FKK Artemis - Berlin

[QUOTE=Ararat;1865045] I'm honestly thinking that this is the first nail in the coffin of the FKK-model (and the new law is of course expected to provide more of that). I don't share the laissez faire attitude of others here, at least not after today.[/QUOTE]I do not see that. Artemis had very strict and many rules and that may be seen as a proof of employment. Less rules, less problems for the club. Other clubs do have less rules, they also had their raids (smaller scale but same issues) and they are still open. When I was at World during a raid all the questions the tax department guys asked the girl where around the topic of self employment or not.

HB.

[QUOTE=Pistons;1865131]900 policement sounds a bit extreme yes. What did they expect to meet? Some enclave full of hells angels / romanian mafia alliance armed with guns? I think it will return, but they will have to meet newer stricter laws. Especially the tax evasion part is of key concern I think. And they want to know that the girls work on their own. Wonder how they can enforce that part though.[/QUOTE]It was not really about tax evasion by the girls. They have little room to evade taxes as most of them will be taxed on a lumpsum basis "per working day". The FKK notes their presence and takes a certain pre-agreed sum from them and pass that to the tax authorities.

The major thing in this raid (if I understood the news articles well) is about evasion of social security dues. The authorities seem to have build a strong case against Artemis. If Artemis is held to be the girls' employer it has failed to pay huge amounts of social security dues, pension plan payments, workers compensation premium, .

And while being there, they also checked for narcotics trafficking, pimping, money laundering, membership of criminal gangs, tax evasion, illegal aliens, .

Those who know their history will remember that Al Capone was finally put in jail for tax evasion and not for his many murders.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1865186]It was not really about tax evasion by the girls. They have little room to evade taxes as most of them will be taxed on a lumpsum basis "per working day". The FKK notes their presence and takes a certain pre-agreed sum from them and pass that to the tax authorities.

The major thing in this raid (if I understood the news articles well) is about evasion of social security dues. The authorities seem to have build a strong case against Artemis. If Artemis is held to be the girls' employer it has failed to pay huge amounts of social security dues, pension plan payments, workers compensation premium, .

And while being there, they also checked for narcotics trafficking, pimping, money laundering, membership of criminal gangs, tax evasion, illegal aliens, .

Those who know their history will remember that Al Capone was finally put in jail for tax evasion and not for his many murders.[/QUOTE]I like the current ownership, he run the club well and is nice guy, but tax thing can alter the ownership of the club. 23 million euro is hardcore sum to pay.

I just hope LU won't change that much as my favorite are there.

Plus, many girls do not tell their family about their job, so I hope this raid won't reveal their job at Artemis to girls family as that means / most likely no more of their presence in Artemis.

It is difficult to finish when you are surrounded by 900 servicemen and SWAT. Several months of investigation and trial. I doubt Artemis will reopen. 23 million Euro or prison for the Simsek brothers. NRW and Hessen next. Thank you for the memories.

Beautiful Mille from Cologne, I will miss you.

[QUOTE=Ararat;1865045]I think we are about to find out a lot about the inner workings of the clubs after this razzia. I'm honestly thinking that this is the first nail in the coffin of the FKK-model (and the new law is of course expected to provide more of that). I don't share the laissez faire attitude of others here, at least not after today.[/QUOTE]No cause for alarm. Prostitutes and punters are witnesses, not accused. The accusation is tax evasion by the owners, in part because the prostitutes are allegedly self-employed but de-facto they are employees of the establishment. There are raids like this all the time at construction sites, also often involving eastern-European workers. The Pussy Club in Heidelberg experienced something similar a while back. Did this in any way hurt honest clubs? No.

Once when I was at Mettmann, some people from the town council came by for a routine inspection. No problem.

Note that for many (most? All?) serious crimes, if there is a believable accusation, the state is required to investigate.

[QUOTE=Zimmerbaby;1865199]It is difficult to finish when you are surrounded by 900 servicemen and SWAT. Several months of investigation and trial. I doubt Artemis will reopen. 23 million Euro or prison for the Simsek brothers. NRW and Hessen next. Thank you for the memories.

Beautiful Mille from Cologne, I will miss you.[/QUOTE]Seriously? I hope it will re-open next week or even today. Is it open today?

I hope they won't goto jail, I only met younger one, but he seemed very nice guy and manage the girl well.

I hope it affect LU in positive way with more younger German girls than eastern Europeans who has been there for ages and are over 30 years old.

I don't know what to say about this.

I guess I was lucky I booked my next FKK trip to Frankfurt instead of Berlin.

I started my FKK career at Artemis and have so many good memories about it.

What if Artemis does not reopen? No FKK in Berlin?

[QUOTE=Guy93;1865220]I don't know what to say about this.

I guess I was lucky I booked my next FKK trip to Frankfurt instead of Berlin.

I started my FKK career at Artemis and have so many good memories about it.

What if Artemis does not reopen? No FKK in Berlin?[/QUOTE]I think it will re-open, but with different ownership. I mean can the brother pay 23 million euro?

Also it will re-open because Merkel knows she need FKK Artemis to attract some tourists, this is true LOL.

FKK Artemis is one of main tour attraction of Berlin and I think government knows that, they just do not admit this.

[QUOTE=Guy93;1865220]I don't know what to say about this.

I guess I was lucky I booked my next FKK trip to Frankfurt instead of Berlin.

I started my FKK career at Artemis and have so many good memories about it.

What if Artemis does not reopen? No FKK in Berlin?[/QUOTE]I know what to say about this: we are fucked in Berlin LOL.

[QUOTE=Zimmerbaby;1865199]It is difficult to finish when you are surrounded by 900 servicemen and SWAT. Several months of investigation and trial. I doubt Artemis will reopen. 23 million Euro or prison for the Simsek brothers. NRW and Hessen next. Thank you for the memories. Beautiful Mille from Cologne, I will miss you.[/QUOTE]American authorities have used these same tactics to shut down strip clubs around the country. As I said, our way of life is under siege!

Well I think some of us here on the forum has a pretty good idea about how this will turn out. As we probably have discussed things around this with the girls (me included).

Now one thing I do wonder is if employment like this is regarded as pimping. And if that will criminalise the owner. As far as I can tell, that could be the main problem here. Well, that and the money. Now, question is if somebody wants to buy Artemis and take over the club. Sounds like it is over and out for mr. Turkey.

Translated from Der Spiegel. The equivalent to Time Magazine in the US.

Raid in major Berlin brothel investigators speak of systematic exploitation.

After the raid on Berlin's largest brothel "Artemis" the prosecutor's office has details on the allegations mentioned. And speaking of organized crime. This is about evasion of social security contributions, exploitation and violence, said chief prosecutor Andreas Behm.

The focus would not only be petty, but deeds, which confirmed the "system of illegal environment". The women had been "kept and exploited a function". The operation was based on organized crime.

Behm made a comparison with the Mafia gangster Al Capone in Chicago of the Twenties. He had been charged with tax evasion, although the actual crime had played on a much more massive level.

"Certainly not violent".

According to investigators, there are direct links between the "Artemis" and the criminal motorcycle gang Hells Angels. Police, customs office and tax police assume that the brothel prostitutes were supplied by members of the Hells Angels.

The band had the "Artemis" operators with directly mediated women, in return, the rockers have enjoyed among others free admission, said chief prosecutor Sjors Kampstra. These contacts were "certainly not violent" expired. A woman was "so maltreated" was that she saw no way out but to call the police.

The women had not worked independently, but were dependent busy shared with the investigators. This is the pension insurance "cheated conservatively estimated at 17.5 million euros," said Michael Kulus from Berlin Hauptzollamt. Then there is the accusation of tax evasion.

The prostitutes were prescribed according to investigators working hours, prices and sexual practices. The arrested housekeepers had enforced the tight control system in everyday life. Therefore, I'm also the "classic red light offense of directing pimping" into consideration. Also, because trafficking is being investigated.

"You manage the crime and implement them".

According to prosecutors and police six "in charge of the brothel society 'Artemis' were arrested on Wednesday night, two operators and four so-called housekeeping establishment. In addition, assets had been seized in the value of 6. 4 million euros, including hundreds of thousands of euros in cash, cars and real estate.

96 prostitutes were previously interviewed. Overall, the police have found 232 people in the raid. 900 policemen, customs officers and prosecutors were on Wednesday evening and in the night to Thursday in use.

The prostitutes interviewed have admitted described conditions in the "Artemis" in large part, said prosecutor Michael Stork. "We can expect a confirmation of the alleged offense. " Many of the more than one hundred encountered Stringer had the system largely confirmed.

The adult women come Attorney Kampstra According mostly from Eastern Europe, Russia and Arab countries. About the arrested operators Kampstra said: "They are not the ones that get their hands dirty, they manage the crime and implement them. " Given the extensive seized documents and computer stand investigators now a Sisyphean task before before charges could be levied.

The "Artemis" was opened in 2005, in a multi-story former warehouse building in western Berlin on the highway near the fair grounds. Operation with saunas and swimming pool advertises aggressively in public. Advertising there were among other taxis and a few years on the buses of the Berlin Transport Authority (BVG). The company argued at the time: "The transport is not the moral guardian. " 2013 ended the BVG but this advertising.

I was planning to visit Artemis next week for 4 days and suddenly realised from the forum that there is a problem. Is it realy shut down for a non obvious time and what would the forum members comment the line up will go and any suggestions for alternative trip. Thanks.

Forget about Artemis next week. Lots of brothels in Berlin with better service. Create your own FKK Berlin. Nude thermas, amazing international restaurants, brothels, partytreffs, sexkinos. For FKKs, Frankfurt and NRW.

I have just arrived to see for myself. I'm happy to report the club is open! I don't know for how much longer though.

The parking lot feels likea post-apocaliptic film set.