraine will get is the one on the table now, no matter how bad it looks. If this goes on for a couple of more years and there is a collapse of AFU (possible for sure), then expect the Russians to take 4 more Oblasts including Odessa. And then what, Ukraine becomes a land locked country.
What a needless tragedy.
-
[QUOTE=BloodRed;3023267]He won't get a noble peace prize for Ukraine since it will be settled on the battlefield. Credit to Trump for at least talking to the Russians though. And one more thing to remember. Let's say Trump agrees to the Russian demands, there are still 2 other parties that need to agree and won't. The Europeans and especially the Zelensky regime.
I can't believe some people actually buy into this horseshit. And what is funny is this. On one hand, we hear the collective west say Russia is weak, their army is shit, they are suffering such huge losses, the situation on the ground is a stalemate, blah blah blah. And then they tell us that Russia will go after Poland, the Baltic republics, etc afterwards. Laughable.
The best deal the Ukraine will get is the one on the table now, no matter how bad it looks. If this goes on for a couple of more years and there is a collapse of AFU (possible for sure), then expect the Russians to take 4 more Oblasts including Odessa. And then what, Ukraine becomes a land locked country.
What a needless tragedy.[/QUOTE]Fortunately Europe resist to clown Trump, to support Ukraine, when MAGA clown wants to fuck them. Shame to MAGA.
-
[QUOTE=BloodRed;3023267]...The best deal the Ukraine will get is the one on the table now, no matter how bad it looks...What a needless tragedy.[/QUOTE]No thanks. In spite of duplicitous / traitorous Trump, Ukraine is winning. As an aside, I love the (surprising) videos of the little Bradley IFV'l raging through the Russians. Pure pleasure.
-
[QUOTE=JohnClayton;3023332]No thanks. In spite of duplicitous / traitorous Trump, Ukraine is winning. As an aside, I love the (surprising) videos of the little Bradley IFV'l raging through the Russians. Pure pleasure.[/QUOTE]Yes, Ukraine is winning. I have been saying this since day 1.
-
[QUOTE=Sirioja;3023268]Fortunately Europe resist to clown Trump, to support Ukraine, when MAGA clown wants to fuck them. Shame to MAGA.[/QUOTE]International criminal killing mothers and babies Putin really fuck too old orange MAGA who wants to rob Ukraine.
