General Info

Biggest problem is not having a proper airline. Thai, Malaysian, Singapore are way way ahead and bring in the tourists. They need to invest in Phil Airlines making Manila a hub if possible.

[QUOTE=GoodEnough;1149269]The objective of increasing tourism is not new; it's been an objective of the government at least since I've been here and probably longer. The major challenge as I see it is that there's so little here-other than decent beaches which are hardly unique to the Philippines-to attract tourists. The lack of anything particularly interesting in the culture, coupled with some of the worst physical infrastructure in Asia and the embassy advisories about instability in the country don't bode well for meeting this objective any time in the near future in my opinion.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Mc Don;1149294]Biggest problem is not having a proper airline. Thai, Malaysian, Singapore are way way ahead and bring in the tourists. They need to invest in Phil Airlines making Manila a hub if possible.[/QUOTE]As I read the above, I'm in the airport in Davao, where I've just learned that the next PAL flight to Manila is delayed four hours, thus lending credibility to McDon's point. The fact remains though, even if PAL could be "fixed," the rest of the shoddy infrastructure would remain as would the lack of any compelling reason to come.

GE

[QUOTE=GoodEnough;1149269]The objective of increasing tourism is not new; it's been an objective of the government at least since I've been here and probably longer. The major challenge as I see it is that there's so little here-other than decent beaches which are hardly unique to the Philippines-to attract tourists. The lack of anything particularly interesting in the culture, coupled with some of the worst physical infrastructure in Asia and the embassy advisories about instability in the country don't bode well for meeting this objective any time in the near future in my opinion.[/QUOTE]Every new Tourism minister has a go at this. Best Tourism minister I can remember was Gemma Araneta Cruz (I think was her name. Back in late 90's) ex model tall and could drink a lot of red wine as I recall from an official dinner or two that I attended.

Well put GE. No infrastructure, people preying on innocent tourists in every corner, Phils will always attract the tourists who want to rough it, but the families in Phuket who are happily paying US$500 per day will never be attracted by Toursism Philipplines except El Nido and Nido wannabees.

[quote=goodenough; 1149335]as i read the above, i'm in the airport in davao, where i've just learned that the next pal flight to manila is delayed four hours, thus lending credibility to mcdon's point. the fact remains though, even if pal could be "fixed," the rest of the shoddy infrastructure would remain as would the lack of any compelling reason to come.

ge[/quote]i don't think that pal is the issue, with cebu pac almost overtaking pal, in terms of pax

come to singapore to see how phil tourism promotes their country. they don't promote destinations: they promote specific hotels and such.

i asked an official as to why they are all out to promote amanpulo, and why not promote the whole country. you know the answer? well, we don't need ****s. as if. those high spenders are the clean ones.

add to it. i could list a lot of instant scammers. and unlike in some touristy countries, the tourists are never insulated from scammers / donation boxes.

heck, even the ocean park has a 'donation' box. what the heck do i pay entrance, and then i am still expected to 'donate'? .

nothing's going to fix their country, as of now. and that' my lord, is my humble opinion.

To continue with why the Tourism Sector is as pathetic as most other sectors of the economy here, I want to recount an experience of this morning that concluded less than 10 minutes ago:

I had an uneventful, quick trip to CDO via Air Philippines from Davao. It left early and arrived early and the entire flight took about 30 minutes. So far so good. My driver was there to meet me, and again, very good so far.

The problems started on arrival at the Mallberry, where I always stay when I'm in CDO. I was greeted warmly by the manager as I walked in and was told that, as I hotel is full (would you believe an Ob / Gyn convention?) and as I had arrived prior to check out time, I would have to wait an hour for my room. Fair enough. Two hours later, after doing a bit of work in the coffee area at the back of the lobby I approached the desk to ask for my key, and the personnel looked at me as if they had never seen me before, had no idea what the hell I was talking about and then stared resolutely at the floor. Staring at the floor is a sure sign that they had forgotten completely about what they were supposed to do, could not admit it, and couldn't think of a credible lie. They were simply paralyzed. The manager, conveniently, was nowhere to be seen.

After another 15-20 minutes, subsequent to a quiet but vitriolic outburst from me, I went back to the desk and was told "It's completely ready sir. Except for the towels." I asked if I was supposed to air dry myself or use kleenex, whereupon someone ran upstairs to put towels in the room. By now. 2 and a half hours have passed.

Earlier, when I first arrived, I jokingly asked the manager of this, one of the most expensive hotels in town, if they were able by now to afford plastic laundry bags as this is the only hotel in which I've ever stayed that doesn't provide them. She told me that laundry bags are available "on special request. ' I can understand why. After all, they must cost at least a peso. So I requested one, which of course wasn't in my room when I finally got into it. So I asked, politely again. Sure enough, about 2 minutes later someone appeared at my door with the comment 'your laundry bags sir." I looked down to see three or four small trash bags (the kind that come off a roll, each large enough to accommodate maybe a pair of pants and a shirt.

Now if this is the best that a reasonably expensive "tourist" hotel can do in this city, there's clearly no hope at all for the general tourism sector. And remember, this is a hotel where I'm well known and to which my company gives a lot of business during any given year.

I think the lousy service, and even worse food, is attributable to a point of view which says "we don't need foreigners." And it's true. The place is so popular with locals, and locals are so used to mediocre service that it's become the standard, they it doesn't need my business, or that of any "picky" foreigner.

I know that as soon as the new Limkatkai Hotel opens I'll leave here and try that, but I have no expectation that the service or the attitude will be any better than it is here: pleasant, friendly, incompetent, inefficient and indifferent.

GE

[quote=goodenough; 1149399]to continue with why the tourism sector is as pathetic as most other sectors of the economy here, i want to recount an experience of this morning that concluded less than 10 minutes ago:

i had an uneventful, quick trip to cdo via air philippines from davao. it left early and arrived early and the entire flight took about 30 minutes. so far so good. my driver was there to meet me, and again, very good so far.

the problems started on arrival at the mallberry, where i always stay when i'm in cdo. i was greeted warmly by the manager as i walked in and was told that, as i hotel is full (would you believe an ob / gyn convention?) and as i had arrived prior to check out time, i would have to wait an hour for my room. fair enough. two hours later, after doing a bit of work in the coffee area at the back of the lobby i approached the desk to ask for my key, and the personnel looked at me as if they had never seen me before, had no idea what the hell i was talking about and then stared resolutely at the floor. staring at the floor is a sure sign that they had forgotten completely about what they were supposed to do, could not admit it, and couldn't think of a credible lie. they were simply paralyzed. the manager, conveniently, was nowhere to be seen.

after another 15-20 minutes, subsequent to a quiet but vitriolic outburst from me, i went back to the desk and was told "it's completely ready sir. except for the towels." i asked if i was supposed to air dry myself or use kleenex, whereupon someone ran upstairs to put towels in the room. by now. 2 and a half hours have passed.

earlier, when i first arrived, i jokingly asked the manager of this, one of the most expensive hotels in town, if they were able by now to afford plastic laundry bags as this is the only hotel in which i've ever stayed that doesn't provide them. she told me that laundry bags are available "on special request. ' i can understand why. after all, they must cost at least a peso. so i requested one, which of course wasn't in my room when i finally got into it. so i asked, politely again. sure enough, about 2 minutes later someone appeared at my door with the comment 'your laundry bags sir." i looked down to see three or four small trash bags (the kind that come off a roll, each large enough to accommodate maybe a pair of pants and a shirt.

now if this is the best that a reasonably expensive "tourist" hotel can do in this city, there's clearly no hope at all for the general tourism sector. and remember, this is a hotel where i'm well known and to which my company gives a lot of business during any given year.

i think the lousy service, and even worse food, is attributable to a point of view which says "we don't need foreigners." and it's true. the place is so popular with locals, and locals are so used to mediocre service that it's become the standard, they it doesn't need my business, or that of any "picky" foreigner.

i know that as soon as the new limkatkai hotel opens i'll leave here and try that, but i have no expectation that the service or the attitude will be any better than it is here: pleasant, friendly, incompetent, inefficient and indifferent.

ge[/quote]i think theres probably 1, 000 guys out there that know exactly what you are saying.

interestingly tho a lot of the local tourism stems from the us balikbayans (people who are filipino americans or is it american filipinos lol ). you should hear them complain about " its not like that in oklahoma or oakland or wherever etc.". but as we all know, it won't change at all.

the definition of speed. its the rate at which a hotel opens with great service, good food and people who know what they are doing, to a hotel with lousy service, no one knows what they are doing and the paint starts peeling on newly painted walls.

Everything GE, FF and McDon has said is true.

I am sure that everyone has some sort of horror anecdote to share even if this is a monger's site.

Nobody has picked up on the point I made in my earlier post with the news cutting that many filipinos are ashamed that so many women here are willing to trade themselves in return for the unique pleasure of meeting a foreign tourist and helping him to spend his cash.

I heard a talkback session on tourism today on radio whilst in a taxi that was disparaging about Cafe Havana as being a place (quote) infested by foreigners and filipina prostitutes in the midst of the high class tourist area of Makati (unquote). I am not sure that Larry J Cruz whose group owns Cafe Havana and other high-class restaurants around Manila would have liked to hear this.

I am interested in the fact that there seems to be a few filipinos who feel that the image of willing filipinas roaming around soliciting sex from foreigners is not a good look to improve tourism in the country. I wouldn't start gnashing my teeth that the good ol' days are over though and that suddenly filipinas will disappear from sight hehe. Nothing much changes in the Phils and if change ever happens then it happens at a snail's pace.

Besides all the items mentioned such as lack of infrastructure, etc, isn't one of the big reasons for low tourism the fact that you don't feel like you are in Asia when you are in PI? As someone else mentioned PI has some beaches but you can ge that many other places. What you get are old churches that look just like the ones in Latin America for example rather than temples and such and medicore food which is not "exotic" or "Asian" like you would get in Thailand or Korea or so forth.

There you go RK, you've raised the issue of the economic impact of prostitution again when I thought we had agreed it was now a closed subject! Seriously, trying to stamp out commercial sex services here is as fruitless as trying to hold back the tides. Mayor Lim tried it by stamping out the bars in Ermita, only to find them regerminating in EDSA Entertainment Complex, the infamous LA Cafe, and others. Unless and until this country manages to make inroads into poverty by providing legitimate economic opportunities for its young people, I doubt that availability will diminish. Since that isn't about to happen within my lifetime or yours, I'd say that there's no reason to be concerned.

GE

[QUOTE=GoodEnough; 1149455]There you go RK, you've raised the issue of the economic impact of prostitution again when I thought we had agreed it was now a closed subject! . . . . <SNIP . . . Unless and until this country manages to make inroads into poverty by providing legitimate economic opportunities for its young people, I doubt that availability will diminish. Since that isn't about to happen within my lifetime or yours, I'd say that there's no reason to be concerned.

GE[/QUOTE]You know me well enough GE to know that I have virtually zero knowledge about the economic impact of anything! My interest is in the sciences. With a splash of home-spun psychology.

You're absolutely correct about not being concerned that much will happen to impinge on prostitution much in the short-term or our lifetimes (whichever come first LOL)

[quote=red kilt;1149451]nobody has picked up on the point i made in my earlier post with the news cutting that many filipinos are ashamed that so many women here are willing to trade themselves in return for the unique pleasure of meeting a foreign tourist and helping him to spend his cash.[/quote]that is 100% true, and, when it comes to more intelligent and a bit capable class, they frown on those who do this. but, then again, if it is done foc, it is ok. .

[quote]i am interested in the fact that there seems to be a few filipinos who feel that the image of willing filipinas roaming around soliciting sex from foreigners is not a good look to improve tourism in the country. i wouldn't start gnashing my teeth that the good ol' days are over though and that suddenly filipinas will disappear from sight hehe. nothing much changes in the phils and if change ever happens then it happens at a snail's pace.[/quote]i had the same arguement, when i was asking. some filipinos here as to their tourism drive being dead. and as i mentioned elsewhere, the answer was 'we don't want ****s'. of course, they forget the thousands of navy boys were praying and doing volunteer work in the phils, during the base days.

and to be honest, their terming hookers as gro, is sort of glorifying the trade.

the funny thing is, every filipino who goes overseas, and meets fellow country-women hookers, have no qualms in screwing their brains off, and still defend their country's honour if a non-filipino calls the filipina hookers as such. to the extent, they end up in jail and all sorts of nonsense, because 'the foreigner degraded the filipina by calling her a hooker. '

i gave up trying to reason with filipinos.

[QUOTE=Red Kilt; 1149451]Everything GE, FF and McDon has said is true.

I heard a talkback session on tourism today on radio whilst in a taxi that was disparaging about Cafe Havana as being a place (quote) infested by foreigners and filipina prostitutes in the midst of the high class tourist area of Makati (unquote). I am not sure that Larry J Cruz whose group owns Cafe Havana and other high-class restaurants around Manila would have liked to hear this.[/QUOTE]Hi RK. Somewhat sadly Larry passed away a few years back. I'm not sure who is now the head of the company he started. Larry was an absolutely fine fellow, a man who could mix equally well in both Filipino and Western cultures. He was also an extremely shrewd restaurateur, who started with the original Havana in Malate, along with a small club in Malate where a young singer called Gary Valenciano used to do the late night show.

Gary Valenciano became the mega selling OPM star Gary V, and Larry got rich and richer.

Incidently, another Larry Cruz restaurant in Bonifacio High Street is dedicated to Larry's father and features many old photos of him.

Ok local history lesson over.

Econo Tech, what does FOC mean? The closest I could find in the abbreviations thread was : FOV Finger Outside Vagina.

[QUOTE=David_33;1149582]Econo Tech, what does FOC mean? The closest I could find in the abbreviations thread was : FOV Finger Outside Vagina.[/QUOTE]Free of charge?

[QUOTE=David_33;1149582]Econo Tech, what does FOC mean? The closest I could find in the abbreviations thread was : FOV Finger Outside Vagina.[/QUOTE]Common abbreviation in use worldwide. FOC = Free of Charge. The kind of sex I like LOL. And Quite different to FOB, which is in use for when you have a chubby gal on top LOL.