Jakarta

Wow, sorry to hear about the bad experience but thanks for the report.

First, yes, don't expect every taxi to know every spot. One visit to Classic had my Bluebird taxi driver asking if this was the right one? I was wondering if there was more than one?

Second, I was not too impressed with Hotel Travel either. I will write a report later. Too busy and too sick.

Third, am surprised at your experience with CJs but maybe the girls are not as hungry there? I had initially said that a million was way too much but have a look at the General Info thread for Indonesia and there is a recent post about pricing.

Was that your whole trip or is there more?

[QUOTE=Unirii; 1123856]First went to HT (Hotel Travel) for a late afternoon session. It was hard as hell to find, I just assumed every taxi drive should know such a place but it's not so. Searched and couldn't find the address in the forum so here it is.

The entrance for spa or whatever the place with the girls is to the left of the main hotel entrance.

For those not familiar it's a large lounge where you can eat, drink, have the company of a girl, and take her to a room for shag.

There was at least 30 girls available but IMHO they were not the greatest looking. Something like pudgy brown little oompa loompas. A few looked younger and cuter though.

I took a girl. They required payment in advance, no chance for later. It was 300k for an hour including the room.

Ream was clean and decent.

The girls I took while really cute ended up being incredibly annoying. Beyond the constant yammering that I couldn't understand she kept trying to put on the condom after 5 seconds of sucking. After about 15 minutes I was greatly annoyed and kicked her out and fetched managment. They offered that I could keep the room but would need to pay 150k for a new girl. Good enough. New girl was slightly less attractive but 1000% more enthusiastic. Finished in her mouth. I appreciate the customer service from management. Pretty good and patient by skeezy brothel standards.

A few nights later to CJs club in Hotel Mulia.

Girls here were better looking on average than at HT and a few really attractive ones but in general still not great.

A few oompa loompas approached me but I had 0 interest. I approached a few of the more attractive girls but basically got the brush off from all of them. Towards the end of the night (30 min before closing) I spotted a new one. Conversation was nice and friendly. But. She wanted one million (good enough, I'm horny and it's late) and. Wasn't even willing to stay 3 hours. Her exact words were 'you finish and then I go'.

So I went home alone.

Not the best introduction to mongering in the Jakarta. I just didn't see alot of great looking girls.

BTW, Bluebird group taxi's are great. Always ran the meter. Never any hassle. Every other type of cab I tried was terrible. [/QUOTE]

The point is you are taking their photos with the expectation that you will be making a profit (whether or not you do make a profit is irrelevant) and you cannot hide behind the idea that because there is a fee that only hardcore mongers will see the pics and not the girls themselves or people who know them. Who knows who's a monger. Let's face it, you're not going to put your face in the pics would you? Of course not, because you don't know who among your friends and family will recognize you.

You're in the UK, right? You better make sure that you are in the legal clear here because what I've realized is that the laws are much more strict the more "developed" a country becomes. I'm on an American forum and they're talking about pics being "private" or not depending on whether there is an expectation of privacy and whether or not you're on public or private property. Sheesh.

As for this site and the pics? Well, I am pretty sure that if one of the girls complained about their photo being up then this site will take it down. Have a look here:

[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Model_release[/url]

It pertains primarily to Americans but this site can be open to a suit if they even publish a photo without a model release. It's charging a fee for people to look at girls' pics and I am pretty sure that most of those girls don't know that their pics is going up on a site like this. Anyways, look it up. I am rambling because I am down with the flu.

[QUOTE=Sir Lancelot; 1123684]I understand the point you make. The truth is that I only charge a fee for my diaries so that the girls contained within remain anonymous to the casual visitor (I hardly make any money). It's similar to this forum. There are thousands of pictures of girls but they are hidden away only to be seen by those who pay a subscription. It's my experience that girls are wary of the internet in case it reveals to their friends / family that they're hookers, so if a cost / subscription is introduced, it means that the photos only get seen by mongers.

In terms of sharing information and the 'ethos of the forum', again, I take your point. However, I would like to point out that I posted 8 HUGE field reports following my trip to Philippines last year and my 'Secret Diaries' blog contains lots of free information. [/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Smoothy;1124972]I'm not sure I get why they charge prices based only on where the girl comes from. Chinese girls are 1. 8 million? Some of those girls are really hot, and some are very mediocre. What they should do is charge based on how good looking the girl is. Some of those Chinese girls should be 1. 8 (not many of them) , but most should be less.[/QUOTE]In a way it sort of makes sense. When you think about just goods, imported products are more expensive than local produces naturally. This logic is totally flawed. But grading girls is just as flawed in my opinion. This is actually pretty neutral choice. Beside, it is up to you to pick the hot ones, no matter where they come from. They parade the girls in front of you anyway.

Have fun.

[QUOTE=Valkyrie; 1125266]In a way it sort of makes sense. When you think about just goods, imported products are more expensive than local produces naturally. This logic is totally flawed. But grading girls is just as flawed in my opinion. This is actually pretty neutral choice. Beside, it is up to you to pick the hot ones, no matter where they come from. They parade the girls in front of you anyway.

Have fun[/QUOTE]Maybe not a good comparison: Imported goods are typically more expensive because of import tariffs imposed by the gov't which (supposedly) protect local producers and (usually) help gather a few more votes in the next election. I am assuming that bottles of wine in Indonesia are so damn expensive because of these tarriffs. (I made the mistake of ordering a glass of merlot of TopGun last month; it tasted like pure vinegar. But anyways, I don't think of TopGun as the kind of place to drink wine.) Imported goods may also be more expensive because of transportation costs. This could possibly be somewhat of a factor, but I doubt it. I think it goes back to simple supply and demand. There is a limited supply of foreign working girls (relative to indonesian working girls) and there must clearly be enough demand for them to warrant the higher price. For those of us bule who don't find the extra value in the foreign girl, we simply pay the lower price for the lovely indo girls. Econ 101 I think.

[QUOTE=John Marigold99;1125303]Econ 101 I think.[/QUOTE]If you're willing to explore some more advanced economic concepts, consider that in Indonesia, a low end high volume Indonesian hooker is probably what is known as a Giffen Good, and a foreign hooker at a place like Alexis would probably be known as a Veblen Good. These concepts are named for the economists who first identified them, as unusual products because they have positive price elasticity rather than the normal negative slope (I. E the consumption goes up as the price goes up, and consumption drops as the price drops). In the case of a Giffen Good, it's a low-end item where consumption increases as the price does due to a decreasing ability to afford better substitutes and a certain repulsiveness associated with doing the very cheapest hookers in any market, and in the case of a Veblen Good, it's a high end item where consumption increases as the price does due to greater status and prestige being attached to it and it's consumers because of it's known higher price.

[QUOTE=Member #2041;1125388]If you're willing to explore some more advanced economic concepts, consider that in Indonesia, a low end high volume Indonesian hooker is probably what is known as a Giffen Good, and a foreign hooker at a place like Alexis would probably be known as a Veblen Good. These concepts are named for the economists who first identified them, as unusual products because they have positive price elasticity rather than the normal negative slope (I. E the consumption goes up as the price goes up, and consumption drops as the price drops). In the case of a Giffen Good, it's a low-end item where consumption increases as the price does due to a decreasing ability to afford better substitutes and a certain repulsiveness associated with doing the very cheapest hookers in any market, and in the case of a Veblen Good, it's a high end item where consumption increases as the price does due to greater status and prestige being attached to it and it's consumers because of it's known higher price.[/QUOTE]I agree that a Veblen effect is entirely possible here. Maybe we can continue this conversation over a beer at Top Gun sometime.

Danibbler,

Firstly, get well soon. I'm struggling a bit with a heavy cold too. Looking forward to some sunny weather in Indonesia. Secondly, I take on board what you are saying. I work in an industry that uses model-release forms but in this instance, I don't think they are at all practical or indeed worth the paper they're printed on as most hookers I've met don't give their real names anyway.

I read the link that you provided as it's an issue that has given me plenty to think about in the past. One line that stands out is that "Liability rests solely with the publisher", so the example I gave earlier. About ISG making money from subscriptions, one the benefits of which is seeing lots of photos of girls (none of whom have signed a model release form). Is a similar position to mine.

I presume that legally I'd be safe because otherwise surely sights like youtube, who publish videos of gogo bars for example, or even wikipedia who use photos on prostitutes, would be legally threatened. I'm guessing their legal teams are pretty clued up.

I'd be really interested to hear Jackson's take on this in terms of the legal situation.

[QUOTE=Mighty Spearsman; 1124856]I sincerely appreciate your "thank-you's" and your promise to post a report.

But then you go ahead and once again ask a lot of questions. While it's tempting to answer your latest set of questions, or at least to tell you to RTFF and read 2007 posts by me (and others) about Malioboro, the reality is that there comes a time when one has to stop asking questions and actually do something & post about it! You've received more than enough info as it is.

The reality is that Jakarta is filled with good places, with a variety of different types of places to visit, from high-end to medium-end to low-end to soap-places to night clubs to smaller pick-up bars. Every place has at least a few pretty girls working there, even places like Kartika. You just have to be there when they're available.

By the way, I've had good luck at Kartika as early as 1 pm and as late as 9 pm. Some girls work only the day shift (ask for Cindy) and others don't arrive at work until 5 pm. My favorite girl at Berlian, Inna, doesn't start until 3 pm, but there's some cute girls there as early as 12 Noon.

So, stop asking questions and go out and have some fun! Then write a report here about what happened to you.[/QUOTE]Don't worry, I intend to go out and have some fun. I just need to make sure I'm clued up beforehand, hence the blitz of questions!

I assure you though, that I RTFFTSAEMEB (read the f*ing forum to such an extent my eyes bled) and as such the only questions I have asked are because I wasn't able to find the relevant answers on the forum. I went back over 50 pages in the jakarta section alone, making notes, although admittedly it's quite possible that in my trance-like state, I missed stuff on Mariobolo. And while there is a LOT of great information on this site (about the massage parlours for example) , not many reports say what time they visited, a really key bit of information.

So anyway, where is the best place to stay in Jakarta?

That was a joke BTW.

[QUOTE=John Marigold99;1125425]I agree that a Veblen effect is entirely possible here. Maybe we can continue this conversation over a beer at Top Gun sometime.[/QUOTE]I would love to, but alas, I am presently stuck in sex prison here in the USA.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;1124972]I'm not sure I get why they charge prices based only on where the girl comes from. Chinese girls are 1. 8 million? Some of those girls are really hot, and some are very mediocre. What they should do is charge based on how good looking the girl is. Some of those Chinese girls should be 1. 8 (not many of them) , but most should be less.[/QUOTE]I went to a low-middle end place in Solo once that had a so-called "Chinese" girl working there. She might have had a grand-mother who was a local Chinese, but she was as dark as any Javanese. And butt ugly to boot. But she worked non-stop, queues outside her door. A local friend said that the local clientele just wanted to be able to say that they'd tried a Chinese girl.

Upon arrival at the airport, I notice they moved the immigration lines for foreigners to having to cue on the left of the walkway prior to arriving in the actual arrival hall. What a clusterfuck.

[QUOTE=Gonzo Two;1125606]I went to a low-middle end place in Solo once that had a so-called "Chinese" girl working there. She might have had a grand-mother who was a local Chinese, but she was as dark as any Javanese. And butt ugly to boot. But she worked non-stop, queues outside her door. A local friend said that the local clientele just wanted to be able to say that they'd tried a Chinese girl.[/QUOTE]Now. That would be just cruel joke. For Chinese I mentioned in Alexis, it is Chinese as Chinese from China. Speaks not a single word of English, most of them. And they have very distinctive Chinese feature that mixed blood will fail to mimic most of the time. Their skin colour would be so milky that it might as well shine a little LOL!

Tough luck on you. Good luck for next one.

Those Chinese girls are from China. That is so true. But some of them are really really hot and others are mediocre. I don't understand how they can expect to charge the same for all of those Chinese girls. By the way, the mamasan who peddles those girls is hot. I'd like to have an hour and 1/2 in one of those rooms with her sometime.

I would welcome the views of fellow members.

I am currently in Cambodia and have some Singapore Airline air miles to use up and am considering a visit to Jakarta as I have never been there before what do you all think?

Where is the best places to visit for our hobby?

How much on average would one expect to pay for all night?

Where would you suggest I stay.

If not Jakarta I am open to suggestions, I have worked in Cambodia, Vietnam and Thailand so am looking for somewhere different.

Thanks

Riverstar,

Suggest the South, near Blok-M. Gran Marakam is very nice but plenty of options at all price levels. Lots of info to be found on this thread. Enjoy!

NS.

[QUOTE=Riverstar; 1126022]I would welcome the views of fellow members.

I am currently in Cambodia and have some Singapore Airline air miles to use up and am considering a visit to Jakarta as I have never been there before what do you all think?

Where is the best places to visit for our hobby?

How much on average would one expect to pay for all night?

Where would you suggest I stay.

If not Jakarta I am open to suggestions, I have worked in Cambodia, Vietnam and Thailand so am looking for somewhere different.

Thanks[/QUOTE]