Sao Paulo Reports

[QUOTE=Rovnak]GFE Finder, I hope you take this as constructive debate. Yes we do agree on some things and disagree on others.

1) I will grant that your experience with tipping and extra rate was not good. I would be upset with such treatment as well. However, my point is that I never have received such treatment nor have I heard such complaints about the bomboa staff from other residents. Contrast this with Romanza which is notorious for abusing patrons. Your post might lead some to believe this practice is rampant at Bomboa. I am merely providing counterpoint b/c in all honesty the staff at Bomboa from security to barmen to checkout have always treated me nice. Maybe they treat gringos worse, as I speak portuguese I do not have that experience exactly. The tipping gesture, not sure where that is coming from maybe too many gringos have started to give tips and now they are expecting it.[/QUOTE]

Since most of the people who read this forum are not Bomboa regulars and not everyone speaks fluent Portuguese, their experience with the staff would likely be closer to what mine was. Hence I think my conclusions and warnings regarding the staff are fair. And to clarify, even though the staff tried to speak English with me, I answered in Portuguese until they did as well.

[QUOTE=Rovnak]The hotel surcharge, it is a good thing you warned people about this. I know the hotel situation is weird b/c of this whole legal thing. When I was last used the hotel, about a month ago, it was very late at night, there were plenty of free rooms. I kept laying there wondering when the phone would ring to say that the hour was up. It did not ring. We wound up overstaying by about 30 minutes as well. I was a bit agitated, and said "I hope they do not plan to charge me extra". And the girl said "they are no longer ringing the rooms b/c of the legal consideration. To avoid "participation" so to speak. I was surprised but not shocked by this explanation, as I know that Bomboa is trying to be very careful to avoid problems. In fact, they did not charge me more, so I was not upset. If they had charged me more, I would have been upset and I understand your frustration. I will ask for clarity on their policy next time. But it is a fair warning that visitors should watch the clock themselves from now on. In every boate. Or at least ask the policy before going to room.[/QUOTE]

Ideally yes we should keep an eye on time but in the room there is rarely enough blood in our brains to focus on tasks like timekeeping! :D

Thanks for checking on this policy and please let us know what you find.

[QUOTE=Rovnak]Live music, quality of music, we just have to disagree there.[/QUOTE]

Fair enough. As I said its presence or absence was and is not a huge deal for me one way or the other.

[QUOTE=Rovnak] I do in fact like Bomboa's atmosphere. I think it is one of the things that makes it special and I do not find this relaxed club like atmosphere in many other places, really none. Where the girls are dancing with the patrons for sheer fun, where they have 3 bands per night during busy days. The music volume is just right for me. If you want to hear the music loudly get close to the bandstand. If you want to converse without competing with the music you can stay further away. I like that freedom. I absolutely hate clubs where the music is so loud that you cannot converse without shouting. IMO the lower music level is a plus not a minus. Drink prices. You are paying 200 to enter Bomboa, and you can use all of that for consumption of food and drink or lose it. That is 8 beers or 4 whiskeys, something like that. I would not have bought the girl a drink either, but not because of the price per se. I would not have bought her a drink b/c she asked right away. Regardless of the price.[/QUOTE]

I thought it was clear from my report, but her asking for a drink so quickly after having met me was indeed one of the reasons that I turned Maya away.

[QUOTE=Rovnak] I generally chat with b/t 10 and 20 girls when I visit Bomboa, walking around. In all honesty, none of them ask me for a drink until I have indicated that I have some interest in continuing the conversation beyond 10 minutes. And even then, I have had many say "no, its not necessary" to my offer for a drink. Or 'just juice is fine". Again, this may be "tourist" treatment. There are some mercenaries in Bomboa, no doubt about it, no doubt about it. I am sure they specialize in seeing guys that look like they have money. Maybe my secret is that I dress like I have no money, which unfortunately is true now. LOL.[/QUOTE]

You have no money and you come to Bomboa? ;) :)

[QUOTE=Rovnak] All the things you accuse Bomboa of being. Greedy and mercenary. Are the things that Bahammas was accused of being by the veterans of that time. In fact Bomboa was often cited as the antidote to the the mercenary setting in Bahamas. Go back and read the boards from that time. You may have had great times in Bahamas, but institutionally it was not known for being MORE customer friendly than Bomboa today. [/QUOTE]

I admit I didn’t research the boards back then as thoroughly as I do today. So, for all I know you are correct. Here’s what I can say: As a Gringo with even worse Portuguese 5 years ago, I had great times in Bahamas.

[QUOTE=Rovnak] I am not trying to be a "white knight" for Bomboa. I am trying to provide some perspective for people who have not visited and will be influenced by your post into thinking they should AVOID Bomboa. As if there are much better options for first time visitors? Other than avoiding boates altogether, tell me your alternative strategy? That is the part that bugged me about your post. What is the alternative? And what do you lose out on with the alternatives? You did not address that, and that is what I am responding to. [/QUOTE]

I can’t recommend alternatives without knowing what specifically someone wants. Do you want to fuck Playboy models who may or may not give you good service with a heavy probability toward the latter? Do you want cheap, cheap, cheap? Do you want to see the girls naked before you consider fucking them? Do you want a place with reasonable odds of getting good service? Do you only have a short time to spare and need to be in and out quickly? My answer would probably change for each of these.

In the interest of disclosure and speaking strictly for myself, I focus heavily on excellent service for a reasonable price. I want to walk away happy and satisfied, as do we all. I found good service for a decent price at Redway. Hence I would be inclined to return there [i]and recommend it if you are looking for good service at a good price[/i]. I would also point out and I’m sure you’d agree that Sao Paulo is a big city with a diverse array of P4P options at nearly every price point.

[QUOTE=Rovnak] If you say "my alternative is to avoid boates and stick with clinicas and prives", then I will say "fine, that is a cost effective strategy and one that I use myself. But is that a reasonable strategy for visitors? " My point is that if a guy is in Sampa for one week and wants to see the best collection of pussy that he can, then he has to expect to pay a lot. If you want the feeling of being inside of a playboy mansion party, you have to pay a lot.[/QUOTE]

See above. I can’t give a recommendation without a criteria; one of the lessons of this hobby is that one size does not fit all or even most.

You don’t necessarily have to pay more to find Playboy model types (who I refer to as optifucks); if you have patience and luck you can find them at the cheaper venues. They might be more concentrated at the higher cost venues like Bomboa, this is true.

[QUOTE=Rovnak] You make an interesting point about being bummed that you are paying 1st world prices in Brazil for the same or worse service and quality. Not sure what 1st world places you are referring to that have collections like Bomboa. I assume you mean European places, cause you sure as shit don't see anything like that in the USA. I have been to the best clubs in Prague (ie. K5), Moscow, SPB, Finland,, and Italy, and they do not compare in terms of numbers of girls and quality. I suspect there are clubs in Spain and Germany that are as good or better, my experience there is limited. What places are you referring to, as I would like to add them to my todo list. This is an sincere not provacative question.[/QUOTE]

There seems to be a curse in that once I name a club to someone as having the world's best collection of optifucks, it gets closed down. First there was Club Bahamas in Sao Paulo. Then there was Club Riviera in Barcelona. I’ve been to K5 and found much to my disappointment that the prettier the girl, the worse the service was. You had to slide your scale below 6/10 before finding a girl who would even kiss, let alone allow DATY.

So, if you really want optifucks (who may or may not give good service) try the Hessen 3 near Frankfurt, Germany (i.e. FKK Palace, Oase, and World.) 30-100+ girls at a given time, many optifucks, the vast majority are <25, all bare-ass naked so no surprises in the room. Here’s the pricing:

1 hour at Bomboa:

R$200 entry +R$20 surcharge + R$120 hotel charge + R$300 for the girl = R$640 or approximately $384. For comparison, one US hobby board defines “high-end” escorts at $400/hr. and above.

1 hour at FKK Oase/World: (FKK Palace is 10 € more expensive to enter)

65 € entry + 50 € per half hour with standard BBBJ and DFK = 165 € or approximately $231.
You also get free access to a sauna, pool, whirlpool, outdoor garden, and all the food and drink you want.

I used to live in Spain so I can say that the clubs also had a broader selection that Bomboa (100-150 sometimes at Barcelona's Club Riviera and Madrid's Flowers Park) and again the vast majority are optifucks.

Take 1 hour at Flowers Park as an example since Club Riviera is no more:


5 € entry + 2 * 70 € for a half hour + 20 € for drinks = 165 € or $231 as above.

So yes, based on these two examples Bomboa is more expensive than some First World venues which score better in terms of quality and quantity of optifucks available. That is why I was concerned and said so in my report.

[QUOTE=Rovnak] But I do know this. The girls that return to Brasil from Europe are almost always way way more mercenary than the girls that have never been there. So even tho you may pay the same in Brasil, if you hook up with a girl that has never been to Europe, your chances of having a top notch GFE is much higher. So, yes, the prices may be 1st world now, but I think you can still get top notch service, and you get a Brasilian. I think that is what is the differentiator. If you like Brazilian chicks then I would take my chances with Brazilian chicks in Brazil over Brazilian chicks in Europe. Even for the same cost.

I know Photo, Kilt, Ilha the Fantasia, Connection, Liberal, Scandalo Lounge, Casarao, MM club, Tivoly, Garden, Romanza, Black Moon, Panthers, Misterium, Lady Night, etc. I have been to all of them in the past year. I took one visitor here on a club tour. We went to Bomboa one night. The next night I thought he would like some variety. So we went to Misterium as they were having an aniversary party. The place was full of girls, certainly 70, we walked through the place, and he said "lets go to Bomboa". Why? Because there were not as many lookers. I would have stayed, myself, as there were a few that caught my eye, but for a first time visitor who wants the best he can see in a short time, it was not worth saving R100 or even R200. Same thing, with another guy, we went thru Scandalo and although the club is better than 1st world in terms of organization and layout, the girls were fairly pedestrian.

I have been to Garden, which is a favorite of some veterans here, and it was a nice looking club. But it was midweek, when it should have been hopping and there were only about 30 girls there and they were no better than what I see at bomboa or photo or scandalo or connection. And the prices were the same or more. So I would take the 50 selection over the 30 selection anyday.

I am not saying that on any given night that Bomboa is the best place to go. But if you have to make a recommendation for 1 night to someone, I would say "it will cost you a lot, but you will have a lot more choice than other places" (other than Photo and Scandalo which are as expensive).

I am not "defending" Bomboa as much as defending the idea that if you want to go to a boate, then Bomboa is a good, imo the best, option. Except on Saturday and Monday nights. Although even then it is perhaps a better option than other clubs, just not as good as Tue-Thurs.[/QUOTE]

Believe me, I [i]wanted[/i] to write a good review for Bomboa. That’s why I started my review the way that I did. I succumbed to the same thought process you just mentioned: a few nights in SP, best odds for a good time because of the high concentration of pretty girls.

[b]There is a huge hole in this thought process, however: it does not take service or price into account. Bomboa fails miserably on both of these counts as far as I’m concerned.[/b] And yes, I hope readers remember this when deciding whether or not to go there.

[QUOTE=Rovnak] So all this leads me to the real question for you. Where would you suggest that a visitor go? That is what I really want to know from you? Which of those clubs or others are better for a person that only has a few nights in Sampa? And why? Obviously, it all comes down to cost-benefit. There are lower cost places, but if the girls are skanks, is that a good cost-benefit? If you want to do 1 girl than Photo is not an option. If you want to see 50 girls, then you have basically 5 options, maybe 6 if you are willing to travel to SBC. So what do you recommend? Calling an escort? What do you recommend to do at night after the clinicas and prives close?[/QUOTE]

Again, I want to be more helpful but without further information on specific criteria I cannot. I’m not trying to cop out; I’m simply trying to say that my answer could change. As I mentioned above, Redway had good service for a good price so I recommend the place with that caveat.

What about when they close? I cannot stay up that late so personally I can’t be helpful there. If you can stay up late, I’ve heard good things about Love Story but I’ll defer to someone who’s actually been there to talk about what you can find in terms of looks, service, and price.

Good discussion,

Your clarifications are helpful. I will focus only on those that still warrant further discussion. Thanks for the FKK listing, I someday expect to have that pleasure. Certainly the FKK has the advantage of ethnic and national variety. I did go to one FKK in Berlin but it was a city FKK, not like the resort style that I have seen in the ads for the bigger FKKs.

Back to SP. See your answer to my question "What do you recommend then? " is the same as mine. "It depends on what you are looking for". It seems you did not provide a significantly better alternative for the high end "optifuck" in SP. That was and is my point.

Bomboa may be less affordable than you want or expect, but for optifucks there are not many alternatives, and when you factor everything together. Entrance, saida, drinks, transportation, room fee, girl fee, single hour or multi hour. Etc. The top 4 Photo, Scandalo, Photo and Bomboa are all outrageously expensive. I know some locals who favor Scandalo, some who favor Bomboa, and some who favor Photo and some who favor Connection. In most cases, the differentiator is ambience, which type of bar scene do they prefer. Because the girls come and go and actually move from one club to the other over time anyway. And I know other locals who swear they will never go to a boate and only go to clinicas and prives.

One boate, alternative is to go to smaller joints, entrances b/t 20 and $R80 and go from one to the other until you find one you like. However, when you factor in multiple entrances and taxi fares to go from one to the other, it may come out to almost as much as the big boate.

I really think you are e overstating the "service problem" at Bomboa. You had a negative service experience, but lets hear from other visitors before coming to a conclusion about this as a trend or not.

I was not asking for myself, as I have my own formula, as do you. I was asking mostly because I show some visitors around once in a while and I want to show them the most satisfactory places. Your standards are perhaps out of skew with a lot of other SP visitors b/c your benchmark is the FKK scene which is one of the best in the world.

To me, there is no magic formula either. However, if you think about it in terms of law of averages, the more girls in a house, the greater the odds that you will see one or more that you really like. This favors the bigger boates. Second, if you can interact and chat with the girls, flirt and kiss even, that favors the idea that you will actually find one that is responsive to you. That again favors the boates, some more than others (degree of flirting, touching, kissing). So when I go to a boate, or recommend that someone go to a boate, it is really to maximize those 2 criteria. Number of girls and pre-deal evaluation. Maybe if you had been at Bomboa on a Thursday night when there are 150 girls in house you might have had a different impression.

If you do not want an optifuck and you are willing to settle for a collection of 10-20 girls to choose from, then there are indeed a tremendous number of places to check out.

As for Love Story, it is in a really seedy part of town, the crowd is very late night disco crowd, very druggy scene. I went only one time so my report is subject to some of the same things I criticize in yours. When I went the place was packed but I only saw one girl that I considered "hot". The rest were ordinary or worse for my taste. For people who like the disco scene it is a viable alternative, but go with the intent of dancing and having that type of fun. I would not recommend it for someone who is specifically looking for P4P only.

Sorry GFE Finder, I think you misunderstood my question regarding "what about when they close? " I think you interpreted my question as "what about when the boates close? " and you responded with Love Story.

I was not asking about "what about when the boates close", I was asking "what about when the clinicas and the prives close? ". That was my question, as their is no disputing that the clinicas and prives are far far cheaper option. I was merely trying to make you focus on the after 10pm options, in order to keep the discussion on "which boate would you recommend" rather than have it dovetail into a clinica is better than boate discussion.

[QUOTE=Gfe Finder]

... So, what would I say in summary?

[b]This place has become Sao Paulo’s answer to Termas Centaurus.[/b] If either is worth visiting at all (and neither is), they would be worth going to just once to satisfy curiosity or to say that you’ve done it. Both places are overpriced and overrated with greedy and unhelpful staff and ridiculous policies. Oh sure, you’ll find pretty girls there but the smarter thing to do (if possible) is to get numbers and meet outside of work just to avoid going to these awful, awful places.

Against my better judgment and for the sake of completeness only, I will include contact information below. Please do not construe this as an endorsement:

Bomboa American Bar

Prices:
Entry, R$200, R$20 surcharge (apparently) for taking a girl to the room.
Sex: R$300/hr. Services beyond intercourse must be negotiated.
Hotel: R$120/hr.[/QUOTE]

Overpriced - Overrated, that's for sure.

Paying those kind of prices are for the very rich or the very foolish tourists, IMHO, no offense intended.

As an example, you can visit Casarao on Ave Augusta on a busy Thurs-Saturday night and find garotas just as beautiful and have them for as low as 125R, which includes the room, if you know how to talk to them. And the entrance fee is only 10R which includes 2 drinks.

Easily get their phone number for later get togethers.

The place is no Playboy Mansion, nor overly-elegant, but the staff is nice and honest, the place is decent, especially when they open the back bar on the busy nights, and you can find some gems.

Be advised that drinks for the garotas can be expensive. The garotas earn half the drink price of about 40R.
I usually just offer them one of my cervejas (beers) and tell them I'd rather give them a little tip later. Works well.

I dig this place for hunting new amigas, and I don't feel like paying ridiculous prices.

Boa sorte ...

Ricker, I agree that Casarao is a good place on Friday / Saturday night for a cheap fuck and a reasonable selection. I would not say that the girls are "just as beautiful", there are SOME hot girls in Casarao, but imo the average looks are significantly lower than the elite clubs. But you are only screwing the ones you like, so a few is enough.

However, if more folks go to Casarao it will be impossible to get in the door. It is already over crowded on a Saturday night. The difference b/t Casarao and the elite clubs is that Casarao is like a college bar, beer on the floor, music so f'n loud you are for sure suffering hearing loss by just being there, a crowd so dense that you have to plot your way across the floor by pushing people out of the way. To get to the cabin rooms you literally pass thru the girls dressing rooms , lol. The time in the room are 40minutes, not 60 i believe. Rooms are 40R , girls ask for 125, not sure if you are getting the girl to agree to 80 when you suggest 125 including room? Whatever, that is small difference either way.

Sure, Casarao is a good option for the experience described above. I went there and did 2 girls a few weeks ago, and both were quite good. It was definitely a better value than the higher end clubs for saturday night, as I said below in my reply to GFE Finder.

But i do not completely agree with your comment about the higher end clubs being 'Paying those kind of prices are for the very rich or the very foolish tourists, IMHO, no offense intended.' ... you speak in absolutes. The experiences b/t Casarao and Photo/Bomboa/Scandalo are radically different. One is a sleazy, smelly, lets be honest, pretty dirty place, albeit cheap and with some good girls ... and the other places are outrageously expensive but immaculate, with lots of girls, food, etc. Its like comparing Burger King to a fine steak house. Sometimes Burger King is great and sometimes you want the steak house treatment. To each his own, no reason to call the guys who want to go to the steakhouse fools.

Ok, maybe your $R125 is the 30 minute price. I was wrong when I wrote 40 minutes for $R40 room. I think the options are 30 minutes, rooom 20, or 1 hour, room 40, is that right?

[QUOTE=Rovnak]Good discussion,[/QUOTE]

Agreed, and I'm glad that my recommendations were helpful. Focusing on where I think further discussion would be fruitful:

[QUOTE=Rovnak]To me, there is no magic formula either.[/quote]

Then why keep asking me for specific alternatives? It's a pointless question, for exactly this reason. No place will solve every monger's need. I can't recommend [i]the[/i] alternative to Bomboa because there isn't one. I can only tell you that it's a waste of time and money in my experience.

Sao Paulo is a big city, there are plenty of other places to take your visiting friends. Just ask them what they want, not what I like!

[QUOTE=Rovnak] However, if you think about it in terms of law of averages, the more girls in a house, the greater the odds that you will see one or more that you really like. This favors the bigger boates. [/quote]

You are making an argument for selection quantity as a criteria. Once upon a time, I agreed with this logic. However, since most guys will typically only do 1-2 sessions/boate visit, all it takes are 1-2 quality ones. This is why I'm more focused on reputation and board research rather than simply defaulting to the tourist havens like Bomboa.

[QUOTE=Rovnak]As for Love Story,... I would not recommend it for someone who is specifically looking for P4P only.[/QUOTE]

Thanks for sharing your take.

[QUOTE=Rovnak]To each his own, no reason to call the guys who want to go to the steakhouse fools.[/quote]

If you truly believe that, I have a few places in the Nevada desert that I can recommend to you. I guarantee you'll change your opinion after a visit there! :D

On a more serious note, my point (and Ricker's too probably) is that there's no reason to pay exorbitant prices when quality girls can be found elsewhere. I keep pressing you on this because although you've tried to justify/excuse Bomboa's exorbitant prices and staff and policies, there is no excuse if cheaper alternatives with comparable quality and service are available.

If you do you homework, you won't need to run from place to place. That's the purpose of boards like this one. They tell you and you know what to expect.

I don't mind you pressing me, I am pressing you

I was pressing you because you trashed one place and then did not give any alternatives for that same profile. What to do after 10pm when the clinicas and prives are closed. There are only boates and escorts. Escorts are a crap shoot. That leaves boates. I asked you a simple question. Which other boate would you recommend and why? You replied with no concrete recommendation other than "it depends". You did not suggest which are these other places with quality girls that enlightened mongers know about, but you did not list any of them or suggest how they compare.

You claim to have loved the Bahamas of a few years ago but hate the Bomboa of today, when Bomboa is basically Bahamas 5 years later with typical Brasil inflation. I went to Bahamas and Bomboa when both were open. Bahamas was more expensive than Bomboa. If both were still open, I am sure both would be comparably expensive. You are more illogical than me in this respect. If you said to me "I never bother with the expensive clubs" I would understand your position better. But you cite as the gold standard a club that was at least as expensive as Bomboa, and now call anybody who goes to Bomboa a fool, even though the cost of mongering has gone up everywhere in Brasil, while the dollar has fallen.

When I pressed you for alternatives you did not list any. When I replied to Riddicks eval of Casarao I gave concrete details about the trade offs b/t Casarao and other places. I was pressing you for similar eval of places other than Bomboa. I was not trying to convince YOU that Bomboa was worth your money as you have made it clear that it is not. I was trying to determine what you do consider to be a good value here in SP.

BTW, Bomboa can accomodate 100. 150 ladies. I don't know why you need be so skeptical on that point, as it seems unnecessarily challenging to an otherwise reasonable debate. And yes, that is my biggest point in why under SOME conditions I think Bomboa is worth it. To see and interact with such a collection of beauty is fun and sometimes worth the extravagance. I can get my rocks off many other ways, but this hobby is about more than just the cheapest fuck. Some guys treat this hobby like a contest to see who can spend the least or the most. For me, the dollars are a consideration but not THE consideration. There are well known posters on this forum who love Garden. I don't try to talk them out of going to Garden. If they like it, more power to them. I went once, did not think it was worth it and have not gone back. However, I respect that for their circumstances and their objectives that Garden is the just right spot for them. I was trying to find out what your just right spot is, but failed. Other than Bahamas of 5 years ago.

[QUOTE=Rovnak]... Its like comparing Burger King to a fine steak house. Sometimes Burger King is great and sometimes you want the steak house treatment. To each his own, no reason to call the guys who want to go to the steakhouse fools.[/QUOTE]

Point well taken, the word foolish was a bit harsh.

I'd give Casarao more of a nice 'Steak and Shake' feel as opposed to Burger King, and Bomboa more of the over-priced fancy steakhouse in town that sometimes you just say WTF and visit.
Tough for me to want to pay 600R ttl for entrance fee, hotel fee and a short time with a garota.

I normally like to enter Casarao on the busy nights no later than between 11 to 1130 PM, get a seat at the bar next to the entrance and watch the garotas coming in and out of the dressing room.

You're right though, the place gets quite busy and crowded later, but that's when I split anyway.

I've met some real cuties there and have gotten numbers off girls for future fun at the hotel, though I do in house occasionally.

The prices, rooms: 25R for 40 minutes / 40R for the hour.
Garota minimum: 100R

If I feel like being with a garota for in-house fun, I just tell her nicely in conversation that I'll help her with 100R and pay for the room.
Almost always get a 'tudo bem' :)

I think you are missing the point of my query. I know what is good for me. I have done my homework, I have visited nearly every place there is to visit in SP. I'm the one who told you that Bomboa on a saturday night is dead. I have a list of all the places I like and the ones and MY reasons for liking or disliking each one.

Sometimes the recommendations on this board and the local boards are spot on, and sometimes they are way off imo.

Example - the local monger board has consistently high marks for MM Club. This is about as far off the tourist track as you can get. This is a mid range local boate that routinely gets positive marks from the local mongers. I went 2 times, with visiting friends. Both times my friends were underwhelmed and wanted to leave right away. The entrance was $R20 , there were 10-20 girls, the place was spotless, very clean, far cleaner than Augusta places, but the girls were very ordinary.

I can give you plenty of examples of low end and mid range places that have good reviews but I have been there, seen them with my own eyes, and I would not fuck any of the girls in there FOR FREE. Not one. There are a boat load of boates down at the bottom of Ave. Sto Amaro, supposedly "good value" boates. They are full of uglies. I'm sorry, but that is not a good value unless you are desperate.

You tell me, "ask your friends what they like". You know what most guys say to that question "take me to the place with the best girls". That is what they say.

I was trying to get you to compare and contrast because as someone who did not like Bomboa, I was curious what you do like. Understand? You are an interesting case because you have been to Bomboa and were not happy. That is why I found your review interesting. I thought, "aha ... let's see what this guy does like".

i asked you if you prefer any of the other high end boates and you did not say. I asked you if you prefer any of the other mid range boates and you did not say. So there you go.

Trust me, if there were good value alternatives to the big boates I would be all over them. I have been to the Sto Amaro batch, I have been to MM, I have been to Sao Bernardo do Campo - Liberal, I recommend it, but its a good R$100 taxi ride there and back.

Lets define mid range as less than 100 to enter and girls for 200 hr. ok?

The ones that I see as reasonably "reliable" alternatives are:
Ilha da Fantasia
Liberal in SBC
Casarao on weekends in particular is a value op.

By reliable, I mean, that there is a good chance the place will have some decent girls.

Connection is borderline b/t mid range and high end. The entrance meet the mid range criteria, but it is so far away that you spend at least an extra 40 - 60 on taxi, so that pumps up the "real" cost. And forget about take out from Connection b/c the saida is even higher than Bomboa.

These nearby streets have between them between 20 and 40 spots that you can check out for a small or no entry fee. The touts that represent these places may actually allow you to take a peak inside before you spend the 7 to 10 reals entry fee for these excellent value venues. Anytime I spend time in Sao Paolo I try to go to the area at least once. My first experience with a GDP in Brazil was in this area and, yes, on a scale of 1 to 10 she was a 10! I never saw her again even though I kept going back looking for her. They can be hit and miss. However, if you take your time, I am sure a lady for anyone's taste can be found at these places.

[QUOTE=Gfe Finder]
Contact Information:

Redway Prive
Open:
M-Sa 10h-22h
Rua Machado de Assis 449
+55 (11) 5081-7195
+55 (11) 5571-8334
[url]www.redway.com.br[/url]

Prices:
R$90/hr. (certain services beyond intercourse must be negotiated and are not available with all girls)[/QUOTE]

From Ana Rosa, it looks like you can take the 508L, 724A, or 857R eastbound one stop to Dr. Jose de Queiros. From there, you could walk 1.5 blocks east then 1 block south.

The line that goes directly in front of it is useless.

[QUOTE=Rovnak]
...The ones that I see as reasonably "reliable" alternatives are:
Ilha da Fantasia
Liberal in SBC...
By reliable, I mean, that there is a good chance the place will have some decent girls...

Connection is borderline b/t mid range and high end. [/QUOTE]

Okay, the reward for reading you guys' extensive dialogue is that I can press you on the above points. Could you provide more detailed reviews of these places?

Most of my Sampa reports concentrated between '05 and '08 with a smattering in '02 and even fewer recently revolved around "Deep Augusta." Maison and New Maison, the sauna place (that was as hot as a sauna throughout), the glitzy place next to that, and Night-something were all a lot of fun, especially with a wingman or 2. Which places are the most fun, now??

Back to the other side of town, there were a couple of "okay" places east of Santo Amarro on Enrique Petroni. The first one on the right was better, but both were fun enough. Are they still in business? Cafe' Brasil and Kalila, I believe. Any recent events?

On the nighttime subject... in Sao Paulo, when the exchange rate bottomed last time, my pattern changed significantly. I found spending 120R at Clinica Kin (or the equivalent) in the day for an hour followed by legitimate fun checking out the robust nightlife scene in the Olympia area (or the equivalent) made the most sense for all-encompassing fun.

Be there a week from today for the first time in a good while-- looking forward to it!

before we bore this forum to tears.

Rovnak, I think I owe you, Ricker, Voyajer1, and Full Throttle a thank you for elaborating on alternative boates and venues. I'm guessing that I'm not alone in saying that I'm glad that readers now have here a fairly extensive list of alternatives to consider and pursue.

However, I think we've reached the limit of what we can productively discuss publicly. You've asked about my personal tastes and rather than bore the board with my quirks, I'd rather continue the discussion with you via PM. I'm guessing no one else here would object.

[QUOTE=Gfe Finder]before we bore this forum to tears.

Rovnak, I think I owe you, Ricker, Voyajer1, and Full Throttle a thank you for elaborating on alternative boates and venues. I'm guessing that I'm not alone in saying that I'm glad that readers now have here a fairly extensive list of alternatives to consider and pursue.

However, I think we've reached the limit of what we can productively discuss publicly. You've asked about my personal tastes and rather than bore the board with my quirks, I'd rather continue the discussion with you via PM. I'm guessing no one else here would object.[/QUOTE]

Actually the SP forum had been quite dead.
I enjoyed the banter :)

I'll be back there in a couple days :) :)