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[QUOTE=Chocha Monger;1221510]Therefore the bars will eventually move away from the current way of doing business and the mongering scene will undergo a transformation to something where sex is no longer the main commodity on sale.[/QUOTE]Right, my opinion as well. The bars move away from the flesh market style towards an entertainment venue. It's happening already.
Like it or leave it seems to be the choice.
Cheers!
[QUOTE=Mc Don;1221477]As for the Koreans and the Asians and their barfining please note that many of them are NEW to the game and are learning.[/QUOTE]No way it's a newbie mistake.
When you were in Angeles City for the first time, were you racking up P10, 000 bar tabs due to ignorance? I wasn't.
Granted, newbies may overpay for trike rides, hotels and on tipping. But the level of spending by Koreans goes wayyyy beyond newbie mistakes.
[QUOTE=Mc Don;1221477]I think most of the stuff written about them outspending us is actually wrong. What we have here is mostly white guys budget travellers observing Korean 'big spenders'.[/QUOTE]Surely, it's not just Korean guys overspending. Plenty of white tourists are too.
But let's cut the bullshit. Of course your average Asian spends more than your average white guy. If you go to the Primeter at night, you will see few Korean guys. They're usually in the mega bars where drinks and barfines are more expensive. And look at their tables. It's filled with alcohol. Those drinks aren't just for themselves. They're inviting multiple girls offstage. You frequently see a table of 4 Korean men with 9 girls. How many white guys are entertaining more than 1 girl at a time?
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Here's why Korean guys are spending so much.
- The average American spends $1, 300 roundtrip on airfare to the Philippines. According to CebuPacific's website, I can fly Seoul to Manila for $320 rountdrip. If you had an extra $1, 000, you'd also have a higher appetite for spending.
- I just checked historic currency rates. Three years ago, it was 49 pesos to the dollar. Today it's 43. The dollar lost 15% of it's value in three years. I checked the South Korean won against the Philippine Peso. It's pretty much the same these last three years.
- The unemployment rate in the United States is 9. 0. The rate for South Korea is 3. 7. Nuff said about the relative strength of both economies.
- South Korea sends more tourists to the Philippines than any other country, even more than the United States (even though the US population is 7 times greater than South Korea's). This shows that a broad spectrum of South Korean society (rich or poor) views Philippines favorably as a travel destination. In contrast, Americans see the Philippines mostly for budget tourism. As such, the Philippines (and Angeles City) attract mostly American budget tourists while upscale American tourist are heading to more expensive Asian locales like Hong Kong or Japan instead.
If you think folks from South Korea have invaded the Philippines, just wait for China. China has 1. 2 billion people (South Korea only has 48 million) and the country's GDP is growing by 9% (5% is considered "booming"). Eventually, enough Chinese will ascend into the middle class and will start traveling and whoring in massive numbers.
Welcome to the "Asian Century".
Fortunately, I believe the supply of girls will always exceed demand. The rate for first-tier girls will eventually become unaffordable for most. But that constitutes only 10-20% of the girls in Angeles City.
FurryFriend, maybe you should speak to the Koreans or the girls about them rather then assume things. Most of the tourists stay 3-4 days an extended weekend because its cheaper for them to get there. Yes they spend a bit more at the bar because they are there to enjoy themselves not everyone enjoys fucking all the time. When I am with a group of friends I do the same, its like a bucks party. Is that so bad? I bar fine multiple times during the day, I have my first jack and coke with my breakfast in the pool bar. I will buy ladies drinks if I like a girl, I don't care if she is cheery or not even if I don't intend to barfine her, I like touching and playing with them and I don't consider 150 peso big money. All my friends do the same too. To each his own. The level of spending as you put it goes by the amount of disposable income one has and the what he considers value for money in terms of entertainment. I don't see any enjoyment in cam shows for instance but hey there are guys out there that spend big on that too. Whatever floats their boat I say.
Another thing you are forgetting is that most white big spenders in phils earn their cash in Asia too. High end is expats leaving in Singapore, Japan, HK, China, Taiwan and they are not just american but european and ausies too. I live in Australia but I make my money largely thanks to asia. I am not affected by any of those figures there infect unlike the americans and koreans my australian dollar has done well compared to the peso. Has that changed my spending habits? NO I am the same guy and monger the same in AC as in Burgos, Singapore, Amsterdam or Vegas. I drink because I like to drink not because the price is cheaper in AC. If I buy anyone a drink its because I like to do so. You will find that the high spenders in phils come to phils BECAUSE they LIKE phils not because it cheap or convenient.
You need to understand that fun is not always just cheap barfine and keeping everything and everyone in tack. No wonder why some girls knock back some punters out there. Guys need to loosen up, buying 2 extra drinks a night on a two week holiday accounts to less the $70 if you can't afford that then I suggest you read up on Cambodia or look at small indo towns where you can actually get even more bang for your buck.
As for the Chinese invasion LOL, don't know if you were around the forums when the Russian inversion was discussed. I am still struggling to cope with the aftermath. Lucky for me I prefer the brown beauties that you can find in abundance in phils and other places while they prefer the porcelain skin types LOL.
Don't worry about the pussy market its always been there it will always be there, I say concentrate on making money so you have more to spend.
Happy mongering. I am off to AC tomorrow. I fly via Bali and Singapore and even though in both places there is a cool scene I am rushing to get to AC before the koreans and the Chinese take over. C ya around.
Ekspet let me know if you are around. I will be in AC and Manila most likely until the 10th then Bohol and Cebu before leaving for Bangkok and Jakarta.
[QUOTE=Mc Don;1221602]Ekspet let me know if you are around. I will be in AC and Manila most likely until the 10th then Bohol and Cebu before leaving for Bangkok and Jakarta.[/QUOTE]McDon, I'm currently on a 5-weeks trip through Asia, started in Phuket, via BKK, Macau, HK, MNL, this week is Cebu and my final week will be AC from 4th to 10th. My phone# is still samesame.
Anyone else around for a SMB? Robb, you maybe?
[QUOTE=D Cups;1221527]All this talk about barfine. I never barfine. I get her phone number and have her come over before or after work. Why make the bar owner rich? Bar fine is ridiculous.[/QUOTE]What a brillant idea. I sort of tried to do that but the girl to my surprise wanted me to come and pick her up from the bar even though she understood that she would get to keep all the money. I wonder why.
Of cause the bars provide some sort of safety for the girls. Also money wise. On days with no costumers they get a minimum salary. And I believe she was afraid to lose that income in case the bar would find out about it. Or maybe it's something the girls do to help each other to bring in business. Because it's easier or safer to make a living from LD and the base-payment than going to hotels.
She had already been with me and we had a good time so she knew I'm not a (sex) monster.
Can you think of other reasons for not daring to do business without involving the bar?
/CPH
I sometimes get grief when I suggest,"you didn't give us enough information to answer the question".
So, my short answer makes some assumptions. You barfined her and loved it and wanted the next night at some sort of discount or wanted to cut out the bar and possibly give her more. I've been there and done that. The problem is. If she barfined, she needs to be back in the bar the next night or she gets a penalty. I assume there is an exception if she has already asked for and / or is scheduled for a day off.
There are about 1001 different variations here, and you obviously have considered a few. X.
[QUOTE=Copenhagen; 1221654]What a brillant idea. I sort of tried to do that but the girl to my surprise wanted me to come and pick her up from the bar even though she understood that she would get to keep all the money. I wonder why.
Of cause the bars provide some sort of safety for the girls. Also money wise. On days with no costumers they get a minimum salary. And I believe she was afraid to lose that income in case the bar would find out about it. Or maybe it's something the girls do to help each other to bring in business. Because it's easier or safer to make a living from LD and the base-payment than going to hotels.
She had already been with me and we had a good time so she knew I'm not a (sex) monster.
Can you think of other reasons for not daring to do business without involving the bar?
/CPH[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Copenhagen;1221654]Can you think of other reasons for not daring to do business without involving the bar?[/QUOTE]He's one. The girl prefers to get paid upfront, which she gets when barfined. If a patron goes outside the bars, she gets nothing if he reneges or pays less than agreed.
Here's another reason. The highly desirable girls want whales, guys who drop serious bank who dish out big tips. Some might even want to get barfined multiple days. Guys who suggest bypassing the bars are essentially advertising his thriftiness who want to pay as little as possible (if he weren't, why not just pay the barfine?). If you were a really hot girl, one where patrons are paying P3000 barfine + P2000 tips, would you save yourself for him or a penny pincher?
Here's yet another. I'm sure the bars and the mamasan impose a revenue quota for the girls to meet. They're running a business and would be foolish not to. Every time a girl forsakes a barfine, she risks missing the quota and getting booted.
Ultimately, I'm sure the girl gets in serious trouble for bypassing the bars and few would risk it.
Besides, if I were a patron, I would want the girl NOW, not wait until her shift ends at 5:00am or God-knows-when (while hoping another patron wouldn't barfine her). I can't be bothered with saving a few hundred pesos doing this, especially since I'm in town for only a few days. Time is money.
[QUOTE=Copenhagen; 1221654]What a brillant idea. I sort of tried to do that but the girl to my surprise wanted me to come and pick her up from the bar even though she understood that she would get to keep all the money. I wonder why.
Of cause the bars provide some sort of safety for the girls. Also money wise. On days with no costumers they get a minimum salary. And I believe she was afraid to lose that income in case the bar would find out about it. Or maybe it's something the girls do to help each other to bring in business. Because it's easier or safer to make a living from LD and the base-payment than going to hotels.
She had already been with me and we had a good time so she knew I'm not a (sex) monster.
Can you think of other reasons for not daring to do business without involving the bar?
/CPH[/QUOTE]1. Girl lives in bar accomodation or shares room / place with other bargirls from the same bar that WILL dob her in to mamasan. Always hunt for local girls for something like that or older independent girls rather then young.
2. She is young and new and doesn't understand that she is the MONEYMAKER not her mamasan. The young fear the mamasan while the seasoned pro respects the cash and cash only.
3. Job security. If she is single mum with few options to find paid work you bet your ass she won't risk her job. One thing I find interesting most girls bond and have friends and rarely change bars even if offered better salary or can see more oportunities. Many times I have spoken to perimetar girls that can make killing on fields but they would rather stick to their bar. They simply don't see it as a worthwhile risk if all you want is for them to skip the barfine for one night. Offer them few nights in manila and see how that changes.
Perimetar girls finish up around midnight. There are lot of them that live far, I know few that live past San Fernado and take up to 5 jeepneys to get home. Figure out a way to spot them and you can have your long time for 500 peso. They will stay with you up to 2 pm when the start work once again. I did this quite often on my last trip and I intend to do it again on this one. Good luck.
[QUOTE=Lugalzaggizi;1221532]I would not ask for a girl's phone number in the bar because I would not want to incur the risk of getting her fired on account of me saving 100 pesos for a drink. If I am going to take down phone numbers of girls it will be back in the hotel after I have barfined them. Part of a girl's responsibility while working at a bar is to make money for the bar, ultimately the reason for her being there. I am not one to support bar owners, but if she is going to be disloyal to her employer why would she be any different with the monger that is trying to get her to shirk her responsibilities?[/QUOTE]The girls are more worried about the snitches. One time while the girl was playing around with my cell phone she inserted her phone number. Then this girl asks me if the other girl gave me her number. Ofcourse I denied it. The bargirls for some reason very jealous of each other. Most will be more than willing to spend the night with you off hours if they are not living in their bar dormitory. Reason is obvious.
[QUOTE=D Cups;1221527]All this talk about barfine. I never barfine. I get her phone number and have her come over before or after work. Why make the bar owner rich? Bar fine is ridiculous.[/QUOTE]Do all the girls you try to get this way agree to it? What percentage say "no" to your offer? Are you trying for the hottest youngest girls on the market?
[QUOTE=Chocha Monger;1221510]The increasing cost of travel combined with a troubled Western economy and job market means fewer Westerners will be willing or able to travel for sex. Asians will move in to fill the void.[/QUOTE]This is what happened in BKK. Nana and Cowboy used to have very few Asian mongers, but now they've slithered their way in.
[QUOTE=Sammon;1221711]The girls are more worried about the snitches.[/QUOTE]Can you imagine the intense blackmail power the patron would have on the girl?
"You're going to bang me all night without sleep or I'll tell the bar and your mamasan that you've snuck out with me."
With this reason, and the reasons I revealed on post #9607, I doubt the high-demand girls are doing this in significant number in Angeles City. This risk versus reward equation doesn't make sense for her.
[QUOTE=Copenhagen; 1221654]What a brillant idea. I sort of tried to do that but the girl to my surprise wanted me to come and pick her up from the bar even though she understood that she would get to keep all the money. I wonder why.
Of cause the bars provide some sort of safety for the girls. Also money wise. On days with no costumers they get a minimum salary. And I believe she was afraid to lose that income in case the bar would find out about it. Or maybe it's something the girls do to help each other to bring in business. Because it's easier or safer to make a living from LD and the base-payment than going to hotels.
She had already been with me and we had a good time so she knew I'm not a (sex) monster.
Can you think of other reasons for not daring to do business without involving the bar?
/CPH[/QUOTE]The reason being it is not allowed by the management and the girl will be fired if it is found out. One girl I ever booked at Club Asia was fired by the management for the above crime.She was brought out by a previous customer without the bar fine. She is now at Golden Nile.
Mongers: of course you have to be discrete when getting the number. Slip her YOUR # with time to meet.
Amjeck: Almost all I have approached do this. No, I don't always go for the "hottest youngest girls" but sometimes I do. I usually go for the cute thin ones with the big tits! The hot young ones are not always the best providers as everyone who has been arond knows.
[QUOTE=Amjeck;1221747]Do all the girls you try to get this way agree to it? What percentage say "no" to your offer? Are you trying for the hottest youngest girls on the market?[/QUOTE]
Unless the girl offers to meet you out side do not ask. It is better to barfine her once then get her number. You can meet her before or after her shift, but expect her to still get other guys and you be doing slops with the other monger if you get her after the shift.