Jakarta

[QUOTE=Natty Bumpo; 1470514]Canyon, I enjoyed reading your concise very interesting trip report. I am all geared up for my first trip to Jakarta in late February. I have been doing my homework for some time and Hotel Alexis and the Malioboro Spa are at the top of my list. I also want to check out Bats, Hotel Travel, Classic Hotel, and Blok M if time permits, but I am going to leave myself open to whatever happens. For example, I plan to start my odyssey the first night at the Alexis. If I find that the girls in Alexis are really hot and my time spent there is indeed rewarding, then I will probably want to visit the place a couple more times. On the other hand, if my experience at Alexis is just OK – nothing really outstanding, then that will give me more incentive to check out the other establishments. I am staying 6 nights in Jakarta, so I figure I will get around to at least 3 or 4 places on my list. I am not going to try to do everything. That is impossible. But if I like Jakarta as much as I think I am going to like it, this will not be my last trip.

I am staying for free at the JW. Thank you Marriott Rewards.

I have a question about Alexis and Malioboro: when is the best time to go? I am assuming around 7pm is a good time to take a taxi from the Marriott.[/QUOTE]Natty,

Both Alexis and Malioboro are open in the early afternoon. However, I think your plan to go around 7 pm is a good one.

Canyon

[QUOTE=Botaki6; 1470711]I know the location of Hotel Travel. But where is Hotel Classic please?

Is there again any action in Lokasari Plaza?

How is the action nowadays at BintangMawar?[/QUOTE]Hotel Classic is in north Jakarta not too far from Malioboro or Hotel Travel, The exact address is KH Samanhuudi 43-45 Pasar Baru Sawah.

[QUOTE=Traveler1234;

BTW, you're overpaying at BATS. But as well as know, YMMV.

Enjoy the rest of your stay.[/QUOTE]Traveler,

I don't think you're clear on the concept, or at least, we have different views on the subject. There is no one set price at BATS, so you really can't make a judgment on what's overpaying or what's not overpaying without knowing who the girl is. There is a wide range of women at BATS ranging from an overweight "plain Jane" in her late 30's to a beautiful 22-year old stunner with a great personality. Clearly, the prices are very different for these two individuals, so saying that someone overpaid based on a certain dollar figure makes no sense at all, if you don't know who the girl is. I think the goal of any sensible person is to get the most pleasure out of sex-not to get the lowest price possible. In my situation, paying $150 instead of $100 is irrelevant, because the extra $50 is not very much by western standards. It's much more important to have a great experience. I've found that you get much better service if you're generous than if you fight for the last dollar. In my situation, the $150 I paid for the 22-year old stunner who gave great service and had a great personality was a great value and was not overpayment in any sense of the word.

By comparison, one would pay about $200 for one-hour service at Alexis for a good-looking Vietnamese, Chinese or Thai. For only $150, I had twice as much time with the stunner who was more attractive than most of the women at Alexis. I think when you post that someone overpaid, you're giving people the wrong idea on how to enjoy themselves. The idea is not to pay the least, but to get the most enjoyment.

[QUOTE=Canyon;1470868]Traveler, I don't think you're clear on the concept, or at least, we have different views on the subject. The idea is not to pay the least, but to get the most enjoyment.[/QUOTE]

No flame intended but......

1. Before your trip, you asked multiple times for pricing guidelines. Which many of us shared with you.
2. These are guidelines, and only that.
3. In my last post, I said the same thing you are now saying. Enjoyment is the key.

You merely paid the retail price, not the street / market price. In fact, you paid full retail plus a premium at BATS. You're right, by western standards $150 isn't much but than again you're in Rome and not LA. It's your money. It's like pay private escort prices for picking up someone at Nana Parking Lot. Next time just don't waste your time and ask 'how much is the street price'.

And just for the record, those 20+ stunners can be had for under $100 and LT, but again YMMV. Enjoy the rest of your stay in Jakarta and have fun!

[QUOTE=Traveler1234; 1470871]No flame intended but.

1. Before your trip, you asked multiple times for pricing guidelines. Which many of us shared with you.

2. These are guidelines, and only that.

3. In my last post, I said the same thing you are now saying. Enjoyment is the key.

You merely paid the retail price, not the street / market price. In fact, you paid full retail plus a premium at BATS. You're right, by western standards $150 isn't much but than again you're in Rome and not LA. It's your money. It's like pay private escort prices for picking up someone at Nana Parking Lot. Next time just don't waste your time and ask 'how much is the street price'.

And just for the record, those 20+ stunners can be had for under $100 and LT, but again YMMV. Enjoy the rest of your stay in Jakarta and have fun![/QUOTE]atCanyon: Its your money and ofcourse anyone is free to do as he want. But it does affect all the rest of us; well I will not speak for anyone so I will say it does affect me. Perhaps she won't settle that easy when I negotiate next time. Or her friends will try to. Overpaying does exist. As to much money doesn't always makes the service better. I admit I overpay several times but thats more out of negotiation weakness then out of full free choice. I just want to say a good negotation will not necessarily change the service you get and benefit other people like me. Up to you.

[QUOTE=Medanboy;1470950]atCanyon: Its your money and ofcourse anyone is free to do as he want. But it does affect all the rest of us; well I will not speak for anyone so I will say it does affect me. Perhaps she won't settle that easy when I negotiate next time. Or her friends will try to. Overpaying does exist. As to much money doesn't always makes the service better. I admit I overpay several times but thats more out of negotiation weakness then out of full free choice. I just want to say a good negotation will not necessarily change the service you get and benefit other people like me. Up to you.[/QUOTE]Medanboy,

I have a different view. I don't think it's my responsibility to hold down the prices for you. You're on your own. If a girl can command more money for her services, I say "congratulations." I believe in a free market economy, where each individual is free to sell her services or for a man to purchase her services. Whatever they agree on is fine. I don't believe in price-fixing-I. E. Guys joining together to hold down prices or girls joining together to hold up prices. Each person should make the best deal for herself or himself. If a girl can get more money out of you and you agree to it, that's fine with me. Also, if you can get a girl for less money, that's fine with me, too.

My experience has been that hard bargaining can take some of the pleasure out of the session. If a girl quotes me a price that is reasonable, I take it without negotiation. It works better that way for me. If I think it's way too high, I decline. Sometimes she'll make a reduced offer that I may accept. If the amounts are not significant, I rarely drive a hard bargain. It's not worth it to me.

Before I go in, I like to have some idea of the market price or at least the range. That's why I asked Traveler what the going rates were and he was very helpful. That doesn't mean that I won't pay more than the average rate if I think the quality is there. Face, body and personality are all important to me. Also very important is chemistry. If we have a lot of rapport, I may pay somewhat above the average rate, just because I like her.

There's also the concept of the marginal utility of money. What this means is that an extra dollar to me is worth less than it would be worth to a girl in Jakarta. So $50 extra to me would not be significant, but it would be to her. To maximize pleasure for her, I'm happy to pay more, since the extra money that I pay will not reduce my pleasure significantly. I find that it makes me happier to treat other people well.

[QUOTE=Canyon; 1471090]Medanboy,

I have a different view. I don't think it's my responsibility to hold down the prices for you. You're on your own. If a girl can command more money for her services, I say "congratulations." I believe in a free market economy, where each individual is free to sell her services or for a man to purchase her services. Whatever they agree on is fine. I don't believe in price-fixing-I. E. Guys joining together to hold down prices or girls joining together to hold up prices. Each person should make the best deal for herself or himself. If a girl can get more money out of you and you agree to it, that's fine with me. Also, if you can get a girl for less money, that's fine with me, too.

My experience has been that hard bargaining can take some of the pleasure out of the session. If a girl quotes me a price that is reasonable, I take it without negotiation. It works better that way for me. If I think it's way too high, I decline. Sometimes she'll make a reduced offer that I may accept. If the amounts are not significant, I rarely drive a hard bargain. It's not worth it to me.

Before I go in, I like to have some idea of the market price or at least the range. That's why I asked Traveler what the going rates were and he was very helpful. That doesn't mean that I won't pay more than the average rate if I think the quality is there. Face, body and personality are all important to me. Also very important is chemistry. If we have a lot of rapport, I may pay somewhat above the average rate, just because I like her.

There's also the concept of the marginal utility of money. What this means is that an extra dollar to me is worth less than it would be worth to a girl in Jakarta. So $50 extra to me would not be significant, but it would be to her. To maximize pleasure for her, I'm happy to pay more, since the extra money that I pay will not reduce my pleasure significantly. I find that it makes me happier to treat other people well.[/QUOTE]I decided on this exact approach in my buying items for import many years ago. If it is not out of the ball park and will make the supplier feel better about his product and his profit then it is a win-win situation for both parties. The same applies to the quality of the WG. You get what you pay for.

RL

[QUOTE=Canyon;1471090]There's also the concept of the marginal utility of money. What this means is that an extra dollar to me is worth less than it would be worth to a girl in Jakarta. So $50 extra to me would not be significant, but it would be to her.[/QUOTE]I neither work on a drilling rig nor as gambling broker. For me 50-$ is a significant amount and not a small tip.

Remember: Enron, Lehman Bros, WorldCom did glamour over a short period only. Wish you enjoy the time you still got and don't flash your fortune: it does not impress anyone. Not even the girls. Most are too pragmatic to see in a big spender a great lover but soemone who can be taken for a ride.

[QUOTE=Robert Long; 1471165]<snip.

The same applies to the quality of the WG. You get what you pay for.[/QUOTE]With pros from escort services: Yes, probably, but absolutely not necessarily with FLs.

[QUOTE=Botaki6; 1471206]<snip.

Most are too pragmatic to see in a big spender a great lover but soemone who can be taken for a ride.[/QUOTE]Well put, Botaki6.

[QUOTE=Medanboy; 1470950]<snip.

Perhaps she won't settle that easy when I negotiate next time. Or her friends will try to. Overpaying does exist. As too much money doesn't always makes the service better.[/QUOTE]Well put, Medanboy.

Besides, I don't think western market 'rules' necessarily apply on street level in poor countries.

/Barri

[QUOTE=Canyon;1471090]I have a different view. I don't think it's my responsibility to hold down the prices for you.[/QUOTE]I agree.

[QUOTE=Canyon; 1471090]My experience has been that hard bargaining can take some of the pleasure out of the session.
If a girl quotes me a price that is reasonable, I take it without negotiation. It works better that way for me. If I think it's way too high, I decline. Sometimes she'll make a reduced offer that I may accept. If the amounts are not significant, I rarely drive a hard bargain. It's not worth it to me.
[/QUOTE]I also agree, but there is a difference BTW hard bargaining and merely 'smiling and saying, how come so high? '. They had you picked as a newbie, LOL.

[QUOTE=Canyon; 1471090]
There's also the concept of the marginal utility of money. What this means is that an extra dollar to me is worth less than it would be worth to a girl in Jakarta. So $50 extra to me would not be significant, but it would be to her. To maximize pleasure for her, I'm happy to pay more, since the extra money that I pay will not reduce my pleasure significantly.[/QUOTE]Yep, you sure made her financially happy! But in no way means you get better or worse service.

Apologies in breaking the flow of recent posts.

This is my first time in Jk and I thought I'd post on my first day's sex-perience for other noobs to learn from.

Taxi-tastic.

Right off the plane things started to go wrong. These guys can see noobs or soft touches and I must be the poster boy. Taxi hawkers descend like a plague of locusts. I rebuff with a smile and a laugh and say I want only bluebird taxi, meter taxi. I RTFF you see, thanks all for those pearls BTW, spot on. I should have written it down instead of just mentally recording the good taxis. It's about 9:30 pm after a long flight and I'm exhausted. They know it. I wait in line for bluebird, there is a que. The hawkers know I want to get the f out ASAP.

"Hey mista you want silver bird taxi?"

Silver bird? That sounds like one of the safe companies. Is it meter taxi?" yes meter" I'm walking with him. How much is it to the city?" about 200, 000" right there I think shit that's the scam they're skimming 50, 000. Fuck it, I'm tired and I want to get to hotel, shower and get some feminine attention. I get in the silver bird black merc taxi. Alarm bell 2. A Mercedes taxi. Alarm bell 3 the driver sets the meter up and it already shows 150, 000. That's the total price from bluebird. Shit, I'm in a scam situation but we re moving on the express way. The meter is ticking up waaaay too fast, we are only a km or so down, not even to the toll booths and the meter says 600, 000! Fuck this. I'm already planning that this is going to go bad, I speak no Indonesian at all, I've got no back up, I don't know where I am.

"Err. Meter, meter too much 600, 000 too much, it should be 150, 000 to city"

We get into an argument with him saying why I chose silver bird that's blue bird price etc. So I went into very sorry very sorry I'm tired I made a mistake, I told him I only have 200, 000 on me, I haven't been to the bank because the Internet said the taxi would be x amount. Very sorry. I'll get out. Stop. I made him pull over on the hard shoulder of the expressway and was going to get out. He calls his head on the radio. They're talking. This is where I think I'm truly fucked. Either they bail me out and I have to hitch hike, or I get roughed over by a gang. So I sit with my head in my hands resigned to it. Then I offer him to stop the meter and pay he driver 200, 000 everything I have (it's not but I figure an extra 5 dollars might get this shit over with). He bites, we are on our way again. Phew. We get the hotel. I pay 200, 000 then bizarrely he says sorry for the misunderstanding on the highway and gives me 20, 000 change. Yeah he's smiling tho, maybe he just wanted to fuck with a whitey, feel superior, whatever, I'm here, only 3 dollars out of pocket and I got a ride in a merc! First for me! (I'm scum you see).

What do you guys make of that? I thought maybe that was the game, just squeeze an extra 50, 000 each time by scaring the passenger into forcing an agreed settlement to get off the crazy meter figure.

Part 2 of my sex-perience soon. In this episode I visit illegals and stadium and have my first ever indo girl!

[QUOTE=Amator;1471370]"Hey mista you want silver bird taxi?"[/QUOTE]Very surprised to hear of your experience with Silver Bird. They are indeed more expensive than regular taxis, almost double, but the cars are considerably better and the drivers are usually experienced and polite. They are operated by the same company as Blue Bird as their "premium" line. You said that the meter was already at Rp150k as soon as you got in. Now, with crappy taxis, it's not unknown for the driver to leave the meter on before a passenger gets in and then "forget" to reset it, but it would be most unusual for a Silver or Blue Bird to do that. Not impossible, but very unusual. I think what happened is that the meter showed 15, 000 (which is what the Silver starts at) , but you were slightly jet-lagged and saw the extra zero. The other possibility is that the taxi was not really a Silver Bird. The drivers usually don't just go up to people and offer their services, there's a special queue. These days, I don't usually consider Silvers worth the extra price, although I'll take them from the airport after a long flight if it means jumping the queue over the people lining up for a blue.

If you think airport taxis are bad now, you should have been here ten years ago. Used to be a major effort to find one that would use a meter. These days most of them will, with a bit of persuasion. If they start groaning and moaning and asking for unrealistic sums, I just ask them to use the meter and tell them I'll give them a good tip. An extra thirty or so from the airport usually results in a satisfied smile. Maybe you're right, maybe they can smell the newcomer -- where you're REALLY going to have fun is when you pick up a taxi outside Stadium, the Blok M clubs, or somewhere like that. Those places are the last vestige of the old "President Taxi" system, where the drivers thought that if the girl you were with is going to get a few hundred thousand for the night, then they should share in the financial benefits for providing transportation.

EDIT: The fact that the driver actually had a radio and gave you some change at the end makes me think it was really a Silver. 180k would be about right from the airport to North Jakarta. Next time, if you're feeling generous, let him keep the change for 200k. Also, you have to pay the tolls yourself and there's an official surcharge from the airport, something like 15k. Drivers ***** because they say they have to wait there for hours before they get a passenger. I don't get that, myself, but they do feel entitled to a bit extra for going to the airport.

EXTRA EDIT: Haha! I can't say the "driver b1tched". Nice to see the administrator of ISG taking such care to prevent foul language. Almost like being at Church, isn't it?

Took one of my regulars to Singapore for a weekend. Way too much whining. But she has a fantastic body and oh so tight. A 50 year old with a 20 year old girlfriend. Most did not even notice. Got to love Asia.

I agree that you most likely had a silverbird. That is a normal fare to the north side. I have noticed a bit more of a crush at the airport with Express offering a stand and being approached by white horse. I negotiated a price with white horse twice and was very happy. A car as nice as silverbird and about 25% discount. No meter but made sure that the price was what was listed.

One more item: Google maps now has traffic on it and I find it is accurate to within 100 meters for areas of heavy traffic. Really helpful in Jakarta traffic.

[QUOTE=WTF0506; 1471702]I agree that you most likely had a silverbird. That is a normal fare to the north side. I have noticed a bit more of a crush at the airport with Express offering a stand and being approached by white horse. I negotiated a price with white horse twice and was very happy. A car as nice as silverbird and about 25% discount. No meter but made sure that the price was what was listed.

One more item: Google maps now has traffic on it and I find it is accurate to within 100 meters for areas of heavy traffic. Really helpful in Jakarta traffic.[/QUOTE]Personally I just go up to the departure level and take one of the bluebirds who dropped someone off. Last time however as the bluebird I chose seened to be parking the security took out his name / photo plate and didn't want to give it back for a small fee. We drove off and tge driver said we gad to do a small circle so he could get it bit back. I said no I get out. No problem and he stopped another empty bluebird for me. Quite kind. Guess it is the risk they willing to take. Happened 1 in 15 timed. Never had to wait more then 5 seconds.