Kyiv

[QUOTE=Sorbonne; 1188550]I thought this may be of interest to readers of this thread. Compare Ukraine with other FSU states. Smily.

[url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-14489883[/url][/QUOTE]Cool link, thanks. My personal favorite place, Uzbekistan, is among the lower three FSU countries in term of GDP per capita, more than half as many compared to Ukraine.

It was nice to see all the interest in my post. After speaking with another member in person (Dtraveler) , I realized my mistake was in fact running out of money, had I just had another 20 bucks I could have seen the night through, but as I said I had little experience and was using plastic as the back up and I did go to 4 places that night.

Just to let you all know, I was "rebuking, being dominant, showing who was boss" thats why I was telling her off and explaining how she was ignorant about credit and insulting me by even questioning my funds. But the fact of the matter was I was out of money, I didn't man up and say "ok ok lets go back to my place and ill give you X-amount" I should have just done that seeing she was a ***** after all.

Someone mentioned the internet is better so which site? I tried mamba w little success. Also someone mentioned that minsk and spb and moscow Kiev are no good nowadays. So where then, tell me please. Ill go there next year, and is kharkov all its cracked up to be?

Next time ill bring better clothes and more "grana" when I go out. I know how to be the man but I just need to have the benjamins or whoever that chick is on the 200 ghrivna bill, and ill be alright I think, but again what site?

I agree with you absolutely! That is the bastard game! A game that works if any young woman in the surroundings is good for the man: I think Slavic men don't mind about any features of the woman they are in front of.

I would like to ask your opinion about two remarks:

- you bought champagne in Minsk. You usually buy champagne also in your own country?

- if a man is very selective about women, how can the bastard game work?

[QUOTE=East Explorer; 1188428]This report reminds me of when I was for the first time in an FSU country 9 years ago. I had no clue about FSU girls and spoke just a few words of Russian. The only difference was that it was much easier to pick good looking freebies than it is now. I could just stay at the bar and girls would come and pull me to the dance floor. Those paradisiacal times are gone. (Especially in cities like Kiev, Moscow, SPB, Minsk or Riga)

Some years ago I had an interesting experience in Minsk with an expat who was working there. We went to a rather posh nightclub where we had booked a table. After a while we spot 2 girls at the bar and invite them to our table for some Champaign and cocktails (a brunette and a blonde, both 19 years, slim and tall). My friend is going for the blonde (as always) and has a great time with her. I take the brunette, but she seems to be rather spoiled and not interested into have a good time. So I go to the dance floor, and start to dance with some other cuties that were looking at our table. After some fun I return to our table to tell my friend that I will leave for another girl. My friend (who speaks perfectly Russian) is looking at me and then starts to shout with the brunette because she does not show enough respect me. He is telling her to change her behavior or to leave immediately our table. I was feeling kind of sorry for her, but my friend told me to relax. Guess what! After 5 minutes the brunette was hanging on my neck! After one hour we were together in my apartment!

That what Prosal is writing about FSU girls is absolutely right. If you are in an FSU country you have to reset your brain and forget everything you have learnt about (western) girls. In an FSU country you are the man and always have to prevail. She has to feel that she is always depending on you and never that you are depending on her. You can be nice to her but always rebuke her if she is not behaving according to your expectations. And if she does not agree, then to hell with her! There are many others girls who will be happy to meet you.

Of course this requires some experience in handling FSU girls. You have to show girls that you have an overwhelming self-esteem. You have to be able to interpret what girls think and want. And in my experience, if you speak some Russian, they will respect you much more.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Bbilly;1188948]Also someone mentioned that minsk and spb and moscow Kiev are no good nowadays. So where then, tell me please. Ill go there next year, and is kharkov all its cracked up to be?[/QUOTE]If your Russian sucks or is non-existent, you'll struggle to find non-pro opportunities in Harkov. Even everyday life might be difficult. You can survive quite easily in Kiev (or Piter and Moscow for that matter) with only English. But in provincial Ukraine, not so.

Hi, I've recently joined this site after coming across it. I've read a lot of reports about Mamba, Rio, et al. Lots of testimonies of great finds on mamba and stories of 8-10 rated girls from Rio. But no one ever seems to share details of the girls they've met. No real mamba URLs. And it baffles me as to why. If these girls are truly great finds then share their pages so others can benefit. As for the 8-10+ rated girls, I understand a lot of girls would not want their photos taken, but looking through the photos linked to some postings and I've yet to see a photo of anything above a 3-5 rating.

As I am heading to Kiev this week I contacted a lot of girls on Mamba that looked pretty decent. Instantly most responded with prices & a number even though not requested. So I assume most girls on there are working. Would be interested to know if anyone has met any of these girls and whether they are genuine. Some have dual profiles with different photos, some are different girls with the same number. The prices are as they quoted in their replies.

Name English Price Number.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=626904476[/url] Alika Yes $100

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=675199915[/url] Alochka No 700 38-068-258-47-55.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=672734318[/url] Lena No 600 38-095-370-07-03.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=671722251[/url] Lena No 600 38-095-370-07-03.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=675585346[/url] Sasha No 800 38-068-258-47-80.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=669828041[/url] Alina No 350 38-067-262-19-12.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=673739210[/url] Helen Yes 600 38-093-606-50-51.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=670045652[/url] Masha Yes $100

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=671217169[/url] Margot Yes 800

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=671152871[/url] Amina Yes

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=673451795[/url] Liza Yes $100 38-093-022-41-78.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=655824157[/url] Olya Yes 38-067-157-61-71.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=669979779[/url] Jeanne Yes 800 38-063-573-67-93.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=675609726[/url] Sabrina Yes $80 38-067-283-36-36.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=581106127[/url] Marina Yes $200 38-050-302-11-26.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=675957115[/url] Mika Yes 38-067-283-36-36

[QUOTE=Malakai; 1189243]Hi, I've recently joined this site after coming across it. I've read a lot of reports about Mamba, Rio, et al. Lots of testimonies of great finds on mamba and stories of 8-10 rated girls from Rio. But no one ever seems to share details of the girls they've met. No real mamba URLs. And it baffles me as to why. If these girls are truly great finds then share their pages so others can benefit. As for the 8-10+ rated girls, I understand a lot of girls would not want their photos taken, but looking through the photos linked to some postings and I've yet to see a photo of anything above a 3-5 rating.

As I am heading to Kiev this week I contacted a lot of girls on Mamba that looked pretty decent. Instantly most responded with prices & a number even though not requested. So I assume most girls on there are working. Would be interested to know if anyone has met any of these girls and whether they are genuine. Some have dual profiles with different photos, some are different girls with the same number. The prices are as they quoted in their replies.

Name English Price Number.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=626904476[/url]

Alika Yes $100.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=675199915[/url]

Alochka No 700 38-068-258-47-55.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=672734318[/url]

Lena No 600 38-095-370-07-03.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=671722251[/url]

Lena No 600 38-095-370-07-03.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=675585346[/url]

Sasha No 800 38-068-258-47-80.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=669828041[/url]

Alina No 350 38-067-262-19-12.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=673739210[/url]

Helen Yes 600 38-093-606-50-51.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=670045652[/url]

Masha Yes $100.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=671217169[/url]

Margot Yes 800.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=671152871[/url]

Amina Yes.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=673451795[/url]

Liza Yes $100 38-093-022-41-78.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=655824157[/url]

Olya Yes 38-067-157-61-71.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=669979779[/url]

Jeanne Yes 800 38-063-573-67-93.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=675609726[/url]

Sabrina Yes $80 38-067-283-36-36.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=581106127[/url]

Marina Yes $200 38-050-302-11-26.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=675957115[/url]

Mika Yes 38-067-283-36-36[/QUOTE]From my experience, VAST MAJORITY of any adult provider on the internet are using fake pictures. A combination of two things mainly:

1) it seems that most girls even if beautiful are too "reserved" to post their real pics on the internet.

2) the other portion would be belonging to agencies who are out there to scam newbie foreigners.

Mumba can be a gold mine for finding relatively cheap, amaturish and cute find. But I'm afraid they require quite a bit of hit and miss / time and effort.

In my opinion, you can surely check it out. But don't waste too much time on it. Girls that you can see in the flesh are all over the place and most of them if not straight up hookers are looking for some sponsorship arrangement with foreigners. They all know what brings you there, and it surely isn't visiting memorials and churches.

So they surely know what the deal is.

[QUOTE=Acolonizer; 1189079]- you bought champagne in Minsk. You usually buy champagne also in your own country?

- if a man is very selective about women, how can the bastard game work?[/QUOTE]In an FSU country you can't go wrong with champagne. In western Europe I would rather take a beer.

Being a "Bastard" with girls is not necessarily something bad in an FSU country. It's basically all about been self confident and straightforward. Of course if you want to go for a 9 you need to have other attributes like appearance, style, charisma, humor or Russian language skills and be prepared to invest time and money.

Going to share some Rio experiences since someone requested.

SOFIA.

I went out with here the 1st night. A very good looking blonde, around 1, 65-1, 70m. She's kind of flirty when dancing and will be the type which makes a lot of eye contact and smile (a lot of dancers are very cold and never give you a look ).

Since she was the hottest at that moment I decide to call her after seeing all the rotation of girls.

Claimed to be 20.

English (7/10)

At first conversation went smoothly. Of course when I say 7/10 I'm comparing it with other girls (a lot don't speak a word!) , so don't expect a fluid conversatoin. 7/10 means she will understand basic sentences and maybe a couple of jokes and can talk some phrases herself.

Face (9/10)

Beautiful blue eyes. When you get her close, you can see some imperfections on her skin but nothing gross.

Body (9/10)

Totally my type, nice tits, slim, nice ass.

Attitude (7/10)

After she's cool and smily, I'll give more details after.

Fuck (3/10)

She's kind of lazy and has really little interest in pleasing you. Despite going down on her, she would just do an average covered BJ, not put much effort when she's up on you. She's also kind of hard to please (I consider myself decent in bed and most women I'm with reach an orgasm, but this one was a tough nut to crack). She has a sensitive clitoris so if you go hard on clitoris she will complain and ask to slow down but if you go softly, she just won't show any sign of pleasure.

For those who still want to fuck her (because she's hot) , she seems to enjoy being fingered and pulling the back hair of her head.

When I requested doggy style, she said she didn't like that position and I'm stupid and didn't insist, should have banged her.

MARIA.

A beautiful 1. 70 brunette. Claimed to be 24. Told me she has been working there for a month.

English (6/10)

I'm not a native english speaker so she would say that she has a hard time understanding me. Despite that fact, I was able to communicate decently with her. If you speak slowly, she will understand most of it.

Face (8, 5/10)

Once again beautiful blue eyes and nice factions. Some little imperfections when close to her but she's pretty.

Body (8, 5/10)

Everything natural, she's not very tight but not fat either. I like her body. Tight pussy also.

Attitude (9/10)

She's a cool girl and fun to talk with.

Fuck (6, 5/10)

When I went down on her, she would put her hands in the way. I was like WTF in my head. I just gently grab her hands and put them away, she wouldn't resist it and enjoy it. Afterwards, I asked her why would she do that.

She said " I don't know, I've been working in this for little time, shouldn't you wear a condom for your tongue?", I loled inside even she actually has a point. I just told her " nah, don't worry. Oral sex has very few risk, and the risk on me" which is not actually true but this way she would just stop worrying and focus in enjoying. After that you can imagine that her blowjob was with condom of course LOL tough she did a little bit of balls licking. I cum (her BJ was nothing spectacular to be honest, but I hadn't have sex nor wanked in 3 days) and then we proceed to fuck again after a while. She was cool, put some enthusiasm and ended up doggy style which is her favorite position.

So I give 6, 5 cause no girl for me will exceed 7 for me without a BBBJ, but overall was a decent fuck.

MARGARITA

I noticed her the same night I went out with Maria. She's a tall stunning brunette. Claims to be 19.

English (4/10)

She speaks some, but for her to understand you, you have to speak veeery slowly, and she keeps you saying things in Russian which I find annoying. However she's amused by the fact that you find it annoying LOL.

Face (10/10)

I never tought I'll give a 10/10 as I'm very picky but she really deserves it. Usually when you get close to the girls, they look less good and you notice the imperfections. With her it was the contrary : she looks even better and you just notice how perfect she is.

Beautiful factions, teeth, eyes, nose, everything. And a super charming smile. Probably one of the most beautiful girls I've been close to in my life.

Body (8, 5/10)

I actually haven't fucked her since she unfortunately doesn't go out for sex. You can see her dancing at the VIP section (never saw her outside despite she told me she actually does). She has a well proportioned body with normal sized boobs, and a nice ass.

When I asked her if she had tought about modeling, she said she was too fat LOL. Of course she's not fat at all, but maybe she's right that if she was closer to be anorexic, she could be working as a model. Her ass seems tight but altough being good looking, don't expect a stunning ass brazilian style.

Also I'm not much into very tall girls so maybe someone would give her a better score.

Attitude (8/10)

She's fun and smiles a lot but language is a barrier. Also she wouldn't be that comfortable with much touching as with the 2 others girls, but that's normal since she's just a dancer and doesn't actually have sex.

Anyway she asks me gently to not massage her neck, but you can still touch her or grab her, she's not bitchy at all. It's just I'm a horny guy and I kind of like to kiss necks or get close to women and she's not the perfect one to do that.

Fuck

No fuck possible, at least w me.

So if you're into private dances (which I hate and don't do) and tall girls, you might try her as I think you will agree w me she's by far the most beautiful girl in the club although you might find she doesn't have the best body.

-

I would appreciate if someone would indicate me good BBBJ's experiences in or outside Rio.

Cheers,

[QUOTE=Malakai; 1189243]Hi, I've recently joined this site after coming across it. I've read a lot of reports about Mamba, Rio, et al. Lots of testimonies of great finds on mamba and stories of 8-10 rated girls from Rio. But no one ever seems to share details of the girls they've met. No real mamba URLs. And it baffles me as to why. If these girls are truly great finds then share their pages so others can benefit. As for the 8-10+ rated girls, I understand a lot of girls would not want their photos taken, but looking through the photos linked to some postings and I've yet to see a photo of anything above a 3-5 rating.

As I am heading to Kiev this week I contacted a lot of girls on Mamba that looked pretty decent. Instantly most responded with prices & a number even though not requested. So I assume most girls on there are working. Would be interested to know if anyone has met any of these girls and whether they are genuine. Some have dual profiles with different photos, some are different girls with the same number. The prices are as they quoted in their replies.

Name English Price Number.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=626904476[/url]

Alika Yes $100.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=675199915[/url]

Alochka No 700 38-068-258-47-55.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=672734318[/url]

Lena No 600 38-095-370-07-03.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=671722251[/url]

Lena No 600 38-095-370-07-03.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=675585346[/url]

Sasha No 800 38-068-258-47-80.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=669828041[/url]

Alina No 350 38-067-262-19-12.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=673739210[/url]

Helen Yes 600 38-093-606-50-51.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=670045652[/url]

Masha Yes $100.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=671217169[/url]

Margot Yes 800.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=671152871[/url]

Amina Yes.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=673451795[/url]

Liza Yes $100 38-093-022-41-78.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=655824157[/url]

Olya Yes 38-067-157-61-71.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=669979779[/url]

Jeanne Yes 800 38-063-573-67-93.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=675609726[/url]

Sabrina Yes $80 38-067-283-36-36.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=581106127[/url]

Marina Yes $200 38-050-302-11-26.

[url]http://www.mamba.ru/anketa.phtml?oid=675957115[/url]

Mika Yes 38-067-283-36-36[/QUOTE]Malakai, I wanted to respond to you, because I see that you have made some effort investigating things, are trying to contribute something, and you are not just being lazy to ask for spoon fed assistance without lifting a finger to read the forum and learn the information already posted there previously thru significant investment of effort and time by writers on this thread.

Your desire to systematize the links to girls on mamba. Ru in order to make it easier for mongers to know who the good ones are, and so as to be able to comment on each of them for the benefit of others, is admirable. Having a girl database upon which to draw for reliable results to have cheap but fabulous sex with beautiful young Ukrainian hotties is a monger's utopian dream.

SHIFTING SANDS: Unfortunately, the girls and agencies using "bait and switch" tactics on mamba. Ru, who are doing so for the express purposes of deceiving the mongers perusing the ads, have anticipated your desire and have long since taken steps to prevent us from figuring out who's who and what's what on mamba. Ru. Remember that a cheat can only be as successful as the confusion surrounding her ruse is. So to confound your efforts at sorting out the truth on mamba. Ru, the individual girls and the agencies advertising on mamba. Ru employ tactics like posting multiple simultaneous profiles as well as frequently deleting profiles. It is easy for them to do this because the profiles do not need to bear any real relation to the girls which will come to your doorstep because the ads are in most cases using fake pictures. Because of this dedicated attempt to create the confusion that helps obscure the "bait and switch" girls from exposure, it would be a very challenging task to keep up with the constant changes, as well as figure out which new profile can be related to the previous profile of the same girl so that the comments about her can follow her for the benefit of the monger community's information. The ads on mamba. Ru are therefore shifting sands, and I have come to the conclusion that, regrettably, it is folly to try to build an accurate and up-to-date data base or listing to guide the monger community as to who can be reliably chosen on that internet site.

The only hope we might have had of creating some order out of the confusion would require an immense amount of cooperation amongst us, the monger community, and a willingness to share, in a concerted effort to bypass the internet ads, by obtaining the personal email addresses and / or phone numbers of the actual girls we have seen which were pretty and provided good services along with our comments, and to gather them and post them on a thread on this forum, or to create a separate website with such information databased there, offering free ads there to the good girls that we found. I doubt this is achievable because it would require a coordinator from amongst us to take up the project, which is lacking given that the idea has been floated before, with no takers, and more importantly the EE mentality of those posting on mamba. Ru, is probably not capable of grasping the concept that good advertising and providing a good service are a better recipe for capitalistic success than the screw-the-foreigner mentality that inspires the bait and switch business model now employed.

So what you are left with, dear fellow monger, is the current situation, where each monger must start from the beginning and re-invent the wheel. You will need to simply put in your own time, as we all have, and try your best to efficiently go through meeting with as many of the girls from ads that appear promising to you, (that actually respond to you when you arrive in Kiev and try to contact them) , and then send away the girls who show up that aren't good looking enough, until someone that you consider worthwhile finally shows up at your door. Yes, there will be a collosal waste of time. But that's the situation with using internet sites in Kiev.

QUESTION: So what is the reason to go thru all this waste of time?

ANSWERS:

1) DAYTIME ACTIVITIES IN KIEV:

-Well, for one thing, a reason to pursue options on mamba. Ru is that, during the daytime, the options of the nightclubs like D'lux, Buddha Bar, Arena, Shooters and all the others, as well as the strip clubs like Rio are not available, as they are not yet open for business. Rio opens at 8pm. Therefore, for daytime exploits why not use your time in Kiev for investigating girls from mamba. Ru?

-You should also consider trying top-modals. Com, a website that I have gotten girls who posted real pictures from in 2010 (I don't know the current status, but it's worth a try at least as much as mamba. Ru) , and for this reason I think it might be different from the rest of the internet websites in that there may be real picture girls advertising there.

-You can also try going to girl apartments during the daytime.

[Note: I have written in prior posts about the recommendation of bringing along a prepared list of questions and answers in Russian / English printed out to assist you in communication with the girl or manager concerning services, times and prices, since this way so you can simply point to the question and the responder can point to the answer. And the suggestion is to get to these apartments by asking a taxi driver if they knew where the girl apartments were and, for security purposes, hiring them to take you and stay with you until you found what you were looking for, and / or perhaps taking the girl back to your apartment if take out is allowed. There was a cautionary note posted some time back about some taxi drivers saying they were afraid to do this because police making a bust at some apartments and arresting some taxi drivers. I do not know the outcome or current status of this issue, because I have not been back in Kiev since I heard of it. But for caution sake, for anyone wanting to try girls in apartments where Ukrainian guys go, you should at least make some inquiries of several taxi drivers to see if there is any perception of danger amongst them. ]

-Alternatively, during the daytime you can wander the malls, shops and streets trying to pick up girls that you see with your own eyes meet your approval as to their level of good looks.

2) COST CONSIDERATIONS:

-A further reason to try your hand at finding some decent girls on mamba. Ru, as well as top-modals. Com, is that they are websites where the prices for girls are in many cases quite low. Girls are advertising hourly rates like 400 UAH ($50 USD), 600 UAH ($75 USD) and 800 UAH ($100 USD). So if you require or desire to have inexpensive costs for p4p during your visit to Kiev, then websites like mamba. Ru and top-modals. Com are indispensable for such efforts. The price is advertised and therefore is known for certain in advance, while the girl's appearance is the unknown factor.

-The exact opposite is the case regarding trying to find girls in the streets, shops and malls, where the girl's appearance is the known factor, but her price, if any, is the unknown. And you also don't know if she is a girl who is interested in p4p at all. With these uncertainties, and the fact that you surely don't want to get your face slapped, or worse, by propositioning the wrong girl, it is best to pursue such girls from the streets and shops as freebies, and wait for them to raise the issue of price. But of course you will not be able to know what kind of price will be demanded at the end in this way, after significant investment of time, but this is the necessary uncertainty in pursuing this course. You will have to be prepared to pony up the amount demanded if you want the girl, and she may ask for more than $100 USD per hour. Therefore, this is not the best way of efficiently obtaining low cost (under $100 USD) p4p as a guaranteed result, so if low cost is a crucial factor to you, you might prefer trying your luck on mamba. Ru and top-modals. Com where the price is fixed in advanced.

-A girl apartment is an option where both the price is known in advance, and the girl's appearance is known in advance. The only unknown factor is the girl's services and performance, but since that is an unknown factor for all the options of finding p4p girls, it is not a factor in recommending a particular way of finding p4p over another way.

HOW TO HANDLE YOURSELF IN DEALING WITH THE BAIT AND SWITCH ISSUE:

One monger suggested in a prior post some months back that we should fight fire with fire and that because too often ugly girls who spoke no English were showing up at his apartment in response to internet ads depicting pretty, sexy English-speaking girls, that in order to lessen the waste of his time, he felt it was fair to make simultaneous dates for several girls to show up at the same time, with the intention that if any of them was good, he would take her and send the rest packing. Sounds reasonable in light of the contempt for us displayed by the bait and switch agencies routinely sending ugly girls in response to ads for pretty girls. In this way you might cut down some of the time delay and waste by girls coming late and then finally an ugly girl shows up. But you might get more than one hot girl showing up at the same time. Lucky you! Can your dick handle the challenge if they both want to stay___LOL?

The other issue was whether to pay the taxi fare of the girls who were ugly and were being rejected and sent away. Various opinions have been stated on this forum, but to me it seems that if you want the agencies to continue sending girls for you to consider, that you should pay the taxi fare for a local ride (realize that if they ask for more than 50 UAH for taxi fare, its likely an attempt to scam you, as that should be enough to get to most places in the downtown Kiev they might be coming from. If they're coming from further away, they should've sent a more appealing girl, and the risk should be theirs). The decision of whether to pay taxi fare for a girl being rejected and sent away based upon her lack of good looks, should be a factor of how extreme a departure the girl who shows up at the door is, from the pretty girl in the ad. If the girl is very ugly or unappealing and is clearly a very large departure from the pretty girl in the ad, one might consider not paying the taxi fare, because whoever sent the girl displayed complete contempt for you as the customer in sending such a girl, knowing what your expectation was in light of the appearance of the girl in the ad they posted to which you responded. But realize that if you send away many girls and fail to pay taxi fare, that you will probably be blacklisted by that agency and they will not send to you girls anymore. It's probably better to call the number and demand to speak to the manager of the agency and have some "real" talk about cutting out the bullshit and stop sending ugly girls when you want a girl like the girl in their picture ad, and ask if they will send immediately their best 3 or 4 girls in a car for you to choose from. Maybe you will get some action and they will take you more seriously.

NIGHT OPTIONS:

Considering the situation, it is probably best for your nightime exploits to shift your focus away from mamba. Ru or top-modals. Com and direct your attention to the nightclubs or strip clubs, especially if you prize the possibility of bedding girls of very high level of good looks in the 8 to 10 range, unless you have a limitation as to cost for your p4p and must stay in the under $100 USD range. The uber-hotties in the nightclubs have been asking for $300 or $400 for an hour of their time, and perhaps some can be negotiated down to $200 USD / hr. Possibly the less spectacular looking girls can be had for less.

However, in the nightclubs there is also a lot of time waste, if you're looking for p4p, because one has to first figure out who are the p4p girls, versus the regular girls out for fun. I have tried Buddha Bar and D'lux and have not seen very many p4p girls there at the times of my vists, but other writers on this forum have written about a significant p4p presence. I don't know how much is wishful thinking and their imagination and how much is reality because I can't confirm it from personal experience which would at least include a conversation in which p4p cost was mentioned by the girl, but it stands to reason that all the River Palace girls must be going somewhere in Kiev to meet their customers, unless the rumors of most of them going to Moscow to work at places like Night Flight are true.

I think that the prices for p4p in the nightclubs are too high at even $200 USD / hour. If you're ready to pay such high prices for a very beautiful Ukraininan hottie you might meet in a nightclub, you might also consider all the internet websites with prices like 150 Euro to 200 Euro per hour and the like. It is an unknown because such prices are advocated by no one on this thread, but there may be a higher chance of encountering beautiful girls from internet escort sites charging $200 USD and higher than you can expect on mamba. Ru where the prices are much lower. But this can be an entirely erroneous assumption. The premise is untested and therefore is an unknown.

For these reasons I prefer the p4p possibilities available in the Rio strip club, because there it's like shooting fish in a barrel, the girls are all collected there for me to see and pick. I don't have to chase all over a nightclub. I can ask openly if a girl wants p4p and will go out of club with me with no untoward consequences. I can see the girl in advance and fool around with her in advance in a private dance. The price is controlled and fixed at a $100 USD / hour rate, although you must take at least three such hours minimum. And there are a decent number of girls in the 8, 9 or 10 range to choose from.

I have also had some luck with girls from vodkaescort.com which has some girls available for 3 hours at around $300 USD or 200 Euro, and the pics were true, although photoshopped. I have been with Julia, Inna and Alina, and all three were nice girls, sexy and pretty and I had a great time. I have never used Gia.com, which has true pics also, because I never found a girl on that site that I felt was appealing enough to justify their $180 USD/hr rate..

Other viewpoints: Some veterans have opined that since there is no way to know in advance if a Rio girl will give good GFE service and $300 is at risk, that maybe it's better to risk only $100 USD on a girl from mamba. Ru or elsewhere who admittedly also may or may not give good service, but then one lost only $100. Also one can have three girls at $100 versus only one chance for a GFE with a Rio girl for $300.

My opinion is that I value quality over quantity. I am not interested in three girls from mamba. Ru or the street where the likelihood of me meeting a beauty on the level of a 9 or 10 for $100 or less is next to impossible. To me the higher level of beauty that I can see and obtain in a date with a Rio girl outweighs all the bullshit I have to go thru to even get a mediocre girl on mamba. Ru. The efficiency with which I can vet and select a girl from Rio makes it a much prefereble method than trying to find girls on the street who I don't even know if they are interested in p4p and the process will take too long. To date I have not had a date with a Rio girl that I have not been happy with, although some girls have been much better than others, all have been adequate. Perhaps I have been lucky, or perhaps I have a good knack for picking the girls who have a good chemistry with me, and the skills to establish a wonderful repoire with the girls that inspires them to treat me nice. Whatever. It works for me. And I'm not crying at the risk of $300, because at this point I don't regard it as a risk, but rather as a challenge to my girl skills. If you can be satisfied with a more average type of nice looking girl, then maybe you can focus on the mamba. Ru method. If that was all I could expect from Kiev, I wouldn't bother with Kiev, and would certainly prefer the FKK clubs of Frankfurt, or the offerings of Vienna or Prague. For me, it is only the prospect of that most lovely creature, the classic 9 or 10 level beauty from Kiev, that outshines the hotties at the FKK's, and who is available at the low rate of $100 / hr, that draws me back here time and time again. And yes, at Rio, I don't even look at the girls who are not 8's. 9's or 10's.

FREEBIES:

The only thing sweeter than p4p with a Kiev 9 or 10 level beauty, is getting it for free. But that takes time to pursue, and I'm only in Kiev for a weekend of two or three nights at a time, so I don't bother with that. But for those that have the time, it is certainly a worthy pursuit to try to bed a 9 or 10 level Kiev beauty for free.

So if you are not interested in p4p, but rather you are interested in freebies, that is the reason to head out to the nightclubs at night and try your hand at that pursuit. Or look for your beauty at the shops and malls during the shopping hours. But you had better have game and style and ample money to achieve results on that level.

On this topic there has been much advice written on this thread on how to get the hottest girls in Kiev for free. You must dress to impress, have game and style and all the things you need to pick up and succeed with beautiful women in your own country of origin. You must project an image of wealth and power, be confident, humorous, speak Russian, and be good looking.

And now, from the most recent reports on this thread we learn some additional tidbits that are requirements to succeed with the peculiar mentality of the Eastern European woman from Ukraine or Russia. You must be a bastard, and a bad boy, able to dominate the EE woman and control her, as she wants to be controlled and dominated. No wussy Mr. Nice Guy, or she will eat you alive and spit you out and go on to the next guy. Sounds real wonderful, doesn't she? The ultimate user. But that's the diagnosis of the experts here on the forum of the EE woman that we're all running after, because of how hot her ass is. Well, to be honest, a description of us, with our monger intentions of just fucking our way through foreign countries like Conan the Barbarian, wouldn't sound too pretty either. We deserve each other, the EE woman and the monger. A match made in. ___well I won't finish the phrase because, well, you know.

And the best piece of advice I recently read on this thread, is how to get the hottest girls for free in any club. It's truly priceless:

[QUOTE=Stevie69;1188602]About little supermodels, in their minds, they hate being ignored, but they hate even more being the source of amusement. Sometimes, I pretend not to notice them, and they will pretend not to see me either, to the point of physically bumping into me to get my attention. When I do look, I usually give them a an admiring yet amused look, which says "yes, you look good, but really, it is funny that you would need to dress like that, and act like such a little *****". And when they dance for you, look and appreciate, wait until they finish, and go talk to them. Thank them for dancing so beautifully, and yes, perhaps offer a drink as a refreshment before the 5 minute mark if she agrees to dance for you (or with you) again. Anyway, I just wanted to concur that FSU women are strange for "western" standards in that, at first, do not really appreciate men who respect and care for them. You have to play this game in which you act like a bit of an jerk. I think you always have to act as if you have plenty of other opportunities, so you can dismiss them without any problem, and that YOU are in control, not them.[/QUOTE]

And then there was this gem:

[QUOTE=Prosal;1188266]+1. This is also my strategy. Obviously having a good time, drinking cocktails and enjoying myself as if I didn't have a care in the world. Ignoring most every girl in the place. Aloofness. Sooner or later you'll get attention. I can't count the times when in a FSU club, standing at the bar, a girl came and said me "You look mysterious, I had to talk to you". This is an effective tactic especially with the hottest girls, the kind who are used to getting hit on 50 times a night and rejecting all 50. Giving the girl the flattering impression that SHE scored a player. Girls like "Byronic" characters, or to reffer to Russian culture, modern Petchorins (A hero of our Time by Lermontov).[/QUOTE]

And there you have it from the experts! The way to score the hottest supermodels in a Kiev nightclub is to conspicuously ignore them!

Then they will come to physically bump into you to get noticed by you.

Of course, if your ignoring of the supermodels, gets ignored by them, and you go home emptyhanded, ___ well it probably must be because you're more of a dork than you thought. __LOL.

LJ.

Very informative Joey, thanks! I wish this forum had a sticky feature (like many other forums) so we could make information easier to find and obtain.

[QUOTE=Liljoey; 1189515]And then there was this gem:

LOL.[/QUOTE]Well, everybody has their own methods, but I am happiest and most successful sticking to mine (wink)

[url]http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?1474-Chisinau&p=438893&viewfull=1#post438893[/url]

[QUOTE=Liljoey; 1189515]Malakai, I wanted to respond to you, because I see that you have made some effort investigating things, are trying to contribute something, and you are not just being lazy to ask for spoon fed assistance without lifting a finger to read the forum and learn the information already posted there previously thru significant investment of effort and time by writers on this thread.

LJ.[/QUOTE]Great post! Very detailed and thanks a lot.

As for the shifting sands matter, as a lot have commented the pictures get re-used a lot for the fakes / bait+switch. A forum thread of agency numbers could be of some possible use as this number will change a lot less than a deleted profile. Just a thought.

I think I will give Rio a go, maybe try one or two mamba for experience sake.

[QUOTE=Malakai; 1189559]Great post! Very detailed and thanks a lot.

As for the shifting sands matter, as a lot have commented the pictures get re-used a lot for the fakes / bait+switch. A forum thread of agency numbers could be of some possible use as this number will change a lot less than a deleted profile. Just a thought.

I think I will give Rio a go, maybe try one or two mamba for experience sake.[/QUOTE]Also, the genuine girls on Mamba a unlikely to change their profiles so much so a forum thread of verified independents could work a lot better than an avoidance list.

[QUOTE=Prosal; 1189530]Well, everybody has their own methods, but I am happiest and most successful sticking to mine (wink)

[url]http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?1474-Chisinau&p=438893&viewfull=1#post438893[/url][/QUOTE]I never was in doubt of you, Prosal. Only in the ability of others to follow in your footsteps.

LJ

[QUOTE=Liljoey;1189653]I never was in doubt of you, Prosal. Only in the ability of others to follow in your footsteps.[/QUOTE]I recently made a video about "game".

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AOzkN8dHnjk[/url]