Kyiv

[QUOTE=Liljoey; 1251303]Dave, I am answering your PM here in the thread, because I believe it will benefit the general readership to view our discussion.

[U]Best Place to Find the Girls For the Batchelor Party[/U]

A batchelor's party in Kiev is a great idea. But you have to be mindful of the risks to success, and the pros and cons of other options. As I stated in response to your PM, when arranging a batchelor's party for a buddy, the guys responsible need to make sure that everything will come off well and successfully, as a batchelor's party is a lifetime event amongst friends to be remembered.

So with your budget and goals, I will tell you what I know that is more or less a reliable given. Bottom Line: You won't be sorry if you go to FKK Oase or Palace, even if you only go or one day and night. And you won't be sorry if you go to Kiev and check out Rio strip club, and indulge in all the other options that Kiev has to offer, which are well described in the Kiev thread.

Happy Hunting,

LJ[/QUOTE]Liljoey, thank you very much for this and other great reports. You come across as no non-sense no drama guy. One who knows what you want and knows how to get it.

In Kiev, did you take any of these girls out to dinner and or touring / cafes during the day? Is it possible to do that without paying an arm and a leg?

What percentage of Rio and night club girls speak english?

[QUOTE=Vitrea; 1251345]Liljoey, thank you very much for this and other great reports. You come across as no non-sense no drama guy. One who knows what you want and knows how to get it.

In Kiev, did you take any of these girls out to dinner and or touring / cafes during the day? Is it possible to do that without paying an arm and a leg?

What percentage of Rio and night club girls speak english?[/QUOTE]I tried many times to get Rio girls to hook up with me during the daytime before their club work hours, not necessarily to feed them, but to come have sex at an earlier time during the day when I had more energy, so that I didn't have to wait until late at night in order to first take them out from Rio. Never was successful. The primary reason seems to be the lack of time for this in their schedules, although I have hypothesized that maybe they are warned off from doing dates during the day by their bosses at the club and they are afraid of crossing their employers on this, although I have suggested to them that they can certainly report any dates they do and pay into the club any portion due from it, so that it shouldn't make a difference to the club if they are honest about it. But none have agreed to it with me, although other guys have claimed success on this.

Consider that they work the entire night from 8:00 PM Rio club opening time until 5:00 AM club closing time, and then they must go home and get some sleep. Typically if they get to sleep by 6:00 or 7:00 AM they would like to sleep most of the day, so they can function at work at night. So they are not early risers, and usually come up for air around 3:00 to 5:00 PM after sleeping the whole day, and then they eat and get ready to go to the club for work again. There are also those that sleep less, and just get a few hours of sleep in the morning, before going to university for their classes and other stuff they must do, and these are the girls who are really functioning at the edge of exhaustion when you see them stripping at Rio. It has happened more than once that such a girl whom I have taken out of the club for a date, when she is at my apartment and it's 3:00 or 4:00 AM, and she gets into a relaxing type of mode on my couch or bed, she will easily be overcome by her fatigue. So keep them active and don't do stuff like let them lay on a bed while you massage their feet or head or anything in between, because it's a sure-fire recipe for them to fall asleep, or start feeling their inherent tiredness.

Percentage that speak English is hard to say. TOnly some are fluent in English. There are quite a few that only speak a few words and understand a bit more. But how much do you really need to speak? Well of course it's more enjoyable if you can converse and joke around. If you have been reading my prior posts adequately, you should know about my recommendation to have a data plan for your smartphone so that you can access a translation application on your phone when you need it to help communicate with a girl that is not good in English. I get Google Translate on my Blackberry. Another fellow showed me a Touch and Talk application on his iPhone which actually will listen to your spoken English and speak back a Russian translation, and vice-versa. So you can dare to hook up with girls who don't speak English well. If two people are having fun and have motivation to be together, then that is enough incentive to communicate by typing into a computer translation application like Google Translate. By the way in my laptop the full version gives a Russian letter keyboard for the girl to be able to type in Russian what she wants to say to you. I've been there done that in just this manner and it has been fine.

If you want to date girls and take them out to dinner and such, then Rio is really not the place to monger for that. But there are so many more girls in Kiev that would be so happy to have dinner with you, that the lack of Rio girls for this will be like a small blip on your pussy meter.

Are you talking about freebies, as in a normal date with a girl who you would like to wine and dine for the pleasure of her company? Are you kidding? There are girls all over the place that would enjoy being wined and dined. Not only in nightclubs and discos. Just roam the streets and shopping malls and start up with whomever you are attracted to. Use any of your lines that you usually use when starting up with a girl. Even simply asking them for help about something in the shop is enough to start a conversation. And it will not be long before you will have succeeded in having a conversation turn into an invitation to them to buy them a drink or a lunch or something. They love it when a seemingly wealthy man wants to spend money on them. Try to take out girls who seem like they are nice human beings.

But watch out for the serial daters and big users. They're all over the place too. Learn how to look at a menu in Russian. ALWAYS do the ordering yourself of the food and drink that they will be eating. DO NOT let them do it. Ask them what they want and after you have heard them, you interact with the waiter and keep control of the process. The wait staff should never be permitted to get the idea that you will pay for anything that you have not yourself ordered. This is sage advice that I have read on this forum and it makes sense to me. And you disregard it, it is at your peril, and you should not be upset if you receive a very large bill that you didn't intend to have.

My posts have not focussed on freebie dating because of the short nature of my visits to Kiev. And the lack of time to develop freebies into full relationships including sex. But there are a lot of posts in the Kiev thread and other threads in Russia about how to date Russian (or Ukrainian) women. You should read the thread and ask questions of those guys who have focussed on writing about freebies dating in Kiev. You may not be able to follow in the footsteps of these guys because you don't know how to speak Russian, or know much about the culture. But that's no reason to stop you in Kiev, the capital city, from approaching women the same way as you might anywhere. Many will speak enough English to speak with you. And it's ok to approach women far younger than you normally would also, as it seems quite acceptable for a girl in her 20's to be with a man that looks in his 40's, and similar. Let the girl be the one to reject you because she thinks you are too old for her. You just keep plugging away and hitting on the girls whose look you like, and if you are personable and seem cultured and nice, you will be surprised at how young the girls will be with whom you will be able to get dates. This is if you're an older guy, as are many of the mongers out there on this forum, who are post divorces and lots of life's baggage. But there are some quite young guys who have gotten into this hobby as well. So if you're a young fellow in your 20's, then go enjoy Kiev, as you are in an even better position to do so.

One of the big resources for dating girls in Kiev is mamba. Ru, a social website, where you can meet girls and arrange actual dates. Travelgirls. Com is another. Vkontakte is another. Etc etc all ok for regular online dating.

You have only asked about having dinners with girls so I'm not sure if you're interested in p4p. But if you are, mamba. Ru also has a fair number of girls on it, in Kiev at least, who explicitly say in their profiles "I am looking for a sponsor" or even more explicitly,"I offer sex for money". If you respond to those profiles, you can find girls who will agree to get into your bed immediately for sex for money, without going through the whole dating thing until you can get them up to your apartment. But you can also have dinner with them, as a way of getting to know them. Those girls looking for "sponsors" are in fact looking for a benefactor / boyfriend and long term sponsorship, even though they will also enter into a more transient sponshorship of only a night, or even 1 or 2 hours.

Good luck with your trip to Kiev.

LJ

Unfortunately, men use their penis to think, and beautiful women are already spoilt everywhere. It is years I repeat the same problem. Anyway congratulations for your taste. And don't be afraid if you don't find girls for the right price, because they never deserve huge money. Just leave them in their shitty attitude. It is clear all people who write here to pay high prices, they are pimps or pimps' friends. For your convenience, I have contacted providers asking 250$ per night.

[QUOTE=Ronaldinjo; 1251073]1. Buddha bar. Spoke to 3 girls in buddha bar. 2 of them 7/10, one 7. 5/10, in the beggining they demanded 300 bucks for 2-3 hours respectively, one of them 350, but in the end the came down to 250 for 3 hours. Maybe there was some lack of klients in that day, but all in all the seemed to me to professional and not that big chance of GFE. So I left. Although I saw one beauty about 8-8. 5/10, that was already taken by turk or italian I suppose. Didn't speak to her, unfortunately. More advantage, you can bye only beer for 50 gryvnas and drink it an hour if you wish, no pressure from the stuff. No need for extra tips. So the club has good potential, don't expect it to bee fool of beauties, it is not, but its possible to find 2-3 decent chicks with little investment.

2. Baltics. In my opinion people in baltic states are most good looking in the world, together with scandinavians, and girls are no exception. Although ukrainian chicks (together with latvo Russian mix) maybe have most beautifull faces in the world, baltic chicks (especially lithuanian (which have mixed with slavs over the centuries) and latvo. Russians, but not pure estonian) are next, but baltic chick have bodies, especially legs that are unmattched, they are just perfect, best in the world. They are a mix of scandinavian, germanic, baltic and slavic (mostly Russian / belorussian and Polish) blood, maybe that what makes them so hot. We had an unforgettable time in lithuania in 1997-2001, and latvia 2002-2004 and estonia (least of all). In lithuania mostly with freebies (prostitution is illegal there, so bad place for morgeners from the beggining, but in that time you could sponsor real stunners. 9/10 and 9. 5/10) , which were easy to catch that time and latvia both freebies and pros (when prostitution was legal then and riga was sex capital of europe). Unfortunately those days are over long time ago, standart of life in baltics are way better than in ukraine or russia, the girls were very much spoiled by foreigners (friends, be carefull not to pay chicks in ukraine more than they deserve, otherwise we are shooting ourselves in leg). But when I visited baltics recently the picture is changed, streets are empty of people (especially daugpilis, kaunas and klaipeda) , since gate for EU was opened a very high quantity of incredible girls left to USA, canada, britain, germany, france, spain, italy, scandinavia, some of them working as pros) , and take in mind that population in latvia or lithuania, not speaking about estonia is less than Kiev alone. So my advise, not to visit those contries now, scene is bad now for morgening, very bad. That paradise gone long time ago, really huge huge piradise that feels like a dream now. Eventhough in riga you can still find decent excort (with right connections) , but uncomparable to 1997-2004. Ukraine and russia are best places now, together with moldova (although quality of girls in moldova a way far from baltics). Friend, take good care about what is left, god knows how long it will stay like this, baltic lesson should teach all of us.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Liljoey; 1251303]Dave, I am answering your PM here in the thread, because I believe it will benefit the general readership to view our discussion.

[U]Best Place to Find the Girls For the Batchelor Party[/U]

A batchelor's party in Kiev is a great idea. But you have to be mindful of the risks to success, and the pros and cons of other options. As I stated in response to your PM, when arranging a batchelor's party for a buddy, the guys responsible need to make sure that everything will come off well and successfully, as a batchelor's party is a lifetime event amongst friends to be remembered.

That being the case, your concerns about the websites for escorts being mostly fake pictures in Kiev is a true and valid concern. On the one hand using these websites is the way to find hot girls in Kiev for $75 / hr or $100 / hr. And discounts for multiple hour sessions are routine. But one need only read this Kiev thread, as I'm sure you are aware that you must do if you are planning a batchelor's party in Kiev, (read the thread going back to at least March 2011, if you don't it's at your peril) , to know that anyone inviting girls from an escort website in Kiev has to go through a process of rejecting ugly or fat girl, after ugly or fat girl etc. That the agency will send to you, until perhaps at some point a girl who is decent looking enough to fuck will show up. This is decidedly not the way to go about staffing your suite with the very pretty honey's needed for a batchelor's party. It will be a disaster. And you will deserve it if you do it anyways, even after reading this. The only way I could even think of advising you to do such a thing is if you make a preliminary solo trip to Kiev and go through the process of checking out girls until you personally meet and fuck the girls you would deem adequate in terms of looks and service, and build up your own "little black book" with names, stats, and numbers of girls that would be known to you to be ok to invite to a batchelor's party. Then you can find the lower cost girls. Otherwise, disaster is waiting.

The only website which has been reported to use true pics is gia-escort. Com. However, they are pricey. But they list the services each girl provides, and provide escorts for 1 hour. 2 hours or 3 hours, and so are flexible. The few reports about them have been mostly positive in that the services advertised are provided. I have never used them because I have never found their girls to be beautiful enough to deserve the rates they want for a 1 hour date ($180) which is high for the Kiev market. Their best looking girls have high rates even for the three hour dates. Maybe you could negotiate with the managers something more reasonable if you find girls that are attractive enough to you and you are taking a few girls at one booking for a batchelor's party. It's worth an email to them to find out.

In my opinion, the Kiev option which has the most potential for success for a batchelor party, given that you have a budget of $300 to $500 per day for each guy, is to go to the Rio strip club. I have reported on this venue extensively, so assuming you will take my advice and read the thread, I do not need to repeat the information in detail. But it fits your requirements. Their minimum is a three hour date for $300. You will spend a bit more on drinks, private dances and admission. So your budget will work for this venue. In this club you will be able to see the bodies of the girls without clothes, so you will be able to see what you are getting before making any decision. You will be able to speak to the girls at your table and even make out with the girls a bit in the private dances, in order to assess their potential chemistry with you and their rapport with you, in terms of will they be a GFE date. So it is really the best environment you could get as a testing ground for making a decision. But even at Rio, it is not a guarantee on each particular girl's behavior and service level once you get back to your hotel or apartment. You need all your mongering skills to evaluate the different girls you will meet to make a decision on which girl to invite out with you. The methodology and approach has been described in prior posts. Each of you four guys will have to find a girl or girls to his liking who will agree to go out and seems to hold the promise of a GFE companionship. But it seems quite possible to succeed with a good batchelor party experience with girls from this venue.

By comparison, in certain nightclubs in Kiev that are attended by WG's, the prices have historically been higher than at Rio (the nightclub girls were asking for $400 / hour or $300 / hour, and sometimes in my experience the medium hot WG's could be negotiated to $300 / two hours). Also the girls are dressed, and you can't mess around with them in a private dance in advance, so you need to figure out if they will be a GFE by just how they speak to you, and you can asses their appearance by how they look clothed, albeit sexily dressed.

On the other hand, one advantage in a nightclub is that you will see them out in the lighting of the nightclub, which is more bright and revealing than the lighting in a strip club. More than one guy has remarked that a stripper who appeared as a goddess naked up on the stage in the strip club, looked much more ordinary in street clothes in the daylight outside the club.

Also, a recent visitor to Kiev reported that prices of nightclub girls may be coming down to a level more competitive to Rio's prices. Ronaldinjo just recently reported 3 hours for $250 being possible with several girls he spoke to at Buddha Bar. If this is true, and will be a sustained trend, it will mean that nightclub options like the Buddha Bar restaurant / bar or maybe even D'lux nightclub discoteque will become price competitive with Rio strip club, and thus become viable alternatives for mongering.

Despite this lower pricing trend at nightclubs, if it is true, I would probably still prefer mongering at Rio because of the "efficiency factor". By this I mean that there is a lack of efficiency in mongering at a nightclub due to the fact that you must first identify who is a WG, and who is a regular girl just out for fun, and then you must find out if she is negotiable to a reasonable price not to exceed $100 / hour. This will take a lot of time at a nightclub, and is much more efficiently achieved at Rio where the price is fixed at $300/3hours (a $100 / hr rate) and almost all the girls are WG's available for take out, which can be ascertained by asking them directly or asking a manager. Ostensibly, at a nightclub, one would assume that WG's would fairly quickly approach any business looking traveller / tourist who was unaccompanied at the nightclub. But I was at D'lux nightclub for several hours late on a Saturday night, and believe me, either there were no WG's there at the time of my visit (which is unlikely) , or they were there, but figuring out who they are is not as simple as you might think. So my opinion remains that rather than waste a lot of time at nightclubs in Kiev, when I'm there on a short visit and need to be certain of scoring each evening, I would get right down to business at Rio strip club where the prices, certainly of the hottest girls, were lower than the prices at the nightclubs. If I have a few more nights in Kiev, I would mix it up a bit and, in addition to the nights at Rio, I would also go to nightclubs to see what I could come up with there. But for purposes of a batchelor party, nighclubs are too "iffy", and you risk not getting the right girls to take home at a reasonable price.

If you have sufficient time in Kiev, however, there is no reason that you should not all try your hand at freebies too. There are the streets and shopping malls which are good places to start up with girls. There is a great nightlife in Kiev, and there are awesome looking girls all over the place. So depending on how many nights you will have in Kiev, you should definitely hit a place like D'lux on a weekend night where the DJ is rockin' and the girls are deliriously hot. There are many good nightclubs mentioned in the Kiev thread, including Arena, Shooters, Avalon, etc. Maybe one or more of you will succeed in picking up some pretty girls, and taking it all the way with them, and then you will have some "real" memories of Kiev, and perhaps girfriends to come back and visit in the future.

As I mentioned in my initial PM response, the best advice depends on me knowing what your goals are. Since you have said that you want to hang with friends in a hotel suite with the girls all together and then each guy would take a girl back to his own bedroom to party, it sounds like you need to be either in a hotel, or in apartment rentals that can accommodate this.

I think it would be wise to avoid going to Kiev during Easter in the beginning of April and during Euro 2012 in June, but a visit at end April should be ok.

You should click on my profile name on any post of mine and click to "View Forum Posts" and read my posts going back. There is much usefull info you will need. You should also read the full thread and the reports of others, because I did not focus on matters I deemed adequately covered by others, or on low end mamba. Ru action, or on freebie action.

Begin perhaps with this post:

[url]http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?816-Kiev&p=1235917&viewfull=1#post1235917[/url]

And read at least those reports referenced by Latexian in Reports of Distinction. That will get you started, but is no substitute for reading the thread.

THE FKK SEX WONDERLAND:

Lastly, I will propose to you an entirely different plan. It is based on my realization that in a short trip to Kiev, the variables and risks inherent in mongering in the various venues might produce results that are not as perfect and fullfilling as you had hoped. Therefore, I had devised for myself, and offered the advice for the others on the forum to consider, the concept of a "Sex Insurance Policy".

By "Sex Insurance Policy" I mean heading straight to an FKK in Germany (or Vienna) after a visit to Kiev. The truth is when I think of it, the place with the most certainty about guaranteed good GFE service, that includes uncovered BJ, otherwise known as OWO or BBBJ, is the FKK club where BBBJ is a standard part of service. By contrast, in Kiev, although you can get an amazing hot young girl to have sex with from Rio strip club, sometimes she will do BBBJ, and sometimes she will only do the BJ covered. It's difficult to know in advance. Additionally, at an FKK, you have a half hour option, which costs less (only 50 Euro at an FKK) , whereas in Kiev an hour is usually the minimum time unit. At an FKK you have an unbelievably sexy environment, with scores of hot girls walking around completely naked, and hitting on you to come have sex with them. It's entirely within the norm at an FKK that you will end up having awesome sex with many different girls multiple times. And you will fuck until your cash runs out, or your penis doesn't work anymore, whichever is sooner__LOL.

But an FKK is a fantasy land. And Kiev is a real world adventure. So it depends on what you will enjoy most. Perhaps you will decide to make an FKK tour for your batchelor party and give up the idea of Kiev. Perhaps you will do as I have been doing, and combine a trip to Kiev with a one night stand in FKK-land. Or perhaps you will stick to your original thought and come to Kiev to learn of its delights.

If you decide to incorporate the FKK experience in your plan, my favorites and recommended destinations to you for it, would be two of the best clubs in the Frankfurt, Germany area, FKK Oase (

[url]http://fkk-oase.de/[/url]

) [great especially in the good weather with an outdoor pool area] and FKK Palace (

[url]http://www.the-palace.de/[/url]

) [very nice facility]. Girls are mostly from Romania and Bulgaria, but there are also some blonde German and Polish girls, and even some latinas.

There is a dedicated thread on this forum for the FKK Clubs, so you would read those threads before you go. Here is a link that shows the location and address of all the FKK clubs in Germany, so you can begin your discovery of FKK-land:

[url]http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=210980961214256580520.00045d515d0f87adf527e&msa=0[/url]

Frankfurt area has the best FKK's I have experienced. This is my opinion, but opinions of mongers differ on this, as you will see when you begin to read the different FKK threads. But Frankfurt does not have a good outcall escort agency scene, as most of its outcall escort agencies are highly overpriced.

A better all around destination for p4p would be Vienna, where the outcall escorts are more reasonably priced (see e. G.

[url]www.viennaescort.at[/url]

Or the varied offerings listed in a portal like.

[url]www.kontaktbazar.at[/url]

) and there is an FKK club in Vienna also, FKK Goldentime (

[url]http://www.goldentime.at/[/url]

) , and the girls are hot and come from all the nearby countries, including blondes from Hungary and the Slovak Republic, as well as the usual Romanians and Bulgarians.

It comes to mind to mention that if you are thinking of coming to Eastern Europe because you like the way Eastern European women look, then since you have a sizeable daily budget of $300 to $500 per day, and you probably speak no Russian, then perhaps take a look at a different possibility. The fact is that thousands of young incredibly beautiful Eastern European girls have flocked [I]en masse[/I] In recent years to London. They come from all of our favorite EE countries for women, including Lithuania, Latvia, Poland, Romania, etc. In order to maintain themselves, many have opted to offer their pussy's for rent. Just take a look at.

[url]www.londonescortguide.com[/url]

And see the kind of awesome beauties that are in London just waiting for you to call them for a date for 150 GBP / hr. (about $236 USD / hr) So although it's more costly per hour than in Kiev, it's less complicated. Perhaps consider celebrating your batchelor's party with the offerings in London, which is an awesome city, has a great nightlife, you will have no language barrier, and can have an awesome batchelor's party with women from Eastern Europe without actually travelling to Eastern Europe, because their gorgeous women have brought their beautiful pussies to London just for you.

I also can't fail to mention Prague as a possibility also. It is certainly my favorite as far as general touring is concerned. As far as p4p, I found that it was difficult to find lower cost GFE services. It was not possible to easily get GFE at the various sex clubs in town. For example, at the vaunted K-5 club very few girls would permit DATY and offer BBBJ. For GFE service in Prague with very beautiful girls, I found I needed to go to the high end outcall escort agencies and book multiple hour dates for 200 or 300 Euros. There have been more recent reports of GFE service at some of the very numerous "privats", the girl apartments which abound all over Prague, but the level of beauty of the girls in these privats is a hit or miss thing. So it would be hard to rely on it for a batchelor's party, unless you did the advance leg work and came to Prague and tried the privats out until you found the girls who were the right stuff.

Same thing goes for Budapest where awesome looking girls abound, but there are a lot of rip off fake pic website escorts. Yet there are a lot of hot girls in apartments all over the city. But one needs to be there and investigate it personally in advance to know where to get the girls who meet your requirements, as I have nowhere I could send you with any guarantees in advance. Same for places like Warsaw, which definitely have potential, judging by the good looks of many Polish girls.

So with your budget and goals, I will tell you what I know that is more or less a reliable given. Bottom Line: You won't be sorry if you go to FKK Oase or Palace, even if you only go or one day and night. And you won't be sorry if you go to Kiev and check out Rio strip club, and indulge in all the other options that Kiev has to offer, which are well described in the Kiev thread.

Happy Hunting,

LJ[/QUOTE]I have been in Prague several times, visited K5 and darling kabaret, there were some beautiful girls over there, but didn't find better places. Lilojey, I think in Kiev there is better chance to be with better looking girls, as in Kiev girls are prettier. What do you think about it lilojey? As one that never been to german fkk clubs, what is difference in girls beauty between fkk clubs and k5 and darling in prague? Why you are not including Prague in your meny? Suppose geographically it is closer to your homeland. Why don't you look toward russia (moscow and st. Peter) to more advantures? Girls over there are very sexy either and higher chance they speak english than in Kiev (maybe educational reasons). I had problems in Kiev in language point of view, very few spoke decent english, and it is difficult to expirience real GFE with language barrier. My Russian is poor (unfortunately). As for future I plan to visit Brazil (at least people speak my native language) , as Portugal is dead country concerning morgening.

[QUOTE=Liljoey; 1251303]Dave, I am answering your PM here in the thread, because I believe it will benefit the general readership to view our discussion.

[U]Best Place to Find the Girls For the Batchelor Party[/U]

A batchelor's party in Kiev is a great idea. But you have to be mindful of the risks to success, and the pros and cons of other options. As I stated in response to your PM, when arranging a batchelor's party for a buddy, the guys responsible need to make sure that everything will come off well and successfully, as a batchelor's party is a lifetime event amongst friends to be remembered.

That being the case, your concerns about the websites for escorts being mostly fake pictures in Kiev is a true and valid concern. On the one hand using these websites is the way to find hot girls in Kiev for $75 / hr or $100 / hr. And discounts for multiple hour sessions are routine. But one need only read this Kiev thread, as I'm sure you are aware that you must do if you are planning a batchelor's party in Kiev, (read the thread going back to at least March 2011, if you don't it's at your peril) , to know that anyone inviting girls from an escort website in Kiev has to go through a process of rejecting ugly or fat girl, after ugly or fat girl etc. That the agency will send to you, until perhaps at some point a girl who is decent looking enough to fuck will show up. This is decidedly not the way to go about staffing your suite with the very pretty honey's needed for a batchelor's party. It will be a disaster. And you will deserve it if you do it anyways, even after reading this. The only way I could even think of advising you to do such a thing is if you make a preliminary solo trip to Kiev and go through the process of checking out girls until you personally meet and fuck the girls you would deem adequate in terms of looks and service, and build up your own "little black book" with names, stats, and numbers of girls that would be known to you to be ok to invite to a batchelor's party. Then you can find the lower cost girls. Otherwise, disaster is waiting.[/QUOTE]I would just like to add that you don't necessarily have to find dozens of quality girls for your bachelor party.

First you have to find 2 or 3 really good girls (in terms of price and quality) whether they be pros or semi-pros. Then they can find other girls for you. Like any business, referrals are invaluable. All girls are plugged into vast networks of friends and colleagues, and if you find one that suits your needs then chances are she has friends who will meet your friends' needs. A hot 8. 0 blonde who is doing everything you want for $300 is not going to set you up with frigid faker who wants $500. So work the dyev network to expand your network.

[QUOTE=Ronaldinjo;1251406]I have been in Prague several times, visited K5 and darling kabaret, there were some beautiful girls over there, but didn't find better places. Lilojey, I think in Kiev there is better chance to be with better looking girls, as in Kiev girls are prettier. What do you think about it lilojey? As one that never been to german fkk clubs, what is difference in girls beauty between fkk clubs and k5 and darling in prague? Why you are not including Prague in your meny? Suppose geographically it is closer to your homeland. Why don't you look toward russia (moscow and st. Peter) to more advantures? Girls over there are very sexy either and higher chance they speak english than in Kiev (maybe educational reasons). I had problems in Kiev in language point of view, very few spoke decent english, and it is difficult to expirience real GFE with language barrier. My Russian is poor (unfortunately). As for future I plan to visit Brazil (at least people speak my native language) , as Portugal is dead country concerning morgening.[/QUOTE]Well I certainly agree about Brazil being a great destination. I'm dying to go to Rio and Sao Paulon but it's a very long flight and a destination I'd rather go with buddies, and my friends can't make decisions, so that trip hasn't happened yet. I've gone solo to European destinations. Prague is just as easy for me to get to as any European destination. I did mention Prague as a destination that could be considered for a batchelor's party. Czech girls are beautiful and awesome looking. But I voiced my reservations about Prague in that the sex clubs and strip clubs were not offering GFE service (uncovered BJ) for the most part, and I was only able to get GFE sex with very beautiful girls through the high end internet escort agencies for Prague. Those prices are not too far off from what the prices are at Rio strip club in Kiev. So maybe I should consider Prague for a revisit at some point. But in the last couple of years, I have been very happy with Kiev and with the FKK's.

Are Ukrainian girls prettier than Czech girls? I don't know if I would go so far as to say that. There are gorgeous 8's. 9's and 10's in both countries, but I've definitely had more sex fun in Kiev than I've had in Prague. Great sex has been more accessible in Kiev.

If you have not gone to FKK's yet, you have cheated yourself out of one of the best sexual adventures that exists. Do yourself a favor and get over to Frankfurt Germany and visit FKK Oase and FKK Palace. There are others in the area which you can investigate if your penis still wants more, but these two are the best comparatively. You have really cheap flights on Ryan Air from Porto or Faro airports in Portugal to the Frankfurt Hahn airport, and from Hahn there is a bus into Frankfurt. After experiencing the FKK's, you will realize what a joke clubs like K-5 and Cabaret in Prague are by comparison in what they offer. In terms of beauty, you can find many 8's in the FKK's, some 9's and a few 10's. Is it enough for you?

Kiev is a better P4P destination than overpriced Moscow and St Petersburg in Russia and no visa requirement to visit Ukraine. But for regular tourism reasons I would like to visit Russia some day.

Language barrier? Well you know what you need to do. Start learning To read and speak Russian. Use the pimsleur. Com audio course. Even a monkey could learn from that course. It's great. Until you can speak, rely on Google Translate and the like to help communication.

[QUOTE=Liljoey; 1251362]I tried many times to get Rio girls to hook up with me during the daytime before their club work hours, not necessarily to feed them,

Are you talking about freebies, as in a normal date with a girl who you would like to wine and dine for the pleasure of her company? Are you kidding? There are girls all over the place that would enjoy being wined and dined. Not only in nightclubs and discos. Just roam the streets and shopping malls and start up with whomever you are attracted to. Use any of your lines that you usually use when starting up with a girl. Even simply asking them for help about something in the shop is enough to start a conversation. And it will not be long before you will have succeeded in having a conversation turn into an invitation to them to buy them a drink or a lunch or something. They love it when a seemingly wealthy man wants to spend money on them. Try to take out girls who seem like they are nice human beings.

But watch out for the serial daters and big users. They're all over the place too. Learn how to look at a menu in Russian. ALWAYS do the ordering yourself of the food and drink that they will be eating. DO NOT let them do it. Ask them what they want and after you have heard them, you interact with the waiter and keep control of the process. The wait staff should never be permitted to get the idea that you will pay for anything that you have not yourself ordered. This is sage advice that I have read on this forum and it makes sense to me. And you disregard it, it is at your peril, and you should not be upset if you receive a very large bill that you didn't intend to have.

My posts have not focussed on freebie dating because of the short nature of my visits to Kiev. .

You have only asked about having dinners with girls so I'm not sure if you're interested in p4p. But if you are, mamba. Ru also has a fair number of girls on it, in Kiev at least, who explicitly say in their profiles "I am looking for a sponsor" or even more explicitly,"I offer sex for money". If you respond to those profiles, you can find girls who will agree to get into your bed immediately for sex for money, without going through the whole dating thing until you can get them up to your apartment. But you can also have dinner with them, as a way of getting to know them. Those girls looking for "sponsors" are in fact looking for a benefactor / boyfriend and long term sponsorship, even though they will also enter into a more transient sponshorship of only a night, or even 1 or 2 hours.

Good luck with your trip to Kiev.

LJ[/QUOTE]Once again, thank you for detailed reply. Just to clarify, I am not looking for freebies. I don't mind paying. Actually, I prefer paying and take the drama out of it. I do get bored with one track mind on sex. I like the idea of dinner drinks and dancing. Web site contacts make me uncomfortable. Do these chicks on websites expect you to send photos and phone numbers etc? I don't look like a serial killer but I am not Brad Pitt either.

Sounds like shopping malls are it but I am usually not good with picking up non-pro girls half my age. You guessed right. 40 yrs.

What time does Rio open?

BTW, One of you said, "do not go during Euro 2012". I know it is going to be crazy in the city but you guys think it is negatively effect mongering that much? That might be the week I may be able to make it. Just working out that way. You think I should drop Kiev and go somewhere else? Thanks

Hi,

I come to Kiev at the end of March.

I have to chose a good hotel for me. Do you think Riviera or Dininpro?

[QUOTE=Vitrea;1251637]BTW, One of you said, "do not go during Euro 2012". I know it is going to be crazy in the city but you guys think it is negatively effect mongering that much? That might be the week I may be able to make it. Just working out that way. You think I should drop Kiev and go somewhere else? Thanks[/QUOTE]When there was a less important event in Kiev like the Eurovision song contest in 2005 it was an earth quake : prices rised up and it took months and months to go back to normal situation. So I guess this time it might be just worse, as Euro 2012 will last for 1 month and not only for a few days and many more people are expected to visit Ukraine.

[QUOTE=Goodbye Lenin;1251669]When there was a less important event in Kiev like the Eurovision song contest in 2005 it was an earth quake : prices rised up and it took months and months to go back to normal situation. So I guess this time it might be just worse, as Euro 2012 will last for 1 month and not only for a few days and many more people are expected to visit Ukraine.[/QUOTE]Well with a big event like Eurocup, there should be plenty opportunities of free pussies. So who know the prices might be stable.

I'm considering going there for the Eurocup. Another options for me is watching the games with my favorites in the FKKs.

[QUOTE=Vitrea; 1251636]Once again, thank you for detailed reply. Just to clarify, I am not looking for freebies. I don't mind paying. Actually, I prefer paying and take the drama out of it. I do get bored with one track mind on sex. I like the idea of dinner drinks and dancing. Web site contacts make me uncomfortable. Do these chicks on websites expect you to send photos and phone numbers etc? I don't look like a serial killer but I am not Brad Pitt either.

Sounds like shopping malls are it but I am usually not good with picking up non-pro girls half my age. You guessed right. 40 yrs.

What time does Rio open?[/QUOTE]Rio opens 8:00 PM.

None of us looks like Brad Pitt. Your appearance will not be less of an issue in a shopping mall than in a website acquaintance. To the degree the girls are interested in your financial sponsorship, they will be forgiving on your appearance.

The EE woman does not necessarily expect an Adonis, and also values other qualities in a man, things that can bring her security and an enjoyable companionship, including wealth, power, intelligence, generosity, confidence, charm, wit, humor etc. So if you have these things, or can create and sustain at least the appearance of having these things, you will be desireable to these girls. I have heard from beautiful girls more than once in reference to my own shortcomings, responses like,"oh that's ok. You're a man," and we have wonderful p4p sex_lol. In p4p your appearance plays much less of a role. That's not to say that if someone really looks like a troll, he might not encounter difficulty in getting every girl he wishes even for p4p. But men of average looks, who are presentable and cultured, should have no problem, especially in p4p situations.

Therefore, you should overcome your issue with website acquaintances, and proceed to solicit dates from girls looking for a sponsor. The very fact that a sponsorship is under consideration will make your appearance much less of an issue. Don't be afraid of giving a picture. Even in regular dating, I prefer to get past the trading pictures stage, as I'm not interested in even meeting someone who doesn't want to date the guy in my picture. If you get the date after she knows what you look like, you're in. Just don't put your foot in your mouth by saying dumb stuff and the p4p aspect will sail her smoothly into your bed.

So I would recommend for you a combined approach. Start developing contacts and setting up dates for at least two months before your trip on websites like mamba. Ru. You can choose to date normal girls, or girls looking for a sponsorship (which means p4p). Having coffee, lunch or dinner with these girls is an expected part of dating such girls. So if that's what you like to do, then have at it. When you arrive in Kiev you can also begin to look to meet girls in streets and shopping malls and clubs, but for obvious reasons (like not getting slapped in the face for propositioning a girl who is not a prostitute) you must treat this as freebies dating, unless and until the girl herself raises the subject of money for her company. Of course, as in normal freebie dating, you can choose to create situations which are conducive to a sexual advance, like inviting the girl to your apartment on some pretext and trying to seduce her, making your usual way into her pants, or at least trying to do so. She can then do one of three things. She can say no, not yet. And you will need to date some more until she is ready to give it up, or until your patience runs out. She can let you have your way with her. Or she can raise the issue of money.

Go to Rio when you don't want to chase a girl so much, and just want to meet a beautiful girl to have sex with for $300/3 hours or $400 for the night. You can take her anywhere you want that is open during the nightime hours, including restaurants, sushi bars, disco nightclubs etc. But I warn you in advance that it would be adviseable to first bring them back to your apartment and have sex with them first, before going out to eat or to nightclub dancing, as later it may not happen due to tiredness, drunkness, or no more time left on the meter, or other reasons. My experience has been that due to the fatigue factor, these girls are not going to be interested in going out dancing after having sex, and will more likely want to get into bed and sleep, or worse, go home. However, if you can succeed in getting out of the Rio club with a girl in the early part of the evening just after opening, like by 9:00 or 10:00 PM, and you have booked the girl with a firm agreement to stay the whole night until at least 5:00 AM, maybe there is time to go home, have sex, and then also take them out. They will probably not be interested in dancing at a nightclub, because they dance all the time and are tired, but if you invite them to go out to eat somewhere nice, then they will probably want to go out. I find they are usually very hungry, as they have not eaten dinner before starting work at the club. Most often I have found they want to stop at a supermarket to buy some food to take back to my apartment to eat first before taking showers and getting to the sex. So forestall that by saying you will take them out to dine after getting acquainted at your apartment. You should have some drinks and chocolates at your apartment, so you can offer girls who come there something.

Hi community,

Somebody in Kiev in March to go for some mongering together and chilling maybe?

Was in Kiev around 30 times the last 5 years.

Finished relation to my last ukr girlfriend actually and want not to hang out with my local friends and my well-known network all the time. Need some kind of "rest" and fresh wind in my sails.

New contacts with like-minded people.

Nice regards.

[QUOTE=Liljoey; 1251487]Well I certainly agree about Brazil being a great destination. I'm dying to go to Rio and Sao Paulon but it's a very long flight and a destination I'd rather go with buddies, and my friends can't make decisions, so that trip hasn't happened yet. I've gone solo to European destinations. Prague is just as easy for me to get to as any European destination. I did mention Prague as a destination that could be considered for a batchelor's party. Czech girls are beautiful and awesome looking. But I voiced my reservations about Prague in that the sex clubs and strip clubs were not offering GFE service (uncovered BJ) for the most part, and I was only able to get GFE sex with very beautiful girls through the high end internet escort agencies for Prague. Those prices are not too far off from what the prices are at Rio strip club in Kiev. So maybe I should consider Prague for a revisit at some point. But in the last couple of years, I have been very happy with Kiev and with the FKK's.

Are Ukrainian girls prettier than Czech girls? I don't know if I would go so far as to say that. There are gorgeous 8's. 9's and 10's in both countries, but I've definitely had more sex fun in Kiev than I've had in Prague. Great sex has been more accessible in Kiev.

If you have not gone to FKK's yet, you have cheated yourself out of one of the best sexual adventures that exists. Do yourself a favor and get over to Frankfurt Germany and visit FKK Oase and FKK Palace. There are others in the area which you can investigate if your penis still wants more, but these two are the best comparatively. You have really cheap flights on Ryan Air from Porto or Faro airports in Portugal to the Frankfurt Hahn airport, and from Hahn there is a bus into Frankfurt. After experiencing the FKK's, you will realize what a joke clubs like K-5 and Cabaret in Prague are by comparison in what they offer. In terms of beauty, you can find many 8's in the FKK's, some 9's and a few 10's. Is it enough for you?

Kiev is a better P4P destination than overpriced Moscow and St Petersburg in Russia and no visa requirement to visit Ukraine. But for regular tourism reasons I would like to visit Russia some day.

Language barrier? Well you know what you need to do. Start learning To read and speak Russian. Use the pimsleur. Com audio course. Even a monkey could learn from that course. It's great. Until you can speak, rely on Google Translate and the like to help communication.[/QUOTE]Yes Liljoey, brazil indeed is great destination, and from what I have heard, pros there are really stunners. In comparison to eastern europe, where 10/10 pros are big rarity, in brazil it is quite common, and chicks there are less money oriented, if they really like you, compared to europe girls. But its all about rumors, you need to go and see. But be carefull buddy, don't go alone, brazil can be dangerouse place.

As for chzechs, there are a lot of beauties in prague, but the persentage of beautifull faces is more common in Kiev, but maybe I need one more visit to clarify this. But anyway, Czech chicks are hot. Liljoey, you say that there is possibility for hot privat girls in internet escort agencies. Is it as relible as mamba or something else?

Its pity I didn't visit Rio kind places in moscow, but privat houses (with very nice girls) Nile Copenhages says there are a lot of hot chicks over there (and moscow is huge huge city) in places similar to Rio, and you can bang them in the place. Would like to know how it is in comparison to Rio in Kiev. All in all there is huge number of beautiful chicks in moscow and especially in st. Peter, although girls in Kiev have little bit prettier faces on my mind. But Russian matrioshkas are very nice either, especially in peter, very kind hearted girls. Big Russian heart.

[QUOTE=Astrocob; 1251647]Hi,

I come to Kiev at the end of March.

I have to chose a good hotel for me. Do you think Riviera or Dininpro?[/QUOTE]Can you help me please?