Kyiv

[QUOTE=Prosal]Seconded at 100%.
I'd add witty to the list. Try to make humor with an ukrainian (or moldovian for that matter) girl and she'll -often- just look at you like you're from Mars.
[/QUOTE]Ukrainian women don't have a sense of humor. Just ask my grandmother.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Russian and Ukrainian women are both beautiful in their own right, with many (including many Russians) saying that Ukrainian women are the most beautiful of all.

Other than that, in my experience Russian women are more intelligent, cultured, cosmopolitan, sexual, honest, realistic and much more clever than their Ukrainian cousins.

I've said it before... all Slavic women are good at being manipulative in their own wiley feminine way, however Russian girls are clever and cunning whereas Ukrainian girls are sneaky and conniving.

Not that I don't like Ukrainian girls, but Russian girls are better overall in my opinion.

Essentially all Ukrainian girls are village girls with village qualities, but with village tastes and village attitudes. They are manipulative as hell, but can be manipulated as well. Nonetheless, the game grows tiresome.Obviously I disagree... but maybe we've just been meeting different kinds of women. My experiences in Russia are based mostly on Moscow and St.Petersburg women, whereas in Ukraine on Kiev and Odessa.[/QUOTE]


Doctor, I really appreciate your opinion and seems to be based or real experiences. What can you recommend in “export “ a woman from these countries which one has better chance to be integrated in a different country? maybe for a 3 months period or maybe longer? Thai women and Latinas are very difficult because you marriage the “family"; is the same with Russian and Ukraine and the integration in a different country easy? e.g. language, food, weather, earn money etc

Very interesting issue Sponsor74 !

I share my experience: 2 friends married with czech women, 1 divorced, 1 still happy together.
Other 3 friends married with slovak girls: they are all together, but only one happy, the others 2 just live together.

So 5 marriage with ex ceskoslovensko country and only 1 happy.

BUT all and I mean really ALL, married not only family, but also wife's grandmother,grandfather....

I am the happiest one, as I go often, I get fun, some relationship, but never thought about marriage. I got much more than all these 5 friends together with much less effort, energy, money...

That's why I will marry only with myself ;)

Curious about the experiences the others have to share

[QUOTE=Lukasek]Very interesting issue Sponsor74 !

I share my experience: 2 friends married with czech women, 1 divorced, 1 still happy together.
Other 3 friends married with slovak girls: they are all together, but only one happy, the others 2 just live together.

So 5 marriage with ex ceskoslovensko country and only 1 happy.

BUT all and I mean really ALL, married not only family, but also wife's grandmother,grandfather....

I am the happiest one, as I go often, I get fun, some relationship, but never thought about marriage. I got much more than all these 5 friends together with much less effort, energy, money...

That's why I will marry only with myself ;)

Curious about the experiences the others have to share[/QUOTE]

In Switzerland (Swiss & Swiss) from 3 marriages 2 divorced and 1 in a deep crisis; Swiss & Foreigners the rate is not too bad like Swiss & Swiss but Russian & Ukraine women have here a very bad reputation mainly due to our ugly and old Swiss women (of course there are exceptions) but the positive side is the bank account of the women here and this is not the case with desperates women from Russia and Ukraine; anyway in my opinion maybe a good chance BUT not necessary to get married, why? the risk is too big

[QUOTE=Waryman]Hello,

CIM was offered in brothels speaking directly to the girl once alone. Ask in Russian <<I want to finish in mouth. How much Easy to get from a translator if you don't speak Russian. Not all offered the possibility but one in two/three. As told, I prefer not too known brothels. As people over there have a limited if any knowledge of english, enough Russian to ask for things or to sustain a simple phone call is a serious advantage (it really saved my life in Russia).

They were not far from khreshatik. I found them asking to cab drivers or to a casino waiter. Regarding cab drivers is useful to tell him to arrange a full-pack. That is calling the brothel, fixing a price and the taxi fare. So you know in advance which is the total cost. If not he will drive you for the whole night through Kiev.

Considering serious or semi serious relationships: After my experience not a little amount of educated girls (university graduates, secretaries et. Al) are quite open to leave for the western world (machismo regarding female work, idealizing the west, divorce.). As I work in a managerial position I did not have much trouble in playing my part in the wooing (I repeat: They are educated girls who have a notion of the real world, they are not fooled easily).

As in any other situation back home, this is taking chances. I don't say that any girl I accosted fell in my arms valentino style. Of course clean looks and an attiring country play their part. And also a certain age range. I really don't think a 46 y. O hardware-shop clerk from Hoboken. Or Tessaloniki for american readers- stands much chances of getting a 22 yo. Wannabe model.

As where are the brothels-girls now I don't know. That was what I was asking for in my first mail!

Regards

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size][/QUOTE]Hello all,

A bit late maybe, but as I always do I try to make a brief report of my travels.

A) Streetwalkers:

To be found after passing the "Victory Avenue" once you past the Shevchenko blvd near the zoo.

Not too many and of varied quality and price (400-500 UAH/hour). best days on weekends around midnight. If interested just ask a taxi driver.

B) Riverpalace:

Around 200EUR/hour. Price is difficult to negociate but not time. I got two girls around 180-200 EUR for the whole night (2:00-8:00). Beautiful but with no particular sexual abilities.

C) Semi-pros:

In places like Arena or Patipa.

About 100EUR two hours. After my experience good ratio quality-service-price.

D) Salons:

Quality medium-low. Price about 500-700 UAH/hour.

E) Freebies:

Takes a lot of work and very difficult for non-residents or non russian speakers.

As I always try to be nice and civil (they are girls not just heaps of flesh) and I am not too spoiled I got two of them who did me a particular good service (in fact one finished with me free just for fun).

Conclussions:

1.- Russian remains mandatory, although the number of english-speaking girls have increased.

2.- Euro-Latin type is much in demand (specially middle class Spaniards and Northern Italians).

3.- The crisis have led many young mothers into the trade (girls here tend to marry very young).

4.- Best time for semi-pros in discos is around 3:00AM.

5.- If you are not too good looking or under forty, try directly an agency like GIA, don't play the fool. In Riverpalace I've seen Anericans disgracing their country more than Guantanamo has. This is not Tijuana, boys!

Have fun.

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]

Thanks for your sincere report.

I would like to deepen:

- about touchkas, did you see any young and nice ones? Did you find them along (very long) Pobedy Prospect or after that (very far from the centre)?

- about prices, never, never, never pay in euros! This is another way to increase prices: from 100 grivnas to 100 dollars and then to 100 euros, that's a difference!

- overnight time is traditionally from 10 p.m. to 8 a.m., that means 10 hours. Less than 10 hours is not "night";

- in all "dating" clubs I always ask for a specific service, the swallow deepthroat blowjob; when a girl agrees then I ask for the price; and then, again, in my (not her!) flat I have always to check she makes good sex because it is usual girls try every kind of tricks and cheats not to commit our agreement;

- about prices, those prices are very high! Where is the "crisis"??? Here somebody payed 150 euros for a whole day, most men pay 100/200 dollars for an hour, but that rate is similar, sometimes lower sometimes higher, than Western Europe!

Guys, keep prices down, otherwise we all have to go to Thailand!

[QUOTE=Waryman]Hello all,

A bit late maybe, but as I always do I try to make a brief report of my travels.

A) Streetwalkers:

To be found after passing the "Victory Avenue" once you past the Shevchenko blvd near the zoo.

Not too many and of varied quality and price (400-500 UAH/hour). best days on weekends around midnight. If interested just ask a taxi driver.

B) Riverpalace:

Around 200EUR/hour. Price is difficult to negociate but not time. I got two girls around 180-200 EUR for the whole night (2:00-8:00). Beautiful but with no particular sexual abilities.

C) Semi-pros:

In places like Arena or Patipa.

About 100EUR two hours. After my experience good ratio quality-service-price.

D) Salons:

Quality medium-low. Price about 500-700 UAH/hour.

E) Freebies:

Takes a lot of work and very difficult for non-residents or non russian speakers.

As I always try to be nice and civil (they are girls not just heaps of flesh) and I am not too spoiled I got two of them who did me a particular good service (in fact one finished with me free just for fun).

Conclussions:

1.- Russian remains mandatory, although the number of english-speaking girls have increased.

2.- Euro-Latin type is much in demand (specially middle class Spaniards and Northern Italians).

3.- The crisis have led many young mothers into the trade (girls here tend to marry very young).

4.- Best time for semi-pros in discos is around 3:00AM.

5.- If you are not too good looking or under forty, try directly an agency like GIA, don't play the fool. In Riverpalace I've seen Anericans disgracing their country more than Guantanamo has. This is not Tijuana, boys!

Have fun.

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size][/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Waryman]Hello all,

A bit late maybe, but as I always do I try to make a brief report of my travels.

A) Streetwalkers:

To be found after passing the "Victory Avenue" once you past the Shevchenko blvd near the zoo.

Not too many and of varied quality and price (400-500 UAH/hour). best days on weekends around midnight. If interested just ask a taxi driver.

B) Riverpalace:

Around 200EUR/hour. Price is difficult to negociate but not time. I got two girls around 180-200 EUR for the whole night (2:00-8:00). Beautiful but with no particular sexual abilities.

C) Semi-pros:

In places like Arena or Patipa.

About 100EUR two hours. After my experience good ratio quality-service-price.

D) Salons:

Quality medium-low. Price about 500-700 UAH/hour.

E) Freebies:

Takes a lot of work and very difficult for non-residents or non russian speakers.

As I always try to be nice and civil (they are girls not just heaps of flesh) and I am not too spoiled I got two of them who did me a particular good service (in fact one finished with me free just for fun).

Conclussions:

1.- Russian remains mandatory, although the number of english-speaking girls have increased.

2.- Euro-Latin type is much in demand (specially middle class Spaniards and Northern Italians).

3.- The crisis have led many young mothers into the trade (girls here tend to marry very young).

4.- Best time for semi-pros in discos is around 3:00AM.

5.- If you are not too good looking or under forty, try directly an agency like GIA, don't play the fool. In Riverpalace I've seen Anericans disgracing their country more than Guantanamo has. This is not Tijuana, boys!

Have fun.

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size][/QUOTE]Waryman,

A great report of distinction, many thanks from london, came in very handy for me, prior to my landing in kiev next week.

I concur with the idea of agreeing a total package with a ta xi driver to visit apts, agree on the return fare, price for a girl etc, I woudn't fancy looking for a taxi in some obsecure kiev suburb. In fact this suggestion is valid for many destinatione in ee and central european countries, at least you have a buddy and a guide, in the taxi driver. And I would keep his no for return visits.

Only by reading and rereading the reports on salons in kiev, I figured out that salons are the term or name given for brothels in apartments

Waryman from your insight and experience with kiev, would FS be available in erotic massage places there discreetly? , and if so how much extra would that be?

And what goes on in sauna places any FS?

[QUOTE=Acolonizer] Guys, keep prices down, otherwise we all have to go to Thailand! [/QUOTE]I know a working girl in kiev who is great at sex, just a perfect sex partner.

Some of these rich guys like her so much, they pay her anywhere from 2 to 5 times what she asks, be it for an hour, a day or a trip somewhere.

Where $100 would do, some of these jerks will give her $500

This does not include the things they buy for her, upon request or not.

I do not care if I was a billionaire, I would not pay more than the agreed upon rate. I would tip reasonably for services rendered.

You rich guys that show off your money by overpaying are ruining some of these woman for the rest of us.

[QUOTE=Explorer69]Maybe you can explain a little bit more in details excactly what you mean - and maybe even give examples? Your view is interesting![/QUOTE]My opinion being subjective, it is just a general impression I have gotten, albeit with a bit of experience.

For example, if you take a girl out for dinner in Moscow and Kiev, the girl in Moscow is just as likely to order just tea and cheescake whereas the girl in Kiev will order expensive shit she barely touches. It's not always that way of course, but it is reflective of general attitudes. And its petty.

By the same token, you sometimes get girls in Ukraine who absolute relish in a meal and you know it is probably the best restaurant meal they have ever had... or maybe will ever have, aside from their wedding day when they'll blow 3 years wages on a 2-year marriage. Lately my Russian girls have prefered staying in and cooking or ordering out. They're bored of restaurants.

So there are constrasts.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]My opinion being subjective, it is just a general impression I have gotten, albeit with a bit of experience.

For example, if you take a girl out for dinner in Moscow and Kiev, the girl in Moscow is just as likely to order just tea and cheescake whereas the girl in Kiev will order expensive shit she barely touches. It's not always that way of course, but it is reflective of general attitudes. And its petty.

By the same token, you sometimes get girls in Ukraine who absolute relish in a meal and you know it is probably the best restaurant meal they have ever had... or maybe will ever have, aside from their wedding day when they'll blow 3 years wages on a 2-year marriage. Lately my Russian girls have prefered staying in and cooking or ordering out. They're bored of restaurants.

So there are constrasts.[/QUOTE]I have noticed the same thing, I agree. But that is only one part of it, but yes, Russian girls are more "big city girls".

My experience is also exclusively from Moscow, St petersburg, Kiev and Odessa

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Thanks for your sincere report.

I would like to deepen:

- about touchkas, did you see any young and nice ones? Did you find them along (very long) Pobedy Prospect or after that (very far from the centre)?[/quote]I mentioned the zoo. Easy to find in maps- as a reference. It is on the far side of town. Girls arem usually at the bus stops. If you see one or two girls at a bus stop mor metro entrance at 2:00 am. Gotcha.

If you mean if a have seen 17yo lolypop suckers with goldylocks. The answer is not.

[quote]- about prices, never, never, never pay in euros! This is another way to increase prices: from 100 grivnas to 100 dollars and then to 100 euros, that's a difference![/quote]I disagree. After the lack of stability with the grivna they prefer a strong currency. And will low the price. You can bet some of these girls should work at a stockbroker's after the ease. And accuracy- of how they make conversions!

[quote]- overnight time is traditionally from 10 p.m. to 8 a.m., that means 10 hours. Less than 10 hours is not "night";[/quote]Well. At 10:00 there are not any girls around.

A tip: if you arrange things too early the girl will try to finish you off as soon as possible and then go back to the place to find another customer. At 2:00 or 3:00 they begin to think the night is not a good one and their attitude is more humble.

[quote]- in all "dating" clubs I always ask for a specific service, the swallow deepthroat blowjob; when a girl agrees then I ask for the price; and then, again, in my (not her!) flat I have always to check she makes good sex because it is usual girls try every kind of tricks and cheats not to commit our agreement;[/quote]As always this is hit and miss. After your comments you prefer rather rough sex. I prefer another approach, which in a 50-70% of cases works well.

[quote]- about prices, those prices are very high! Where is the "crisis"??? Here somebody payed 150 euros for a whole day, most men pay 100/200 dollars for an hour, but that rate is similar, sometimes lower sometimes higher, than Western Europe![/quote]This is relative. I prefer to pay 100eur for one-two hours with a young commited girl than 150 usd for an old gruntling nag.

What I like of ua girls is the natural semi-pro approach. If they like you or you earn their trust they can be very, very girlfriend like. Believe it or not one girl washed my dishes after the service. ""this is a mess I can't leave you like that""!

I insist. Most. At least my targets. Or the ones that aim at me- are semi-pros with a regular life, if they don't get what they expect, they prefer to go home empty handed. For harcore pros I would rather recommend fkk clubs or south-western europe (I have no experience on turkey or britain for that point), as they are cheaper.

They are having difficult times but. At least kiev- they are not as bad off as it seems: with 300eur you can leave well in the left bank.

Regards

[quote]Guys, keep prices down, otherwise we all have to go to Thailand![/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]My opinion being subjective, it is just a general impression I have gotten, albeit with a bit of experience.

For example, if you take a girl out for dinner in Moscow and Kiev, the girl in Moscow is just as likely to order just tea and cheescake whereas the girl in Kiev will order expensive shit she barely touches. It's not always that way of course, but it is reflective of general attitudes. And its petty.

By the same token, you sometimes get girls in Ukraine who absolute relish in a meal and you know it is probably the best restaurant meal they have ever had... or maybe will ever have, aside from their wedding day when they'll blow 3 years wages on a 2-year marriage. Lately my Russian girls have prefered staying in and cooking or ordering out. They're bored of restaurants.

So there are constrasts.[/QUOTE]

Doctor, good post even if subjective. In Kiev I have some experiences and really great women and regarding dinner I did not have this experience; however, sometimes after the dinner was only bye bye. Thailand is similar with the girls in a dinner, they order and order and don’t eat all BUT the prices there are cheaper therefore, the damage is not too big, anyway the yellow Asia skin is not my favorite. I really prefer the white skin and blondes from Ukraine; sorry no experiences in Moscow due to the Visa requirements for us Swiss people and the expensive hotels / apartments in Moscow, any change in this topic, easy to get a visa there in the airport? Or apartments in good location for USD 100 per night? I assume the girls prices are more or less like in Ukraine?

I'm planning on going to Kiev for my first time and am looking for help regarding several things.

First off, I am looking at finding a month long apartment rental from about September 7th to October 7th or so. My budget is about 300-450 euros. I'm afraid I'm on a bit of a budget and that the cheaper the place is the more I will be able to get my dick wet. Plus it needs internet so I can look up info on girls. I'm not sure if anyone could help in these regards as I see most of you are spending that much for a week's stay.

Secondly, I am completely new to the P4P game and really just want to get a few fantasies fulfilled so that the grass is not always greener on the other side. I figure I will pay if I can't try and swing some freebies, but there is a lack of game that I need to work on and try to overcome. I figure I will be in Kiev for a month so I have time to get over the learning curve. Lack of Russian is a concern as well. I'm assuming that English will serve me better than French or Spanish though.

Lastly, any tips on using mamba/flirt for picking up freebies?

[QUOTE=Sponsor74]Doctor, good post even if subjective. In Kiev I have some experiences and really great women and regarding dinner I did not have this experience; however, sometimes after the dinner was only bye bye. Thailand is similar with the girls in a dinner, they order and order and don’t eat all BUT the prices there are cheaper therefore, the damage is not too big, anyway the yellow Asia skin is not my favorite. I really prefer the white skin and blondes from Ukraine; sorry no experiences in Moscow due to the Visa requirements for us Swiss people and the expensive hotels / apartments in Moscow, any change in this topic, easy to get a visa there in the airport? Or apartments in good location for USD 100 per night? I assume the girls prices are more or less like in Ukraine?[/QUOTE]
You can't get a visa at the airport, you must arrive with a visa.

Although apartments have gone down in price recently in Moscow... as have hotels... anything central will still be $150+. There are many agencies though, just google it and check.

Price-wise:

salons/brothels: $100/hour and up
pick-up bars: $250 and up/2-3 hours and up

It's not cheaper than Kiev, but had gotten a bit more affordable in the last year. More of a problem is the fact that the quality at the pick-up bars isn't that great. The salons have a much higher quality for price ratio however if you dont speak Russian, they can be difficult to locate and navigate once there.

St.Petersburg is actually easier in that sense, and slightly cheaper.

Hey man

Some good reports from you on your recent trip. I'm taking some buddies to Kiev next weekend, wondered which clubs/bars you'd recommend that were fun and had a decent selection of semi-pro's/non p2p's.

Happy mongering all!