Kyiv

more Sasha

more sasha

more sasha

[QUOTE=Maverick1]more sasha[/QUOTE]


nice girl!!!
can you explain where did you find her, how much did you pay etc... ???????

I met her at McDonalds at My Don. I was at the right place at the right time with the wrong idea.
The first two nights and mornings were free, dinner and a movie. Little did I know that she worked for Max at erotic massage. I feel in "love" with the illusion as she went to Moscow to see her Aunt. Her Aunt turned out to be her 60 year old sponsor Mario from Rome who took her to St Petersberg. ;-) I found out that I was about one of 7. We spent two weeks together in late June when I found out my sweet love was not so sweet. ;-)
I dished out a few hundred for her to go to college and get a room, the room turned out to be with her 20 year old Romo in Berdansk. ;-) There was also Amr from Dubai, Ian from England, Mohamed from Turkey, Marismo and Vlad. This was all before she turned 19! Sadly she looks like she has partied hard and long for the last 11 months. It looks more like 10 ten hard years. She is a player's player and has the blood temp of a reptile. ;-)

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Everyone has his own hunting style. I saw an user, of this forum, says "Hey girl, come to me for having fun, I have a lot of money to spend." In your opinion, is this a good approach?[/QUOTE]

Only if you have a lot of money and willingness to use it! ;)

I really believe there are many different working approaches, depending on girl and attitude of the hunting man. Stay tuned and find the fastest way to get the right key to open paradise's doors. Money is just one of the lever. Class, charme, sharpness, respect, adaptation, places, fun, chemistry matter also a lot

[QUOTE=Ash1001]
And remember, when you do treat a girl, it's because you WANT to, not because you think you have to. What you do with your $s is entirely under your control.[/QUOTE]

Words of wisdom....

[QUOTE=Maverick1]I met her at McDonalds at My Don. I was at the right place at the right time with the wrong idea.

The first two nights and mornings were free, dinner and a movie. Little did I know that she worked for Max at erotic massage. I feel in "love" with the illusion as she went to Moscow to see her Aunt. Her Aunt turned out to be her 60 year old sponsor Mario from Rome who took her to St Petersberg. ;-) I found out that I was about one of 7. We spent two weeks together in late June when I found out my sweet love was not so sweet. ;-)

I dished out a few hundred for her to go to college and get a room, the room turned out to be with her 20 year old Romo in Berdansk. ;-) There was also Amr from Dubai, Ian from England, Mohamed from Turkey, Marismo and Vlad. This was all before she turned 19! Sadly she looks like she has partied hard and long for the last 11 months. It looks more like 10 ten hard years. She is a player's player and has the blood temp of a reptile. ;-)[/QUOTE]Mc Donalds at My DON? where is this exactly I know the Mc Donald in the main stree there in Kiev center, are you talking about this MC Donald? or how can O go to this one you menationed?

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Everyone has his own hunting style. I saw an user, of this forum, says "Hey girl, come to me for having fun, I have a lot of money to spend." In your opinion, is this a good approach?[/QUOTE]

It's personally not my style but I'm sure it will work. And it will work far better as a sponsorship advertisement (with offered rate quoted) than a chat up line :)

Hi,

I plan to spend 4 days.next week- in Kiev or Prague.

I have been in both already but which one could be the best choice.

I speak a little bit Russian and I would like to be sure that in 4 days I could have sex with some girls in Kiev for free, if not Prague seems to be a better choice.

What do you think?

Thanks

[QUOTE=Toptraveler1]Hi,

I plan to spend 4 days.next week- in Kiev or Prague.

I have been in both already but which one could be the best choice.

I speak a little bit Russian and I would like to be sure that in 4 days I could have sex with some girls in Kiev for free, if not Prague seems to be a better choice.

What do you think?

Thanks[/QUOTE]

If you have been to them both before, then you already know the answer................

[QUOTE=Toptraveler1]Hi,

I plan to spend 4 days.next week- in Kiev or Prague.

I have been in both already but which one could be the best choice.

I speak a little bit Russian and I would like to be sure that in 4 days I could have sex with some girls in Kiev for free, if not Prague seems to be a better choice.

What do you think?

Thanks[/QUOTE]You cannot be sure that if you stay 4 days in Kiev you will have sex for free.It is equally likely you find a scammer in club.However if you want to have some chance to lay girls for free,then Kiev is better choice than Prague.

To put it this way,in Kiev you have 30% chance to bed a girl in 4 days if you come on weekend and hit all the clubs or by prearranged contacts from internet.In Prague your chance is more like 5%.

I lost the phone number of Max.

Can somebody could help me?

But I've long long time ago.

[QUOTE=Qjump]If you have been to them both before, then you already know the answer................[/QUOTE]

Maybe Mav meant to say My Dong. Actually I think he means Maidan. Mav, if you met her at McD it looks like you just caught her before she became a pro ho. Bet she doesn't eat at McD anymore, does she? ;)

AC, that approach only works in River Palace. Even in Decadence where it's all about the money they girls will either 1) look at you like a piece of crap - that is if they aren't already doing that or 2) Say to themselves, let's see how much I can soak this sucker for.

What is the complete address of big sexy shops in Kiev?

Please, help me. I need good tools for my art.

Hello fellows,

I have a KIEV STAR mobile phone card in my mobile phone I bought in Germany. So far no problem.

However, today (I am in Nikolaev now) I wanted to make a phone call to a local girl, but not showing that I am in the country.

In Germany I can easily hide my number by changing the relevant setting in my mobile phone (SAMSUNG) with my German mobile phone company.

Now I cannot use this procedure successfully, cause if I do, no more calls can be made.

Questions: Has anyone had the same experience?

Is it only with KIEV STAR?

Does it work with other mobile phone operators?

Please help me, if you can!

Does anyone here know what is a good apartment company to deal with in Kiev?
I tried to book with Kievapts suggested by one you guys, and they don't book anything under 4 nights. I need an apartment in center of Kiev for only two nights? Should I just book a hotel room? your input is very much appreciated.

[QUOTE=Dallim93]Does anyone here know what is a good apartment company to deal with in Kiev?

I tried to book with Kievapts suggested by one you guys, and they don't book anything under 4 nights. I need an apartment in center of Kiev for only two nights? Should I just book a hotel room? your input is very much appreciated.[/QUOTE]

kievapts will book and if not try uaapartments.

i cant believe they shined u on for less then 4 nights. normally they charge an extra $10 a night or something which is still cheaper then an apartment and one of their flats is nicer then even a 5 star apartment in the centre. did you talk to arik or jean? they are both owners so make sure u speak with them.

[QUOTE=Elmar]Hello fellows,

I have a KIEV STAR mobile phone card in my mobile phone I bought in Germany. So far no problem.

However, today (I am in Nikolaev now) I wanted to make a phone call to a local girl, but not showing that I am in the country.

In Germany I can easily hide my number by changing the relevant setting in my mobile phone (SAMSUNG) with my German mobile phone company.

Now I cannot use this procedure successfully, cause if I do, no more calls can be made.

Questions: Has anyone had the same experience?

Is it only with KIEV STAR?

Does it work with other mobile phone operators?

Please help me, if you can![/QUOTE]Do you have a 380 #? How did you get Kyiv star in Germany?

I personally have a blackberry "world edition" in the states but it is completely useless here. I just purchased the least expensive non sexy phone last summer and it actually works better then my BB.

Anyway if your SIM # is not 380 then it would not be a local # and I don’t see why they would sell you a Ukrainian SIM card in Germany?

Hello,

Does anybody have email or number for Max from Italy?

Spassibo for frsir reply from TELOS.

However, there is some misunderstanding.

I am in Ukraine right now!

Did anyone try over here to hide his local tel number on his mobile phone?

Hi Elmar,

Rufnummernunterdrueckung geht auch bei mir nicht.
Habe ebenfalls Kievstar, SIM in UA gekauft.


Gruss

Reiner

I have been in Russia, Romania, Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania.
BUT not in Ukraina. I am afraid it might be too late for Ukraina.

In Russia today it is too expensive for me, but I had a lot of funn 5 years ago.

I do love EE girls, I had the pleashure of doing Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania some years ago and prices and service was exelent. I tried again lately and I ounderstood it is too late. The girls are gone - mostly to England and Germany and the service is often rip-off. I do find sexy girls in the stripclubs, but all the work to get her phonenumber and make a deal outside the club usually ends with nothing.
Before I could work this way easy.
What happened? Am I right?

In Romania the girls only care about your money and I was disapointed with the service. Is there anyone who is happy with the situation in Romania?

I had a great session with a russian girl some days ago. She said the Ukraenian girls look good, but in generall not serviceminded. Do you think the service from a russian girl use to be better than the ukraenian?

My plan was to go to Kiev, but I am probably way too late. I dont ounderstand why people go to Kiev and pay more than other places in europe.
I dont ounderstand why it is so expensive in Moscow. Why the moscowgirls go to London when they can make more money in Moscow?

If some of you can give me god ideas about where I find the best EE girls I am ready to leave for a sextrip soon.

Thanks

Because 90% of Moscow is a shit hole? Also in Moscow hot girls are a dime a dozen, in London less so and London is currently the 'Glam' FSU destination.

[QUOTE=Dick1]Why the moscowgirls go to London when they can make more money in Moscow?
[/QUOTE]

Prices are so expensive in Moscow because the place is awash in Petro money which drives all other portions of the economy and brings in a lot of foreign interest and business.

If you don't want to spend a lot of money don't go to Moscow, Saint Petersburg or Kiev.

Mobile Phones...

I don't remember ever seeing private calls from Ukraine numbers. Maybe when you guys try to do it doesn't allow you to make calls. SIM cards are so cheap 5-10uah just go out and buy a new one if you need to make discret calls or you are a stalker.

My UMC err, MTS SIM card has worked in the US, England, Switzerland, Netherland, Spain and Germany.

Telos, why doesn't your Blackberry work in Ukraine? Is it a US CDMA phone with no SIM card?

Apartments

ISG used and some times not approved apartment agencies are...

[url]http://apartments.com.ua/[/url]

[url]http://www.uaapartments.com/[/url]

[url]http://www.ukraineapartments.com/[/url]

Wow, prices are crazy and it doesn't help being American $. ;)

To find the best EE girls?What does it mean?

1.To find the best looking EE girls?

2.To find the most available EE girls?

3.To find the cheapest EE girls?

4.To find the most service oriented EE girls?

Every question has a different answer and much depends on personality and experience of the monger.Places I prefer would prove crap for others and where they go seems mistake to me.

[QUOTE=Telos]Do you have a 380 #? How did you get Kyiv star in Germany?

I personally have a blackberry "world edition" in the states but it is completely useless here. I just purchased the least expensive non sexy phone last summer and it actually works better then my BB.

Anyway if your SIM # is not 380 then it would not be a local # and I don’t see why they would sell you a Ukrainian SIM card in Germany?[/QUOTE]

I guess the mobile phone was bought in Germany and it works fine even with Kievstar card. This is true for all the european mobiles

Blackberries work also perfectly in UA where both EDGE and GPRS networks are well supported. "Worldwide" means that the RIM services (basically mails and synchronization of basic services like calendars and task lists) work everywhere in the world for the same flat right. Calls ans text messages depend on the card and its carrier.

The problem is that an US SIM card typically works on different frequencies and then you have roaming problems here. Putting a local card (assuming that your specific blackberry model can work on different frequencies, as most of the models do) requires anyway full reconfiguration of your blackberry (and loss of everything you have in). If you really want to use it, make a backup and go to a local technician, if you are not able to reset and reinstall all the BB facilities by yourself.

Thanks everybody for trying to help me.

However, you seem not to grasp my problem. Anyhow, it was my problem until now. I just bought a sim card from LIFE, a UA mobile phone provider. Reason for that: my favourite girl friend over here is on LIFE and that way I can call her free of charge non stop.

I asked the girl Olga in the shop to hide my number. Olga spoke good English and was very helpful and finally successful. Nevertheless the whole procedure took a good 20 minutes incl. Olga asking her local boos and sitting in the waiting queu for LIFE hotline.

Now my other devushki contacts cannot sse, that I am in their country and instead I can easily pretend (for tactical purposes), that I am still in Germany.

[QUOTE=Dick1]I have been in Russia, Romania, Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania.
BUT not in Ukraina. I am afraid it might be too late for Ukraina.

In Russia today it is too expensive for me, but I had a lot of funn 5 years ago.

I do love EE girls, I had the pleashure of doing Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania some years ago and prices and service was exelent. I tried again lately and I ounderstood it is too late. The girls are gone - mostly to England and Germany and the service is often rip-off. I do find sexy girls in the stripclubs, but all the work to get her phonenumber and make a deal outside the club usually ends with nothing.
Before I could work this way easy.
What happened? Am I right?

In Romania the girls only care about your money and I was disapointed with the service. Is there anyone who is happy with the situation in Romania?

I had a great session with a russian girl some days ago. She said the Ukraenian girls look good, but in generall not serviceminded. Do you think the service from a russian girl use to be better than the ukraenian?

My plan was to go to Kiev, but I am probably way too late. I dont ounderstand why people go to Kiev and pay more than other places in europe.
I dont ounderstand why it is so expensive in Moscow. Why the moscowgirls go to London when they can make more money in Moscow?

If some of you can give me god ideas about where I find the best EE girls I am ready to leave for a sextrip soon.

Thanks[/QUOTE]

Try Cyprus. Plenty of EE girls with the best price. You can have a girl for 6 hours for under 200 euros

[QUOTE=Lapin]Try Cyprus. Plenty of EE girls with the best price. You can have a girl for 6 hours for under 200 euros[/QUOTE]

So they travel all the way to Cyprus (which has higher living costs than UKR) to earn LESS money?

Hello,

Any recommendations for good and reliable apartment service in Kiev? I usually stay in hotels in the centre but want to try out an apartment this time.

[QUOTE=Ash1001]So they travel all the way to Cyprus (which has higher living costs than UKR) to earn LESS money?[/QUOTE]

Less money then where? they are given accomodation the fare (they repay that) and get to earn money. (more than they would in Ukraine, I know three girls who have bought apartments and cars and live very well from a tour of duty to Cyprus once a year ;o) and its all done legally for them visas are given to the girls by the Cypriot government not like trying to sneak into western europe.
Cyprus is a great place to p4p EE girls and a very well kept secret, its great for it and the prices you have just been told are correct!

Many people do not understand the economics in EE countries vs western countries. Let's say the demand for pros is not elastic in EE countries while it is elastic in non-EE countries. What does it mean?

The girls in EE countries no matter how much they ask they will have the same number of clients or slightly increased or reduced because only rich people can afford to pay these prices. There is no important middle class only bottom, low class which cannot afford any price and high upscale rich class which can afford every price. So when the magnitude of upscale class increases that is when due to increased oil price more people become rich the prices of pros increase accordingly because there are more people who can afford them. They catch with the minimum, I cannot explain that exactly.

In western countries the middle class drives the prices of average prostitution (not models, famous etc). So the prices balance where demand meets offer and they seem more reasonable because they are formed according to middle class wages, their main supporter.

Simply a girl in Kiev who asks for 300$ per 2 hours will make 300-600$ on average per day because this is the limit set by rich people demand. The same girl in Cyprus can ask for 150$ per 2 hours and will make over 1000$ per day because she will have 5-10 clients per day because there are a lot of middle class people who can afford her. If she asked for more, like 300$ for 2 hours she would make less because fewer than 2-4 clients per day would want to have sex with her due to other chances set by girls offer and because they cannot afford such a price. So the best for her is to set for a lower price while in Kiev if she accepted 150$ for example instead of 300$ she would not have so many more clients per day as to compensate the damage because in Ukraine simply there are not so many people of the higher class.

Not only that, but there is also the sun and fun factor for girls.

Who wants to be stuck ho'ing in Lugansk, Kiev or where ever when you could be hanging at the beach in Cyprus. You have to remember Ash, the center of Kiev is not representative of the whole Ukraine.

Hi Elmar,

If u have a Ukraine Sim card (Kiev Star, UMC, Jeans or whatever) it is NOT possible to hide your number when you are making phone calls with it.

This option is blocked by all providers!

If you bring your own Sim card from for instance Germany you can Roam into the Kiev Star or the UMC network and u can hide your number! The person who you call in Ukraine will see a standard Ukraine number in his or her display when u make a call with your German Sim card.

I can't read every post here because I am hunting here in Kiev, but it seems the question is: where can prostitutes earn more money as soon as possible and with minimum work?

I want to reply to this question with another question: why do Ukrainian prostitutes go abroad, for example to Italy, if they can earn much more in Kiev? I hear, every week, prostitutes wishing to go abroad to earn more: is this the classical slavic madness? They launched the Sputnik in 1957 and, at the same time, they don't know the result of 1+1?

Last news, now in River Palace girls are asking for 300$/first hour (for bad work, of course, I am sure a lot of men don't know what is real sex with a woman otherwise nobody will pay more than 50$/first hour). If they ask for 300$, it means there are a lot of men paying at least 150$/first hour. Where are the happy days when men paid 100$/day?

Sure, there are a few people paying $300/hr for sex in Kiev. But they are the minority. Which also answers your question as to why do girls leave Kiev to 'work' overseas. How many people did you see walking out of RP arm in arm after coming to a deal? Not many, before Eurovision in 2005 it was a constant stream of couples leaving.

I said it before, I'll say it again. Kiev Center is not representative of what life is really like in the Ukraine. Beautiful girls in Kiev are a kopeck a dozen. The moment you forget that is the moment you end up at RP paying $300/hr.

Sure Cruiser, but you need both time and game to get them. For very short trips RP is both convenient and central. Plus, as you've often recounted, there is an art to 'seducing' the RP girls into getting them to give you more for less..

Many (not all) girls at RP are both overpriced and brusque. They know they are dealing primarily with Westerners whom they won't see again so they think they can get away with it.

Where do the rich locals hook up with their sponsorees? Do you need to be a regular at Tsar club splurging on the Dom Perignon?

I might be going to Kiev this July and was trying to do a search on flirt using babelfish. Everytime I did a search it kept giving me girls and guys from the USA.

How can I search for girls just in Kiev.

Thanks

Guys I need help with flirt.com. I tried doing a search for kiev girls who want sponsoring but all I get is girls and guys from the United States.

Can someone help me using this? I did use babelfish so I dont know what I did wrong.

Thanks

[QUOTE=Smith Joe]Guys I need help with flirt.com. I tried doing a search for kiev girls who want sponsoring but all I get is girls and guys from the United States.

Can someone help me using this? I did use babelfish so I dont know what I did wrong.

Thanks[/QUOTE]

Dont use bable fish to translate the whole page
Just copy and paste parts of it.

[QUOTE=Smith Joe]Guys I need help with flirt.com. I tried doing a search for kiev girls who want sponsoring but all I get is girls and guys from the United States.

Thanks[/QUOTE]I think your problem is not Babelfish, but how to use the pull down menus. At the very top of the menu it says "Liuboi gorod" "pick a city" . This will bring you to a world map. There are three sequential menus: you pick country Украин Ukraine, then the oblast Киев Kiev, then the city Kiev within the oblast.

Does this address your issue?

[QUOTE=Smith Joe]Guys I need help with flirt.com. I tried doing a search for kiev girls who want sponsoring but all I get is girls and guys from the United States.

Can someone help me using this? I did use babelfish so I dont know what I did wrong.

Thanks[/QUOTE]I think your problem is with the pull down menu, not babelfish.

I think the web site recognizes your IP address as being in the USA and so gives you a choice of US cities. You need to get past this. At the very bottom of the pull-down menu you get "pick another city" vybrat drugoj gorod. You will get a pop-up screen with three cascading menus for country, oblast, city where you pick Ukraine, Kiev, Kiev (in Russian).

Note Ukraine, is second from the top of the country list, below Russia, not at the bottom of the country list in its alphabetical order.

If you have set your browser to prevent all pop-ups, you may never get past the first step.

Does this help?

Note correction: you are looking for "vybrat drugoj gorod" at the very bottom.

I'll be in Kiev until 5 May, if you want we can meet.

Send me a private message with your e-mail.

[QUOTE=C Strahd]Hi there,

I will be travelling to Kiev from 30. April until 05. May. Any of you there and able to show me arround a bit and giving me a hand with the girls / ladies?

I dont speak russian, only english or german.

ATM. waiting for my account to get activated, so I think PMs are currently not possible.

Any help appreciated.[/QUOTE]

I am also trying to follow your directions to get into Flirt.com. The trouble I have is which site are you guys talking about. There is many sites that star with "Flirt". Are you speaking of flirt.com or flirt. Ru or flirt.com. Ru, or flirt&love.com? I registered on flirt. Ru where there is a pull down menu and you can find Ukraine and Kiev on the pull down menu. But then I don't know how to find the girls that are advertising to get "sponsorship", may be you can help many of us newbies and clarify this further.

Thank you for your time.

[QUOTE=Moliere]I think your problem is with the pull down menu, not babelfish.

I think the web site recognizes your IP address as being in the USA and so gives you a choice of US cities. You need to get past this. At the very bottom of the pull-down menu you get "pick another city" vybrat drugoj gorod. You will get a pop-up screen with three cascading menus for country, oblast, city where you pick Ukraine, Kiev, Kiev (in Russian).

Note Ukraine, is second from the top of the country list, below Russia, not at the bottom of the country list in its alphabetical order.

If you have set your browser to prevent all pop-ups, you may never get past the first step.

Does this help?

Note correction: you are looking for "vybrat drugoj gorod" at the very bottom.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Moliere]I think your problem is with the pull down menu, not babelfish.

I think the web site recognizes your IP address as being in the USA and so gives you a choice of US cities. You need to get past this. At the very bottom of the pull-down menu you get "pick another city" vybrat drugoj gorod. You will get a pop-up screen with three cascading menus for country, oblast, city where you pick Ukraine, Kiev, Kiev (in Russian).

Note Ukraine, is second from the top of the country list, below Russia, not at the bottom of the country list in its alphabetical order.

If you have set your browser to prevent all pop-ups, you may never get past the first step.

Does this help?

Note correction: you are looking for "vybrat drugoj gorod" at the very bottom.[/QUOTE]Thanks I tried doing what you told me but failed miserably. lol.

I don't know what I am doing wrong. My popups are off and still no map shows up. Do I need to become a VIP member to make searches?

Sorry for my incompetence. lol.

[QUOTE=Smith Joe]Thanks I tried doing what you told me but failed miserably. lol.

I don't know what I am doing wrong. My popups are off and still no map shows up. Do I need to become a VIP member to make searches?

Sorry for my incompetence. lol.[/QUOTE]

Dont use bable fish to trabslate the full page! thats the problem!
Have a friend who had same problem, as I said copy and paste certain parts into bable fish

I discovered prices rose up about 50% in entertainment services in last months: for example the mint rhino strip bar in February was 60 grivnas/entry, instead now this is 100 grivnas/entry, prostitutes in February was 60$/first hour, instead now they are 100$/first hour. Crazy prices, above all about prostitutes because they usually have anal sex (and swallow blowjobs) with their boyfriends but they don't give her ass for customers paying crazy prices.

Now scamming has definitely become the favourite sport in Kiev! I have some regular girls that in the past they were good girls. But now they have become scammers too. In my opinion, there are a lot of ways for scamming, the classical way is to have a dinner in an expensive restaurant and to pay for her taxi transfers.

I am studying a strategy to waste their money as much as they wasted my money. .

In general, any girl doesn't deserve a gentleman. We have to be gentlemen just to fuck them and to throw them away when we have bored about them, in the same slavic male style. Or better, I explain what I see with my own eyes: girls in Kiev are used to be easy fuckable with their slavic men, whatever is the slavic men's behaviour. Instead girls in Kiev are used to be scammers with foreigners. I heard some users here are successfull with freebies but I am sure they have a slavic style to manage girls in Kiev.

A lot of funny/sad things I saw here in Kiev, maybe I will report in future. I am always ready to reply to private messages that I received but I would like a real information exchange among us.

About a good service and a valued price, I suggest Ludmila/Yana phone number +[blue][Telephone Number deleted by Admin][/blue]: she deserves a visit!

[size=-2][u][b]EDITOR's NOTE[/b][/u]: [blue]This report was edited to [u]remove personal telephone numbers[/u] in the text. Please do not post personal telephone numbers in the Forum. Instead, please invite other Forum Members to contact you for this information directly via the Forum's Private Messaging system. [i]Thanks![/i][/blue][/size]

[QUOTE=Qjump]Dont use bable fish to trabslate the full page! thats the problem!
Have a friend who had same problem, as I said copy and paste certain parts into bable fish[/QUOTE]Oh this is not a problem. What I did was translate on one tab the whole page. But to navigate I used the regular page without any translation but still knew what I was clicking due to the other tab I had open. I hope that made sense.

When I registered it gave me a map. And I choose my place of residence as NY, USA. Is that the problem? Should I have said I was from Kiev?

Also, the site is the same that ITtravel always uses which is flirt.com. Ua.

Thanks guys for your patience with me.

[QUOTE=Smith Joe]When I registered it gave me a map. And I choose my place of residence as NY, USA. Is that the problem? Should I have said I was from Kiev?

Also, the site is the same that ITtravel always uses which is flirt.com. Ua.
[/QUOTE]I myself would put down Kiev if that's the city where you're going to be. It probably won't make a big difference because you will like only correspond with women you write to first. (No surprise: the 18-25 year olds will not be looking for you.) Eventually, they will ask "What brings you to the Ukraine? To Kiev? " so you might as well figure out what you're going to say.

[QUOTE=Dallim93]I am also trying to follow your directions to get into Flirt.com. The trouble I have is which site are you guys talking about.

Thank you for your time.[/QUOTE]There are three big databases for dating in the Ukraine. Each database appears under 2-12 different names and URL's. See this link to a previous post for a list.

[url]http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?p=677964#post677964[/url]

It's not Flirt.com, but Flirt.ru which has about 10 million screenames.

The other two big ones are dating.ru and loveplanet.ru

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]I discovered prices rose up about 50% in entertainment services in last months: for example the mint rhino strip bar in February was 60 grivnas/entry, instead now this is 100 grivnas/entry, prostitutes in February was 60$/first hour, instead now they are 100$/first hour. Crazy prices, above all about prostitutes because they usually have anal sex (and swallow blowjobs) with their boyfriends but they don't give her ass for customers paying crazy prices.

Now scamming has definitely become the favourite sport in Kiev! I have some regular girls that in the past they were good girls. But now they have become scammers too. In my opinion, there are a lot of ways for scamming, the classical way is to have a dinner in an expensive restaurant and to pay for her taxi transfers.

I am studying a strategy to waste their money as much as they wasted my money. .

In general, any girl doesn't deserve a gentleman. We have to be gentlemen just to fuck them and to throw them away when we have bored about them, in the same slavic male style. Or better, I explain what I see with my own eyes: girls in Kiev are used to be easy fuckable with their slavic men, whatever is the slavic men's behaviour. Instead girls in Kiev are used to be scammers with foreigners. I heard some users here are successfull with freebies but I am sure they have a slavic style to manage girls in Kiev.

A lot of funny/sad things I saw here in Kiev, maybe I will report in future. I am always ready to reply to private messages that I received but I would like a real information exchange among us.[/QUOTE]At least Acolonizer you have discovered the advantages of slavic style.

AC (and Hecker), you are just wasting your time (and money) avoid the sl uts and ho's who don't fit your needs or who you know are probably scammers. Very easy to do. That's the real Slavic style Hecker.

Yes that's true but it is hard to act as a Russian, first of all it is necessary to speak Russian well and to "assimilate" (does this word exist in English? ) their acting: when I see Slavic people talking among them, it seems to see actors in a movie, everything done by them is fake and is a part of a pretending game among them.

Sometimes, or often, here forumers misunderstand what I talk about. Therefore it is possible people don't understand what I am talking in next examples, this is a very important detail to understand how much different is Slavic mindset "mentalitet".

First example.

In November, I went to the street address of a prostitute but I didn't remember the number of her flat. So I asked to a person walking near there (of course, I didn't say she is a prostitute) and this person called the owner of that flat, Victor. Victor replied she ran away some months ago because he sent police to stop her business. Victor speaks Russian only and so he phoned her speaking-English daughter to translate to me. In last week, I met this prostitute again and again (I have a too good time with her and a very discounted price) and I discovered she is living at the same street address. You know, flat owners always know who is living in their flats. Therefore the situation is: Victor lied to me and her daughter, he doesn't want people and his family know he is connected in prostitution business and he acts as a tender father.

Second example.

In last week, I went to some massage salons and strip bars. Everybody, both foreigners and Ukrainians, said to me there is no sex inside those. I went out with some Ukrainians and they always repeated they don't know massage salons and stripbars with sex service. Instead I had sex in a massage salon and I saw blowjobs are usually provided in some strip bars to Ukrainians, to Ukrainans only, and for the same price of a private dance.

There is something important more to add here but I haven't time to report about that.

I am sorry for my English. Anyway the discover is one only: here forumers are discussing about crazy prices and River Palace and other sex services but the truth is that we are talking about a business built just for foreigners and these crazy prices, River palace etc. Are just stupids things for stupid foreigners and this forum is, often but not always, a big shop window of some businessmen. I am sure some mongers have good information about cheap sex in Kiev but there is no convenience to share them with the world.

[QUOTE=Hecker]At least Acolonizer you have discovered the advantages of slavic style.[/QUOTE]

Yes Acolonizer. Because if you make all your contacts known, foreigners will spoil them. Basically the foreigners make a mistake slavic men do not do. They pay the girl before. Girls used to provide first and then get paid, for example you had sex with them and then they asked for presents, now they have learned that foreigners pay hoping and so can play game not providing since the payment is given beforehand. It was different. You will never experience the old good time. The basic is never get frightened. Think you are Acolonizer and your dick exceeds from Italy to Kiev. So there is no problem. Your dick is your advantage. This is the right thought frame.

How do you stop someone at random on the street and ask someone where a flat is that you don't know the number to? Do you say, hey, I was at this apartment near here some time last week. Can you tell me where it is?

You had the number of the apartment owner? But not the mobile phone number of the girl?

I've been out with Ukrainians and Russians in Kiev and have yet to experience a 'local preference' at salons and strip clubs.

Does the Sun rise in the west and set in the east when you are in Kiev too?

I have not been to Kiev in 2 years but will be there for the last 2 weeks in May. I was hoping that someone would be kind enough to help me with the current pricing is for girls at RP. Any info on what the going rate is for a girl for the night will be greatly appreciated. I also have been reading the board and have not seen any information on any other good clubs to find beautiful working girls. Is there anywhere new worth mentioning?

[QUOTE=Lego Maniac]I have not been to Kiev in 2 years but will be there for the last 2 weeks in May. I was hoping that someone would be kind enough to help me with the current pricing is for girls at RP. Any info on what the going rate is for a girl for the night will be greatly appreciated. I also have been reading the board and have not seen any information on any other good clubs to find beautiful working girls. Is there anywhere new worth mentioning?[/QUOTE]

Lego have you read the last 3 pages? its mentioned about eight times.
Bascially it far more expensive than 2 years ago, if you are not hard nosed and dont care if you go home alone!

OK I am here and always ready to learn from everybody . . . can you explain which good words i need to say for getting a blowjob in a strip bar?

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]I've been out with Ukrainians and Russians in Kiev and have yet to experience a 'local preference' at salons and strip clubs.[/QUOTE]

Yeah Lego, what board have you been reading. All your questions are answered already.

River Palace, Arena, Decadence. $100-$500 depending on the girl, you and where you are.

You guys are giving them way too much credit. Their "technique" is usually just lazy and oafish and a product of growing up in an environment where men rule by default and women are a dime a dozen.

Actually, Slavic style is something like this:
"красота требует жертв! от 10 тысяч $ в месяц"

One of their biggest advantages is language. 90% of us can't communicate in Russian/Ukrainian. If you are speaking English you are either going to be with girls:

1) who like to speak English for practice or prestige (like students or young professionals or girls who hate life in Ukraine),

2) who actually like you for some inexplicable reason and speak English to accomodate you

3) who speak English because they know you are a foreigner they can fool and cheat and laugh about it later with their friends

You might get lucky and just meet girls in category 1 and 2... but if you are unlucky you are going to stumble across mostly girls in category 3. They are multiplying in Kiev at an alarming rate.

As for foreigners vs. locals in strip clubs, some locals have an advantage, some don't. I think one of the most significant advantages is the fact that many of us foreigners treat strippers as some sort of heavenly angel with a heart and soul, whereas the locals tend to treat them as pieces of meat, pets that do tricks or goods that are bought and sold. The truth is somewhere in between, but the guys treating the girls like a dog are going to get her to do more tricks than the guys just lapping up her charity time.

Just as often though, you'll be in a strip club without local politico high-rollers and just be there with some Vlad Normalno-type cheapskates and the girls will figure that out quickly and ignore them. Money talks... and it doesn't have to be much. Some local guys come to the club with just enough money for beer and nothing else. Drinking beer is fine, but having 10-20 grv here and there for the girls works wonders.

Besides the language, cultural attitude and money factors, some girls are just genuinely afraid of their local men. Nobody is afraid of foreigners. Fear is a significant motivational factor in the ho-ing business.

Doctor Skank, all good you wrote, but my question remains: which words are necessary to get a blowjob without lies and delays.

So someone a few weeks back posted about a strip club "Rancho". I had a chance to check it out and it’s a bit outside the center but I feel worth the drive.

Entry is 80h and what you get is a mostly private (id imagine on the weekends it’s busy) strip show with 7 or 8 girls (1 fat one the rest where stripper HOT! ). The show itself is 1 hour and seems to be choreographed. They come up to you rub tits and ass in your face and allow you to touch and poke (or at least they did not say no to me). It is only topless but that’s ok. They also change into different outfits during the show.

At the end they bring you on stage and strip you naked and dance around you. Kinda an interesting twist! Then after that they line up and you select which one you want. I think it was $120 for 1 hour or $200 for all night (they go to your place).

The Rancho place itself is pretty nice. They have a restaurant, live bands (weekends only I think), saunas, and some other jazz.

Next time I’m feeling like a hoe or strip show I will definitely come here. Their English was not the greatest but then again your 25km outside the center.

Very nice girls. Telos approved! I’m going back tomorrow so I will report if anything interesting happens. If it’s just me and my friends in this room I’m going to take Crusier D’s patented ass slap to the next level and try the patented Telos whip the cock out of the pants (worked at Seamless in Las Vegas).

I look forward to checking it out the next time I'm in Kiev. I was going to go a few months ago but I got too busy. :)

I like the cowboy motif, I just love girls in hats.

Telos, what direction is Rancho in?
I have not even heard of it, need to go it sounds
Q

Oh mamma mia, also Rancho: this is another attraction for tourists. Maybe I was unlucky but I wasted my money there. The manageress proposed 100$/hour but I didn't like any girl very much for that price. And then why to pay 100/120$ when you could get a good blowjob for 40$?

[QUOTE=Qjump]Telos, what direction is Rancho in?

I have not even heard of it, need to go it sounds.

Q[/QUOTE]Here is a link to their website (I hope I'm allowed to post it):

[url]http://www.rancho.kiev.ua/contact.shtml[/url]

Oh yeah they even have a hotel there. I'm going again tonight I will report if the first time was a fluke or if its as good as last time with the same quality girls.

Obuhiv Road, Pidgirtsy village
There is a ‘non-stop erotic show’, private shows and VIP-room in the strip club.
Striptease show: from 09:00 PM till 06:00 AM.
Website: [url]http://www.rancho.kiev.ua/erotic-bar.shtml[/url]

[QUOTE=Delgado]Obuhiv Road, Pidgirtsy village
There is a ‘non-stop erotic show’, private shows and VIP-room in the strip club.
Striptease show: from 09:00 PM till 06:00 AM.
Website: [url]http://www.rancho.kiev.ua/erotic-bar.shtml[/url][/QUOTE]

To be exact NEW Obuhiv road just before partisan restraunt, I DONT BELIEVE I have passed this place so many times and did not know it was there, well I knew the western theamed place was but not a strip club also.
Now I have to pop in.........................

Sounds like there will be a lot of ISG'er making the pilgrimage, if it's as good as it sounds.

How's the food. :)

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]Sounds like there will be a lot of ISG'er making the pilgrimage, if it's as good as it sounds.

How's the food. :)[/QUOTE]

For food go up the road to Partisan its a great place and fun also! cant get a table at weekends during the summer ;)

Hey Doc, please check your PM.

Looking for help in Warsaw...

[QUOTE=Brandon88]Hey Doc, please check your PM.

Looking for help in Warsaw...[/QUOTE]
Didnt get anything, I wouldnt be much of a help for Warsaw anyway... )

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]

Actually, Slavic style is something like this:
"красота требует жертв! от 10 тысяч $ в месяц"

[/QUOTE]

Skank, is this an advert by a Russian girl looking for sponsorship? Saying "Beauty demands victims, from $10K per month" sounds very arrogant (unless it's meant to be tongue in cheek).

Hi Guys,

I'll be in Kiev this coming week end - who'll be around?

I'm keen to try out somewhere a little off the beaten track on Saturday. Somewhere like Saxon or Kalinka Malinka, way out in the 'burbs. Any takers?

Sunday will be a trip to Shooters followed by RP, in true sexpat style. Or a strip club followed by RP. Or something completely different.. followed by RP.

Is Avalon/Azhure still good value? And what 'replaces' 112 now that it's closed for good?

Former 112 is open again, now called "Gienas Dance Club".

Also new at Mandarin Plaza: "Grotesque Club".

[url]http://www.whatson-kiev.com/index.php?go=News&in=view&id=3916[/url]

[QUOTE=Ash1001]Skank, is this an advert by a Russian girl looking for sponsorship? Saying "Beauty demands victims, from $10K per month" sounds very arrogant (unless it's meant to be tongue in cheek). [/QUOTE]Ok, not to split hairs here, but I think a better rendering would be: "Beauty demands sacrifice. " It is commonly mistranslated as "victims" because of its nationalistic usage. IE. "7 million people were sacrifices of the Soviet empire in the forced famine. " Which makes as much sense when used as: "7 million people were victims of the Soviet empire in the forced famine. " Again not to strain on a small point here, it’s just a thought. The real point is: DAMN I don’t care how fine you look or how good you are at sucking the stripes off a zebra. You are not worth 10k and anyone who pays that much is a schmuck.

On a personal note I have been here in Kyiv for a while know, trying to personally live out the gospel according to Monger. (hence the nickname)Well, actually I have to be here often for work, but in my free time. Well I try to spread the good news of my seed.

In my various times in Kyiv, I have been with roughly 40 or so girls, and I’ve never posted here or kept memoirs so some are lost by the wayside, and remain simply as vague recollections of coital bliss with a face in mind and no name to be grasped. But, that does not mean I am without reports. So for your consideration, here are a few noteworthy recallings.

I have used freebies, street girls, girlfriends, co-workers, agency girls, individualki, various websites, and yes. Even GIA. Let me say from the onset, that I rarely like paying more than $100, but will if I think it’s worth it, or I’m being an idiot.

First off the bat, is kievprivat.com, alternately kievdosug. Ru in Russian. I like this place simply because (and I know it’s hard to believe) all the pictures are real. As far as I know, the site popped up a few years ago and now seems to be a great resource for girls just coming into the city. I suggest, trolling the pages of this one. While you can arrange what price you want (65, 80, 100, 120, 150) it’s hit or miss (I always go with 80 or 100) I have gotten some excellent picks for $80, and at the same time have been shocked at send some dogs right back to the pound. I like this site because, for the most part, it will tell you what services they offer (although it says no, most can be convinced of BBBJ) and I really like to eat pussy.

With this site your best bet is to pick a few choices of girls you want and see who’s available and what prices (as it’s not listed on the site) I regularly pick the newbies. What can I say, I’m a sucker for a village girl. 2 of my faves were 18 and had been in Kyiv only a week, but there gone now (seems a lot of these girls only last a few weeks in the biz. Seems some just want to make a grip of cash before returning home). But I have been lucky as of late and found 2 great girls.

1 was Eva, she is 18 and hot. It was literally her first time on the job (so special). She had just done the photos that day, I refreshed the page and her profile appeared. Excellent! $100 for the hour (I’m not much of an all-nighter kind of guy, I like to have my fun and then be left alone) BBBJ and some passionate sex where apparently no had told her yet, that she was a ***** and shouldn’t like her job and be cold to her john. She really liked getting her pussy eaten, which was great for me because, as I said, I love to eat pussy. Like most newcomers, she was a talker, but that’s because she was nervous, and she was so cute when she asked to see her profile page on my computer. She was thankful they covered part of her face. (yeah, a lot of them do that here, but like I said many are young and just want to earn some cash, not be known as a prostitute) Great experience all around it was like being with a girlfriend the first time.

Also on there was Nika, she also had been in Kiev for only a few days. She is 21 $80 an hour. And was just super fun. Again, a nervous talker, because again a real newcomer. But, I find a few placed family photos (brothers, sister, friends, not wives and kids) help ease them and take the edge off the fact that they are starting a career fucking strangers and getting cum in their eyes. Same thing; a little chit chat, a smoke, show me the website. And then it was on. She FUCKING loves her job. It is well worth a few minutes to get to know them and make them feel comfortable, and your experience will be better. Great head (no BBBJ sadly), great tasting and tight pussy, awesome sex! One note: she can get loud when she’s liking it. All in All, a great girl. Good body small firm tits, and the best of all were her smile and eyes! Always smiling, and always looking with intense eyes, even during sex!

One other note about this site. It goes down intermittently. Don’t know why. .

There are very few P4P girls that I return to, as I like to be just another forgotten face, and have run into a few in social settings, once even on a Campus. Very Awkward, but sometimes worth the reward, as it has turned into some free play. Speaking of free play, I’ve been meeting with this girl named Sveta, that I met a few months ago. AMAZING! I met her when she was 17. And literally met her on her birthday for a fuck (hey. I may not fear Ukrainian law, but I do fear the US state department). We hook up every few weeks in between her boyfriends. She would date me, but I made it clear that I only want a good time, and that means sex. She is OK with it as, well, I am good at what I do. That, and I’m pretty good looking. I’m 30, single, have a bit of disposable income, and apparently in this culture my style makes me a bad-ass. (ha, take that childhood bullies).

I have a few more freebies, but they are far more infrequent, and I decided a while back that a girlfriend wasn’t worth it, as they only suck money, and after a while, not much else. (there have been some exceptions, but alas, they didn’t last. Besides I’m wary of freebies, because sometimes they end up costing so much more. So, I fuck chicks that only want to be fucked, and if they want more I set them straight or send them packing.

I don’t go to clubs much, I have never been to RP, and usually avoid garden-variety streetwalkers. I’ll admit that I like them young. But, hey I’m not 65. I usually go for 18-25. I’m not a big, downtown kinda guy. Or at least not the touristy downtown. I meet women on the street, in the store, at university (yeah, I even sometimes have legitimate reasons to be there). Never on the metro. Except once when I rescued a gal from a few punk-asses that were disturbing here (I am 6’4", broad, and sometimes one hell-of-a-scary-mother-fucker. When I want to be) That was a grateful fuck. Mmmmm.

I try to go to more local restaurants and what not, and the best thing I ever did was learn Russian. I once saw a girl’s boyfriend *****-slap her down in Troeshina, and leave her. I offered to get her a cab, and she asked to stay with me. Great night, she nearly jumped me when we got in the door. She calls every couple of months.

As far as the general nature of things go, I’ll say this, act like a tourist and you’lled get screwed, not in a good way. Venture out, and remember, like most things in life, act like you’re "supposed" to be there, not like a dick who "owns the place" or like a phony trying to be cool, but act like you’re supposed to be there and you know what you’re doing. And you pretty much won’t have problems. I spent a Summer on the East Coast of the US, and I washed peoples boats. Some had them docked behind their house, I f you knocked and asked permission to go back they eyed you the whole time, but if you simply unlatch the gate walk back around and work, nobody gave a shit. Just a thought.

Well, this has already gone seriously long, but one more thing before I go for today. To get it out of the way: GIA

Alright, I will admit I have used GIA 5 times. I know shame on me. But with the exception of a girl named Nika (who is a royal greedy **** and should be taken to the pasture. Ha ha wasn’t supposed to cum there was I, well that’s what you get for assuming I didn’t want more before your time was up, and hey you were already dressed, and my only other option was to soil your pretty little clothes) they were all pretty good. Yes, some of their women look scary even in the pics, but the quality of service was astounding. And besides, they were the first place I ever called.

My first was with Ruslana (who quit like 2 weeks later) Simply wonderful. Great Fuck! Great BBBJ +CIM! Seriously, she sucked me off, and sucked me up, and threw on a condom and fucked me, I came, she pulled off the condom, and immediately sucked me off again! The cycle just continued. My balls hurt for like 3 days.

Yana. Who has been reviewed here before. Studying to be a lawyer. Boy, she could make me cum! Enough said. Too bad she’s gone too!

Zhanna. I’ll admit, I’ve been to her twice. It was intense. I will say this flat out: BEST HEAD EVER! She swallows every load and even wants you to sometimes pull out so you can cum in her mouth! Serious slit! God I love her!

Alright that’s all for now. I may need to go out trolling tonight! Peace!

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]

Thanks Delgado.

How would you rate Kiev's main elitny clubs, which I suppose at the moment are Tsar, Barsky and now Grotesque? Decadence is officially passe, right? :)

And, are you around this w/e?

[QUOTE=Ash1001]Skank, is this an advert by a Russian girl looking for sponsorship? Saying "Beauty demands victims, from $10K per month" sounds very arrogant (unless it's meant to be tongue in cheek).[/QUOTE]
It's an advert by a Slavic guy looking for a girl. Again, I really don't buy into the whole Slavic guys showing girls who is boss theory. Doesn't really correspond to what I've seen and heard. It's up to us to be boss, let's have some fighting spirit!.. )

Ash, my last visit to Kiev was in november, but I hope to be there again in may, I´ll check all new clubs and report :-)

Ok, not to split hairs here, but I think a better rendering would be: "Beauty demands sacrifice. " It is commonly mistranslated as "victims" because of its nationalistic usage. IE. "7 million people were sacrifices of the Soviet empire in the forced famine. " Which makes as much sense when used as: "7 million people were victims of the Soviet empire in the forced famine. " Again not to strain on a small point here, it’s just a thought. The real point is: DAMN I don’t care how fine you look or how good you are at sucking the stripes off a zebra. You are not worth 10k and anyone who pays that much is a schmuck.

On a personal note I have been here in Kyiv for a while know, trying to personally live out the gospel according to Monger. (hence the nickname)Well, actually I have to be here often for work, but in my free time. Well I try to spread the good news of my seed.

In my various times in Kyiv, I have been with roughly 40 or so girls, and I’ve never posted here or kept memoirs so some are lost by the wayside, and remain simply as vague recollections of coital bliss with a face in mind and no name to be grasped. But, that does not mean I am without reports. So for your consideration, here are a few noteworthy recallings.

I have used freebies, street girls, girlfriends, co-workers, agency girls, individualki, various websites, and yes. Even GIA. Let me say from the onset, that I rarely like paying more than $100, but will if I think it’s worth it, or I’m being an idiot.

First off the bat, is kievprivat.com, alternately kievdosug. Ru in Russian. I like this place simply because (and I know it’s hard to believe) all the pictures are real. As far as I know, the site popped up a few years ago and now seems to be a great resource for girls just coming into the city. I suggest, trolling the pages of this one. While you can arrange what price you want (65, 80, 100, 120, 150) it’s hit or miss (I always go with 80 or 100) I have gotten some excellent picks for $80, and at the same time have been shocked at send some dogs right back to the pound. I like this site because, for the most part, it will tell you what services they offer (although it says no, most can be convinced of BBBJ) and I really like to eat pussy.

With this site your best bet is to pick a few choices of girls you want and see who’s available and what prices (as it’s not listed on the site) I regularly pick the newbies. What can I say, I’m a sucker for a village girl. 2 of my faves were 18 and had been in Kyiv only a week, but there gone now (seems a lot of these girls only last a few weeks in the biz. Seems some just want to make a grip of cash before returning home). But I have been lucky as of late and found 2 great girls.

1 was Eva, she is 18 and hot. It was literally her first time on the job (so special). She had just done the photos that day, I refreshed the page and her profile appeared. Excellent! $100 for the hour (I’m not much of an all-nighter kind of guy, I like to have my fun and then be left alone) BBBJ and some passionate sex where apparently no had told her yet, that she was a ***** and shouldn’t like her job and be cold to her john. She really liked getting her pussy eaten, which was great for me because, as I said, I love to eat pussy. Like most newcomers, she was a talker, but that’s because she was nervous, and she was so cute when she asked to see her profile page on my computer. She was thankful they covered part of her face. (yeah, a lot of them do that here, but like I said many are young and just want to earn some cash, not be known as a prostitute) Great experience all around it was like being with a girlfriend the first time.

Also on there was Nika, she also had been in Kiev for only a few days. She is 21 $80 an hour. And was just super fun. Again, a nervous talker, because again a real newcomer. But, I find a few placed family photos (brothers, sister, friends, not wives and kids) help ease them and take the edge off the fact that they are starting a career fucking strangers and getting cum in their eyes. Same thing; a little chit chat, a smoke, show me the website. And then it was on. She FUCKING loves her job. It is well worth a few minutes to get to know them and make them feel comfortable, and your experience will be better. Great head (no BBBJ sadly), great tasting and tight pussy, awesome sex! One note: she can get loud when she’s liking it. All in All, a great girl. Good body small firm tits, and the best of all were her smile and eyes! Always smiling, and always looking with intense eyes, even during sex!

One other note about this site. It goes down intermittently. Don’t know why. .

There are very few P4P girls that I return to, as I like to be just another forgotten face, and have run into a few in social settings, once even on a Campus. Very Awkward, but sometimes worth the reward, as it has turned into some free play. Speaking of free play, I’ve been meeting with this girl named Sveta, that I met a few months ago. AMAZING! I met her when she was 17. And literally met her on her birthday for a fuck (hey. I may not fear Ukrainian law, but I do fear the US state department). We hook up every few weeks in between her boyfriends. She would date me, but I made it clear that I only want a good time, and that means sex. She is OK with it as, well, I am good at what I do. That, and I’m pretty good looking. I’m 30, single, have a bit of disposable income, and apparently in this culture my style makes me a bad-ass. (ha, take that childhood bullies).

I have a few more freebies, but they are far more infrequent, and I decided a while back that a girlfriend wasn’t worth it, as they only suck money, and after a while, not much else. (there have been some exceptions, but alas, they didn’t last. Besides I’m wary of freebies, because sometimes they end up costing so much more. So, I fuck chicks that only want to be fucked, and if they want more I set them straight or send them packing.

I don’t go to clubs much, I have never been to RP, and usually avoid garden-variety streetwalkers. I’ll admit that I like them young. But, hey I’m not 65. I usually go for 18-25. I’m not a big, downtown kinda guy. Or at least not the touristy downtown. I meet women on the street, in the store, at university (yeah, I even sometimes have legitimate reasons to be there). Never on the metro. Except once when I rescued a gal from a few punk-asses that were disturbing here (I am 6’4", broad, and sometimes one hell-of-a-scary-ass-mother-fucker. When I want to be) That was a grateful fuck. Mmmmm.

I try to go to more local restaurants and what not, and the best thing I ever did was learn Russian. I once saw a girl’s boyfriend *****-slap her down in Troeshina, and leave her. I offered to get her a cab, and she asked to stay with me. Great night, she nearly jumped me when we got in the door. She calls every couple of months.

As far as the general nature of things go, I’ll say this, act like a tourist and you’lled get screwed, not in a good way. Venture out, and remember, like most things in life, act like you’re "supposed" to be there, not like a dick who "owns the place" or like a phony trying to be cool, but act like you’re supposed to be there and you know what you’re doing. And you pretty much won’t have problems. I spent a Summer on the East Coast of the US, and I washed peoples boats. Some had them docked behind their house, I f you knocked and asked permission to go back they eyed you the whole time, but if you simply unlatch the gate walk back around and work, nobody gave a shit. Just a thought.

Well, this has already gone seriously long, but one more thing before I go for today. To get it out of the way: GIA

Alright, I will admit I have used GIA 5 times. I know shame on me. But with the exception of a girl named Nika (who is a royal greedy **** and should be taken to the pasture. Ha ha wasn’t supposed to cum there was I, well that’s what you get for assuming I didn’t want more before your time was up, and hey you were already dressed, and my only other option was to soil your pretty little clothes) they were all pretty good. Yes, some of their women look scary even in the pics, but the quality of service was astounding. And besides, they were the first place I ever called.

My first was with Ruslana (who quit like 2 weeks later) Simply wonderful. Great Fuck! Great BBBJ +CIM! Seriously, she sucked me off, and sucked me up, and threw on a condom and fucked me, I came, she pulled off the condom, and immediately sucked me off again! The cycle just continued. My balls hurt for like 3 days.

Yana. Who has been reviewed here before. Studying to be a lawyer. Boy, she could make me cum! Enough said. Too bad she’s gone too!

Zhanna. I’ll admit, I’ve been to her twice. It was intense. I will say this flat out: BEST HEAD EVER! She swallows every load and even wants you to sometimes pull out so you can cum in her mouth! Serious ****! God I love her!

Alright that’s all for now. Peace!

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]

[QUOTE=Reverendfun]Ok, not to split hairs here, but I think a better rendering would be: "Beauty demands sacrifice. " It is commonly mistranslated as "victims" because of its nationalistic usage. IE. "7 million people were sacrifices of the Soviet empire in the forced famine. " Which makes as much sense when used as: "7 million people were victims of the Soviet empire in the forced famine. " Again not to strain on a small point here, it’s just a thought. The real point is: DAMN I don’t care how fine you look or how good you are at sucking the stripes off a zebra. You are not worth 10k and anyone who pays that much is a schmuck.
[/QUOTE]Great report!

Still not to split hairs, I interpreted it as "Beauty demands victims, from $10,000 a month" . For example, if there is a car or plane crash, there are "жертвы". They certainly aren't sacrifices.... ))

Either way, the guy has too much money and likes to throw it away. I am not a native speaker though, so I can't 100% say what he meant by it.
[QUOTE=Reverendfun]
In my various times in Kyiv, I have been with roughly 40 or so girls, and I’ve never posted here or kept memoirs so some are lost by the wayside, and remain simply as vague recollections of coital bliss with a face in mind and no name to be grasped. But, that does not mean I am without reports. So for your consideration, here are a few noteworthy recallings.
[/QUOTE]I suggest you do, it's added value! You'll appreciate it later when you get older... )))

Always a good bet in Kiev is "Talgen", a pub with the small strip bar "Marylin" downstairs.

Krasno(or in Ukrainian "Cervono")Armeyskaya Str. 32A

Luda, the long time, always same loking admin gives you a smile. The girls don't look like on [url]www.kiev-x.com[/url], but have great performance. Drinks are moderate and no rip-off. You must negotiate where you can take them to and how many bucks for. She may even say no. Russian speaking only. Silicone sometimes available.

And of course for the big boys there is "RIO". River Palace currently sucks, but may always change. Prices start from$500/night, negotiate as low as 200.

This is an important question: what is the slang Russian word standing for "swallow blowjob"?

Blowjob to completion doesn't mean anything because CIM is not swallow blowjob. I want a genuine, complete, funny swallow blowjob. I am bored to hear stories like that "just CBJ or BBBJ or CIM, but gorgeous!" If a blowjob is not a swallow blowjob, that is not a blowjob!

I am the founder of the party for the democracy of swallow blowjobs.

"заглотать сперму" - means to swallow sperm.

It's direct. No slang needed.

New to the forum and just wanted to say I have been a fairly consistant user of GIA and the girls are good the photos real and the prices compared to the rest of the world reasonable.

Hi all,

Looking for streetgirls in Kiev.

I prefer the chase of it, when the girls realise what you are after it then comes to see who is best looking at the right price.

There are some gems out there i would prefer to pay $50 for some streetgirl than $200 for some hyped up bimbo.

Any help much appreciated

Crompton.

"заглотать минет" stands for swallow blowjob?

I can't say "oh my girl, you are good at a "глубоко минет и заглотать сперму" because, of course, she will look at me and will reply "нет" to my silly Russian. I need something more strong and short, like a shot of vodka . . .

[QUOTE=Reverendfun]"заглотать сперму" - means to swallow sperm.

It's direct. No slang needed.[/QUOTE]

Gents, It's not really needed to speak good Russian. Speak the couple of words you need for sex (like shachtyor for anal, etc.), and make your body and gestics work. And understand how these chicks in Ukraine, Russia, Kazakhstan, etc. think. MUCH more important.

I tried dozens or more like that, and for a two hour or one night stand that even better than speaking russian.

What do you want - make sex or start family talks :)

Of course your company must pay for LOTS of trips so that you can "deepen" your experience. But if it is a Dyelovaya Komandirovka, who cares :)

One note about street girls: uuuaaahh. I propose metal condoms, very infected (like in Primorskaya Str. in Odessa).

What's cheaper, a fair price for a chick or HIV treatment?

Hey Colon, your posts are all talk about "prostitutes" and various things you would like them to do for you, in more detail than any of us would like to hear. If you have real-world adventures and information, by all means share them. But if you are only getting off by talking dirty, there are phone-sex services that would be more appropriate for indulging your fantasies.

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]This is an important question: what is the slang Russian word standing for "swallow blowjob"?

Blowjob to completion doesn't mean anything because CIM is not swallow blowjob. I want a genuine, complete, funny swallow blowjob. I am bored to hear stories like that "just CBJ or BBBJ or CIM, but gorgeous!" If a blowjob is not a swallow blowjob, that is not a blowjob!

I am the founder of the party for the democracy of swallow blowjobs.[/QUOTE]

I have already posted some personal stories and some meeting reports. I have already replied to some private messages asking for detailed information. I am sure I have done a good work. And I am more sure about my work when I compare my work with titled services, places and people, or better what they are in real life because they are often different from their reports here.

I am curious and therefore I want to understand what is the truth. The truth is often very different from personal opinions.

For example, talking about mongering for girls, I never found a honest girl. The truth is: call them prostitutes, friends, lovers or wives, they are always big liers because they are biological female. This is a "dirty" game between males and females and we need everything to win our battle. When we use too many words, our language is not understood. Therefore we need to say few and strong words to be understood. And my question was very easy: as we say "swallow blowjob" in English, so it must exist a Russian idiom " . . . минет"!

Instead, people blah blah blah and this very easy question hasn't been replied yet.

If you wish to be a Gentleman (Travel), please move to Vatican City ;-)

[QUOTE=Gentleman Travel]Hey Colon, your posts are all talk about "prostitutes" and various things you would like them to do for you, in more detail than any of us would like to hear. If you have real-world adventures and information, by all means share them. But if you are only getting off by talking dirty, there are phone-sex services that would be more appropriate for indulging your fantasies.[/QUOTE]

Good advice, thank you. You forgot some things:

1 - expressions like "shachtyor" are hard to know. In fact I haven't found any expression standing for "swallow blowjob", yet: can you help me?

2 - When I find a beautiful and smart girl (for me), I make everything to keep that girl. So it is hard for me to apply the Russian style "fuck her hard and throw her away";

3 - I have no company paying for my journeys and I am not the secret Bush's son and therefore my stays in Kiev must be very intense;

4 - I don't know about street workers in Kiev, but, in my deep experience, I found the best and cheaper services with Ukrainian street workers in Italy. The problem in Italy is that Ukrainian street workers are very few and Italian prostitution market is hard managed by criminal organizations: maybe there is more Russian Mafia in Mestre/Venice than in Kiev!

[QUOTE=Sasha Byelov]Gents, It's not really needed to speak good Russian. Speak the couple of words you need for sex (like shachtyor for anal, etc.), and make your body and gestics work. And understand how these chicks in Ukraine, Russia, Kazakhstan, etc. think. MUCH more important.

I tried dozens or more like that, and for a two hour or one night stand that even better than speaking russian.

What do you want - make sex or start family talks :)

Of course your company must pay for LOTS of trips so that you can "deepen" your experience. But if it is a Dyelovaya Komandirovka, who cares :)

One note about street girls: uuuaaahh. I propose metal condoms, very infected (like in Primorskaya Str. in Odessa).

What's cheaper, a fair price for a chick or HIV treatment?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Good advice, thank you. You forgot some things:

1 - expressions like "shachtyor" are hard to know. In fact I haven't found any expression standing for "swallow blowjob", yet: can you help me?

2 - When I find a beautiful and smart girl (for me), I make everything to keep that girl. So it is hard for me to apply the Russian style "fuck her hard and throw her away";

3 - I have no company paying for my journeys and I am not the secret Bush's son and therefore my stays in Kiev must be very intense;

4 - I don't know about street workers in Kiev, but, in my deep experience, I found the best and cheaper services with Ukrainian street workers in Italy. The problem in Italy is that Ukrainian street workers are very few and Italian prostitution market is hard managed by criminal organizations: maybe there is more Russian Mafia in Mestre/Venice than in Kiev![/QUOTE]1. Buy at least one good pocket dictionary(like oxford) and when at home scan internet news or personals in russian and try to translate them with dictionary.It is a bit time consuming but t is worth the effort.You will see the other side of the hill.

2. It is wrong to make everything to keep the girl.What are you talking about?The girl should do everything possible to keep you.Remember this is a country where the game is run by girls,not by boys.

3. Right.Most do not have a financial supporter for their expenses(unless they are *****s to sb else).Time is extrmeley important.You have to kill time.Time and duration are the worst things,every hour you stay in Kiev you have to pay for it,it has a cost,so the less time needed the better.

4. Yes in the West there is more control on these things.This is the wild East.The promise land.

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Good advice, thank you. You forgot some things:

1 - expressions like "shachtyor" are hard to know. In fact I haven't found any expression standing for "swallow blowjob", yet: can you help me?

2 - When I find a beautiful and smart girl (for me), I make everything to keep that girl. So it is hard for me to apply the Russian style "fuck her hard and throw her away";

3 - I have no company paying for my journeys and I am not the secret Bush's son and therefore my stays in Kiev must be very intense;

4 - I don't know about street workers in Kiev, but, in my deep experience, I found the best and cheaper services with Ukrainian street workers in Italy. The problem in Italy is that Ukrainian street workers are very few and Italian prostitution market is hard managed by criminal organizations: maybe there is more Russian Mafia in Mestre/Venice than in Kiev![/QUOTE]As for expressions for swallowing, I would ask: Mozno progladit or mozno pit spermu or moges progladit or lubis progladit spermu or lubis pit spermu or xatsiu ty progladis mayou spermu. Mozno? Or pijes spermu? To delayes?

There are many ways to ask the same thing, it depends on the girl.

заглотай - is direct enough... it simply is the command form of "Swallow".

so say: заглотай сперму Сука! - swallow *****!

девушка, ты хорошо заглотала! - you swallowed good!

ты заглотающая девушка? - do you swallow?

Are there any good massage parlors and strip clubs in Kiev? Is there a lot of big breasted women in Kiev? I guess Kiev has various types of women who cater to all needs.

Any info on Kiev Street walkers ?

You can find some after 23:00hr when you drive from Kiev to Zhytomir. About 5 km out of Kiev. Also you can find some when your drive from Kiev to the village "Ukrainka". Just outside Kiev toge.

Never tried any of them and I never would.

Happy hunting.

The roadway next to the park just past Victory Square. Saw them there last winter.

The roadway over the Dniper bridge next to River Palace, go to the left bank, they are on the side with the McD. Saw some there two winters ago

In years past on Schevenko Blvd at the top of the hill.

My info is obviously outdated but I think the Victory Square and Left Bank locations are still active.

From what I understand quite a few girl around Mandarin Plaza and Khreshatic are also open to p4p but not obvious about it.

Useful report, Cruiser D (is your name Bob? )

I know a lot of prostitutes have "working" flats in Pobedi Prospekt and in Pechersk area. Therefore I make 1 + 1: is this the "working" process? Prostitutes usually walk on roads during the day and they meet customers on roads to work in customers' cars. When customers want something more, prostitutes take them in "working" flats or in customers' flats? What do you think? Is this a full-time prostitute's typical "working" day?

Moreover I see in [url]www.flirt.com.ua[/url], prostitutes' profiles are not always managed by themselves but they are often managed by other people, maybe their girlfriends or boyfriends or mamashkas. Everything makes to think prostitution is a very organized industry. What do you think?

The girls on the street are in no way the same as the ones in the apartments (not the ones I have seen on the street anyway)

Organized? really? you think so? I always thought they where all independent ;)

If you are drunk enough, it is sort of fun to have a cab from rp take you to the place on the hill, pick up a girl, and have the poletzei stop you, brandish weapons while you stupidly laugh, get robbed in a minor way, and sort of think it is an enriching cultural exchange, of course it helps one's perspective if you have been in the military and are dumb, like your faithful correspondent.

I'm just giving you the information based on what I have observed. Most of it is outdated but I would guess there are still strolls past RP on the Left Bank and past Victory Square. There also seems to be quite a few girls open to p4p in the Mandarin Plaza and Khreshatic area, mostly during warm weather. The gambit runs from club girls, student girls, single mothers and drug users. Quality varies to say the least.

Most of the street walkers are free lancers and have nothing to do with the salon girls. It's just to earn some quick money - new outfit, food, rent, pay for grades, drugs, whatever.

Anybody stay at Slavutych Hotel?

Just back from a long night of entertainment. After spending far too much time and Coronas at Rio, we drifted off to RP for a change of scenery. Rio admission tickets are no longer accepted at any table except poker, so plopping down your stub on the way out on Black at the Roulette table and possibly getting back your entire bar tab is now over, at least according to the sleepy bint working the table.

Uh-oh, the World Bank has some sort of event going on, and there is not a single hotel or apartment available in town at any price, but thankfully Agent L had a place (Cruiser knows who). I figured this influx of Euro-flush visitors would cause the already outrageous opening offers to go even higher into the atmosphere.
In the main club room at RP, the scene was sausage-fest. Another red flag. Ratio looked to be 1:1, very bad for RP.

So we have time, not having to worry about the clock on a Saturday night, and we decide to take one for the team and hold prices down. $200 is the limit, no exceptions.

Agent L works the sweaty crowd for a double date and makes clear what the compensation will be. Some refusals and some "we'll get back to you". So we wait. Agent L wants to raise the bar to $300, and I refuse. Let's see if the tortoise will win the race. Nothing to lose.
By 3am, the sausage concentration diminishes significantly. Now it is a Mexican Standoff. The tarts begin assessing the situation, clock is ticking, eyes darting in concern, while the two sides all over the room try to decide what to do. The Ukrainian concept of going home empty rather than budge at all downward on price is starting to be severely tested. You can see it in the eyes.
Finally one nice young lady makes her move, coming down from 300 to 200 immediately, and off we go.

Final damage: $200 + 100 Grivnas for taxi as a final concession. So there is a data point for you.

Congratulations! Just one more question: 200$ in two (girl + you) or 200$ in three (girl + you + your friend)?

[QUOTE=Brandon88] ( . . . ) Final damage: $200 + 100 Grivnas for taxi as a final concession. So there is a data point for you.[/QUOTE]

Were they initially asking for $300 for the night at midnight? That may actually be better value for money than $200 for the night starting at 3am

I don't think so because I am sure they asked for an overnight price and this means at least 8 hours, this doesn't mind if starting from midnight or if starting from 3 am: for example from 3 am + 8 hours + 15 min. Taxi = 11. 15 am

My question is just a curious question, to calculate the probability about a girl is a good professional (same price for one, two or three men) or unworthy piece of meat.

[QUOTE=Ash1001]Were they initially asking for $300 for the night at midnight? That may actually be better value for money than $200 for the night starting at 3am[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Kraled]

Its fun to brandish weapons while you stupidly laugh, like your faithful correspondent.

[/QUOTE]

Nice that you re-appeared here after a year.

By the way, on your 6 trips to Ukraine, have you any stupid fotos of the Kiev/kharkov dolls you met?

Like this doll from Candyland, Sveta.

It was $200 for just me and the girl. No way I'm double-teaming. He can find his own.

For me, all-night versus short time is the same. I don't want them lingering around for hours. That's just me.

Hello,

I was planning to visit kiev for the first time on Wednesday 21st for 5 days, but it seems there are no quality apartments left, a conference in the city. Only a single apt around Purshkinakaya street. Should I cancel my trip? Does the quality of Apt effect if you meet a girl and bring her back?

Advice needed please.

Thank you in advance

[QUOTE=Namster]Hello,

I was planning to visit kiev for the first time on Wednesday 21st for 5 days, but it seems there are no quality apartments left, a conference in the city. Only a single apt around Purshkinakaya street. Should I cancel my trip? Does the quality of Apt effect if you meet a girl and bring her back?

Advice needed please.

Thank you in advance[/QUOTE]From the main ' K ' street. OK area!

I really don't think where makes so much of a differnce in SCORING!

For Namster and many others.

When you hunt a freebie, a good woman shouldn't mind to your money, your car and your house. Otherwise she is a b**** pretending a good woman.

When you hunt a prostitute, prostitutes fuck everybody, everywhere, everyway. Prostitutes can swallow sperm, smiling, from the dirtiest and unhealthy and drug-addicted man in the world and in the meanwhile prostitutes can fuck with condom, blaming, the cleanest and healthy and sweet man in the world. Prostitutes are not regular people. I know very well what prostitutes are and this is an unbelievable thing. If you think prostitutes are like regular women, it is better for your life not to start mongering.

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]For Namster and many others.

When you hunt a freebie, a good woman shouldn't mind to your money, your car and your house. Otherwise she is a b**** pretending a good woman.

When you hunt a prostitute, prostitutes fuck everybody, everywhere, everyway. Prostitutes can swallow sperm, smiling, from the dirtiest and unhealthy and drug-addicted man in the world and in the meanwhile prostitutes can fuck with condom, blaming, the cleanest and healthy and sweet man in the world. Prostitutes are not regular people. I know very well what prostitutes are and this is an unbelievable thing. If you think prostitutes are like regular women, it is better for your life not to start mongering.[/QUOTE]Every woman is a prostitute and a good woman at the same time.There is no reason to make distinction between pros and good women.The point is if you want to release the pro from the good woman or the good woman from the pro.

Let's say like you divide men in pigs and nice men.Hey AC,where do you belong?

Thanks for the sentiment, I have never taken a photo, sorry.

May come back and a few weeks.

This is a very hard matter because now we are not talking about sex, but we are talking about the essence of human being.

First of all, if you say that same opinion in a "regular" audience, you are sure people think you are a perverted mad.

Second, I partially agree with you. I really saw what human being can make, not everything but the top of iceberg, and I am very disgusted for all my life. OK, all men are pigs too and all women are b**** too.

What is the difference between good and bad? The "limit": when a human being put a limit in his extreme points, then that human being is good, otherwise not. I know this is hard to understand for an anglosaxon background and here is an example: when three husbands (and fathers of family) have no scruples to join for a (multiple) fisting session with a young girl like their daugthers, I am sure those same husbands have no scruples to have the same things with a child.

At last, yes, I am a sweet man!



[QUOTE=Hecker]Every woman is a prostitute and a good woman at the same time.There is no reason to make distinction between pros and good women.The point is if you want to release the pro from the good woman or the good woman from the pro.

Let's say like you divide men in pigs and nice men.Hey AC,where do you belong?[/QUOTE]

Hello,

I am in Kiev now and its very Hot I am trying the street game on Kreschatyk but as yet I have not succeded, got a few studentka numbers at papita so lets see if anything happens after dark. Any fellow members out there to provide help with the day game?

Cheers

I am a bit worried. Ukrainian and Russian women, of my same age, sometimes write to me by Flirt site. The problem is they seem old like my mother. Orchids at 18 and W. C. At middle 30s.

Full report to follow later, but i have to admit the Local Studentkas are very wary now of Foreigners. Even if you speak passable or basic Russian. This is not easy.

Gents, Rio takeout is now 1250 hryvnas for the hour (or 2 if she likes you). Private lap dances are now 200hrv (up from 150).
Beers continue to be fairly reasonable at 20hrv per bottle for Corona or Heineken.

USD exchange rate is on a wild roller coaster. 4.5 one day, 5.1 the next.

FYI.

[QUOTE=Brandon88]Gents, Rio takeout is now 1250 hryvnas for the hour (or 2 if she likes you). Private lap dances are now 200hrv (up from 150).

Beers continue to be fairly reasonable at 20hrv per bottle for Corona or Heineken.

USD exchange rate is on a wild roller coaster. 4.5 one day, 5.1 the next.

FYI.[/QUOTE]Best I have seen lately is 4.72 (today).

Where have you seen 5.1?

[QUOTE=Telos]Best I have seen lately is 4.72 (today).

Where have you seen 5.1?[/QUOTE]

A bank up Bodhana jumped up on Saturday.

[QUOTE=Brandon88]A bank up Bodhana jumped up on Saturday.[/QUOTE]Bull shit, the past 8 weeks or so the monkey shit dollar has been below 5. , towards the end of April it was starting to make a comeback; somewhat, closing in on 4. 99, about two weeks ago yulia (the face of anticorruption) tymoshenko revalued the hryvnya, making it stonger against all majors, the dollar fell to 4. 40, and has raised; a little, since then, the best rate you'll find is most likely at? , which today was at 4. 70.

Last week the dollar was re-pegged from 5. 05 to 4. 85, this was done by yulia's request. The reason this is happening is because inflation is at 30 percent, due to her fucked up polices. She did this same crap in April "05 and yushchenko fired her ass, which is basically the only smart moved he's made since he's been in office. He brought her back last December and she's pulling the same sit.

[QUOTE=Timmy21]Bull shit, the past 8 weeks or so the monkey shit dollar has been below 5. , towards the end of April it was starting to make a comeback; somewhat, closing in on 4. 99, about two weeks ago yulia (the face of anticorruption) tymoshenko revalued the hryvnya, making it stonger against all majors, the dollar fell to 4. 40, and has raised; a little, since then, the best rate you'll find is most likely at? , which today was at 4. 70.

Last week the dollar was re-pegged from 5. 05 to 4. 85, this was done by yulia's request. The reason this is happening is because inflation is at 30 percent, due to her fucked up polices. She did this same crap in April "05 and yushchenko fired her ass, which is basically the only smart moved he's made since he's been in office. He brought her back last December and she's pulling the same sit.[/QUOTE]Probably some Ukrainians make a lot of money by selling dollars and buying them again when Timoshenko proceeds to reevaluation. Of course the latter knows as well when this is going to happen.

Went to Prime club last night.

Hands down the hottest girls I have seen in a Kiev nightclub in this place.

Music was not up my alley but the talent was unreal. I guess Fridays is this drum and bass shit and saturdays is R&B which is much more standable.

80h entry. its near the bus station.

I will be back there soon.

Saxon is also a great student club. Only 30h entry but its kinda far.

The Ukrainian rates was/is tied to the dollar. Since W is doing a much better job fucking up the US econmy then Yulia is with Ukraine she's trying to make some adjustment. Of course if friends/family profit from insider trading all the better - that is after all the slavic way. :)

Yulia is a thief and probably not worthy to hold the position she has but she's way ahead of the other cast of characters in that country. Yulia's still trying to get people back their money from when the banks failed. Saying inflation in Ukraine is her fault is like W saying there is nothing he can do about the price of oil - if he were only president of the US, oh wait...

Be nice to Brandon - he is/was in Kyiv and I know he can read. Maybe he mistaked the buying/selling rate?

Telos, where is the bus station? :)

[QUOTE=Telos]Went to Prime club last night.

Hands down the hottest girls I have seen in a Kiev nightclub in this place.

Music was not up my alley but the talent was unreal. I guess Fridays is this drum and bass shit and saturdays is R&B which is much more standable.

80h entry. its near the bus station.

I will be back there soon.

Saxon is also a great student club. Only 30h entry but its kinda far.[/QUOTE]

PM me! I wanna know how long your going to be in Kiev, I plan on taking some time off at the end of summer when the prices go down again.

Hello,

I am in Kiev.

Anybody around to meet up?

Telos, what sort of attitude do the girls at Prime have? Friendly and approachable, or stuck up? I'm wondering how long it will take for it to degenerate into another Decadence..

Hello,

I am in Kiev. Is anybody around to meet up?

[QUOTE=Ash1001]Telos, what sort of attitude do the girls at Prime have? Friendly and approachable, or stuck up? I'm wondering how long it will take for it to degenerate into another Decadence..[/QUOTE]They where not bad. We where the only foreigners in there that I saw so thats always a plus. It was more a student club like Saxon.

Worth checking out IMO. I'll be back a few more times for sure.

Here I am in Kiev again. And again I see the same situations and, at last, I realize these situations are the average here in Kiev and in the world.

First of all, I am a little bored about forumers that want to meet another forumer in Ukraine and, then, they never do anything to meet him. Or about beginners that want everything ready to use.

Then, there are some situations:

- When a man has found a woman for a lasting relationship. For this man, his lover is the best woman in the world. But this woman is not nice (or better, she is ugly indeed) and this man is secretly interested in other women (or better, prostitutes). For me, this situation has no meaning because for all my life, I am looking for just one nice and smart woman and one woman is enough for me and I don't mind if she is a regular woman or a prostitute. Instead, the average is to find two women, one official lover just for children and one unofficial lover just for sex. And, at the end, there is no real lovers, no men, no women.

- I am a little bored with master mongers because massage salons and strip bars are often soft brothels. I saw in a strip bar, Ukrainians getting real blowjobs (for who knows what is a real blowjob) and I saw in a massage salon, Ukrainians getting real blowjobs. I can't imagine how hard salons and bars were in the past. And I am sure this is the average in all massage salons and in all strip bars, real blowjobs for Ukrainians, who are not stupid and they never pay for an erotical massage or a private dance. Why has no forumer reported this? Why do most people talk about expensive prostitutes?

- In my experience with freebies, maybe small maybe unlucky, they are time-wasting and money-wasting and, at the end, freebies are as honest as prostitutes.

- I have found two kinds of Italians, the Italian businessman and the other Italians. The Italian businessman usually cheats Italians when he sells his products to them, therefore it is better never to say to be Italian. The other Italians are used to be too good-mannered men. In the past, Italians are famous to be latin lovers, instead now they are so too good-mannered that they have become "pirla" lovers, this means "silly" lovers in Italian slang.

- I have found Americans (from U.S.A.) in flights and around Kiev. They are usually excited people. They put themselves in the center of the show and, in their opinions, everything, that they do, is fantastic. Of course, they are often wrong. Engaged Americans are very jealous with their Ukrainian women. This is a mutual business in these relationships between Americans and Ukrainians. Americans know to be richest but requiring females and Ukrainians know to be the nicest but requiring wealth. Until dollar is important and visa for U.S.A. assures wealth, this is a big business for both and they both are aware this is just a business.

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]

I am sorry for my english, I have been now in kiev so many times, I know how is work in kiev if you are only in kiev for 4 days is the best place go to Riverplace. But many tourist rip of the market so now the price is from 200 to 400$ for 1 hour. Before the price was 100$, if you pick up a girl from riverplace is good for you to ask is this girl call taxi agency so you will only pay 30 uah or you take take outside riverplace you will pay 100 uah. Before you come to kiev you need to make a budget because is expensive city. I prefare to go nightclub and pick up a freebies, but is not easy. For tourist or foreginer is the best to stay in the city because is safe for you. I have been in saxon nightclub and forsage nightclub, yes is a lot of student but is far away from city and I feel not safe like when I go to nightclub in the city it can be dangerous, because many taxi driver is corrupt they working with police and mafia.

About skybar and decadence don't go because is expencive the price of entrance is 150 uah and some in the weekend 200 uah, is a elite club only full of rich people, if you come there so is better too stay in your country. What I found is very important in kiev is how you dress and especial your shoes, you need to dress well or you don't have any chance, you need to know, is the girls who play the market in kiev now, so you can meet many girl who just play with you especial for tourist you will spend a lot of money of her and you get nothing from her. Shooters is a good place to pick up some freebies and some times art 44 and in krechatyk)). About safety is safe in the city, beware of drunk people in group, they are some skinhead grown it up in kiev now they get inspiration from russia. But almost go after turkish, arabic, and african student.

I am professionel hunters I am only looking only for freebies, I can not tell you what is the best bar and the best nightclub, because tourist who read this will only rip of the market))).

Have a nice time in Kiev.

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]

Thank you Spanishboy.

I would like to underline the first problem is not prices, because prostitutes' prices have the same strategy of taxi's prices, but the first problem is the quality.

Maybe most men are used to very low quality, maybe most men like just piggy sex with every kind of girl, but to find a charming girl very good at everything sex, it is hard in all over the world: sex is an art that most people think to know but they know at maximum 25%.

And sometimes it is very ridicolous when men talk about freebies. Freebies don't always mean nice girls. Because you fuck for free, therefore your girl is nice?

OK, I agree, it should be better never with prostitutes.

The question about freebies in Kiev is the relationship quality x number/time x money spent. This is rather low since in Kiev you can get an 8 in terms of appearance maximum (mostly you bed 6-7) and the number if you stay one week and do everything inside the week (first meeting to bed) will be 1-2 while the expenses will be at least 250 euro everyday (everything included, rent, dates expenses, clubs), so you will have spent 1850 + 400 euro plane ticket just to fuck one 7 or 6.

Some people may be happy with the above but the challenge is that there are alternative places where the ratio quality x number/time x money is better.

[QUOTE=Hecker]The question about freebies in Kiev is the relationship quality x number/time x money spent. This is rather low since in Kiev you can get an 8 in terms of appearance maximum (mostly you bed 6-7) and the number if you stay one week and do everything inside the week (first meeting to bed) will be 1-2 while the expenses will be at least 250 euro everyday (everything included, rent, dates expenses, clubs), so you will have spent 1850 + 400 euro plane ticket just to fuck one 7 or 6.

Some people may be happy with the above but the challenge is that there are alternative places where the ratio quality x number/time x money is better.[/QUOTE]

Interesting points...

2.5 days, one trip to RP (didn't do take out), about $170 US in accommodations between two different places and I had my hands around her breast, kissing her neck and her pants down while the baby slept on day 3 about 4 feet from us.

That was shot number 1

Shot number 2 I have on my hard drive - :) which happen after dinner, she cooked, now restaurant food here.

First time ever traveler to EE, Not even considered a serious player or monger State side, did I get lucky?

I don't think so. Putting cultural differences aside for a second, women deep down desire the SAME things when it comes to partners in varying degrees.

She is not a looker, needs the right clothes, hair style and makeup to elevate her status which I put at 5. Her body however is better than some of the extremely skinny girls that Doc likes to post, but he likes them that way and I wouldn't kick a thin girl like that out of my bed either. This woman is much thinner by American standards with larger B or small C cup titties.

Add the incentive that I am an African-American, that might have increased my chances of sexual contact by a certain amount. I mean the Hungarian girl I dated for a hot second here in LA, she had a nice collection of IR porn in her apartment, she worked for a distributor so access was easy but she didn't bother to hide it well either.

[i]I bring that up to prove there's a measurable amount of natural curiosity and many women are interested in the myths and fables they have heard from Western Women.[/i]

So not turning this post to be about me per-say but I came out ahead by going the freebie route. The only thing that didn't make it worth it overall is that I had to play damage control when the freebie felt cheap and used all of a sudden... We just had did the deed about two hours earlier and after dinner, Telos SMS'ed me and wanted to know if I wanted to go out with him.

That's when the shit hit the fan, she made a big scene and there was plenty of drama with her putting the baby in the stroller and actually opening the door, but I knew she wasn't going anyplace....

"You come to Kiev just to see cheap girls..."

She also said something that might have caused me to leave but I knew it was anger speaking and not her true intent and unfortunately she pulled out the "race" card and babbled something about there wasn't AIDS in Ukraine until African immigrants showed up and she was concerned I had made her sick, Uh chances are Caucasian mongers are not going to get this card pulled on them.

Just to prove that was false, she sheepishly requested we fuck again and that this time we get it on her digital camera.

From time to time, on Skype she'll ask when I am visiting again and when are we going to have sex again and she has sent me nude pictures, topless pictures and the like...lol

For unexperienced mongers (I totally include myself in that) you should stick to proven properties and RTFF!

If your serious about meeting your future wife, just be honest, no shadiness, no double talk, no tricks. It pays off quickly, as I said I don't think what happen to me is unique.

[QUOTE=DJ FourMoney]
"You come to Kiev just to see cheap girls..."
[/QUOTE]That is the stigma.
[QUOTE=DJ FourMoney]Here body however is better than some of the extremely skinny girls that Doc likes to post, but he likes them that way and I wouldn't kick a thin girl like that out of my bed either. [/QUOTE]I don't always go for the super skinny ones DJ4$, depends on my mood. Sometimes I like a bit more tit and ass.[QUOTE=Hecker]Some people may be happy with the above but the challenge is that there are alternative places where the ratio quality x number/time x money is better.[/QUOTE]Just curious, where do you think it is better?

You guys do know there are several tens of thousands of beautiful girls in Kyiv, right? To those who find it tough going - Stay away from the very attractive spoiled 'center' girls. There are going to chew you up and spit you out. Then we all get to hear you cry about it on here.

If you have been to Kyiv more then 3-4 times and are still lamenting about this or that it's time to find someplace else to go.

Spanishboy, you don't need to have the girl call a taxi service at RP. Just walk to the street and flag down a car. I generally pay 30uah when I leave to go back to the center - with or without a girl. Sometimes 40 or 50 if I'm tired.

Hey, where have Irish Lad, Uke and Tonit66 been?

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]That is the stigma.
I don't always go for the super skinny ones DJ4$, depends on my mood. Sometimes I like a bit more tit and ass.Just curious, where do you think it is better?[/QUOTE]

I'll take any of your leftovers!

I know you like some "onion" and "melons" with your ladies, I its just the very tall and very thin ones tend to stand out - :)

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]You guys do know there are several tens of thousands of beautiful girls in Kyiv, right? To those who find it tough going - Stay away from the very attractive spoiled 'center' girls. There are going to chew you up and spit you out. Then we all get to hear you cry about it on here.

If you have been to Kyiv more then 3-4 times and are still lamenting about this or that it's time to find someplace else to go.

Spanishboy, you don't need to have the girl call a taxi service at RP. Just walk to the street and flag down a car. I generally pay 30uah when I leave to go back to the center - with or without a girl. Sometimes 40 or 50 if I'm tired.

Hey, where have Irish Lad, Uke and Tonit66 been?[/QUOTE]

I totally agree, there are many "Stunnas" among the "normal" women you''ll find on the outskirts of the city and at agencies around the city, several of them...

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]You guys do know there are several tens of thousands of beautiful girls in Kyiv, right? To those who find it tough going - Stay away from the very attractive spoiled 'center' girls. There are going to chew you up and spit you out. Then we all get to hear you cry about it on here.
[/QUOTE]In addition to that, despite all the talk of sponsored girls etc., the vast majority of girls lead fairly simple, boring lives... and go to clubs maybe once of month, if at all.

If you take time to look at Ukrainian girls' faces and bodies, IMO you'll notice that often all that separates a plain Jane 7 from a stunning 9 is upscale clothing, a decent hairdresser, a tan and some other forms of decoration and maintenance. The faces and bodies are often quite uniform. It's no surprise that most models were once plain-looking dumpy country girls with good bone structure that somebody "discovered" and glammed up.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]In addition to that, despite all the talk of sponsored girls etc., the vast majority of girls lead fairly simple, boring lives... and go to clubs maybe once of month, if at all.

If you take time to look at Ukrainian girls' faces and bodies, IMO you'll notice that often all that separates a plain Jane 7 from a stunning 9 is upscale clothing, a decent hairdresser, a tan and some other forms of decoration and maintenance. The faces and bodies are often quite uniform. It's no surprise that most models were once plain-looking dumpy country girls with good bone structure that somebody "discovered" and glammed up.[/QUOTE]

Yep Yep...

I noticed that too, very plain, no makeup, pants mostly, no mini's really nothing fancy. That's because the average wage doesn't allow it.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]That is the stigma.

I don't always go for the super skinny ones DJ4$, depends on my mood. Sometimes I like a bit more tit and ass.Just curious, where do you think it is better?[/QUOTE]Let's say you stay in Kiev 7 days to bed a 7 and you spend 2300 euro(plane tickets included) for all the dating(with girls you bang or not).

So the index becomes quality(7) x number(1)/money spent(2300) x time(7 days).You divide the money by 1000 to get a result without zeros.So you have:

7 x 1/ 2,3 x 7.The index is 1/2.3 or 0.4.

Let's say you travel to another place where you bang an 8 and a 7 and you spend 1600 euro for one week.The index becomes: (8 x 1)+(7x1)/1.6 x 7.

It is 15/11.2 or 1.3.

So the index can triple if you travel to another place and get these results.

In my opinion the normal index for Kiev by this method is 0.4-0.8 depending on
monger.For example if you need to travel more than one time to bang a girl you met before,then you have to calculate 2 or more plane tickets in expenses,so the index lowers.

From my experience there are 2-3 ukrainian cities where the index is better than in Kiev and I strongly suspect 1-2 belarus cities as well.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]In addition to that, despite all the talk of sponsored girls etc., the vast majority of girls lead fairly simple, boring lives... and go to clubs maybe once of month, if at all.

If you take time to look at Ukrainian girls' faces and bodies, IMO you'll notice that often all that separates a plain Jane 7 from a stunning 9 is upscale clothing, a decent hairdresser, a tan and some other forms of decoration and maintenance. The faces and bodies are often quite uniform. It's no surprise that most models were once plain-looking dumpy country girls with good bone structure that somebody "discovered" and glammed up.[/QUOTE]I have measured the incidence of attractive girls in Kiev by observations on the street.Independant of clothing,make up etc,based only on phsyical appearance the incidence of attractive girls in Kiev is 1 out of 20.This means that there are about 10000 beautiful girls in Kiev.(Population 2.5 million,half of them women,1/5 of women in age 18-30,1/20 of them attractive).

The proportion of attractive girls in Dnipro for example is 1 out of 30.In Poland it is 1 out of 10 etc.

[QUOTE=DJ FourMoney]Yep Yep...

I noticed that too, very plain, no makeup, pants mostly, no mini's really nothing fancy. That's because the average wage doesn't allow it.[/QUOTE]I don't think it is wage... Ukrainian girls spend what little money they have on things that make them look good. They'd rather starve than not have anything to wear. Every girl has a mini in her closet... and can get dolled up decently if she has too. Still there is a big difference between being professionally styled (expensively) and doing it yourself. Often that's the superficial difference between girls in elite clubs and restuarants and more average ones. Just my personal impression.

The main reason you see mostly average girls on the street is because most girls ARE average. Average looking, average dreams, average motivation. Once you've been in EE for a while and the WOW factor wears off, you notice that by no means are all Ukr girls hot. Before I get flamed, that isn't to say that Ukr girls and their Slavic sisters aren't on average hotter than almost any other girls on the planet overall... they are, at least for those who like white girls.

[quote=doctor_skank]i don't think it is wage... ukrainian girls spend what little money they have on things that make them look good. they'd rather starve than not have anything to wear. every girl has a mini in her closet... and can get dolled up decently if she has too. still there is a big difference between being professionally styled (expensively) and doing it yourself. often that's the superficial difference between girls in elite clubs and restuarants and more average ones. just my personal impression.

the main reason you see mostly average girls on the street is because most girls are average. average looking, average dreams, average motivation. once you've been in ee for a while and the wow factor wears off, you notice that by no means are all ukr girls hot. before i get flamed, that isn't to say that ukr girls and their slavic sisters aren't on average hotter than almost any other girls on the planet overall... they are, at least for those who like white girls.[/quote]

there was never a "wow" factor to wear off, i had already been in norway and sweden and throughly impressed.

i agree among "white women" scandinavia and fsu have the rest of the world beat hands down, its not even a competition.

who would flame you?

anybody that has been a few places would know that while slavic women are hot, they tend to be very thin, have flat butts and most of the time, generally no curves at all. some caucasian guys especially those from europe tend to like that look. american taste tend to vary from person to person as our mixed heritage creates some interesting and attractive women and shapes our taste in women.

i can appreciate the typically attractive slavic woman. in a way its sexy, while elegant and graceful especially with tall women. they are tight and taut, many american women that thin are skanky and mousy.

scandinavians tend to be more my speed as i am a "tit" man firstly and an "ass" man secondly and while "ass" is harder to find in say norway, its not impossible.

nobody has ass like latinas or black women its not even up for discussion but i think people confuse that erotic sexy look with "cheap" and "dirty" and that's too bad.

i still think sao paulo or at the least the southern part of brasil is the best of both worlds, strictly based on photo submissions on isg of course - :d

I think this is my last time, for this year or more, in Kiev. I will upload a nice picture of my favourite girl, when I will come back home. I have a lot of things to think about at my home.

I am here just to write: I have fear! Every Slavic person can be a wolf hidden in a lamb.

Some strange and bad things are happened in these last days. For example, I discovered that, that taxi driver who I thought he was my friend, instead he is strongly connected with prostitution management. And some more different bad things.

How can foreigners trust in these people when these people can suddendly become their own killers? I have fear!

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]I think this is my last time, for this year or more, in Kiev. I will upload a nice picture of my favourite girl, when I will come back home. I have a lot of things to think about at my home.

I am here just to write: I have fear! Every Slavic person can be a wolf hidden in a lamb.

Some strange and bad things are happened in these last days. For example, I discovered that, that taxi driver who I thought he was my friend, instead he is strongly connected with prostitution management. And some more different bad things.

How can foreigners trust in these people when these people can suddendly become their own killers? I have fear![/QUOTE]

I am not sure where you are from Acolonizer......... by the looks of your post your own island somewhere perhaps?
Taxi driver connected to legal wrong doings? every major city in the world my friend is just the same.
Every slavic a wolf in sheeps clothing? perhaps you should come off your island more its a dog eat dog world out there again not just in Kiev, its the same in England, USA and other non EE countries.
Killers? why would they want to kill you when they can just steal from you instead.
For me Ukraine is very safe compared to western countries, and I feel far safer walking around here at night than I ever do in other places in the world.
Please I feel your post is a over reaction to a country that has so much to offer and you make it sound like hell on earth! wake up smell the coffee, and get out more ;)

[QUOTE=Hecker](Population 2.5 million,half of them women,1/5 of women in age 18-30,1/20 of them attractive).[/QUOTE]I'd find more than 1 out of 20 girls aged 18-30 that I would fuck, probably more like 1 out of 10. Then again, I'm usually downtown and the numbers of hot chicks is higher. In clubs or glam places it's even higher.

Go to the right club and it's 25% very doable. Maybe my 25% wouldn't correspond to yours. Thankfully tastes vary.

Somedays when my testosterone levels are up, I'd probably do just about any one of them if the body was ok. Or maybe I'm just a perv.[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Some strange and bad things are happened in these last days. For example, I discovered that, that taxi driver who I thought he was my friend, instead he is strongly connected with prostitution management. And some more different bad things.

How can foreigners trust in these people when these people can suddendly become their own killers? I have fear![/QUOTE]I wouldn't trust a taxi driver, period. Just like I would never really trust a *****.

Use them, be friendly with them, have a small "relationship" with them... sure. But trust them? No way.

Use some common sense Acol... taxi drivers, *****s, lawyers, bookies, bartenders. They just want your money. Treat it as a service industry... you pay a fee and get some service from them, whether it's a trip to an airport, some numbers of girls, faster drinks at the bar or in the case of a pro, some faux-passion and affection. If the price and service is OK, everybody's happy.

Ooohhh, these are very wise and friendly words: thank you! Yes, I live in a countryside area near Venice and, until some years ago, here was a paradise in comparison of metropolitanean areas.

I worked in London for about six months but I don't remember these situations happenned.

Yes, you are right, maybe I am from an island and now I am very shocked about how many filthing situations that I see in this "civilized" world. John Lennon sang "No hell, no heaven, just living" but in my humble opinion, the Earth is the real hell. Yes, you are right, no feelings for prostitutes, but it is hard for me because I don't make difference among "regular" girls and prostitutes and I am always used to have an human relationship with people.

Some years ago, I came out from my paradise and I discovered there is no human relationship, just the "advantage" is the lord in every kind of relationships, in business relationships, in family relationships, in social relationships, in religious relationships, etc.

Yes, you all are right, but it was better the people were human and not as any other things to throw away in the litter bin when there is no "advantage".

Bye bye.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Use some common sense Acol. Taxi drivers, *****s, lawyers, bookies, bartenders. They just want your money. Treat it as a service industry. You pay a fee and get some service from them, whether it's a trip to an airport, some numbers of girls, faster drinks at the bar or in the case of a pro, some faux-passion and affection. If the price and service is OK, everybody's happy.[/QUOTE]

Headed back to Kyiv next month for the first time in a two years. I am somewhat surprised that the crazy inflation isn't having some sort of impact on the local girl mentality, at least as reported here. From what I've read, the rate has been somewhere around 15-18%!

I know very little about economics but I can rationalize two outcomes:

Inflation makes everything more expensive so providers charge more.

Inflation makes everything more expensive so providers become more willing to dip below their asking price.

Anyone seeing any impact in the scene, or even in day-to-day commerce?

Zizz

Zizz, prices are higher.

AC - from reading your latest message I can only assume it's your first day reading this forum, welcome.

[QUOTE=Zizz Bang]Headed back to Kyiv next month for the first time in a two years. I am somewhat surprised that the crazy inflation isn't having some sort of impact on the local girl mentality, at least as reported here. From what I've read, the rate has been somewhere around 15-18%!

I know very little about economics but I can rationalize two outcomes:

Inflation makes everything more expensive so providers charge more.

Inflation makes everything more expensive so providers become more willing to dip below their asking price.

Anyone seeing any impact in the scene, or even in day-to-day commerce?

Zizz[/QUOTE]I think Helena Moscow has provided an aspect of inflation on escorts' prices from an escort point of view which I find interesting.

She claimed that as the wages for the workers are adjusted in a level that allows them to buy the means for their survival,so that their working power remains intact,the same are adjusted for working girls.

That is pros have to get more when inflation increases in order to sustain their working power.In case of escorts this is translated into buying cosmetics,having plastic surgeries,buying make up,clothes etc as being able to pay rent and afford all daily expenses,so when the inflation drives prices up,escorts' prices have to go up as well.

Of course this style of thinking is purely marxistic descending from communist times but may explain how slavic escorts view themselves and their demands as high maintenance.

Saint words! Not only about prostitutes (their correct name) but in general about all FSU peoples. Besides, they think to be always poor even when they earn like western people and they think all western people are billionaires.

[QUOTE=Hecker]Of course this style of thinking is purely marxistic descending from communist times but may explain how slavic escorts view themselves and their demands as high maintenance.[/QUOTE]

I see these girls on several sites, but no reviews. Anybody had one?:

[url]http://www.escort-models.kiev.ua/Masha-dosug-prostitutki-Minet-glubokij-intim-uslugi-dosug.715.html[/url]
[url]http://www.escort-models.kiev.ua/Bozhena-foto-prostitutok-Seks-klassicheskij-intim-dosug-prostitutki.338.html[/url]
[url]http://www.escort-models.kiev.ua/Dinara-shlyuha-Striptiz-ne-profi-intim-ukrainy.530.html[/url]
[url]http://www.escort-models.kiev.ua/Nastya-deshevye-prostitutki-kieva-Zolot.-dozhd-vydacha-kiev-intim.617.html[/url]
[url]http://www.escort-models.kiev.ua/Anzhelochka-prostitutki-anketa-Legkaya-dominaciya-intim-uslugi-kiev.701.html[/url]
[url]http://www.escort-models.kiev.ua/-Alesya-prostitutki-dorogo-Seks-klassicheskij-eroticheskij-massazh-intim.690.html[/url]
[url]http://www.escort-models.kiev.ua/Evgeniya-seks-bez-znakomstva-Seks-analnyj-v-ukraine.369.html[/url]
[url]http://www.escort-models.kiev.ua/Natasha-individualki-deshevye-Strapon-predlagayu-intim.653.html[/url]
[url]http://www.escort-models.kiev.ua/Snezhanna-nomer-prostitutki-Massazh-Klassicheskij-intim-uslugi-kiev.116.html[/url]

Sorry I know its a long list, but I plan on the attempt to fuck a minimum of ten women on this trip. If I can handle it....

I am planning my first trip to Kiev mid August and would appreciate any assistance I can get.

Would it be a good time to make the trip given it is the middle of Summer?

Would it be worth my while to travel to Odessa?

Thank you in advance.

JC

Funny question! I hope I don't repeat this for thousands times!

They are usually all well organized "agencies". For example, you phone a receptionist, for example Masha, and after Masha talks about your call to her manageress and after her manageress decides which girl to send to you. Girls are usually very unprofessional girls, very low quality services and very high prices and very low respect of you. You are one more chicken to pluck.

You can choice three options:

- to pay 100$ and more for something similar to fuck a plastic doll;
- to save 100$ and more masturbating yourself;
- to look for a long-time prostitute, she will be a real porn actress and she won't be expensive.

In specific, I collected about 50 phone numbers from several sites like yours and I discovered all "agencies" are just hunters of chickens. The same about River Palace and main discos in Kiev. The same about sex services offered by foreigner firms. Ukrainian, American, Italian, etc. sex activities for foreigners are just hunters of chickens (understand, Cruiser D?)

In my personal experience, I found two harcore prostitutes, incredible things because they had nice face, perfect body, extreme sex and honest prices. Unfortunately, they had a very bad character and, like all prostitutes, soon or late, they will disappear.

I am sure I was lucky to find them because it is not easy to find incredible things.

[QUOTE=Horny29]I see these girls on several sites, but no reviews. Anybody had one?:

[url]http://www.escort-models.kiev.ua/Masha-dosug-prostitutki-Minet-glubokij-intim-uslugi-dosug.715.html[/url]
[url]http://www.escort-models.kiev.ua/Bozhena-foto-prostitutok-Seks-klassicheskij-intim-dosug-prostitutki.338.html[/url]
[url]http://www.escort-models.kiev.ua/Dinara-shlyuha-Striptiz-ne-profi-intim-ukrainy.530.html[/url]
[url]http://www.escort-models.kiev.ua/Nastya-deshevye-prostitutki-kieva-Zolot.-dozhd-vydacha-kiev-intim.617.html[/url]
[url]http://www.escort-models.kiev.ua/Anzhelochka-prostitutki-anketa-Legkaya-dominaciya-intim-uslugi-kiev.701.html[/url]
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Sorry I know its a long list, but I plan on the attempt to fuck a minimum of ten women on this trip. If I can handle it....[/QUOTE][size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]

Sometimes you need to be able to offer the girl something more besides money.

You need to be able to recognize a girl who will not provide you with a good time. And you must be able and willing to walk (run away from her).

I never had anything but fantastic sex with the girls I brought home from RP at $100-$200. But I also remembering bickering with a girl for half the taxi ride back to my place. When we finally got here I gave the driver 50uah (this was 2005) and shut the door in the girl's face. You have to be willing to do that too. Otherwise you are just being lead around by your penis and you will have one bad time after another. Remember the girls in the places you go to are PROFESSIONALS, the hard core ones will recognize you as a mark and take advantage of you. Understand whom you are interested in and more importantly who will be interested in you. Some nights you will be going home alone but as you may have finally figured out it's better then having a bad time and being taken advantage of.

Allow me to very highly commend Cruiser D's thoughts on Monger discipline.

Short and to the point.

Sometimes we (me) forget some of what should be the Golden Rules of Mongerdom due to being distracted by the heavy whiff of estrogen.

Treat them all with respect going in.

Don't get jerked around and thank them by doing repeats for excellent service levels.

The most effective way to deal with lack of respect from the "other side" and poor service levels is to haul back and wallop them where it hurts most - in the pocket book - and send them away with a smile and explanation from the bar or from the hotel/apartment before starting the session. If the session has started and the service is not up to what was contracted for then again, smile, explanation is detail and if not immediately made up to your satisfaction, out the door they go with the previously agreed payment and clear instructions that there will not be a repeat.

Thre is no shame in retiring home alone when out playing. It doesn't mean you are a loser simply that you are a discerning monger.

Cruiser D's words could be printed on a small visiting card for Mongers to retain and hand out to new arrivals to the Hobby.

Thanks Cruiser D.



[QUOTE=Cruiser D]Sometimes you need to be able to offer the girl something more besides money.

You need to be able to recognize a girl who will not provide you with a good time. And you must be able and willing to walk (run away from her).

I never had anything but fantastic sex with the girls I brought home from RP at $100-$200. But I also remembering bickering with a girl for half the taxi ride back to my place. When we finally got here I gave the driver 50uah (this was 2005) and shut the door in the girl's face. You have to be willing to do that too. Otherwise you are just being lead around by your penis and you will have one bad time after another. Remember the girls in the places you go to are PROFESSIONALS, the hard core ones will recognize you as a mark and take advantage of you. Understand whom you are interested in and more importantly who will be interested in you. Some nights you will be going home alone but as you may have finally figured out it's better then having a bad time and being taken advantage of.[/QUOTE]

Allow me to very highly commend Cruiser D's thoughts on Monger discipline.

Short and to the point.

Sometimes we (me) forget some of what should be the Golden Rules of Mongerdom due to being distracted by the heavy whiff of estrogen.

Treat them all with respect going in.

Don't get jerked around and thank them by doing repeats for excellent service levels.

The most effective way to deal with lack of respect from the "other side" and poor service levels is to haul back and wallop them where it hurts most - in the pocket book - and send them away with a smile and explanation from the bar or from the hotel/apartment before starting the session. If the session has started and the service is not up to what was contracted for then again, smile, explanation is detail and if not immediately made up to your satisfaction, out the door they go with the previously agreed payment and clear instructions that there will not be a repeat.

Thre is no shame in retiring home alone when out playing. It doesn't mean you are a loser simply that you are a discerning monger.

Cruiser D's words could be printed on a small visiting card for Mongers to retain and hand out to new arrivals to the Hobby. Applicable in almost every situation and country.

Thanks Cruiser D.



[QUOTE=Cruiser D]Sometimes you need to be able to offer the girl something more besides money.

You need to be able to recognize a girl who will not provide you with a good time. And you must be able and willing to walk (run away from her).

I never had anything but fantastic sex with the girls I brought home from RP at $100-$200. But I also remembering bickering with a girl for half the taxi ride back to my place. When we finally got here I gave the driver 50uah (this was 2005) and shut the door in the girl's face. You have to be willing to do that too. Otherwise you are just being lead around by your penis and you will have one bad time after another. Remember the girls in the places you go to are PROFESSIONALS, the hard core ones will recognize you as a mark and take advantage of you. Understand whom you are interested in and more importantly who will be interested in you. Some nights you will be going home alone but as you may have finally figured out it's better then having a bad time and being taken advantage of.[/QUOTE]

I agree about a night alone instead of wasting money.

But there are some heavy "but".

The first, we are talking prostitutes.

But do you know prostitutes have sex for money only? But do you know prostitutes' mindset? Do you think, with your charming face and nice cloth, to target more prostitutes or to get from prostitutes? Do you think, more respect you give and more respect you receive?

But these behaviours are just the behaviours that prostitutes want their customers have, because in this way they make you understand who is the real boss: them, the prostitutes.

More charme or respect you have with prostitutes, and more they waste your money and time. In any time you should be ready to break any human relationships (if you can have any human relationships, of course).

I can't repeat what I detailed described in my previous posts.

But a typical example is: it is years and years a prostitute makes swallow blowjobs from everybody (ugly, old, dirty and drug addicted, all! ) for 200 grivnas. One day she will come with you for a classy meeting, before in a restaurant or disco (paid by you) and after in your apartment. She pretends to be a tender girl and she asks 300 dollars for a night with you, no swallow blowjobs, why? Because she never made them and it is dangerous for health. But do you really think it is better to have charme or respect?

"""Treat them all with respect going in.

Don't get jerked around and thank them by doing repeats for excellent service levels.

The most effective way to deal with lack of respect from the "other side" and poor service levels is to haul back and wallop them where it hurts most. In the pocket book. And send them away with a smile and explanation from the bar or from the hotel/apartment before starting the session. If the session has started and the service is not up to what was contracted for then again, smile, explanation is detail and if not immediately made up to your satisfaction, out the door they go with the previously agreed payment and clear instructions that there will not be a repeat. """

A lot of "but" here, too.

One more typical example.

The girl comes to you flat. It is better to see her naked: didn't you get any bad surprises when she has undressed? Tits A---, fat waist or cellulited legs, etc. And in this way, you can verify her real age, too: you say 22 but your body says 28. Or maybe, do you believe in pictures on Internet?

Then, you negotiate services: yes, no, yes, no. (Did you never understand why the first hour is the most expensive? ) She makes a protected blowjob, no deep throath. You blame, you like deep throat (at least), because deep throat is a real sex. But she can't (doesn't want). Then you try to fuck her vaginally. Therefore she wides her legs, just a plastic doll. (But why does nobody, in this forum, remember a fuck is good when the vaginal muscles are tighted around the penis? )

At last, you are not satisfied for services negotiated, before she said she is good and she makes some services and, instead, after she didn't make any good services but she is just very good to waste time with sigarettes, showers and phone calls. What will you do? "I am not satisfied, go home! "? She will pretend to be sad or angry with you but, just out the building, she will smile and phone her padruska about the new chicken.

No, wrong way! Why don't you remember when you buy, for example, a household appliance. If this appliance doesn't work or fire your house, what do you do? Do you go back to the shop and do you say "I won't buy anything again here! "? (And the shop manager answers "Don't worry, I have two thousands chickens for the same applaince. ")

I can continue for hours, this is the real world. There are too many people excited for an easy fuck. A fuck doesn't always mean sex. In fact sex is an art. And mongering means cheating women more than women cheating men, this is the eternal sex war.

In my opinion the general attitude of a girl,whether freebie or pro is the same to every man regardless of his appearance.This is the general attitude.The fine details of her attitude are shaped by his appearance and behaviour.

What do I mean?
Let's take three hypothetical customers
1.One is young,good looking and has decent behaviour
2.The other is middle aged,average looking and has normal behaviour
3.The thirld is old,bad looking and has shitty behaviour
How will a pro react in this hypothetical example?

We take three pros
1.One is young,good looking and has decent behaviour
2.One is middle aged,average looking and has normal behaviour
3.One is old,bad looking and has shitty behaviour

Let's say the guy no.1 meets pro no.1.The result will be excellent combination of sex with value for money.
Let's say guy no.2 meets pro no.1.The result will be satsisfactory sex with good value for money
Let's say guy no.3 meets pro no.1.The result will be average sex with normal value for money.

Let's see what happens when guy no.1 meets pro no.3.The result is total disappointment.
Also when guy no.2 meets pro no.3,the result is shitty.
And then guy no.3 does not do any better with pro no.3 than the rest of the guys.

So the pros' general attitude is very important,because it will decide their response to each category of clients.
The fine details of the pros' attitudes(which play major role in the ideal case of pro) are determined by the individual guys' characteristics.
So if sb claims that in general only the guy's attitude determines everything,this is not right.But if he says that guy's attitude is irrelevant,it is also false.

To get the best out of pros,one has to search a lot and especially pay attention to their phone personality.Their attitude on phone is similar to what he will encounter(except from some very experienced gold diggers).
What is true for pros is also true for freebies.

AC, I keep it simple and I've never had a problem in Kiev. You make it complex and you seem to have nothing but problems.

Sometimes you need to realize when you are having nothing but problems the problems may lay with you and you may need to change the way you approach things.

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]I can continue for hours ...[/QUOTE]Please don't.

AC:

I've had both good and bad experiences with pros and although every once and a while you end up with one who is simply a dud (and you didn't notice this until you'd paid the mamachka/pimp), in most cases performance has been good to excellent.

When the performance was bad or when I didn't really have a great time it was usually MY own fault, meaning I was too tired, too drunk, in a bad mood, undermotivated or whatever.

I find that pros feed off of my vibe even more than I do theirs... so bringing the right fun, happy yet assertive attitude to the bedroom is a key to getting your money's worth and enjoying yourself.

If things aren't optimal for me, I generally don't use a pro and just go home alone.

By the way, one thing I never do in EE is whack off/masturbate. That's a sin and violates the Monger Code of Conduct. I'll bet you are all very happy I provided you with the visual image.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]AC:

I've had both good and bad experiences with pros and although every once and a while you end up with one who is simply a dud (and you didn't notice this until you'd paid the mamachka/pimp), in most cases performance has been good to excellent.

When the performance was bad or when I didn't really have a great time it was usually MY own fault, meaning I was too tired, too drunk, in a bad mood, undermotivated or whatever.

I find that pros feed off of my vibe even more than I do theirs... so bringing the right fun, happy yet assertive attitude to the bedroom is a key to getting your money's worth and enjoying yourself.

If things aren't optimal for me, I generally don't use a pro and just go home alone.

By the way, one thing I never do in EE is whack off/masturbate. That's a sin and violates the Monger Code of Conduct. I'll bet you are all very happy I provided you with the visual image.[/QUOTE]

How could you be wacking off?

I didn't wack for at least 4 months after coming back from Germany, I had enough sex, I was actually tired of it.

You on the other hand, have not only pros but how many GF/Sex Partners?

Maybe 2-3 constant ones right?

So WHY would you wack off? It has nothing to do with SIN or breaking of the Monger Code, you just have a steady supply of Pussy, no reason to wack off.

ME on the other hand its time to make a run for the boarder.... Being in SoCal I can do that - ;)

[QUOTE=DJ FourMoney]How could you be wacking off?

Maybe 2-3 constant ones right?

[/QUOTE]Haha, I don't whack off in EE. It would feel like defeat. I just refered to it because someone (I believe AC) mentioned it would be cheaper to do so than take a pro. Like I said, it's a sin to whack off in EE.

As for how many constant ones, I am not nearly as prolific in Ukraine as Cruiser or some others since my main stomping ground is Russia. I only get to Ukr a couple times a year. Next trip in August to my beloved-hated Odessa.

In Russia, I won't tell you how many "regulars" I have. It's embarassing... over the course of months and years it is pretty easy to assemble a small army of Amazons, nymphs and Amazonettes... :)

Anyway, Kiev is a good city to live and to have fun and I am sure it is less expensive of most European and FSU capital cities.

A lot of tales for fooling yourselves.

1. Money is the most important thing in life: don't waste your money.

2. I believe in master mongers but they are few and they are not a good statistical sample.

3. Women, in general, always do something to get something. Also when they say "love", they think "advantage".

Numbers talk. You go on Internet: which prices you find? I haven't invented them! You phone them and you meet them: which real prices and which real services? I haven't invented them! You go to River Palace or Decadence or Patipa or somewhere else, which prices and which prices you find? I haven't invented them! These are just numbers, big numbers, not opinions, and they show what is the real situation.

I know most men, too. When they need a fuck, they are in a weak situation that everything is good. A lot of "I was happy of that fuck. " mean "I can't say to myself that fuck doesn't worth its price. ".

I thank Doctor Skank because he talks wise and humble. I thank Hecker for his deep scientific approach. But they are master mongers, not common people.

About my previous examples, I found those situations almost all times. And I talk about just what I saw and I heard.

About good appearance for getting good sex, I saw with my own eyes, twenty year old Ukrainian prostitutes, in Italy, prefer over-sixty year old men, instead of a thirty/fourty because he pays 10 euros more (I say 10, not 100). Try to think those prostitutes made swallow blowjobs, without any cleanings, to sixty year old men and, then, try to explain to me why I have to spend money to be charming when, at the same time, no charming men get more than me. I think this is a normal situation.

I repeat the situation in Kiev:. Unprotected sex is normal and swallow blowjobs are normal for Ukrainians. Girls say the opposite because they like to fraud foreigners.. Also now, price for two hours of a good all sex session is 120/130 dollars. You could sometimes find a very talented girl and give her a tip. Instead the market for foreigners demands 100/120 dollars for the first hour and offers a low quality service.

Anyway, Kiev is a good city to live and to have fun and I am sure it is less expensive of most European and FSU capital cities.

[quote=acolonizer]anyway, kiev is a good city to live and to have fun and i am sure it is less expensive of most european and fsu capital cities.

a lot of tales for fooling yourselves.

1. money is the most important thing in life: don't waste your money.

2. i believe in master mongers but they are few and they are not a good statistical sample.

3. women, in general, always do something to get something. also when they say "love", they think "advantage".

numbers talk. you go on internet: which prices you find? i haven't invented them! you phone them and you meet them: which real prices and which real services? i haven't invented them! you go to river palace or decadence or patipa or somewhere else, which prices and which prices you find? i haven't invented them! these are just numbers, big numbers, not opinions, and they show what is the real situation.

i know most men, too. when they need a fuck, they are in a weak situation that everything is good. a lot of "i was happy of that fuck. " mean "i can't say to myself that fuck doesn't worth its price. ".

i thank doctor skank because he talks wise and humble. i thank hecker for his deep scientific approach. but they are master mongers, not common people.

about my previous examples, i found those situations almost all times. and i talk about just what i saw and i heard.

about good appearance for getting good sex, i saw with my own eyes, twenty year old ukrainian prostitutes, in italy, prefer over-sixty year old men, instead of a thirty/fourty because he pays 10 euros more (i say 10, not 100). try to think those prostitutes made swallow blowjobs, without any cleanings, to sixty year old men and, then, try to explain to me why i have to spend money to be charming when, at the same time, no charming men get more than me. i think this is a normal situation.

i repeat the situation in kiev:. unprotected sex is normal and swallow blowjobs are normal for ukrainians. girls say the opposite because they like to fraud foreigners.. also now, price for two hours of a good all sex session is 120/130 dollars. you could sometimes find a very talented girl and give her a tip. instead the market for foreigners demands 100/120 dollars for the first hour and offers a low quality service.

anyway, kiev is a good city to live and to have fun and i am sure it is less expensive of most european and fsu capital cities.[/quote]kiev is the 23rd capital in the world in terms of prices i think.it is close to southern european eu countries.

i do not consider myself a master monger,i am just used on having very limited time,so i do everything in high speed.maybe i am good in limited time conditions because this is what i have to cope up with.

the point is to be able to pull if you are in a new place,have no contacts at all and have maximum 4 days to stay.if you can pull,the place is good.if you cannot get a girl to hotel in these 4 days,the place is not the best,there are better places.
i went to germany and got two girlfriends in 4 days.because i am experienced and know where to search.people who pick up with me say they lose me because i am very fast.i kiss girls and they eat in restaurants waiting for me.

the whole point if you have limited time is to be always in the move,have a lquid plan which you change constantly.

for example you have 10 internet contacts,you meet them,you have to judge quickly and eliminate the ones which will not lead to fast sex because they are a waste of time.you have to decide in the first 30 minutes of the date and build the strategy.so you need logistics.

a lot of lays is lost due to bad logistics.women have no idea about them and make things worse all the time.how to meet,attract,isolate,lay,you have always to estimate the time needed,so you need to be experienced in logistics.because if you lose one day courting a girl which at the end gets away,you will have lost the chance to meet and bed another one.

so limited time approach needs speed,thinking before things happen(expecting the unexpected and being able to deal with it) and good logistics.

when you have everything inside your head you become robotic and spit your stuff.it is like the driver who sees the road and makes a forecast about what is going to happen with the other cars instead of thinking if his leg is on brake etc which is done by the inexperienced driver.

if you exercise,you will find yourself more thinking about logistics and doing natural callibration of girls' responses than what you actually tell them.

Please help.

What is the difference between AdultFriendFinder.com and AsianFriendFinder.com?

Which is more helpful?

Does somebody know where she is now? Maybe her name is Vika Victoria. Does somebody know how I can contact her? Please, help!

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]In Russia, I won't tell you how many "regulars" I have. It's embarassing... over the course of months and years it is pretty easy to assemble a small army of Amazons, nymphs and Amazonettes... :)[/QUOTE]Don't you have the problem TO manage that army without mutinies?

That's the problem in my opinion!

Of course we like to change girls, but it's an hard job to keep the "old ones" calm: they become jealous, possessive and so on.

I am talking about normal girls, of course, not about pro.

[QUOTE=Assimil]don't you have the problem TO manage that army without mutinies?
:)

that's the problem in my opinion!

of course we like to change girls, but it's an hard job to keep the "old ones"
calm: they become jealous, possessive and so on...

I am talking about normal girls, of course, not about pro[/QUOTE]Surprisingly enough it isn't difficult to manage at all. In fact, I don't even try... it manages itself.

I don't have any serious jealousy/possession issues. Perhaps because I simply won't accept it and they know that I cannot be possessed. Trying to do so is the quickest way to get me to leave. Leaving is the quickest way (in most cases) to have them come chase you.

Of the existing contacts, of course some get lost over the years, many marry or enter serious relationships. Some get bored or disappointed with a casual one with me. It surprises me however how many, the majority actually, are satisfied with occasional contact, some pleasant SMSs, some mild romance and an afternoon, evening or night of sex.

Since I am always need the thrill of finding new girls, the list of contacts has gotten very long. It's impossible to maintain all relationships, but thankfully most of the relationships require very little maintenance.

Many of them still live with their parents even into their mid-20s, meaning they cannot spend the night during the week. Older Russians/Ukrainians are very conservative in this respect, the fathers much more than the mothers. This is great, since it means my nights are free to call up one of those that lives alone or with a girlfriend to come over and spend the night or have a midnight meeting.

A few have married millionaires and "almost" millionaires (seriously) and are looking to become baby factories. We maintain contact but in MOST cases nothing sexual is going on even though they lament about missing passion in their lives.

Of the unmarried, some of them mutiny, or simply fade away. Many come back, usually when in between boyfriends or when they've gotten bored with him. A lot of girls cheat on their boyfriends/husbands. A lot. It's sobering. Can't decide if they are evil for doing it or if they are just so unfulfilled in their relationships that they have to. I don't question it, but some of them insist on talking about it.

It is a self-managing system and I only make a "big" effort to maintain relations with a select few that I had a very special connection with.

Of the others, it really isn't that difficult, but unfortunately sometimes I can't mentally keep track of them all. Beyond the beauty and the sex, they are simply great girls. Warm, smart, witty and sexy. With every victory there is somewhere a loss, at least in human, emotional terms.

Help! I need a nice 'wing man' to keep Dasha company. She is from another city and coming to see her friend (my friend) here in Kyiv. Both 21. Speak good english, Dasha is quite nice, real blonde, sweet and best of all VERY FREE! (as in no $$)

Now I haven't 'beded' either, but if you have the apartment we can use for a small party (I live with ' O ', so I can't) WE have a 90% chance of scoring!

Let me know if you are up for it? Looking at Friday or Saturday night!

LS

Are there more ISG members living in parts of Russia or the Ukraine? An early retirement in Odessa flickers in my brain once in a while.

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Does somebody know where she is now? Maybe her name is Vika Victoria. Does somebody know how I can contact her? Please, help![/QUOTE]

Usually she is on [url]www.flirt.com.ua[/url] she is not from Kiev but guess from Zhitomyr (saw her there too).

Tied once, but when I saw her in reality I stepped down, she must be 30 or so and she ads as 18-22 or so...

Asked for 300 USD/night anal included

The pic must be 5 or 6 years old at least!!!


IT

Hi All,

Can anybody tell me whether Hotel Lubid is girl friendly?

Also do they have thier own girls there?

Cheers,

Crompton

Lybid hotel is gf, but you have to either book a double room right from the start or pay the girls stay and have her sign in.

FORGET the girls in house, they are shit!

Did someone make experiences with this service?

[url]http://escort-models.kiev.ua/en-kiev-escorts-girls-gallary.html#start[/url]

It seems to me as a fake, but the girls look hot and the prices are payable.

Where were you 3 weeks ago?? :)

I'd help you out, but I'm stuck in Luxemboring.



[QUOTE=LifeSavour]Help! I need a nice 'wing man' to keep Dasha company. She is from another city and coming to see her friend (my friend) here in Kyiv. Both 21. Speak good english, Dasha is quite nice, real blonde, sweet and best of all VERY FREE! (as in no $$)

Now I haven't 'beded' either, but if you have the apartment we can use for a small party (I live with ' O ', so I can't) WE have a 90% chance of scoring!

Let me know if you are up for it? Looking at Friday or Saturday night!

LS[/QUOTE]

So Brandon, how was Kyiv?

And yes Gesteo you have about zero chance of the girls in the pictures on that website showing up.

I was in Kiev end of June for 5 days.

First off things here are not cheap anymore in Kiev and there is a hotel shortage and you will pay exorbitant prices for good hotel of which there are only a handful (Hyatt $967/night, Radisson $639/night). Best alternative is renting apartment.

The short term p4p may not be worth coming here for. While there are some attractive escort girls around they charge very high prices ($300/hour).

I did experience a nice place for erotic massage Rakuena (US $80 for 1 hour). However it is difficult to find even with the address and a map. There are no signs when you arrive and not many people speak good enough English to help out. (It always turned into a hassle when trying to find something in Kiev)

One thing I really liked about Kiev is it is a beautiful city and the weather was really nice while I was there. Also there are plenty of excellent places to eat (restaurants, bakeries, fine teas, etc.)

Conclusion--would not be on my top ten lists to visit. Better places around and they need put afew more signs in English and build plenty more hotels.

[QUOTE=Horn Hiyo]I was in Kiev end of June for 5 days.

First off things here are not cheap anymore in Kiev and there is a hotel shortage and you will pay exorbitant prices for good hotel of which there are only a handful (Hyatt $967/night, Radisson $639/night). Best alternative is renting apartment.

The short term p4p may not be worth coming here for. While there are some attractive escort girls around they charge very high prices ($300/hour).

I did experience a nice place for erotic massage Rakuena (US $80 for 1 hour). However it is difficult to find even with the address and a map. There are no signs when you arrive and not many people speak good enough English to help out. (It always turned into a hassle when trying to find something in Kiev)

One thing I really liked about Kiev is it is a beautiful city and the weather was really nice while I was there. Also there are plenty of excellent places to eat (restaurants, bakeries, fine teas, etc.)

Conclusion--would not be on my top ten lists to visit. Better places around and they need put afew more signs in English and build plenty more hotels.[/QUOTE]
Good post, perhaps many readers of this forum need to understand Ukraine is not Benidorm, Blackpool, LA, Miama or Sydney and will not be for the foreseable future!
I am not an authourity on Kiev or many cities in Ukraine, but having lived here in the Ukraine for a few years beware and understand, this is a developing country and unless you understand Russian/Ukrainian!! You will struggle to communicate with many of the people.
Regards to all

Horn, if you had read the forum first you would have learned things haven't been cheap in Kyiv since 2004-2005 (Orange Revolution, Eurovision) but the real ground work for it was laid it 2003 when petro prices took off.

With inflation being rampant in Kyiv/wordwide (and for the Americans, the dollar being so weak) if you are a casual traveler or a sexpat I would write Kyiv off for another two years. When the petro market pops and the Russian/Ukrainian economy collapses then it will be time to start visitng Kyiv as a sexpat again.

Going to Kyiv or Odessa without speaking Russian is fine, you will just find things slightly more difficult. However if you go any place else in Ukraine without some basic to moderate Russian skills you are just wasting your time.

As far as paying $300/hr for a girl in Kyiv. You can get a world class ho in NYC or any first class city for that price. Why would anyone want to subject themselves to Kyiv or Moscow for that price...

Sevastopol, the next time I'm trolling the clubs of that fine city we'll have to meet. :)

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]Horn, if you had read the forum first you would have learned things haven't been cheap in Kyiv since 2004-2005 (Orange Revolution, Eurovision) but the real ground work for it was laid it 2003 when petro prices took off.

With inflation being rampant in Kyiv/wordwide (and for the Americans, the dollar being so weak) if you are a casual traveler or a sexpat I would write Kyiv off for another two years. When the petro market pops and the Russian/Ukrainian economy collapses then it will be time to start visitng Kyiv as a sexpat again.

Going to Kyiv or Odessa without speaking Russian is fine, you will just find things slightly more difficult. However if you go any place else in Ukraine without some basic to moderate Russian skills you are just wasting your time.

As far as paying $300/hr for a girl in Kyiv. You can get a world class ho in NYC or any first class city for that price. Why would anyone want to subject themselves to Kyiv or Moscow for that price...

Sevastopol, the next time I'm trolling the clubs of that fine city we'll have to meet. :)[/QUOTE]

I would agree with all the above, your main reason for going to Kiev if you don't have any contacts ahead of time (which would be stupid) is to find a wife....

For mongering your better off in German FKK's especially if you want to bang Slavic women, there plenty in them and just as pretty and way more affordable.

I would almost say none of the FSS (former soviet states) or Russia are excellent places for mongering for complete newbies and I'm not saying I'm an expert, but having been to Kiev, been offered sex for $150US from a semi-pro to $250US for River Palace cutie, that was more than I was willing to pay and I'm not rich by any measurement.

The [i]Golden Days[/i] are over and running off into unexplored territory (Moldova, Georgia and other "tiny" villages, less known cities) is just a waste of your time and money if you hope to score without any knowledge of the language or a local "guide".

And yes next time RTFF!

Who helps us? This is one more stupid reply that I have received (please, Jackson, in Russian too):

[url]http://flirt.com.ua/anketa.phtml?oid=222174953[/url]

Привет. Я очень интересуюсь, чтобы встретить Вас. :-)
Hi. I am very interested to meet you.

Что и когда конкретно Вам интересно?
What and when are you interested in?

я люблю оральный секс без презерватива
I like oral sex without condom

нет
no

что Вы любите преуспеть?
What are you good at?

Миньет с презервативом, классика, анал, стриптиз, массаж.
300$ - час
500$ - 2 часа
1000$ - ночь
80678960532
blowjob with condom, pussy, ass, strip-tease, massage
300$ - 1 hour
500$ - 2 hours
1000$ - night

I sometimes read prices of prostitutes in Moscow and they seem much much much more cheaper!!! And with a higher quality of sex services!!! Definitely, this is the best way to keep far all foreigners!!!

[QUOTE=Horn Hiyo]I was in Kiev end of June for 5 days.

First off things here are not cheap anymore in Kiev and there is a hotel shortage and you will pay exorbitant prices for good hotel of which there are only a handful (Hyatt $967/night, Radisson $639/night). Best alternative is renting apartment.

The short term p4p may not be worth coming here for. While there are some attractive escort girls around they charge very high prices ($300/hour).

I did experience a nice place for erotic massage Rakuena (US $80 for 1 hour). However it is difficult to find even with the address and a map. There are no signs when you arrive and not many people speak good enough English to help out. (It always turned into a hassle when trying to find something in Kiev)

One thing I really liked about Kiev is it is a beautiful city and the weather was really nice while I was there. Also there are plenty of excellent places to eat (restaurants, bakeries, fine teas, etc.)

Conclusion--would not be on my top ten lists to visit. Better places around and they need put afew more signs in English and build plenty more hotels.[/QUOTE]

I agree the Rakuena is difficult to find, it took me three attempts! You have to follow their instructions exactly as there is no sign. Good once you are there, but little or no contact with masseuse was encouraged other than HJ.

I'll be in Kiev this month, and have found some other massage places on the web:

Angel, 169 Gorky Street
Salon Glamour, Puskinskaja Street
Salon Dolly, Beseina Street

Does anyone have any experiences at these places?

Sorry, I wrote wrong. This is the correct link:

[url]http://flirt.com.ua/Afroditta111/[/url]

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Who helps us? This is one more stupid reply that I have received (please, Jackson, in Russian too):

[url]http://flirt.com.ua/anketa.phtml?oid=222174953[/url]

Привет. Я очень интересуюсь, чтобы встретить Вас. :-)
Hi. I am very interested to meet you.

Что и когда конкретно Вам интересно?
What and when are you interested in?

я люблю оральный секс без презерватива
I like oral sex without condom

нет
no

что Вы любите преуспеть?
What are you good at?

Миньет с презервативом, классика, анал, стриптиз, массаж.
300$ - час
500$ - 2 часа
1000$ - ночь
80678960532
blowjob with condom, pussy, ass, strip-tease, massage
300$ - 1 hour
500$ - 2 hours
1000$ - night

I sometimes read prices of prostitutes in Moscow and they seem much much much more cheaper!!! And with a higher quality of sex services!!! Definitely, this is the best way to keep far all foreigners!!![/QUOTE]

Everything was already said. Use the "search" tool.

[QUOTE=GreenRoamer]I agree the Rakuena is difficult to find, it took me three attempts! You have to follow their instructions exactly as there is no sign. Good once you are there, but little or no contact with masseuse was encouraged other than HJ.

I'll be in Kiev this month, and have found some other massage places on the web:

Angel, 169 Gorky Street
Salon Glamour, Puskinskaja Street
Salon Dolly, Beseina Street

Does anyone have any experiences at these places?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Everything was already said. Use the "search" tool.[/QUOTE]

Actually they do not come in a search, so try checking your facts first. And if "everything was said already" there would seem little point to this forum?

[QUOTE=GreenRoamer]Angel, 169 Gorky Street
Salon Glamour, Puskinskaja Street
Salon Dolly, Beseina Street[/QUOTE]I have been in massagesalon Idzanami (Pushkins’ka 19B, tel. 237 89 26) 1,5 years ago. I suppose it is now called Salon Glamour!

They do the massages in an appartment in a normal appartmentblock. I asked people where can I find this massagesalon: nobody knew:)! I have been there 3 times and had very good massages for a very reasonable price. Beautiful girls and only one girl spoke english ... who cares :)

It is only 300 metres from the metro station Treatral'na, and probably 800 metres from Kreschatyk. Good luck!

I know ukrainians asked for blowjobs and they got them both in salons and stripbars between 200 to 400 GRIVNAS. I have already written some detailed posts. If you are in Kiev for massage and pussy fuck only, please stay at home because you will be disappointed about prices, service quality is decreasing and price level is increasing. In fact, it is one year I try to stop forum readers to pay too much money to girls but nobody listen to me. Now, a stupid pussy fuck for a hour is between 100$-150$, more than in Italy. Add airplane fare and flat rent, (low quality) sex in Kiev costs as in Australia.

Thanks men!

If you didn't understand, Slavic women are famous for their swallow deep throat blowjobs. If you didn't find any girl for that, this means women fraud your money.

[QUOTE=GreenRoamer]Actually they do not come in a search, so try checking your facts first. And if "everything was said already" there would seem little point to this forum?[/QUOTE]

Which strip clubs are these AC?

Hi!

I will be visiting Kiev at the end of the week. I have found a couple of ladies on Flirt.ru looking for sponsorship. The deal: be my "girlfriend" and I will provide financial assistance.

2 of them (20 and 24 yo) are asking for 1500 USD for 3 days (all day), the last one (26 yo) the same price for 5 days.

What do you think about those prices?

I haven't chimed in here for awhile. I've been in Kiev for awhile, so mostly do the local thing - local freebies, as well as some P4P w/Russian speaking only girls, to be found on various websites (much cheaper than RP, but quality not always as good).

In any event - I have a sizable apartment, and a decent database of info (stored in my aging head). If anyone is headed to kiev for a short jaunt, and needs a relatively cheap, 'liberal' place to stay, send me a private message.

Rozan,

The girls posting 'sponsorship' - if you are only in kiev a short while, they aren't really for you. They will want all the money up front, and Ukrainians aren't known for the honesty/service.

You are better off with the one hour straight forward girls on flirt - there are oodles of them, typically around $100/hour. Some good quality, some not.

Yes, saint words! You will meet the lady in person and take her in your flat. Here, you will look at the lady's body very well and you will ask about "services" and you won't be afraid about "embarassing" questions because, as Street Sleuth wrote, "Ukrainians aren't known for the honesty/service". Ask about no-condom blowjobs and anal sex because they are normal sex in all sex meetings. Will the lady reply "niet"? OK, don't worry, say "no respect of me, no money to you" and kick her out the flat. Please, don't worry because we, all forumers, are sure she will provide bad sex and she will waste your money. In this way, you will contribute to decrease girls' prices in Kiev. Otherwise, the next time, you will pay 150$/first hour for an easy pussy fuck.

[QUOTE=Street Sleuth]Rozan,

The girls posting 'sponsorship' - if you are only in kiev a short while, they aren't really for you. They will want all the money up front, and Ukrainians aren't known for the honesty/service.

You are better off with the one hour straight forward girls on flirt - there are oodles of them, typically around $100/hour. Some good quality, some not.[/QUOTE]

AC wow I can see why you are a real hit with the women, jaded to say the least..... you seem to get a shit deal everytime you come to Ukraine why not just stay home and save money? or perhaps you have the same problem at home? bad service? bad girls?
Ever thought your shitty approach rubs the girls up to start? and thats why you are treated in such a way?
I would guess so.
To those in Ukraine for the first or five hundreth time dont take his posts to heart.............. you get out what you put in!
So make the effort and enjoy the times, dont and just stay home!

What about Gia ? It is a long time I saw no report about this agency, back feedbacks or what ? what I like in Gia, you see in advance which services girl provides.

Any other agency we can trust in Kiev about escort girls ?

Spasibo..

Luka, GIA has been covered ad nasuem here. Below average girls at above average prices.

Street, is the apartment a western remodel? Where is it located?

Rozan, you can still sponsor a girl for $1500/month so you tell me if you are getting a good deal at 3 days...

Who are you? One more pimp that advertises here? I know what is "the work" better than you.

Money is the most important matter in life. And women, all kind of women, know that! You are free to be generous with prostitutes, because you are thinking with your own penis, of course.

Approach? Are you joking? OK, we, me too, can be a gentleman. But what do I usually see? When prostitutes need money, they make swallow blowjobs to old and dirty men with no approach, just men say "I want swallow blowjobs, 30 euros". I really laugh when I read that some people dress smart to meet prostitutes. Do you want a prostitute or a wife? The difference is the respect! A prostitute doesn't mind of you at all, you pay her and that's it! You could die one minute later the fuck, on the same bed, and she has already forgotten you: you are crazy, why have men to be a gentleman with prostitutes? Maybe you like to play as a gentleman, but you pay the time to play as a gentleman and not to have sex: good deal, sure!

And about services in Kiev? You come to Italy (and, perhaps, in all over the world) and all Ukrainian prostitutes make no-condom blowjobs. Why? Try to switch your brain on!

[QUOTE=Qjump]AC wow I can see why you are a real hit with the women, jaded to say the least. You seem to get a shit deal everytime you come to Ukraine why not just stay home and save money? Or perhaps you have the same problem at home? Bad service? Bad girls?

Ever thought your shitty approach rubs the girls up to start? And thats why you are treated in such a way?

I would guess so.

To those in Ukraine for the first or five hundreth time don't take his posts to heart. You get out what you put in!

So make the effort and enjoy the times, don't and just stay home! [/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Rozan481]Hi!

I will be visiting Kiev at the end of the week. I have found a couple of ladies on Flirt.ru looking for sponsorship. The deal: be my "girlfriend" and I will provide financial assistance.

2 of them (20 and 24 yo) are asking for 1500 USD for 3 days (all day), the last one (26 yo) the same price for 5 days.

What do you think about those prices?[/QUOTE]To give you a comparison I found a girl which is asking for 100$ per day and 100$ for each of her girlfriends per day.So it is 300$ for 3 girls for the whole day.

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Who are you? One more pimp that advertises here? I know what is "the work" better than you.

Money is the most important matter in life. And women, all kind of women, know that! You are free to be generous with prostitutes, because you are thinking with your own penis, of course.

Approach? Are you joking? OK, we, me too, can be a gentleman. But what do I usually see? When prostitutes need money, they make swallow blowjobs to old and dirty men with no approach, just men say "I want swallow blowjobs, 30 euros". I really laugh when I read that some people dress smart to meet prostitutes. Do you want a prostitute or a wife? The difference is the respect! A prostitute doesn't mind of you at all, you pay her and that's it! You could die one minute later the fuck, on the same bed, and she has already forgotten you: you are crazy, why have men to be a gentleman with prostitutes? Maybe you like to play as a gentleman, but you pay the time to play as a gentleman and not to have sex: good deal, sure!

And about services in Kiev? You come to Italy (and, perhaps, in all over the world) and all Ukrainian prostitutes make no-condom blowjobs. Why? Try to switch your brain on![/QUOTE]

Pimp? Well before we get into a real nasty argument I will not respond to your insult.
I confirm every time I read your posts it’s always negative about Ukraine and how you can’t get bbj and anal sex off all hookers you meet.
If Ukraine is so bad stay home! Don’t come here! It’s really that simple.
Market forces are a thing here….
So you come here spouting real anger towards women here and hookers and you seem to think because you are paying money they should do what you tell them?????
If you want the best out of anyone who works for you there must be a relationship of mutual understanding…… but obviously with your mindset you have never managed a single person…. If you have god help them.
Keep on smiling!!!!!!!!! ;)

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Money is the most important matter in life. And women, all kind of women, know that! You are free to be generous with prostitutes, because you are thinking with your own penis, of course.

Approach? Are you joking? OK, we, me too, can be a gentleman.... Do you want a prostitute or a wife? The difference is the respect! A prostitute doesn't mind of you at all, you pay her and that's it![/QUOTE]
I disagree. I admit I do not have a lot of experience with prostitutes, or P4P as most of us refer to it here, but I think your attitude and approach can make a lot of difference, especially in Ukraine, where there are a lot of relatively "normal" girls hustling for a little extra money. They are not all harden hookers.

Based on my own experience and many of the stories recounted here, I see a lot of evidence that treating a semi-pro well can lead to better treatment in return. Of course there are exceptions and girls who view every guy as a "mark" to be exploited to the max, but there is also a world of working girls out there who will tailor their attitude and service level to suit yours.

Same is true with strippers. Some girls just go through the motions no matter what, but some girls will give you a better time if you treat them well. Same is true with any service profession.

Sure you have to make sure you get what you pay for, but sometimes you also get what you deserve (for better or for worse).

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Who are you? One more pimp that advertises here? I know what is "the work" better than you.

Money is the most important matter in life. And women, all kind of women, know that! You are free to be generous with prostitutes, because you are thinking with your own penis, of course.

Approach? Are you joking? OK, we, me too, can be a gentleman. But what do I usually see? When prostitutes need money, they make swallow blowjobs to old and dirty men with no approach, just men say "I want swallow blowjobs, 30 euros". I really laugh when I read that some people dress smart to meet prostitutes. Do you want a prostitute or a wife? The difference is the respect! A prostitute doesn't mind of you at all, you pay her and that's it! You could die one minute later the fuck, on the same bed, and she has already forgotten you: you are crazy, why have men to be a gentleman with prostitutes? Maybe you like to play as a gentleman, but you pay the time to play as a gentleman and not to have sex: good deal, sure!

And about services in Kiev? You come to Italy (and, perhaps, in all over the world) and all Ukrainian prostitutes make no-condom blowjobs. Why? Try to switch your brain on![/QUOTE]I am rather shocked by this attitude! You are far out and very wrong! My experience are that if you treat girls well, it may be either pros - or specially semipros, the treatment you receive back is much better. If you start pushing them, what you get back is bad. Of course now and then you meet the wrong girl, but if you you think it gets much better by playing tough and strong, then you have missed something important. Treat them like a lady and you get a hot (and sometimes very tender!) sex partner in return. Smile to the world and the world will smile to you!

I always say: it is not important my opinion (or your opinions) but it is important the reality. I reply you all: illusions, just illusions, illusions only.

I know your cases very well. I know what prostitutes think, too.

First of all, I agree approach is important but I add gentleman style is often not good.

I am sure most mongers are gentlemen. If it is true that approach is very important, girls should not raise their prices because this is a way to thank for your gentleman style. Instead, girls continue to raise prices year by year (or quarter by quarter). And you continue to think your gentleman style is good. Ridicolous!

When a man behaves as a gentleman, he shows himself to girls that he can do everything for them. And therefore girls, for their own natural instinct, take advantage of gentlemen in a cynical way. Therefore prices go to the sky.

I did my duty with everybody. If you want to continue to waste your money. that's your right.

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]I always say: it is not important my opinion (or your opinions) but it is important the reality. I reply you all: illusions, just illusions, illusions only.

I know your cases very well. I know what prostitutes think, too.

First of all, I agree approach is important but I add gentleman style is often not good.

I am sure most mongers are gentlemen. If it is true that approach is very important, girls should not raise their prices because this is a way to thank for your gentleman style. Instead, girls continue to raise prices year by year (or quarter by quarter). And you continue to think your gentleman style is good. Ridicolous!

When a man behaves as a gentleman, he shows himself to girls that he can do everything for them. And therefore girls, for their own natural instinct, take advantage of gentlemen in a cynical way. Therefore prices go to the sky.

I did my duty with everybody. If you want to continue to waste your money. that's your right.[/QUOTE]You do not need gentleman attitude.You need pimp attitude.This comes with experience.You have to quickly callibrate each girl,search their limits etc.

[QUOTE=Hecker]To give you a comparison I found a girl which is asking for 100$ per day and 100$ for each of her girlfriends per day.So it is 300$ for 3 girls for the whole day.[/QUOTE]

Hi Hecker!
How are these gals???
Let me know more, they might be for me next time in Kiev, eventually PM me as you know...

IT

Hey Hecker,

Did you read the previous posts? I mean the same behaviour you wrote. The problem is that a lot of forumers are still sure "more you are generous, and more you get". And these people have inflationed the market. For example, you find girls for 100$/day but 75% girls, on Internet and in places like River Palace, want at least 100$/hour. I am trying to stop this trend but it is not possible when most men are happy to be fucked their wallets.

[QUOTE=Hecker]You do not need gentleman attitude.You need pimp attitude.This comes with experience.You have to quickly callibrate each girl,search their limits etc.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]Luka, GIA has been covered ad nasuem here. Below average girls at above average prices...[/QUOTE]

Cruiser I believe, but so far, Gia it is the only one escort service, no scam, I found in Kiev....have I to search better or simply even if it is not the best value money, but it is the only one ?

Thanks..

Try the apartments. You can meet and talk to the girl you want to take home.

[QUOTE=Acolonizer] The problem is that a lot of forumers are still sure "more you are generous, and more you get". And these people have inflationed the market. For example, you find girls for 100$/day but 75% girls, on Internet and in places like River Palace, want at least 100$/hour. I am trying to stop this trend but it is not possible when most men are happy to be fucked their wallets.[/QUOTE]
I don't think very many guys here are saying "the more you spend, the more you get".

I think many are saying, treat a girl, even a pro, decently and she may give you better service, or a better experience in return. But treat her like a ***** and she will act like a *****.

Oh my god. She may give a good service for the first time but it is sure next times, more you treat her like a princess and more she fucks your money. Please, use the same girls' method: be always smiling and always cheat people.

Moreover, market prices speak up: most girls ask for 100$/hour because most men pay 100$/hour.

I have my own statistics and I can say that you are definitely wrong, this is the reality and not personal illusions.

You will be right when prostitutes give discounts because customers are polite with them.

[QUOTE=Gentleman Travel]I don't think very many guys here are saying "the more you spend, the more you get".

I think many are saying, treat a girl, even a pro, decently and she may give you better service, or a better experience in return. But treat her like a ***** and she will act like a *****.[/QUOTE]

I wonder where is the time in which forumers were talking about swallow blowjobs, wild anals, fistings, bondages and gangbangs more than GGG/666? It seems there are only wussies here.

Low cost carriers Wizzair have arrived in Kiev and set up their latest European base at Borispol Airport, in a move that should radically change the transport set up of this emerging 'New European' nation. From July 2008 residents of the Ukraine will be able to jet about the country to Lviv, Odessa and Simferopol, for as little as 79 UAH.

What's more, these pink and purple pioneers of the skies, will begin international operations to and from the Ukrainian capital from September this year. The good citizens of London (Luton), Dortmund and Milan (Bergamo) will be amongst the first to have the chance to sample Kiev's amazing mix of ancient and modern charms.

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]Low cost carriers Wizzair have arrived in Kiev and set up their latest European base at Borispol Airport, in a move that should radically change the transport set up of this emerging 'New European' nation. From July 2008 residents of the Ukraine will be able to jet about the country to Lviv, Odessa and Simferopol, for as little as 79 UAH.

What's more, these pink and purple pioneers of the skies, will begin international operations to and from the Ukrainian capital from September this year. The good citizens of London (Luton), Dortmund and Milan (Bergamo) will be amongst the first to have the chance to sample Kiev's amazing mix of ancient and modern charms.[/QUOTE]

I say its only bad if you want to keep mongering to a limited few + locals.

For me it looks like it will be cheaper to go to Kiev next time than last time....

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]Low cost carriers Wizzair have arrived in Kiev and set up their latest European base at Borispol Airport, in a move that should radically change the transport set up of this emerging 'New European' nation. From July 2008 residents of the Ukraine will be able to jet about the country to Lviv, Odessa and Simferopol, for as little as 79 UAH.

What's more, these pink and purple pioneers of the skies, will begin international operations to and from the Ukrainian capital from September this year. The good citizens of London (Luton), Dortmund and Milan (Bergamo) will be amongst the first to have the chance to sample Kiev's amazing mix of ancient and modern charms.[/QUOTE]

If this results in groups of Brits steaming into Kiev for Stag Parties then it's over, and I speak as a Brit, Trust Me it's Over !

I agree, once all the 'stag parties' start arriving from the UK (+elsewhere) Ukraine will be finished as we have known and enjoyed it for years!

Such a shame it will soon be ruined! (Likewise Dubai finished)

Time to find another gem off the beaten path?

[QUOTE=Tremayne]If this results in groups of Brits steaming into Kiev for Stag Parties then it's over, and I speak as a Brit, Trust Me it's Over ![/QUOTE]Agreed... throw in some Germans from Dortmund and Italians from Bergamo and it's truly over.

The drunken grope factor will drive away even the most Western-curious devage.

Those that are left will have Euros stuffed up their asses by idiot touristsov

You are right, and I speak as a german. When these groups you mentioned arrive, wether its in Ukraina or Moldova or whereever, its the beginning of the end.

Cheers,

C.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Agreed... throw in some Germans from Dortmund and Italians from Bergamo and it's truly over.

The drunken grope factor will drive away even the most Western-curious devage.

Those that are left will have Euros stuffed up their asses by idiot touristsov[/QUOTE]

Okay let's be serious about this....

If they are coming NOW because its cheap to get there, they are value mongers (cheapskates!). Are they willing to pay RP prices? Highly unlikely. Will they hang out at the local discos and hot spots trying to pull local talent? Yes, if that's your hunting grounds, you have more competition/headaches.

Give the ladies some credit here, they understand if your in Kiev its likely your a sex tourist anyway or looking for a bride and if your in Shooters then its your night-off or your really not that serious about it or your just looking for easy and cheap or even free pussy.

That being said, for those like me that would ONLY return to Kiev to continue the courting ritual from some lady you met online or visiting Kherson to go to some Americans marriage agency, this has no effect on you.

Drunk chaps from Sussex or Heliborn won't get in your way very much and if your like me and was one of maybe 5 people on a Ukrainian Air Airbus that speaks English, you could have some friendly and interesting conversations while en route, so stop with the gloom and doom already, the [i]Golden Days[/i] were over about 5 years ago, you already have a black book full of contacts most will never meet these drunkards from WizzAir's extended service to Kiev...

All said with tounge firmly planted in cheek...

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]Low cost carriers Wizzair have arrived in Kiev and set up their latest European base at Borispol Airport, in a move that should radically change the transport set up of this emerging 'New European' nation. From July 2008 residents of the Ukraine will be able to jet about the country to Lviv, Odessa and Simferopol, for as little as 79 UAH.

What's more, these pink and purple pioneers of the skies, will begin international operations to and from the Ukrainian capital from September this year. The good citizens of London (Luton), Dortmund and Milan (Bergamo) will be amongst the first to have the chance to sample Kiev's amazing mix of ancient and modern charms.[/QUOTE]I think West Euros have always been able to get good deals on excurisions to the FSU, and my guess is that travel won't increase because of this new lost cost carrier. On another note, I live in East Ukraine and the (travel) agents I spoken with have mentioned that travel from westerners to the FSU have decreased closed to 50 percent from last year this time, maybe this is due to the novelty of visiting the FSU is wearing off or the monkey shit economy, maybe a little bit of both.

[QUOTE=Timmy21]I think West Euros have always been able to get good deals on excurisions to the FSU, and my guess is that travel won't increase because of this new lost cost carrier. On another note, I live in East Ukraine and the (travel) agents I spoken with have mentioned that travel from westerners to the FSU have decreased closed to 50 percent from last year this time, maybe this is due to the novelty of visiting the FSU is wearing off or the monkey shit economy, maybe a little bit of both.[/QUOTE]Travel to UKR isn't cheap or easy compared to other places, as there are relatively few direct flights to Kiev (or other places) and even though those flights aren't particularly expensive, they aren't particularly cheap either. For example Prague, Tallinn etc. are much cheaper and easier to reach.

It will make a difference. It's just a question of time anyway and we'll deal with it when it happens.[QUOTE=DJ FourMoney] If they are coming NOW because its cheap to get there, they are value mongers (cheapskates!). Are they willing to pay RP prices? Highly unlikely. Will they hang out at the local discos and hot spots trying to pull local talent? Yes, if that's your hunting grounds, you have more competition/headaches.

Give the ladies some credit here, they understand if your in Kiev its likely your a sex tourist anyway or looking for a bride and if your in Shooters then its your night-off or your really not that serious about it or your just looking for easy and cheap or even free pussy....[/QUOTE]It might have one advantage if cheap-o tourists do end up encouraging a more accessible cheap-o sex market. But there are really almost only disadvantages to cities become tourist attractions for working-class and stag party type tourists. They just get on everybody's nerves.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Travel to UKR isn't cheap or easy compared to other places, as there are relatively few direct flights to Kiev (or other places) and even though those flights aren't particularly expensive, they aren't particularly cheap either. For example Prague, Tallinn etc. are much cheaper and easier to reach.

It will make a difference. It's just a question of time anyway and we'll deal with it when it happens.It might have one advantage if cheap-o tourists do end up encouraging a more accessible cheap-o sex market. But there are really almost only disadvantages to cities become tourist attractions for working-class and stag party type tourists. They just get on everybody's nerves.[/QUOTE]

Loud Blokes and Americans seem to get on everybody's nerves hmmmm....

Stag Party types? Hmmm, as I said the city's best offerings are highly expensive by Stag Party standards. Those are the easiest to find. Only those with local connections or can read or speak Ukrainian or Russian can find the cheap lays. Most of them are going to be in the city center anyway and yes that is an anoyance.

I think they'll stick to Prague frankly; Tallinn I've heard is a WASHOUT as [i]Professional Daters[/i] have ruined the freebie market (not if you want something more lasting but it will take a few weeks for the panties to drop).

Is there a place on the planet not ruined by Professional Daters or Stag Party types???

Minisk?

Since 50 has moved out of Alamty, I would say that place might be safe if you want Slavic punai straight up or with a Saki twist and isn't infested with all the types that tend to ruin "markets".

C'mon Doc, there has to be a skinny slav girl with your name on it ready to be Mrs Skank...lol

I hear some guys say the Czech Republic sucks I hear some guys say the Ukraine sucks. I am not worried about prices. What is the best place in Eastern Europe to get native girls to do something strange for a piece of change? I am Black so I know that will be a factor and yes I have read the fucking forum.

[QUOTE=D Etat]I hear some guys say the Czech Republic sucks I hear some guys say the Ukraine sucks. I am not worried about prices. What is the best place in Eastern Europe to get native girls to do something strange for a piece of change? I am Black so I know that will be a factor and yes I have read the fucking forum.[/QUOTE]Depends on what you want. If it is "just" sex in 30 min to 60 min sessions, your best bet may actually be German FKKs... plenty of EE action there and especially in Frankfurt, little or no racial stress AFAIK. Affordable prices.

Even cheaper are German RLDs and Laufhäuser. Quicky type 15 minute action can be had in red light districts for as little at 30 €.

For overnight, takeout or longer sessions you're better off in EE, but will likely run into some racial issues now and then.

Furthermore, as DJ4$ said, EE can be a bit tougher to navigate for those who don't speak the local lingo. Easy to find options are increasingly cost-prohibitive.[QUOTE=DJ FourMoney] C'mon Doc, there has to be a skinny slav girl with your name on it ready to be Mrs Skank...lol[/QUOTE]If I were inclined to take a bride, I could've been married 30 times over by now... :)

I just know I couldn't be satisfied with just one though, so why marry... maybe in 10 years or so. Maybe.

[QUOTE=D Etat]I hear some guys say the Czech Republic sucks I hear some guys say the Ukraine sucks. I am not worried about prices. What is the best place in Eastern Europe to get native girls to do something strange for a piece of change? I am Black so I know that will be a factor and yes I have read the fucking forum.[/QUOTE]

As a Black Man, let me say this loud and clear so you understand.

I do not proclaim to be an expert but having been there, I can say this -

Your Euros are better spent in Germany, per Doctor's orders!

P4P is hard to find (in Ukraine), at least for those budget minded mongers. Having said that, I did go to River Palace, but unless you like high prices ($250-300US), to be frank don't go, but its worth it just to look. You'll find Slavic girls just as attractive in Germany and I really do MEAN that.

I did get an offer from a semi-pro - $150 but did not partake. Fucking her would be been nice, but I thought it was legit before the offer so I declined based on that, not on prices or attractiveness.

You can find P4P for well under 100US in Kiev for example but you really need to speak the local language and that pretty much goes for every FSU country, even that ones that are apart of the EU save for Czech Republic, where English is widely spoken by most people in Prague.

Some places (countries) are cheaper, but service is shitty and selection is even worst, just how many times does somebody have to post that before you believe its true? (Slovakia, Estonia, Romania) You could go the path of the less traveled (Kazakhstan, Moldova, Georgia, Bosnia) and might find a worthy candidate to be your wife before you hit on some P4P worth your dollars (not worth much these days, are you being paid in Euros?).

Too much effort if you ask me and I don't care how cheap Wizzair is....

I highly suggest you scope the FKK boards, you'll find what your looking for and at reasonable prices and GFE or PSE is EASY to find and expected by most customers so they tend to deliver and its LEGAL!

Dear friend...

You never say for what you get offer and for what you pay... 300 USD can be an enormous price or a ridicolus one...

That is the matter: what you pay for? 10 min? 2 hours? 1 day with BBBJ and CIM???

That is all the problem

IT


[QUOTE=DJ FourMoney]As a Black Man, let me say this loud and clear so you understand.

I do not proclaim to be an expert but having been there, I can say this -

Your Euros are better spent in Germany, per Doctor's orders!

P4P is hard to find (in Ukraine), at least for those budget minded mongers. Having said that, I did go to River Palace, but unless you like high prices ($250-300US), to be frank don't go, but its worth it just to look. You'll find Slavic girls just as attractive in Germany and I really do MEAN that.

I did get an offer from a semi-pro - $150 but did not partake. Fucking her would be been nice, but I thought it was legit before the offer so I declined based on that, not on prices or attractiveness.

You can find P4P for well under 100US in Kiev for example but you really need to speak the local language and that pretty much goes for every FSU country, even that ones that are apart of the EU save for Czech Republic, where English is widely spoken by most people in Prague.

Some places (countries) are cheaper, but service is shitty and selection is even worst, just how many times does somebody have to post that before you believe its true? (Slovakia, Estonia, Romania) You could go the path of the less traveled (Kazakhstan, Moldova, Georgia, Bosnia) and might find a worthy candidate to be your wife before you hit on some P4P worth your dollars (not worth much these days, are you being paid in Euros?).

Too much effort if you ask me and I don't care how cheap Wizzair is....

I highly suggest you scope the FKK boards, you'll find what your looking for and at reasonable prices and GFE or PSE is EASY to find and expected by most customers so they tend to deliver and its LEGAL![/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=It Travel]Dear friend...

You never say for what you get offer and for what you pay... 300 USD can be an enormous price or a ridicolus one...

That is the matter: what you pay for? 10 min? 2 hours? 1 day with BBBJ and CIM???

That is all the problem

IT[/QUOTE]

Opps I failed to mention that..lol

Yes it could be a quickie or several hours, YMMV

The girl I asked gave me a price, said as long as I wanted but didn't offer any extras and wanted $250.

Its been mentioned here several times, it was bad and 20 mins, others report she was there until they kicked them out.

With FKK's you much more likely to hit GFE or PSE as long as you don't look like Puff The Magic Dragon...

[QUOTE=DJ FourMoney]As a Black Man, let me say this loud and clear so you understand.

I do not proclaim to be an expert but having been there, I can say this -

Your Euros are better spent in Germany, per Doctor's orders!

P4P is hard to find (in Ukraine), at least for those budget minded mongers. Having said that, I did go to River Palace, but unless you like high prices ($250-300US), to be frank don't go, but its worth it just to look. You'll find Slavic girls just as attractive in Germany and I really do MEAN that.

I did get an offer from a semi-pro - $150 but did not partake. Fucking her would be been nice, but I thought it was legit before the offer so I declined based on that, not on prices or attractiveness.

You can find P4P for well under 100US in Kiev for example but you really need to speak the local language and that pretty much goes for every FSU country, even that ones that are apart of the EU save for Czech Republic, where English is widely spoken by most people in Prague.

Some places (countries) are cheaper, but service is shitty and selection is even worst, just how many times does somebody have to post that before you believe its true? (Slovakia, Estonia, Romania) You could go the path of the less traveled (Kazakhstan, Moldova, Georgia, Bosnia) and might find a worthy candidate to be your wife before you hit on some P4P worth your dollars (not worth much these days, are you being paid in Euros?).

Too much effort if you ask me and I don't care how cheap Wizzair is....

I highly suggest you scope the FKK boards, you'll find what your looking for and at reasonable prices and GFE or PSE is EASY to find and expected by most customers so they tend to deliver and its LEGAL![/QUOTE]

Germany sounds good to go. But isn't it oversaturated with "clients" considering the US military is there in great numbers? I was looking to kind of go off the beaten path.....

D Etat, I don't think the US military has had much of an effect on the Germany economy since the end of the Cold War.

And as far as the on going debate about whether Kyiv will become a stag destination for Western Europe. Although the Kyiv police keep a much lower profile then their bothers in Moscow. I think that would quickly change if they are provoked or tempted with easy targets. Not only that where would they stay? 150-200 euro apartments? 400 euros at the Hyatt? Don't think so. I'm more concerned about making it easier to access for serial daters and sexpats. Not that I am worried about the competition, they just drive the prices up.

[QUOTE=D Etat]Germany sounds good to go. But isn't it oversaturated with "clients" considering the US military is there in great numbers? I was looking to kind of go off the beaten path.....[/QUOTE]Don't overestimate the US military presence. It isn't 1986. Many bases have closed years ago. There are less Americans in Germany every year.

As to saturation, it depends on what you are after.

If you are refering to FKK and RLD paid sex, you likely won't encounter any soldiers unless you are in the immediate proximity of a US base, of which there only a couple left. Most clients at FKK are businessmen from around Europe or the US or locals.

In terms of dating/looking for regular girlfriends or ONS, most German towns and cities are fairly devoid of US citizens. Frankfurt, Berlin and Munich have the most, as well as the most black Americans... mostly ex-Gis who decided to stay. Nonetheless, a black man is still fairly rare but common enough that most racial issues don't exist or aren't "in your face" AFAIK. Black Americans continue to be fairly popular in Germany, thanks to Will Smith, Kobe Bryant, 50 Cent and co.

Around US bases you will run into the mud shark phenomenon (don't be offended, it's a term black soldiers use themselves)... local women who are interested only in black men. Careful treading here though, many of them already have a bastard kid or two and have been through several bfs on their Germany tour before said brothers PCSed back to CONUS. You'll have to have your filter radar on.

I'm sure you have some ex-Army friends somewhere... if they've been stationed in Germany they can fill you in with more details than I can.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Don't overestimate the US military presence. It isn't 1986. Many bases have closed years ago. There are less Americans in Germany every year.

As to saturation, it depends on what you are after.

If you are referring to FKK and RLD paid sex, you likely won't encounter any soldiers unless you are in the immediate proximity of a US base, of which there only a couple left. Most clients at FKK are businessmen from around Europe or the US or locals.

In terms of dating/looking for regular girlfriends or ONS, most German towns and cities are fairly devoid of US citizens. Frankfurt, Berlin and Munich have the most, as well as the most black Americans... mostly ex-Gis who decided to stay. Nonetheless, a black man is still fairly rare but common enough that most racial issues don't exist or aren't "in your face" AFAIK. Black Americans continue to be fairly popular in Germany, thanks to Will Smith, Kobe Bryant, 50 Cent and co.

Around US bases you will run into the mud shark phenomenon (don't be offended, it's a term black soldiers use themselves)... local women who are interested only in black men. Careful treading here though, many of them already have a bastard kid or two and have been through several bfs on their Germany tour before said brothers PCSed back to CONUS. You'll have to have your filter radar on.

I'm sure you have some ex-Army friends somewhere... if they've been stationed in Germany they can fill you in with more details than I can.[/QUOTE]

At one time I took offence to "Mud Sharks" but LOL, after seeing how some German women act around Black Men, hmmmm DESERVED.

Freebie sex for sure is much easier in Germany and Scandinavia but you need time to make the panties drop especially in Scandinavia but once that happens - LOOK OUT

Obama was a hit in Berlin this evening, uh I think that underlines Germans are basically very comfortable with African-Americans, they were bumpin the O'jays outside of Frankfurt Main train station when I was in town, go figure.

My demands are a bit different however. I'm seeking wifey material but that doesn't mean I have to go without and currently I haven't had sex since I left Germany.

Both times at Oase and Palace I had better sex in one shot than many of the women I have dated and one was best looking woman I've ever stuck my dick into, it felt great, she was down, grabbed me under my towel before hand and would be a solid 8 on most people's scale, didn't ask for money up front either.... WIN-WIN

We've had this conversation before, if somebody would put my post in ROD then maybe we can avoid repeating ourselves - LOL

Thanks for feed back guys. I guess my Nike Air Forces will be touching German soil soon.

[QUOTE=DJ FourMoney]Loud Blokes and Americans seem to get on everybody's nerves hmmmm....

Stag Party types? Hmmm, as I said the city's best offerings are highly expensive by Stag Party standards. Those are the easiest to find. Only those with local connections or can read or speak Ukrainian or Russian can find the cheap lays. Most of them are going to be in the city center anyway and yes that is an anoyance.

I think they'll stick to Prague frankly; Tallinn I've heard is a WASHOUT as [i]Professional Daters[/i] have ruined the freebie market (not if you want something more lasting but it will take a few weeks for the panties to drop).

Is there a place on the planet not ruined by Professional Daters or Stag Party types???

Minisk?

Since 50 has moved out of Alamty, I would say that place might be safe if you want Slavic punai straight up or with a Saki twist and isn't infested with all the types that tend to ruin "markets".

C'mon Doc, there has to be a skinny slav girl with your name on it ready to be Mrs Skank...lol[/QUOTE]

The way I see it the main concern about Stag Parties, if they ever come, is not the increased competition to us foreign local guys, that isn't the problem.
The problem is the image of the foreigner that the behaviour of these Stag Party tourists may project.
Although I would never claim to be Mr.Super Stud what success I have had with Ukrainian women has been achieved by sticking to three basic rules.

1) Always play the part of the polite and gentlemanly foreigner

2) Dress well

3) Wear expensive shoes (I don't know why but sooner or later these Slavic
girls are going to check out your shoes)

In the past I had hoped that by abiding to these rules I was, in my small way, helping to perpetuate the diminishing mystique of the foreign guy.
Now if the city is about to be besieged by hoards of hairy arsed Brits all wearing football shirts and dirty trainers it won't be long before the Ukrainian women start to view the Foreign guys as something to be avoided. Especially if they have just moved to Kiev from the countryside, a source of much fresh talent.The natural progression from that is that they will fall into the clutches of their own men especially now that more Ukrainian guys are starting to earn good money.

Stag parties happen where alcohol is cheap in places like Prague, Krakow, Riga etc. The tourists come basically to drink.

There came a lot of british tourists to Kiev before 2003 when alcohol was relatively cheap. They stopped coming.

And the accomodation in Kiev is not such to allow finding cheap hotel rooms etc easily. There is no infrastructure to prevent from rip off and to be drunk is dangerous in Ukraine. In Moscow stag parties stopped after serious beating of the staggers by Russians and expell of many English by authorities.

My guess is that till infrastructure improves as to make able to accomodate thousands more of tourists and till Ukraine becomes more stable economically and more european oriented, stag parties are not going to happen. Especially when the tourists have to pay so much due to high inflation rate.

[QUOTE=Hecker]Stag parties happen where alcohol is cheap in places like Prague, Krakow, Riga etc. The tourists come basically to drink.

There came a lot of British tourists to Kiev before 2003 when alcohol was relatively cheap. They stopped coming.

And the accommodations in Kiev is not such to allow finding cheap hotel rooms etc easily. There is no infrastructure to prevent from rip off and to be drunk is dangerous in Ukraine. In Moscow stag parties stopped after serious beating of the staggers by Russians and expel of many English by authorities.

My guess is that till infrastructure improves as to make able to accommodate thousands more of tourists and till Ukraine becomes more stable economically and more European oriented, stag parties are not going to happen. Especially when the tourists have to pay so much due to high inflation rate.[/QUOTE]

All your points are well taken and true... In reality this has no effect on the "market" as we currently know it.

It will not effect you dating locally if you are a local for business reasons. For those Western Europeans and US men already all around Ukraine, they have regular girlfriends/wifes or a regular cashe of women available to them (think Cruiser D, Hecker, etc)

I will be back in the market [i]way[/i] before any Stag Parties become a regular occurrence, grab what I want and come back!

To address Tremayne's point -

1) That's my nature anyway

2) Well I dress Urban, not too baggy, not too tight, in between...

3) Now Brooks Brothers shoes would look out of place, I took 5 different pairs of K-Swiss, two customed designed by ME all matching whatever I wore, I looked TIGHT my man!

I go where they play "Da Beats", I find upscale bars/clubs nauseating. I was prepared however for an upscape affair if it came to pass, but it didn't...

[i]"Girls don't makes passes at men with glasses"[/i] and that's my number 1# change I have planned before I go back I feel that should improve things quite a bit...

Hi guys,

Got to entertain a client next week when I'm back in Kyiv for first time in a while. What's the best nude strip joint in town -any recommendations?

I'm in apartment, so no problems on the p4p front. A contact told me a disco in Podil by the river was easy to score students from....I'll try my best and report back if the semi-pros are keeping prices more reasonable than further up the river at RP.

Thanks in advance anyone who replies or PMs.
K

hi for all, it is a long time i did not check the reports, do not have time, but i will give you my experience in kiev, you may agree or not, this is my story.

i was in kiev in the begging of may for just 4 days, i talk a text from borispul i paid 30 usd. first day i was in the dnipro hotel, i tried to call**mystery tramp allot of time but no answer. so i do not won't to west my time i call up nika from gia, i have a good time with her

the only thing is she is not 177 height, and i rely like tall woman, but otherwise she is good, she is sexy, she is smart, she will do some extra stuff for you, i have her for 2 hoer, i gave her 300 $, it was wort. she kiss me reel good with her worm muitch, i fucked her 4 times, she was willing to do any thing for me.

after i sleep till 2 0r 3 in middle of the night i try to stand up, i fill i still can use some pussy from a girl, so i won't town, i get out the hotel and i walk on the chrarep001ic street. not allot out at 3 am, i do not see girls, but her and their it was, woh the try to check my attention, but i do not find the good for me. at one point 2 girls call me, the ask me if i need company, and the start to dens for me on the street, the was looking drunk so i walk away. i cam back in the hotel in the labey i say 2 blondinow girl’s, very sexy tall and tine, my type, i ask the girl to come to my room, she won't 300 usd i was not ready to give they, so the 2 girl**live the hotel, i won't to the bar but not find good girl for me so i won't back to slip.

the different between a girl from gia and a girl from a hotel, from gia even i now it is expansive but at list i now i can trust her, kisses will be kisses, fucking will be good, and 2 hoers will be tow hoers reel sex, with a girl from the hotel i do not trust her. theta is my opinion.

the next 2 day i was biz with my bizznes i do not have time, at the lest night my company give me a room in the "president hotel’", it is bigger and nice’r from the dnipro hotel, and i thing it is more perfesonel, **the services**is beater, and even the prise was beater (125 usd for a night).

i cem in the hotel after a big hard day, i came back from odessa, it was 3:00 am, and in the la bey form the hotel i see 2 working girls, one from the girls**wave to me with her hand, she was a**tall woman, properly in her mid 30’s, but very**sexy, **after i cheek**in**my room i go down to her and and**she start to do bizznes, i told**her if she won't to come up to my room, won**she come in i told her i will**pay only**100 usd for 2 hoer, she refuse, but i told her i am**only reedy to pay 100, i guss she do not have allot costumers this night because she agree, **i have sexy with her 2 times, she explain me she is very pure, she do not have noting only this money wot she is making in the hotel bla**bla.

it was 5: am i fall slipping.

in the day before i all reedy mad a appointment with gia to send me a girl in the mooring (even the our opining at 11: am but i need i girl before this time).

at 8: am the girl "faina" form gia call me up she is in the la bey, **i won't down to her, i pay 20 usd for the security (ukrainian still robbery).

i most say faine is the reel dael, she is tall and sexy, she was reel good, even i heed sex tow hoers before, she made a very good job, she work for me 2 hoers all over, she do not tolk away her golden hands from my hard dick, she rob it, and suck it aging and again, like she never heed**sex in a long time. she was willing to do any thing, she make me rely dry, she took out me com probably 4 of 5 times.

i pad her 250 usd, it was now 11. 30 am i check out from the hotel i russ borispul to my plain back to the usa.

i now allot of you do not like gia but as i told all reedy before this is my only way to go.

i wish you all the best.

her555

[size=-2][b][u]editor's note[/u]:[/b] [blue]i would suggest that the author or another forum member consider posting a link to this report in the reports of distinction thread. please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]click here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]

Kiev experts,
I'm coming next week, any suggestion where to meet regulars, disco, shops, parks, swimmingpools, theatre.....
I immagine they are everywhere as in any city but there are always some place where girls are more in the mood for meeting new friends......
Thanks a lot !
Latin

Knight, try any of the Rhino clubs, from what I saw they have the hottest girls. Although as of two winters ago you couldn't pay to have sex with them. Someone on this forum mention that had changed. While it's possible I doubt it.

Kiev report

Think of your trip to Ukraine as a refresher lesson on how to be a man. The moment you land in Kiev, forget everything you have learned about “normal” male-female relationships. You will be surrounded by gorgeous women, dressed elegantly and sexy, being reasonably open to you advances, and in many cases, willing to take it all the way. Ninety percent of the women you see will be hotter and sexier than your wife, girlfriend or ex-girlfriend back home. You will soon realize that it is okay to strike up a conversation with a beautiful woman, and that often she will actually be flattered by the attention and welcome a little flirtation. That is how life should always be!

If you are a 20 year old hot-shot who will not be satisfied unless you fuck every hot babe you see, you will be miserable. If you are a little older and have learned to appreciate the beauty of women, enjoy flirting with them, and occasionally make love to them, you will have a great time. If you are even older, I do not know; maybe you just have to be shameless and realize that in Kiev it is okay to hit on and bed a babe half your age. You could relive your glory days and go home a happy man.

From the minute you leave your apartment or hotel to the time you get back (hopefully with a girl) you will see a stunningly beautiful woman every 30 seconds. I have actually taken data on this; it is absolutely astounding! Unlike the women you are used to back home, they will be slim (note Americans!), blue-eyed, blonde, dressed elegantly in short skirts or mini-dresses, high heels and, in winter, often in thigh-high boots (I just love the miniskirt-thigh-high boot look!). Outside of cheerleader conventions, the miniskirt coefficient is the highest I have every seen in my life. All you have to do is enjoy the view and fully absorb the experience, soon enough you will be walking with a stupid ear-to-ear grin.

First, use your new surroundings to get your confidence up, to get fully comfortable with the idea that you can chat up an incredibly hot babe and she will be generally receptive, smile at you, and not dismiss you. After years of living among “sexually liberated women”, you might have thought that you no longer had balls, but in Kiev you will soon realize your balls had merely shrunk, but hey are still there, and they can quickly grow back. The process of “sexual liberation” has unfortunately rendered western women not quite asexual, but certainly far less feminine that women in the Ukraine, and has had an equally deleterious effect on men (I think I am talking more about North America here, in western Europe things are not as bad). Within a few hours you will be walking tall, smiling broadly, shamelessly checking babes out, and chatting them up as if it were the most natural and normal thing in the world. It is.

Hit on them selectively or you will have to hit on them every 30 seconds. Just use a little common sense: if a babe is rushing to catch the bus on her way to work (by the way, dressed so invitingly sexy that you wonder how Ukrainian men ever manage to do any work at work!), it is unlikely that she will stop to talk to a stranger. But if a babe is just window shopping, having a coffee or just walking around (they do that a lot, particularly on weekends), you really cannot miss.

Of course, this does not mean that you can be a rude, drunk asshole. Women do not like that, anywhere! Be polite, friendly, sober and confident. Women everywhere love that.

Do not assume every girl you talk to is gong to bed you, be we all know that the road from first contact to sex is fairly short and direct. The problem in the west is that it is hard to find any women you would actually like to have sex with, so we do not even bother with first contact. When we find one worth pursuing, she is probably being pursued by everyone else around her, and probably has developed an attitude. In Kiev, there are gorgeous women EVERYWHERE. Competition is good for business.

ANY opening line will do! The key is to make that first contact, just like anywhere, except that here the babes are far better looking and more open to your advances. A simple and direct: “hello, my name is ____” with an offer of a handshake works perfectly fine. It identifies you as a foreigner, and as being respectful of women. Or you can ask for directions, compliment them on their beauty (with some subtlety), talk about how nice the weather is, ask for tourist suggestions, and always watch for any signs of a smile. The only hard part is someone who speaks enough English (or whatever you speak) to understand your jokes. As usual, the moment you make a girl laugh, you know you are in!

Before you enter a bar in Kiev (or any of the FSU states, for that matter), you should get a post-dot-com now-unemployed computer geek to re-write your targeting software. In the typical bar in North America, a couple of minutes after entering you will have targeted the 3 babes that turn you on (and that third one you are not really sure about!). The rest are just the back-up plan, if you get too drunk. In Kiev it is nearly impossible to target anyone, because there are just too many incredibly gorgeous women. Face it, if you get laid here, it will be with someone close to your ultimate fantasy girl. It is just mind-boggling!

Eastern European Women

Before continuing, I put together a few thoughts about Eastern European babes. First, they are slimmer than North American women, and that is one huge difference, pardon the pun. All women are potentially beautiful, but when they are 20 Kg overweight by the time they are 25, well… the future is bleak. Second they are just more feminine: they wear dresses and high heels and make up and always look nice. When visiting Eastern Europe you will sometimes see tourists who made the mistake of visiting, as couples. The men spend all their time with their tongues hanging and regretting their decision to marry, and the women take a huge hit to their self esteem. Taking your wife to Kiev surely enhances your chances of a divorce.

They are not only feminine in their appearance, but also their behaviour. When you are out with an Eastern woman, she will make you feel like you are the king of the world. She will look hot and she will be with you! She will dance for you, hang by your arm, attract but ignore potential suitors, and make other man there wish he were you.


The specifics

As soon as you step on the airport, you will be a target for people who want your money. Other than sex, you will spend the most and be ripped off the worst by taxis. A local would never pay more than 100 UAH, but you will be asked 250 UAH. Eventually, you will settle on 150 or so. A girl I met negotiated with a cabbie a trip to her place where she went in for 15 minutes, and back to my place for the night, for a total trip lasting over an hour, for 60 UAH!

Before my trip I had gathered a database of 50 pros and 25 non-pros; I had called a few of the pros to make sure the numbers were real, and I had contacted the non-pros and they were supposedly willing to meet me. I thought I was fully prepared and could not lose. Well, I did not lose, but not because of my preparation.

As soon as I settled at my apartment I started calling some girls (by the way, I had to change apartments-the short story is that Flatlux are unprofessional and deceptive; but kievrent.net are okay). As usual, I could not reach anyone on the other side, they did not speak English and some hung up, the prices were higher than advertised, or they added extras like 50 UAH for a taxi (where are they coming from, Odessa?!). I eventually ordered a girl and waited, but the girl who arrived was not even close to the cutie pictured online. I sent her away and decided to hit the city instead.

Later I will conclude that in Kiev there is no reason to actually pay for sex (not directly, anyway) but it was late and it was my first night, so I headed for the River Palace.

The River Palace

As you walk into the River Palace, you will immediately take notice of hot blondes in heels and miniskirts. Some people say fire, others think it is the wheel, and recently others have said the microprocessor, but I will suggest again that humanity’s greatest invention is the miniskirt. Here they are everywhere, coupled with high heels and often thigh-high boots. I had to muster all my will power to resist the urge to drop to my knees and work my way up from those smooth, shapely legs to those barely hidden sweet pussies.

Actually, it is better if you do not enter into negotiations right away. Take a walk around the place to check out the talent. There are 3 floors: sometimes the best girls can be found in the slot machine rooms, quietly disposing of the money they are about to recoup from you. One of my favourite places is the bench near the entrance, where I like to sit after a walk-around. From there you can keep track of the flow of babes between the main areas. From there you get a good look at those magnificent legs, and you get a good, well-lit view of the talent. Some of them act seductively and friendly in the disco, but when they come to sit here you get a better feeling of their actual personalities. Some of them are total bitches, and seem to think talking to them is a privilege. By the way, someone else here mentioned that they judge you by your shoes, and here, in the light, they do.

After 20 minutes of sitting there I moved to the downstairs bar, where the action starts earlier than at the “nightclub”. There were a couple of girls dancing and a few more sitting at the bar. As soon as I sat, the girls began to check me out and the ones dancing began smiling at me. If you can forget that it is a hooker bar, it can be very good for your ego. I smiled broadly to the one sitting next to me and introduced myself. I introduced myself to the other 2 girls sitting next to her, and ended up chatting the most with the one in the middle: a pretty mini-skirted blue-eyed blonde with fantastic breasts. The one farthest from me was hotter but did not seem to speak any English, or just was not too interested.

The usual meaningless chit-chat followed: where are you from, how long are you here, what do you do for a living, are there any other good bars in town, how is the weather, etc. Soon enough the talk becomes more directed. One of the questions they ask about this time is whether I am staying in a hotel or an apartment. I am not sure why this is one of the first questions, other than because of the difficulties you might have getting a girl past hotel security. But what do they care? The tip for the concierge will come from your pocket, not hers. If anybody can shed any light, please do so.

Around this time, they might ask for a drink. As we all know, girl drinks are a little expensive, and whereas I might not mind buying a drink for a girl in a regular bar (I see it as an investment), I prefer if professionals buy their own drinks. I just keep an eye on the drink and excuse myself to the bathroom as she finishes. I may go to one of the other bars and I return 20 minutes later, if I do. By that time, she will have bought her own fucking drink.

Anyway, the conversation quickly veers towards the goal. Do I have a girlfriend in town? (funny how she did not ask whether I had one OUT of town or whether I was married), am I looking for a girlfriend? (am I?), or do I want some company? Soon thereafter the first price quote comes up and it is ridiculous: 300 or even 400 USD for 2 hours, PLUS a taxi. Is it neurosurgery??

Given that good quality girls from GIA (some photos are fake, and all are doctored, of course) can be had for 150 USD (yes, some want to charge 300, but who pays for that? For that much, stay at home!) and girls form the street can be had for as little as 100 USD or less, there is no reason to pay 300, let alone 400. The only benefit at River Palace is that you get to see the merchandise up-close before making a purchase, but similarly, if the girl who shows up at your door is not quite what you saw online, you can always send her home. I put my limit at 150 USD, and girls are willing to accept even less early in evening (so they can go home after having earned their keep, or return to “work”), or late in the evening (when the prospects of finding a moron who will pay 300 USD are dwindling).

Back to negotiations, I try not to dismiss the ridiculous offer, but rather ask more details: what is included? Is she going to be as nice as she is being right now? How long? All night? For all three? A trick I like is to say that I do not know if I have that much and then take out a wad of cash to check. Of course, after checking you have enough money, point out that you want to get the best value for your money and there are many other girls around, and as soon as you can, go to the bathroom and put all that money in a different, secret pocket. The sight of money will convince her that you are a serious customer.

To me the River Palace is about the experience: being surrounded by gorgeous babes who dance for you (although that happens everywhere) and smile at you (less common). Shameless flirting is the rule, if they do not even like you enough for that, they are probably be awful in bed, regardless of how great they look.

You will find two types of girls: hard core pros and part timers. Pros are in their 20’s and look fantastic and think it is a privilege to talk to them, or fuck them. They are more likely to hold on for that 400 USD for 2 hours idiot. I chatted with an old warrior who recounted the days in the 90s when you could be a model/actress/fantasy type girl to take a 9 hour bus from Odessa, spend all day and all night with you, fuck you and suck you to your heart’s content, and take the bus 9 hour bus ride back the next day, all for 100 USD. Some of us can only dream of having been there in those days!!

The second type are the semi-pros. They have regular jobs but make a little money on the side. I met a nurse, a secretary and a beautician. They are more likely to fuck you if they actually like you, and might not be absolutely physically perfect, but probably better fucks. To make the story short, I picked up a gorgeous blonde, supposedly a receptionist, about 28, who gave me a perfect GF experience all night, for 200 USD. In the bed, on the couch, in the shower, oral, 69, kissing, followed by a shower when she tenderly washed my entire body. We fucked at least 3 times, but I had drunk too much and did not come (I take long in any case). She felt responsible for my orgasm and in the morning, before heading out, she made the point of blowing me to completion. Again, awesome GFE, all night (well, 6 hours), for 200 USD.

The street

In Kiev, if you are staying for at least a few days or are coming back (or have a good story saying that you will), there is really no reason you should EVER pay for sex. On weekends, girls dress in their sexy outfits, short dresses and miniskirts, high heels and just walk up and down the main street, FOR HOURS, hoping to run into someone. You just have to be shameless and talk to them. Yes, occasionally, some will be ***** princesses and not talk back, but unlike back home, you can tell them to fuck off! Do not worry, they are not friends of friends whom you will meet at the next office party!

I spent an afternoon sitting at an outdoor café, Pan Pizza, eying the beauties. When I sat down the place was relatively empty and I was minding my own business, reading the Kiev post and enjoying the view. When I looked up a few minutes later several tables had been filled by beauties who were occasionally looking up and trying to get my attention. They would look up, smile, speak a little English among themselves, just to make the point that they could. I paired up with two of them, and spent the evening and the next night with one of them.

On another occasion I was watching a violin player on the street, just enjoying the music. I went up to buy his CD, and watched a little more. In a couple of minutes I noticed a mini-skirted high-heeled beauty moving beside me, an invitation to strike a conversation. I did.

On another occasion, I was just walking taking a photo of a church, and asked some girl if she know what it was. She answered politely; I said thanks and moved on. A couple of minutes later I stopped again to take more photos, and noticed her behind me still. I smiled and struck a conversation. We walked and chatted for 30 minutes. She said that she had been walking all day (that is what they do. It is weird. Better than staying at home, I guess) and although I invited her to my place or a night out, she said she was taking a bus home. By the way, she was wearing a cute mini-dress and high heels, of course. Half-way up the main street I saw the violin guy and said that I wanted to watch, but instead of going her way she came with me. That is another peculiarity of Kiev women, if you are too nice of thoughtful they will not respect you. It is an extension of the “nice guys finish last” logic. Unfortunate! Anyway, the fact that I was willing to leave her to watch some violinist was the turning point for her, and we did end up at my place. I spent over a day with her, and bought her some lingerie and a dress the next day, for a cost of under 100 USD. Not a bad deal!

About the non-pros that I had lined up, it became a scheduling nightmare. It seems that there are two types of non-pro women in Kiev, those that walk the streets all day in the hope of meeting a (rich? foreign?) boyfriend, and those who are trying to make a life for themselves and work incessantly. Out of the 25 girls I had lined up, after much effort and many phone calls, I ended up meeting only 4, only one of which I liked. Unfortunately, these girls are far more interesting than the walkers, but it is just not worth the trouble.

One more thing I noticed is when you hang out with a girl, waitresses and store clerks look at the girl with some jealousy. I am sure THEY would love to be with you instead of being stuck at work. My point is that it is relatively easy to ask “what time do you get out of work? Would you like to get together”. I did not have the time, so I only did it 3 times, and got smiles and phone numbers, only 1 fake. Sometimes when I walked alone I seemed to get the feeling girls were looking at me and wondering why I was alone.


Take home message

To summarize, there is no reason to pay for sex in Kiev, at least not directly, unless you are really intent on getting your ultimate fantasy girl and do not mind paying 300 USD for potentially horrible sex with a gorgeous body. By the way, one of dancers at Moda bar drops into the River Palace after work, wearing her little go-go mini-dress. Everywhere you look, you see unlikely couples, where the woman is gorgeous and the guy is not, nor rich (as far as you can tell), nor does he treat her well. At strategic tourist places you will see impeccably dressed babes waiting to meet foreign men, often much older. The rule is be shameless, and flirt, with the babes walking the streets, and more so with regular girls, who will be flattered by the attention and CAN look as great as any street walker (pro or non pro). I was there for 10 days, so I had time but really, the time from first contact to sex was a couple of hours at best, and under 48 hours at worst, in most cases within 24 hours. If you are there for just a few days, you might have to do things differently.

One last thing. Shooters is a racist establishment. They decided I was arab (am I? it does not matter, that is the point, and yes, I understand a few words) and did not let me in. SAY NO TO RACISM, with your wallet.

My two cents!

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The establishment itself is by no means racist. It's owned by a good friend of mine, a genuinely nice bloke.

It's just that the goons at the door often can be. If you see the owner around outside (a well built Scottish guy - you can't really miss him :)) just let him know and he'll sort them out. It could be trickier if he's not around though.

I have to disagree with Stevie 69.

1. Everywhere you look in Ukraine you see normal couples where the girl is in the same caliber with the man. There are very few unlikely couples.

2. It is very difficult to pick up girls in Kiev's streets. Most of them do not answer at all. I find it very bad idea to tell them to fuck off since it will give foreigners a bad reputation.

3. No girls try to grab the attention of foreigners by speaking english or coming behind them or walking for hours just to meet them. All this is science fiction.

4. Old foreigners date average girls. Very average and they have to pay for dates. In Kiev average young girls are available for older foreigners.

No doubt Stevie is speaking from his own experience. He just forgot to mention that he is Ricky Martin's identical twin brother..

[QUOTE=Hecker]Old foreigners date average girls. Very average and they have to pay for dates. In Kiev average young girls are available for older foreigners[/QUOTE]

On average yes. But supermodel young girls are availabe to old foreigners (and old locals) who have the $$.

[quote=stevie69]to summarize, there is no reason to pay for sex in kiev, at least not directly, unless you are really intent on getting your ultimate fantasy girl and do not mind paying 300 usd for potentially horrible sex with a gorgeous body. i was there for 10 days, so i had time but really, the time from first contact to sex was a couple of hours at best, and under 48 hours at worst, in most cases within 24 hours. if you are there for just a few days, you might have to do things differently.[/quote]good report stevie69!

i agree with much of what is said in general, and actually has been said on this forum many times before by regular posters.

i also agree with ash though that your report is overly optimistic on some points, for example time between first contact and sex being under 24 hours. sometimes yes, but "on average" ? even if that may have actually been your experience, it's hardly typical. it can often be tough to get a 2nd date/contact within 24 hours, considering their schedules... and your own.
[quote=stevie69]
ninety percent of the women you see will be hotter and sexier than your wife, girlfriend or ex-girlfriend back home. [/quote]maybe you should find new girlfriends back home. just a thought.
[quote=stevie69]
you will soon realize that it is okay to strike up a conversation with a beautiful woman, and that often she will actually be flattered by the attention and welcome a little flirtation. that is how life should always be! [/quote]depends on your definition of beautiful. in the upper beautiful category, she gets a ton of attention every time she leaves the apartment. it’ll take more than a little attention to spark her interest.
[quote=stevie69]
if you are a 20 year old hot-shot who will not be satisfied unless you fuck every hot babe you see, you will be miserable. [/quote]35 is a much better age to score hotties in ee than 20. life is great.
[quote=stevie69]from the minute you leave your apartment or hotel to the time you get back (hopefully with a girl) you will see a stunningly beautiful woman every 30 seconds. i have actually taken data on this; it is absolutely astounding! [/quote]you are still in rookie mode if you still believe this. ee and particularly kiev are full of hotties… but stunner every 30 seconds? come on. their bodies are great, their faces often very average.[quote=stevie69]any opening line will do! the key is to make that first contact, just like anywhere, except that here the babes are far better looking and more open to your advances. a simple and direct: “hello, my name is ____” with an offer of a handshake works perfectly fine. it identifies you as a foreigner, and as being respectful of women. [/quote]true enough that any opening line is fine. point is to make contact. shaking hands is not really done between men and women in ee, but i suppose it doesn’t hurt. they’ll know you are a foreigner anyway by your speech.[quote=stevie69]when you are out with an eastern woman, she will make you feel like you are the king of the world. she will look hot and she will be with you! she will dance for you, hang by your arm, attract but ignore potential suitors, and make other man there wish he were you. [/quote]generally true, but never forget that if you want to get serious with your ee princess, by her nature she is inclined to trade you off for something better if she gets the chance. and yes, many of them will flirt with other guys while you go to the toilet/get a drink/make a call on your phone because if she is hot, she is getting hit on by other guys, particularly the locals especially if they are obviously some sort of local player. if she is so enamored and impressed by you after an afternoon together with your smalltalk, walk in the park and 15 words of russian, how do you think she is with a guy with even better game or offers her a more long-term perspective? just sayin’. if she’s that hot, she’s been here before or is looking to get there. just roll with it.[quote=stevie69]you just have to be shameless and talk to them. yes, occasionally, some will be ***** princesses and not talk back, but unlike back home, you can tell them to fuck off! do not worry, they are not friends of friends whom you will meet at the next office party! [/quote]you do have to be shameless and one does have to have a thick skin, because you will sometimes get brushed off or ignored. hope you are being figurative in saying fuck off. literally saying it will make you some “new friends” sooner or later. besides, just because she doesn't want to talk to you doesn't mean she is a ***** princess. maybe she just isn't interested. people in ee don't apologize for anything, they just do what they feel. girls included. they assume their actions will get the message across.[quote=stevie69]
they would look up, smile, speak a little english among themselves, just to make the point that they could. [/quote]that’s honestly never happened to me, it certainly isn’t typical. she must have been pretty interested in you.[quote=stevie69]
out of the 25 girls i had lined up, after much effort and many phone calls, i ended up meeting only 4, only one of which i liked. unfortunately, these girls are far more interesting than the walkers, but it is just not worth the trouble. [/quote]
pre-arranged dates often fall through, that’s why you should always have plan b, c, d…
[quote=stevie69]one last thing. shooters is a racist establishment. they decided i was arab (am i? it does not matter, that is the point, and yes, i understand a few words) and did not let me in. say no to racism, with your wallet. [/quote]shooter is full of “arabs” or other dark-skinned people any day of the week. call it racism i suppose, but i guess they just didn’t like your face. that can happen anywhere.

in any case man, thanks for the detailed report! i'm jealous, need to get back to kiev soon...

From Herr and Stevie, after reading Herr's post, I thought, is this what Kiev has become, guys who visit, resort to calling Gia and MT, and end up paying $300 for two hours with a gia girl, this is something I would never do. After reading Stevies post I felt it was; somewhat, too rosie. But, I haven't caroused in Kiev since 10-03, so I really don't know the situation there; but, I live in east Ukraine for 4 years already. The beauty of the girls, yes of course, many beauties, but one can see a lot of fat ones as well, the local diet is full of fatty foods and they fry everthing, it eventually catches up to many of them.

Approaching the girls, stevie is right act like a man and go for it, but if rejected, never, ever would I say f--- off, or something of that nature, I simply walk away, it's no big deal, happens to everyone, just go with it. Looks matter to these girls, and if your just average looking like me, well ok, I'm above average looking, but that's not the point, the point is you need to look and dress good, at all times, clean yourself up, well groomed, everyone mentions shoes, but it's not only shoes, these girls notice everthing, nice shoes, watch, shirt, ironed pants, mobile, purse, everything matters, and pay attention to these details. One thing I do now, is only approach girls who give me a few possitive non verble singles first, then if interested I make the move, and ommunicate is vital. I am not just talking about speaking Russian, you need to know how to communicate with these girls, these girls operate on emotions, so excit them! Make them happy, sad, laugh, tell them exciting (SHORT) stories, make good eye contact, look at them like your totally interested in them, and listen, listen and listen when they are talking, even if you know it's total bull shit and you're bored out of your mind, act like your totally interested. Excite thier emotions and these girls well want to see you again and again.

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For any of you who have not heard, and for those who want a more recent re-telling, the "loose money / dropped wallet" scam is still alive and well in Kiev.

I was walking from Maidan Independence to metro Teatralna around 7pm when a guy comes up and asks for Pushinskaya street (which we were standing on). I gave him my standard response, in Russian "I don't know. I'm a foreigner, " and he took off ahead of me, dropping a billfold in a plastic baggie from his shoulder bag.

Having read about this trick, I did not pick it up, but shouted to him "Hey, this is yours. " (All this in Russian. Maybe not grammatically correct, but comprehensible.)

The guy picks it up, thanks me. Shakes my hand and walks off. A second guy comes along (I later conclude he is part of the scam), and asks me about the first guy. "What happened? " He also asks where I'm from. I tell him I'm from the USA and he tells me his brother works as a taxi dispatcher in Brooklyn. (Plausible if you've ever been to Brooklyn).

On cue, the first guy reappears and asks the two of us if we found his pen! His pen, for heavens sake! No we didn't find your pen. Fifteen seconds later he's back and asks if we found another packet of his money. On cue, miraculously, a third guy appears, flashes his wallet ID and declares himself to be militsia (he is in uniform). He's obviously the accomplice of the first guy and they start their routine demanding to see my money "to see if it's his lost money. "

At this point, to my utter surprise, the second guy, the one "with a brother in Brooklyn, " opens his wallet, shows them and me a single U. S one hundred dollar bill and the grifter announces magnanimously that its not his. It takes me a minute to realize that the second guy has opened his wallet only to encourage me to open my wallet.

At this point, even though I know it's a scam, I forget the good advice posted in this forum.- where you demand to go to the police station.- and I figure I can talk my way out of it. All I have on me at the time is 300 grivna which I have just gotten from an ATM on Maidan. (That's probably where they spotted me). I tell them I have money but it's not his money. I tell them, in Russian, that I have a bankomat receipt for exactly the money in my pocket. I take it out, show the receipt, keep the guy from grabbing the money and put it back in my pocket.

Meanwhile I'm trying to make the guy say what money he lost. I tell him to write down what money he lost. I tell the militsia to write down what money we're supposed to be looking for, but the guy keeps demanding to see my wallet. I take some change out of my other pants pocket and I show it to him one coin a at time. One kopek, is this yours? I ask. I show it to the militsia. Is this his? A five kopek piece? Is this yours? (I'm trying to be sarcastic, but my Russian is not really that good.)

I keep this up, one coin at a time, until they begin to pull back. Then I tell them I have twenty dollars in my wallet and I show them my wallet. (Luckily I paid for my apartment that morning). They pull back. The first grifter apologizes and walks off. The militsia has already disappeared. The third guy, who I now peg for an accomplice, says good bye.

You can see why they run the scam: even if you are on to them, even if you don't pick up the money, even if you don't have much money on you, they have nothing to lose. Even if you insist on going to the police station, they merely risk the embarrassment of looking like bozos in front of the thieves/cops with whom they work. Still, next time that's what I'll do. If I have the presence of mind.

The other thing that makes sense is this: if you see the money on the ground, turn around and walk away, and find the militsia before he finds you. Tell him there is a thief up ahead.

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Yes, I saw that too. I suspect it was scam, but I avoided it by not being too honest, at least in thought. They guy dropped the money and I picked it up and followed him, for about a minute. He eventually turned around and I immediately gave him the money. He seemed thankful and then quickly pointed out he had 2 sets of bills. I shouted at him, in english telling him I knew the same and just walked away. He kept looking at me, and I quickly disappeared. I figure it was a legitimate error which he tried to turn into a scam (unlikely, but possible), or his colleague just had not kept up and by the time he turned he was alone. Yes, in the back of my mind I was thinking that if he did not eventually turn around I might keep the money, but luckily I did not have to make that decision.

About the other comment of things being too rosy. Well, RP girls ask for 300-400 USD sometimes, a "student" at Mandarin plaza wanted 300 EUro (or 400 USD), and all the girls parading around mandarin plaza and at the disco want at least 300 (photo included). The key is to use these obvious tourist places only to look, but conduct your search elsewhere. There are perfectly beautiful girls everywhere, who might be more reasonable about money, or want more than just your money.

one last thing. i did not imply act list an ass if you get turned down, but i do hate it when girls will not even bother to turn you down and simply look away, which yes, does happen. i am sorry, but rudeness begets rudeness; "turn the other cheek" is not my motto. anybody, man or woman, who ignores someone trying to talk to you, is simply a rude ass.

about being judged by your appearance, i was referring mostly to pros, or gold diggers. if it obvious you are trying and wearing your best suit, they will likely look at everything and a cheap suit might nullify the effects of an expensive watch, but with so many things to focus on, maybe they concentrate on the key ones. i do get the impression that shoes are important. why shoes? i do not know. women seem to be obsessed with shoes.

with non pros i had good success at the beach, wearing nothing but shorts (why do men there wear speedos?- it is unsightly!), or walking around main street dressed as a tourist (dress shorts, t-shirt, sneakers and camera).

It seems I generated a lot of criticisms, comments and discussion. It would be nice to have comprehensive reports as well. Maybe all these afterthoughts by me can be combined into a single reply?

About Shooters being racist, racism is not defined by the official policy, but rather by actions. Now that your friend is aware that the goons outside are setting up their own policies maybe he will take action. What action? well the goons could be fired. The outside sign saying that "face control in in effect, no questions asked" could be removed and replaced by a phone number foreigners could call to report such incidences. A specific dress code could be put in effect instead of a vague "face control".

The first thing the bouncers asked is whether I was tourist and then where I was from before calling someone and telling me I could not go in. The right lines are "welcome to shooters, please come in". It is a shame. I heard Shooters was good and the way I was treated at the door marred an otherwise great trip.

I disagre that sb should tell women to fuck off because they will gradually harden their attirude and start telling tourists to fuck off.Who would dare to have the same attitude in a western country for example to go to UK or Germany and tell the local girls to fuck off?
These people learn and learn fast and soon the moving of head to other direction will turn to blaming and conflict.There is enough damage foreigners have caused.

As for face control I never have had any problems.Mostly girls get rejected in high class clubs like Decadance if they do not look like models.
In order for a man to be rejected,well it goes a long way.
If sb inside the club suspects that you are an Arab or a Turk and grabs you,deny it and have your passport ready to prove that you are not Arab.If you give proper explanations,there is no problem.(since now).

It is always good to pass as a Pole in Ukraine and as an Ukrainian in Poland if they do not bother asking you where you are from.

Anyway this is my piece of advice.

[QUOTE=Stevie69]The outside sign saying that "face control in in effect, no questions asked" could be removed and replaced by a phone number foreigners could call to report such incidences. A specific dress code could be put in effect instead of a vague "face control".
[/QUOTE]If it happened to me I'd be pissed too. It has happened to me in Russia on rare occasion, but never in Ukraine. But besides your individual problem and the annoyance one feels when directly affected by it, there is nothing wrong with face control per se. It is there for a reason. Nobody has an inherent right to enter a club. It's not the public library.

If some doormen are abusing their power to express their racist frustrations, then I agree that it is pretty sad. Could also very well be that the management doesn't want too many of any particular foreign race or type of people to dominate the place. If it becomes too Turkish, too African, too hip-hop, too casual, too English or even too German for that matter, it could be the end of the club in terms of women coming, who are the honey pot that attracts more foreigners who like to waste their money on drinks and women. Every club has a target audience and Shooters is definitely mixed race with a mixture of foreign guys and locals who want to party.

And even if it were racism, do you really think anybody in Ukraine cares? Write a letter to the Kiev Post.

What about ugly girls getting rejected at the door or guys wearing ratty shoes? Is there a number they can call too?

That's business and believe it or not, that's the way it is done in most places. Shooters is harmless compared to some of the more upscale clubs.

I would say that in the upscale clubs security is ONLY interested in how loaded you are, and possibly whether the chick you're with comes up to scratch.

Shooters is not especially expensive and therefore accessible to local, average-earning Ukrainian guys. Hence there is probably some latent desire in the bouncers to bias things in favour of their countrymen. Not ideal, but that's life.

I'm sure most ordinary Ukrainians would be truly shocked that foreign guys are being prevented from entering clubs and chasing their women.. ;)

I stop reading the forum for two days and see a flurry of messages. :)

Here's a couple of points I'd like to make.

1) Only a chump shakes hands with a girl. Unless its business.

2) You are a little off on your taxi prices. I think locals are paying 110uah to/from the airport. 20-30uah will get you anywhere in the center and 50uah will take you anywhere the metro goes.

3) EE girls tend to be more slender then most western girls and tend to dress sexy otherwise they are about the same. I don't know about you but the American and Western European girls I have dated have been as attractive as any girl I've seen in Kyiv.

4) You talk a lot about not having to pay for sex but you don't mention actually having any. ;)

5) Oh, and one of my friends who is American (went to HS in the US) but is of Middle Eastern heritage got the bum rush from Shooters too.

6) Unless you are at the beach EE girls do not like men to wear shorts.

I might "have" to stay at Premier Palace sometime later this month for work reasons. I assume they are still girl-friendly and have a couple of overpriced lobby girls as well?

Anybody with current experience with this hotel?[QUOTE=Cruiser D]I stop reading the forum for two days and see a flurry of messages. :)
[/QUOTE]We missed you, that's all. Now get back to work.
[QUOTE=Cruiser D]1) Only a chump shakes hands with a girl. Unless its business.
[/QUOTE]Even in business it is considered quite awkward.[QUOTE=Cruiser D]5) Oh, and one of my friends who is American (went to HS in the US) but is of Middle Eastern heritage got the bum rush from Shooters too.[/QUOTE]Maybe Shooters does have a problem, yet every time I've been there it's been very international... like a UN convention, and Turkey had the chair. It sounds like the management is trying to maintain balance to me, which is a good thing even for Turkish and ME mongers. Too many of your own countrymen in one place will definitely spoil the soup, and that pretty much goes for all nationalities.

[quote=stevie69]one last thing. i did not imply act list an ass if you get turned down, but i do hate it when girls will not even bother to turn you down and simply look away, which yes, does happen. i am sorry, but rudeness begets rudeness; "turn the other cheek" is not my motto. anybody, man or woman, who ignores someone trying to talk to you, is simply a rude ass.[/quote]that's a cultural thing and may be sometimes genuine rudeness, but in most cases it's either a defense mechanism... even a "no" is sometimes signal enough for particularly aggressive guys to press their attack... or just their way of communicating non-interest for whatever reason.

now ask yourself, are you a guy who takes the no for an answer or do you use the opportunity to start your speel of "why nots", "let's just talk" or "can i buy you an ice cream?"... making sure of course to touch her arm while doing so?

i'm not directing this at you particularly, but if some women are annoyed with men and not interested in exchanging even the simplest of conversations i quite frankly understand them, especially if that conversation is to be in a language they may not speak or may not want to speak.

could also be she doesn't want to be seeing speaking to a foreigner, it can be bad for a girl's reputation in certain circles.[quote=stevie69]one last thing. i am sorry, but rudeness begets rudeness; "turn the other cheek" is not my motto. anybody, man or woman, who ignores someone trying to talk to you, is simply a rude ass.
[/quote]by the way, guys who spend their afternoons speaking to every random girl that crosses their path in hopes to have sex with her one or two times before casting her aside are considered pretty rude asses as well. maybe two rude asses do not a happy couple make?

as much as we mongers revel in the glory of our female conquests, many (perhaps even most) people look down upon hobbyists such as ourselves. that is why most of us chose to operate under the radar. doesn't bother me since we get way more pussy than they do, but it still doesn't surprise me when we receive the occasional lukewarm or icy welcome.

[QUOTE=Stevie69]Kiev report
...One of the questions they ask about this time is whether I am staying in a hotel or an apartment. I am not sure why this is one of the first questions, other than because of the difficulties you might have getting a girl past hotel security. But what do they care? The tip for the concierge will come from your pocket, not hers. If anybody can shed any light, please do so.[/QUOTE]
I did not have this exact thing happen to me, but certainly girls took note when I said I was staying in an apartment. (So did business associates, who in many trips still had not clued into this economical way to travel, and were impressed by my savvy - thank you ISG!) I think it is kind of a litmus test - do you know your way around, or are you just a tourist?

Plus some girls view (or used to, a few years ago) hotels with a stigma - hotels are for hookers. Of course, if you are at River Palace or Night Flight, this should not be a problem, because they are hookers. But some "normal" girls may balk at going to a hotel, because they are still pretending that they are just being sociable, not commiting to having sex.

I'm landing in Kiev tomorrow for some days, does anybody has a contact for Mystery Tramp ?
I read a lot of good and bad reports about her, I'm new to Kiev and will mainly point at regulars, but who knows what happens and MT seems to me as a plan b,c,d.....and a very kinki sex addicted...

If yes please PM me.
Thanks a lot,
Latin

[QUOTE=Ash1001]I would say that in the upscale clubs security is ONLY interested in how loaded you are, and possibly whether the chick you're with comes up to scratch.

Shooters is not especially expensive and therefore accessible to local, average-earning Ukrainian guys. Hence there is probably some latent desire in the bouncers to bias things in favour of their countrymen. Not ideal, but that's life.

I'm sure most ordinary Ukrainians would be truly shocked that foreign guys are being prevented from entering clubs and chasing their women.. ;)[/QUOTE]

I just have to add -

I entered Shooters with two women, maybe that works - ;)

<---Black Man from America, no issues in Kiev

[QUOTE=Gentleman Travel]I did not have this exact thing happen to me, but certainly girls took note when I said I was staying in an apartment. (So did business associates, who in many trips still had not clued into this economical way to travel, and were impressed by my savvy - thank you ISG!) I think it is kind of a litmus test - do you know your way around, or are you just a tourist?

Plus some girls view (or used to, a few years ago) hotels with a stigma - hotels are for hookers. Of course, if you are at River Palace or Night Flight, this should not be a problem, because they are hookers. But some "normal" girls may balk at going to a hotel, because they are still pretending that they are just being sociable, not commiting to having sex.[/QUOTE]It is also important to differentiate between hotels. The "Hyatt" has a whole different ring to it than the "Slavutich", which is named after a kind of beer. At least that's MY version of the story. :)

Still, if travelling privately or staying for more than a couple of days you should be in an apartment.

If the company is footing the bill and your stay is short, go for the Hyatt or Premier Palace to save the hassle of getting setup in your apartment.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Maybe Shooters does have a problem, yet every time I've been there it's been very international... like a UN convention, and Turkey had the chair. It sounds like the management is trying to maintain balance to me, which is a good thing even for Turkish and ME mongers. Too many of your own countrymen in one place will definitely spoil the soup, and that pretty much goes for all nationalities.[/QUOTE]Yeah I agree with this Shooters thing - I've personally never seen a problem and also see a lot of people (turkey) in there. I think one of the managers is turkish and one of the owners.

Maybe you got there too late? I have seen them only let in select people if its a really packed night and late.

[QUOTE=Telos]Yeah I agree with this Shooters thing - I've personally never seen a problem and also see a lot of people (turkey) in there. I think one of the managers is turkish and one of the owners.

Maybe you got there too late? I have seen them only let in select people if its a really packed night and late.[/QUOTE]Me? I've always gotten into Shooters with no problem. Some other posters with a darker look have had problems, whereas others have gotten in fine. I contend that although individual bouncers/doormen may have racial issues, the club itself isn't racist at all and just tries to maintain a balance of different nationalities.

I actually quite like that place, even though I've only scored there a couple of times and usually just got drunk. The atmosphere was usually fun though.

[QUOTE=Stevie69]It seems I generated a lot of criticisms, comments and discussion. It would be nice to have comprehensive reports as well. Maybe all these afterthoughts by me can be combined into a single reply?

About Shooters being racist, racism is not defined by the official policy, but rather by actions. Now that your friend is aware that the goons outside are setting up their own policies maybe he will take action. What action? well the goons could be fired. The outside sign saying that "face control in in effect, no questions asked" could be removed and replaced by a phone number foreigners could call to report such incidences. A specific dress code could be put in effect instead of a vague "face control".

The first thing the bouncers asked is whether I was tourist and then where I was from before calling someone and telling me I could not go in. The right lines are "welcome to shooters, please come in". It is a shame. I heard Shooters was good and the way I was treated at the door marred an otherwise great trip.[/QUOTE]Face control is important because they want beautiful people inside.I have never had any problem entering any upscale club anywhere even alone and with very cheap clothes.

I thank Stevie69 (do you like 69 very much, don't you? ) for his interesting report. That has some useful information and, if it is all true, you are a very successful boy In general, average men must work a lot to get some fucks.

I confirm Shooters' etiquette, only Ukrainians (or foreigners with UKrainians). The first time in November 2007, I went there with an American forumer but "security" men didn't want we got in. The second time, in June 2008, I went there with an Ukrainian, only he talked to "security" men, then a "security" man looked at me very carefully and, at last, we got in. This is a way to say "Ukrainian girls to Ukrainian boys only".

I'm curious if anyone has any experience with the dozens of Ukrainian marriage websites out there. Just for kicks, I did a google search and came back with a bunch of options.

I have no idea if they are scams or legit matching services though. Some of the girls on RWGlobe.com anyone would be lucky to marry, for example.

Obviously, these aren't sites designed for one night P4P. But for those looking for something more serious, are there any legit sites out there?

[QUOTE=Is Guide]I'm curious if anyone has any experience with the dozens of Ukrainian marriage websites out there. Just for kicks, I did a google search and came back with a bunch of options.

I have no idea if they are scams or legit matching services though. Some of the girls on RWGlobe.com anyone would be lucky to marry, for example.

Obviously, these aren't sites designed for one night P4P. But for those looking for something more serious, are there any legit sites out there?[/QUOTE]

Elena's Models seems to work okay. I paid for three email addresses and I'm still in contact with one, one didn't get back to me after sending her a picture, strange she already knew what I looked like. One is from one of the 'Stans and not really my type looks wise. The last one is 21 and from Crimea and working during the summer, has been out of the country and speaks pretty good English and one of the few on Elena's surprisingly enough looking for an African-American. Its also the same site another friend of mine who is Black as well, found and married his wife.

I'm also on Lucky Lovers; met the girl I hooked up with in Kiev on that site.

Overall I'm not too pleased I think I can do better, but I think I have limited prospects in the EE so I need to "spread myself around" on many sites to maximuize my success rate.

With that said I'm not giving up on Western European women as there no Visa issues and level of conversational English is usually higher, unlike Ukraine/Russia when the best English speaking girls are most often models, escorts, tennis players or work for multi-national companies.... Larrisa the 34 year old Kiev single mother and Lena the 21 year old student have would I would call English level about 4, not quite conversational, Larrisa actually used a dictionary at times during our chats on Yahoo..lol

My next trip will include visting local marraige agencies, many of the web sites out there have local offices as well.

If you Google "Russian Women Forum" you should come up with a good forum about this subject and is frequented by both American Men and Russians women, not all whom are married. I didn't link it here because as you say the main focus of this site is P4P or Short Term relationship with thought to Long Term if smitten by somebody.

You also might want Google "Russian Women Blacklist" which should give you a list of the best sites to use and the ones that report Rip-offs, shake-downs, etc.

Doc seems to like Bride.ru and they use "face control" on that site under "Gold, Silver and Free". You can guess how many "hotties" you'll find under "Gold" compared to "Free" but a few decent ones fall through the cracks for whatever reason, so its recommended as well.

Good Luck and maybe Jackson should add a Sub Forum around here about this subject.

Not to make this post any longer, but there's hope for you even though changes on the ground make it seem more diffcult. The only thing that has become harder actually is bagging freebies just because your a Westerner, Decent Looking and Young. I takes at least ONE date and you have to appear sincere. Fail that and nothing will happen. Sounds like home huh? Well not really, because if your in pursuit of a serious relationship the numbers don't lie; Western men because of several reasons are not following through with the women they contact through web sites and agencies. Which means less men visiting and more women available...

What you have to avoid is Professional Daters.... That's the challenge now.

[QUOTE=Is Guide]I'm curious if anyone has any experience with the dozens of Ukrainian marriage websites out there. Just for kicks, I did a google search and came back with a bunch of options.

I have no idea if they are scams or legit matching services though. Some of the girls on RWGlobe.com anyone would be lucky to marry, for example.

Obviously, these aren't sites designed for one night P4P. But for those looking for something more serious, are there any legit sites out there?[/QUOTE]
Elenas Models seems semi-legit.
I have met a couple of girls from there, and corresponded seriously with a few others. I think some of the girls there are serious about marriage/relationships, but there are a reasonable number of "good time girls". And of course, some scammers.

Lucky Lovers seems to have even more "real" women and a very low scammer ratio.

So, lots of nice girls, but not as explicitly available for sex as appears to the case on some other sites.

Thanks guys.

May someone tells us what is the address of RP and if there is another place in Kiev similaire to this one?

Where we could find apartment in Kiev for next week?

Thank you

Every taxi driver in Kyiv knows the words 'River Palace' in english. Or do you plan on sending them a letter? If you really have to know their address google 'River Palace, Kyiv, Kiev', they have a webpage.

If you want to find apartment agencies that have been mentioned in this forum use the search feature. Or google 'apartments, kyiv, kiev'.

Good luck.

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]Every taxi driver in Kyiv knows the words 'River Palace' in english. Or do you plan on sending them a letter? If you really have to know their address google 'River Palace, Kyiv, Kiev', they have a webpage.

If you want to find apartment agencies that have been mentioned in this forum use the search feature. Or google 'apartments, kyiv, kiev'.

Good luck.[/QUOTE]

Yep every taxi driver knows where it is in English, nothing to fear. With Telos it was onwards and upwards!

read this very interesting article:

[url]http://www.kyivpost.com/nation/29364/print/[/url]

River Palace is a big business of Western people and this forum is a shop glass of that big business.

A lot of comments here are about Western business in Kiev and this is a reason because very few people blame about prices.

I am curious to try prostitutes where Western business are harder to get in. Maybe price goes down and quality goes up.

What about prostitution in Slavic countries, what is the problem? Prostitution is a Slavic background: in the past, hotels needed young blankets for their customers and girls needed money for their marriage settlements.

I bet those young studentkas loved dressing up like that ;)

AC, will you stop whining and complaining about the prices in Kyiv - please go some place else if you can't handle it in Kyiv. Simple.

As far as River Palace goes, it doesn't seem to do half the business (girls going home with guys - RP's itself seems to be fine) it did before 2005. Any of you long time veterans care to comment? Although RP isn't the place to go to find a 8 or a 9 to rock you world all night for $100-$150. It's still an enjoyable place to go to interact with the pro's and see where their head is at. Occasionally you will bump into a semi pro. And the downstairs bar is nice when there isn't a live band playing.

If you have money and you think you are very smart, that is the place you should go.

A brief business trip is bringing me to Kiev next week, have a Wednesday and Thursday night to play with. When I say night I mean AFTER midnight until about 3 or 4 max since I have business dinners at night and work again 9ish. Not going to even contact any regular gfs or pro contacts. Want something new.

Methinks Arena or RP best bet, as I really won't have time to pursue any freebies.

Anybody with recent Arena experience? What was pro/non-pro scene like?

I've read the recent reports saying anywhere from $150-300 for Arena type studentki hooking. Any other recent experience?

Just for arguments sake, about $150 is all I would pay, which could make RP a challenge. Probably better off at Arena... or maybe just try Shooters and see if any semi-pros are hooking there.

Thoughts? Any other ideas club-wise? Not interested in salons or agencies.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]A brief business trip is bringing me to Kiev next week, have a Wednesday and Thursday night to play with. When I say night I mean AFTER midnight until about 3 or 4 max since I have business dinners at night and work again 9ish. Not going to even contact any regular gfs or pro contacts. Want something new.

Methinks Arena or RP best bet, as I really won't have time to pursue any freebies.

Anybody with recent Arena experience? What was pro/non-pro scene like?

I've read the recent reports saying anywhere from $150-300 for Arena type studentki hooking. Any other recent experience?

Just for arguments sake, about $150 is all I would pay, which could make RP a challenge. Probably better off at Arena... or maybe just try Shooters and see if any semi-pros are hooking there.

Thoughts? Any other ideas club-wise? Not interested in salons or agencies.[/QUOTE]


Full of pick ups... but no idea on price... ask Irish Lad he may know...

But I got two "indipendent" 6 in face and 8 in body Valeria and Oksana for 300/night plus dinner so 150/200 might be OK

IT

here I copied and pasted...

Two nights with Valeria (21, 160 and 45 or so) and Oksana (23, 165 and 50 English speaking) a nice semi lesbian couple, nothing exceptional, but good, nice, well educated and stunningly cheap 300 USD + dinner for both. Got them from Hecker, unfortunately they did not do all…

The best was surely when Valeria was laying on me, cock inside, kissing, and Oksana was taking care of my balls making a tongue bath to them… got the orgasm without that Valeria moved… Oksana is a nice licker (covered) and Valeria is perfect at cow girl… the first evening she come with dying hot pants and white boots, sometimes I really like when whor** are dressed like who***!

Both have very very nice bodies and 5-6 rated faces, but Valeria (a brunette) is really getting you hard!

Total damage for Valeria and Oksana:
Two nights at 300 $ each (for both!)
Two Cialis at 20 $ each
Two dinner for three at approx 400 Grivnas each (one sushi and one BBQ style)

[QUOTE=It Travel]Full of pick ups... but no idea on price... ask Irish Lad he may know...

But I got two "indipendent" 6 in face and 8 in body Valeria and Oksana for 300/night plus dinner so 150/200 might be OK

IT

here I copied and pasted...

Two nights with Valeria (21, 160 and 45 or so) and Oksana (23, 165 and 50 English speaking) a nice semi lesbian couple, nothing exceptional, but good, nice, well educated and stunningly cheap 300 USD + dinner for both. Got them from Hecker, unfortunately they did not do all…

The best was surely when Valeria was laying on me, cock inside, kissing, and Oksana was taking care of my balls making a tongue bath to them… got the orgasm without that Valeria moved… Oksana is a nice licker (covered) and Valeria is perfect at cow girl… the first evening she come with dying hot pants and white boots, sometimes I really like when whor** are dressed like who***!

Both have very very nice bodies and 5-6 rated faces, but Valeria (a brunette) is really getting you hard!

Total damage for Valeria and Oksana:
Two nights at 300 $ each (for both!)
Two Cialis at 20 $ each
Two dinner for three at approx 400 Grivnas each (one sushi and one BBQ style)[/QUOTE]Thanks for the info.. will probably try Arena since it is within walking distance of my hotel.

Just remembered I have the number from a stripper I never met a second time as well as some RP girls I ended up abandoning at the bar.. may try them as well.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Thanks for the info.. will probably try Arena since it is within walking distance of my hotel.

Just remembered I have the number from a stripper I never met a second time as well as some RP girls I ended up abandoning at the bar.. may try them as well.[/QUOTE]


Good! And report us please... I think to another sex week... ;)

In my opinion the best way is just going and sit at the bar... order something and keep an eye on the tables... usually full of teens from 7-8 pm up to 12... then deciste which you can pick up... ;)

Usually I rent a flat exactly in front of the entrance of Mandarin so I'm not more far than 50 m from Arena and from a couple of nice bars where I can have a good breakfast. Some in the underground city (in the middle part just under the little square in front of the merket) have even "Illy caffè" a must for Italians... and the underground pub beside ul. Baseina number 5 opens at 11 and make excellent breakfast with eggs, bacon, etc...

If you need a good restaurant in walking distance (but no pick up there), on ground in my taste ARENA food is so so, you gan get at Pervak, just around the corner and next block [url]www.pervak.kiev.ua[/url]

At the corner of the little and short Rogodieniskaya and Kreshatik... not more than 150 meters, not cheap (a good dinner will go for 100 USD for two), not western, but good international cooking, good georgian wine, good beer, they have Illy Caffè too... different areas inside, and a nice and luxurious place to "work" a normal girl to get her in bed. Worked with miss U., with Ira and others... ;)

Casual with no sneakers is OK, open to the last customer leave.

Happy hunting

It

Of course you are in a Hotel, but I write this for others too... ;) Notice that Mystery Tramp is at work again... ah ah she was on flirt some days ago... unfortunately Lol...ita is definly gone :( She is my best fuck, BBBJ + CIM + COF GFE ever... 9/10 just because no Anal.

Hi somebody has info?

[url]http://flirt.com.ua/blestyawaakukla/[/url]

Looking for a sponsor... 18, skinny... real pig face... interested in $$$

Exactly what's needed for a nice weekend in Kiev!

Thanks in advance...

IT

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]read this very interesting article:

What about prostitution in Slavic countries, what is the problem? Prostitution is a Slavic background: in the past, hotels needed young blankets for their customers and girls needed money for their marriage settlements.[/QUOTE]

Hi you were just searching for Vika... the black hairde girl... found some messagers in my flirt com.ua private mai...

I suppose she is the one answering so...

приветик
60 уе час 100 уе два часа
класика орал анал куни страпон
остальное по договоренности
живу сама рядом с метро политех

Already sended the telephone number by PM

IT

Thanks. This is the evidence I always say the truth. Unfortunately for you, mongers, these are prices of 2007 and Vika is not working in Kiev (and Ukraine) anymore. Go, go to River Palace and pay 100/200 $ hour for an easy pussy fucking. The truth is very different from what people usually say!



[QUOTE=It Travel]Hi you were just searching for Vika... the black hairde girl... found some messagers in my flirt com.ua private mai...

I suppose she is the one answering so...

приветик
60 уе час 100 уе два часа
класика орал анал куни страпон
остальное по договоренности
живу сама рядом с метро политех

Already sended the telephone number by PM

IT[/QUOTE]

How are the chances for mongering during Christmas time in Kiev? I was there a couple of times, but not during last two weeks of December. Any info will be appreciated.

[QUOTE=Kris420]How are the chances for mongering during Christmas time in Kiev? I was there a couple of times, but not during last two weeks of December. Any info will be appreciated.[/QUOTE]
1. It might be Christmas for you but for most Ukrainians its not.
2. Its just like any other week accept the last week everyone is loking forward to new year.

Kris, if you want help, RTFF and use the "search" function - type in the word "Christmas" and you will see many reports from past years accurately describing the situation here.

That time of year is basically a wasteland unless you have fully prepared and have a lot of ladies waiting just for you. Otherwise so many go off for holidays in Egypt or just go home to their parents elsewhere in the country. The 25th is a normal workday, this year the winter holiday starts the 27th until about January 12 - January 7 is the Orthodox Chistmas and it is a national holdiay here.

[QUOTE=Uke Boy]Kris, if you want help, RTFF and use the "search" function - type in the word "Christmas" and you will see many reports from past years accurately describing the situation here.

That time of year is basically a wasteland unless you have fully prepared and have a lot of ladies waiting just for you. [/QUOTE]Uke, speaking of wasteland, I am in Kiev for a couple of days on business and Kiev (just like Moscow) is pretty much a wasteland in August.

It's no surprise for me and totally expected as I've been here in August before, but it should be repeated for newbies. It's not the best time of year, especially for freebies.

Thankfully I wasn't interested at all in freebies tonight (a Wednesday night), since I didn't finish business until about midnight.

Summing it up:
* called stripper contact, she's on holiday but will fuck me next time when she is in Kiev. About $180/800 Grv.

* went to Arena, didn't even go in. Dead.

* 112 (or whatever it is called now) also dead.

* went to River Palace, paid 40 to get there. Was packed, but as the girls told me it was packed with durachki/idiots... i.e. tourist guys who wanted to laugh and have fun groping the girls pretending to be princes but don't have enough money to actually take one home. Sorry guys if you are in this group, they hate you.

* fair but unspectacular squad of girls, mostly 6- 8 quality

* girl who said she is "about 18" offered $500 at 12.15, I countered with $250 and told her to come back after she'd thought about it. She looked older than 18, it might have been her marketing ploy. She was tall and skinny with good tits and mile-long legs, about 1,78 (5'10"), brunette. Olessia. One of the 8s.

* about 45 min later left with same girl for $250, paid 70 grv for taxi out front (he wanted 100) and fucked her silly in Premier Palace, no prob with security.

* passionate kissing, BBBJ, all positions, no anal, 2x sex, some pictures, very, very good sex.

* me happy camper, even though $250 was more than I like as I usually like to spend no more than $200, though felt wasn't going to "escape" at 1.30 for less as RP was full of guys. Drank nothing, bought her or others nothing, so extra costs $0.

* after I kicked her out about 3.00 (2 hours) even though we'd agreed on 4.00 (3 hours) as I had to wake up early the next day, she said she's going back to RP to try for $500... sloppy seconds. We laughed. She might get it, she was one of the top 5 there.

* gave her 50 grv taxi cash, I was sex drunk, what can I say.

* didn't get her number as I (almost) never screw a pro twice. That's what girlfriends are for.

So is life in Kiev in August.

Just for argument's sake, I speak Russian quite well. May or may not help, I don't know anymore... but tend to think it will make your overall experience better.

Sounds like the two crews deserve each other - the scheming ho's and the time wasting tourists.

Very bad for giving her 50uah for taxi money after paying $250, knowing she was going back to RP.

A few years ago I think it helped if you spoke Russian at RP. I don't think it does now. Unless you come across the rare semi pro.

Just think in another week or so the city will be packed with fresh university girls. :)

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]

* went to River Palace, paid 40 to get there. Was packed, but as the girls told me it was packed with durachki/idiots... i.e. tourist guys who wanted to laugh and have fun groping the girls pretending to be princes but don't have enough money to actually take one home. Sorry guys if you are in this group, they hate you.

* after I kicked her out about 3.00 (2 hours) even though we'd agreed on 4.00 (3 hours) as I had to wake up early the next day, she said she's going back to RP to try for $500... sloppy seconds. We laughed. She might get it, she was one of the top 5 there.

* gave her 50 grv taxi cash, I was sex drunk, what can I say.



Just for argument's sake, I speak Russian quite well. May or may not help, I don't know anymore... but tend to think it will make your overall experience better.[/QUOTE]

You are inflating the prices!!! ;)

250 for 2 hours.. Phone to the Mystery Tramp... ;) she gets 400 but all nighter...

Don't worry, just joking ...

IT

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Uke, speaking of wasteland, I am in Kiev for a couple of days on business and Kiev (just like Moscow) is pretty much a wasteland in August. [/QUOTE]

Skank,
Been waiting for your report. Sounds like it was an underwhelming visit with the exception of the RP Pro. For those of us who don't know, please tell why Kiev is so dead in August. And more to the point, when does it pick up again? I am probably going to be in Kiev September 13 - 16. It's my first time in Kiev and I have no clue where to go so I am taking my pointer from you and the boys on the forum. A buddy from Moscow may join me but he hasn't been in Kiev for years so I am anticipating that he will not be much help at all.

The one thing I do have going for me is that I do speak some Ukrainian. Or perhaps it will be a liability? I grew up speaking Ukrainian as my family is originally form there. The only problem is that I have the Ukrainian vocabulary of a 10 year old!!!!!! Who knows, maybe the "diwchinkas" will find that endearing? Maybe not.

Back to business - so what I am hearing is that River Palace is a bit of a hike from the center of town but it is a pretty sure bet for pros? True?

Arena sounds like a nightclub with both pros and amateurs. True?

Since you have the phone number of a stripper in Kiev, I am assuming that there is a strip bar that might be worth visiting as well. Yes?

For those who are itching to tell me to RTFF, I have combed it carefully and the information that seems to be specific also appears to be quite dated.

I have invested some time on Mamba trying to scare up some amateur recruit action and am getting nowhere. Not even a nibble. Even the girls who are bordered in pink are not answering my charming inquiries. Is Mamba not the right dating site for Kiev? Just to make sure it was not just "me" I went trolling for recruits in Moscow and got plenty so there must be something about Mamba and Kiev.

I am headed to Kiev after 3 days in Ashgabat (T-stan) and have no idea what-so-ever how THAT's going to turn out in the mongering department but will be sure to write a report.

Thanks, in advance, for any tips, directions, phone numbers, and recommendations in Kiev.

Jake

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]Sounds like the two crews deserve each other - the scheming ho's and the time wasting tourists.

Very bad for giving her 50uah for taxi money after paying $250, knowing she was going back to RP. [/QUOTE][QUOTE=It Travel]You are inflating the prices!!! ;)

250 for 2 hours.. Phone to the Mystery Tramp... ;) she gets 400 but all nighter...

Don't worry, just joking ...

IT[/QUOTE]I thought I might get some flak for paying $250 and I admit it is more than I prefer to spend, but here's my comments.

* It was either $250 or a) nothing and sleeping with a hard-on needing relief or b) waiting until 3 am and saving $50.

* $250/2 hours is high-end compared to other options. Nonetheless, we agreed on longer (she would've stayed as long as I wanted most probably, at least 3 hours), but I needed sleep as I had to work next day. She didn't leave, I kicked her out.

* IT, I hear what you are saying but a) very rarely do I like all-nighters, as I usually need some sleep for either work or if not working, maintaining my grueling freebie schedule. b) I don't like fucking the same ho twice. Why? c)MT? You have to be kidding.

* Cruiser of course you are right, she didn't need taxi money but a) we'd already agreed on it before and b) I was sex drunk and c) it's $10. WTF.
[QUOTE=Jake993]Skank,
Been waiting for your report. Sounds like it was an underwhelming visit with the exception of the RP Pro.
Thanks, in advance, for any tips, directions, phone numbers, and recommendations in Kiev.

Jake[/QUOTE]Jake:
* I really enjoyed RP actually, which is rare for me. I usually dislike the place. But ever since I fucked my secretary at work a couple weeks ago, I've been in a good mood.

* I'd arrived from Moscow where I had been in the SwissOtel for 3 nights and banged 3 freebies (2 previous contacts), so a no-hassle pro sounded good... besides, it was pretty dead in the Arena clubs I checked out on that Wednesday night.

* River Palace is ONLY pros. It's Kiev's Night Flight. It's fairly central, but you'll need a taxi.

* Arena is pros and amateurs, yes. It's not really popular among the Kiev in crowd, but tourist girls, village girls and pros go there. It's the McDonald's of discos, which can either be good or bad depending on your perspective. Will probably go there tonight.

* September is GREAT. As Cruiser mentioned, new university girls arrive all horny and tan from their summer holidays.

* August sucks because a) many girls on holiday and b) university not in session, lots of talent goes home. Actually, Moscow is similar in some ways, but the lack of girls is more extreme in Kiev. Odessa is just the opposite. I go there tomorrow.

* Speaking Ukrainian, even if childish, will definitely be a boon.

* Very good dating/freebie scene, but beware of scams and the scene is a bit different from Moscow. In a way it's more basic.

* There are a couple of strip locales, PM me.

Hey guys, I'm in Kiev a few days from the 26th. Anyone want to touch base and share a few beers?

Michael Gage

[QUOTE=Jake993]. I have invested some time on Mamba trying to scare up some amateur recruit action and am getting nowhere. Not even a nibble. Jake[/QUOTE]Not certain if Mamba is one of the many 'sister sites' to love. Mail. Ru? If it is, I can't beleive you are having troubles. I have used love since early 2005, am 50, no russian, and I get many, Many, MANY to respond!

Must be my 'charm'.

LS Guy

Kiev is dry on cheap prices. Last winter one agency I used was $70-80 and now 135-160. I met a hot girl I can't share info on that was fantastic. I also met a 32 year old off Flirt that gave me the best bbbj I ever felt, made me explode and swallowed without hesitation. Never felt anything like brought me to the border of cumming three times and finished the fourth. Licked me head to toe. She had and enjoyed complete control. She also had the wettest pussy (naturally no lube) that I ever felt. She made the trip worth while. This ran me $180 for two hours but she stayed much longer, and I believe would have spent the night.

I tried another girl after her (19) and could barely even get off, to mechanical. In all paid $800 for 3 girls and one for nothing

Prices are to high in Kiev to go for sex alone, I don't understand people that do it for no other reason. Going to enjoy Kiev and having sex while there is a different story.

[QUOTE=MichaelGage]Hey guys, I'm in Kiev a few days from the 26th. Anyone want to touch base and share a few beers?

Michael Gage[/QUOTE]

Let me throw the following into ring, for what it is worth, re MichaelGage. Never met the gentleman and he does absent himself from posting for extended periods. However, MichaelG's long past posts (still available) were some of the very informative ones that piqued my interest in ISG and the valuable information to found in ISG and from its band of mongers globably continues.

I won't be anywhere near Kiev from the 26th, but cheers and monger on Michael ! If I was, I certainly would want to meet the man and share a few beers and tales.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]* September is GREAT. As Cruiser mentioned, new university girls arrive all horny and tan from their summer holidays.[/QUOTE]It really makes sense. These girls were on the beaches looking for summer romance. There was a huge shortage of men, both locals, rich Russians, Arabs, Turks, and not to forget THE Westerners. The scene could be best described by a DROUGHT. So these girls could not wait for their holiday to get over to come back to Kiev and sleep with foreigners.

It all makes sense. I cannot wait to visit Kiev in September.

Thanks for the tip .

Do you have a man crush on MG? ;)

Doc, how's Kyiv? Too busy to report? Have some nacho's at Friday's for me. :)

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]
* IT, I hear what you are saying but a) very rarely do I like all-nighters, as I usually need some sleep for either work or if not working, maintaining my grueling freebie schedule. b) I don't like fucking the same ho twice. Why? c)MT? You have to be kidding.

.[/QUOTE]

Was just joking doc!!!

You know I do the contrary (overnights and often the same girls...) happy hunting...

IT

[QUOTE=Markharding]It really makes sense. These girls were on the beaches looking for summer romance. There was a huge shortage of men, both locals, rich Russians, Arabs, Turks, and not to forget THE Westerners. The scene could be best described by a DROUGHT. So these girls could not wait for their holiday to get over to come back to Kiev and sleep with foreigners.

It all makes sense. I cannot wait to visit Kiev in September.

Thanks for the tip .[/QUOTE]Are you attempting sarcasm? ) September is infinitely better than August for girls in Kiev.[QUOTE=Cruiser D]Do you have a man crush on MG? ;)

Doc, how's Kyiv? Too busy to report? Have some nacho's at Friday's for me. :)[/QUOTE]Cruiser, Kiev was just a roadbump on my way to Odessa... am there now.. :)[QUOTE=Jake993]I have invested some time on Mamba trying to scare up some amateur recruit action and am getting nowhere. Not even a nibble. Even the girls who are bordered in pink are not answering my charming inquiries. Is Mamba not the right dating site for Kiev? Just to make sure it was not just "me" I went trolling for recruits in Moscow and got plenty so there must be something about Mamba and Kiev. [/QUOTE]As a lot of Kiev students and or employees are out of the city, alot of them are also not online. It'll pick up. Besides, Mamba takes patience and a lot of groundwork. I hate it since I am lazy and bored with i-chat, but it does pay dividends so keep it up.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]As a lot of Kiev students and or employees are out of the city, alot of them are also not online. It'll pick up. Besides, Mamba takes patience and a lot of groundwork. I hate it since I am lazy and bored with i-chat, but it does pay dividends so keep it up.[/QUOTE]

Good call. It has been slow, but I was persistent and got a few nibbles. I got a reply (and an email) from a girl who claims to be an independent pro who works out of her apartment. From her photos she appears to have a rock hard body at 42 Kg and promises to be into all of the fun things that would make me want to pursue the lead.

Does anyone have any experience with the girls (from Kiev) who work the dating sites and are pros who operate out of their apartments? Good? Bad? Safe? Not? On the surface they appear be similar to the girls who have the same type of business in Moscow.

Anyone? ........ Anyone? ......... Behuler? (sorry- old joke).

I wish I had visited Roksolana's massage place as soon as I got to Kiev as I would have enjoyed more than my quick one-off visit. See [url]http://roksolana-massage.com.ua/eng/massage/[/url] for phone number. They have moved to 3a st. Tarasivska but the general area is the same. I find it easy to take the Metro to Universitets then take the path that goes between the medical center and botanical garten to Tasasivska. Their place is a 100m further past Lva Tolstova on the E. side of the street.

It took multiple phone calls to work out an appointment, but I was finally told which floor to visit and Dasha, who has some English, met me and introduced me to Natasha. "She will give your massage." Natasha seemed shy and not the usual brash, smoky sex-worker I've encountered in Kiev so often. She took my Hr. 300 (for an hour--if only I could have lasted that long!) and showed me to a nice bath for a solo shower. I then lay face down on a clean sheet on a nice bed in a very clean and efficient bedroom and she oiled up my back from shoulders to legs, then more oil for herself, and proceeded to give me a lovely oiled body-to-body massage with lots of squishing, pressing, and friction from her lovely, 23-something body with full breasts and shapely bottom. No flat buns on Natasha!

After some time (who can keep track of time under those circs?) she flipped me, oiled up the front, and proceeded to a similar series of rubs--front to front, front to side, front to back, breast to face, buns to groin--it was, to a B2B newbie such as myself, freaking awesome. I was getting a bit too close with the "rod between the buns" position so I got her to switch to a doggie style that gave me great visuals (shaved) and she turned her manual attention to my penis. It was a fabulous finish, and she didn't quit until I was screaming and pounding for her to stop.

Another shower to cleanup, and throughout the initial cleanup, shower, and redressing Natasha sat around looking cuter than any Penthouse model. If fact, she could easily have been better looking than 90% of the babes at [url]http://www.kindgirls.com[/url], and that's saying a lot.

So there you go--cheap, clean, safe, non-smoking, and very satisfying. Not recommended if you must have FS/oral, as that is apparently not on the menu, but hey, I'm a foreigner and we never *really* know what's going on.

PS The posted phone numbers are +38 044 2280848 and +38 067 2795085.

[QUOTE=Gamma Ray 007]

So there you go--cheap, clean, safe, non-smoking, and very satisfying. Not recommended if you must have FS/oral, as that is apparently not on the menu, but hey, I'm a foreigner and we never *really* know what's going on.
.[/QUOTE]

GR7 - thanks for the tip. Will put it to good use in a few weeks.

[QUOTE=Jake993]Good call. It has been slow, but I was persistent and got a few nibbles. I got a reply (and an email) from a girl who claims to be an independent pro who works out of her apartment. From her photos she appears to have a rock hard body at 42 Kg and promises to be into all of the fun things that would make me want to pursue the lead. [/QUOTE]Sounds like a good thing.

I can only repeat my experience that getting laid with a pro (or regular gf) to start a mongering trip gives your mojo a kick start and will help you enter any normal dating situation with the right cockiness. Helps me anyway.

As for Mamba, keep plugging away. It can take time to get good leads, it doesn't take to long to figure out which contacts are a waste of time. A lot of girls are there just to chat. Filter them out.

Gamma Ray 007

You are so right. I have enjoyed several fantastic massages, notably from a student at Premier Palace that I just happened to bump into in the lobby as her booking had let her down!! We all get lucky sometimes? She seemed like quite a newbie looking to earn some extra cash and tried very hard to please! Your report made me LoL as it was just as tough for me to concentrate, as she was about 19 and fucking fit!!!

Often thought about trying the place you mentioned in your report, but never got around to it. Maybe next visit?

Fox7717

I was on my way to my apartment on Lesi Ukrainki Blvd. When all of a sudden this blond hair guy finds a bag on the ground. Acting surprised he show's me it's a bag full of cash. He was very convincing. Then he offers to spilt half of it with me. My greed got the best of me and I said okay. At the last moment I said "no I don't want it, you keep it" because I remembered reading in some forum about this scam. With in 15 seconds another guy claims he lost a lot of money. I believe the scam goes like this, If I had taken the money, the other man who conveniently showed up just before the transfer, would have said that was his money. He would count it and say there is some missing. He would accuse me of keeping some of his money. He would harass me and call me a thief. He would then threaten to call the police, until I paid him the remainder of the missing money. Fortunately I remembered the the article that one of our fellow hobbyist wrote.

Also a friend of mine in Kiev told me an associate of his had won $2000 at River Palace. He was going to take a taxi home, but a car just happened to pull up and offered to take them where they were going. The girl he met at RP said it was better to take the car because it was cheaper then the taxi. He reluctantly agreed. He didn't realize it at the time, but the girl slipped some drugs in his drink while he was inside RP. He woke up in some alley with all his money stolen. So my fellow hobbyist always keep your eye your drink. If you're unsure about it get a new one! And if you are carrying a lot of cash on you. It's better take the taxi! Play it safe unless you are absolutely sure you can trust the girl your taking to your apartment or hotel.

On my next report I will write about a great experience I had at a massage parlor in Kiev.

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]

[QUOTE=Fox7717] notably from a student at Premier Palace that I just happened to bump into in the lobby as her booking had let her down!! [/QUOTE]Speaking of Premier Palace, it is a great no-hassles girl-friendly hotel with a perfect location.

Rooms OK... probably 4 star by international standards, but overall 5 star ambience.

One thing though... I KNOW there must be lobby girls, especially based on the reports here... but in a casual glance around I personally didn't see any in the lobby or lobby bar from about 11pm-1am. No prob for me as I ended up going RP, but still thought it was curious. Wednesday and Thursday night.

Maybe I missed something?

Anybody try the strip cabaret upstairs? Any action there? I didn't try due to business commitments, but saw some hotties headed that way.

Dr Skank,

Agree PP Hotel is fine if rather soulless and rooms are a bit drab.

I have seen several lobby girls, but crap quality. Staff always look bored?

Tried The Opera last time, which was better I thought, apart from location.

Anyway, I had a good look around Taboo 'nightclub' It's quite impressive & classy. The girls were just awesome!! but it's obvious you will spend a small fortune before even a sniff of take out and so decided to leave it until I have something to celebrate and feeling stupid! (Overall would cost $2,000+ I think)

Fox7717

A note about Rio & River Palace: Most of these girls, especially those who haven't been in the business for a long time, are looking actually for a permanent sponsor. If you are in Kiev for a long trip or come here on a regular basis, you can easily turn many of these girls into freebies relatively quickly, given you are willing to invest some time and energy. The first time you take them home, treat them real nice, like a girlfriend. If there is chemistry between you and the sex was good, next day SMS them thanking for a great night and say something like you are looking forward to see them again. Invite them to your apartment a few days later and pay again. Then invite them to a regular date: to dinner, movies, bowling, skating etc. The 3rd or 4th time around you will probably not need to pay at all. Once you establish the trust, they will be more than happy to accompany you for free to vacations in Turkey, Egypt, Crimea etc. Of course you pay all expenses at all times...

Either way you are still paying. I haven't met a FSU girl yet who wasn't more then happy to go on an all expense paid vacation.

And a lot of girls working at River Palace do have sponsors, you figure that one out. ;) So whenever your GFE is at 'momma's' or out with the girls she's probably picking up some spare change at RP.

Dr S, there used to be quite a few very expensive, very good looking lobby girls at PP. I haven't actually been in PP in two years so my intel is not current.

Cruiser D

I think maybe your memories are playing 'tricks' with you?

Stayed at PP several times over past c2 years and lobby girls have been crap!

Would not even think about it!

Maybe it was a bit longer then that. As the Kyiv nightlife and sugar daddy scene developed PP must have become less then an ideal location for the hot girls. Up until 2005 it was one of very few upscale locations.

I miss those days. :)

[QUOTE=Hedonist]A note about Rio & River Palace: Most of these girls, especially those who haven't been in the business for a long time, are looking actually for a permanent sponsor. If you are in Kiev for a long trip or come here on a regular basis, you can easily turn many of these girls into freebies relatively quickly, given you are willing to invest some time and energy. The first time you take them home, treat them real nice, like a girlfriend. If there is chemistry between you and the sex was good, next day SMS them thanking for a great night and say something like you are looking forward to see them again. Invite them to your apartment a few days later and pay again. Then invite them to a regular date: to dinner, movies, bowling, skating etc. The 3rd or 4th time around you will probably not need to pay at all. Once you establish the trust, they will be more than happy to accompany you for free to vacations in Turkey, Egypt, Crimea etc. ...[/QUOTE]And then you can get married to them.

[QUOTE=Markharding]And then you can get married to them.[/QUOTE]

Thanks Markharding, brilliant post, keep up the good work!

Cruiser, of course you are right. We are paying always, but in this case under a significantly discounted rate and service quality is guaranteed. One can have a wonderful week for under $1,000 with a cutie who really knows how to satisfy your needs. Markharding, can you tell me what is wrong with that?

[QUOTE=Hedonist]Thanks Markharding, brilliant post, keep up the good work!

Cruiser, of course you are right. We are paying always, but in this case under a significantly discounted rate and service quality is guaranteed. One can have a wonderful week for under $1,000 with a cutie who really knows how to satisfy your needs. Markharding, can you tell me what is wrong with that?[/QUOTE]There is nothing wrong with that. If this is what you want, it is your perogative.

But my opinion is that these girls are professional actresses. This is why mongers are constantly chasing pros from town to town, country to country, and continent to continent, IN SEARCH OF THAT GIRL-FRIEND EXPERIENCE.

But one will never get a GFE except with a true girl-friend.

In my opinion, this whole issue of mongering is an addictive disease, like gambling etc ... And I wish I can be cured of this disease myself.

Take care and thanks for reading.

As the good Doc likes to say, as long as you are having fun that's all that matters.

PP does have the perfect location, but if I was on the company dime I think I'd rather spend it at the Hyatt. Maybe PP tanked the lobby girls to promote the strip club? The big money by the hour girls or sugar babies are hanging out at Decedence.

Hey Doc, are we doing the Superbowl at RP again this year? It will be year #5 for me - four at RP, one at Arena. I think I'm going to skip NYE in Kyiv this year but ya never know.

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]As the good Doc likes to say, as long as you are having fun that's all that matters.

PP does have the perfect location, but if I was on the company dime I think I'd rather spend it at the Hyatt. Maybe PP tanked the lobby girls to promote the strip club? The big money by the hour girls or sugar babies are hanging out at Decedence.

Hey Doc, are we doing the Superbowl at RP again this year? It will be year #5 for me - four at RP, one at Arena. I think I'm going to skip NYE in Kyiv this year but ya never know.[/QUOTE]If money were absolutely no object, I might chose the Hyatt as well... but as it is, the Hyatt is about $200 MORE a night than PP. It was the company's time, but I did have to show some inkling of financial responsibility.

Super Bowl is on, for sure. Wouldn't miss it for the world! I'm staying longer this time to... will prob arrive Saturday and stay through most of the week.

Was in the RP for the 100th time. If you see a girl from there driving a Ferrari, it was paid by me :-)
Girls now ask already USD 400. Regardless whetehr you agree or not with their price level, that they try (i never paid) to raise their prices, is not unfair: Kiev is getting avery expensive place very fast. 20% inflation in the first 5 months of the year! The Radisson was around 290 euro/night a year ago, soon it is 390.
The Hyatt went up froim 414 euro a few months ago to more than 500 euro now! SO one night in Kiev can become expensive when you take "all the expensive options":-)

[QUOTE=Fslag338]Was in the RP for the 100th time. If you see a girl from there driving a Ferrari, it was paid by me :-)
Girls now ask already USD 400. Regardless whetehr you agree or not with their price level, that they try (i never paid) to raise their prices, is not unfair: Kiev is getting avery expensive place very fast. 20% inflation in the first 5 months of the year! The Radisson was around 290 euro/night a year ago, soon it is 390.
The Hyatt went up froim 414 euro a few months ago to more than 500 euro now! SO one night in Kiev can become expensive when you take "all the expensive options":-)[/QUOTE]

Its called inflation in a growing economy! if your from the US that's a strange saying I know to put growing and economy in the same sentence!
But hey some places in the world still have growth.
The words credit crunch are not heard here in Ukraine.......
Yea I met the girl with the ferrari she gave me a lift home... telling me something about daft foreginers thinking pussy is worth so much ;)

[QUOTE=Qjump]
Yea I met the girl with the ferrari she gave me a lift home... [/QUOTE]
Are you guys serious about a girl at RP with a Ferrari? I thought you were just joking. Will be in Kiev the weekend of the 13th. Must check her out for myself. But if prices are really headed to where you say they are, it might be a short visit to RP.

[QUOTE=Jake993]Are you guys serious about a girl at RP with a Ferrari? I thought you were just joking. Will be in Kiev the weekend of the 13th. Must check her out for myself. But if prices are really headed to where you say they are, it might be a short visit to RP.[/QUOTE]My advice for RP:

* Go there for fun and with the right attitude. It's your night.
* The right attitude is that it is a game, because it is. You can't win, but you don't have to lose.
* If you want to get laid, plan on spending $250-300. No more.
* You can get away with less, but you'll have to wait until at least 2:30-3:00. Girls start with $500.

Take a look, there are good girls to be had and performance is IME very good. But there are few "bargains" price-wise in RP. Essentially it is a slightly bigger version of RP.

[QUOTE=It Travel]Good! And report us please... I think to another sex week... ;)

In my opinion the best way is just going and sit at the bar... order something and keep an eye on the tables... usually full of teens from 7-8 pm up to 12... then deciste which you can pick up... ;)

Usually I rent a flat exactly in front of the entrance of Mandarin so I'm not more far than 50 m from Arena and from a couple of nice bars where I can have a good breakfast. Some in the underground city (in the middle part just under the little square in front of the merket) have even "Illy caffè" a must for Italians... and the underground pub beside ul. Baseina number 5 opens at 11 and make excellent breakfast with eggs, bacon, etc...

If you need a good restaurant in walking distance (but no pick up there), on ground in my taste ARENA food is so so, you gan get at Pervak, just around the corner and next block [url]www.pervak.kiev.ua[/url]

At the corner of the little and short Rogodieniskaya and Kreshatik... not more than 150 meters, not cheap (a good dinner will go for 100 USD for two), not western, but good international cooking, good georgian wine, good beer, they have Illy Caffè too... different areas inside, and a nice and luxurious place to "work" a normal girl to get her in bed. Worked with miss U., with Ira and others... ;)

Casual with no sneakers is OK, open to the last customer leave.

Happy hunting

It

Of course you are in a Hotel, but I write this for others too... ;) Notice that Mystery Tramp is at work again... ah ah she was on flirt some days ago... unfortunately Lol...ita is definly gone :( She is my best fuck, BBBJ + CIM + COF GFE ever... 9/10 just because no Anal.[/QUOTE]Hello IT can you give me the exact address of "Illy Caffè" ? or much more informations for find it?

Thank you

I don't write reports here because of my limited English skills, anyway I had a question about the Taxi Prices in Kiev today:

1. What is a fair price for the trip from Borispol-Airport to the city centre ?

2. What is a fair price for distances within the city if you take non-official taxis, for example from maidan-place to "Shooters" Discotheque?

Thanks in advance!

Okay, a taxi question, I'll field this one.

The taxi services that most locals use charge around 110uah to go to the airport. I paid 108uah at the end of this winter from Maidan to Borispil. Taking a taxi from Borispil to the center always seems to be a little more expensive due to taxi mafia pricing. I paid 150uah on NYE for Borispil to the center, anywhere from 100uah to 150uah is reasonable pricing. However, I have never actually walked past the taxi guys to outside the terminal to see if I could get a better fare, might be worth a try.

Pricing inside the center tends to run from 20uah anywhere inside the center to 50uah to anywhere the metro goes. I haven't used a private car in about 2 years so I have no idea where that pricing is. ALWAYS settle on the pricing before you get in the car. If it's too high flag down the next car.

Dr S. I still think the breaking point at RP is $200 for several hours. I could be wrong - I'm not an RP pro, but I do know people who are. :)

Some advice for taxi by my personal experience.

1. Lada taxis cost always less than other more advanced vehicles. It is more unlikely that you get scammed by entering an old Lada taxi. So search for Ladas everywhere.

2. Do not approach taxis which stand next to each other because their drivers are friends and by the time one of them gives an offer, the rest will not accept any grivnya less. So it is better to approach alone taxis.

3. In airport. When you arrive, a guy or more will come to you and tell you to come to their taxis before you even exit terminal. They will never leave you being on your face literally and speaking to you constantly.

Never accept to get into the taxi of the first person who comes and talks to you. He will ask for a ridiculous price, for example 250 grivnyas because he regards you as an ignorant tourist. Say I know the price is only 100 grivnyas and say it in Russian. The first driver will not accept such a low offer and will try to take you to his friends who will try to arrange a slightly better price let's say 150-180 grivnya. You have to ignore them and go to the next group of taxi drivers.

It is important if the drivers are friends between each other. If they are not, they will start giving competitive prices, for example one will say I will take you with 140 grivnyas, you tell that the other from the different group of drivers and he says, O. K. , I will take you with 130 grivnyas, you act then like willing to enter the taxi and then get again to the first driver who offered you 140 grivnyas, you tell him the other driver from the next group accepts only 120 grivnyas, so he has to lower the price. He will say something like O. K.come in, I will take you with 110 grivnyas.

By this time you can enter the taxi because if you try to get even more discount by continuing the bid, it is likely that some others like managers will appear to solve the conflict and they will insist that you pay 150 grivnyas or you have to leave. So just take advantage and do not overdo because they regard bid as stealing them while if they manage to keep the price up by former arrangement that no taxi driver will take less than 150 grivnyas for example, means that they win.

The point is to win them but to not completely humiliate them as to make them take revenge. (aka the driver saying sorry Mr. , I don't have coins or 10, 20 grivnyas banknotes, so I cannot give you 30 back if you give me 150, meaning that you have to pay 150 actually since it is impossible for you to get 10, 20 grivnya banknotes in remote area).

The means Ukrainians use to scam tourists

1. Blackmail

2. Quick action, so you cannot oppose it

3. Element of surprise. You do not expect at all that it will happen

4. Taking you in unfavourable circumstances. When you are off balance, on trip, tired, in remote areas, etc. So you don't have power to resist.

I gave you some hints about the way they think and see situations. There are winners and losers everywhere.

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]

Wages in Kiev reached 3200 grivnya last July.This means 500 euro average wage.In province they reached 2000 grivnya,about 300 euro.

So in comparison to 1999(average wage 50$) the salaries are 6 times higher and in comparison to 2003(average 85$) more than 3 times higher since the dollar is devalued,so we take euro into account.

Inflation rose by 30% last year,so money spent on dates increase.

Comparison to Poland:wages 2.5 times less than the polish (850 euro).

Comparison to Czech Republic:wages 3 times less than the czech (900 euro).

Kiev wages more than half than average polish wage.

All these reflect on the difficulty on getting girls.

Even more:Unemployment in Ukraine is 8%,in CR 8%,in Poland 12%.
In Kiev less than 1%.

So the map has changed since 2003 for example when the average ukrainian wage was 5 times lower than the czech and 4 times lower than the polish.

The difference becomes less in relative terms but bigger in absolute numbers.
What matters for getting freebies in my opinion are the relative numbers,the proportion,3:1 in 2008 between CR and Ukraine instead of 5:1 in 2003 and not the absolute difference in wages (400 euro in 2003,600 euro now).

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]

[QUOTE=Hecker]Wages in Kiev reached 3200 grivnya last July.This means 500 euro average wage.In province they reached 2000 grivnya,about 300 euro.

So in comparison to 1999(average wage 50$) the salaries are 6 times higher and in comparison to 2003(average 85$) more than 3 times higher since the dollar is devalued,so we take euro into account.

Inflation rose by 30% last year,so money spent on dates increase.

Comparison to Poland:wages 2.5 times less than the polish (850 euro).

Comparison to Czech Republic:wages 3 times less than the czech (900 euro).

Kiev wages more than half than average polish wage.

All these reflect on the difficulty on getting girls.

Even more:Unemployment in Ukraine is 8%,in CR 8%,in Poland 12%.
In Kiev less than 1%.

So the map has changed since 2003 for example when the average ukrainian wage was 5 times lower than the czech and 4 times lower than the polish.

The difference becomes less in relative terms but bigger in absolute numbers.
What matters for getting freebies in my opinion are the relative numbers,the proportion,3:1 in 2008 between CR and Ukraine instead of 5:1 in 2003 and not the absolute difference in wages (400 euro in 2003,600 euro now).

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size][/QUOTE]

The gas prices have just risen by 65%, thanks to the dick head presedent inviting the americans to use Ukrainian ports and come visit him on a weekly basis. so the wages are all spent anyway and bound to go up more!

I think that the limit is the 300 euro. I mean, as I have written before, when the average wages exceed 300 euro per month (or 300$ when referring to older times), chances to get freebies get much worse because the lower class, unemployed etc desperate girls who strived for short term relationships (even for one day) with foreigners vanish and the more they disapear, the less the chances for getting quick results (without having to start a relationship) become.

It happened in Czech Republic in 1999 when the wages surpassed 300$ per month and in Poland in 2001 when the same happened.

It probably happened in Russia two years ago. (just see the reports in Moscow 2005 section and compare to those nowadays).

So in my opinion the huge base that provided easy to shag freebies for one night stand has shrinken to such an extent that it is almost impossible for the short time traveller to rely on finding them and so he has to start long term relationship (which means visiting more often than once a year), which before was not the case and of course no prerequisite for getting laid.

But I just want to give my feelings regarding the Ukraine economy, I am not an ecomomist by any means, but I ve lived here for the past four years and I also spent the night in the Hotel Donbass. Twice.

I think Qjump and Hecker both raise interesting points, and I can see were they're coming from, right now in Ukraine we have Inflation (big time) which is high prices, high wages, high growth, low unemployment, last April in a move to curb this inflation the UAH was made stronger against all majors, I think they made this move in an effort to slow the economy, and maybe even bring on a mild resession, and this would mean low prices, low growth, low wages, and higher unemployment. It appears to be working somewhat, the inflation rate at present is 16 percent, a few months ago it was close to 30, and economists are predicting that for the year 2009, inflation could be as low as 9 percent. My feelings, wishfull thinking, I think 12 or 13 percent is more realistic.

Qjump makes an interesting point, I think he's saying high wages; yes, but also high energy costs, which of course is very true. As an example, the cost for bus fare has risen by 100 percent in the past year, an average ukrainan could easily spend 100 dollars a month on bus fares. But, it could get much worst, on January 1, natural gas cost could increase 300 percent, and if this happens, expect to see; to put it bluntly, and economic collapse. The reason for this is because the industry here has not modernized, not at all, plants spend alot of money for their engerny needs and if this increases, I think you can expect to see lay offs in the thousands, esp. Were I live in the far east. Just my feelings, if any one wants to know about the circus called Ukraine politics I can give input re: that issue as well. And one more thing, OBAMA! Please.

[QUOTE=Timmy21]
last April in a move to curb this inflation the UAH was made stronger against all majors, I think they made this move in an effort to slow the economy, and maybe even bring on a mild resession, and this would mean low prices, low growth, low wages, and higher unemployment. It appears to be working somewhat, the inflation rate at present is 16 percent, [/QUOTE]

Sorry, you provide some misleading/incorrect info:

1)Booming economy ?
NJET !
In August, the real industrial production (inflation of prices being considered) of UA fell 0.5% compared to August 2007. Could be seasonal effect, though. But I do not think so, because of slowing world economy, and the rise of energy prices beginning of next year.
[url]http://www.kommersant.ua/doc.html?docId=1024151[/url]

2)Industry is worried about stagflation: sinking production AND increasing prices.
The strong UHA hurts the industrial export, which has to compete with China etc.
In the first seven months of 2008 the prices for industrial products have risen 34.1% !
[url]http://www.kommersant.ua/doc.html?docId=1008761[/url]

3)The inflation in the fist 8 months of 2008 was 14.8%, in comparison to August 2007 it was 26% !
[url]http://korrespondent.net/business/economics/576007[/url]

Especially inflation for foodstuff I can personally see very clearly:
In May, I bought 10 eggs on the market here in Nikolaev for about 3.5UHA.
Now I have to pay 5.5UHA !
Cheapest mineral water on the market in Nikolaev in May 1.75UHA/1.5l, now 2UHA !
Cheese, for instance, on the market almost as expensive as in the cheap food shops in Germany (ALDI, Lidl). Minimum for cheese is about 32UHA/kg, which is equivalent to 4.76Eu/kg with current exchange rate.
At ALDI in Germany you can buy starting at 4.99E/kg.

Cheers from Nikolaev

When cheese gets the squeeze you know things are bad.

Seriously, is such detailed economic analysis really useful when trying to pull girls? Let's suppose a Kiev girl in her early twenties is earning an exceptional - or at least very good for her age - salary, say $900 pm. After she's covered rent ($5-600 per month) and food ($100 if she eats at home) she's got precious little left over for fun. Maybe a few cocktails with her friends, the odd tight fitting pair of jeans.. Plus she'll be paying for transport and lunch every day.

She's going to need some kind of male input for the luxuries. Increasingly that male contribution is going to be from local Ukrainian guys, but dinner with wine at a fancy restaurant, the sort of thing to sweep her off her feet, is not something she'll experience within her local circle that often as it's not a priority when your total entertainment budget is $200 for the month. That's where we come in.

BTW it's important to make sure you click first before spending money; don't spend in the hope it'll make her like you! Obvious, but worth reiterating.

[QUOTE=Ash1001]When cheese gets the squeeze you know things are bad.

Seriously, is such detailed economic analysis really useful when trying to pull girls? Let's suppose a Kiev girl in her early twenties is earning an exceptional - or at least very good for her age - salary, say $900 pm. After she's covered rent ($5-600 per month) and food ($100 if she eats at home) she's got precious little left over for fun. Maybe a few cocktails with her friends, the odd tight fitting pair of jeans.. Plus she'll be paying for transport and lunch every day.

She's going to need some kind of male input for the luxuries. Increasingly that male contribution is going to be from local Ukrainian guys, but dinner with wine at a fancy restaurant, the sort of thing to sweep her off her feet, is not something she'll experience within her local circle that often as it's not a priority when your total entertainment budget is $200 for the month. That's where we come in.

BTW it's important to make sure you click first before spending money; don't spend in the hope it'll make her like you! Obvious, but worth reiterating.[/QUOTE]Yes, exactly. They need the luxuries. I older times they needed to survive. It is very different to get a girl by paying for her a pizza or a chicken to eat and very different to wait that a girl will be so exceptionally pleased by a perfect expensive meal in a luxury restaurant that she is going to sleep with you.

Girls really needed the small money before 2003 for survival, substinence reasons, not for luxury.

Hey guys,

That's all true! The global economy is our problem because mongers are becoming poorer and girls are becoming richer.

Luxury is a necessity that begins where necessity ends :)

this report is a little tardy but suppose better late than never. as you may recall, i was in ashgabat, turkmenistan before coming to kiev. well, actually, i flew s7 airlines from ashgabat to moscow arriving at 6:40 am on friday. after spending the day doing laundry and suffering from “tourista” i caught a 4:30 pm flight on aerosvit to kiev. yep, you heard right. tourista, montezuma’s revenge (maybe turkmenbashi's revenge is more apropos), walking trots, hershey squirts, peeing out your bum (ok – that’s too much information). i must be getting too complacent with all of this travel because i picked up some sort of bug in ashgabat that literally liquefied everything that i ate for about three days.

since it was a night flight from ashgabat and i spent all day in less than great shape, i was pretty bushed when i got to kiev. i came down with a buddy who works in moscow and was in need of a much deserved “wild weekend in kiev” and did not want to let him down, so as soon as we got settled in the flat, we went out on the town for dinner. we chose avalon, which turned out to be a good choice. friday night was crawling with devushki and avalon had its fair share. as it was still early we went up to the top floor for a nice seafood dinner. unfortunately, my stomach was just not cooperating and i desperately needed to rest and try to get my system back to normal. so armed with immodium i was back at the flat and in bed by 11:00 pm while ildar my buddy went back to avalon where he told me he had an awesome time. with the exception of having to get up to “take care of business” a few times, i slept fairly well.

at about 5:00 am, i heard to apartment door open and ilar came into the apartment with a “hoe in tow”. i thought he brought her home for himself but he came into my room and told me to get myself together as i had work to do! have i got good friends or what? apparently, he struck out at avalon and decided to stop by one on the salons that the taxi driver recommended. after he was done his hour (for $110), he asked if he could take a girl home for his sick friend. they said “sure” and charged him only $110 to take one home for me. of course, the clock start once she went out the door. in fact, i think they forgot about her because the phone call did not come until she had been there for at least an hour.

anyhow, i was nursed partially back to health by cleo (as in cleopatra). she was 27 years old from lviv and she told me that she had only been in kiev for two weeks now. what a little sweet heart. strawberry blond hair with a cute little nose, smallish boobs and a nice hard body. good farm girl from the polish border no doubt. anyhow, she was fun for an hour especially since she was relatively fresh. i’m sure that most will agree that you can really tell the ones who still have some amount of enthusiasm for their work and cleo was into her work so that was a really nice bonus. cbj (i was too tired to argue), cg, rcg, and a few that i don’t know the name for. really nimble and athletic and i wish i had not been feeling so bad. hey, but when you have a job to do…….

as i said earlier, she got a phone call reminding her that her time was up and that a taxi was waiting. after the left i went back for another 4 or 5 hours of badly needed sleep.

Saturday night, Ildar was determined to get me out and since I had bailed on him the night before, I decided that I need to get my ass back in shape (no pun intended) and get out there. We scoped out ARENA and ended up having dinner on the ground floor in the Beer Bar. The place was absolutely lousy with pussy. I mean is was almost comical. Dozen and dozens of girls were coming and going from the restaurant and I am sure many were getting ready to head upstairs to the Night Club. I made eye contact with a dark haired beauty a few tables over whom Ildar told was Bessarabia. For those who do not know, Bessarabia is that part of southwestern Ukraine that butts up against Moldova. The Night Club did not open until midnight so we just sort of hung back and sipped beer waiting for the club to open. I would have made a move on her right there and then but Ildar seemed determined to show me the club so I hung there.

When we went up to the club, I was surprised to see the number of guys milling around the enterance waiting to get in. I thought it was a line up until Ildar told me it was just face control. But since we were well dressed and not exactly “chorny”, we marched to the head of the line and walked in like we owned the place. As you can imagine the place was absolutely crawling with chicks. What blew me away was how beautiful and TALL these girls were; decidedly taller than Moscow I would say. And these were party girls “par excellence”. You could see them coming out of the ladies room rubbing their noses and some were quite unabashed about asking you if you had any coke when you asked them to dance. Interesting.

By about 3:00 AM I was getting pretty tired since I was still keeping one eye on the boys room. By that hour the facilities were getting pretty grotty and not exactly conducive to sitting down for a good…… well, you know. Luckily, by 3:15 AM or so, Ildar was getting pretty wasted as he was slamming Mojitoes at a pretty good rate. He soon indicated that he did not have any pussy on the line so when I suggested we try and check out River Palace, he did not hesitate. We hopped a taxi and took the 15 minute or so drive to the river boat but not before stopping by the apartment to take care of some "business". After 5 minutes I felt like a new man and bounded down the stairs into the taxi. Ildar was nearly passed out so I knew we had to work fast.

Even at that hour, the River Palace had probably 30 girls between the dance floor, the bar area and the lounge seating. Being Saturday night, there were a few 9-10, all kinds of 7-8’s and the others. Plenty to prime property to consider even at that hour. Ildar was fading fast so I decided that I needed to do some quick hunting. Ildar said he wanted to find a Charlize Theron look alike tonight so I cruised the bar to get drinks and see what I could come up with. I was barely in the bar area when beautiful Ukrainian girl in her late 20’s early 30’s made a bee line to me and stated that she was what I was looking for. Maybe yes, maybe no. She was a classic Ukrainian looking women with dirty blond hair, nice full lips and great smile. I little on the petite side and very fit looking. Her command of English put me on guard immediately, but I explained to her that I had a friend who needed some company as well. She said it with was not problem – she had a friend too. I negotiated her opening gambit of $400 down to $400 for both her and her friend for 2 – 3 hours and went back to tell Ildar. Since we had a 2 bedroom apartment , I figured this could have been party time. But it was not to be; Ildar is ethnic Azeri, though educated in Moscow, and clearly of Caucasian persuasion. The friend turned up her nose and was not interested and she bolted from the premises. Ildar wanted to keep looking so Jeanna and I sat and played kissy face while Ildar kept scoping out possibilities. As he was a little drunk, it was not going well for the boy. By 4:00 AM, he was doing the head-bobs and Jeanna was getting impatient. The rest of the girls had sort of caught on and were avoiding like plague us so things were going downhill fast.

I suggested to Ildar that we make a move but he insisted that he want to find a girl. Remembering his gesture from the night before, I felt like I need to cut him some slack so we hung around for another 15 minutes or so while Ildar chatted up a few more blonds and came up with nothing satisfactory. Finally, he threw in the towel and gave up his quest grumbling that these girls were all ugly. Yeah, sure Ildar you go with that. We were pleasantly surprised to hear that Jeanna had her own car so we avoided that whole rip-off problem with taxi drivers holding you for ransom out at RP. Soon, we were back at the apartment taking turns showering while Ildar went to bed and was sawing logs in no time.

While Jeanna was certainly experienced, she lacked a certain amount of enthusiasm. Apparently she learned English while living in Japan and working there. Not your average Ukrainian farm girl. Like Cleo from the night before she insisted on CJB and it took a heck of a lot of coaxing to convince her that CJB was getting us nowhere. She relented and soon was getting enthusiastic with a nice BBBJ. I just KNEW she didn’t like the taste of latex. During our inter-coital pillow talk we reviewed the issue of price. We had agreed on $400 for her and her friend but now she was telling that she wanted $300 or she would not go for round 2. I said that was fine because I was tired anyhow. I don’t think she expected me to call her bluff and she back peddled rapidly and agreed to finish the job for $200. Where do these girls get this from? Strange tactics. Anyhow, I kicked her out after 2 hours and was happy to get some more sleep as it was starting to get light.

When I woke up about 10:00 AM Sunday , my stomach was not getting any better and I was really starting to get worried. Everything I had eaten since Thursday was liquefying within an hour and going down the drain from one end or the other. Turkmenbashi’s revenge was getting the best of me. I showered and dressed and found a nice café just off of Kruschetik. There was an Opteka next door and I was able to explain to the pharmacist that the Immodium was not working. She gave me an over-the-counter anti-biotic and charged me about 8.5 Hrivas or about $1.25. Unbelievable – I still can’t believe how cheap and easily available pharmaceuticals are in some of these countries. Had I been in the USA, I would have been screwed and had no choice but to go to the hospital or clinic and that would have chewed up half a day and several hundred dollars no doubt. But I digress. Sunday was a quiet day and Ildar was still hurting from the last night and was in no mood for pussy. I took this as a gift and used the opportunity to let my system heal.

As I have written here before, I do not write detailled reports because of my limited English skills, anyway I would recommend the Club "Kalinka-Malinka" to any monger who come to Kiev.

It is far from the city centre, in district Troechina, so a Taxi will be necessary, price for a Taxi-Trip from the Centre should be between 40 or 50 Grivnas.

As far as I know, there is disco there only at Friday and Saturday, the Entrance fee was 50 Grivnas at Friday and 100 Grivnas (for male) at Saturday, because of an (awful) stage show.

Prices for drinks: Corona-Beer 22 Grivna, average Long-Drink around 40-45 Grivna.

In my point of view, the place is a great experience, it is a "True-Russian-Disco", with music mostly from the eighties and a Great guy/girl ratio.

The crowd is mixed, a lot of young people/students, but also 30-40 y.o.-and definitely a lot of the girls there were approachable!

The atmosphere in general is maybe more authentic than in the clubs in the centre of Kiev, a lot of horny and emotional Kiev girls who like to flirt and to dance, but also a lot of drunk ukrainian/russian/caucasian guys and there are brawls from time to time.

It is not really dangerous, though, since there is also a lot of security personnel present, but for a foreigner who doesn't speak any Russian, it may be unwise to be unaccompanied there, well, this is just my advice, as I know most of the guys here are hard-core mongers.

Homepage with adress:

[url]http://www.2k.ua/rus/restaurants_kiev_kalinka.php[/url]

Have fun there, and enjoy Kiev in general !

Monday in Kiev was back to back business meetings. My stomach was feeling much better and I was getting my strength back. I got the airport at 7:30 PM for a 9:40 PM flight and soon on my way back to Moscow. On the plane, I met a gorgeous blond named Vika who got on and sat in the window seat in my row just before the door closed. My initial thought was, “oh sure, another rich spoiled Russian Blondnika” who prances onto the plane at the last moment and think she owns the place. I had the aisle so there was just the two of us. She was really stunning and Ilar, who was sitting in the aisle seat across from me, kept needling me to make a move on her. That’s not usually my style so I just sort of laughed it off. When the drinks cart came around she ordered a shot of Garilka (Ukrainian vodka) so I followed suit and just before drinking I offered a toast just to be polite. This turned out to be a great ice breaker as she got very chatty. She said she did not speak any English but could understand some as she is an international lawyer working for a firm in Moscow. I asked if she had been in Kiev for the weekend as well, but she told me that she had been in Tbilisi (Republic of Georgia) for the weekend and that direct travel between Georgia and Russia was pretty limited these days, hence the connection in Kiev. One shot led to two, and two led to three and pretty soon we were both pretty chatty.

She was a Russian citizen as she declined the usual landing card for foreigners so I am guessing that she might have Georgian relatives. In any case, we started chatting about Moscow and asked her which her favorite night club was. She said she didn’t do night clubs much and preferred Jazz clubs. On the subject of restaurants she told me her favorite was Ginitsvalli, so there MUST have been some sort of Georgian connection. One thing led to another and she agreed to have dinner with me on Tuesday night as she did not go back to work until Wednesday. She gave me her phone number and agreed to the date. When we landed, we walked together down to the immigration in SVO-1 and split as she walked into the line for Russian citizens. All this time Ildar has his mouth hanging open and offering new found respect for my pick up abilities.

The flight arrived just after 12:00 midnight and immigration was quick and easy. Ildar’s driver was waiting outside so in moments we were headed into town. Ildar had an early meeting on Tuesday so he declined my offer to hook up with Pizdyets at Itazsh. It wasn’t until I got out of the car that I realized that I had left my Russian mobile phone on the fucking plane. Damnit. I still had my US Blackberry with me so I wasn’t incommunicado, but Vika’s number was on that phone!!!!!! Double damnit.

Pizdyets and I had a few drinks back at Itazsh and decided to relocate to Hot Dogs to check out the action. I honestly can’t remember the name of the girl I dragged home that night or what I paid her because I was so pissed off that I lost my stupid phone with Vika’s number on it. She probably sat home Tuesday night and cursed that stupid Americanits for not calling her.

But speaking of Hot Dogs, it was pretty dead on that Monday night. Pizdyets and I agreed that we would have one beer (maybe two) and then give some serious thought to hitting one of the salons. There was a brunette sitting next to us at the bar that I gave a passing glance and a smile to but that was about it. The rugby was on TV so we chatted and laughed about my “shitty” weekend in Kiev and decided one more beer would not hurt. For no particular reason, I turned to the gal next to me and asked if I could buy her a drink. She asked for a shot of Red Label which immediately got my attention as most of the girls (as you all know) tend to shy away from whiskey while they are working. There was something a bit shy and non-aggressive about this girl, which was not what I was in the mood for considering how pissed off I was about losing Vika’s number. Screw the phone – I wanted that NUMBER!!!!

Luckily, a stereotypical “dirty girl” materialized and soon Pizdyets and I were sitting at the table with the two of them discussing the price of tea in China. Dirty Girl kept telling me “pashlee, pashlee” (let’s get outta here) so when Pizdyets and Whisky Girl got up to dance we made a move to my apartment and she punished me for losing Vika’s phone number. Whip me – beat me – make me write bad checks…….

NOTE: I will post this in both the Ukraine thread and the Moscow thread as it’s a lead-in to the rest of the week in Moscow.

Nice reports Jake, it's nice to read about the Kyiv scene since I'm not there at the moment. Sorry to hear about your medical problems. I had the flu so bad the last three days I was in Kyiv I couldn't stand one of those days.

Two things, It used to be when you took a girl home from an apartment the time started when you got to your place. Second, you made a tactical error in relocating from Arena to River Palace on Saturday night. On Friday and Saturday night the hot River Palace girls go to Arena and Decadence.

Sorry to hear about Vika. Luckily my Ukrainian phone is a windows mobile smartphone so when ever I charge it with my laptop usb port it automatically backs up. But you obviously lost it before you had any possible chance of backing it up. Hey, I left my passport on a BA flight in Heathrow during one of last years trips to Kyiv but was able to get it back with the help of the friendly BA staff. Always check the seat backs before leaving the flight. :)

Nice to read your report too Duesentrieb. I always like to hear about the 'other' side of the city. It still has a feel of Kyiv center pre 2005.

Anyone there in mid/late Oct? I am thinking to head over for the first time, but all my friends keep saying it's pretty dangerous. Esp since I'm an ethnic minority. I considered just sticking to the German FKK scenes, but I've wanted to go for a while now.

I'm currently debating between Kiev or Bucharest. Any thoughts on this, from a safety perspective? Would I be better to travel with a friend? And in terms of mongering how do the 2 cities compare? :)

[QUOTE=Borat69]Anyone there in mid/late Oct? I am thinking to head over for the first time, but all my friends keep saying it's pretty dangerous. Esp since I'm an ethnic minority. I considered just sticking to the German FKK scenes, but I've wanted to go for a while now.

I'm currently debating between Kiev or Bucharest. Any thoughts on this, from a safety perspective? Would I be better to travel with a friend? And in terms of mongering how do the 2 cities compare? :)[/QUOTE] I don't know about Bucharest, but Kiev is reasonably cosmopolitan. Having said that, there does not appear to be quite the visible wide range of ethnic minorities that you might see in Moscow. Are you concerned about safety or ability to score with girls? I have heard (and once saw with my own eyes) that while a lot of the girls turn up their noses at some minorities, people are relatively safe in Kiev as compared to Moscow. They don't seem to have the same kind of "skinhead type" gangs of angry young men that were once (and may still be) a problem in Moscow.

Kiev is desperately trying to be accepted by the western European community and hooliganism towards minorities is becoming socially unacceptable. If you are a minority, the girls may not want to fuck you, but you are not likely to be beaten up either. My friend from Azerbaijan had no trouble getting laid at the salons in Kiev.

Having a wingman is always a good idea.

I was more concerned with safety, being oriental, and with plans to travel there alone.

No problem with the girl side of things, freebie or not. I suppose ignorant racist idiots are everywhere, but I've found some countries in EE to LOVE asian men. Maybe the Ukraine isn't one, but I'm not going there as some pick up artist, just a mongerer :)

I just keep getting told that the Ukraine is still a bit of a 'cowboy country' and to be extremely cautious esp as I would stand out in the crowd.

Maybe there's certain areas to avoid, or just to stick to a safe area. If you had 5-7 days there, would you just do RP, or maybe some of the prev posted parlours? Maybe Odessa is better?

[QUOTE=Borat69]Maybe Odessa is better?[/QUOTE]No, it ain't.

[QUOTE=Borat69]I was more concerned with safety, being oriental, and with plans to travel there alone.

No problem with the girl side of things, freebie or not. I suppose ignorant racist idiots are everywhere, but I've found some countries in EE to LOVE asian men. Maybe the Ukraine isn't one, but I'm not going there as some pick up artist, just a mongerer :)

I just keep getting told that the Ukraine is still a bit of a 'cowboy country' and to be extremely cautious esp as I would stand out in the crowd.

Maybe there's certain areas to avoid, or just to stick to a safe area. If you had 5-7 days there, would you just do RP, or maybe some of the prev posted parlours? Maybe Odessa is better?[/QUOTE]Avoid all central and eastern Ukraine.

Stick to big cities.

If asked tell that you come from USA.

[QUOTE=Hecker]Avoid all central and eastern Ukraine.

Stick to big cities.

If asked tell that you come from USA.[/QUOTE]

And yea sure saying you come from the USA gets doors opened for you these days. Have you checked the list of the worlds most despised nations recently?

Respect is earned in a singular way these days not as a nation.
Gone are the days that saying you are from USA or the UK gains you much respect world wide thanks to our respective governments foriegn policies.

Donetsk is no problem for Orientals there are many foreign students here even from china studying at the univercity.

So take no notice come here to Ukraine enjoy yourself, relax and have fun, the world is full of biggots no matter where you go.

I will probably be told to RTFF but I have a question...

I am completely hopeless at speaking any other language besides some pidgeon French and Russian is impossible! Can anyone recommend a Ukranian site that operates in English and where I can get e-mailing some ordinary Kiev girls to prime for my next visit to Kiev? (Flirt ua is still not up & running?!) All the sites members recommend seem to be in Russian/Ukranian.

Maybe a site similar to Facebook?

Cheers!

Umm try Facebook :) Or myspace, or cruise flirt.com.ua looking for english speakers. I usually just stand in the middle of the food court in Globus and scream 'any english speakers want to date me?'

When did saying 'I'm from the UK' open doors? The 1900 or 1800's? :P

I agree with Hecker tho..actually I wouldn't leave Kyiv or Odessa if you were worried about getting hassled.

[QUOTE=Fox7717]I will probably be told to RTFF but I have a question...

I am completely hopeless at speaking any other language besides some pidgeon French and Russian is impossible! Can anyone recommend a Ukranian site that operates in English and where I can get e-mailing some ordinary Kiev girls to prime for my next visit to Kiev? (Flirt ua is still not up & running?!) All the sites members recommend seem to be in Russian/Ukranian.

Maybe a site similar to Facebook?

Cheers![/QUOTE]
Try [url]www.LuckyLovers.net[/url]
Almost everyone there speaks some level of English, and many have very good English. The downside is that is has no explicitly sexual ads (like the pink ones at Mamba) and many girls are there for real relationships or social networking.

However, there are many who appear open to all kinds of offers...

The only place on earth where saying you're from the UK opens doors is the US. Still! :)

...I never said being British would open any doors. In fact it often has the opposite effect, something like being American? I usually say i'm Australian or something. (By the way Ash 1001 I disagree about the states and being British unless you are off the beaten track.) Only speaking English has never really been a problem although I would like to have a talent for languages, but I'm truly hopeless! Will just have to make do with being good at making money?

I'm not interested in marriage type sites, just regular girls who want to be treated right and have some fun, which is what Gentleman Travel recommended site looks like and it's in Russian! Shame flirt.ua is still not up & running!

Any other bright ideas?

Fox7717

Ooohhh heart troubles

You should be aware:

- Ukraine is becoming pretty similar to Western countries, for example I see some Ukrainian men engaged with ugly Ukrainian women and meanwhile they fuck nice prostitutes: this reminds me Italy:.(

- Before you should fuck a woman a lot, and only after you should think about a lasting relationship! Hey guys, are you still children? I am very frightened to think good ladies are on thirties only, and these ladies had sex with hundred (or thousand) men before me, and now they are tired of this life, and now they are looking for a "lasting relationship": I prefer buying a young tochka instead of marrying an old witch!

- That's life, the world is running very fast for everybody, we need Russian girls and therefore we need to speak Russian too! Otherwise, look for a Russian girl in your own country.

[QUOTE=Fox7717]...I never said being British would open any doors. In fact it often has the opposite effect, something like being American? I usually say i'm Australian or something. (By the way Ash 1001 I disagree about the states and being British unless you are off the beaten track.) Only speaking English has never really been a problem although I would like to have a talent for languages, but I'm truly hopeless! Will just have to make do with being good at making money?

I'm not interested in marriage type sites, just regular girls who want to be treated right and have some fun, which is what Gentleman Travel recommended site looks like and it's in Russian! Shame flirt.ua is still not up & running!

Any other bright ideas?

Fox7717[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Ooohhh heart troubles

You should be aware:

- Ukraine is becoming pretty similar to Western countries, for example I see some Ukrainian men engaged with ugly Ukrainian women and meanwhile they fuck nice prostitutes: this reminds me Italy:.(

- Before you should fuck a woman a lot, and only after you should think about a lasting relationship! Hey guys, are you still children? I am very frightened to think good ladies are on thirties only, and these ladies had sex with hundred (or thousand) men before me, and now they are tired of this life, and now they are looking for a "lasting relationship": I prefer buying a young tochka instead of marrying an old witch!

- That's life, the world is running very fast for everybody, we need Russian girls and therefore we need to speak Russian too! Otherwise, look for a Russian girl in your own country.[/QUOTE]



As said, despite no Russian, I do pretty well. just want to try something different. So Acolonizer.......any bright ideas?

Asking AC for help? Your doomed. :)

[QUOTE=Fox7717]As said, despite no Russian, I do pretty well. just want to try something different. So Acolonizer.......any bright ideas?[/QUOTE]


Before 1776, sure.

[QUOTE=Ash1001]The only place on earth where saying you're from the UK opens doors is the US. Still! :)[/QUOTE]

I will be in Kiev in a couple weeks, is there a map of the action sites available, similar to the one for Warsaw?
I see many different prices posted, did anyone ebver post a guide, like escort agencies and Riverside?
Thanks

[QUOTE=Johntodd]I will be in Kiev in a couple weeks, is there a map of the action sites available, similar to the one for Warsaw?
I see many different prices posted, did anyone ebver post a guide, like escort agencies and Riverside?
Thanks[/QUOTE]

Look through this thread i posted a map some time ago... it was a little out of date but have a look.

Before 1776 being British in the American colonies would have been a risk to life and limb. But I think nowadays the positive attitude and interest in our accent comes from the fact we're seen as quaint, powerless and always following the US on foreign policy.

Although, maybe it IS just the girls...

[QUOTE=Ash1001]Before 1776 being British in the American colonies would have been a risk to life and limb. But I think nowadays the positive attitude and interest in our accent comes from the fact we're seen as quaint, powerless and always following the US on foreign policy.

Although, maybe it IS just the girls...[/QUOTE]

Lets get it straight Ash, had we not also been controlling the rest of the world at the time, we may have had the manpower to make sure they never got independence, obviously at the time the British thought it a less important colony to keep.
Forward thinking perhaps? as by the end of this decade it looks like you will be able to buy the USA for a few quid ha ha ha.

[QUOTE=Qjump...by the end of this decade it looks like you will be able to buy the USA for a few quid ha ha ha.[/QUOTE]That is the most "Durock - ing - ist!" statement I have heard in all of my time in Ukriane!

LS 'USA will rock ALL - always" Guy

[QUOTE=LifeSavour]USA will rock ALL - always[/QUOTE]

It's doing a great job rocking world financial markets at the moment..

Sorry guys for delay, I was in Kiev in August, my impression was that many girls were on holiday, but on the other side I could find more coming from the villages visiting friends or the city.
You could easily see them from the face and clothes they had and where they go visiting monuments and particulary churches.
In Lavra, a famous church complex, I met Anna a 21 y student, she was not a professional so I really appreciated her friendship smile and body, I'll post a picture.

Before Anna, I visited some famous place like River Palace, very bad, only some old guys and old professionals doing their job, Arena nice girl but expensive, and latin american disco, good if you are able to dance, otherwise avoid it.

My favourite was Shooters, really a standard disco, good music, friendly people, not a place for professionals, but where is possible to meet a standard girl or just dance and meet normal people.
It's very difficult to go in, they try to exclude foreiners, they absolutely avoid arabian people, I became a regular customer so no problem at all, just be polite and well dressed.

I really raccomend to stay in an appartment, I shared a large one in the center with some friends, no problems to come back with girls any day/time and there's more fun :)

Language is really a problem, but I noticed that some young speak english, never ask do you speak english, just start talking and asking, otherwise the answer no, smile and go away....

Went to see the big park on the river during daytime, really bad, dirthy and groups of young drunk people, the water is brown but they like to take a bath, interesting the gym in the park, Ukranian man are really macho, but they don't have the style that is appreciated from the best girls....

I found Ukranian gilrs really beutiful, nice body and naturally walking like models on high heels all day long, the center is similar to Monte Napoleone street in Milan during fashion week, probably the best find easily a sponsor to exchange the fresh body and smile with money and gifts.

Now I miss the tac tac music of them walking ....:(

Latin

[QUOTE=LifeSavour]That is the most "Durock - ing - ist!" statement I have heard in all of my time in Ukriane!

LS 'USA will rock ALL - always" Guy[/QUOTE]

The Great Depression took place from 1930 to 1939. During this time the prices of stock fell 40%. 9,000 banks went out of business and 9 million savings accounts were wiped out. 86,00 businesses failed, and wages were decreased by an average of 60%. The unemployment rate went from 9% all the way to 25%, about 15 million jobless people.




Causes of The Great depression of USA

* Unequal distribution of wealth

* High Tariffs and war debts

* Over production in industry and agriculture

* Stock market crash and financial panic



Effects of The Great depression

* Widespread hunger, poverty, and unemployment

* Worldwide economic crisis

* Democratic victory in 1932 election

* FDR's New Deal

[url]http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/usa-2008-the-great-depression-803095.html[/url]


Does this ring any bells????

In fact I would go as far to say this is the death toll of the USA being the dominant economic force in the world...........

me stupid? never! ;)

God bless America may she rest in piece.

Now back to the hookers!

[QUOTE=Qjump]The Great Depression took place from 1930 to 1939. During this time the prices of stock fell 40%. 9,000 banks went out of business and 9 million savings accounts were wiped out. 86,00 businesses failed, and wages were decreased by an average of 60%. The unemployment rate went from 9% all the way to 25%, about 15 million jobless people.




Causes of The Great depression of USA

* Unequal distribution of wealth

* High Tariffs and war debts

* Over production in industry and agriculture

* Stock market crash and financial panic



Effects of The Great depression

* Widespread hunger, poverty, and unemployment

* Worldwide economic crisis

* Democratic victory in 1932 election

* FDR's New Deal

[url]http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/usa-2008-the-great-depression-803095.html[/url]


Does this ring any bells????

In fact I would go as far to say this is the death toll of the USA being the dominant economic force in the world...........

me stupid? never! ;)

God bless America may she rest in piece.

Now back to the hookers![/QUOTE]





Although it gives me NO pleasure to say this, I agree, this looks like the end of the 'American Empire' (They all fall eventually!) Now back to the hookers to quote qjump!

Often does not provide any real advantage? (Ditto American.)

Shame I'm not Scot's or Irish, as everyone seems to like them, probably because they never had an empire and upset half the planet?! (Or Aussie or Kiwi come to that.)

Anyway.......back to the hookers!

Being confident, fun and spending money give you such a significant advantage that it's very difficult to ascertain what effects nationality/race/accent have on their own.

[QUOTE=Ash1001]Being confident, fun and spending money give you such a significant advantage that it's very difficult to ascertain what effects nationality/race/accent have on their own.[/QUOTE]

I think here though confidence comes with time, language skills or not!
But cash, a good time and fun always impresses!

I was on a bar yesterday, and three twenty year olds where fighting regarding who was going to date a certain lucky guy as he happened to have a 4x4 and they all wanted to be seen in the front seat!
They did not realise I was in ear shot and it was very funny to listen to.
anyway the upshot of the conversation was they would take turns.....

[QUOTE=Ash1001]Being confident, fun and spending money give you such a significant advantage that it's very difficult to ascertain what effects nationality/race/accent have on their own.[/QUOTE]



I agree, splash a bit of cash, be nice and make a girl laugh and you are halfway there usually. (Confidence and a bit of modesty also helps.)

This joke you just have to do when you know german (bavarian)

"di vikiano!"

[url]http://flirt.com.ua/anketa.phtml?oid=241291294[/url]

Epicurus,

Sounds like a good plan, it also sounds as if you hit on a gem, while you were here money back.

I will be be checking out the RP tonight, I don't expect to have any carry out, especially since I didn't understand the difference in room configurations. lol. Well it is my first visit to Kiev and now I know why many of the old timers on this board choose to find apartments instead of hotels.

[QUOTE=Skywalker159]Epicurus,

Sounds like a good plan, it also sounds as if you hit on a gem, while you were here money back.

I will be be checking out the RP tonight, I don't expect to have any carry out, especially since I didn't understand the difference in room configurations. lol. Well it is my first visit to Kiev and now I know why many of the old timers on this board choose to find apartments instead of hotels.[/QUOTE]I will be going to RP also tonight to check it out and I won't get any girl either, tomorrow I am meeting someone I met at the church. How do I recognise you?

I don't think I will try to contact that girl from last night again. She was nice and such, but the miscommunication will be frustrating. Her english skills or french or german were totally absent. At first it is fun, but that's also because of the excitement of just seeing eachother for the first time (and sex).

Epicurus,

This is embarrassing, but I didn't make to RP last night. I fell asleep. I thought I would take a quick power nap so I would be fully energized for my first visit to RP and when I woke up it was 3am.

I will definitely be there tonight. If you do show up tonight I will be probably the only African American in the crowd, somewhere near the bar.

Have fun with the church girl.

Umm, not quite Q. Do we really want to get into this? The sane answer is of course no. :)

I think you got American war debt after 1918 confused with English war debt.

America as evidenced by recent events still drives the world's economy, probably will for the foreseeable future.

[QUOTE=Qjump]The Great Depression took place from 1930 to 1939. During this time the prices of stock fell 40%.
(lots of dreck deleted)[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]Umm, not quite Q. Do we really want to get into this? The sane answer is of course no. :)

I think you got American war debt after 1918 confused with English war debt.

America as evidenced by recent events still drives the world's economy, probably will for the foreseeable future.[/QUOTE]



The 700bn (bet it ends up being more like a Trillion?) will do NOTHING to solve the real problem, but simply bails out the Bankers. (I did say bankers!) The underlying problem of 1,000's of Americans who cannot pay their mortgages will continue and so repossessions and so falling prices. Any bets on a 2nd bail out?!

Anyway, back to the hookers:-)

[QUOTE=Fox7717]The 700bn (bet it ends up being more like a Trillion?) will do NOTHING to solve the real problem, but simply bails out the Bankers. (I did say bankers!) The underlying problem of 1,000's of Americans who cannot pay their mortgages will continue and so repossessions and so falling prices. Any bets on a 2nd bail out?!

Anyway, back to the hookers:-)[/QUOTE]

From Obama and a mostly Demo Congress - YES

A "New" New Deal - More than likely

We'll just have to see if they totally re-tool this bailout, that will be key and they can do it. Just as you said, kill foreclosures, allow reworking of mortgages in Bankruptcy court, pretty much done deal, no heavy debt on the tax payers.

Right Wing Idealogy is pretty much DONE, ran its course and they'll make a come back in about 10-12 years or so.

Now we can go back, NOT to hookers.. but to Freebies!

[QUOTE=DJ FourMoney]From Obama and a mostly Demo Congress - YES

A "New" New Deal - More than likely

We'll just have to see if they totally re-tool this bailout, that will be key and they can do it. Just as you said, kill foreclosures, allow reworking of mortgages in Bankruptcy court, pretty much done deal, no heavy debt on the tax payers.

Right Wing Idealogy is pretty much DONE, ran its course and they'll make a come back in about 10-12 years or so.

Now we can go back, NOT to hookers.. but to Freebies![/QUOTE]



Democrat or Republicans will it makes no real difference!

Agreed about the freebies. Just started a brilliant 'thread' with an average girl in Kiev who seems to know stacks of hot babes and speaks excellent English, so looking very promising!

Since I am a newbie and have been a member of this board for several years, having never an opportunity to post anything, it is time I put in my two cents for what its worth. (I want to give thanks to the senior members of this board for their insights Doctor Skank, Cruiser D, Hedonist, It Travel (even though I am not looking for pigs), Bez Bezarra and for special insight as African Americans DJ Four Money and Blue Steele (haven’t seen any posts from in a long time)).

My first excursion in the fame River Palace of Kiev was not what I would could a eye opening experience since I did not take part of the pleasures that were offered. My main intention was to scout out the scene and see how everything played out.

It was a short cab ride from my Soviet era hotel to the River Palace with an air of anticipation on my mind like a child waiting to open his Christmas presents after the jolly ole elf has made his appointed rounds. I strode down the ramp to reception area that were surrounding by Valkeries to each of the golden rooms, walking in as his I owned the place, I immediately walked the stairs to sports bar, for some food and a beer, before returning upstairs for the main event. It was fairly quiet as I was led to a table to enjoy my meal, which consisted of a club sandwich and a beer. I quietly passed the time watch as bar slowly began to filled, but nothing eye catching. After about an 90 minutes having long finished my meal and several beers I was ready for the main event, swinging by the restroom to check my attire, because I wasn’t going to stopped because of shoddy appearance.

Having paid the Valkery 60 hryver I walked into the disco of pleasure. I was disappointed once I was passed the maidens of stamp checkers; it was empty except for one other customer sipping on his drink. I noticed that all the tables surrounding the dance floor and an at least one row behind them were all reserved, but with no one sitting in them. That would begin to change 30 minutes later. I found a non reserve table close to the dance floor and in the non smoking section which was a joke for those of us who do not smoke and are used to smoke free bars and restaurants.

While I was in the process of having another beer the ladies of the evening begin to arrive and by 12:30 the ratio of men to women was about 3:1 a buyers market, form what I could tell. There were very few 9-10’s, lots of 5-7’s a several 8’s, but nothing that would reach out and grab you. I don’t have anything against blondes, but I prefer redheads and brunettes and there were a lot of blondes. The one brunette that caught my eye was gone before I could make my move when I had spotted her hiding between the bar and dance floor, how I had missed her was beyond, but no since crying over spilled beer.

I would like to say that things picked up after my princess vanished in the arms of another man, but it went downhill from there, seated across from me were several gentlemen eating some type of seafood dish, which I am positive contain large amount of shrimp which I don’t get along with at all, combine with the cigarette smoke filled air, began to have its effect on me, I was becoming I'll, but I decided to battle on despite what was going on with my body. I figured it was time to switch from beer to scotch to fight this impending doom. My table was next to one of the reserve tables in which a long legged brunette was now occupying, but was preoccupied with an annoying Asian gentleman who wasn’t high on her hit parade and continued to remove his roaming hands from her body.

It was at this time I had decided that since this leggy brunette who was being bothered by her unwanted guest that I would come to her rescue, since my earlier object of desired had departed. I was not destine to take my brunette beauty with me this evening because I had began to lose my bout with the smoke and the shrimp and the only thing I could think of was to get out of the place as quickly as I could with dignity before the contents of my stomach became apparent to everyone. The look of disappointment in my leggy friend was I had time for as I left with no beauty in tow toward the exit.

Luke? :)

Believe it or not RP is one of the least smokest clubs in Kyiv. Then again just being in Kyiv isn't recommended for anyone who has asthma. And if you think Kyiv is bad wait until you sample Eastern Ukrainian.

Nice report, but why did you stay in a hotel. Although apartments aren't the amazing value they used to be they are still better then the hotels. And you should have known from reading the reports that RP and the other clubs in Kyiv don't start until 1230. Don't be hesitant to engage a girl in conversations, they don't bit, that's extra. :D

Cruiser D,

I knew there was smoking in the clubs, but I didn’t realize how bad it would be. Even though I read the forum countless of times, no one mentions much about the smoke in the clubs.

I will admit I made several tactical mistakes during my visit to RP, one I should have positioned myself in the area between the bar and dance floor instead of where I was seated by the reserve tables and the dance floor. If I had done that I might have walked away with that brunette stunner that I spotted to late and was gone like the wind on the arm of another gent.

My other mistake was I should have booked an apartment instead of a hotel, but since this was my first trip to Kiev and not knowing the racial situation all to clearly, despite reading DJ Four Money posts many times over. I figured a hotel would be a good option until I learn more. After I a still a newbie, even though I have been reading the posting on this board for several years now. Mistakes were bound to happen even though I was fortified with the information from this board!

Dear alls,

Can anybody gently suggest me if is better an hotel or an apartment to visit kiev in safe and full freedom? Can I know the name of hotell or good serviced apartment where night guest are allowed?

Many thanks to alls.

[QUOTE=Skywalker159]Cruiser D,

I knew there was smoking in the clubs, but I didn’t realize how bad it would be. Even though I read the forum countless of times, no one mentions much about the smoke in the clubs.

I will admit I made several tactical mistakes during my visit to RP, one I should have positioned myself in the area between the bar and dance floor instead of where I was seated by the reserve tables and the dance floor. If I had done that I might have walked away with that brunette stunner that I spotted to late and was gone like the wind on the arm of another gent.

My other mistake was I should have booked an apartment instead of a hotel, but since this was my first trip to Kiev and not knowing the racial situation all to clearly, despite reading DJ Four Money posts many times over. I figured a hotel would be a good option until I learn more. After I a still a newbie, even though I have been reading the posting on this board for several years now. Mistakes were bound to happen even though I was fortified with the information from this board![/QUOTE]

Smoke? whats smoke? where did you go? ahh there you are!
As cruiser said try it in the east if you think thats smokey.

Any position in RP.... for me propping the bar up is the best spot, you see them all, at some point and they always seem to have to say hello.
Sit down? hell no stand up!

I realized my mistake too late, but have made a mental note for my next visit.

As for sitting next to the reserve table I thought this would be prime territory since if you go to the effort to reserve yourself a table, you think more highly of yourself and the competition.

Hey guys,

Recession has arrived! For everybody! Girls must have respect now and must cut their prices in half!

[QUOTE=Skywalker159]Cruiser D,

I knew there was smoking in the clubs, but I didn’t realize how bad it would be. Even though I read the forum countless of times, no one mentions much about the smoke in the clubs.

I will admit I made several tactical mistakes during my visit to RP, one I should have positioned myself in the area between the bar and dance floor instead of where I was seated by the reserve tables and the dance floor. If I had done that I might have walked away with that brunette stunner that I spotted to late and was gone like the wind on the arm of another gent.

My other mistake was I should have booked an apartment instead of a hotel, but since this was my first trip to Kiev and not knowing the racial situation all to clearly, despite reading DJ Four Money posts many times over. I figured a hotel would be a good option until I learn more. After I a still a newbie, even though I have been reading the posting on this board for several years now. Mistakes were bound to happen even though I was fortified with the information from this board![/QUOTE]

Use the force next time....

I was a complete newbie traveling to Europe for CS, I didn't take any chances and went with proven advice expect for ignoring those that said "NO" to Frankfurt and "YES" to Berlin.

But RP was not all that smoke-filled. Sure there is some smoke, but I can handle it. I agree with D, don't play that shy bit, this is Slavic country, be aggressive that's what they want.

RP is buyers market until the subject of price comes up....

IMHO the best time to get something for take out, is between 2-3am when if you have seen a girl the entire night usually means she hasn't been offered anything and could be looking to get some business and be willing to reduce her price.

I wasn't getting anal for the price I wanted to pay so I said no thank you in the end.

Plus the "freebie" cashed in several hours later so in the end, I got what I wanted.

I would suggest an apartment as well. Glad you enjoyed my post, I was wondering if anybody had got any mileage out of anything I was saying... :)

DJ,

I found your post helpful in that there are very few people of race on this board and so your insights were very helpful to me. As were all the other posts by the senior members.

If we remember, Gia prices, which can be used as a rough baseline for other service providers of better and worse quality, by other agencies or independents, at RP or the streets, went up from a minimum of 150 USD to 160 USD when the dollar dropped over the past year. Now the dollar has gone up, and the russian economy has hit bottom, but prices have not gone down. I figure the minimum at Gia should now be 130-140 USD, and other providers should also be lowering their prices accordingly. Let's see what happens over the next month or two as the number of travelers goes down, the holiday season approaches and the effects of the markets spreads to the Ukrainian economy. Please keep reporting.. and refusing to pay unreasonable prices.

Its too soon to tell, but the Dollar appears to be the safe haven for today. AKA P4P more affordable if you are in dollars. Commodity-Asset deflation.

Also, if there is a recession, which there appears to be, this should further affordable P4P.

If either of the two US Pres candidates offers a subsidy for P4P (a stimulus package) to help with the effects of the depression, he has my vote.

Also, consider that some economies may see substantial currency devaluation, again good for foreign buyers of domestic products and services. I often think of how good it must have been to be in Argentina after the most recent currency collapse.

There may be opportunity out there, a buyers market.

How are prices tracking in the Ukrane?

Today (in far east Ukraine) the dollar was trading for 5. 60, the highest I ve seen in maybe 4 yrs. I wouldn't say the dollar is trading high because it's strong, this is the monkey shit dollar we're talking about, the reason is the UAH has gone titties up! About three weeks ago the Ukraine stock market (I didn't know they was such a thing) lost 70 percent of it's value. The local currency here is losing value fast! This may have been brought on by a huge trade dificit which was 6. 5 bill about 8 months ago and is now close to 12 bill, and is expected to rise to 35 bill in a few yrs. Also today, clown Yushchenko dissolved the parliament, this could, well most certainly will, lower the UAH value even more so. And lets not forget, on Jan 1, natural gas prices are expected to rise considerably, this could bring layoffs to thousands of employees in the industrial east. A ressession, maybe, I say this bcause inflation is still high here.

There has been a change of visa requirements (May '08) for Americans and west Euros, from what I understand its back to 180 days registration (from 90), anyone else who lives here, (Uke Boy) is this your understanding as well?

[QUOTE=Timmy21]Today (in far east Ukraine) the dollar was trading for 5. 60, the highest I ve seen in maybe 4 yrs. I wouldn't say the dollar is trading high because it's strong, this is the monkey shit dollar we're talking about, the reason is the UAH has gone titties up! About three weeks ago the Ukraine stock market (I didn't know they was such a thing) lost 70 percent of it's value. The local currency here is losing value fast! This may have been brought on by a huge trade dificit which was 6. 5 bill about 8 months ago and is now close to 12 bill, and is expected to rise to 35 bill in a few yrs. Also today, clown Yushchenko dissolved the parliament, this could, well most certainly will, lower the UAH value even more so. And lets not forget, on Jan 1, natural gas prices are expected to rise considerably, this could bring layoffs to thousands of employees in the industrial east. A ressession, maybe, I say this bcause inflation is still high here.

There has been a change of visa requirements (May '08) for Americans and west Euros, from what I understand its back to 180 days registration (from 90), anyone else who lives here, (Uke Boy) is this your understanding as well?[/QUOTE]Question is, since RP girls for example quote in dollars and euros... when do we start pushing the prices back down and when do they start taking what they can get as they realize their pseudo-economy is going tits up?

is ''a person of race'' WTF!!

We are all members of the human race aren't we?

Personally I could NGAF what colour or race a person comes from. You have to take people as you find them. Being an arsehole is not confined to any particular race or colour!! (Or any particular political view or religion come to that.)

Why have we all seemingly become so 'lily livered' about stating the bloody obvious. For example if I were Indian, I would NOT be happy being referred to an an 'Asian' or a person of race (whatever the fuck that means) I'm a fucking Indian and proud of it! This shit does so much harm.

Anyway, back to the hookers as Ash1001 says:-)







[QUOTE=Skywalker159]DJ,

I found your post helpful in that there are very few people of race on this board and so your insights were very helpful to me. As were all the other posts by the senior members.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Question is, since RP girls for example quote in dollars and euros... when do we start pushing the prices back down and when do they start taking what they can get as they realize their pseudo-economy is going tits up?[/QUOTE]



I'm interested in seeing go tits up......

[QUOTE=Timmy21]Today (in far east Ukraine) the dollar was trading for 5. 60, the highest I ve seen in maybe 4 yrs. I wouldn't say the dollar is trading high because it's strong, this is the monkey shit dollar we're talking about, the reason is the UAH has gone titties up! About three weeks ago the Ukraine stock market (I didn't know they was such a thing) lost 70 percent of it's value. The local currency here is losing value fast! This may have been brought on by a huge trade dificit which was 6. 5 bill about 8 months ago and is now close to 12 bill, and is expected to rise to 35 bill in a few yrs. Also today, clown Yushchenko dissolved the parliament, this could, well most certainly will, lower the UAH value even more so. And lets not forget, on Jan 1, natural gas prices are expected to rise considerably, this could bring layoffs to thousands of employees in the industrial east. A ressession, maybe, I say this bcause inflation is still high here.

There has been a change of visa requirements (May '08) for Americans and west Euros, from what I understand its back to 180 days registration (from 90), anyone else who lives here, (Uke Boy) is this your understanding as well?[/QUOTE]
Sevs view on Russian/Ukraine economic policy (from the ordinary provider,whether it be bread,sex,rice or accomodation).
It is of no importance the exchange rate in this country or the rate of inflation/deflation or whatever to people plying their particular trade or commodity, if a loaf of bread or a shot in the dark is 3uah/300uah on a Monday,it will never be 2.5uah/250uah on Tuesday or Xmas day regardless of what has happened in Europe/USA/Asia or the moon.
Think Einstein said something about what goes up, must come down (maybe old Albert never visited Ukraine/Russia)?

[QUOTE=Timmy21]Today (in far east Ukraine) the dollar was trading for 5. 60, the highest I ve seen in maybe 4 yrs. I wouldn't say the dollar is trading high because it's strong, this is the monkey shit dollar we're talking about, the reason is the UAH has gone titties up! About three weeks ago the Ukraine stock market (I didn't know they was such a thing) lost 70 percent of it's value. The local currency here is losing value fast! This may have been brought on by a huge trade dificit which was 6. 5 bill about 8 months ago and is now close to 12 bill, and is expected to rise to 35 bill in a few yrs. Also today, clown Yushchenko dissolved the parliament, this could, well most certainly will, lower the UAH value even more so. And lets not forget, on Jan 1, natural gas prices are expected to rise considerably, this could bring layoffs to thousands of employees in the industrial east. A ressession, maybe, I say this bcause inflation is still high here.

There has been a change of visa requirements (May '08) for Americans and west Euros, from what I understand its back to 180 days registration (from 90), anyone else who lives here, (Uke Boy) is this your understanding as well?[/QUOTE]Practically the devaluation of hryvnia decreased the average ukrainian wages from 400$ in July to 320$ in September.(they decreased even in hryvnia).If this trend continues,life for westerners will become easier.

Ukrainian economy could collapse(there can be no bail out program in this country unlike Russia and EU),however Putin promised support in exchange to ukrainian reorientation to Russia.Timoshenko already agreed.If the agreement is kept,gas prices will not increase in January.

Anyway the news are encouraging for mongers.

To bad this didn't happen sooner at least I would've gotten more bang for my miserable dollar.

[QUOTE=Timmy21]Today (in far east Ukraine) the dollar was trading for 5. 60, the highest I ve seen in maybe 4 yrs. I wouldn't say the dollar is trading high because it's strong, this is the monkey shit dollar we're talking about, the reason is the UAH has gone titties up! About three weeks ago the Ukraine stock market (I didn't know they was such a thing) lost 70 percent of it's value. The local currency here is losing value fast! This may have been brought on by a huge trade dificit which was 6. 5 bill about 8 months ago and is now close to 12 bill, and is expected to rise to 35 bill in a few yrs. Also today, clown Yushchenko dissolved the parliament, this could, well most certainly will, lower the UAH value even more so. And lets not forget, on Jan 1, natural gas prices are expected to rise considerably, this could bring layoffs to thousands of employees in the industrial east. A ressession, maybe, I say this bcause inflation is still high here.

There has been a change of visa requirements (May '08) for Americans and west Euros, from what I understand its back to 180 days registration (from 90), anyone else who lives here, (Uke Boy) is this your understanding as well?[/QUOTE]

Timmy,
The colapse of prominvest bank is the reason its shooting up as everyone is taking there grevna out of prominvest and running down and changing it to dollars so Ukraine being Ukraine theres nothing like cashing in on other peoples loss........ hence the high dollar and euro exchange rate, as everyone is putting there money back under the bed.

[QUOTE=Fox7717]is ''a person of race'' WTF!!

We are all members of the human race aren't we?

Personally I could NGAF what colour or race a person comes from. You have to take people as you find them. Being an arsehole is not confined to any particular race or colour!! (Or any particular political view or religion come to that.)

Why have we all seemingly become so 'lily livered' about stating the bloody obvious. For example if I were Indian, I would NOT be happy being referred to an an 'Asian' or a person of race (whatever the fuck that means) I'm a fucking Indian and proud of it! This shit does so much harm.

Anyway, back to the hookers as Ash1001 says:-)[/QUOTE]

Oh lighten up, I think he meant how people of color would be perceived in Eastern Europe.

I can say no negative effects from my experience and all my experience tells me, given more time, much more could have happen....

If the Uah is in the toliet, hmmm Ukrainian Air should be hella cheap...

[QUOTE=DJ FourMoney]Oh lighten up, I think he meant how people of color would be perceived in Eastern Europe.

I can say no negative effects from my experience and all my experience tells me, given more time, much more could have happen....

If the Uah is in the toliet, hmmm Ukrainian Air should be hella cheap...[/QUOTE]




We should all 'lighten up' and stop all this PC crap.

End of sermon and back to the girls...who I agree prices will fall.

Guys,

I am going to hit kiev today. I am latin and I had been reading all post, however would you mind reminding all mongering fellows.

- What are the best strip bars in kiev

- What is the current dollar excahnge, and

- Best activities in the afternoon other than calling gia or similar escort places Finally:

Any advices on RP? , best girls names you know for girlfriend experience?

Thanks

Hecker,

What do you mean registration (Visa? ) went back to 180 days from 90 days? Americans and EU citizens don't need visa!

Finally Wizzair is going to fly from Germany to Kiev!!! They start in January. From Dortmund, 4 times a week and from Cologne, 3 times a week!

Price about 130 euro round trip including all costs!

Have a nice stay here!

[QUOTE=Primejm]Guys,

I am going to hit kiev today. I am latin and I had been reading all post, however would you mind reminding all mongering fellows.

- What are the best strip bars in kiev

- What is the current dollar excahnge, and

- Best activities in the afternoon other than calling gia or similar escort places Finally:

Any advices on RP? , best girls names you know for girlfriend experience?

Thanks[/QUOTE]There is no other activity in the afternoon unless you hit it with a freebie - or unless you have an appointment with a stripper you met the night before!

Strip bars: read the threads"Dollar exchange: check it on the internet

Who's going to bail Russia out? When oil goes under $50/barrel the Russian economy is going to make the ruble crash of 98 look like a tea social.

[QUOTE=Hecker]Practically the devaluation of hryvnia decreased the average ukrainian wages from 400$ in July to 320$ in September.(they decreased even in hryvnia).If this trend continues,life for westerners will become easier.

Ukrainian economy could collapse(there can be no bail out program in this country unlike Russia and EU),however Putin promised support in exchange to ukrainian reorientation to Russia.Timoshenko already agreed.If the agreement is kept,gas prices will not increase in January.

Anyway the news are encouraging for mongers.[/QUOTE]

Timmy the convoluted registstration process in the Ukraine was put in place to hurry up WTO membership. Ukraine got membership in what, the spring/winter? Hence the relaxed rules.

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]Who's going to bail Russia out?[/QUOTE]

One thing for sure its not going to be the good old US of A

Only Americans seem to think oh well at least the rest of the worlds going to get it as well! I have news for you, apart from the UK no where is going to get it as bad as the USA, bank bail out pah! just delaying the obvious bankruptcy of America, its not if, its when!

Please tell me why are all commodity dealers/ producers now starting to deal in Euros only?

The writings on the wall, now please back to the hookers!

[QUOTE=Qjump]One thing for sure its not going to be the good old US of A

Only Americans seem to think oh well at least the rest of the worlds going to get it as well! I have news for you, apart from the UK no where is going to get it as bad as the USA, bank bail out pah! just delaying the obvious bankruptcy of America, its not if, its when!

Please tell me why are all commodity dealers/ producers now starting to deal in Euros only?

The writings on the wall, now please back to the hookers![/QUOTE]



Agreed USA national debt is now 12 Trillion and counting! Has doubled in less than a year. Their screwed? UK not doing much better though. Bail out will not work. How will borrowing MORE money solve debt crisis?!

Anyway...back to the hooters!

[QUOTE=Fox7717]Agreed USA national debt is now 12 Trillion and counting! Has doubled in less than a year. Their screwed? UK not doing much better though. Bail out will not work. How will borrowing MORE money solve debt crisis?!

Anyway...back to the hooters![/QUOTE]You know, there is an "American Politics" thread...

Here's a picture of my girlfriend's tits. If I'm honest to myself, it's pretty much her tits that keep me calling back. That and her marathon cock-sucking sessions. Some girls just loving sucking man meat.

Dr S, that is quite the nice rack!

Q, do you read any other website other the ISG? How many of the world's stock markets closed last week? Here's a hint for you - none of them were the NYSE.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]You know, there is an "American Politics" thread...

Here's a picture of my girlfriend's tits. If I'm honest to myself, it's pretty much her tits that keep me calling back. That and her marathon cock-sucking sessions. Some girls just loving sucking man meat.[/QUOTE]



Great rack...any more photos...found a gem there!

Hope the current crisis becomes bigger and the domino effect comes to East Europe. Cheaper prices, modest girls content with a lot less, less glamour and more action. Back to the good old golden days.

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]Dr S, that is quite the nice rack!

Q, do you read any other website other the ISG? How many of the world's stock markets closed last week? Here's a hint for you - none of them were the NYSE.[/QUOTE]Yes you are so right, the only site I ever visit! how did you guess?

Now please back to the hookers!

And pictures of tits not just conversations by tits.

[QUOTE=Folletto]Hello IT can you give me the exact address of "Illy Caffè" ? or much more informations for find it?

Thank you[/QUOTE]Did not see your post!

You can buy Illy at Tsum. On K street.

Otherwise in the basement under the Rinok one of the bars is serving it. Just look at the sign.

IT

[QUOTE=Qjump]And pictures of tits not just conversations by tits.[/QUOTE]Yep Cruiser would certainly be known as a right tit in the UK. Or should that be a left one based on his politics?

Hi guys

I was in kiev this past May and almost all the girls in RP were asking for $400 at around 11:00pm, I waited and watched for the price to go down, at around 2:30am the price for some of the girls had dropped to $250-$300. I took a nice blond back to my room, and spent about 3 hours with her.

My question for the more senior members here:

If I take a girl out say at 11:00pm, do I have her all night, like from 11:00pm to say 5-6:00am? Or the $400 basically buys me the 2-3 hours time with the girl? Which means I would get more girl/hr in this case, can you guys recommend which track is more advantageous: early take out and pay the $400, or take much later and pay $250-300?

Thanks

[QUOTE=Dallim93]Hi guys

I was in kiev this past May and almost all the girls in RP were asking for $400 at around 11:00pm, I waited and watched for the price to go down, at around 2:30am the price for some of the girls had dropped to $250-$300. I took a nice blond back to my room, and spent about 3 hours with her.

My question for the more senior members here:

If I take a girl out say at 11:00pm, do I have her all night, like from 11:00pm to say 5-6:00am? Or the $400 basically buys me the 2-3 hours time with the girl? Which means I would get more girl/hr in this case, can you guys recommend which track is more advantageous: early take out and pay the $400, or take much later and pay $250-300?

Thanks[/QUOTE]Very simple: clear that up with the girl beforehand. Most assume the deal is 2-3 hours/1-2 pokes. Although some girls are happy to stay the night and do so without question, some girls want to go back to the club for round 2.

Sloppy seconds. Nasty.
Or just go home and sleep in their own bed. Understandable.
Or go back to their unsuspecting boyfriend or husband. Funny.
Or go back to their pimp boyfriend and give him the money. Buzz kill.

If you want her for a longer time, it is best to negotiate and clear this up beforehand.

I also think you should adjust your purchasing habits to yourself. If you are fresh and energetic at 12.00... maybe it pays off to take one then (paying about $100 more than you would later) as opposed to waiting around, spending $30-50 on drinks only to take a girl home at 4am for $100 less and then only have energy for 1-2 pokes?

[QUOTE=Dallim93]Hi guys

I was in kiev this past May and almost all the girls in RP were asking for $400 at around 11:00pm, I waited and watched for the price to go down, at around 2:30am the price for some of the girls had dropped to $250-$300. I took a nice blond back to my room, and spent about 3 hours with her.

My question for the more senior members here:

If I take a girl out say at 11:00pm, do I have her all night, like from 11:00pm to say 5-6:00am? Or the $400 basically buys me the 2-3 hours time with the girl? Which means I would get more girl/hr in this case, can you guys recommend which track is more advantageous: early take out and pay the $400, or take much later and pay $250-300?

Thanks[/QUOTE]There is no simple answer to this. It depends on the girl, on you, how you click, is she hard pro, and what kind of deal you make.

I could personally never understand the point in waiting to 3 -4 am, save 100 bucks, but in the meantime spending money - and maybe getting a little drunk and tired - so the sex is also less fun?

If you are early, you may risk that the girl gets out quickly to go back to RP. On the other side, I once had a bad early meeting, and I myself went back to RP and got another girl for a great allnighter!

[QUOTE=Dallim93]Hi guys

I was in kiev this past May and almost all the girls in RP were asking for $400 at around 11:00pm, I waited and watched for the price to go down, at around 2:30am the price for some of the girls had dropped to $250-$300. I took a nice blond back to my room, and spent about 3 hours with her.

My question for the more senior members here:

If I take a girl out say at 11:00pm, do I have her all night, like from 11:00pm to say 5-6:00am? Or the $400 basically buys me the 2-3 hours time with the girl? Which means I would get more girl/hr in this case, can you guys recommend which track is more advantageous: early take out and pay the $400, or take much later and pay $250-300?
Thanks[/QUOTE]
Ditto on what Dr. Skank said. Iwas there last month and the girls in RP seemed quite direct and willing to talk explicitly about what for how long and how much. The one I took home (well, actually she took ME home as she had a car) told me upfront that she would stay until 5:30 AM and then she was outta there.

Thank you gentlemen for your comments and much needed advise.

I have one more question for you guys. I will stay in Kiev 3 nights this time. Beside setting up dates with the girls online in advance of my visit there, and visiting RP. Would you recommend any other venue that is a "must try" for getting a good taste of mongering in Kiev?

Thank you for your advise and your wisdom.

Moved to 1 of the newer sleeping districts in Kyiv 3 weeks ago. Finally alone (no gal) after a year.

Was waiting for the auto-bus OR marchutka and sitting drinking a liter around 22:00. There was this taller blonde 'prancing' back and forth inf ront of me.

After 10 minutes she went to walk to metro and I said, Nyte marshutka?

In decent english it was. 'stupid transport'. So I asked why she spoke english? 'I am a Doctor"! Yes, that expalins it. Anway we talk some and I tell her I am new to the district, by this time our BUS comes. We get on and I sit with her. She is from Belarussia, but is UKR girl. I tell her I want to speak english with her soon. Ask if she is married? "yes, " So I ask if she has a boyfriend? And she says yes. Maybe 2!

SEE, guys. THEY are 'fawkers' just as much as we are.

I tell her it is my Birthday tomorrow and I want her to celebrate with me. We agree on Cognac in cafe near our homes.

So today we meet at 4:00pm. We comes 'smoking hot'. Tits bulging out. And is so sweet! Tells me all about her husband and how HE is nothing. And how she wants to have some attention. So I tell her we can go and she can she the attention of a USA guy.

Sorry, but daughter is home. So I sms her later. How I want. ALL.

She replies, Why not, you are gentle!

I say come in the morning. (I AM LIKING THIS, as I am in 'morning mode' usually)

We will see how good this is?

My point is this. These girls are so missing a good, nice, fun, easy going guy to show them some care & atention.

At over 50, in USA I could never. Ever get this gal to even.

Oh well, I am here and LUVING IT!

LS (the master of FREE) Guy

After 9 years, I FINALLY have access to a laptop in my Ukrainian apartment, so I can attempt to initiate a monger meeting, with any Seniors interested in swapping tall tail tales over tallboys.

Any buyers?

I almost hope nobody's in town, I am so fucking drained tired at this point that I can't even type anymore. I've reached that point where I'm half-fucking just for the workout to try to pull every muscle and for the thrill of the screams I'm getting out of the dyevs. I want to give them something to remember long after their ass cheek hickey's have faded purple to yellow-green.l

[QUOTE=Dallim93]Thank you gentlemen for your comments and much needed advise.

I have one more question for you guys. I will stay in Kiev 3 nights this time. Beside setting up dates with the girls online in advance of my visit there, and visiting RP. Would you recommend any other venue that is a "must try" for getting a good taste of mongering in Kiev?

Thank you for your advise and your wisdom.[/QUOTE]If you haven't been to Kiev before, then RP is your safe bet. And if you go there 3 nights in a row you will see new girls every night (although some will be there every night!). In the weekend Arena might be worth to try. Depending on how much money you want to spend/can spend you can go to the nightclub Millenium in Dniepr Hotell. They sometimes have real stunners and almost all of them are for take out. But it will cost you maybe 600 USD for all night. Be careful with girl's drinks etc. in club, suddenly you have spent another USD 200 there. You can get there around 10 pm, check it out and then move to RP around midnight. But this will cost you twice as much as RP.

Life, the next time I am in Kyiv I just have to meet you. Did you move to Bovary? ;)

Bez, yeah for years and years we were stuck using dial up and phone cards, now it seems like at least half the apartment have broadband now. I got hooked on the USB broadband cell modem I used the last time I was in the Ukraine.

[QUOTE=Cruiser D
Bez, for years you were using dial up and phone cards, now apartment have broadband. I got hooked on the USB broadband cell modem in Ukraine.

[/QUOTE]

Sometimes you are quite off.

I've never tried anything here except Internet Cafe before, because I never HAD a laptop, because I never bothered with using internet websites to meet dyevochkas. Just never needed it before. My style has always been networking through human contacts, mamachkas, padrugas, agencies, on and on.

Ok, so last year I discovered, thanks to somebody suggesting, the dating sites, but I still only used that at home, to pre-set meetings and have phone numbers to call when I got here. That actually worked, but it was limited, again, some are serious to meet, and others not. Making any new contacts with that since I've arrived, well, since I've been here 2 and a half weeks, I have YET to meet even one new girl with the dating websites. Its like Lukasek said about Ufa, when you're in your home country, some may be very friendly, cause they really don't think that you will come. Once you get here, they act like they never knew you or wanted you to come, like they and got spooked.

Not all, mind you. Dasha in Russia, and Olya here in Ukraine, are 2 of the absolute most incredible dyevs, 100% 10's in every possible GFE I could ever want, and without the websites, I never would have found either one. Since I left Russia in the spring, Dasha is now missing in action. She sms's me in May, and no response since. GO figure.

But SINCE I've been here, nothing with the internet. All new acquaintances since I've been here have been old style for me. Killing time posting ain't so bad, waiting now for Polinka to come over.

So I was NOT using dial up or phone cards, and as far as the adapter or connection, I just plugged the cable in, and started surfing. But with the laptop I bought last month at CompUSA, even the IP tech guys here in the provinces at their office could not configure the protocols or Network connection to get that thing to work here. We even spent a half hour on the phone with Sylvannia tech support long distance to NYC, and that was completely useless, to get it through the very final step where it kept kicking back to some question about the PPPoe virtual private network broadband connection settings. Each time we put in the codes and passwords, that work for EVERY OTHER laptop that anyone else has ever used here, MINE WOULD NOT accept it.

But that is just simply the Bez way, with all things technical.
Give me a nipple or a clit, and I'll get that thing gushing and twitching like
a mexican jumping bean dripping juice down my chin!

Cell modems? Fuck if I know!

Last shot, anybody up for Saturday Night in Kiev, or am I jsut gonna have to give all my time to Zhenya and Marina? At least they are texting me like mad waiting for my return. Mongers? well, I guess I never had much use for you lot in the past, why should now be any different, right?

Doc, you out there in the suburbs? Time for another PapaJohns bathroom BJ
with some blondinkas from Archangels'k?

Roger the Dodger Mellie? You still serving time for that gone-bad arms deal with the Mauritanians?

Strav?

Anyone?

[QUOTE=Bez Bezarra]Doc, you out there in the suburbs? Time for another PapaJohns bathroom BJ
with some blondinkas from Archangels'k?

Roger the Dodger Mellie? You still serving time for that gone-bad arms deal with the Mauritanians?

Anyone?[/QUOTE]Bueller? Bueller?

Actually it was Mellie who scored the Siberian bathroom blowjob... but it was Papa John's... :)

Mellie is still around and banging birds right and left. Good stuff too.

Regrettably I'm in St.Petes, otherwise I'd buy you a Slavutich. Or was that Slutovich?

Cruise MAN, last time I told you we could hook up. I would pay for metro to RP and you could buy me a beer!

But now I won't offer that. Word is metro will go to 2 uah! Ouch!

Bez Guy, I'll drink a beer with ya. Hell. I drink 8 liters a day anyway.

LS Guy

Ps. Dr Freebie was called into the hospital early today, we are meeting at 22:00 near my flat!

Pps. She is what is called a "Narcologist" WTF is that? I told her I was an American Alcoholic. But here I am just a SOCIAL drinker! She laughed!

That 'you' was supposed to be taken as a general 'we'. Thats why I changed it about 2 minutes after I posted the original message. But alas I was not fast enough to beat the web surfing Bez.

And you are right, the internet is universal, you have to throw a lot out there to get one good hit. Dating Agency websites have a lot higher hit percentage because the girls are serious, about what who knows but their intentions are usually serious, whether it's for a single free meal or a life time of free meals. :) Ask for the Dyev's mobile number and then call her and chat. That is generally the litmus test to see if there will be any real time face (or other body part) time.

I'd say your ASUS is suffering from built in NIC driver problems. Solution, download a new driver (if there is one) or buy a USB network interface that works with both your laptop and the Ukr network interface. Or better yet hang out at the University of Hot Young Female IT Students and ask for help.

Little chilly in Kyiv today? :)

The metro is going up to 2uah? No way! Forget it, I'm never going to Kyiv again.

Why didn't you show up for the Super Bowl Ho Down? Got another one coming up soon.

[quote=cruiser d].

i was not fast enough to bs bez.

i'd say your asus is suffering.

chilly in kyiv today?

[/quote]

1.
the asus i borrowed from the ip company president, works just fine, wonderful, in fact. i've been using it for 2 weeks. he lent it to me, because his 2 tech guys could not get my brand new off the shleves sylvannia gos to accept their pppoe whatever thingy, so he was nice enough to hold onto my $300 piece of crap, and let me use one of his. in an hour, i will be returning his asus, and retrieving my gos, and thus you will see no more posts from bez until i return home, but when i do, i will have fotos.

2.
i wouldn't know the weather in kyiv since i'm still out here in kyandilund oblast, near the tractor factory and nucular testing waste disposal plant for chernobyl science project memorials. but its probably 6 degrees there. here in oblast cuntry, its sunny and nippy, though my flat is very toasty, as the radiators kicked on 4 days ago, and i can finally sleep without 3 fucking blankets and 2 warm-up suits on. these radiators have one speed, full blast, so its quite balmy inside, in fact, i have to keep the windows open to keep it bearable in here. its obviously necessary to have the heat cranking, since it will be 30 below zero in another 6 weeks, and the heat will be welcome to all the locals, but for me, i'm happy to walk around in shorts and no shirt, just like being home!

this is bez, signing off from the land of kandy.

see you again in the spring.

You can use the Wifi in Borispil with your Gos. :P

And you said you were going to stay across from Manadrin Plaza, so who is BS'ing who here. Come on Bez, you aren't fooling anyone anymore. You aren't a budget minded province ho'er. The reports are already filter in from my spies at Decedance, seems like you spent the last two weeks there in the company of $500/hour ho's and 5k/week sugar babies. Yuri the bar man said you were dropping an easy 2k/night for bottle service, chicken wings and bubble gum for the girls.

Browsing through the recent discussion on UKR economy and exchange rates, I couldn't help but notice how far our dollar got hammered in recent years.

The last time I was in Keiv, was in Dec 2004, orange revolution time. An apartment in krischatic street was $45 a night. All nighter with a russian blonde from RP was $150 ( I think) and I bought a last minute air ticket from Kiev to Lviv for just $60. And the freebe who stayed with me for 2 days and took me to her apartment also ..... priceless.

Yup, Royal it was good times back then. 1k/month for a great western apartment in Maidan or within site of Mandarin Plaza. The RP girls were running $100-$150 for the night. GIA was still priced ok. The salons were running $40-$80. But you can still get cheap airfares. :)

But even as good as that was, we (I) missed the 'wanna fuck, I'm American' days. Or 'I'll buy you diner for sex' during the Ruble crash of 1998.

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]

You said you stay across from Manadrin Plaza.

Bez, you aren't fooling anyone anymore.
You aren't a budget minded provincer.

The spies at Decedance see you in the company of 5k/week sugar babies.
Yuri said you drop 2k/night for girls.

[/QUOTE]

Your agents must have been tailing my identical twin, Udre Bezarra, small arms dealer and large living monger, he prefers to shoot .22 caliber KGB Markov well placed rounds into targets like Galina Krasnopizd's eye socket.

I, on the other foot, AM foolin' everyone, in fact, I can fool most of the fools most of the time, but not too early please!

But so what if when I'm passing through and camped out holed up with a couple of 3-holers in a flat next door to the Fortuna Cigarny Bar on Beseynya Ul.! Its not like I'm sleeping INSIDE the Prada store!

As far as $5,000 per week models, you're just completely wrong as usual, but I think at this point, that your point is simply to write the most innacurate posts in an effort to fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shamus on George W?

That's why 15 out of my 17 nites, I was right back home, hangin wth Mr. Kupervich, and my new freebie Darva, who has an apple of a popa.

For the mongering record though, I would like to go down for posterity, that I, one Beznarkoff Guzzouli Wolfrick von Schmucklestien Bezarra LLC LTD & Sons, did my very absolute almost best to initiate a monger-gatherin' last Saturday in K-City, and was re-boofed by all those parties who you know who you are, especially that LS Gay, who blew off a confirmed meetin' o' the ISG Klan, for none other than some little pieces of pizda, two in suck-cession, might I add, one "regular old gal-pal, but she's got free food!", in light of the historic proportion of the occasion, left the Bez holding, (and squeezing), the bagpipe bag!

So let it be known, (Admin that's you!), that next time around fall '09, when Bez hits Mandarin Plaza, it might just not be with Alyssa, 18 year old hard charging tennis star wannabe that had only posted her page one day before a friend and big titty loving monger himself looked her up and tipped me off to call her, turns out she was very VERY much quite the little eager beaver to meet up at Fridays at 11:30, and without so much as a, "can I buy ya a drink?", walked right out from the foyer with me, passed through the empty Bessarabka, past the Bentley's in Mandarin, and into the lair I had concocted to which the ultra-debauching of her one-month old post-op 38D breast implants, I performed another Doctor Skank method gifting program of a very cheap black lace see through neglige' teddy bear nighty.

Thanks to this well tested and approved monger pre-sex labia moistening technique, I simply told her I had been waiting all along for a dyev like her, to model this sleep wear, so she became excited and grabbed the thing right out of my hands, and into the tyualet, proceeded to strip down to nothing, and emerge all fresh implants and beaver in this nighty, practically blowing up the capital city with her insane perfect body. Ok, I'll admit her face was nothing inspiring, but not a problem either, with very soft skin and lots of smiles, thick and very healthy dark brown hair that she twirled all around the Bez Johnson while deep-throating, but as I said, a strong shouldered athletic freaky Kiev girl, on the prowl for a passin-through monger. Boy did I get lucky! She rocked my damn world, and surprised the hell out of me with her ultra-horny tennis style sex romp, grinding her pussy so hard into my jaw as she sat on my face, that its still sore from the mashing she inflicted upon me.

All this, when I only expected to go grab a brew or two with some monger ex-pat from Springfield, little did the Bez know this no-show was gonna lead me to a very memorable session with my first and only 18 year old Ukrainian implant amazon girl with an insatiable appetite for cock. My only regret is that she did NOT want to allow me to share my wonderful luck with the board, as she insisted NO FOTOS of her or her impressive 38D's. what a shame! She was quite a site, if you could imagine any of the new crop of WTA tennis stars, about 5'8", extremely solidly built shoulders, but not an ounce of fat, all muscle, and now to add as well, all tits, squatting down leg thrusts, and huffing puffing grunting with each and every beef injection inside her twat, man what a work out! I wish I could say that she nearly killed me, but that I had been working out daily and nightly for 2 straight weeks in the provinces, to prepare myself for this 3 set match against a very intimidating opponent, she stared me down like some breakfast sausage, and gobbled my rod like there was no tomorrow.

After I splooged a sticky spurting onto her smiling cheeks which she rubbed in for a healthy zit-free complexion, she thanked me and bear hugged me, and was off into the night for a taksi homeward to her grandmother's doma, leaving me with a wild and crazy story that could have only been a result, ONCE AGAIN, of the weird and wacky circumstances of this monger-haven we call ISG!

Myabe I DO need to spend a little more time here in Kyiv? I must say, all my complaining about prices being too high, didn't come to fruition this time around, as Nataly was not complaining for the $150 I gave her for the 2 hours she fuck-fested with me for our post-provincial follow up session, and Alyssa never even mentioned dengi during our entire evening together, so I slid 400 hrivna into her purse when she was leaving. Perhaps she will think Bez to be a cheapo-lay, though I believe she was in it for the thrash, over the cash, and subsequently left with her own ear-to ear huy sucking grin.

As I mentioned with GREAT regret, sorry but no after-match neglige' modeling fotos with Alyssa, but she is in Kyiv, if you wanna find her, she hangs in Independence square with her tennis program girlfriends.

So, Darva in the provinces with her cute little and very spankable apple-popa:

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]Yup, Royal it was good times back then. 1k/month for a great western apartment in Maidan or within site of Mandarin Plaza. The RP girls were running $100-$150 for the night. GIA was still priced ok. The salons were running $40-$80. But you can still get cheap airfares. :)

But even as good as that was, we (I) missed the 'wanna fuck, I'm American' days. Or 'I'll buy you diner for sex' during the Ruble crash of 1998.[/QUOTE]

Start thinking Ruble crash of 1998 and move back in time from there CD. Reasonably safe to predict that we will see UKr. and EE getting back to those times from this Xmas on. It is going to be a great Monger Spring in EE once again. Just be sure to keep your powder dry and enjoy. Bez B will think he died (again) and is in 3-hole heaven once more. It is gonna be brutal for the Young Players but the Old Hands will thrive.

Prepare to Hang in and Enjoy. Oh yes - no longer will the good ladies be turning up their noses at the puny US $ - until it crashes again, IMO, along with super high interest rates in 12-18 months. I can hardly wait.

[url]http://www.advfn.com/news_UPDATE-2-IMF-Ukraine-agree-on-16-5-billion-loan-deal_28947523.html[/url]

Sorry to intervene but the ones who have been hit till now by the economic crisis in this forum are the mongers who cannot get easy credit to visit FSU and not the local women.

Ukraine is on the path of recession,not collapse.Wages in terms of US dollars stand now in the same level as one year ago,at 310$ per month.

I have written that the limit of 300$ per month decides for the girls' attitude,if it is surpassed,chances to get freebies get considerably lower.(for example you may start getting one freebie per week only which is economically unacceptable).

So unless the wages fall under the 300$ per month,we will see no real improvement in condition in Ukraine for pussy investors.

[QUOTE=Excess]Start thinking Ruble crash of 1998 and move back in time from there CD. Reasonably safe to predict that we will see UKr. and EE getting back to those times from this Xmas on. It is going to be a great Monger Spring in EE once again. Just be sure to keep your powder dry and enjoy. Bez B will think he died (again) and is in 3-hole heaven once more. It is gonna be brutal for the Young Players but the Old Hands will thrive.

Prepare to Hang in and Enjoy. Oh yes - no longer will the good ladies be turning up their noses at the puny US $ - until it crashes again, IMO, along with super high interest rates in 12-18 months. I can hardly wait.

[url]http://www.advfn.com/news_UPDATE-2-IMF-Ukraine-agree-on-16-5-billion-loan-deal_28947523.html[/url][/QUOTE]


looking at EUR/USD appreicated to 1.6 level and now back to 1.2, thinking that crude oil price climbed from 50$ to 150$ per barrel and now is below 80$, everything is NOT predictable anymore

For beginner mongers who wish to come to Ukraine.

It is hard to sum up all information from this forum and from my experiences into few words. I try to put here what can help foreigners in Ukraine and nobody says that. I am sure you will save a lot of money with my report!

First of all, about men. Too many men think when a woman is beautiful, then she can ask everything. Too many men think it is right to be a gentleman with women. Too many men have hard lives with women in their own countries and they hope to find good women in Ukraine. Too many men think pussy fuck is more important than money. Too many men don’t know sex is an art and this is not just a sperm download. Too many men don’t know the sweetest women can provide the worst sexual perversions to the ugliest and oldest men in the world for cheap. Too many men don’t know women stay with a man just for a temporary convenience. Etc. If this is your condition, please don't come to Ukraine. Ukraine is for tough mongers who can get the best sex with very little money. Go to Thailand or Brasil, cheaper and easier!

Ukraine, Ukrainian economy and Ukrainian women have too many connections with Western business, such as a lot of "agencies", "salons", "sites" in Kiev are owned by European or American or Australian men, therefore you expect to receive Western style P4P, little sex for big money. This is not worth a travel to Ukraine for P4P purpose. Remember prices and services informed by Internet sites, River Palace, Patipa, and so on. 100/150$ for a hour of a bad covered blowjob and a bad missionary fuck: this is a further evidence that men are stupid! Master mongers sometimes write about exciting sessions, but they forget to write those sessions are uncommon and GFE sex with beautiful women is rare also in Ukraine. Or do you think a woman becomes beautiful only because she gives her pussy to you?

I read Kiev was the origin of Russian people, but in the past! Now I see in Kiev too many women who have a Mediterranean or Turkish appearance more than a Russian look.

Recession? Where is the economic recession? Not with Ukrainian women! P4P prices continue to go up although the world recession. OK we negotiate prices with 1, 10, 50 women and prices are always high. No matter about services, swallow blowjobs and anal sex are usual with Ukrainian men, but not with foreigners! Go to strip clubs, Ukrainian men often get swallow blowjobs or more, no matter for foreigners. Go to massage salons, Ukrainian men often get swallow blowjobs or more, no matter for foreigners. This means only one thing: no respect. And do you like to pay a woman who has no respect of you?

Beginner mongers, come to Ukraine only for good business or hard mongering, otherwise try experience elsewhere, cheaper and easier!

AC, are you joking? Or just trying to reduce competition? Do you really use swallowing to measure the respect? Is really saving money the point? Shouldn't be how to get the best sex?

I agree that UA is not cheap and sometime also not easy. Ukrainian women LIKE sex but not CHEAP men (pocket and brain). They have a lot of pride and you have to deal with this.
Anyway here I continue to experience definitely the best and wildest sex, and always with stunning looking women.

Sex quality and GFE matter a lot for me and honestly being a (not stupid) gentleman had a big payoff most of times. GFE is what I want and what I get. Do women stay with me for temporary convenience? So what? I also have temporary fun with them. Do I spend a lot on them? I don't think so. Looking at the ratio GFE/spending I don't regret one cent. Is pussy most important than money? I'm happier when I sleep with a hottie than when I sleep with banknotes. Is the wildest sex only for locals? Not my personal experience.

Each of us has different behaviours, according to our priorities and goals. I'm absolutely happy with my experience here. Do you think my way makes a harder life for mongers like you? I don't think so... anyway who cares?

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]For beginner mongers who wish to come to Ukraine.

It is hard to sum up all information from this forum and from my experiences into few words. I try to put here what can help foreigners in Ukraine and nobody says that. I am sure you will save a lot of money with my report!

First of all, about men. Too many men think when a woman is beautiful, then she can ask everything. Too many men think it is right to be a gentleman with women. Too many men have hard lives with women in their own countries and they hope to find good women in Ukraine. Too many men think pussy fuck is more important than money. Too many men don’t know sex is an art and this is not just a sperm download. Too many men don’t know the sweetest women can provide the worst sexual perversions to the ugliest and oldest men in the world for cheap. Too many men don’t know women stay with a man just for a temporary convenience. Etc. If this is your condition, please don't come to Ukraine. Ukraine is for tough mongers who can get the best sex with very little money. Go to Thailand or Brasil, cheaper and easier!

Ukraine, Ukrainian economy and Ukrainian women have too many connections with Western business, such as a lot of "agencies", "salons", "sites" in Kiev are owned by European or American or Australian men, therefore you expect to receive Western style P4P, little sex for big money. This is not worth a travel to Ukraine for P4P purpose. Remember prices and services informed by Internet sites, River Palace, Patipa, and so on. 100/150$ for a hour of a bad covered blowjob and a bad missionary fuck: this is a further evidence that men are stupid! Master mongers sometimes write about exciting sessions, but they forget to write those sessions are uncommon and GFE sex with beautiful women is rare also in Ukraine. Or do you think a woman becomes beautiful only because she gives her pussy to you?

I read Kiev was the origin of Russian people, but in the past! Now I see in Kiev too many women who have a Mediterranean or Turkish appearance more than a Russian look.

Recession? Where is the economic recession? Not with Ukrainian women! P4P prices continue to go up although the world recession. OK we negotiate prices with 1, 10, 50 women and prices are always high. No matter about services, swallow blowjobs and anal sex are usual with Ukrainian men, but not with foreigners! Go to strip clubs, Ukrainian men often get swallow blowjobs or more, no matter for foreigners. Go to massage salons, Ukrainian men often get swallow blowjobs or more, no matter for foreigners. This means only one thing: no respect. And do you like to pay a woman who has no respect of you?

Beginner mongers, come to Ukraine only for good business or hard mongering, otherwise try experience elsewhere, cheaper and easier![/QUOTE]

If any new people read this, ignore everything thats written!

I am getting more and more to believe he's never even been to Ukraine.

In fact I believe he tells tales better than Hans Christian Anderson.

What salons, sites and agencies are owned by Americans Europeans and Australians? Do you get the whole way business is done here? I guess NOT.

And yes we get it you give no women any respect! So what?

Your post is no help, its a shitty opinion miss guided and false and should be treated as such.

AC -

For newbies, just follow the examples of many but you sir, you seem to be negative about anybody that visits the EE looking for sex. If you have problems, guess what? You have problems, that doens't mean others will.

Hecker -

Okay I give up, your saying wages are attached to pussy? So the less money you make, the more your inclinded to be involved in P4P trade?

Wouldn't that also mean that men looking for services have less money to spend on sex???

Sorry it doesn't make sense to me....

[QUOTE=DJ FourMoney]AC -

For newbies, just follow the examples of many but you sir, you seem to be negative about anybody that visits the EE looking for sex. If you have problems, guess what? You have problems, that doens't mean others will.

Hecker -

Okay I give up, your saying wages are attached to pussy? So the less money you make, the more your inclinded to be involved in P4P trade?

Wouldn't that also mean that men looking for services have less money to spend on sex???

Sorry it doesn't make sense to me....[/QUOTE]What is that?I wrote that there is a natural limit of wages which in my opinion is at 300$ which sets the difference in freebie attitude,in fact it determines if you can get massive quantities of freebies in limited time.

In the last year wages in Ukraine surpassed this limit approaching even 420$ in July.With the crisis they have been hit but they still stand at 315$,above the 300$ limit.

For example if you go to a place and you cannot bed a freebie inside 3 days,the place is not worth visiting because there are other places where this is possible.

For example in 2003 when the wages were 87$ on average,you could go every night to a different club in Kiev and every night go to bed with a different girl you met at the club.Now there are scammers,proffesional daters,etc and it is almost impossible to get laid inside 3 days in Kiev,neither you get one night stands by visiting the clubs let's say Friday,Saturday.There are reasons for that.

Most people seem to foreget that money paid on scammers and professional daters and time lost and money paid on plane tickets and accomodation should all be added when estimating the ratio of qualityXquantity/costXtime.

For Qjump: instead I know Ukrainian mindset very well and statistics speak up. Your opinion is shit! Facts are facts! In general, crazy prices for bad services. A real GFE is rare in comparison of calls and meetings that we have.

Facts and evidences! How many Ukrainian girls make deepthroat cum injections for 30/50 euros? Until last year, here in Italy all Ukrainian girls have usually made deepthroat cum injections for 30/50 euros. Why not in Kiev? Why not usual for foreigners? Why not for 100$ too?

Do you believe to help people to talk about fairy tales? Why do you write about fairy tales? We pay for a service, why women want just to cheat us? We know all Ukrainian women are hot and they like real sex. Do you know what is real sex? That's one name: royal blowjob! When a woman doesn't make a royal blowjob, that means she doesn't have real sex: that's it! There is no further opinions! This is the only real fact. Full stop!

I have been to Kiev six times in a year and I don't need to evidence anything to you! Instead I am very sad when I see a lot of gentlemen, not like you, in Kiev waste their money for female vampires. And I become more sad when I see ta lot of gentlemen are happy just because they fuck vaginally a beautiful girl, who is not worth her price definitely.

Ac, you need to change the way you do things. Has it gotten a lot harder in Kyiv, sure but not too hard. The simplest advice I can give is avoid girls you know you are going to have a bad time with. Have a drink with a girl in RP before you take her home, chat with her. In 5 minutes time you should be able to tell if she's worth it. Don't go throwing time and money at a girl because you have to have her. It's a plan for failure.

Westerners do not control any facet of the Kyiv p4p scene. It is control by local organized crime, the politicians and the police. Of course sometimes this is one entity in Kyiv. :)

T66, nice to see you back.

well, not all the AC says is wrong. when i need a quick hardcore bang, it's usually Germany and Fkks that do it to me.

Russia and Ukraine are no longer the haven that was 12 years ago; but for a semi-pro romantic time with a hottie, it's still FINE.

All Bez reports have been numbered 1371 for at least 3 years.

All CD reports have been numbered 791 for several years too?


PLEASE EXPLAIN!!!

[QUOTE=Fox7717]All Bez reports have been numbered 1371 for at least 3 years.

All CD reports have been numbered 791 for several years too?


PLEASE EXPLAIN!!![/QUOTE]

Never noticed.... but will take care ;)

IT

It is really sad to see so many posts about the sex that people did not have in Kiev, whether it be because of price or ability. If you cannot get laid by a beautiful girl in Kiev, for free or at a reasonable price, you are either not looking or not informed. Forget River Palace and the discos. Go out on the street, Khreshatyk is the best place, and just go up and talk to the women who are always sitting and walking there after regular work hours. The prospects are unbelievable, just go up, say Hi, and let nature take care of the rest.

[QUOTE=Hecker]
For example in 2003 when the wages were 87$ on average,you could go every night to a different club in Kiev and every night go to bed with a different girl you met at the club.Now there are scammers,proffesional daters,etc and it is almost impossible to get laid inside 3 days in Kiev,neither you get one night stands by visiting the clubs let's say Friday,Saturday.There are reasons for that.

[/QUOTE]

Yes back in 2004 you could take a real hottie home from 111 (ah, just the name brings back memories!) for $100.

The rule seems to be that they want to earn a month's money in one night. That's the tipping point.

Bez and I are the same person.

[QUOTE=Ash1001]Yes back in 2004 you could take a real hottie home from 111 (ah, just the name brings back memories!) for $100.

The rule seems to be that they want to earn a month's money in one night. That's the tipping point.[/QUOTE]

So they can go on expensive shopping sprees and buy cars, wouldn't you demand that if you could get it??

The girl I talked too in RP wanted $250US for what I got for 100Euro in Germany and I'd say the FKK girl was better looking. Also 9 times out of 10 in Germany its an PSE or GFE if you take in the "signals" given too you. Girl grabbed my Johnson under the towel and said "I like Black Men" - Geezus I don't need a bigger invitation than that!

From all the complaining for some unless you have previous connections either online or from previous visits, then Kyiv is prolly only good for Wife Hunting these days and even that is a YMMV.

[QUOTE=Ash1001]Yes back in 2004 you could take a real hottie home from 111 (ah, just the name brings back memories!) for $100.

The rule seems to be that they want to earn a month's money in one night. That's the tipping point.[/QUOTE]Yes, I agree. You have to spend the local average wage per month in one day. This is the rule.So for Kiev it is 3200 gryvnia or 400 euro.

[QUOTE=It Travel]Never noticed.... but will take care ;)

IT[/QUOTE]



Since I mentioned the numbering of their reports, they have started to increase, but if you look a year or two back in the archive you will see what I mean.

Also CD posts below that CD and Bez are the same person!

Now I'm even more confused!

We all know that Ukraine and Russia are not the pussy paradise they where 10 or 15 years ago… But chatting on the economic crisis here it’s a little bit too much… And I’ll still go there for girls… May be you are all right for quickie prices, but I’m for overnighters or several day sponsoring so… it’s still convenient and cheaper than EU by far! May be you can even move to a small town where you can cut in half the prices! But… you are in the middle of nowhere!

I still remember when I had two teen sisters, in Moscow, not Kiev but the situation was in the 90’s the same, for 4/5 nights, staying at me day and night, for 700$… by the way doing BBBJ + CIM and swallowing! :p :p
Now this is the show up rate at Night Flight! I well remember when you could get Hotel girls (of course more expensive than others) for 100 $ for a whole night of sex. And I’m not meaning form 01.00 to 06.00. I just mean a girl staying with you 12 or even more hours usually making sex in the evening and in the morning, as Bez says, a threeholer (BBBJ, CIM etc. where normal). Still have nice minds of some teens I got then. You could even get some just in exchange for hotel and nice lifestyle… (I remember got two interpreters for a long threesome weekend… not beauties but two real young pigs just for hotel and restaurant). But’s gone!!! Nothing to do!!! It international crisis do not help to make the prices lighter! At least so far… may be in Moscow it will help do not know in Kiev.

The crisis is not the matter. There is an usual equation valid nearly everywhere. A good night of sex with a upscale girl and nice GFE, not a 4 hour quickie, usually costs what a normal medium-low monthly salary is with some exceptions. This is price for pros not for freebies that usually are cheaper. Just a week ago what I consider a stunner (19/160/42, red hair, freckles etc) asked me via e-mail 15.000 RUR/night in Moscow and 20.000/day for sponsoring on vacation. The medium salary of a metro conductor is exactly 13-15.000 RUR (look at the ads on the Metro)! Kiev is no exception to this rule.

On ground I have soon to go to Kiev (and later in Moscow and Kishnev) for a week I made lots of internet contacts getting pics and so on. Of course most are agencies, some are crazy, but the normal fees are in the area I said.

In Kiev you still find threeholer (I like the word!) pros for 350 USD/night… but most will ask you 400-500 grivnas/hour, and you have to go down. I just tested girls I did not like… I they ask 500 and you say 400 they almost agree immediately so… It’s obvious that the real price is around 300 or less (USD/night of course).

If you go out for students or, even better, for clerks or shop assistants you can go far lower. The price class will be 150/200$ night and/or 300$/24 hours. I’m going to Kiev with a friend so we rented two, brunette and blonde, 25-26 y.o. shop assistants, medium girls, let’s say 6.5 or so, doing all: lesbo show, BBBJ, CIM, anal etc… for 300 a day + some nice restaurant. So when I arrive I do not have to chase for pussy between working meetings (or may be at 2 am at RP or Arena), but I’ll find it directly in bed! In Kishnev I made agreements with two standard girls 21 y.o. and 22 for 100 € a day (but you have to take them to restaurant and some nice lifestyle, but you can fuck the brain out of them) and 150 USD is a normal salary there.

I rented Oksana plus Valeria (shop assistants if not wrong) some month ago at 300$/night + dinner for both… Not beauties, but they know what they do… the petite Valeria is cow girl... laying on you kissing and cuddling while Oksana is giving balls a tongue massage! Of course not stunners, but on ground they look like bit*** I like them: so whor** has to be whor**!!!

For instance I found even crazy subjects asking for 750 USD/night for a ugly, fat 31 y.o. in Kiev! A real dog… would not even fuck her for free!

Of course in Internet it takes time but on mamba, flirt, moslove (or whatever you call it the database is always the same) with some daily work you can find the right topics, but put in mind to spend 10-15 hours… or even more, in a week for two weeks before you get there, to have contacts and spare ones. One or two hours a day for getting good contacts… and avoiding the hidden agencies.

Even if the girls do not look openly on a sponosrhip or do not have the indication sex for money, most of them will accept to be sponsored in a fair way (look at the ones giving wide age indication or no age indication (for the partner I mean) at all. From 100 messages if you chose right you get 20/30 answers an at the end 10 will be fuckable at a right price.

Now I’m working on sponsor searching ones (most girls who do not put age limits are so even if not written), just one type 18-21 skinny and tiny… china bone white skin and pink pussy lips! I like the average next door student type let’s say in the ISG voting 6.5-7.5. Will take them to the flat I rent in Kiev and nail out their brain!!! I think to try to find the right one (or may be two) to sponsor for a long time. (a couple of years), on ground I’m progressively cutting my job to have more time. Will search for a teen (or two) for vacation. You might say why a 18-19 UA or RUS blondinka?

Several reasons but mostly three.

1 Why should you rent a 26-30 y.o. when you can get an 18-19? It’s like getting a used car or a new one!

2 I would like to go to vacations in nice sea resorts at least thrice a year, and when you wake up and see in the bed the body of this beautiful teen, you can just hold her wrists and use your best friend to wake her up! And when relaxing I love the taste of real teen pink… like only china bone white skinned Russian ones have! :p

3 When I’m on these vacations I really want a sex object (may be two!) not a girlfriend, to be used as it has to be used: for my pleasure, and it’s obvious that you have to pay for this. Of course I’ll still go with other girl types, like Inga, perfect for a two day full anal treatment, but not for sponsoring for a vacation!

By the way I’ll do the (she agreed but we have to take care of the period) second treatment of Inga… you will see the pics… soon I hope.

Understanding EE women is difficult, I do not even understand women from my country! Just two short episodes.

I start with Iriska (in Moscow) sponsored a couple of years ago and facialized happily (there are pics in the Moscow and Russia Photo section). She was offering her plus a girlfriend, but at that time I was not in Moscow. Now she is married (I did not know)… and I chatted via ICQ and she said I’m married… And I: who cares… still want to sponsor you (I was missing anal!). Noo she said, my husband… but we can meet in the afternoon for some hours, but no anal! And I answered No anal no money! The pig!

The other episode is even better. In Kiev I knew miss K. (do not want to put pics or name)… A nice dinner in a resturant, a nice dinner at my home and a nice fuck at my home: six hours of crazy sex. She is not a beauty, but exactly what I like 22/160/50, blondinka, she is not so skinny you might think, but a part of kilos are in two huge boobs: DD size! Done for free. She now is married too (since six months)! And told oooohh we can go out for a drink, not in the evening my husband is very jealous. And : ohh come and take the drink at me so nobody will see us…, yeha she said but I must be home around 8 pm. I answered why don’t you come for lunch? So she will come at 12… and probably be drilled in every hole up to the evening! And then go home to the new married husband! :p

EE and specially UA and RUS teens are unbelievable… they fuck like rabbits, so even if the price is higher I still prefer them.

IT

PS May be I’m wrong… but for sure you can’t find a nice teen, or very close to teen doing all sex you want for a day for approx 300 € in Western Europe…

Only if you're a chump.

[QUOTE=Hecker]Yes, I agree. You have to spend the local average wage per month in one day. This is the rule.So for Kiev it is 3200 gryvnia or 400 euro.[/QUOTE]


IT, how did you know she was a metro conductor? And such a long post and no mention of MT? Are you over her now? :)

Fox, I thought everyone knew Bez and I were the same person?

DJ, the foreign god effect was gone after 2003 in most major FSU cities. I was seriously considering going to the FSU in 1993 but instead moved back to the US from Europe. From talking to my credible buddies who were over their in the 90's the 'fuck me I'm American' stories are true. I think the good Doctor caught the end of that era.

Ooohhh, at last, somebody doesn't talk about fairy tales and I agree about everything. At last, again, you have underlined the importance of price and the quality of sex. Unfortunately for us, happy days have gone forever. Remain to us the duty to keep price low for GFE sex.

[QUOTE=It Travel]Of course in Internet it takes time but on mamba, flirt, moslove (or whatever you call it the database is always the same) with some daily work you can find the right topics, but put in mind to spend 10-15 hours… or even more, in a week for two weeks before you get there, to have contacts and spare ones. One or two hours a day for getting good contacts… and avoiding the hidden agencies.

Even if the girls do not look openly on a sponosrhip or do not have the indication sex for money, most of them will accept to be sponsored in a fair way (look at the ones giving wide age indication or no age indication (for the partner I mean) at all. From 100 messages if you chose right you get 20/30 answers an at the end 10 will be fuckable at a right price.

Now I’m working on sponsor searching ones (most girls who do not put age limits are so even if not written), just one type 18-21 skinny and tiny… china bone white skin and pink pussy lips! I like the average next door student type let’s say in the ISG voting 6.5-7.5. Will take them to the flat I rent in Kiev and nail out their brain!!! I think to try to find the right one (or may be two) to sponsor for a long time. (a couple of years), on ground I’m progressively cutting my job to have more time. Will search for a teen (or two) for vacation. /QUOTE]IT, what is your age? Obviously you have good success with teen girls, and I am just curious.

Practically the answer is in the title... I just pay them. In a way or another. Now in cash, when the situation was different with some lifestyle moments....
Of course I try to be well educated and polite and do not treat them like who***. Had no problems except MT stealing my Ikra! But she is out of business now.

I have no success with teens I just like them. Waking up and look at a naked perfect tiny body is without price!

Just for your information I'm a big man (tall and a little bit to heavy too) between 45 and 50 y.o. (but some, not the paid girls, say I look 38 or so). Even if I go to dinner with a who** I treat her like a lady. May be this is one of the key of success, on ground I got also some for free. Despite most Italians I speak fluently several languages, and basically at least seven. And this helps a lot. When you get nice university students (18-21) it’s important to fascinate them not with stupid things but with culture and talent. May be this is one of the reasons I got some young pigs in the bed ;) .

I think I answered your question? Otherwise write again…

IT

Sorry I forgot that I'm teen addicetd! :p :p :p laying with an 18teen or with a 35 y.o. makes a big difference!!! ;)


[QUOTE=Explorer69][QUOTE=It Travel]Of course in Internet it takes time but on mamba, flirt, moslove (or whatever you call it the database is always the same) with some daily work you can find the right topics, but put in mind to spend 10-15 hours… or even more, in a week for two weeks before you get there, to have contacts and spare ones. One or two hours a day for getting good contacts… and avoiding the hidden agencies.

Even if the girls do not look openly on a sponosrhip or do not have the indication sex for money, most of them will accept to be sponsored in a fair way (look at the ones giving wide age indication or no age indication (for the partner I mean) at all. From 100 messages if you chose right you get 20/30 answers an at the end 10 will be fuckable at a right price.

Now I’m working on sponsor searching ones (most girls who do not put age limits are so even if not written), just one type 18-21 skinny and tiny… china bone white skin and pink pussy lips! I like the average next door student type let’s say in the ISG voting 6.5-7.5. Will take them to the flat I rent in Kiev and nail out their brain!!! I think to try to find the right one (or may be two) to sponsor for a long time. (a couple of years), on ground I’m progressively cutting my job to have more time. Will search for a teen (or two) for vacation. /QUOTE]IT, what is your age? Obviously you have good success with teen girls, and I am just curious.[/QUOTE]

I did not know she was a metro conductor. She is not. The average salary of the metro conductor is just a sample, because it's well known. Now if I’m not wrong goes from 8.000 (when at conducting school) up to 23.000 when you are at the end of career: RUR/month of course!

No mention of MT... she is gone last access to her page [url]http://flirt.com.ua/sweetmail-a5346/[/url] (where 1/3 of pics are mine) on last Aug 8th… so…

It’s a pity because as lot knows here her BBBJ + CIM (when a little bit drunk) was nearly the state of the art… :p :p

Of course I could never imagine to take a such who*** to vacation. Too uneducated. Lol….ita was very very different, but she is gone too. Now I’m searching for a 18-21 y.o. to keep for some time as a sponsored vacation friend… (but I want a threeholer I like the word…)

By the way the good era is still on the way in deep Russia or Ukraine, where it’s not so difficult to get in bed for a night with a teen stunner for less than 150 USD… Unfortunately usually unskilled in BBBJ or other things…

By the way we have to find another MT for the Kiev Tourist Office! So she can greet people at Boryspol while queuing for the passport control… ah ah ah.

IT

PS now I’m concentrating more on younger ones, the last time (Ikra robbing apart) I already found the MT a little bit too old for my tastes… not that silky skin you expect from a Slavic teen. I tried to help her with facials :p :p but she was unhappy! (cum is full of ialuronic acid used in cosmetics...)




[QUOTE=Cruiser D]Only if you're a chump.




IT, how did you know she was a metro conductor? And such a long post and no mention of MT? Are you over her now? :)

Fox, I thought everyone knew Bez and I were the same person?

DJ, the foreign god effect was gone after 2003 in most major FSU cities. I was seriously considering going to the FSU in 1993 but instead moved back to the US from Europe. From talking to my credible buddies who were over their in the 90's the 'fuck me I'm American' stories are true. I think the good Doctor caught the end of that era.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=It Travel]Practically the answer is in the title... I just pay them. In a way or another. Now in cash, when the situation was different with some lifestyle moments....
Of course I try to be well educated and polite and do not treat them like who***. Had no problems if you except MT stealing my Ikra! But she is out of business now.

I have no success with teens I just like them. Waking up and look at a naked perfect tiny body is without price!

Just for your information I'm a big man (tall and a little bit to heavy too) between 45 and 50 y.o. (but some, not the paid girls, say I look 38 or so). Even if I go to dinner with a who** I treat her like a lady. May be this is one of the key of success, on ground I got also some for free. Despite most Italians I speak fluently several languages, and basically at least seven. And this helps a lot. When you get nice university students (18-21) it’s important to fascinate them not with stupid things but with culture and talent. May be this is one of the reasons I got some young pigs in the bed ;) .

I think I answered your question? Otherwise write again…

IT

Sorry I forgot that I'm teen addicetd! :p :p :p laying with an 18teen or with a 35 y.o. makes a big difference!!! ;)


[QUOTE=Explorer69][/QUOTE]

Real Big Difference!

No fat, no winkles, no lines, no marks and with the typical diet EE girls have they tend to be really THIN (Doc knows a thing or two about paper thin girls).

I do admit to liking some weight though and Western European girls tend to have natural tits and asses (kinda like Brazil) that drive me nuts. Nobody has asses like Brazil does, its in the water or something.

But I love banging women around 110-115lbs (whatever that is in kg)

Your post kind gave me an idea next time I go to Europe, rent a girl for a couple of days and find some cheap beach spot. I know what you mean when you like to take these girls on vacation with you, what better excuse to make sure they take a bikini along or buy them one. Just like Doc likes buying them Hello Kitty booty shorts....

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]IT, how did you know she was a metro conductor? And such a long post and no mention of MT? Are you over her now? :)
[/QUOTE]And she told me she drove the tramvai!

[QUOTE=DJ FourMoney]
The girl I talked too in RP wanted $250US for what I got for 100Euro in Germany and I'd say the FKK girl was better looking. Also 9 times out of 10 in Germany its an PSE or GFE if you take in the "signals" given too you[/QUOTE]

You're right in that on a strict quality to price comparison RP can't match any of the FKKs. But I suspect most Kiev regulars like the 'romance' of RP - being able to have a drink with the girl, connect with her, and most importantly, getting to take her back to one's lair. FKK is more obviously transactional.

Hyatt Regency concierge arrested in prostitution bust

Today, 09:37 | Ukrainian News

A concierge of the elite Hyatt Regency Hotel in Kyiv has been arrested on suspicion helping guests find women for prostitution, according to the Ministry of Interior Affairs.

The 21-year-old concierge worked in cooperation with four women who worked as prostitutes.

Clients were charged $500 per hour and $100 went to the concierge.

The concierge did not deny his involvement; on the contrary, he willingly told policemen about his business.

According to the concierge, guests of the hotel knew that the department of concierges is for the leisure of guests. They can learn from concierges about restaurants and places for entertainment, how to find girls and where, or get their phone numbers.

He said his managers were aware of the business of procuration of women.

Police have instituted a criminal case under part 2 of article 302 of the Criminal Code.

As Ukrainian News earlier reported, officers of the Kyiv department for crimes related to [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908][CodeWord908][/url] on July 3 arrested a doorman of Premier Palace Hotel in Kyiv on suspicion of procuration of women.

The arrest was made by officers with the Kyiv department assigned to [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908][CodeWord908][/url] crimes.

--------------------------

$500 per hour???? Are the guests at that hotel out of their minds??? The guests are the ones who really should have been arrested, on a charge of gross criminal stupidity.

What hell shall they have a bikini for or even undies??? ;)

My standard is similar to Doc's one, even if I like also other types. Perfection is difficult to have but here you have a sample:

[url]http://flirt.com.ua/kubrina2008/[/url]

look at the pics whe she was in some holiday... 21/160/42 red, white skin, freckles... could be 18/155/42... :p :p

By the way 110-115 is between (approx.) 50 and 52 kg depends on how tall they are for a real skinny one with this weight you have to go over 170 cm... Just for Info the well known MT is 165 approx and 45 kg... Lol...ita was 160 an probably 42-3 or so... :p

If you rent the girl two days, do not waste time in changing place, just fuck her where she is.. no flights no time waste! From 3/4 days up it's may be wort to take them somewhere else... knowing russian/ukranian an all inlusive resort in the middle of the desert would be perfect!

It

PS just now I'm negotiating with a non skinny one but... 18/175/65 blondinka.. D cups... white and soft... also that is nice...

[QUOTE=DJ FourMoney][QUOTE=It Travel]



Real Big Difference!

No fat, no winkles, no lines, no marks and with the typical diet EE girls have they tend to be really THIN (Doc knows a thing or two about paper thin girls).

I do admit to liking some weight though and Western European girls tend to have natural tits and asses (kinda like Brazil) that drive me nuts. Nobody has asses like Brazil does, its in the water or something.

But I love banging women around 110-115lbs (whatever that is in kg)

Your post kind gave me an idea next time I go to Europe, rent a girl for a couple of days and find some cheap beach spot. I know what you mean when you like to take these girls on vacation with you, what better excuse to make sure they take a bikini along or buy them one. Just like Doc likes buying them Hello Kitty booty shorts....[/QUOTE]

They probably arrested him because he confused $$$ and Grivnas!!! :D :D :D

Otherwise they will arrest all the town, and the last policmen will be arrested by a babuska coming from nowhere and selling garlic and onions on K. street!


IT

[QUOTE=Uke Boy]Hyatt Regency concierge arrested in prostitution bust

Today, 09:37 | Ukrainian News

A concierge of the elite Hyatt Regency Hotel in Kyiv has been arrested on suspicion helping guests find women for prostitution, according to the Ministry of Interior Affairs.

The 21-year-old concierge worked in cooperation with four women who worked as prostitutes.

Clients were charged $500 per hour and $100 went to the concierge.

The concierge did not deny his involvement; on the contrary, he willingly told policemen about his business.

According to the concierge, guests of the hotel knew that the department of concierges is for the leisure of guests. They can learn from concierges about restaurants and places for entertainment, how to find girls and where, or get their phone numbers.

He said his managers were aware of the business of procuration of women.

Police have instituted a criminal case under part 2 of article 302 of the Criminal Code.

As Ukrainian News earlier reported, officers of the Kyiv department for crimes related to [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908][CodeWord908][/url] on July 3 arrested a doorman of Premier Palace Hotel in Kyiv on suspicion of procuration of women.

The arrest was made by officers with the Kyiv department assigned to [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908][CodeWord908][/url] crimes.

--------------------------

$500 per hour???? Are the guests at that hotel out of their minds??? The guests are the ones who really should have been arrested, on a charge of gross criminal stupidity.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Ash1001]You're right in that on a strict quality to price comparison RP can't match any of the FKKs. But I suspect most Kiev regulars like the 'romance' of RP - being able to have a drink with the girl, connect with her, and most importantly, getting to take her back to one's lair. FKK is more obviously transactional.[/QUOTE]I like both FKK and EE take home girls... and I have been with some amazingly beautiful FKK girls from all over the world. A 21-year old blonde Sardinian chick, a 19-year old brunette fuckbunny with braces and a round-assed half-Brazilian sex pot come to mind... but despite the vibe and GFE you can get at FKK... the assembly line nature of the FKKs themselves are a bit of a buzzkill. For example the trash can full of tissues and used condoms next to the bed...

[QUOTE=Uke Boy]Hyatt Regency concierge arrested in prostitution bust



$500 per hour???? Are the guests at that hotel out of their minds??? The guests are the ones who really should have been arrested, on a charge of gross criminal stupidity.[/QUOTE]The price doesn't surprise me, it was the Hyatt. Rooms are about $500/ IIRC. You can imagine the clientel there.

A fool and his money are soon parted, but if the money flow is endless...

Its was on the TV two nights ago.
They are also having a clampdown on street hookers in Kiev.
Its showed them getting chased all over a park! a wonder to be seen!
Some actually didnt look too bad.............. now wheres my map ;)
I would say the guy at the hyatt was paying the management out of his cut, but the management forgot to pay the real management of Kiev.
Also whats happened is the change of power at the top is filtering through, so last year most of these things where run by the past PM's people, now theres a whole new management slowly comming into place, and these people need to now pay the new management not the old its a lack of comunication...... whats new in Ukraine????
LOL
But after this next election....... all change again.
if you don't like the government in Ukraine..... wait there will be another along in ten mins :o

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]The price doesn't surprise me, it was the Hyatt. Rooms are about $500/ IIRC. You can imagine the clientel there.

A fool and his money are soon parted, but if the money flow is endless...[/QUOTE]

I'm not surprised too... If you think that in some Hotels in Moscow (three stars) they ask for 250 $/hour but they are real dogs, close to 40, and at least 15 kg overweight!!! A girl in Hyatt must be nice at least, of course the guy forgot to pay who is controlling the market.

If you go deep in Internet in those non English speaking I still found young nice girls for 100 $ for some hours and 200 $ for a whole afternoon like 02.00 pm to 08.00 pm (then they have to go out with the boyfriend!). I'll post the pics of one of theese in the Photo section (i'll do it becuase she is public and searching for a sponsor).

In UA a girl in a organization of every 100 USD she gets probably between 30 and 40 gets in her pockets. So it's easy to understand that if an escort agency asks you for 800 USD/day (they go from 600 to 1.300 or even more!) you could get a nice teen freebie for 300-400/day. Of course she takes some risks!

IT

[QUOTE=Qjump]But after this next election....... all change again.
if you don't like the government in Ukraine..... wait there will be another along in ten mins :o[/QUOTE]10 minutes are up... and UShenko is still in power.

No guarantee that what comes after him is any better for us.

Is anybody surprised by prostitutes' prices? . I always repeat about this, this is the reality, very few people pay for 350$ all night real sex and most people pay 100/150. 500$ per hour. Instead I am surprised by government politics on prostitution: is that possible Ukrainian government is more reliable than Italian government?

[QUOTE=Fox7717]

All Bez reports have been numbered 1371 for at least 3 years.

PLEASE EXPLAIN!!!

[/QUOTE]

1371 is code for FSB link to Interpol database, to monitor all you other mongers for illegal activities, and for mind control hypnotic. These are the basic steps for all OMON operatives with top secret classified clearance to national security council files. Of course, that was after my service working as Deputy Chief at Spetsnaz, and liaison with Lubyanka burial detail.

You see, this is my real problem with the Chechens and their man Sabirzhin who was undercover as concierge at the Belgrade Hotel. You can read all about it in Izvestiya, in the Estonian bureau section, when my twin brother Rodian and his 3 bodyguards were found strapped in their Land Cruiser at the bottom of frozen Patriarch's Pond.

This is just an example of the hidden camera in the closet tape recordings used by ex-KGB, also known as VChK. They kept close watch on all Vorzh, since they don't pay income tax on black market, and the vory's connection to their inside men at Petrovka.

Galina, taking dictation:

[QUOTE=It Travel]

I know she was a metro conductor.
The salary of metro conductor is well known.
8.000 RUR/month

By the good era is in deep Russia, to get in bed with a teen stunner for 150 USD
Usually unskilled in BBBJ or other

[/QUOTE]
So if this is the conductor's salary, (8000 r = $320), then the ticket taker girl must be less than half of that? The short cute 19 year old sweet brunetka that freely and openly gave herself to me, after only one short conversation and a glass of fruit juice at the cafe across the street from my flat, on a late Tuesday afternoon, put me into orbit trying to perform some acrobatic sex acts while she grunted and gasped? Yes it was her.

But unskilled? I think that's up to question, as I have now asked many girls how they are so incredibly talented and seem to thoroughly enjoy performing fellatio, and they all say that the girls at the college dorm like to get a bottle of vodka or some beers, sit around and get drunk, and watch some porno video, where they very intently study porn queens deep throating and going to town on monster cocks. This seems to give them not only motivation and anticipation to get their own hot meat to suck on, but they get a big kick out of teasing and pleasing their sex partner, hence the big reason they seem to get into it much more so than their counterpart cold ugly greedy Western fat cows.

In the cold and sober light of day, its sometimes better to leave the shades drawn a bit, so I did not brighten this frame of Valya, my Estonian dyevochka who works at the fruit juice bar near the park, every day from 7:00 in morning to 10:00 at night. All that time standing around, she works up quite a lot of sexual energy, thinking about sex, singing about sex, talking about sex. When she got me up in my flat, we made small talk for only 3 minutes, and she tore my clothes off standing in the kitchen, and was quite ready to be drilled right there on the floor. What an interesting existence they lead, waiting around for something different and new to come along into their boring day to day routines, some spicy sausage to plunge into her waiting pizda.

Valya, dampened and dimmed:

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]10 minutes are up... and UShenko is still in power.

No guarantee that what comes after him is any better for us.[/QUOTE]

I do not think any one has a real power ther, they all need Russian energy.... or not?

IT

8000 RUR are nd 30% more in dollars, over 300...

Bye!!!

IT


[QUOTE=Bez Bezarra]So if this is the conductor's salary, (8000 r = $160), then the ticket taker girl must be only half of that? The short cute 19 year old sweet brunetka that freely and openly gave herself to me, after only one short conversation and a glass of fruit juice at the cafe across the street from my flat, on a late Tuesday afternoon, put me into orbit trying to perform some acrobatic sex acts while she grunted and gasped? Yes it was her.

But unskilled? I think that's up to question, as I have now asked many girls how they are so incredibly talented and seem to thoroughly enjoy performing fellatio, and they all say that the girls at the college dorm like to get a bottle of vodka or some beers, sit around and get drunk, and watch some porno video, where they very intently study porn queens deep throating and going to town on monster cocks. This seems to give them not only motivation and anticipation to get their own hot meat to suck on, but they get a big kick out of teasing and pleasing their sex partner, hence the big reason they seem to get into it much more so than their counterpart cold ugly greedy Western fat cows.

In the cold and sober light of day, its sometimes better to leave the shades drawn a bit, so I did not brighten this frame of Valya, my Estonian dyevochka who works at the fruit juice bar near the park, every day from 7:00 in morning to 10:00 at night. All that time standing around, she works up quite a lot of sexual energy, thinking about sex, singing about sex, talking about sex. When she got me up in my flat, we made small talk for only 3 minutes, and she tore my clothes off standing in the kitchen, and was quite ready to be drilled right there on the floor. What an interesting existence they lead, waiting around for something different and new to come along into their boring day to day routines, some spicy sausage to plunge into her waiting pizda.

Valya, dampened and dimmed:[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]I like both FKK and EE take home girls... and I have been with some amazingly beautiful FKK girls from all over the world. A 21-year old blonde Sardinian chick, a 19-year old brunette fuckbunny with braces and a round-assed half-Brazilian sex pot come to mind... but despite the vibe and GFE you can get at FKK... the assembly line nature of the FKKs themselves are a bit of a buzzkill. For example the trash can full of tissues and used condoms next to the bed...[/QUOTE]

A BLONDE Sardinian? Is there such a thing?

Yes, the production line aspect would kill the feeling for me. I personally need to sense that the girl I take home is 'mine' (and the good ones make me feel that :))

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]I like both FKK and EE take home girls... and I have been with some amazingly beautiful FKK girls from all over the world. A 21-year old blonde Sardinian chick, a 19-year old brunette fuckbunny with braces and a round-assed half-Brazilian sex pot come to mind... but despite the vibe and GFE you can get at FKK... the assembly line nature of the FKKs themselves are a bit of a buzzkill. For example the trash can full of tissues and used condoms next to the bed...[/QUOTE]

I only noticed that in the RLD in Frankfurt - ;)

[QUOTE=DJ FourMoney]I only noticed that in the RLD in Frankfurt - ;)[/QUOTE]You weren't looking very closely. Next to the bed. :)

[QUOTE=Ash1001]A BLONDE Sardinian? Is there such a thing?

Yes, the production line aspect would kill the feeling for me. I personally need to sense that the girl I take home is 'mine' (and the good ones make me feel that :))[/QUOTE]I'm sure peroxide helped... but she was a 10 nonetheless. One of the very best ever I've had. In terms of actual fucking and BBBJ skill, FKK is nearly impossible to beat. Only problem is you can't have them in the comfort of your own home... drink/chat/cuddle with them.

It just isn't the same in the fuck factory atmosphere of a FKK.... but the actual fucking itself can be awesome.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]I'm sure peroxide helped... but she was a 10 nonetheless. One of the very best ever I've had. In terms of actual fucking and BBBJ skill, FKK is nearly impossible to beat. Only problem is you can't have them in the comfort of your own home... drink/chat/cuddle with them.

It just isn't the same in the fuck factory atmosphere of a FKK.... but the actual fucking itself can be awesome.[/QUOTE]

Interesting discussion from members led by the good Doctor.

While not the most experienced Fkk'er by any means on the board, I have had my share and would comment. Picking up your FKK comments , Dr S:

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]In terms of actual fucking and BBBJ skill, FKK is nearly impossible to beat. Only problem is you can't have them in the comfort of your own home... drink/chat/cuddle with them.

It just isn't the same in the fuck factory atmosphere of a FKK.... but the actual fucking itself can be awesome.[/QUOTE]

can agree, however we need to get you to FKK land to experience (as it seems that you haven't made it yet) venues such as Bernd's near Koeln as opposed to the Frankfurt 3 - though they too have their charms..

Here, I believe that you will find not only " actual fucking and BBBJ skill," but all one could want in the areas of "drink/chat/cuddle with them.". Reconfirmed at Bernd's recently during the recent ISG Global mini-conference and the obserations of many mongers over the years.

And just so you don't feel too far out of your favorite stomping grounds, Katja, Tanja, Rita and Djarmila were in full force at Bernd's and were well used by ISG members as Laptops during the conference. The ladies being from Kaliningrad, Dneipro, Belorus and Kazahkastan respectively. Speaking of BBBJ skills, Ms Katja has been voted twice as Miss German Blow-Job Queen of the year by the German forums' mongers.

And of course, for IT Travel, there are anal practitioners in the house. ;-)

Highly recommended, Dr. S.

[QUOTE=Excess]Interesting discussion from members led by the good Doctor.

While not the most experienced Fkk'er by any means on the board, I have had my share and would comment. Picking up your FKK comments , Dr S:



can agree, however we need to get you to FKK land to experience (as it seems that you haven't made it yet) venues such as Bernd's near Koeln as opposed to the Frankfurt 3 - though they too have their charms..

Here, I believe that you will find not only " actual fucking and BBBJ skill," but all one could want in the areas of "drink/chat/cuddle with them.". Reconfirmed at Bernd's recently during the recent ISG Global mini-conference and the obserations of many mongers over the years.

And just so you don't feel too far out of your favorite stomping grounds, Katja, Tanja, Rita and Djarmila were in full force at Bernd's and were well used by ISG members as Laptops during the conference. The ladies being from Kaliningrad, Dneipro, Belorus and Kazahkastan respectively. Speaking of BBBJ skills, Ms Katja has been voted twice as Miss German Blow-Job Queen of the year by the German forums' mongers.

And of course, for IT Travel, there are anal practitioners in the house. ;-)

Highly recommended, Dr. S.[/QUOTE]

When you say Frankfurt 3, surely you don't mean Palace, Oase and Miami*

*(I only kid about Miami eeek Pass, do not stop, skip one spot to Park Palace)

I am not experienced in FKK as most of you are, but my short visit to the suggested places, I can report nothing but bliss. There isn't much cuddling (though I did a bit with the German at Oase) but the rest of it is very GFE and I'll have to try your Bernd's suggestion Excess.

[QUOTE=Excess]Interesting discussion from members led by the good Doctor.

While not the most experienced Fkk'er by any means on the board, I have had my share and would comment. Picking up your FKK comments , Dr S:



can agree, however we need to get you to FKK land to experience (as it seems that you haven't made it yet) venues such as Bernd's near Koeln as opposed to the Frankfurt 3 - though they too have their charms..

Here, I believe that you will find not only " actual fucking and BBBJ skill," but all one could want in the areas of "drink/chat/cuddle with them.". Reconfirmed at Bernd's recently during the recent ISG Global mini-conference and the obserations of many mongers over the years.

And just so you don't feel too far out of your favorite stomping grounds, Katja, Tanja, Rita and Djarmila were in full force at Bernd's and were well used by ISG members as Laptops during the conference. The ladies being from Kaliningrad, Dneipro, Belorus and Kazahkastan respectively. Speaking of BBBJ skills, Ms Katja has been voted twice as Miss German Blow-Job Queen of the year by the German forums' mongers.

And of course, for IT Travel, there are anal practitioners in the house. ;-)

Highly recommended, Dr. S.[/QUOTE]Thanks for the recommendation Excess!

Bernd's has been on the radar for a long time, as it comes highly touted as a GFE type place, as opposed to Palace, Oase and World which are more the fuck factories I refer to.

I've been to several FKKs and my experience has ranged from so-so to OMFG. Definitely recommended, but there is no denying that it is a fundamentally different experience than picking up a girl and taking her home for a few hours.

One is not inherently better than the other, but they are different.

Seems very strange to me too. Fucked some (I'm Italian) and there was always a big black bush :p :p If it's trimmed correctly, it's not bad!

BUT HERE WE ARE ON KIEV SECTION OF ISG NOT ON SARDINIAN!!!! :(

IT

[QUOTE=Ash1001]A BLONDE Sardinian? Is there such a thing?

Yes, the production line aspect would kill the feeling for me. I personally need to sense that the girl I take home is 'mine' (and the good ones make me feel that :))[/QUOTE]

I'm often in Frankfurt....

so please PM me the name and adress (and may be the girl's names) of this heaven wher they do both BBBJ and Anal... with UA girls!!!!

IT

[QUOTE=Excess]Interesting discussion from members led by the good Doctor.

While not the most experienced Fkk'er by any means on the board, I have had my share and would comment. Picking up your FKK comments , Dr S:



can agree, however we need to get you to FKK land to experience (as it seems that you haven't made it yet) venues such as Bernd's near Koeln as opposed to the Frankfurt 3 - though they too have their charms..

Here, I believe that you will find not only " actual fucking and BBBJ skill," but all one could want in the areas of "drink/chat/cuddle with them.". Reconfirmed at Bernd's recently during the recent ISG Global mini-conference and the obserations of many mongers over the years.

And just so you don't feel too far out of your favorite stomping grounds, Katja, Tanja, Rita and Djarmila were in full force at Bernd's and were well used by ISG members as Laptops during the conference. The ladies being from Kaliningrad, Dneipro, Belorus and Kazahkastan respectively. Speaking of BBBJ skills, Ms Katja has been voted twice as Miss German Blow-Job Queen of the year by the German forums' mongers.

And of course, for IT Travel, there are anal practitioners in the house. ;-)

Highly recommended, Dr. S.[/QUOTE]

Someone forgot to make his monthly payments. :)

I guess the boys at Kyiv Vice haven't heard about River Palace yet. I wonder how that salon right next to a police station has been able to be undetected after all these years. :)

[QUOTE=Uke Boy]

A concierge of the elite Hyatt Regency Hotel in Kyiv has been arrested on suspicion helping guests find women for prostitution, according to the Ministry of Interior Affairs.

As Ukrainian News earlier reported, officers of the Kyiv department for crimes related to [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908][CodeWord908][/url] on July 3 arrested a doorman of Premier Palace Hotel in Kyiv on suspicion of procuration of women.

The arrest was made by officers with the Kyiv department assigned to [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908][CodeWord908][/url] crimes.

[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Thanks for the recommendation Excess!

One is not inherently better than the other, but they are different.[/QUOTE]

And are we not lucky to be able to enjoy both and indeed all ? It is really a wonderful life, if you don't take it too seriously !

Enjoy Doc.

E.

PS - IT Travel some suggestions coming to you later. ;-)

[QUOTE=Cruiser D] I wonder how that salon right next to a police station has been able to be undetected after all these years[/QUOTE]

Cos it's where the cops go to unload ;)

No, because they own it.

I think Kyiv Vice would make a good TV show. I'm going to pitch it the next time I'm in Kyiv. I'm thinking a cross between Miami Vice and Barney Miller.

Yeah dude I was just kidding.

QJump matey - would any of your properties currently be vacant? I was toying with the idea of chucking it all in for a while and spending a couple of months in K town. Anything to suggest? I was thinking say $60 per day for something decent & central etc. etc. BUT that would be the rate for 2 months' continuous occupation. Do you go that downmarket? :)

[QUOTE=Ash1001]Yeah dude I was just kidding.

QJump matey. Would any of your properties currently be vacant? I was toying with the idea of chucking it all in for a while and spending a couple of months in K town. Anything to suggest? I was thinking say $60 per day for something decent & central etc. Etc. BUT that would be the rate for 2 months' continuous occupation. Do you go that downmarket? [/QUOTE]As I know, YOU tend to like the 'wine & dine' freebie approach. The Queens are in the center. Trust ME, YOU will do just fine in any other region.

In fact, you may DO better!

The attitude of girls about the center is rapidly changing. Nice pectopahs, good shops, even discos are popping up ALL over the outer regions.

Just my thoughts.

LS Guy

Having been out and about the left bank there are quite a few nice place. You just have less chance of running into someone who speaks english.

Ash, we do have them.... but at teh moment they are all rented... in fact i had to rent one myself this week when i went over there.


So I found myslef in Kiev for a night this week and after getting rid of a client really early, as he didn't drink as he had come from Indonesia.
I called a pal and we hooked up in Arena fro a couple of the home brews there the semi pros where out in force even as early as 8pm.... perhaps the credit crunch is making them work harder? any way we chatted to a few and i must admit there where three or four little student types and quite cute with it. But i was getting a little worse for wear and at about 11pm me an my pal jumped into a taxi to head home............
We where half way up Kreshatic when we looked at each other, decided it was not home time and we should at leat go have a look into River Palace, since i was here and all that ;)
So down to the river we went last time I was there was Feb so I expected a real change in faces, there where a few younger ones in, but so many of the same faces i had seen in Feb, perhaps I should leave it a year between visits so i forget them?
Any way drunk, and not really looking for a take out we parked ourselves at the bar and began the interviews, after say 2 hours and way way too many beers later a "pig" sorry I can not decribe her as anything else came over, opens with $200, I tell her I could not possible do a full night for $200 but perhaps an hour! she says great! i say you do realise you are paying me?
She says yes yes of course.... i sober up quickly, smile and say yes ok $200 and i am yours for 2 hours :)
She then tags on as we leave to get a cab. and follows me home, we are waiting for my taxi guy to arraive and she starts to complain that we should get a cab sat there I say no i will wait fro my taxi, she moans its cold, why so slow etc etc at this stage i am fully pissed off with this girl and think its time I let her come home and waste her time more since not only is she ugly she also has the attitude of a *****. when we get home she says ok before we start wheres my $200? I explain again that the agreement was her to pay me $200........ now I have a unhappy hooker in my rental and I kick her out the door......... shame really as i may have given her one had she paid me the $200 ;)
Why do i always come back from RP with another story? one day i will go there sober....perhaps the super bowl night, but i wont leave sober! :)

Q - you gotta admit, one way or another, you can ALWAYS have fun with a Ukrainian girl! Interesting attitude though - all girls think they are great looking and if a piggy has some hottie friends who are charging $200 she is damn well going to charge that too. Market forces? Bah.

[QUOTE=LifeSavour]As I know, YOU tend to like the 'wine & dine' freebie approach. The Queens are in the center. Trust ME, YOU will do just fine in any other region.

You may even SCREW better

The attitude of girls about the center is rapidly changing. Nice pectopahs, good shops, even discos are popping up ALL over the outer regions.
[/QUOTE]

You have a point. I know Kiev is a huge sprawling city and the golden square mile in the centre has little to do with the rest of it. All my previous trips have been very short so I've tended to stay in the centre.

You mentioned Kalinka Malinka and Saxon a while back.. does the 'I American' approach still work there?

What kind of rents are we talking for something 'EVRO REMONT' in your neck of the woods?

Do the tsentr dyevs STILL have that princess attitude? I thought they might be a little more grateful for a trip to a nice pectopah, given that they now probably have to cut down on one meal a day to pay the rent!

Ash, i was in saxon a while back, full of ones like the one we met here in donetsk, the small dark one you took for dinner, I am sure you remember ;)
I remeber as I am still trying to spot her around, I will try to hit where you missed :)

Ash, are you sure you've ever been to the Ukraine? :)

It will be a long time in coming before the center princesses drop the attitude - something like the ruble crash of '98. Try a normal girl, leave the center girls to the professionals.

[QUOTE=Ash1001]You mentioned Kalinka Malinka and Saxon a while back.. does the 'I American' approach still work there?

What kind of rents are we talking for something 'EVRO REMONT' in your neck of the woods?[/QUOTE]. Approach, I just show them my HUGE. Personality!

As far as Euro, a studio can be had for $800 depending of course on how close to a metro station.

Right now a 1 room, just normal repairs is still $600 at the lowest.

Check slando.com. Ua, I use google translate to see the pages in english.

Hope it helps?

LS

[QUOTE=Qjump]Ash, i was in saxon a while back, full of ones like the one we met here in donetsk, the small dark one you took for dinner, I am sure you remember ;)
I remeber as I am still trying to spot her around, I will try to hit where you missed :)[/QUOTE]


Oh, I remember all right :) How could I forget a cute little number like that? Good luck, I think she actually liked both of us! I had to pass up on that one due to lack of time as I was also chasing the tall blonde I met in Atlas bar. I returned a month later to close the deal. These short trips are bloody exhausting!

[QUOTE=Qjump]
It will be a long time in coming before the center princesses drop the attitude - something like the ruble crash of '98. Try a normal girl, leave the center girls to the professionals[/QUOTE]

Cruiser, if by 'centre girls' you mean the sugar daddy hunting regulars of Barsky or Tsar, forget it, I don't go to the centre for girls like that. What I'm after is the village girl, the out of town gem making a foray into the centre that she can't really afford. You can always spot the type as her face will light up when you offer a $10 bottle of shampanskoye (yes, even now).

And not all sponsors are oligarchs. I'm sure a lot of them will be running businesses that will be affected by the downturn, and may have to drop their sponsorees from 10 to maybe just their favourite 3 :) But yes these bitches' attitude will be the last thing to change.

[QUOTE=Ash1001]And not all sponsors are oligarchs. I'm sure a lot of them will be running businesses that will be affected by the downturn, and may have to drop their sponsorees from 10 to maybe just their favourite 3 :) But yes these bitches' attitude will be the last thing to change.[/QUOTE]If the economy tanks, which it almost certainly will, they'll change their attitude quick.

Interesting just listening to the tone of my regular contacts... none of the Russian girls I know are scared or commenting on the "krisis" (although they should be) but a significant number of the Ukrainians are.

I mean, it must suck to have a third of your salary cut overnight... from $300 a month to $200.... :)

I have a feeling attitudes will change quickly if things go to shit. Only problem is, the girls are much wiser and more savvy than they were a few years ago. Even in times of crisis, they now their value to men... especially horny Western, Turkish and Indian men.

Luckily there will be less foreign men traveling to the FSU now too. :)

Thanks for the info LS

I just chatted with an "on the ground" expert. There is no Econimic Crisis!

Lifesavour? 04:58 Hi there. You have quite a list of requirments! )

I have just 1. BBBJ? Do you know this slang?

? 05:14 Of course, but I think you should go to River Palace, I don't do 5 minute BBBJs. If you are interested in a class companion and can afford a few $1000 a month, then lets talk.

? 05:14 To answer your next question, Yes, I do swallow.

Lifesavour? 05:16 No, that was not my next? Ha)) And I do not go to RP! And I do like and have had a 'class' girlfriend. But for the $$ you are talking it has to be FULL. TIME! Only me!

Who do you live with now?

Lifesavour? 05:17 You know there is an ECONIMIC CRISIS here! ))

? 05:28 There is? I haven't noticed. My current Master has been recalled to the states at the end of the year, so I find myself in an position to find someone to replace him. I would go with him, but his wife would object, she doesn't like girls. I am well provided for as I deserve it, I do it all and much more. I live alone or with my lover, she fulfills my needs but I serve my Master when ever and for what ever required.

""" OK, so which one of you guys is going home? """

LS

Spent a few days in Kiev, went to RP arrived early so played in the Casino for a couple hours. Around 9:00p the ladies began arriving to the bar downstairs, many were very attractive. I landed up with a good looking lady, was unable to understand her name, we negotiated $150, plus 200Kiev for a return cab, Stayed at the Radisson, the secureity guy wanted 100Kiev to let the lady in. She had a great body, but was very mechanical, I was glad to see her leave.
The next day I visited a massage place [url]http://www.bagira.com.ua/en/[/url]
they had a 2 lady deal called Tsumini for $140, it was about 1.5 hrs long, very memorable. They had a good choice of ladies, I choose Alla and Zloty, the whole massage was very symitrical, orchrasted. There was no sex just a tit release at the end.

[QUOTE=Johntodd]Spent a few days in Kiev, went to RP arrived early so played in the Casino for a couple hours. Around 9:00p the ladies began arriving to the bar downstairs, many were very attractive. I landed up with a good looking lady, was unable to understand her name, we negotiated $150, plus 200Kiev for a return cab, Stayed at the Radisson, the secureity guy wanted 100Kiev to let the lady in. She had a great body, but was very mechanical, I was glad to see her leave.
The next day I visited a massage place [url]http://www.bagira.com.ua/en/[/url]
they had a 2 lady deal called Tsumini for $140, it was about 1.5 hrs long, very memorable. They had a good choice of ladies, I choose Alla and Zloty, the whole massage was very symitrical, orchrasted. There was no sex just a tit release at the end.[/QUOTE]John, those photos look very sexy and glamorous.

Do you know, are they actual photos of the girls that work there or?

I think all mongers can afford 1000$/month for a real sex slave.

This is the problem.

I never met girls for 1000$/month.

I never had real girlfriend sex, except one in Kiev.

6 months ago I went to River Palace with an Ukrainian man and I left that Ukrainian man negotiates with girls, and too many girls asked for 500 or 1000$ per night, for what? I am sure for very bad service.

I think 1000$/month is a very good price and if she makes much more than a man could imagine, that's a real deal!

But I have a doubt: if she knows River Palace, why does she ask just for 1000$/month instead of 1000$/night?

[QUOTE=LifeSavour]I just chatted with an "on the ground" expert. There is no Econimic Crisis!

Lifesavour? 04:58 Hi there. You have quite a list of requirments! )

I have just 1. BBBJ? Do you know this slang?

? 05:14 Of course, but I think you should go to River Palace, I don't do 5 minute BBBJs. If you are interested in a class companion and can afford a few $1000 a month, then lets talk.

? 05:14 To answer your next question, Yes, I do swallow.

Lifesavour? 05:16 No, that was not my next? Ha)) And I do not go to RP! And I do like and have had a 'class' girlfriend. But for the $$ you are talking it has to be FULL. TIME! Only me!

Who do you live with now?

Lifesavour? 05:17 You know there is an ECONIMIC CRISIS here! ))

? 05:28 There is? I haven't noticed. My current Master has been recalled to the states at the end of the year, so I find myself in an position to find someone to replace him. I would go with him, but his wife would object, she doesn't like girls. I am well provided for as I deserve it, I do it all and much more. I live alone or with my lover, she fulfills my needs but I serve my Master when ever and for what ever required.

""" OK, so which one of you guys is going home? """

LS[/QUOTE]

" .... a few $1000 a month"

Means more than 1!

She is thinking more like 3 or 4

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]6 months ago I went to River Palace with an Ukrainian man and I left that Ukrainian man negotiates with girls, and too many girls asked for 500 or 1000$ per night, for what? I am sure for very bad service.[/QUOTE]Is this right? Up to USD 1000 for all night in RP??

[QUOTE=Gergiev]John, those photos look very sexy and glamorous.

Do you know, are they actual photos of the girls that work there or?[/QUOTE]


The photos were the real thing. The massage was excellent, one girl showered with you, then the second girl entered the room, they began with a well choregraphed massage, it was perfection. I was offered a lesbian show, strip show. Six ladies were available, the photos were not retouched.

[QUOTE=Explorer69]Is this right? Up to USD 1000 for all night in RP??[/QUOTE]

Yes it sure is! If you have a idiot hat on your head!
Max for me would be $250 but i am sure someone will tell you less....
Ac remember seems to have entered a different time continuem to the rest of us!

Qjump, you are a hypocritical man!

I agreed with LifeSavour because 1000$/month is a deal, and I advised about prices in River Palace. And in Kiev, average price is not 250$/night but 350$/night, all inclusive if you are lucky. This is the truth.

And I never said I agree those prices. This is just the market in Kiev and this means a lot of men pay those crazy prices for bad services. In fact I seldom read reports focused on sex performances and I often read reports about the "beauty" of girls or the "passion" of fuck. In easier words "I can't say to myself that I have wasted money for a fuck that I could have in my own country"

P.S. I like travelling throughtout "worm holes" in time continuom: in fact my nickname is a colonizer (of worlds).

[QUOTE=Qjump]Yes it sure is! If you have a idiot hat on your head!

Max for me would be $250 but i am sure someone will tell you less.

Ac remember seems to have entered a different time continuem to the rest of us![/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Johntodd]The photos were the real thing. The massage was excellent, one girl showered with you, then the second girl entered the room, they began with a well choregraphed massage, it was perfection. I was offered a lesbian show, strip show. Six ladies were available, the photos were not retouched.[/QUOTE]John, thank you. Indeed, they do look the business.

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Qjump, you are a hypocritical man!

I agreed with LifeSavour because 1000$/month is a deal, and I advised about prices in River Palace. And in Kiev, average price is not 250$/night but 350$/night, all inclusive if you are lucky. This is the truth.

And I never said I agree those prices. This is just the market in Kiev and this means a lot of men pay those crazy prices for bad services. In fact I seldom read reports focused on sex performances and I often read reports about the "beauty" of girls or the "passion" of fuck. In easier words "I can't say to myself that I have wasted money for a fuck that I could have in my own country"

P.S. I like travelling throughtout "worm holes" in time continuom: in fact my nickname is a colonizer (of worlds).[/QUOTE]

Ha ha ha
Perhaps we have a slip in world of translations, i thought you where saying your friend payed $1000 for a RP girl for the night?
If so then yes the man is a FOOL!
I stand by my $250 a night, in fact back in the good old days...... no I cant bring myslef to say it i I will sound like everyone else on here it used to be so much better!!! ;)

Umm, LS ol' buddy, it's a scam.

John, I hope she fucked you as good as she did for getting 200uah $40 for a taxi from you.

AC, Q, I can still close the deal at RP for $200 for the night for a 7+ girl. Do I get $400+ offers sure, but those girls get a chuckle and a pat on the head. When I first started going to Kyiv it was $100-150, maybe $200 for a super hottie for the night. I remember two threesome in particular, a 7 and an 8 for $200 and a 8 and an 8.5 for $200 too. I remember I had offered the 8.5 $150 for the night, she came back and said her friend would come along for $50 more. I almost said no, but I figured $50, wtf. Wowie zowie, those girls were incredible, they did not let up from the moment they walked in till they left. I ended up tapping the 8.5 all next winter for taxi money and dinners. We still keep in touch, actually I'm probably going to give her a call after I'm done writing this. :)

My bud is sponsoring a super hottie 19year old for $1k/month and a $600/month left bank apartment. I'm sure if I was in Kyiv full time I could do $1k/month sans apartment. But then again, I am me. :)

[QUOTE=LifeSavour]I""" OK, so which one of you guys is going home? """[/QUOTE]

Scam? Me or her?

Ummmm, ol' buddy (kinda loose with your terms).

She is the real deal, we lived together for almost 2 years. Many on site here know her and me.

It is no scam. And for the right guy, it will put about $15, 000 usd into his pockets!

For what? A little paper work and probably a few fucks. That is if he is half (or better) the man I am!

Ls 'broker' man

Was in Kiev about 3 months ago and ran into the following girl: [url]http://viktoriat. Wmsite. Ru/[/url] her mobile is: 8 067 233 63 18 she does not speak english. The first night I was there, she told me she could not come and sent me her friend. A very attractive black haired girl called Marina. Thin, small breasts, in her late 20's. She also does not speak English, only Russian. The girl wanted USD 200 for 2 hours. She was fun, nice girl, but due to language barrier not much communication. Enjoys DATY and doggy style. First shot everything was covered. We took a shower together, washed each other down and went back to bed. For the second round she did OWO before putting on a condom. She took her time riding me, and started to massage her clit, getting herself off right after I came for a second time.

We were together more than two hours. I got the sense that she is a semi-pro and does this part time. She told me she does a lesbian show with Vicky. I asked her about anal and she told me it depends. I was too tirred to push it this time.

The next night I called Viktoria and we agreed to meet. Best bet is tell her which hotel and then send her sms with the name of the street and your room number.

I asked her about anal. She told me she doesn't but will come with a friend who does. Thinking its Marina I agreed. Price was USD 400/2 hours.

Stayed at the hotel Opera which is girl friendly. Reserve a room on the 2nd floor where the casino is and the girl can come directly to you. Otherwise you will have to go down and pick her up since the lifts have key cards.

Girls arrived at my door. Viktoria and a dark haired plump girl. Nice face though, big breasted, nice round ass but not Marina. Viktoria is a red head (strawberry blonde) who is thin with small breasts. Similar body type to Marina actually. First thing she did, which surprised me, was that she went to the mini-bar and took out two drinks, and created mixes for her and her friend. I sensed they were nervous. Again the feeling of being semi-pro. They went to the bathroom to change and came out naked. I had both of them sit down next to me. Viktoria (can't remember the other girls name) took out a condom while I started to kiss her friend. She put it on and started to suck my cock, making it hard. I then had the friend go down on me while Viktoria licked and sucked on my balls. When I was ready, I told both girls to get onto the bed and I was hoping they would start to play with each other but the friend say 'no lesbi'. I took their hands and had them masturbate themselves. I laid down between them and pulled Viktoria onto me while kissing the other girl, licking her breasts as she continued to masturbate. Viktoria was quite mechanical though, no kissing, she was focused elsewhere, after a few minutes I pulled Viktoria off me and got the other girl to get on all fours. She asked me 'anal' I smiled yes. She took some jel and smeared her ass as Viktoria pulled off the condom and put a new one on. I took the girl hard. She was quite tight. I took her hand and told her to masturbate while I pushed into her. I told Viktoria to stand behind me. She kissed my back and shoulders and squeezed my balls as I pounded the girl who started to moan. That only encouraged me to pound her harder. After I came, the girls switched on the tv and drank their drinks, trying to chat with me but the language was a barrier.

After a couple of minutes I got ready for round two. The girls sensed what I wanted and drank up their drink. The friend and I started to kiss, she took me in her mouth and started to suck me off. I got Viktoria to get on all fours and spread her pussy for me. I licked her ass and **** while she masturbated. I then started to finger her as the friend put a condom on. I positioned the friend to be between Viktoria's legs. I then entered the friend who had a soaking wet pussy. I slowly built up a rhytm while all the time licking Vicky who had her eyes closed and was fingering her clit. A good finish.

I actually liked both of Viktoria's friends more than Viktoria herself. I found her mechanical and cold. I would use her services though to get me in touch with Marina and her little plump buddy. I will attach two photos of her she sent me which are not on her site.

One more thing, when the girls left I get a call from reception 5 min later asking me if everything is ok. Nice touch.

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]

Life you are commenting on the wrong thread...scroll down this one and see what your last comment was.

Sorry mate. To much 'samogon'

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]My bud is sponsoring a super hottie 19year old for $1k/month and a $600/month left bank apartment. I'm sure if I was in Kyiv full time I could do $1k/month sans apartment[/QUOTE]

Yes, for that kind of $ you'd have a good chance with her mother :D

While we're on this topic I thought you might all find this interesting:

[url]http://blogs.wsj.com/wealth/2008/11/18/rich-cut-back-on-payments-to-mistresses/#comments[/url]

Not about the FSU, but it does reveal lglobal trends.

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]Umm, LS ol' buddy, it's a scam. ..... My bud is sponsoring a super hottie 19year old for $1k/month and a $600/month left bank apartment. I'm sure if I was in Kyiv full time I could do $1k/month sans apartment. But then again, I am me. :)[/QUOTE]


This gal wants a FEW $1000 a month... OK... so why is it a SCAM? YOU HAVE A BUD DOING $1600???

Is he in Kyiv? Living with her? Why would a guy ever do this with a gal unless HE had ALL of her?? ALL THE TIME!!!

These 'girls' coined the phrase - CHUMP!!!

We just work on different levels Ash, maybe someday we'll be in Kyiv at the same time and you can watch me in awe. ;)

I look forward to it. Always willing to learn. Come to think of it, the mom may actually be quite hot..

LS Man - didn't you provide O. with free accommodation in your tsentralni apartment, groceries and coffee in the morning? There's got to be something financial in it for these dyevs. That's just the 'law'.

Yes that was a very ENJOYABLE 15 months of my life! Older than her father, she was younger than my sons (and WAY hotter) than their now wives!

I used to love the guys back home that were 'hunks' in their own minds and always stated. I NEVER pay for sex!

Man, WE all PAY, ALL the time.

LS, he lives in an apartment he bought in Kyiv a few years ago worth about a mil USD. The girl already asked to move in with him. He said no, he calls her when he wants her and she comes, otherwise he would run into scheduling problems with other girls. Chump, eh? Like I told Ash, it's a different level.

For the mongers who do not know her... MT is back... just chatted in her flirt page: no idea if she is still on the market but seems so... The page was down since august. May be she will be in circulation at RP or Arena...

[url]http://flirt.com.ua/sweetmail-a5346/[/url]

No idea of the telephone, now she si searching also for M + M for threesomes..., but do not think she does anal!

IT

Yeah they should hire her at Kiev Tourist Office

PS For those who do not know her here one of my best pics, waiter dressed, handcuffed to the bed, ready to be nailed and glazed...

Was it worth 1.5 mil last month?

LS, doubtful. But he bought it just before the prices went crazy. His equity now is still higher then what he paid for it. I'm sure it won't be when the Ukrainian economy collapses in the spring. I'm sure he's not concerned about it. The car he occasionally drives in Kyiv cost more then the apartment you are staying in. Kyiv isn't an investment for him. Like you he's just there to enjoy life. I wish I had the amount of time to spend in Kyiv that the both of you do. ;)

IT, nice to see MT is back. I hate change. :) And if she hadn't literally fucked a thousand or so men since the time I first saw her I would have no problem at all tapping shit again or at least mouth fucking her. Her oral skills were top notch, she was ironically the first pro I had in Kyiv. I'm amazed and saddened she hasn't bought implants yet.

Cruiser, the gist of your argument seems to be that the more (resources, money etc.) you *have*, the less you need to *spend* (or give to girls or whatever). I'm not disputing this - I'm intrigued. Do elaborate.

FYI, I saw MT at RP earlier this month.

Ash, it's been covered before. If you can offer a girl a lifestyle you don't need to give as much hard cash. This of course depends on the girl too, some just want the $, those I avoid. Unless of course it's a one time agreement. :)

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]IT, nice to see MT is back. I hate change. :) And if she hadn't literally fucked a thousand or so men since the time I first saw her I would have no problem at all tapping her shit again or at least mouth fucking her. Her oral skills were top notch, she was ironically the first pro I had in Kyiv. I'm amazed and saddened she hasn't bought implants yet.[/QUOTE]

I think she saw more than 1000 cocks... We all know that her BBBJ + CIM when she is a little drunk is... mmm :p

But, sorry, I think you are American? Right... why a such skinny beauty should get implants!!! It's ok with that mini A cup... ;)

IT

PS same reason I like her unshaven! Her pubic hair is so little and smooth (typical of slavic girls...), unforuntately still not fucked an unshaven original red one! Where Pink is Pink :p

Implants and shaved! ;)

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]Implants and shaved! ;)[/QUOTE]Apart the face she is close to perfection as she is.... in body not in colour here you have what I could say is neraly 10 (of course if she does BBBJ, CIM, swallowing, anal etc)...

Look here (but in Moscow...)

[url]http://flirt.com.ua/kubrina2008/[/url]

Red haired, pale white skin, freckles, 164/44, A-- cups, she doesn't get 10 (thinking she does all sex) just because 21, not 19.

IT

I can just imagine a DATY when she is dripping wet.

We have different tastes.

I was not at River Palace Sat or Sun night.

Anyone have a phone number for MT or is it just through flirt?

please PM me.

I have LOOKED at all the photos ever on site here. Sure I would let her suck me. Maybe even fuck me. BUT PAY her?

My God, my gal ('O' as ASH called her previously) used to laugh at this.

WE just never saw how this gal could make $$ fawking.

Yes, "different STROKES for different FOLKS"

STROKES. Pun was intended!

Wow she looks amazing! I love skinny girls and I would love to visit Kiev, but I don't know the language and I worry that I won’t get the most out of it.

Thanks for the pic! I'm in love :)

[QUOTE=It Travel]For the mongers who do not know her... MT is back... just chatted in her flirt page: no idea if she is still on the market but seems so... The page was down since august. May be she will be in circulation at RP or Arena...

[url]http://flirt.com.ua/sweetmail-a5346/[/url]

No idea of the telephone, now she si searching also for M + M for threesomes..., but do not think she does anal!

IT

Yeah they should hire her at Kiev Tourist Office

PS For those who do not know her here one of my best pics, waiter dressed, handcuffed to the bed, ready to be nailed and glazed...[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Jerkus]Wow she looks amazing! I love skinny girls and I would love to visit Kiev, but I don't know the language and I worry that I won’t get the most out of it.

Thanks for the pic! I'm in love :)[/QUOTE]


Instead of taking my "ikra" I thik she should give me a gratis fuck every time I'm in Kiev..

By the way if you make a search you'll find lots of photos I made of her (approx 80 or so in different years and others too...) I'll write in her page and see if she answers... ;)

IT

She looks better in person LS. I tapped her for $100 for the night in late 2004 - probably right after Skank did. ;) I don't think there's anyone on here who's beening going to Kyiv since 2005 who hasn't done her. She's a slender hyper sexual long legged blond who would beg for you to mouth fuck her and blow a load on her face and then beg for more. Exactly what everyone was coming to Kyiv for.

There's a lot of miles on that road now.

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]She looks better in person LS. I tapped her for $100 for the night in late 2004 - probably right after Skank did. ;) I don't think there's anyone on here who's beening going to Kyiv since 2005 who hasn't done her. She's a slender hyper sexual long legged blond who would beg for you to mouth fuck her and blow a load on her face and then beg for more. Exactly what everyone was coming to Kyiv for.

There's a lot of miles on that road now.[/QUOTE]

I did her several times (pictured too) just after your start... she is surely over 1000's.... of what you want to know? CIMs, BBBJs, for fucks, may be over 5000 and surely well over 1000 men... but surely a great thing in a bed...

IT

PS If all Kiev girl were like MT.....!!!! :p :p :p

Arriving Kiev on December 2, and staying around for a week.

Not a problem to touch base with anyone interested in some fun.

MG

Not correct: in fact now she begs just for money and she doesn't mind about everybody, except for her mother. Caution: she is not for beginners!

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]She looks better in person LS. I tapped her for $100 for the night in late 2004 - probably right after Skank did. ;) I don't think there's anyone on here who's beening going to Kyiv since 2005 who hasn't done her. She's a slender hyper sexual long legged blond who would beg for you to mouth fuck her and blow a load on her face and then beg for more. Exactly what everyone was coming to Kyiv for.

There's a lot of miles on that road now.[/QUOTE]

AC, why would you even bother with such a well documented girl? She used to be great, now she's jaded.

which companies does the trustful apartment rental in kiev currently?

[url]http://www.kievhotelservice.com/[/url]

i've used this before, but they don't seem to have too many options, as they now have long term tenants living in their apartments.

i'm basically looking for a studio or one-bedroom apartment near the id square with the high speed internet access for 80 usd or less. is it not possible?

thanks in advance.

Hi gents. I've been sequestered for a time. Got back home from Warsaw and got a pink slip. The bastards.
Now I'm in a new position that has very little travel, so it looks like I'll have to live vicariously through you guys. Cruiser, we'll have to have a drink some other time unfortunately.

I was wondering if the RP (or similar) scene has been impacted yet by the economic state of affairs there? Anything to report?

[QUOTE=Brandon88]Hi gents. I've been sequestered for a time. Got back home from Warsaw and got a pink slip. The bastards.
Now I'm in a new position that has very little travel, so it looks like I'll have to live vicariously through you guys. Cruiser, we'll have to have a drink some other time unfortunately.

I was wondering if the RP (or similar) scene has been impacted yet by the economic state of affairs there? Anything to report?[/QUOTE]

Surprisingly enough it has, a lot of new girls plus a little flexibility on prices.
Wednesday night around 01.00 I negotiated a couple of hours for $200.00 and my friend who was busy getting drunk then decided at 03.30 he wanted some action and connected for $140.00. In both cases the girls were about a 6, but if you go there, be ruthless on prices because the good news is guys it's becoming a buyers market again. Don't you just love a global financial crisis ?