Kyiv

[QUOTE=Immy007; 1177016]LJ.

Regarding Rio, I think the girls on the top floor are usually better looking. Upstairs is always full and bottom is more or less empty.

This is what I noticed in my June trip, your experiences might have been different. I did go during weekdays mostly to avoid the weekend rush.

Does Club Paradise have the same pricing and policy as Rio?[/QUOTE]Yes, Paradise has the same pricing, and also the same girls who rotate there from club Rio to dance.

[QUOTE=Liljoey;1177159]Yes, Paradise has the same pricing, and also the same girls who rotate there from club Rio to dance.[/QUOTE]Indeed, Rio was so popular (with tourists and local elitniy) that they just replicated almost everything, bar prices, girls, topless only, takeout price.

And I don't know about you LJ, but it seems totally random to me on which of the 3 floors the hottest girls will be on recent visits. Certainly the VIP area has not had a consistently better selection in my experience.

Indeed, I think the ground floor seems to have a higher number of girls willing to leave the club with you. VIP seems to be full of "dancers only". Although I know a few of the girls refuse to go with client after around 2. 30 or 3am because it would be 0700 before they got home and some have college or work and others have babysitters to relieve.

I have a soft spot for the ground floor anyway from years back when it was definitely the best part of the club. Mere mortals or tourists got directed up the spiral staircase and the lower bar remained unknown to many. Then they had the fire and it all changed! Not sure if memory is playing tricks with me, but I seem to recall at some point in the distant past didn't the girls downstairs go fully naked on the stage? Maybe some other Kyiv old-hand can correct me (maybe 7, 8 or even 10 years ago?)

My next trip will also be in September, ready for the fresh university recruits arriving from the provinces!

[QUOTE=TheKnight; 1177888]Indeed, Rio was so popular (with tourists and local elitniy) that they just replicated almost everything, bar prices, girls, topless only, takeout price.

And I don't know about you LJ, but it seems totally random to me on which of the 3 floors the hottest girls will be on recent visits. Certainly the VIP area has not had a consistently better selection in my experience.

Indeed, I think the ground floor seems to have a higher number of girls willing to leave the club with you. VIP seems to be full of "dancers only". Although I know a few of the girls refuse to go with client after around 2. 30 or 3am because it would be 0700 before they got home and some have college or work and others have babysitters to relieve.

I have a soft spot for the ground floor anyway from years back when it was definitely the best part of the club. Mere mortals or tourists got directed up the spiral staircase and the lower bar remained unknown to many. Then they had the fire and it all changed! Not sure if memory is playing tricks with me, but I seem to recall at some point in the distant past didn't the girls downstairs go fully naked on the stage? Maybe some other Kyiv old-hand can correct me (maybe 7, 8 or even 10 years ago?)

My next trip will also be in September, ready for the fresh university recruits arriving from the provinces![/QUOTE]

WHERE THE HOTTEST RIO GIRLS ARE?

Let's approach this logically, since the impressions given by different writers in recent posts give divergent views about where (which floor. Which bar) the hottest girls in Rio are located. To say that hotter girls are dancing in one bar or room at Rio than other bars or rooms as a rule, presumes that the people who make decisions at Rio as to who dances where, have an intention and a plan as to this. If not, then it is random chance as to which girl will be dancing on which floor and in which bar, or it may be there is a plan, but that some other criteria than "hotness" of the girls is being used to make work assignments for the girls.

I think many visitors to Rio can confirm what happens when a new person comes to Rio, or even a known customer comes in later in the evening. They are usually told it is full downstairs and they are ushered to the upstairs outer or inner bar. What this clearly implies is that the downstairs gets full first. Who does it get full with? There are local regulars who may have made a reservation. There are also tourists who are regular customers known to the managers who regularly visit the club and always tip the managers, who the managers will find a place for in the downstairs bar if possible. What this means is that there is a higher "demand" for seating in the downstairs bar. Does this higher demand for seating in the downstairs bar, that is cultivated by management, also mean that management makes an effort to insure that hotter girls are dancing in the downstairs bar? Probably. And it accords with my perceptions and recollections. Also girls would want to be dancing where there are guys who are regular big spenders.

This is not to say that there aren't also hot girls dancing in the upstairs bars (the inner and outer room). Of course there are many hot girls on both floors. What we are talking about is whether there is more of a concentration of hotties in the downstairs bar. In a given allotment of significant time, let's say an hour or two, will one see more hot girls in the downstairs bar, compared to the upstairs bar? Possibly.

But on the other hand it is also entirely possible that the higher demand and preference for seating in the downstairs bar has nothing to do with hotties dancing there, and simply is a way of according that downstairs bar some more status so as to cater to their VIP very monied regulars, and where the hotties dance is random.

I have seen so many hotties in the upstairs bars, that the matter is just inconclusive to me.

In the VIP room upstairs I thought I perceived a pattern about the type of girls who dance in the VIP. There were many girls who were very young, quite petite and cute in the VIP. There were also some taller really beautiful stunners like Rosa (who no longer works at Rio) and Taya. But I'm not sure if it's coincidence, or that management had made a conscious decision to have a certain type of girl.

Currently I will just start in either downstairs of upstairs room, and ask to change rooms if I don't see girls I like in the line up of the room I am in within about 20 minutes or so.

LJ

Hi Guys,

Next month some friends and I will be in Kiev for few days for the first time.

From what I have read here, I should at least check out the Rio but is there other places you would recommend?

Is it save for me to take a taxi alone if I want to visit some others places that my friends are not interested (thinking some massage parlors).

Any suggestions are welcome.

Thank you

[QUOTE=Jonas B; 1178444]Hi Guys,

Next month some friends and I will be in Kiev for few days for the first time.

From what I have read here, I should at least check out the Rio but is there other places you would recommend?

Is it save for me to take a taxi alone if I want to visit some others places that my friends are not interested (thinking some massage parlors).

Any suggestions are welcome.

Thank you[/QUOTE]Me and my friends do have the same question, we (4 guys, age 22-24) also go for the first time to Kiev for 5 days in August.

We have read this forum but some suggestions are welcome. We also like to checkout the vodka-bar, does somebody know what type of girls are there freebies, pro / semi pro's?

Last month I went to Dubai. When I entered a club (york club) , the place was packed with P4P al the WG's were approaching me directly. Is this the same in a specific club in Kiev or is it only in clubs like Rio?

Thank you

[QUOTE=Jonas B; 1178444]Hi Guys,

Next month some friends and I will be in Kiev for few days for the first time.

From what I have read here, I should at least check out the Rio but is there other places you would recommend?

Is it save for me to take a taxi alone if I want to visit some others places that my friends are not interested (thinking some massage parlors).

Any suggestions are welcome.

Thank you[/QUOTE]Me and my friends do have the same question, we (4 guys, age 22-24) also go for the first time to Kiev for 5 days in August.

We have read this forum but some suggestions are welcome. We also like to checkout the vodka-bar, does somebody know what type of girls are there freebies, pro / semi pro's?

Last month I went to Dubai. When I entered a club (york club) , the place was packed with P4P al the WG's were approaching me directly. Is this the same in a specific club in Kiev or is it only in clubs like Rio?

Thank you

[QUOTE=EagleJohny; 1178472]Last month I went to Dubai. When I entered a club (york club) , the place was packed with P4P al the WG's were approaching me directly. Is this the same in a specific club in Kiev or is it only in clubs like Rio?

Thank you[/QUOTE]It used to be like that at RP. It's different at other clubs and Rio. When you visit Rio, you have to tell administrator / manager which girl you like. After that he will approach a girl on stage and quietly tell her "after your dance, go to table 1, 2, 3, 4" The girl will come to your table and you can start talking to her. When you visit regular clubs (D'Lux, Buddha Bar, Arena etc.) , you will have to approach the girls directly.

[QUOTE=Curious12;1178580]It used to be like that at RP. It's different at other clubs and Rio. When you visit Rio, you have to tell administrator / manager which girl you like. After that he will approach a girl on stage and quietly tell her "after your dance, go to table 1, 2, 3, 4" The girl will come to your table and you can start talking to her. When you visit regular clubs (D'Lux, Buddha Bar, Arena etc.) , you will have to approach the girls directly.[/QUOTE]@EaglyJohnny: HINT: Two months ago I had the same question. You just have to get some feeling with approaching the (available) girls. My first approach was a disaster, I approached a girl in D'lux because I thought she was a WG, but then her 'extreme big boyfriend' came to me. He wasn't that nice, so had to run for my life. After visiting some other clubs you will get some experience and you will easily recognise the WG from the normal party girls!

Enjoy!

[QUOTE=EagleJohny; 1178485]Me and my friends do have the same question, we (4 guys, age 22-24) also go for the first time to Kiev for 5 days in August.

We have read this forum but some suggestions are welcome. We also like to checkout the vodka-bar, does somebody know what type of girls are there freebies, pro / semi pro's?

Last month I went to Dubai. When I entered a club (york club) , the place was packed with P4P al the WG's were approaching me directly. Is this the same in a specific club in Kiev or is it only in clubs like Rio?

Thank you[/QUOTE]EJ.

Dubai is completely different from the clubs in Kiev. You need to directly approach the girls.

Vodka-bar is ok and you can get all types here but quality of the girls isn't too great. I think you should check out D'Lux instead, it's 200 UAH entrance at weekends but some really hot ladies to be found here.

[QUOTE=Immy007; 1178792]EJ.

Dubai is completely different from the clubs in Kiev. You need to directly approach the girls.

Vodka-bar is ok and you can get all types here but quality of the girls isn't too great. I think you should check out D'Lux instead, it's 200 UAH entrance at weekends but some really hot ladies to be found here.[/QUOTE]Where is D'Lux? Don't give me name of street because I can't read Ukrainian. Give me the area around it. Is it close to independence square?

Very close to the main entrance of the football stadium.

Dynamo Kiev, old football stadium.

[QUOTE=Castonthis;1179384]Where is D'Lux? Don't give me name of street because I can't read Ukrainian. Give me the area around it. Is it close to independence square?[/QUOTE]Yes it's past Independence square, take a cab if not sure.

Address is Hrushevskoho 3

I have 10 days of vacations coming up from Aug. 31 to Sept. 10. I am thinking of a first trip to Ukraine. May I have few questions for our experienced mongers to Ukraine? 1) If you were me, where would you go? Kiev or Odessa, taken into account the cost of airline tickets, quality of girls and costs of your stay, I. E, girls, hotels, and food. I live in Los Angeles, California. If is a longgggggg way to Ukraine. 2) Would you split your vacations? 5 days in Kiev and 5 days in Odessa. 3) Do you have a list of hotels in both cities?

Keep in mind that I am somewhat budget-oriented.

Good days gents.

EZ

[QUOTE=Ezyngo; 1179842]I have 10 days of vacations coming up from Aug. 31 to Sept. 10. I am thinking of a first trip to Ukraine. May I have few questions for our experienced mongers to Ukraine? 1) If you were me, where would you go? Kiev or Odessa, taken into account the cost of airline tickets, quality of girls and costs of your stay, I. E, girls, hotels, and food. I live in Los Angeles, California. If is a longgggggg way to Ukraine. 2) Would you split your vacations? 5 days in Kiev and 5 days in Odessa. 3) Do you have a list of hotels in both cities?

Keep in mind that I am somewhat budget-oriented.

Good days gents.

EZ[/QUOTE]From LA and having lived in both, I vote Kiev. Odessa is a bit less expensive but I feel like Kiev has much more going on.

Stick with apartments and make sure you book in advance (like now) especially for Odessa if you go there.

[url]www.kievapts.com[/url]

[url]www.odessapats.com[/url]

Interesting comparision. (see also my other post). I think FKKs and visiting Kiev (or any other eastern-european city) are totally different things. When I am in Kiev, I almost always succeed in having non-paid sex, because there are many girls around, and also many non-pros like to have a good time. It is of course not completely for free, because you pay for drinks, dinner, etc, but not for the sex directly. If you are able to pick-up girls in your homeland, then you are also able to do this in Kiev and you end up with much better girls than at home IMHO! Also you will have DFK and OWO as "standard" with these kind of dates, but of course it can also result in a less succesfull evening with no sex at all.

If you look strictly at paid sex (so professional workers) , I agree with most of the things Liljoey wrote. And especially because the service level in Kiev (and other cities) is very unpredictable, compared to the very reliable FKKs in Germany, I would always choose for the latter one. In e. G. Oase, all girls must offer DFK and OWO as standard (if they ask extra for it, and management knows about it, they are warned only one time. 2nd time they can go!) , and most of the girls offer CIM, CIF and A-level if you are willing to pay extra for this, but all in all for me this results in a 90% score of good sessions when I go there.

Of course focus in the FKKs is purely on sex, little relax in between, but then sex again (I Love it!) , but if you want a more relaxig and cultural environment, and also have some non-sex quality time with a beautiful woman on your side, visiting Kiev (and other cities) is a better choice and has a more relaxing atmosphere, and as said, you better find a non-pro girl on the street / shops / restaurants / bars / etc before going to pay for it. It seems Club Caribean still has a mix of "regular" and "pros" being present, so you can then always decide what you want.

[QUOTE=Liljoey; 1175772]Trip for Weekend Aug 31 – Sept 6.

I am confronting the age old question of FKKs vs Kiev in designing my next trip. I'm undecided as to the best course for my upcoming trip on the Labor Day holiday weekend of Aug 31 – Sept 6. I have already booked my flight arriving in Frankfurt Sept 1 and returning from Frankfurt Sept 6. But I am torn between staying for all five nights of the long weekend in Frankfurt, or flying to Kiev for a visit from Sept 2 – 5, which will leave me with only the first night and the last night in Frankfurt, and three nights in Kiev in between.

The reason for my indecision is because of my reactions to what happened on my last recent trip to Kiev and Frankfurt for the weekend of July 1 – 5.

MY LAST TRIP: KIEV: The trip to Kiev was awesome. I had amazing sex with one of my favorite girls from Rio on Friday night, then on Saturday night I was with Alexandra, a new girl from Rio, and then Sunday I spent a wonderful 3 afternoon hours in bed with Alina, a sexy blond from vodkaescorts, and topped it off with an incredible 3 hour duo experience with my favorite Rio girl, together with Gella, a really cute blond, who was a new girl there. It was a great weekend filled with a total of 12 hours of very good sex at the $100 / hr rate and loads of awesome visual memories to savor until my next visit to Kiev.

MY LAST TRIP: FKKs: On the way back home, I spent the night of July 4 in Brussels and sampled the offerings of the red light district there on Aerschot Street alongside the Gare du Nord, and the next day I stopped in Frankfurt on July 5 and spent an amazing afternoon with three hot Romanian girls at FKK Oase which still has my head spinning. The three sessions at Oase were a total of four hours for 400 Euro plus the 65 Euro entrance fee, with the total cost in dollars for the four hours of bliss being approximately (465 Euro =) $650.

COSTS: Clearly, when one is considering large amounts of p4p sex over a weekend, an important aspect to consider is that the rates are much cheaper in Kiev than in the Frankfurt FKKs. For the 12 hours of sex that cost $1200 in Kiev, one would have to pay 1200 Euro, or $1684 USD in Frankfurt FKKs for the same amount of time.

BEAUTY: At the FKKs, the girls are mostly hot girls, definitely doable for the most part. I am partial to the dark-haired swarthy-looking girls from places like Romania and Bulgaria, who tend to have very sexy, sculpted hard—bodies. So I am a happy—camper in the FKKs where there are many such girls. Of course, at Oase I also saw the beautiful and sexy, Nina, a home—grown German blond sex machine. There are often very pretty Polish blondes there as well. But somehow, when I consider the Ukrainian hotties I have been fucking from Rio strip club, I personally feel that the Kiev girls are more consistently beautiful and more generally, on a higher level of looks than the FKK girls, but this is subjective, of course.

SERVICE: In this area, I feel that the FKK girls, in general, provide better service on a more consistent basis. The uncovered blow job is standard in the FKKs, whereas in Kiev, there is no guarantee of an uncovered blow job, or a concept of a 'standard service' that includes it. Each girl in Kiev is different, and an uncovered blow job must be agreed to separately.

NOTE: FKK standard session is supposed to include uncovered blow job, however, some girls have taken to trying to charge another 50 Euro for it as an 'extra, ' a practice we must unilaterally reject because it will ruin something that was great about the FKKs. The best way is to side—step the issue by telling the girl that instead of paying her 100 Euro for a 30 minute session with uncovered blow job, you are prepared to give her more time and pay her the 100 Euro for an hour session but only, of course, if the blow job is uncovered, and no more of this nonsense about extras. Most of the time it works for me, and if it doesn't, I pass on doing a session with such a girl charging as an extra for a service that was always considered included in the standard session. Of course, if you are a guy who doesn't want to spend 100 Euro for an hour session, this won't work for you, and you should pass on that girl.

ENVIRONMENT: I include this as a factor to consider because there is nothing quite like the impact of the environment of an FKK! When you walk into a room filled with gorgeous naked women, all wanting sex with you, just for the asking, it is a shocking, mind—blowing, truly unique experience, that cannot be rivaled. You will not find anything in Kiev to compare with this aspect. The FKK is a heady, sexual, hedonistic extravaganza, that has to be experienced to understand it, because words cannot capture the feeling of it adequately. I have compared it to having an open pass to go to Hugh Heffner's Playboy Mansion, where Centerfold models lounge around the pool and the grounds, and that you can also have sex with as many of those hot girls as you want, effortlessly. In Kiev, you have to do a lot more work to get good pussy into your bed.

SEXUAL CAPACITY: An important consideration is one's own sexual capacity. In the environment of the FKK, one can quickly become sexually exhausted. There is a limit on how many times a man can ejaculate in one day, and a limit in how long a man may be able to continue to maintain erections in order to perform sex, even with the assistance of pills like Viagra or Cialis. And multiplying the effects of having a lot of sex, by trying to do it for many days in a row, one after the other, one will certainly reach one's limit rather quickly in an FKK environment – a few days for most men. Since there is a separate entrance fee of 65 or 75 Euro to be paid when entering the FKK, it is to one's advantage to have as much sex as possible in each visit, to amortize the entrance cost over more sessions, which brings down the net cost for each session. Let's say, you're an average 47. 53 year old, and you can ejaculate 3 or 4 times a day, without too much problem, but at the FKK you're going to try to do this for a few days in a row on a weekend vacation. You will most likely find that you reached a saturation point for sex after a few days, and you won't even want to go have more sex. What you will feel you want most – is a rest! So for most men, it is best to break up visits to FKKs to no more than a few days at a time, unless you are a unique sexual amazon.

WHO WINS? : So with regard to the above considerations, Kiev wins when it comes to lower costs cumulatively and overall. (But FKKs win when it comes to unit cost, because in FKKs you can be with a girl for only half an hour at a cost of 50 Euro, whereas in Kiev you are required to go for an hour session for the most part, and in Rio there is a three hour minimum with each session). Kiev also wins when it comes to beauty. On the other hand, FKKs win when it comes to being assured of good service, including uncovered oral sex, as in Kiev this depends on each girl, although most of the girls that I have been with in Kiev did great uncovered blow jobs without even being asked. And FKKs win when it comes to sexuality of the environment. Kiev is merely a nightcub or strip club scene, or on the street, or outcalls to your apartment.

MY CONCLUSION: I think they both have their strong and weak points, so what I have done as a compromise, is to combine the two. I like to start in Frankfurt FKKs for a frenzied day or even two days, to get the edge off. And then, go to Kiev for the sex—weekend where the goal is to get the most beautiful girls possible to share my bed, and then return home by way of Frankfurt for a final FKK fling to bang as many hotties as is possible. So far, this approach has worked well for me. So that's probably what I'll do this time too.

LJ[/QUOTE]