German FKK Clubs - Lounge and chat area

[QUOTE=XXL;1868345]Regarding taxes, a girl at Artemis explained to me many girls liked Artemis because it applied the "Berliner model" aka "Duesseldorfer Model" regarding taxes. The model provides that the clubs withholds a modest sum for taxes (I heard 30 euros mentioned) each day from each girl. The girl then need not bother about filing tax returns.[/QUOTE]The so called "Duesseldorfer Modell" is the standard procedure in almost every club in Germany. Girls use this everywhere and not only at Artemis. And AFAIK the daily tax payment is still 25 euro.

[QUOTE=Craiova;1868361]The so called "Duesseldorfer Modell" is the standard procedure in almost every club in Germany. Girls use this everywhere and not only at Artemis. And AFAIK the daily tax payment is still 25 euro.[/QUOTE]In Hessen 25€, 30€ in Berlin AFAIK. And it has nothing to do with the self employment status of the girls, it's a down payment on the girl's income taxes, not more.

HB.

[QUOTE=HessenBub;1868395]In Hessen 25, 30 in Berlin AFAIK. And it has nothing to do with the self employment status of the girls, it's a down payment on the girl's income taxes, not more.[/QUOTE]Yep that's how it is. But the daily tax payment of 25 or 30 euro is only theoretical a down payment bc in reality usually no foreign club girl makes a german tax declaration therefore the down payment is de facto already the tax declaration.

[QUOTE=Craiova;1868361]The so called "Duesseldorfer Modell" is the standard procedure in almost every club in Germany. Girls use this everywhere and not only at Artemis. [/QUOTE]The Artemis girl told me "bei weitem nicht in jedem Laden", that's a far cry from "in almost every club in Germany". The girl in question was a German girl (Joice) who'd been around in Germany. Good body, good service. She told me when she wanted to work somewhere she sent her boyfriend on a reconnaissance as a customer to the place to fathom the atmosphere, a clever move I thought. She scoffed when I mentioned press reports of "trafficked women" at Artemis, of all places.

The fact is with such a daily lump sum girls who could make 10000 euros a months could technically pay 30 euros a day income tax.

[QUOTE=XXL;1868440] She told me when she wanted to work somewhere she sent her boyfriend as a customer to the place to fathom the atmosphere, a clever move I thought. She scoffed when I mentioned press reports of "trafficked women" at Artemis, of all places.[/QUOTE]Sure. Her "boyfriend". Cool, he goes there to check out the place and fuck a few girls with her money. LOL. Why should Artemis have less issues with trafficked women than any other FKK?

HB.

[QUOTE=XXL;1868440]The Artemis girl told me "bei weitem nicht in jedem Laden", that's a far cry from "in almost every club".[/QUOTE]Girls in clubs tell a lot. Just today I've read at the german forum RF a club girl told a guy one night in dorm bed at one big5 Frankfurt club cost 350 euro per night together with the club entrance fee. The guy believe this and wrote this BS in forum. LOL.

No idea where your Artemis girl has worked before but all my regular clubs use the "Duesseldorfer Modell" for instance all Frankfurt big5 FKK clubs.

[QUOTE=Craiova;1868450]Girls in clubs tell a lot.[/QUOTE]She'd never have told the story if it had been to Craiova or Hessen Bub instead of to gullible me, I know, I know. Or those guys wouldn't have believed it anyway, for sure.

The girl in question was interested about one of the Bavarian clubs in which I was a regular customer but yes, she was probably just feigning interest to rub my ego. Besides, who would send a boyfriend to a prospective employment place to get an idea of how it's like inside? No one would do such a thing.

[QUOTE=Jim57;1868213]If you want something similar to Sharks or Artemis I'm assuming you are looking for girls to be nude? If so you are limited in that area. There may be others here who know better but I think the only true FKK in the greater Cologne area is Babylon. All the other clubs suggested are sauna clubs and girls will be wearing some clothes. However its a smallish club so you won't get the quantity but quality is fine & service levels are good.[/QUOTE]I don't care about the nudity, I'm just looking for a club with most number of girls.

[QUOTE=Samcik;1868460]I don't care about the nudity, I'm just looking for a club with most number of girls.[/QUOTE]Mondial consistently has a ton of girls. Numbers at GT and ACA were low last month and imo Mondial had more girls. As for them being naked I prefer MOST of those Mondial girls to be fully clothed!

[QUOTE=XXL;1868440]The Artemis girl told me "bei weitem nicht in jedem Laden", that's a far cry from "in almost every club in Germany". The girl in question was a German girl (Joice) who'd been around in Germany. Good body, good service. She told me when she wanted to work somewhere she sent her boyfriend on a reconnaissance as a customer to the place to fathom the atmosphere, a clever move I thought. She scoffed when I mentioned press reports of "trafficked women" at Artemis, of all places.

The fact is with such a daily lump sum girls who could make 10000 euros a months could technically pay 30 euros a day income tax.[/QUOTE]Either way the rumor that Artemis girls are charging clients whatever they want is alarming. There should be some house rule in FKK. Like every other enterprises not just FKK.

Interesting to hear about the new pricing in Artemis on this board. If it works it could improve the LU as all the girls will be lining up to come to Artemis thus driving standards up in terms of 8-10's AND it could then spread to all other FKKs.

So that's 200 per hour --oh well, it'll have the long term effect of keeping riff-raff out! Seriously, guys like us hooked on FKK will pay the higher price. Could lead to higher standards too.

Whoa, You say let's not speculate, and then present a straw man argument about not criminalizing men. But where did that even come from? No one (credible) has said anything about criminalizing men. One raid on Artemis, and we are moving so far far from the actuals.

The worst that has been (speculated) is that Artemis might close, and then some one said today one girl (or perhaps a couple of girls) are charging excessive amounts. It is not yet confirmed that laissez faire pricing policy is official for the whole club at Artemis.

How did we even jump from there to (not) criminalizing men?

In fact, even the so called German prostitution bill (which has been speculated here endlessly) has a silver lining. It might make BBBJ illegal, but otherwise it is blessing the whole act of prostitution as clearly legal and perhaps sustainable under the new law for a much longer period.

No reason for alarmist speculations that men will be criminalized. Far from it.

[QUOTE=Sybarite2006;1867913]I think all this speculation is pointless!

....


I don't think Germany, at the moment, is in danger of going the Scandinavia or French route of criminalizing the client! Well I hope not!

If it does, move on to Switzerland or Austria![/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Jnpr30;1868539]Whoa, You say let's not speculate, and then present a straw man argument about not criminalizing men. But where did that even come from? No one (credible) has said anything about criminalizing men. One raid on Artemis, and we are moving so far far from the actuals.

The worst that has been (speculated) is that Artemis might close, and then some one said today one girl (or perhaps a couple of girls) are charging excessive amounts. It is not yet confirmed that laissez faire pricing policy is official for the whole club at Artemis.

How did we even jump from there to (not) criminalizing men?

In fact, even the so called German prostitution bill (which has been speculated here endlessly) has a silver lining. It might make BBBJ illegal, but otherwise it is blessing the whole act of prostitution as clearly legal and perhaps sustainable under the new law for a much longer period.

No reason for alarmist speculations that men will be criminalized. Far from it.[/QUOTE]Let just ignore, self claim police that are very common here. We are always just discussing, and they try to turn this forum into debate club. I mean it is lounge and chat, it does not mean to be constructive like in court or parliament.

Some report of some girls are already taking advantage and control over pricing rule is messed up. What is the point of FKK concept. I might avoid Berlin next time I go and give some time to see how Artemis get back to how it used to be.

We need Kenan back in his chair.

[QUOTE=MrHo;1868494]Either way the rumor that Artemis girls are charging clients whatever they want is alarming. There should be some house rule in FKK. Like every other enterprises not just FKK.[/QUOTE]FKK clubs say they are open for male and female guests. Both pay entry. Girls pay the 25/30€ down payment on their income tax. The club just provides facilities, food and beverage, towels etc. No other business relationship between the club and the guests. That's basically it. Prostitution in Germany is legal, no need for the new law to improve that fact.

Now the enterprise (in any business) has a group of people offering services / working in his facility. If he doesn't set any rules, regulations, doesn't give any orders or detailed instructions on how the service has to be provided, the people offering the service are freelancers / self employed. If there is somebody giving detailed instructions, this is taken as a sign that the person is actually not self employed. This is not just a problem for FKK clubs, this applies to any other business. IBM faced that problem with IT freelancers they hired to reduce fix labor cost and save social security payments etc.

All I want to say it is not that simple and not just black and white, it's grey. All shades of grey. LOL.

HB.

[QUOTE=HessenBub;1868625]Girls pay the 25/30€ down payment on their income tax.[/QUOTE]So, are the clubs authorised by the government to collect income tax from independent contractors? If they are, I presume identification like tax file numbers would be required?