Angeles City

Why not boycott these bars???

I have no stake in this (don't plan a trip to AC anytime soon), I'm only interested in the power of the board!!!

Say, we continue (weekly for 4 months) to push for members/visitors to the board to boycott all DH group bars...................I'd be interested to see the effects on their quarterly profit margin. Also, board members in AC info other punters-visitors of this experiment (not putting yourself in any danger, of course.....just small talk and recommendations).

Maybe we do have the power to change the down trend (treatment and prices) which would benefit everyone who visits AC in the future.

[QUOTE=LukeSkyWanker]I have been following the Angeles forum for a few years, I have intended to visit several times but at the last minute have always headed to Thailand or Indonesia due to concerns over scams and safety. My conclusions as a watcher are that the prices overall including hotels etc are equal, the women in Thailand are on average prettier but the attitude in Angeles is better. Maybe it would be a good idea if a new thread is added similar to the Thailand forum
"Places to Avoid" the dolls house group establishments should be listed.


May the force be with you.[/QUOTE]

Any problem experienced by foreigners is reported almost immediately, either by the numerous expats here through the forums, or by the more than several internet newsletters (such as Harry the Horse) published here. Thus the bars, police and locals are always under the microscope for their behaviour. Does it make a difference? I can't answer that. Do other location forums have an equal reporting system? There is a huge expat community living in Angeles City, if it were as much of a Wild West as one might imply by the reports, I doubt it would have such an active and vibrant expat community. That community seems to be growing by the month in part due to the current permanent visa problems in Thailand.

The vast majority of visitors and locals to Angeles have no problems. Ok, maybe if you are long-term resident or the luck of the draw has had you pick pocketed, or overcharged for a trike, maybe even an occassional bill padding (I've never heard of one that amounted to more than a couple of dollars U.S., at worst). I remember years ago in London, in a strip joint, a group of customer/tourists being ripped off for hundreds of pounds, after only 10 minutes, and the big ugly guys coming out of the back room to ensure payment.

Whether DHG was in the right (I can't imagine that) or in the wrong, the boycott is on--but for many it has been avoided anyway due to its pricing policies. But I am sure DHG has not noticed as the tourist traffic is so low on Fields avenue this year that be it a boycott or no visitors, the effect is the same. For clarity, though, Blue Nile Executive Club as mentioned in a previous post, is not part of the Blue Nile group which operates Blue Nile (the executive club is on the second floor of the Blue Nile Bar). Blue Nile has no relationship to the incident at the DHG.

My main point is that if one is avoiding Angeles City or the Philippines due to what they read on the forums, you are missing one of the top adult tourist destinations. I've been coming here for years and now live here and I have had ZERO incidents of personal safety, organized scam or even street crime. Like many I read the forums and generally followed the advice often given--don't interact or go with anyone you meet on the street (for me this includes the beggars, flower girls and street vendors), always have a smile and be courteous, avoid dark alleys and side streets, go to the bars most recommended on the forum, don't behave in an unsafe fashion (drunk in public, flashing large amounts of money, etc). Finally, for years I travelled to Thailand until I discovered Angeles, I've not been back to Thailand since. Just my preference, I found everything I needed here.

[QUOTE=Rubberyman]Bonzo, have you seen the pictures of the guy after the beating? Check out Harry the Horse's newsletter. The management story was that he fell down. Well, if you believe that the injuries received are consistent in any way with management's story, then do I have an insurance policy, used car, a bridge in Brooklyn to sell to you.

I agree with you when you say one should be careful everywhere - that is sound advice.

You also are right in saying that thinking one can avoid it by avoiding a bar or bar group is also correct.

However, while you cannot avoid it by avoiding bars with bad reputations, you can certainly minimise your risk by avoiding them - bars with bad reputations and bars with good reputations normally have those reputations for a reason.

You may not make the badly run bars change their behaviour, but you CAN make the other better run bars more successful by patronising them and thus rewarding good safe environments.[/QUOTE]


Sometimes you have to say the same thing here many times before people understand.

Look, OF COURSE no one deserves to be beaten like that - that goes without saying, but I have said it three times now. So the whole "this nice sweet innocent guy who did absolutely nothing wrong" thing was an unnecessary aspect of the story and makes it LESS credible and exactly the type of propaganda that makes bad situations worse. Btw, I'm not even saying that it's not possible that innocent people can be victims - I just doubt it in this case, as the entire article smacks of bias.

Anyhow, the reality is the guy was beaten nearly to death - the reasons for that don't matter; they are inexcusable. But, as players in a sometimes dangerous game, we can all learn from this story - and the lesson is a bigger one than just avoiding DH or it's group of bars.

The unfortunate REALITY of life in this environment is that if you get drunk and argue and/or shove people around and/or try to run out on a tab, you might get beaten. Is that right? Hell no. But it's the reality that we must be aware of here.

-B-

I feel sorry for the guy, and I'm sure there's an interesting story of what actually happened........but I don't care either way!!!

I'm only interested in trying out this experiment!!!

Imagine, if it really does effect a bars bottomline and they make changes????
Imagine, if the forum "is that powerful"
Next step would be working on the bars in Thailand!!!!!

[QUOTE=Rubberyman]Bonzo, have you seen the pictures of the guy after the beating? Check out Harry the Horse's newsletter. The management story was that he fell down. Well, if you believe that the injuries received are consistent in any way with management's story, then do I have an insurance policy, used car, a bridge in Brooklyn to sell to you.
[/QUOTE]

Sorry, I've posted on another board the same thing. There's such a thing called "Raccoon Eyes". It'll look like you have like two black eyes even though you have not been punched in the eyes or hit there. It is a sign of head trauma. Do a search on "raccoon eyes". I wasn't there and can't say if he was beaten or not, but based on my understanding of raccoon eyes, it's possible he hit his head to the ground where he may have slipped or fell back or been pushed back by someone or whatever. His face on the picture doesn't show any other trauma, so it makes me think it's definitely possible that his head hit the ground or something but how or why is the question. There had to be some force there though. I think if they beat his head in there would be more trauma to the face.

I'm not a fan of DH Group by the way, but I'm not going to say that they did this or that without any kind of good resources. Something happened there for sure.

[QUOTE=Key Master]Sorry, I've posted on another board the same thing. There's such a thing called "Raccoon Eyes". It'll look like you have like two black eyes even though you have not been punched in the eyes or hit there. It is a sign of head trauma. Do a search on "raccoon eyes". I wasn't there and can't say if he was beaten or not, but based on my understanding of raccoon eyes, it's possible he hit his head to the ground where he may have slipped or fell back or been pushed back by someone or whatever. His face on the picture doesn't show any other trauma, so it makes me think it's definitely possible that his head hit the ground or something but how or why is the question. There had to be some force there though. I think if they beat his head in there would be more trauma to the face.

I'm not a fan of DH Group by the way, but I'm not going to say that they did this or that without any kind of good resources. Something happened there for sure.[/QUOTE]
If you look at his nose you will see that it suffered some trauma. If he fell on his nose the rest of his face would likely have suffered abrasions. Since there are no apparent abrasions in this area a punch to the nose is more likely the cause of the nose trauma. If they took a 2X4 to his cranium his hair could be covering the point(s) of impact.

His "Raccoon Eyes" could be due to a steel toe boot to the head. "Raccoon Eyes" are usually caused by basilar skull fracture which only occurs in 4% of head injury cases. The most common causes of basilar skull fracture are automobile accidents and non accidental injury (blows to the head). This injury is not consistent with a fall on a level surface. Though I'm sure Doll House Group and their attorneys will argue otherwise.

Furthermore, the PNP would not have charged the bouncers without probable cause. They were the ones on the scene and investigating the incident. I'm sure the Pinoys got the benefit of the doubt. If this monger's ass wasn't viciously whopped they would not have arrested them.

[QUOTE=ThatGuy865]There is definitely money flowing thru these clubs and the head count is insignificant to these guys.[/QUOTE]Probably not completely insignificant. But yeah, there's not much question that some AC bars have, shall we say, other sources of income. This isn't the place to go into it, but ask any long-term expat. They'll tell you exactly the kind of people you're dealing with in these places.

I've got a few local friends who do like the big show bars and never have a problem. They just make sure they know the price of everything before they order it, and they pay as they go rather than running a tab. But who needs that, with so many good, friendly, honest bars in town.

Jackson: as a public service I request you allow an exception to your rule and allow this link to an external site including the picture of the victim:

The facts are becoming more clear about the incident where a Swede was nearly beaten to death by Dollhouse security on December 22 when he refused to pay a ladies drink price for a drink consumed by a girl he brought there from another bar. The company version of events is that the man slipped and bumped his head. I refrained from forming an opinion on who was telling the truth as I did not feel I had sufficient evidence to pass judgment. Until now that is.

After now having seen the pictures of the victim's eyes swelled shut and completely Black, which is not consistent with a slip and fall, and after reading more facts about both that particular incident and others involving DH Group security (the article from the Harrythehorse website is copied below), I find DH's story at odds with the evidence and will no longer patronize any DH group bars unless/until additional evidence surfaces which would convince me that the incident did not involve a beating by DH security.

Be aware that there are at least 6, the two most famous being Dollhouse itself and Atlantis. These are the two most impressive facilities with the largest lineups, best shows (bodypainting, Brazilian thing etc), and most photofriendly policies which are all big pluses. I have never had a bill padded at any of their bars personally, though I always try and pay as I go at all bars to avoid the potential for mischief. I have only paid one BF at Atlantis in all my years as I find them impersonal and the girls less than friendly despite the great shows and having many lookers in the lineup. Others claim to get good results from Atlantis and DH.

I certainly invite any members affiliated with DH group to offer any evidence they have which they claim refute the accusation of bill padding and brutality. I also would be interested if they admit the allegation that there is a sign in the lady's room offering a commission to girls from other bars who allow their companions to be charged ladies drink prices (typically 250Pesos) at DH group bars.

Here is the article from this week's newsletter of harrythehorse- to see the pictures go to [url]www.Harrythehorse.com[/url] then January 2010 archive.

An incident in front of the Doll House resulted in a Swedish National (Thomas Bergelin), being knocked to the ground, kicked in the head repeatedly, knocked unconscious and is now lying in the Angeles Medical Center in a coma like state. The doctors are not sure how much of a recovery he will make. Allegedly, the incident took place around 0200 hrs, 22 Dec and involved a Mamasan and a member of the internal security force employed by the Doll House. A source informed me that the foreigner was accused of leaving the premises without paying his bill but in truth, the girl he was with was inside paying the bill at the time he was attacked. Supposedly the Mamasan slapped the foreigner and when he went to grab the Mamasan in defence, the guard grabbed him and knocked him down. Then, allegedly, the Mamasan, the guard and the door boy continually kicked the man in the head while he was down on the ground. This resulted in brain damage, bleeding from the ear, internal bleeding from both sides of the brain and both eyes blackened. The Doll House management claims that it was an "accident". An interview with the victim was impossible as he was not conscious when I received this information.

A few days after this incident was reported to me, I received the following message from the victims friend, Peter:

Hi Horse, just thought you would like to know a Swedish friend of mine was attacked in the Dollhouse bar. He took his girlfriend in there for a drink and found the Dollhouse trying to charge him Ladies Drinks prices for his girlfriends drinks. She does not even work there. He refused to pay the ladies Drink price for his girls drink and the mamasan got the Doll House security to beat him up. He is a friendly guy who comes here on holiday every year, no trouble, always polite and generous. He is now in a coma fighting for his life after the beating. The Swedish Embassy is now involved and I think the shit is going to hit the fan. Especially if he dies. There are 2 posts running on *******.comand it seems the Dollhouse group will be seeing some back lash from this attack. I've known this guy for many years and he is a long time patron of Roadhouse and well liked. I hope you can follow up on this and let everyone know that these big bars can not keep ripping people off with their prices and even worse beating them in to a coma. I enclose a picture of Thomas for your file. I sure hope for the clubs owners sake he lives!, Regards, Peter.

(This is one story I hope to be able to track for the end results. Behavior of this type by any Club in town is deplorable. This is what happens when you hire oversized Filipino goons as guards in the Clubs. This is not the first time that the Doll House Club has been involved in incidents involving over aggressive actions with foreigners and also with overpricing activities and other incidents of manipulating receipts. For over a year now I have advised about being very careful when patronizing any Club run by the Doll House Group as one must watch their bills very carefully. The waitresses/cashier all too often overcharge or fail to properly explain their lady drink prices to customers. No doubt the Doll House management will have their version of the incident and I will be seeking that out, but there is absolutely no justification in having a customer of theirs lying in a hospital in a coma as a result of an altercation in their club. Folks, there is nothing that can be done about the standardization of prices on Fields Ave as the Club owners can always justify their cost of goods and other expenses as dictating the prices they charge. Fair enough, but when customers start to feel abused, as well as overcharged, then customers start to look elsewhere for their entertainment. If physical abuse comes into the equation then this black mark affects all bars on Fields regardless of the fact that the majority of the Clubs bend over backwards to take care of their customers. This incident disturbs me, it is serious and the culprits who committed this offense should be investigated and punished, (Roland and Allen) if indeed, this incident went down as reported. Update. (30 Dec 09). Last night I learned that Tom is out of his coma but is not well. He is suffering from memory loss and the doctors have said, if there are no complications, it will take him 16 weeks to recover. I visited station four and found that two individuals were arrested and taken to the Fiscal. Many feel the charge should be attempted murder but Fiscal Garcia decided to charge them with assault only and they were released on P6, 000 bail each. What a weak assed decision and you can bet if it was a foreigner who kicked a Filipino so brutally, the charge would be more severe and the bail, if any given, would be much higher. Allegedly, the Dollhouse management is trying to brush this off as an "accident" saying the guard pushed Thomas and he fell, striking his head on the pavement (Does the picture of Thomas to the right look like an accidental fall?). Supposedly there is a sign in the Dollhouse ladies room encouraging visiting ladies from other bars to ask for a ladies drink and get a commission. Additionally, a source informed me that after talking to one of the Filipino managers of the Dollhouse he was told that it was their policy to charge visiting ladies for ladies drinks. If that, is indeed, their policy then it is bullshit and can lead to many more incidents in a Club known for ripping off foreigners with their billing practices. If I took my wife into the Doll House or any other woman and they charged me for a ladies drink, I absolutely would not pay it! I have heard that the Swedish expats in town are boycotting the Dollhouse and are encouraging Swedish visitors to this town to do the same. My feeling is, as it has been for a number of years, that I do not go to the Doll House or any of the other Clubs under this Group because I do not trust their billing practices. It appears that the owner of this Group is out to buy up as much as he can on Fields Ave and might feel he is so rich and powerful that he can step on anyone he wants. Right now, the following establishments come under the Doll House Group: Doll House, Crystal Palace, Baby Dolls (previously Byrd Cage), Tropics, Atlantis, Pony Tail (Darn I like this one, decent Expat management here), Club Asia and what was the Blue Nile Executive Club. Could the Golden Nile be next and what about the property that used to be the Vian Lodge? That is a lot of entertainment under one persons control and the money supply must be endless. I applaud successful businessmen who come here and do well and provide great entertainment to visitors but I begin to worry when the safety of those living and visiting here is questionable when they enter certain clubs. These internal security men should be trained to subdue a person without using excessive force, something the goons in the Doll House Group have not learned to do. I have heard that further investigations into this attack is on-going and that the CIDG is involved as well. One other thing I would like to see is those ridiculous looking ladies in front of the Doll House and Atlantis moved off the street and closer to the entrance of the Clubs. Their practice of grabbing people and trying to pull them into the Club is not acceptable and can lead to confrontations. I was informed of one incident where a father was walking with his 15 year old son and he was grabbed by one of the Atlantis Club ladies and would not let go, even after the father told her to do so. The father ended up forcing her to let go and then the incident ended up in Station Four where the girl was submitting a complaint. It was settled but again, it shows how easily the practices of these employees can lead to entrapping a foreigner.) A further note on the difficulty in using the legal system to go after these individuals and the Doll House Group. One is a criminal case and the other is Civil. To pursue would take a minimum of P200, 000 plus filing fees and it would take at least two years of litigation. Thomas does not have that kind of money and he also has a mother back in Sweden who is not well. Derek and the Dollhouse has both the time and the money to drag out any litigation for years. The decent thing that Derek could do is pick up the tab for Thomas's hospital bill plus damages and go from there. What's the chances of that happening? His hospital bill as of 30 Dec was P90,000.00

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]

Sorry, I've posted on another board the same thing. There's such a thing called "Raccoon Eyes". It'll look like you have like two black eyes even though you have not been punched in the eyes or hit there. It is a sign of head trauma. Do a search on "raccoon eyes". I wasn't there and can't say if he was beaten or not, but based on my understanding of raccoon eyes, it's possible he hit his head to the ground where he may have slipped or fell back or been pushed back by someone or whatever. His face on the picture doesn't show any other trauma, so it makes me think it's definitely possible that his head hit the ground or something but how or why is the question. There had to be some force there though. I think if they beat his head in there would be more trauma to the face.

Racoon eyes and basilar skull fracture may certainly result from malicious trauma but as with any medical presentation the history is always the most important and it seems clear the story was he got a whipping.

Stay lucid and diplomatic and these problems can probably be entirely avoided. FWIW, I've only been to the PI twice but I've met hundreds of filipinas by now and have yet to meet a hostile or overtly aggressive one, unlike many areas in USA urbana.

[QUOTE=Pete Benetar] I've only been to the PI twice but I've met hundreds of filipinas by now and have yet to meet a hostile or overtly aggressive one, unlike many areas in USA urbana.[/QUOTE]Like you said, you've only been there twice. Maybe after you've been there quite a few times you think differently. I have seen Filipino's open a "can of whip ass" on tourist. And I'm not talking one on one. They are notorious for ganging up on foreigner. Just get in a public dispute with a Filipino and and be dumb enough to fight in public. They will automatically jump in on the side of another Filipino and not even care what the issue is about, and you will get a beat down.

[QUOTE=Chocha Monger]If you look at his nose you will see that it suffered some trauma. If he fell on his nose the rest of his face would likely have suffered abrasions. Since there are no apparent abrasions in this area a punch to the nose is more likely the cause of the nose trauma. If they took a 2X4 to his cranium his hair could be covering the point(s) of impact.

His "Raccoon Eyes" could be due to a steel toe boot to the head. "Raccoon Eyes" are usually caused by basilar skull fracture which only occurs in 4% of head injury cases. The most common causes of basilar skull fracture are automobile accidents and non accidental injury (blows to the head). This injury is not consistent with a fall on a level surface. Though I'm sure Doll House Group and their attorneys will argue otherwise.

Furthermore, the PNP would not have charged the bouncers without probable cause. They were the ones on the scene and investigating the incident. I'm sure the Pinoys got the benefit of the doubt. If this monger's ass wasn't viciously whopped they would not have arrested them.[/QUOTE]

Everything is speculative. No one on this board or the others seem to have anyone who was out front. It sounds like there were just mainly locals outside and they aren't talking. In regards to not being consistent with a fall on a level surface and that the bouncers were charged. Not saying that there was anything physical when I suggested anything earlier in trying to point out other possible scenarios. I believe there was an incident there, but I'm not into truly convinced that it was an absolute beatdown. There could have been some shoving or wrestling that led to him falling and a knock on the head onto something really hard that was not level but had significant force possibly from an altercation and with possibly an inability of a drunk man being able to ease a fall or maintain balance.

The security guards may have been charged with too much force or something leading to the injury and not an assault. I don't know. Just not into totally making a judgement without much information which I think most people on these boards have done due to DH resentment, which I myself have. I have shown that repeatedly by giving them oh so little business over the years and pretty much walk by their bars a lot of times without even looking in.

I would hope that DH takes care of this man's medical bills and whatever else is needed to get him back on his feet even if he may have had some of the blame which I know nothing of except he was supposedly drunk. Either way not jumping on the bandwagon like the majority. Too much speculation and hate and no eye witness accounts. I have seen too many drunk guys I wish got a wake-up call but not to this extent even if it was an accident.

[QUOTE=Matius]My main point is that if one is avoiding Angeles City or the Philippines due to what they read on the forums, you are missing one of the top adult tourist destinations. I've been coming here for years and now live here and I have had ZERO incidents of personal safety, organized scam or even street crime. Like many I read the forums and generally followed the advice often given-don't interact or go with anyone you meet on the street (for me this includes the beggars, flower girls and street vendors), always have a smile and be courteous, avoid dark alleys and side streets, go to the bars most recommended on the forum, don't behave in an unsafe fashion (drunk in public, flashing large amounts of money, etc). Finally, for years I travelled to Thailand until I discovered Angeles, I've not been back to Thailand since. Just my preference, I found everything I needed here.[/QUOTE]I took my first trip to AC in late August of last year and I found myself feeling quite safe. (Of course, studying here helped a lot in avoiding bad situations.) Between airfare, hotel and spending money I spent around 2, 200 US dollars and maybe lost 20 dollars at most getting cheated. I even rode a Jeepney at night with a girl and was fine. (Keep your wallet in your front pocket, much harder for someone to pick.) AC is quite safe if you use your head. Remember, you will always be outnumbered in a situation like that and right or wrong just pay. It sucks but I would rather be out five or ten American dollars that be put into a coma. I'm not blaming the victim, it's just reality.

Pony Tails charged me 300 pesos for a SM Light for a Cherry Girl but they told me ahead of time that is what it would cost. I went to Dollhouse and Pony Tails with my girl and as far as I remember I was not charged LD prices. When I took my Treasure Island girl back to TI they would charge me LD prices for her, which sucked. I paid too much for for one trike ride, but it's a buck and not a big deal.

(By the way, Pony Tails had just opened and their lineup was fairly brutal as far as looks go, but it was a weekend night and the place was packed so a lot of the hotties were with guys already. A lot of the wait staff was quite cute though.)

Personally, when I go back I probably won't even bother with Dollhouse or Crystal Palace, except for maybe their photo shows. I'll be focusing more on the Perimeter and making sure I'm not stupid enough to spend a whole week with the same girl again, although she was cool.

Gonzofiend

[QUOTE=Key Master]Either way not jumping on the bandwagon like the majority.[/QUOTE]
Thing is, it's pretty much impossible to NOT choose sides here. If a person knows about this incident and still chooses to visit the DHG, he is by default taking DHG's side. And if he chooses not to visit, he's taking the Swedish guy's side.

As for me, the incident was severe enough that I can't in good conscience go there until the thing is cleared up. If DHG's version of events turns out to be accurate, I can always make up for the money I didn't spend there (which, to be honest, isn't all that much anyway). But if the Swedish guy's version turns out to be more accurate, then I couldn't unspend the money I'd already spent.

[QUOTE=Billy Baht] Lodging is all over the board with more high end hotels opening up recently (who wants to pay first world prices in a third world country? Not Billy Baht!) [/QUOTE]
BB, for a high end hotel in London or Paris you pay easily 300-400 or more Euros a night. Far away from the mere 100 USD to be paid in ABC or LGH.
But not to be unfair, IMHO ABC and LGH aren't bad but not really 5*hotels.

Just my 2 Sen..

[QUOTE=Chocha Monger]A few days after this incident was reported to me, I received the following message from the victims friend, Peter:

Hi Horse, just thought you would like to know a Swedish friend of mine was attacked in the Dollhouse bar. He took his girlfriend in there for a drink and found the Dollhouse trying to charge him Ladies Drinks prices for his girlfriends drinks...she does not even work there. He refused to pay the ladies Drink price for his girls drink and the mamasan got the Doll House security to beat him up. He is a friendly guy who comes here on holiday every year, no trouble, always polite and generous. He is now in a coma fighting for his life after the beating. The Swedish Embassy is now involved and i think the shit is going to hit the fan...especially if he dies. There are 2 posts running on *******.com and it seems the Dollhouse group will be seeing some back lash from this attack. I’ve known this guy for many years and he is a long time patron of Roadhouse and well liked. I hope you can follow up on this and let everyone know that these big bars can not keep ripping people off with their prices and even worse beating them in to a coma. I enclose a picture of Thomas for your file. I sure hope for the clubs owners sake he lives!!!!!!!!!, Regards, Peter.

(This is one story I hope to be able to track for the end results. Behavior of this type by any Club in town is deplorable. This is what happens when you hire oversized Filipino goons as guards in the Clubs. This is not the first time that the Doll House Club has been involved in incidents involving over aggressive actions with foreigners and also with overpricing activities and other incidents of manipulating receipts. For over a year now I have advised about being very careful when patronizing any Club run by the Doll House Group as one must watch their bills very carefully. The waitresses/cashier all too often overcharge or fail to properly explain their lady drink prices to customers. No doubt the Doll House management will have their version of the incident and I will be seeking that out, but there is absolutely no justification in having a customer of theirs lying in a hospital in a coma as a result of an altercation in their club. Folks, there is nothing that can be done about the standardization of prices on Fields Ave as the Club owners can always justify their cost of goods and other expenses as dictating the prices they charge. Fair enough, but when customers start to feel abused, as well as overcharged, then customers start to look elsewhere for their entertainment. If physical abuse comes into the equation then this black mark affects all bars on Fields regardless of the fact that the majority of the Clubs bend over backwards to take care of their customers. This incident disturbs me, it is serious and the culprits who committed this offense should be investigated and punished, (Roland and Allen) if indeed, this incident went down as reported. Update - (30 Dec 09) - Last night I learned that Tom is out of his coma but is not well. He is suffering from memory loss and the doctors have said, if there are no complications, it will take him 16 weeks to recover. I visited station four and found that two individuals were arrested and taken to the Fiscal. Many feel the charge should be attempted murder but Fiscal Garcia decided to charge them with assault only and they were released on P6,000 bail each. What a weak assed decision and you can bet if it was a foreigner who kicked a Filipino so brutally, the charge would be more severe and the bail, if any given, would be much higher. Allegedly, the Dollhouse management is trying to brush this off as an "accident" saying the guard pushed Thomas and he fell, striking his head on the pavement (Does the picture of Thomas to the right look like an accidental fall?). Supposedly there is a sign in the Dollhouse ladies room encouraging visiting ladies from other bars to ask for a ladies drink and get a commission. Additionally, a source informed me that after talking to one of the Filipino managers of the Dollhouse he was told that it was their policy to charge visiting ladies for ladies drinks. If that, is indeed, their policy then it is bullshit and can lead to many more incidents in a Club known for ripping off foreigners with their billing practices. If I took my wife into the Doll House or any other woman and they charged me for a ladies drink, I absolutely would not pay it! I have heard that the Swedish expats in town are boycotting the Dollhouse and are encouraging Swedish visitors to this town to do the same. My feeling is, as it has been for a number of years, that I do not go to the Doll House or any of the other Clubs under this Group because I do not trust their billing practices. It appears that the owner of this Group is out to buy up as much as he can on Fields Ave and might feel he is so rich and powerful that he can step on anyone he wants. Right now, the following establishments come under the Doll House Group: Doll House, Crystal Palace, Baby Dolls (previously Byrd Cage), Tropics, Atlantis, Pony Tail (Darn I like this one, decent Expat management here), Club Asia and what was the Blue Nile Executive Club. Could the Golden Nile be next and what about the property that used to be the Vian Lodge? That is a lot of entertainment under one persons control and the money supply must be endless. I applaud successful businessmen who come here and do well and provide great entertainment to visitors but I begin to worry when the safety of those living and visiting here is questionable when they enter certain clubs. These internal security men should be trained to subdue a person without using excessive force, something the goons in the Doll House Group have not learned to do. I have heard that further investigations into this attack is on-going and that the CIDG is involved as well. One other thing I would like to see is those ridiculous looking ladies in front of the Doll House and Atlantis moved off the street and closer to the entrance of the Clubs. Their practice of grabbing people and trying to pull them into the Club is not acceptable and can lead to confrontations. I was informed of one incident where a father was walking with his 15 year old son and he was grabbed by one of the Atlantis Club ladies and would not let go, even after the father told her to do so. The father ended up forcing her to let go and then the incident ended up in Station Four where the girl was submitting a complaint. It was settled but again, it shows how easily the practices of these employees can lead to entrapping a foreigner.) A further note on the difficulty in using the legal system to go after these individuals and the Doll House Group. One is a criminal case and the other is Civil. To pursue would take a minimum of P200,000 plus filing fees and it would take at least two years of litigation. Thomas does not have that kind of money and he also has a mother back in Sweden who is not well. Derek and the Dollhouse has both the time and the money to drag out any litigation for years. The decent thing that Derek could do is pick up the tab for Thomas's hospital bill plus damages and go from there. What's the chances of that happening??? His hospital bill as of 30 Dec was P90,000.00[/QUOTE]We all should never go to this place.

And tell all not to go ther I know what it is like I did get the same from Thailand in soi cow boy I not pay for lady drink that lady never come to sit with me as I did report in Bangkok report.

It hapen to me I get beaten up so bad.

We should stik together like can we all put $ 1. 00 in the pot to pay court cost to take them and stop them from doing this aging?

I would like to be the frist to satart it?

I am so not happy to read about thist as I have been there.

Please get back?

What can we do.