Safe Sex and Sex Related Discussions in Thailand

[QUOTE=Lee66]Buffered gels are coming on the market soon, that is if they can survive the big anti-p4p propaganda. large numbers of men can't use condoms in sea, most are no longer involved with p4p (scared about aids). I"ve been doing surveys in north thailand, and bangkok. Most of the girls think they catch aids the first time they fuck some one with aids and no condom. And most will fuck u with no condom if you tell rhem you don"t have aids. I use a non patentable gel for 6 years, never caught anything. Yes the anti sex club has very effective propaganda but it is a lot easier to die from somthiung else you haven"t been told to worry about. Now I am in phnom penh I am far more concerned about haveing a accident on the street or getting asaulted by several of the towns ya ba addicts, as just happened last week about a block from martini.[/QUOTE]

Lee66,

good luck to you. You will need it.


Giotto

There is so much nonsense and half knowledge written here in this thread, and in other safe sex threads of the board, besides very few reasonably substantiated reports about the facts. Especially reg. HIV there are still so many open questions, scientists are working on in huge projects.

There is no such unofficial number that 30% - 50 % of the Thai Bar Girls are HIV positive. Where should that number come from, most of those girls would not even admit to work in that business to avoid losing face. There are estimations from wonnabe scientists about infection rates in Pattaya and the BKK p4p areas, but nobody should take this numbers for granted.

Then I read something about CD4 cells (T-cells with CD4 receptors) being located in huge numbers in the urethra, to transport the HIV virus to the lymph nodes! No, those cells can be found in the blood and the lymph fluid. To get into contact with the CD4 cells the HIV virus has still to pass through the skin membrane into the blood/lymph system, and it is still unclear up to today under which circumstance this definitely happens. There are theories that additionally funguses/other STDs are involved in that process.

What information should we use to make up our minds about the risks we take?

There are some country related numbers regarding the AIDS infection rates of the populations, published by the WHO and the CDC. That gives us a rough idea in which countries it might be more dangerous to play the p4p game.

Then there are some facts scientists know today:

- the HIV virus either enters into the body via injections directly into the blood (shared needles, drugs) or via the mucous membrane (and there is a lot of that skin type located on the primary sexual organs of men and women). There are no proven cases that a transfer had taken place via a normal skin contact (hands, body).

- if there are small lesions, cuts, sores on your primary sexual organs the risk to get infected is higher ( I would say MUCH higher). Two reasons for that: Lesions can bleed, and blood is a highly infectious fluid. The other way around lesions are an easier entry point for the virus.

- the HIV virus is NOT extremely infectious itself, some other viruses like the hepatitis viruses are up to 100 times more infectious (that means easier to transfer)

- women get much easier infected with the virus than men (during unprotected sex). The reasons mentioned as explanation for that phenomenon are the sperm staying longer time within the vagina than vaginal fluid stays on the penis, and the monthly period of the woman (open wound).

To come to a conclusion should be easy now for all of us:

- the risk to get infected is always there during unprotected intercourse

- the risk of getting infected is potentially higher for those who prefer HARD SEX or ANAL intercourse, due to the fact, that skin lesions can occur caused by those techniques. The intestine of the rectum is naturally not well prepared for sexual intercourse.

- the risk of getting infected is potentially higher if the intercourse is performed with insufficient lubrication (the woman doesn’t get wet enough, no gel is used, special techniques without natural lubrication).

- the risk of getting infected is LOWER if sufficient gel is used, but THERE IS STILL A RISK!!!

- the risk of getting infected is higher the higher the concentration of the virus in the body fluid is which the mucous membrane is exposed to. This concentration tends to be highest in the blood, followed by vaginal fluids and sperm. It is very low (nearly not existing) in the saliva.

- the risk of getting infected via oral sex exists because of lesions in the mouth caused be teeth brushing, meals or smaller skin infections. That risk is low, but it exists, too, in both directions! Same reason metioned above.

Conclusion:

There is only ONE WAY of protecting ourselves from getting infected: Using a condom as a barrier between our mucous membrane and the fluid of our sexual partner, sufficiently lubricated. Gels used without condom may lower the risk, but there is still a mentionable risk left.

Even with using a condom there remains a small risk (breaking condoms, wrong usage after exposure to body fluids).

Using only a gel is like playing Russian roulette.


Giotto

[QUOTE=Giotto]Conclusion:

There is only ONE WAY of protecting ourselves from getting infected: Using a condom as a barrier between our mucous membrane and the fluid of our sexual partner, sufficiently lubricated. Gels used without condom may lower the risk, but there is still a mentionable risk left.

Even with using a condom there remains a small risk (breaking condoms, wrong usage after exposure to body fluids).

Using only a gel is like playing Russian roulette.

Giotto[/QUOTE]Well, I believe there is one other way: Find the love of your life, see a medical doctor to check for STD, and stay loyal to the love of your life. IMHO, this is of course more safe than having many different partners from various backgrounds highly exposed to STD. But then again we have to stop mongering :-(.

Happy hunting,

HF

[QUOTE=Giotto]Then there are some facts scientists know today:
- ...
[/QUOTE]

Actually, they do not know that much. In their overwhelming majority they strongly believe that ... etc. That is all.

Pretty much everything about HIV/AIDS is much less hard factual science than what people are led to believe.

Nonetheless, one should not need to be concerned by HIV/AIDS to be persuaded to stick to safer sex practices. There is a lot of very nasty things one can catch, especially when engaging into unprotected sexual intercourse with a third-world underprivileged undereducated and overused sex worker.

[QUOTE=Seydlitz]Nonetheless, one should not need to be concerned by HIV/AIDS to be persuaded to stick to safer sex practices. There is a lot of very nasty things one can catch, especially when engaging into unprotected sexual intercourse with a third-world underprivileged undereducated and overused sex worker.[/QUOTE]

Absolutely correct. It should be a very easy decision for all of us to always play safe.


Giotto

Yes condoms offer good protection, but if you are one of the many men that are fucking, and refusing to use condoms, then at least you can get circumcised, look for herpes, sores, etc, on your member befor fucking. And if you can get abuffered gel then even better. Then there is this new 3 drug combination may actually prevent aids just by taking this daily.

[QUOTE=Lee66]Yes condoms offer good protection, but if you are one of the many men that are fucking, and refusing to use condoms, then at least you can get circumcised, look for herpes, sores, etc, on your member befor fucking. And if you can get abuffered gel then even better. Then there is this new 3 drug combination may actually prevent aids just by taking this daily.[/QUOTE]

Lee66,

[b][COLOR=RED]DAMNED![/COLOR][/b]

If you believe that there is a drug combination which prevents you of ALL STDs including HIV when going bareback then this is up to you! But you will find NO medic in the world who backs this theory.

And - YOU can infect your partner, too! And afterwards your partner can infect somebody else...and so on, that's the way the pandemic develops.

Did you ever think about what impact this information can have on others, reading that on a forum which purpose is to find women for sex?

And please - don't start this fucking stupid "circumcised" discussion now. That is nonsense pure, too! Hell, my blood pressure, I get sick if I read something like that.

Lee66, Switch on you brain, please!


Giotto

This whole "Safe Sex in Thailand" thread is fucking stupid.

Instead should be a large banner with the words:

Wear a fucking condom!

giotto, MAY means maybe, not WILL. this 3 drug combination(for hiv prevention) is in phase 3, has worked on monkeys, gilead the manufactor has distanced its self from this product because to many people are buying and using it as if it works, I would think at least for a while it is better then nothing, most likely the virus will become immune to it as well. From an academic point of view, this board is not the best place for discusing this sort of thing . (to many gullable people making false assumptions).

[QUOTE=Coma Boy]

Wear a fucking condom![/QUOTE]


I think there is a pun there somewhere, but I cant think of it.

[QUOTE=Coma Boy]This whole "Safe Sex in Thailand" thread is fucking stupid.

Instead should be a large banner with the words:

Wear a fucking condom![/QUOTE]


Defiantly, Coma Boy!

Oh, did you hear about the new drug that's coming out next month? It prevents all diseases, not only STDs, plus it has a side effect that works like a Viagra. Oh, and I almost forgot to mention: 40 out of 50 men who took it in the test group, have increased their earnings by 34% (some in the stock market, and some by getting a raise)!

Condoms Cancer Causing.
Safe sex proves yet again not to be that safe. - The Chemical and Veterinary Investigation Institute located in Stuttgart, Germany, just released information on research into condoms and found that 91% of the condoms they tested were high in a carcinogen.

LifeSiteNews.com is reporting on this carcinogen found in the majority of condoms:

Study scientists, who conducted the research at The Chemical and Veterinary Investigation Institute in Stuttgart, Germany, said "N-Nitrosamine is one of the most carcinogenic substances," as reported by the Reuters news service.

[QUOTE=Lee66]Condoms Cancer Causing.
Safe sex proves yet again not to be that safe. - The Chemical and Veterinary Investigation Institute located in Stuttgart, Germany, just released information on research into condoms and found that 91% of the condoms they tested were high in a carcinogen.

LifeSiteNews.com is reporting on this carcinogen found in the majority of condoms:

Study scientists, who conducted the research at The Chemical and Veterinary Investigation Institute in Stuttgart, Germany, said "N-Nitrosamine is one of the most carcinogenic substances," as reported by the Reuters news service.[/QUOTE]

I'm not a chemical engineer but aren't petroleum distillates carcinogenic? Since condoms are made from a derivitive of petroleum I guess they are right.

If you change the oil in your car and get oil on your hands, you wash your hands with soap and water. The oil being carcinogenic doesn't mean you won't change your oil again does it?

This is a bad pun isn't it? condoms .......change your oil........

nocbj4me

NoCBJ4me,

as far as I know the major part of condoms that are sold aren't made from a derivitive of petroleum, they are made of rubber latex, which is "enriched" with a few other ingredients. All in all a natural product. Only a few are made of Polyurethane.

[url]http://www.avert.org/usecond.htm[/url]
[url]http://www.infoforhealth.org/pr/j44/j44chap11_c.shtml[/url]
[url]http://www.fda.gov/oashi/aids/condom.html[/url]

[QUOTE=The Traveler]....as far as I know the major part of condoms that are sold aren't made from a derivitive of petroleum, they are made of rubber latex, which is "enriched" with a few other ingredients. All in all a natural product. Only a few are made of Polyurethane.....[/QUOTE]Indeed most 'rubbers' are made out of rubber, i e latex, harvested from rubber trees (BTW: a big cash crop in LOS). Some people are allergic to latex and for them there are condoms made from a plastic material. Then there are the original 'condoms' made from lambs' guts, used since ancient Roman times. Supposed to feel better but kinda gross and very expensive.

In LOS good condoms are hard to find. Most of them are too small and low quality, made in China or Korea. So bring a good supply of your favorite brand and a few more to trade and give away. Get the kind with a spermicidal lubricant, which will kill bacteria and viri too.

I ran out of condoms once in Phuket and did BB. Sure enough, I cought the clap! No HIV, thank goodness.

Cancer by condom? I used rubbers since puberty as they were easily available from vending machines in the streets of Germany. My dick has not rotted away yet. However a lot of friends and relatives in my age group died of acohol and nicotin related afflictions already, from accidents too.

Actually my doctor says mongering keeps me young and healthy. Happy too.