Seeking Arrangements

[QUOTE=GoingDumb;2933114] or should I end things and look for something "real" off of sa?[/QUOTE]I personally would continue to see her, but Elvis is right about looking elsewhere in parallel.

I think the expectation of a serious relationship from any of these p4 p or pseudo situations is probably going to end in heartache. And likely a high percentage.

Do I believe it's impossible? No. I have experienced it myself. One of my favorite people was working at an agency and she was a super sweetheart. Runway model physique, sexy accent, etc. I booked her once after talking to her on her professional socials and we hit it off. She told me to see her in between other clients, etc. It was an amazing time (approx 6 months), especially since I was hanging out with other pros (who doesn't like hanging out with sexy women who make heads turn?) off the clock. So my namesake is probably from this situation ("foolish" Out of the blue, I tell her I don't want anything serious. A month later, she disappears, apparently dating someone and stopped working. If I was in a different situ, I would have given it a real shot. Who knows what would have happened.

Anyhow, not sure if this helps, but I always wonder how she is doing, hoping for the best (she always struggled with supporting her family / but never let me give her $). I have also met the opposite, ones who play the long game and have scammed and emptied many a pocket. So there's definitely a bit of everything out there.

F.

[QUOTE=GoingDumb;2933114]Could use your guys advice on a situation. Been seeing a girl I met on sa for a few months now. She didn't want usual sugar / ppm but I take her to nicer restaurants and on trips. She made it clear early on she doesn't want a relationship and ended it with the last guy from sa because he wanted more. It was basically a fwb which was fine for me.

After a recent trip I found myself wanting something more serious though. The trip was great but it makes me sad to think these memories of it won't lead anywhere. I'm on the younger side and don't have experience with longer relationships so hoping some of you guys can provide some perspective. She's said she doesn't want a relationship and I'm not naive to try to change her mind. Is it possible to enjoy seeing her knowing it's short term or should I end things and look for something "real" off of sa?[/QUOTE]One other thing I should mention:

There are zounds of marriages that do not start off as traditional prostitution. 20 year old girl meets guy in calculus class, girl is not good with math, guy helps her with homework. A year later they have been going to restaurants, movies, and sports events together, and are fucking each other on a regular basis. Do you think he was paying her money every time they had sex? Of course not. Now, how many of those marriages do you think end in divorce between either partner turns 55? Look at the statistics. James Sexton also points out that some partners run off and abandon their spouse, while others get a legal separation. Depending on the state, these might not fall into the technical definition of divorce. Still more remain in a hostile marriage for the sake of their kids, church, and family approval. Marriages they would have dissolved a decade ago were it not for outside influences. So, do you really think the American divorce rate is around 50%? Or do you think the actual rate of "failed" marriages is more like 70 or 80% ?

So how many of those marriages do you think started off by a guy dating a sex worker? The point I'm trying to make is. Things can go wrong with a partner regardless of the circumstances. And I think adding a sex worker into the mix just presents one more complication on top of a situation that eventually, at some point, is 70% likely to dissolve. So this is potentially making a complicated situation even more complicated. This is even if you don't want an official marriage, and just want a long term committed partner, or common law wife to live with. All these things we guys do to begin with, have the risk of something going awry in the future. So if you decide to continue seeing this woman, you should at least prepare yourself, that down the road things will turn sour. Now, if they don't turn sour, then that's great, more power to you. But in that scenario, you spend maybe a few days and a few thousand dollars possibly researching attorneys, therapists, planning to dodge skip tracers, and maybe preparing yourself mentally for the emotional toll if this woman initially says "yes", then breaks your heart later on. Personally I'd rather spend a bit of time and money now, knowing it might not work, then charging ahead and expecting long term success. If you are prepared for the negative, it makes testing the waters a little easier if you want to try it out.

[QUOTE=GoingDumb;2933114]Could use your guys advice on a situation. Been seeing a girl I met on sa for a few months now. She didn't want usual sugar / ppm but I take her to nicer restaurants and on trips. She made it clear early on she doesn't want a relationship and ended it with the last guy from sa because he wanted more. It was basically a fwb which was fine for me.

After a recent trip I found myself wanting something more serious though. The trip was great but it makes me sad to think these memories of it won't lead anywhere. I'm on the younger side and don't have experience with longer relationships so hoping some of you guys can provide some perspective. She's said she doesn't want a relationship and I'm not naive to try to change her mind. Is it possible to enjoy seeing her knowing it's short term or should I end things and look for something "real" off of sa?[/QUOTE]Here is a dose of reality which will either depress you or free you. Right now you are having sex with a girl you like for no more than the price of dinner and with no expectations. This is the pinnacle — as good as it gets. Because after a few years either one of two things will happen and probably both. It will get routine and you will want someone new. Or she will get lazy and entitled and you will want to move on. This is inevitable and how it unfortunately works in life. Men are not built for monogamy and the vast majority of women tire of the type of sex we like and just don't put in the effort anymore.

That's why we are all here because in real life the ongoing sex with a beautiful woman who is affectionate and adores you lasts a few years at best. Yes there are exceptions and maybe Elvis is one. But for the rest of us the lustre fades. And if you can just move on and say next next (sure there will be tears) then you are a lucky man. Keep Rockin on with this girl. Don't try to make it more than it is. And be prepared that it's temporary. But you just repeat it. There are literally billions of women. Next next.

Gents, I have an opportunity to go literally almost anywhere for a week. I want to go somewhere that Seeking rocks. Specifically where there is a large quantity of active girls. I have found that that's the key to having access to lots of hot girls. It's a numbers game.

I have already done, and loved, London, nyc, Barcelona, Madrid, and Mexico City. Great seeking game there.

I have not enjoyed Frankfurt, Budapest, Tijuana, Dublin. There just wast enough volume to make it work.

What are the other great cities for easy young civvy action? Asia is also ok for me.

Been here too. My wife was a trophy wife by most people's definitions. She didn't come from a family of money but made plenty of her own, was gorgeous, adored me, and did all kinds of things others wouldn't for me. Never really understood or figured out how I got her. In my mind love and sex are two completely different things, unfortunately she didn't see things that way and we're not together anymore. I'm sure we had that conversation before we got married but it's not the kind of thing you keep rehashing so she inevitably found out and that was that. It didn't help that we were in the 7 year itch time frame and sex was stale. I read something once that pretty much sums up married sex. Put a quarter in a jar every time you have sex before and during your first year of marriage. Pull a quarter out of the jar every time you have sex after the first year and that jar will never be empty.

Like Steve says, there are exceptions but we're animals at the end of the day and we are programmed to procreate and they are programmed to nurture and care. I've got regrets about how my marriage ended but I'm convinced that getting to where I am now was inevitable.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2933477]
That's why we are all here because in real life the ongoing sex with a beautiful woman who is affectionate and adores you lasts a few years at best.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=GoingDumb;2933114]
After a recent trip I found myself wanting something more serious though.
[/QUOTE]Not sure if others have said it. You need to see more girls if this is the only one you are seeing now.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2933492]Gents, I have an opportunity to go literally almost anywhere for a week. I want to go somewhere that Seeking rocks. Specifically where there is a large quantity of active girls. I have found that that's the key to having access to lots of hot girls. It's a numbers game.

I have already done, and loved, London, nyc, Barcelona, Madrid, and Mexico City. Great seeking game there.

I have not enjoyed Frankfurt, Budapest, Tijuana, Dublin. There just wast enough volume to make it work.

What are the other great cities for easy young civvy action? Asia is also ok for me.[/QUOTE]Dude you have done some of the best seeking in the world — Madrid Mex City London. Going to be hard to improve on that. Sorry but I don't recall your background. Have you been to Brazil? It's known for the club and clinics scene but if you haven't had a Brazilian girl in Brazil you really haven't lived. Maybe go there and try the seeking scene and if you strikeout the clubs are fabulous. But possibly my best Seeking girl ever I scored in Rio. $100 usd ppm. And same per day when I travel her. Exceptional? Probably. But the economy is different there than Madrid and you can likely score a real keeper for not so much as elsewhere.

Really a waste of time in Germany and most of Europe, Asia too. Do consider Poland if you like slavs but use gold bikini club. Lots of traffic there and every girl I met spoke good to excellent English.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2933492]Gents, I have an opportunity to go literally almost anywhere for a week. I want to go somewhere that Seeking rocks. Specifically where there is a large quantity of active girls. I have found that that's the key to having access to lots of hot girls. It's a numbers game.

I have already done, and loved, London, nyc, Barcelona, Madrid, and Mexico City. Great seeking game there.

I have not enjoyed Frankfurt, Budapest, Tijuana, Dublin. There just wast enough volume to make it work.

What are the other great cities for easy young civvy action? Asia is also ok for me.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2933492]Gents, I have an opportunity to go literally almost anywhere for a week. I want to go somewhere that Seeking rocks. Specifically where there is a large quantity of active girls. I have found that that's the key to having access to lots of hot girls. It's a numbers game.

I have already done, and loved, London, nyc, Barcelona, Madrid, and Mexico City. Great seeking game there.

I have not enjoyed Frankfurt, Budapest, Tijuana, Dublin. There just wast enough volume to make it work.

What are the other great cities for easy young civvy action? Asia is also ok for me.[/QUOTE]Frankfurt, Budapest might have lots of professionals posing as Sugarbaby. Both cities are great for normal p4 p. I found cities where p4 p isn't that great comes with good amount of university girls venturing on seeking for extra money. Prague is best destination for p4 p in EU but seeking is crap here and mostly unnecessary. Helsinki was the best for me where I even had opportunity to score a former miss universe contestant and Krakow came close second.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2933477]Here is a dose of reality which will either depress you or free you. Right now you are having sex with a girl you like for no more than the price of dinner and with no expectations. This is the pinnacle as good as it gets. Because after a few years either one of two things will happen and probably both. It will get routine and you will want someone new. Or she will get lazy and entitled and you will want to move on. This is inevitable and how it unfortunately works in life. Men are not built for monogamy and the vast majority of women tire of the type of sex we like and just don't put in the effort anymore.

That's why we are all here because in real life the ongoing sex with a beautiful woman who is affectionate and adores you lasts a few years at best. Yes there are exceptions and maybe Elvis is one. But for the rest of us the lustre fades.[/QUOTE]You have to understand Steve, I was a sap. I bought the bullshit society was selling us. My wedding to the ex was epic. People still talk about it. The girl was a beauty, a professional, a good lover. I was sure we were going to be in love forever and fuck like rabbits our whole life.

And the OP wants a legit woman like her, one not on seeking, the myth that the girl you are with loves you for you, and the reassurance it will stay like that. You think you do not need an arrangement. This is so wrong. The reality is if she is hot she probably already has been a sugar baby. And there is always an arrangement. You just pretend it does not exist.

The default arrangement is she gets half your income even if she is not fucking you and a huge chunk of your assets. The sweet sound of lifelong marriage vows is there so you do not get a prenup nor have an exit plan. I fell for it and God it was the biggest mistake of my life. Sure, being a SD was not as acceptable socially as being a husband but what matters more, society being happy or me?

And then one day, it happens. I told this to another poster here. All of a sudden my dick tastes funny and my ex refused to suck it. In hindsight, I should have covered it with the nastiest shit around and said suck it or we get divorced, but I was like if you do not want to suck it, I will find someone who does. We men give up sex to make peace. We are so dumb.

And if you think you will fare better in the marriage game, you won't not with the naive attitude I had that is so common. It is ingrained in you over decades. I guarantee you that my ex-wife was as good if not better than yours, and she was a virgin.

Steve, you are totally right in that the typical relationship goes downhill. For me it seemed to be three months of great sex and then the SB thinks she has you (and more like a year or two with a GF). Then her financial needs escalate and the sex is less often and worse, so you swap her out. I just thought this was the reality for me and all men and was content to be a SD forever.

And of course, that is when a woman pops up who is wife material, but I realized with her our relationship had to be an upgrade over a sugar one, or why bother?

I thought at some point, she too is going to not want to suck dick. All women get there, but I feel insecure I could lose my job if I do not perform. Why should wives and GFs be different? Instead of getting rid of the photos and phone numbers of all my other women, I kept them, so she knows those girls are a phone call away.

I want her secure in that if she performs we will be together but certain that I will take off if she literally and figuratively stops sucking dick. And just like with the ex-SBs, I want an easy exit plan there if I need it.

And Steve, I would have completely agreed with you about the need for strange, but have you ever known a guy who cheated who was being gotten off three times a day? Can a guy like that even think about another woman?

So do we really need strange or do we need to be sexually fulfilled? If you have a woman getting you off, is stunning, and is great at it, do you think most guys are going to risk losing her for someone less? Hell, maybe the reason guys really stray is the deal they currently have with a woman sucks, and they want a better one.

So we should not say guys are cheating unless they are refusing blow jobs and literally saying while getting sucked off, "Hey, I want her to suck it now not you. " That means 99+% of infidelity is on the women, and we have let them get away with it.

And how many guys would even have the balls to tell anyone their wife says their dick tastes funny? And if I told my male friends, you know most of them would tell me that I needed to clean my dick and say to themselves no one says my dick tastes funny. I had one guy in my life who said anything negative about wives and women. One! Even guys who had lousy wives put the female POV first.

But what happens if a hooker or SB encounters a dirty dick? Does she emasculate you and shame you and not perform? Fuck no. She would not get paid. She is going to clean you. So why would a wife not do that? Because it is not about a dirty dick. It is about power. It is about her saying she can do nothing and you have to live with it. Guys with the cleanest dicks in the world with cum that taste like honey have dirty dicks when women do not want to give head. I repeat, we men can be so stupid.

So yeah, I found an amazing woman but if it were thirty years ago and I made the same mistakes as I did before, I am not sure the ending with this gal would be any different than it was with my ex.

I have done it in Medellin and CDMX, by far my favorite is Medellin. There are litterally 1000 girls under 30 and I found a 40 yr old that has one of the best bodies I have seen AND she did not go to the gym. If I was smarter I would post a pic of the 40 yo in Cancun in a brazilian style bikini.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2933492]Gents, I have an opportunity to go literally almost anywhere for a week. I want to go somewhere that Seeking rocks. Specifically where there is a large quantity of active girls. I have found that that's the key to having access to lots of hot girls. It's a numbers game.

I have already done, and loved, London, nyc, Barcelona, Madrid, and Mexico City. Great seeking game there.

I have not enjoyed Frankfurt, Budapest, Tijuana, Dublin. There just wast enough volume to make it work.

What are the other great cities for easy young civvy action? Asia is also ok for me.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Jbj64;2933712]I have done it in Medellin and CDMX, by far my favorite is Medellin. There are litterally 1000 girls under 30 and I found a 40 yr old that has one of the best bodies I have seen AND she did not go to the gym. If I was smarter I would post a pic of the 40 yo in Cancun in a brazilian style bikini.[/QUOTE]Damn. I did all Facebook pros in MDE. Didn't know Seeking was so good. Going to have to get back there. Quick 3 hour flight from miami so pretty attractive!

[QUOTE=Jbj64;2933712]I have done it in Medellin and CDMX, by far my favorite is Medellin. There are litterally 1000 girls under 30 and I found a 40 yr old that has one of the best bodies I have seen AND she did not go to the gym. If I was smarter I would post a pic of the 40 yo in Cancun in a brazilian style bikini.[/QUOTE]What are you smoking? Seeking sucks in Mde. It is full of pros, the response rate is shit and flake rate is through the roof. Good luck finding a decent girl these days. Not saying it is impossible, but extremely difficult. I guess you are into hardcore pros, this is why seeking works well for you, but most guys here, including Steve, are looking for a different kind of experience rather than wham bam thank you ma'am type.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2933677]Dude you have done some of the best seeking in the world Madrid Mex City London. Going to be hard to improve on that. Sorry but I don't recall your background. Have you been to Brazil? It's known for the club and clinics scene but if you haven't had a Brazilian girl in Brazil you really haven't lived. Maybe go there and try the seeking scene and if you strikeout the clubs are fabulous. But possibly my best Seeking girl ever I scored in Rio. $100 usd ppm. And same per day when I travel her. Exceptional? Probably. But the economy is different there than Madrid and you can likely score a real keeper for not so much as elsewhere.[/QUOTE]The best Seeking girl I have ever met was in Rio. She happened to be the only girl I met off Seeking there. I hit a jackpot, so to speak. But overall, Seeking is not really popular in Brazil, pickings are slim. There is a well developed p4 p scene, so I guess Seeking is not really necessary. I would look into Buenos Aires, it might be a hidden gem. Big cosmopolitan city, tons of college girls (from around the world) and much less developed p4 p scene. Perfect environment for Seeking to thrive.

[QUOTE=MiamiBoy1;2933748]The best Seeking girl I have ever met was in Rio. She happened to be the only girl I met off Seeking there. I hit a jackpot, so to speak. But overall, Seeking is not really popular in Brazil, pickings are slim. There is a well developed p4 p scene, so I guess Seeking is not really necessary. I would look into Buenos Aires, it might be a hidden gem. Big cosmopolitan city, tons of college girls (from around the world) and much less developed p4 p scene. Perfect environment for Seeking to thrive.[/QUOTE]The girls call it Baires. And Mb is spot on. I've had three smoking hot Seeking girls in Baires and it's a lovely city as well. Def recommend.